Latest / truthunedited / The Moment I Stopped Fighting God and Surrendered _ Phil Wickham - The Jesus People Podcast

Transcript

The Moment I Stopped Fighting God and Surrendered _ Phil Wickham - The Jesus People Podcast · truthunedited

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: There's a time in my life I wanted to be Bono,
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean? In a band, and God,
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: He closed that door. I've started a song for my wife.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: I've done it so many times where I've written a
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: song for her, and then all of a sudden, like
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: the generators go out, and all the lights go out, and.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: It's just important, right?
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: And so I just had this thought, like, I'm just
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: going to keep, I'm going to lead worship. And I
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: went to the front of the stage, and as loud
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: as I could, I was like, And it was like
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: a braveheart moment.
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: It's protecting my family, protecting my kids from thinking that
• 0:30
  Speaker 3: we're special or that we deserve more.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: I don't want my kids to think they... People, like,
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: want to give you free stuff or, like, hey, why
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: don't you sit in the front? And we have to, like,
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: be careful about that.
• 0:39
  Speaker 4: The lies.
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: of the enemy that I'm so prone to believing, about
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: my unworth to do it at all, about my ill-equippedness.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: I just felt like this question in my spirit, Phil,
• 0:49
  Speaker 3: are you letting me be the Lord your whole life?
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: There's dark corners that I wasn't letting his light in,
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: you know, and I didn't feel shame.
• 0:59
  Speaker 4: Guys, welcome to the Jesus People podcast. Super honored to
• 1:02
  Speaker 4: have a new friend and brother in Christ, Phil Wickham,
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: on the pod. Thanks for being here.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: Thanks so much for having me on, man. It's been awesome.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: We've been hanging out, talking about the scriptures. I already
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: feel like you're such a brother, man.
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: It's our first time we met today. Right.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: But I don't feel like that, man. I sense the
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: same spirit in you that's in us that call on
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: the name of Jesus. So thanks so much for having
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: me on.
• 1:23
  Speaker 4: Amen. I'm so grateful to hear you say that because
• 1:24
  Speaker 4: I feel the same way. And I was telling you earlier, Man,
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: your songs have become part of our daily rhythm.
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: We wake up and we put.
• 1:32
  Speaker 4: On your songs. I've watched you run through that little
• 1:35
  Speaker 4: tunnel in like Solana Beach.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: If you're from here, you know all the little spots
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: we go and do all the reels and stuff. It's amazing.
• 1:42
  Speaker 4: And I'm really curious. I was telling you this earlier,
• 1:44
  Speaker 4: but I'm so curious where this depth comes from, this intimacy.
• 1:50
  Speaker 4: The songs you write have such theological depth, such an
• 1:54
  Speaker 4: applicable– daily applicable thing to them where, and they're great
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: and they're listenable and they're beautiful. And so for me,
• 2:04
  Speaker 4: I always go, wow, how did he write that? Like
• 2:07
  Speaker 4: what spot did you have to get into to write
• 2:11
  Speaker 4: Living Hope? Where did you go to write Psalm 23?
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: You know, I'm just so curious about these things. So
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: what is your process to write songs?
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: Goodness.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: That's a good question because I don't know if I
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: can answer it when I think of From Song to Song.
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: You know, every song has such a unique story of
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: how it came about. Like, Living Hope was almost completely
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: written over a text thread with my buddy Brian Johnson.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: And not in one day, not in one month. Like,
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: that song kind of lived on our phones for months.
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: So I think there's a few things that go into it.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: One is I'm so thankful to have the upbringing I
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: had like really in sound scripture teaching. I grew up
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: at a church called Calvary Chapel that really put a
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: huge emphasis on knowing the word of God. Like there's
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: so many, so many songs I know from when I
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: was young, like study, do show thyself approved unto God,
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rather than
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: dividing the word of truth. That's just like straight from scripture.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: I probably have like 50 of those in my head,
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: you know, because our church was like big on learning
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: scripture and knowing it. And I probably, by the time
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: I was three years old, I could lead people down
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: the Romans road, you know, like, Jesus, you know, if
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: you confess with your mouth, Jesus is Lord. I didn't
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: really know what it meant, but I knew these things.
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: And so I'm so thankful to parents who had a
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: huge emphasis on understanding and knowing the scripture. And then
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: as I grew up, I didn't just like, I remember
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: a specific moment when we had moved from Orange County
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: to San Diego. I picked up guitar because I had
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: no friends around. I was probably 12 years old, didn't
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: have ambition to like, be on the road or write
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: songs or put out records.
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: I was just a lonely kid that loved Narnia, you know?
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: And the way I learned how to play guitar was
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: my dad gave me these chord charts of the songs
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: that we sang at the time, which was like, I
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: could sing of your love forever and shout to.
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: The Lord all the earth, you know, those like 90s songs.
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: And so that's how I learned how to play guitar.
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: And then in singing these songs of worship, the Holy
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: Spirit met me. And over that summer, I went from
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: knowing scripture and knowing what it meant to look like
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: a Christian to not even in a bad way, just
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: was young, you know, just trying to follow the footsteps
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: of my parents and living in the Christian culture that
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: I was in. My dad's on staff too. I, the
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: Holy spirit started opening my heart up to understanding God
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: as a person and as someone I could know. And
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: over the last 30 years since then, it's 42 now, um,
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: I've come to, I deeply love Jesus.
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: I love God. I love the father.
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: I think he's so awesome. I don't understand him. I,
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: barely scratched the surface. Sometimes it's kind of frightening. Like
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: the ocean is frightening.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: It's just so big. I can't even wrap my mind
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: around it in that way.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: Um, but his heart revealed to me in scripture, the
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: more I find out about it, the more I'm just,
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: I love him.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: I love God. And I'm not perfect, not perfectly, but
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: he's just so creative and beautiful.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: And the story he writes stories, he writes in the
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: way he never leaves and the hope he gives and
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: the goodness and the gifts and everything.
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: He just knows what's best. And he wants me to
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: be part of it all.
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: It's just, it's awesome.
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: Like who he is. And so knowing the scripture and
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: then knowing who he is more and more in my life.
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: And then also I love music. Like I, I love
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: writing songs.
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: Like I'm, I would do it whether if I was
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: never believed in God, I'd still be, I would have
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: tried to be a famous musician. Actually, there's a time
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: in my life I wanted to be Bono, you know
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: what I mean?
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: In a band.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: And God kind of made, he closed that door.
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: Thank the Lord.
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: We wouldn't have.
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: Well, because that's another, we'll talk about the story in
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: a second because it's epic. Like the, what God really
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: called me into doing what I'm doing now, at least
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: to me, it's epic because I, I never questioned it
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: since then.
• 5:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: But, and so when you couple.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: All this, also, I'm very, I, I'm very stubborn, like
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: in my, Like I never let an idea die if
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: I feel some spark in my heart. Like I've had
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: worship leader friends that I write songs with. They called
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: me the axe because I just keep chopping. Like I
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: just like, I was like.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: I know there's gold in here, but I can't find it.
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: Where's the chorus to these verses? I will, I.
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: Can't stop obsessing about like verses of living hope. I'm like,
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: I know those verses are so special and it just,
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: I can't find the chorus because And then at some
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: point it feels like God's like almost like honors that like,
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: I don't want to know that I probably wrote, there's
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: been songs I've written 12 courses for. And the 13th
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: one is like, finally something about it makes my heart
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: just want to explode with singing.
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: You know? So I think, I don't think, I can't
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: say this is my process.
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: I think I could just kind of more explain, like,
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: I'm so thankful to have an understanding of the scriptures
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: from a young age. I'm so thankful that God has
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: increasingly revealed himself to me because it makes me want
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: to sing to him and invite people into these moments
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: where he like, I kind of, I describe writing a
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: new song often as like, I know, I know what
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: the cross looks like, but sometimes God just, it's almost
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: like a prism. And when you just shift the prism
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: a little bit, like the light and everything in the
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: room changes, you know, like now there's different reflections and
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: now the lights, it's all, it's the same prism, the
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: same light, but you just, God let you see something
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: in a different way.
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: It's like, there's a song right there, you know? Um,
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: so you chase that prism shifting.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: Moment with stubbornness and with joy and with just the
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: sheer love of like knowing this could help someone in
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: a moment.
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: This could be someone's new prayer. This could be my
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: new prayer.
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: So I think all those things together, whether it's in
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: the room, like I was last week, I was in
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: the room with Chandler Moore and my producer, Jonathan Smith.
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: And we wrote eight new songs together over three days.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: And it was just like downpour.
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: Like it was amazing.
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: I've never had that happen. Or like, this is amazing.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: Grace is a song of mine from years back. That
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: song was written over three years. And so there's not
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: really a process as much as just like those ingredients,
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: I think, that go into these moments of like finally
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: being like, okay, there's a song. Sometimes it's like a river.
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: Sometimes it's like chiseling away at a stone.
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: But there's a song. I can't let it go.
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: Is it a bit like prayer in a way?
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, it is. There's portions of it that are.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: The moments, the lyric writing and understanding– that you talk,
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: that this is the song, especially when I'm writing songs
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: intentionally to sing with my church or with people, I
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: know like we're talking to God and we're creating new
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: ways to say something to him. And so I want
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: this to be, I want this to be cognizant. I
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: want this to flow. I want this to be conversational.
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: I don't want to just, I mean, there's, you could
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: write a song that says, you're the creator of the universe.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: Thank you for the cross. I've got joy in my heart.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: You know, all these phrases that are true, but like,
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: I don't want to, I want to sing a song
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: that's like, this is the narrative of the cross and
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: this is my response to it, you know? And so
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: in that situation, like I wouldn't come to God and
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: be like, holy are you? And then say something that
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: has nothing to do with that and says, I want
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: to talk to him as if he's a person in
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: the room, you know? And so that's the same in
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: a similar sense. That's the same way I think about
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: the songs.
• 9:11
  Speaker 4: Well, and what comes to mind to me is Psalm 23,
• 9:14
  Speaker 4: your song, the Lord is my shepherd. There's nothing I need.
• 9:18
  Speaker 4: You lead me to the safest places. You lead me
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: to the safest places. that's not actually what it says,
• 9:23
  Speaker 4: but it's what it says.
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean? It captures the heart.
• 9:27
  Speaker 4: It captures the heart. And like, for me, when I
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: listened to that, I'm like, that is the cry of
• 9:32
  Speaker 4: my heart, but it's put in a way that I
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: would probably say it more in a prayer than David did. Yeah.
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: That song was written without, I never thought anybody would
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: hear that song. That song, during lockdown 2020 COVID times,
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: I just wanted to start I wanted the Psalms in
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: my heart more. I wanted to learn them, and I
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: already knew Psalm 23, but I remember doing Psalm 1.
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: um i did psalm uh 4 i i did a
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: psalm 119 i remember doing psalms and just making them
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: almost word for word just so they would just be
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: in my life in my heart because i'm like well
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: i got time you know yeah yeah um psalm 23
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: was one and that flowed i did not have to
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: work on it i mean it's already written but it's
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: psalm 23 my version wasn't but it just I was
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: just praying.
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: I knew it in my heart. So I just remember
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: sitting down. The Lord is my shepherd. There's nothing I need.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: You know, in the chorus, your goodness, your mercy will follow.
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: I think it probably took 30 minutes, you know.
• 10:28
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: Because I wasn't really trying to write a song. I
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: was just trying to pray the Psalms.
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: Does that happen often where you're just communing with the
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: Lord and it just comes out?
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: It doesn't happen often where a song that I share
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: that ends up being public comes out.
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: Oh, so you have a lot of private songs. Yeah.
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: So even ones that I've forgotten, I, I, I love that.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: I like, I've got a little room above my garage. Um, that's,
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: you have to access from the outside, literally like, um,
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's probably 10 by 10, but that's my
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: little studio. And, uh, and there's been, yeah, I, I'll
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: go up there and, and, and worship the Lord and, um, not, yeah,
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: not even trying to write a song, you know? Um,
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: but just trying to, I try to do that because
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: I was like, man, you're giving me so many songs,
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: so many beautiful moments, so many things. I just want
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: to give you a moment where I'm just loving you
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: with my.
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: Music, you know?
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: And so there's songs once in a while, a chorus
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: will pop out, but I almost.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: Feel like.
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: It's okay.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: It's like this, like there's been times where I've started
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: a song for my wife, like, or just something's come
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: out that sounds like a love song. Like just recently I,
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: my wife has green eyes and I.
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: I just wrote this. This chorus just popped out.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: I was, we were around the campfire and I was
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: singing kind of to the kids about their mom, you know?
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And it's actually kind of good. Like, it's like, okay,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: how'd it go?
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: All I see is a field of red roses underneath
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: the big white clouds and a blue sky.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: There's nothing I love more in this world than my
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: green eyed girls. Kind of like that kind of sweet
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: little thing, you know, like just sweet little melody. And,
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: and then I showed Mallory.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: And she didn't say it this time, but there's been
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: times in the past because I've done it so many
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: times where I've written a song for her. And she's like,
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: finish that song for me, though, because I always end
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: up turning them into worship songs later. Because it's like,
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: that was good, but I'm a worship leader and that's
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: what I'm making of it. And so that being said, like,
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: I kind of feel like that with the Lord in
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: those moments.
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: You know, like, this was going to just be for you.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: And I think I'd know it if he gave me,
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: it's like, okay, this is maybe for more than just
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: this moment, but also like, if something comes to mind,
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: it's like, you know, I'd rather there's, you know, better
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: as a moment with you than a lifetime anywhere else.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: And it's cool.
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: You know, and if it's flowing in the chorus, like,
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: it's like, Lord, can I, I know it was just
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: for you, but can I take that?
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: You know?
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: So you might know that that's for something else, but
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: for the most part, I try to turn off my, like,
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: I'm looking for a song as I'm giving you, you know,
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to turn that off in my brain once
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: in a while so that when I'm just singing to him,
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: It's just singing to him. It's like maybe almost think
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: of it as like tithe or something.
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: This part's for you.
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: I mean, dude, I feel that as like a Christian influencer.
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: Sometimes it's like, ooh, that's an insight. And to just
• 13:21
  Speaker 4: be like, Lord, was that just for me? Is that
• 13:23
  Speaker 4: just for me and you or can I?
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: Maybe for the right moment, I'll save it.
• 13:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's good.
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: You know what?
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: Time's on stage, though, in those spontaneous moments. I love
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: when songs sunk. Songs, ideas, and choruses pop out with
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: the band on stage with the community of believers.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: We were just on tour.
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: I mean, there's probably 8,000 to 10,000 people a night
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: this last spring. And so to be in that moment,
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: you're singing about heaven, you're singing about his holiness, and
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: then a spontaneous thing happens. You're singing, holy, holy, holy
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: is the Lord Almighty in a new melody. You've never
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: sang it before. And just like, wow, I can't wait
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: to make this a song. Because for me, that feels
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: like it was born in the very place it was
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: made for.
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: So I love those.
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: Is it ever hard to... receive the praise when you're
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: trying to spotlight praise onto Jesus?
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: It used to be more hard.
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: Uh, I think, uh, originally in my small little youth
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: group and communities, you know, when I was in high
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: school and people were like, Hey, like, you know, you're
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: pretty great for a high schooler, you know, cause I
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: was starting to lead in just big church.
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: We called it that.
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: Then that's the first time you're getting any praise. Um,
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: first time any girls are looking my way first, you
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: know what I mean? First time any of that's happening.
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: And so then you're kind of like, I'm like, I
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: don't think I've ever was like, put, you know, put
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: you off cocky, but I was definitely like, okay, I'm like,
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: I'm like the senior with the guitar, you know, like
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: I'm kind of, um, and you get over that really fast.
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: At least I did when things start.
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: Cause that's really just out of like security and I
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: want a desire for people to approval of man and
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: as our people think you're here.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: You're worthwhile, your existence is worthwhile, you know?
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: But once things start going outside of like, well, I
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: had nothing to do with me, but like for some reason,
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: I remember when I heard that a missionary had, I
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: was still in high school and a missionary had translated
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: my song to Hungarian and was singing in the church.
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: And then they did it at a pastor's conference in Europe.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: And then Europe's churches started singing this song. And I'm just,
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: and I remember it. No part of me felt like, yep,
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: that's what it should be doing.
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: Every part of me felt like almost nervous, scared.
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: Like, I don't think.
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: Did I write everything I'm supposed to write for other
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: people to sing across the country? You know what I mean?
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: The weight of the responsibility, even as a young kid,
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: of leading God's people in worship and putting new songs
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: in people's hearts, that's always... been a heavy thing for
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: me and, and it's grown in heaviness. Um, and, and
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: you also see in, in regards to the, the praise
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: thing you see early on, like, wow, this is obviously
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: people responding to a spirit thing.
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: People responding to the gospel in songs. Yeah.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: God has given me an ability to put some chords
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: and melodies together with these truths, but like, this is
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: bigger than the song's not this good, but the truth is,
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: you know, like this, Like, I could never have done this.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: This is a God thing. And I think the more
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: you see that, the more you, I just go like, okay, like, Lord,
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: just help me. Just keep my heart pure. Like, help me.
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: Like, I just want to be in your will. Like,
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: I don't want to mess this up. Like, you just
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: direct me, you know? But then the pray, and then,
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: but then like, even in that situation, yeah, the pray,
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: you kind of think like, oh, well, you always put
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: the finger up.
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: Like, wasn't me, wasn't me.
• 16:51
  Speaker 4: But you know.
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: As you just people, they just like connecting with the
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: ones that have connected them with something bigger than what,
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: you know, like when people are touched in their spirit,
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: especially by someone directly pointing them to Jesus, like how
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: you do, like a pastor does.
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: I think most people aren't.
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: Most people aren't like putting me on a pedestal as
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: much as just saying like, thank you. Like you gave
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: me words in that moment. That was in that we
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: sang about heaven when my grandpa died for your song.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: We prayed that prayer about it belongs when my kid
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: had cancer. Like I don't think they're coming to me
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: and praising me. more than just saying, thank you. And like, I've,
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: you've really connected me with truth that helped me. And
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: so like, I just, there's just, I think when a
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: human does something inside of you like that, like you just,
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: you automatically just want to connect with them.
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: Not because like, totally, you know what I mean? I
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: think there are idols out there.
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: I think people do put people, people on pedestals out there,
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: but like, I don't know if that makes sense.
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: It makes sense. It's a really humble way to look
• 17:52
  Speaker 4: at it. And I think it's a realistic way to
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: look at it because I do think for the vast
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: majority of people that run into you in the street
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: or in Vons or wherever, they're connecting it to an
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: experience they had with Jesus. And I think that's probably
• 18:04
  Speaker 4: an honor for you. But I also think that on
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: the flip side of it, you do have people that
• 18:08
  Speaker 4: are doing some like worship leader worship. You know what
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: I mean?
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you for sure can have that.
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: And I think little by little, you just love on
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: people when you can. Like we were just, me and
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: my family, it was the last night before we were
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: going to drop my almost 15-year-old off at her. She's
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: doing this ballet intensive. She's such a beautiful ballerina, and
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: she's going off for like three weeks to hone in
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: her skills, you know. And so we said, what do
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: you want to do? And she said, I want this dinner.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: I want this ice cream. I want to go watch
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: the sunset with everybody because we're here in San Diego,
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: you know. And so we get out there. And I've learned,
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: and my wife for sure, when someone recognizes and cares,
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: you pick up the vibe real fast. People think they're
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: being secretive, but they're not. And some people just care
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: a lot. And you do sense that. And so I
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: think less than dealing with the praise, it's more like.
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: Protecting those moments.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: It's more like protecting my family, protecting my kids from
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: thinking that, we are special or that we deserve more
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: or that like, Oh, but my dad's does this. Like,
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: how do we, how do I don't want my kids
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: to think they, because for some reason, when, when you've
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: connected or when you, people like want to give you
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: free stuff or like, Hey, why don't you sit in
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: the front or why don't you?
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: And we have to like, be careful about that.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: You know, all that kind of things with our kids
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: thinking and let them know what always, this is what
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: we're singing about. This is why dad's going on tour.
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: This is what, this is the main goal. And so
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: I think it's– for me in my life now, it's
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: not a matter of– I don't think– yeah, praise is– like,
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: thank you. Like, it doesn't do anything for me. It's
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: more protecting my family and protecting those sacred spaces.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: You know?
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: Hey guys, I want to take a quick break and
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: I want to tell you about a ministry that's really
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: near and dear to my heart. It's called global Christian relief.
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: Global Christian relief goes into the countries that are most
• 20:02
  Speaker 4: heavily persecuted where Christians are being enslaved in Pakistan, where
• 20:06
  Speaker 4: they're being killed daily in Nigeria. where they don't have
• 20:09
  Speaker 4: scriptures in countries I'm not even allowed to name. And
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: the cost to smuggle a Bible is $ 5. The cost
• 20:16
  Speaker 4: to feed a family in Nigeria is so minuscule, you
• 20:20
  Speaker 4: wouldn't believe it. The cost to free a slave in
• 20:24
  Speaker 4: Pakistan is like giving up a Chipotle burrito a week.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: And my encouragement for you would be to give a
• 20:30
  Speaker 4: small recurring gift, to not forget our brothers and sisters
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: in Christ right now who are being persecuted because Jesus
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: tells us, Whatever you did for the least of these brothers,
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: he's speaking about the persecuted church there. You did for him.
• 20:42
  Speaker 4: So if you want to bless Jesus on this earth
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: right now, you do it through the persecuted body. So
• 20:47
  Speaker 4: my encouragement to you would be give a small recurring gift.
• 20:50
  Speaker 4: There's a link in the show notes or in the
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: description and support your family who right now are being
• 20:56
  Speaker 4: killed daily in Nigeria, who are being enslaved in Pakistan
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: and who oftentimes feel like they're forgotten by their American
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: brothers and sisters in Christ. Yeah, that's beautiful. I think
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: that's probably why you were called to such a heavy
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: mantle as well, in reaching so many people, because the
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: Lord's like, I can trust you. I want to get in,
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: and that reminds me of David, because Saul wanted the acclaimed,
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: David just wanted the presence. And you were the voice
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: of David. I want to talk about that a little bit.
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: I want to get into your book, Everyday Hallelujah, because
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: you are a worship leader, but you're talking about unlocking
• 21:25
  Speaker 4: deep joy through everyday acts of worship. So it's not
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: just singing on stage or singing to the masses. And
• 21:31
  Speaker 4: we're going to put the link for this Unbelievable book
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: in the show notes and in the description so you
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: guys can check it out. But you teased us earlier.
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: You said that there was a moment where the Lord
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: called you.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: How did the Lord call you to be a worship leader?
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: It's very typical for me.
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: Like he needed to like be on my head with it,
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: you know, because I think now looking back, it's like
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: he always from the first time I was leading worship
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: in front of 13 kids and my heart just exploding
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: with joy as a junior high kid. if I would
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: have known him now and know how he works now
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: back then, I'd be like, oh, whether this is my job,
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: I don't know. But whether I'm going to, I know
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: I'm going to say yes to every time someone asks
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: me to do this because I love it and God's
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: getting the glory and I don't need to overthink it. But,
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: you know, you go through that period when you're 18,
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: 19 after high school, it's like, what am I supposed
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: to do?
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: And you get pulled in different directions.
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: And I was actually in a band called Fairchild that
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: me and my best friend His name is Sean.
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: Awesome, awesome guy. And he loved, he loved Jesus.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: And he moved down from Southern California or Northern California
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: to live with us, you know, and.
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: He was working at a church and I was doing stuff,
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: but we would come together. We'd be worship together. And also, um,
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: also we had this dream. Like we are YouTube 2.0.
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: Like I am Bono. He is edge.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: You know, that, that was our, our dream in our
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: mind and we're going to conquer the world. And we
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: started writing songs for it and all this stuff. It's
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: a beautiful dream. That's a, I, That could be a
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: great dream for someone. Meanwhile, someone came up to my dad,
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: an affluent family that were friends of ours, and they said, hey,
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: Phil's writing all these songs for our church, and they're
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: going around our different churches, and people are singing them.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: Why doesn't he have an album out yet? And my
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: dad's like, well, it costs money, especially back then, because
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: you had to get in a studio. You couldn't just
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: get a laptop and a mic and make an awesome record.
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: And so they're like, what does it take? And my
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: dad told him what it took. And they wrote tens
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: of thousands of dollar check for us. We bought all
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: the studio equipment and me and my dad made a
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: record called give you my world. And that had just
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: worship songs on it that I'd written. And, uh, so
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: I w I had that out and that was like
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: circulating on its own. I never sent it to anybody,
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: never asked to play anybody. I never, I never sent
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: it to a label, but within a year label started calling.
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: People started figuring, and I would always say, no, that's just,
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: that's just like my worship thing.
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: I'm, I'm in this band, you know?
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: Um, and, uh, cause I wanted to be in a
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: cool band and like, that's, that's the, that's the long-term thing.
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: Everybody wants to be in a cool band, you know?
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: But meanwhile, every Sunday I was at a different church
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: leading worship and honestly loving it.
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: Um, and as we, I delve, delve more into this
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: band thing. I just felt more of a pull, more
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: of an anxiety. And I, I was trying to push
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: it away, but we went in anyway. Anyway, we went
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: to England.
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: To help out this church plant to be, and there
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: was this festival out there, a Christian festival. They had
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: Fairchild on the bill, which is awesome.
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: We've cool.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's pretty cool music, you know,
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: and we're playing, we play one day, we're supposed to
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: play the next day, but it starts raining, starts pouring. And, uh,
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: And so they had this thing called the tea tent,
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: which is a very British thing. It's like the tent
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: where if you don't want to be watching all the
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: rock bands, you go in the tent and there's acoustic stuff.
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: And so it starts pouring. So everybody, it's like night,
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: everybody pours in there.
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: It's probably like made for 700 people and there's like 5,000.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: It's just like crammed. They're getting a PA set up
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: and they say, Phil, get up there and sing some songs.
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: And I get up there and I'm just like trying
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: to sing some songs. No one's paying attention. And then
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: all of a sudden, like the generators go out and
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: all the lights go out and it's just pouring rain. And, uh,
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: and so I just had this thought, like, I'm just
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: going to keep, I'm going to lead worship. And I,
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: I went to the front of the stage and as
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: loud as I could, I was like.
• 25:08
  Speaker 4: I love you, Lord.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: And it was like a brave heart moment. Like everybody
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: started singing along and it was just a Christian festival. Yeah.
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: Christian festival, but invite your friends kind of thing, you know,
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: like it's, it's for the neighborhood, for the community, but yeah,
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: Christian festival.
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: Um, They worship.
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: In the morning and in bands. And then there was
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: an evangelical kind of thing at the end.
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: You know, you can receive Jesus. Beautiful. But people started
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: roaring with me.
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: And I just remember, like, I felt like in my mind, like,
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: it was like that Steven Spielberg moment. And just, like,
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: all the wind in my face and just, like, light.
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: It was just a beautiful moment. And then, no joke,
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: let it be a sweet, sweet sound.
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: In your ear. On ear, power came back on. Everybody cheers.
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: And then we worship for like an hour, just me
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: and a guitar.
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: And it's just this epic moment.
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: And the whole time, The months leading up to that,
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: I was going through all this turmoil, all this inner, like, wrestling.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: And what am I supposed to do? Why do I
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: feel this way?
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: And I just felt like God said, like, he, like,
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: unlocked my heart for me. Really what he was doing
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: was like, Phil, take it in. Like, I'm not calling
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: you right now. Like, I've been calling you your whole life. But, like, check, like,
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: look at your heart right now.
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: How much joy. Like, this is why you're here. That's
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: how I felt. Like, God was saying, look it. Just
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: take stock.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: And it was so much joy. And so from then on,
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: it was sad. I had to tell the band, you know,
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: and that wasn't easy. But since then, it's just been
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: a beautiful little by little, just trying to write songs
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: for people to grow closer to Jesus and loving every
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: minute of it.
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: Wow. That's beautiful. Have you talked to Forrest about his story?
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: A little bit.
• 26:52
  Speaker 4: You need to swap stories. Very, very similar. I'll let
• 26:55
  Speaker 4: him tell you the full story, but he was in Surfaces,
• 26:59
  Speaker 4: massive band.
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: So that's one different thing because my band wasn't massive.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: Right. But I think he went to go play like
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: a vow renewal service. Some rich people paid him a
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: bunch of money. And they were like, oh, play some
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: of your new Christian stuff because he had released like
• 27:12
  Speaker 4: two songs. He said the Holy Spirit falls and he
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: like hits his knees and starts weeping and starts playing
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: and then realizes this is what I.
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: Need to do.
• 27:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Wow.
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: That's crazy. I have heard this now that you're saying it.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: It's amazing. I haven't ever thought how our two stories
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: kind of connect. That's beautiful.
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, very, very similar.
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: I love Forrest.
• 27:31
  Speaker 4: One of the peers started. Yeah.
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: I love him guys.
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: I'm thankful for him.
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: Awesome.
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So yeah, just leading worship ever since then. And camp,
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: I can't believe that was when I was 21, 20.
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: And then the next, next year I signed with a label.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: I still work with a lot of the same guys now,
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: 20 years later, which actually just celebrated my first record
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: with a label coming out a month and a half ago.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: And now there's been over 10 albums and Christmas stuff
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: and live things and tours and, And through it all,
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: I just see God's goodness. And I'm just, I can't believe,
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: like this last tour was like my favorite tour I've
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: ever done, man.
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: Really? Yeah, favorite.
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: And I think a lot of it has to do
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: just with my continued growth in Jesus and knowing the
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: Father better and better. I just like, the more you
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: get to know him, the more beautiful it is to
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: be in his presence. But I think, so I had
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: two prayers for this tour. It was the Song of
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: the Saints tour. It was my last record. Stop me
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: if I'm talking too much.
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: You're on a podcast. Keep talking.
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: I had just a few prayers.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: One was that God would just free me of any
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: need to prove myself, any need to live up to
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: the expectations of what an arena artist looks.
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: Like, anything. He would just free me to love him
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: and love his people.
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: Hmm.
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: Um, and the second prayer was that everybody on my team,
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: cause there's going to be about over a hundred people
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: out on the, on the tour, on the crew side that,
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: and a lot of, several of them don't aren't church people.
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: They're just like, they rig lights and just that everybody,
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: no matter where they came from, would look back and
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: say like, I got to be a part of something
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: really special.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: And I wish that was going on next year. I
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: belong there.
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: And there was something in a part of that, that
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: I can't put my finger on or I can, cause
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: I knew it's Jesus. Um, and God answered those prayers
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: in a huge way. Um, I was praying that prayer
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: a lot because I've found in times past that I
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: can really, before I'm out in front of the amount
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: of people that God has put in front of me,
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: whether it's a couple hundred a night or a couple
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: thousand or tens um.
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: Man it though the lies of the enemy that i'm.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: So prone to believing about my unworth to do it
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: at all about my ill-equippedness about uh some the like
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: they are so fiery and so hot like before tour
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: um And I've come to recognize it.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: And now, months in advance, pray against it. That's what
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: that was.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: Like, give me a freedom in just knowing who you
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: are and who I am in you. And I don't
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: want to have to think about anything other than the
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: words I'm singing and the people I get to be with,
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: you know. And the night, the day before I flew
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: out for rehearsals of the tour, I was asking the Lord, hey,
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: what do you want? Because I actually did, he was
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: already answering that prayer and how God was meeting me.
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: I was just excited.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: I said, Lord, what do you want me to bring
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: into this tour message-wise? Because I know there's always a moment,
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: and maybe it's different every night, but if there's something
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: you want to underpin this whole tour, like that I
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: can bring, is there anything? And a verse that I've
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: spoken many times from the stage came to mind. If
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: you confess from your mouth Jesus is Lord and believe
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: in your heart that God raised him from the dead,
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: you will be saved.
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: And I thought, oh, awesome. Yeah, I'll give people an
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: invitation to be saved.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: I can do that, Lord. That sounds great. And I
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: just felt like God just say, like, slow down. Like,
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: and I opened up the scripture and I read it again.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: And I stopped at that first sentence, the first beginning
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: of the first sentence. If you confess with your mouth,
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: Jesus is Lord. And as I read that over and
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: over and looked at those words, I just felt like
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: this question in my spirit. Phil, are you letting me
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: be the Lord of your whole life? Phil, are you
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: letting me be the Lord of your whole life? And
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: I sat in that for a little bit. I was
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: in my backyard. And I started crying because I felt
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: like there's answers I could say yes to. And there's
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: things I had to say no to, you know. And
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: not that was I saved. I know I'm saved as
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: best as I can know.
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: I've called in the name of Jesus. It's by grace.
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: That wasn't a question.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: It's like, are you letting the full working of the
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: kingdom happen in your life? And some things came to
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: mind that I have just, I've let be a stronghold
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: because it doesn't seem a big deal. There's lies I
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: believe that came to mind about who God is, about
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: what I need to do to be in his good
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: graces that came to mind. There's dark corners that I
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: wasn't letting his light in, you know. And I didn't feel...
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: shame or condemnation. I just felt an invitation to more freedom.
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: And it's like that thing, like if we are in
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: a fight or with an army, and if you surrender,
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: you are about to become a captive.
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: But if you do the.
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: Same thing to Jesus, like I want to surrender my
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: will and my life under your kingship, it's the opposite.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: We become more free.
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: And as I sat there and I said, Jesus, I
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: I want you to be the Lord of my life,
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: but I don't even know how to do it. Like,
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: I feel like I don't know how to do it even. Like,
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: I'm just fail. Can you just help me? And I
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: just felt like the biggest resounding yes. And the most, like,
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: I've already been freed in Jesus, but in a new
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: way in my life. I've experienced his freedom. And this
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: thing he calls abundant life. In a bigger way than
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: I ever knew.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: And I was so.
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: blown away by his grace and kindness. And I so
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: stoked because I know there's a lot of people that
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: have called on the name of Jesus that come to
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: my shows.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of church people.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: I also know there's a lot of people that are
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: going to walk into those rooms that are carrying addictions
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: and strongholds and secret sins and bitterness and things.
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: And all those things mean that.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: You have not let the king be the king because
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: those things don't live in the kingdom. And we have
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: tried to create counterfeit kingdoms where we want the benefits
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: of the kingdom, love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: We want those things, but we deny the kingship of Jesus,
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: you know? And, like, it's not easy all the time.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's taking up our cross, but when we
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: do and we say, I want to crucify all that stuff,
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: not because I want to be a good Christian, but
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: because I know at the other end for the joy
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: that was set before Jesus is that same joy that
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: was set before me.
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: It's being.
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: The joy that was set before him, he endured the cross,
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: despising the shame. And what's that joy? I believe it's
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: me being free. And so that's, I get to experience
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: that same joy. I get to walk into the same
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: joy that was set before him when I crucify myself.
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: And there's things like, Lord, deal with it. And so, man,
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: to be able to give that invitation every night, I
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: just felt like the Lord was like, Jesus, be the king.
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: I want to draw a line in the sand.
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: Like, And I just loved singing it every night because
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: I felt like it was a middle finger to the devil. Like,
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: let's draw a line in the sand, church. Like, we're
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: not going to pick up our phones and look at
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: disgusting things at night anymore. We're not going to believe
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: that money is the way we're secure our future. We're
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: not going to believe that we need likes to prove
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: that we're good. We're not going to believe that what
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: this person said about us last is who I am.
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: I'm going to believe who you say I am. I'm
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: going to believe what you say is good. Because I have,
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: not just because I trust, because I've seen with my
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: own eyes that when we walk into that, we're literally
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: walking into what Jesus calls abundant life.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: And I've experienced it, man, in a new way. And
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: I'm so thankful.
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: And that's a huge long answer to why this has
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: been my favorite tour. Because I have felt like I've
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: been set free from things I didn't even know I
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: needed to be set free from. I thought I'd taken
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: care of all the big things in my life, you know?
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: And maybe there'll be more in the future. But Jesus
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: answered the prayer of like, for me just to be
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: free and just to see people not as a crowd,
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: but as, man, it blows my mind that I look
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: out and I see a family and they spent money
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: to be there and time. And there's this couple over here,
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: they have a babysitter at home. And then there's this
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: kid over here that came with his youth group. And
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: I'm just like, who am I that God would allow
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: me to do this? I don't, my answer is, I
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: don't know. It's just by his grace, but Lord, I
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: hope that I am a trustworthy vessel for you to use. And,
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: and so, uh, I'm, I've just absolutely, I've got to,
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: I'm so thankful I get to do what I do. And, uh,
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: and so then this all ties together. So then if
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: you think like, where do the songs come from? It's like, well,
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: I want to sing. I'm thinking about those people that
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: are going to be in the room that God increasingly
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: gives me love for. I'm thinking about the one who
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: saves me and ran to meet me on the road.
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: And it's like, okay, how can we package this? How
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: can we say this in a way that feels fresh
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: and old and ancient and modern and beautiful? How do
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: we do it in a way that's even better than
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: the last time? Because it lights my heart up to
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: make music. It lights my heart up to sing truth
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: with people. It lights my heart up to connect people
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: with the same things I've connected with. And so it
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: just all kind of feeds off each other. And it's
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: just awesome that we get to be a part of
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: people's lives through things we create.
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: Amen, bro.
• 37:02
  Speaker 4: Well, the thing that I've gotten to learn about you
• 37:05
  Speaker 4: just in the few hours we've spent is that you
• 37:07
  Speaker 4: are a true worshiper. You're not just a worship leader.
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: You are a leader of worship. You are a worshiper.
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: It's like it's in you. I see tears filling your
• 37:17
  Speaker 4: eyes when you talk about your love for him. And
• 37:20
  Speaker 4: tears fill your eyes as you talk about your love
• 37:22
  Speaker 4: for the people that are in front of you and
• 37:24
  Speaker 4: the honor that it is to sing songs to them,
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: that they're singing songs of yours in Europe and now worldwide.
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: It's crazy.
• 37:30
  Speaker 4: It's crazy. And a lot of that wisdom has been
• 37:33
  Speaker 4: pointed to this book, Everyday Hallelujah.
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Everyday Hallelujah. I loved writing this book, man.
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: I will tell you, this is my second book with
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: a publisher. I never imagined myself as an author and
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: I still don't consider myself an author, though I have
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: two books published now.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: I don't know if I ever will.
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: I'm a songwriter and a musician, you know, and this
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: book kind of shows that because every chapter is, I
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: wouldn't say it's devotional size, but I also wouldn't say
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: it's chapter size. I wanted each chapter to be succinct
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: and to do exactly what my songs do. which is,
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: but you can do it in a much longer conversation
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: per chapter. But I wanted this to remind people who
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: God is and to give them new language, new analogies,
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: new ideas of how to walk in a life of worship.
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: And I'm so excited for people to read this book.
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: It really, if.
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: Anybody has connected with what I've said now, if anybody's
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: connected with my songs, then.
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: This feels like an extension of all of that. And
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: I like... I was even reading.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: Chapters to someone to my band before we went out
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: just because that's what it does for me. It's like
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: I wrote these I wrote these chapters to be like,
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: I want this to prepare people's hearts. Each chapter prepares
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: hearts to walk into the day with a heart posture
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: towards heaven, beholding Jesus in a fresh way and and
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: kind of pumped to be like, this.
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: Is yours, Lord.
• 38:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: And so every day I'm like, I'm a I didn't.
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: I definitely wrestled through the first book I did because
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: I thought so much like, what in the world do
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: you do to write a book?
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: And this one was just a joy, and I'm so
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: excited to have it out.
• 39:06
  Speaker 4: Well, we've got the link in the show notes and
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: in the description. Phil, thank you for being with us.
• 39:10
  Speaker 4: What an honor, man. Glad to be friends. Glad to
• 39:12
  Speaker 4: be co-laborers in ministry.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: I'm so proud of you, bro. Thank you.
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's few and far between, guys, that just
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: have the talent and want to say, here, I'm going
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: to give it back to you, Lord. And so thank
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: you for your yes. and for what you're doing and
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: impacting so many people. I'm so i'm just proud of
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: you as a not as a big not even from
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: older to younger anything like that just proud of you
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: from brother to brother great job keep going please have
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: me back and.
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: So much gladly yeah man would love it well grateful
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: to you and the impact you've made on our family
• 39:44
  Speaker 4: and i'm sure to millions of others that are listening
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: to thousands of others, listening great for your songs. And
• 39:50
  Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, you're a part of our every morning.
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: Seriously.
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: You really are. So grateful, man, guys, thank you for
• 39:56
  Speaker 4: tuning into the Jesus people podcast. Go check out everyday.
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: Hallelujah.
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: And we will see you guys next week.