Latest / Honey Badger Radio / After the divorce, Sam's wife changed her attitude towards their love life| Fireside Chat 259

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After the divorce, Sam's wife changed her attitude towards their love life| Fireside Chat 259 · Honey Badger Radio

• 1:00
  Speaker 1: Hy whiskey.
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: Oh lucky she could repay.
• 1:33
  Speaker 3: Oh, hello, lady, what I.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Read?
• 1:46
  Speaker 4: Let's begin.
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: Indeed, Hello everybody, and welcome to Honey Badge Radio. My
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: name is Brian and this is the Fireside Chat and
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: today I have a special guest, Samuel. I'm not going
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: to release any more of his before his own protection,
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: but Samuel is someone who has a pretty heroing story
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: to tell us about some experiences he had, and I
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: don't want to, like, you know, belabor this anymore. So
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: first off, I just want to say thank you so
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: much for coming on the show. Samuel. How are you.
• 2:31
  Speaker 3: I'm doing well, Thank you for having me.
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: Yes, So, I guess we'll just get into the story.
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: First off, you are a member of the military. Were
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: a member of the military, what I guess the first
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: question is what made you? What did you do in
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: the military and what why did you you know join?
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: What was your what was the thing that got you
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: to do that?
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: Well? I was in for fifteen years, and I was
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: in special operations and something that's called civil affairs. And
• 3:07
  Speaker 4: initially I was a teacher. I was a teacher for
• 3:10
  Speaker 4: eleven years, an elementary school teacher. And that is not
• 3:17
  Speaker 4: a good job to be in when you have twins
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: all of a sudden. And yeah, so when you've got
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: a white of support and twins, being a teacher is
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: not the best job. So I actually went to the
• 3:31
  Speaker 4: army for the money and money and benefits to help
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: support the family. Yeah, And I did that for fifteen years,
• 3:43
  Speaker 4: all right.
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: And so did you join the military out of a
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: sort of a necessity, like a duty to the family.
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: Yes, absolutely, And then I ended up working in the
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: civil affairs section because it was the thing that I
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: thought was as similar to teaching as I could find.
• 4:04
  Speaker 4: I mean, we did a lot of missions to places
• 4:07
  Speaker 4: like Syria and things like that that.
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: M oh I see, yeah, I see. So why did
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: you adjust out of curiosity? Did you like doing being
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: a teacher?
• 4:19
  Speaker 4: I loved being a teacher. I absolutely loved it. If
• 4:23
  Speaker 4: if it hadn't been for the financial reasons, that's what
• 4:27
  Speaker 4: I would have done forever.
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: And as a.
• 4:31
  Speaker 4: Matter of fact, before the uh, I don't want to
• 4:33
  Speaker 4: jump ahead of the story too quick far, but before
• 4:37
  Speaker 4: going to trial, I had obtained another job as a
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: special education early childhood teacher, and that was the thing
• 4:47
  Speaker 4: that I was playing on doing when I had got
• 4:49
  Speaker 4: if I had gotten out of the military in a
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: more traditional way than I ended up getting out.
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: Mm hmmm hmm, All right, well, yeah, so I was
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: just curious. It's I know that there are you know,
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: teaching can be a very, very rewarding job. I did
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: a little bit of substitute teaching a couple of years
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: back during COVID, you know, to sort of help out locally,
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: and I did enjoy it. I did enjoy it. Okay,
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: So before we get into your story, I'm going to
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: talk to the audience really quick. If you guys have
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: any questions for Sam, feel free to send a super
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: chat or a super chow and I'll be sure to
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: read it as soon as it goes through. And yeah, please,
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: you know, consider contributing to the conversation, both in the
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: live chat as well as the comments section, and I'll
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: be on the lookout for any of your commentary. If
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: you want to send a super chow, it's feedabadgel dot
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: com for it s last just the tip and then
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: that way we get more of the money that you
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: donate and it doesn't go to Google. And you can
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: also send longer messages and it's less likely to get
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: like say, censored if you want to say something that
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: you know, maybe Google doesn't agree with. So anyway, please
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: consider doing that. All right, so let's get into how
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: you met your nowlex wife. What was the story behind that?
• 6:09
  Speaker 4: Okay, well, probably about ninety percent of my life is
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: super super born and I'm about, yeah, at borderline nerdy.
• 6:18
  Speaker 4: I'm an English major and a Grammar nerd, and so
• 6:23
  Speaker 4: that's most of my life looked like that. And like
• 6:26
  Speaker 4: I was just talking about, I was a teacher for
• 6:28
  Speaker 4: eleven years and that was what I truly loved doing,
• 6:32
  Speaker 4: and had two young sons at home and a wife,
• 6:37
  Speaker 4: and that's what I did. And I did that for
• 6:39
  Speaker 4: about seventeen years. And in that time, I went into
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: the military, like I was saying, and out.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: Of curiosity before you get into that, I'm sorry, out
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: of curiosity, did you have the kids before you got
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: married or did you have married and then there were
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: the kids?
• 6:59
  Speaker 4: We got married and had children, all right, Yeah, And I.
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: Wasn't sure about the order of that, So thank you
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: for clearing that up. Yeah.
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, And don't don't hesitate to jump in at any
• 7:10
  Speaker 4: point because I kind of I don't want to get rambling.
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: There's a lot to the story.
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: So sure, sure, yeah, So.
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: So how'd you meet your wife? I think that was
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: where we were at.
• 7:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, so building up to meeting the second wife.
• 7:28
  Speaker 4: And I want to be very clear about this. I've
• 7:32
  Speaker 4: been married three times, and yeah, the wife that had
• 7:37
  Speaker 4: we had all the issues between us was wife number two.
• 7:43
  Speaker 4: And I'm saying this specifically because in the past I've
• 7:47
  Speaker 4: done interviews and whatnot, and my first wife, who was
• 7:52
  Speaker 4: still a great friend and the mother of my children,
• 7:55
  Speaker 4: was a little upset that I didn't clarify enough that
• 7:58
  Speaker 4: she was not the wife in question, and so I
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: just wanted to say that, you know.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: That's good, that's a good point to make.
• 8:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yes, the mother of my two perfect, perfect
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: boys has nothing to do with any of this. So
• 8:19
  Speaker 4: and basically, I mean, I wish there was something more
• 8:24
  Speaker 4: complicated to the story than the fact that I'm gonna
• 8:27
  Speaker 4: recovering alcoholic and I had been sober for seventeen years
• 8:34
  Speaker 4: and congratlations, oh thank you very much. And during this
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: first marriage and after the children and while I was
• 8:44
  Speaker 4: in the military, I relapsed and I just decided that
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: that alcohol was the be all and end all, and
• 8:53
  Speaker 4: that's what I wanted to do and I wanted to
• 8:54
  Speaker 4: be out, and I wanted to be dating, and I
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: wanted to be cool, and you know, never mind the
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: fact that I'm like forty three years old at this point.
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: I guess that's I think it's a pretty classic mid
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: life crisis right there. But what I did was a
• 9:14
  Speaker 4: little bit silly, I don't know any other way to
• 9:18
  Speaker 4: say it. Like, instead of being out and being wild
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: and partying, I basically married the first girl I met
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: when I was out of the first marriage, and she
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: and I ended up together. We just we met online.
• 9:32
  Speaker 4: It wasn't anything super unusual about the way we met. Now,
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: there's a lot to the story that has to do
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: with mental health issues, you know, both mine and hers.
• 9:50
  Speaker 4: And when I look back on a lot of the
• 9:53
  Speaker 4: things now that seemed really cool about our relationship, they're
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: actually like terrible red flags. So I don't know anybody
• 10:00
  Speaker 4: out there can relate to this, or this might be
• 10:03
  Speaker 4: helpful for people, But a lot of times when you
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: meet somebody in there just head over heels infatuated with you,
• 10:12
  Speaker 4: I mean to a really really extreme extent, that can
• 10:18
  Speaker 4: be a red flag, you know, But you know, at
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: the time as I saw was this cute girl who
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: was really really into me and my girl. I mean,
• 10:28
  Speaker 4: she was in her early thirties, and so yeah, we
• 10:35
  Speaker 4: hit it off immediately, and you know, within gosh, a
• 10:41
  Speaker 4: couple of weeks we were talking about marriage and whatnot.
• 10:46
  Speaker 4: One of the things that I really liked about her
• 10:49
  Speaker 4: was we would we would sometimes drink together and then
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: moving a little more toward what I think we're here
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: to talk about today. She was really into like fantasy
• 11:05
  Speaker 4: and role play and stuff. And for me, you know,
• 11:10
  Speaker 4: having gotten out of a seventeen year marriage of being
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: like super nerd with an English degree, man, this sounded
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: really exciting to me. I was like, oh right, yeah, it.
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: Was like so she was into some I guess it
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: like fetishes, and you were kind of like, at least
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: you consider yourself to be a pretty like vanilla person. Oh,
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: so this was kind of exciting and different. So it
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: wasn't like something you were into initially, but she was,
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: and you were kind of excited at the prospect.
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: I was excited at the prospect, absolutely, and so it
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: actually what she really enjoyed worked out perfectly for me
• 11:58
  Speaker 4: in that in the English major that I am and
• 12:02
  Speaker 4: somebody who really enjoys writing and things like that. She
• 12:06
  Speaker 4: really liked like fantasy stories and she would have to
• 12:10
  Speaker 4: write stories for and things like that, and.
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: But she did.
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: She liked doing the role play too, And there was
• 12:20
  Speaker 4: one very specific role play that she liked. And at
• 12:24
  Speaker 4: the time I thought it was something that was like,
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: I don't know, it didn't seem quite normal to me.
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: But I've learned later that that it actually isn't that unusual.
• 12:37
  Speaker 4: But she liked doing this daddy daughter fantasy thing where
• 12:43
  Speaker 4: so it was this domination and so the daddy was
• 12:48
  Speaker 4: the dominator and then the the daughter was the the dominat.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: I guess, I think.
• 12:59
  Speaker 4: And the yeah, I told you that that's the grammar
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: nerd right there. I'm trying trying to figure out how
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: that works grammatically. Okay, but yeah, and I want to
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: be real clear, like I'm not trying to to, you know,
• 13:16
  Speaker 4: make it sound like I'm a choir boy. I really enjoyed.
• 13:19
  Speaker 4: Oh sure, yeah, absolutely.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: No, I mean like what, yeah, like we're dealing with,
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: you know, the things of this nature that it's the
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: No one is claiming that things are very black and white,
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: you know, Like I knew people who were into that
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: more than others. I remember just a little story. I
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: remember one time I used to live in Chicago. I
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: had good friends there. One guy he kind of almost
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: like he thought that he and I were being coming
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: close friends, and he was like, oh, I want you
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: to come with me to this place called smart Bar
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: in Chicago. And I was like, sure, why not? I
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: was going to clubs, you know, I was. It was
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: in my twenties. And we went and it was like,
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: you know, I was not used to it. Like it
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: was very very there was very very weird, kinky stuff
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: going on, but I sat through it. I was like,
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: all right, well I saw that, and now we can go,
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: you know. So like I get it. There are people
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: that are into stuff. They need something a little extra
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: to get worked up, and yeah, it is what it is.
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think that's actually pretty normal. So I've
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: been with girls that are into that too when I
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: was younger.
• 14:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but anyway, so yeah, I'm sure you weren't a
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: choir boy.
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: No, it definitely wasn't.
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: And what I really really liked the story telling part
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: of it, Like that was something that I was really
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: really into. And and she, I mean she would go
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: as far as to like get some costumes and things
• 14:50
  Speaker 4: like that. And so it was just but that characterized
• 14:54
  Speaker 4: the first or maybe let's just say one facet of
• 14:58
  Speaker 4: our relationship. Sure, the okay, oh.
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: I was gonna ask, Okay, what I got from the
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: sort of like short, short, short version that I got
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: that was sort of like how I brought you on
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: was that you guys were engaging in BDSM I put
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: in the title, right, So that's like bondage, sub dom
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: and whatever the m thing masochism, okay, and so like,
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: it doesn't sound like there's anything really like you know,
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: or even close to something like violent that was going
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: on or something that could be interpreted as violence to
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: like people who are more prudish. So was it just
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: this kind of like role play thing or did things
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: become you know, more intense as time went on.
• 15:47
  Speaker 4: It was so the okay, so the role play itself
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: became more intense in the sense that, like the we
• 15:57
  Speaker 4: had to keep on up in the ante with everything. Yeah.
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: But and this is the funny part, because I don't
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: know how far ahead we want to jump in the story,
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: but it's it's actually the role plan that ended up
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: being the quote unquote issue itself even Okay, nothing actually happened,
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: but I'll save that for a little bit.
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let's we'll get to that. But I had I
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: was thinking that there, that this is making things more
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: interesting because of the standard that we're going to be
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: looking at later for these allegations. So but let's yeah,
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: let's go back to So you guys are doing this
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: thing and you're having a good time, and things get
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: you know, you you kind of have to like find
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: new ways to make it exciting or to keep it exciting,
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: so maybe you have to do you know, more often,
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: more intense whatever. So and you were talking about getting
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: married like a couple of weeks into this, Oh yeah.
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: We did get married.
• 17:01
  Speaker 4: We yeah, well, Mary, although we were only married eleven
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: months and should have never been married even that long.
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: So yeah, because the other facet of our relationship was
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: that she is an extremely extremely abusive person physically, mentally, sexually,
• 17:26
  Speaker 4: I think, emotionally. I don't think there's any way of
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: the ways that she's not abusive.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: In what ways was she abusive to you that you
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: could like give some examples of these different types of abuse,
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: And I how how soon into it did you like
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: start experiencing it, like, was it like within the first
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: week or so, did you kind of excuse it? You know,
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: like what was your reaction? Okay, so let's let's hear
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: about that.
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: I did as the ultimate oh my gosh, a thing.
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: Called when you help somebody. Yeah, when you help somebody.
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: Uh enabler.
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: Yeah. It was terrible because there were so many things
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: that were just like not quite right early on, and
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: I would excuse it and just thought that she was.
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: Like quirky and different.
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: And I mean she was definitely quirky and different as
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: for sure, But then we would have these fights and
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: this is another you know, let me tell if anybody's
• 18:34
  Speaker 4: listening to this right now who has a similar situation, Like,
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: you know, like you don't show passion if your fights
• 18:43
  Speaker 4: are that violent, that's not passion, that's not love. I
• 18:46
  Speaker 4: mean she would tell me sometimes that like she only
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: hit me because she loved me so much, and that
• 18:52
  Speaker 4: was just her expression coming out basically, and I thought
• 18:58
  Speaker 4: that was really cool. I was like, wow, I can't
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: even imagine somebody loving somebody that much that it would
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: boil over in that way. And so and so I
• 19:10
  Speaker 4: just want to take like one just real quick second
• 19:13
  Speaker 4: to say that, like, I know, there are a lot
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: of men who are in abusive situations who feel like
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: they're not able to speak out. And I just want
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: to be clear out there, there aren't like men men abusers,
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: or female abusers, or old abusers or young abusers. There's
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: just abusers, and there are abusive people in this world.
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: And that's just how it is, Okay. So the ways
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: that she would be abusive, I mean, we have pictures
• 19:47
  Speaker 4: of her, and I mean, i'll tell you who we
• 19:49
  Speaker 4: are here in a minute, but I mean there were
• 19:51
  Speaker 4: pictures that were like submitted officially of her hands that
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: were bruised and she tested that that was her hand
• 20:02
  Speaker 4: bruce from punching me in the Yeah.
• 20:05
  Speaker 5: She would hurt her own hand hitting you, Yes, and
• 20:10
  Speaker 5: broken the ear drum, which isn't nearly as serious as
• 20:15
  Speaker 5: it sounds, but and not.
• 20:17
  Speaker 4: As hard to deal to do a lot of like
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: choking and just a lot of general hitting.
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: So she would hit you, would you hit back.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: Ever, so there were times when it would escalate to
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: where she would just either like I would see it
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: coming and she would hit me or just come up
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: from behind. The time with the ear drum was just
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: up from behind. And I don't know, I feel like
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: even now I make excuses for but the truth of
• 20:56
  Speaker 4: the matter is like she was very, very she was
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: a lot smaller than me.
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I.
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: Mean, I'm just gonna be honest with you. It didn't
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: hurt like I did. Get a pretty good black guy
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: get it in a busty, But it was kind of
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: more like, you know, like, why are you you know
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: what I'm saying.
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: Oh, I get it, I get it. Yeah, so she
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: would you would excuse it because she was smaller than you.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: You didn't think it hurt that bad, but it didn't
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: discourage her from doing it anyway. And I mean, I
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: know you know this, so I'm not really telling you
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: something you don't know. But I guess in a way,
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: you're lucky she didn't use a weapon on you or
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: you know something else, right, because yeah, or like poison
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: you or whatever, because that kind of stuff happens too.
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: But maybe maybe she just thought you were just a
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: good punching bag when she wanted to take out frustrations.
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: What kind of stuff did you guys fight about? Was
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: it just what she just looking for something to fight about?
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: Or so just like saying like the story is actually
• 22:01
  Speaker 4: like painfully long, but there was a custody battle with
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: my first wife and.
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: It for the boys.
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: The boys, yes, And it started out initially as me
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: just wanting to see them more, and then it turned
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: into this whole big thing and it got way out
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: of hand, and then second wife basically became just preoccupied
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: with first wife to a really really extreme degree, to
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: the point where it was and I'm not exaggerating, literally
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: the only thing she talked about. I mean, if she
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: wasn't talking about her, she wasn't talking and so it
• 22:56
  Speaker 4: was just this.
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: Beyond obsession.
• 23:01
  Speaker 4: And I can tell you, and I mean i'll tell
• 23:05
  Speaker 4: you even even now after everything has happened, I feel
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: bad for her that.
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: She goes through that, because it's.
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: Got to be horrific. You know, I wouldn't wish it
• 23:17
  Speaker 4: on anybody, because it's just every single wake in thought
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: and then I think she dreamt about her, you know
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: what I'm saying.
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: So so so the fact that you had an ex
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: wife and you had children with this ex wife, that
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: means that you have to like you know, be in
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: contact with her while even while going through a custody battle. Heck,
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: even after like let's say you win and everything, you
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: probably still have to on some level, you know, maintain
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: a kind of relationship with your ex wife because of
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: your sons. Yeah, and the second wife did she just
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: not want that at all, That she want you cut
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: off completely from your children and everything because you weren't
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: giving her enough of your time, or that she felt
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: like for some reason her your ex wife was like competition.
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: Because I don't. I mean, that's what I That's what
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: I would guess if I had to, and it made
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: her obsessed over it.
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: I wish it was I wish it was more than this.
• 24:10
  Speaker 4: But she thought that if we had the boys fifty
• 24:14
  Speaker 4: percent of the time, then we wouldn't have to pay
• 24:19
  Speaker 4: any child support. And she only thought that because somebody
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: had told her that once and that was it. That
• 24:26
  Speaker 4: was the whole thing.
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: She wanted me not to pay child support.
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: Oh, so she made she didn't want your resources going
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: to yeah, somebody else.
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: Basically I was already paying like way less than I
• 24:40
  Speaker 4: needed to, just because I had had come up with
• 24:44
  Speaker 4: working with with their mom. We just agreed on a
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: fee and it was way cheaper than the state.
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: Would have made me pay. But in any case, it
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: wasn't a burden. It was one.
• 25:00
  Speaker 4: One unwell known fact about our military is that they
• 25:04
  Speaker 4: actually pay us really really well. And I was making,
• 25:10
  Speaker 4: you know, good money. I didn't have any issues with money,
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: and so there was no burden with this. This was
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: not a burden. She just wanted there to be more money.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: Just that's what it sounds like. Yeah, So, okay, so
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: she physically hit you a lot. Uh, you said that
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: she also verbally or emotionally abused you as well as
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: sexually abuse you. Are you comfortable talking about some of that.
• 25:38
  Speaker 6: Yeah, just the the mental and emotional abuse.
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: To me, I think it's it's.
• 25:52
  Speaker 4: Considerably worse because, like I say, I really don't and
• 25:56
  Speaker 4: I don't want to downplay physical violence in any way.
• 25:59
  Speaker 4: It's you know, because but I'm just like, to me,
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: the scars of the emotional stuff are just way worse.
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: And and I mean, she would tell me that like
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: I should probably I should kill myself because then my
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: family would be so much better off, but that I
• 26:17
  Speaker 4: was too much of a pussy to kill myself because
• 26:19
  Speaker 4: I was afraid of guns, which I don't even know
• 26:22
  Speaker 4: what that was, you know, in reference to.
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: You know, so what happened was.
• 26:32
  Speaker 4: So at the advice of a lawyer, I started recording her.
• 26:40
  Speaker 4: And the reason that I started to record her when
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: when it initially started was I was desperately, desperately in
• 26:50
  Speaker 4: love with this woman, and I thought she didn't know
• 26:54
  Speaker 4: the things that she was saying, and that if she
• 26:56
  Speaker 4: just heard what she was saying, she would to her senses.
• 27:01
  Speaker 4: That's what I really I really sit here now saying that,
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: as silly as that sounds coming out of my mouth,
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: I really thought that's what would happen.
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: And and it didn't happen.
• 27:12
  Speaker 4: She heard she I tried playing her some of the
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: recordings and she was like, well, yes, So I said
• 27:20
  Speaker 4: that because and she would could justify everything. And I thought, mistakenly,
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: I've had about thirty plus hours of recordings of her,
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: and there's plenty of places where you can hear her
• 27:35
  Speaker 4: hitting me, and then the verbal abuse is there as well.
• 27:42
  Speaker 4: And I had thought that those were recordings that I
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: was going to be able to use in my defense,
• 27:47
  Speaker 4: and that turned out not to be the case. Like
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: nobody ever heard any of them, and so there's just
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: that and then I mean, I won't get into any
• 28:00
  Speaker 4: like real big specifics of like the sexual abuse.
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: I just know that.
• 28:06
  Speaker 4: I just know that how I perform now versus how
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: I performed before is dramatically different.
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so she okay? Yeah, because sometimes what people talk
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: when they talk about sexual abuse. Yes, sometimes what they
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: refer to are things like, you know, denial of sex, right,
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: like you're not going to get any or whatever. Sometimes
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: that's the framework. But if this sounds like there's something
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: actually like physical that she did to you in a
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: sexual context, that's, uh, that's pretty messed up. I'm really
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: sorry that that happened. But okay, so how you you
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: did mention recording her? So and you end the marriage
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: only lasted about eleven months, So like where when did
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: first of all, the divorce did you initiate or her?
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: And if it was you, when did you say enough
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: is enough? Like what was the what was the last straw?
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: Right? Well, way way way too late? And I say
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: this mostly because of not not because of what I
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: was going through, but because of what my sons were
• 29:20
  Speaker 4: going through, because we were at that point out of
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: fifty to fifty custody, So they were spending half the
• 29:28
  Speaker 4: week there at this house, which would just you know,
• 29:32
  Speaker 4: her being her.
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: So would she be like a problem, Like would she
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: make life harder for your kids too?
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: He hated the kids? And how you hate eight year olds?
• 29:45
  Speaker 4: I don't really know exactly.
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: So these were eight year old twins, right, four year.
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: Old at the time.
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah at the time.
• 29:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah, she absolutely hated them, and she thought that it
• 29:58
  Speaker 4: was justified because she thought that they were just clones
• 30:02
  Speaker 4: of their mom, and so she kind of viewed it
• 30:06
  Speaker 4: as her. She was hating the mom through them, Yeah,
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: through the kids, but she thought.
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: That was okay somehow.
• 30:17
  Speaker 4: And so so how would she treat your kids?
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: Like, would she just talk bad about them? She wouldn't
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: do anything abusive to them, She just neglect them, be
• 30:28
  Speaker 2: smart with them or short with them, make them feel unwelcome.
• 30:33
  Speaker 4: No, there was never anything physical, no physical abuse, but
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: just that very unwelcome.
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah yeah did it? Did it make your kids feel
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: like they didn't really look forward to coming to see you?
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: But did they kind of they hated coming to see
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: you because of her. Yeah, that's that's insane, man. So,
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: like we hear a lot of stories about, like you know,
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: in a divorce, the mother of the kids turns the
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: kids against the ad Like that's a that's a common
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: thing that we hear about, but we don't hear about
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: like a step mom. I mean that happens most likely,
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: but you don't hear about a step mom turning the
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: biological children of the previous wife against you know, her
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: new husband or whatever. Yeah, because she doesn't. She just
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: wants to drive a wedge in the family and that
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: and then it's only for financial gain, at least as
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: far as you know. I mean, I suspect that there's
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: probably some ego thing going on too, where she's like,
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: why aren't why am I not the center of his universe? Right?
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: Why don't I'm not the white I should be the
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: one with the children? Why does why did he have
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: a past wife? I should meet the man? And he's
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: like completely finished. I mean, I'm getting a little bit ranty,
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: but it's just crazy, like that's that's wild, man. I'm
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: really sorry to hear that. I got a super chat.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna read it really quick. Albatross gives us five
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: dollars and says I'll never understand why women like what
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: he's describing, even bother being in relationships to begin with,
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: well with with men who have kids unless they believe
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: that they can like somehow change that. How early into
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: let me go back a little bit. How early into
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: your relationship did she learn that you had a previous
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: marriage and children? And were you you were you already
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: like apart from your you were already divorced from your
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: first wife at this point. Is that before you met
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: this new woman? Is that right?
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: Yes?
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: Okay, okay, So it wasn't like infidelity or anything like that, right, no?
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: No, no, no, okay.
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: So, like, how soon into your relationship with your second wife,
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: who's the one we're talking about in this story, did
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: you did you wait until you told her about your
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: previous marriage and children? And what was her initial reaction
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: to that? Oh?
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: She she knew early on, and I felt like she
• 32:55
  Speaker 4: was happy about it, and she she she has the
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: son of her own, so I think she had good
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: feelings about things. I'm I really haven't thought too much
• 33:10
  Speaker 4: about that part of it, to be honest with you,
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: but I know she was positive early on.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So that I mean, isn't that strange that unless
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: you know, when you get those that honeymoon period and
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: you hear about somebody's shortcomings or some whatever something about
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: their past that maybe you don't know how you're going
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: to feel about it, or maybe you dislike it, but
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: you just kind of like let it slide because you
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: just want to be with them. Like it could just
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: be that she initially thought, well I can handle that, right,
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: and then realize that she couldn't, because like, what did
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: you think about her having a kid before? And what
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: was your relationship with her kid? Did you see him
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: much or her him?
• 33:56
  Speaker 4: It's a him and we had a good relationship, you know,
• 34:00
  Speaker 4: I say, that's not a tremendous amount of time to
• 34:04
  Speaker 4: form a really.
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: Great love months. Yeah, but you were on good terms
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: and he didn't like dislike being around you or anything.
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: No, no, yeah, okay, that that part was very good.
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: And yeah, yeah, that part was very good. I guess
• 34:23
  Speaker 4: one thing I wanted to throw out there too is
• 34:26
  Speaker 4: and I don't think you can underplay this, but I
• 34:30
  Speaker 4: mean she's she's really mentally ill. And I mean I
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: laugh as I say that, but one hundred percent she is.
• 34:40
  Speaker 4: And it's not I'm not saying.
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: I think she was seeing a professional or on any medication.
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: She had some serious questions. Seriously, No, no, no.
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: No, she wasn't.
• 34:50
  Speaker 4: And and I tried really really hard to get her
• 34:56
  Speaker 4: to look into that, and that didn't go over very well.
• 35:02
  Speaker 4: So but I think so I'm jumping going to jump
• 35:08
  Speaker 4: backwards now to your other question about when did I leave?
• 35:11
  Speaker 4: And yeah, and I started to say, you know, I
• 35:15
  Speaker 4: waited too long because the boys were there. But she
• 35:18
  Speaker 4: had gotten really really upset one evening about one of
• 35:22
  Speaker 4: the boys teachers, and she was just going on and
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: on and on and on and on, and it was
• 35:31
  Speaker 4: starting to escalate to the point where it just, you know,
• 35:34
  Speaker 4: it didn't feel great with her being in the house
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: around the kids. But luckily she wore herself out and
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: fell asleep, and which that that's what happened. She would
• 35:43
  Speaker 4: just go so intensely for a while, it would just
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: like wear her out and she would collapse on the
• 35:50
  Speaker 4: couch and that would be my little reprieve. And so anyway,
• 35:57
  Speaker 4: it hits me with should have hit me way long ago,
• 36:01
  Speaker 4: but it finally hits me. I'm like, I've just got
• 36:04
  Speaker 4: to get the boys out of here. I don't need
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: to figure anything else out right now. I just have
• 36:09
  Speaker 4: to get the boys out of here. And so I
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: had just decided that, you know, they were going to
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: leave the next day and then I would come home
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: and figure out whatever. But turned out the fight got
• 36:23
  Speaker 4: bigger and bigger and bigger, and I left the next day.
• 36:26
  Speaker 4: And that was May, oh the week before the Tuesday
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: before Mother's Day, so I can't remember the exact exact date,
• 36:37
  Speaker 4: but that was that was five oh my gosh, six
• 36:40
  Speaker 4: years ago, so twenty nineteen, twenty nineteen, may have twenty nine.
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, all right, and all right, so you got out
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: of air. You wanted to get your boys to safety,
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: like did you just go to a family like or
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: their mothers? What did you do with them?
• 37:02
  Speaker 4: Well, so they were able to go to their moms
• 37:05
  Speaker 4: and she was just completely thrilled because basically, you know,
• 37:09
  Speaker 4: that had been the custody fight and then now it's
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: over and she has them, so that's good news for her.
• 37:16
  Speaker 4: So that works out fine. And then I stayed with
• 37:20
  Speaker 4: a buddy. I mean, all that stuff about being in
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: the army and the camadre and all that stuff, roderie, camaraderie.
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: That's the work.
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know, I'm not the English teacher.
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: Right, hard to believe that I ever was.
• 37:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so but yeah, one of my buddies took me
• 37:42
  Speaker 4: and I stayed with him for a little while, so meanwhile,
• 37:48
  Speaker 4: rewind us a little bit I had. Before she and
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: I got married, I had deployed to Syria, and in Syria,
• 37:55
  Speaker 4: which is all in the news right now, and it
• 37:58
  Speaker 4: was handful of years ago.
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: It was, you know, a big deal too.
• 38:03
  Speaker 4: And in Syria, I made a ton of money, just
• 38:07
  Speaker 4: more money than than I could spend. I don't think
• 38:11
  Speaker 4: people shouldn't feel sympathetic for soldiers as far as finances go,
• 38:17
  Speaker 4: because financially, well, yeah, well yeah, they paid us.
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: But I mean, I mean, granted, I think it's fair because,
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: like you know, for many of them, it's their lives.
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: So I'm okay with paying them, you know, like, yeah, yeah.
• 38:33
  Speaker 3: Absolutely so.
• 38:35
  Speaker 4: I while I was in Serio, two things happened, well
• 38:39
  Speaker 4: since Sirio. One was I bought her a home and
• 38:45
  Speaker 4: that I was going to come home to, but she
• 38:47
  Speaker 4: was going to have, you know, and set.
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: Up for us. So I bought a home for both
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: of us.
• 38:54
  Speaker 4: I don't mean to say I bought it for her,
• 38:57
  Speaker 4: but I bought this home for both of us, and
• 38:59
  Speaker 4: we were going to have been when I got home.
• 39:01
  Speaker 4: And it was a two hundred and fifty thousand dollars house,
• 39:04
  Speaker 4: which is nothing now, but you know, six seven years
• 39:07
  Speaker 4: ago is actually kind of a big deal. Yeah. I mean,
• 39:11
  Speaker 4: I don't know, you couldn't get an apartment for that nowadays,
• 39:13
  Speaker 4: but anyway, back then, it was a decent amount of money,
• 39:21
  Speaker 4: for sure.
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: And that was one of the things that happened.
• 39:24
  Speaker 4: The other thing that happened was we had this sexton
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: relationship where there was a lot of yeah, so.
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: You message each other of sexting, yeah.
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, and you know, completely normal in the military.
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: But we had continued our daddy daughter fantasy thing, and
• 39:50
  Speaker 4: she would tell me that she was home all alone
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: and like her dad wasn't Daddy wasn't going to be
• 39:57
  Speaker 4: very happy with some of the things that she was doing,
• 40:00
  Speaker 4: and this would escalate back and forth until we were
• 40:04
  Speaker 4: right in these really long, complicated things. So while I
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: was there, I wrote which I embarrassingly still have to
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: this day, but I wrote just really lengthy, really detailed
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: story about what was going to happen when I got home,
• 40:25
  Speaker 4: and if she had been being bad, and these are
• 40:28
  Speaker 4: the things that were going to happen, A, B and C,
• 40:31
  Speaker 4: you know, part one, two and three, you know, sure, sure,
• 40:34
  Speaker 4: and very very specific and didn't give it, didn't give
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: it any more thought for several months. And so after
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: I left her, she lets say, I'll try to be
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: somewhat quick with this part of the story. After I
• 40:54
  Speaker 4: left her, she stopped paying for the house. And this
• 40:58
  Speaker 4: became a big problem because I wanted her to have
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: the house, but she stopped paying for it, and with
• 41:07
  Speaker 4: no other recourse, I hired a lawyer and I sued
• 41:12
  Speaker 4: her in January of twenty twenty. I sued her for
• 41:17
  Speaker 4: the house. Just division of property was just a normal,
• 41:21
  Speaker 4: you know, divorce type thing.
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so like six months later you sued her basically, okay, and.
• 41:29
  Speaker 4: You know, like I say, there's I'm trying to speed
• 41:31
  Speaker 4: the story up a little bit.
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: I'm looking her buck.
• 41:33
  Speaker 4: But so I we sued her on a Friday, and
• 41:39
  Speaker 4: on Monday she told the army that I had raped
• 41:42
  Speaker 4: her several times a couple of years prior.
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: And was she in the She wasn't in the military?
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: Was she was? She also?
• 41:52
  Speaker 4: No?
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: Okay, just okay, so she was a civilian all right,
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: So anyway, go ahead, Yeah, you guys met online. So yeah, right, so.
• 42:02
  Speaker 4: And fast fast forward in a bunch when the charges
• 42:08
  Speaker 4: were read to me. It was the exact story that
• 42:13
  Speaker 4: I had written in Syria and the exact stories.
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: So the story that she so, the sexting story that
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: you sent her. She was using that as evidence of
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: real abuse. Okay, but obviously the sexting story was a fantasy.
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: It's it was basically like a rape fantasy because she
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: was able to use it to make actual rape allegations
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: and using the military as the tool, not as opposed
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: to going to the police.
• 42:46
  Speaker 4: Right, yeah, yeah. She actually testified at the trial. She
• 42:52
  Speaker 4: testified the story that she and I were texting back
• 42:57
  Speaker 4: and forth to each other. I mean, I remember the
• 43:00
  Speaker 4: night we were going you know what I'm saying.
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: Was the text like like submitted as evidence. So she
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: used the text as a confession essentially, or as go ahead.
• 43:13
  Speaker 4: I submitted the text because I went to the lawyer
• 43:18
  Speaker 4: and was like, look, this is this is crazy. This
• 43:21
  Speaker 4: is look, this is what this is. And I showed
• 43:23
  Speaker 4: him like I printed it out and it's time stamped
• 43:26
  Speaker 4: and all this stuff, and he's like, okay, cool, let
• 43:28
  Speaker 4: me take this. We'll get this taken care of.
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: And because if they if they have the times and
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: dates of the text, then they know that you're in
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: another country.
• 43:37
  Speaker 4: Exactly.
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: Okay, all right, well anyway, go ahead, it didn't matter, no,
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: of course not no.
• 43:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah. So basically she had a story that that I
• 43:50
  Speaker 4: had made up, and I'm I'm pretty good at make
• 43:52
  Speaker 4: it up stories, so yeah, exactly. I mean, it's it's
• 44:00
  Speaker 4: what I do. And that was the thing that I
• 44:02
  Speaker 4: really enjoyed about our time together was, you know, the
• 44:07
  Speaker 4: create that creative aspect.
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: Of it instead.
• 44:11
  Speaker 4: So I I used to say, when I was in
• 44:15
  Speaker 4: in prison, I would tell the guys, I'm like, I've
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: got to be the only guy in prison right now
• 44:21
  Speaker 4: because of a story that he made up.
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: I've got to be you know.
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: So okay, let's let's okay. So it's but let's back
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: it up. So she makes these allegations. She doesn't go
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: to criminal court. She goes to military the military police
• 44:39
  Speaker 2: or military court. Right, And the purpose of this is what,
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: like what's the because like it came it came from
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: the fact that you felt they need to flee the
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: home with your sons. And then later you were like, well,
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: you know what, you can have the house. It's fine,
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: and but but she refused to pay for it. So
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: I guess, like it was still under your name, like
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: it was going to affect you. Yeah, so you would
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: have been if your credit would have been affected if
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: she didn't pay. So you're like, you should, you know,
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: I'll give you the house, like you can have it,
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: but you got to keep paying for it. And she's like, no,
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to do that. And so then you're like, well,
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: I'll sue you and you know, get justice. And then she,
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: responding to you, responding to the fact that she's not paying,
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: decides to make a rape allegation, a multiple rape allegation
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: against you. Doesn't go to the the you know, the
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: civilian cops who are the people you normally go to
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: for this, goes to the military, and they basically just
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: like they just run it through, right. I assume that
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: because this is what I hear. It's sort of like
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: what happens on college campuses. They just like, you get
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: an allegation and they just say, okay, we just need
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: a conviction. Does's just get it out of the way. No,
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: we don't. We don't want media on this, we don't
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: want it to make us look bad. Let's just like
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: convict him and get rid of them.
• 45:59
  Speaker 4: Is that what happened, and yeah, and all that's accurate,
• 46:02
  Speaker 4: except that the civilians do look at it. And and
• 46:07
  Speaker 4: this is this is kind of significant, because.
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: The civilian police and courts did look at your case.
• 46:13
  Speaker 4: They do and if there's no probable cause, there's nothing
• 46:17
  Speaker 4: they can do with it. So they just they move on.
• 46:20
  Speaker 4: And that's exactly what they did in my case. And
• 46:24
  Speaker 4: so the military will take it and they can decide
• 46:29
  Speaker 4: there's probable cause, or they can decide to proceed without
• 46:32
  Speaker 4: probable cause, which is incredibly unusual. And I know this
• 46:37
  Speaker 4: because I'm one of like count on two hands people
• 46:41
  Speaker 4: whoever even went to trial without probable cause. And there
• 46:47
  Speaker 4: was no even probable cause in the beginning, and that
• 46:49
  Speaker 4: was because of those text messages that I submitted and
• 46:55
  Speaker 4: the the individual with the which essentially is it's an
• 47:00
  Speaker 4: Article thirty two here and it's essentially a grand jury.
• 47:05
  Speaker 4: When that was turned in at the grand jury, they said,
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: now there's no probable cast. However, the military can still
• 47:12
  Speaker 4: decide to go forward if they want to, and they
• 47:16
  Speaker 4: wanted to for whatever reason.
• 47:18
  Speaker 3: We'll never never, never be the reason.
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: So okay, so they the civilian course didn't really have anything,
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: but it didn't really matter because the military course are
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: the ones that pulled the trigger on your conviction and sentencing.
• 47:33
  Speaker 2: So I got a super chat. I'm going to read
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: and then we'll get to what happened after that. So
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: AD open mind is what you'll find. Gives us ten dollars.
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: Thank you, Ad, and says, did she know did she
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: show excitement based on the text that you sent from Syria?
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: So did you get were there responses from her showing
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: interests or excitement like she's playing along with your whole thing?
• 48:01
  Speaker 4: Yes?
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: And was was that also part of the evidence or
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: was it just like completely out of context?
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: Here's just this Yeah, so ed in just a couple
• 48:10
  Speaker 4: more details. The story itself was about animas, and there
• 48:18
  Speaker 4: was lots of lots and lots and lots of evidence
• 48:23
  Speaker 4: about her desire and request for enemas throughout. Wow okay,
• 48:31
  Speaker 4: and that was all submitted into evidence and just didn't
• 48:38
  Speaker 4: didn't matter, So it.
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: Didn't matter, Okay, So that clearly she she was into it,
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: and there were and did they even did? Like were
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: the responses from her submitted or is it they just
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: like didn't matter or okay, yeah.
• 48:53
  Speaker 4: Didn't matter.
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: The I mean, I don't.
• 48:57
  Speaker 4: I don't want to simplify because it's actually a pretty
• 48:59
  Speaker 4: complicated a system. But the biggest mistake I made was
• 49:03
  Speaker 4: I didn't testify. I had a really high, high priced
• 49:07
  Speaker 4: lawyer who told me not to testify. And I mean,
• 49:11
  Speaker 4: I still say to this day, you'd be silly not
• 49:14
  Speaker 4: to listen to your high priced lawyer.
• 49:17
  Speaker 3: But he told me not to testify.
• 49:19
  Speaker 4: So I didn't.
• 49:20
  Speaker 3: That was I think that was that?
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: So okay, So how long did this whole thing go
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: in terms of the trial and what like, what happened to,
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: what were you sentenced to, what was the charge? All
• 49:35
  Speaker 2: of that?
• 49:37
  Speaker 4: Okay, So the trial itself was, Oh my gosh, isn't
• 49:43
  Speaker 4: a lot of this isn't going to sound real.
• 49:45
  Speaker 3: I'll just.
• 49:47
  Speaker 4: I'll put it out.
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't think you can surprise us
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: that much, but go ahead.
• 49:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Well, so it went forty one day. It had
• 49:57
  Speaker 4: a forty one day break from the time it started
• 50:01
  Speaker 4: until the time it ended. So we went like four
• 50:03
  Speaker 4: days and then there was a forty one day break,
• 50:07
  Speaker 4: and then there was another two days. So it was
• 50:11
  Speaker 4: six days altogether with forty one days in the middle,
• 50:14
  Speaker 4: which is hugely, hugely problematic because in that forty one
• 50:20
  Speaker 4: days there was a lot that the jury had forgotten, and.
• 50:26
  Speaker 3: You know, that's that's a pretty.
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: Break. Yeah, so they're okay, yeah, go ahead.
• 50:35
  Speaker 4: The forty one day break was because the prosecution hadn't
• 50:39
  Speaker 4: turned over three gigabytes of information, and we never got
• 50:46
  Speaker 4: the three gigabytes of information. We did get the long,
• 50:49
  Speaker 4: long break to supposedly review the information that never managed
• 50:55
  Speaker 4: to come to us anyway, And so it was prosecution's
• 51:00
  Speaker 4: fault that we had that break in the first place,
• 51:02
  Speaker 4: and that, you know, that is just one of the many,
• 51:06
  Speaker 4: many things. So I think that was your your one
• 51:09
  Speaker 4: question was how long did this thing go?
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: How long did it go? And then like what were
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: you ultimately you know, convicted of and how like found
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: guilty and all that, and like what was the punishment?
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: I guess.
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 51:23
  Speaker 4: So there were there were two charges of sexual assault,
• 51:28
  Speaker 4: and one was the story that was from Syria and
• 51:33
  Speaker 4: the other one was another story about a cabin and.
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: These are all these were sexts. These were just like
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: texts that you said, these both of these stories. So
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: you're so you're so good a writer, all right?
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: Well yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Well you.
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: Could probably get a job with like the what's the
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: name of the company that does all the roll the
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: Steevie romance novels. They were like really borderline. Yeah, like
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: you could probably get like a you know, be like
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: a high seller if you did that. But anyway, so
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: two counts based yeah, based on sexting. That's you know,
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: it wasn't even really the actual you know, acts of BDSM,
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: which of course you well, she had bruises, did they
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: when when you said that, you know, there were pictures
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: of her bruises on her hands from hitting you. Was
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: that something that she was able to submit as evidence
• 52:34
  Speaker 2: of her being abused because we've seen, we've talked about
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: stories where women abuse men and if they hurt themselves
• 52:41
  Speaker 2: abusing men, they can call the police or they can
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: take them to court and claim that they're being abused
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: even though they're hurting themselves trying to hurt the men.
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: Do you think that that was something that like, did
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: that play a role at all? Did she use that?
• 52:56
  Speaker 4: I think so? But she also wasn't ashamed of it
• 52:59
  Speaker 4: at all, because they they asked her and I mean
• 53:02
  Speaker 4: she without hesitation, she was like, yeah, I did that.
• 53:06
  Speaker 4: I mean I think she was like a little bit
• 53:10
  Speaker 4: proud of it. I mean, so there's a time to
• 53:14
  Speaker 4: the story. But the thing that I like to focus
• 53:17
  Speaker 4: on the most is like just just the amount of
• 53:21
  Speaker 4: people out there, and I want to say people very clearly,
• 53:24
  Speaker 4: the amount of people out there, males, females, young and
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: old who are suffering abuse and even I also want
• 53:33
  Speaker 4: I can't believe I have to say this in this
• 53:35
  Speaker 4: day and age, but like, but mental and emotional abuse
• 53:38
  Speaker 4: is abuse. You know, physical abuse is terrible, it's horrible,
• 53:43
  Speaker 4: but mental abuse and physical I'm sorry, mental abuse and
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: emotional abuse is also abuse, and it can leave some
• 53:50
  Speaker 4: very very deep scores for people.
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: So absolutely absolutely so.
• 53:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but I know I like left your question of
• 53:58
  Speaker 4: miles and miles behind. So the two charges, I was
• 54:02
  Speaker 4: found not guilty on one of them and guilty on
• 54:05
  Speaker 4: the other. I was found guilty of domestic violence and
• 54:10
  Speaker 4: then drunken disorderly although to this day we don't really understand.
• 54:14
  Speaker 3: But I didn't get punishment for that. So what is
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: what it is?
• 54:18
  Speaker 4: I was sayingenced to three years and I served twenty
• 54:23
  Speaker 4: five months.
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: So all right, so like two years and some change,
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: like a month, two years and a month and it
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: was like good behavior, I guess.
• 54:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah. So yeah, it's one year ago yesterday that I
• 54:39
  Speaker 4: got out.
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: M all right, so yeah that was that sounds terrible.
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: So then like where uh, where are you at now?
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: And I guess, like, are you in touch with this
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: woman anymore? Or is that likempletely behind you? And what
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: has been the aftermath of this, you know, being like
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: a stain.
• 55:05
  Speaker 4: On your on your record?
• 55:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well so there was no contact.
• 55:12
  Speaker 4: She and I had cut off contact way before there
• 55:14
  Speaker 4: were ever even allegations or anything.
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: And I just think.
• 55:25
  Speaker 4: She she wanted the house and she was really angry
• 55:30
  Speaker 4: that I had left her, and I think she just
• 55:32
  Speaker 4: saw it as a tool that she could use to
• 55:35
  Speaker 4: control me.
• 55:36
  Speaker 3: I don't think it was much more than that. I
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: really don't.
• 55:39
  Speaker 4: And it is, unfortunately, it is a tool that's available
• 55:42
  Speaker 4: to I mean women, it is, And I mean, I'm
• 55:47
  Speaker 4: I'm glad we have the protections in place that we do.
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: You know, I know they do a lot of good,
• 55:54
  Speaker 3: but they do harm as well.
• 55:56
  Speaker 4: And yeah, I think we as a society, we are
• 56:00
  Speaker 4: We're smart enough to be able to look at each
• 56:03
  Speaker 4: case and decide, you know, which is which ones are
• 56:07
  Speaker 4: a little bit crazy and which ones are you know,
• 56:11
  Speaker 4: probably need to be looked into a little bit more.
• 56:13
  Speaker 4: I think we, you know, have that ability to do
• 56:16
  Speaker 4: that as a society. So and your other question is,
• 56:23
  Speaker 4: I am I'm a convicted sex offender and.
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: You're on the registry and is it like a state thing.
• 56:32
  Speaker 4: It is, yes, and one piece of good news is
• 56:38
  Speaker 4: good and bad. The Army legal system is so slow
• 56:45
  Speaker 4: that even though over three years have passed now, my
• 56:49
  Speaker 4: case is still under appeal in the just the normal
• 56:53
  Speaker 4: regular appeal process. And I'm waiting on this appeal. So
• 56:58
  Speaker 4: I could get an e mail tomorrow saying everything's been overturned.
• 57:03
  Speaker 4: I can't get those twenty five months back, unfortunately, and
• 57:07
  Speaker 4: I'm not super young anymore.
• 57:09
  Speaker 7: So but yeah, so does the fact that you're on
• 57:18
  Speaker 7: a registry cause you any problems?
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: Or are you on good like you know, are you
• 57:24
  Speaker 2: on good terms with the the guys you have to
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: check in with the people in your neighborhood and all
• 57:29
  Speaker 2: of that.
• 57:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And I don't want to I don't want to
• 57:32
  Speaker 4: downplay this because it's different state to state and locality
• 57:39
  Speaker 4: to locality within the state, So I don't I don't
• 57:42
  Speaker 4: want to downplay the like the pain in the butt
• 57:46
  Speaker 4: that it erks with people. But if you don't have
• 57:50
  Speaker 4: charges that involve a juvenile, then it's not that big
• 57:56
  Speaker 4: of a deal. You just you register and you keep
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: in touch with whatever agency. It's different in each state.
• 58:04
  Speaker 4: It's the state police here, it's usually the sheriff's department
• 58:07
  Speaker 4: and other places. You just have to keep in touch
• 58:10
  Speaker 4: with them every uh anywhere between three and six months.
• 58:16
  Speaker 3: So but again I don't want to I don't want
• 58:18
  Speaker 3: to downplay it as a.
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: No, no, we know, we get it. It's it sucks,
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: like and it's not just it's not just like the
• 58:26
  Speaker 2: hassle of like you know, dealing with that in real life,
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: doing all this stuff you gotta do, and the fact
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: that you don't know what your neighbors think of you,
• 58:34
  Speaker 2: because like I, you know, maybe they have to know.
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: I don't know. But it's just the idea like that
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: that you have this thing over your head, you know,
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: and it's based on lies, and you don't know like
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: if you could ever get out from under it, like
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: even if you get the appeal and everything, you know,
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: like it could I get it? Like I well, based
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: on people I have talked to, you know, I got
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: another super chat. I don't want to read it really quick.
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: Thank you. Add again, open mind is what you'll find
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: says for ten dollars, Thank you. Add Hee says you
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: submitted evidence, were not even in the country when it occurred,
• 59:11
  Speaker 2: denied evidence, had over thirty hours of recorded proof. The
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: civilian police cleared you, and the military still found you guilty.
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: That was his question for you.
• 59:24
  Speaker 4: I think yes, the answer is yes, So none of
• 59:29
  Speaker 4: the recordings were able to be submitted.
• 59:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they didn't have the recordings.
• 59:37
  Speaker 4: You can get abused and then still be guilty or
• 59:42
  Speaker 4: not guilty of any given crime, you know, and so
• 59:49
  Speaker 4: you don't get to use any of that other stuff basically.
• 59:53
  Speaker 4: And I will say, I don't really have an explanation
• 59:59
  Speaker 4: for the the the whole uh oh my gosh, probable
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 4: cause I'll never really understand that.
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 3: So I agree with you.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: I don't know what.
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 3: I don't know what to tell you in.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 4: Terms of your question, because it's the weird thing about
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 4: the problem.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: Well, the standard of evidence for the military case you're
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 2: wondering guys, is it's lower than civilian courts. Civilian courts
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: is generally, like you know, beyond a reasonable doubt and
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: military courts is basically preponderance of evidence. So you know,
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 2: and that and that preponderance of evidence that that is
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: a very gray area. You can move things around. It's
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: just like the colleges. Like I said, when we talk
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: about university campus allegations, it's the same thing. The civilian
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 2: courts are. Actually they have a much higher and more
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: reasonable and constitutional standard than the military courts or the
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 2: kangaroo courts. Basically, you know, it's like, why do when
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: there are allegations that sketchy or even false, Why is
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: it they don't go through the you know, the police. Well,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: because it's probably not going to go through. But if
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: you go to you know, you go to your boss,
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 2: you can get somebody fired. You can go to your
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: superior officer, or you know, like some other way, go
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: to the dean and then you can, like you know,
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: if you want to, if you're using it in a
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: vindictive way, which that's what it seems like this is,
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: then it's it's a lot easier. So all right, anyway,
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: So for okay, so I wanted to tell everybody that's
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: watching again talking to Sam about his terrible experience. I
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 2: have some links in the description. Uh, there's a petition
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: for you guys to sign, and there's a website called
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: would You doc Care, And it's talking a lot about
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 2: several cases that are miscarriages of justice against men and
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: women in our armed forces. And uh, you know, as
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 2: I think one of my previous guests said, this isn't
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 2: just you know, an issue just based on the due
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 2: process problem, but it is also a it is a
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 2: national security issue because why would men join the military,
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: Why would anyone join the military when this kind of
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: stuff can happen and there and these are horror stories.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 2: So I don't know if you want to add anything
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: to that, Sam, but I just wanted to like tell
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: people about like where they can go to support and such. Yeah.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 4: Absolutely. So the prison that I went to where I
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 4: served my time as a military prison, Fort Levenworth, Kansas,
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 4: and it's comprised of eighty five percent of these type
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 4: of cases. And that's their number. That was the number
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 4: they gave me when I was there. That wasn't any
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 4: kind of like, uh, you know, dig in for the truth.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 4: So it's it's liable to be a little bit higher.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 4: And so this is happening to far more people than
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 4: we realize, and I think because a lot of people
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 4: don't have military individuals, And so that's the whole point
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 4: of the petition and asking that question, like would you care?
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 4: You know, it's easy to say that it's this marine
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 4: who's like halfway across the country, But would you care
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 4: if it was your son or your brother or your uncle?
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 3: You know?
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 4: And so when you think of it that way, it
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 4: becomes a very different question. And so that's that's what
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 4: we're wanting people to ask themselves, Like, I mean, these
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 4: are the these are the people that give their lives
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 4: for the country, give their time and anniversaries, and I mean,
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 4: I can't tell you how many Thanksgivings and Christmases I
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 4: missed in fifteen years. I mean it was quite a few.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 4: And these are the people that it's happening to.
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 2: So yeah, So a couple of final questions. Well, first
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 2: of all, I'm glad that you're doing well. Are you
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 2: like you you mentioned in the beginning of the show
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: that your first ex wife is still like a good
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: friend to you, and so like you guys are still
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: in touch and you're getting along well, and and your
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: sons are well.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 4: They're doing great.
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 3: They are.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 4: They live a good ways from me because of the
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 4: stepfather who is in the military, and so I don't
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 4: see them nearly as much as I would like, but
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 4: we talked pretty frequently.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 2: But that's good.
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 3: They're definitely doing well.
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 4: I mean, it's it's been a lot for them.
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they're like teenagers now I'm guessing that they're fourteen
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: now fourteen? All right, Well, yeah, so so they're hitting
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: puberty and they're noticing girls. So like, what advice would
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 2: you give them in retrospect to everything you've experienced if
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: you could, Well, what I'm saying, I guess is what
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: what do you think, like in what ways do you
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 2: think that you have changed or if at all since
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: having this experience?
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well I don't. I don't know how I would.
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 4: I would die if they ever wanted to join the military.
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 4: Uh yeah, So I couldn't really advise anybody to join
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 4: the military. It was just like you were saying, it's
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 4: a national security issue, Like who would My advice.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 3: Would be, don't join.
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 4: So he's going to go out and join, you know
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 4: at the end of the day, like who's going to
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 4: do it?
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 3: And and so, but advice for girls and this is.
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 4: Just uh not really super relevant to anything we talked
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 4: about today, but just being very very careful about what's
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 4: online and who you think you're talking to, and you
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 4: think you're talking to this person, but you're really talking
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 4: to this person. And and that's a conversation that that
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 4: we've had, you know, quite a bit, and very specifically
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 4: like don't don't really don't talk to anybody online.
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 3: I just nothing good that.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 2: You mean? Well, I think that the new the young
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: generation coming up now, they're actually statistically more interested in
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 2: meeting people face to face and online. The no online
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: thing is not a novelty for them because they grew
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: up around it, but like being around with people. So
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 2: hopefully that continues as a trend. And because I agree,
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 2: I think the internet can be it's not really the
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: best place to make close friends, especially I mean, yeah,
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 2: so I would, I would be awarey of that. All right? Well,
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: so are you like starting over you just like on
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 2: your own? Like or are because you you had three wives?
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 2: Are you single right now? What's going on with that? No?
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 4: I have an amazing girlfriend, Okay, who's beyond understanding to
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 4: say the least. And I mean, I hope I come
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 4: across Okay, but my life's been fairly devastated.
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: No, you know, you see to be coping.
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 4: I mean, I live with my father. I'm forty nine
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 4: years old and I live with my father. I do
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 4: have a job. I probably make about half what I
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 4: was making in the military, and so yeah, I'm very
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 4: fortunate to have the job that I do have, but
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 4: it's you know, it's pays hourly wages, and it's just
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 4: as is what it is. And and so I'm still
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 4: trying to figure all that out. And one of the
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 4: issues is that they because of the super long appeal process,
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 4: they kind of put your life on hold and because
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 4: there's there's a whole lot to that process, and so
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 4: I have been kind of waiting in the last year
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 4: just to hear about the appeal. So that kind of
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 4: slows them too.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 2: Are you at all optimistic about, like, you know, things changing,
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 2: maybe because we've had a change in the guard I am.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 4: I am optimistic. When I was there at the facility,
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 4: there were far fewer people coming in and there were
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 4: no numbers to support that, but the fact of the
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 4: matter is there were just way less people and it
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 4: was noticeable. And so and now with new administration and
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 4: somebody who's been accused and been through the kind of
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 4: the process themselves. Yeah, I mean just to jump off
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 4: top of a tiny bed. I've read someplace where somebody
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 4: said the day will come when every single person is
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 4: going to at least know somebody who's been accused.
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 3: It's going to be yeah.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 4: So yes, I am hopeful that fewer cases will be brought.
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 4: And you know, let the civilians do their job because
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 4: they know how to do it way better than the
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 4: military does.
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 2: Well, their incentives are different, so that that's a big
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: part of it. All right, Well, I don't know if
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 2: there's any fi thoughts you have before I wrap it up,
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 2: but I think this is good. What do you think?
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 4: I think it's been wonderful and I really appreciate you
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 4: having me on.
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 2: All right, well, thanks for coming on and sharing your story.
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 2: I know it's very personal and emotional, so I really
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 2: appreciate it, and thank you guys for joining us. I'm
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: going to wrap it up here, but once again I'm
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 2: reminded to check out the links in the description. Sign
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 2: the petition if you can, and check out the website.
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: Would you dot care? You know, I think that these
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 2: conversations are very important and yeah, I want to thank
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 2: Samuel for coming on the show. I want to thank
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 2: you guys for watching. If you like this video, please
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 2: hit like, subscribe. If you're not already subscribed, hit the
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 2: BELF notifications, leave us a comment, let us know what
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 2: you guys think about what we discussed on the show today. Again,
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 2: you'll find links to relevant things in the description of
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 2: this video, and please share this video because sharing is caring.
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 2: Thank you guys so much for coming on today's episode
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: of The Fire Slight Chat, and we will talk to
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: you all in the next video.
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 8: Are machines, dude, Okay, they are literal machines. They are
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 8: talking point machines. They are impossible to fucking deal with,
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 8: especially if you have like especially if you have like
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 8: a couple of dudes who have good memory. On top
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 8: of that too, holy shit, you're fucked