Latest / Justice For / Kouri Richins Trial Week 3: Detective Testimony & A Stunning Defense Strategy

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Kouri Richins Trial Week 3: Detective Testimony & A Stunning Defense Strategy · Justice For

• JusticeFor: Well welcome back to justice for trial recap edition. We're your hosts. I'm Jackie and Sam. I'm here this week She is here this week. I'm really glad to have her back. was kind of weird talking to myself, not gonna lie. She kept like texting me and was like, does this look okay? Does this look okay? I'm like, yeah, it's doing fine. It's easy to put two of us on this big couch. Try to put one of us on this couch. So sorry to start off with a spoiler, but there was absolutely no other way to start this episode. We had a shocking week three of trial, but before we get into all of that, we have an announcement to make. We have another live show coming your way Colorado Springs. I mean, we've been telling you guys that it's been in the works to guess what is actually happening. April 16th at 6 PM. We will be taking over Voodoo Brewing off Garden of the Gods. The show will start at 6 PM. So get there a little bit before to grab your seat, grab a drink. We do have a limited amount of reserved seats up front with a special gift. Those are $20 on our website, justiceforpodcast.com and tickets aren't required to attend. You can just show up. It is open to the public. We're not shutting the place down. Correct. So, but that just makes you don't have to worry about getting a seat. Yeah. I actually held open voodoo when it first came to town. So I wouldn't be endorsing a place that I didn't absolutely love and adore. So. ⁓ and it's amazing. It is. Their drinks are amazing. The food is phenomenal and the people that work there are even better. So come hang out with us and treat the staff amazing. I have four words for you. ⁓ Green chili gouda fries. Deadass. They're so fucking good. And also we do know that there are some teens who have been wanting to come to our show since Painting with a Twist was an 18 and up event. We are 13 and up this time. super excited for some of those younger listeners who do listen to us. I mean obviously we can't control it. We're not going to ID. No we're not. Just be prepared that we are, you know who we are. Yeah you know who we are. We cuss. I'm not going to apologize for that. That's just who we are and we talk about murder. Yeah, I'm just gonna be straight up with you We talked about some fucked up shit. So Just if you're gonna bring your kids just be aware be prepared. All right So are you are you ready to get into week three of trial? ⁓ so I'm not gonna lie to you. I didn't actually watch trial She watched like five minutes Yeah Because I've been waiting for this it's like the most important five minutes. Yeah, she likes my recaps better and then you read all my my mini recap Yeah, I don't just not like what wait for this no ⁓ I do read the recaps I actually Have been trying to comment on some and things like that and just be part of it So I'm aware of what's happening. Just not she knows this aware She knows All right, but the thing I did watch I do have a reaction video for what I found out. Yes Mine got split a little bit, but I will get into it so In a shocking turn of events, the defense rested its case without calling a single witness. Kouri also made the decision to not testify, which was interesting because there was definitely a lot of alluding to her testifying in the first two days of this week. Like the first time they said something, I was like, wait a minute, do I understand what they just said? they, are we talking about her testifying? ⁓ Kouri also made decision to not testify. ⁓ Which, ⁓ I you're not but there were more- I'm kind of shocked, but just like more like, what a fucking idiot. ⁓ Well, ⁓ I'm more shocked because ⁓ there were comments ⁓ in this week of alluding her testifying. Yeah. And I really thought were getting her ⁓ But we didn't. ⁓ I'm surprised. I'm honestly surprised that she's not... that they are not like... we should put her on the stand. Because I personally think these defense attorneys are fucking idiots. I'm... nothing. I hope you're offended. ⁓ I mean they should be offended. It's a true statement. Yeah, but like I feel like they are dumb enough to put her on the stand But then again, I also know that the cross-examination Wild Absolutely wild I would expect the prosecution to like soup to the defense's level of Carmen's yeah Testimony so let's go ahead and just start with Monday Which was dates in a trial and we started with Cody right who was Eric Richens business partner and a really close friend of his The state started his testimony by playing a video from a gathering on March 5th, so the day after Eric died. And they showed Kouri having a gathering at the house, everyone was drinking and laughing, and they were asking him who's in the video. not in the video. ⁓ They also showed a picture from this night during his wife's testimony, Allison, and she just like named the people in the video. Bryce is one of those people. We will talk about that. I also have a picture of that as well that we'll put up here. It was just very interesting because we didn't, like we talked about that video and they just brought it in to show the party. But Amy was also there. Eric's sister. So it's very confusing in all of this. don't, I don't know, like we knew she was there, but I don't know what we were getting at with all of that. Also spoiler alert, Amy never testifies and I cannot figure why Amy never gets on the stand or does anything, but she didn't. Well, his other sister did though. Yeah, but I'm just... You will understand when I get to Detective Woody why I'm so confused about Amy never testifying. So, Jamie Woody. We love her. We... ⁓ you're gonna love her. can't wait. They also asked him about... a phone call that he received from Eric on Valentine's Day where Eric was sounding really serious and urgent about something that happened. But they didn't actually talk about the poisoning or the sandwich or any of that on the call. Or what was it? What was the call for? Just to show that Eric was panicking that day? I don't know. Maybe because his wife was off fucking someone else. The defense tried pushing into the finances and how much Eric and Cody made, but they weren't allowed to get very far because there was no reason for it. There wasn't relevance. So they switched their focus to ⁓ hunting infractions that actually gave him some yell time if you remember that from our first episode ⁓ how they tried to make it seem like Cody turned him in for this ⁓ that Cody was the reason that he did all this. No, ⁓ Game came to Cody and Cody ⁓ the truth which Eric encouraged him to do because Eric admitted to fucking up. ⁓ was all about a tag. Yeah, there was a wrong tag. wasn't anything crazy. ⁓ the defense tried to make it out like Cody was the one who turned him in so their relationship deteriorated after that. ⁓ more family vacations and they didn't hang out anymore and it caused such a riff. Oh because of the deer tag? Yeah. And Cody was like no we were fine. They then grilled him about Eric's trucks. Trucks, his personal work truck belonging to C &E. Masonry. Okay. Because you know how like it's a tax write-off if you buy like your personal vehicle underneath the company and then the gas and everything else is underneath that. I'm well aware. It's really smart. So the work truck was taken a few days after Eric died. All right. But Kouri was driving his personal truck. And when she took it into the dealership for maintenance, took the opportunity ⁓ pick it up from the dealership and take it from Kouri since it was C &E Masonry Property. ⁓ it wasn't responsible as a company to have somebody who wasn't insured through the company driving that truck. ⁓ not wrong. That shit's... ⁓ Literally, I love a head on a daily. I know but I love a petty Betty like and like his face while he's talking about this I was like, ⁓ you were just being petty as fuck boy. It was great. So then Kathy Nester questioned him about Becky Lloyd You remember talking about her the C &E employee? About taking Eric's computer from the house days after he died But we never talked to Becky about that So the judge kinda got on for bringing something up with Cody that they should have brought in during Becky and they didn't get very far with any of that. But basically they were showing the jury that Eric's laptop, his work laptop was with Becky, then it was with private investigator, then it was with the sheriff. I don't know. Probably because they didn't want her to shut it down and they knew that they like to introduce... ⁓ Prosecution? No. The defense really likes to introduce evidence through the wrong witnesses and then complain and complain and complain and complain about how it should be let in. We're gonna get into that here in a little bit. ⁓ Then Cathy proceeded to ask Cody a million questions regarding his knowledge of Eric's prescription drug abuse in high school. His use of THC gummies. And Cathy confused herself, the judge, the prosecution, and probably the jury during this line of questioning. She could not keep straight the terms illicit drugs, prescription drugs, and red devils. Red devils is something the kids called a pill in high school and that they would take. So like, you know how high school is whatever. And Cody being the innocent little kid, is Like he has learned about all this since high school and like he knew about red devils. He thought it was Sudafed in high school That's what my mind thinks it and the defense was like you mean like Sudafedrin or something like that or Sudafedrin something like a different one a different one from Sudafedrin. What's the other one? Sudah something and He was like, yeah, that's just what I thought it was and they They were just trying to trick him up so they could impeach him, just like they did with Carmen and Robbie. So they were trying to get him to say the wrong things by confusing illicit drugs, street drugs, or prescription drugs, all of that, and red devils. they caused so much confusion that the judge had to dismiss Cody and the jury to discuss how all this questioning was going to go. And... the arguing that Cathy does in this with the judge. I'm just gonna play the clip of it because you guys just have to hear. You just have to hear this. I can't describe it any other way. with this, Kathy and Wendy just don't listen. They just keep saying what they want to say over and over until the judge either gets hella stern with them or just drops it. And they like to talk over everyone. Witnesses, the judge all the time. I've never seen this ever. No. This man has the patience of a saint. I'm sorry. That clip was so long. ⁓ I tried to figure out ways to clip it and I really did, but you can't ⁓ like you just, you need all of it just the facial expressions, the like I need you to know this has been three weeks of this. is not just like, one explosive moment. There were many of these. ⁓ I also understand why she's sitting here talking and she's looking to Kouri for answers. ⁓ That's... ⁓ defending. Why are to her for answers? ⁓ Hello? ⁓ ⁓ don't ⁓ So that you imagine having to argue with a judge like that? ⁓ He's like, what evidence do you have? He just said it. No, he didn't. Yeah, he did. I like how she saw, I don't know any other way to say that question. And generally this is where the judge would give them another way to say this question because he has literally told them how to do this case the whole time. Alright, so next up we had Matthew Throckmorton and he is a forensic document examiner. I am not going to lie to you, I sped through his testimony because well, the first 20 minutes of it was his accreditation and all the juicy stuff happened with the defense. I actually sped through this and came back to it because I needed to get through trial. ⁓ Honestly, his entire point of his testimony was to prove that the signature on the was forged and he did his conclusion was that Eric signature was forged on the insurance document but he couldn't tell who did it but he knew it wasn't Eric who signed it. So generally how they can check against other people's handwriting is that everybody has a tell in their own handwriting that will come through in a forgery but none of Kouri's tells were in it and weren't really any other tells of anybody around that they compared with. ⁓ ⁓ couldn't ⁓ it was Kouri ⁓ they definitely say it wasn't Eric. Interesting. And of course the defense tried to undermine him by attacking the reliability of handwriting analysis in general and basically calling it fake science and bringing up that the industry as a whole has been attacked for its legitimacy in the past few years. Did they say this is a fake? They didn't say fake science, but that's basically what they were saying too. That like basically like it's not solid and like it's about it's very ⁓ what's the word for it? like perceptive, like it's at somebody's own discretion, how they do everything. And when that didn't work and he just kept disproving them in it. They brought up an internal investigation that he was involved in where another officer in his department accused him of falsifying documents. He actually got cleared of all that wrongdoing and in the same breath, like he was like, I got cleared of all that wrongdoing and that officer actually got in trouble for it. And by the way, I have 4,000 hours plus training in document examination. Like he answered the whole thing together and was like, no, no, yes. So he was on the stand for a while, but like they had to go through so much credentials and how it works and how they get to this conclusion and how it works and all of that and I understand that. I get it. But this is also some of first trial that I've had a handwriting expert in. So I've listened to it before. Yeah. Um, next up we had Jamie Woody and she was the initial lead detective for the case. So she showed up that day, like initially on the day of Eric's death and she was the lead detective on the case until she was given the opportunity to become a canine officer, something she always wanted to do. So when the opportunity arose for her to get her dog, she took it. So that is the only reason that she left. I knew that's why I said that you're going to love her. understand. Also, Jamie is like all business. She is like not playing games She will not play around and she is like answering like straight and knows what she's doing, right? Well, if you become a canine officer something like changes in you Yeah, but I a feeling she was like this before. No, she's just about stage. Yeah, period. So since she was the responding detective on the morning of Eric's death, she had a lot of interactions with family members, including Eric's sister Amy. And something odd happened. ⁓ So while talking about her interaction with Amy, they asked the jury to leave. And they did some test questioning with Jamie without the jury to see where the prosecution was going with this. So yeah, you heard that right? When she arrived at the home that morning, Eric's sister Amy stopped her at the bottom of the driveway and said that Eric told her that Kouri had been trying to kill him. Why didn't we get Amy on the stand? I agree. But also we've had so, so, so much in here that wasn't allowed in because it was hearsay. I don't know how, like, well obviously this is why we didn't have the jury in the room because it was a whole hearsay thing. But I don't know why we didn't call Amy to the stand for this. This is why I didn't understand. I wonder if... because they continuously kept doing hearsay, hearsay, because technically no one else heard this. There's no proof. The only people are his family. But yeah, they can't testify to it because it is hearsay without it being on a recording. And there's no writing of it, things like that. I think that's probably why. Because her entire testimony may have just been obsolete because there's no hard. Yeah, and that could be like yeah, it's impactful. It's strong but and they were they were really moving to get this in because it changed how Obviously had an effect on how detective Woody went in the house and then looked at the whole situation. Absolutely You know what I mean? Absolutely. So ⁓ which thank God. Yeah at the same time We also got some testimony about the trash cans in the bedroom, the master bath, and the kitchen that were empty. So remember how Aunt Chelsea Gibson, she said that, no, they didn't check any of that. And the defense was like, well, I didn't even check that, blah. Well, Detective Woody actually looked in all of them, and they were empty. And when she asked Kouri about it, Did we know about this before? Did you tell me about this? No. So the trash cans were empty? Well, we knew that there was nothing found in the trash. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But they were empty. were empty. OK. And Kouri said that her housekeeper had emptied them, but she couldn't remember the housekeeper's name. Right, that makes sense. Turns out that they did actually try to find the housekeeper and she did actually. Well, it's like a bitch. Yeah, there was a housekeeper, but we didn't really like to find like when she took the trash out, I don't think. there's a whole thing like I don't even remember the normal or something. But anyway, there actually was one. It was in there. Interesting. All right. We had Todd Gabler next. He's the private investigator and this man... Hold on, I'm still kind of stuck in this trash thing really quick. What? When did the housekeeper come? We did not get into that on the same. Okay, cuz for me, I have to say it was the date like the day before like obviously the day before is what she was saying was the Housekeeper came since this was in the middle of the night So unless the housekeeper was there before they went to bed. We should have had some trash from dinner or other. That's what I'm saying Like that's weird to me. Yeah That's weird to me. It is weird. take out the trash and guess what? I'm about to have to take out the trash again because I keep finding more trash to throw in the trash. Yeah. And you have three kids in the house. And you eat dinner. How does that make sense? Just saying. Okay. Okay. I'm sorry. Go continue on with the next thing. No, you're fine. I just wanted to clarify the trash things. That's fair. I just needed to clarify that that's fucking weird. Yeah. So Todd Gabler was the private investigator. And he was hired by Eric's family and testified that his investigation was focused on finding the truth about Eric's death. And he made it clear on the stand that he told Eric's family whether Eric did this, somebody else did this, no matter what the outcome was, they had to accept it, no matter what it was. He was there to find the truth, not to find anybody's agenda. And he was all business on the stand. He wasn't playing the defense's game. Everybody was 50-50 about him in Court TV's comments. Some loved him and thought he was amazing, and others thought he was snippy and not a good look for the snake. State. I almost said snake. So... I mean, there's people who just like... Conformity and they just okay tell me he literally at one point said I don't need to be babysat by cops Period to the defense. It was great some key points from his testimony. Okay, he spent 936 hours on the investigation and billed over a hundred thousand dollars He placed GPS trackers on vehicles belonging to Kouri and her mom They also put one on what they thought was Carmen's car but it up being somebody else's so they pulled it quickly. this is her home. And a person's Well it was somebody who was living in the house that she was at and they thought it was hers. ⁓ Private investigators don't need warrants like the police do. So they just have to follow a different set of rules in order to have enough probable cause to do this. Enough reason to do this. He searched the Richins' home after it was released by law enforcement with permission from the estate. So, Katie and Clint, yeah. And during the search, he found what's been referred to as the My Princess Letter. In Eric's nightstand. And we did not know about this. Witnesses acknowledged it in court, but the contents were never discussed in detail. God damn it. Yeah. We didn't even get shown it. So we don't know what it is? No. Why? Why are you even fucking... Okay. Jackie, you're building me up. You're really Tara, you yeah, thank you. This is... Honey, it wasn't much better watching it. It was not much better watching it, okay? You know she's serious because she called me honey. Listen, you guys, I'm so glad that this trial was only three weeks instead of five. I don't know if I could have kept doing this. um... Yeah, I don't... I don't... Oh, God. Good one. So cross-examination got really tense with him, as you can imagine. The defense tried to suggest that Eric had a sexing relationship with a friend named Bryce. Remember I mentioned Bryce in that picture in the video and there's something with that video picture that's been another testimony that didn't include because I didn't know if it was important or might matter. But apparently that party, Bryce had his pants off at one point and they put the picture up to show that this was before Bryce took his pants off. But we need to remember that this party was after Eric's death, not before Eric's death. Just to be clear, I need that is very, very important because They're trying to say that Eric and Bryce were having a sexting relationship that was inappropriate. Bryce the princess? No. Dammit. And so Gavler testified that he read messages and believed there were two friends joking, not evidence of an affair. ⁓ my gosh, I just recalled the Snapchat you sent me of this. Okay. And I have video of this because you have to see how ridiculous he thinks this all sounds on the stand. ⁓ Is that not the greatest thing you've ever heard? Bro, do you guys know straight men? Like straight friends? What do you mean? Right? ⁓ my gosh. That... Okay. I'll just tell you right now. I am very close with a lot of people, okay? And many people including my husband believe I have relations with specifically Lauren at work because her and I are so close and we joke about sexual things all the time. I'm sorry, if you've ever worked in a restaurant and heard the guys in a kitchen talk, yeah, ⁓ my husband and his best friend, you know, bird, we all worked together when we first met. If you were to ever, they would seem like they're gay. Yeah, they, they, they legitimately would. If you saw them together, you would think that they were a couple. Do you remember the TikToks? Sure. And that went around like, that is finally me and you, me, me and your friend, Steve. Yeah, that's literally. Street men relationship. Yes. I'm yes it is you real so that that that was the end of his testimony That was just super fun And I need y'all to know I was in my workout class at like 6 a.m When I was listening to that and I was like dying laughing Just like dying laughing at this feels like this is not happening right now I love that he was just laughing about it. He was ⁓ my gosh him and his neck brace killed me my gosh All right, so day 11 of trial. Yeah, Tuesday Turned into a long day of legal arguments as attorneys worked through a massive amount of evidence tied to the testimony of the case leads and lead investigator detective O'Driscoll and The morning began without the jury present with the court reviewing hundreds of pages of interview transcripts like 900 of them and it was all related to Jeff O'Driscoll's testimony and Much of the debate centered around interviews with Carmen Lager the former housekeeper and She previously testified that she helped attain the pills for Kouri and prosecutors wanted to introduce specific clips of expert expert. Yeah, you got it Prosecutors wanted to introduce specific clips from her interviews during a Driscoll's testimony to show consistency in her statements. Okay, and Makes sense to me right they want to but the defense was like, okay The defense only wanted those to be called in if they could recall Carmen to cross examine her about it, or if Carmen was back. And so the judge was like, cool, go ahead and recall her as a witness when you guys get your chance. And they're like, no, we shouldn't have to recall her as a witness because that's shifting the burden on the burden of proof onto us when it is the state's responsibility. So they should be the ones who recall her. So like they could have saw they want the opportunity to cross exam. Yeah. Underneath these things. And so the judge was like, so they're like, no, we shouldn't have to do that. Like they were just, they could have literally avoided so much of this by just recalling her during their stuff, but they refused to. So. Oh my gosh. I just thought about back in that clip, we just watched how like the question was asked to the guy and he was just like looking at the screen and Kouri's like. Yeah, her faces are ridiculous at the reduces. be fair, I would not be able to control my face if I was in a courtroom ever. Yeah. So they don't want to call her back, but they don't want what the state is presenting for the answers. So defense pushed back that if the state wants to just present selected excerpts that the full interviews, so all 900 pages, ⁓ should be put in. so that the receives the full context. prosecutors like, that's gonna take hours, like seven hours of showing interviews. Like it's not necessary, we're wasting the jury's time, like ⁓ it's not necessary. ⁓ And the defense was like, no, you want some it, we want all of it or nothing. ⁓ It was either all or nothing. It was all of the transcripts or none of the transcripts. And they were like, the prosecution's cherry picking and it's not fair. But I'm sorry, didn't the prosecution try to accuse them of cherry picking during Carvin Luber's statements? Or they accused the prosecution of cherry picking during Carvin Luber's and then they turned around and cherry picked what they wanted to show? Yeah. Okay. Just so we're on the same page about the cherry picking here. The back and forth took up most of the morning. that's what the prosecution was doing. They were like, fine, go ahead. Do it. Do Do it. We can do it. Do it. And so this took up most of the morning. They, because they debated what needed to be redacted, what should stay in and how the interview clips will ultimately be presented to jurors. During this, the defense asked the judge for two full days, like a two day continuance in the middle of trial to go through the transcripts and finalize what they wanted. The defense? Yeah. judge denied that request so fast it wasn't funny. Instead, he granted a compromise, giving the defense until the evening to complete the review while the prosecution prepares edited video clips that match whatever transcript rulings get finalized. He was like 6 p.m. They're like, can we have till 11? And he goes, no, you can have till 6. Period. And before crap, before crap. Before court wrapped up for the day, prosecutors briefly called Chris Cochrademos back. You remember our Celebrite King? he was there for less than five minutes. He basically told us how timestamps appear on extracted phone data and how daylight savings times affects the shown in the text message. So it's either negative six or negative seven. Okay. That's it. Wow. It comes up later when the defense tries to put something in that's a negative five and they're like, this doesn't make sense and we don't want it blah, blah, blah. I'm not going into that because it was the most pointless 45 minutes of my life and they didn't get accepted in anyway, so it doesn't matter. So yeah, so that was rest of that day. That's literally all they did on Wednesday. Or on Tuesday. Which brings us to Wednesday and Thursday. And I'm covering these days together because they bleed into each other so much. It's so stressful. Yes. So on Wednesday, court resumed at 1 p.m. with the jury present and the state briefly recalled Carmen to address questions about her probation violations after the defense challenged her credibility. And she acknowledged the weapons violation, connected to a firearm found in her room, but she pushed back on other allegations. So they did call her back? Yeah, the state ended up calling her back. Okay. Great. To appease the defense. Yeah, yeah. Whatever. But before the jury was present for that, there was a lot of legal matter dealt with between counsel and the judge. Even though the jury wasn't present, the cameras were still rolling in the courtroom. And we will get to that later because if I tell you about it now, it's going to confuse you, but it matters later. So give me a minute. After Carmen got off the stand after lunch. state called their last witness. And this is lead detective Jeff O'Driscoll ⁓ this is the testimony we have all been waiting for from the state. ⁓ testimony went into Thursday morning and there was definitely a reason he was safe for last. I like his testimony explained the prosecution's actions ⁓ or thereof over the past few weeks of trial. ⁓ Yes. Oh Driscoll started off testifying about Doppel. Do you know what Doppel is? I don't know what that is. It's a database that police can go in and pull every prescription you've ever been prescribed for controlled substances. They can see when it was filled, when you've picked it up, and detectives pulled Eric's prescription history for his whole life and it showed zero prescriptions for fentanyl or similar drugs. Yeah, you should have seen the look on Kouri's face. It looked a little bit like that. No, I'll go lie. The prosecution then head of Driscoll walked the jury through key parts of the investigation into Eric's death, starting with the level of fentanyl in Eric's system, making them dig into Kouri and Eric's personal life. And they began tracing phone records that eventually led them to Carmen, and Kouri's phone records ultimately gave her away. All of the text messages between her and Carmen is what gave her away and it wasn't Eric's family or anyone else that started them down that path. The jury then saw two sets of text messages between Eric and Kouri where they discussed THC gummies. One exchange where Kouri suggested taking them during a movie date another where Eric suggested taking them out at night without the kids to relax. ⁓ Yeah, you should have seen look on Kouri's face. It looked a little like that. No, I'll go lie. The then head of walked the jury through key parts of the into Eric's death, starting with the level of fentanyl in Eric's system, making them dig into Kouri and Eric's personal life. And they began tracing phone records that eventually led them to Carmen, and Kouri's phone records ultimately gave her away. They showed email communications between Kouri and the news stations, showing that Kouri reached out to them and set everything up. They also showed texts with her family where she discussed her plans for writing another book about Eric's family and his death. It included like, it's up here, pause if you want to read it, but she was talking about how she has to clear it with her attorneys and make sure it doesn't say anything and they're gonna hate this and blah blah blah and how much it's gonna be and she should be little afforded with the money coming in soon. But I think the best thing that came out of it was the fact that she used a ghostwriter for the children's book. She didn't fucking write shit. After she told everybody that she sat at the kitchen table and wrote this book with her boys to help them overcome the loss of their father. ⁓ huh. Yeah. We all watched the interview. ⁓ So ⁓ they did show a picture of her the show ⁓ promoting her book, but they didn't show any clips it and they didn't show the clip of the anchors talking about what she said. ⁓ I'm surprised they didn't also subpoena any of them the discussion that was had with them. ⁓ But you remind me of those clips. Yeah, do you remember where like she was on the talk show and then they had a clip afterwards about after she was arrested and how she was talking to them about he died from COVID and that like she was so worrying and like she gave off all the energy and all the vibes of this. But like now looking back, they can tell certain things were kind of weird. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I like as soon as you said the talk show, was like, Oh, I remember this, but I couldn't remember it. You know? Yeah. Okay. Oh yeah. One more thing. Lisa, Kouri's mom, sent Detective O'Driscoll a copy of the book anonymously with a note that read, there are two sides to every story. This is the true Kouri, a devoted wife and adoring mother thought you should know anonymous. ⁓ Yeah, so he requested the info of who sent that from Amazon and Amazon snitch. I mean, it's a fucking detective. What do you mean? It's not a snitch. They probably were just a dumb hole. Right. Right. Then we got something else that was new. Wait, hold on, before you tell me this, couldn't that be like... Trying to sway a detective? Hmm. It's not a bribe by any means, but like... That's an anonymous tip. I mean, she didn't threaten him or anything. She just thought she was doing something. It's fair, but it could still be seen as... Tim always not a bit nice lying to me. What is her to meeting a officer? I'm not saying I'm not trying to say it like in a mean way I'm just saying she could be trying to sway him. Oh, yeah, that's she was trying to do I know but I'm saying isn't that like some kind of Impeding of an investigation. I don't know somebody tell us what that means If it means anything So here's another new thing There's an orange notebook found in Kouri's nightstand that was introduced. ⁓ And I'd never heard of it. It contained journal entries and a timeline of events after Eric's death, including notes about family interactions and learning that a private investigator had been hired. If you're watching this, pause and read them. Cause we're just gonna have them popped up all over the screen. I have like 15 screenshots of this, I think, cause there's so much of it. There's a few key ones that we'll put up here. All the other ones are going to be on the website or they are all posted on like a little post for it. Go look and read them. But basically she's just writing everything. everything down. Like when she started therapy, when the kids started therapy, what happened, like very much in detail, happened on ⁓ Eric's dad's demeanor and how he answered the phone. Like he was expecting it. It was just really weird, some of the stuff that was in it. ⁓ Yeah, so that was just very interesting and it just showed that Kouri was trying to keep all of her thoughts and timeline and all the statements very well laid out so she could remember them. Because this was gathered after she was arrested. So back to my statement about Kouri's phone records giving her away and leading them to Carmen and Robert. If you remember during both of their testimonies, the defense played some pretty damning interview footage and that the defense fought for it because I quote, the state is cherry picking and not showing everything. we need to show the real context. So the prosecution pulled an uno reverse and played the same footage that the defense presented previously, but added before and after context. ⁓ ⁓ we thought what ⁓ know about the, just to get a conviction of Kouri, we thought that was bad. No, ha ha. I now understand why the state let that go ⁓ because context of it makes him look bad. ⁓ The looked bad. ⁓ I'm not gonna play all those clips because they're really long I am gonna try to get them up on YouTube But I do have a clip of a Driscoll being asked about what the defense chose to leave out and what actually happened Just so you guys can get the gist of all the footage we had to rewatch and also Kathy Nester is being her usual self in this so is that not wild? You know, I understand why she can't be like hearsay here's a no objection objection what grounds though? ⁓ don't like it. ⁓ Just every time she talks, every time that kind of interaction happens, which is a lot with the judge, all I think of is Michael Scott in the office. You can't fire them. You have to have cause. I do have cause. Cause I hate them. Because I hate him. Yes. I swear the defense every time they speak about something. That's all I hear in my head. Yeah. ⁓ So then got jail calls from Kouri, between Kouri and her mom, Lisa. ⁓ And Lisa runs her kid's life way. more than we thought. a recording that's played, Lisa immediately barks at who bought the sandwiches on Valentine's Day. ⁓ Kouri sounds like a teenager getting at first. ⁓ It isn't really telling of their relationship. ⁓ I'm gonna you two calls. ⁓ One between and Lisa and they discuss what Eric's family's saying and there's like, ⁓ you know, start with I believe, well, and her mom goes, well, I'm about to believe a whole bunch of stuff when I talk to this person tomorrow. ⁓ And they're like laughing about the whole alleging that she left him in love note and a sandwich on his seat. Like, why would she do that? She also calls her brother and like they are laughing and joking about the whole situation and it's just disgusting. But my favorite thing is that one of these calls starts, the call of Lisa starts with literally calling O'Driscoll an idiot by name. And she had to literally sit in front of O'Driscoll. while this is being played. Okay, so there's one thing, and this was actually played Wednesday morning without the jury present, or at one point without the jury present. I don't know when it was, it's something that prosecution fought for in the 900 pages of transcript that got taken down in 150. It's a section about talking about the fact that Eric was not suicidal. ⁓ And this actually comes into play later, like actually gets, like, ⁓ word of it get published. ⁓ ⁓ And I believe like the I don't know if the phone call or not gets published that it's in ⁓ but I Am gonna play this clip from the judge talking about it outside the jury's presence Because it very much sums it up very well. I'm gonna put the pictures up with it that came out later. Yeah, it's just it's just interesting. Yeah Yeah, so there's that. Any thoughts there? I mean, I understand. Like, I figured that was the motive. Like, money and the fact that she has another boyfriend and told her boyfriend, it would just be easier if it was not. Yeah. Yeah, there's two fucking motives right there. Yeah, so super crazy that the defense... I'm like, well, I understand why the defense didn't want that hint, but at the same time, I love this judge. He's been explaining how trial works to these defense attorneys the whole time. She... He has a very lucky life. Yeah. The last thing the prosecution did was introduce the Walk the Dog letter. Oh, God, I We've been waiting. Oh, my God. Okay, only six pages were allowed in, but that's more than what we needed. Just to refresh your memory, in this letter, Kouri coached her family members on what to say to Kouri's then lawyer, Sky Lozaro, about Eric and talking about getting illegal drugs in Mexico and how he secretly used all the time and the trouble it would cause, and flat out saying Eric hid them in his truck in an allergy bottle and even placed them in Kouri's bags while traveling. So, prosecution had O'Driscoll read the letter. asked him one question and that was who's sky and he responded ⁓ Kouri's first attorney Sky Lozaro and then the prosecution said they were done with him that's it how to read it and one ⁓ and then handed it off to the defense ⁓ And that letter's damning enough on its own, they don't even have to do anything with it. It is damning enough by itself, but do remember when we first read that letter, we were like, who the fuck is Sky? Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. The defense pushed back hard during cross-examination, which I knew was going to happen, but luckily he wasn't playing the defenses games and they did not like it at all. Shockingly, they left the walk the dog letter, addressed the Lisa and didn't try to make it a part of that bigger manuscript that they've been pushing. Like, just remember they tried to say it was a part of this story she was writing and it was part of a manuscript and it was taken out of context. Yeah, we didn't try to push that. They also but they also didn't say where the letter was found in jail They said that it was found among Kouri's personal possessions They never flat-out said in her jail cell so the jury does not know that this letter came from jail Since they didn't take the I mean they can probably piece that together. Yeah, her attorney's name was in it. that okay But yeah Since they didn't want to take the course of action to play it out of a manuscript, they took a different course of track, get and see going. They just decided to attack from the angle that he did not properly investigate the allegations in the letter. So they went hard that he never obtained a warrant for Ronnie's phone to verify alleged messages from Eric, to which the prosecution had him ask him about that. And they said, well, I didn't have enough probable cause for a warrant, so I couldn't get one. That letter wasn't enough. Then they went down the path of no fentanyl being recovered in the cups, glasses, straws inside the home, including the hydrocodone bottle that went with Eric's body. And that zero pills allegedly connected to the case had ever been recovered or tested in the house. We did get clarification on where that bottle is. So it got taken, medical examiner. Then we got some hearsay stricken out of it because it was what happened to it. The medical examiner doesn't have it anymore. Like I think it got thrown away or whatever. It never got tested. I think that's a big fuck up on the detective's part is not testing that bottle. I'm not gonna lie it is. It's a big question on that jury. Not gonna lie. They really pressed O'Driscoll on the lack of phone location data for Eric's phone. During the time that the drugs were picked up at like the Midway Mansion and the other times and the fact that they, or on Valentine's Day, they didn't track his whereabouts. They also didn't do any investigating into his whereabouts in Mexico. You know, like where he went, didn't go and whatnot. And they were just kind of like... alluding that like they didn't investigate Eric well enough to make sure he didn't get these drugs. They're putting holes in here. You know, they're just like, oh, why didn't you investigate this? Why didn't you investigate this? Like, why didn't you go through all this Mexico history? I'm gonna get it. Those are good holes to poke. Those are good holes. They ⁓ showed text messages where Kouri and Eric were discussing the Midway Mansion ⁓ thought they were doing something with this, but weren't. They just showed them discussing numbers ⁓ that very different from each other. They showed he was in fact laying gravel at the mansion that day that he died for Kouri. ⁓ But like, ⁓ and then messages. So those ones weren't really that great, but then there's a message about them celebrating it. ⁓ And I like, okay, that kind of does show Eric celebrating it a little bit. ⁓ ⁓ They also tried, you remember those three gifts from the very beginning? The Kevin Spacey one, the Donald Trump one, and then the Dumb and Dumber one with the money on the face? It's from opening statements, and I brought them up in both of them. There three gifts found on Kouri's phone. Kouri didn't open them 836 on ⁓ ⁓ when Eric died. ⁓ fourth, fourth, fourth. ⁓ of talking about this with our forensic analyst, They brought this up with O'Driscoll and tried to prove that it came from Eric's phone and Corrie didn't open them until 8.30 in the morning after he died. When we had a literal forensics examiner say that they could not locate where those files came from. The day he died or the morning after? The morning after. Like 8.30 that morning after. no, no, no. like... died on the fourth. Yeah, he died on the fourth. So she opened it on the fifth. Anyway, he was found at 3 a.m. and they were open at like 8.36. According to the defense questioning O'Driscoll. But yeah, we had a whole thing. about the phone where they couldn't figure out where those actually came from and they explained it all. Okay. Yeah, there was a whole thing where he wasn't wanting them to admit this underneath. Driscoll because like the judge finding him saying that he's not the witness for this and it just turned into a whole clusterfuck and it's just so stupid. The prosecution ended up mic dropping on their like rebuttal with them with a, isn't that last one, Kevin Spacey from House of Cards and then just like left. I don't know, he just pointed out where all the gifts came from and we never got anywhere with him. I don't know. But that was basically Driscoll's testimony. The prosecution saved him for last to literally show where the defense was cherry picking and doing all of this. ⁓ I don't think the state intended for the defense to arrest without calling anybody. And so therefore, I think that's reason they didn't do as much as they did. They could have done. up to this because they knew what opportunities they were going to have with the defense's witnesses. But I do now understand why Detective Driscoll is safe for last. We had to admit so much evidence before we got to him. And I really enjoyed them using him as a mic drop for everything the defense tried to turn around on them. Okay, so Remember how I told you that something was happening earlier that morning But if I went over it, it's just not gonna make sense. This is where it makes sense Okay, so the defense basically the fence wanted to bring in a witness that tried to come to detectives and tell them about Eric trying to get fit in 2019. Uh-huh. But in order for his testimony to be admitted, they would also have to allow additional testimony from Hayden Jeffs, the handyman who has passed away, but his testimony is on footage. And then they would also have to allow Nick Bonds Savage, Carmen's acquaintance testimony and who is also on video. And ⁓ they wouldn't do all this to get this one guy in, but his testimony isn't on video. ⁓ And his testimony is that nobody ever talked to him and didn't take his allegations seriously, but also the defense sent him there. So ⁓ when we came back around, so this is what we came back to after the state rest. So before the state rested, the judge was asking about calling additional witnesses. And this is what you're talking about. And because he asked before this, asked, look dead at the defense and I've never seen a judge do this. And he looked at the defense and said, this is high stakes poker. What would you like to do? So they wanted to wait until after O'Driscoll's testimony to come back to this. And they decided to not open that door. And because they decided to not open the door to allow that guy's testimony in. the prosecution did not have to call additional witnesses and so therefore the state ended up resting. Which is where... ⁓ The judge asked Kathy Nester and Wendy Lewis if they needed time discuss with their clients make their next moves blah blah blah ⁓ That is when they went ⁓ then they said we rest and Kouri said I'm and the judge was like ain't Kouri's not gonna testify So let's go ahead and do that and then he was like we should probably do this in front of the jury now. ⁓ so ⁓ Yeah, ⁓ before So before got to that ⁓ you know, all the wrestling and all that stuff, the defense had to do its... obligatory duties, which was asking the judge to dismiss several charges through a motion for a directed verdict, which is basically a judgment of acquittal. And they argued that the state had not presented legally sufficient evidence to prove the crimes. They said that the prosecution failed to establish that Richens actually obtained or administered fentanyl to her husband and instead showed at most that she sought prescription oxycodone through apartment with testimony from alleged dealers indicating he never supplied fentanyl. They also argued the financial crime counts lacked of proof intent, ⁓ the state did not show that when Kouri allegedly signed documents or obtained insurance, she intended to kill her husband or commit fraud. ⁓ she forged his name, ⁓ they said that ⁓ ⁓ for their husbands all the time. ⁓ In short, the defense contended that even when viewing the evidence in the light most favorable to the state, prosecutors had not proven the essential elements of murder, attempted murder, or related fraud charges strongly enough to allow the case to go to a jury. And the judge, of course, denied this motion by then stating that the state had met its burden of proof. Its minimum burden of proof. it was after this that Kouri Wafer-Rights and the defense ⁓ I know that you and Jen were beyond shocked when they arrested. I was beyond shocked that Kouri didn't testify because we had been alluding to this like I have said and there were statements and comments and I just I was surprised that she didn't at least testify. Yeah. I mean, was, I was, okay, and after a very lengthy discussion with my sister on the way home after this because I had to process and take all this in, I think I'm more shocked that they didn't at least call a couple character references for her to at least attest to her person or maybe even her marriage and her life. But. This has been such a massive hearsay trial, I don't know who they could have called. Because they can't call Lisa, Ronnie, or DJ, her mom and brothers, because that opens up to the Walk the Dog letter, that opens up to her mom was present the morning Eric died, that opens up the jail calls, that opens up everything. ⁓ But she doesn't have a friend other than Chelsea Barney and Allison. There's not another friend we could have called. There's nobody we could have called. I feel like that just kind of goes to show her character. Like, I'm not saying people who don't have friends are shitty people, but in the real estate game, it shows you're a shitty person. I'm just gonna be real. Yeah. Yeah. Also, fun time. How come I never brought up that... How come the client who she got these painkillers for was never called? Unless he was on the defense, I mean, where's this client we heard so much about? We never even heard a name for him. Prosecution never even asked who the client was if they ever found that out. Can you remind me how old their oldest child is? probably a teenager now, like 13 or 14. Maybe 15. Nah, they were too young, they can't. You don't think so? No, they were too young at the time and they can't testify to her character and all the adult stuff. Ages, wouldn't be- Oh, I wasn't meaning that. Oh, that they- no, they wouldn't have been on the stand. Katie would have never allowed it. That's valid. I just wonder if the cops spoke to them at all. Oh, probably. Because if the kids were there... Kids retain a lot of shit. They see a lot of shit. I mean, they talked to Natalie Cochran's kids a whole bunch, but we haven't really heard much talk with them. And I have a feeling that the family kept the kids very much protected. Or they did talk to them multiple times and there wasn't anything there that was, you know. That's fair. ⁓ Interesting. One thing that of became clear week was that the defensive strategy ⁓ changed from when in doubt, create reasonable ⁓ to ⁓ they were trying to cause much that it messed up the flow of testimony, leaving jurors with large gaps in confusion. ⁓ And ⁓ I think that that became of ⁓ like strategy at a certain point. And I think once it became clear that they weren't going to call any witnesses, this became their strategy because this week was so disruptive. They asked for a two day continuance. They're doing this. I feel like they were just trying to confuse the jury and get everything like that, especially with the red devils and all of that. And that was their new defense. And that's why they rested because they were like, they haven't proved their case yet. We've disrupted so much. Let's not give them more power, more ammo by our witnesses. I hate to say it's kind of a good strategy though. Once I sat back and looked at it, I went, holy shit. They decided to really stick to the letter of the law and they don't have to any burden to prove. They don't have to prove anything. They don't have to do anything. Sure. So but also cory looked terrified the entire day I have pictures that I have up here and i've this video of like when she's just standing and you can see like everything else is still but her chest is just ⁓ it's crazy I want to talk about how he feels jurors bro let me go first while you gather your thoughts because i've thought about this So as a juror, I don't know where I would sit. I know this case inside and out. I know way more than the jurors ever would. And also it kind of got a little confusing about what evidence the jurors do have and what evidence they don't have. Me and my sister were getting tripped up talking about that yesterday because of how much the jury was in and out of the room. One of the things for me though is there's no proof of fentanyl in the house. And we have all been told how dangerous even a little bit of powder is. But if there was an overdose on fentanyl, there'd be fentanyl still around him. But if Kouri didn't, then it would all be cleaned up. So yes, while they haven't found any evidence, I also don't think they tested enough evidence either. So I kind of sit like it, I see on one side that if there is no proof of it in the house, it very much looks like Kouri did it because she cleaned it all up. Especially because there's the testimony that he had been dead for a while. But also not test, not testing that hydrocodone bottle is not good. That's a big thing. ⁓ So but also Kouri looked the entire day I pictures I have up here and i've this video of like when she's just standing and you can see like everything else is still but her is just ⁓ it's crazy I to about how he feels jurors ⁓ ⁓ let me first while you gather your because i've thought this ⁓ Rebuttal that really good. Okay. Mm-hmm just because Detectives like obviously yes, they're going in hearing. Eric said my wife killed me and would have killed me. Yes, I'm like that but she was a little convincing with her crocodile tears and the knot tears that she had. that they are going into this thinking, ⁓ this guy over there, ⁓ this guy. I forgot about the 911 call that got played. ⁓ my God. They played the full 911 call and like. She kept saying, I don't know. I don't know if I can do that. I can't. I don't want to. I don't know. And like, she was like, whisper crying. So like, she wouldn't wake the boys up. And at one point you hear the boys come in and she's like, no, no, no, go away, go away, go away, shut the door. And like, when the ladies and like, she can't pull off the bed sideways. They didn't start to pull this way. And like, she was like, I don't know if I can do CPR. I don't know. And then like, she starts doing CPR, but you can tell that she's like not actually doing CPR. Cause it doesn't sound like it. And then like, there's so much confusion. people coming in. it wears you the fuck out. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. was a little wild. I ain't gonna lie. Her voice, yeah, go watch some 911 Call. I'm not playing in this. This episode's long enough. But that part was also little damning for her, was her own 911 Call because she's... Yeah, but we've played a lot of clips. Yeah, her 911 call sounded a lot of fake crying like the body cam footage did from the beginning. And it was, she was like whispering, like panic whispering. I'm sorry. In that moment, I'm going to lock my door and not worry about my kids. That's valid. That's, that's fair. That's fair. That's fair. So I guess what I'm saying is like going in thinking one, you don't know how he died until however long it takes to get toxicology back in the autopsy, everything like that. You wouldn't think I need to collect all these cups. True. And they looking for an overdose and there's a bottle next to him and she kept the other thing is she kept saying that he doesn't do any drugs He doesn't do any drugs no prescriptions blah blah blah. She kept saying that on the body cam. So now this is her story, which is weird Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so she's changing up her stories. So it's like again as On a detective side of it. You see a bottle next to him Clearly he's been dead for a little bit. There's blood coming out of him now Yeah, there's the obvious. as, like there's no actual wounds. So you're gonna see it as an overdose. My first thought would not be, I need to go through their trash. need a- True, I mean they had it as a suspicious I can't take these cups. They had it as a suspicious overdose, but you're right, they weren't thinking of getting cups in that moment. But I'm also wondering if the jury's stepping back to see that. I mean they did put the proof with how search warrants work and how they only have it time. I just, I really feel like there's holes on both sides. Yes. I feel like didn't call the sister. Yeah, I was like or even talk about the fight with the others Apparently that was an apparently in one of the 18 million hearings that I put watching before this child because it got to be so much that Wasn't allowed in But it's But they, the judge will do not allow it in because I don't know. Okay. I think it's because it's part of the civil lawsuit. There's certain things that aren't allowed in because they're part of the civil lawsuit I think, but and we've seen that in other trials. I just, as a juror, I don't know where I would sit. I am very scared of a hung jury. I... I'm scared of a home jury. That's fair. I mean, if I didn't know this case, like, I don't know if I could actually say what side I would be on if I didn't know. As a juror, there's so much confusion that, I... Yeah, and like, hearing about it for the first time, going, through this... Yikes. I see what you're saying. So and the no character witnesses for Kouri looks bad but also some of the investigative work over here and like what they didn't look in what leads they didn't follow look bad I just Like my sister made a good point if I was on this jury and I requested the court transcripts after which you can and then you read through all the stuff you weren't in the courtroom for and You end up finding her not guilty or on a hung jury. You're gonna be pissed. Hell. Yeah, like pissed like so I know. I think juries need to be part of that shit personally I do. So Monday, we're going to have closing arguments. ⁓ And then after closing arguments, I'm going to assume closing arguments and jury instruction, which I have fucking PTSD from Karen Reed about jury instructions. We literally took half like the end of Thursday and Friday for counsel to discuss jury instructions to send to the judge. They can all agree on it. I'm scared. So we will get closing arguments on jury instructions, which I believe should take us to lunch or right after lunch. I personally, my predictions for deliberation is Monday night, Tuesday, earliest we're gonna get a Wednesday verdict. earliest is a Wednesday verdict. I honestly don't think we're gonna get a verdict till the end of the week. I think this one's gonna take a minute because you understand something. The jurors only have their notes. There is no transcript for them. There is nothing else for them. The judge said this at the very beginning, told them to take very good notes. ⁓ He even said that, I'm sure he goes, I'm sure to the defense, I'm sure you can go back and watch Carmen's testimony at 1.5 speed on court TV whenever they wanted to review it for the transcript stuff. So there's another part. Yeah, I don't think it's going to be a short deliberation by any means. No, we're going be on verdict watch for a minute. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, I thought we were going to be on verdict watch for Letitia for a minute. No. Thankfully not. But that was a very much more thorough, investigated, and trialed out. Like, that was not like this. That one was very solid. And there was very different wounds and Yes. I get it. How long do you think deliberations are going to take? When was she arrested? you remember the date she was arrested? May of 2023. Just because I a year after I I it's always poetic justice personally and around the time frame and it's been I Don't know years, and I don't know if their sentencing is going to be right after like immediately after if the judge is gonna take him in it. I don't know how he's gonna do this. But we did have trial on the anniversary of Eric's death. Yep, yep, yep, yep. There's always that type of poetic justice in these cases. So I, for deliberation-wise, I was just trying to see if it was gonna line up with a different date and it doesn't. So I'm thinking that... I'm going to agree with you, early as maybe Wednesday. If not, I think we may not get an actual verdict until next week. Like the following week? Yeah, that's. That's all I got for you guys on that. I'm really glad that I don't have to sit through two more weeks of defense witnesses because I would lose my mind. I was already losing my mind. She messaged, was it yesterday? Yeah, it was yesterday that you messaged or was it Jen that was like, it was really quiet today. ⁓ it was me. It was so quiet because I had nothing to listen to. That also happens after I'm listening to trial. My brain's too quiet without something all the time. Yeah. So I just really think that, like I know you said that it was probably going to be hungry or something. one of those lines. I just genuinely think that the prosecution, yes we don't have all of the evidence and there were holes, but I feel like they explained at least two motives strong enough for her to do this. I agree with The boyfriend whose testimony was... yeah. Wow. Yeah. So... I don't know. We're just gonna have to watch. I would not want to be on this jury. I want to be a perma-jury. ⁓ I need to. I'll also explain to Nicole what jury duty was and she goes, that's so cool. I want to do it. I don't know why people hate jury duty I don't know either. don't know either. Please. Please. I wish we could get on Kimberly Singler's jury, but we can't. No, we would be in this trial. I don't think you and I are probably ever going to be able to be on a jury again. Never. It sucks. Alright, so make sure you're following us everywhere at Justice for a podcast Go on our website get tickets for our live show mark your calendar for a live show April 16th voodoo brewing Follow us Facebook Instagram tick-tock Spotify YouTube Apple Amazon music everywhere we are everywhere Anyway, ⁓ so that's all I've got for you today ⁓ It's gonna be interesting, but make sure you are like follow subscribed everywhere because the second verdict watch starts We're on verdict watch as well. Yep, and I have been updating person there the conversations having great Are we putting stuff out? It's gonna be love love love all the comments everyone's theories. Everyone's talking about it We love this. This is this is why we do this. Yeah, it's good All right. Well, we know that we came at you out of our normal schedule. So we will see you on Tuesday for part Yes for part two we're super excited about it part two I share your recipes and make sure you come and watch because this is where we deep dive into What the detective that I left you guys on? Yes, make sure you do that. We will catch you guys on Tuesday for part two. Yep Thank you again for being here with us for our over hundred episodes. We hope you had a very safe ⁓ wait, no, it's still it's coming up. Have a very safe st. Patty's day. Yes Happy Saturday. See you Tuesday. Okay. Love you. Bye.