Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Gary Russell about his choice of Day of the Daleks (3/4)

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Talks to Gary Russell about his choice of Day of the Daleks (3/4) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

0:33
I'm still a little bump in my to do it quicker.
0:39
Hello there. My name is Gary Russell and I'm
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here with Joe and we are here doing camps with a blunt
0:46
penknife the podcast that's reviews.
0:49
Episodes of Doctor Who in a madcap zany and sometimes
0:53
sophisticated and usually quite informative.
0:55
I'm on it kind of way. And today we're doing a said
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three, the day of the Daleks. I am very excited to watch.
1:05
Episode. 3 of day of the Daleks we're skipping into war-torn
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Dalek future. We are what could not be
1:11
exciting about that. Absolutely nothing.
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It's just perfection. Here we go.
1:17
They do. Let's do it.
1:18
Live is straight to the point. Is it there?
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All right, then five, four, three, two, one.
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And we're off. We don't know.
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We're not. Oh, I'm just about offer you
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love me. I made it is going.
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Now, it starts at 6:30 to started my, just a blur S, as
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well. So breast completely the wrong
1:45
button because at 59 years old, I still can't work out how to
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press the button on a Blu-ray player because you need to
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ancient teach technology and Technology anybody listens.
1:59
This knows how good our technology Mas anca.
2:01
Arabic when I said that, if it's not, it's just that those words
2:05
are just so beautiful to see on a screen and that's where Lee
2:08
green pattern of that. Beautiful title sequencer.
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Look. So wonderful in those days,
2:14
still is now, but I thought I was about to ask a very steady
2:16
pressure passing off at stake? Are you know, four episodes of
2:19
Doctor? Who for part stories?
2:21
Yeah, I think very often. There isn't quite enough plot
2:25
for four episodes in a four-part doctor who story.
2:29
But I think this is one of those stories.
2:31
Ruiz. We're absolutely fits that
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timing perfectly. I think there's enough going on
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narratives, always, moving as twists and turns happening is
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Great Character stuff, right up until the last episode.
2:46
I don't think there's a second waste, you really this?
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I totally agree with you about the dogs.
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I'm just trying to think generally, I think for part is
2:54
actually on the whole are pretty damn good in doctor.
2:57
I think four parts is the perfect length of do too.
3:00
It's times 3. I Threes like a sometimes, I
3:03
don't know, the threes three seem to always feel like they've
3:07
got stuff cut out and to par Doctor Who stories know that
3:10
just that should never happen. No, I think for for works, I
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can't think of many stuff for parties that don't sustain
3:18
themselves. They all have that one is set up
3:22
to his action, 3 is explanation and running around pulling
3:26
everything together and then forwards, Big Bangs.
3:29
But I think that was you don't you?
3:30
I think that's what Doctor Who is all.
3:31
About and and it clearly in this episode, it's also all about
3:35
1970s nightclub sound visual effects because I remember as a
3:41
kid watching this and thinking that was some top of the pops or
3:44
well, that's that sort of effects as people go through the
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time travel and everything is pure top of the box background,
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the sweet and T-Rex, and everyone would have those
3:52
effects played over their faces every week.
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If you hang around long enough, you're going to end up in the
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top of the pops, a the 80s, you know, yes.
4:00
What we get there in. In holds an omen of the first
4:04
one to use the top of the pop set.
4:06
The, we were talking earlier about the dynamic between boas
4:09
and act and its really good in this little scene with the
4:13
doctor where you get, you know, and that's the hard leader.
4:17
But at the same time, she has a conscience.
4:19
She has a understanding of what's going on.
4:22
I don't understand. Sorry, I don't understand the oh
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groans, having this strange 1970s cop car noise effect every
4:31
time They turn up. If I was an ogre on trying to
4:35
capture people, the last thing I do is announce my presence by
4:38
having what appears to be a dead car siren going on in the
4:41
background behind it. However, in terms of the story
4:45
yet in terms of the TV experience, I think it's just
4:47
there for the kids to come home from succumbing, you know, but
4:52
it's an old, it's an odd noise to have because it's such a 20th
4:55
century noise. It doesn't sound 22nd century.
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It sounds like something, you know.
5:01
If like me, you're a kid of this era, it said, cars and you're
5:05
just thinking. Why is, why is there a red cars?
5:07
Police car going on in the background and I remember, I
5:11
shared don't think. I did think this when I was
5:13
eight, but I certainly when I was an adult watching this, it
5:16
took me a couple of times to realize it's a deliberate effect
5:19
and not just I thought when it because it happens in episode 1
5:23
and when they kill the or they knock out the original Tim
5:28
Condren gorilla, and I remember thinking, oh, Oh, that's just a
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police siren in the back and they forget they couldn't not
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record it when they were filming and then written, as I know,
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it's there wasn't. Oh, I was talking earlier about
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that photograph in the radio times, before the episode with
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the week, for the episode went out, and that photograph, is
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this thing here of Pertwee of hiding behind this broken wall.
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And that's such a power that we've all the reasons, well, the
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all the plant out there camera, it's a powerful image because
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the expectation that one, photographs, just picked up
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early hiding behind a wall and yet, it probably It's of what we
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love about. Our book was enough to you know
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that's scary vision of the future.
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Yeah, this is 1972, 71 72. And yeah, those three the
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Brentford tower blocks when they went up.
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What a massive thing. I remember my mom and dad
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talking about them because they were on the you could see them
6:20
from the chizik fire on the M4, and that was knew you didn't see
6:25
tower blocks like that, they, that hadn't happened.
6:28
You had office blocks but this was three in a row.
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Major tower blocks built in the late 60s.
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And so the use of them in this I think is really clever.
6:38
This is this is one of these centers talking about where his
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body language when he's so frightened of the Daleks and
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he's trying not to be but he is terrified of them when you see
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his hands in a minute, he's kind of rubbing his fingers together
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and looking upset but he's also unfortunately spending an
6:55
inordinate amount of time having to talk to a Dalek barely in the
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scene already NASA meteoric. This.
7:01
Yes. Leslie explaining the profiles
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of the inner world of. It says, you know, about the
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hierarchy of power in the story and how interesting that is.
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You got the Daleks, then the controller.
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Then there's the people he's threatening and it sort of
7:14
filters down. Yes, it's all about power
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struggles it. But that's that's what good
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drama is built on is if it was all just the Daleks and then
7:24
everyone else it would be nonsense.
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But the fact there are all these layers of society that we're
7:30
learning through. Through thorough way, one-liners
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and things like that. It's fantastic.
7:35
Very nice story. I'm never quite sure how much is
7:39
Louis Marx and how much is Terrance dicks?
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I was gonna be like this background because I often think
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the Terrance dicks is doing a rusty Davies style.
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I think he is, I think intense very good at it.
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He's so clever at making everybody's stories work.
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The other thing I love about her with polio.
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Does he see? We're seeing this thing here.
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There's a On that door that part was about to open.
8:04
Yeah and the / we era is full of little symbols like that that
8:10
the design Department have done. There's no explanation for it,
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looks vaguely like a Dalek. I stick I think but it's just
8:16
they always do that in Frontier in space and and and colony in
8:20
space and all his. There's always labels and
8:24
stickers and symbols to suggest the future.
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I think it's a really interesting thing that the / we
8:30
are did That doesn't carry on past.
8:33
Genesis of the Daleks Genesis is the last time that we really
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have. Interesting stickers,
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interesting stickers transfers, we don't who magazine?
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This is what I mean about his hands.
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He's clenching his fists and everything here.
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Lesson is given it is alway front of these in Mobile Daleks
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obviously, something in Albury Woods is not a small man, they
8:55
cast a very very, very tall actor against dialects which in
9:00
some respects you might think. He's a stupid thing to do, but
9:03
it isn't. It's an incredibly clever thing
9:05
to do, you know, I think they look quite long text or how to
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find they are. But they're tiny, he's really
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tall and he's still frightened of them, and there's a 8 year
9:14
old kid. That was a really good way to
9:16
constantly make me think the Daleks are frightening, because
9:20
if that man's frightened of them, and we've seen how
9:22
powerful he is in all the other scenes and he's frightened of
9:24
them. The Daleks must be really,
9:26
really scary. I've always told us the power of
9:28
those who though isn't, it is like, you know, the diets are
9:30
absurd. Looking, if you break them down.
9:33
But how people react to that? Those performances is, what
9:36
sells it hard time? When I was going, when I was
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watching this, I wish his early today in preparation for this.
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And one thing I found really interesting was, how I was
9:46
reacting to this as an adult compared to how I used to react
9:49
to this as a child and this depiction of the future as a
9:53
child. I remember, you know, the bit
9:54
where the Ghazal at whipping, the slave, that sort of visceral
9:58
imagery, that really scared me as a child, Possibly affect it
10:02
out. Maybe not ever going to go into
10:05
that. But what really attached says
10:09
more about you than it does about day of the Daleks, what
10:12
about you. But what affects me now, is that
10:14
adults sequence is coming up in a bit where the controller
10:17
threatens, the section leader and says about his family and
10:21
his children, and all the sort of inference rather than the
10:24
actual imagery itself. It's like it is interesting how
10:27
you view this differently as a child and as an adult, Lot of
10:31
people, lots of Doctor Who but it's good Doctor Who that makes
10:34
you still be able to appreciate it from both points of view.
10:39
Now, here we've got a valentine Palmer's coming to the series.
10:43
And I remember the first time I saw this went on video naughty
10:48
illegal, video would have been sort of early 80s and being
10:51
shocked at how later on in the story.
10:53
This is episode 3 and money has just arrived because in the
10:56
terrorist six normalization, he's the lead character, he's on
11:00
page one. And if it's Maury, all the
11:02
future subject told from his point of view and we meet all
11:06
the other, we meet job and Merrick and all the other Rebels
11:11
that we don't get to see here. Although, one of them is
11:12
actually named when he gets killed and it's like Terrence
11:16
really was clever, but I was gobsmacked when I first saw this
11:19
again and when I do, he's not actually the main character.
11:22
He's not in it for the first two episodes, Valentine Palmer's,
11:26
very interesting man. He's a painter and a sculptor, I
11:30
think. But more importantly is
11:34
Grandfather or great-grandfather was the last person aboard
11:39
Titanic who survived really, and he made quite a he wrote books
11:46
and things about this. He's fascinating man little bit
11:49
of a conspiracy theorist as well, about Titanic result is a
11:52
bit odd but fascinating men didn't stay very long.
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Brilliant answer, very, very good.
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I've been making to guy to look Copland and and read some of his
12:04
books and things about the Titanic, the height of
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sophistication in the future. There is a platter of grapes a
12:10
fix. Yeah, I love that.
12:13
We were to you talking about the scene with the whips and the
12:17
kids that were she talked about John Lennon.
12:19
We did actually see any children, but we certainly do
12:21
old people looking around. This is a very unusual thing for
12:25
Doctor Who this story and that particular part of it of a, we
12:29
seized the slaves, because If you think about most Doctor Who
12:34
up to this point, the future of Earth is pretty much portrayed
12:40
in a very glossy sci-fi pulpy kind of way even.
12:47
Dalek invasion of Earth everyone's in modern-day
12:50
clothes. Everyone.
12:51
You know? Yeah, we've been dominated by
12:53
the dark but actually could still be set in 1965 with no
12:55
problem. This is the first time there's a
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little bit of it in Colony in space and a lot more of it in
13:00
the novelization. Colonies based.
13:02
Yeah, angry first time, we've seen a dystopian future for
13:07
Doctor Who that is deeply unpleasant that people have as
13:10
you say whips and they're they're lugging things around.
13:13
And obviously that would go on a lot more.
13:15
In later Doctor Who's, but do the Daleks is kind of all the
13:19
way through the 60s, the future of Earth.
13:22
You look at you look at seeds of death and stories like that and
13:27
Earth is always seen as shiny silver space suits.
13:29
And, you know, you've got the eyes Warriors and all these
13:32
things. It's all terribly nice based on
13:34
that, all week cocktail dresses. Yeah.
13:37
Where is here because it has to be but this is first time
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doctors actually dead to show an alternative that which is quite
13:45
an adult thing and a very 70s thing.
13:47
The dystopian Futures that we saw on television in the 70s
13:51
will almost uniformly. Portrayed as - that kind of
13:56
George. Orwell thing had finally come to
13:58
television and we were going right.
14:00
Well, done those. 84 a couple times.
14:02
But now we can put it in other shows and there are, you know,
14:05
shortly after this, you get survivors, you get Blake 7, you
14:10
get 1990 and that all showing dystopian Futures that are
14:14
desperately unpleasant and I just thought of the turn it in
14:19
Doctor. Who before as I say there's a
14:20
hint of in Colony in space but it is only a hint and that's not
14:24
that on Earth. Anyway, so it's kind of one step
14:27
removed. This is the first time we see a
14:29
really brutalized version of Earth in the future.
14:32
We're seeing an absolute worst, aren't we?
14:36
Because this isn't how it's supposed to be.
14:39
That's the point is it's it makes you sit and watch this.
14:43
And go. I don't want the future to look
14:46
like this. I'm fed up with the in shiny
14:48
silver space suits from from seeds of death.
14:51
Now, I'm seeing a future that I don't want to see.
14:53
And I think that again, is a very telling part of Barry Lex's
14:59
approach to Doctor Who. His whole ecology thing.
15:02
His whole we're fucking up the world thing which is runs all
15:05
the way through his Five Years on Doctor, Who and even, it's
15:08
even here because it's going World Peace.
15:12
It's all going to go wrong. There's going to be a third
15:14
world war. And look, this is what it leads
15:17
to. We talk about a third world war
15:19
but we actually need that scene of the controller, talking about
15:23
the survivors living in holes in the ground.
15:26
And then we need to see people with being whipped and having to
15:29
carry heavy loads. And that's never been seen
15:31
properly in Doctor Who before. And I think it's fascinating
15:34
that they do this and are the Daleks and within six to eight
15:38
months, every other TV show, that's got a slight space.
15:41
He bent in it, you know, exactly the same thing this character
15:45
here he is in one C. Okay, he comes in the dock.
15:49
He's so interesting. This guy, he comes in and he's
15:52
quite threatening with the guard, isn't it?
15:54
He's like, get out, you know, I'm in charge.
15:56
The second that Doors Down? He's like, which rebel base are
15:59
you with for suddenly realized actually he's working with them,
16:02
then the controller comes in and he starts threatening him.
16:05
And it's just so interesting is in one bloody scene and it's
16:10
Peter Hill. Well, I think is the actor who
16:15
you won't remember these years later.
16:19
Not that many years later, but shortly after this, he went into
16:22
Crossroads and he and he's after Brownlow in Crossroads for quite
16:26
a few years who has one of the most memorable deaths in
16:30
Crossroads ever, because he plays his guy who is a complete
16:34
loser, in everything in his life and his kids are bored of him
16:37
and his wife's a bit fed up with him and he's always fight.
16:41
Going to win, he's always fighting to get better and
16:44
things like that. And you don't need to accuse him
16:47
of sexually assaulting in which never happened, and he has his
16:50
bright. And then finally, he wins a
16:52
bowling trophy, something as simple as a bowling trophy, and
16:56
it's like his whole life has been made up and he's walking
16:59
home with the bowling trophy and gets hit from behind by a car
17:02
and is killed and large shot, is the bowling trophy rolling
17:05
through the rain, and his hand Landing beside it, and I Stark,
17:10
and he's such a good. Good actor.
17:12
Because and it's a shame that this is his only Doctor Who role
17:14
because he is actually, it's a great moment, but he's a little
17:17
bit wasting it because he should have had a much bigger role.
17:21
He's a brilliant, brilliant actor.
17:22
I just think there's a lot of complexity there for a one carat
17:26
one scene. Carrots that, you know, is that
17:29
dicks? I'm wondering about Steve, I'm
17:31
sure is, I'm sure it's Terrance dicks.
17:33
I mean not to anything away from Louis Marx because I think whole
17:37
the whole plot and then the the story is very much.
17:41
Louis Marx, but there are moments like this sequence as
17:45
you're talking about where he's telling him about his kids
17:47
inning, to me that feels like this that I can hear terrence's
17:50
voice in that. I can hear.
17:53
I can imagine Louis doing that scene and that those dialogue
17:56
lines are probably there but Terrence will have just gone
17:59
through and made the menacing and then poor Bernard again does
18:03
very successfully with his Studio cameras high in height
18:08
mouth. There's no sort of, that's
18:10
extreme Close up and it works. It really works because that's
18:14
that tells you Menace. I love it.
18:16
You need actors there than the on afraid of the camera on it.
18:20
Go for it. Louis Marx is an interesting one
18:22
because he strided so many production teams Giants.
18:28
What else do you do planet of evil?
18:33
And of course in BBC terms he's a hugely successful and
18:37
important producer. What is worth in the 70s and
18:42
80s? He is one of the BBC's biggest
18:46
ever producers of drama. Which is why I think a lot, you
18:51
know, I don't take anything away from him for this because I do
18:54
think story-wise, and dialogue wise, for the most part, this is
18:58
him. It's just that the Terrence
19:00
polish, so clever. That's what you've been
19:03
guaranteed. We're isn't, it is that Terrance
19:05
dicks, polish, there's a competency to all of it.
19:09
There's a through. With, with Terrence and berries
19:11
work that you never felt. And I think this is possibly
19:17
true of most good where you have a good dynamic between a
19:20
producer of script editor and it certainly doesn't happen in the
19:24
mid-60s stuff. And it doesn't really happen in
19:27
the mid J&T stuff. But when you have a good rapport
19:31
between the script editor and producer and they're both their
19:33
Visions are informing the program hinge.
19:36
Kevin Holmes are another good set for that.
19:38
Yeah, that is Impression that the show is always consistent.
19:42
You always know you're watching Doctor Who you never see it down
19:45
and go. Oh, suddenly didn't feel like
19:47
dog, too. And I think, you know, the sort
19:51
of J&T, Eric's a Whittier you frequently from story to story
19:55
could go, well, that is to stop to because it doesn't feel
19:57
related to last week's top pulling in opposite directions.
20:00
That. And interestingly, Eric's award
20:03
says he was looking over his shoulder could see that
20:05
relationship between terrorism. Barry Letts and what they
20:08
produced and It could go so right?
20:11
Yes and he was kind of see what they would do it and it could go
20:14
right but it could go wrong and and clearly clearly did and I
20:18
think you know there's a real the Pertwee era has.
20:23
It has a solidity to it. That is like no other five-year
20:28
period in Doctor Who we're from from silurians.
20:33
Well, I suppose it really is silence.
20:35
The roots of giant robot. It just feels like the same
20:39
Program. There is no getting away from
20:41
it, the influence of Barry Letts and Terrance can never be
20:46
underestimated or undersold because that, the two of them
20:50
were Geniuses at this show. They understood the show and
20:53
they understood, I think, more than any other producers to
20:57
direct a run. They understood Their audience.
20:59
Really, really well, they understood children.
21:02
They understood what they could do.
21:04
And what the, what the kids needed to do and occasionally,
21:06
they got their hands slapped for it.
21:08
But you know what? One complaining about automn
21:11
policeman, kids weren't complaining about things being
21:14
terrible day is always the adults as well as the adults.
21:17
And I think Barry and Terrence really understood this show and
21:22
season 9, I think is the point where everything flows
21:27
beautifully. They they kind of gone right
21:29
with we're bored of the master. So he'll make a couple of brief
21:32
appearances, but we're relatively bored of him.
21:35
But this is about the doctor and Joe and a series of monsters and
21:38
a series of Ventures and season nine just and ten as well.
21:44
They just work. They just they they that that is
21:47
the central core of this era of Doctor Who and although I will
21:51
tell you that season 7 is my all-time favorite season Doctor
21:54
Who by long way and I think a lot of season 8 is brilliant, 9
21:58
and 10. I think is the point where you
22:01
can see why this show became the huge success that it was during
22:06
po here at that, but the however good heart Lon.
22:09
On areas were the Pertwee era, put Doctor Who on the map and
22:13
put it into the public Consciousness.
22:15
Suddenly everyone knew what a doll, it was a lot of time.
22:17
This was and Who Doctor Who was they knew the word Time?
22:20
Lord, even you know, at this point and it's like, yeah it
22:24
needed that and that is solely down to to bury and Terrence and
22:28
how they made the show and an awful lot to do with poetry and
22:32
Katie Manning in it Courtney as well, being completely
22:36
accessible to the audience to watch them, one of the smartest
22:39
thing. As I think buried, let's did was
22:41
when he did that survey as to what the contingent of the
22:44
audience was and they realize they had as many adults as
22:47
children watching and listening, right?
22:49
We'll just make great Ellie. We won't take our eye off the
22:52
kids. What we won't write a specific
22:54
before, the kids are making all those levels.
22:58
Yeah. And I think I do think the next
23:00
person who got that right was Russell, I don't think between
23:03
Mary and Terrence, however, good Hinchcliffe and homes were and
23:08
however, good gentian. Can't I still think that Russell
23:12
is the first person that came in and went, this is a family show.
23:16
And I've got to make sure that every episode is watched by at
23:19
least two generations of a family and enjoyed by them
23:22
all.i. Plenty of fire boys, that wept
23:25
into their points about that bourbon bin, but I sat there
23:28
watching it with my nephew and he was laughing, his family.
23:32
Absolutely is brilliant for God's sake, but the rest are
23:37
great. The kids that's just A brilliant
23:40
pink. Absolute brilliant.
23:43
And you know what gassy politicians.
23:45
I mean honestly gasbag politicians.
23:47
That's the one of the best jokes he ever did.
23:49
There was a sequence a minute ago which I think there's a line
23:52
in it. The whole sequence is great, is
23:54
the bit between the dog traffic controller where yeah Deming him
23:57
for being a quisling and there's a line.
24:00
That's so angry. It could come from the pain of
24:02
Malcolm hope and I don't think it's just at all.
24:04
Where's the doctor goes? And they like being happy if I
24:08
love that line. I've got that's a Terrence line.
24:13
I bet that's a Chase. Find our love it.
24:17
But obviously it's so dark that we have to change this like it.
24:21
Yeah, yes. And then we have to have a
24:23
little silly Runabout on a look. Here's a trick to make jumper we
24:27
happy. And of course at the time this
24:30
one now that I never sat down and thought, Oh, that's a trike.
24:34
I said, I went that's a fantastic bit of.
24:36
Yeah, that's been built for Doctor Who because you've never
24:38
seen them before, and then I did not think I was over.
24:41
I was trying to catch up with him.
24:42
I've just thought of which as a kid, I really was Most exciting
24:48
thing in the world because it's Patrick troughton and William
24:50
Hartnell on the title sequence behind the dialects in Andover
24:54
on and Jon Pertwee. And it's like, oh my God.
24:57
Everything I've ever wanted as a kid in that one tiny sequence.
25:02
What the hell is that? We're good.
25:03
His name appearing over the action is a wrong button.
25:09
A little bit too. I'm Peter Hill.
25:10
It was Peter. Yeah, but I was just making it
25:13
up. I'll tell ya.
25:16
It's just it's this. This story is so good and that
25:18
is an absolute classic episode climax.
25:23
That's not mention is an episode 4.
25:26
So I'm going to mention it now very quickly because one of my
25:28
absolute loves in life is I'm a someone who studies of narrative
25:32
quite a lot when I'm watching TV and reading a book, I think that
25:35
and when I plot blocks together perfectly in the fire Max and
25:40
delivers a punch, it's that's one of my love it.
25:45
And the bit where / with Z1 his face when he says, stars is the
25:49
one that did it or you did it yourself.
25:51
I can remember as a child, just get chills watching that say and
25:56
I was like, yeah, as an adult. I just think it's pretty.
25:58
I'm partly cells that moment that everything they is worth
26:03
its actors knees. He just he again he understood
26:07
Doctor Who you understand how to play?
26:08
This is, man, everyone thought would be terrible because he's
26:11
from a comedy and variety background but he isn't.
26:14
He's a brilliant. Brilliant actor.
26:16
Who is Understood how to create the character of Doctor Who and
26:21
I suspect. The only time in part of his
26:23
life. He ever played a character
26:24
pretty similar to himself. He was at, he allowed himself to
26:29
be Jon Pertwee underneath it all, but he's the man, he's the
26:35
cool man. He is the doctor.
26:36
He'll always be for me. He will always be Doctor Who
26:40
that, every other actor who's ever played.
26:42
The doctor. They're all brilliant.
26:44
There's no never been a bad one, but We is still at the top of
26:49
that that hill and everyone's in my eyes is constantly trying to
26:53
reach him. I suppose we've complemented
26:56
Barry. Let's be confident.
26:57
Is Terrence sticks and Louis Marx, direct set everybody but
27:01
for out this Arrow. The through who's the through
27:03
life? Who's the hero?
27:05
It's the man. He's just he's a hero to kids,
27:09
you know, he was the reason we watch dr.
27:12
Who he was a reason that we cut out pictures of him and stuck
27:16
him in a school book. And everything.
27:18
He was a hero. He was, he was just he never let
27:21
us down as kids. You knew, hey, he his present,
27:26
his screen presence. Exuded confidence and I suppose
27:34
it's a bit of a cliché to say, but I think it's true looking
27:36
back. You felt safe with him.
27:38
You never really thought the doctor was ever going to die.
27:41
You will never convince a Joe Grant or Sarah or Leisure.
27:43
We're going to survive, but you always knew the doctor was going
27:48
to hit you. You trusted that he would find a
27:50
way out of it, which you didn't have.
27:53
I can't say heart law because I didn't see enough and was a kid.
27:55
But troughton, obviously, I watched troughton years as a kid
28:00
and Brilliant as he was. I never felt that I was watching
28:05
the show because of the doctor, I was watching the show because
28:09
of everything else in it and the doctor was just part of it with
28:12
Pertwee. By the time you get to this
28:15
point in perley, we're watching the show because the doctor is
28:19
the man we're watching, and we're gunning for him.
28:21
And we're not going to be brothers around closing time.
28:23
We're supporting him. We're going.
28:26
Yeah, we want you to See dr. Because you're just a genius and
28:30
we love you think that Barry Letts as and I know, ballast and
28:34
cast your vote away, but he took it with it.
28:36
I think Pertwee was, you know, the person who made him realize
28:39
that this is how it needed to be.
28:41
But, you know, no matter how dreary what is on the screen
28:45
that the actors are charismatic enough that you always want to
28:49
watch them despite anything, or whatever happens in the Jon
28:52
Pertwee era. I'm in my element watching jumbo
28:56
go through that and Katie as well.
28:58
Well, I think that is a perfect said earlier that because they
29:02
had such a good friendship, off-screen that Dynamic, and
29:05
that Charisma makes them both incredibly watchable and
29:08
believable. You don't ever think you're
29:12
watching actors. You think you watching a time
29:14
lord and he's any human friend. And that's, that's a skill.
29:18
That's that something to be admired.