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75% Therapist with Sean Linder | Financial Planner Search · Financial Planner Search

• Chase: All right, Sean Linder, welcome to the show. Great to have you on, man. Sean Linder: Thanks for having me today, Chase. Sad to be here. Chase: Yeah, I've been yeah, I've been really looking forward to it. So let's jump right in. tell us about your practice and what you specialize in. Sean Linder: Yeah, so I have what I would consider to be a rather boutique practice. we specialize in dealing with high net and ultra high net worth individuals that come from a lot of different walks of life. but their one commonality is they have fairly complex financial lives. And, you know, our one model that we have here at is you know we we we strive to simplify the complexities of family wealth. so I'm more than happy to get into you know who we work with, how I work with them, but you know, from a high level standpoint, it's it's it's high net worth, ultra high net worth individuals that have complex lives is really what what our core bread and butter is. Chase: Yeah, I want to talk a lot more about who your clients are and why they why they come to you. But before Sean Linder: Mm-hmm. Chase: that, why don't you tell us a little bit about what inspired you to do this? What's your what's your origin story? Sean Linder: Yeah, yeah. So I've been I've been in the advisor space since I graduated college. So we're going back about sixteen years now. you know, I started out at a as an analyst, kind of gr worked my way from an analyst to being a service advisor to being a a full fledged, you know, producing advisor pretty quickly. And I started out at a firm. I've I've always been in the independent world, independent advisory practices. and and at the first the first Company I was at, we we really worked with we worked with with high net worth individuals, ultra high net worth individuals that have, you know, like I said, complex financial needs. And I really saw the value that the advisory relationship could bring. And that really kind of molded how I wanted to build out my own specific practice. it was really that the value that we could bring to those relationships that had those complex financial needs that that really I felt brought a lot of value to. So that kind of that kind of built around my my philosophy on how I work with clients today. Chase: And so how how did that experience shape the way you approach your practice today and how you work with clients? Sean Linder: So it it was a very personalized approach. we did not have a lot of clients at the firm. Chase: Mm-hmm. Sean Linder: as the same goes with me today. You know, I never aspire to have hundreds of clients. You know, I have what I would consider to be a very intimate book of business and book of individuals that I work with. and because what what I found was you really have to for the for these individuals and these families that have really complex needs You you really have to give them the time to help them facilitate their needs, wants, and desires with their within their financial lives. And and that takes a lot of time. And it it you you don't have the amount of time to do something like that if you have hundreds of clients. You know, I never wanted to take this one size fits most approach and just kind of tweak it around. I really wanted to bring a personalized, customized approach to each of our relationships. And that's what I was doing then and I that's what I continue to do now at at Honor. Chase: Was there something that you experienced or something that you saw early on in your career that inspired you to to take that specific approach of of avoiding being, you know, having the hundred clients and being able to focus on a few? Sean Linder: Well, I would say y it it really comes down to the relationship. Is really what it what it comes down to, Chase. You know, it's the finances are a very intimate topic. You know, it's it's one where, you know, not a lot of people like speaking openly about their financial situation. You know, it's not it's not a common discussion. Right? You know, you're not going out with your buddies and saying, hey, you know, let's go over, you know, let's talk about each other's balance sheet and you know, what what what what struggles or what what opportunities do you have, or so on and so forth. So it's a very, it's a very intimate part of your life, right? And and it takes a while to to to form that relationship. And and it was the relationship aspect that I really gravitated towards. You know, it's it's it's I found that you know, at least the clients that I work with, they really value the relationship. Side of things and really I I try to take an approach where I want to work with multiple generations. So if if you look at the clients that I work with now, it's not only generation one that have maybe earned the money or built the built the wealth or whatever, but it's it's also generation two, which is their children, and then in some cases I'm I'm I'm on generation three. And a lot of our clients, they they have they're they're fortunately in a situation where They they've built generational wealth. And they they want to make sure that the other generations are stewards of this wealth. So it's not just the blocking and tackling of, you know, how do we have the right estate plan in place? Do we have the right entity structures in place? Do we have the right portfolio asset allocation? You know, it's not just that, it's more, it's also about the the educational piece, you know, making sure that these other generations really understand what it means to be a steward of this wealth and what this wealth means and what are the opportunities and what are the drawbacks of it, right? And and what can you do and what can they do to to really extend this out, to really help the family over successive generations. And it was really that that relationship piece that that I really value and I and I find that that my clients really value that that kind of builds our framework. Chase: So before we move on to talking about your clients, which you're gonna do here in a second, Sean Linder: Yeah. Chase: I'm curious how would you contrast the way you work with the way you see other advisors in the industry working? Sean Linder: That that's a great question. You know, it's it's interesting. We're we're in a unique you we're in a very unique time in this wealth management industry, and I'm sure you you you see this all the time just doing what you do. There is it's very well documented that there's a succession issue right now in wealth management. It is you have a very rapidly aging advisory base and you do not have the backfill of younger advisors such as myself coming up, right? So what you're starting to see is a mass migration towards these large aggregates. Right. And you can name off a a whole slew of them, but they're everyone's going out and they're buying up, you know, different practices here and there. And really it's it's a function of one, there's there's a succession issue within that that that that smaller boutique practice. And two, you know, quite honestly, valuations are are are pretty high as well because private equity has come in and they're backing this and on and so forth. But what I've been seeing a lot is when when you kind of go to that that much larger firm type scale, you start losing that intimate connection and you're going more or less from being chased to now you're being more so an account number, right? And one where it's okay, here's box A, B, and C, we gotta figure out how Chase the client can fit into box A, B, or C and maybe we we treat we tweak things around the around the edges a little bit to to provide that customized feel, but it's still box A, B, and C. Right? And it's it's i you're you're losing that that intimate approach and your that intimate relationship with the client when you go through that. Is what it comes to. You know, and I think quite honestly I think we're very uniquely positioned. You know, I I can confidently turn to my my clients. You know, I was tell I was telling you before, you know, I have a one and three year old here. and I can confidently turn to my clients and say, hey, you know, this is a new relationship. It's going to take time for us to build this relationship. But what what I can promise you is I'm I'm not going anywhere anytime soon. I have a pretty long runway in front of me. You know, I will be here through the most one of the most pivotal points of your life, which is transitioning either from owning a business or going into retirement, or whatever it is, right? That next phase of your life and hopefully seeing it through to the to your successive generations. Chase: So now let's talk about who who comes to you. Describe the kind of person who typically comes and finds you and says, I want to work with Sean. It works well with you. Sean Linder: Yeah. Yeah, great question. So like like so we'll start let's start off, you know, high level and we can kind of work our way down. like I mentioned core clients are high net and ultra high net worth individuals that have complex financial needs. We we really we wanna act as the personal CFO for those for those families. And we wanna help coordinate not only, you know, the investment management side, but the estate planning side, the tax management side, anything that touches the financial side, insurance side, you know, we wanna have a our hands on and help quarterback that situation. Okay. when we dive down into like what what what are the what's the backgrounds of of a lot of my clients, it's the the core of my client base is is business owners. And a subcore of that, quite honestly, is is a unique niche. I work with a number of McDonald's franchise owners as well, which have their own unique opportunities and challenges. You know, but all my clients aren't franchise owners. You know, I have other business owners that that have either started, you know, a healthcare business or a trades business. I have a couple corporate executives that I work with. I actually just brought on my first NIL athlete. so that's been that's been an interesting experience, you know, go walk working through that. it's been a great experience, but it's it's been different, right? 'Cause because they have their own unique set of challenges that that come to them. Right? You know, it's not a gradual build up of wealth, it's kind of a sudden wealth thing. And they're like, my gosh, you know, I went from being a a starving, you know, college kid to now I have all this money, what do I do with it type of thing, right? And and the educational process that goes around it. So it's I've really grown this business grassroot blaze. You know, it's it's been through referrals. You know, it's just doing right by the client and and them making introductions to their friends, their business partners, their acquaintances, and it's kind of just Built into what it is today. Chase: So what are the questions they typically ask when they meet with you for the first time? Like what's keeping them up at night when they first come to you? Sean Linder: I I I I think the biggest question that that they have is yeah, I a lot of them come and they say, Hey, listen, I've been doing it this way my whole life basically. Right? A lot let's just take a business owner. I've been building this business my entire life, you know, I've been doing what I think to be a good job at it, you know, and you can see just by the value of the company and so on and But they they s they look at it and they say, I've been doing it this way. It's worked, but I don't know what I don't know, type of a thing. Like what am what am I missing here? You know, because they hear, you know, the you know, the more the more wealth you have, the more complexity you have in your life. And they're like, What what what am I missing here? What aren't I doing right? I think quite honestly, that's the biggest core question. You know, I I very rarely do I get a client that that comes to me and says, Sean, I have this specific need. that needs to be fulfilled and that's it. It's more or less along the lines of, Sean, you know, I've I've done well up until this point. I just don't know I don't know what I don't know. And I need some assistance, you know, making sure that I have all the, you know, everything everything in order. because, you know, they could they could be running into estate planning issues, you know, estate taxation issues, you know, and there's there's different things that that that pop up and I you know, we can go into, you know, any types of of scenarios. But it's it's more or less along the lines of I don't know what I don't know. Can you help me out here? And tell me what I don't know and what should we be doing? Chase: So what's a typical situation that you lead them through? Are there any stories that come to mind or stand out to you? Sean Linder: Yeah, I got one. I got one. So this is this is one of my clients. he him and his is is him and his family, they they they they grew a very very successful business. they were when I started working with them, they were I would say six, seven years away from from selling the business. And we knew the trajectory of the business. They were going to have they were gonna have well in excess of a nine figure. And like what what do we do? This is a lot of money. We have more money than we know we're gonna spend. But how do we structure this? What do we do? I d I don't know how I don't know the best I don't know the best route to go with with when we do have this windfall. What are going to do with all these proceeds, right? And one of the best things we did was we helped them implement different various trusts and and we what we did was we moved part of the ownership of the business away from them personally. Because they they were gonna have a huge estate tax liability at at their passing. And they're like, we want we want to preserve this wealth, we want to take care of you know our immediate family, our indirect family, you know, we we just want to make sure that that everybody's taken care of. And one of the best things we did was was moving that ownership away from them prior to sale because there's a number of different levers that you can pull as a business owner from an estate planning standpoint. So and and we'll just go into this one, but for instance, everyone right now. They have about $15 million that they can give to anybody, federal estate tax free. Right? Anything up so for a married couple, it's $30 million, basically. Right? And anything over that $30 million, though, gets taxed at 40%. So that can be a pretty hefty tax bill if you're looking at a at a nine-figure net worth at your passing. And what we were able to do was through a series of installment sales and gifting, we were actually able to move fifty million dollars of this couple's net worth out of their net worth, which ultimately is going to save them about twenty million dollars of estate tax at their passing. And what's also more impressive is we were only a we were able to do that by only utilizing four million dollars of the fifteen million dollar exemption. Because as a business owner you have a lot of different levers like I mentioned. You can have things like a minority ownership discount or an illiquidity discount that you can take on those shares. If you have debt on your company, the IRS takes the net present value of that company. So you your your enterprise value minus your debt gets you your net value, right? And there's a lot of different things that we can do to reduce that value of your of your of your business that you're you're you're moving out so we can preserve as much of that lifetime exemption as possible. So that's that's just, you know, and then he went Went through, he was operating the business, the business grew, we get to a sale, very successful sale for the comp or for the family, and and ultimately, you know, we save them twenty million plus of estate tax at the at the end of this, you know, and that and that excludes all the growth that's going to come in that trust as well. So I mean that's that that n that twenty million dollar number, that's just gonna grow exponentially over the decades. Chase: that's awesome. you must be one of their favorite people now. Sean Linder: Yeah. Chase: as far as your clients' values go, what do you what would you say are the some of the common values that you see pop up among them? Sean Linder: I th they they value the relationship. I would say that's first and foremost. You know, they are there there's a lot of different options now in the wealth management industry. There's there's you know, there's a lot of do it yourselfers, you know, a with with AI among us, you know, that's that's the next biggest thing is is hey, don't work with the Sean, work with the Chat Bot type of a thing, right? And it they really they really value that relationship that we've built and and me acting as their sounding board for a lot of things that pop up in their lives. You know, it it's I talk to I I talk to my clients a lot more about personal issues that they have and just working through it more so than the financial piece, to be quite honest with you. It's it's I'm really there as their as their as their personal sounding board for issues that and and comp and complexities that pop up and different situations. They're like, hey Sean, you know, we have this situation, how would you address it? and we would just talk through it. So I think that's that's the one element that I think they value the most is is the relationship. Chase: So you often become kind of like a guide and a counselor for for your clients as well, not just moving dig digits around on a screen. Sean Linder: yeah, exact I I tell you know, I I joke I joke with my clients. I I'm like seventy five percent therapist, twenty five percent financial advisor. So Chase: Ha ha ha. Sean Linder: it's but it's great. It's it's it's I everyone I work with is, you know, I love to death. They're great people. They really are. And it's it's fun. It's Chase: I love that. Sean Linder: been it's been a lot of fun. Chase: So who do you absolutely not work with? Who is who would be someone who'd who would come along and say, Sean, I wanna work with you and you would say no. Sean Linder: I yeah, that that I to be frank, I have I have run one rule in my my firm, you know, and and as as the founder I I can have this rule. no assholes is my one rule. So if you're an asshole, Chase: I love it. Sean Linder: you're you're but but all jokes aside, I I think where wouldn't we be a good fit? Do it yourselfers is probably one. You know, if you if if you have if if if you feel like you want to manage your assets yourself and do your planning and things like that, there are a lot of resources out there today where you can do that a lot more inexpensive than going out with it. To be quite honest with you. You know, so one one I would say it would be do it yourself first. Two, it would be it would be individuals that are like, Hey, I have one specific need that needs to be addressed and one need only. So if you came to me, Chase, and you're like, hey Sean, you know, I I don't want you to do any planning for me. I don't I have my a financial plan set. I have my estate plan set. I had all all I want you to do is manage my assets. Probably not a good fit. because because of the approach I take, I really take it like taking a holistic approach. I think it you really have to have all pieces of your financial life talking to one another in order for everything to be moving in the right direction. so it just goes against my philosophical viewpoint. i quite honestly. And so I I would say if if you put it in a broad category it's really the Chase: So it sounds I think we have a pretty clear picture of who you work with and who you don't. Where do you typically find your client or how do how do your tip clients typically find you? Where do they come Sean Linder: Yeah. Chase: from? Sean Linder: well, like I mentioned, it's it's been a it's it's been purely a grassroots approach here. You know, it's they have they have came to me through through relationships that I've had, whether it's existing client relationships, or professional relationships that I have that that have been made that have made introductions, that has been really the the the only way I've grown my business up until this point. Right, wrong or indifferent. That's you know, that's it is what it is, right? Chase: with that grassroots approach and it really being referral based, I think that speaks a lot to the trust that your clients have for you if they're willing to refer their friends and family to you. Sean Linder: Yeah, I hope so. I I think it I think it is. You know, i it's it's I I know I know whenever I'm you know, one of my friends asked me for a referral, whether whether it's a contract or anything like that, I I'm not gonna refer someone I had a bad experience with. So I I hope, you know, it's it's it it has been a good experience. And and I I think it has. Yeah. Chase: So when it comes to your practice, where do you see it in the next one to three years? What's your vision? What are the goals you're working on? Sean Linder: Yeah, that's a great question. It's like I mentioned, I I will never have a book that's hundreds of clients. That is I I can I can tell you that. I if if you you just there just isn't enough time in the day to serve these individuals how they need to be served, you know, and having a very tailored, customized approach to each individual family, it takes a lot of time. It really does. so I never envisioned I nor nor could I. I'd have to completely change up my business model, to be quite honest with you. If I was like, hey, the growth machine's on, you know, I'm just bringing in, it's it's an asset graph, right? Bring in as many clients as you can, type of a thing, right? but as I, you know, over the next I would say three to five years, where I see this going is really just refining, refining the process that I I've started to build. You know, being able to provide additional services, being able to provide better services to the clients. can continue building that relationships with the ones that I have. You know, it's I have a number of clients, you know, they they come to me. It's I I'm not one that looks at minimums as far as AUM goes. because I can tell you right now, my largest relationship that I have now, we start out with a $200,000 portfolio. And it's now approaching nine figures, right? So it's it's I don't look at what is what w you have to have X dollars to work with me. I I more or less look at clients and say, what what complexities do you have and can I bring value to the relationship? And can we grow this for the long term? Right. So over the next couple of years I have a number of clients that are are looking for b looking to exit their business, so continuing to help them through that process because quite honestly, outside of starting the business or starting a family, this is probably next to their their their biggest life event that they're they're gonna go through. so helping them through that and really just refining what I've what I the foundation that I built today and going on from there. Chase: So are you facing any challenges in achieving what you want to achieve in the next few years? Is there anything standing in your way there? Sean Linder: That's a great question. Is I I think it it's w I think the biggest unknown is gonna be the evolution of AI. You know, and and maybe that's maybe that's like a standard answer to this, but it but there's a lot of unknown, quite honestly, that goes around it, you know. And what what is the evolution of these of these codes going to be and how is it going to, you know, affect, you know, our daily lives, to be quite honest with you. it it's That's probably the big I I I wouldn't l necessarily classify that as as a challenge. I think it's I think it's more or less an uncertainty that's out there. because what you're seeing, you're just seeing you're just seeing the rapid development of different technologies and different ways to implement it. And it's it there's there's a big there's a big question mark, I think just in society in general, about what what is Chase: Mm-hmm. Sean Linder: life gonna look like in five, ten years with all this with all of this, right? Chase: Quick though, what do you have any predictions for for how our our lives and how your practice and how we rel do you have any predictions for what's gonna happen on the AI front and how it's actually gonna affect our lives? Sean Linder: I mean it kinda I mean on one sense in in one sense we're all you know, you you hear, you know, we're we're gonna be living, you know, real life iRobot situation and we can all put on our Will Smith hats, you know, and and we're we're Chase: Yeah. Sean Linder: fighting these you know, these robots. no, y jokes aside, I think there's I personally, you know, just just knowing how I am and knowing how I work with my clients and knowing the value what they value, I I I have a Hard time seeing a chat bot replacing humans in the sense of the relationship that's out there. Right? You know, and and let's be honest, like the markets have been relatively calm over the last number of years. You know, I mean COVID aside, I even COVID, I mean during COVID it was and I started my practice in the but it it's I mean the market I mean it was down significantly but it bounced right back, right? And so we haven't had a very long drawn out process or or down market in a in a long time, to be quite honest with you. so so no one's really been challenged, I'd say, from an investment standpoint. You know, you've had these little blips here or there, but they've they've basically it's been the the market's been coming roaring back, you know, and it's only a matter of time. It'll happen again. And it's it it's it's one of those where it that relationship piece is going to be crucial when that when that happens. And and so I I I think, you know, artificial intelligence, you know, I'm seeing it, I'm seeing all the benefits of it. You know, you you you look at all just the different systems that we have and they're they're implementing Chase: Okay. Sean Linder: it and You know, it's it's there's a lot of benefits to it and there's a lot of tools that come along with it that I think can enhance the client relationship and and just our serviceability of the client. But at the core of of what I do and really where my value is, I I I have hard pressed time viewing it going away anytime soon. Chase: Yeah. And everybody everybody had Sean Linder: So where does that lead us into society? I have no I have no freaking idea where that leads us into society, Chase: Yeah. Sean Linder: to be honest with you. Chase: Yeah, I think that's the like like you said, that's the question mark hanging there in front of all of us. We're all on the same side here wondering, hmm, what's gonna happen? So Sean Linder: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Chase: so when let's say let's say I I want to work with you, Sean. If I want to become your client today, what does walk me through it? What does onboarding look like? What happens the first four to eight weeks, and what is working with you look like over the course of a calendar year? Sean Linder: Yeah, that that's a great question. So it it's first convers the the first call is really just a discovery call. It's more or less saying, Hey Chase, what why are you giving me a call? Why are you talking to me? What's on your mind? You know, what what are what are you what are you going through? What what are some some worries that you have? What are some goals? What are your objectives? Tell me a little bit about, you know, the family, tell me a little bit about your financial picture. Just it it's really it's really high level discovery of of the relationship, right? It it's kind of talking through, hey, you know, can I and then, you know, what I would do is tell you a little bit about what I do, how I can bring value to the relationship. And then what we would do is I'm I'm a big believer in in using financial planning as the foundation to build off of I look at the portfolio as a means to implement a financial plan. So I'm I have a very planning centric firm and process. So the first thing we would do is we would start building out a financial plan. we would start collecting different types of statements. We would start looking at what does your balance sheet look like, what what are what what what liquid assets, what illiquid assets are out there, what debts are out there that need to be serviced or paid off. and so we'd start building out that overall financial picture, you know, and then we would just take it another step from there. And we would start saying, Okay, well what now that we have a rough picture built. What does what are your goals and objectives? You know, for a lot of clients it's well, my first goal is making sure my wife and I, or my partner and I can can can step away from our job or our business and and survive. Okay, that's first objective. If that's checked, what are your other objectives? Well, we want to we have charitable intent, you know. So I've helped clients out, set up donor-advised funds, you know, we have one that has a foundation. And there's different benefits and drawbacks to each, but it really kind of just depends on what your charitable intent is and what you want to give to. And I want to provide for my family. Okay, well let's talk about how we how we go through that and how we set this up. Right? So we go through and we start looking at estate documents. What do have in place? What are things that we might need to tweak? What are things that we might need to implement on the estate planning side? And then once we have this this this robust plan built out about what your goals, what your objectives are, and what your needs are, then we go to the portfolio. And we say, okay, this is how we're going to implement your portfolio. You know, and it's quite honestly that even that is is a very customized approach. You know, I'm one where a lot of my business own you think about a business, right? It's it's it's a large private equity holding. So a lot of my clients are are used to that kind of investment. Right, so I'll utilize both public investments but also private investments. You know, we have private debt, we have venture capital, we have private equity, and it's really just a flavor of what can we do to achieve your objectives that you have set out. Right? First thing we want to do is generate income. Make sure, you know, I don't care what you know, growth aside, I want to be able to cover your living expenses. So how do we generate enough income within your portfolio? Right? That can be Individual bonds, that can be municipal bonds, that can be private credit, that can be, you a slew of different things. But let's let's cover the income piece for first and then we can shift over to the growth side of the portfolio, right? Because the growth is really there to that's your hedge against inflationary pressures, right? Because we all know that our lives are gonna cost more in five, ten years, even if we don't change up our lives, it's just gonna cost more, right? So the growth part of the portfolio is one that that comes secondary to the income. because we wanna have we wanna make sure we can cover our living expenses, but it's just it's equally as important because that's where generational wealth can really be built, right? So it's I would say that's high level, that's kind of the process that I give. Chase: Awesome. Sean Linder: With a new client. Chase: So for a business owner who has kind of seen and felt themselves in what you've shared during this conversation, Sean, and if they want to get in touch with you, what should they do next? Where should they go? Sean Linder: Yeah, that's great question. the the best way to get a hold of me is go to my website, anarchwealth dot com, H O N A R C Wealth dot com, click on contact us, and that's gonna populate my email address. You can shoot me a little blurb, say, Hey, let's connect, you know, send me some dates with dates and times at work and we'll we'll we'll we'll connect that way. You know, all my clients have my personal cell phone. You know, I'm on speed dial for a lot of them. So it's That's that's the best way that that I would say would be the initial contact. Chase: Excellent. Sean, thanks so much for taking the time to talk to me today. Sean Linder: Yeah, it was great, Chase. I appreciate it, man.