Latest / The Sheppertonian (for Shepperton village) / 🎸 Herman’s Hermits at Shepperton Studios: Keith Hopwood

Transcript

🎸 Herman’s Hermits at Shepperton Studios: Keith Hopwood · The Sheppertonian (for Shepperton village)

• 0:36
  Hello and welcome to the Sheppertonian.
• 0:38
  I'm Gareth and this is the local podcast bringing you stories, voices and events from in around Shepperton.
• 0:44
  A slight change in this episode as this was a remote recording.
• 0:49
  I'm in Shepperton and my guest is in Manchester.
• 0:52
  I recorded the video and what resulted was a lovely chat.
• 0:56
  So I've decided to release it as a video on YouTube as well as the audio version.
• 1:00
  So if you're listening to this rather than watching, the YouTube link is in the show notes if you want to switch over and vice versa, if you just want to listen, either head to theshepertonian.uk podcast or you can
• 1:14
  shut your eyes if you like.
• 1:16
  Before we begin, a quick thank you to the local businesses supporting the Sheppertonian through the Business Club Business Partners.
• 1:23
  The Ferry Coffee Shop, the wonderful coffee shop down by Shepperton Lock.
• 1:27
  Meon Media, flexible business support and the Sound Boutique: thoughtful audio for every story.
• 1:33
  And business member Island Motors providing MOT and servicing in the Shepperton and surrounding areas.
• 1:40
  Their backing makes it possible to keep sharing stories like this one.
• 1:44
  You'll find their details on the website and if you'd like your message in front of a local audience, head to the business club page at thesheppertonian.uk/business-club.
• 1:55
  And one thing of interest is now you can list your business on the website, so that's worth checking out.
• 2:01
  Now, this episode is a bit different.
• 2:03
  My guest is a composer friend of mine and you'll quickly learn the connection to Shepperton.
• 2:09
  Some of you will know that as well as running the Sheppertonian, I'm a composer for TV and I met Keith Hopwood at a conference 10 years ago.
• 2:19
  That's incredible.
• 2:20
  Time flies so quickly, but we were chatting so much when we met that we missed the keynote.
• 2:26
  And that's because Keith Hopwood was in a band in the 1960s called Herman's Hermits, one of the biggest bands to come out of the British invasion of the US in the 60s.
• 2:37
  And back in 1967, that band came to Shepperton to film one of their movies right here on our doorstep.
• 2:44
  And since then, Keith's had an extraordinary career as a composer, working on everything from the Wind and the Willows to the BFG to Bob the Builder.
• 2:54
  So settle in.
• 2:56
  This is Keith Hopwood.
• 2:57
  So let's thank you, by the way, for doing this.
• 3:00
  This is brilliant.
• 3:02
  I mentioned to someone in our local bowls club that you'd agreed to come on and he was very excited.
• 3:08
  Well, really good oh, yeah.
• 3:11
  So let's get going.
• 3:13
  Manchester early days.
• 3:15
  Yeah.
• 3:16
  How did a schoolboy from Urmston end up in one of the biggest bands of the British Invasion of the us?
• 3:24
  That's crazy, isn't it?
• 3:26
  Well, I mean, I was, I suppose about 12, 13 when I'd.
• 3:32
  I'd.
• 3:33
  I got my first guitar and then I.
• 3:37
  I started a band with a friend of mine.
• 3:39
  He was a drummer, obviously, at school.
• 3:41
  And so by the time we were 15, we got a band together for five of us and we'd go out and do the local, you know, working men's clubs and pubs and all that sort of thing.
• 3:53
  And, yeah, just very.
• 3:55
  Again, it was just tunnel vision.
• 3:56
  That's really.
• 3:57
  You know, at that age, that's all I wanted to ever do, you know, like.
• 4:01
  So we, we carried on doing these gigs, but not very many.
• 4:06
  It was difficult, you know, obviously nobody could drive and, you know, buses are a bit awkward, so we had to hire a guy.
• 4:13
  So if we got like four pound fifty or five pound for the night, you know, like 90% of that went to the driver and we.
• 4:19
  So.
• 4:19
  But we.
• 4:20
  We weren't any for the money.
• 4:22
  And after a year or so of this, this other local band came to see me and said, you know, do you want to join our band?
• 4:34
  And this was Herman and the Hermits, as they were known at that time.
• 4:40
  So I.
• 4:41
  I said, well, I don't know, I've never.
• 4:43
  I've never seen them, you know.
• 4:44
  So I went to see them and it wasn't very good and it was very echoey hall, you know, so it was.
• 4:51
  It was the worst of all things.
• 4:53
  But I got chatting to them afterwards and, you know, they showed me how they were working, you know, and they would.
• 4:59
  They were working more, they were getting more money and they got a manager.
• 5:04
  I thought, oh.
• 5:05
  So I thought, well, we, you know, we can probably fix the music.
• 5:09
  And we.
• 5:11
  I saw a jump ship and that.
• 5:14
  That was the start of it.
• 5:16
  And then, you know, we started, or our manager started to get us recording auditions, you know, all you wanted then was a record deal, you know, and so we, we plowed on with that.
• 5:30
  Failed every single one.
• 5:33
  And Mickey Most was the final straw, you know, he was like the last thing and he said, no, no, this.
• 5:38
  This won't do, you know.
• 5:41
  So at that point, I mean, we knew what the problem was.
• 5:43
  It was, you know, the bass player and the drummer, they just.
• 5:46
  Just weren't in the same room, you know, so we, we changed it round.
• 5:50
  We got another couple of guys in and we got Mickey back up to have a look at us and.
• 5:56
  And all was good.
• 5:57
  So he said, right, I'll find you a song.
• 6:00
  And a month later he came back, said he'll learn this.
• 6:04
  We learned that.
• 6:07
  Went down to Kingsway Recorders in Holborn and, you know, three hour session, A side and B side came out in August and number one in September.
• 6:21
  So it was.
• 6:22
  That was I'm Into Something Good.
• 6:24
  So it was all a bit off the scale, really, you know.
• 6:28
  So, I mean, we're all still like 17ish at that point, you know.
• 6:32
  That must have been quite mind blowing.
• 6:35
  It was completely.
• 6:37
  And it.
• 6:37
  And it still happens to this day, the, the overnight fame, basically.
• 6:41
  The Arctic Monkeys, famously, they were booked in a small venue and when there was a certain single came out, they had to rebook for the Astoria in London.
• 6:51
  Yeah, it's just that.
• 6:53
  And I mean that kind of effect on someone so young must have been.
• 6:57
  Well, you see, the first hurdle was we just wanted to get signed because we could see all these bands getting signed to a record deal.
• 7:05
  So that's the first thing.
• 7:08
  And we.
• 7:08
  We never had a deal with a record company.
• 7:10
  We were only ever signed to Mickey Most.
• 7:12
  But that was, you know, as good as he'd just done House of the Rising sun, you know.
• 7:16
  Okay, so we got that in the bag and then the next thing was to make a record.
• 7:23
  After we'd made the record, the next big hurdle was just to hear it on the radio.
• 7:27
  I mean, nobody had any ambitions or thoughts of how far up the charts were.
• 7:32
  I mean, it was just, let's hear it on the radio.
• 7:34
  And the first time we heard it on the radio, we were in a club in Bolton and we were so excited it was off the scale.
• 7:42
  So when it did start to move very quickly, it took three weeks, three, three jumps to get to number one, which was just hard to grasp really.
• 7:55
  So that.
• 7:56
  That kind of.
• 7:57
  It is a meteoric rise, isn't it?
• 7:59
  It's like an overnight success.
• 8:00
  What was it like being part of it?
• 8:03
  Well, we were the height of it.
• 8:04
  The touring.
• 8:05
  Yeah, I mean, we were instantly on whatever TV shows there were.
• 8:09
  I mean, obviously we'd done a couple.
• 8:11
  As it was going up, we'd start to get the TV shows off and so we've got all those.
• 8:16
  And obviously the gigs just became bigger.
• 8:18
  We got all these.
• 8:19
  Whatever we were doing to still to.
• 8:22
  To do, but the gigs got a bit bigger and obviously just more of them.
• 8:26
  I mean, at that time, you know, promoting your music was that you couldn't rely on the radio because it was quite restricted and there was only the BBC and you got bits of TV shows, but there's no video
• 8:40
  or anything.
• 8:41
  So really you're on the road and you're on the road all the time.
• 8:44
  And obviously when you get that kind of success, it's literally that they just cram every day full of.
• 8:51
  Full of gigs.
• 8:52
  So, yeah, it was very, very full on.
• 8:56
  And then, you know, quite quickly, within a month or so, we.
• 9:00
  We went over to New York for a week just to do promotion and that, and.
• 9:07
  And then within a couple of months, it all started over there as well.
• 9:10
  So.
• 9:11
  Fantastic.
• 9:12
  It's.
• 9:13
  Which we've not even.
• 9:14
  I don't think anybody had even thought about America.
• 9:17
  You know, when we started out, it was.
• 9:20
  It's not like now wave.
• 9:21
  It's like, you know, the Holy Grail.
• 9:23
  I mean, it was then the Holy Grail member.
• 9:25
  But we were a bit naive to sort of.
• 9:28
  To even think about it.
• 9:29
  Yeah, it really was a wave, wasn't it?
• 9:31
  It's like once.
• 9:32
  Once the floodgates opened, what was I going to say?
• 9:36
  Yeah, I was just reflecting, actually, what you were saying about the only way to get noticed was by being everywhere all at once.
• 9:42
  Yeah.
• 9:42
  And being honestly on the road.
• 9:44
  And in some ways that's kind of come full circle, isn't it?
• 9:47
  Because.
• 9:48
  Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 9:50
  For different reasons.
• 9:51
  Yeah, yeah.
• 9:52
  For more financial reasons.
• 9:53
  Because, you know, getting that cut of the royalties, it's the only way to.
• 9:59
  Make the money now is to go back on the road.
• 10:01
  Yeah.
• 10:02
  So you dead right?
• 10:04
  Yeah.
• 10:05
  Everybody is on the road.
• 10:07
  Amazing.
• 10:09
  So, Mrs.
• 10:10
  Brown, you've got a Lovely Daughter, the song recorded with the band almost as an afterthought.
• 10:14
  Am I correct in that?
• 10:15
  Well, it was.
• 10:17
  I mean, the.
• 10:17
  The origins of it were really weird.
• 10:19
  I mean, the band, they were doing it when I joined the band, so I didn't know what the hell it was.
• 10:24
  And it was actually written for a drama, a television drama.
• 10:29
  Right.
• 10:30
  And it was written as the.
• 10:32
  Over the closing credits and Tom Courtney was in the drama and he sang this song and obviously they put it out as a single and somebody in the band, or Peter, I don't know, somebody heard it.
• 10:44
  Oh, it's a novelty.
• 10:45
  We'll do that.
• 10:46
  So he used to dress up with the short pants and the satchel and the little school cap, you know, and.
• 10:51
  And they'd do this song.
• 10:52
  So I.
• 10:53
  You know.
• 10:54
  Okay, right.
• 10:54
  So I learned the song and it was a banjo in the.
• 10:57
  In the.
• 10:58
  In this.
• 10:58
  On the record.
• 10:59
  Well, of course, we didn't have a banjo, so I had buy this Gretch Country Gentleman, which has dampers that you just wind up, so it's permanently damped, which was the closest we got.
• 11:11
  And that was.
• 11:11
  That was the sound.
• 11:12
  So we.
• 11:13
  We did it on stage and that.
• 11:14
  And when we got to, we'd had the success of I'm Into Something Good, and Mickey said, right, we need to do an album, like, quite quickly.
• 11:22
  So we do it.
• 11:23
  And we didn't have a massive repertoire and in fact, we'd run out of songs we could do.
• 11:27
  And he said, well, we need another one.
• 11:29
  And he said, well, we've only got this, but we can't do this, you know, so.
• 11:33
  So we played it for him and he said, that's all right, we'll do that.
• 11:36
  So we did it like the last sort of quarter of an hour of the session.
• 11:42
  And that was.
• 11:42
  And that was it.
• 11:43
  And this was.
• 11:44
  This was probably a month, you know, late 64.
• 11:48
  And then of course, the middle of the next year when this album had finally come out in America by the summer and it was some.
• 11:56
  A DJ in the Midwest somewhere obviously took a fancy to it and started playing it a lot.
• 12:01
  Got all these calls and all this thing.
• 12:03
  Then it's rippled out and all over the place to live the orders for it as a single, you know, we're getting bigger and bigger.
• 12:12
  And we said, no, no, no.
• 12:13
  And Mickey said, no, no, no, you know, and.
• 12:16
  And in the end he just caved in.
• 12:18
  He said, if it gets to this ridiculous number, okay, we'll put it out.
• 12:22
  And of course he did.
• 12:23
  So it got to a huge amount of advanced orders.
• 12:29
  We put it out.
• 12:30
  It nearly went in the top five in Billboard, which was unheard of.
• 12:34
  It's a very slow moving chart.
• 12:36
  You go up it bit by bit, and this thing came in within the top six and then went to number one.
• 12:43
  So it put you immediately.
• 12:47
  I mean, America's such a big place.
• 12:49
  It was recorded for the end credits of a TV show, but then you made the film.
• 12:57
  So was that related to the TV show or what?
• 13:00
  How did that come.
• 13:00
  No, no, the TV show was a drama.
• 13:02
  I mean, I've not.
• 13:03
  I've never seen it.
• 13:04
  But the TV, the, the The play and the song were written by Trevor Peacock.
• 13:10
  Trevor Peacock, if you follow the Vicar of Dibley, is the guy in it.
• 13:16
  No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
• 13:17
  That's.
• 13:19
  That's Trevor Peacock.
• 13:21
  So at the time he was a playwright doing, you know, series plays and that.
• 13:26
  And this was a seriou drama and that.
• 13:30
  So he'd written that and he'd written this song.
• 13:33
  So we'd.
• 13:34
  Our first foray into moviemaking was in Hollywood and it was such a fiasco.
• 13:41
  I mean, we made the film, but as an experience, it was a joke.
• 13:45
  So we said, look, if we've got to do another one, which we did.
• 13:49
  We knew we got a second one, we're not doing it, we want to do it in England.
• 13:54
  And we asked Trevor Peacock to write the script, because he did.
• 13:57
  So we went out, had a few jars with him and, and, and he came up with this story, you know, and, and what we were concerned about, I mean, in the.
• 14:07
  The first movie we were ourselves, meaning we were a band with a hit record.
• 14:12
  Da da da da da.
• 14:13
  You know, so.
• 14:15
  And we said, well, if we've got to do another one, we don't want that.
• 14:18
  We'd rather be just, you know, okay, we could be a band, but we're not super successful.
• 14:22
  We're just all scratching around, you know.
• 14:24
  And so that's what he came up with.
• 14:27
  And then, you know, Mrs.
• 14:28
  Brown was this greyhound dog which was totally useless as a greyhound.
• 14:34
  So that's how we ended up in Shepperton for six weeks.
• 14:38
  Yeah, lovely segue shot here at Shepperton Studios in 1968.
• 14:44
  7...
• 14:44
  1967.
• 14:46
  Oh, it came out in 68.
• 14:47
  Very happy.
• 14:49
  So let's talk about what you remember about being here in Shepperton.
• 14:53
  What it was like walking around this stretch of Middlesex as a young pop star making a movie.
• 15:00
  What stuck with you?
• 15:01
  I mean, we talked about the Ship, didn't we?
• 15:03
  Should we.
• 15:03
  Should we start?
• 15:04
  Yeah, well, to start with, we.
• 15:06
  We stayed.
• 15:07
  I don't think we were in it very long.
• 15:08
  Cause we kind of upset the owner and probably a bit raucous and very late at night.
• 15:13
  So we decided it was better to get out of there.
• 15:16
  So we went to the Warren Lodge in Church Square.
• 15:19
  And that was completely different.
• 15:22
  And the guy that was looking after that was just wonderful.
• 15:26
  You know, he put up with everything.
• 15:27
  And then when it got too late, he just went to bed and we just like, you know, wrote everything down that we did.
• 15:33
  And he was always there at 6 o' clock making us a breakfast, you know, and we had a fantastic time there.
• 15:39
  And of course, there was quite a lot of guys in the business that lived locally.
• 15:45
  You know, a couple of the Kinks were in and out of there, and Roger Daltrey and a couple of boxers.
• 15:52
  Can't remember the name now, but they were in there.
• 15:54
  So the.
• 15:55
  The nights were always fantastic.
• 15:58
  We had a lovely time.
• 15:59
  It was.
• 16:00
  It was a very hot summer.
• 16:02
  It was like it.
• 16:02
  Like it is now.
• 16:03
  It's so I remember the.
• 16:05
  The weather as well.
• 16:06
  So.
• 16:07
  Yeah, it was the Warren Lodge.
• 16:09
  Apart from the Sunday morning with the bells, the church bells.
• 16:12
  We could have done without that, but.
• 16:14
  But it was a fantastic experience.
• 16:17
  Yeah.
• 16:18
  So you were hanging out with these people just because they were also staying in the hotel.
• 16:23
  No, no, they were.
• 16:24
  They were just.
• 16:25
  They've just come in for a drink at night, you know, because they live not far away.
• 16:28
  Right.
• 16:29
  Wow.
• 16:30
  Amazing.
• 16:31
  Yeah.
• 16:32
  So what, what would be a typical filming day then?
• 16:34
  Would you have someone pick you up and.
• 16:36
  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 16:37
  They pick us up at probably six o' clock and, you know, head off, you get some breakfast on the film set and whatever we're doing, you know, parts of it.
• 16:49
  Originally they were going to shoot some of it in Manchester, but that went by the board.
• 16:52
  So we did it all either in Shepperton or in central London.
• 16:56
  There was.
• 16:57
  There was a few bits where we were in London for the day, you know, or train station and places around.
• 17:04
  So, yeah, it's quite an experience.
• 17:06
  Stanley Holloway, lovely man and his sort of people.
• 17:10
  Mona Washburn and Lance Percival So all these guys from the, from the mid-60s.
• 17:18
  Yeah.
• 17:19
  So what was the filming schedule like?
• 17:21
  Was it quite, you know, an intense, you know, regime?
• 17:28
  Well, I don't remember as intense.
• 17:30
  It was.
• 17:32
  It was.
• 17:33
  Well, you know, what film is like, it's very slow.
• 17:35
  You.
• 17:35
  You do better then you've got to wait for hours while we set it up again and then you do.
• 17:39
  You do that, you know.
• 17:40
  So.
• 17:41
  No, I don't remember.
• 17:42
  Intense.
• 17:42
  It would.
• 17:43
  I think we enjoyed it.
• 17:44
  We just did as best we could, you know, nobody.
• 17:47
  We had an equity card.
• 17:48
  But really that, that was our acting abilities.
• 17:51
  That was.
• 17:51
  That was about the limit.
• 18:40
  And was it all on...
• 18:42
  within the studio's ground?
• 18:44
  Did you go out and film?
• 18:46
  Yeah, we filmed a lot in London.
• 18:49
  I think there was a few bits around Shepperton somewhere, just in greenery somewhere.
• 18:53
  Seems to remember there was one bit in King's Cross station and another bit involving sort of fruit and veg barrows that were somewhere in London, I have no idea where in central London.
• 19:09
  Oh, and the greyhound truck, Catford.
• 19:11
  So.
• 19:11
  Because it was a greyhound, Mrs.
• 19:13
  Brown.
• 19:14
  So, yeah, we had a couple of days there trying to get this dog.
• 19:19
  We couldn't even get the dog to follow the rabbit.
• 19:22
  We got a real duff greyhound.
• 19:25
  So yeah, we were out and about a little bit there.
• 19:28
  Yeah.
• 19:30
  So are there any other, like, funny little memories from recording the film?
• 19:38
  Of course.
• 19:38
  The other thing we had to do, we had to.
• 19:39
  We had to record the music for it.
• 19:41
  So on various days we'd, we'd be into the studio doing a bits of the soundtrack for it.
• 19:52
  Under the next lot they were shooting Oliver, the original Oliver film.
• 19:59
  So that was going on at the same time.
• 20:01
  So we'd wander over there and, you know, sit and watch them.
• 20:05
  And of course you've got all these 8 year old, 8, 8 going on 28 year old kids.
• 20:12
  They're all very seasoned and old hands.
• 20:16
  So that was great.
• 20:18
  Did they come out of character and they'd all be very posh or.
• 20:22
  No.
• 20:23
  Yeah, they were, they were wonderful.
• 20:25
  It was, it was a great experience watching all that.
• 20:28
  Obviously it was completely different to what we were doing, you know, with proper access.
• 20:32
  Fantastic.
• 20:33
  Oh, that's lovely.
• 20:35
  So any other kind of landmarks around Shepperton that you remember?
• 20:40
  Did you kind of keep to the square?
• 20:42
  Did you go down by the lock?
• 20:43
  Did you go up the High Street?
• 20:45
  You know.
• 20:46
  Yeah, I don't think we went up the High Street a lot.
• 20:48
  I mean, I think because most of the days were, you know, were full.
• 20:52
  So it really just.
• 20:53
  The nights, I seem to remember, we did go down the road.
• 20:57
  We went to see somebody who can't remember the name of the little village now, but it was like the next village, perhaps.
• 21:04
  No, not, no, not that well.
• 21:06
  Walton.
• 21:08
  Walton.
• 21:08
  Walton on Thames.
• 21:09
  Yeah, Walton on Thames.
• 21:10
  There was somebody living down there.
• 21:11
  I don't know if it was Tom Jones, it was somebody that we had a night out with down there, but most of it from the memory, we were just at the hotel, you know, by the time we got
• 21:22
  back there and had to eat, you know, it was.
• 21:25
  So we didn't really venture, I don't think, far, far from there.
• 21:30
  And the, the days obviously were.
• 21:33
  The time, you know, was, was pretty full, so there wasn't a lot of spare time, as it were.
• 21:39
  Yeah, yeah.
• 21:40
  So going from touring stadiums to composing music for kids TV.
• 21:46
  Yeah.
• 21:46
  And of course we are now in that marvelous little club that we've both.
• 21:51
  Yeah.
• 21:52
  Contributed to the Wind in the Willows.
• 21:54
  Yeah.
• 21:54
  Which is such a wonderful, wonderful thing.
• 21:59
  So let's see, you didn't go straight into it.
• 22:04
  How did the second career start?
• 22:05
  What was the shift like?
• 22:07
  Right.
• 22:07
  What happened was, while we were still in the band, Lek and I, the guitarist, there was a period where Peter got a film.
• 22:16
  He had three months to go and shoot a film.
• 22:19
  So obviously we're not working.
• 22:21
  And we said, right, we should, we should do something.
• 22:23
  So we built a studio and we didn't know what we were going to do with it, but we built a studio and and then, and then we went back on the road, you know, after three months.
• 22:34
  But we got this guy in to run it who'd been a previous roadie of ours, but he was ended up as a disc jockey so he was quite commercially minded.
• 22:45
  So we did all that and then by the time the band had sort of fizzled out and, and I was about to leave it, you know, we, it.
• 22:54
  It got to the point of doing bits and pieces for commercial, not commercial radio because I haven't started them but you know, commercial TV.
• 23:01
  So we did that.
• 23:02
  Lek decided it wasn't for him so he bowed out.
• 23:05
  And I got the guy that had started my first band with at school, Malcolm.
• 23:10
  I rang him, I said, what you doing?
• 23:12
  He wasn't doing much.
• 23:13
  So I said come in here and do this and I said, you might have to write a few tunes.
• 23:18
  You know, we'd never written any tunes.
• 23:19
  He said.
• 23:20
  I said don't worry, it'll be all right.
• 23:21
  And it's because I was going to go back on the road.
• 23:23
  So he sort of took over the day to day thing a bit by bit.
• 23:26
  We were doing stuff for commercial TV and, and demos and things.
• 23:33
  And then we happened to meet in a, an edit room I think in Manchester.
• 23:39
  We met Mark hall and Brian Cosgrove and this was at the time where they were just about to leave Granada where they were both employed and start their own company.
• 23:52
  And that's how we got in with them and we did, we did the music.
• 23:55
  They did a, an initial series called Sally and Jake.
• 23:59
  So we did all the music for it.
• 24:00
  We did a single for it which I sang.
• 24:03
  We did an album for it and all this stuff, you know, and this was an ITV series and that was all very good but unfortunately they'd, they'd gone into business with a, a guy in Manchester who had a,
• 24:19
  you know, a production company and the business wise for them it didn't work out so they, they then chopped everything and started again.
• 24:28
  And that's when they, they started as Cosgrove Hall.
• 24:31
  Initially they were called Stop Frame and so they, they started again in Chorlton with the backing of Thames TV and you know, proceeded to make all these different films.
• 24:43
  So, you know, we were, we were quite involved with them.
• 24:46
  And then at one point Mark hall rang up and said, can you come and talk to me about this project that they were going to do?
• 24:54
  And he said, I want you to do the music.
• 24:57
  This was for the Wind in the Willows.
• 25:00
  There wasn't a pitch or anything.
• 25:01
  He just said, I want you to do music.
• 25:03
  How he got the, you know, the confidence to.
• 25:06
  Because the stuff we'd done at that point was absolutely nothing like the Wind in the Willows.
• 25:10
  You know, it was all very kidsy.
• 25:12
  And so anyway, he did.
• 25:14
  And not only that, he wanted us to do the music first, not last.
• 25:19
  So they wanted to animate to the music, as it were, you know.
• 25:23
  So we did all these pieces of music.
• 25:26
  It was totally orchestral, which was, you know, a bit of a departure for us.
• 25:31
  And that was the start.
• 25:32
  That was the feature film that we did.
• 25:33
  And then we did like 65 episodes of afterwards of half hour episodes.
• 25:40
  And it was just, as you say, I was privileged to actually be involved with it.
• 25:45
  And.
• 25:46
  And the quality of the whole thing, you know, the acting, the writing was just phenomenal to the point where with the feature film, we said, you know, this is so good.
• 25:58
  Can we make an audio version of it and use everything we want from the film?
• 26:03
  So I found a guy who had heard on Radio 4 to use as a narrator to link the bits, because obviously this was going to be like 45 minutes long, not 90 minutes long.
• 26:15
  And so we very carefully put this thing together.
• 26:18
  We used dialogue from the film, we used sound effects from the film, the music.
• 26:24
  And, you know, in between we'd have this narrator link here all together.
• 26:28
  So we put this out as an album, a vinyl album to start with, and a cassette.
• 26:33
  And that.
• 26:34
  That was that.
• 26:34
  And then gradually, of course, over the years, it then became a cd.
• 26:39
  And this CD is still.
• 26:42
  I mean, I sent two to Australia yesterday.
• 26:45
  They just.
• 26:46
  I mean, it's not hundreds of them, but it's constant, you know, and it's.
• 26:49
  It's lovely.
• 26:50
  And people write back and say, oh, you know, this was my childhood.
• 26:54
  And so it was a very, very special gig to do.
• 27:00
  Yeah, we're very lucky.
• 27:02
  Yeah, it's one of those brands, you know, some British brands don't do so well overseas because it's very kind of UK centric.
• 27:12
  But Wind of the Willows is one of those exceptions, isn't it, where people just know it all around the world.
• 27:18
  And it's.
• 27:19
  It seems to be every.
• 27:21
  You pick up a newspaper somewhere and there'll be just some passing reference to something, either whether it's toad or the wind in the world or Kenneth Graham, you know, that is sort of constantly in and out of the
• 27:32
  news, you know.
• 27:32
  So it's, it's very.
• 27:34
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 27:35
  So you've written for that, you've written for the BFG.
• 27:39
  Amazing.
• 27:41
  Yeah, the BFG was just, I mean we didn't really, I mean we knew that was going to be a bit more of a difficult thing.
• 27:48
  So that was a bit of a pitch that, that we had to do.
• 27:51
  But then the interesting thing about that was we, we, we got the, we got the job.
• 27:56
  And there was one part in it, in where in the script it was just a blank page and this was the whizz popping part of the book because at that point they had quite figured out how to address
• 28:10
  the farting issue, you know.
• 28:12
  So, so Malcolm, my writing part.
• 28:17
  Yeah, he was, he was a wordsmith.
• 28:19
  He was, he was very good with words.
• 28:21
  And, and he came over one day, he was living in Wales and I was in England.
• 28:25
  So he, he'd driven all the way over about two hours, you know, very excited.
• 28:29
  He said, I've got something, I've got something.
• 28:30
  So he played me, he'd written all.
• 28:32
  He had to stop in a lay by and write some of this down, you know.
• 28:35
  And then he got, he got to where I was, we put it down and we eventually made a demo.
• 28:40
  I wrote a chorus for it and, and we presented them with this demo and said, how about this for the blank page?
• 28:47
  You know, at that point we thought, well, it won't work because you know, when you're doing that sort of presenting to the writers and producers, it's usually, well, thanks, but you know, no thanks, you know.
• 28:57
  Anyway, much to our surprise, at the end of the day they thought, yeah, this three minute song actually addresses the whole thing and you know, takes the edge off the, all the noises, you know.
• 29:08
  Yeah.
• 29:09
  So we did it and then they said, well, if we're going to have one song, we should have another song.
• 29:13
  You can't just have one song in a, in a movie, you know.
• 29:16
  So we then had to write another one for the dream sequence towards the end.
• 29:21
  So it was, yeah, it was a great gig and we did half of it.
• 29:25
  The idea was to do the sort of giant land sequences all with very synthetic, you know.
• 29:33
  And the guy we were working with at that point had just got this fairlight which was like a monster.
• 29:39
  Yeah.
• 29:41
  And, and the, the other bits in England were all totally orchestral.
• 29:45
  So it was, it was a mix of the two.
• 29:48
  But yeah, great experience.
• 29:50
  The, the fairlight, of course.
• 29:52
  Responsible for most of the 80s output of music.
• 29:56
  Oh yeah, it's all treble stuff and all that.
• 30:00
  Yeah.
• 30:02
  Okay.
• 30:03
  You wrote a memoir in recent times.
• 30:06
  Yeah, Hermit's Tale.
• 30:08
  What keeps you writing and creating after all these years?
• 30:13
  I don't know.
• 30:14
  Yeah, I don't know.
• 30:15
  It's just, it's what I do, it's what I like doing.
• 30:19
  I don't have any hobbies.
• 30:20
  You know, the, the, the, the music is really the work and a, and a hobby.
• 30:25
  I'd be very lucky to work on a lot of these shows that were just very enjoyable, you know, I mean they didn't Bob the Builder for seven years, but that was just.
• 30:34
  To me it was just like creating country music all the time.
• 30:38
  You know, there's nothing very, there was nothing very kidsy about the music.
• 30:42
  I think if it had been one of those shows where it had to be tinkle, tinkle and varied and then seven years of that would probably been a bit of a trial.
• 30:51
  But this was just very enjoyable and a fantastic quality of, you know, the, the acting in it and the writing.
• 31:01
  So I've been extremely lucky, you know, Pingu, that, that was just a joy.
• 31:08
  So I don't know, it's just.
• 31:11
  I enjoy doing it and you know, when I started doing my own stuff during the COVID thing, we did an album because we've still got a market in America for all this stuff and you know, my son said,
• 31:23
  well, this we should do.
• 31:24
  We don't need a record company anymore, we just do it and you know, put it out.
• 31:28
  So, so we did that, that went quite well and so I've just carried on doing that sort of songs here and there for it.
• 31:38
  Did the book been over to America a month or so ago for a, an event there convention thing and, and I nearly did a gig with.
• 31:49
  With Peter because he still works all the time in America.
• 31:54
  But in the end the weather didn't help us so we'll have to do that another time.
• 31:58
  But yeah, lots going on.
• 32:02
  Fabulous.
• 32:04
  Okay, so the final question, which may or may not be difficult, if you could tell that 21 year old version of yourself filming at Shepperton in 1967, anything about where the journey was going to take him, what would
• 32:19
  that be?
• 32:20
  Well, that the journey's a bit of an unknown, but I think you've, you've got to follow your own belief and have confidence in what you do and you've got to look out for the opportunities.
• 32:32
  You know, I mean my big leg up was obviously it was being in the band and establishing that.
• 32:39
  But then after that you've got to go out and look for it and if it's really what you want to do then, and you're any good at it, then there's no, nothing to stop you.
• 32:51
  But you've got to use, you know, use the advantages that you got and just look for every opportunity, really.
• 32:59
  It's.
• 33:00
  And good luck.
• 33:01
  It's not easy.
• 33:03
  It's not easy, as, you know, as I know.
• 33:07
  Yeah, yeah, no, but I really.
• 33:09
  Yeah, I relate to that answer because you, you had the nous to go, right, I'm going to set up a production company, I'm going to build a studio.
• 33:17
  So you.
• 33:18
  Yeah, yeah.
• 33:19
  A lot of people probably wouldn't have that kind of sense of forethought.
• 33:23
  No, I mean, it was good at the time.
• 33:25
  Looking back on it, it was.
• 33:26
  It was a very good thing to do, you know, I mean, and we were only sort of doing it.
• 33:32
  I mean, Lek and I used to write songs on.
• 33:34
  On the road, so we, you know, we.
• 33:36
  We did a lot of that.
• 33:37
  And at the time we were recording these demos in my attic, I had a Vortexian recorder which was massive and weighed about as much as a small Volkswagen, you know, and it was just quarter inch and you just
• 33:51
  add it and I don't know, you know, that sort of thing.
• 33:54
  And, and that was part of it.
• 33:56
  We said, look, we've got three months.
• 33:58
  Why don't we, you know, find a little space, build a studio and then we could do these.
• 34:02
  Not in your asset and in the studio, you know, so that was the initial thing, but also partly just to say, well, then it's another string to the bow.
• 34:11
  The studio itself, not our songs.
• 34:13
  And.
• 34:14
  Yeah, and, and it, and it proved to, to work like that, you know, I'd got no idea at that point that we'd end up, you know, doing commercials and, you know, and of course, when it then went into
• 34:26
  the 70s and late 70s, we.
• 34:29
  We moved from this tiny little place in Stockport into Central Manchester, a 5,000ft facility, two studios, and made soundtracks to like a gazillion commercials, TV commercials, you know, that's what, that's what got the whole thing going, as well
• 34:48
  as doing all this animation stuff.
• 34:50
  So, yeah, it built up quite a head of steam until the late 80s when we came out here.
• 34:58
  Fantastic.
• 34:59
  Oh, that's brilliant.
• 35:03
  That was Keith Hopwood, from the Manchester club circuit to a number one on both sides of the Atlantic.
• 35:09
  From filming at the legendary Shepperton Studios in the 60s to decades of composing for some of the best loved shows on television.
• 35:17
  If you want more, his memoir is called A Hermit's Tale.
• 35:21
  Well worth a read.
• 35:22
  Thanks again to the businesses supporting the Sheppertonian through the Business Club.
• 35:26
  Their support keeps this podcast rooted in the community.
• 35:29
  I'm Gareth.
• 35:30
  This has been the Sheppertonian, and until next time, I'll see you around.