Latest / Naughty But Nice with Rob Shuter / Jeffrey Epstein Special Episode: With Dylan Howard author of the best-selling book “Epstein: Dead Men Tell No Tales.”

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Jeffrey Epstein Special Episode: With Dylan Howard author of the best-selling book “Epstein: Dead Men Tell No Tales.” · Naughty But Nice with Rob Shuter

• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello, and welcome to the Naughty Night Show.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: We've got a very special holiday addition, Labor Day edition
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: today with my friend author Dylan Howard, who has got
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: out the best selling book Epstein, Dead Men, Tell No Tales. Hello, Dylan,
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: Robert's good to be with you again. Fantastic to have
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: you back. So you've got another hit books on your hands.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: Let's jump right in because there's so much to discuss
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: about this. What time is it? It is? Well together now, Dylan,
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: tea time, tea time, Thank you very much. So, Dylan,
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: before we jump into this, give us a little background
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: on why this book appealed to you. Why did you
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: have to do all this work and get this book
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: out well. I had been covering the Jeffrey Epstein story
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: for a number of years along with my colleagues Melissa
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: Cronin and James Robertson for the very As outlets that
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: we wrote for, and we had this abundance of information,
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: court documents, police files that we had accumulated over five
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: or six years of reporting. Now you have to understand
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: that the reason for Jeffrey Epstein's arrest at Teterboro Airport
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: in July last year was the reinvigorated reporting about what
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: took place. We were obviously acutely in a position to
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: be able to deliver on the untold story of Epstein,
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: and immediately decided to write this book. And it stands
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: as the definitive account about how Jeffrey Epstein rose from
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: nothing in blue collar Brooklyn to where he where he was.
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: So you guys were sort of lucky then that you
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: had already done all the work. So if anybody wanted
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: to start an epic like this, it would take years
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: and years of research. But you had been doing that
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: because you were all working reporters for many different outlets,
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: so you had got it. Sounds to me like a
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: treasure trove of information about Epstein, and the time was
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: right to put it all together in the book. Is
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: that correct? Well, that's exactly right. I mean to give
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: you a literal sense as to what happened. I had
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: all my files shipped out to my house, and Melissa
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: flew in from California, and James and myself and her
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: had a retreat here and we worked through all the
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: documents and pieced it together, and the book came together
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: very quickly and very sharply, right, really timely too, so
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: people don't really know who this man is. It's a
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: name that has been floated around a lot in the media.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: Some people are paying a lot of attention. We're a
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: celebrity podcast, so we know I think the name, but
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: explained to us who was Jeffrey Epstein. He was a
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: deeply complex individual. He was somebody who grew up in,
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: as I said earlier, blue collar Brooklyn. His parents were
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: local council workers is I think his mother was a teacher,
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: and he ultimately ended up going to the Dalton School
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: where he was a teacher, and there are stories about
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: his weirdness and his odd behavior. Believe it or not.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: His boss at the Dalton School was the father of
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: the current Attorney General, William Barr. Now. He was booted
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: out of the Dalton School under circumstances that have never
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: really been revealed, and he moved to bear Stone Sterns.
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: An incident took place there where there were some nefarious
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: financial dealings, and he was fired from there. He went
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: to Towers Financial, which, before Bernie made Off, was the
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: largest Ponzi scheme in the history of America. The firm's founder,
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: Stephen Hoffenberg, went to jail for some twenty years for
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: his role in the Ponzi scheme. He has alleged that
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: Epstein also was involved in the the Ponzi scheme but
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: avoided any criminal prosecution. And he believes there is a
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: reason that we will get to as to why Epstein
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: was not charged. But we know him primarily today, at
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: least people listening to this show because of the sex allegations,
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: and I think they're more than allegations. These were proven
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: to be the case. That's what we hear about today.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: So the financial aspect, Dylan, has been slightly underlooked, degree correct.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: The question of how Jeffrey Epstein amassed his fortune has
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: never really been explained, and we go a long way
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: to explaining it. As conspiratorial as this sounds, Jeffrey Epstein
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: ingratiated himself within the uppermost circles of the elite. His
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: Black Book, as has been described, has many many names,
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: very high caliber names. Give us a few of them, Dylan,
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: we know about Prince Andrew in Britain, his names in
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: that book. Who else would we find in that book? Well,
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: Bill Clinton was in that book. We know we spent
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: a lot of time with Bill Clinton. Really It really
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: was a who's who models, I think and people. I
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: think Naomi Campbell was in there, lots of big names
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: that we've heard. Do you know I actually met him
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: once still, and I was working from Naomi Campbell and
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: Tyra Banks and they were doing Victoria's Secrets, and he
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: was one of those guys who was always backstage, and
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: you really shouldn't have been backstage if you weren't working
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: on the show, or if you weren't fabulously rich. His
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: money seems to have allowed him to not only get access,
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: but to get away with this for so long. Do
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: you think that's right? Yes, So the reality was Leslie Wexner,
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: who is the founder of Victoria's Secret, stepped out earlier
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: this year in the wake of the Epstein allegations he was.
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: Epstein was Wexner's right hand man and controlled all of
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: his fortune. Um so he was one individual as a
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: retail tycoon who was listed in the book. Don't forget.
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: There was Donald Trump, the billionaire hedge funder Glenn Juban,
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: former Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak, the ex Harvard president
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: Larry Summers, former New Mexico Governor Bill Richardson, former Main
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: Senator George Mitchell and many others. Now it's critical to
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: note that all of these men have denied any wrongdoing
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: with regards to their involvement with Epstein. But the reality
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: was he surrounded himself with these people, and what he
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: would do was gather intelligence and sell it to the
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: highest bidder. Often in most scenarios that was Israeli intelligence,
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: Saudi Arabian intelligence, or Russian intelli. So he was that
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: high up and mixing with people that really our decision makers, princes,
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: and so the information he had was really national security worthy.
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: And you found out in your book that he was
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: almost dare I say spy? He was a spy. There
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: is no doubt about that. Let me put this into context.
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: Gallaine Maxwell, he's number two, the right hand woman who
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: currently sits in a Brooklyn jail facing six counts on
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: a six county diptment. She was the heiress to the
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: Maxwell fortune. Her father, Robert Maxwell, was the owner of
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: the Daily Mirror newspaper in London and once also owned
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: the New York Daily News. He is a known Israeli spy.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: He was believed to have been killed off the back
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: of his yacht. He disappeared Lady giz Lane in the
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: Virgin Islands. Before that, according to Ari Ben Mshani, who
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: is a whistleblowing Israeli former spy who was Robert Maxwell's
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: spy handler, there was a meeting in the late nineteen
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: eighties in which the business Maxwell's busyness of spine was
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: turned over to Epstein and his daughter Gillane. Wow. Wow,
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: this is like a James Bond novel, except James Bond
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: in this novel is awfully, awfully sinister. How did Gillayan?
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: We've heard her name a lot lately and she's in prison.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: Now you pointed out, how did she get involved with
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein? What's the connection there? She was completely besotted
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: by him. She wanted to be in a relationship with him,
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: She was in love with him. She was in love
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: with him. They had a two year sexual relationship and
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: according to the indictment, they also participated in sexual activities
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: with underage victims as well. Together. She essentially was someone
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: whom couldn't say no to the ultimate power that was
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: this conniving and compelling individual who had everyone wrapped around
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: his fingers. Was charming Dyland? Was there some charm because
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: Obviously the money is power, but there must have been
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: something about him too. Was there a being silly thinking
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: this man could be child? I mean he was a
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: silver fox, he had he was a handsome man. He looked,
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: looked the part, played the part, and had the wealth too. Uh,
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: mixing of those high net worth circles. I mean he
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: had his own island, which has been called Ugy Island
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: in the US, Virgin Island. What sort of money are
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: we talking like? What was his value? What it was worth?
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: A six hundred million, six hundred million, that's still an
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: enormous amount of money. Six hundred thousand, sure paycheck. I wish,
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: I wish. So he was worth about just they have
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: half a billion, A lot of money for a guy
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: who didn't have a job. It's a peculiar question. Where
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: was that money coming from? Foreign intelligence? So I'm one
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: of the few people that has seen inside Jeffrey Epstein's
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: Manhattan Residents, which is the most expensive residents in Manhattan.
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: Now I haven't been inside. I want to clarify I've
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: seen inside. I've seen. Is it sinister or does it
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: look like a beautiful town? Has? It's gordy? It's horrible.
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: I mean, there's this the notorious photo of the painting
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: of Bill Clinton wearing the monica Lewinski drew. Stress. Now,
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: that wasn't in a private vault. That was in the
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: one of the main rooms. So if you was being
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: shown off. So if you went to the house, you'd
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: walk in and you see a beautiful, slightly strange picture
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: of Bill Clinton. But it wasn't a cheap one. This
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: was he he commissioned an artist to do this painting,
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: this oil painting, and I think to therese stuffed animals
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: in there. I think he had liar there was the
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: most importantly, every room had a camera. That camera would
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: feedback to a central system. That central system was next
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: door to a study that had xerox size photocopying machines.
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: So what would what would take place, according to my sources,
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: was that Epstein would bring people over and invite them
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: over for a party. He would have of age women
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: mingle with the men, and then he would seed two
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: underage women or three underage women into the group and
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: they were told who their target was. So you were
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: told tonight, you have to go after target X, and
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: they did, and they did, and then and then they
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: would get then he would get the video and compromising
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: information on that individual and either blackmail them or trade
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: or try and turn them into a source for foreign intelligence.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: So there's a lot of very nervous, very powerful men,
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: I would say, not women, but men in the world
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: that should be terrified today. Yes, now, I didn't believe that.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: I thought that with the arrest of Galain Maxwell, that
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: they had effectively achieved their highest target. And indeed, the
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: government had said that there would be no superseding indictment
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: on Galain Maxwell, and they didn't plan to file charges
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: against anyone else. What I can tell you is that's
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: not the case. The investigation remains very active. The FBI
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: has this as is a priority one case. They filed
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: recent court documents indicating that this story, or certainly this case,
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: is not over. And I also learned from a source
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: that somebody whom I believed, through assumption because of the
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: way in which the case was built against Galaine Maxwell,
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: had participated in exchange for immunity or a non prosecution agreement.
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: The reality was that this individual has not, and she's
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: now living in a country that where there is no
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: extradition treating. Dyln't talk us through his suicide, his death
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: and why that is so controversial. So that made a
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: lot of news here. What happened there? What do you
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: think went? Well? Everybody loves a conspiracy theory. Who doesn't.
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: It was very convenient for people to think that Jeffrey
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: Epstein would have been murdered because of the secrets that
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: he held. Probably not just convenient, I mean, it's sort
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: of maybe a logical conclusion if this goes as high
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: up as you say, and I totally believe you're reporting here.
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: People wanted him gone, and when he was locked up
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: in that jail cell with nothing to do for twenty
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: four hours a day, that might have been an opportunity.
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: That's where the conspiracy theory sort of comes from. Where
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: are you in this? Do I think that Jeffrey Epstein
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: ah was strangled and murdered? No? Do I believe that
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: he was given the means, motive, and the message to
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: commit suicide. Absolutely, the simple reality of the fact. For
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: anyone who covers law and justice, they know that if
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: someone attempts suicide, which Epstein had two weeks earlier, you
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: are not returned to regular prison population. So soon thereafter,
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: two weeks later, he was returned to regular population. He
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: was given regular clothing. So that was an opportunity to
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: strangle yourself. Dlaane Maxwell, for example, now is wearing paper
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: as her clothing because she's she's the most watched prisoner
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: in the world at the moment. Really he wasn't. How
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: come he was? Well, I mean that begs. There are
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: some serious flaws from the d o J, which runs
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: the correctional arm of the law enforcement branch, about why
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: they allowed Jeffrey Epstein back in a regular prison population,
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: why they allowed him to have electrical appliances with cords,
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: and why they allowed him to have prescription meds in
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: which potentially overdose. So what your theory is is that
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: he was given the opportunity to do this and he
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: realized his life was never going to be the same.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: He wasn't returning to the most expensive residents in New York.
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: It was over, so he took that way out. Well,
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: he's only He's only legal defense, and this is the
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: only legal defense that Gillay Maxwell can use is the
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: two thousand and seven, two thousand and eight plea deal
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: in Florida that Jeffrey Epstein struck a single count. I
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: think it was for prostitution, not underage sex. At such
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: a low conviction, how did he His only defense was
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: to suggest that double jeopardy existed, that he could not
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: be prosecuted again for crimes in which the government had
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: the opportunity to prosecute him earlier. And as part of
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: that deal, he struck an agreement with the government that's
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: so called in quotation marks others would not be also
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: charged with relation to the sex traffickings. Very unusual. Listen
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: to it. It is they weren't named. So Gillain Maxwell
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: lived a life in America believing that she was protected
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: by that very agreement at a time when she could
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: have fled the country under her French citizenship, used her
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: twenty million dollars to leave, but she didn't because she
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: never believed she was going to be untouchable. She wasn't
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: You mentioned earlier that the d o J that Mr
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: Barr's father at one point employed Jeffrey Epstein. There's got
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: to be some sort of speculation about that, or is
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: that just a coincidence. I mean, I think it is
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: a coincidence, but certainly one indication about William Barr's connection
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: to this case raises some serious dare I say it
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: nefarious connections. The father's name was Joseph and in fact
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: had authored a book which was fantasy, sexual sexual fantasy
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: that involved young women. Um and to that extent it
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: raises just he had another twisted element to this particular story.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: It's a wild story and you do amazing, amazing job
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: in its want to say the book the book is Epstein.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: Dead Men Tell No Tales. What was the most surprising thing?
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: You've been a journalist, a top journalist for decades, Styland,
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: You've seen a lot. What surprised you about this story? Well?
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: I think it is what hasn't happened yet that that
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: I think he's going to be the most compelling part
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: of this story. Gallaine Maxwell, she represents not the number
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: one target for the Southern District of New York, which
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: is the governing body that he's prosecuting this. She has
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: three options. She can admit guilt and they will probably
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: reduce her sentence and drop the perjury charges. Two, she
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: could choose to fight this. She should not. The Southern
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: District of New York doesn't bring a case against anyone
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: unless it is unimpeachable, So before they prosecute they know
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: going to win. Got it? So she's up the proverbial
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: creek without a paddle. What's the third option? Would be
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: to sing and sing like a canary. But I'm told
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: via sources close to her that she won't do that.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: She doesn't want to talk about particularly Prince Andrew, and
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: she doesn't want to talk about Bill Clinton. Now, the
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: reality of the situation is you don't get a choice.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: If you tell on one, you must tell on all.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: But the bigger question is this was such a complex
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: intelligence operation for the purposes of blackmailing powerful individuals and
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: politicians in the United States and abroad, and it went
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: on for four decades. So it does not discriminate along
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: political lines. It's not an ideological argument that you can say,
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: let's use this as a campaign tool in the current
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: election to dig up the Democrats or dig up the Republicans.
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: For four decades, these people who were the world's most
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: worst sexual predators were allowed to roam free for decades
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: on American soil. Who knew what, when they knew it,
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: how they knew it, and why they did nothing about
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: it is going to be the most revealing part of
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: this case. If it goes to trial, be careful if
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: you look down the rabbit hole, because you might find
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: something far more sinister. I can't see the government wanting
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: to do that. I can't see William Barr wanting to
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: do that. So I think you'll find that there would
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: be enormous pressure being placed on Gawaine Maxwell right now
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: behind bars to take a deal that means that means
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: she likely will never see daylight again. What do you predict?
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: The final question, Dylan, what's going to happen next? What
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: should we keep our eyes on? What's going to she'll
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: take a plea deal. She's facing thirty years jail, she'll
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: probably get fifteen to twenty UM. She's in her late fifties,
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: so that means that she's not likely to see daylight
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: until she's seventy to eighty m. I simply can't see
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: any charges being dropped against her, and I can't see
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: any defense attorney suggesting to her that it's worth going
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: to court to try and get this tossed out. But
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: I do raise one pure scuttle but suggest and it's
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: a what if scenario. We know that she was married,
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: but we don't know who she was married to. She's
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: refused to identify the identity of the man to pre
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: trial services, which looks after the chaperoning of someone from
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: here to jail to court. What if, and I place
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: a significant emphasis on IV Maxwell seek secret husband is
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: none other than Jeffrey Epstein himself. What would that mean?
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: It means that she has a get out of jail
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: free card because the notion of spousal privilege is not
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: terminated by death. So every piece of evidence that the
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: government has, emails, handwritten notes, phone records, even witness testimony
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: to some extent, could be struck out of court because
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: she's his wife. Because she's his wife, Dylan Howard, you
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: are the best in the business. This is an ugly,
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: ugly story. Nobody has told it better or with more
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: compassion than you. Once again, the best selling book is
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: Epstein Dead Men Tell No Tales. Hey, thank you for listening.
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: Don't forget to subscribe on I Heart Radio, app, Apple
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: podcast or wherever you listen. Leave us a review, and
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: remember altogether, Dylan, if you're going to be naughty, you've
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: got to be a wife. Take care of everybody. Thank you.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: It's not even nice with b