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42. Ancestral Healing & Business Constellations with Ngan Tra Do · Constellations and all that...

• 0:00
  Everyone, welcome to Constellations and all that.
• 0:03
  Today I'm excited to have a special guest on my show all the way from Vietnam.
• 0:10
  And, uh, welcome Nanan.
• 0:12
  Hi everyone.
• 0:13
  Hi Tracy.
• 0:14
  Uh, it is my pleasure to be here with Tracy today.
• 0:18
  Um, I am Nando, a Vietnamese, uh, born in Vietnam and also currently based in Homan City.
• 0:26
  Because I gone and, uh, I've been with the Constellation work for 10 years and I'm very much enjoying the process and journey of that.
• 0:36
  The first time I encountered the Family Constellations in 2014, in the three day workshop in Malaysia, and since then, I. I just busted in so many questions that, uh, finally I find the hints.
• 0:53
  I filed the hints in the constellation work.
• 0:57
  So therefore I took one year, uh, of training to, uh, constellations and.
• 1:03
  I took it as a hobby for the last kind of seven years because I was with another energy healing modality full time.
• 1:12
  But, um, due to the, one of the live events, uh, one of the biggest happened to me in the last year.
• 1:20
  So I completely came back to constellation work and, you know, um.
• 1:26
  Fully dedicate myself to two modalities at the same time.
• 1:30
  So for now, I am here and like every day, uh, reading, practicing question and answers and like, life is just very cherishing, you know, very joyful for me at the moment.
• 1:45
  So thanks again for Tracy for inviting me.
• 1:48
  You're welcome.
• 1:48
  Looking forward.
• 1:49
  So, so what country did you, um, train in?
• 1:53
  So you said you spent a year training, was it in Vietnam or Malaysia?
• 1:56
  That was initially in Malaysia, Langa, and I was, um, my certification was issued by one of the institute in Germany.
• 2:06
  Very cool.
• 2:06
  Yeah.
• 2:07
  So for the viewers and the listeners, uh, NA and I met in January this year in person in Vietnam, in Ho Chi City.
• 2:16
  She came.
• 2:17
  Uh, to where, to near to where I was staying so that we could meet in person.
• 2:21
  I'd gone to Vietnam for a family holiday and somewhere along the trail of different things I had been made aware of none and.
• 2:32
  So I reached out and said, Hey, I'm gonna be in Ho Chi Minh City.
• 2:36
  What's the chances we can meet?
• 2:37
  And you came along and yeah, we had a lovely hour or so together, just chatting and connecting and it would've been really nice to have more time, but there was so much going on.
• 2:48
  Yeah, it was, it was a fascinating place that we went to, and, and the conversations just really, really flowed.
• 2:55
  So I thought, oh, it'll be interesting to have you on my podcast.
• 2:58
  And, and yeah, share a little bit.
• 3:01
  From a different perspective as well.
• 3:03
  So yes, I'm ready.
• 3:05
  So when's, I'll start with this question for you.
• 3:09
  When someone, when you meet someone for the first time and they ask you what you're doing and you are explaining family constellations to them, how do you explain it?
• 3:20
  What is your elevator pitch or your explanation?
• 3:25
  Take it.
• 3:25
  Very simple like family.
• 3:28
  Systemic constellations for me is, uh, it's experimental process that everyone can take a look at their own pictures in the bigger triangle, bigger perspective by exploring the underlying hidden dynamics which occur repeatedly.
• 3:51
  Into the live, work and also organization.
• 3:54
  And from that, the benefits of the family, systemic counseling, it was so clear for them that giving them a chance to go beyond what they have known.
• 4:04
  And, um, of course, this is the outcome that I, they often got from the client, that they will be, what they got is, um, over expectation.
• 4:15
  So I. I think that that's very clear from the reviews, from ceremonies and Yes.
• 4:21
  Uh, very simple, you know, uh, keywords is, uh, hidden dynamics or underlying dynamics or patterns or, uh, issues.
• 4:30
  So I mentioned some issues like, uh, family relationship, health, money.
• 4:38
  Yeah.
• 4:38
  Also organizational issues.
• 4:40
  So in Vietnam.
• 4:42
  Since I brought it in, I, I told myself like family is just one part of the picture, so I want to include the, the business, the corporate organizations.
• 4:55
  So I work in the two different stakeholders, so I want to make people benefit from whatever context they are.
• 5:05
  Yeah.
• 5:06
  And there's a lot of that in Vietnam.
• 5:07
  How have the locals.
• 5:09
  Because, because ancestral um, devotion is something that's very big anyway in Vietnam, whereas in the western world we take, we had moved away from that.
• 5:20
  But then there are many of us that are moving back to it, I guess.
• 5:23
  So how has it been received for the um, for the Vietnamese 'cause I know you work with a lot of expats as well.
• 5:31
  But yeah, for the locals, they do, they get it straight away because of the ancestral context of it?
• 5:37
  Actually, not really.
• 5:39
  Or I haven't finished my observation process yet.
• 5:42
  Mm-hmm.
• 5:43
  How so far what intrigued them is curiosity of the name of the practice and I. I, I just couldn't just bring them about the ancestral because this is already overwhelming all around the country.
• 5:58
  Every Ted, every Lunar New Year holidays and they have to come by.
• 6:03
  The family have, uh, big meals and big, you know, preparation for the rituals and welcome to the ancestors coming back and enjoy the holiday together with them.
• 6:15
  So it is like having every year, so I don't want to.
• 6:20
  Methodologies with the old practice.
• 6:23
  So I was, I was thinking a bit of it, but um, I just naturally bring in the grandparents, uh, parents outta love, outta the very common sense of, you know, how you look at love by hacking, by friendly, seeing each other, by being connected.
• 6:44
  So, I, I, I make it very simple for the locals.
• 6:47
  Ancestors at the first place.
• 6:51
  But of course everything is like underline, you know?
• 6:55
  So only me know, but I don't want to Right.
• 6:57
  Always stay here for the ancestors.
• 7:00
  We must work with ancestors and everybody run away.
• 7:03
  Yeah.
• 7:03
  To but the but the close to, too close to be the distance.
• 7:08
  Yeah.
• 7:09
  But the expats, they dive into that a little bit more.
• 7:12
  They're very open for, for the constellation.
• 7:14
  Many of them in Vietnam, they, they have heard about it, but they haven't experienced it.
• 7:20
  Ancestors, of course, they have different stories, like I decided to leave my country for a certain reasons.
• 7:28
  Of course there's something going on with the nuclear and extended families.
• 7:32
  And yes, we have worked, uh, for some cases, um, with the ancestral and, uh, you know, the board with the bonding between them and the family.
• 7:42
  And yeah, everyone have kind of, you know, un told stories and we, we just open up during the session.
• 7:51
  But I did feel more or less safer.
• 7:54
  When doing Constellation outside their home country.
• 7:57
  Yeah, yeah.
• 7:58
  For, for receiving help or receiving informations, which is very lovely.
• 8:02
  Yeah.
• 8:03
  We have a lot of, um, I guess expats here from different countries as well, so, because so many other countries have heard of family constellations that um, I get quite a variety of people coming along.
• 8:17
  Yeah.
• 8:18
  How's your New Zealand?
• 8:19
  How's it in New Zealand?
• 8:21
  In terms of your question, so in in New Zealand, the, it's very well aligned with Maori, with their worldview.
• 8:30
  And, um, I do quite a bit of work, uh, different mid eyes and with different groups, and there are, there are a number of other facilitators doing that as well.
• 8:41
  I'll tell you the story.
• 8:42
  When the first time I was in the constellations, of course, I didn't understand any shit.
• 8:48
  Okay?
• 8:48
  So it's like everything, it, even the training, I was the youngest.
• 8:56
  Among like, um, 16, 17 of, uh, ladies and gentlemen, it was very fun when you were the youngest and you was so much innocent when you, you heard the first time you heard how, how the trainer told you, okay, you can do this A, B, C, D, and I was thinking, wow, the process was so simple.
• 9:16
  Oh, is it Oh, and every, everybody just laugh at me.
• 9:20
  And it would, they were thinking, how could.
• 9:24
  I think so simply because it's going to be very, very complicated because you have to, to deal with the issues, you have to deal with client, but I didn't see anything of what they see, so I, I took myself full of curiosity, full of innocence and going to the field, and I just make it as the way I see.
• 9:49
  Sometime this is, this is how it works.
• 9:51
  You know, you put a lot of information and you just draw you, you drown into it.
• 9:58
  So for me, I start with nothing, but I come out with something.
• 10:02
  Yeah, beautiful.
• 10:04
  And sometime it come up with nothing as well, but I didn't have any expectation from my work, so I, I really, yeah, I feel myself, uh, sometimes silly, but yeah, that this is how I grown up from the, from the, the bottom.
• 10:20
  Mm. Beautiful.
• 10:21
  Have you had, um, I guess, well, I'm guessing here and then.
• 10:26
  One of my roles is not to make assumptions and here I go, making money.
• 10:30
  Um, do you get a lot of people coming in that are connected still to the trauma of war?
• 10:37
  Not directly themself, but I would say my parent generations is.
• 10:43
  Are the, the one who, uh, directly get into the wall.
• 10:47
  And also my, uh, the grandparents, but most of them, my clients are around 30, 40.
• 10:55
  And they are not, they're not, they, they were born after the war finish.
• 11:00
  Would some of them not have the residue of the board?
• 11:03
  Sometimes I, I, sometimes I have clients here that are entangled with their.
• 11:09
  Grandfather's pain from the law or you know, they might be having suicidal tendencies.
• 11:16
  And it comes through that.
• 11:18
  It's connected to the, you know, the guilt of surviving.
• 11:23
  I got, I got actually, even though I, I work with the later generation, however, I saw the, how much impact heavily, you know, uh, towards them in, in terms of their behavior, the way thinking, the way of thinking of, uh, how.
• 11:43
  They have to be successful in their life and, you know, self expectations.
• 11:48
  Yeah.
• 11:49
  Also the result from the wall that you, you, you going to be starving if you are not working hard.
• 11:56
  Or another, uh, case is like.
• 11:59
  I am the, I'm the victim, also the case, and also I have to, working is the only, only thing that make me happy, because without working, I could not get love from my parents.
• 12:14
  That's the case.
• 12:15
  Yeah.
• 12:16
  So a lot of, a lot of thing, but people can, people don't link themselves with the war.
• 12:21
  They don't have any clear, um, image of the war, but what they are, the resolved from what the war, uh, the war produced.
• 12:31
  Yeah.
• 12:32
  But I'm glad that they, they, they realize what they are struggling with.
• 12:37
  This is the first start of healing journey, isn't it?
• 12:41
  Yeah.
• 12:42
  Absolutely.
• 12:43
  You shared with me earlier that you are interested in constellations in business and, and you started practicing that.
• 12:52
  Yes, yes, and I find it quite, I say quite similar.
• 12:59
  When we look beyond the, the principles, the, you know, the framework, and we just keep the first, the very first principles and we start applying a different context.
• 13:13
  We see the world, the world ha has been functioned just the same way.
• 13:19
  Right?
• 13:20
  Well, that's a system, isn't it?
• 13:21
  So it's, yeah.
• 13:22
  And I, I find the, the, the business people, they just need different, uh, language from the constellation work.
• 13:30
  They don't believe in the soul, they don't believe their movement, but we use another way to explain them.
• 13:36
  And we just focus on the result, result oriented, uh, approach.
• 13:42
  And, uh, the, the issue from the business, what they are, you know, figuring out every day.
• 13:49
  And yeah, quite practical, but also very, very.
• 13:56
  I, I don't know what to express myself, but I feeling like, okay, even though I don't have full experience of the business, but I start from, from from now and then until I just building up and every single case, give me the.
• 14:13
  Huge inspiration of, of, you know, deaking down the issues and asking myself, and, you know, internal process is always there.
• 14:23
  So I, I don't dare to start, so I just, I just go for it.
• 14:28
  So I'm now taking, taking note of the organizational issues, using the Constellation techniques to solve the problems.
• 14:38
  So I just documented it and one day I can just take a look at it.
• 14:43
  Before I didn't think about it, but right now I think okay, I should do, because there are so many cases I, no way I could remember all them.
• 14:52
  Exactly.
• 14:53
  Yeah, exactly.
• 14:54
  Is there anything.
• 14:56
  That you would be able to share.
• 14:59
  That was an example.
• 15:01
  Obviously, without giving away anyone's information, it's something that you've seen that has been.
• 15:09
  Impacted greatly by having a constellation in, in the business setting.
• 15:14
  Okay.
• 15:15
  For the business, let's say for organizational issues.
• 15:19
  So once I have, I have the guy came up, determined, wanted to sit in her seat, and he's, he was bringing in the issues of the, um, the organizational issue.
• 15:34
  He, he was struggling.
• 15:36
  Uh, he, he was practicing the same way of, you know, uh, work, uh, for the last 17 years.
• 15:44
  And it's a time to grow, but he, he didn't know how to grow, where to go, which direction, and is, uh, like, um, you know, breaking moment, I think, or, you know, you have to swim or you have to, yeah, take that leap.
• 16:02
  Finished.
• 16:02
  Yeah.
• 16:03
  Yeah.
• 16:03
  Yeah.
• 16:03
  So, so he, he brought, he brought in the, the issue and then I remember that, um, the consulate was, constellation session was very interesting in a way.
• 16:14
  Like, uh, he, we all thought that.
• 16:18
  It's not gonna work.
• 16:19
  It's not going to, you know, family constellations is didn't help you.
• 16:24
  I was about to refuse to work with him and he, he keeps, he kept sitting there and, and you know, convince me, please work with me, prostitute.
• 16:35
  I really have some burning issues.
• 16:37
  And then after 10 minutes we decided, okay, we do it.
• 16:42
  And we initially thought of the money issues.
• 16:46
  In, nothing moved.
• 16:48
  And then of course there would be another direction.
• 16:53
  Right?
• 16:53
  And then we brought in the planning.
• 16:58
  Planning of the business and then the team members and then we start to see the movements.
• 17:05
  He never, ever thought of how much important it was with the planning.
• 17:10
  He just ignored totally since then, and now there's investors came as a representative and investor has a connection with the planning and we.
• 17:24
  Here we go.
• 17:25
  I investor said, I'm not going to invest in you without the planning.
• 17:29
  You need to be very well planned.
• 17:32
  And he, he, he, he told everybody, I'm not the guy who, who for planning.
• 17:37
  I'm just go for action.
• 17:39
  So then.
• 17:41
  Conversations, understanding, and then he, he realized something that I'm not, I'm going back talk, talking to the team and establishing the planning, and then someone will take care for the, for the execution.
• 17:56
  But he's, he owns the vision and the mission and later on he opened his enterprise.
• 18:02
  And registered, and next month he came back to support the, the, the workshop event.
• 18:10
  And he share, he gave me the name card with a big smile and he said everything was great.
• 18:18
  And he did that, did that, did that, and I, I would say, okay, okay.
• 18:23
  We had the short interview with him and he keep talking about what he's.
• 18:28
  Doing, I feel.
• 18:29
  Yeah.
• 18:30
  Okay.
• 18:30
  Let let everybody go back to the section now, because we haven't started yet.
• 18:36
  So I see he, he was very ex, very, very excited to, for the new journey.
• 18:41
  And, um, one of the thing is for the.
• 18:44
  The COSO called Young Vietnamese, right?
• 18:46
  They're very much into action.
• 18:48
  When they see something moved and transform inside them, they, they just bang, they do it, and without any hesitation to see how it, it emerge and came back and tell the, tell me what, what, what.
• 19:06
  You know, what transformed them.
• 19:08
  So I, I guess homework is good for them, but yeah, I didn't, I didn't tell him what to do, that he just manifested himself to do that.
• 19:17
  So, yeah, so basically the field was showing him where his block was because he wasn't planning ignore, and he was, he was thinking, um, as long as I have the big card and I, I am into action, everything is fine.
• 19:36
  But this is the old story.
• 19:37
  In the last seven 70 years, things change.
• 19:41
  Now investor come and they, they, you know, they require something else bigger than what he has been doing.
• 19:48
  Apart from trust and interest, right?
• 19:51
  Yeah.
• 19:51
  Yeah.
• 19:52
  Oh, fantastic.
• 19:54
  And what about for you?
• 19:56
  Uh, if you feel to share, is there anything that Constellations has maybe.
• 20:02
  Had an impact on you, has helped you in any way, or you've seen the effects of something that you've witnessed and it's, and it's been, oh, that's part, that's for me as well.
• 20:14
  Something you've represented in.
• 20:16
  Of course.
• 20:18
  Um, yeah.
• 20:19
  The reason I, why I was going back full time with the Constellation was the live event happened to me.
• 20:28
  Uh, last year.
• 20:30
  I, I lost my former husband suddenly at that time.
• 20:35
  I suddenly thought about a constellation.
• 20:37
  I decided to use it to help myself, so I was in this, in the role of both facilitator and the hot seat person.
• 20:48
  I found it so much powerful.
• 20:51
  To, to be reconnected to the soul and to have the real conversation, even though I lost him, I completely, and that, that, that moment really helped me to accept the, the loss, you know, and before I, I got panic attack during the, um, eating the crisis.
• 21:14
  After doing the, the consolation, everything just getting back to normal, like the numbness and, uh, appetite loss and everything about the panic attacks start to be regulated.
• 21:27
  And I, I, I feel very much thankful for the moment.
• 21:32
  One of the ladies who's Thai I I, I was doing in crappy and she was so intrigued.
• 21:40
  By the process.
• 21:42
  She was a part of the participant and she decided to invite me to conduct the workshop in Bangkok.
• 21:49
  So we have done number of events in Bangkok because the first crappy session I did for myself.
• 21:57
  Wow.
• 21:58
  Yeah.
• 21:59
  With all that, that you were able to do that during that time.
• 22:03
  Now, because I know that it was a, you shared with me when I met you.
• 22:07
  What had happened, and yes, and it was, um, unexpected and tragic, the way the events happened, and so I honor you that and acknowledge that that took a lot for you to do that.
• 22:21
  I didn't actually not, I didn't, I didn't take a lot of effort.
• 22:26
  I find myself, I had nothing, just the constellation, then I just use it.
• 22:32
  I had no choice at that moment.
• 22:35
  And I want to find out what's going on, what happened to them, to him, why he left us so suddenly, that's a lot of question.
• 22:44
  Only consolation session gave me the hints of, you know, yeah.
• 22:51
  I just went for it.
• 22:53
  Literally.
• 22:54
  Well done.
• 22:55
  Well done.
• 22:56
  Yeah.
• 22:56
  Thank you.
• 22:56
  And now you're supporting many others too.
• 22:59
  Yes.
• 23:00
  That also a part of my healing journey too.
• 23:02
  Mm. It just like consolation work, Joe, me, not another way around.
• 23:08
  So I, okay.
• 23:10
  I'm doing thing.
• 23:12
  Yeah.
• 23:13
  And do you see in your own fa family system, do you see the um, the shifts?
• 23:21
  Like with your parents?
• 23:22
  Do.
• 23:22
  I don't know if you have any siblings.
• 23:24
  I do.
• 23:25
  I have one sibling, actually two, but one is around in the past 10 years, even though I was practicing constellation work as my hobby, but I am constantly applying the key concept of, uh, belonging, order of love hierarchy as extra into my family system, into my life.
• 23:50
  I find it, um, the first one year of training I was totally into working on myself, and I see a lot of, uh, patterns, entanglements, and of course I worked for a solution.
• 24:04
  And coming out from the 10, one year, I was more or less clear the past, you know, and then going on with the new, the new shit of the present moment and the future and onward.
• 24:18
  And Yes, since I, I know the consolation, I start feeling like I want to have baby because I believe that I'm able to make the new way of life out of it.
• 24:33
  I no longer knew the same pattern that I'm aware of.
• 24:37
  Yeah, so the new living come with a new pattern.
• 24:41
  Come with the new way of life.
• 24:44
  Beautiful.
• 24:45
  Before, I didn't have such a strong urge to, to such a wish, but right now it's different.
• 24:51
  The second thing is my parents are very much like they raised me, like how they was raised, like in the military.
• 25:01
  Very strict, very disciplined.
• 25:04
  But you know, after I knew it and.
• 25:08
  I kind of accept and I kind of see how they change according to my change as well.
• 25:14
  They, they really let me free from whatever they want, so I, I, I'm so blessed that I, I can feel full of freedom when I'm around them.
• 25:25
  And very much into myself, which I, I feel so much, uh, appreciated that and now, yeah, no way that even my parents couldn't change me.
• 25:37
  How can other people can interfere my boundaries?
• 25:41
  So I, I see the boundary is set.
• 25:44
  That also very helpful.
• 25:46
  When I work with the clients one-on-one or the B group, I do not have the burden or the interference from outside to my boundary when I work with them.
• 25:58
  It's not helping, but it's working with, you know, that.
• 26:04
  So I, I go home, I have, have a sleep.
• 26:06
  The issue still belong to them and the transformation still in their own settle, you know?
• 26:14
  In their own world own they are the ownership, isn't it?
• 26:17
  The owner of the issue.
• 26:19
  Yeah.
• 26:20
  How about you, the second?
• 26:22
  Oh yeah, I, I've, I've seen quite a lot of transformation in my family system.
• 26:26
  I had a really big one, um, really early on I saw.
• 26:31
  After doing a constellation, I saw the shifts very quickly in my, in my siblings.
• 26:37
  There was a big energetic shift when we when, because we were all out of alignment because there were siblings that were missing that were not given a place.
• 26:46
  And once they were given a place, everything shifted in the dynamics in my family.
• 26:52
  Um, and from that also I saw a shift with my daughters and their relationships.
• 26:57
  And then I also noticed.
• 26:59
  I witnessed, um, some things happen with my dad, more so with my dad than with my mom and his family system and this connection to his, his siblings as well.
• 27:10
  So yeah, that's one that really stands out for me.
• 27:13
  But when, so my mother lived with us for a long time.
• 27:17
  Mm-hmm.
• 27:18
  And, um, she's.
• 27:21
  Passed on.
• 27:21
  Now she's transitioned.
• 27:22
  But when she was here in the house and I had done a constellation, there were oftentimes when as I was assimilating things or integrating things, mm, we just didn't, we just never seemed to meet each other in the house.
• 27:36
  We had quite a big house, but it's not that big.
• 27:38
  Right.
• 27:39
  And then when we did get to meet, when we did get to see each other again, it feels such a different energy.
• 27:46
  So, yeah, I've, I've noticed over the years, you know, my own softening mm-hmm.
• 27:52
  And the insights that come that allow for old story to drop away Beautiful and old patterns here.
• 28:01
  Have you got, uh, have you got a favorite facilitator or maybe there's more than one that you have seen or that you would like to see?
• 28:11
  I haven't, I haven't found the, the favorite one.
• 28:15
  I just recently, in the last few weeks, I had a strong calling to have the, the teacher or the mentor for the, for, for, for this work.
• 28:27
  I haven't found it.
• 28:28
  I heard about, uh, Stephan Stephan house.
• 28:31
  Houser.
• 28:32
  Yeah.
• 28:32
  I could love to see him, but this time, uh, in Bangkok, I could make the trip.
• 28:38
  I think maybe next time when he, he come back to Asia so I can see him.
• 28:45
  I'm not sure if he's the one.
• 28:48
  Yeah.
• 28:49
  Could be great if you can introduce me.
• 28:51
  Some of the people.
• 28:53
  Yeah, there's a, um, there's a big event happening in Mexico in October.
• 28:58
  Okay.
• 28:58
  Where there's gonna be quite a few facilitators from around the globe going to it.
• 29:03
  Will you come?
• 29:04
  Yeah.
• 29:05
  England St. Just, she is a trauma specialist.
• 29:09
  A trauma neurologist.
• 29:10
  She comes us up and she's been, she worked very deeply alongside Bert for a number of years.
• 29:16
  And in gala she is from, she's either from Mexico or Columbia Northern.
• 29:23
  Mm-hmm.
• 29:24
  Um, she's spicy little lady.
• 29:27
  And what else?
• 29:30
  I'm just thinking of the Mexico, um, gathering.
• 29:32
  This is at the moment Barry Cross.
• 29:35
  He's from the United, United States.
• 29:36
  Yeah.
• 29:38
  And Francesca Mason, boring.
• 29:40
  She's from America as well.
• 29:42
  Very cool.
• 29:43
  She does a lot of nature constellations.
• 29:45
  Mm-hmm.
• 29:46
  Working with, um, yeah, with nature and, yeah.
• 29:51
  Yeah.
• 29:51
  Energies.
• 29:53
  Cool.
• 29:54
  So, because your podcast is now streaming around the globe, I make a wish that one day, the.
• 30:03
  ICA will make one of that the similar event in Asia.
• 30:09
  Everybody can, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 30:12
  You can join.
• 30:13
  You never know.
• 30:14
  We put it into the field.
• 30:16
  Say, you come this time, please, please land.
• 30:21
  Land the seed.
• 30:23
  Yeah.
• 30:24
  How many f facilit, like how many.
• 30:26
  Family Constellation facilitators are there in Vietnam.
• 30:29
  Are there many?
• 30:30
  Not many.
• 30:31
  Very new, as long as I know, it's like less than five.
• 30:36
  Wow.
• 30:37
  Yeah.
• 30:38
  And other people, they, they, they are combining or they work, they are, they're learning.
• 30:44
  Different modalities are part of Constellation, so I, I I'm not sure they are like full-time practitioners.
• 30:51
  Right.
• 30:51
  Yeah.
• 30:52
  And other they, uh, they don't have the, the social media or I don't, I don't know them.
• 30:59
  So, so far it's not very plenty.
• 31:03
  Yeah.
• 31:03
  In New Zealand it was quite small.
• 31:05
  It's starting to grow.
• 31:07
  There have been a, uh, a few different teachers come and go too.
• 31:10
  So more and more people are learning.
• 31:12
  I'm teaching now myself.
• 31:14
  I'm into my fourth year of teaching, so there's quite a few students coming through me.
• 31:19
  And then there's Joe down in, um, the Bay of Plenty and, um, Maya in the south island, and Erin was in the Bay of Plenty as well.
• 31:28
  So there's quite a few coming through.
• 31:31
  It's growing.
• 31:32
  And then, and then we have a lot of.
• 31:34
  Um, we have a lot of South Americans, south Americans, I suppose.
• 31:39
  Yeah.
• 31:39
  But we'll be that continent through there.
• 31:41
  So there's a lot of them that come through that have, um, trained overseas, maybe from Germany or, and like Brazil.
• 31:49
  Mm-hmm.
• 31:50
  Places like that.
• 31:51
  So they're coming into Tracy.
• 31:53
  Tracy, tell me how's your, how's your experience with training, training people?
• 31:59
  Do you, how, how do, how do you enjoy it?
• 32:02
  I love it.
• 32:03
  So when I, when, when I train people, so I'm also a drum doula, so I teach people how to make a drum, right?
• 32:12
  So a drum that you would use.
• 32:14
  And so it's become part of when you train with me, you also make a drum, whether you use it in the field or not.
• 32:23
  Um, to move energy is entirely up to you.
• 32:25
  But the idea is that the drummers a support.
• 32:29
  To help to clear your own energy and to help as a resource for you, whether you use it in your constellations or not.
• 32:37
  And my first lot of trainees, I, um, we made our drum halfway through the training, and I, by then, I'd already helped, we'd birthed probably at least 500 drums over the last Wow.
• 32:53
  10 years of different things with different people, myself and another person.
• 32:58
  And, um, that might be a slight exaggeration, maybe close to that anyway.
• 33:03
  Um, but when I did my first training, what I discovered was that after the second, no, we were on their third month of training and we made the drums and I recognized that as they were birthing the drums, a lot of things were coming up for them because it's quite an emotional and an intense experience.
• 33:23
  Birthing a drum.
• 33:24
  'cause it is like birthing a baby.
• 33:25
  You go through all these different layers of the process.
• 33:28
  And so there was some that were struggling with, um, it, you know, they're, oh, this is not good enough and, um, oh, I'm not doing it tight enough, or I'm doing it wrong.
• 33:40
  And those were some things that I noticed in the pattern of, of that person as they were doing the training.
• 33:47
  And then another one who, um.
• 33:49
  I just wanted to throw in the towel, just like, oh, give up.
• 33:52
  I'm, I'm can't do this.
• 33:55
  It's too much.
• 33:56
  And that was that person, they were finding life quite overwhelming as well.
• 34:02
  So I thought, ah, okay.
• 34:04
  So the, the drum is showing me where people need the resourcing.
• 34:09
  So now when they train with me, we make the drum on the first weekend.
• 34:14
  First, uh, we do a half day on the Friday.
• 34:17
  We do a full day on the Saturday, and the, the Saturday is dedicated to the drum making.
• 34:22
  And from there I'm observing as well as, um, teaching them how to make a drum, but observing the process and how it is for them.
• 34:31
  So that has made it easier for me in the way that I know.
• 34:37
  Yeah, it's given me, it's, the field has shown me another way of, of being able to resource people because it's.
• 34:43
  You know, in the training, the more people work on their own issues, their own blockages and blind spots, the more clearer they will be to be a facilitator should.
• 34:54
  So yeah, so that's a really good resource and I'm loving it every year that I've just learned so much from the different groups that come in, the different people.
• 35:03
  And, um, I've had some doctors come through and train with me and, um, yeah, a variety of.
• 35:11
  Beautiful souls who are already doing a lot of great work in the world anyway, and they're adding this toolkit to this, um, tool to their toolbox.
• 35:21
  I mean, yeah, no.
• 35:23
  Excellent, excellent.
• 35:24
  I'm curious, may I ask another question?
• 35:29
  Yeah.
• 35:29
  Have you observed the difference when you conducted the constellation session with the drum and without the drum?
• 35:37
  Did you find any challenge doing constellation work without the drum and let's say the tool boxes?
• 35:45
  For example, myself, my side.
• 35:47
  Since I know that constellation work cannot standalone alone, I, I have a bit warm up exercises at the beginning, like breath work or movement exercises or, you know, emotional connection exercises or even yoga or even a lot of thing to open people up.
• 36:11
  And move them from thinking to feeling, and they definitely couldn't do it themselves.
• 36:18
  And I helped them a bit.
• 36:19
  And I also work with other practitioners in Vietnam, and I worked so well, even though I, I even had all session.
• 36:28
  Right.
• 36:28
  But working with them is just like.
• 36:32
  So smooth after, you know, everybody going to the session, everything just flow.
• 36:39
  How about your side?
• 36:40
  So sometimes I consulate, like if I'm doing a whole workshop, I will use the drum at some point and sometimes in the session and feel that there is a blockage of energy.
• 36:52
  So I will just drum and walk around the space.
• 36:57
  Then sometimes it's just like something moves and then there's a, there's a release of energy that can then something.
• 37:04
  Um, I do do exercises as well.
• 37:07
  I do a lot of, um, different combinations of exercises and I will often drum during those because that, it, it, the somatic experience of the drum.
• 37:18
  Yes, the sound, the vibration, you know, and all of that allows, you know, the brain can drop in as you can listen to the drum rather than trying to be in the mind.
• 37:29
  So, um.
• 37:31
  Yeah, I have this one that I call, um, yes to life, and it's, and it's three people.
• 37:38
  So you have yourself, you have your mother and your father, and um, and it's an experience.
• 37:43
  I take you through a process of receiving the life force that comes from your parents.
• 37:48
  And I drum the whole way through that.
• 37:52
  And then we do, we do three rounds of it because everybody gets to have a chance to have that experience.
• 37:57
  So that you are receiving the life force that comes through your family system, and I talk through the whole process and then I get you to turn around and we say some words to the parents, and then you can step in as your adult self and take them in, you know, like.
• 38:14
  Rather than when you are in the front and they're behind you, you're, you're, you're in the space of I'm the little one, you are the big one, and you turn around and you're still the little one, but you are also in your adult self.
• 38:24
  So you are going in and you're saying Yes to this.
• 38:27
  Yeah.
• 38:28
  And, and then once I'm go through that pro part of the process, then I get them to step back again.
• 38:34
  A few more words.
• 38:35
  And then I invite them to turn around and to feel their parents behind them like a launchpad.
• 38:42
  You know, I'm still drumming.
• 38:44
  And then we sort of, I build it up until it gets to the tempo, gets quite fast, and then I invite them to step forward and really take it all, all in.
• 38:52
  Um, yeah, I think the drum is such an important tool for me.
• 38:58
  Yeah.
• 38:58
  In, in that space.
• 39:00
  And, uh, and I'll use it in the breaks.
• 39:03
  Clear the room.
• 39:04
  I notice difference.
• 39:05
  I definitely, I think sometimes I notice that if I haven't for whatever reason and haven't drummed, then I can be quite tired afterwards.
• 39:14
  I think the drumming clears that energetic residue away like quickly.
• 39:18
  Yeah.
• 39:19
  I'm sure this is very powerful and very stimulating whenever you use the drum.
• 39:24
  And so you use the drum during the session as well, so Sometimes, yeah, so, so drumming when I'm doing the exercises, but the exercises are kind of like.
• 39:34
  Constellations in themselves, but it's like a group.
• 39:37
  Everyone's doing it at the same time.
• 39:40
  And then, um, sometimes in someone's constellation, I may be drumming if I'm called to drum for them while they're doing their constellation, but it'll, it'll only be for like a small part of it, not for the whole time.
• 39:53
  Right.
• 39:55
  Wow.
• 39:55
  That interest.
• 39:56
  I would, and I, and I also use my voice as well.
• 39:59
  Yeah.
• 40:00
  So, um.
• 40:02
  For a long time, tone and sound wanted to come through me, and I hadn't seen anyone do that, so I was like, mm-hmm.
• 40:12
  It's not happening.
• 40:13
  And I was very resistant to the whole.
• 40:16
  Concept of it, how would you use your voice and tone?
• 40:20
  Tone to, to facilitate the session?
• 40:24
  Yes, but in the, I use it in a, in like a bring through.
• 40:28
  So I, I see sound, I see the frequency that is needed.
• 40:32
  I don't, couldn't explain to you how I see it.
• 40:34
  I just see it and then I just open my mouth and then a sample will come out and it will shift the energy as well.
• 40:42
  Wow.
• 40:43
  And sometimes it goes for so long.
• 40:45
  I'm thinking, how on earth am I making this sound?
• 40:49
  I don't even know how it's happening because I couldn't hold my breath for that long.
• 40:53
  You know, like I couldn't, if I wasn't in the field, if I wasn't in the constellation right now or, or a sound bath.
• 41:01
  'cause I sometimes do sound healing energy work as well.
• 41:04
  That's when it's all starting to flow through me.
• 41:07
  I would love to join the training of drumming and uh, yeah, I feel like I'm very much with the editorial.
• 41:16
  Uh, yes.
• 41:18
  Yeah.
• 41:18
  I was thinking one day I can join the training.
• 41:21
  A few.
• 41:23
  Yeah.
• 41:23
  Perhaps you, can you come back to Vietnam?
• 41:26
  One thing?
• 41:27
  Yes.
• 41:28
  I'm sure I'll be back to Vietnam.
• 41:30
  We have family there, as you know, so we'll be back.
• 41:35
  Let's, let's, um, think ahead.
• 41:38
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 41:40
  You can do a workshop here together with Tracy and the drum.
• 41:47
  Would you bring the drum as well?
• 41:49
  I can bring a drum, yeah.
• 41:50
  Easy.
• 41:51
  Yeah.
• 41:51
  Yeah.
• 41:53
  Wow.
• 41:53
  Is, is a drum a traditional thing in Vietnam?
• 41:56
  I know that.
• 41:57
  I went to some, yeah, they have a big drum and, but nowadays it is not very.
• 42:04
  Applicable in the, in the daily modern life.
• 42:08
  I miss that too.
• 42:09
  I, I was always.
• 42:12
  Resonant.
• 42:13
  Resonant with the drumming stuff.
• 42:16
  Last year I joined a Japanese drum and you know, traditional Oh yes.
• 42:23
  With the rock Rock band using all the traditional instruments, including the drum.
• 42:29
  Oh my God.
• 42:31
  It was mind blowing where they're all just like moving their arms and doing That's right.
• 42:37
  Wow.
• 42:37
  That would've been.
• 42:41
  Everybody moved.
• 42:43
  Yes.
• 42:44
  Yeah.
• 42:44
  But for you, like you, you use a smaller drum, but you use a smaller scale of the group H. Can you show me your drum?
• 42:51
  So this is my drum.
• 42:52
  You see this?
• 42:54
  Oh, cool.
• 42:55
  Yeah.
• 42:56
  I see it's made from deer skin.
• 42:58
  From the deer.
• 42:59
  Yeah.
• 43:00
  Let me just change the, the sound here.
• 43:03
  Can I hear very well?
• 43:04
  You can make it louder.
• 43:06
  It's vibrating a bit at the moment 'cause it's not warm enough, so it's got bit of a Okay, very cool.
• 43:13
  Yeah, yeah, I can hear the vibration.
• 43:15
  Cool.
• 43:16
  So, and there's the back of it.
• 43:18
  Uh huh.
• 43:19
  Wow.
• 43:19
  Nice spider.
• 43:20
  Yeah.
• 43:21
  Or we can do that way, it's like a tree.
• 43:24
  Depends in which way we hold it.
• 43:26
  Yeah.
• 43:27
  Yeah.
• 43:28
  So, so if someone, if someone join the constellation session and asking about you, the drumming, what is the shortest explanation?
• 43:38
  Coming from you ask me about the drumming as in Yeah, yeah.
• 43:42
  Like why you use the drum, and then you need to quickly answer them and move on with, um, help to clear the help to clear the energy.
• 43:50
  Okay.
• 43:50
  Okay.
• 43:50
  Anything that stuck, um, any blockages that, uh, and what if people don't believe in energy, how could you explain that?
• 43:58
  Um, I'll get them to stand up and just to feel it, to feel the vibration of the drum and notice what happens for them.
• 44:05
  In their body.
• 44:05
  Right?
• 44:06
  'cause you can really feel it go through your body.
• 44:08
  So if you can feel that, then you'll know that, you know, everything is energy.
• 44:13
  So if they don't believe in it, then they've got some work homework to do.
• 44:17
  They will feel it themselves.
• 44:18
  Yeah.
• 44:20
  Yeah.
• 44:20
  That's the only way.
• 44:21
  Yeah.
• 44:22
  That's interesting.
• 44:23
  It's, it's.
• 44:24
  Um, I think I find that mostly people that come are really interested in energy and are drawn to the work as well.
• 44:32
  Mm-hmm.
• 44:32
  It's occasionally someone brings their, maybe their partner or their friend along 'cause they really want them to experience it and, and that's when, if they're not into or understanding of it, that's when things can get difficult.
• 44:48
  Right.
• 44:48
  You know, they don't really wanna be there.
• 44:50
  They're only coming along to support someone else and.
• 44:54
  Um, they're not interested, so that that can be quite, they tend to not sit in a hot seat either, which is absolutely fine.
• 45:03
  Um, but they could yeah.
• 45:05
  Have quite a, have the brakes on, we would say here.
• 45:09
  So the stopping movement of energy.
• 45:12
  Mm-hmm.
• 45:13
  What other questions have I got?
• 45:15
  How are we going?
• 45:16
  We've done very well.
• 45:17
  We've gone over an hour already.
• 45:18
  I like the drumming part very much.
• 45:21
  Well, that was another thing.
• 45:23
  So, uh, going, coming into the work, um, seeing other facilitators, going to events where you see other facilitators, you know, working.
• 45:33
  So they have conferences, we call them intensives or immersions, um, here either in Australia and we've started to do them here in New Zealand as well.
• 45:45
  Um, you get to see other people facilitate, so that means.
• 45:48
  There are things that you see and experience that you may not be doing in your own work.
• 45:54
  Sometimes it's like, oh, I'm not gonna do that.
• 45:57
  That doesn't, that doesn't resonate with me.
• 45:59
  And then other times it's, they using the drum.
• 46:01
  That's really all that feel, that energy move.
• 46:04
  So yeah, we had some visitors come to New Zealand who, who used a drum and that was where I was like, and by then I was already making drums.
• 46:15
  Right.
• 46:15
  I just wasn't using them in my constellations.
• 46:18
  That's awesome idea.
• 46:20
  I never thought of it.
• 46:22
  Since I met you, I still, I still kept the drumming ID inside me.
• 46:28
  I haven't made myself yet, but I will.
• 46:32
  Yeah.
• 46:32
  So far.
• 46:33
  Shake it.
• 46:33
  Another is another one a good, um, yeah.
• 46:37
  Yes.
• 46:38
  Just a little shakers, bells, or, yeah.
• 46:42
  Yeah.
• 46:42
  Yeah.
• 46:43
  I remember you told me when we met, I only used the sound Oh yeah.
• 46:48
  Also, um, help people to come back to their Paris, uh, as let's say, uh, parasympathetic mood system.
• 46:57
  Yes.
• 46:57
  Yes.
• 46:58
  And make them cooling down.
• 47:01
  Yeah, a little bit.
• 47:03
  And also I have.
• 47:05
  Friend who do the full session of sound healing after the conation session, which is very beautiful.
• 47:12
  And I got a eurythmy, I got the um, movement dance technique.
• 47:19
  I have two different kind of movement practitioners, so.
• 47:24
  I invite them all invite to join me of each of sessions.
• 47:28
  So I see how I can emerge with the, the technique I emerge with the activity and also the practitioners and of course the drumming.
• 47:40
  There's something that I am going to make it.
• 47:42
  And it's like, you know when you're in the field and you are, um, and you are following the energy.
• 47:49
  So that's what, when you drum, you need to stay out of your head and just go with the, the energy that's in the field as well.
• 47:55
  Mm-hmm.
• 47:55
  So if we're drumming and we're trying to keep a beating in a certain rhythm, it's not flowing with it.
• 48:02
  You've gotta just kind of just let the drum, let the field guide the.
• 48:08
  Question, do the rhythms make an impact on their own internal process?
• 48:17
  The rhythms?
• 48:18
  Do you, do you think the rhythm make the impact or you just start the drumming?
• 48:24
  I generally just kind of start the drumming.
• 48:28
  Yeah.
• 48:28
  Um, there's another thing that you can do with the drum.
• 48:31
  I do use it to make the sound of the heartbeat as well.
• 48:35
  Ah.
• 48:38
  So, um, but if you just move that around.
• 48:43
  Yeah.
• 48:44
  Can you hear that on your end?
• 48:46
  Yes.
• 48:47
  Right.
• 48:48
  And it has quite a, uh, um, and that's often, I'll start that way.
• 48:52
  Mm. Yeah.
• 48:54
  And then I'll go.
• 48:55
  Very cool.
• 48:56
  Wow, Tracy.
• 48:57
  And just that little heartbeat can, can really have, uh, quite a.
• 49:02
  Profound effect.
• 49:03
  You know, especially if you're doing something with your mum and dad and you've got that heartbeat going in and you are in the moment that, that exercise I shared with you, but yes to life and you are with your parents in that space or the, and representatives of your unconditional parents in that space and you hear the heartbeat and just kind of, it drops, drops you into, into your heart space.
• 49:26
  And I mean, that's what we hear for nine months, right?
• 49:28
  You hear our mother's heartbeat.
• 49:30
  I'm amazed by what you are doing, Tracy, I'm amazed by what you are doing too.
• 49:35
  I think you're doing a job in Vietnam.
• 49:37
  Like you say, there are very few people over there doing this work, so you are leading the way, which is awesome.
• 49:43
  So good.
• 49:44
  Thank you.
• 49:46
  And um, PO Chi Min City is a big place, right?
• 49:50
  Yeah.
• 49:51
  Quite overwhelming sometimes.
• 49:54
  Yeah.
• 49:56
  Yeah, but there are many people, especially the, the community leaders, they love the, they love the constellation work, and I find it so lucky that I realized the value of the work without me telling so much, and I'm, yeah.
• 50:15
  That's cool.
• 50:16
  How, how often would you do a Constellation?
• 50:20
  Do you do it for a day or is it a weekend or?
• 50:25
  During the week, when do you run your sessions?
• 50:28
  Not regular at the moment, but, um, we have every, every month have the mini workshop and the Thursday evening.
• 50:37
  And I also have the workshop at the weekend, and I also have the organizational session during the weekdays.
• 50:46
  Yeah.
• 50:47
  And most of the time reading and living.
• 50:51
  And do you do one-on-ones as well?
• 50:53
  Yes.
• 50:54
  Yeah.
• 50:55
  I'm very much seeing how I will be calm when I do the one-on-one, but yes, I'm open for that too.
• 51:04
  Yeah.
• 51:05
  And I got the, the first testimony of the one-on-one session in the last weekend.
• 51:11
  So Yes, continue.
• 51:12
  Continue.
• 51:14
  It's growing.
• 51:15
  It's growing.
• 51:15
  Yeah.
• 51:15
  Really stepping it out there.
• 51:17
  Right.
• 51:18
  Let me just think.
• 51:19
  I think we're just about coming to an end here.
• 51:22
  Anything else that the field would like me to ask?
• 51:25
  Do you have the regular question to end the session?
• 51:28
  Not really.
• 51:30
  I kind of just wait and see what the field wants me to, um, bring in.
• 51:33
  Wow, that's also cool.
• 51:35
  I would ask, um, for contact details, so I know that you've shared some with me and we'll put them in the thread, but for those people who would like to hear it, 'cause some people are audible and would like to hear you say it, how would people find you?
• 51:52
  Sure.
• 51:52
  Um, people can either find me on Facebook on NDO and Family Systemic Constellation fan page, I can also share with you and also Instagram ndo uh therapy.
• 52:09
  It's very simple and also LinkedIn, but I am, I am studying building up.
• 52:15
  My own website is coming.
• 52:17
  Not today, it's coming.
• 52:19
  It's coming soon.
• 52:20
  One of those things, isn't it?
• 52:22
  When we, when we're busy doing this work, it was, you know, I had a website.
• 52:26
  It took a while and I was, um, and building it all.
• 52:31
  There's so much in the administration side of things that hasn't been, um, they would get forgotten because I was so busy doing the work that didn't have that.
• 52:42
  And then it'd come to me like, ah, I haven't even advertised my workshop because I'm just so busy.
• 52:47
  And now I have, um, some support in the back office helping me with that sort of stuff.
• 52:52
  And it's just made everything so much.
• 52:54
  Flows so much easier.
• 52:56
  Yeah.
• 52:56
  Yeah.
• 52:56
  That's good that someone helping you floating around up here and now being That's right.
• 53:01
  Execution is in important.
• 53:02
  Right.
• 53:03
  And I, I'm happy that you now having a team behind you and Yeah.
• 53:08
  Helping you there.
• 53:09
  Well, it's been beautiful to talk with you and, um, yeah, I think we'll, we'll pause here and look forward to maybe catching up with you again sometime soon.
• 53:21
  And.
• 53:22
  You know, who knows when I'm gonna get back to Vietnam?
• 53:25
  Yes.
• 53:26
  I would love to hear the date that you will be here.
• 53:29
  And I try to make something the best outta your journey.
• 53:35
  Okay.
• 53:36
  I'm really determined doing that.
• 53:38
  'cause I, I'm imagine how you use the drum.
• 53:41
  It's just so inspiring for me.
• 53:43
  I imagine my style will be very different.
• 53:46
  Right.
• 53:47
  I believe so.
• 53:48
  I believe so.
• 53:49
  Either we, we make the, the constellation workshop with the drumming and we also have another drumming session as well.
• 53:57
  Oh wow.
• 53:59
  I'm just cannot stay still when thinking of Tracy coming for Ho Chi Mean and Doing something.
• 54:06
  And please share some time of your holiday for, for work.
• 54:12
  Okay.
• 54:13
  Yeah.
• 54:13
  Yeah, definitely.
• 54:14
  Absolutely.
• 54:15
  Mm mm I I really, I, I'm really mean that, yeah.
• 54:19
  Thank you.