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Hell and Gone Murder Line: Amanda Tusing (Archive Episode) · Hell and Gone: Murder Line

0:46
Speaker 1: School of Humans. Helen Got Murder Line actively investigates cold
0:52
Speaker 1: case murders in an effort to raise public awareness invite
0:55
Speaker 1: witnesses to come forward and present evidence that could potentially
0:58
Speaker 1: be further investigated by law enforcement. While we value insights
1:03
Speaker 1: from family and community members, their statements should not be
1:06
Speaker 1: considered evidence and point to the challenges of verifying facts
1:10
Speaker 1: inherent in cold cases. We remind listeners that everyone has
1:14
Speaker 1: presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.
1:17
Speaker 1: Nothing in the podcast is intended to state or imply
1:21
Speaker 1: that anyone who has not been convicted of a crime
1:24
Speaker 1: is guilty of any wrongdoing. Thanks for listening.
1:29
Speaker 2: On June fourteenth, two thousand, there was a huge storm
1:33
Speaker 2: brewing in northeast Arkansas. It had been raining heavily all
1:36
Speaker 2: day and according to local weather data, tornadoes had hit.
1:41
Speaker 2: Over one hundred trees were downed, power line were down,
1:44
Speaker 2: and homes were destroyed. Twenty year old Amanda Tussing, who
1:48
Speaker 2: went by Mandy, was hanging out with her fiance, Matt Irvin,
1:52
Speaker 2: at his apartment in Jonesboro. Amanda lived forty miles away
1:56
Speaker 2: in Dell, Arkansas, which is in Mississippi County. She lived
1:59
Speaker 2: with her father, Ed, her mother Susan, and her twin
2:02
Speaker 2: brother Andy. She also had an older brother who worked
2:05
Speaker 2: out of state. Matt did not want her to go
2:08
Speaker 2: home that night. It was about a forty five minute
2:11
Speaker 2: drive on a good day and the weather was bad,
2:14
Speaker 2: but Amanda wanted to get home, so she left Jonesboro
2:17
Speaker 2: at around eleven thirty PM, so even if she drove
2:21
Speaker 2: very slowly, she should have gotten home around twelve thirty
2:25
Speaker 2: am at the latest. Amanda told Matt she would call
2:28
Speaker 2: him from her parents' landline as soon as she got home.
2:31
Speaker 2: She did have a cell phone by the way, but
2:34
Speaker 2: her family said she never kept it charged and it
2:37
Speaker 2: was always dying. Matt never got that call by one
2:42
Speaker 2: thirty am. He was concerned, and Matt called Amanda's mother,
2:46
Speaker 2: Susan tussing and woke her up.
2:50
Speaker 3: Susan told Matt to hang on a second.
2:52
Speaker 2: She said she would check to see if Amanda was
2:54
Speaker 2: in bed, but when she went into Amanda's bedroom, she
2:58
Speaker 2: saw that Amanda was not home. This was totally unlike Amanda.
3:03
Speaker 2: Her family knew something must have happened on that road,
3:07
Speaker 2: so her dad, Ed and her brother Andy got in
3:09
Speaker 2: the car together and drove toward Dell. Meanwhile, Matt left
3:13
Speaker 2: his house in Jonesboro and started driving down Highway eighteen
3:17
Speaker 2: in the opposite direction. Their plan was they would meet
3:21
Speaker 2: in the middle and hopefully see Amanda. Somewhere along the way,
3:25
Speaker 2: Matt saw Amanda's nineteen ninety two Pontiac grand am parked
3:29
Speaker 2: under a street light. It was on the shoulder of
3:32
Speaker 2: Arkansas Highway eighteen, about a mile west of the small
3:35
Speaker 2: town of Monette. Amanda's car was on the side of
3:39
Speaker 2: the road.
3:40
Speaker 3: It looked like.
3:41
Speaker 2: It had been parked there intentionally, in other words, not
3:44
Speaker 2: like she randomly swerved over. Matt got out of his car,
3:48
Speaker 2: stepped out into the darkness, walked over and looked inside.
3:54
Speaker 2: I'm Catherine Townsend. Over the past five years of making
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Speaker 2: my true crime podcast, Helen Gone, I have learned that
4:00
Speaker 2: there is no such thing as a small town where
4:03
Speaker 2: murder never happens. I have received hundreds of messages from
4:07
Speaker 2: people all around the country asking for help with an
4:10
Speaker 2: unsolved murder that's affected them, their families, and their communities.
4:15
Speaker 3: If you have a.
4:16
Speaker 2: Case you'd like me and my team to look into,
4:18
Speaker 2: you can reach out to us at our Helen Gone
4:20
Speaker 2: murder line at six seven eight seven four four six
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Speaker 2: one four five at six seven eight seven four four six'
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Speaker 2: one four five this Is Helen gone murder.
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Speaker 4: Line matt called the.
5:22
Speaker 2: Police they met him And amanda's father out On highway
5:27
Speaker 2: eighteen by the. Car law enforcement showed up shortly after
5:31
Speaker 2: two thirty. Am at, first police were thinking maybe her
5:35
Speaker 2: car broke. Down the keys were still in the. Ignition
5:38
Speaker 2: when they started it, up the car ran. Perfectly there
5:42
Speaker 2: was also gas in the. Tank they noticed some other things.
5:45
Speaker 2: Too there was a coke can in the drinkholder that
5:48
Speaker 2: was half to three quarters full and it was still
5:51
Speaker 2: chilled with condensation on the, side.
5:54
Speaker 3: Which police believed.
5:56
Speaker 2: Indicated to them that someone had taken a drink out
5:59
Speaker 2: of that can pretty. Recently they also noticed the radio
6:03
Speaker 2: was turned To amanda's favorite station with the volume turned,
6:06
Speaker 2: down and the windshield wipers had stopped.
6:09
Speaker 3: Midwipe on the.
6:10
Speaker 2: Windshield the interior of the car did not show any
6:13
Speaker 2: signs of foul. Play amanda's stuff was, inside her cell
6:17
Speaker 2: phone and her billfold were on the passenger. Seat her
6:20
Speaker 2: cell phone was, dead but again her parents said that
6:23
Speaker 2: that wasn't necessarily a red flag because it was very often.
6:26
Speaker 2: Dead she had a habit of letting her phone run.
6:29
Speaker 2: Down and, this by the, way was back way before.
6:31
Speaker 2: Smartphones back in two, thousand cell phone reception was very
6:36
Speaker 2: spotty in those. Areas in some of those areas it still.
6:39
Speaker 2: IS i talked To amanda's, Cousin jonathan about the. Case
6:44
Speaker 2: her cousin was born After amanda, disappeared But amanda's family
6:49
Speaker 2: has never stopped trying to figure out what happened to.
6:51
Speaker 5: Her the weird things about the case is that like
6:56
Speaker 5: her car Wasn't it didn't look like somebody had like
7:01
Speaker 5: pulled her over and dragged her out of the car
7:03
Speaker 5: or anything like. That everything was like in, place but
7:06
Speaker 5: she had left all her stuff. There so people like
7:11
Speaker 5: to say, that, Like amanda would never have pulled over
7:14
Speaker 5: for no.
7:15
Speaker 2: Reason you, Know investigators and her family believed that she
7:20
Speaker 2: may have pulled over to stop for some reason or
7:23
Speaker 2: been pulled over by. Someone amanda's family and friends and
7:28
Speaker 2: volunteers came out to, search but they saw no sign
7:30
Speaker 2: Of amanda for. Days then three days, later On june,
7:35
Speaker 2: eighteenth two, Thousand Father's, day a, Couple trent And Fonda, davis.
7:40
Speaker 3: Were coming back home after a trip To.
7:41
Speaker 2: Jonesboro they drove over the twin bridges On Arkansas highway
7:45
Speaker 2: one thirty five that ran over a body of water
7:49
Speaker 2: Called Big Bay. Ditch the couple saw what they thought
7:52
Speaker 2: were some clothes floating in that. Water then they realized
7:56
Speaker 2: that they were looking at a. Body it Was Amanda.
7:59
Speaker 2: Toussing Amanda tussing's body had been. Found this was twelve
8:10
Speaker 2: miles in the opposite direction of where she was. Driving
8:14
Speaker 2: she was driving, east her body was found to the.
8:17
Speaker 2: West an autopsy revealed That amanda had water in her nasal,
8:21
Speaker 2: passages but not her. Lungs law enforcement have said publicly
8:25
Speaker 2: that they Believe amanda was dead before her body was
8:29
Speaker 2: thrown into the, water but they reportedly could not decide
8:33
Speaker 2: on a definite cause of death because it could have
8:36
Speaker 2: been a dry drowning where the victim dies of choking
8:39
Speaker 2: on the water but water never actually gets into the.
8:42
Speaker 2: Lungs AMANDA i had no visible injuries except a small
8:46
Speaker 2: bruise on the back of her. Head there were no
8:48
Speaker 2: obvious signs of sexual, assault but because she had been
8:52
Speaker 2: in the water for, days it must have been very
8:55
Speaker 2: hard to know for. Sure the police also had more bad.
8:59
Speaker 2: Luck the heavy torrential rains had washed away a lot
9:03
Speaker 2: of potential. Clues Gary, etter the original detective on the,
9:10
Speaker 2: case told Kait Regionate news quote the Medical examiner's office
9:15
Speaker 2: checked and said that she had no physical injuries other
9:18
Speaker 2: than being in the water and the impact of the.
9:20
Speaker 2: ELEMENTS i think whoever did this probably did it. Before
9:25
Speaker 2: that's What i'm, thinking due to no evidence end Quote Detective.
9:30
Speaker 2: Etter by the, way in my, opinion from what he
9:33
Speaker 2: said in, public it really does seem like he deeply
9:35
Speaker 2: cared about this. Case last year in twenty twenty, three
9:41
Speaker 2: The Craighead County Sheriff's office assigned a new detective Named
9:44
Speaker 2: David bailey to this, case and he has said that
9:48
Speaker 2: he's reviewing everything with a fresh. Eye so who Left
9:52
Speaker 2: amanda there floating in that ditch while they were figuring this?
9:56
Speaker 2: Out by the, way law enforcement did not say there's
10:00
Speaker 2: no immediate danger to the, public which is what they
10:03
Speaker 2: say a lot during these. Cases in, fact they said
10:06
Speaker 2: kind of the opposite In Mississippi. County In Craigheak, county
10:10
Speaker 2: they told women traveling alone to be careful and to
10:13
Speaker 2: take extra. Precautions Mississippi County Sheriff Leroy meadows told a
10:18
Speaker 2: local paper, QUOTE i would urge people traveling alone to be.
10:22
Speaker 2: Careful it would be wise to make sure you know
10:24
Speaker 2: who is trying to stop, you or drive to a
10:28
Speaker 2: lighted area before.
10:29
Speaker 3: Stopping end. Quote this is very good.
10:32
Speaker 2: ADVICE i just want to point out That amanda did
10:36
Speaker 2: stop under a street, light and her parents said she
10:40
Speaker 2: was very safety conscious and they had told her they
10:42
Speaker 2: had drilled it into she should only park in well
10:45
Speaker 2: lit areas late at. Night so even if she had
10:49
Speaker 2: followed that, Advice i'm not sure that it would have helped.
10:51
Speaker 2: Her amanda's car had some partial fingerprints, inside but according to,
10:57
Speaker 2: police nothing. Usable according to law, enforcement her car did
11:01
Speaker 2: not look like it had been wiped. Clean this led
11:05
Speaker 2: investigators to believe that the perpetrator probably did not get
11:09
Speaker 2: inside the. Car Detective etter said something else in that
11:14
Speaker 2: interview with the news. Channel he told, them, quote the
11:17
Speaker 2: first thing that comes to your, mind And i'm not
11:19
Speaker 2: saying it was a law enforcement, officer first thing that
11:22
Speaker 2: comes to your mind is that a law enforcement officer
11:25
Speaker 2: would know how to conceal the.
11:27
Speaker 3: Evidence end.
11:28
Speaker 2: Quote amanda's family laid her to, rest and the funeral
11:36
Speaker 2: procession was three miles. Long everyone loved this young woman
11:41
Speaker 2: who had dreams of being a, veterinarian and her father
11:45
Speaker 2: Told channel Eight news that Because amanda loved the song
11:49
Speaker 2: tie yellow ribbon around the Old oak, tree the town
11:52
Speaker 2: actually ran out of yellow ribbons because there were so
11:55
Speaker 2: many of them that had been tied to trees in her.
11:57
Speaker 2: Honor this murder brought the town together but also terrified
12:02
Speaker 2: locals all at the same. Time police did take a
12:06
Speaker 2: close look At, Matt amanda's, fiancee which is completely. Normal
12:10
Speaker 2: according To amanda's, family they got along very. Well they
12:14
Speaker 2: had occasional minor arguments about things like where he was
12:17
Speaker 2: going to go to, school but they apparently had a very,
12:20
Speaker 2: good loving relationship and were very. Happy they were supposed
12:24
Speaker 2: to get married.
12:25
Speaker 3: The next year In.
12:26
Speaker 2: June amanda's cousin said That matt did not appear to
12:32
Speaker 2: be a person of interest for.
12:33
Speaker 5: LONG i know that at the, time they obviously first,
12:39
Speaker 5: suspect you, know is always going to be the, spouse
12:44
Speaker 5: and so they questioned him and he was Really i'm
12:47
Speaker 5: pretty sure he was very, cooperative and THEN i think
12:51
Speaker 5: they ruled him.
12:52
Speaker 2: Out, Also matt was the person who Reported amanda. Missing
12:57
Speaker 2: matt told investigators he And amanda had dinner At Dixie
13:00
Speaker 2: cafe that, night the night she went, missing and later
13:03
Speaker 2: stopped at a grocery store before going back to his.
13:05
Speaker 2: Apartment one Of amanda's school teachers was able to confirm
13:09
Speaker 2: that they had seen the couple at The Dixie cafe that,
13:12
Speaker 2: night so police were able to confirm her. Activities then
13:18
Speaker 2: they went back To matt's. Apartment it was getting late
13:20
Speaker 2: and the weather was, bad And matt did not Want
13:23
Speaker 2: amanda to get on that. Road amanda still lived at
13:26
Speaker 2: home with her parents and she had a, Curfew so
13:29
Speaker 2: If amanda normally called her parents before heading, home why
13:33
Speaker 2: did she head out so late that. Night could she
13:36
Speaker 2: And matt have been. Arguing they Grilled matt. Hard they
13:40
Speaker 2: questioned him several, times but police said he was totally
13:43
Speaker 2: cooperative that he had passed polygraphs three separate. Times police
13:48
Speaker 2: also considered another possibility very early on That amanda could
13:53
Speaker 2: have been pulled over by a member of law, Enforcement.
13:56
Speaker 5: So they think it Was there's been a theory that
14:00
Speaker 5: it was someone in law enforcement that pulled her over
14:03
Speaker 5: and then got her out of the car and then
14:06
Speaker 5: took her or people think that it might have been
14:10
Speaker 5: someone impersonating law enforcement and got her.
14:13
Speaker 2: Out detectives were Processing amanda's body in the clothes that
14:17
Speaker 2: she was found in when her body was recovered from that.
14:20
Speaker 2: Ditch she was still wearing the same jeans and white
14:23
Speaker 2: GAP t shirt she had been wearing when she went.
14:25
Speaker 2: Missing her driver's license was in the front pocket of her.
14:28
Speaker 2: Jenes NOW i wondered at first if that had some
14:32
Speaker 2: kind of. Significance could that be evidence That amanda got pulled?
14:36
Speaker 2: Over but her mother said not. Necessarily she told police
14:42
Speaker 2: That amanda normally kept her driver's license like that in
14:45
Speaker 2: her front. Pocket apparently she never kept it in a
14:48
Speaker 2: purse or a. Billfold amanda was wearing her diamond engagement
14:52
Speaker 2: ring when she was, found so between that and the
14:55
Speaker 2: wallet that had been left on her, seat detectives took
14:57
Speaker 2: this as even more. Evidence the motive was obviously not.
15:00
Speaker 2: Robbery investigators Believed amanda was killed somewhere else and then
15:05
Speaker 2: thrown into the, water but the question is where and,
15:09
Speaker 2: why because the only injury they found was a bruise
15:12
Speaker 2: on the back of her.
15:13
Speaker 3: HEAD a few years After.
15:15
Speaker 2: Amanda, disappeared law enforcement gave photos to THE tv Station
15:20
Speaker 2: Regionate news and they are. Haunting you could see one
15:26
Speaker 2: of the clues that can of coke in the drink
15:28
Speaker 2: holder that was partly. Empty it was chilled with condensation
15:32
Speaker 2: on the night she. Disappeared now a lot of people
15:35
Speaker 2: have wondered if the coke can was a clue that
15:38
Speaker 2: maybe she had stopped somewhere.
15:40
Speaker 3: On the road during her.
15:42
Speaker 2: Drive it was late at, night and that is a
15:45
Speaker 2: pretty remote strip of. Highway there are only a couple
15:48
Speaker 2: of gas stations along. It police did apparently check surveillance
15:52
Speaker 2: footage from one of these convenience stores and said they
15:55
Speaker 2: did not See amanda on, it but that's not proof
15:59
Speaker 2: that she wasn't. There and someone else also brought up
16:02
Speaker 2: another interesting. POSSIBILITY i was reading a lot of online
16:04
Speaker 2: comments and they mentioned the were vending machines at a
16:08
Speaker 2: couple of these, Places so even if she didn't go,
16:11
Speaker 2: in maybe she stopped at a vending. Machine, Now matt
16:15
Speaker 2: apparently told investigators he wasn't sure if she had taken
16:19
Speaker 2: the drink from his house or, Not so that's another
16:21
Speaker 2: possibility she might have taken it from her fiance's home
16:25
Speaker 2: because she was not in the car that. Long before
16:28
Speaker 2: something stopped her on that dark stretch of. Road there
16:33
Speaker 2: was a witness who reportedly said that he saw her
16:36
Speaker 2: at a gas, station but police couldn't confirm, this and
16:40
Speaker 2: again they reportedly pulled surveillance footage and didn't see her in.
16:44
Speaker 2: IT i don't know times or, details because remember this
16:47
Speaker 2: is still an open, investigation so we don't have access
16:49
Speaker 2: to any of the case. Files in the photos that
16:53
Speaker 2: were released to the, media you can see a basketball
16:56
Speaker 2: on the. Foreboard amanda played sports in high. School she
17:01
Speaker 2: was an accomplished. Athlete there's also A bridle magazine in the.
17:06
Speaker 2: Car she was clearly excited about her upcoming wedding and
17:10
Speaker 2: probably looking at. Dresses Both amanda's parents say they believe
17:15
Speaker 2: she may have been stopped by, someone maybe someone impersonating
17:18
Speaker 2: a police, officer or that she had some kind of car.
17:21
Speaker 5: Trouble the law enforcement theory is a good, one but
17:27
Speaker 5: then there's been other people who have said maybe it
17:30
Speaker 5: was a serial killer that was just you, know passing
17:33
Speaker 5: through that came and did. It because just the evidence
17:39
Speaker 5: at the, car there was basically no evidence to go off.
17:42
Speaker 2: Of over the, years law enforcement have debated and investigated
17:48
Speaker 2: a lot of these. Theories like so many, cases this
17:52
Speaker 2: one has been the subject of several rumors over the.
17:54
Speaker 5: Years there's a ton of people in the, COMMUNITY i
17:57
Speaker 5: mean a ton of people that want this case to be.
18:01
Speaker 5: Solved and there's a ton of people who think that
18:03
Speaker 5: it's like literally like we're right there and they're they're.
18:08
Speaker 5: Close but that's just all. HEARSAY i, mean it doesn't mean.
18:12
Speaker 1: Anything but.
18:14
Speaker 5: There's people who say who swear up and down they
18:17
Speaker 5: know who did. It they just don't have, evidence enough
18:20
Speaker 5: evidence to book the.
18:21
Speaker 2: Guy the strip of road Between jonesboro And dell is pretty,
18:26
Speaker 2: remote especially back. Then it passes through a couple of
18:29
Speaker 2: small towns Like manila And Black, oak and there are
18:32
Speaker 2: only a couple of gas stations that would have been
18:34
Speaker 2: opened during that. Time over the, years a lot of
18:37
Speaker 2: people came forward with, tips but most of them led to.
18:40
Speaker 2: Nothing in two thousand and, three the sheriff And Ana,
18:44
Speaker 2: County jack McCann Of Craighead, county said that they had
18:47
Speaker 2: gotten a major tip that someone had told them there
18:51
Speaker 2: was some sort.
18:52
Speaker 3: Of note In amanda's.
18:53
Speaker 2: COFFIN i don't know if it was a confession or,
18:55
Speaker 2: information but it was apparently something that could have helped
18:59
Speaker 2: lead to the killer's. Identity amanda's body was. Exhumed there
19:04
Speaker 2: was no note or anything else inside that casket besides her.
19:08
Speaker 3: Remains to, me.
19:10
Speaker 2: This really does show how police were willing to act
19:13
Speaker 2: on any. Tip i'm sure that after going through the
19:16
Speaker 2: trauma of unearthing their daughter's, body the fact that the
19:19
Speaker 2: coffin had no evidence must have been another devastating blow
19:23
Speaker 2: For amanda's. Parents around that same, time a psychic detective
19:28
Speaker 2: rolled into town with a COURT tv show Called Haunting.
19:31
Speaker 2: Evidence i'm sure many of you know HOW i feel.
19:33
Speaker 3: About psychics on this.
19:34
Speaker 2: Podcast apparently their paranormal investigation did not provide any credible. Leads,
19:40
Speaker 2: then in two thousand and, seven an anonymous person told
19:43
Speaker 2: The sheriff's department that they had heard people allegedly Discussing amanda's,
19:47
Speaker 2: murder but nothing came to that. Either in so many
19:52
Speaker 2: of these, cases we see this over and. Over people
19:54
Speaker 2: over the years will claim either that they did it
19:57
Speaker 2: or they know someone who did.
19:58
Speaker 3: It they'll do it sometimes for their own.
20:00
Speaker 2: Reasons sometimes if they're, incarcerated they may want to impress other,
20:04
Speaker 2: inmates and the more publicity a case, has the more
20:08
Speaker 2: rumors start, flying but police were willing to listen because
20:12
Speaker 2: there was a real lack of physical evidence in this.
20:14
Speaker 2: Case there were zero suspects and no clear. Motive there
20:18
Speaker 2: was one single hair found On amanda's. Body they DID dna,
20:22
Speaker 2: testing but it turned out that it Was amanda's own.
20:25
Speaker 2: Hair The sheriff's department admitted that law enforcement was up
20:31
Speaker 2: a creek and WHAT i take from that is that
20:33
Speaker 2: they were just, stuck no forward movement on the. Case
20:37
Speaker 2: amanda's father did an interview WITH Kit channel, eight and
20:40
Speaker 2: it was. Heartbreaking he talked about the f That amanda
20:44
Speaker 2: was found On Father's. Day the reporter asked him if
20:48
Speaker 2: he was affected every Single Father's. Day he got tearful and, said,
20:53
Speaker 2: yeah but it's no different from other. Days he's affected
20:57
Speaker 2: every single day by his daughter's. Murder so police are
21:03
Speaker 2: left with a few different. Possibilities Was amanda killed by someone,
21:08
Speaker 2: random maybe someone who was just passing through the. Area
21:11
Speaker 2: detectives don't think. So they think the location of the
21:15
Speaker 2: body is a big. Clue they point out that it's
21:18
Speaker 2: near an access point that they believe only someone local
21:22
Speaker 2: would know.
21:22
Speaker 4: About but what.
21:26
Speaker 3: About a local serial?
21:27
Speaker 2: Killer several people have suggested That amanda might have been
21:37
Speaker 2: killed by someone impersonating a police. Officer, now there was
21:41
Speaker 2: one very high profile case the real rapist who was
21:44
Speaker 2: preying on women In arkansas in the late. Nineties the
21:47
Speaker 2: papers gave him the name the Blue Light. Rapist his
21:51
Speaker 2: real name Was Robert Todd. Birmingham he was convicted of
21:54
Speaker 2: raping two women in Eastern arkansas in nineteen ninety. Seven
21:58
Speaker 2: the reason he was given that nickname was because he
22:01
Speaker 2: had blue lights on top of his. Car he pulled
22:04
Speaker 2: women over and impersonated a police. Officer one Of robert's,
22:08
Speaker 2: victims a seventeen year old whose first name Was, shannon
22:11
Speaker 2: told detectives he pulled her over while she was traveling
22:14
Speaker 2: alone on a state. Highway she said at first she
22:18
Speaker 2: thought she was going to get a speeding. Ticket after
22:21
Speaker 2: he signaled for her to pull over and she, Did
22:24
Speaker 2: robert came up to the window of her car carrying a.
22:26
Speaker 2: Gun he told her to cover her face with a
22:30
Speaker 2: shirt and to get out of her, car then he
22:33
Speaker 2: forced her into his. Vehicle once he Got shannon into his,
22:37
Speaker 2: vehicle he claimed that his buddy was going to take
22:40
Speaker 2: her To Little rock to pick someone, up But, instead
22:43
Speaker 2: he drove her to a remote location and raped. Her
22:47
Speaker 2: he told her that if she would kiss him, back
22:49
Speaker 2: he wouldn't hurt. Her after the, assault he forced her
22:52
Speaker 2: to redress and took her to a. Field he made
22:55
Speaker 2: her lie down and wait until he was. Gone robert
23:00
Speaker 2: was convicted of those two, rapes but he was suspected
23:03
Speaker 2: of committing. More there were other attacks women who were
23:08
Speaker 2: pulled over in the same area with Blue mars lights
23:11
Speaker 2: and then sexually, assaulted But robert was never convicted of those.
23:15
Speaker 2: Attacks side. Note in twenty, seventeen lawmakers Passed Shannon's, law
23:21
Speaker 2: name For. Shannon this law increased the penalty for anyone
23:25
Speaker 2: caught illegally possessing blue emergency. Lights robert was sentenced to
23:31
Speaker 2: life in. Prison he died in prison OF covid related
23:34
Speaker 2: complications In may twenty. Twenty But robert was convicted in
23:40
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety, seven which of, course was three years Before amanda's.
23:44
Speaker 2: Death but there was still lingering questions about these other
23:48
Speaker 2: alleged blue light. Assaults were these copycat rapes or could
23:53
Speaker 2: there have been another blue light rapist out there one
23:56
Speaker 2: who wasn't. Caught there was another young woman eighteen year
24:02
Speaker 2: Old Dana, stidham who went missing From Bella, Vista, arkansas
24:06
Speaker 2: On july twenty, fifth nineteen eighty. Nine on that, Day
24:09
Speaker 2: dana was on her way. Home she had gone out
24:13
Speaker 2: to run some errands for her, dad who wasn't feeling.
24:15
Speaker 2: Well he asked her to pick some stuff up for,
24:19
Speaker 2: him so she went To Philip's Food store In Bella.
24:22
Speaker 2: Vista she bought Some alka seltzer and some dishwashing soap and.
24:25
Speaker 2: Sugar this is all according to. Receipts she left at
24:29
Speaker 2: three SEVENTEEN. Pm, now there was another grocery store closer
24:33
Speaker 2: to her, house but later one of the detectives on
24:36
Speaker 2: the case talked to reporters and said That dana avoided
24:39
Speaker 2: that store because a guy whose parents owned the store
24:42
Speaker 2: back then hung out there a. Lot, now apparently this
24:45
Speaker 2: guy had a crush On, dana but the feelings were not.
24:48
Speaker 2: Reciprocated the last time That dana was seen alive was
24:52
Speaker 2: when she left that food store after running her errand
24:55
Speaker 2: for her. Dad she used to work At phillip's food,
24:58
Speaker 2: store so she knew a lot of people there and
25:00
Speaker 2: they all remembered talking to. Her she talked to people
25:03
Speaker 2: she knew in the store and in the parking. Lot
25:06
Speaker 2: police said they also talked to another, witness someone who
25:09
Speaker 2: was apparently doing some landscaping near the.
25:11
Speaker 3: Store.
25:12
Speaker 2: Now this person apparently told police that they Saw dana,
25:15
Speaker 2: lee but they weren't sure which way she turned when
25:18
Speaker 2: she drove. Out after, That dana never came. Home On
25:24
Speaker 2: july twenty, sixth at around six thirty, am a police
25:27
Speaker 2: officer was driving southbound DOWN Us highway seventy one when
25:30
Speaker 2: they Saw dana's nineteen eighty Four Dodge omni abandoned on
25:35
Speaker 2: the shoulder Near Wellington. Road the keys were still in the,
25:38
Speaker 2: ignition the driver's side window was halfway, down and the
25:41
Speaker 2: rear tire was slightly deflated but not totally. Flat, again
25:46
Speaker 2: there was no obvious sign of anything being wrong with the,
25:49
Speaker 2: car and no sign of foul, play but this Time
25:54
Speaker 2: dana's purse was missing and the driver's seat was way,
25:57
Speaker 2: back as if a taller person had been the last one.
26:00
Speaker 2: Driving dana had been doing laundry that, day and her
26:04
Speaker 2: laundry was found scattered several feet away from the. Car
26:08
Speaker 2: the search For dana went on for, months, then In
26:10
Speaker 2: september of nineteen eighty nine a hundred Found dana's remains
26:14
Speaker 2: in a creek bed near The Arkansas missouri. Border her
26:17
Speaker 2: clothes were buried in a shallow grave. Nearby she had
26:21
Speaker 2: a cut on her left shoulder. Blade it's been reported
26:24
Speaker 2: that detectives were not sure of the actual cause of,
26:27
Speaker 2: death but they are withholding, details SO i can't be
26:30
Speaker 2: sure about. That and obviously this is still an open.
26:32
Speaker 2: Investigation but they have made some facts, public like the
26:36
Speaker 2: fact that detectives had suspicions about that, guy the one
26:39
Speaker 2: who had a crush On, dana the one who attended
26:41
Speaker 2: the same high school she. Did they questioned this, person
26:44
Speaker 2: but in the, end The Benton County, Prosecutor Brad, butler
26:48
Speaker 2: said he didn't believe he had enough physical or circumstantial
26:51
Speaker 2: evidence to file any. Charges we're going to talk more
26:54
Speaker 2: in depth About Dana stidham's case in a future. Episode
26:58
Speaker 2: AND i just want to be. CLEAR i always hate
27:00
Speaker 2: when people make really tenuous connections between cases that are
27:03
Speaker 2: obviously not. CONNECTED i have no reason to believe right
27:07
Speaker 2: now that these two cases are. Connected dana was found
27:10
Speaker 2: in a, Grave amanda was found in a body of.
27:12
Speaker 2: Water dana's clothes were buried, Nearby so at least from
27:16
Speaker 2: what we know what's come out, publicly it does seem,
27:20
Speaker 2: like at least on the, surface there could be more
27:22
Speaker 2: evidence That dana's case may have been some type of
27:26
Speaker 2: a sex. Crime amanda disappeared at, Night dana disappeared in
27:31
Speaker 2: the middle of the. Day but there were also some.
27:34
Speaker 2: Similarities both women were. Petiitue dana was five foot two
27:37
Speaker 2: and one hundred, pounds with, short dark. Care the crimes
27:41
Speaker 2: happened near each. Other women's cars were found abandoned on
27:45
Speaker 2: the side of the road with the keys and the,
27:47
Speaker 2: ignition and there were similar theories discussed in both, cases
27:51
Speaker 2: including the possibility someone impersonating a police officer could have
27:55
Speaker 2: pulled them. OVER i found something very interesting in the court.
27:59
Speaker 2: Documents after the blue light rapist's, conviction the circuit court
28:04
Speaker 2: allowed a second victim to testify in. Court they allowed
28:08
Speaker 2: this so that they could establish the rapist pattern his
28:11
Speaker 2: Mo so what's interesting here is that two Of robert's
28:15
Speaker 2: victims had some. Similarities the reason this is interesting to
28:19
Speaker 2: me is not Because robert Killed, amanda we know he,
28:23
Speaker 2: didn't he was in jail at the, time but because
28:26
Speaker 2: maybe the methods he used can give us some insight
28:28
Speaker 2: into other. Predators robert would tell these women they were
28:32
Speaker 2: being charged WITH, dwi but he said perhaps he could
28:35
Speaker 2: work something out with. Them he also apparently would do body,
28:39
Speaker 2: searches and then that was the excuse he used to
28:42
Speaker 2: put his hands on these women across the Line. Physically
28:45
Speaker 2: he did not get into the women's, cars he followed
28:47
Speaker 2: them in his. Car, also both Of robert's victims had
28:52
Speaker 2: families that were out of town at the time when
28:54
Speaker 2: their attacks took. Place and this is something that piqued my.
28:57
Speaker 2: Curiosity was this something he knew beforehand because he recognized these,
29:01
Speaker 2: women or was this something he found out while questioning
29:04
Speaker 2: them initially.
29:05
Speaker 3: And used his.
29:06
Speaker 2: Advantage so the killer could have been someone impersonating a police,
29:09
Speaker 2: Officer but there is also another possibility the killer could
29:13
Speaker 2: have been a real police, officer either one that was
29:16
Speaker 2: on duty at the time or off duty in a patrol.
29:19
Speaker 2: Car law enforcement definitely seemed to consider this. Possibility the
29:25
Speaker 2: sheriff made the comment to news station eight that a
29:27
Speaker 2: police officer would know how to hide. Evidence in, fact
29:31
Speaker 2: detectives spoke to several police officers From Mississippi county And Craighead.
29:36
Speaker 2: County they apparently ruled a lot of people out and
29:39
Speaker 2: gave a lot of polygraph tests to members of law.
29:41
Speaker 2: Enforcement one person and they focused on was reportedly a
29:45
Speaker 2: police officer who lived in the nearby town of Black.
29:48
Speaker 2: Oak that would have been one of the towns That
29:51
Speaker 2: Amanda tussing would have gone through on her way. Home
29:55
Speaker 2: true crime Author George, jared who we worked with on
29:59
Speaker 2: The Rebecca gould, case discussed this theory in his Book
30:02
Speaker 2: whispers and The, willows and in his book he said
30:06
Speaker 2: that he discovered through his law enforcement sources that that officer's.
30:10
Speaker 3: Name Was Johnny.
30:11
Speaker 2: Williams apparently a lot of women were complaining back in
30:15
Speaker 2: the day That johnny would follow them. Home he wrote
30:18
Speaker 2: in the book that police Interviewed Johnny williams multiple. Times
30:22
Speaker 2: amanda's cousin wasn't sure about the name when we brought it,
30:25
Speaker 2: up but the family has said over the years they
30:29
Speaker 2: have heard that there was someone in law enforcement who
30:32
Speaker 2: police apparently, suspected couldn't get enough evidence on and hoped
30:36
Speaker 2: would give a deathbed confession when he began to get.
30:39
Speaker 2: Sick johnny got a terminal illness in two thousand and
30:43
Speaker 2: nin he passed away the following. Year, Now Johnny williams
30:49
Speaker 2: was never publicly named a, suspect never arrested or charged
30:53
Speaker 2: in connection with anything Involving amanda's. Case we have no
30:57
Speaker 2: idea if he had any information at, all but any
31:00
Speaker 2: information he would have had went to the grave with
31:02
Speaker 2: him in twenty. Ten so who Killed Amanda? Tussing there
31:12
Speaker 2: are still a lot of possibilities to. Consider one is
31:16
Speaker 2: That amanda did stop at a convenience store on her
31:18
Speaker 2: way home and got that can of. Coke maybe someone
31:22
Speaker 2: saw her there and followed her out of the. Store
31:25
Speaker 2: now that person might have been a police. Officer or
31:27
Speaker 2: it's also possible that the person who got her to
31:31
Speaker 2: pull over wasn't a police officer at. All maybe it
31:34
Speaker 2: was someone faking car. Trouble maybe they got her to
31:37
Speaker 2: pull over another, way or maybe she pulled over. First
31:42
Speaker 2: it was meaning really heavily that. Night maybe she was
31:46
Speaker 2: sitting in her car until the rain passed and someone
31:49
Speaker 2: saw her park. There in that, moment sitting inside that
31:53
Speaker 2: dark car with zero, visibility she was very. Vulnerable whether
31:58
Speaker 2: it was a law enforcement, officer someone impersonating a police,
32:01
Speaker 2: officer or just a sick and twisted random. Person it
32:05
Speaker 2: seems likely that it was someone who lived in the
32:08
Speaker 2: area and they could be still out. There I'm Catherine.
32:14
Speaker 2: Townsend this Is Helen Gone Murder. Line Helen Gone Murder
32:27
Speaker 2: line is a production Of school Of humans And iHeart.
32:29
Speaker 2: Podcasts it's written and narrated by Me Catherine townsend and
32:32
Speaker 2: produced By Gabby. Watts music contributed By Ben Sale special
32:37
Speaker 2: thanks To Amy tubbs for her research. Assistance Noah camera
32:41
Speaker 2: mixed and scored this. Episode executive producers Are Virginia, Prescott Brandon,
32:46
Speaker 2: barr And Elsie. Crowley listen To Helen gone ad free
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