Latest / Ryder Lee / Mysterious Disappearance of Steven Kubacki | Trey Hudson & Ryan Burns

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Mysterious Disappearance of Steven Kubacki | Trey Hudson & Ryan Burns · Ryder Lee

• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Buildings behind me were the headquarters for the World War
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Two Office of Strategic Service. It was here that the
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: first halting steps toward mind control began.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: The ten years before Stanley Kubrick made The Shining, he
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: made another film. There's a film about mic code called
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: The Clock We're Gorn.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: The Shining is one movie that has really been put
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: through the wringer, and one thing that people really don't notice.
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: That doesn't really make it a lot, since.
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: All during the shoot Kubrick is rewriting the movie.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: What we see here is Stanley Kubrick trying to encode
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: a secret meaning into The Shining that he doesn't want
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: anyone to know about it.
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: Kubrick has several references to freemasonry in his films.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: There's a lady that walks past that has a bloody
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: handprint on her ass.
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: The Shining is Kubrick's eleventh film, and there's elevens all
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: through the film. Eleven is a special number in occult theology.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: The Shining has been regarded as one of the greatest
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: horror films ever made, but is it really a horror film?
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: The Shining also is loaded with sexual innuendo.
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: The family is isolated up at the overlook, which is
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: a perfect opportunity for some sort of CIA experimentation to
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: go down up there.
• 1:56
  Speaker 3: Using mk ultra methods psyche at the control assassins literally assassins.
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: Experimental drugs including LSD were administered to human guineas.
• 2:10
  Speaker 3: The patients were never told that their treatment was part
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: of a CIA experiment.
• 2:15
  Speaker 5: And there was this story which involves him spiking the
• 2:20
  Speaker 5: drinks of one of his deputies, this guy Frank Olson,
• 2:24
  Speaker 5: and he jumped out of a window to his death.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: It's a demonic possession, you know.
• 2:32
  Speaker 6: So it makes.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: Someone feel like they don't have any control over this
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: etherical entity outside themselves, when really it's the people who
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: are imposing the trauma that need to be held accountable
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: for the actions.
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: Stuts.
• 2:47
  Speaker 4: We know what happened in the apartment that they had.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: There are many clues that point to the fact that
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: this theory of what the Shining is really about is
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: the correct theory.
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: We think that we're watching a horror movie where ghosts
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: are kind of forcing a man to go off and
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  Speaker 2: kill his family.
• 3:08
  Speaker 6: But what are we really watching here.
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: Wendy, I'm home.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to another wonderful Races by Giants Discussion. We
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: are live. Welcome everyone in the chat. Get to see
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: you guys and any moderators and or channel members out there. Today.
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: We have a very exciting show for you guys involving
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: the strangest disappearance of a man that I have ever heard.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: But a quick reminder that my brand new documentary, A
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: Clockwork Shining will be released at the end of the
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: month on Amazon Primes Cross. I really hope everyone watches
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: it when it gets released. Supporting independent filmmakers is very
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: important and that's where the industry is really headed. I'll
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: keep everyone updated exactly when it drops. If it's not
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: at the end of this month, it'll be the beginning
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: of October. And I'm really excited about it. It's the
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: best thing that I've ever put together and have ever
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: been a part of. I'm really excited for you guys
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: to see it. So, without further ado, we have with
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  Speaker 1: us this evening returning guest author and director of the
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: Anomalist Studies and Observation Group, which focuses on investigating places
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: of extreme high strangeness. He's former DoD US Army Military
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: Intelligence Security specialist, Anti terrorism and counterintelligence. Trey Hudson, Welcome
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: back to the show. How's it going with my friend?
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: Hey, it's going great. I'm just a writer. I'm happy
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: to be here as always. You know, you you put
• 4:49
  Speaker 3: a jingle on the phone and say can you come on?
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: And I am, you know, I put my running shoes on,
• 4:53
  Speaker 3: So I'm just I'm just tickled pink to be here
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: once again.
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: Thanks so Mustra. We're gonna get weird here today, my friend.
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: We times, weird things are happening.
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: Somebody toward it. The weirder the better, and you know,
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: just just so you know just how weird it could get.
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: Is I have the sacred yellow Pad of Inquiry out
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: with writing on it, so you know, I've been, you know,
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: really kind of digging got into this, so I'm I'm
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: really geeked out about it. It's going to be a
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: great show.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: I am too. And next up we have returning guests
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: that also investigates area of high strangeness and actually owns
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: property overlooking Skinwalker Ranch. He hosts the popular Paranormal Hero
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: Paranormal podcast and has written about his experiences investigating the
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: skin Walker. Ryan Burns, Welcome back to the show, my friend,
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: how's it going?
• 5:42
  Speaker 4: Going great writer any day with yourself and Trey is weird,
• 5:48
  Speaker 4: and I'm all about getting weird. I can't wait to
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: get into it getting weird.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: Baby. I just realized that you guys actually know each
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: other and I've worked together before. I didn't didn't really.
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: Know about that.
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: Tell us how you guys both met.
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: Oh, go ahead, rider, that's.
• 6:06
  Speaker 4: Okay. So we were involved with the project. I think
• 6:09
  Speaker 4: it's okay to talk about now. Yea is It was
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: something taking place in New Mexico having to do with
• 6:18
  Speaker 4: various extraterrestrial or UAP related experiences, and yeah, we we
• 6:26
  Speaker 4: told you a little bit about it at the beginning.
• 6:29
  Speaker 4: But yeah, we ended up kind of going to this
• 6:34
  Speaker 4: remade Chinese restaurant that was being used as a kind
• 6:39
  Speaker 4: of base camp for operations, and you know, just a
• 6:42
  Speaker 4: weird scenario. Didn't know who was going to show up,
• 6:45
  Speaker 4: and sure enough there, you know, I walked in and
• 6:48
  Speaker 4: there's Trey and this Chinese restaurant and I'm like, well,
• 6:51
  Speaker 4: things are gonna get weird a lot like today, and
• 6:53
  Speaker 4: they did.
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah. It was kind of a kind of odd because
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: this Chinese restaurant. Yeah, you walk in and it's like
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: half of this building and it's kind of like run
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: down and it's got like your greasy paper on the windows,
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: and you're like, you know, is this like, am I
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: going to get murdered? Then you walk in it's like
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: a CIA safehouse, you know, all this equipments everywhere and
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: people milling about doing their sundry, you know things, and
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: then you kind of get to take a peek back
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: behind the curtain and see how the sausage is actually made,
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: you know, on these projects, and it was it was
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: just really quick, really really cool. And I've been a
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: guest on writers show Hero Pairanormal before, so that's kind
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: of how I think we first first first became acquainted.
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: But yeah, our pop paths are starting to kind of
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: cross and intertwine now a little bit more, as you know,
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: as the high Strangest community. And I hope this is true.
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: I hope this isn't just a wild wisule my part.
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: I think maybe people are starting to communicate and interact
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: a little bit better and we can start sharing experiences.
• 7:53
  Speaker 3: And I spent this weekend actually with a friend of
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: Ryan's up in the mountains somewhere with Jacob and uh
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: and uh god, my mind just went completely blank The
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: Confessionals podcast.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: Uh uh, Tony.
• 8:12
  Speaker 3: Tony, I'm sorry, Tony, You're gonna Tony Merkle, Yeah, you
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: can kick my butt. So yeah, So, I mean all
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: our paths are starting to cross now, and I think
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: that that's really cool. So, you know, as we talked
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: about earlier, the paths are crossing. Independent filmmaking is added,
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: zenis so it's a good time. Good time.
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: Was the Chinese restaurant made specifically for your guys' set?
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: Did they remain no restaurant? It was like a cover.
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: They just made the put actors in there and pretended
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: that it was a Chinese restaurant.
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And Ryan can uh, Ryan can attest to this
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: as you'd walk through the kitchen to go to the
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: bathroom and you know their guys, you know, they're making
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: up whatever dish and they kind of look up at
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: you and go back to their work, and it was
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: just kind of surreal.
• 8:58
  Speaker 4: It really was literally as with cleavers cutting stuff up
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: and you're looking over like it was like big trouble
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: in little China if you're like yeah. And there was
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: one point, I'm sure Trey remembers this. One point there
• 9:10
  Speaker 4: was one guy who was so kind of astounded by
• 9:14
  Speaker 4: all of the you know, sunderiness of the scenario that
• 9:18
  Speaker 4: he started wondering. He said, you know, I'm worried that
• 9:21
  Speaker 4: there's FEDS looking looking about. And I remember Trey was
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: in the back seat of a vehicle at that point
• 9:27
  Speaker 4: and said, oh, I was. I was a fed until
• 9:29
  Speaker 4: just recently. And the guy, the look in the guy's
• 9:31
  Speaker 4: eyes was it was really a fun experience, It really was.
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: I never told you what I did to that guy later,
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: because you know the place where we actually filmed the
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: building and then you know how the production van behind it, well,
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: we were all kind of standing back there waiting for
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: the sun to set for some of the scenes, and
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: so you know, this guy was really agitated. He had
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: an app on his phone and he was like watching
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: for Spurrious RF Energy and it's like, dude, everybody's wearing
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: wireless mics. Of course there's Spurrios r F energy. But
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: I thought, well, let me let me just see what
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: I can do here. And I'm like, you know what, dude,
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: I was sitting here and I saw this like big
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: black suburban pull up like two blocks down, and he's like, yeah,
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: I saw I saw these hobos get out of it.
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: But the hobos seem to have very expensive single lens
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: reflex cameras with long lenses, and they just kind of
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: started wandering around and one of them was right over here,
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: and I'm making all this up, you know, and this
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: guy's just he's starting to get more agitated and more excited.
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: And I don't know, I.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: Don't know it would be the FEDS, or if it
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: would be the Health and Food Administration.
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: Looking at or the Mormons, you know, one of the other.
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: I don't know who it was, you know, but I'm
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: just like a stick looking for a pot to stir.
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: And so anyway, it was. It was an interesting, Uh,
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: it was an interesting few days man.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: Speaking of like Vegas and stuff. I just watched a
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: little documentary on YouTube last night, Ryan where there's like
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: tunnels all under Vegas of like homeless people were like
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: homeless people and like drug addicts live like and it
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: spans all through Vegas. I didn't even know about it.
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: I knewbout the tunnels under La but I didn't know
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: that there was ones under Vegas as well.
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: I have a buddy that took a golf cart into
• 11:17
  Speaker 4: him and he said that they went as far as
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: they could go, and it was miles and miles, but
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: they wanted to make sure to be able to come
• 11:29
  Speaker 4: out because they didn't want to run out of juice
• 11:31
  Speaker 4: in there. But yeah, it's over two thousand people the
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: population underneath Vegas right now, that's wild.
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Do we know how those were Were they built whenever
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: they built the city of Vegas or were they there
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: before because the ones in La supposedly were there before.
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: I'm sure you guys know about the theories of the
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: tunnels underneath La. Were reptilians supposedly live in the tunnels
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: under La. And you had that gentleman this last night
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: was shoe Felt and he was going to dig in
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: into the tunnels. I posted about it on Facebook or
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: a couple of weeks ago. But this guy was gonna
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: he had like this sonar type of like X ray machine,
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: and he mapped out all the tunnels underneath LA. And
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: he said that it like mapped out in like the
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: what looked like a reptilian or like a lizard or
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: something like that. And then he saw that there was
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: like gold, like giant gold slabs on the X ray machine.
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: And then he started like digging. They got the permission
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: from La, like the city of La to do it,
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: and he went into the back of a parking lot
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: started drilling down into the concrete and then he hit
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: this like mud and they thought if they dig down
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: any further into the tunnel that it would just completely
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: collapse the tunnel, so they stopped digging and then it
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: just kind of went quiet. And supposedly the guys like
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: maps and all that was like stolen and his extra
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: machine was stolen. But you don't know how much of
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: this has just been like lore or whatever. But do
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: we know anything about these the tunnels in Vegas. I'm
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: guessing that they were built by the people that built Vegas.
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: Right, Interestingly, yes, and it's kind of a two part yes,
• 13:25
  Speaker 4: so yes and yes. So the people that built Vegas
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: were pretty much Mormons and the Mob. And interestingly, yes,
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: tunnels were built by the Mob. But also they have
• 13:39
  Speaker 4: these massive, like one hundred year floods, and when that happens,
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: because of the calichi and the hardness of the ground,
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: they realized really quick that they needed to have massive,
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: just massive drainage systems. After the fact, back in the
• 13:59
  Speaker 4: seventies and eight there was a couple instances where there
• 14:04
  Speaker 4: there was just huge floods, you know, and and basically
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: that this required all kinds of underground excavation. Luckily, a
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: lot of the people in Vegas are very familiar with
• 14:15
  Speaker 4: underground excavation due to projects nearby. So, yeah, there's a massive, massive,
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: In fact, some of them are so big you can
• 14:23
  Speaker 4: fit semis into them. And some of the rooms open
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: up so large that, you know, this friend of mine
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: said that you literally you could hear an echo, you
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: could tell the room was huge, and it wasn't until
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: you put like a really bright spotlight that you realized
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: just how big it was, like the size of Costcos
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: and Walmarts and and even bigger in some cases.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: That's wild because they were also talking about in the
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: little YouTube documentary that I watched that it would flood
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: a lot of times and then all the people's stuff,
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: which I don't really know how much valuable things actually
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: could possibly have down there, but it all gets destroyed.
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 15:06
  Speaker 4: A really funny story, not to get derailed from what
• 15:09
  Speaker 4: we're talking about, was my wife was working for a
• 15:14
  Speaker 4: construction company I'll leave unnamed at the time, but she
• 15:18
  Speaker 4: got an emergency call one day and a gentleman that
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: worked just under her had equipment, heavy equipment fall into
• 15:29
  Speaker 4: a tunnel. And this was right on the Vegas Strip.
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: And you know, it's what was really funny about this
• 15:37
  Speaker 4: is I had just talked to her. I had This
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: was years ago. I had gotten off the phone with
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: John Lear, the late great John Lear, and he was
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: telling me the location of one tunnel that would be
• 15:49
  Speaker 4: now under where the Aria is, like city center, and
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: he was telling me exactly where it was and what
• 15:57
  Speaker 4: tunnels it connected to, and he basically under his breath said,
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: like people are going to start finding these because of
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: all the construction. And then literally that same week, this
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: guy called with an emergency call. What do we do?
• 16:10
  Speaker 4: We've lost equipment that's fallen into a tunnel. We don't
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: know who built the tunnel, it looks old, it doesn't
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: show up on the maps or the schematics. What do
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: we do? She told them who to call, and they
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: basically said, rebuild it the way you found it, because
• 16:25
  Speaker 4: they didn't have any info on it either. And that's
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: kind of how Vegas is. Salt Lake City, Utah, where
• 16:32
  Speaker 4: I grew up, has like wild tunnel lore as well.
• 16:36
  Speaker 4: There used to be all kinds of tunnels leading out
• 16:39
  Speaker 4: from Temple Square, the LDS Temple, going in all directions.
• 16:43
  Speaker 4: And back then there was a mall across the street
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: called the Crossroads Mall, and they claimed a lot of
• 16:48
  Speaker 4: this reptilian stuff at the Crossroads Mall and they rebuilt that,
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: renamed it, and I remember when they knocked it down,
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: there were so many levels underground that you could see
• 16:59
  Speaker 4: from the stre but they rebuilt it and they called
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: it the Gateway, which isn't much better from a conspiracy perspective.
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: But yeah, there's all kinds of wild reptilian lore going
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: into the tunnels under Salt Lake City, Utah. And I
• 17:14
  Speaker 4: remember I went to the Pie Hotel, a very old
• 17:18
  Speaker 4: hotel that's miles away from Temple Square, and they took
• 17:22
  Speaker 4: us down into these tunnels that they called the catacombs,
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: and they told us, you know which way to go
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: if you wanted to head towards Temple Square. So I
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: don't know how far and vast these tunnel systems are.
• 17:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so weird, Yeah, go ahead, yeah, yeah, just quickly.
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: I remember I read an article in the the Troglodytes
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: of Las Vegas, and I remember seeing photographs of almost
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: like apartments, you know, like an apartment unit they would
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: build out of palettes and stuff, and they had couches
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: and they would boot leg electricity and all, and it
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: was just like a like an underground city like you
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: see in some sort of dispotopian movie. Yeah.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: I mean, and it's not completely off topic, because I
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: think that might be, you know, you know, speaking of
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: like tunnels and stuff, that might be some how some
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: of these people like go missing, like they get into
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: some of these tunnels, like it's said in the catacombs
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: in Paris, like you can just get completely lost in
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: there if you don't know where you're going, and you'll
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: never be found. It's so vast and so deep. And
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: it's just strange that how all these like cities are
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: just built on top of like miles and miles of tunnels.
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: Freaking weird. It's almost like some kind of military thing
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: going on. But what we're here for today is to
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: talk about this gentleman named Stephen Quebecci. And I'm just
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: going to give an overview of this case, which is
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: probably the most fascinating missing person's case I've ever read about.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: So then give both of your guys's thoughts because I
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: sent you both this article of this gentlemen that went missing.
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: So Stephen KUEBACKI was a college student. He was going
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: to college to be a doctor. He was actually in
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: his final year of schooling. But in nineteen seventy eight,
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: Stephen Kuebaki went across country skiing on the frozen over Lake, Michigan.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: The lake had been frozen over. He went hiking up
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: there and when he didn't return, his dad then filed
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: a missing person's report. The police investigated the area where
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: he reportedly went missing. They found his snowmobile, his skis,
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: his polls, his skiing polls, and his backpack, which I
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: find really odd. And after an extensive search, the search
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: and rescue teams got involved and they had determined that
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: the Stephen Kuebaki must have fallen into one of the
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: deep caverns in the Eye and then drowned, though there
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: wasn't any evidence of this. They just found all of
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: his stuff. His family and his friends went through the
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: morning process of his death. His college even held a
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: memorial and they gave him a diploma in his absence.
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: He was a very well liked individual. He didn't have
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: any mental issues or mental problems that we know of.
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: But the most interesting part about this story is that
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: fifteen months later, a man in Massachusetts picked up a
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: hedgehiker who asked to be taken to the nearest pay phone.
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: This was Stephen Kubacki, right.
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: He told his.
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: Family, his friends, and the media that he had woken
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: up in a nearby field, he was wearing clothes that
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: he didn't recognized, and that he had had no recollection
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: of what had happened to him over the past fifteen
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: months beforehand before he went missing up on Lake Michigan.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: And this story kind of just faded out of faded
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: into obscurity really because mister Cubaki claimed that he didn't
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: remember any of it and where he had been the
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: past fifteen months. So what do we make of this case, gentlemen.
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: Well, there's a lot to unpack here, and I kind
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: of did a deep dive onto Actually it's doctor Kubaki.
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: Now he has a PhD in psychology that he got
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: from the University of New Mexico, And you know, there,
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: I did a deep dive and I found a very
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: good series of articles written by a woman named Ellen
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: killerin back in twenty nineteen, some really good information. Yeah,
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: developed a chronology of basic Kebaki's claims and his academic
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: efforts and all of that, and then it went to
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: his actual website. And there's if you start to put
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: all of these three things together, his story, his current story,
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: a recent interview he did in twenty twenty three, just
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: last year, and then the reporting like you just referred
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: to the article you sent to us and ms kill
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: Arian's stuff. It kind of starts to paint a picture,
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: you know, and you can draw some potential conclusions out
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: of that, which you know, I'll go into a little
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: bit later, some things that seemed dispary it at first,
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: but if you start putting the pieces together, kind of
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: paints a picture that may or may not be as
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: mysterious as people think. Ryan, what do you.
• 22:53
  Speaker 4: Think, brother, Yeah, this is I have to agree that
• 22:59
  Speaker 4: these things, these things happen. And you know, when you
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: deep dive into this stuff, you find other cases much
• 23:09
  Speaker 4: like we had described in Vegas with the underground tunnels.
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: There was a guy in Vegas known as Kenny Veach
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: who was a hiker and kind of went out in
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: the wilderness similar to Kubaki, and this was more recent.
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: And what was wild is he found something he called
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: the M Cave. It was shaped in the form of
• 23:32
  Speaker 4: an M. And he went inside and or I'm sorry,
• 23:36
  Speaker 4: he got close to it and he could hear voices
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: inside of it in strange colors, and he was scared
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: for his life and ran off, and he went back
• 23:47
  Speaker 4: due to internet and trolling and YouTube, and he still
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: has YouTube videos of this M Cave and him hiking
• 23:54
  Speaker 4: out to it. But he was urged to go back
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: and go into the cave, you know, it in the
• 24:01
  Speaker 4: middle of the Mojave desert, and all kinds of people
• 24:04
  Speaker 4: speculated all kinds of things, and he as well went
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: missing and has not been found. And it was a
• 24:12
  Speaker 4: similar case with like the ski pole. People found his
• 24:16
  Speaker 4: cell phone, they found his car, but he was nowhere
• 24:19
  Speaker 4: to be seen. But when you really start to pick
• 24:22
  Speaker 4: some of these things apart, there are some interesting coincidences
• 24:28
  Speaker 4: and possibilities that make you wonder if there might be
• 24:31
  Speaker 4: a more rational explanation.
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: Well, what's weird about this is whenever he came back,
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: we're talking about Stephen Quebaci here. Whenever he came back,
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: he had a backpack full of items he claimed that
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: he had no idea how he got. He supposedly had
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: like maps of the western part of the United States
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: with him that he didn't recognize or know how he got.
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: And then the other question is is if he was
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: just going to like disappear and just you know, run off,
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: he wasn't you know, happy with his life like some
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: people have kind of theorized it he was doing, then
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: why did he just leave all of his stuff up
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: on Lake Michigan. It didn't really make any too much sense,
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: like you would think if you were just going to
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: I guess maybe to make it more believable that he
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: like maybe just trying to my fake is that I
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: don't know my fake is done or whatever. But it's
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: just interesting that if that was the case and he
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: just wanted to kind of run away and not have
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: anybody know where he was and everyone think that he's dead,
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: then why didn't he take any of his stuff with him?
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a good question. Now this was in nineteen
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: seventy eight. Now I started college in nineteen eighty three,
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: so not too far after this. And you know what
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: we have to remember is you didn't have the Internet,
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: you didn't have the you didn't have phones. You didn't
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: have unless you work for the government or a large
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: agency access to computer time. Darpainnet was about the only
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: big network where all of these computers were linked. You
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: didn't have, like I said, cell phones. You could still
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: go up to the airport and walk right up to
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: the gate and buy your tickets with cash using an
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: assumed name. And if you remember back in the case
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: when they found his two skis neatly placed side by side,
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: that the two poles neatly placed in the snow, which
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: does not indicate somebody who fell in a crevasse, and
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: the backpack placed very neatly on top of the skis.
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: The only piece of ID that was found in the
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: backpack was a bill from his dentist, So it sounds
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: like maybe his driver's license and any other you know,
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: stuff you know, he might have taken with them. So
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: it's you know, it's one of those things that back then,
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: and I actually have a book in my library written
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: during that time period on how to dis peer, how
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: to go and to a cemetery find an infant that
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: died you know young, go to the court of the
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: Court of Records, gets their birth certific and then use
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: that to establish an entirely new identity. So, you know,
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: it's one of those things that you know, trying to
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: look at it through the twenty first century optics of
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: how could somebody go missing? Back then, it was pretty easy,
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: you know, you could just you know, tune out and
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: never be heard from again. Yeah, and then this book.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: It's also interesting too that whenever he got back fifteen
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: months later, he then claimed that why would he claim
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: that he didn't remember the fifteen months prior.
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: That's that's where the story unravels. That's where the House
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: of Cards start gingerly coming apart. In his interview in
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty three, if you go to his personal website,
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: which is Stephenkoubaki dot com, he talks about a book
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: that he has co written with Dylan Warrels, and he
• 28:02
  Speaker 3: says he will not discuss what happened during those months,
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: but he does give some interesting things that he said
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: that they will find in the book. And like I said,
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: this is straight from his website. A revolutionary organization. Now
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: you have to remember this was just a few years
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: after Patty Hurst was kidnapped by the Symbonese Liberation Army.
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: He mentions a idealistic terrorist in training named Nathan T. Stanfield,
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: spiritual experiences, hallucinogenic drugs. Oh where else have we heard
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: about hallucinogenic drugs that make people, you know, forget their
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: place in society. I think the thing called MK something,
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: What was that? I don't know. I don't recall alternative realities.
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: And last, but not least, the French Foreign Legion. Now
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: he says these are things that will all bear during
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: the narrative in his books that have to with those
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: missing fifteen months. So you know, it's just kind of
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: a big, big question mark on what exactly happened. And
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: now that he has a degree of recollection years later,
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: you know, many many years later, to the point where
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: he can actually recall it and put it into a book.
• 29:17
  Speaker 3: So yeah, you take that for what it's worth. I
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: think it's very interesting that he now seemed to have
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: some kind of sharp recollection and it's not what you
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: would think. It's like this, you know, hocinogenic drugs in
• 29:29
  Speaker 3: the French Foreign Legion and you know revolutionary groups in
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: the US. Is it's just all very odd.
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: That is really strange. Maybe he didn't actually remember when
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: he got back and then little things started kind of
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: coming back to him, but he's not one hundred percent
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: sure on it, so he can't really say exactly what
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: it was. I kind of like a little little fragments
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: of things that happened. But then it's like, well, how
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: did he get to being alone out on Lake Michigan
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: skiing to being drugged and put into some kind of program,
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: some kind of mk ultra program. That's that would be
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: the strange thing with the CIA just be out there
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: waiting for him to go on the skiing trip to
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: like capture.
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: Him or whatever.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: Did you did you notice anything about like weird weather anomalies? Uh?
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: In the search for him? Were there any strange because
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: that seems like we've talked about it several times. I
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: think me and Ryan and both me and Trey have
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: talked about the weird weather anomalies that happened whenever these
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: people go missing and normally like calls off the search.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: Was there anything like that in your research that you
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: found on this guy?
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: No, not anything in particular. There were several helicopters and
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: you know, quite a the search apparently it was a
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: lot bigger than the media originally let on. It was
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: a huge search. Now you got to remember this, Uh
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: this guy went to uh my notes out here, Deerfield Academy.
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: Deerfield Academy is an extremely exclusive prep school and boarding
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: school in Deerfield, Massachusetts. I mean like extremely exclusive. So
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: you know, if you had this guy go missing his family,
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: even though this was in another state, could put a
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: lot of influence, you know, on doing a massive search.
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: But I remember reading about the weather and it seemed
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: like the search was you know, reasonable, the weather wasn't awful.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: That there were actually a man and a woman cited
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: the day before taking photographs that the man was having
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: his photograph taken by a long, dark haired woman adjacent
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: to where he went missing. So I thought that was odd.
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: And it was clear enough that the snowmobilers saw his
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: skis and equipment out on the ice. So but you
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: have to also remember this is right at the point
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: of what they call the Michigan Triangle, you know, which
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: has you know, strange ships and all kinds of weird
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: stuff that goes on in that part of the part
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: of the world.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for people that are just joining in, we're talking
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: about Stephen Quebaki is a gentleman that went missing in
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: nineteen seventy eight skiing up in Lake Michigan, and when
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: he didn't return, his dad filed a missing person's report.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: The police investigated the area. They found they found his snowmobile,
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: he found his skis, his polls, and his backpack and
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: they did an extensive search. Like Trey was just mentioning
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: for the student, the search and rescue team said that
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: it's possible that he fell through the ice and that
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: he had drowned underneath the ice on Lake Michigan. And
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: then fifteen months later, he is then picked up by
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: a hitchhiker who asked to him to be taken to
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: the nearest payphone, and it was Stephen Quebaki, and he
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: told his friends, his family in the media that he
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: didn't remember the last fifteen months. A lot of strange
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: things were found in his backpack. He had clothes on
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: that he didn't recall how he got his clothes. He
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: had maps in his backpack. Was there anything else that
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: was strange in his backpack that he had that he
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: didn't remember having?
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: Tray, Yeah, he had forty dollars. He had a new
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: set of clothes that he was wearing that were not
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: his he had a T shirt from a marathon runt
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: that was ran in Wisconsin. And the thing that I
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: thought was the most intriguing is he had an entirely
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: new set of spectacles. His glasses were different, So you know,
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: I don't know if you could just walk into an optometrist,
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: you know, without any id back, then you probably could
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: and just get a new set of spectacles. So he was,
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: you know, actually involved in things. There were certain think
• 33:56
  Speaker 3: if I recall, right, certain pieces of pocket litter, you know,
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: receipts and junk in his backpack that made it look
• 34:01
  Speaker 3: like he had jumped around the jumped around different places.
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: And I'm trying to see how I can find this
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: in my notes. I think it was like Chicago in California,
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: and you know, let's see, he had a backpack that
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: with maps, hitchhiking signs meaning receipts and stuff making it
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: look like he traveled through Sacramento, San Francisco, a Reno, Chicago.
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: In Utah, he had forty dollars in cash, new glasses,
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: new sneakers, and a T shirt from a marathon in Wisconsin.
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: But his car was found as well, right because he
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: drove up to the lake Michigan. His car was found,
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: so I don't maybe someone else picked him up or something. Ryan,
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: what do you think.
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: Do you know of any other.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: Cases where people have you just mentioned there's several cases
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: that are sort of like this, But is there any
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: other cases where people have gone missing and then reappeared
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: after a long period of time? The only one I
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: can really think of, which is a missing four one
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: one Missing persons, which was I think it was in
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: the second one, maybe the either the first Missing for
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: one one documentary or the second one where the kid
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: went missing, uh and he like traveled all through like
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: fifteen miles and went through Barbois fences and everything is
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: that eventually found them face down in the snow. But
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: I don't think that that was that long of amount
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: of time between those. I think it was maybe like
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: a day or two. You know of any other instances
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: of people going missing and then reappearing after a long
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: amount of time?
• 35:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it is. It's not, you know, un familiar territory
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: to have these stories, and sort of like Trey has alluded,
• 35:57
  Speaker 4: when you go prior to the internet period to the
• 36:00
  Speaker 4: cell phone period, there's a lot more of them. That
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: story of Kenny veach with the m cave is kind
• 36:05
  Speaker 4: of unique because it's it's cell phone era, it's Internet era.
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: But yeah, some of them are absolutely wild. There's the
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: legend of the Zenetti train, which was a train on
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: its maiden voyage carrying I believe one hundred and four passengers,
• 36:23
  Speaker 4: which never emerged out of a tunnel in Italy, and
• 36:27
  Speaker 4: then the train was seen in Mexico in the eighteen
• 36:30
  Speaker 4: forties and a lot of paranormal investigators and researchers have
• 36:35
  Speaker 4: spent years searching the evidence. But it's really, you know,
• 36:39
  Speaker 4: unique because there's a bit of a bit of substance there.
• 36:44
  Speaker 4: But prior to cell phones, prior to internet, it's difficult.
• 36:49
  Speaker 4: This particular train, it was the maiden voyage, so everybody
• 36:54
  Speaker 4: was new, you know, which there was a lot of
• 36:56
  Speaker 4: chaos and confusion, basically offering free ride for basically one
• 37:01
  Speaker 4: hundred passengers, and the train was going from Rome to
• 37:06
  Speaker 4: Milan and it was scheduled to pass through this new,
• 37:10
  Speaker 4: brand new half mile long tunnel in the Lombard Mountains
• 37:15
  Speaker 4: and it entered one side. People saw it, it just
• 37:18
  Speaker 4: didn't come out the other side. And then being seen
• 37:22
  Speaker 4: in Mexico in the eighteen forties and people talking about it,
• 37:26
  Speaker 4: talking about people speaking a strange language, wearing different clothing.
• 37:31
  Speaker 4: The legend kind of grows. That's the problem is it
• 37:34
  Speaker 4: grows and it gets more elaborate, you know, every time
• 37:36
  Speaker 4: somebody tells it. Over time, more details are added. And
• 37:41
  Speaker 4: with this Stephen Kubaki case, I find that when these
• 37:46
  Speaker 4: things take place, not to say that there isn't anything
• 37:48
  Speaker 4: anomalist it doesn't happen out there in the world, because
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: I think we're all of the opinion that very much
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: this is possible. That you know, there are technologies, there
• 38:00
  Speaker 4: are anomalous electromagnetic frequencies and terrestrial magnetics which can occur,
• 38:07
  Speaker 4: and that you know, portals are a thing. I mean,
• 38:10
  Speaker 4: many cultures have talked about them for millennia. But but
• 38:13
  Speaker 4: you have to really kind of go through these cases
• 38:16
  Speaker 4: carefully because it's easy to get sucked into them.
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: This one is just the strangest one that I it's
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: so hard to put your finger on it. Like a
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: lot of the other cases that me and Trey and
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: the I've looked up and looked into, I've been able
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: to really find a solid explanation, like the the out
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: left Pass incident. You can put a solid explanation on that.
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: You can put a solid explanation on the nineteen ninety
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: three Corvinia incident. You can put a solid explanation on
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: a lot of this stuff. You can even put a
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: solid explanation on the Yuba County five. That mean Trey
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: did an episode on last time. This one though, it's
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: so weird, but.
• 39:04
  Speaker 3: Let me throw some stuff out there, if I may.
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: I don't want to act like I'm monopolizing all of this.
• 39:09
  Speaker 3: I just yeah, I'm one of those researcher guys, and
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I'm going to burst, you know if
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: I don't get this out. So, you know, so let's
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: go back and take a look at the environment. You know,
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: not only the physical environment, but this sociological environment that
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: he lived in. Is he was a very wealthy came
• 39:26
  Speaker 3: from a wealthy family. He was going to a very
• 39:28
  Speaker 3: small Christian liberal arts school there in Michigan, and he
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: they talked to his roommate, or not a roommate, but
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: one of his classmates, and it was really interesting because
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: they said that he was into dungeons and dragons. Now,
• 39:50
  Speaker 3: there's nothing wrong about being into dungeons and dragons. Okay,
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: I played Dungeons and dragons in high school and a
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: little bit later. But during his twenty twenty three interview
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: as sixty eight year old adult, he admitted that he
• 40:03
  Speaker 3: was so much into what he called J. R. Tolkien,
• 40:06
  Speaker 3: i e. Dungeons and Dragons, that his group actually wore
• 40:11
  Speaker 3: hoods and capes around that they were, you know, that
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: kind of fringy, kind of avant garde, you know, dungeons
• 40:20
  Speaker 3: and dragons fantasy group. And when they interviewed some of
• 40:24
  Speaker 3: his classmates, is it was said that he hung out
• 40:29
  Speaker 3: with a weird group and it was so strange that
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: when they interviewed the dean of students during the investigation,
• 40:37
  Speaker 3: is he actually said that he hung around it with
• 40:41
  Speaker 3: about twenty quote unquote weird people. Okay, in his his
• 40:48
  Speaker 3: world was so strange and so opposite of what this
• 40:52
  Speaker 3: conservative Christian college was, that he lived off campus. You know,
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: he was kind of, you know, wasn't you know, lock
• 41:02
  Speaker 3: stock in step with the uh, you know, the Christian
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: worldview of this very conservative college. As I said before
• 41:09
  Speaker 3: the day before his disappearance, uh in this uh Tillerin
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: did an excellent job of getting a copy of the
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: police report for this, uh, this disappearance is there was
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: a young man who is climbing across the jagged eyes
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: because in Lake Michigan the ice will be pushed up
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: against the shore and calls big jagged you know ice
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: cliffs and stuff like that. A young black haired, petite
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: girl was taking picture of a young man climbing along
• 41:37
  Speaker 3: these crags there on Lake Michigan. The next day, a
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: young man ski poles, backpack, uh, and skis are found
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: in that same general location. And this is where the
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: whole thing starts to unravel a little bit, is uh.
• 41:55
  Speaker 3: People at that time, some of them believe that he
• 41:59
  Speaker 3: actually or illustrated the whole thing. And there wasn't much
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: of an uproar on the campus when he disappeared. There
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: wasn't a candle light visual, there wasn't a you know,
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: a outpouring of support you know for his family and
• 42:13
  Speaker 3: everything at the university. And I remember, you know, we
• 42:16
  Speaker 3: had a guy get murdered when I was in university
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: and there was out for him. So remember that. So
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: we had the day before somebody taking photographs of a
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: young man. Now he was known to have several girlfriends,
• 42:29
  Speaker 3: but they were in either Germany, because he did spend
• 42:32
  Speaker 3: some time as a student studying in Germany in France.
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: So you know, I don't know if you're a bespectacle
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: d and d hood wearing guy was much of a
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: ladies guy in Europe. I just don't know. I know
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: that's not the way it was when I was in university.
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: But apparently he had interactions with females, perhaps maybe from
• 42:53
  Speaker 3: that same environment, with that same worldview. There's an entry
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: in the report, the police report about a female student
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: who's his name has been redacted, so it's not clear
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: really who she was that may have been at that
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: lake shore or with somebody else. This female stopped going
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: to classes around the time that Kubaki vanished. Within two
• 43:16
  Speaker 3: or three weeks, she had left the campus and had
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: gone to live with an aunt in Grand Rapids, Michigan.
• 43:22
  Speaker 3: She had been deeply distraught when he went missing, extremely distraught,
• 43:27
  Speaker 3: so distraught she left college in a threatened to take
• 43:31
  Speaker 3: her own life because of this, leaving a suicide note
• 43:34
  Speaker 3: for her roommate tied directly back to the Kabaki disappearance.
• 43:40
  Speaker 3: So when I start putting all of this together, is
• 43:43
  Speaker 3: you have a kind of outsider breaking traditional convenience out
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: of very conservative Christian college. You have a female about
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: he goes missing. You have a female at about the
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: same time that becomes extremely distraught at him going missing,
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: threatens suicide, and mysteriously disappears to live with an aunt
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: in grad Grand Rapids, Michigan during the seventies. And the
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: guy disappears and comes back fifteen months later. Fifteen months
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: is a few months past nine months. So do you
• 44:18
  Speaker 3: see where I'm heading. It's possible that she he may
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: have impregnated this female. She was at a conservative Christian college.
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: She left, went back to live with her aunt to
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: have the baby or aboard it. And he was so
• 44:33
  Speaker 3: embarrassed because of his strict, affluent family back in Massachusetts
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: that he took off and disappeared for fifteen months, well
• 44:46
  Speaker 3: after a possible baby would have been born.
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: That is putting the detective and the investigative hat on
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: trained him.
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: So I don't get to do any I don't get
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: to do it anymore professionally. So whenever something rolls across
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: my desk and I get a chance to stretch the
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: old investigative muscles, I really unfortunately dig into it.
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: That's great, I mean that sounds highly plausible. But then
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: but then two, why after all these years, like if
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: that was really the case, I mean, how many years
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: ago was that. That'd have been eighty ninety to then,
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: like forty over forty years ago, Like why not come
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: out and be like, hey, this is what happened. Obviously
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: no one would care at this point.
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: If you know, I've got I've got a theory for
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: that too, is if you go back and you look
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: at his chronology, chronological list of education. Okay, he jumped
• 45:45
  Speaker 3: around in universities. He got his degree in German from
• 45:50
  Speaker 3: Hope College. He got his MA and linguistics from University
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: Ohio University in Massachusetts. He taught German to our linglist
• 45:59
  Speaker 3: to the Audi Arabian National Guard back in the early eighties.
• 46:05
  Speaker 3: He got his clinical psychology PhD at the University of
• 46:08
  Speaker 3: New Mexico in nineteen ninety, so he was doing pretty well.
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: He was, you know, pretty respected. He actually, nineteen ninety
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: to ninety two, he had a two year internship in
• 46:21
  Speaker 3: clinical psychology at Dartmouth Medical School. He did his PhD
• 46:25
  Speaker 3: dissertation and it was quote called Comparing Values and Methods
• 46:29
  Speaker 3: of Cognitive behavioral and psychodynamic therapies. So the man clearly
• 46:34
  Speaker 3: was an academian. In ninety two to ninety eight, he
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: was a professor in Laramie, Wyoming. And this is where
• 46:40
  Speaker 3: things take an interesting turn. Is next. From nineteen ninety
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: eight to two thousand and one, he was the director
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: of clinical training at the airs Errogacy School of Professional Psychology.
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: This is a for profit university that was not accredited
• 46:58
  Speaker 3: by the APA, quite shady. A matter of fact, they
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: had to be closed down because of improper dealing with finances.
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: So then he moves to a place called Bastier University
• 47:10
  Speaker 3: and was the chair of the Department of Psychology. Now
• 47:13
  Speaker 3: this is a very new age university and is not
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: very well respected in the community. So then two thousand
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: and five to the present, he goes into private practice
• 47:24
  Speaker 3: for adults and children and is also a writer. So
• 47:31
  Speaker 3: here the man is doing. He's sixty eight years old,
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: he's doing his private practice. I don't know how much
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: of a next ay he has built up. And then
• 47:41
  Speaker 3: all of a sudden, at about retirement age, I'm going
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: to put out a book. I'm going to get a
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: co author, and I'm going to write this book, and
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: I'm going to make it all mysterious and tell people
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to talk about what happened during those
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: fifteen months, but if you buy my book, it's an there.
• 48:01
  Speaker 3: Is he getting ready for retirement? Is this is this
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: a way of possibly padding his meager U income as
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: a retirement?
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: Well you think, Ryan, do you think this was a
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: plot to get rid of his uh, to kind of
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: disappear in this pregnancy that would have been frowned upon
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: at the time, because it kind of I would imagine
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: it would have been really frowned upon in the especially
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: like in that day and age if you go and
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: being at a college, a Christian college and impregnating someone
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: without being married and all the Christian values? Or is this, uh?
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: Is this a time travel thing? Ryan? Was it an
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: alien abduction like a lot of people saying that that
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: a're talking about in the chat right now. Or was
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: it a c I a MK ultra program?
• 48:58
  Speaker 4: You know, I think reported by the evidence, and I
• 49:02
  Speaker 4: understand that he is. He's much like Tery says, he's
• 49:07
  Speaker 4: trying to kind of put it out there. He has
• 49:09
  Speaker 4: this way of putting it out there hypothetically alluding to
• 49:16
  Speaker 4: the fact that there might be some time travel involved
• 49:20
  Speaker 4: or some missing time, and I get that. I'm not
• 49:27
  Speaker 4: that's not to say that this is an impossibility, but
• 49:31
  Speaker 4: the fact is it really to me, it really has
• 49:34
  Speaker 4: like this air of like Forrest Gump with missing time.
• 49:40
  Speaker 4: You know, he's he's he's moving around, he's going different places.
• 49:45
  Speaker 4: There's evidence of that he's on this adventure, but then
• 49:49
  Speaker 4: he doesn't remember or he alleges not to remember the adventure,
• 49:53
  Speaker 4: and it's it's it's very different than other cases where
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: it's like I went into the future or I went
• 50:02
  Speaker 4: into the past and this is what I saw, so
• 50:06
  Speaker 4: some aspects are very different. So I have it's it's
• 50:11
  Speaker 4: difficult to chalk this up to time dilation. And of
• 50:16
  Speaker 4: course Einstein's theory of special relativity states that you know,
• 50:22
  Speaker 4: time is relative specifically to an observer, but he doesn't
• 50:27
  Speaker 4: even take the position of being an observer. So it's
• 50:32
  Speaker 4: it's I don't know. This is one that it really
• 50:35
  Speaker 4: reminds me of like a dude where's my car meets
• 50:40
  Speaker 4: Forrest Gump. He doesn't know what happened, but it happened
• 50:44
  Speaker 4: to him, and so I haven't read the book. Has
• 50:48
  Speaker 4: anybody gotten anything out of that?
• 50:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not published yet. He's apparently, based on his
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: web page as of today, he's still shopping for a publisher.
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: And it's it's really fun because you go to his
• 51:00
  Speaker 3: website and he already has a list for for podcasters,
• 51:05
  Speaker 3: you know, like things that you can talk about during
• 51:07
  Speaker 3: podcast interviews, and he's casting that net out there. So
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: it's just it's it's very oddient. Like I said, mine
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: is just a theory that's just you know, based on
• 51:16
  Speaker 3: the data. I that's a hypothesis. I'm not saying that's
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: what happened, but it could be an explanation.
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: I think it's a very good hypothesis that took a
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: lot of detailed research and discovery on. This is his website,
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: Stephen Kuebaki pH d well Stephen Kuebaki dot com, And
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: uh yeah, I guess he's he's And it does make
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: sense that because that's something that you would do at
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: the end of your you know, the end of retirement,
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: when you're just kind of wanting to screw off and
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: not really do anything. I'll just write this, I'll just
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: write this book and make it all mysterious. I mean,
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: what does he have to lose at that point? I mean,
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: he's was sixty some years old. How old does he trainst.
• 52:05
  Speaker 3: He's sixty eight. Now the opposite side of that coin
• 52:09
  Speaker 3: is perhaps something very strange did happen to him that
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: could be perceived by his colleagues, peers in the public
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: as indicative of mental illness. So it would not bode
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: well for him as a practicing clinical psychologist to print, write, print,
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: and publish a tone basically throwing signs of mental illness
• 52:32
  Speaker 3: out there. That would not be a career enhancer. I
• 52:34
  Speaker 3: would imagine, you know, I know that you know, probably
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: wouldn't go over too well. And you know my former career,
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: so you know, maybe all of this strange stuff did happen.
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: And the reason he's not publishing previously is he wanted
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: to wait until the end of his career so there
• 52:49
  Speaker 3: would be no professional repercussions. I mean that's another possibility.
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes sense. I mean then if this girl
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: really well was kind of involved as well, then she
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: could have traveled up there with him to Lake Michigan,
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: and then he left his car behind and then hopped
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: in her car, yeah, and dipped out. But then why
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: why make all the stuff about the LSD and the
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: in the MK Ultra and like time.
• 53:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the weird thing is is he didn't talk about
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: it for years and years and years and years and
• 53:28
  Speaker 3: years and now you know, and I suggest you go
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: listen to the interview. It's really interesting. It's on another podcast,
• 53:36
  Speaker 3: and I'm not going to mention the podcast unless you
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: are okay with it, but it's, uh, you know, it's
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: it's really interesting that you know, he talks about this
• 53:43
  Speaker 3: stuff and now some of it, uh you know, starting
• 53:47
  Speaker 3: to come out, but you have to go to his
• 53:48
  Speaker 3: web page to kind of dig this data out. One
• 53:50
  Speaker 3: of the things that he told the podcaster is I
• 53:53
  Speaker 3: will not talk about what happened during those fifteen months
• 53:57
  Speaker 3: on this podcast. I will not talk about it. And
• 54:00
  Speaker 3: his his co guest was mister Quarrels, so they both
• 54:07
  Speaker 3: why are they even bringing him on If he doesn't
• 54:09
  Speaker 3: want to talk about supposedly what he experienced in those
• 54:12
  Speaker 3: fifteen months, that doesn't make any sense. That's that's really
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: strange because he talked about, you know, what happened, you know,
• 54:19
  Speaker 3: his life up before, his life afterwards, and there was
• 54:22
  Speaker 3: a whole lot of it's in the book, you know.
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: Comments migauel Hire, thank you. I posted a five dollars
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: super child I thank you very much for your contributions
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: to the show. My friend I posted on a live
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: stream of twenty six k people and told them Ryan
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: called certain certain stuff to happen. This is the only
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: way I can comment get him writer, thank you so
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: much for your contribution to the show. Really appreciate it. Yes,
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: I mean it all kind of adds up in a
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: way when you think of it, like critically in logically,
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: but then too, would you just be hopping around with
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: this pregnant girl like all over the West Coast during
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: that time, and why did he have all this stuff
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: in his backpack when you show back up.
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: Fifty Yeah, yeah, you know, I really, like I said,
• 55:16
  Speaker 3: this is just a hypothesis. This is just one of
• 55:18
  Speaker 3: many explanations that are out there. But you know, for me,
• 55:21
  Speaker 3: the you know, it kind of made sense.
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it definitely makes a lot more sense than time
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: travel or abduction or you know, alien abduction or any
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: of that stuff. Have you ever heard of like people
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: having like dreams of they're missing relatives and then they
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: have a dream of where they are and then like
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: the police couldn't find them, or the investigation team couldn't
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: find them, and then they have a dream about it
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: where they are like their location, and then they go
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: find them.
• 55:59
  Speaker 3: Ryan, is any of that ring a bell for you?
• 56:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah? That goes into like this. It's really a new
• 56:07
  Speaker 4: a new technology if you guys follow the phase which
• 56:11
  Speaker 4: Tray may be aware of this. It's an app that
• 56:14
  Speaker 4: a lot of intelligence professionals are getting these days by
• 56:19
  Speaker 4: a gentleman who was born in a Siberian scientific collaboratory
• 56:26
  Speaker 4: and he's perfected all kinds of these focused phase states
• 56:30
  Speaker 4: in like rem sleep and yeah, you can you can
• 56:34
  Speaker 4: access planes of existence that can allow more information in
• 56:42
  Speaker 4: than is usually possible. And I mean this stuff not
• 56:46
  Speaker 4: to get too wu wu, but with this particular case,
• 56:50
  Speaker 4: you know, until somebody reads the book, we really don't know, right,
• 56:53
  Speaker 4: But I think Trey might be really grasping onto like
• 56:56
  Speaker 4: the higher ground here, the more stable ground, and the
• 57:01
  Speaker 4: parts that we can nail down, which is definitely the truth.
• 57:08
  Speaker 4: Just to be Devil's advocate, I think, you know, what
• 57:13
  Speaker 4: does this mean for a whole of like paranormality and
• 57:16
  Speaker 4: time travel? Well, I think that we know, at least
• 57:22
  Speaker 4: scientists believe. I should say that according to time travel theory,
• 57:26
  Speaker 4: the faster you travel, the slower you experience time. So
• 57:33
  Speaker 4: experiments have shown this to be true. So unless it's
• 57:36
  Speaker 4: a scenario where he was just in such a slow
• 57:41
  Speaker 4: state of experiencing whatever he experienced that he doesn't remember much.
• 57:45
  Speaker 4: I think, like he said that it was like going
• 57:47
  Speaker 4: into the twilight zone. I don't want to call the
• 57:50
  Speaker 4: guy a liar, but on the other hand, he's he's
• 57:53
  Speaker 4: really not giving us a whole lot of tangible observational
• 57:59
  Speaker 4: data to make any any kind of you know, reasonable
• 58:07
  Speaker 4: explanation or come to any reasonable explanation, because there's just
• 58:12
  Speaker 4: nothing there. It's like, you can ask me these questions.
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: You can't ask me these questions. You've got to read
• 58:17
  Speaker 4: the book, and that makes it difficult until somebody reads
• 58:21
  Speaker 4: the book.
• 58:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I kind of wonder if anybody has done a
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: remote viewing session on this, you know, I'll kind of cast,
• 58:29
  Speaker 3: you know, cast some questions out there see if I
• 58:31
  Speaker 3: can find out if anybody's done that. I think it's
• 58:33
  Speaker 3: right for remote viewing, So that would be really cool
• 58:36
  Speaker 3: to see what comes out of that.
• 58:38
  Speaker 6: Well.
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: It's also interesting too, is if he did kind of
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: fake it and then you know, go off on this
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: adventure with his girlfriend and then somehow like break it
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: off with her and then until the baby's born, and
• 58:52
  Speaker 1: then went on an adventure for four months afterwards or
• 58:56
  Speaker 1: what would that be six months? Yeah, baby's born in
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: nine months six so six month afterwards. He just goes
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: off on an adventure on the West coast and then
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: runs out of money and runs out of whatever other
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: resources he has, and then his hitchhiking, and then this
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: guy picks him up and he's like, hey, take me
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: to a payphone. I got to make a call to
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: my dad so I can get out of this mess
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: that I've created. Why wouldn't he just get rid of
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: the stuff in his backpack right then? You wouldn't have
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: to create an explanation. Then you wouldn't have to say, oh,
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: I don't know about it. I don't know how I
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: got these clothes on, or where these receipts came from,
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: or where these maps came from. Just ditch it all
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: because get rid of it all. Then you don't have
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: to come up with an explanation.
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, you and I had talked about when we
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: were private messaging back and forth about the fugue state.
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: You know that when people get into a situation that
• 59:49
  Speaker 3: they can't think their way out of, you know, they
• 59:51
  Speaker 3: can't come up with a plausible plan. Is sometimes they
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: fall into what's called a fugue state and they just run.
• 59:58
  Speaker 3: You know, there's no rhyme or reason to it. They
• 59:59
  Speaker 3: just get as far away from the situation as he could.
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 3: And you know, hypothetically, you know, I have to keep
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 3: throwing that word out there. This is just a theory.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 3: If a girl had came to him and said, hey,
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 3: I'm pregnant, I'm having a baby in seven months, he said,
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 3: I don't want any part of it. I don't want
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 3: any part you know, with you. I'm done. And then
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 3: he said, okay, maybe I can throw my backpacks and
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 3: skis out on the ice and just run away as
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: far as I can using the thumb and back in
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 3: the seventies, hitchhiking was still a very viable means or
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: a person of either little means or wanting to clandestinely
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 3: travel across the country to use you know, hitchhiking was
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: still relative. I'm not going to stay safe, but it
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: was an acceptable means to get from point A to
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 3: point B.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: Man can't do that anymore. After nine to eleven. Dude,
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: No one picks up any hitchhiker anymore, ever, except also
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: the serial killers. Serial killers put a little dampening on
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: that before.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 3: Except I remember Ryan telling a story about a strange
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 3: hitchhiker clad in fur as he and his mother were
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 3: driving along one time. But that's a whole other story.
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, tell us about it, Ryan, I want to
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: know about the sitch hiker.
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 3: This is wild.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, this act been actually quite recently. We were coming
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 4: back from the Moon Lake gathering up that was held
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 4: in Altamont, Utah. And it's very strange because I had
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 4: seen this same entity or person or whatever we want
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 4: to call it with another individual, Alan Jin, who Trey knows,
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 4: and he basically picked me up for breakfast. We were
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 4: going to have some breakfast and we got to an
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 4: area known as Three Corners, and for lack of a
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 4: better word, I see a complete nude We see a
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 4: completely nude younger Native American girl I would say twenties,
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 4: jump over a fence line, run across the street in
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 4: front of us, wave and smile, and jump over the
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 4: next fence line and run into the field, no shoes,
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 4: no clothes, only had a satchel of fur and tanned
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 4: hide on and you know, I just kind of looked
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 4: at Alan and said, did you see that? And he said, yeah,
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 4: I saw it. So we went and had breakfast. Anyway,
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 4: and I've told many people about that story. But fast
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 4: forward to what happened more recently. I was with my mother,
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 4: of all people, coming back from the Moonlight Gathering conference
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 4: where I'd just spoken, and instead of going the usual
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 4: way back to space Wolf research, we went back a
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 4: slightly different way. And I had mentioned to her about
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 4: this same sighting, and I just kind of, you know,
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 4: it was in the back of our minds. I wasn't
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 4: expecting to see anything, and just north of three corners, boom,
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 4: we see this black like like a bulky black package.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 4: It looks like in the road. At first, I didn't
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 4: know if it was like someone's laundry or like a
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 4: dog that had been hit by a semi. It was
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 4: just a black bulk of matter, and as we approached
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 4: it in the vehicle, it stood up very wildly, stood up,
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 4: kind of like shaking things off. It had a leather
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 4: strap in one hand, partially clothed again, no shoes, and
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 4: as we got closer, I got the same smile and wave,
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 4: and it was the same girl, and she had red
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 4: face paint on her face this time. And I went
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 4: by so slow that, I mean, we got a really
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 4: good look. And I looked at my mom and I'm like,
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 4: that's the girl that I told you about before, and
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 4: she's like, you're kidding me. And of course my mom said,
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 4: why did you wave? And I said, I don't know.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 4: I did the first time too. I'm such a sucker.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 4: And you know, my mom tried to urge me to
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 4: turn around and go back, and I wasn't having it.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 4: I've talked to too many elders that you know, tell
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 4: you not to make eye contact, not to wave, not
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 4: to do these things. So I didn't turn back. But
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 4: if I encounter that again with someone else, I'm not
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 4: sure what I'll do. I just I'm not sure what
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 4: I'll do, but I probably won't wave.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: That is wild, dude, That is super wild. I heard
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 1: a very interesting theory of the other day watching some
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 1: YouTube shows where they're talking about how maybe the skin
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 1: walker or dog Man or whatever this entitya is like
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: has the ability to like possess animals. Have you ever
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 1: heard of them before? Where like they can like they'll
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: take a young cat or like kittens or like something
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 1: and then like put their essence into that animal and
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: then it like mutates the I don't know, I don't
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 1: really know. I didn't really think about it too much,
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 1: but I just thought that it was really interesting. And
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: there I listened to this case where this guy had
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 1: had many encounters in his neighborhood with this dog man
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 1: type creature, and he noticed that the the trash can,
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: like the dumpster right by his house like always had
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: kittens in it, like all the time. It was like
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: this place where people from all over the county and
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: the thing would come to just drop off like kittens
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: in this dumpster and here we go out there. He
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: would hear the kittens and the next day the kittens
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: would be gone. And he had many like interactions with these, uh,
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: these dogmen type creatures, and he came to the conclusion
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: that that these creatures were taking these animals, like these
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 1: super young animals. Oh no, I thought it was really interesting.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 4: Well, it's very fairly i should say, not not very
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 4: well known, but fairly well known in certain circles that
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 4: animals have a tendency to react sort of like biosensors
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 4: when these things are are around, and that can transform
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 4: their behavior significantly and get them to do things that
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 4: are very much not normal, like maybe those kittens were
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 4: I don't know, in that in that trash container for
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 4: safety or a variety of other reasons. But oddly, according
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 4: to uh my hopey elder friends, the they said that
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 4: the dmones who empowers skin walkers, manifests as a female
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 4: with red face paint. And this was something new to me,
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 4: and I thought I knew everything when it came to
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 4: shape shifters. And this is concerning because if I see
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 4: her in this dimension, according to them, it's because she's
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 4: targeting my consciousness, which that that the red face paint
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 4: has has something to do with that targeting. And of
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 4: course I took this. I was like, oh, you know,
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 4: this is this is this is great, and they were like, no,
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 4: this is not great, this is not great. So I
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 4: don't know, I don't know exactly, you know, what what
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 4: what the what?
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 3: What's up with.
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 4: The smile and the wave, especially because it doesn't seem
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 4: like an accidental encounter now that it's two people deep,
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 4: people who you know, weren't expecting to see it, and
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 4: I'm not sure why what might be happening, but it's
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 4: in close proximity to the property that you were discussing
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 4: at Space Woolf Research, and uh yeah, I guess we're
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 4: gonna find out more. But animals definitely react to these things.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 4: And that's why if you have animals around and they
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 4: start acting strangely and you have some other accidental encounter
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 4: that might be paranormal in nature, there's a very good
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 4: reality that these things could be coinciding for some reason.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: Well, it looks like we lost trays. Probably gonna come
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: back in. I don't always gone, we'll come back in.
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 1: What this reminded me of this story with the animals,
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: It almost seemed like a sacrifice. Have you seen Game
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: of Thrones? You watch Game of Thrones, Well, there's I again,
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 1: like the third or fourth season when they're out beyond
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: the Wall, and I want to call him Crowley, but
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: I think I'm just thinking Alistair Crowley. But the little
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 1: village of the man that has just nothing but daughters,
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: and every time there's no boys, there's like no men there.
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: He just has nothing but daughters. And it turns out
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: that he's taking the sons that he has with all
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: these women and he's sacrificing them to the night King
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 1: so that he can like create his army of undead.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: That's what this kind of reminded me of, like that
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: the cats were if the story is true. It's not
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 1: saying that I believe the story. I just think it's
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: an interesting story and it's fun to speculate and theorize
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 1: on if that was actually happening. It seems like some
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 1: kind of like weird sacrifice or like an animal sacrifice,
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 1: Like why are all these people just bringing large amounts
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 1: of kittens to this dumpster all the time and only
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: this dumpster?
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 4: Hm, It's freaky. And animal sacrifice has so much to
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 4: do with so many different traditions, you know, even you know,
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 4: all of the cults really, whether whether you look at
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 4: any of them, even even even the UH, even the
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 4: more popular modern day UH religions, have long and extensive
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 4: histories of different forms of animal sacrifices and burnt offerings.
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 4: So they command the attention of some of these entities
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 4: behind the veil, that's that's for sure.
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, some countries even still do like animal sacrifice out
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 1: in the open. There's trades back some countries even do
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 1: it like they'll like sacrifice like goats and sheep just
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: like out in the middle of the street, like for
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: their for their religion. I think there's like a day
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: out of every year that they're just allowed to sacrifice
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: animals in the street.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I have kind of a funny story about that.
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 3: It was a bit of a culture shock. Is I
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 3: was attending a course at can't remember, I believe it
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 3: was at the US Army Intelligence Center in school, and
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 3: I was staying in the officers dormitory and they host
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 3: a lot of foreign officers, and I remember I walked
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 3: into the uh you know in the area where they
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 3: have the communal washing machines and all, and in the
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 3: big sink, you know, big washroom sink, there was a
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 3: guted chicken. So somebody had either sacrificed the chicken, you know,
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 3: from another culture, or they had went and somehow found
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 3: a live chicken and gutted it and left the detritus
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 3: of that grizzly act there in the big water.
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: Animal sacrifice, freaking human sacrifice of the gods, like our history.
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 3: Is soult at the at the US Army Intelligence Center
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 3: and school.
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 1: What about what about they were doing it there.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 3: Yes, that's where the dormitory was.
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: Wild. Okay, if you're from another country, can you and
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: you don't have citizenship, you can't join the military, right.
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah. What they'll do is they do a lot of
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 3: exchange programs. And I remember when I was going through
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 3: the Intel school, we had actually British officers. I think
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 3: we had one officer that was might have been Colombian.
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 3: You know, you actually do have officers that will be
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 3: granted temporary clearances up to a certain point, usually not
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 3: at the top secret slash Special Compartment and Information your level,
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 3: but there'll be granted clearance is like up to secret,
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 3: and they can attend schools, uh to a point. You know,
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 3: with the US military, it's uh, there's tons of exchange
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 3: officers all over the world, both US and for.
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 1: It sounds like a covert spy program train.
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 3: Well, you know it's I'd rather not go too deep
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 3: into that, but yeah, it's it's you know, it's a
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 3: it's an old business. It's been around a while.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it makes sense. We'll send our we'll send our
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 1: exchange military people over to your country and we'll get
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 1: a little information out of you, and you can send
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: your exchange people over in our country, and that's how
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 1: it'll work. We'll play nice with each other. That's what
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: it seems like to me. I don't know, all right, gentlemen,
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: you have you guys, got anything else that you would
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 1: like to bring up? Any strange things that you're itching
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 1: to get off your chest, or strange disappearances or strange
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 1: acts or anything of high strangeness, anything been happening at
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 1: you and Tall basin of late Ryan.
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 4: You know that that would have to be the main
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 4: wild observation was that that that sighting? But I do
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 4: want to get Trey's opinion, with his background of h
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 4: you know, it's sort of along the lines of devices
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 4: and maybe even time travel a little bit there. There
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 4: is the gentleman Andrew Bastiago that has claimed that he
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 4: was part of something called Project Pagasus that he said
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 4: was a very large umbrella under DARPA of time travel,
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 4: most most likely Nikola Tesla technology. According to a lot
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 4: of the people that have researched it, the two big
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 4: parentheses booms with like a really rough power cord you
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 4: could just plug in and anyway controllable. Seems really far fetched.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 4: He's been kind of poo pooed out of a lot
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 4: of real research. But interestingly, I mean, the guy is
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 4: a real guy, and he's got real stories of when
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 4: he claims to have gone places, unlike Kubaki. But I
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 4: want to get Trey's opinion of a more recent potential
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 4: connection to a newer project Pegasus, which might be under
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 4: the same umbrella. I'm unsure, but all of these devices
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 4: in the Middle East that have been exploding, and what
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 4: his thoughts are if that might be coming out of
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 4: the same NSO group or Masad, or if this is
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 4: just a coincidence.
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 3: What do you think true? Yeah, Now let me preface this.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 3: I am out of the business, so everything I say
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 3: is merely speculation, not based on any kind of knowledge
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 3: that I had previous or have now. So got to
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 3: cover everybody's rear end.
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 6: On that.
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 3: Is going back to some of the more esoteric DARPIS stuff,
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 3: And Walter Bosley will probably feel the same way I do.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 3: When you're read into a special program, you sign an
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 3: indoctrination statement, which is basically a you will not ever
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 3: talk about this kind of statement, and if you think
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 3: that that statement will not be executed. Julian Assage, who
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 3: isn't even a US citizen release that information classified information
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 3: which wasn't even that highly classified on wiki links, and
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 3: the US government has been dogging him to the point
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 3: where he had to take refuge in the Nicaraguan embassy.
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 3: So that's to the extent that the US will go
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 3: if somebody compromises information. So you know, if anybody says, hey,
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 3: I'm going to tell you about this secret program, there's
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 3: two things. Either the program has already been declassified. They're
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 3: really risking being in a federal prison for the rest
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 3: of their life. All they're full of what my kids
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 3: used to call kaka, you know, one of those three.
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 3: So that's kind of that's the kind of the front
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 3: end of the question. The back end of the question
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 3: talking about the Israeli assassination is Placing small micro packages
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 3: of explosives in communication devices is not that uncommon for
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 3: most Sades. If you study the nineteen seventy two Munich
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 3: operation where the Black Hand are Black Black September Group
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 3: I'm sorry, assassinated Israeli athletes at the nineteen seventy two
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 3: Munich Olympics. When Mosades sent their teams out to assassinate them.
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 3: One of the mess that they'd used was breaking into
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 3: a guy's home, putting an explosive charge inside the receiver
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 3: of his telephone that was keyed to a certain tone,
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 3: and so basically they called the guy at home. He
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 3: answered and they said, you know, is this you know?
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 3: Blah blah blah. He says yes, and they spent that
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 3: tone and basically bleue half his head off. So they're
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 3: used to operations like this. The Israeli are the Hesbela
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 3: pager and walkie talkie incident. What I'm hearing through open
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 3: sources is that the pagers were actually manufactured in Taiwan
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 3: and I think Germany under a license by the Taiwanese
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 3: company that has the pagers. So you're one step away
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 3: from the original manufacturers. And my belief is either that
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 3: was a Masad front company or Mosads somehow got into there,
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 3: or they co opted this shipment from Germany to Hesbelah.
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 3: And the reason Hesbelah went to that is because Israel
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 3: was targeting their cell phones and sending missiles right on
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 3: top of their cell phones, and so they were able
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 3: to get into that the operating system of that pager
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 3: program to explode, send a circuit, activate a circuit at
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 3: a certain tone and set off the explosives. So what
• 1:19:00
  Speaker 3: they've done was was a bratmaster operation in disrupting Hesbalah
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 3: command control and communications. What we call C three is
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 3: you know a lot of these guys had the pocket
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 3: pagers in their front pockets. When you get your your
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 3: penis and testicles blown off, that sends a message. And
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 3: so now they're not trusting any of their communications devices,
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 3: and they completely cut the head off the serpent by
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 3: not allowing the brain to communicate with the rest of
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 3: the body. So I think it wasn't anything, you know,
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 3: overly esoteric. I think it was just excellent uh intelligence work,
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 3: excellent field work, and just some of the extremely spooky
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 3: stuff that MOSAD does that the only MOSAD does so well.
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 4: Great answer, Yeah, I'm I'm right there with Trey.
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 1: With Project Pegasus, sounds like a completely made up, made
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 1: up program, and a lot of these things are completely
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 1: made up to literally, the only ones that we know
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 1: about are the declassified ones or the unclassified programs. It's
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 1: the only ones that we can possibly know about. It.
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 1: If someone throws out a real program that is still classified,
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 1: they would be gone after no.
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah, with hands down yeah, and what what what happens
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 3: in that? And I'm not confirming or denying I've ever
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 3: been involved in something like this. But if a program
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 3: or information about something is accidentally discovered or figured out,
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 3: or you know, somebody has an epiphany and that word
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 3: gets back to counterintelligence agencies, you know, throughout the various services,
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 3: is that individual will be pulled into a room and
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 3: they'll be uh seated in front of a specialist and agents,
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 3: and a paper will be slid across to them called
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 3: an inadvertent disclosure statement, and it'll be and it'll say, hey, Bob,
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 3: you're a really smart guy, and you figured something out
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 3: and somebody heard you talking about what you figured out
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 3: in the cafeteria. Well, Oopsei, that information that you were
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 3: talking about in the cafeteria is classified at blah blah
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 3: blah level. Here is an agreement for you to sign.
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 3: You're saying, I accidentally found this information. It was no
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 3: fault to my own. I will never discuss it again
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 3: until I receive you authorization from the proper original classification
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 3: authority that has been downgraded to unclassified. You sign your name,
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 3: the agent signs the name is taking the oath. Everybody
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 3: goes home happy unless you talk about it, because you
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 3: basically have been told legally that that is classified information
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 3: and under US law you cannot disclose that information. And
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 3: if you will fully disclose it, you'll be getting a visit.
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 3: And it's not you know, you're not going to be
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 3: you know, have a nine milimeter glock suppress or stuck
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 3: up under your chin or anything dramatic like that. You'll
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 3: just be arrested, taken to federal court, convicted and putting
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 3: you know, prison. An example that is Robert Hanson, FBI
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 3: agent that ran the counterintelligence operations against a KGB back
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 3: in the seventies and eighties, turned out to be a
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 3: KGB double agent. He recently died, but his life after
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 3: he was arrested was in a cell at the super
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 3: Max facility in Florence, Colorado. Twenty three hours a day
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 3: he was in a cell. He saw sunlight for one
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 3: hour and that was for the rest of his natural life. So,
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 3: you know, people that go out and you come up
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 3: with these outlandish claims. And I need to reach out
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 3: to Walter because I've got some questions about some claims
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 3: that have come out here lately about the individual that
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 3: has done that. You know, are you willing to roll
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 3: those dice for me? I'm chicken. I'm not going to
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 3: roll them. You know. I like my life pretty much
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 3: the way it is now, So yeah, you have to
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 3: take come out stuff, like you said, with a grain
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 3: of salt. Certainly.
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 1: Absolutely, well, gentlemen, thanks so much for coming on. Really
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: appreciate it as a wonderful conversation. I really enjoyed it. Trey,
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 1: can you let people know where to find you online
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 1: and plug your book? I know you're writing another book currently.
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: You got a lot of projects going on. Lets me
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 1: know what's going on with you.
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you can go to Tree Hunton Research dot com.
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 3: You know, some of my stuff is there that has
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 3: at the email address which is Trey Hutton Research at
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 3: gmail dot com. And also it has a link to
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 3: my last book, which is The Metal Project Explorations into
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 3: the South Skinwalker Ranch. And if you go on Facebook
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 3: Trey Hudson Dash.
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 1: Author links to Tredy's information is in the description of
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 1: this video. Ryan, Let the people know where they can
• 1:23:36
  Speaker 1: find you and what you got going on.
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 3: Brother.
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 4: Of course, thanks for having me on today. It's been
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 4: a pleasure. Hero Paranormal. You can go to YouTube, Patreon,
• 1:23:46
  Speaker 4: or just hero paranormal dot com.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 1: Awesome, Thank you guys so much. Thanks everyone in the chat.
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 1: I really appreciate each and every single one of you
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 1: for contributing to the conversation here today. And please be
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 1: sure to hit the thumbs up button to help the
• 1:23:59
  Speaker 1: channel on the algorithm, share a subscribe, hit the bell
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 1: icon as well for our notifications, and we'll see you
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 1: guys next time. Also, let us know what you guys
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 1: think about this Stephen Kubaki incident. You think it was
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 1: time travel, you think it was aliens or do you
• 1:24:14
  Speaker 1: think more along the lines of what Trey has discovered,
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 1: which I think is an incredible research. Let us know
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 1: what you think done in the comments below. See you
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 1: guys next time.