Latest / District Territory / Inside the revitalization of the Nationals’ once-antiquated farm system

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Inside the revitalization of the Nationals’ once-antiquated farm system · District Territory

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to the District Territory podcast. I'm Eric Shellhouse
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: from Bat Boys Baseball and joining me today, Kevin Franzen
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: of the Washington Nationals and Spencer Nussbaum from the Athletic.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: The Nationals get a series opener win against the Phillies.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: I think that was important for the Washington DC sports
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: fans out there after Sunday's loss to the Eagles. But
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: you know, Something good for the morale. Spencer, you put
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: out a story earlier today about the little things the
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Nationals have been doing down on the farm system to
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: see some drastic improvements. Nobody in baseball has improved quite
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: as much as them. Talk about the things the guys
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: have been working on down on the farm there that
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: has led to such an incredible improvement.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it'll be hard for me to keep this concise
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: because my editor let me do 3,500 words on this. Um,
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  Speaker 2: I will try my best. I will say the biggest
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: thing that I heard talking to, I know it's probably
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: too much. Um, but I think it was, uh, it
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: was worth it.
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: Uh, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: So my, um, my conversations with players, coaches, executives down
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  Speaker 2: on the farm, um, the biggest thing that I kept
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: hearing over and over was low hanging fruit. Um, and
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: by that they meant adding strength, adding velocity, helping guys
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  Speaker 2: hit the ball in the air, things that aren't necessarily, uh,
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  Speaker 2: easy to teach, but they felt that they had a
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: process to teach and more than that, things that other
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  Speaker 2: organizations had been teaching for a while. So they took the,
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  Speaker 2: I guess, most important things, the big rocks, the low
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: hanging fruit, whatever simile or metaphor they wanted to use.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: And they hit those really, really, really hard. I could
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  Speaker 2: go on in a number of aspects, whether it is
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: their commitment to helping every player and not just top prospects,
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: whether they, I could talk about them adding coaches. I
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: could talk about any individual guy's story, but I would
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: say the main thing that it came back to was again,
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: just doing the things they weren't doing before and doing
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: them at a, at an elite level is why we've
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: seen no farm system baseball on the pitching side or
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: the hitting side have a better year over year than
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: the nationals this season.
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: What do you attribute– I mean, we can always say just,
• 2:19
  Speaker 4: you know, Paul Timoney, Devin Pearson, and Justin Horowitz coming
• 2:23
  Speaker 4: in and revitalizing this minor league system because.
• 2:25
  Speaker 3: A lot of the guys that they.
• 2:29
  Speaker 4: Really improved were guys that were in the system for
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: a while. Because, I mean, you're not trying to get
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: people to throw guys under the bus. You don't want
• 2:36
  Speaker 4: to do that. But, I mean, what do you think
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  Speaker 4: the overlying message was from, let's say, the Mike Rizzo draftees?
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the phrase I heard over and over, again,
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: kind of just came back to, I'd say two pieces.
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  Speaker 2: The first was a confidence piece, right? Where it was just,
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: I think it was a real message as the Nationals
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  Speaker 2: were going through the hiring process of trying to get guys,
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  Speaker 2: get coaches who could instill confidence in players. And beyond that,
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  Speaker 2: I think it was being really, really detailed about telling
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  Speaker 2: guys this is what is going to make you a
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  Speaker 2: great major league player as opposed to this is what
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: we think might help you right now or this is
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: what you could work on and then a couple weeks
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: from then they would change it. I had the example
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: of Ronnie Cruz, right, where not the longest tenured player
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: in the organization but still someone who struggled with swing
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: decisions in the past and at the start of this season.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: But they never deviated from teaching him swing decisions. They
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: were doing it in single A. They were doing it
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: in high A because they knew that is something he
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: will always have to work on. Talking to other guys
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: in the system, again, so much of it came back to, hey,
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: they are showing me objective data that says if I
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: strike out X number of batters or beyond that, if
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: I throw not like X number of pitches, but basically
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: if I have this sort of success, that is what
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: correlates to me becoming a Logan Gilbert in the big leagues,
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: or I'm trying to think of what other comps guys,
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: but like they can see themselves in big leaguers. It
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: is just a matter of doing those things that big
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: leaguers do in the results, in the routine, all those things.
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  Speaker 2: And I think when you see that, when you see
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  Speaker 2: that objective data that says big leaguers do this and
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  Speaker 2: I eventually can do this, I think that went a
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  Speaker 2: long way with the, with the players.
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  Speaker 3: In the org. We talked about it last time.
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  Speaker 4: I think what's impressive about the organization is in itself,
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  Speaker 4: like what we had 12 guys, 11, 12 guys last
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: year that had 10 plus homers.
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  Speaker 3: And we mentioned it last time, 28 guys had 10
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: plus homers this year.
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  Speaker 4: You know, we had, we saw eight guys have more
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  Speaker 4: than 61 walks. 61 was the high last year. You
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: had 106 this year, you know, and then what? 95,
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  Speaker 4: 96 by Eli Willits. Luke Dickerson was a guy with
• 4:53
  Speaker 4: one of the six. Like that's a huge, that's a
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  Speaker 4: huge step up.
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  Speaker 3: To be able to do.
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  Speaker 4: Now, this is a foundational piece, too. Like, you feel
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  Speaker 4: like this is where it all begins, right? Like, this
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  Speaker 4: is almost like the floor of it, you know, in
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  Speaker 4: the development part. That's the cool part about this.
• 5:13
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• 5:16
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• 5:21
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• 5:23
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• 5:23
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• 5:26
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• 5:30
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• 5:31
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• 5:33
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• 5:35
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• 5:36
  Speaker 3: A couple of weeks. Very nice.
• 5:37
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• 5:41
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• 5:44
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• 5:47
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• 5:51
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• 5:56
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• 5:58
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• 6:01
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• 6:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think players can understand that. There are
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: a couple of areas where the Nationals are bad. bordering
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: on cutting edge right but a lot of it really
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  Speaker 2: was about let's get ourselves to the place that other
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: big league orgs are at um i'm just and you
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: know i don't know to the degree that you felt
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: or understood or um were thinking about like org wide
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: stuff when you were a player coming up in the
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: minor leagues but i my impression coming in was like
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: all these guys are just like i'm trying to survive
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: here like I want to be a big leaguer one day.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: Like there's a lot of anxiety around that and you're
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: not really focused on the big picture stuff. And so
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: part of what I guess captivated me or captured my
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: attention was that so many of these guys spoke the
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: same language that if I'm talking to Devin Pearson, if
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: I'm talking to Paul Tavone, they're.
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: Using the same words. Well, that's the part of it.
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  Speaker 4: Like I think people only talked about like the coaching
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: side of it, you know, and making sure that everyone
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: was aligned. But you want players that have the same
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  Speaker 4: vocabulary on the whole thing. You want to make sure
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  Speaker 4: that that's– and it's resonating. They understand it. There's one
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  Speaker 4: thing of teaching it, and I think the part that
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  Speaker 4: really stands out is when you're talking about the Ronnie
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  Speaker 4: Cruz story and teaching it and just continuously teaching it
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  Speaker 4: and continuously educating him on his swing decisions and what
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  Speaker 4: it looks like, what it's supposed to be, and how that–
• 7:42
  Speaker 4: that's the part that resonates with me. Growing up with
• 7:46
  Speaker 4: two parents as teachers, that's what you want, right? You
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  Speaker 4: want it to resonate with the kids. Well, it doesn't stop.
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  Speaker 4: Once it hits, you got to keep going because the
• 7:53
  Speaker 4: next thing you know, you're trying to get to the
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  Speaker 4: next level. And that's the fascinating part about this whole
• 7:58
  Speaker 4: front office and the makeover and the people that they've
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: kept is they're all on this common goal, right, with
• 8:07
  Speaker 4: all different views. So it's okay to have a difference
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  Speaker 4: of opinion, right?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, it is.
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  Speaker 3: It's okay to have that. but as long as everyone
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  Speaker 3: gets on the same page because of you talking about it. Right.
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  Speaker 2: And I, I even, and I, there were so many
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  Speaker 2: things I, even with how long their story was, I
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: didn't include in the story. Like the coaches they put
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: in single A look different than the coaches they put
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  Speaker 2: in high A, right? Like the single A coaches are
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  Speaker 2: a bit more skills based. The high A coaches are
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  Speaker 2: a mix of skills and, um, kind of mental skills,
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  Speaker 2: so to speak, if we're going to use that term. Um,
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  Speaker 2: But you think about a guy like Ronnie Cruz, right?
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  Speaker 2: I went down to Wilmington in, I think, late April,
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  Speaker 2: early May, when he was still having some of that
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  Speaker 2: carryover success from single A, and I talked to their
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  Speaker 2: hitting coach, and he was like, you know, I was
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  Speaker 2: asking him, how is Ronnie going to keep doing this?
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  Speaker 2: Because he's still crushing the ball, and he's like, we
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: know the breaking balls, you know, down and away are
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: going to be a problem for him. We've already seen
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: them be a problem for him. We expect some regression
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  Speaker 2: to come, right? But we believe in this kid. we
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: are going to keep teaching him the way that we did.
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  Speaker 2: And we're going to adjust as we go. And it,
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  Speaker 2: I mean, it's, it's stunning really to hear like, not
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: like predicting the future, so to speak, but they're, they
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  Speaker 2: understand what a guy is good at and what isn't.
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  Speaker 2: And that's, that's why you get the results you do
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  Speaker 2: this season.
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  Speaker 4: It doesn't get over like the positive doesn't overshadow those,
• 9:31
  Speaker 4: those negative sides, because again, it's development. And if you,
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  Speaker 4: if you ignore the, if you put a shadow on,
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  Speaker 4: on those, those things that you really need to hone
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  Speaker 4: in on, you're going to get passed up and it's
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: going to be a lengthy development process on the whole thing.
• 9:45
  Speaker 4: So the other part of this that I'm interested in
• 9:49
  Speaker 4: is because of the success you're, and we've already seen
• 9:53
  Speaker 4: with Travis Fitta, right? Like him going over to grand Canyon,
• 9:55
  Speaker 4: becoming a hitting coach there.
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: He was in AAA as one of the two hitting
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: coaches they had there.
• 10:03
  Speaker 4: The health of the organization is, I feel like, always
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: dependent on having good coaches, but how many coaches get poached?
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: You want coaches getting poached. That means you're doing something right.
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: I asked this exact question to a few people in
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  Speaker 2: the org. I think the best response I got was
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: one time when I asked someone, just kind of point blank,
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: who are the geniuses in the organization? Who are the
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: people that came in and you were like, holy crap,
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: what plan is this guy on? How do we keep
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: him forever? And they were like, we could go down
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: the list here and they did name some names, but
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: the overall point they kind of got to was like,
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  Speaker 2: it is, it is about the system.
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: Right.
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  Speaker 2: And it's why you see organizations like the brewers, the rays,
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: the guardians, um, kind of the elite year over year,
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: small market teams thrive. Um, despite constantly having a front
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: office and coaching talent poached, like absolutely every single guy
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: that is in that, um, or I shouldn't say every coach,
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: but almost every coach in the system right now is
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: helping guys thrive. And that The point was not to
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: say that they are not important or that they are
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: not doing their job well. I think the idea is
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: to get to a place as an organization where you
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: can have talent poached and you know how to replace it, A,
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  Speaker 2: because of staff development within, B, because you are keeping
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: the same hiring practices you had that initially brought in
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: those guys, and C, because the system and the philosophy
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  Speaker 2: should just get stronger year over year. I am not
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: going to sit here and say that they will survive
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: some massive poaching or brain drain. Cause I don't know that,
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: but everything in my reporting suggests that they are thinking
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: about it and that it is something that they're not
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: going to deviate from their processes in part because they
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: think that they want this to sustain no matter what
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  Speaker 2: coaches are in the org.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: Good stuff happening down in the lower levels in the farm.
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: And I'm excited to see those guys come to the show.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: Let's talk about last night a little bit, man, because
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: Richard Lovelady was back and that just fired me up.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: You know, he is my favorite coming in there out
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: of the bullpen. But it was a shutout performance from
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: the Nats relievers, Yovani Cruz, Brad Lord. And then is
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: Eric Tolman the new closer? Franny, I want to start
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: like what could it be? What what does this bullpen
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: mean to the team at this point? Who do you
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: trust down there the most, really, with how the season
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: has gone? Is Eric Tolman the guy that you're turning
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: to in the final weeks here this season? It certainly
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: seems like that is Blake Butera's plan.
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so. I mean, it's kind of out
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: of necessity more than anything. Is he a closer?
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  Speaker 4: I mean, I'm never going to say for a guy
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: coming up from AAA, you know, yeah, he's a closer.
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: He's going to be a high leverage piece. Let's just
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: say that.
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: At some point consistently in his career, we'll see it.
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: You know, what, pitching profiler on X yesterday or last
• 13:13
  Speaker 4: night just said Washington has a demon on its hand,
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: and it's real Vonnie Cruz. And the stuff that he
• 13:17
  Speaker 4: showed last night with the sinker, over 100 that he
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: was averaging, and then you add in the nasty slider.
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: But it was more fastball usage last night that made it.
• 13:28
  Speaker 4: Because when you throw 100 and you have to respect it,
• 13:30
  Speaker 4: you land it in the zone.
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: It's a different beast.
• 13:33
  Speaker 4: When he wasn't throwing strikes with that fastball, the slider
• 13:37
  Speaker 4: was nasty, but it was the one you were looking for.
• 13:41
  Speaker 4: And big leaguers at some point are going to time
• 13:43
  Speaker 4: it up and get everything right. But just throwing a
• 13:45
  Speaker 4: little bit of that two-seamer in there with 100, I mean,
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: it's crazy stuff. I mean, the guy with the worst
• 13:53
  Speaker 4: stuff in that pen is Richard Lovelady. And that mixed
• 13:59
  Speaker 4: in between those guys– I think is, is pretty nice
• 14:02
  Speaker 4: to see, right? Like if you're able, if you're able
• 14:04
  Speaker 4: to go from Yovani Cruz, get it to Brad Lord
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: and then to Eric Tolman and you have him in
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: the middle, that's fine, right?
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: Like that's, that's exactly where you need him to be. Yeah.
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: And I, one, I guess like compelling piece that kind
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: of ties back to both Tolman and Cruz. I actually
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: asked Tolman this the other day when he got his
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: second save, I believe I was like, most guys who
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: were called up from AAA, like, aren't closers within two weeks.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: And he kind of chuckled at that and was, I
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: was like, you know, just what is it like to
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: kind of experience that? And what does that mean to
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: have the organization put that trust in your hands? He
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: kind of acknowledged both like he didn't expect that and
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: he relishes the opportunity to be in that spot because
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: it is a learning opportunity that most guys do not
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: get to have when they are two weeks into their
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: big league career. Um, and I think Cruz is kind
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: of the same story, right? Where he was thrust into
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: high leverage and didn't succeed early on. They sent him
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: back to Rochester again to work on, um, fastball command
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: among a couple of other things. Uh, and I, you know,
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: we have seen plenty of poor results from the bullpen
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: this year. We have litigated that plenty of times. Um,
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: but I think it is compelling that two guys with
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: elite stuff who look like back-end pieces in the future
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: are doing it right now. Is that maybe the best
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: way to do it compared to a slow build-up like
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: Cruz is having right now, 6th to the 7th to
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: the 8th to the 9th? I'm not totally sure, but
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: it is interesting to see the org go about it
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: this way.
• 15:37
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• 16:38
  Speaker 1: Well, I want to talk really quickly about Nassim Nunez
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: being selected as the Nationals representative for Roberto Clemente Awards.
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: It's nominated for the player who best represents the game
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: of baseball through extraordinary character, community involvement, and philanthropy. That
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: was such a big part of Nas' development coming up. Franny,
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  Speaker 1: he just plays with a youthfulness to him out there
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  Speaker 1: that I think a lot of kids around in the D.C.
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: area also see a little bit of themselves when he's
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: out there on the field. But why was Nas such
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: a good selection for the Nationals for this award?
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  Speaker 4: Well, I think it's hard to, to select a guy
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  Speaker 4: to represent your organization in this because, uh, especially with
• 17:23
  Speaker 4: the Nats, they got a lot of guys that.
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  Speaker 3: Do a ton of community work.
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: Um, and that's the part that I find even more
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  Speaker 4: impressive is you have a lot of guys that aren't,
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: you know, on big league contracts, as far as, you know,
• 17:37
  Speaker 4: long-term long-term deals, they go out and they do stuff
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  Speaker 4: in the community because they want to, it's not a
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: have to thing. It's a want to, and I, Sean
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: Bertani does such a great job with the community relations
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  Speaker 4: department and getting guys situated in the spots that they'll
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: succeed in. Same thing as coaching, right? Put them in
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  Speaker 4: great spots. And for Nas being at the Nats Academy
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  Speaker 4: as much as he is, I think it's huge. Seeing
• 18:02
  Speaker 4: someone with that electric smile continuously bringing energy to them,
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  Speaker 4: the kids at Nats Academy, I think is something that's inspiring.
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  Speaker 4: But it's also one that you just you want to
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: be able to focus on Nas, but you can't forget
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  Speaker 4: that so many of the guys on the Nats do
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: a hell of a job in the community. And that's like,
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: that's the part, um, you know, the, the hospital visits
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: that they continuously do, uh, some announced, some are not announced.
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: You love, you love that fact of it. So, um,
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  Speaker 4: I'm always been a proponent of this. Like, look, I
• 18:34
  Speaker 4: was a 2007 nominee for the giants, uh, in my
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: first full years in the big leagues. And it means
• 18:42
  Speaker 4: a lot because you know that, you know, Roberto Clemente
• 18:46
  Speaker 4: obviously was one of the greatest players of all time,
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: but he was also one of the greatest, like he,
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: he was doing charity work before, you know, it was
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: really a thing, you know, when it came down to it,
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: like in, in sport, you know, he died, you know,
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: in a plane crash, trying to do humanitarian work in,
• 19:04
  Speaker 4: in Nicaragua. And I think that's the part where it's
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: not even his, his home country that he was going
• 19:10
  Speaker 4: to try to help, you know, One day we will
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: see a Roberto Clemente award winner being a rookie, being
• 19:18
  Speaker 4: a first or second year guy. Cause every guy that
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: wins it every year, you know, it's not a, and
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: I don't want to sound like it's a knock on him,
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: but it's always someone that's paid pretty well. And you
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: could look at it year over year. There's rarely a
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: guy that's been a minimum guy. I don't think it
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: ever has. So, so many guys do such great work
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: and we need to.
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: Focus on that.
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: And I'm glad Nas is being recognized for that, but
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: it's not the only guy there that does it. So
• 19:47
  Speaker 4: it's a team that could be filled with a lot of,
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: number 21s on the field yesterday.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, just one small piece to add to that or
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: maybe unpack a little bit more that I think Franny
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: touched on. You know, the Nationals, and rightfully so, put
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: out videos, pictures, clips from some of these hospital visits,
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: some of these reading to kids, some of these, um,
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: Nats Academy visits, things like that. Uh, there are so
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: many that we just like never see. Um, and I
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: am not saying that everything should be seen. What I
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: am saying is like, they are in the community. I
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: think more than even like myself as a reporter, Franny
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: as a broadcaster, um, fans, you, Eric, like none of us,
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: I think we have a sense because we try to
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: pay attention to those things. Um, But there is a
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: lot that we don't see behind the scenes. And I
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: do think Nas.
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  Speaker 3: Which is good. I think it's good.
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: Yes. Yeah. There were a number of people that definitely
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: could have been up for this. I think Nas is
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: a great pick for this year. It was really cool
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: to see.
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: Well, I'm going to remind people really quickly to subscribe
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: to the District Territory Podcast on YouTube or Apple Spotify.
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: Wherever you're getting this podcast, you don't want to miss
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: any episodes into the offseason, and we're going to be
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: giving away this Eli Willits signed baseball card once we
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: hit 1,000 subscribers on YouTube. We had a fan comment
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: in the last episode, too. The Nats infield defense ranks
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: 28th in outs above average in fielding run value. Is
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: this something that the team is looking to improve? Spencer,
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: we have kind of approached it, I think, or discussed
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: before about this money ball approach the Nationals have had
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: of just trying to throw runs on the board. rather,
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: I guess, than take an approach, not, not completely ignore
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: and disrespect the defense. Um, but this is obviously something
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: they're working on, but I'm curious, I guess, as to
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: where they prioritize it in comparison to some other things.
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: I don't think they lack prioritizing it. I think it
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: is something that like takes longer to, uh, not work on,
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: but it takes longer to improve. Right. We talked about
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: the low hanging fruit earlier. Um, again, hitting the ball
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: in the air. I wouldn't have known this at the
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: start of the year per se, but I think they
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: find that easier to teach than teaching a guy who's
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: historically been a negative on defense to be better there.
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: I also think the Nats are, and this is not
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: to excuse their defense, I still think it has been
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: below league average when you look at the whole of
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: the year, but we think about how much they were
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: dragged down in April and candidly, how poorly CJ has
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: graded out at shortstop. And maybe don't think about the
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: progress that Brady has made at third base. We think
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: about that play yesterday or any number of plays he's
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: made over the last couple of weeks. When we think
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: about Vivas, who hasn't had a great season, but I
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: think defensively, especially when he's at second base has played
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: pretty well. Louie's improvement before he was traded. I think
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: it is a huge focus from the team. I mean,
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: it is like kind of, Blake be tears bread and
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: butter is a, is defense. And yeah, absolutely. They need
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: to be better. But I, I wouldn't say they are
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: like not spending enough time on it. I think that
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: it is part of their org philosophy.
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: It is for sure.
• 23:15
  Speaker 4: And I think, look, you can't tackle everything all at once. And,
• 23:19
  Speaker 4: and I think that's a huge part of this.
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: You got it.
• 23:21
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: I think the incremental wins is going to be a
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: huge factor. It looks different. If CJ is a second does.
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: Um, you know, the, the other thing too, is throughout
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: the league, there's a lot of teams that are, you know,
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: positive OAA, negative DRS, positive DRS, negative OAA.
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: Um, rarely do you have.
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: Like just these, these align, you know, it's metrics are
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: hard when it comes to defense. I don't believe in
• 23:46
  Speaker 4: all of them because of it. Um, because there's a
• 23:49
  Speaker 4: lot of things that are involved in this whole thing
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: that it just doesn't match up with the eye.
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: Um, you know, so has it, have they gotten better defensively?
• 23:59
  Speaker 4: I would say honestly, yes, they have, but there's a,
• 24:03
  Speaker 4: cause I think they're the factor. You look at the catching,
• 24:06
  Speaker 4: catching has got exponentially better this year, whether it's from
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: pitch framing, blocking, um, game calling, you know, that we
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: know that that's kind of been taken away from them
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: on that.
• 24:16
  Speaker 3: But like the fact that, uh.
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: We're seeing them improve, I would say daily, you know,
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: year over year has been crazy. Um, That takes a
• 24:27
  Speaker 4: huge chunk of how much better this defense is already.
• 24:31
  Speaker 4: Just by the catching position. First base, Louis did a
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: great job over there. He had some spurts early in
• 24:39
  Speaker 4: the year where it was not good.
• 24:41
  Speaker 3: He got better. He got more engaged. You can see
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: that with the guys that continue over there.
• 24:47
  Speaker 4: This whole thing, Daylon, what he's done in the outfield
• 24:50
  Speaker 4: and left field has been as good as a year-over-year
• 24:54
  Speaker 4: change individually. in all of baseball, not just by this team.
• 24:59
  Speaker 4: I think it's that part. I'm looking at this whole
• 25:04
  Speaker 4: thing with the defensive side that a lot of it's personnel-based,
• 25:11
  Speaker 4: and you've got to be able to coach what you have,
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: but it's a little bit different than, let's say, the Cubs,
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: who obviously have.
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: Had the right processes in place to, you know, make
• 25:25
  Speaker 4: sure that they get everything right, everything around, but then
• 25:28
  Speaker 4: they acquire their perfect.
• 25:30
  Speaker 3: Players for their, their positions.
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: And, you know, the peak row Armstrong's to the Ian
• 25:35
  Speaker 4: Haps that they've had, uh, to, to Bregman, to, to
• 25:39
  Speaker 4: acquiring Dansby Swanson and shortstop. I mean, there's a lot
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: that goes in this Nico Horner at second, you develop,
• 25:46
  Speaker 4: you acquire, but you, at the end of the day,
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: they all have to have similar traits that you could
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: be able to go to. So those guys are really
• 25:53
  Speaker 4: good defensively.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I, it's funny cause I also was talking
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: to some people about this as I was working on
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: the player development story. Right. So much of this and I,
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: I candidly, again, maybe could have hammered this home harder,
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: but so much of this comes down to acquisitions, right?
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: Like there, there are certain traits that guys it's simply
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: harder to develop or it takes more time to develop.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: think about walk rates or whatever it may be, but
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: defense is such a huge part of it. I don't
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: know that, you know, it is easier to maybe have
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: Jacob Young be a great defensive player than it is
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: to have, if you put K-Bear out in center, you
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: can't teach him to be a great center fielder, right?
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: That's kind of the simplest way I can put it.
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: Well, the Nationals will open up a bullpen game later
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: today here with Jared Simpson and then kick off their
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: final road trip of the season. Spencer, is it not
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: going to be Jared Simpson? No, it is.
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: It's funny. I wanted to touch on this real quick.
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: It was initially going to be Cade Cavalli. I laugh
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: because I spent like an hour trying to chase this
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: down before the end of the game yesterday. I think so.
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: They're pushing Cade to Friday because they want to give
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: him a little extra rest just with the season going.
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: coming to an end. Um, but yeah, I, I spent
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: like an hour trying to chase down who it was
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: actually going to be. And then, uh, Blake announced it
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: after the game. That's why I left.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: There you go.
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: Um, well, we'll get to see Kate in action on Friday, uh,
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: for the nationals final road trip of the season. We'll
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: be back with another episode over the weekend, uh, until
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: then take care of yourselves, everybody.
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: Peace.