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Turning Corporate Culture Upside Down: Leadership Insights · Unstoppable Success Podcast

• 0:01
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Unstoppable Success Podcast, where we spotly visionary leaders who have mastered the art of growth, purpose, and powerful connections.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Jacques Schollinger, connector, high performance coach, and creator of the Leap to Your Success Framework in Two Steps TS.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: Each week we dive into bold insights, real conversations, and powerful strategies to fuel your growth, deepen your relationships, and ignite transformational momentum.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: And why?
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: Because you were meant to be unstoppable.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's leap into the podcast.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Well, hello everybody, and welcome to another amazing episode of Unstoppable Leadership Spotlight.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: I am your host, Jacqueline Strominger, and today I have the absolute pleasure of speaking with Nico Vandeveen, and you're gonna love hearing from him.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um we've just had a great pre-show conversation.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you know, he is not here in the United States, he's actually over across the pond um in Belgium.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, I was like, wait a minute, Belgium in the in the country.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, wait a minute, where are we?
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: We were just talking about a few different countries.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, um, so let me just tell you a little bit about Nico.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_00: He is a premium confident for high achievers, successful CEOs and founders and entrepreneurs.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: His journey is a masterclass in professional evolution, stretching over 25 years in diverse fields such as nuclear, as the nuclear industry, legal, um, IT, telecom, sales, and extensive experience has culminated in a deep understanding of fulfillment beyond conventional, conventional success metrics, which obviously really tends to bring in um great leadership because when you have vast experience, you have you can learn so much about leadership.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: So, Nico, welcome to the podcast.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's my pleasure.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: So, so I you know, I I'm really curious.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you had all this great you know experience and across all these different depths of of professions.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: And if you could say like what was the what was the turning point for you in this that you were like, you know what?
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: Now I want to go out and and and help other people.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think I think that part's been there the whole while.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: Uh why otherwise do you go into leadership to guide people towards uh good goals and and wonderful dreams and so on?
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: But if if I would go to a point where a decision was made to do it as an independent person, that might be a very big switch, is when I saw a couple of symptoms in a large company, which is called Big Blue, but I'm not gonna name the car, the company in itself.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, when uh one of the things was like Excel sheet management, um, leadership, micromanagement, um, you know, paralysis in change, all those wonderful things.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: I've I've started to name those things as as a disease, you know, CEO disease and founder syndrome, or two funds in a year.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: Really, it's like I've noticed the same things happening to entrepreneurs who are good leaders, but sometimes you know, letting go and stuff like that does not really work for them because you know, first you start it on yourself, then you have to go to the next level by letting go.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: But to answer your question, um, honestly, I think about 2020 would have been the key year.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: 2019, 2020 would be the key years that I actually decided to jump into um the pool of reaching out to a more individual uh IL level story.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_00: So, all right, so a couple things that you said, I just kind of want to kind of touch on.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, as you said, you know, when I was asking the question, you know, most people step into leadership because they have the goal to help people.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: But I actually want to challenge you on that because sometimes I think people get into leadership not because they have that in a you know, they want to help other people, it's because they've they've they've um performed well at a company and somebody has helped them rise up into that spot.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I always chuckle when I get this kind of question because it's it's it's so very prevalent these days.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_01: I see it happening so many times.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the one expert who does a great job, you know, gets in early, stays in late, you know, gets all these things done, becomes the next leader of a team.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, worst mistake that a company can make, by the way.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: That's my opinion, to be completely honest.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: You have your exceptions, indeed.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm going to actually talk to myself here and be an advocate of the devil because I actually recently put somebody in that position, but I was able to prepare him for leadership, which is a big difference.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: And that's a lot, that's what happens a lot, is that you have a lot of people, you know, they're expert and they're they're great in what they do, and you have to make a distinction between is somebody a leader or individual contributor who's an expert.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: And in a company, uh, I also work in learning and development, and and I see these things happen.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: Look for true two two distinct trajectories.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: One is getting them into leadership, and the other one is giving them the alternative to become an expert for their team, being you know, a sidekick of a leader, not as in they need to, you know, manage people, because usually um they're a bit awkward in managing people for one uh one part, or they just don't have the talent for it.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: And you can learn leadership to up to a certain extent.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um funny.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that I I just flashed through my mind that that my whole career has become falling into leadership one time after another just by being somewhere, uh, by acting with people and so on.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: So some kind of inherent talent that was within me.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: But I've seen other people who just jump into being the expert the whole time, you know, they just know things, they they find the problem and they solve it, and nobody ever asked for it in a certain way.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but yeah, I I I see what you mean, and and indeed it's something that sometimes needs to be avoided to just push somebody in that direction.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, you're right, you're right.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: Right, you know, and and as we're talking, you know, what one of the things that I find that's really fascinating, what you you know, just sharing is that you know, you said like either giving somebody that ability to say, as you shared, you know, you you just um help somebody transition into leadership, like you you help them get ready for it, keeping get ready for it, right?
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, so you but it and it's and you know, but before you help them get ready, you gave them a choice.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_00: You ask the question, right?
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, is this something you know, do you is this something that you want to do?
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: Do you see yourself as a leader?
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: Is it something that you want to grow into, right?
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: And or you know, again, asking those questions.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's actually, you know, when I think about the one of the quintessential things about leadership that's that tends to happen is that the person going into it, you know, they it's more like, oh, I want to go, that's my it's part of my trajectory.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: I I know I go here, and then my next step is to be like the assistant, blah, blah, blah.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's to be the the director, and then you know, and you have this ladder, but nowhere really along the way is somebody really asking and saying, like, or asking the question, what do you really want to do?
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: We just know, right?
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I want to climb the ladder.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: But is it really what we want?
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_01: That's a good question.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's something, yeah, it's it's it's very, very um, very difficult to answer because you have to be honest.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: You're gonna be honest, not with the person who's asking the question, it's gonna be, you know, getting up in the morning, seeing that mirror, and saying, What do I really want?
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: Do I want to get on this next step on the ladder, or do I want to sit where I'm sitting right now and just be better at what I do?
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_01: And at the point that we were discussing uh his jump, um, it was only like six or seven months ago, and he had the opportunity to really go into a very technical-oriented uh direction, or into this.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I had discussion with him and I asked him that question, and and he was really kind of baffled looking at me.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, Yeah, but it's the logical next step.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, No, no, no, no, no, no, there's no logic here.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_01: This is about feeling and knowing and understanding who you are as a person.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, because as a leader, you need to know a heck of a lot about yourself before you start leading people.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: If you don't, there's a lot of stuff that you're gonna meet along the way that you don't want to meet.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: Because all your people are reflections of you and they're gonna just rub it into your face when you're doing something wrong, and you're gonna have to tackle that.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: And it it's better to tackle beforehand instead of really in your in your role.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: And it's so important.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, you do as a leader, you really do need to know who you are, you need to know your values and what you stand for.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, and something that you said, again, I'm just going back to this, is is is helping, you know, as you said, do you know it's about helping people, and I don't, and I think this is a key thing about leadership, is that I think people for sometimes forget that part, like the word lead is not tell, right?
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right, and so if we think about what leadership really means, it is you know, and and I'll go down to like you know, you we were talking before about like being like on a farm, right?
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you have the the person who's leading a flock, you're bringing people to a point, you're moving people, and so I think we forget that.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: And so I want to ask you as you know, as you're working with people, how do you help your clients?
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: And how do you help people kind of like take that step back and say, how do you lead?
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: Well, first of all, I I'd like to make a comparison as well.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: What what I see, what leadership is, um, is this old image of you have a horse and carriage and the the the comparisons is the horses are your team, and the carriage is the the product or service or whatever you're you know moving into the world about or outside of the world.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Now you have different kinds of leaders.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, there's the manager who's sitting on top of the carriage, telling people where they need to go.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_01: Then you have the leader that is in front of all the horses, showing them how to need to do it, and expecting all of them to do the same.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: And then you have this one person that's somewhere there in between that you don't see is running around between the horses and listening to all the horses and trying to understand why that one horse wants to go left and the other one goes right, and you try to compare them and ask them, you know, why are you doing this and bringing them back together in that same direction, you know, putting the noses in the right direction.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: To me, leadership in my core is that guy who is invisible, but who is there to only support their environment instead of directing them, you know, micromanaging and all that stuff.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_01: So, how I help my clients in that story is by purely listening first to their to what's going on with them.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there's there's a lot of leaders out there who are in in very specific positions, and I would say executives or C levels or founders or entrepreneurs who are managing a flock that is so diverse that they meet a lot of different stories, and they need to be able to tell somebody those stories, but they're not going to be able to do that to their employees or to their team members.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm the one who is listening to their story in full confidence and I will not spread it.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: That's what that's the first thing, you know, creating the trust environment of you can tell me your story and it will not leave the room.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: That is apparently, and that's the feedback I get, is that it's very exceptional.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_01: Even though people go to therapists and coaches and so on, their story is being recycled and reused for other other means.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: They might put another name on it and this and that, but in some point they're you reusing it, and it's it's not okay to do that, basically.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: You know, if somebody tells you something in confidence, you say it's right, yeah, yeah.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't have any, for instance, I don't have any uh specific um witnesses or anything like that that that will tell you about my services.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_01: I I do not want that, I don't care about it.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_01: It is I do what I do, and people come to me for that reason.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: So that's that's that's why I have the possibility to tell them a little bit more and a little bit deeper on who they are, because they're telling me their stories, their deepest threats, their deepest fears, their deepest concerns.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_01: I can tackle those deepest fears and concerns and threats more deeply.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: Kind of saying a lot of deep here, but yeah, it's it's really what's happening.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: And the thing is, they come out of this in a as a totally different person because it's what I said earlier.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_01: You meet your reflection in your team, you meet your own pains in your team.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_01: If somebody's not performing, it it is really a reflection of you.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: You're not performing in a certain part of what you're doing, and they will show you as long as necessary that you yourself see what's what's what's going on.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: What are you doing wrong?
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: I've had this experience in this in the law in the past myself.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_01: I was I've never been a writer, you know.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_01: Procedures and all those documents, it's not my thing.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I I love AI for it these days.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um it helps me.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: I call her Luna.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I love I love AI for yes, but anyway, yeah.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: Helps helps a lot.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but somebody in my team as well was always complaining about the fact that she didn't know what she needed to do.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, if you don't have any standard operating procedures within your department, you know, you're you're effed.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_01: You know, forget my French.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_01: Uh but I started understanding like, whoa, hold on, there's a big hole there.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: What's the hole?
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: And eventually I had a mentor within the company who who really rubbed it into my face, and he said, So, how do you know every day what you need to do?
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, Well, actually, I opened up my email and that's what he said to you.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_01: You're turning out fires, you're not solving problems, you're turning out fires.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: Where are your SOPs?
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: Where are your standard operating procedures?
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: What are you doing?
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: And oh, okay.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, and I started realizing these things, and and it's solved.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: The person who had the issue suddenly knew exactly what she needed to do, and her day was much better, her life was much better, and so on.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_01: And then you come to the layer where you become the foundation of your team, where you are at service, and that's where I want to reply to the question you have about helping.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: As a leader, you are not there to be what a lot of people think as being the boss.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_01: It always makes me think about the 80s episodes, uh series of the who's the boss, um, where you never know who's the boss, basically.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but indeed, you're there to service them.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: And a couple of months ago, I went to a company and I saw a perfect example of how uh an infrastructure, a frost structure, or organizational structure looks like, what it looks like when you're when you're helping the right people.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: And they had it upside down, basically.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_01: If you know you're a classic, classic structure in organizations is pyramid, they turned the pyramid upside down and they said, you know, everybody executive is supporting all the rest of the teams, they are supporting the sales guys and so on.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: And it just they're there to provide you with the necessary funds to do that event, to do the customer attraction solution and and so on.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_01: And they're not there to tell you what to do, they're they're the expert.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: And and I love saying this uh to my team when I come into a meeting room.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, listen, guys, I'm the dumbest person in the room right now.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: You're gonna tell me what you need me to do to get your stuff moved forward, and that's what they love.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_01: You know, keep keep them in the place where they are the best.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: That's their expertise.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: So that's how I see leadership and helping and and so on.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: I hope it gives you an answer to the question.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: No, and and and actually it's so it is, it's you know, so listeners, I really want you to like think about this too.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like, this is a real, you know, we're we're always talking about, you know, key insights.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: And I really think this is something that, you know, you may have heard it before, but you know, it it is turning the that pyramid upside down.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: And we are here to serve people, the people that are that they're they're in your they're on your team, and you are you're not telling people what to do, you know.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: If you can think a bit about it in the sense of like the conductor, right?
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: The conductor is helping people, you know, is like helping people figure out what notes to be playing so that the other people who are playing other notes can come together in a beautiful melody so that they can work together.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_00: He's not dictating, you know, who's doing what.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: He's he's conducting, right?
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so as a leader, we are doing that.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's you know, you're not dictating to your team, you're there to help the team thrive and just and but the other part too is also really getting to know your team, right?
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: So that you know that oh, I know Nico.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: Nico wants to go here, like his vision is for him to do blah blah blah, like five years from now.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: What do I need to do as the as the leader to help raise Nico up to that, whatever that is.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and and what you said in the beginning was it's like, do people like you know, I think some that's why I think sometimes people fall into leadership and they forget.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like at the end of the day, it's it's we're leading people.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: So get to know your team and their values as you're sharing.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it's it's it's easy to see where you're going uh if you if you're not being mindful of the effects of where you're going.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um you know, the next step is logical step.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: It's not the next, no, it's it's there's no logic in in humanity.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: Humanity does not have logic, life does not have logic.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's it's so funny that also, you know, my kids, uh they're turning 15 and 13 uh this year, and and it must be horrible to have me as a dad because I can be so very, you know, right on the dot, and they're like, oh dad, you know these things, and why are you telling us?
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I prepare them for a lot of things, and I said, you know, pain is something that's part of life, don't run away from it.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: It's something that's part of life, and you're gonna have pain in life, but it's a good thing.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: Pain gives you, teaches you, and it it brings you to a point where you find your limits and your boundaries, and you go from there and you find those, and then you break through them and in comfort and so on.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that's something where a leader as well needs to understand the pain of their team, and it's a bit what you're saying of somebody's evolution.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know that they're in pain because they want to get somewhere else.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: So, how can you solve their pain?
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's by listening and going through the pain, either with them or for them, or just understanding how you can, you know, move away the wall that that they also you know tend to walk into.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but one of the biggest things there, and it's it's it's so prevalent with with children, with your team, with whatever you do, it's letting go.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's really letting them do it and trust in the in in their in their ability to get through that pain and and that wall, and and they will they will achieve, but just be there to you know pick up the pieces if they don't.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's one thing as well that I've learned.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_01: I've seen people jump into a role that they thought they were ready for, and they were not, and they had to come back, and you know, embarrassment was was very prevalent.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: Uh you know, they crawled into a shell, and I was there to break through that shell again and say, you know, there's nothing's changed in your expertise, you are still good at what you do, you just tried something and you failed, which is amazing to do.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: You know, fail forward is one of the best things I ever learned, and and and pain is part of that, and you have to understand all those things, and yeah, it's so much fun being a leader.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right, right, right.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I I and and listeners, this is a really big this is a key thing, is is and I think something that you just said, I think is it's and it's beautiful to be able to say to somebody, it's okay.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: You you you took a step, maybe it didn't it didn't come out the way you wanted it to, but that's okay.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_00: You're learning from it, and you the ne the next time you step you can step bigger because you can you can know but as long as you the leader can help that person grow as opposed to you know there's two different ways you could it could happen right you could uh shun the person and make them feel like shit or you know whatever right and not make them feel good and and they and they don't or you could help them thrive and so you know you have to decide what kind of person do you want to be well the quick question is whether you want to keep them or not because that's that's that's what happens when you make those choices that's clearly what happens.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: One goes the other doesn't it's as simple as that you know and it's so you know I and I talk to people about this a lot of times too is that people you know and and and that and I'm sure people have heard it a thousand times but it's a key thing to remember nobody ever leaves a company because of money.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: They may say it's money but they they really leave a company because they don't feel that they are appreciated.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: They don't feel that they have been that they're that they they don't feel worthy or that the the leadership doesn't make them feel good about themselves.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: And if you can help people feel good about themselves when they walk into that room God that's just like beautiful right you want it's like a drug it's like right it is it it is so like a drug um all right so Nico I could talk to you for hours but so tell me like what is like the one thing if you could give people like you know one thing to walk away with what do you want them to know?
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: There's so many shrink it down to to pure leadership.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: If there's one message that I I I would bring out there is find someone and it and it doesn't have to be a professional but find someone who is 100% trustworthy.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't take that word lightly 100% is is something that I really really emphasize someone here is 100% worthy of your confidence and your trust and speak to them openly on what is going on within your leadership role and ask them before you even start do not give me any solutions do not ask me any questions I just want you to listen because listening to your own voice is sometimes the key to finding a solution to all your problems.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's the same thing as writing down a problem is solving it halfway because every solution that you're looking for for a problem is within writing down and within the problem.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: So that's one thing that I would yeah send out there.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: I love that that is so important and so true.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_00: So how can our listeners connect with you and learn more about you and well the quickest way is LinkedIn.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm always active on LinkedIn so I publicize uh a weekly podcast as well the everlasting fulfillment podcast where I discuss CEO disease and founder syndrome very very explicitly with the with executives and C levels um and on on the other side I you know do the LND uh and the confidant story that's uh that's the other thing but LinkedIn find me on LinkedIn or just type in my name put it com right behind there and you'll swim overseas under the ground to a wonderful country called Belgium and that's where you'll find my website.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely fantastic well Nico I so appreciate you being a guest on our podcast um this is the Unstoppable Leadership Spotlight Podcast and again I'm your host and Nico thank you so much for being an amazing guest and please listeners reach out to Nico and connect with him great amazing wisdom and insight so thank you so much.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for joining me on the Unstoppable Success podcast where we don't just talk about growth we leap toward it.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: If something today lit a fire within you sparked a new idea or gave you the extra push forward please don't keep it to yourself.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: Share this episode and podcast with a friend, colleague or fellow high achiever be sure to subscribe rate and review and most importantly connect with me Jacob Schuminger at leaptoyoursuccess.com for coaching, community and your next bold move keep leading with intention keep building your network with purpose and most of all keep leaping because you are meant to be unstoppable