Latest / The Restaurant Guys / Restaurant Trends That Don’t Add Up | Inside Track

Transcript

Restaurant Trends That Don’t Add Up | Inside Track · The Restaurant Guys

• 0:42
  Mark: Hello everybody, and welcome.
• 0:43
  Mark: You are listening to The Restaurant Guys.
• 0:46
  Mark: I'm Mark Pascal and I'm
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: and I'm here with
• 0:47
  Mark: Schott.
• 0:48
  Mark: Together we own Stage Left and Catherine Lombardi restaurants in
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: in New Brunswick, New Jersey.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: We're here to bring
• 0:53
  Mark: the inside track on
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: food, wine,
• 0:56
  Mark: and the finer
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: things in life.
• 0:57
  Francis: are you today?
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: Francis, I'm well.
• 0:59
  Francis: well.
• 0:59
  Francis: I am very excited.
• 1:01
  Francis: Our guests today are two of my favorite people.
• 1:03
  Francis: Um,
• 1:04
  Speaker 4: so
• 1:04
  Francis: start out normally with a little banter between Mark and Francis, and then after the break we'll come back and we'll be interviewing Mark and Francis.
• 1:11
  Mark: know what's ironic about that?
• 1:13
  Mark: What?
• 1:13
  Mark: One of my favorite people will
• 1:14
  Francis: favorite
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: on
• 1:15
  Mark: today.
• 1:15
  Mark: Thank
• 1:15
  Francis: be on.
• 1:16
  Mark: Thank you, for
• 1:17
  Speaker 4: you for your high opinion of me.
• 1:18
  Francis: Uh, yeah, so every once in a while people ask all the time, they're like,"Can you guys do just a, a you guys only show?" So we got a few things to catch up on, so it's
• 1:26
  Speaker 4: it's just focused
• 1:26
  Francis: us.
• 1:27
  Francis: Um, and the other, my fa- another favorite part of the show today is we're gonna get to drink on the podcast.
• 1:33
  Francis: Yay.
• 1:33
  Francis: it's it's good.
• 1:35
  Francis: So we have to say a special shout-out thank you to, our, longtime listener and friend, one of our regular listeners
• 1:42
  Speaker 4: from the
• 1:42
  Francis: birth of the podcast on the radio
• 1:44
  Speaker 4: Way back.
• 1:44
  Speaker 4: One of the first- way
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: back machine
• 1:45
  Speaker 4: when podcasts were new.
• 1:46
  Francis: Kelvin has, Sent us a- an
• 1:48
  Speaker 4: an article.
• 1:49
  Speaker 4: He often sends us stuff that we sometimes
• 1:51
  Francis: on the show, and do on the show, and he's...
• 1:52
  Speaker 4: he's,
• 1:52
  Francis: and he wrote about
• 1:54
  Speaker 4: the the rebirth of this Hawaiian spirit.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: Um,
• 1:57
  Speaker 4: I'm
• 1:58
  Francis: I'm gonna butcher the pronunciation but I'm gonna give it my best.
• 2:00
  Francis: It's ʻōkalāhau, I think is how
• 2:02
  Speaker 4: how it's pronounced, and it
• 2:04
  Francis: made from, a root in Hawaii that is fermented
• 2:08
  Speaker 4: and then distilled.
• 2:09
  Francis: it went away for a long time and there's been a real revival of the Hawaiian Native Spirit.
• 2:13
  Francis: It is pretty much the only alcohol of Hawaiian Native Spirit.
• 2:16
  Francis: And we'll tell you the story later.
• 2:17
  Francis: So anyway, I love Calvin.
• 2:19
  Francis: I've always loved Calvin.
• 2:20
  Francis: He's visited us
• 2:20
  Speaker 4: us here,
• 2:21
  Francis: come to the restaurant many times.
• 2:23
  Francis: We've actually visited him in Chicago.
• 2:25
  Mark: we'll be out there again for Martini
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: Expo.
• 2:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 2:27
  Mark: us there.
• 2:28
  Francis: there.
• 2:28
  Francis: Yeah.
• 2:29
  Francis: what I love about Kelvin though, he sent us this article on the, and it was about how this new distillery, the Ola Distillery, was gonna make the best ever there.
• 2:38
  Francis: And, their initial bottling was gonna be numbered bottles that went to people who kinda crowdfunded and became early investors in
• 2:45
  Speaker 4: in spirit.
• 2:46
  Francis: And then he sent us a
• 2:47
  Mark: He's like that.
• 2:48
  Francis: so I'm looking at this bottle of a
• 2:50
  Mark: By the way, if you ever
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: By the way, if you ever wanna become friends with the
• 2:52
  Mark: Guys, sending a bottle is the best
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: way.
• 2:55
  Francis: Or a box of cash.
• 2:56
  Francis: We will also take a
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: a box of cash.
• 2:58
  Speaker 4: No,
• 2:59
  Francis: so Calvin, thank you.
• 3:00
  Francis: we got...
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: So
• 3:01
  Francis: pre-release we learned about it.
• 3:03
  Francis: We're gonna talk about it on the show anyway.
• 3:05
  Francis: And I think these first number bottles you had to be a member to get this first release.
• 3:09
  Francis: It's a big deal.
• 3:10
  Francis: There's a visitor center.
• 3:11
  Francis: You can- We'll put the
• 3:12
  Speaker 4: link in the show notes where you can
• 3:13
  Francis: to the, distillery.
• 3:14
  Francis: When
• 3:14
  Mark: the Restaurant Guys go to Hawaii,
• 3:16
  Francis: Yeah, it's in Hilo on the Big Island.
• 3:19
  Francis: right on the
• 3:19
  Speaker 4: on the water.
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: It's supposed to be great.
• 3:21
  Speaker 4: Um, anyway, so- I
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: hope it doesn't suck.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: It
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: c- exactly.
• 3:23
  Speaker 4: Boy-
• 3:24
  Francis: c- Yeah, exactly.
• 3:24
  Francis: Boy.
• 3:24
  Francis: Uh, we're gonna tr- If you're hearing this show, it doesn't suck.
• 3:27
  Francis: Uh, but if it, if it, does, Jennifer's gonna trash it.
• 3:29
  Francis: So we've opened this beautiful box.
• 3:32
  Mark: And I'm opening the, certificate of authenticity that comes with the box.
• 3:38
  Mark: We have bottle number 125 of 150.
• 3:41
  Mark: Wow,
• 3:41
  Francis: wow.
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: That's,
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: that's very special.
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: That feels special
• 3:43
  Speaker 4: That does feel special.
• 3:44
  Mark: That feels special.
• 3:45
  Francis: And we're gonna open this bottle.
• 3:47
  Francis: So they
• 3:47
  Speaker 4: they have rele- this isn't their first ever release.
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: They have released before.
• 3:50
  Speaker 4: They've won some great awards.
• 3:52
  Speaker 4: Oh, this,
• 3:52
  Francis: a, it's a sealed wax top, but
• 3:54
  Speaker 4: but they have conveniently made one that you can cut
• 3:56
  Francis: with a wine
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: opener.
• 3:58
  Francis: All right, let's
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: Let's see.
• 3:59
  Francis: Distilled from qui root.
• 4:02
  Speaker 4: K- oh, ki varietal.
• 4:03
  Speaker 4: I guess there are
• 4:04
  Francis: kinds of qui, like there's different kinds of,
• 4:06
  Mark: Yeah, I'm Very knowledgeable on
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: on this subject.
• 4:08
  Francis: not, we are not knowledgeable at all, but it, there must be different,
• 4:11
  Speaker 4: versions of it, you
• 4:12
  Francis: different kinds of mezcal.
• 4:14
  Mark: So that-
• 4:14
  Speaker 4: this is pretty cool.
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: So that-
• 4:16
  Mark: oak is gonna give a little bit of color, even if it's not for too, in there for too long
• 4:20
  Francis: it's really kind of a straw yellow
• 4:22
  Speaker 4: gold.
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's got a real whiskey vibe.
• 4:24
  Francis: Wow.
• 4:25
  Francis: I've never smelled anything like that.
• 4:27
  Francis: It's got a real whiskey vibe.
• 4:28
  Francis: It's almost got a scotch-like note to it.
• 4:30
  Francis: But it's, it's, it's
• 4:31
  Speaker 4: it's kinda honeyed.
• 4:32
  Mark: It's got definitely, you know, that honeysuckle
• 4:35
  Francis: and I say scotch'cause it's got kind of that
• 4:38
  Speaker 4: clover field, Mm-hmm clover kinda thing.
• 4:41
  Francis: Very gentle
• 4:42
  Speaker 4: for the-
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: Well, it's 41.7%, so-
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: Let's go.
• 4:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah
• 4:47
  Francis: A whole
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: new Richard
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: Ladies and
• 4:49
  Mark: we have a new category
• 4:50
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: I
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: mean- Which super,
• 4:53
  Mark: know, I, I get that, that smokiness that you would get from a scotch-
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: Right, right,
• 4:57
  Mark: But at the same time, I get that, that honey heather that, you get from an Irish
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: whiskey.
• 5:02
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 5:03
  Mark: You know, I got a little bit of that vibe in there at the same time, But I think more scotch-like than, than anything else.
• 5:10
  Francis: Time, but I think more scotch-like than, than anything else Yeah, but
• 5:10
  Speaker 4: but there's
• 5:10
  Francis: a...
• 5:11
  Francis: it's got
• 5:11
  Speaker 4: got a richness to it, and there's,
• 5:12
  Francis: there's that
• 5:13
  Speaker 4: core of honey, and
• 5:14
  Francis: a viscous r-
• 5:15
  Speaker 4: richness through it.
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: And
• 5:17
  Francis: finish goes on forever.
• 5:19
  Francis: I'm a sh- super big fan.
• 5:21
  Francis: I think they sell this for, like, 500 bucks
• 5:23
  Mark: bottle.
• 5:23
  Mark: This is really
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: cool.
• 5:24
  Speaker 4: I
• 5:24
  Francis: It's really cool.
• 5:24
  Francis: I think they sell this for, like, 500 bucks
• 5:25
  Mark: for like 500 bucks a bottle.
• 5:25
  Mark: It's a lot.
• 5:26
  Francis: It's a lot.
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: Um-
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: Well, we are drinking
• 5:31
  Mark: a hand-labeled, hand-bottled 125
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: 125
• 5:34
  Mark: of
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: of 150.
• 5:35
  Francis: Well, and I have to say, I'm an old, I'm a cynical old man, And this is a
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: a brand n- something brand new under the sun.
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: Uh, so- I'm, I'm very impressed
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: all right.
• 5:42
  Mark: So if you are a friend of mine
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: and you
• 5:45
  Mark: try this product, come in and, pour you a little sample.
• 5:47
  Mark: If you are not a friend of mine, I will tell you we're out of it.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: it.
• 5:50
  Francis: I, well, no,
• 5:51
  Speaker 4: no, so Here's the deal.
• 5:51
  Speaker 4: Here's what we're gonna do.
• 5:52
  Speaker 4: If
• 5:52
  Francis: a Restaurant Guys regular, and if you are a Restaurant Guys regular,
• 5:56
  Speaker 4: then within a month of or podcast,
• 5:58
  Francis: you
• 5:58
  Speaker 4: come into Stage Left in Catherine Lombardi
• 6:00
  Francis: ask for us." We're
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: usually here.
• 6:02
  Speaker 4: But whether we are or we're not, if you want,
• 6:04
  Francis: the
• 6:04
  Speaker 4: first two people who are Restaurant Guys regulars
• 6:06
  Francis: in and ask for
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: for a little,
• 6:08
  Francis: little
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: taste of this, we will pour you a little- We'll pour,
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: you
• 6:10
  Mark: we'll pour you a little half ounce until we can't pour you a little half ounce anymore.
• 6:13
  Francis: Yeah, well no, first five guys.
• 6:15
  Francis: I'm
• 6:15
  Speaker 4: I'm drinking the rest.
• 6:15
  Speaker 4: You
• 6:16
  Francis: I'm only giving the first five
• 6:17
  Mark: drinking it.
• 6:17
  Mark: We can't, we're only getting the first five guys.
• 6:17
  Mark: I didn't say why we
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: can't
• 6:19
  Francis: I was gonna say, when, why we can't have nice things?
• 6:19
  Francis: Yeah.
• 6:19
  Francis: Oh, there, there you go.
• 6:20
  Francis: All right, so let's tell everybody about this spirit,'cause I was fascinated to learn about it.
• 6:23
  Francis: So it's the Ola Distillery in Hilo.
• 6:26
  Francis: and what this is from
• 6:27
  Speaker 4: from the ki root.
• 6:28
  Speaker 4: So the ki root,
• 6:29
  Francis: K-I,
• 6:30
  Speaker 4: is native
• 6:31
  Francis: the Hawaiian Island chain, and it
• 6:33
  Speaker 4: it was
• 6:33
  Francis: produced throughout the Hawaiian Islands.........pre-European contact, right?
• 6:37
  Francis: So it was
• 6:38
  Speaker 4: fermented, slightly
• 6:40
  Francis: 'cause it has an okay sugar content, But it was a lightly fermented beverage.
• 6:43
  Francis: It
• 6:44
  Speaker 4: It was really the only
• 6:45
  Francis: product that the native Hawaiians had on the, on the island, right?
• 6:48
  Francis: That's what I
• 6:48
  Speaker 4: I read.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 6:49
  Speaker 4: and then they encountered
• 6:51
  Francis: sailors who were like, Let's turn this up
• 6:53
  Mark: And then it
• 6:54
  Speaker 4: a bit," right?
• 6:55
  Speaker 4: And so it
• 6:55
  Mark: need more alcohol, less volume
• 6:57
  Francis: And then it became a stronger, uh, alcoholic product'cause they
• 7:01
  Speaker 4: they fermen- they- Mm-hmm......c- and concentrated sugars more and fermented it better, and then they distilled it.
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: And so this became,
• 7:07
  Francis: it's kind of a, a
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: confluence of the native
• 7:11
  Francis: and then meeting European
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: practices.
• 7:13
  Speaker 4: And the name comes from...
• 7:15
  Speaker 4: Okole Hao
• 7:16
  Francis: means iron butt
• 7:18
  Speaker 4: because they
• 7:18
  Francis: ferment it in iron, rounded pots.
• 7:21
  Francis: And what everybody does- Yeah, that's what it meant.
• 7:22
  Francis: And what
• 7:22
  Speaker 4: I'm, glad that's
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: what it meant
• 7:23
  Speaker 4: and, And what everybody doesn't know is- that was also Mark's nickname in high school- Iron,
• 7:28
  Francis: iron butt.
• 7:28
  Francis: Okay, there you go.
• 7:30
  Speaker 4: so what emerged
• 7:30
  Francis: the iron butts was kind of, a
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: moonshine.
• 7:34
  Speaker 4: I'm
• 7:34
  Francis: they weren't aging it in virgin oak barrels
• 7:37
  Speaker 4: in the, in the ships, but-
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: There's a
• 7:39
  Mark: part of the story though that I, that I'm enjoying.
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: This is in an old sugar
• 7:44
  Mark: that was built in 1924 is where the distillery is, and they've
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: they've
• 7:48
  Mark: of repurposed that old sugar factory to become this distillery, and, uh, just a
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: a cool story.
• 7:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 7:54
  Speaker 4: and if
• 7:54
  Francis: if you're
• 7:54
  Speaker 4: you're, down there,
• 7:55
  Francis: it's worth a visit.
• 7:55
  Francis: I'm gonna visit
• 7:56
  Mark: it
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: it if if I'm- For sure I'm out,
• 7:58
  Francis: it it looks beautiful and it's
• 7:59
  Speaker 4: it's a cool story and they, obviously were taking great care
• 8:03
  Francis: the fermentation.
• 8:03
  Francis: it's three different stills.
• 8:05
  Francis: They have two
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: two different kinds of continuous stills and a pot still.
• 8:08
  Francis: Uh, obviously they're taking a lot of care.
• 8:09
  Francis: It's
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: Has everyone tuned off yet?
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: Are we- I I just did.
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: Can I
• 8:12
  Mark: All right.
• 8:12
  Mark: They also make a smoked-
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: just...
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: Sorry.
• 8:12
  Francis: sorry.
• 8:13
  Francis: They
• 8:13
  Speaker 4: They
• 8:14
  Francis: make a smoked- version,'cause you were talking about smoky before.
• 8:16
  Francis: Yeah.
• 8:16
  Francis: This isn't that, with local woods.
• 8:19
  Speaker 4: And one of the cool things they do is when they make the spirit, they put it in barrels that they rotate every day.
• 8:27
  Francis: And so you read a lot about-
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: You mean like
• 8:29
  Mark: they
• 8:30
  Francis: You mean like riddling they rotate?
• 8:30
  Francis: yeah.
• 8:30
  Francis: yeah.
• 8:30
  Francis: They, they turn the barrel every day.
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: is, but you can't age things very long on islands
• 8:35
  Francis: a lot of wind, a lot of heat, a lot of dryness, you know.
• 8:38
  Francis: Seven years in there's nothing left
• 8:40
  Mark: the
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: in the barrel.
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: Right, evaporation.
• 8:41
  Speaker 4: You know?
• 8:41
  Francis: they turn it every day...and they're taking advantage of And one of the things they say, which is not what the indigenous spirit was when it wasn't aged in oak,
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: with the fact that oak respires, you know, that you get Mm-hmm......some respiration to it,
• 8:53
  Francis: the salty air, the tropical air, the tropical breezes
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: give it a unique
• 8:58
  Francis: like happens with some rums.
• 9:00
  Francis: but they also, they agitate it every day cause it
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: it does what those
• 9:03
  Francis: bottlings do.
• 9:04
  Francis: Like, so one of the things that's popular
• 9:07
  Speaker 4: is they've taken to
• 9:09
  Francis: aging a lot of different whiskeys on ships,
• 9:12
  Speaker 4: sending them around the world.
• 9:13
  Speaker 4: And one of the things that happens with them,
• 9:15
  Francis: they're in sealed containers, not oak, but one of the things that happens with them is they're agitated all the time'cause the boat is always moving, And they, conjecture that that has an effect on the spirit.
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: So-
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: So sitting next to you is a lot like me
• 9:27
  Mark: a whiskey on a
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: on a boat.
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: Why is that
• 9:28
  Mark: I'm agitated
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: all the time.
• 9:31
  Francis: I didn't see that coming.
• 9:33
  Francis: I'm really surprised.
• 9:34
  Francis: I'm
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: I'm really surprised.
• 9:35
  Francis: Um, but I don't roll you around, every day only'cause I can't.
• 9:38
  Francis: I
• 9:38
  Speaker 4: I would.
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: I would if I could.
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: Jefferson Ocean Aged Bourbon is tremendous,
• 9:43
  Francis: the cask
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: strength.
• 9:44
  Speaker 4: So we love the ocean
• 9:45
  Francis: trend.
• 9:46
  Francis: I I find that it does affect the spirit because we have a lot of-
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: lot
• 9:49
  Mark: gotta tell you, it was one of those things that I just thought was malarkey.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: And it,
• 9:53
  Mark: there it
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: it was.
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: it's great It produces great spirit.
• 9:56
  Francis: because you have the Jefferson regular right next to the Jefferson Ocean aged, and the only difference is one has been sent on a voyage for
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: for eight months.
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 10:03
  Francis: you're like, Oh, it's,
• 10:04
  Speaker 4: it's different." It's different.
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: Anyway, so-
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: No question it's different.
• 10:06
  Speaker 4: so they do that here.
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: Little bit of the history.
• 10:09
  Francis: it was lightly alcoholic, then it was greater alcoholic, then it was distilled, then it was banned
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: by King Kamehameha I.
• 10:18
  Speaker 4: 'cause everybody's getting
• 10:18
  Francis: on the island.
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: Then,
• 10:20
  Francis: the ban was lifted by King Kamehameha
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: So
• 10:24
  Mark: know what everybody in our generation
• 10:26
  Francis: you know what everybody in our generation knows about- Of
• 10:27
  Mark: course when you say King Kamehameha.
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: I don't know, Mark.
• 10:30
  Speaker 4: What's the story-
• 10:32
  Francis: of a man named Brady who was living with three boys of his own?
• 10:36
  Francis: All right, for All you young people, I wanna tell him of that Brady Bunch
• 10:39
  Mark: So they went to Hawaii and they found a King Kamehameha idol on the beach, and it turns out it was cursed.
• 10:48
  Mark: and Greg had a surfing accident, and then Peter got attacked by a, a, giant spider.
• 10:55
  Mark: And then all sorts of bad things happened until they returned the idol to its rightful
• 11:01
  Francis: So I don't know if you're familiar with the
• 11:03
  Speaker 4: the term jump
• 11:04
  Mark: shark.
• 11:04
  Mark: Do you know that, do
• 11:05
  Speaker 4: do you know
• 11:05
  Francis: that, do you know that term?
• 11:06
  Francis: Do you know what that
• 11:06
  Speaker 4: that means?
• 11:07
  Francis: so jump the shark means, like, when you've just gone too far.
• 11:11
  Francis: it's over, it's...
• 11:12
  Francis: And it was...
• 11:13
  Francis: So as the Happy Days franchise kept going, and they just ran out of stuff to write about, they went somewhere, and Fonzie not only is a motorcycle guy,
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: He was water skiing,
• 11:22
  Francis: and then there's a shark, and then Fonzie jumps the shark, He jumped the shark, and that was when everybody, even nine-year-olds were like,"Okay, this show's too stupid." I can't watch I can't
• 11:32
  Speaker 4: can't watch it anymore."
• 11:33
  Francis: And the similar episode for The Brady Bunch was the Hawaiian vacation with
• 11:36
  Mark: I loved...
• 11:37
  Mark: It
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: It was a two-parter.
• 11:39
  Speaker 4: Okay?
• 11:40
  Francis: I forgot
• 11:41
  Mark: loved that show.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: You're just not thinking like a 10-year-old
• 11:44
  Francis: just not thinking like a 10-year-old.
• 11:44
  Francis: Yeah, I know.
• 11:45
  Francis: I'm thinking like an old man, and to finish the history of this particular
• 11:49
  Speaker 4: spirit, in 1889 a smuggled bottle earned a bronze medal at the Paris Exposition,
• 11:55
  Francis: and so it had
• 11:56
  Speaker 4: international standing.
• 11:58
  Speaker 4: So
• 11:59
  Francis: what happens after World War
• 12:00
  Speaker 4: II.
• 12:00
  Francis: I- it was illegal.
• 12:02
  Speaker 4: moonshiners were doing it, some World War II people
• 12:05
  Francis: stationed there.
• 12:05
  Francis: My dad was actually stationed on Hawaii in World
• 12:07
  Speaker 4: World War
• 12:07
  Mark: So was Uncle Joe
• 12:09
  Speaker 4: never never heard of this spirit from either
• 12:11
  Francis: Joe or
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: or my dad.
• 12:12
  Speaker 4: but then it kind
• 12:13
  Francis: faded away completely,
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: like, if you were a tourist,
• 12:15
  Francis: you could buy a souvenir bottle.
• 12:17
  Francis: But what the souvenir bottles were, was they were, either bourbon or some other neutral spirit with some
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: extract
• 13:50
  Francis: of the ki root in it And so it wasn't really being made on any scale at all.
• 13:55
  Francis: Fakey
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: Fakey fake.
• 13:55
  Speaker 4: fakey fakey fakey, fake.
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: Um, and
• 13:57
  Francis: it's, I think it's really tremendous that,
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: you know,
• 14:01
  Francis: there's a a renaissance, if you will, of this,
• 14:03
  Mark: I'm
• 14:03
  Francis: uh, great
• 14:04
  Mark: a big fan of new categories, so let's go.
• 14:06
  Mark: Let's make 10 of
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: of these.
• 14:08
  Mark: Let's have 10 different versions
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: and
• 14:11
  Mark: out a new category.
• 14:12
  Francis: thanks Kelvin for
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: for sending it.
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: We're gonna be right back with our guests.
• 14:15
  Speaker 4: As you know, our favorite
• 14:16
  Francis: we ever have, us.
• 14:17
  Francis: So stick with us.
• 14:18
  Francis: we'll be
• 14:18
  Speaker 4: we'll be back in just a second.
• 14:20
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 14:20
  Speaker 4: Hey there, everybody.
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: Welcome back.
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: It's Mark and Francis.
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: So
• 14:23
  Francis: are we gonna talk about today, Mark?
• 14:24
  Francis: We have no guests, so we have to
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: to, like, talk about our own stuff.
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: You know, it's funny, we
• 14:28
  Mark: so
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: much stuff to talk about
• 14:30
  Mark: that we're like,
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: We need to do a show Right with just us
• 14:33
  Speaker 4: Right
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: because we have too many topics we wanna get to.
• 14:36
  Francis: Well,
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: the first thing I wanna talk about is I think the Green Star experiment was very interesting in the
• 14:43
  Francis: Guide,
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: and
• 14:45
  Francis: really nobody to talk about that with
• 14:46
  Speaker 4: with except Michelin.
• 14:47
  Francis: Michelin Man.
• 14:48
  Francis: We could have had the Michelin Man on the show, but, uh, he was unavailable
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: 'cause he doesn't really exist.
• 14:52
  Francis: So, um, let's talk about the Green Stars.
• 14:55
  Francis: Will you tell everyone
• 14:55
  Speaker 4: what Green Stars were?
• 14:56
  Mark: So Green Stars were a Michelin accolade that that you could earn by sourcing local and really focusing on your ingredients being sustainable, it more than that.
• 15:09
  Mark: also the way you treated your Oh, my
• 15:10
  Speaker 4: God, mental health of your employees overall.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: I just think that It, it really never had a chance, and I think the reason it never had a chance is because how could you...
• 15:22
  Mark: a lot of people
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: wanted to go for it, how could you vet them all?
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: There's so many metrics.
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: Dude, if two people wanted to go for it, how do
• 15:29
  Mark: vet them all?
• 15:29
  Mark: Well,
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: them all?
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: Well, you have a lot of,
• 15:31
  Mark: you had a lot of
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: of people trying to get a Green Michelin Star.
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: Our friend Michael Cimarusti at Providence a, a, Michelin Green Star.
• 15:37
  Speaker 4: and, and there's no doubt.
• 15:38
  Speaker 4: I mean, we know people who work for him now Mm-hmm and who used to work for him at a high level, and
• 15:41
  Francis: you know, he
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: really does everything to-
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: Right down to the, beehive on the roof.
• 15:46
  Francis: yeah.
• 15:47
  Speaker 4: I think it's good to recognize restaurants that do those things, but you know, when you're awarding a Michelin Star for service or, or a, a Bib Gourmand or multiple stars, it's about sending in a critic who judges what the diner's experience is with service and food.
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: That's pretty-
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: Judges the product.
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and you
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: may- They, they Judge the results.
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: And, and, you know, you can...
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: Y- you judge what the customer gets when they go- Mm-hmm.
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: into the dining room, And you may get that wrong.
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: You may visit on three bad nights.
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: You might have a
• 16:16
  Francis: that's
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: not that good, but Michelin Star...
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: Michelin was always known for having great reviewers who remained anonymous, who visited several times, and, you
• 16:24
  Francis: could judge a product.
• 16:25
  Francis: But if you're
• 16:26
  Speaker 4: trying to judge all those other things,
• 16:28
  Francis: you gotta send in somebody to, like, cross-reference receipts,......uh, do mental health
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: checks on the employ- It
• 16:34
  Francis: foolish endeavor, I think,
• 16:35
  Speaker 4: and
• 16:36
  Francis: the way they
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: did it
• 16:37
  Francis: they were like,
• 16:38
  Speaker 4: Oh, well, we, you answer a
• 16:41
  Francis: Now, no one has ever lied on
• 16:42
  Speaker 4: on a questionnaire as far as we know.
• 16:45
  Speaker 4: But might they exaggerate?
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: But
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: you know they vetted some of that, you know- Yeah, but- You know from talking to Michael they spent some time vetting Providence and making sure it was Green Star worthy.
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: I think the problem,
• 16:56
  Mark: honestly from where I sit,
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: was y- you just can't use all those resources to, to truly vet all the places that want a Michelin Green Star- I or that are, that are in line to possibly get one.
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: Well, I 100% agree with you there.
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: But I think even if you wanted to...
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: Do you remember the story we did, um, I think this was in the old,
• 17:17
  Francis: the, before the
• 17:18
  Speaker 4: the resu-
• 17:19
  Francis: the, before the
• 17:19
  Speaker 4: the resurrected restaurant guys.
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: We did a story on a like a-
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: Resurrected and Restaurant Guys, let's not do that.
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: Let's...
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: It's a little-
• 17:26
  Francis: no, we're gonna hold
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: off- It just feels a little bit,
• 17:28
  Francis: That is a little bit, uh- No, We'll wait until we start our cult blasphemous.
• 17:30
  Francis: We'll wait until we start our cult.
• 17:31
  Francis: Anyway,
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: th- but there was a, a a young chef
• 17:35
  Francis: who
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: opened a sustainable restaurant on an island, and he claimed that everything they served
• 17:41
  Francis: came from that
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: that island.
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: And we're like,"Well, sir-"
• 17:44
  Francis: Where
• 17:44
  Speaker 4: is your two acre chicken coop?" You know what I mean?
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: It was like be...
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: It was physically impossible- Right.
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: I,
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: I
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: do remember that...for everything to come from that I do remember that story.
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: But, but
• 17:51
  Francis: so-
• 17:52
  Speaker 4: some stuff
• 17:52
  Francis: come from the island, And
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: And it was when workers who worked for him
• 17:57
  Francis: the
• 17:57
  Speaker 4: the whistle.
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: Outed him.
• 17:58
  Francis: How would they know?
• 17:59
  Francis: Um, so how would
• 17:59
  Speaker 4: would
• 17:59
  Francis: know that you're gonna cross-reference
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: his
• 18:01
  Francis: for a year to see which
• 18:02
  Speaker 4: eggs come from where?
• 18:03
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 18:03
  Speaker 4: It
• 18:04
  Francis: it was a fool's errand.
• 18:05
  Francis: I, it was a
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: was a fool's errand.
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: It seems really, really difficult to do.
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: Uh-
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: Anyway, they pulled it.
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: And you know what?
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: Kudos for them for trying,
• 18:11
  Francis: but I'm glad they pulled it cause I thought, Oh, there's a lot of
• 18:14
  Speaker 4: of opportunity for bullshitting here."
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: So,
• 18:16
  Mark: you know, on the topic of Michelin, uh, you and I haven't really covered There are a lot more places where Michelin restaurants are being reviewed.
• 18:26
  Mark: And a lot more types of restaurants are getting Michelin stars and Michelin recog- recognition
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: right now.
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: And some of that I
• 18:36
  Mark: as a really
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: good thing,
• 18:38
  Mark: and some of
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: of that I see
• 18:40
  Mark: a, like Michelin being a little both
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: deluded and Diluted
• 18:45
  Speaker 4: Diluted and Deluded.
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 18:48
  Speaker 4: That
• 18:48
  Francis: great, Mark.
• 18:49
  Francis: I like that.
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: We should
• 18:50
  Francis: a band, and that should be
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: be its name.
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: Diluted and Deluded.
• 18:53
  Speaker 4: Um, yeah, well, you know, it's funny.
• 18:55
  Speaker 4: I think the problem is,
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: And we could spend all day talking about this, and we're not gonna do that
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but just
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: So no worries for those of you who are about to turn us off.
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: but the
• 19:04
  Francis: but the Michelin stars were, I
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: I think
• 19:06
  Francis: one star had a, had a cast a broad net.
• 19:08
  Francis: But
• 19:09
  Speaker 4: But when you get to two and three stars, historically
• 19:11
  Francis: it has
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: has always been fine linen tablecloth, fine dining rooted in Mm-hmm the Western tradition, and they're trying to broaden that out.
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: And I think it's great
• 19:18
  Francis: broaden that out, but
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: but I just think that you need to, have a different category w- A Michelin three star restaurant
• 19:25
  Francis: not be a sandwich truck under it.
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: it.
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: Now,
• 19:26
  Francis: I'm
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: exaggerating.
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: It's,
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: it's- I, I, and I guess what you and I are saying there is it can't just taste good.
• 19:32
  Francis: Yeah,
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: Can't just be super tasty.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: There's got, there's gotta be more to it than that.
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: I think that brings up the issue are restaurant critics still
• 19:39
  Francis: at all?
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: And, and I think
• 19:41
  Francis: grew up in a time
• 19:42
  Speaker 4: when restaurant critics were everything, and they'd visit you once every year or two years- I think Michelin is still important
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: or three years.
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: So you have to...
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: Y- if, and those are restaurant critics.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: are, are, are four diamonds from,
• 19:53
  Mark: AAA
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: still important?
• 19:55
  Speaker 4: Oh,
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: it's important.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: It's not as important as it once was, but still important.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: So those, those people are critics.
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: think I think
• 20:01
  Francis: for our
• 20:02
  Speaker 4: growing up they were too important.
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: And I think-
• 20:04
  Francis: ...that in this day and
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: and age-
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: Jim, Jim from Sheboygan who- Yeah who comes in and says- But, but it's- your staircase
• 20:10
  Mark: is,
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: too steep
• 20:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 20:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: And it should- It's a little- should be disqualified.
• 20:14
  Speaker 4: Well, look, there are problems with both sides, but I think there are places in the world for professional writers like Michelin and the, and the professional food
• 20:20
  Francis: out there still.
• 20:21
  Francis: Um, and
• 20:22
  Speaker 4: and I think maybe we don't give them enough credit these days.
• 20:24
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 20:24
  Francis: Um, but I
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: I think it's good
• 20:26
  Francis: a balance like that.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, the Green Star thing, I think is a failed experiment and- Yeah you know, well, well-headed- You know, well-meaning-
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: Kudos to them for trying it,
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: you know?
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: But I think it, I think it had too much red tape.
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah,
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: I don't think Too much investigation
• 20:41
  Francis: don't think it was possible to
• 20:42
  Speaker 4: to
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: do
• 20:42
  Speaker 4: so there's a lot in this world that people try, and I, you
• 20:45
  Francis: give a lot
• 20:45
  Speaker 4: lot of credit to people who try things, and some things
• 20:47
  Francis: gonna work out well.
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: Let's
• 20:49
  Francis: about another thing that I
• 20:51
  Speaker 4: I think it's a fraught issue that m- may not be working so well
• 20:57
  Mark: certain communities.
• 20:57
  Mark: I don't
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: I don't think
• 20:58
  Mark: fraught issue,'cause I,'cause I know what you're gonna talk about,'cause we had a, a, a pregame today- Yeah
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: Yep
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: where we talked about, mocktail bars.
• 21:04
  Mark: bars.
• 21:06
  Mark: Bars that only make
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: non-alcoholic cocktails.
• 21:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 21:10
  Mark: And I, you know, I, The reason we're talking about this is is I saw in the news yet
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: another one closed,
• 21:16
  Mark: uh,
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: in Brooklyn.
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: a- a- and I'm like-
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: like,
• 21:19
  Mark: They're,
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: they're going to keep closing.
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: It's
• 21:22
  Mark: they're, and they
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: they may keep opening, but they're definitely going to keep closing.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: They're going to keep closing
• 21:28
  Mark: because
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: anybody can do it.
• 21:32
  Mark: And if that's your only purpose...
• 21:34
  Mark: I
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: I don't wanna say anybody
• 21:35
  Mark: it, because obviously some people are gonna
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: gonna do it better than other people do it.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 21:38
  Speaker 4: I mean, anybody can ma- make a chicken.
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: Correct.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: But Right
• 21:42
  Mark: you have some of the greatest cocktail minds in
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: in the world
• 21:46
  Mark: working on non-alcoholic drinks at Sunken Harbor Club or Kathleen Lombardi or the
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: Clover Club
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: Or Dead Rabbit.
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: Or Dead Rabbit.
• 21:55
  Mark: Or Dead Rabbit Yeah.
• 21:55
  Mark: And some of the greatest cocktail minds and and flavor minds
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: and flavor mixers in the world
• 22:01
  Mark: are working on
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: non-alcoholic spirits.
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: And for you to come in
• 22:07
  Mark: and open one of these
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: places
• 22:10
  Mark: where your
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: choices are so limited- know I think is a problem
• 22:14
  Mark: because
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: There's no reason to go to a cocktail bar that only serves
• 22:18
  Mark: cocktails because you
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: can go
• 22:21
  Mark: a cocktail bar and have non-alcoholic cocktails,
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: unless you don't want to be around people who are drinking.
• 22:27
  Speaker 4: Well, I think that if you,
• 22:29
  Francis: if
• 22:30
  Speaker 4: you don't wanna have alcoholic cocktails and you go to a non-alcoholic cocktail bar, I can see why you might want to do that.
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 22:37
  Speaker 4: and I can see how some of those great minds
• 22:38
  Francis: go off and open their own cocktail
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: bars, and maybe some of these non-alcoholic cocktail bars,'cause we haven't been to many, maybe they're doing amazing work.
• 22:45
  Speaker 4: I think there is just
• 22:47
  Francis: less
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: social about that.
• 22:49
  Speaker 4: And I think, we think that non-alcoholic cocktails are very important to have
• 22:52
  Francis: as part of a cocktail program, or at least I do.
• 22:54
  Francis: do.
• 22:54
  Speaker 4: Do you?
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: Uh-huh.
• 22:55
  Mark: So yes, but I, but I, disagree
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: with you a little bit on
• 22:59
  Mark: one.
• 22:59
  Mark: I don't think they need to be
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: any less social.
• 23:03
  Mark: I th-
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: I look at
• 23:04
  Mark: from an economics perspective, like
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: like I do a lot of things, right?
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: Sure.
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 23:08
  Mark: Is this sustainable?
• 23:09
  Mark: Will this continue to work?
• 23:11
  Mark: And you're, when you're single-headed
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: like this
• 23:16
  Mark: and you wanna be extraordinary, you have to
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: to be better
• 23:21
  Mark: than the people who
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: are doing it as part of their
• 23:26
  Mark: Yep.
• 23:26
  Mark: Yep.
• 23:26
  Mark: Okay?
• 23:27
  Mark: You
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: You have to be better than
• 23:28
  Mark: are, And
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: I don't
• 23:29
  Mark: how
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: any of the,
• 23:32
  Mark: uh, we'll
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: we'll call them mocktail
• 23:33
  Mark: even though the, I
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: I know that
• 23:35
  Mark: some people.
• 23:35
  Mark: I'm sorry if you're upset.
• 23:37
  Mark: but there's no reason to
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: go to
• 23:40
  Mark: places other than to
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: around, not be around people who are drinking.
• 23:44
  Mark: That's, That's, the
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: the only reason I
• 23:45
  Mark: to go to those places Why wouldn't you go to Sunken Harbor Club and have one of the great non-alcoholic cocktails in
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: all the world?
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: Why would you go
• 23:54
  Mark: one of these
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: other places
• 23:55
  Mark: unless you're
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: you're going to a coffee bar?
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: Well, I think you are right in that you
• 23:59
  Francis: you
• 24:00
  Speaker 4: cast a broader net with a great bar that serves both
• 24:03
  Francis: and
• 24:03
  Speaker 4: and non-alcoholic cocktails.
• 24:05
  Francis: I,
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: I'll throw out to you, I think a coffee bar is a good analogy.
• 24:07
  Speaker 4: I think that going out for drinks is a social thing, and we can welcome into the larger social environment of people going out for drinks people who come for non-alcoholic cocktails.
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: The reality is people who come for the non-alcoholic cocktail
• 24:23
  Francis: probably staying for
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: one or two and going anyway.
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: Well,
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: that's why I'm talking about the
• 24:26
  Mark: right?
• 24:27
  Mark: You're, you're
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: probably not staying and
• 24:29
  Mark: dinner.
• 24:30
  Mark: You're
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: probably not staying and having- Well the, the extra things that you would have in that atmosphere.
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: Well, so what you're saying, but what you're saying is that people will, who will go for a non-alcoholic cocktail
• 24:40
  Francis: will be having dinner and a
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: a non-alcoholic cocktail,
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: right?
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: But what I mean is if you go to a bar, forget cocktail bar.
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: you and I have been to bars
• 24:49
  Francis: to get a bottle of mediocre beer and play
• 24:51
  Speaker 4: darts, right?
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 24:53
  Speaker 4: If it
• 24:54
  Francis: a
• 24:54
  Speaker 4: a non-alcoholic beer bar, we wouldn't have
• 24:57
  Francis: there to play darts, and there's
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: something
• 24:59
  Francis: about alcohol itself
• 25:01
  Speaker 4: for many people
• 25:03
  Francis: that s- other people
• 25:04
  Speaker 4: people wanna be
• 25:04
  Francis: participate in it to whatever level,
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: But nobody goes to the non-alcoholic beer bar and
• 25:09
  Francis: out for four hours
• 25:10
  Speaker 4: listening to music and throwing darts.
• 25:12
  Speaker 4: I- It
• 25:12
  Mark: doesn't happen
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: happen
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: I guess my point is more
• 25:15
  Mark: two, factions of
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: of people are already
• 25:17
  Mark: this niche.
• 25:17
  Mark: Mm-hmm.
• 25:18
  Mark: one faction is the, the coffee bar,
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: and they're doing their thing,
• 25:22
  Mark: kudos to them.
• 25:23
  Mark: they they filled a void that,
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: that I didn't even know existed.
• 25:27
  Mark: Right.
• 25:27
  Mark: But they definitely have done it, and congratulations, and they're doing it.
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: And the other is
• 25:31
  Mark: the
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: true cocktail bar
• 25:33
  Mark: where people are going out
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: out to socialize,
• 25:35
  Mark: and actually it's
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: it's an...
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: There's
• 25:37
  Mark: one, the, restaurant that is serving cocktails
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: and wine and Yeah...liquor
• 25:42
  Mark: those things.
• 25:43
  Mark: Those places are
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: already filling
• 25:45
  Mark: void.
• 25:45
  Mark: Yeah.
• 25:45
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 25:46
  Mark: now you're
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: you're gonna also
• 25:47
  Mark: against restaurants that
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: that have no liquor licenses, which we have a lot of here
• 25:50
  Mark: Jersey-
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: yeah
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: which are serving non-alcoholic cocktails.
• 25:54
  Mark: to go to a, a bar that is not serving alcoholic cocktails, that is
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: is not serving,
• 25:59
  Mark: a
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: restaurant menu,
• 26:01
  Mark: I, just don't see the need for it.
• 26:03
  Mark: I don't see how that mocktail bar, stays in business for a long period of time,
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: and,
• 26:09
  Mark: so far I'm right.
• 26:11
  Speaker 4: I agree with everything you said,
• 26:13
  Francis: t-
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: I say that the non-alcoholic bar, the bar that serves
• 26:17
  Francis: even if it's mediocre, but if it's in a good place and it's
• 26:20
  Speaker 4: it's convenient,
• 26:21
  Francis: people will go there and hang out all
• 26:22
  Speaker 4: all afternoon and watch the game, or just hang out with each other, or go there and meet and talk.
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: But people are not going to the...
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: the You go to the coffee, bar, you have your coffee, you leave.
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: Nobody stays at the coffee bar all afternoon drinking coffee for four hours.
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: And I think it's just a, it's a different social milieu You
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: so Jennifer has just brought to us a
• 26:40
  Mark: point, that
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: she sits in a
• 26:41
  Mark: bar, and spends
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: three or four
• 26:43
  Mark: there.
• 26:44
  Mark: And Francis' retort to that was,
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: "Well, how many do you have?" And she
• 26:48
  Mark: Two." And
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: my point to
• 26:50
  Mark: is,
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: and while Jennifer's sitting there,
• 26:53
  Mark: 70 people
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: go up to
• 26:54
  Mark: counter, grab a
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: a to-go coffee, Yeah and go, and go Yeah...and do
• 26:59
  Mark: thing.
• 26:59
  Mark: Yeah, yeah.
• 27:00
  Mark: And the difference is people aren't gonna go into a mocktail bar, grab their mocktail, take it
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: it to go,
• 27:06
  Mark: and drive home down the,
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: the
• 27:08
  Francis: down the freeway.
• 27:08
  Francis: Al- although I have to tell you, I
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: I think it's kinda interesting.
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: I think of Jersey City,
• 27:10
  Francis: everybody were
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: were walking around
• 27:11
  Francis: fancy mocktails
• 27:12
  Mark: down the
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: down the street- I think it'd really
• 27:14
  Francis: the whole town.
• 27:15
  Francis: I really do.
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: I
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: just- Out for a dog
• 27:17
  Francis: Yeah, that
• 27:17
  Mark: that was a happy- a little puppuccino and a, and a-
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: a- Well-......and a mocktail
• 27:20
  Francis: A puppuccino.
• 27:21
  Francis: I love it.
• 27:22
  Francis: I honestly, I think I would like it better if it
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: it was actual cocktails, But I think...
• 27:26
  Francis: But here, every place that serves cocktails should
• 27:28
  Speaker 4: serve mocktails.
• 27:29
  Speaker 4: I just think that- Yes...you can, but you can, Well,
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: and now you have that's happening.
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: yes.
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: yes.
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: So that's why I think there's not
• 27:35
  Mark: space economically.
• 27:37
  Mark: But- Again, I don't,
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: I, I'm not talking
• 27:39
  Mark: philosophically here.
• 27:40
  Mark: I'm
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: talking about economically, I don't know how to make that
• 27:43
  Mark: work, and it appears
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: that nobody does.
• 27:46
  Speaker 4: what I was gonna say earlier is every place that serves
• 27:48
  Francis: cocktails should serve a mocktail, but if they don't, they're gonna be fine as
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: as a business.
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: 'Cause you can, you can have a standalone
• 27:54
  Francis: bar, beer bar, whatever.
• 27:55
  Francis: It just isn't economically viable to have
• 27:58
  Mark: a, a
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: bar.
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: I,
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: I don't
• 27:59
  Mark: formula.
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: Maybe
• 28:00
  Mark: economically possible,
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: and maybe somebody's gonna figure out
• 28:02
  Mark: formula,
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: but it ain't gonna be
• 28:04
  Francis (2): there's end our mocktail bar.
• 28:05
  Francis (2): discussion
• 28:07
  Speaker 4: I need a drink before we
• 28:08
  Francis: so we'll be back in just a moment.
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: Stick with
• 28:10
  Francis: On
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: On the other side, I'm gonna give you a hack for and the ever-rising cost of wine lists in America, something we discovered when we were out at
• 28:18
  Francis: so you
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: so you don't wanna go
• 28:19
  Francis: Hey there, folks.
• 28:20
  Francis: Welcome back.
• 28:20
  Francis: So Mark, I have a hack that I, I shared with you when we were
• 28:24
  Speaker 4: were out
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: That's
• 28:25
  Mark: cause I
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: I usually call you
• 28:26
  Francis: It's funny'cause I
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: a hack.
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: So,
• 28:28
  Mark: so tell me
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: me about your Hack-
• 28:29
  Speaker 4: Hack- Do you know, Do you-
• 28:30
  Francis: you- do you know the thing about us is
• 28:33
  Mark: us is
• 28:34
  Francis: know you never
• 28:35
  Speaker 4: call me anything behind my back that you don't call me to my face.
• 28:39
  Francis: Because you call me everything to my face,
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: Which
• 28:42
  Francis: fine, which is
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: is great.
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: I
• 28:44
  Mark: am meaner to you on the show, you are
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: are meaner to me in real life.
• 28:46
  Speaker 4: Oh, that's not- That's not true.
• 28:49
  Speaker 4: I think that's not true.
• 28:50
  Francis: So I came up with a hack I wanna share with everybody.
• 28:52
  Francis: We were out in
• 28:53
  Speaker 4: in Aspen at the Aspen Food
• 28:54
  Francis: Festival.
• 28:54
  Francis: Let
• 28:55
  Speaker 4: Let me tell you something.
• 28:56
  Speaker 4: It's not
• 28:57
  Francis: in
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: in Aspen
• 28:58
  Mark: It- Aspen.
• 28:59
  Mark: is a city
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: for the
• 29:01
  Mark: Yeah.
• 29:01
  Mark: Okay?
• 29:01
  Mark: But it
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: it doesn't mean that that the non-rich can't go and visit and have little samples while
• 29:07
  Francis: can't go and visit and have Little samples.
• 29:07
  Francis: while they're there.
• 29:07
  Francis: Little
• 29:08
  Mark: Little samples.
• 29:09
  Mark: Little samples, and then Yeah
• 29:09
  Speaker 4: skedaddle.
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: Do
• 29:10
  Francis: Little samples.
• 29:10
  Francis: you gotta- you know how you keep poor people out
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: out of your town?
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: Do you
• 29:13
  Francis: how you keep poor people out of your town, You build it on the
• 29:15
  Speaker 4: the top of a mountain.
• 29:16
  Francis: anyway, so
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: I realized-
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: Cause I thought it was your lowest bottle of
• 29:19
  Mark: is
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: $180.
• 29:21
  Mark: Uh, no.
• 29:21
  Mark: I
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: 1- I thought that was
• 29:22
  Mark: of the ways to keep
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: poor people out
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: of your town hundred, 125.
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 29:26
  Francis: but
• 29:26
  Speaker 4: but honestly,
• 29:27
  Francis: prices are
• 29:27
  Speaker 4: are rising in restaurants, and prices
• 29:29
  Mark: Francis and I are, are traveling a
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: a lot right now, uh, as you know.
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: Thank you Restaurant Guys listeners,
• 29:34
  Mark: supporting, that little
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: dream of
• 29:36
  Francis: And the
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: the regulars in particular.
• 29:37
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 29:37
  Speaker 4: Thank you everyone who's a paid subscriber.
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: Thank you very much.
• 29:40
  Mark: but the more we
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: travel, the
• 29:42
  Mark: we see, and it's happening fast.
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: It's
• 29:45
  Mark: fast.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: It, we're
• 29:46
  Mark: back to cities we were
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: were at last year, and we're seeing
• 29:49
  Mark: this, this whole
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: escalation of wine prices and wine lists.
• 29:54
  Speaker 4: Well, and look, we, we own our building, so I think our rate of increase has
• 29:57
  Francis: slower than most.
• 29:59
  Francis: Like, other people- have caught up and, to, to us and gone past us.
• 30:02
  Francis: But, uh, it's, everyone's got, everyone's
• 30:04
  Speaker 4: under tremendous pressure.
• 30:05
  Speaker 4: Everything's uh, more
• 30:06
  Francis: you don't need to hear us whine about
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: that.
• 30:08
  Speaker 4: But what you do face as a consumer is we're facing wine lists where the floor, where the minimum bottle of wine
• 30:15
  Francis: was
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: 49, then was 59, then was 65.
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: In New York City, 80 bucks is the
• 30:22
  Mark: and 80, 89 bucks is the
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: the
• 30:24
  Mark: And-......I see
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: any wine on any
• 30:26
  Francis: list.
• 30:26
  Francis: And in a lot of places 80 bucks, you know, you have four bottles of wine
• 30:29
  Speaker 4: between 80 and 100- Mm-hmm
• 30:30
  Francis: and, 100, and you don't want those four bottles of wine,
• 30:32
  Mark: you know, Right.
• 30:32
  Mark: and
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: And it's the bottle that if you went to a liquor store you could buy for 12 bucks.
• 30:35
  Speaker 4: So here's the interesting thing that
• 30:37
  Francis: I discovered out there, and I realize is kinda true overall.
• 30:40
  Francis: More and More restaurants who are like,"Listen, the rent is so high, I can't charge less than 80 bucks a bottle for a bottle of
• 30:47
  Speaker 4: of wine." Yeah.
• 30:47
  Speaker 4: I...
• 30:47
  Speaker 4: I...
• 30:48
  Speaker 4: and but, but they wanna have a more
• 30:51
  Francis: wine by the glass
• 30:52
  Speaker 4: program.
• 30:52
  Speaker 4: So if they're charging where we were 100,
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: 120 bucks for the cheapest bottle of wine- Well, because what end, in- invariably what ends up happening if you, if your wine list
• 30:58
  Mark: too expensive, people will go to beer or wine by the glass
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: or cocktails.
• 31:02
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: So
• 31:03
  Mark: you want your wine by
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: by the glass list to be a little more approachable so it's in line with beer or cocktails, right?
• 31:10
  Speaker 4: So what
• 31:10
  Francis: smart wine buyers are
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: are doing, and yes, you're exactly right, but
• 31:13
  Francis: a lot of smart wine buyers are doing
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: is they're bringing in wines specifically for by the glass.
• 31:20
  Speaker 4: But those wines at a fair markup
• 31:23
  Francis: might be lower than the floor they wanna have-...for their wine by the
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: the bottle.
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: And so what we started doing was
• 31:31
  Francis: I
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: I noticed that was happening at a
• 31:33
  Francis: out there,
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: and, I've done
• 31:35
  Francis: couple times since,
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: and I noticed that there was a really good glass of wine in their mid by the glass pricing.
• 31:43
  Mark: Let's even call
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: call it 25 bucks a glass, right?
• 31:46
  Francis: R- or 20
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: bucks a
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: glass.
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, 20, 25
• 31:48
  Mark: a glass so something that would be
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: 80 or 100 bucks a bottle.
• 31:52
  Francis: So
• 31:52
  Speaker 4: I, we looked at something that
• 31:53
  Francis: 20 bucks a
• 31:54
  Speaker 4: a glass,
• 31:56
  Francis: their lowest bottle...
• 31:57
  Francis: I, I, didn't want anything
• 31:58
  Speaker 4: under 120 that
• 31:59
  Francis: on their wine list,
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: list, but they had some really thoughtful selections
• 32:02
  Francis: by the glass
• 32:02
  Speaker 4: list.
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: And this is an important question you have to ask.
• 32:06
  Francis: you
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: say to the waiter, the
• 32:07
  Francis: "How many glasses do you get out of a bottle of wine?" Cause
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: some people pour four ounces, some
• 32:12
  Francis: pour five, and
• 32:12
  Speaker 4: and some people pour six, right?
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 32:14
  Francis: And the,
• 32:16
  Speaker 4: the sommelier said,"Well, we generally get f- uh,
• 32:19
  Francis: and a half glasses out of a bottle of
• 32:20
  Speaker 4: of wine." And I said, Well,
• 32:23
  Francis: okay, this$20 a glass wine, how much is this by the bottle?
• 32:26
  Francis: I don't see it on your bottle list." He's like,"Oh, that's not on the list." I said,
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: "Well,
• 32:30
  Francis: if I were to
• 32:30
  Speaker 4: to order a bottle of this?
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: Can I
• 32:31
  Francis: one?" He's like,"Yeah, you can have that for 80 bucks." I'm like,"Oh, okay.
• 32:36
  Francis: We'll do that
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: I was with Francis
• 32:38
  Mark: when, he did this the first time,
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: that bottle of wine,
• 32:41
  Mark: I believe,
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: was more
• 32:43
  Mark: interesting, a
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: a better value,
• 32:45
  Mark: and made
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: us happier than any of those wines under$120 on that list that we looked at.
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 32:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 32:51
  Speaker 4: So there's a new hack
• 32:52
  Francis: and I think that
• 32:53
  Speaker 4: only...
• 32:54
  Speaker 4: People r- respect what you're doing when you ask the question, but you have to ask,
• 32:58
  Francis: How many glasses you get out of a bottle?
• 33:00
  Francis: Hey, what if I, were to just order a bottle of this?
• 33:02
  Francis: and uh, it's a
• 33:03
  Speaker 4: a new
• 33:03
  Francis: we ordered an$80 bottle of wine
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: there was nothing
• 33:06
  Francis: wanted to drink for under 120.
• 33:07
  Speaker 4: And I, I think that's a, a, trick that's
• 33:09
  Francis: come in handy.
• 33:10
  Francis: So there's a little restaurant guy's
• 33:11
  Mark: hack
• 33:12
  Speaker 4: hack.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: So Francis, what you don't know-
• 33:14
  Speaker 4: Yeah
• 33:15
  Mark: is that I had a hack
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: very similar to this before you had this hack.
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: Tell me.
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: Well, I
• 33:23
  Mark: went
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: to a restaurant-
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah
• 33:25
  Mark: and I, needed to to leave relatively quickly and and I didn't want to wait for them to
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: to make me a whole pizza.
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: So I said,
• 33:34
  Mark: "Can I get six slices of
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: this pizza?"
• 33:38
  Mark: And they were like,"Well, I can make you a pie." And
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: And I said,"No,
• 33:41
  Mark: I'll just take
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: these six slices."
• 33:43
  Francis: it
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: it more
• 33:44
  Mark: And they heated up my six slices.
• 33:46
  Mark: It was the same price.
• 33:46
  Mark: They heated up my six slices.
• 33:48
  Mark: I
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: got out of there in six minutes, And I was on
• 33:51
  Mark: way.
• 33:52
  Mark: So I've been doing
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: your little hack
• 33:54
  Mark: since the
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: the'80s.
• 33:56
  Speaker 4: How is it that you're
• 33:58
  Francis: fancy with the fancy upbringing and my dad drove a truck for Reingold?
• 34:02
  Francis: How, how is that?
• 34:03
  Francis: That should be
• 34:04
  Speaker 4: switched.
• 34:04
  Speaker 4: that should really be switched.
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: I think maybe we were, we were born to the wrong
• 34:08
  Francis: I
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: I
• 34:09
  Mark: It's
• 34:10
  Speaker 4: think maybe.
• 34:11
  Speaker 4: Very
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: possible.
• 34:12
  Speaker 4: I think my
• 34:12
  Francis: always want a football player and He didn't get
• 34:14
  Mark: he wanted me, And I wanted
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: wanted my dad to be able to lift a keg.
• 34:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah, there you go.
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: So.
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: Anyway, I hope you
• 34:18
  Francis: have enjoyed the time with just The
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: The Restaurant Guys.
• 34:21
  Speaker 4: It's intimate little things like this that bring us so
• 34:23
  Francis: closer together.
• 34:24
  Francis: Don't you think?
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: us.
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: Hey,
• 34:25
  Francis: wanna support us
• 34:26
  Speaker 4: and support the things we do,
• 34:27
  Francis: we
• 34:28
  Speaker 4: would really appreciate you doing a couple things.
• 34:30
  Speaker 4: One
• 34:30
  Francis: tell a friend about The Restaurant Guys.
• 34:32
  Francis: If you like us, we would love for more people to know about the show.
• 34:35
  Francis: and if you could
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: find your way to subscribe
• 34:37
  Francis: the price of a nice cup of coffee every month, uh, you can have
• 34:40
  Speaker 4: have
• 34:40
  Francis: with The Restaurant Guys and, we would appreciate that very much.
• 34:44
  Francis: I'm Francis
• 34:44
  Speaker 4: Szott.
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: And I'm Mark
• 34:46
  Francis: We are The
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: The Restaurant Guys, and
• 34:47
  Francis: find out more about us, as always, at restaurantguyspodcast.com.