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2024 Draft Recap Part 1 · Filmstudy - Baltimore Ravens Talk

• 0:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hi folks, welcome to the other episode of Film Study.
• 0:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is Ken McCusik.
• 0:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's time for our annual draft recap.
• 0:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know this is a show I look forward to doing every year.
• 0:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: The draft is a culmination of a lot of work.
• 0:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then it's a lot of fun to watch the draft together to concern over every selection.
• 0:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: We certainly had lots of reason to do that this year.
• 0:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, joining me to talk about that experience is Jake Vogel.
• 0:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jake, how you doing?
• 0:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: Doing great, Ken.
• 0:38
  [SPEAKER_00]: How are you?
• 0:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I've been okay.
• 0:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it was in a plus draft for the Ravens, not three pluses, but a plus draft, and I guess I'm I'm most feeling boxed in after this draft about the Ravens solution to their left tackle issues really not being handled.
• 0:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I would agree with that.
• 1:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: would, you know, provide some optimism towards a left tackle of the future potential.
• 1:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, I think right now just like you that he's probably penciled in is the right tackle.
• 1:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know if he's really going to be a left tackle option for them.
• 1:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: So that is definitely a frustration along an offensive line and maybe a little bit of a lack of
• 1:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, a lack of total draft capital you're saying, right?
• 1:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, they didn't have much or an option in terms of moving up there.
• 1:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: They did have, I guess, nine picks.
• 1:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: That was kind of exciting.
• 1:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And D3 was a lot of fun in order in terms of seeing some guys take threes.
• 1:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a whirlwind for me because it's a lot of players that I don't know anything about yet.
• 1:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, seeing some players who are drafted, including the last couple of guys who are even drafted and not knowing anything about them, you know, going in is kind of interesting.
• 2:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I've got a little bit of a research sense, and hopefully we'll be able to talk about everybody as we go through this.
• 2:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: But let's talk about the role out of the draft early, because I think one of the interesting things that started off was the run on quarterbacks.
• 2:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, absolutely, it was a huge benefit to Baltimore as well as our primary competitors in the AFC.
• 2:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, and overall positive that six quarterbacks came off in the first round.
• 2:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: early.
• 2:38
  [SPEAKER_00]: But definitely a surprise that I think the biggest surprise was Atlanta going with Michael Panics.
• 2:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: That kind of came out of nowhere, especially with them having just eight Kirk cousins to that $100 million plus contract.
• 2:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 2:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: So the cousin's deal is really like a two year deal where they can get out right now.
• 2:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's something like 65 million of that 100 it's maybe not quite that much, but there's a substantial amount they can save.
• 3:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: If they cut him in 20 sticks, but he's really going to be there through 25.
• 3:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we don't have to go through this.
• 3:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: We talked about that on the show.
• 3:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's worth listening to in terms of the draft, the first round of the draft when you look at it.
• 3:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's certainly an interesting pick, but not one that I think was really shocking.
• 3:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then the 12th pick with Nick's going to the Broncos, I think the Broncos were kind of feeling some of those trash compact walls closing in on them too in terms of maybe not getting a quarterback.
• 3:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: it was a long, long fall off the cliff to Spencer Rattler at the seventh quarterback taken.
• 3:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely agree with that.
• 3:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it is rare to see that many quarterbacks come off the board in the first round.
• 3:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's only happened a couple of times.
• 3:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know if it's ever happened that early with all six being through the 12 Olympic.
• 4:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that was a record, I think they said so in here, but if I'm wrong, I apologize for that.
• 4:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: The jets end up trading the number 10 pick.
• 4:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: and one spot correct one one spot with the Vikings right so the Vikings moved up and the jets were linked very closely to Brock Bowers and so it was a it was a spot at which I thought there would be a chance where the Vikings might take a player but I
• 4:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ravens had some bad news.
• 4:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry.
• 4:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've got to step back for a second.
• 4:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ravens had some bad news.
• 4:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Number five when the chargers took Joe Alt, which precipitated a run on left tackles.
• 4:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's the kind of the second run that got precipitated in this draft.
• 4:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: The jets traded out of number 10.
• 4:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Vikings went up and they picked J. J. McCarty at number 10.
• 4:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: uh... at number eleven instead of bowers which would have been perfectly fine you know we expected to be able for and and and he he end up going but a little bit later uh... they ended up taking fashado at number eleven that kind of put the ravens in a two left tackle hole at that moment meaning there there were two less tackles and we could have reasonably expected to be on the board yeah can't completely agree with that
• 5:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: It definitely came to, it was probably a pretty big surprise that the chargers went with an offensive tackle, but when you look at the team and the change that they had in general manager head coach and possibly philosophy, it wasn't as big of a surprise as maybe the sportsbooks would lead you to believe.
• 5:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 5:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they didn't, you know, and also Greg Roman is going to be the offensive coordinator.
• 5:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: They want to really ought to help with whatever they want to build in terms of a Ravens-esque run game to support, you know, one of the things that's funny about this is I'm not sure Roman can build that same kind of running back with Herbert at quarterback.
• 6:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that that actually will be very difficult for him.
• 6:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I completely agree and they didn't really address the running back position until very late, they ended up with a guy that I did like come on to bed all if I remember correctly running back at a choice.
• 6:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then other than that, we know that, you know, they are trying to be the Baltimore Ravens but out west, so we call them, but Ravens west with Gus Edwards and J.K. Dobbins running it back with Greg Romance.
• 6:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll see what happens with that, but certainly not going to be as easy, they don't have quite the same, not even close to the same benefit.
• 6:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: of a quarter-back mobile running threat that they did with Lamar Jax?
• 6:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's the thing.
• 6:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't see them all of a sudden converting to a huge number of mesh plays or RPOs or whatever the whole song, but not a huge number.
• 7:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't think to really support the run game.
• 7:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Jax ended up picking Fashano at number 11.
• 7:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: As I mentioned then, of course the double hit from in the division with mims going to the bangles and
• 7:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Steelers taking Fontano at number 20, both just crushing blows in terms of what could happen.
• 7:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: We expected both of those teams might take offensive alignment, so it's not really surprising.
• 7:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Bengals have an out on quite a run of taking enormous tackles.
• 7:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they literally have three six foot eight offensive tactics on their roster right now and all three of them could have starting spots this year so they have a big offensive line I'm not sure that it fits in what most teams are doing.
• 7:52
  [SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, playing more of the space zone scheme game, but perhaps Cincinnati wants to go more in the power gap scheme direction with the enormous size that they have it.
• 8:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: It definitely seems like that kind of size, particularly if you don't go to the zone, but maybe even if you go to zone running also, it's gonna really be able to lean on their opponents.
• 8:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Just the more you can do that straight ahead, I think the more you can get them tired by the fourth quarter, and I have a much greater fear of Cincinnati's run game now, but we'll see.
• 8:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, okay.
• 8:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, we're getting down into the nitty gritty here.
• 8:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're in the in the 21 plus range, and there's still a couple of offensive tackles left with the main one being Tyler Gaiton of Oklahoma who's actually played some left tackle.
• 8:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he slipped and slipped.
• 8:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: We thought Dallas might get about 24 Dallas traded back to 29.
• 8:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: We thought that Green Bay may take him at 25, didn't happen.
• 8:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: We had all the way to 29.
• 8:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're still crossing our fingers.
• 9:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tyler got it and might drop to the Ravens at number 30.
• 9:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: We also thought you got Kingsley Suamata Iya there who might not be a terrible consolation prize very high upside, at least from my perspective.
• 9:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And as it turns out, Dallas, of course, disappoints us tremendously by selecting a data.
• 9:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've actually thought, I think you and I both thought that the chiefs might take a tackle at 28 when they moved up and then they ended up taking change.
• 9:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Where are they?
• 9:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
• 9:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'll see if you're worthy, but yeah.
• 9:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I see if you're, sorry, yes.
• 9:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: The sixth man, right?
• 9:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: No.
• 9:33
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think you may have left out the tunnel to Steelers, but everybody listening to this, I'm sure was watching the draft and is well aware of the first round picks that came off the board.
• 9:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: But, yeah, absolutely, there was that run on offensive tackles.
• 9:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: And it almost got to the point that the Ravens had one really solid option at 30 and, you know, Dallas,
• 10:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so Gaiton is a guy, you know, not a lot of the guys in Latham and MIMS, both SEC studs at Alabama, Georgia, respectively, haven't played on the left side yet.
• 10:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're projected left tackles at the NFL level, and they, Latham certainly would not have gone as high as he did, were that not the case.
• 10:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: And keep what he got seven overall or something that Taiton was really early.
• 10:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
• 10:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think the same of MIMS, MIMS is enormous.
• 10:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: You could look at it more as a stochastic play for MIMS.
• 10:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're getting a roll of a die or whatever.
• 10:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you know, one to four, he's going to work out at left ankle and a five or six is going to be a great right tackle.
• 10:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can think about it that way.
• 10:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I think that it's a, it's really more, both those guys probably will get their chance at left tackle, I would expect.
• 10:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, the fact that Gaiten had already played left accolade in those very unpolished, and certainly it's not perfect in any way in his time at Oklahoma, was a big positive.
• 10:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And one that I think a lot of people said, maybe the Ravens should have traded up for.
• 11:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, obviously the team who had 28 and traded, and that was Buffalo, who traded it to the chiefs, was willing to move, why not give that a shot.
• 11:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And in terms of what it would have taken, we're taking what about 40 JJ points to move up, which would have been about a,
• 11:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: of a pick in the fourth round, I believe.
• 11:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
• 11:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that sounds right to me.
• 11:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, honestly, because it was getting down to just one tackle at the end there, I viewed some of the corner prospects.
• 11:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: perhaps is as high a value than Deighton, but the bigger need was certainly on the offensive line.
• 11:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I wasn't overly disappointed that the Ravens were able to get a...
• 11:55
  [SPEAKER_00]: a corner that they highly value in Nate Wiggins at 30, but missing out on the tackle run was definitely a tough field of swallow and guidance certainly similar to Amarius Men's has some tools that would lead you to believe he has the chance to make it at let tackle.
• 12:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: So anyway, we have to get over this guidance thing at some point.
• 12:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the Ravens are up on the clock at number 30.
• 12:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: They had Kingsley, Sua Mata, I think a lot of the people on the pod were calling for, but there was definitely call on the pod for Wiggins on the watch party for Wiggins as well.
• 12:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And my explanation of this was, Wiggins is distinctly the better player.
• 12:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you go back and you listen to me if you want to swing, with you distinctly the better player than Sua Mata, yeah.
• 12:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the problem is barriers to entry.
• 12:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And at a left tackle has enormous barriers to entry.
• 12:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: You just don't know when you're ever going to get a shot for one.
• 12:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was interesting.
• 12:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought that the Ravens in the press conference afterwards to cost us said, if they didn't get a left tag, sorry, didn't get a corner back in round one.
• 12:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: They thought they might not get a good corner back.
• 13:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then of course, they go on to get a good corner back much later on to draft as well.
• 13:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
• 13:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
• 13:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: I absolutely agree.
• 13:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like they kind of left out in the fourth round with TJ Tampa as well as we'll get too later.
• 13:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: I do understand what he was saying and kind of how, you know, lock drafts and simulations work with certain positions.
• 13:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: In corner is one over the years that if you don't get a guy early,
• 13:31
  [SPEAKER_00]: the chances of you hitting on a player that can be utilized early in his career and be effective is very rare.
• 13:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, the ravens got bright and Steven's in the third round, and we believe that, you know, he's turned the corner, he was a really good player last year, and that pick is looking pretty solid, but it's not like in his first year, he was starting
• 13:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I didn't really have too many issues with the pick since the tackle's really dried up at that point.
• 14:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and I didn't either, I mean, honestly, for what it was, I'm okay with the pick.
• 14:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's certainly a plus pick of value pick.
• 14:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: We can actually use my number one corner on the board.
• 14:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so it gives you an idea of how much I value the berries to entry component that I'm willing to pass up the number one corner for a player.
• 14:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, Guyton, who clearly is unpolished in the six or seven best left tackle in this draft.
• 14:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, we can say hello to a player and let's talk about him for a second, I guess.
• 14:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: is the most athletic corner in the draft, not just in terms of speed, but in terms of his jumps, really good size in terms of height.
• 14:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: As a little bit short arms, this was pointed out and a 30 and a half inches, he's not like some of the slot corners you see that could be down in the 28s, but you know, other...
• 14:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: There are players who are short at the time.
• 14:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: There are plenty of players who are over 31.52 inches as well.
• 15:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he's a little bit disadvantaged there.
• 15:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Fastest 40 time at the combine among all corners.
• 15:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I want to get his 2023 metrics as well, but anything else to say about Wiggins, the athlete.
• 15:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, yeah, he was the fastest corner in the draft.
• 15:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: somewhat a response to what Kansas City did in the first round, you know, then taking speed and Xavier worthy the fastest combine player ever and the Ravenstaking a corner that ran in the four two's, you know,
• 15:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: It, it makes, it makes a, a good bit of sense up.
• 15:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: The Ravens clearly have the probably the most difficult division in the AFC North with every team being in contention for the playoffs this past year with three of the four making it and.
• 16:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: winning division should be first and foremost.
• 16:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: However, Baltimore has to be able to get over Kansas City in the playoffs because they seem inevitable at this point.
• 16:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: So building a roster with a larger AFC competition scope makes sense and I think Wiggins is a good player for going against Jamar Chase and his athleticism as well as going against the likes of
• 16:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: Miami with all their speed and Kansas City, so I was a big fan of the player and especially the athleticism that he brings.
• 16:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: He can truly rely on his recovery speed, and I think he already has a decent amount of polish in technique, but there's plenty of room to grow within being a young player and still being able to put on some muscle to his frame.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: you know, it's good about this and you mentioned both technique and muscle as areas of potential growth here.
• 17:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think both are possible.
• 17:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's only, he's only 20 right now.
• 17:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: He'll be 21 in August.
• 17:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's fantastic news from, from that perspective.
• 17:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I love it when a player like this already has outstanding coverage metrics despite some limitations.
• 17:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he, he,
• 17:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Really killed it this last year in 23, 4.3 yards for target and he had a 44.4 opposition passer rating that the 4.3 yards for target, I didn't have a ranking for that, but the 44.4 opposition passer rating was a tenth best among all corners and there is 190 guys who had melt met a snap limitation, I sent for that.
• 17:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I love it when coverage metrics.
• 17:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: corroborate outstanding physical gifts.
• 17:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: I also love it when coverage metrics are there before every single technical and polished gift is already there.
• 17:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of like having a young hitter who already is hitting 300 with a lot of power and he's still striking out of time.
• 17:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: While that guy when he strikes out a little bit less and he gets more batting average ball and play on more balls,
• 18:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's really going to improve your situation.
• 18:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Wiggins is a very nice addition there.
• 18:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: During the 2013 season, Ted's Walker beat him for a 43-yard play in the Winner of North Carolina.
• 18:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, despite that, Wiggins had a really big game that day with the interception and a forced fumble that we've talked about multiple times, one of two on the season that was very similar.
• 18:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the second longest play he gave up the whole season was only 18 yards.
• 18:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it has Walker's Raven, so maybe we can like what's going on with the guard of that.
• 18:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, absolutely.
• 18:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: He looked really good in what I've seen at Nate Wiggins.
• 18:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: I was a big fan.
• 18:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: He was strong in.
• 18:51
  [SPEAKER_00]: the North Carolina game, which probably was his toughest, you know, just in terms of that big play, he said locker and then what he was able to do against Miami as in Miami, Florida and Virginia, he's just a, they stun player.
• 19:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: Those aren't the best teams and the ACC isn't necessarily the greatest conference, but
• 19:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think he went against enough solid players that you can feel pretty confident with where he's gonna be to start his career.
• 19:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I do completely agree with that, but you're totally showing your own Georgia stripes there, and that's fine.
• 19:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: And one thing that he'd been a little bit, that had been questioned about him was his tackling ability.
• 19:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he's got a pretty damn good tackle rate.
• 19:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And since he wasn't targeted, all that much but actually was targeted a moderate amount, which is a lot for a coverage corner as good as he is.
• 19:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: The good news from that, by the way, is it's not a tiny number of targets.
• 19:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: that his 4.3 yards per target was derived over.
• 19:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: If it were 10 targets or something, give it up 43 yards and nobody ever threw it in.
• 19:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's still say maybe we don't know everything.
• 19:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's it.
• 20:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's an unbelievable number, but maybe we still don't know everything.
• 20:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: But in this case, they threw ahead him a bunch.
• 20:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: They just weren't successful doing at it at all, and that's good news.
• 20:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: So this tackling was it was a 13.3% mistacklory, which is about almost square on the median of cornerbacks, the 190 that I looked at.
• 20:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was penalized just once entire season.
• 20:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, that's a guy who knows he can rely on his recovery speed as you mentioned early, because he will not get grabby when he gets a foot in the wrong direction at the top of the
• 20:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I like that.
• 20:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: The final thing, you know, I noticed he was 23 on the consensus marks that I saw.
• 20:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought he was a top 15 talent.
• 20:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: The other guys, everybody's got
• 20:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: a little bit in terms of war, it's Quinion Mitchell who was the first one off the board I believe, you know, has real context issues of where he was, Terry and Arnold, you know, playing the SEC just wasn't having quite the metrics that Wiggins had.
• 21:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I thought Wiggins was the guy and it did not, it did not play out that way for him.
• 21:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's the third corner draft that I believe, yeah, the third quarter, because of two of them McIntyre and Dijin, what did they do, didn't they?
• 21:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I did think it was going to be a fantasy that the Ravens who get him at number 30 just absolutely thrilled that they got him still concerned at the end of day one about where the Ravens left tackle situation was completely doing that.
• 21:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: you want to move on to round two then let's do it by all means and so round two we had a lot of trades at the beginning of the day and that we don't have to say too much about that other than then some of the cornerbacks who were left on the board got taken fairly quickly uh... so trade at the end of the first round to get one of the guys who really wanted
• 21:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so at the end of the first round, yeah, your guy for the second round was Xavier would get out of South Carolina to Carolina Panthers moved from 33 to 32.
• 22:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: I believe it's just that one spot with Buffalo to take him.
• 22:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then another guy,
• 22:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: Ricky Pierce saw a win at 31 to the San Francisco 49 or so we kind of got another small run on why their severs at the end of the first round and into the second And Ricky Pierce saw was a big favorite of James Ogden once again.
• 22:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to continue to bring his name up because I just really like the work that he's done for his his website Redstar Baltimore
• 22:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you know, in his appearances on your pod as well as some others, so we're very grateful to have him and he does great work and I recommend his draft guy to anybody, but they, he puts a very clearly puts a lot of work into that and it's something where, you know, with a newborn or whatnot and an actual job and a life, I don't know how it does it.
• 23:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, since by semi retirement, I've had a hard time understanding how anybody with a real job can do this kind of stuff.
• 23:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so, yeah, they did really get maybe went a little bit earlier than a lot of people were expecting.
• 23:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: But his name was very hot, you know, as we entered the draft on Thursday night.
• 23:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: So a little surprising, but I think they got a good player and in somebody that will certainly help out Brice Young, you know, as early as this year.
• 23:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, we have a little bit of running corners, a little, a lot of wide receivers off the board and round two.
• 23:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they weren't necessarily in the order that I expected them.
• 23:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Keon Coleman, one at 33, Ladma Kunky at 34, Jalen Polk was a little bit out of order from my perspective at 37th of the Patriots, but hey, they're the Patriots, they probably know what they're doing.
• 24:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then we had some corners run off the board as well, and Dijin, McKinsey, Lasseter, and Milton, all four in a row, beginning at 40.
• 24:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, absolutely.
• 24:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Cooper Dijin, with somebody we were talking about on the show for the Ravens, and that was a big surprise that he made it into the second round.
• 24:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: I thought that,
• 24:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: Baltimore perhaps would have liked to have another player with some interchangeability skills that Kyle Hamilton already shows us in Baltimore.
• 24:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: And clearly he just wasn't as high on the board.
• 24:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think the Ravens prioritized pure outside corner coverage skills and Cooper Jean maybe fits more as a
• 24:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: A safety slash cover three corner, somebody that's really good in zone and maybe can do some of the things, you know, moving into the slot and whatnot, but the pure coverage skills of Nate Wiggins was just more enticing to EDC.
• 25:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I would agree, I'm not.
• 25:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe the Ravens are really well suited to take advantage of Dijin's versatility, but since they already have a guy, a safety that they like to bring up, it might be more complex to get that done.
• 25:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it's easier, probably if Dijin is the queen of the chess board, probably for some other team, then if he's here in Baltimore and they have to be concerned about him on every play when they also need to be concerned about Hamilton and or he's playing.
• 25:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, one of the interesting things about the second round is there weren't any any offensive tackles taken between nine and 55.
• 25:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that was a long stretch through the depth.
• 25:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know Patrick Paul had announced on Twitter before the draft.
• 25:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought he was going at the end of the round, not, not in the second.
• 25:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, his name still had not been called, uh, and then a couple other guys Blake Fisher.
• 25:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Roger Rosengarten and Kingsley Suamata Iya, those four tackles kind of all consolation prize-level tackles were still on the board.
• 26:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Officers, a guy watching your team play a fair amount that I thought would have probably been a third round pick, but we still saw some of the residual impact of the tackles taken to the first round.
• 26:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hit again, once Patrick Paul was taken off the board by Miami at Pick 55.
• 26:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I completely agree.
• 26:30
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think Paul was another high upside player that has that ability to play laptop in Miami got to start to run in the second round on those tackles and a Blake Fisher went before Baltimore as well.
• 26:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like he's more of a true right tackle.
• 26:52
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure how you feel about this shirt,
• 26:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Fisher, more likely to stay on the right side, I would agree.
• 27:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then, you know, we got to the Ravens, picking Roger Rosengarten, I mean, clearly, this was a one that we talked about on, on night two, I was involved with that, and a lot of us were kind of on the Kingsley train, just felt maybe he had more upside and potential
• 27:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: Baltimore clearly felt otherwise at least, they felt that the better value was to take Roger Rosen gardener necessarily that he has stronger tools to be a left tackle, but there's a lot of things that could go into it, they need help on the offensive line in 2024 to start with, and Roger might be
• 27:52
  [SPEAKER_00]: more NFL ready on day one than Kingsley Sua, Mata.
• 27:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
• 27:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I, I, I completely agree with that by the way that he's he's certainly more ready now.
• 28:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I, I.
• 28:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: One of the advantages the Ravens had is the fact that you have Ronnie Stanley signed for 2024.
• 28:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they have the luxury in this draft had the luxury in this draft of a ramp up year on a developmental left tackle where a lot of teams don't have that, they just they cannot wait.
• 28:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when you draft as low as the Ravens do year after year after year, you're not going to get one of the NFL ready off at left tackles very often.
• 28:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you got to take advantage of that ramp up period when you get it.
• 28:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so that's where I felt a lot of the value was lost here, Rosengarten himself, a substantial overdraft relative to the mocks.
• 28:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And look, I hope like every Ravens fan out there, Roger Rosengarten ends up being a great NFL player.
• 28:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: But let's not pretend like he's there right now.
• 28:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got a lot of very significant shortcomings, even though he's got a pretty decent PFF pass-bocking grade.
• 28:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to go through a little bit of what I saw in the National Championship game with Michigan at some point during this.
• 28:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: He only had as PFF scores, by the way, only 15 pressure events in 625 past blocking snaps, but that included five in the National Championship game.
• 29:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I looked at the National Championship every past blocking snap he had in that game.
• 29:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would say the number is either 10 or 11.
• 29:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, and so I'll I'm going to run through these plays and I'm going to lay them out and we're going to talk about who got them, who got them for pressure, how they got them for pressure, you guys can watch the tape because I'm going to give you the pressures in the order they occur, so you're going to know by uniform number and bite by how that he got beaten, which ones I'm considering a pressure, all right, and so if you disagree, that's fine, but I'm going to tell you the PFF is being very.
• 29:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: generous generous in terms of of his invasion of the cone to say that so there was there was quite a lot of that but let's talk about us is a specifics for a 65 308 33 and a half inch arms which it's a little bit short for offensive tackle but there's been plenty of offensive tackle's gotten away but that's not too short for the right side at all it's just it's it's short on the left side 49240 would tell me he could get out there and be a very good run block or once he's trained
• 30:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: So far has not graded out wells or run blocker in college.
• 30:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: He does, he does run the backside of some counter plays, but I would not say he's an exceptional displacement player.
• 30:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: So far, I wouldn't even say he's really been exceptional holding the back end of too many double teams.
• 30:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it's been, you know, can you move up a half level and seal you?
• 30:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can usually do that because linebackers will typically have shorter arms.
• 30:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's a scraping player.
• 30:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: you're getting at that point.
• 30:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm hopeful that Joe D can fix a lot of the run-block elements, where I'm less convinced is you got a very polished past blocker here, a very polished guy.
• 30:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got a great mirror.
• 30:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: What he doesn't have is he doesn't have the length for two things.
• 30:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: One is to
• 30:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: make up for getting beat to the outside and really push a block or 12 to 6.
• 31:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can definitely see opponents are too effective using their length against him or using one arm longer than two a lot of the times.
• 31:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the other thing he really doesn't have is the anchor.
• 31:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he's a little bit lean at 6.5 308 that's that's small for a tackle and boy look at the other guys in this draft at 6.8 3040 and you know, right all those so there was a there's a part that I want to give you a chance to respond to any of that stuff before I move on to the individual plays in the national championship game.
• 31:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I agree with you.
• 31:31
  [SPEAKER_00]: I do feel like he has a lot of potential due to his athleticism.
• 31:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: His four nine, what was it, four nine six two early, four nine two, that was the fastest out of all offensive linemen in this, generally.
• 31:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know that's that's fantastic.
• 31:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but the fastest at the combine for any offensive linemen.
• 31:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: So that is very good.
• 31:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: The Ravens clearly want to move to a more athletic line.
• 32:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think we've seen that by some of the moves they have made, you know, drafting Tyler Winterbaum for one.
• 32:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: somebody that can really get out and run and make some hey at the second level in the run game.
• 32:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, he had his deficiencies, especially in his rookie season as far as being a pass protector, but Jo-D and whatever Tyler did in the off season really helped solidify his work as a pass protector in his second season.
• 32:34
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I do believe that Roger Rosengarten can learn some things with Joe as far as becoming a more effective run blocker.
• 32:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I do think
• 32:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: One of his main deficiencies now is the lack of sand in the pants, as a lot of people like to call it.
• 32:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: He just doesn't have a lot of weight in his lower half, and that is where sometimes he will lose his anchor against some of the more powerful, full rushers, and you know, the speed to power guys.
• 33:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: So,
• 33:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I wholeheartedly agree with that.
• 33:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think in terms of the run blocking, I do think a lot of that's on Joe G to make him a better run blocker.
• 33:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because he's big enough to block any level two guy and the technique necessary to do the things at the line of scrimmage we're never going to expect him to be a big displacement guy.
• 33:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: but we will expect him to be a good guy to hold the back end of double teams or to climb well and get there.
• 33:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he's got the speed otherwise and the tools and probably the processing from you know what we can see on interviews of the guy seems to be a smart guy.
• 33:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm not, I'm not really concerned about the run block.
• 33:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm concerned about the past blocking.
• 33:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think more than anything that element of positional improvement is all on the player.
• 33:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: it's on him to go and get the off-season training he needs because the team is not going to have time to work with him individually to make him better pass-bucker.
• 34:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this two components to it, one is the physical that he just needs to get bigger.
• 34:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: He needs to add, you know, probably 15, 17 pounds by the time he really matures as a player, and he's still 21, but by the time he really matures as a player, he needs to probably get up to about 325 pounds that he's carrying
• 34:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Phil Sims talks about this everyone said a while and and people going to get karate lessons or they do do other martial arts and what not to to become better hand fighters Whatever it takes, you know, whether that's offensive line school, whether that's something else.
• 34:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got a long way to go and the national championship game
• 34:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Really gave me a look at that because the guy he's playing with the guys are playing against and if you look at the Michigan guys for example The year before or what the two years before when the when the Michigan team had Aiden Hutchinson and a job Right, that was two years ago That was an unbelievable group of past rushers the Michigan guys are actually a fairly pedestrian group that got them for a bunch of pressures in this game And he's in the pack 12 before that so I don't know where they fall in your estimation of power five
• 35:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: not at the top.
• 35:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: No, certainly not at the top.
• 35:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: I will say that the pack was impressive this year, and maybe it was just a couple of teams, but it was trying to find a scene, you know, their whole conference basically being dissolved in this upcoming season, and then finally, you know, putting together a really solid season with Oregon and USC with Caleb Williams and, you know, Washington for sure, so yeah.
• 35:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, to the top, you know, to the top quarterbacks, anyway, uh, uh, going there.
• 35:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: So.
• 35:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to go through the place one at a time, but the guys, one of them I actually liked to draft the first one, I got to him was Jaylin Harrell, who ended up going to the seventh round, he has a reasonable chance to make the roster.
• 36:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then, Braden McGregor was a UDFA signed by the jets.
• 36:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: He got him once, Derek Moore, who is a pretty darn good pastor.
• 36:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I should probably the best of this group.
• 36:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's in the 2025, 2025, 2026 season, but he might be out in 2025, I think from how well he played in 2024.
• 36:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: He did get beat by Chris Jenkins on a stunt once.
• 36:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to go through these in order.
• 36:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you can watch that cut up of that game and ask yourself, you know, is what I'm hearing about past blocking really correct about this guy.
• 36:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then the fourth was.
• 36:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: They mentioned Josiah Stewart.
• 36:36
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm not an agent.
• 36:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, yeah, he's the fourth.
• 36:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's number five.
• 36:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, I'm just go by uniform number.
• 36:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's beaten inside by 32 after oversetting to the outside.
• 36:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that was not a pressure.
• 36:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was beaten outside by eight by speed for a pressure.
• 36:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was bold on a stunt pickup by 94 for a pressure.
• 36:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Not unexpected, but he got bold pretty badly.
• 36:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: He gave ground a number five.
• 36:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's Josiah Stewart inside.
• 37:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: rushing from wide nine, but the pressure came first from the other side.
• 37:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: No pressure scored on that one.
• 37:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tripped over the guard on a field, stunt hand off, probably not his fault.
• 37:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: PFF may have scored it differently.
• 37:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would call that not his fault and just give a zero on the play as opposed to a minus two.
• 37:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, he lost 17 that's Brad McGregor again inside for a pressure the second half by the waste terrible of this game, just utterly terrible then and Washington was catching passing all the time, uh, in the second half, uh, beaten inside by a spin move by 32.
• 37:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Harrel again for a pressure gave ground to five on consecutive plays.
• 37:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't believe either of those was a pressure, a lot of pressure to the stunting five.
• 37:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: beaten outside by 32 speed to flush panics definitely pressure on that one beat now side by 32 for pressure beaten outside by speed 32 for pressure turned around by spin 32 for pressure the inside and then bulled by eight forcing panics to throw up ballots for one more so it was a very tough second half in particular for Rosengarden and you might I don't really care whether you call it nine ten or eleven pressures
• 38:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think there's any way to come up with five out of that, at least not the OS score, invasion of the cone and making sure the quarterback is comfortable with his feet there.
• 38:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Same way.
• 38:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know PFF scores a different free, but I'll give you a chance to watch the tape, see how you like it.
• 38:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Try not to watch individual plays, try and watch the entire thing, and write them down on a pad.
• 38:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: But a guy who gives up a pressure every fifth play, and they did have about 56 pass blocking staff in this game.
• 38:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, is not a guy who's going to score very well, but the highest you could score is about a 40 if you were perfect on your other plays.
• 38:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so, uh, you know, he did, he didn't in fact give up, uh, I don't think I have it in here, but he did have a quarterback hit on one of those places, well, that was surrendered.
• 38:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: So very tough game.
• 38:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And let me, let me say this also.
• 38:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was his worst game of the year, but it wasn't superior competition.
• 38:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, Chris Jenkins is the only guy who's kind of a mid-round draft pick that even faced.
• 39:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Everybody else was seven, UDFA, not, you know, anybody who's at the top of the list of past structures in this draft, not anybody else that I'm aware of who's going to be a great NFL player, although who knows about Josiah Stewart or Derek Moore who are coming out later.
• 39:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it's possible one of those guys could be good.
• 39:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Jalen Harrell was the main one who continuously beat him and and he's a guy that I don't think anybody's going to put at the top of NFL pass rushers.
• 39:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, well, anyway, not for that.
• 39:31
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, something that you mentioned earlier in regards to what he needs to do is really get with some personal offensive line coaches and in his interviews and, you know, right after the draft, we at least I learned and probably some other people knew prior he had been working with Joe Staley the long time.
• 39:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: So it is good that he has some connections like that in that he has been working with a phenomenal form of player.
• 40:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure how much work Staley has done with other players and developing them, but, you know, it is good that Roger is already kind of taking that responsibility upon himself to improve, you know, before he even gets to an NFL team.
• 40:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, good for him.
• 40:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you know, the Ravens have had a number of tackles they've drafted late.
• 40:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll either worked out a tackle or worked out somewhere else on the inside Ryan Jensen was a tackle who became a center late late later.
• 40:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: In a case of Rosengarten, I don't think there's another position for him other than tackle.
• 40:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you can't play tackle, he's, I guess he could move to center would be the most likely that he's just totally not the right body type for guard.
• 40:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, I don't know that he'll ever put on the way.
• 40:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: or really changes shape to become a guard.
• 40:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: That's just something he doesn't appear to be.
• 41:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: What we wanted is more of a tackle early in the draft and we got that.
• 41:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: Hopefully he develops and is able to stick at one of the tackle spots.
• 41:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: It would be fantastic if we had the tools to become the successor to Ronnie Stanley on the left side, but as the right now, I would be pretty surprised if that is the case.
• 41:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, outstanding.
• 41:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: So maybe still needs to be fixed.
• 41:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully a player who will help immediately in 24 because there is a very short handed on the offensive line.
• 41:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: But not a true developmental player in the same way that Sua Matta Iya would have been where you're, you're probably going to have to redshirt him for a season.
• 41:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And hope he doesn't play while he, you improve technical aspects of his game and coach him up to his size and like,
• 41:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: Right, in the the one little caveat that I would add.
• 42:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: Roger had played left tackle prior to the final two years at Washington.
• 42:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I don't know if he has any college snaps necessarily at left tackle, which would be the valuable thing, right?
• 42:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: But in his high school, and I think just before he got a starting opportunity, he was a left tackle, and they moved into the right side to be the blind side protector at a poor Michael Penetence.
• 42:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: which, you know, that that is a positive thing.
• 42:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: In some ways, Washington, you know, could be saying, hey, this is a very refined past protector and we want to put them on on the blind side preventics or it's just, hey, we got this other guy, Troy Fettano, that is a really good left tackle.
• 42:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: Let's keep him on the left side and let's move Roger over.
• 42:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: So let me just address that before we move on.
• 42:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: First of all, great that he's on the blind side in terms that I think mirror is really critical to have on the blind side.
• 42:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I guess I could see a time when he could move to left tackle.
• 43:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: But if I'm comparing him to Ronnie Stanley, the first thing that comes to mind is that Ronnie Stanley gives up a lot of bump pressure on the back side because he makes that exchange of mirror for space.
• 43:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he's very good at it and Jackson is very comfortable with it on that side.
• 43:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so the same could happen to Rosengarten as well as being a guy who gives ground for space.
• 43:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think one of the big differences between the two is in arm length.
• 43:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he got about an inch of arm length different there.
• 43:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it makes all the difference in terms of getting the good grip inside on the player.
• 43:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then even having your grip strength come to bear at that point.
• 43:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you really need to you need to be able to to get in there.
• 43:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: You have get to get to get to the inside or even to the to the armpit to to be able to get your grip strength to then be a factor on the play.
• 43:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And a lot of the longer arm guys.
• 43:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what you'll see is the rep is over as soon as they get latched on.
• 43:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're like, uh, I don't know, giant squid or something.
• 43:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: latching up to the opponent.
• 44:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: He definitely has some problems with not being able to, even though he's got a mirror allowing a pass rush to roll off him in one direction of the other, and I think a lot of that is length related.
• 44:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: It may also be in part hand fighting related, and that would have to be the area in which you can prove he's not going to prove his length at this point.
• 44:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, completely agree.
• 44:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: With that, I think we've really kind of touched on Rosengarten.
• 44:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, so give me a thoughts on a thesis, Isaac, who came out in, yeah, I guess he was in around three, right?
• 44:34
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, these are Isaac at a Penn State.
• 44:38
  [SPEAKER_00]: He is the the more productive past Russia out of the duo coming out in this draft from Penn State between him and Chopra Robinson.
• 44:49
  [SPEAKER_00]: A player that I saw was very effective on stunts.
• 44:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: A lot of times, he would even go on touch, which doesn't necessarily give you the best idea for his ability to beat blockers at the next level, but it was nice to see his effectiveness there.
• 45:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: Something that lots of scouts and analysts comment on is his ability to beat up tight ends.
• 45:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: That is obviously a good thing.
• 45:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: You don't want a password sure that can't do that.
• 45:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: So it's a positive there and I think even though he was the more refined password sure he still offers
• 45:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: a decent amount of developmental tools for Chuck Smith to, you know, find him.
• 45:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm pretty excited with what he brings to this outside line back a room.
• 45:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: I could see him having.
• 45:49
  [SPEAKER_00]: a similar role to Tavia's Robinson in terms of snaps this year, but perhaps a little bit more just depends on the health of, you know, day with a job, if he gets mixed in there or not, and I do think of these eyes and
• 46:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: has more past rush potential than what we got out of Tavius last year where I think Robinson is more of your edge center.
• 46:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think Isaac can do some of that, but he's going to be more of a designated past rusher until he kind of develops.
• 46:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 46:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I first of all, completely agree with that in terms of him being a designated a situational pass rush or a guy they bring in on on the second and a long third and 10 latent games when they want pass rush.
• 46:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they could do a lot of rotation certainly with that.
• 46:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Ravens have already got kind of Malik Harrison and
• 46:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Robinson to take early down usually base defense snaps on the edge.
• 46:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they stuck with that pretty much for all of 2023.
• 46:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: It wouldn't surprise me if they start 24 that way, then they might need Malik.
• 47:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: To remake his body yet again to lose a little bit of weight frankly because he was planning I think it around 259 this last year That was his listed weight anyway to go back to playing inside a linebacker Now they go they don't absolutely need it to start the season which makes it difficult and a really hard chore from a leak to play at the right weight But is early playing time probably comes it outside linebacker in base in base packages later on in the season though If anything were to happen to Rokuan Smith, they're gonna really need a two-down bumper
• 47:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: in there, they could go to the street to get it because they've done it certainly with Josh Bines before, but about I think it could be Malik's anyway, in terms of how that affects the total snaps there, Mikhailson didn't have a lot of snaps, but somebody's got to play those snaps.
• 47:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think they want to keep the
• 47:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: all of their situational guys, which really means a way, a job, a wake is a two-way player, but a job, it probably still means van no way, they don't really want to make a run defense guy, and I'm sure it means Isaac just because of his size.
• 48:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it means a lot of staff's on first hand for Robinson and maybe he's paired up with a way sometimes, maybe he's paired up with with Harrison other times, but they don't have a lot of space right now.
• 48:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I was thinking they go out
• 48:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Who would be a guy.
• 48:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think the reason that will happen and it might happen close to the season is because somebody gets hurt either Isaac suffers early camper off season injury or whatever and he's he can't start the season or job was not ready or job gets hurt again.
• 48:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think we're quite at the point yet.
• 48:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know how you feel about this to the job.
• 48:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, might not make the team it being your three.
• 48:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm not at that point yet.
• 48:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think we've seen some flashes from them.
• 48:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'll be at very small amounts just due to the amount of time that he's bound to be able to be at the end of a little bit.
• 48:49
  [SPEAKER_00]: It would be a really tough look for the rating to move on from a high investment second round pick in his third season, certainly possible.
• 49:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: And it's a sunk cost at this point, but I would not love it if they moved on.
• 49:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then maybe he figures it out somewhere else and then you just get caught with your tail between your legs.
• 49:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's risk in all directions in life.
• 49:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Take your fork in the road, there's risk.
• 49:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if you keep them on the Rossbury underperforms and you didn't take the opportunity to get the guy you should have, that's a potential loss too.
• 49:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Really sad that the gamble wasn't made easier for them to make because no one would blame them.
• 49:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: No one would think it was the wrong move if he was just entering his second year after an unproductive rookie season after an NFI season.
• 49:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right, exactly.
• 49:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: and that's a shame, but let's go back and talk about Isaac because we didn't talk about too much of him before.
• 49:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: In terms of measurables, he's a little bit light in the loafers at 247, but he's six four, got long arms.
• 49:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: He'll be 23 in October and he runs a 474-40.
• 50:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those are all really nice characters to have.
• 50:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're a little spoiled here in Baltimore because we have a sub four four outside line back right away.
• 50:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Isaac represents
• 50:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, well above average speed at that outside line vector position.
• 50:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I agree, it's one thing when you're coming from probably one of the most,
• 50:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: freaky athletic testing universities in Penn State with just the amount of athletes, you know, I'm sure it started before Mike of Parsons and Adafay, but you just think about those guys recently, Chopra Robinson was pretty darn athletic this year as well.
• 50:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, him being compared to those guys, makes him look
• 50:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: on athletic, but that's not the case.
• 50:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: He has plenty of juice running for seven is perfectly fine for an outside linebacker, and you know, you think about the days where, you know, the Ravens were getting sucks because of his poor athletic testing.
• 50:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think he ran in like 48.
• 51:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: Something.
• 51:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: 40 or dash I could be wrong there, but yeah, yes, the question.
• 51:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: When do I already do on 40 yards to get the quarterback kind of thing?
• 51:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think he had a decent 10 yards split, but it worked out for Baltimore, and I think he has plenty of athletic tools.
• 51:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: Baltimore is certainly blessed with the addressers that they do have in that potential.
• 51:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: When you consider O.A.
• 51:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: of Java, what kind of an O.A.
• 51:30
  [SPEAKER_00]: was able to do last year coming off of his couch, and Isaac of course, and Tadias as well.
• 51:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: But we really have to hope they realize some of that this year, probably need to get something out of Isaac as a rookie.
• 51:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see definitely because there's going to be some game day in actives, a job of Robinson, Isaac, any of them are possible in actives on game day.
• 51:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll see how that works out, but then going to kind of a six to make five situation there.
• 51:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll be Harrison, Harrison, Zeno, and Special Team.
• 51:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they certainly have him active.
• 52:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: A couple of things about Isaac I want to make sure a pressure rate in his final year is 15.9%.
• 52:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought in the run game, he's not terrible, he's just too small to deal with a pulling guard.
• 52:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's not really great against tackles that are bigger than him.
• 52:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: He'd be kind of fun to watch even with some brother-in-law play.
• 52:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: You usually have some players who are trying a little bit harder and Isaac and Rosengarten would probably be among those both.
• 52:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure they'll be up against each other a lot during camp and that'll be something I'll be looking for.
• 52:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Isaac had not obvious Sam characteristics, but he did drop 11.7% of the time in college.
• 52:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: So maybe I'd look at the 40-time, maybe that's something and he had solid results.
• 52:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's 6.5 yards per target.
• 52:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it wasn't like tight ends were burning him consistently for a big yardage.
• 52:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: But that's a nice trait to have by the way.
• 52:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you can drop the coverage and give your pass for us the flexibility to send somebody else slot inside linebacker or safety.
• 52:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: on the past rush so that's nice.
• 53:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have one other thing to say about Isaac and it may be unfair as a criticism but I think there's a lot of throw into the outside in the college game from various teams including some bad ones and he's only had one bad at past in his whole college career and that was way back in 2019, four years ago.
• 53:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: So
• 53:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: The reason I don't like that isn't because he should be jumping up at the line of Scrimmage to knock down a pass.
• 53:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: You get some that way, and if you're done lap, you get five per year or whatever.
• 53:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the other place we get a lot of them is in screen-pass diagnosis.
• 53:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so when the screen goes to the outside, you should have a player who understands what's going on, realizes, oh, a screen-pass, and immediately bolts to a spot where he has a chance to deflect that
• 53:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: minor criticism, but they're probably quite a few screen passes that went off on his watch to his side, where he didn't make a play on the ball.
• 53:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, agree with that.
• 54:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: It reminds me of the stat you mentioned last year with
• 54:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: Will Anderson out of Alabama and his lack of forced fumbles, you know, with all of those sacks that he was able to accrue how to be just have one forced fumble in his career, you know, one of those kind of head scratchers, but I think it's working out for the text and so far.
• 54:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: And hopefully that's the case with Isaac where, you know, get him around, you know, maybe Kyle van Noy is probably the best Ravens outside linebacker at diagnosing and getting hands on on footballs probably.
• 54:38
  [SPEAKER_00]: Right now, and then, you know, talk about the defensive line as a whole, you got Brad Rick Washington, that's been on to, to get his hand on a football and of course Brad Urban.
• 54:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, I think some other people can influence him and Zach Orr is going to be chopping at the bet to get these guys disruptive.
• 54:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 54:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and that is one of the real nice things about Isaac is he's a guy who they certifiably got some first pressures by adding him.
• 55:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he's a guy who will get to the quarter first move the quarterback off the spot, create opportunities for players like Matt and B.K.
• 55:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: and Peers and O.A.
• 55:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: to finish, uh,
• 55:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: then no way whoever it is, who's rushing the quarterback, clownies job last year in a lot of ways, he did pick up a fair number of sacks, but he picked up a ton of pressures, and those really help Matt at B.K.
• 55:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: in terms of his sacked total.
• 55:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Urban as well got two cheap ones against San Francisco off initial pressures by clowning.
• 55:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, he created a lot more sacks than his exact total would tell you.
• 55:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's move on around the four here on D3 and Ravens had six picks, exciting day coming up.
• 55:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we want to talk too much about the general flow of things.
• 55:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Other than to say, I think we really noticed a large divergence from consensus that was occurring on D3 a lot of people way over drafting.
• 55:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought in division that McKinley Jackson is at the inside
• 56:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: uh... guy that that uh... that uh... that uh... it was drafted by the bingles i think he's a third round pick and i i'd probably had him as a fifth round pick uh... and let me see who who that was here i think that's the guy i'm trying to remember i don't recall yeah i'm a kimley jackson the defensive lineman from from Texas a nm one fifty nine consensus and and the uh...
• 56:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think I think it was in the third round, but it might have been early in the fourth that the Bangalists got him.
• 56:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I was fairly significant overdraft in the name of need.
• 56:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And whenever you see that, the Ravens are probably going to be coming from who they end up getting.
• 56:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: And their first pick of the day at number 113, which were still 13th pick of the day at this point, was Devantez Walker, a wide receiver who'd been largely spurned early on during this process.
• 56:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of wide receivers are off the board at this point.
• 56:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, leading up to the draft, you know, the months prior, I believe Tez Walker was probably in the top 15 wider severs for most, most people that are talking about the wider severs class.
• 57:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I think Steve Smith, senior and, you know, not everybody has to.
• 57:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: necessarily give credence to his evaluations of players because who knows to the level that he's watching these players, but you know, he has those little clips out there that you can find on twitter slash x and we're talking about guys and Walker was somebody that He is pretty high on but he had outside of his top 25 so I don't really understand how
• 57:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he had mentioned Ted Walker has a ton of tools, you know, his ability to to win deep down the field.
• 57:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, he he believes that there's a lot of room for growth and you get this guy in a receiving room with good receiving coaches and get him to lock in and he thinks, you know, in the year two, he's going to take off and really become somebody.
• 58:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: That's a little encouraging to hear I know that Steve Smith was high on Zayf flowers last year, and he was a great player for Baltimore in the short-synth that he had here, but my own personal viewpoint
• 58:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: ability on certain routes but does not have the full route tree and that's something that he's going to have to work on in the off seasons.
• 58:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: Right now his skillset certainly opens up the deep passing game for Lamar Jackson gives a target and hopefully pushes back the safety coverage and that can do a ton for the team.
• 59:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: They added their cannery
• 59:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: The run game is still going to be a big part of what Baltimore does, and if there is a legitimate threat of passes going over the head of the defense, that's a good thing for both the running game as well as the intermediate passing game.
• 59:36
  [SPEAKER_00]: you know, make him an effective piece of of game plants.
• 59:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I really think that's kind of this his early role, uh, and perhaps that will take some, some of the weight, uh, away from players like Rashad Bateman, that for whatever reason struggled with the deep ball on connection with the Mar last year.
• 59:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I still think that needs to be fixed no matter what, even if
• 1:00:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, a lot to unpack there, but what's it was it will start with the router you're 100% correct and he's got it even start with a good two route.
• 1:00:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Threat there if and particularly if you're on the x side of the field.
• 1:00:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, you're out in space.
• 1:00:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, your route running is supposed to beat the corner opposite you who's off on the best corner of the other team has to offer.
• 1:00:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and you need to be able to to fool him and be able to run multiple routes.
• 1:00:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Devontas Walker is more of a, you, you would hope that he would be a deep threat and he is that.
• 1:00:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: These good contested catch player, but also got to come back for the football and the effective and surprisingly not good on a hitch routes.
• 1:00:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: 5.2 yards per target on hit routes.
• 1:00:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Part of the problem with that is he's a terrible yac receiver, which is unacceptable for who he is.
• 1:00:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's a big man at 6193.
• 1:00:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got long arms 33 and a quarter, 436 speed.
• 1:01:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's part of forcing this tackles is to make people miss and they open field with your speed.
• 1:01:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's track star in terms of his jumps.
• 1:01:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean,
• 1:01:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, should be all sorts of things to make a very dangerous and the open field.
• 1:01:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: They've got 2.8 Yacht per reception and his final year there in North Carolina.
• 1:01:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Two Miss Tackles Force in 41 receptions.
• 1:01:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's just completely unacceptable for a player of his size and athleticism.
• 1:01:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And also, it's not like he has a bad quarterback who's forcing him into bad situations all over the time.
• 1:01:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like the balls high and outside low and away all the time, the catchers always have it to die for it.
• 1:01:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's gonna make it hard to get stolen based or caught stealings.
• 1:01:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: But in this case,
• 1:01:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: The balls right down the middle a lot from Drake May, and he still was not doing a lot with it after the catch.
• 1:01:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: So most of his success was on a fairly limited number of vertical routes where he had tremendous number of yards and a good completion percentage on those, which I really like that because I think Lamar will
• 1:02:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: have a high degree of trust in him because of his size and some of the success he's had already in throwing them deepball and won't be that relationship like he had with Bateman where it seemed the overthrowing him on the deepball a lot till really trust him to go get the ball like a like OBJ at least I hope that's the way that develops.
• 1:02:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: But right now I don't see him as a back-up axe not right away.
• 1:02:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well okay I do see him as the back-up axe but I don't see him as the extra silver right away who's going to take a bunch of snaps away from Bateman.
• 1:02:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because he just doesn't, doesn't have the entire schematic diagram that entire set of routes you could do to do various things against various coverages and really take advantage of that defender on that side of the field.
• 1:02:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he probably starts on the strong side of the field and you've been.
• 1:02:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: have some opportunities to run out of bunch routes and other things.
• 1:02:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Develop those hitches at a better level.
• 1:02:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe pick up one or two additional routes as you're saying, whether they're deep crossing routes, he does do some of that now, by the way, likes to kind of go to the middle of the field.
• 1:03:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: The thing will help him most will become a valuable extended play target for Lamar.
• 1:03:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Lamar will trust him to a much greater degree if he can show his that.
• 1:03:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: The thing that will hurt in the most, if he becomes a problem with his hands that starts causing intersections.
• 1:03:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Baitman had that unfortunately right off the bat in his career and it's taken time to regain the trust of Lamar so we have to hope that doesn't happen to Walker in the same way.
• 1:03:33
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, oh, I can go ahead.
• 1:03:36
  [SPEAKER_00]: No, no, I, I'm looking.
• 1:03:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: I can completely agree about all those things, you know, thinking more about the player.
• 1:03:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to rub people the wrong way when I say this.
• 1:03:52
  [SPEAKER_00]: He, in some ways, he reminds me of
• 1:03:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: Devin Dubernay.
• 1:03:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: But I will say there are some major differences.
• 1:04:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: Devin Dubernay coming out of college was more of a screen receiver.
• 1:04:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: He did catch the ball down field here and there and he was very strong hands.
• 1:04:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, continued throughout most of his career in Baltimore as, you know,
• 1:04:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: fairly good hands, not as good as doing a bobbles ball a little bit, but is good in the contested catch game.
• 1:04:30
  [SPEAKER_00]: But the area that I find them to be similar is that they're both linear athletes.
• 1:04:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: And when you were talking about the yac ability, that kind of resonated the point.
• 1:04:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: Ted Walker, for whatever reason, and I have seen a decent amount of it now, just doesn't seem to have a bunch of wiggle to his low or half heat.
• 1:04:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: For whatever reason, he has that pure athleticism that speed, I'm not sure that he's ever going to become a real yak player, and I hope I'm wrong there,
• 1:05:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: anybody.
• 1:05:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: But I don't really see it in his movement skills that he would become severely better yards after the catch threat.
• 1:05:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: However, what he does have is a good skill in, you know, getting vertical catching the deep ball in the area that he can definitely improve is
• 1:05:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: Driving back to the football on your hitches, your curls, your combats, and I think that is an area that showed up negatively on film, you know, in 2023 at North Carolina.
• 1:05:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: So.
• 1:05:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think there's there's plenty of meat on the bone for him to improve.
• 1:05:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: He hasn't had a great situation yet in his career, you know, moving around places.
• 1:06:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: I believe he has an interesting story, you know, growing up as well and he's faced a ton of adversity already, but
• 1:06:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: seems like not necessarily the yards up in the catch player that that many want.
• 1:06:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, hopefully that is something to improve.
• 1:06:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, one thing is if you can develop a slant that's deadly or potentially deadly after the catch, then the other thing that will give you is a slugo.
• 1:06:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: You kind of automatically gain that if you can if you can threaten the slant and it's and the slant is deadly because of the kind of speed you have.
• 1:06:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: And
• 1:06:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Devont as a walker is faster than Devon Durney, so it's just really hard to do, because Devon Durney was a hell of a fast player, but we'll see how they use him in this in this first year.
• 1:07:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would say, I don't see them using as a gadget player, even always one of the fastest guys on the team.
• 1:07:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think, and this is unfortunate, because I think Zay is the better receiver and the more sudden athlete who gets your better separation a lot of the time.
• 1:07:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think Zay Flowers
• 1:07:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: could be drawn back into more of that role.
• 1:07:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm hoping that's not the case.
• 1:07:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I hope they, you know, they leave it with Hill and Ali.
• 1:07:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I guess those are the main guys right at this point.
• 1:07:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've tried to think of it as they could.
• 1:07:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those are real speed.
• 1:07:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: I would agree that those are the two primary players, but what we saw, you know, briefly from Bateman last year on an end-around ended up being a positive play, what I did see from Test Walker on a number of games was also that ability to run end-around.
• 1:07:49
  [SPEAKER_00]: Not necessarily huge gains, but he can certainly do it and get you seven yards with more potential than that.
• 1:07:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I wouldn't limit it to just a couple players, but I certainly, like you don't want safe flowers to be kind of pigeonhole into that role, because I think the more that you can get him down the field.
• 1:08:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: and winning intermediate is going to be great for Lamar.
• 1:08:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be great for Zay.
• 1:08:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: And the offense is a whole because so much of the early portion of 2023 was Zay Flowers, you know, catching screen passes and, you know, having little gadgety things to do.
• 1:08:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then they finally started to use them on more than they had a lot of success in using it.
• 1:08:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Deep, last thing about Tess Walker is that he's really gonna have to learn how to run block.
• 1:08:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's not that he's done none of it at the college level and he just hasn't been exceptional and that's something he's gonna really have to be with the Ravens given.
• 1:08:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: how they want to use the offense.
• 1:08:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't care that Henry has a great head of steam or other backs, we have our good Miss Tackles Force guys.
• 1:08:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: You got to be able to be a wide receiver who keeps his feet in a good positional blocker.
• 1:09:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And frankly, it his size and his athleticism and his length shouldn't be a problem at all for him.
• 1:09:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure if he if he decides it's not something he really is enthusiastic about doing, he's going to see the field less because of it.
• 1:09:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't believe that will be a problem.
• 1:09:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: I believe he does have a good head on his shoulders.
• 1:09:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: He has the frame.
• 1:09:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: He has the speed to be a phenomenal down the field blocker for these speeding running backs that we do have.
• 1:09:34
  [SPEAKER_00]: And Paul Lee that does certainly have some explosiveness, especially after I was able to watch some more of him.
• 1:09:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: a really good player in 2021 and has some of that key Mitchell to less, less so where he can be tracked down, but he's going to to break some runs and is also a more physical back coming out of college.
• 1:10:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm excited for Ali and Justice Hill still has great speed at his age, you know, as a veteran in the league now.
• 1:10:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, we still, we're gonna come back and talk about the last five Ravens draft picks on the second part of this show.
• 1:10:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's just so much fun talking with you about this Jake really appreciate all the time you spent on the on the draft watch party and I hope puppy people.
• 1:10:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Frank, excuse me.
• 1:10:33
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, it was, it was a lot of fun being part of the draft party.
• 1:10:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: I was with you in a number of panelists on as well as co-host Voss on day two and then gave Fergi and Nikhil Mita and Kevin Ostriker.
• 1:10:52
  [SPEAKER_00]: There's even more guys that I'm probably forgetting, but all of the Ravens content people.
• 1:10:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: We have
• 1:10:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, through Twitter and I'm podcasts are fantastic to work with and interact with, honestly, and I don't currently do any specific podcasts other than, you know, the occasional appearance here with you, but
• 1:11:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, I thoroughly enjoy it every time that I do, uh, I just don't have it at real Jake Vogel on Twitter, and you also cover a lot of Georgia football.
• 1:11:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Do you write any of that up or you just a fan who on Twitter who really shows stuff?
• 1:11:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I don't, I don't do any writing currently, but yeah, you can find me on Twitter and have conversations with, with me about Georgia, about Ravens, NFL, and college in general.
• 1:11:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, we'll really appreciate staying in the time.
• 1:11:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Other folks out there, if you'd like to be on a film study short, the great off season is in front of us here.
• 1:11:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: We got a lot of free time.
• 1:11:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: There will be a few more shows looking back at the draft here.
• 1:11:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then we're going to start looking forward to this year with a lot of two player episodes.
• 1:12:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you would like to be on one of those and take a particular pairing of players, tell me about that.
• 1:12:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you'd like to talk about a player from the past,
• 1:12:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'd love to talk about you.
• 1:12:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those short episodes, 15 minutes, nothing like this draft recap, but we'll do it very quick.
• 1:12:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Just have about three memories of the player you want to talk about that were special for whatever reason to you.
• 1:12:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jake, thanks again for coming on.
• 1:12:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, thank you, can.
• 1:12:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we'll talk you next time on Film Study.