Latest / Let's Talk with Carl Lee / Media Portrayals, Youth Scouting, and Pro Athlete Expectations

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Media Portrayals, Youth Scouting, and Pro Athlete Expectations · Let's Talk with Carl Lee

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you gotta work.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: You gotta work. Cry sign.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: It's mine gotta show. Everybody is my sign. You gotta work,
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  Speaker 1: cry Son. Another mind from Saga Dogs Day Line, Don't.
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: Tell You Gotta wurk.
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  Speaker 3: Welcome to Let's Talk with Carl Lee, where sports, culture
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  Speaker 3: and community intersect. Joined Carl and frequent co host Hollis
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  Speaker 3: Lewis as they dive into engaging conversations with guests from
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  Speaker 3: all walks of life. Let's Talk is probably presented by
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  Speaker 3: Attorney Frank Walker, Real Talk, Real Experience, Real Results, Frank
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  Speaker 3: Walker Law dot Com. Let the conversation begin on Let's Talk.
• 0:46
  Speaker 4: Welcome, ladies and gentlemen, and Let's Talk with Carl Lee
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  Speaker 4: and my co host Hollis Lewis.
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  Speaker 2: What so, What's up?
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  Speaker 4: Hollis Lewis is our project director of Crisis Intervention in
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  Speaker 4: West Virginia. Hollis, one of the things that I wanted
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  Speaker 4: to I wanted and I don't know if I did
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  Speaker 4: this before, but I really want to ask you a.
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  Speaker 2: Question about what that entails.
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  Speaker 4: I think I did it maybe off air, but I
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  Speaker 4: want people to actually know what that is before I
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  Speaker 4: kind of go through the rest of the introduction there.
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  Speaker 5: Crisis Intervention Teams are community based programs in which we
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  Speaker 5: bring together law enforcement, firefighters, ems advocates, mental health, behavior
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  Speaker 5: health professionals, and other community partners in order to build
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  Speaker 5: a better response to persons in crisis. We facilitate this
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  Speaker 5: through a series of trainings and most importantly, connecting community
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  Speaker 5: resources and connecting community members together. Because what we understand now,
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  Speaker 5: you know, with mental health, houselessness, substance use disorder, is
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  Speaker 5: that not every situation or not every emergency call is
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  Speaker 5: criminal justice quote unquote right. Some people need help, some
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  Speaker 5: people need to be guided to resources, and so it
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  Speaker 5: gives you know, law enforcement in particular, just more tools
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  Speaker 5: in order to navigate those sort of situations. Man, I
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  Speaker 5: think you had you had a summit. I think yeah,
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  Speaker 5: we had a summer. We brought the whole state together.
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  Speaker 5: We had thirty three counties represented, nearly two hundred people
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  Speaker 5: down here in Charleston, and just hearing from subject matter experts,
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  Speaker 5: those who live the experience, and those who are running
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  Speaker 5: successful CI programs.
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  Speaker 4: All right, well, let's talk is probably presented by Attorney
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  Speaker 4: Frank Walker. Real talk, real real experience, real results. You
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  Speaker 4: can visit Frank Walker at Frank Walker Law dot com
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  Speaker 4: for more information. You can also catch Let's Talk with
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  Speaker 4: Crawley every Sunday at one pm and Thursday at seven pm.
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  Speaker 2: On five eighty WCHS.
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  Speaker 4: If you missed any of the episodes and you want
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  Speaker 4: to catch up, you can go to wchsnetwork dot com
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  Speaker 4: slash Let's Talk. You can also follow us on Facebook
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  Speaker 4: at Let's Talk with Crawley for any of the updates show.
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  Speaker 4: All right, so, Hollist, I think you were going to
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  Speaker 4: jump in. You wanted you you were you were antsy
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  Speaker 4: and telling me that you kind of wanted to jump
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  Speaker 4: in and start off the show, So go ahead with it.
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  Speaker 5: We definitely got a lot to talk about, you know,
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  Speaker 5: Olympics and NFL and all that stuff. But what I
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  Speaker 5: wanted to hit on first is that, you know, we
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  Speaker 5: being in the media, we've gone from being players to
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  Speaker 5: being coaches and caught, you know, coming to this side
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  Speaker 5: of the game. And I recently, you know, read a
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  Speaker 5: story on Jalen Hurts and his head coach and you
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  Speaker 5: know they're having friction and whatnot that could have led
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  Speaker 5: to their you know, ultimately being eliminated last year from
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  Speaker 5: the playoffs. And also there's news about skip Bayless, who
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  Speaker 5: was a fame or infamous to some people, who was
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  Speaker 5: you know, no longer going to be. I think he's retiring,
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  Speaker 5: not that he's just not going to be with SCS.
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  Speaker 5: But you know, when we think about the role of
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  Speaker 5: media in sports, has it become too invasive? It does it?
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  Speaker 5: Does it? Is it hurding sports? Is it promoting sports?
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  Speaker 5: Kind of what's your thoughts on that? Okay, I got
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  Speaker 5: two sides to it.
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  Speaker 4: I guess being behind the mic and how I think
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  Speaker 4: about it controversy too.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, I think being behind the mic.
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  Speaker 4: My personality, I think allows me to be a little
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  Speaker 4: bit more comfortable with being maybe more open to say,
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  Speaker 4: you know, say things that maybe I wouldn't just randomly
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  Speaker 4: say for the for the reason to make sure that
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  Speaker 4: people understand exactly kind of like what's happening. And as
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  Speaker 4: a player, I did feel like there were some questions
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  Speaker 4: that shouldn't be asked to me, you know whatever that
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  Speaker 4: I can't really necessarily recall one, but I'm sure that
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  Speaker 4: at some point there was there was a conversation with
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  Speaker 4: the media that I wasn't happy with or interview went
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  Speaker 4: and the way that it because you know, as you know,
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  Speaker 4: editing out certain stuff and editing.
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  Speaker 2: And putting other things in. You have that ability to
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  Speaker 2: do that.
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  Speaker 5: So and sometimes it seems as though a lot of
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  Speaker 5: times they take your worst talking point and.
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  Speaker 4: Put it out there and put it out there so
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  Speaker 4: you get you get uncomfortable with the media. And you know,
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  Speaker 4: and I'll say this, some of our best athletes in
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  Speaker 4: the state of West Virginia, I think the media is
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  Speaker 4: the primary source of the reason why they don't come back.
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  Speaker 4: I think it's a you know, I think it is
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  Speaker 4: because of some of the things that they have said
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  Speaker 4: or the way that they set them because a lot
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  Speaker 4: of times when you're writing to me, in my mind,
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  Speaker 4: when you're writing a story about something that's happened.
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  Speaker 2: You may not know all of the facts. And that's true.
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  Speaker 5: And also I think because of the twenty four hour
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  Speaker 5: coverage you also have, it seems like at some junctures
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  Speaker 5: you want to be salacious or you want to be invasive,
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  Speaker 5: and it's just like, you know, what's the media's proper place.
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  Speaker 5: Is it to promote and pump up stores, sorts, sports,
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  Speaker 5: excuse me? Or is it just to find those gritty headlines?
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  Speaker 4: Well to me, and again I'll go back to my
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  Speaker 4: experience with being in jail in Minneapolis with.
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  Speaker 2: The crazy scenario.
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  Speaker 4: Was so the media then covers this story and says
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  Speaker 4: that me and Anthony Carter Ac.
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  Speaker 2: They had to physically pull us off the ground. That
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  Speaker 2: never happened. I mean, it never happened.
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  Speaker 4: And the only real reason that we actually ended up
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  Speaker 4: in the police car in handcuffs and then to the
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  Speaker 4: station was I had I was trying to get Ac
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  Speaker 4: to go back in. We were going to go back
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  Speaker 4: in Viking.
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  Speaker 2: Cre This was party.
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  Speaker 4: Okay, we're in tucks, so we're not. It's not like
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  Speaker 4: we're wrestling around on the ground. We're I've read that story.
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  Speaker 4: It made it seem like we.
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  Speaker 2: Was in the club. Okay, So.
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  Speaker 4: I'm trying to get him in and the and and
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  Speaker 4: the police grabs him and.
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  Speaker 2: Like I'd like, hey I got him.
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  Speaker 4: I reached reaching im telling him like hey I got
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  Speaker 4: him brother.
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  Speaker 2: Now, next thing I know, we were in trouble.
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  Speaker 4: This story then comes out like they had to physically
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  Speaker 4: pull us apart, And how do you defend that? Right, Like,
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  Speaker 4: it's in the it's in the newspaper, So where do
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  Speaker 4: you you know, I'm trying to tell this story that
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  Speaker 4: it happened this way and and the only And think
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  Speaker 4: about it. If that were the case, why wouldn't I
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  Speaker 4: why wouldn't the team have something negative to say about
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  Speaker 4: that or saying something about you know, Carling Anthony Carter.
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  Speaker 2: Yes they did have a fight.
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  Speaker 5: Did that make the headlines here as well? Or its
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  Speaker 5: kind of just stayed in Minisota.
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  Speaker 4: I don't, I don't, I don't know. I know my
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  Speaker 4: mom knew about it because I she was my first call.
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  Speaker 4: So I don't know if people even knew that. You know,
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  Speaker 4: they and they may not have. But it just it
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  Speaker 4: goes to your point, though, you can write your story
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  Speaker 4: not based on on facts but the assumptions of what
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  Speaker 4: you think. Or maybe maybe they interviewed the police officer,
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  Speaker 4: and a police officer said that, hey.
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  Speaker 5: You know because and to your point, I'm kind of
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  Speaker 5: glad you're going here because I think it forces it.
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  Speaker 5: You know, a lot of these stories aren't written with objectivity.
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  Speaker 2: Right.
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  Speaker 5: We've seen the situations where the various young men have
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  Speaker 5: been accused of you know, assault type of crimes and
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  Speaker 5: just to come find out later that they were actually
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  Speaker 5: innocent of those crimes. But it cost them years. It
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  Speaker 5: cost them draft picks and all these different things of
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  Speaker 5: that nature. So is the media obligated to be objective
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  Speaker 5: when they write these stories or when they talk about
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  Speaker 5: this stuff?
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  Speaker 2: Well, let me ask let me let me answer that
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  Speaker 2: with a question.
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  Speaker 4: So if I have, if I have the opportunity to
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  Speaker 4: write this story about me and you, we we went
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  Speaker 4: to blow, We went the blows after the after the show, right,
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  Speaker 4: And so if I have my chances to write the
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  Speaker 4: best story, do I am? I worried about the fox,
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  Speaker 4: but but but it is it the best story?
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  Speaker 2: Or is it the headline? And story?
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  Speaker 4: Yes, I gotta get the headline because now now you're
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  Speaker 4: forced it's a lot of news out there.
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  Speaker 5: It's a lot of media out there. So now you're
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  Speaker 5: forced to just what's gonna pop for me?
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  Speaker 4: Well, and and and here's the other thing. I have
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  Speaker 4: asked a couple of writers to come on yeah okay,
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  Speaker 4: And I haven't gotten anybody to come on okay.
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  Speaker 2: And part of that I think could be because.
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  Speaker 4: They're not sure what I might ask him.
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  Speaker 2: But I can remember, I can clearly remember. I'm sure.
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  Speaker 4: And I even have the article and in and in
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  Speaker 4: one of my scrap books that you know that I
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  Speaker 4: would you know, if I got drafted, if I would
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  Speaker 4: get to an opportunity to the league, that I wouldn't
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  Speaker 4: be able to make it.
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  Speaker 2: How do you.
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  Speaker 5: They said that about you? Yes, okay, yes, so a
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  Speaker 5: media a media person said that about you.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, and so my thing is is okay.
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  Speaker 4: And then once I made it, then it was like,
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  Speaker 4: well he you know, he might do a little bit,
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  Speaker 4: but it ain't gonna be.
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  Speaker 2: It ain't gonna be what it was.
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  Speaker 4: Okay, So I can feed off of that, But why
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  Speaker 4: would we write an article like that, like because you
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  Speaker 4: don't know, like you don't know what, But.
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  Speaker 5: Why wouldn't he if that's his opinion of your player,
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  Speaker 5: particularly like if he's seen you play and he's measuring
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  Speaker 5: you against you know, other what does he measured?
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  Speaker 2: What is he measuring? He's measuring me.
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  Speaker 5: Against what he sees he measured was he sees you
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  Speaker 5: and other players? Similar situation. The players who.
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  Speaker 4: From from here no no, no, I'm talking about from
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  Speaker 4: from making it.
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  Speaker 2: They don't know what player did they know that had
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  Speaker 2: made it.
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  Speaker 5: But this was the high school, this was no, this
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  Speaker 5: is in college, okay, college against college players, right, other
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  Speaker 5: college players. He cannot necessarily just limit it to hearing West,
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  Speaker 5: Virginia Marshall, other you know, players who played the position national.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, let me ask you this.
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  Speaker 4: Do you think do you think that sitting in the stands,
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  Speaker 4: roaming the sidelines, you can assess an athlete's talent?
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  Speaker 2: I think you can. I think I think I definitely
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  Speaker 2: think you can.
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  Speaker 5: I think, particularly like I said, I if you coached it,
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  Speaker 5: you played it and.
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  Speaker 4: You no, no, no, no no. I am not saying you
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  Speaker 4: as a coach, as a player, as a player. I'm
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  Speaker 4: talking to you as a media guy, immediate person, immediate person.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, I think if you watched enough ball, then I
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  Speaker 5: think you can have a sense of somebody's natural talent. Now, again,
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  Speaker 5: we don't know the work ethic, We don't know the
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  Speaker 5: heart know, we don't know that part.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, that's that's right.
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  Speaker 4: There's the three pieces that you can't that you can't
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  Speaker 4: that you can't add into.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, we don't.
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  Speaker 5: But that's not I don't think that's their job because
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  Speaker 5: and and again I'll bring it back to us cause
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  Speaker 5: and again I don't want to go down here, but
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  Speaker 5: we faced last year around this time, we faced extreme
• 12:19
  Speaker 5: criticism for the whole transfer thing because everybody you know,
• 12:23
  Speaker 5: they blamed that on us, as far as it not
• 12:26
  Speaker 5: necessarily the movement, but they blamed the conversation and the
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  Speaker 5: controversy around it on us. We was the one who's
• 12:33
  Speaker 5: kind of open those can of worms, and we were
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  Speaker 5: doing that right from our own from where we're sitting
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  Speaker 5: at now and providing our own analysis of it without
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  Speaker 5: necessarily knowing all the facts.
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  Speaker 2: Right, yes, yes, yes.
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  Speaker 4: Right, yes, okay, Okay, now, all right, So I've gotten
• 12:51
  Speaker 4: questions on that within the last week or so, Okay,
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  Speaker 4: I had Okay, So I had a conversation, okay, And
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  Speaker 4: I had no intention up bringing this, bring this in,
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: but I had a conversation okay, youth football.
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  Speaker 2: Okay.
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  Speaker 4: And I know this is like a like a like
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  Speaker 4: a nose non starter for you, Okay, But I had
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  Speaker 4: a conversation in in youth football with a parent and
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  Speaker 4: with two parents, and we were talking about kids that
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  Speaker 4: play somewhere else. There were there has been a couple
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  Speaker 4: of kids who called us and wanted us to have
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: to give them waivers. Yeah, okay, I told them there
• 13:33
  Speaker 4: are no waivers. There's no such thing as a waiver
• 13:35
  Speaker 4: in the new league. There's no there's no such thing
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: as a waivers. Waivers used to be you could grant
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  Speaker 4: them an opportunity to go play somewhere else.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, so no, they don't have them. You you were.
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  Speaker 4: What the rule is is that you go and you
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  Speaker 4: play where you're supposed to go to high school.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, okay, So you can't play anywhere. No, you can't
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  Speaker 2: just play. No, you can't just play anywhere else.
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  Speaker 4: So you have to so, and I'm sure there's some
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: there's some reason, justifiable reasons to do that, but the
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  Speaker 4: main deal is is that you.
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  Speaker 2: Have to play where you're high school.
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  Speaker 4: So if you're going to a South Charleston high school,
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  Speaker 4: feeder school or in elementary, so that's where you got
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  Speaker 4: to go.
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  Speaker 2: So I said that.
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  Speaker 4: The players who leave, the players who leave do not
• 14:24
  Speaker 4: care specifically about whether or not we can fill the team.
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  Speaker 4: You know, we're low on numbers South Charleston. It's low
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  Speaker 4: on numbers in our youth football programs. And for me
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: to okay, somebody to leave, I get it. You have
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: a right for your kid to do whatever you want
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: your kid to do. What is my role for the
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: city of South Tustan. I'm trying to do the best
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  Speaker 4: for everybody's kid. I don't have a kid invested in this.
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: I don't have a grandchild invested in this. So I'm
• 14:54
  Speaker 4: just trying to make sure we feel the team. Why
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  Speaker 4: am I letting your kid go? Why am I saying, oh, yeah,
• 15:00
  Speaker 4: take your kid wherever you want, good luck? Why would
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: I do that if because at the end of the day,
• 15:07
  Speaker 4: who am I for? I am for the entire team
• 15:12
  Speaker 4: when you go because you want to.
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: Go, see we're going down the road.
• 15:16
  Speaker 5: I mean again though, but but again, kind of bringing
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  Speaker 5: it back to the media thing. I understand what you're saying,
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  Speaker 5: but I think those are the nuances when we talk
• 15:26
  Speaker 5: about like whether we can judge somebody or whether it's
• 15:30
  Speaker 5: just that we have an opinion of somebody without necessarily
• 15:33
  Speaker 5: knowing all the facts.
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  Speaker 2: That's my job. Yeah, I don't.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think I think us as media, I think
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  Speaker 4: you know, you know, this is not my this is
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: not my full time job, but me as being part
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: of this, I have I think it is. I think
• 15:48
  Speaker 4: it's I think I have to talk about things that
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: happen that I see, that I feel, and all those
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: kinds of things and and and say my.
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: My view on them, because that's what we do.
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: That's what we do. But but but you know, and
• 16:04
  Speaker 4: and I'm not saying that we are. I am always
• 16:06
  Speaker 4: right or my my opinion is always right.
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: It's just mine. Yeah, But when does it go too far?
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  Speaker 5: Because you look at somebody like a Skip Bayless and
• 16:14
  Speaker 5: I think a lot of the beefs quote unquote that
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  Speaker 5: he's been involved with basically just you know, belitting players
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  Speaker 5: and their accomplishments and what they've been through.
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  Speaker 2: See.
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  Speaker 4: I think I think, I think to me, Skip Bayless
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  Speaker 4: may have just gotten a little he just felt comfortable
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  Speaker 4: to a point where he could say whatever he has.
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: He would say that like the Shannon Sharp Yeah, like
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: you know, like you when you start critiquing somebody personally, yeah,
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  Speaker 4: and saying that they're not something, and particularly when they've
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: already accomplished.
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  Speaker 2: They've alreay accomplished things. See, I think, I think.
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  Speaker 5: To your point, I think that's when it gets dicey because,
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  Speaker 5: like I said, I can have my opinion and my
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  Speaker 5: analysis on you. What I can't do is like denigrade
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  Speaker 5: what you've already done, or I really can't even denigrate
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  Speaker 5: your potential person right, you see what I'm.
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  Speaker 4: Saying, Right, I don't think like that's that's my thing.
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  Speaker 4: I don't I don't ever want to. I don't ever
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  Speaker 4: want to be on a show.
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  Speaker 2: And say that a player isn't this.
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: He may not be that in the moment, but like
• 17:23
  Speaker 4: you said, work ethic, all of those kinds of things,
• 17:26
  Speaker 4: we don't know that piece of it. And then and
• 17:29
  Speaker 4: the problem with I think with media us included is
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: is sometimes we're we're put in positions to to be
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  Speaker 4: the expert opinion, right, And and I don't make the
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: case that it's it's our opinion. It's not expert opinion.
• 17:44
  Speaker 4: It's just an opinion. And I think when you get
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: on that national stage, I think you get and and
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: and if you get full of yourself, you think that
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: you can you can justify or you can confirm how
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: good a player is is it should be, shouldn't be?
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: You don't think he's this, and da da da dah.
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: You don't have a right to think.
• 18:04
  Speaker 5: And I think people like just hear locally because that's
• 18:07
  Speaker 5: actually a good point, because I think some people when
• 18:09
  Speaker 5: they go national, that national status, they think that they're
• 18:13
  Speaker 5: the expert just because they've reached the national status, right.
• 18:17
  Speaker 5: And I think some people just to bring it back local.
• 18:19
  Speaker 5: Some people thought, I think they thought that we were
• 18:24
  Speaker 5: trying to proclaim ourselves as an expert when we're talking
• 18:26
  Speaker 5: about the transferred thing and different things of that nature.
• 18:28
  Speaker 5: When we were just giving our opinion on it, we
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: weren't necessarily saying like good, right, wrong, whatever. We're saying,
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: this is our position and this is what we think
• 18:38
  Speaker 5: about it from where we sit, yeah, and.
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: From what we've done and and like for me, I
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: always say, even at Marshall, when we weren't winning, I
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: couldn't I couldn't imagine leaving.
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: Like I mean, I don't know if it was a
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: built in loyalty.
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: I knew that Sonny Randal had played pro Bob Pruit's
• 18:59
  Speaker 4: my my dB coach.
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, come on, like.
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: I'm somebody said, somebody said, like Middle, I mean, you
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: football like you don't have coaches. You don't have coaches
• 19:09
  Speaker 4: that know what they're doing. We don't have kids that
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: know what they're doing. You know what I'm saying. And really,
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: really all that you need is if you can get
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: a guy, because every.
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: Dad wants to coach.
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: Now I shouldn't say that, but a lot of dads
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: want to coach, and they want to coach because their
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: kids playing and they don't necessarily have to know all
• 19:25
  Speaker 4: the details of football. They don't have to have played football.
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: They're gonna google drills and do all that kind of
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: stuff because these kids are gonna they're gonna advance. You know,
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: when you're talking about K through two? What what? What
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: football can you teach them?
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: Actually?
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you just got to do. You got no more
• 19:46
  Speaker 4: than the kid hand the most athletic kid the ball.
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: He's gonna score and your team's likely gonna be a winner.
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: You know, And I and I think that you know,
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: we judge coaches, We judge we judge me if folks,
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: you know, and all that I.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: Think that they're trying to do is just their job.
• 20:06
  Speaker 4: You know, I got this mic, I got the opportunity
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: to have this mic in front of me. I chose
• 20:10
  Speaker 4: to have you to be on a mic across from me.
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: We're not we're not perfect, but we could. But but
• 20:16
  Speaker 4: don't be don't get angry at what we say because
• 20:20
  Speaker 4: it's just an opinion, and that opinion.
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: Could be it could be way off from yours.
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but you can speak yours to us, you know,
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: you can We're not saying that you can't be right.
• 20:33
  Speaker 4: We're just saying simply that this is today's show, this
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: is what we said, and we feel this way. We
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: could even change we we we probably I'm sure I've
• 20:42
  Speaker 4: had some conversation where after the show or day or
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: show after the show, like, oh, you know what, I
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: wish I had to say that or didn't say.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: That, or da da da dad, and and that's normal.
• 20:51
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, again, I think that's that's appropriate. And I
• 20:55
  Speaker 5: think that's sort of the job of the media, I
• 20:58
  Speaker 5: think is to you know, give that opinion, to provide
• 21:02
  Speaker 5: some expert or some knowledgeable analysis when appropriate, and just
• 21:08
  Speaker 5: to be that voice and provide entertainment as well. But
• 21:11
  Speaker 5: I I but I don't think, like I said, once
• 21:13
  Speaker 5: it starts getting invasive, like I said, that article with
• 21:16
  Speaker 5: Jayalen Hurst and as coach, is that necessary? Why like
• 21:19
  Speaker 5: why are we doing that, you know? Or some of
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: the things that Skip Bayless has said that you know,
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: he's been demonized for like.
• 21:25
  Speaker 4: While we're doing that well, and I think and I'm
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: gonna go to Skip Bayless again just for the just
• 21:31
  Speaker 4: for the fact that you know, he got so big,
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: he got huge, you know, how to the best thing.
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: Everybody's catching him.
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: And I think there's always this, there's always this, oh,
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: you know what, he messed up.
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: He said this.
• 21:46
  Speaker 4: Oh we need to get him on this, you know,
• 21:48
  Speaker 4: and and and and I and I think that you know, everybody,
• 21:51
  Speaker 4: you know, every great athlete has that time where that
• 21:54
  Speaker 4: somebody is gonna get him, somebody's gonna say, oh, he's
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: lost it, you know, he he can't do it anymore.
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: And there's a little bit of.
• 22:04
  Speaker 5: But I think the media now is experiencing that because
• 22:07
  Speaker 5: for a long time it was one sided. I give
• 22:09
  Speaker 5: you that. Ye after he was living in the glasshouse.
• 22:12
  Speaker 5: Everything they do would be critiqued. Now the media is
• 22:15
  Speaker 5: getting that, particularly like with players, you know, having their
• 22:18
  Speaker 5: own podcasts and their own shows and everything. They're giving
• 22:20
  Speaker 5: it back like the media was given. And I think
• 22:23
  Speaker 5: it's it's causing some sort of friction and it's causing
• 22:26
  Speaker 5: maybe the relationship to change a little bit.
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: I think the.
• 22:29
  Speaker 4: Public that's hearing it is uncomfortable with it because now
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: you're both sides. Because now you are not even necessarily
• 22:36
  Speaker 4: both sides, but now what you said and now somebody
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: is now critiquing you. That's like has some status, has
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: some platform.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: Now now all of a sudden, you're like looking like, well, well,
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: hold on, hold on.
• 22:50
  Speaker 5: We got to remember guy like Gift. He's been you know,
• 22:52
  Speaker 5: in his businesses like the seventies, so.
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: He's it's changed, and.
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: It took him a long time to get to to
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: that level. And then I think once he got there,
• 23:05
  Speaker 4: he he felt invincible. Yeah, and and could say anything,
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: you know, he could say, well, you know what, Hollins
• 23:13
  Speaker 4: lewis he he should never have been playing. He should
• 23:16
  Speaker 4: have never you know, I just don't nobody cares what
• 23:19
  Speaker 4: you not to that, not that, not to that degree, nobody,
• 23:22
  Speaker 4: no one, We don't. We don't need you to assess
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: his skill set he played, talk about say he didn't
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: play well, say something, but don't don't say he didn't
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: deserve to be there.
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: He's there. I agree with you on that.
• 23:33
  Speaker 5: And And speaking of Skip Baylor, speaking of the Cowboys,
• 23:37
  Speaker 5: you know really yeah, we're gonna go there. Well, uh,
• 23:41
  Speaker 5: you know, they don't want to pay Dak because we've
• 23:43
  Speaker 5: seen like the huge quarterback contracts. Right, you see Ta
• 23:47
  Speaker 5: get paid. You've seen Lawrence get paid, youve seen Lamar
• 23:52
  Speaker 5: Jackson get paid. You've seen uh love and the packers
• 23:56
  Speaker 5: get paid. I'm talking about like two hundred plus million
• 23:59
  Speaker 5: dollar contracts. As an ex player, how does how do
• 24:03
  Speaker 5: you feel about that? Now you didn't play quarterback obviously,
• 24:07
  Speaker 5: but how do you feel about that?
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: It is?
• 24:10
  Speaker 4: It is, It is tough. But the read again, I
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: get to look at it from hindsight. Looking at it
• 24:19
  Speaker 4: from hindsight, Now you have to know where you're at.
• 24:22
  Speaker 4: You have to know where because you're looking at your career.
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: You're looking at you're looking at people who get in
• 24:27
  Speaker 4: signed how many how many years did they have left?
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: How many years you have left?
• 24:34
  Speaker 4: Because the question is is can you make if we
• 24:37
  Speaker 4: bring a quarterback in?
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: Can you be.
• 24:39
  Speaker 4: The number one quarterback? So before we try to pay
• 24:42
  Speaker 4: you for because one year? Maybe, I mean, I mean
• 24:47
  Speaker 4: he got one. Like to me, he's at the end, Yes,
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: you think so, I do you.
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: Think you have to end? I'm thinking I just don't
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: see him. I just don't.
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: I just don't see him. Just all of a sudden,
• 24:59
  Speaker 4: where's he going up? Where's he going to Let's.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: Just say, let's just say a hot take.
• 25:03
  Speaker 4: Let's just say let's say if he plays three years, Yeah, okay,
• 25:08
  Speaker 4: are those three years gonna be better than the last three.
• 25:10
  Speaker 5: So you're saying he probably reached his climax's potentially, I
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: think so Wow, that's a hot take.
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: I'm just saying I'm not a dollars fan. Let me
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: make that clear. But with the argument about him not
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: not wanting to pay him, but do you but if
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: you're Jay Jones, do you pay him now? I'm probably
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: not paying here's the thing. And let me tell you why.
• 25:33
  Speaker 4: Let me tell you why, because there's too many possibilities coming.
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: See. I disagree with that. I disagree with that.
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: Listen, Okay, Okay, trust me when I tell you Okay,
• 25:46
  Speaker 4: and I and and and there's a whole lot of
• 25:48
  Speaker 4: people out there like, what is he saying? Trust me
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: when I tell you before I'm going to pay this
• 25:55
  Speaker 4: guy talking about two hundred fifty we talk about yeah,
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: maximat before I put him in a mox category. And
• 26:05
  Speaker 4: I'm not sure he is the he is mine, he's
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: the He's the ticket that's gonna take me to the bowl.
• 26:11
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna start all over again with with with with
• 26:15
  Speaker 4: with with with a number one pick as a quarterback. Wow,
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: I see, or I'm gonna trade around for somebody until
• 26:25
  Speaker 4: I get the guy, I'm gonna throw away some picks
• 26:29
  Speaker 4: and and and try to get me somebody that that's
• 26:32
  Speaker 4: that's gonna, that's gonna that that's.
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: Got time to go because he's gotta go now, right.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: Would you say.
• 26:43
  Speaker 5: You gotta go, you gotta get you gotta win the
• 26:45
  Speaker 5: playoff games you had next year at least got to
• 26:49
  Speaker 5: get to the NFC Championship. At least you at least
• 26:52
  Speaker 5: got to get there.
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: You got it? You saying win it. I'm not gonna
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: necessarily say he I'm talking.
• 27:00
  Speaker 4: About the NFC champions you guys.
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: I think he's got to get that.
• 27:04
  Speaker 4: And then the question is, before you hand the money,
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: can you say, can you say we're gonna comfortably give
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: him this money because we think we're gonna go.
• 27:15
  Speaker 5: I mean, I think Jerry Jones has said that without
• 27:17
  Speaker 5: saying that. I don't think he's comfortable. I don't think
• 27:20
  Speaker 5: he believes in that. But I'll say this, when I
• 27:24
  Speaker 5: thought about this, are.
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: You a Dallas fan? No, I'm not at all?
• 27:29
  Speaker 5: Okay, Okay, yeah, but I thought about this, and I
• 27:33
  Speaker 5: guess my perspective is that I don't know how many
• 27:36
  Speaker 5: high caliber quarterbacks out there because I had this argument
• 27:40
  Speaker 5: years ago. Quarterback is truly the hardest position of play
• 27:42
  Speaker 5: in sports because of your physical ability and the processing
• 27:47
  Speaker 5: time that you have to make decisions right and all
• 27:50
  Speaker 5: the things, the things you need to account for within
• 27:53
  Speaker 5: that four to five seconds. And I don't know how
• 27:57
  Speaker 5: many elite or even good quarter even good quarterbacks out
• 28:01
  Speaker 5: there right now because when you when we talk about
• 28:04
  Speaker 5: what they're paying them's going they're paying these guys because
• 28:06
  Speaker 5: it's just not a lot of them out there. When
• 28:09
  Speaker 5: we talk about the NFL to day, like how many
• 28:11
  Speaker 5: Super Bowl caliber guys are out there now? You might
• 28:14
  Speaker 5: have three or four out of sixty seventy quarterbacks.
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: I'm so it's like, if you find somebody who is
• 28:22
  Speaker 4: very good, I don't know. If we say Dak is elite,
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: I'm saying very good, you gotta pain. I agree, I agree, but.
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: But you disagree.
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: But I'm looking at I'm looking at the ownership and
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: what I remember of how that is like when you
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: get to that when you get to that end and
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: you're trying to push that that that that number up. Yeah, bro,
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: they're looking at where he's thirty two. You know, by
• 28:52
  Speaker 4: thirty three we don't even know if he gonna be
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: able to run, and he ain't done it yet. And
• 28:56
  Speaker 4: he ain't done it yet, man, I mean, I'm sitting
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: so so if it's up to you right now, you
• 29:02
  Speaker 4: said you're gonna let Dak play out this year and
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: then we're gonna If you don't make it to where
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: we need to make it, you're gonna Why am I.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: Gonna pay you on the hopes that you're gonna do
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: and you ain't.
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: Done it yet, play out your last contract. Get us
• 29:15
  Speaker 4: somewhere that makes us think that you you can take us.
• 29:18
  Speaker 4: You can take us home and at the end of
• 29:20
  Speaker 4: your career you can bring us home. Okay, maybe because listen,
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: because I got to take a break here. I know,
• 29:27
  Speaker 4: but I just don't know who you get. I don't
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: If you ain't got Dex right now, who better than that?
• 29:33
  Speaker 4: Somebody might take him? You might Do you trade him?
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: You said trade him in load up?
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Do you possibly? Possibly? I don't know. I don't
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: know who you would get.
• 29:42
  Speaker 5: I mean, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you in totality,
• 29:47
  Speaker 5: but I'm saying, if you trade him, you let him go,
• 29:50
  Speaker 5: whatever happens.
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: Who do you get all.
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: Right, hold that thought right there, ladies, that it will
• 29:54
  Speaker 4: take a quick break up.
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: We'll be right now.
• 29:56
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• 31:56
  Speaker 2: All right, ladies and gentlemen.
• 31:58
  Speaker 4: Uh we just left on the break here having a
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: very good argument. So Hollis, put your point out there
• 32:08
  Speaker 4: again for me.
• 32:09
  Speaker 5: No, I was just saying, and again I'm not necessarily
• 32:11
  Speaker 5: disagreeing with you in totality, as I mentioned before, I
• 32:15
  Speaker 5: guess all I'm saying is that when you look at
• 32:18
  Speaker 5: and I'm saying, you got your elite guys that's playing
• 32:21
  Speaker 5: quarterback in the National Football League, and you have your
• 32:24
  Speaker 5: very very good guys.
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: I would pick Dax.
• 32:26
  Speaker 5: He's teetering, right, but he's a very very good guy
• 32:29
  Speaker 5: based off you know, the wins, playoffs, wins and all that.
• 32:32
  Speaker 5: And I'm saying, if you let him go, you're trading
• 32:35
  Speaker 5: who do you get that can fill those shoes for
• 32:39
  Speaker 5: as long as he's been doing it, Because it's been
• 32:41
  Speaker 5: he's been good for a long time.
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: Now, Okay, okay, One, he's not Patrick Mahomes because he can't.
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: He cain't nobody Patrick's I'm just saying that. So to
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: the point of him being able to take a team there,
• 32:54
  Speaker 4: he can't do it.
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: You don't think.
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: No, I know, I can't argue with that now, Okay,
• 33:01
  Speaker 4: I mean, you know what I'm saying, I ain't got
• 33:02
  Speaker 4: much for you. I mean there's court the great quarterbacks
• 33:06
  Speaker 4: that are out there now. Okay, they're taking their team somewhere.
• 33:10
  Speaker 4: Not saying that they don't have a team around them,
• 33:12
  Speaker 4: but they're taking their teams.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: I mean, no, I'm.
• 33:17
  Speaker 5: Thinking because I mean, if you look at Love what
• 33:19
  Speaker 5: he did last season, he took his team to uh.
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: I think he got great pieces around him. Josh Allen
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: takes his team Joe Burrow. Okay, I see where you're going.
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: I see where you're going. They're they're they're doing everything.
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: They're running there, passing there, doing all this kind of stuff.
• 33:36
  Speaker 4: Everything in their in their wheelhouse. They're using to push
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: their team for. But Dax is giving you twelve wins,
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: ten twelve wins every year all the time, right, but
• 33:45
  Speaker 4: every year?
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: But but what is it? What is it getting you?
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: Those those two wins are great? But where are you going?
• 33:56
  Speaker 3: Man?
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: That's where you're going. That's a tough argument.
• 33:58
  Speaker 5: I mean, that's really a tough argument because I just
• 34:02
  Speaker 5: I understand what you're saying, and I'm saying in the
• 34:04
  Speaker 5: playoff time, in the really really crunch moment, when you
• 34:07
  Speaker 5: need to advance where you need to go, you have
• 34:09
  Speaker 5: to he ain't necessarily I don't know if he's inhibited
• 34:12
  Speaker 5: or whatever, but it's not going with him right. And see,
• 34:15
  Speaker 5: and I'm saying, who you get now, and seeing, here's
• 34:17
  Speaker 5: his problem, here's his problem. His problem is not him
• 34:19
  Speaker 5: per se, but because he's not those quarterbacks that we
• 34:24
  Speaker 5: just named who's literally throwing the ball side arm, underhand,
• 34:29
  Speaker 5: whatever they have to do to complete the pass that
• 34:31
  Speaker 5: gets you to the next round of the playoffs.
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: He's not doing that. He's not doing that, man.
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: And the standard for the quarterback now it's Patrick Mahomes.
• 34:44
  Speaker 4: I mean, that's the that's the new Yeah, I mean
• 34:50
  Speaker 4: it is, it is, you know. And even the Super
• 34:53
  Speaker 4: Bowl that Patrick Mahoon lost, he was clearly you know,
• 34:58
  Speaker 4: he clearly if the team would have cooperated, they probably
• 35:01
  Speaker 4: would have won the game because he clearly.
• 35:03
  Speaker 5: Was pushing y'all down there. He just ain't really have
• 35:06
  Speaker 5: the help that he needed in that one.
• 35:07
  Speaker 4: Because and think about it this way, when the game's over,
• 35:12
  Speaker 4: when the Kansas City game is over, how.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: Many times have you said gosh, if he just could
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: have done more.
• 35:19
  Speaker 4: Never, okay, I mean because even if you're thinking of
• 35:21
  Speaker 4: a guy like Jalen Hurts, right, yeah, he took that
• 35:24
  Speaker 4: team somewhere we were just talking about, and.
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: Damn, I never can't can't can Doc run Canny? Canny
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: really run like Kenny can. He really hurt me. He's
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: not a scrambler. He can.
• 35:35
  Speaker 5: He can get you some first downs though, a couple
• 35:37
  Speaker 5: out the pot, a couple, but he ain't a runner.
• 35:41
  Speaker 6: Me.
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: As a defense, I don't have to worry about him
• 35:42
  Speaker 4: as a run. Yeah, you ain't got to worry about no,
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: you know.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: So now now my defense.
• 35:47
  Speaker 4: When I got to go to Kansas City, I gotta
• 35:49
  Speaker 4: think about the running back, quarterback, receivers all I gotta
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: worry about all that. And really, when you're playing Dallas,
• 35:58
  Speaker 4: I'll just assume, let you have hit, Go get your
• 36:01
  Speaker 4: four or five yards, Go get you a first down
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: every now and then, because that's all you're gonna do.
• 36:07
  Speaker 4: Because you ain't you're not gonna I'm sorry to the
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: Dollars fans. I ain't hating on Dallas. I'm just saying
• 36:14
  Speaker 4: I keep saying, he ain't that guy. I don't in
• 36:17
  Speaker 4: your opinion, I don't think. I think the reason they're
• 36:20
  Speaker 4: not paying him, the reason why they don't want to
• 36:22
  Speaker 4: pay him, is because they don't see an upside.
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: He ain't going up. Okay, he ain't going up.
• 36:28
  Speaker 5: That's a tough one that I mean, that's really a
• 36:31
  Speaker 5: tough one to argue. Just kidding, And I'm just saying,
• 36:34
  Speaker 5: based off the state of quarterback, it's just not a
• 36:36
  Speaker 5: lot out there, man, it's not a lot of I
• 36:40
  Speaker 5: would personally say it's not a lot on Dak's level.
• 36:42
  Speaker 4: But let's let's just say this. There's a couple of quarterbacks.
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: There's a couple of quarterbacks who who nobody really thought
• 36:49
  Speaker 4: was gonna be great, good right out of the shoot.
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: Some of them haven't met right.
• 36:57
  Speaker 4: Dallas has to get another They have to get a
• 37:00
  Speaker 4: they have to get a new style quarterback. He's still
• 37:05
  Speaker 4: he's a mixture of that guy that can kind of run.
• 37:08
  Speaker 4: He can run out of the pocket, but he ain't
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: gonna He's not gonna run the ball to hurt you.
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: Okay, you see what I'm saying. Patrick Mahomes is gonna
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: hurt you.
• 37:18
  Speaker 4: He can kill you running the football, and because of
• 37:21
  Speaker 4: the way he can throw the ball the way that
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: he can throw the ball to defend. He's got all
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: the pieces that you need to wear when you cause,
• 37:28
  Speaker 4: like think about it, You're sitting in the film room,
• 37:32
  Speaker 4: he hands the ball off, guy runs ten yards. You're
• 37:35
  Speaker 4: looking at the old line, looking at the running back. Man,
• 37:38
  Speaker 4: they're good, okay. Then you look at the receivers. They're
• 37:42
  Speaker 4: running routes balls right there. Then all of a sudden,
• 37:46
  Speaker 4: you blitz him. The visiting team is blitzing him, and
• 37:50
  Speaker 4: all of a sudden he breaks out of the pocket,
• 37:53
  Speaker 4: goes for fifteen.
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: And to your point, in the Super Bowl last the
• 37:56
  Speaker 5: last Super Bowl, he had the two big twenty thirty
• 37:59
  Speaker 5: yard runs that really put him over the top.
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: So to your point, I mean, you're right.
• 38:04
  Speaker 4: Yeah, when you're breaking down that film, you're looking at
• 38:06
  Speaker 4: that dude because he's the guy that you're that's unaccounted for.
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and and and and again.
• 38:13
  Speaker 5: I think you know, when we're looking at quarterbacks, the
• 38:16
  Speaker 5: new style quarterbacks, you gotta be able to you gotta
• 38:19
  Speaker 5: be Josh.
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: Love C J.
• 38:22
  Speaker 5: Stroud, You gotta be able to give me something because
• 38:25
  Speaker 5: I because I always said, like you, as a quarterback,
• 38:27
  Speaker 5: you need to account for at least three to four
• 38:29
  Speaker 5: first downs in the game, maybe five. But now it's
• 38:32
  Speaker 5: maybe you gotta account for that big play with your legs,
• 38:34
  Speaker 5: and you gotta be able to throw awkwardly, yes, because
• 38:37
  Speaker 5: any kind of way.
• 38:38
  Speaker 4: And you're gonna have people trying to throw that side
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: arm ball. Now, Stafford, they all do it. Really, I've
• 38:44
  Speaker 4: seen quarterbacks practicing that.
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: Now. You know, it's like what they told us not
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: to do exactly.
• 38:48
  Speaker 5: Gotta practice throwing across your body side arm you gotta
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: you gotta have all the angles in your repertoire.
• 38:54
  Speaker 4: If if if a quarterback would have thrown it. If
• 38:56
  Speaker 4: I'm at State and a quarterback tries to throw a
• 38:58
  Speaker 4: side arm ball, I'm pulling him out and I'm like,
• 39:01
  Speaker 4: are you crazy? But now you gotta have it. You
• 39:04
  Speaker 4: now you coaching it. Now you're coaching it. That's part
• 39:06
  Speaker 4: of the coaching. And see and I think I think
• 39:09
  Speaker 4: that that's what's growing out of that's what's growing into
• 39:16
  Speaker 4: the new quarterback and some of those great quarterbacks of
• 39:20
  Speaker 4: the past that are still kind.
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: Of hanging on. We already know.
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: They already know, team already knows they don't have that
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: m They can't bring that to you.
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's a good point.
• 39:34
  Speaker 5: I can't because I mean again, we're talking about a
• 39:36
  Speaker 5: different level of athleticism and athletes.
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: Yes, and you got if you don't have that guy,
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: I mean you better have.
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: You better have a damn Marino as a quarterback if
• 39:46
  Speaker 4: you don't, if he can't.
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: Move, no, yeah, no, those nose don't grow on trees.
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: Now those are not easy either.
• 39:54
  Speaker 5: So and and you know, speaking of athletics, we talked earlier,
• 39:58
  Speaker 5: uh you know, we both big Olympics fans, and what
• 40:01
  Speaker 5: we were talking about. I like the conversation. I want
• 40:04
  Speaker 5: to bring it up now, just about the athleticism that
• 40:08
  Speaker 5: we are getting to witness in these Olympics. And we
• 40:12
  Speaker 5: talk about like when we talk about football in particular, basketball, baseball,
• 40:16
  Speaker 5: American sports where results driven, right, I think even with
• 40:21
  Speaker 5: a Patrick Mahomes, you're looking at, oh he made the past,
• 40:23
  Speaker 5: but you're not maybe looking or the average ran ain't
• 40:26
  Speaker 5: looking at how he made that priss right, or how
• 40:29
  Speaker 5: difficult or how difficult? Here you go, what's the difficulty
• 40:32
  Speaker 5: like a gymnastic right? And I'm watching I don't and
• 40:35
  Speaker 5: we talk about stuff you're watching, but I'm watching, like
• 40:37
  Speaker 5: the diving yesterday, and I'm watching these Chinese athletes go
• 40:42
  Speaker 5: ten meters and hitting the water at thirty miles an hour,
• 40:47
  Speaker 5: doing about fifteen flips and notes blow splash, and I'm
• 40:52
  Speaker 5: just in awe of just the athleticism that I'm seeing.
• 40:56
  Speaker 4: It's and again when you're looking at the men's and
• 40:59
  Speaker 4: the women's gymnastics, crazy, the just the just the ability
• 41:05
  Speaker 4: to get the height and the and be able to
• 41:09
  Speaker 4: stay in the air to do all of the swings
• 41:12
  Speaker 4: and twists, and like I can't even get my feet
• 41:16
  Speaker 4: over one time or another. I'm breaking my neck. I
• 41:19
  Speaker 4: already know, you know, and I'm trying to And when
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: you look at it, you're you're missing it. If you
• 41:25
  Speaker 4: don't look at it and think about trying to do it,
• 41:30
  Speaker 4: you you if you're not truly watching it, unless you're
• 41:34
  Speaker 4: asking yourself, like how would I be able to do that?
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: What? What? At what age could I have even thought
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: that I could do it?
• 41:42
  Speaker 4: And again, you know, I think, you know, I was,
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: so I was so thinking that I was, you know,
• 41:49
  Speaker 4: and not and not taking anything from me.
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: But I was.
• 41:52
  Speaker 4: I'm pretty athletic, you know, I was, you know, I
• 41:54
  Speaker 4: play corner. You got to be athletic to play corner.
• 41:56
  Speaker 4: I can shift and change directions and all that kind
• 41:58
  Speaker 4: of stuff and open my hips and all that. Man's
• 42:01
  Speaker 4: that's a thousand times difficulty.
• 42:05
  Speaker 5: But see, I would argue that not necessarily, it's just
• 42:07
  Speaker 5: that it's crazy to me.
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: But we don't look at that.
• 42:11
  Speaker 5: We don't look at you backpedaling, changing hip directions maybe
• 42:16
  Speaker 5: two or three times within a route, you know, maybe
• 42:19
  Speaker 5: giving the receiver a little leeway. You're playing a game
• 42:21
  Speaker 5: with him. The balls in the air, you catch back
• 42:23
  Speaker 5: up and then do a pass deflection. We're not looking
• 42:27
  Speaker 5: at that and saying marveling and the technical ability and
• 42:30
  Speaker 5: athleticism that it takes to do that. All we look
• 42:33
  Speaker 5: at is saying, he knocked the ball out. That's all
• 42:36
  Speaker 5: we say. And you did all this within a span
• 42:39
  Speaker 5: of five seconds or the interesting thing. Okay, so the
• 42:42
  Speaker 5: interesting thing that I appreciate that, and I think the
• 42:44
  Speaker 5: Olympics it really gives us that time to look at
• 42:48
  Speaker 5: like just drew athleticism not true, but just just to
• 42:51
  Speaker 5: be able to look at it. Cause we mentioned like
• 42:53
  Speaker 5: when you look at a dive, whether the dive is
• 42:56
  Speaker 5: is a seven or ten to the average person, it
• 42:59
  Speaker 5: looked like a ten to us. So they got to
• 43:01
  Speaker 5: break down a little small technicalities because it's that.
• 43:04
  Speaker 4: Level and on the gymnast, like when they hit the ground,
• 43:07
  Speaker 4: like you'd have done fifteen flips in the air and
• 43:10
  Speaker 4: they're expecting you to land solid.
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: You just stick it right.
• 43:13
  Speaker 4: Still, come on it can they not have a step.
• 43:16
  Speaker 5: But but if they didn't judge it that way, because
• 43:19
  Speaker 5: a lot of the guys and girls can do that,
• 43:22
  Speaker 5: they have to judge it because it all is amazing.
• 43:24
  Speaker 5: I mean, even if we were talking about track and field.
• 43:27
  Speaker 5: In the Sydney mcglocktin, she runs the four hundred hurdles
• 43:31
  Speaker 5: faster than most people run a four hundred.
• 43:35
  Speaker 4: Please please say that again and just slow it down
• 43:38
  Speaker 4: so people can can assess the mcglock.
• 43:40
  Speaker 5: And runs a four hundred meter hurdle faster than most
• 43:44
  Speaker 5: people can just run us straight up, and I'm talking
• 43:46
  Speaker 5: about elite athletes can run a four hundred. I seen
• 43:49
  Speaker 5: her in the Semis yesterday and it looked like she
• 43:52
  Speaker 5: I couldn't believe what I was watching. It looked like
• 43:54
  Speaker 5: she was literally jogging bro and were just hit and burned.
• 43:58
  Speaker 5: Everybody burnt the field.
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: Think about it.
• 44:00
  Speaker 4: Because there's been like three or four races that have
• 44:03
  Speaker 4: been like just blowouts. Think about this, everybody that's in
• 44:10
  Speaker 4: the blocks, all eight runners are the best in the world.
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: How to see when when you watch the hundred yard dash,
• 44:20
  Speaker 4: that was great because it was like what point eight
• 44:23
  Speaker 4: something between all of.
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: Them crossing the line.
• 44:28
  Speaker 4: But in some of these, whether it be two hundred meters,
• 44:31
  Speaker 4: hundred meters, all those races, like you're getting some like
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: some blowouts.
• 44:38
  Speaker 2: In some of these races.
• 44:40
  Speaker 4: That you're talking about, you're going against the absolute best
• 44:43
  Speaker 4: in the world.
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: There's nobody else walking this earth that can do it
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: best time period.
• 44:48
  Speaker 5: And the funner ones are the ones where it's tightly contested, right,
• 44:52
  Speaker 5: so you have your blowouts. But I'm looking at like
• 44:54
  Speaker 5: one hundred meters where like I didn't know who won
• 44:57
  Speaker 5: that run.
• 44:57
  Speaker 2: I know, and the same thing.
• 45:00
  Speaker 5: I'm looking at the women's steeple chase yesterday and that
• 45:03
  Speaker 5: was a dog.
• 45:04
  Speaker 4: I'm not I'm not, I would never you. I don't
• 45:07
  Speaker 4: even know how you decide you want to do this, how.
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: You do that?
• 45:10
  Speaker 4: What makes you say you gotta hurdle, you gotta jump
• 45:13
  Speaker 4: over the wall to the water feet feet where no
• 45:17
  Speaker 4: who does that and I watched it, and I watched
• 45:19
  Speaker 4: the young lady.
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: I forget she was.
• 45:21
  Speaker 5: I want to say, I don't want to mess the
• 45:22
  Speaker 5: country up, but I watched her run this race masterfully.
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 45:27
  Speaker 5: I watched the guys in the fifteen hundred meter That
• 45:31
  Speaker 5: was the best best race I've seen thus far. And
• 45:33
  Speaker 5: they're running a fifteen hundred meter in less than four
• 45:36
  Speaker 5: minutes for them fighting at the end, running full speed
• 45:40
  Speaker 5: on the last hundred and fifteen hundred meters, bro.
• 45:44
  Speaker 4: And and and let me in case you have missed this,
• 45:47
  Speaker 4: and I'm sure you'll be able to see it again,
• 45:50
  Speaker 4: watch right immediately after the race, they collapse.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: I mean it's like they are dying.
• 45:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, think about the fact that they're they're sprinting through
• 46:02
  Speaker 4: that line. They're they're they're putting that pain off until
• 46:06
  Speaker 4: they're done.
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: And you see their faces. Yes, because how many times
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: have you.
• 46:10
  Speaker 4: Ever run a quarter And you know when we used
• 46:12
  Speaker 4: to run the running test. You get to that last curve, man,
• 46:16
  Speaker 4: you on the last on the on the fourth one,
• 46:19
  Speaker 4: you you're about to die and you you starting to
• 46:22
  Speaker 4: slow down long before you get to the end.
• 46:26
  Speaker 5: Man, I'm telling you, I just like bro I just
• 46:29
  Speaker 5: I have. I guess I don't know, like I said,
• 46:31
  Speaker 5: or maybe I'm just more acutely aware. But just watching
• 46:34
  Speaker 5: these Olympics and seeing these athletes. I mean we're watching
• 46:37
  Speaker 5: volleyball right now to the to the Olympics. I seen
• 46:39
  Speaker 5: the synchronized swimmers. It's just really just the level of
• 46:43
  Speaker 5: elite athleticism in this world we were I think America,
• 46:47
  Speaker 5: we could we become biased to football, basketball, Yes, but
• 46:50
  Speaker 5: it gets a lot deeper, man.
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: It really does.
• 46:53
  Speaker 4: And and when you start talking about like my question
• 46:56
  Speaker 4: is if I'm a basketball coach, if I'm an NBA
• 46:58
  Speaker 4: basketball coach, man, I'm watching his.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: Volleyball, can I get one?
• 47:02
  Speaker 4: I did one of these guys because they have the
• 47:04
  Speaker 4: vertical they had.
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: Can we teach them to shoot the ball?
• 47:08
  Speaker 5: I mean, look at his brother now he's year and
• 47:10
  Speaker 5: nine for Canada. I mean he has to be Look
• 47:12
  Speaker 5: he looks like he's about sixteen. He's a jumping through
• 47:15
  Speaker 5: the roof. Man, Like it's a it's truly special to watch.
• 47:19
  Speaker 5: And talking about that four hundred, you got something coming up? Uh,
• 47:23
  Speaker 5: because you know, if you if you're an old state head,
• 47:26
  Speaker 5: you know we know about them four hundreds, and we
• 47:28
  Speaker 5: know about a guy who used to be a camp
• 47:30
  Speaker 5: cussing the South.
• 47:33
  Speaker 4: Well, I'm not, I'm not, I don't want to. I'm
• 47:38
  Speaker 4: assuming you're talking about the event with Sterling. So yes,
• 47:43
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna do. We're gonna do one on one with
• 47:46
  Speaker 4: the one that I did with Randy Moss was one
• 47:48
  Speaker 4: on one with me and Randy Moss. But I'm gonna
• 47:51
  Speaker 4: I actually have got my good friend Sterling Sharp, Shannon
• 47:55
  Speaker 4: Sharp's brother, which he would hate to said it that way.
• 47:58
  Speaker 4: He's gonna come in and uh, we're gonna we're gonna
• 48:01
  Speaker 4: get on stage. I'll give you the correct dates when
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: I when I when I secure him, I have secured it.
• 48:08
  Speaker 4: But I want to make sure everything is good. And
• 48:11
  Speaker 4: we'll be putting out some information. We'll be putting out
• 48:13
  Speaker 4: something here and then we'll be it'll be but it
• 48:15
  Speaker 4: will be in South Charleston. It'll be at the Holiday
• 48:17
  Speaker 4: Inn again for those who came last time. And basically
• 48:20
  Speaker 4: what it is, it's a it'll be a buffet dinner.
• 48:24
  Speaker 4: Then there'll be an opportunity to come into the main
• 48:27
  Speaker 4: room and I'll talk and Sterling and talk, and primarily
• 48:34
  Speaker 4: he'll be talking.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he'll be talking.
• 48:37
  Speaker 4: And and and and to tell you like and he
• 48:40
  Speaker 4: gets a bad rap about, you know, not being a
• 48:42
  Speaker 4: media guy or not being overly friendly.
• 48:46
  Speaker 5: But but I'll say this kind of before you go.
• 48:48
  Speaker 5: I thought, because I know he was like an NFL
• 48:51
  Speaker 5: analyst for a while after his playing career, and I'm
• 48:54
  Speaker 5: telling you, man, he was super good. Like can people
• 48:57
  Speaker 5: think like And I know Shannon Sharp probably a little
• 49:00
  Speaker 5: bit more entertaining, but Sterley's sharp as far as you know,
• 49:04
  Speaker 5: having that mouthpiece for the game and be able to
• 49:07
  Speaker 5: talk on it and and be able to be witty
• 49:09
  Speaker 5: and quick like, he was really good.
• 49:12
  Speaker 4: He he has a I think he has a bold
• 49:17
  Speaker 4: here's a Boulder opinion on the game, on on a play,
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: you know, And because he was he was, he was
• 49:26
  Speaker 4: so good and it's a shame, it's a it's an
• 49:29
  Speaker 4: absolute shame that he's not in the Hall of Fame
• 49:31
  Speaker 4: and and and that's that's and that's a media issue. Yes,
• 49:35
  Speaker 4: well yeah, yeah, And I would challenge anybody go look
• 49:37
  Speaker 4: up his highlights, Go look go type YouTube sta Sterling
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: Sharp highlights.
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: He he was phenomenal.
• 49:43
  Speaker 4: And hopefully you don't see me in any I mean,
• 49:46
  Speaker 4: because here's a guy who is leading, tied or behind
• 49:51
  Speaker 4: first or second with Jerry Rice the entire time he
• 49:54
  Speaker 4: was playing.
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: His career ended early because of a neck injury.
• 49:58
  Speaker 4: You know that he couldn't couldn't continue to play with
• 50:02
  Speaker 4: But the numbers speak for themselves, man, and and it
• 50:06
  Speaker 4: just it's just crazy. And because his thing was I
• 50:09
  Speaker 4: think he had an issue with the medium had quoted
• 50:12
  Speaker 4: him the wrong way, and so he quit talking to him.
• 50:15
  Speaker 5: And see, and that's what I'm saying. And again, everybody's
• 50:19
  Speaker 5: entitled to their own opinion has a media personality. But
• 50:21
  Speaker 5: just to come back to that, that shouldn't blind you
• 50:24
  Speaker 5: from somebody's accomplishments.
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: No, right, No, it's.
• 50:28
  Speaker 5: Like it's like t O not being a first battle
• 50:30
  Speaker 5: of Hall of Fame. We understand all the drama. Whatever
• 50:32
  Speaker 5: WU is, How is he not? How is Sterling sharp?
• 50:36
  Speaker 5: Because if Terrell Davis, who had a short career is
• 50:40
  Speaker 5: in the Hall of Fame, right or Megatron, who had
• 50:42
  Speaker 5: a shorter career is in the Hall of Fame, it
• 50:45
  Speaker 5: only makes sense because I think in the time that
• 50:47
  Speaker 5: he played, in that time period, I think he had
• 50:51
  Speaker 5: like the most receptions, most sutdowns within that time frame
• 50:54
  Speaker 5: that he played, and that's phenomenal.
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: And and I will tell you this, And.
• 50:58
  Speaker 4: He didn't have Joe Montanna Steve you No, he had
• 51:00
  Speaker 4: a young breadth off.
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 51:02
  Speaker 4: And and I will tell you this if if you've
• 51:05
  Speaker 4: ever been on the field with someone who could have
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: fun and be that skilled, I mean like he bro
• 51:12
  Speaker 4: he would laugh like he would be laughing, like he'd
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: be like, I'm I'm locked in on him, like I'm
• 51:17
  Speaker 4: I'm covering the man, the Man. And he's like, bro,
• 51:21
  Speaker 4: what what what covered y'all in y'all playing Man the Man.
• 51:23
  Speaker 4: Don't worry about it. I ain't running, I ain't going nowhere.
• 51:26
  Speaker 4: It's a run. It's a run.
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: Don't worry about it.
• 51:27
  Speaker 4: Relax, right, just relax Snap the ball, you know, Like
• 51:31
  Speaker 4: I mean, he'd run through our huddle because he knew
• 51:34
  Speaker 4: because me and him was good friends and and and
• 51:37
  Speaker 4: so he knew all all the guys. He'd come through
• 51:39
  Speaker 4: the He come through our huddle. Y'all ain't calling nothing
• 51:41
  Speaker 4: but but but Man the Man. That's all y'all play.
• 51:44
  Speaker 5: I'd be I'd be jealous of guys like that because
• 51:46
  Speaker 5: I just could. I had to be so locked in.
• 51:48
  Speaker 5: I had to be totally focused and concentrated. And I
• 51:50
  Speaker 5: couldn't do that, see and and and I know I couldn't.
• 51:53
  Speaker 5: I couldn't play that way. I wish I could play.
• 51:55
  Speaker 5: I wish I could play that way like, because it
• 51:57
  Speaker 5: would be fun, way more fun, right, he.
• 52:00
  Speaker 4: Would have fun the entire game, right, talking to talking
• 52:04
  Speaker 4: to all the debates, and I tell the DB's say, look, do.
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: Not fool with him.
• 52:08
  Speaker 4: He's gonna laugh you into the end zone exactly what
• 52:11
  Speaker 4: he's going to do.
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and and and and again because.
• 52:17
  Speaker 4: And I don't know how deep I'm going to be
• 52:19
  Speaker 4: able to get into into his relationship with the with
• 52:23
  Speaker 4: the media, but I really would like to dive into
• 52:26
  Speaker 4: it because.
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: I think the media has the ability to blame.
• 52:32
  Speaker 4: Him, you know, and and I and again because usually
• 52:37
  Speaker 4: I think and again, I think this is a horrible
• 52:40
  Speaker 4: kind of situation that you don't necessarily know who necessarily
• 52:43
  Speaker 4: is voting for the Hall of Fame people or the
• 52:47
  Speaker 4: candidates to go into the Hall. I think you know
• 52:50
  Speaker 4: what bothers me is I think that the media is
• 52:55
  Speaker 4: what's holding him out. And I think that's unfair because
• 52:58
  Speaker 4: if you ask in need dB that played against him
• 53:03
  Speaker 4: and played against Rice, if you if you know in
• 53:06
  Speaker 4: our in our conference, we had to play him twice,
• 53:11
  Speaker 4: and we played we played the forty nine ers once
• 53:13
  Speaker 4: or whatever.
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: I'm telling you.
• 53:15
  Speaker 4: Now, I was more concerned with Sterling than I was
• 53:19
  Speaker 4: with right and not taking anything from him.
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: What is Sterling? He's what by sixty three? No?
• 53:24
  Speaker 4: No, he no, he's right around he's right around my height.
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: He's just about one maybe not. I ain't six two though,
• 53:31
  Speaker 4: by six right right? But he was he was solid
• 53:35
  Speaker 4: like his brother. Oh gosh, yeah, yeah he was. And
• 53:38
  Speaker 4: he was fast.
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: He was fast, and he was strong, you know.
• 53:42
  Speaker 4: He he he caught a pass on me, a dive
• 53:44
  Speaker 4: and catch on me.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: He grabbed me.
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: He knew what I was gonna do. Like I punched,
• 53:48
  Speaker 4: you know, you know how we stepped punch. I punched,
• 53:51
  Speaker 4: got a good thought. I had a great punch on him.
• 53:53
  Speaker 4: He grabbed shoulder pad and everything and just ripped it
• 53:56
  Speaker 4: right like and just pulled it. My jersey was down
• 53:59
  Speaker 4: under over top of my on my shoulder pad, and
• 54:02
  Speaker 4: I'm chasing him. I'm trying to chase him all the
• 54:04
  Speaker 4: way down the field. He dies and makes a catch
• 54:07
  Speaker 4: for he's laughing, wow, like he makes the catch, hits
• 54:10
  Speaker 4: the ground gets up laughing, and I'm looking at the
• 54:13
  Speaker 4: official and I'm like, look, look he's grabbing my jersey,
• 54:16
  Speaker 4: and but he's just laughing, just having as much fun
• 54:19
  Speaker 4: as he can possibly have.
• 54:20
  Speaker 5: I can't wait for that one. So, and speaking, another
• 54:23
  Speaker 5: one of our state brethren, Coach ERL. Monroe, got inducted
• 54:27
  Speaker 5: to the West Leon State Hall of Fame. So we
• 54:28
  Speaker 5: want to send him a shout out and congratulate him
• 54:31
  Speaker 5: for sure on that accomplishment. Yes, sir, Coach Moroe, we
• 54:34
  Speaker 5: definitely want to give you a shout out and congratulations.
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: Man.
• 54:37
  Speaker 4: Just want to give our sponsor one more shout out.
• 54:40
  Speaker 4: Frank Walker Frank Walker Law, Real Talk, Real Experience, Real Results.
• 54:46
  Speaker 4: For more information, go to Frank Walker Law dot com.
• 54:50
  Speaker 4: All right, ladies and gentlemen, we're gonna get out of here,
• 54:52
  Speaker 4: and we appreciate you being here.
• 54:55
  Speaker 3: He Let's Talk with Carl Lee is presented by Attorney
• 54:58
  Speaker 3: Frank Walker, Real Time, Real Experience, Real Results, Frank Walker
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: Law dot Com. Comment on episodes, ask Carl and Hollis questions,
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: or it suggests topics. At our Facebook page, search for
• 55:10
  Speaker 3: Let's Talk with Carl Lee and remember to like the
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: page to become part of the conversation.
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: If you fall, doesn't don't for get back up for
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: your feet. Anything can be a win, yup, even defeat.
• 55:21
  Speaker 2: They say, shits a bath for you.
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: Wise Vinetary Sweet couldn't play with big kids. I had
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: to sit in the street and watch from a distance.
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: But over time I grew. If I put in the work,
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: in no time, I'm doing everything that I worked and
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: prayed the moka. If you ask me how did I do?
• 55:36
  Speaker 6: What?
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna say.
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: You gotta work, cry shine, just mine gotta show. Everybody
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: is my time.
• 55:41
  Speaker 4: He ain't here.
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: You gotta work, cry shine. Love a mind who.
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: Talk of die this day line, don't talk. You gotta work.
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: You gotta work. You gotta work. You gotta work. You
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: gotta work. You gotta work.