Latest / SisterSmart Leadership / 11: Preparing for a Promotion When You Don’t Feel Quite Ready with Nicolle

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11: Preparing for a Promotion When You Don’t Feel Quite Ready with Nicolle · SisterSmart Leadership

• 0:00
  Jill Avey: What if you were next in line for a promotion, but you weren't
• 0:02
  sure if you were ready for it yet, and in fact you weren't even sure you
• 0:05
  wanted to stay in the organization?
• 0:08
  And then once you got the promotion, you didn't always
• 0:10
  feel like you belonged there?
• 0:12
  Join us to hear from Nicole.
• 0:14
  She's one of the sisters in leadership clients, and she's going to share how
• 0:18
  her journey unfolded and then how she got her feet under her and her new
• 0:21
  role and how she's doing so well in it.
• 0:24
  I'm Jill Avey, a career success coach, and this is Sister Smart Leadership, the
• 0:29
  show that explores how women can rise from director to vice president and beyond
• 0:34
  by fully leaning into their feminine energy as their biggest advantage.
• 0:38
  Let's get you one step closer to the recognition and promotion you deserve.
• 0:43
  I would love for you to meet Nicole, who is here to share her
• 0:46
  journey with Sisters in Leadership and how it's affected her life.
• 0:49
  I hope that as you listen to her story about getting promoted to
• 0:52
  her current role, that you see that her story could be your story too.
• 0:57
  Nicole works for a very large metropolitan transit system
• 1:00
  and manages the payroll there.
• 1:02
  She reports directly to the C F O and leads a team of 20.
• 1:06
  Then they manage the payroll for 6,000 employees.
• 1:10
  So Nicole, when you are thinking back to before you joined the Sisters in
• 1:15
  Leadership Program, what were you experiencing then, and what made you
• 1:19
  realize the importance of having the right guidance to get to the next level?
• 1:22
  Nicolle Lewis: I really realized I kept burning myself out.
• 1:27
  I moved to San Francisco about eight years ago and came from a small
• 1:32
  community into a big metropolitan area, and really took my work ethic.
• 1:39
  I had.
• 1:40
  From where I came into my new roles and realized I was trying to do everything,
• 1:46
  I realized that kind of afterward what I realized was I was having burnout.
• 1:49
  Like I just felt like I was going, going, going, going and not getting anywhere.
• 1:53
  So that's one of the things I was struggling with.
• 1:56
  And I think also really identifying who I was when I entered a position and
• 2:02
  what I wanted to bring to that position.
• 2:04
  Jill Avey: Was there one obstacle that you were facing more than the
• 2:07
  others that was really, that was really inspiring you at that time?
• 2:11
  Was that the burnout?
• 2:12
  Nicolle Lewis: I think the burnout and also realizing that I needed
• 2:16
  to know a little more about myself.
• 2:17
  I.
• 2:18
  And to really be able to bring what I wanted to bring forward in where I was.
• 2:24
  I, I kept looking outward for signals and what I needed to do and
• 2:29
  realized that that really wasn't getting me where I needed to go.
• 2:32
  Jill Avey: How did that feel for you at the time?
• 2:34
  Nicolle Lewis: It felt, I think it created, in retrospect when I
• 2:37
  look back, I was uncomfortable.
• 2:40
  But really there was a fear.
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  I think that kind of underlied.
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  Was kind of underlying the actions I was taking or how I was
• 2:48
  bringing myself to work every day.
• 2:50
  Jill Avey: Was that kind of blocking you in in some
• 2:53
  Nicolle Lewis: Yeah.
• 2:53
  Yes, it definitely was.
• 2:54
  I think I was more hesitant to speak up.
• 2:57
  I was more hesitant to introduce ideas than I'd been in the past.
• 3:01
  And I think that's part of what I was realizing was like, this wasn't
• 3:04
  who I felt like I used to be.
• 3:05
  So what's, what's kind of happening here?
• 3:08
  What do I need to do to, to shift out of it?
• 3:10
  Jill Avey: What were you feeling that told you that you needed
• 3:13
  to get to know yourself better?
• 3:14
  I feel like this is a tricky thing that, you know, that people
• 3:17
  aren't always able to identify that that's what the solution is.
• 3:20
  Nicolle Lewis: It is.
• 3:20
  For me, I definitely felt more anxious around work, which I'd never felt before.
• 3:27
  And I could tell I was hesitating a lot when I went to work on
• 3:32
  something or present something.
• 3:35
  That was new to me.
• 3:36
  And so it really made me start thinking about what's happening around this
• 3:40
  area that just wasn't there before.
• 3:43
  And what do I need to do to shift out of that, back out of that again?
• 3:46
  For me, I finally realized a shift, like changing my life so much probably had.
• 3:53
  More to explore than I gave it credit for at the beginning.
• 3:57
  You know, at the beginning when you make a change, I think you're all about
• 4:00
  what's positive about this change.
• 4:02
  Why is this a good change for me?
• 4:03
  There's a reason you decided to make it the change.
• 4:06
  And so part of that for me, was recognizing that there was probably other
• 4:11
  areas that go with change to explore and really look at and be able to embrace
• 4:18
  the whole experience of that change.
• 4:21
  I think now I realize too, you can focus on the positive, but you have
• 4:25
  to also recognize maybe the other things that are happening as well.
• 4:29
  And if even if those are negative, what are they and really addressing them.
• 4:33
  Jill Avey: It can go in sequence, right.
• 4:34
  It felt like there was a point in the program where, where you really
• 4:38
  realized, oh, I'm still carrying this.
• 4:40
  Nicolle Lewis: Definitely, definitely there was, and I I was really
• 4:43
  able to work through it and, and have tools to, to go through it.
• 4:47
  And having a group also to discuss things with other women understanding
• 4:52
  that I wasn't the only one maybe having self-doubt or having that fear
• 4:57
  or questioning where I was or where I wanted to go was really helpful
• 5:02
  in being able to work through that.
• 5:04
  Jill Avey: Were there challenges that were specific to being a woman in this,
• 5:08
  that you felt might be different for you?
• 5:11
  Nicolle Lewis: Yes, I think so.
• 5:12
  I think for me, one I think has always been balancing family and work.
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  And there's always been a little bit of that guilt if there's too much time going
• 5:23
  into work or not enough time going into work, too much time going into the family.
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  So I think that that's something that doesn't have to be specific to women, but
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  I think in our society it, it is, we tend to carry more of the the household burden.
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  And even if we have someone that's sharing with that, I still think it's
• 5:40
  a societal expectation that you're the one taking the lead in all those areas.
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  And so there's that pressure or that feeling of I have
• 5:47
  to do everything everywhere.
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  So I do think that that was that was due really to being a woman.
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  And then also just I think in my experience in the workplace too,
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  Women bring something different to the workplace, but then also I think the
• 6:01
  expectations of what they're going to bring to the workplace have been set.
• 6:04
  And so that's also something you have to navigate all the time.
• 6:09
  Jill Avey: And you're working in a structure that's got a long
• 6:11
  history and, you know, very stable ways of doing things, and so,
• 6:17
  Nicolle Lewis: very institutional and ingrained.
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  And really in looking back at where I've had my careers, a lot of
• 6:25
  them have been very male-centric.
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  Fishing industry and then coming here into the metro it is
• 6:33
  really a lot of maintenance, a lot of traditional male roles.
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  And that's Something that they are definitely working through, but
• 6:41
  it's, it exists, you know, it's been been there for a long time.
• 6:46
  Jill Avey: You've done such an incredible job with this.
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  You were hired into to be somebody's replacement, and that doesn't
• 6:52
  always work out for people.
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  Lots of people get in, hired to succeed somebody, and then it doesn't happen.
• 6:58
  , I think it's been Really exciting to watch you just really prepare yourself for
• 7:01
  the role, instill the confidence in them that you could take it on and then, and
• 7:06
  then get a chance to take that step up.
• 7:08
  I was wondering if you think about the seven steps to promotion that we talk
• 7:12
  about in the Sisters in Leadership program, if there was some of those that
• 7:16
  you felt made a bigger difference for you?
• 7:18
  Nicolle Lewis: I think definitely really getting a handle on my emotions and
• 7:25
  I think with stepping into some place that's very, has a lot of institutional
• 7:29
  knowledge and has a lot of things that have come about, not necessarily because
• 7:33
  there's written policies or things have written down, it's just somebody
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  knows that's the way it's been done, that it's really easy to start looking
• 7:42
  at everything that needs to be fixed, everything I'd want to do differently.
• 7:46
  And I had shift that a little bit and also bring some optimism to the table.
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  I mean, to really be, what can I bring that might even be little bits of
• 7:56
  Introduction of new ideas and new things.
• 7:59
  Because I'm not going to shift everything that's been put in
• 8:01
  place for such a long time.
• 8:04
  So really being able to focus on what I could bring and really learning
• 8:08
  what I wanted to introduce and what I could do little bits at a time.
• 8:14
  So I think really balancing myself was one of the first things I needed to
• 8:17
  work on, and that was really helpful in going through those steps and bringing
• 8:22
  that optimism, really taking the time to look at what was worth putting time and
• 8:28
  energy into, recognizing what that was.
• 8:32
  Making connections with the C F O, who was going to stay in
• 8:36
  place, of course, as I moved up.
• 8:37
  So really being able to take time to let have him get to know me, get to
• 8:42
  know him, where does he work from.
• 8:45
  I knew the transition was going to happen, but to be able to introduce
• 8:47
  what I wanted to have happen as that transition came about.
• 8:51
  And that really empowered me more too because I think when I first came in, I
• 8:55
  thought, well, I have to leave everything the same and wait for Mike to shift.
• 9:01
  And I realized, no, I need to start working now on how I want it
• 9:04
  to look when that shift happens.
• 9:07
  Jill Avey: Yeah.
• 9:07
  Yeah.
• 9:08
  That was great.
• 9:09
  I feel like you've worked on your executive presence quite a lot
• 9:12
  too, to really kind of step into this role and that that's been a
• 9:15
  journey even after you got the role
• 9:17
  Nicolle Lewis: Yes.
• 9:17
  And still ongoing.
• 9:19
  Jill Avey: this on.
• 9:20
  Nicolle Lewis: Yes.
• 9:21
  Yep.
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  Realizing, yeah, I had to really start stepping into the role before the role was
• 9:27
  there for me was, was a big part of it.
• 9:29
  Jill Avey: And how about after you got the role?
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  Nicolle Lewis: There's always things that come up, of course,
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  and it's still evolving.
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  But it's been good.
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  I think really putting resources in place as that transition happened was
• 9:41
  very beneficial and really important, and the program helped me realize
• 9:45
  that to really look ahead at what I wanted to have be happening rather
• 9:51
  than waiting for it to just occur.
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  And having those meetings and those conversations ahead of
• 9:57
  time was really helpful for me and I didn't have that before.
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  I was really starting to think, what am I doing here and why do I want to
• 10:06
  step into what's already, what's here?
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  Not realizing I could start making the shift before that point.
• 10:12
  Jill Avey: I feel like there's been some work for you of building
• 10:15
  your team and you've made a lot of changes with your team as well.
• 10:19
  I think that was using some of the conversational intelligence,
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  Nicolle Lewis: yes, definitely conversational intelligence.
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  Taking time to really let my team talk.
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  The culture also had been very much, people are talked to, you have a
• 10:34
  meeting and someone just leads a meeting and talks the whole time.
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  So, learning conversational intelligence, learning how to open
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  up the door, open-ended questions, leaving the space for people to
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  reply, to have their own ideas.
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  That takes time.
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  I can put a question out there, but I have to really wait and
• 10:55
  let them provide the answer.
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  It doesn't do any good for me to put the question out, and then also
• 10:59
  the answer if I went participation.
• 11:02
  So we've really been growing the team and participating and being part of
• 11:06
  our team meetings and leaving space for people to each take time to share
• 11:12
  and bring something to the table.
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  And it's, it's changed the culture already.
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  It's, it's very nice.
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  It's still a work in progress, but I see movement there.
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  And we did, I did bring in an assistant payroll manager who shares some
• 11:25
  of that, those same philosophies, and that's been really helpful.
• 11:29
  Jill Avey: And that's allowed you to be able to delegate a lot more too, it feels
• 11:32
  Nicolle Lewis: yes, which is something going through the
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  delegation I realized I did not do enough of, and it's still struggle.
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  I mean, there's still times every week I look at my list and I, I now at
• 11:45
  least look at it with the eye of are there things I can move somewhere else?
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  Are there things that somebody else could be doing?
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  And there usually is.
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  So it's very helpful to look at What I'm working on for the
• 11:56
  week with those, with that lens.
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  Definitely.
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  Jill Avey: What other examples come to mind from the program of
• 12:02
  things that you've put into place?
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  Nicolle Lewis: definitely the meetings for me, just really being
• 12:08
  more intentional with my time.
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  More intentional with conversations I have throughout the day and with
• 12:17
  all levels of the organization.
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  I think before I approached a lot of conversations and sitting in payroll,
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  a lot of times when people come to you, they're looking for an action or
• 12:29
  an answer to a question or an inquiry.
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  It's kind of a reactionary based situation a lot of times.
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  But I now look at each one of those Exchanges as a way to like really
• 12:41
  create an experience when I'm dealing with someone that's at the same level
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  I am at the senior level or even higher up, really thinking about what
• 12:50
  I'm presenting in that conversation.
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  And is there a way to, to make some connections and really bring some
• 12:56
  networking to the table at the same time?
• 12:59
  And that's something I, I wasn't doing
• 13:01
  Jill Avey: those little opportunities.
• 13:02
  Yeah.
• 13:03
  Yeah.
• 13:04
  That's wonderful.
• 13:05
  How did you find the time to do the program?
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  Nicolle Lewis: I am a morning person, the rest of my family is not.
• 13:11
  So for me, my, my time in the weekends, in the morning, I really
• 13:15
  carved out time that was just for me.
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  And that was actually beneficial as well to really set something aside.
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  That was just for me, I think also helped in just my whole growth and
• 13:29
  really gave me time and space to be thinking about what I wanted to be doing
• 13:33
  throughout the week and throughout the day, rather than just getting up and
• 13:37
  reacting to everything around me, it really gave me some centering time.
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  So I carved out the time early in the morning, weekends and really also took
• 13:47
  a couple times in the evening where I'd at least do one evening a week where I'd
• 13:51
  sit down and just say, this is my time that I'm going to work on the program.
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  And it was really easy to do as you get started because you can
• 13:57
  see so many benefits from it.
• 13:59
  Like I could really see and feel myself shifting.
• 14:02
  So it made me want to get into the program more
• 14:04
  Jill Avey: I think that's one of the hardest things that for people to
• 14:07
  imagine themselves taking that time.
• 14:10
  And also it's one of the, the first things that I encourage people to do is
• 14:14
  to create that habit of, you know, figure out when it is you're going to do this.
• 14:18
  Nicolle Lewis: I was going through and reading some stuff and looking
• 14:21
  at Time that we just spend with notifications and different things.
• 14:24
  So I also kind of did a cleansing and turned off a lot of my notifications on my
• 14:28
  phones that really I hadn't even realized were on, that were just interrupters.
• 14:33
  I also took the time to go through some of my Facebook feed and other feeds and
• 14:37
  just connections that I , I wasn't really connecting with anymore, but were taking
• 14:41
  time every time I'd get into those apps and that, it just freed up some time
• 14:46
  for me that I realized I was spending a lot of energy in places that I wasn't
• 14:50
  getting anything from that really weren't contributing to my growth or where I
• 14:56
  was currently and that helped to kind of open up space for something new.
• 15:01
  Jill Avey: Right.
• 15:02
  Yeah.
• 15:02
  It's amazing how much time we can waste with notifications, right?
• 15:06
  Just these little things can really open up.
• 15:08
  Yeah, it all adds up.
• 15:10
  Now that you've got your team to the place that you have gotten it to,
• 15:14
  what's the rewarding part about it?
• 15:15
  What are you appreciating?
• 15:16
  Nicolle Lewis: I know I appreciate more that I can bring myself to
• 15:20
  work every day that I feel I'm providing more authenticity in all
• 15:23
  my interactions that I don't have to think about is this the answer I want
• 15:30
  to provide or is this the right answer?
• 15:32
  I think it going through the program and realizing I had that fear and realizing
• 15:37
  what was behind that has let me let go of that and really just present
• 15:43
  what needs to be presented every day.
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  Have the interactions that need to happen.
• 15:48
  Understand there's going to be difficult times, there's going to be some
• 15:51
  information that I'm maybe not going to like or have an emotional reaction to, but
• 15:57
  that I can center on, that I can take some moments and realize there is an emotional
• 16:02
  reaction happening, but it is information.
• 16:05
  How can I process it?
• 16:06
  What can I do?
• 16:07
  What can I move on?
• 16:08
  So I think it's really opened up definitely more time and space.
• 16:13
  For me to focus on the growth I want to have and the direction I want to go in,
• 16:19
  rather than putting the energy into each moment as it happens and having that
• 16:26
  interrupt the day of what's happening.
• 16:28
  I think I have more control over, like how I'm feeling and how I'm reacting to things
• 16:33
  and how I can center myself and really.
• 16:36
  Use the tools to move forward and build who I want to be as a leader
• 16:41
  and show my team what that looks like and give them space to grow as well.
• 16:47
  Jill Avey: It must be so nice for your team to have this new environment that
• 16:51
  they're working in and where their voice is heard and they get to have
• 16:55
  more growth potential than they used to.
• 16:57
  Nicolle Lewis: It is.
• 16:58
  We, we were able to do a training this year that was really great.
• 17:01
  It just really focused on them and interactions with the team
• 17:06
  and what they bring to the table.
• 17:08
  And it was really heartening to see them share and really be
• 17:14
  comfortable being able to do that.
• 17:16
  Jill Avey: Yeah.
• 17:16
  Nicolle Lewis: it's helped them.
• 17:17
  They actually help each other a lot more than they used to.
• 17:20
  I mean, Three years ago when I came in, everyone was definitely sitting at their
• 17:24
  own table, their own chair, and really worried about just what was right in
• 17:29
  front of them, and they still definitely have to do that to get payroll done.
• 17:33
  I mean, there is a, a certain amount of time that has to be spent every two weeks
• 17:37
  to make sure all the transactions happen, but we now have a chat where people,
• 17:42
  they throw questions in for each other.
• 17:44
  So questions that used to only come to me now go into that chat and they can help
• 17:49
  assist each other with those answers.
• 17:51
  And then everyone sees what like, Would be the best common practice.
• 17:56
  Or someone has an idea that another person hadn't had and they feed off of that.
• 17:59
  It's really great to watch that happen.
• 18:01
  You can see sometimes some hesitation, but the more we just introduce that
• 18:06
  environment the more it's being utilized.
• 18:09
  They can help each other more a lot of times than I can with some of the issues.
• 18:13
  Someone on the team has probably dealt with it way more often than I have, so
• 18:17
  it's a great way for them to be able to share that knowledge with each other.
• 18:21
  Jill Avey: You said that this is a male dominated environment that you're in.
• 18:25
  Do you feel like you're bringing your feminine leadership
• 18:27
  strengths to this role?
• 18:29
  Nicolle Lewis: I do and I, I feel very fortunate to have
• 18:32
  gone through this program.
• 18:34
  And also when I went through this program, I also started finding like-minded
• 18:38
  people and coworkers and it's amazing when you're open to your growth and
• 18:45
  what you're looking for, you start to see it where it does actually exist.
• 18:49
  Where I think before I didn't, I didn't think it existed.
• 18:51
  So in that I've also connected to some other women in the organization that bring
• 18:57
  some of that energy to the table as well.
• 19:00
  And we've been able to give each other ideas and help support each other in
• 19:04
  bringing that forward, especially in our team meetings and our group settings.
• 19:08
  Being able to have people share, being able to have team time where
• 19:13
  they're interacting together, and that's been really great.
• 19:17
  Jill Avey: What advice would you have for other women who are wanting to
• 19:20
  bring out their leadership skills more?
• 19:22
  Nicolle Lewis: I think probably just starting somewhere.
• 19:26
  I think that was the hardest part for me at the beginning was I thought,
• 19:29
  oh, that's not what someone else did before me, or that's not what
• 19:33
  I see happening here or there.
• 19:36
  And so I really just had to take that first step of I'm just going to introduce
• 19:40
  this one item and see where it goes.
• 19:42
  I'm going to introduce another item and see where it goes.
• 19:45
  And it felt good to me, which was helpful.
• 19:48
  And then I think that people feel that around you.
• 19:50
  They feel that it's important to you and it it's, and yet that
• 19:54
  you think they're important.
• 19:55
  And so I think that really helps move that forward.
• 19:59
  But I think it's just starting with that first step.
• 20:01
  Jill Avey: And you made small steps.
• 20:02
  I think that's an important piece
• 20:04
  Nicolle Lewis: Yeah, they were small steps and, and watching for the buy-in
• 20:08
  and seeing what's happening around you.
• 20:09
  And for me, it was helpful to find some like-minded people and get ideas.
• 20:13
  when I was sharing what I was doing and they were sharing what they were doing,
• 20:16
  and it's like, oh, you are doing that?
• 20:18
  That is happening in your group.
• 20:20
  I just didn't know that it was like, it can exist in this environment.
• 20:24
  Jill Avey: Right,
• 20:25
  Nicolle Lewis: And we definitely had one of the managers I connected with is a
• 20:28
  manager in wellness, and so that was very helpful because she encompassed that role.
• 20:33
  I think that's why she was in that role.
• 20:34
  It really was very important to her and she tried to bring that to the
• 20:37
  table across the organization, but she also had very specific exercises
• 20:43
  and ideas and reasons why this is important in the workplace and
• 20:47
  it really needs to be supported.
• 20:48
  So it, it kind of helped also build my confidence in this is the right way to go.
• 20:53
  I know it feels that way to me, but I can really take that to the next step.
• 20:58
  Jill Avey: Anything else that you want to add?
• 20:59
  Nicolle Lewis: I feel like without this program, I probably wouldn't
• 21:05
  have stayed where I'm at right now.
• 21:07
  And for me it really took time to look inward and really build my
• 21:12
  strength and what I wanted to do.
• 21:14
  But I wouldn't have been able to do that on my own.
• 21:16
  So it was really great to have really specific steps to work through really
• 21:21
  specific support to find other people that were looking to reach those same goals.
• 21:29
  Because I really think I would've burned out or would've felt like I wouldn't
• 21:33
  have known how to introduce what I wanted to introduce into the environment I was
• 21:38
  in and see that what I'm introducing actually was making a difference and
• 21:43
  that I have a place to be able to be here and know what my values are and what
• 21:47
  I want to bring to the table, and how I can fit those into what's happening.
• 21:52
  I am not going to change the whole culture, but I can change the culture
• 21:56
  around me, my immediate team, how I'm interacting with the employees,
• 22:00
  what the employees are feeling when they're coming into payroll and the
• 22:03
  responses they're getting from us.
• 22:05
  And that's enough for right now.
• 22:06
  And that's good.
• 22:07
  And I know it's what I can bring in and that it's me.
• 22:11
  And I'm not changing who I am to be there.
• 22:13
  I'm just building on who I am.
• 22:15
  Jill Avey: And I think a lot of people are looking for how to do that.
• 22:17
  because it feels like you have to morph into something else in some places.
• 22:22
  But you've really found a way not to do that.
• 22:24
  Nicolle Lewis: And it, it did take going through the steps of really
• 22:27
  looking at who we are and what our values are and what we want to bring to
• 22:31
  the table was really helpful in that.
• 22:33
  Jill Avey: I like to ask everybody this.
• 22:35
  Who is a woman that inspires you by her leadership?
• 22:38
  Nicolle Lewis: this is a difficult question for me.
• 22:40
  I realize I have not had a lot of immediate women role models in
• 22:47
  leadership I even dug into my mind.
• 22:49
  I'm like, who in my immediate work world is someone that I can pull from?
• 22:53
  And there, there have not been a lot.
• 22:56
  I think as I came into knowing I wanted to really define myself more as a
• 23:02
  leader Brene Brown of course resonated.
• 23:05
  I picked up Imperfect a long time ago.
• 23:08
  It sat on my shelf for quite some time, but it really probably was the first
• 23:12
  book I read that made me realize I guess what it means to really know who you
• 23:19
  are and really give yourself grace and really be able to not have to be like
• 23:24
  that perfectionist, not have to have everything and know everything to be
• 23:28
  able to succeed and lead in something.
• 23:31
  So that was really helpful for me.
• 23:33
  I think it started to plant that seed that maybe there was something
• 23:36
  more out there for me to learn and really be able to bring to the table.
• 23:41
  I think going through this journey, I really think more about my grandmother,
• 23:46
  who I did work with as a young woman and who moved to Alaska in her fifties and
• 23:54
  eventually became the general manager of Alaska Timber Insurance Exchange, which
• 23:59
  was a workers' comp and health insurance company for all the logging industry.
• 24:04
  And I realize, I think more in my life now where I'm at.
• 24:08
  What that probably really took for her to do
• 24:12
  Jill Avey: Yeah,
• 24:13
  Nicolle Lewis: and how gutsy that was.
• 24:16
  And probably the world she had to traverse to reach that level.
• 24:22
  And in going through some of the learning I've done now I can see I do remember,
• 24:27
  I remember very specifically being in the office with her and having someone
• 24:31
  come in for a meeting and stuff, and I can remember her going like this.
• 24:35
  She like, did this took up the space.
• 24:39
  Yeah.
• 24:39
  And I now know, like in going through all this, I'm like, Oh, like she had to
• 24:45
  really probably just innately learn or be able to build those pieces to be able
• 24:50
  to be in the world she was in because she really was in a very male world.
• 24:54
  I mean, she was going out to logging camps and the owners of the logging
• 24:58
  companies, and it was all male, but she, she knew really what she
• 25:03
  needed to do at that time to be able to make her space in that world.
• 25:08
  Jill Avey: For our listeners, let me specify.
• 25:10
  Nicole just leaned back and put her hands on her head, so that's
• 25:14
  the power move we're talking about.
• 25:16
  Nicolle Lewis: Yeah, and definitely
• 25:18
  Jill Avey: to take up some space
• 25:19
  Nicolle Lewis: take up the space in the room.
• 25:20
  Yeah.
• 25:22
  And so I, I do think more about what it took for her to really do that.
• 25:26
  And she was single at that point and was single for the rest of
• 25:31
  her life and really built a career for herself and left a mark.
• 25:34
  I mean, there's people that will still be like, oh, your grandmother, she
• 25:38
  ran that timber insurance exchange.
• 25:40
  And, I do think that, That's always been something in the back of my mind
• 25:45
  that I did see her in that position, and it did give me confidence that
• 25:49
  that's somewhere women could go.
• 25:51
  Jill Avey: That's wonderful.
• 25:52
  Thank you so much for sharing your story.
• 25:54
  I really appreciate you coming here and, and talking to me today.
• 25:58
  If you found Nicole's story inspiring or helpful, let us know in the comments.
• 26:02
  If you're on watching this on YouTube, we'd love to hear
• 26:04
  which part you like the most.
• 26:06
  And maybe that's about her grandmother.
• 26:08
  I think that might be my favorite part, but what a spunky lady she must have been.
• 26:13
  If you'd like to hear more about the Sisters in Leadership process and
• 26:16
  how it might work for you, download my private podcast, the Seven Step
• 26:20
  passport to promotion on the sister smart.com website and the link
• 26:24
  will be below in the show notes.
• 26:26
  If you want to dive deeper into women's leadership and how to
• 26:29
  move up in your career, subscribe either on YouTube or wherever you
• 26:33
  listen to your favorite podcast.
• 26:35
  I'm on a mission to help more women get into leadership and stay here because
• 26:40
  if that's a line for you, I'd love to have you be part of this community
• 26:44
  and tune into more episodes of Sister Smart Leadership to support you in
• 26:48
  becoming the leader you want to be.
• 26:51
  Nicolle Lewis: Thank you, Jill.
• 26:52
  Jill Avey: Thank you.
• 26:53
  If you're ready to fully lean into your feminine leadership and get promoted
• 26:57
  from director to vice president and beyond, hit that subscribe button so
• 27:01
  you'll get all the episodes to come and check out the recommended video here
• 27:05
  to see how women are rising up without playing by the old rules that built these
• 27:09
  male dominated industries and systems.