Latest / The Rave Social Podcast / 47 Memes, Meaning, & Social Strategy with Calleigh McLaughlin

Transcript

47 Memes, Meaning, & Social Strategy with Calleigh McLaughlin · The Rave Social Podcast

0:12
SPEAKER_01: Hello everyone and welcome back to the Rave Social Podcast.
0:16
SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Jaden, and today we have a special guest, Callie.
0:20
SPEAKER_01: She is an internet friend of mine.
0:22
SPEAKER_01: We met literally, I'm pretty sure, just through memes.
0:26
SPEAKER_01: Like we found each other through memes.
0:28
SPEAKER_01: Um, and we're really excited to have her on today to talk about memes, also social media strategy and a little bit of like our spiritual insanity.
0:38
SPEAKER_01: And it's gonna be really good.
0:40
SPEAKER_01: Callie has a lot of knowledge about social media, knowledge about memes.
0:45
SPEAKER_01: We were just talking about her history in social media, and she is a fountain of knowledge.
0:49
SPEAKER_01: So we're really excited to have her on.
0:51
SPEAKER_01: And Callie, if you just want to give a little intro to you, pass it to you.
0:58
SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me.
0:59
SPEAKER_00: I am so excited to be here.
1:01
SPEAKER_00: I definitely, yeah, I make memes.
1:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, that is how we met.
1:04
SPEAKER_00: I remember I follow a lot of like social media people too, because that's my my main job.
1:09
SPEAKER_00: That's how we bring in the money.
1:10
SPEAKER_00: So I'm a social media strategist.
1:12
SPEAKER_00: I guess you could call me a content creator as well.
1:14
SPEAKER_00: Well um of sorts.
1:16
SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, I'm a strategist, a content creator, um, spiritually insane for sure.
1:22
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, um, that is my my full-time role is social media strategy memes.
1:28
SPEAKER_00: I've been making memes since 2020.
1:30
SPEAKER_00: That's when I got sober.
1:32
SPEAKER_00: Fun fact, I got out of rehab and no one had anything to do except go on Instagram.
1:38
SPEAKER_00: And so starting a sober meme account genuinely seemed like the only thing that seemed like the right thing to do at the time.
1:43
SPEAKER_00: And so that's what I did.
1:44
SPEAKER_00: And this account was just born out of like fun.
1:48
SPEAKER_00: And that's yeah, this is again what the elites don't want you to know is like the only account is like have fun and be yourself.
1:55
SPEAKER_00: The first rule of meme club, literally.
1:57
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it's so true.
2:00
SPEAKER_01: And your meme account is iconic.
2:02
SPEAKER_01: Do you want to share the handle?
2:04
SPEAKER_00: Yes, it is existential spices.
2:06
SPEAKER_00: A lot of people think it's existential Pisces, it works, it does work because I'm also a Pisces, but it must be like existential spices as a take on existential crises.
2:17
SPEAKER_00: It started as spicy sobriety and then it changed.
2:21
SPEAKER_00: So I didn't want the focus of the account to be only sobriety and not drinking because yeah, you progress in your sobriety journey, but also in your life.
2:30
SPEAKER_00: Like, my life isn't about just like not drinking, like it's sobriety is a part of my life, but there's so much more.
2:36
SPEAKER_00: There's so much more.
2:36
SPEAKER_00: And so I want to like transition.
2:39
SPEAKER_01: I love that so much.
2:41
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so the first thing that I do want to talk about is your meme account.
2:45
SPEAKER_01: So you started it in 2020.
2:47
SPEAKER_01: How did you grow it?
2:50
SPEAKER_01: So now it's at like 25,000 followers, which is awesome.
2:53
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
2:54
SPEAKER_01: And was that growth quick?
2:56
SPEAKER_01: Was it slow?
2:57
SPEAKER_01: How did you start to figure out what people were connecting with?
3:01
SPEAKER_00: So honestly, again, like I think I hit 5k within the first couple months.
3:06
SPEAKER_00: And again, it was born out of fun.
3:09
SPEAKER_00: There was never an intention to like grow this account or like become a big giant meme account.
3:14
SPEAKER_00: I was like, I'm having fun.
3:16
SPEAKER_00: The people seem to like what I'm posting.
3:19
SPEAKER_00: And I believe from a strategic perspective, if your account is delivering value, consistent value, then people will follow it.
3:25
SPEAKER_00: And that's to show folks.
3:27
SPEAKER_00: But other than that, there was never an intentional effort to like grow, grow, grow, like heavy growth strategy.
3:34
SPEAKER_00: I was like, I'm having fun.
3:35
SPEAKER_00: This is an outlet.
3:36
SPEAKER_00: Again, people like what I'm posting, so I'm gonna keep doing what I'm doing.
3:40
SPEAKER_00: Um, as I've grown over the years, like the content has definitely evolved.
3:44
SPEAKER_00: When I first made it, I I was getting sober but in and out of sobriety.
3:48
SPEAKER_00: And I did a bit of like a cleanup.
3:51
SPEAKER_00: She's like, I did a bit of a cleanup of the account lately because I looked at some of the stuff I posted back in 2020 to like 2023, and I'm like, like sometimes you we don't want record of things on the internet, and so it's okay to evolve, and that means you're doing things right as an artist, as a creative, is just if you cringe at your previous work, you are doing something right, right?
4:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think so too.
4:13
SPEAKER_01: And like it's kind of this is kind of a side tangent, but it's like I feel like on that same note with creators in general, like I think they have a lot of fear of posting things that they might regret, regret, posting things that they may not agree with a year from now, or things like that.
4:31
SPEAKER_01: And I get it because like the world is scary and they'll cancel you, and I think they want to be mean sometimes.
4:37
SPEAKER_01: But I'm like, that just shows evolution and like you're just you're just evolving in public, literally, which is actually like really brave.
4:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and honestly, I I am a big fan.
4:49
SPEAKER_00: I think like cancel culture is kind of on its way out because people are genuinely like, I don't care anymore.
4:54
SPEAKER_00: I don't care, it's not interesting to rip on people all the time, it's just not interesting.
5:01
SPEAKER_00: You kind of do become like uncancelable if you just ignore it, if you actually say that's so true.
5:06
SPEAKER_00: The problem start to arise is when you're not sorry for something and you're apologizing for it, anyways.
5:12
SPEAKER_00: I would post things, no one's ever gonna be happy, but like I would post things, even stories like oh, going on a hot girl walk.
5:18
SPEAKER_00: And someone told me I was ableist because not everyone could go on a walk.
5:22
SPEAKER_00: And I said, You can you go outside and touch grass?
5:27
SPEAKER_00: Because that's what you need to do.
5:29
SPEAKER_00: Um oh my god, that is insane.
5:33
SPEAKER_00: Honestly, it you just ignore it.
5:35
SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't, I do not care.
5:36
SPEAKER_00: I will never make a public apology.
5:38
SPEAKER_00: There's nothing to apologize for.
5:40
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, like I'm just a person and I'm just like learning.
5:43
SPEAKER_00: I think exactly that yeah, so growing the account, yeah, it just kind of had like slow and steady growth over the years.
5:51
SPEAKER_00: I've had periods of like exponential growth.
5:53
SPEAKER_00: When I first started my social media management business, and I was like chronically online and I was just like at home all the time with time to create and with Instagram, it went like this.
6:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, also, the more spiritually aligned I am and the more fun I'm having with my content, it grows.
6:09
SPEAKER_00: That's the law of least resistance too.
6:11
SPEAKER_00: When it comes to virality, the posts that have always done the best, is I'm sure you see this, and I've seen with clients too.
6:17
SPEAKER_00: The real, the carousel, the whatever that you spend hours like perfecting everything, it flops.
6:23
SPEAKER_00: And the one that you're like beep boop bop, that's funny, post it, it will go viral.
6:27
SPEAKER_01: Yes, it's so true.
6:29
SPEAKER_01: And like I try to any of my clients that are on our signature offer, IG888, like that's what I tell them.
6:37
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, we're giving you the strategic foundational content.
6:41
SPEAKER_01: But if you have an idea and you want to post it, like please, for the love of everything, post it.
6:47
SPEAKER_01: And it's probably gonna outperform everything else because it's the timing, the charisma, all of it is like aligned perfectly to pop off.
6:56
SPEAKER_01: And when you don't have that inspiration, we're gonna be here to hold the foundation for you.
7:01
SPEAKER_01: And so, like, I think that is just such like I think that people that are trying to grow on social media, they either do one or the other.
7:10
SPEAKER_01: They're like, all my content needs to be strategic, it's pre-planned, it's scheduled, I never vary from that.
7:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, or they they live on the other end of that.
7:19
SPEAKER_01: That's like, I only post when I'm inspired, I only want to do like something viral, whatever.
7:24
SPEAKER_01: And it's like, you really do need the blend of both, which I'm sure you've you've related to that with the meme account.
7:31
SPEAKER_00: A hundred percent.
7:32
SPEAKER_00: And I think there was a time when I was just like creating so sometimes you're just in flow and you're just creating there was a time when I was just like popping off, like I had so much to say, like so much in my head, and just creating, and I had time to post, but you know what?
7:47
SPEAKER_00: As I got older and my life got fuller, and I got a more of a big kid job, and I'm like working in an office five days a week, you have less time and you're in a committed relationship.
7:57
SPEAKER_00: You just have less time.
7:59
SPEAKER_00: And I used to think at the beginning, I was like, am I losing my creativity?
8:02
SPEAKER_00: Am I doing something wrong?
8:03
SPEAKER_00: Because I feel like I have no time to like to put out anymore, kind of to create and to put my workout.
8:10
SPEAKER_00: No, you actually as an adult just have to schedule in like strategic creative time.
8:15
SPEAKER_00: I block like one to two hours of my weekend at least to do like intentional creative work for myself, for no one else.
8:25
SPEAKER_00: Um this is the hard part, especially when your creativity is very much embedded into social media, detaching from the outcomes and the performative outcomes.
8:35
SPEAKER_00: Like, even if one person liked it or if one person found it funny, good enough.
8:41
SPEAKER_00: You've provided some value to someone.
8:44
SPEAKER_00: Um and if it does better than that, wonderful.
8:46
SPEAKER_00: But that's why I very much had to keep spicy like about fun.
8:52
SPEAKER_00: Because the moment I made it, I the moment I try to create strategy for that account, or the moment I try and be like growth oriented, or the moment I make it about me.
9:02
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I noticed was the moment I tried to post like Cali-based content.
9:07
SPEAKER_00: One, the algorithm.
9:08
SPEAKER_00: But they were like, no, people liked it, but the algorithm was confused.
9:12
SPEAKER_00: And I know that from a strategic perspective, anytime you do like a harsh pivot, your your content will start to the views will start to go down.
9:19
SPEAKER_00: So if you're committed to your new direction, that's fine.
9:23
SPEAKER_00: But I was like, what's the goal here?
9:24
SPEAKER_00: To because I'm not trying to be an influencer, I'm not um so I have to remember at the end of the day, it's about having fun and it's for the people.
9:32
SPEAKER_00: Spicy's for the people, and that's when it works.
9:34
SPEAKER_00: Your content will always do better if it is for for your audience.
9:38
SPEAKER_00: That's the strategic.
9:40
SPEAKER_00: I I know it's so funny.
9:42
SPEAKER_01: Like, I people throw around the sh word strategy, like honestly, I hate the word, but like I get it, it plays a role, so you have to use it.
9:51
SPEAKER_01: But it's like one of my big things in my business and with all my clients is that your strategy does not need to be 65 pages.
10:00
SPEAKER_01: All it is is what is your offer and who are you talking to?
10:04
SPEAKER_01: Like, that is yeah, that's slip, that's all of it.
10:07
SPEAKER_01: That's the entire strategy.
10:08
SPEAKER_00: And like, have some pillars if they help you.
10:11
SPEAKER_00: Um pillars help some people.
10:13
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it depends what kind of structure you're working into as well.
10:16
SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, there is totally a middle ground between like I will only post and create when I'm inspired.
10:21
SPEAKER_00: Because I'm telling you, as an adult with a full life, that strategy won't work unless you actually sit around.
10:27
SPEAKER_01: There's gonna be a time when it's not working anymore, and like everyone is so different.
10:31
SPEAKER_01: It could be because you know, it's winter and you have seasonal depression, it could be because you had a baby, it could be because your husband's work is stressful or your partner's work is stressful.
10:42
SPEAKER_01: Like it's it, you don't you're not gonna be able to know and foresee that.
10:45
SPEAKER_01: And so, like having the blend, I think, is important.
10:48
SPEAKER_01: Like having a vision, holding yourself to some sort of like consistency accountability.
10:54
SPEAKER_01: And then, like, there are times when that's gonna flow more naturally, and there's times where you're gonna have to try a little harder, right?
11:01
SPEAKER_00: Like, you're gonna have to set aside the two hours to be creative, and it doesn't mean you're doing it wrong, I think, or it doesn't mean you've like lost your spark or lost your creativity.
11:12
SPEAKER_00: I think that's a loop I got myself into for a while.
11:15
SPEAKER_00: I was like, have I lost it?
11:16
SPEAKER_00: Like, do I not want to do this anymore?
11:18
SPEAKER_00: It's like, no, you're busy.
11:19
SPEAKER_00: You have a job that takes you 40 to 50 hours of your week, and it's normal to be tired and not want to create more content after that.
11:27
SPEAKER_00: But there's that balance between like flow and then creative discipline.
11:32
SPEAKER_00: Like it takes you think like the some of the most brilliant authors or like script writers or like producers, directors, whatever, like actors, like it's work, it's still work, even and like when you read their like their life stories and stuff like that, you uncover that a lot of the times like they struggled.
11:52
SPEAKER_01: Like it wasn't just like I'm so creative in my flow, like everything's perfect.
11:56
SPEAKER_01: It was like, I want to jump off a bridge, this is so painful, and then they they open up to this new side of creativity, and like I think it's insane to hold yourself to the standard that you're always gonna be creating and creative, you're not always going to be, and you have it's just like navigating those times, I feel like is the most important part.
12:21
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, and creative burnout is real too.
12:24
SPEAKER_00: And I hesitate to talk about this because when I say creative burnout, it simply means like you just you don't you're you're burnt out like creatively, but yeah, um I know that there's a lot going on in the world, and I'm not like, oh like creative burnout, like poor me.
12:38
SPEAKER_00: I hate content for a living, like I'm not saving lives, I'm and it doesn't mean I don't work really hard and take my work and my job and my creativity seriously.
12:48
SPEAKER_00: I think that's really important, and I think it's also important to not fall into the trap of like, how dare you enjoy your life when there's such atrocities going on in the world?
12:55
SPEAKER_00: Like, that doesn't help anyone.
12:56
SPEAKER_00: That doesn't help anyone, it doesn't help anyone to be miserable all the time.
12:59
SPEAKER_00: It certainly doesn't, but um creative burnout happens when you're running your creativity from a quantitative lens because just because the more hours you work doesn't it actually won't get better, it won't go practice is one thing, like practice, practice, practice and repetition.
13:18
SPEAKER_00: But just like there was a time too when I was working my full-time job, and then I kept two freelance clients, and so I had three jobs, and so I was managing like probably had over 20 accounts on my phone, of which I was like also responsible for all the like back-end management, all of the content creation, your brain and multiple, like four different platforms, your brain explodes.
13:41
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you that's not okay that way, don't get good at anything that way.
13:46
SPEAKER_01: No, like I think the creative, the biggest thing with creatives is creating it's the spaciousness and the commitment to creating, even if it's bad.
13:57
SPEAKER_01: I think that's how you avoid the creative burnout because I think people get they get into creative burnout and then they're like they want to shut down and they want to, like you said, am I bad at this?
14:09
SPEAKER_01: Am I not good at this anymore?
14:11
SPEAKER_01: Like, should I quit?
14:12
SPEAKER_01: They get there and it actually is creating more space.
14:16
SPEAKER_01: So, like, what can you take off of your plate to give yourself more spaciousness?
14:20
SPEAKER_01: And then it's committing to like still trying, like, I'm still gonna try to create something, it might be bad, and that doesn't matter.
14:29
SPEAKER_00: Yep, yeah, you will not get better without repetition.
14:33
SPEAKER_00: Detaching from the outcomes is hard, and even detaching from your work is hard, like my work is not who I am.
14:42
SPEAKER_00: That's been a big lesson for me in the last I think year and a half is like where you can still be very invested in your work and your identity, you're a piece of your creative identity, but it cannot be everything.
14:58
SPEAKER_00: If you put your entire identity into your business or into your job or into your creative output, whatever that may be, you are setting yourself up for failure.
15:08
SPEAKER_00: It can be important to you and you can be obsessive and delusional and passionate, but if it's the only thing you have, I am telling you, you are setting yourself up for failure because your idea could quite literally be ripped away from you at any moment.
15:21
SPEAKER_00: You can lose clients, you can lose the job, you can like go through a creative rut.
15:24
SPEAKER_01: It's gonna start so the algorithm can hate you for a second.
15:29
SPEAKER_01: It just happens, absolutely, it just happens, yeah.
15:33
SPEAKER_01: No, I love that so much.
15:35
SPEAKER_01: I um I feel like I have one more question on just on your memes, kind of going back to that.
15:41
SPEAKER_01: And I so I have a meme masterclass that I teach people just like how to make memes on a really simple level, just taking like their clients' problems and making them a joke and how to find a picture that goes with that.
15:55
SPEAKER_01: That's what I teach in the meme masterclass.
15:57
SPEAKER_01: But if you were to, if somebody is listening to this and they want to start making memes, what would you tell them?
16:04
SPEAKER_00: Oh man, like kind of my creative process, I guess.
16:08
SPEAKER_00: Honestly, this is like I just have a large notes out folder full of the dumb things that go through my head.
16:17
SPEAKER_00: Um, and like relatable scenarios.
16:19
SPEAKER_00: I I have gotten a bit more strategic with it.
16:22
SPEAKER_00: Like the content that I know always does really well is situation ship content.
16:26
SPEAKER_00: The issue is I'm now in a very healthy, committed relationship.
16:31
SPEAKER_00: And so I don't make situationship content anymore.
16:34
SPEAKER_00: But that's okay.
16:35
SPEAKER_00: I still have like lots of old lore, lots of old bangers, and it's okay to go through your archives too and um like do repurposing.
16:43
SPEAKER_00: But, anyways, if someone were to want to start, find something you want to make content about, um, whether that be like your job, work, I don't know, a situation or a part of yourself that's like really important to you, um, or that you face a lot of like funny situations in.
17:01
SPEAKER_00: Just write down funny things that have happened to you or like relatable situations.
17:05
SPEAKER_00: And honestly, this is called strategic strategic scrolling.
17:08
SPEAKER_00: This is a bit hard.
17:10
SPEAKER_00: Go to your explore page and set a timer and save some stuff, put it in like a repost or a meme folder and like look at the images, look at the formatting that they've used, and then just start.
17:20
SPEAKER_00: Just start.
17:21
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, put words on a picture, just do it.
17:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, put on a picture.
17:26
SPEAKER_00: That's it.
17:26
SPEAKER_00: Tori, that may have been like a really convoluted.
17:29
SPEAKER_01: No, that I feel like that is such a great answer.
17:31
SPEAKER_00: Like the way I do it is so lax, but you need to be easy on yourself when it comes to if it's something like memeing, you need to be easy on yourself about your creative process because it ain't that deep, and it's not supposed to be, and if you make it deep, your content will be bad.
17:45
SPEAKER_01: It's so true.
17:45
SPEAKER_01: Like, if you try really hard on a meme, it just like is not gonna hit.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: No, it's not um bad.
17:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, like it's supposed to look bad and it's supposed to be like silly.
17:56
SPEAKER_01: One thing that I kind of talk about in the meme masterclass is like misery loves company.
18:01
SPEAKER_01: A lot of the most popular, most viral memes are about either a negative situation or they do have kind of like they will have kind of a negative like touch on it, like totally, you know.
18:15
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
18:16
SPEAKER_01: So I think you can take like any situations in your life or your business or your job or whatever you want to make memes about, when you're like, oh my gosh, this is like dreadful.
18:26
SPEAKER_01: There's a way to make it funny and relatable, and people love that.
18:30
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
18:31
SPEAKER_00: And I think like I'm also always walking that fine line between being relatable and funny, and like a little bit negative or a little bit of like a cutting undercurrent, and then just being like, I hate the world all the time because my content kind of used to be like that, and I don't like that anymore.
18:48
SPEAKER_00: Because yeah, I also don't believe that.
18:50
SPEAKER_00: I'm also like, I don't believe this anymore.
18:52
SPEAKER_00: And the world's I don't believe the world's a bad place and we're all doomed and like everything sucks.
18:56
SPEAKER_00: Like, if that's your paradigm, if that's how you want to live this life, you have fun, but I'm not doing that, right?
19:01
SPEAKER_00: I won't be there.
19:02
SPEAKER_00: Oh no, but struggle, struggle is another thing.
19:05
SPEAKER_00: So, like, I have an entire like folder full of my thing lately has been like creative flow, like creative output, and like that finding creative identity and such a fucking first world problem, but anyways, um like I did a whole thing on that and like creative identity formation, and okay, so what are the like relatable things that someone would go through in relation to that?
19:28
SPEAKER_00: So, like performative outcomes, how am I gonna make a meme about that?
19:33
SPEAKER_00: Or that was another thing.
19:35
SPEAKER_00: Um, situationships, yeah.
19:37
SPEAKER_00: I had a whole like roster notes app of like situationship content or stuff about being like spiritually insane.
19:43
SPEAKER_00: So, like, no, I love those ones.
19:45
SPEAKER_00: Pulling tarot 20 times in the morning until you get the answer you want isn't gonna help you.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: Like pulling tarot as if like that's gonna really change your day.
19:58
SPEAKER_00: I often find no, it will you will go crazy.
20:02
SPEAKER_00: You will go crazy, especially if you there was a time like I was going through some like serious mental health stuff, and I really had to take a break from all of the like the tarot, the manifestation, because you get in your head about like I'm gonna cause like all these bad events, and first of all, hi OCD.
20:18
SPEAKER_00: Oh is that you?
20:20
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, and if one actually understands true, genuine like manifestation and tapping in and being in touch, you would understand like intrusive, non-intentional thoughts don't manifest, they don't.
20:30
SPEAKER_00: So if you're listening and you're like, I have OCD, like or some kind of like insane anxiety, am I gonna manifest all my intrusive thoughts or not?
20:39
SPEAKER_00: I have never once in my life manifested a genuine intrusive thought.
20:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, like a thought.
20:43
SPEAKER_00: Never, never, but it's very scary, it can be very scary.
20:48
SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, pulling tarot 20 times in the morning until you get the answer that you want.
20:54
SPEAKER_00: What are you doing?
20:56
SPEAKER_00: Stop it.
20:56
SPEAKER_00: I'm talking to myself too.
20:57
SPEAKER_00: Stop it.
20:58
SPEAKER_01: No, I know, and then also like that's so funny.
21:01
SPEAKER_01: Like, especially if you're connecting with like the spiritual world, like everyone that's into spirituality knows that vibe or that feeling, and like that's so relatable.
21:10
SPEAKER_01: Like, throw some text on a totally a page.
21:13
SPEAKER_01: And what I love about your memes too is a lot of times yours are just like text, like it's not even there's not pictures.
21:20
SPEAKER_01: Sometimes there are.
21:20
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
21:21
SPEAKER_00: But like I use I use threads or I used to use Twitter X, but now yeah anymore.
21:27
SPEAKER_00: But threads also, because it's uh native to Meta and Instagram.
21:31
SPEAKER_00: See, this is a strategic hack.
21:32
SPEAKER_00: They they'll push it more.
21:34
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they like it.
21:35
SPEAKER_00: Right.
21:36
SPEAKER_00: So, like, yeah, I will what I do is I will tweet or thread something, I'll post something on threads, like something a thought that I had.
21:42
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I know this is gonna land.
21:44
SPEAKER_00: I'll see how it does on there, and usually I take my best performing, I categorize them, and then I repurpose them into a carousel.
21:49
SPEAKER_00: That's what I love.
21:51
SPEAKER_01: There you go, everybody.
21:52
SPEAKER_00: Literally, write something you think is funny, take a screenshot, post it on Instagram.
21:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, I even do that with our our Clients, like I'm like post on threads, post on threads, post on threads, and then we take their threads content and we create other social media platform content out of it.
22:09
SPEAKER_01: And it's totally easy strategic hack.
22:11
SPEAKER_01: There you guys go.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: Or like if if you want a certain look, like take a still image, go make a reel out of it, just put text on the front, or take a still image, funny image, go post it as an Instagram story, put the Instagram in-app text on it, take a screenshot, and you're done.
22:28
SPEAKER_00: Then it looks like it was made on Instagram.
22:30
SPEAKER_00: That's the they'll push that.
22:31
SPEAKER_01: And yeah, oh my gosh, Kate.
22:33
SPEAKER_01: This is like we're leaving Memeville now, but like that is such a strategic thing that I try to.
22:41
SPEAKER_01: I have people come to me all the time.
22:43
SPEAKER_01: Like, even clients are like, I want to create like those reels that have like all the fancy no text, and this is happening and that is happening.
22:52
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, that's great, but the ROI on it is not gonna be worth the time investment that you put into creating that.
22:59
SPEAKER_01: If you've built your entire platform on being a video editor, yeah, and people are there to see that, like that's different.
23:07
SPEAKER_01: But if you're just like if you're just a service provider, not just a service provider, but if you are a service provider, throwing some text on b-roll is the ROI on that is gonna be way higher because it took you five minutes instead of two hours.
23:23
SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, that's where that's where you have to find that strategic balance.
23:28
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
23:29
SPEAKER_00: ROI is so important with organic social media because it is really easy to waste a lot of time and a lot of money on things that don't work.
23:39
SPEAKER_00: And there's something to be said for testing, especially if it's a brand new account, like testing out your content experiment styles.
23:44
SPEAKER_00: But unless you have the unless one, yeah, your content is about like how to edit better videos, yeah, that's different.
23:51
SPEAKER_00: But if you're yeah, just if you are a service provider and you're not based around like graphics or editing, please just post normal content that looks native to Instagram because it's not gonna benefit you anymore to like spend hours and hours teaching yourself Da Vinci or Premiere Pro, which you can if you've got the time and the money by all means, but like just use Cap Cut or use like edits or Instagram in app because also people who are on Instagram wanna be on Instagram.
24:16
SPEAKER_00: People who are want to be on TikTok.
24:19
SPEAKER_00: If you're on YouTube, that's a whole other story.
24:21
SPEAKER_00: But people on YouTube want to be on YouTube, you can get away with um a bit of a different feel on YouTube.
24:26
SPEAKER_00: Uh, YouTube Shorts is actually my favorite right now, but I love YouTube Shorts easy.
24:31
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, like you need to stay as native to the platform as possible.
24:36
SPEAKER_00: Like, if if I see a TikTok watermark on Instagram, I'm going to scroll away.
24:41
SPEAKER_01: No, I'm gonna scroll away.
24:42
SPEAKER_01: And like when I see over edited content on Instagram, I'm like, this is an ad.
24:49
SPEAKER_01: And it might not be, it might not be, but like that's how it registers to me.
24:54
SPEAKER_01: And I just like I scroll by because I'm like, I don't want to, I don't need this high production value.
24:59
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
24:59
SPEAKER_01: It's just like it doesn't connect with me.
25:02
SPEAKER_00: Um user psychology, we don't go to Instagram for like highly edited content.
25:06
SPEAKER_00: We yeah, it's not TV, it's yeah, TV, and um I know the tides are kind of changing, but that also depends on your account.
25:15
SPEAKER_00: Like a big trend right now is certain brands are creating like their own mini TV shows, kind of.
25:21
SPEAKER_00: And here's the thing: if you have a production team, if you have like a and the budget, you have the budget if you have a production team and you want to and a good idea, but if you don't, then you're not gonna have the ROI to support that.
25:33
SPEAKER_00: Um, also stay in your lane.
25:36
SPEAKER_00: I have grown an account to almost 30,000 followers now by taking screenshots and putting text on like funny images that feel good to me.
25:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like it doesn't have to be that serious.
25:51
SPEAKER_01: I know it's so hard.
25:52
SPEAKER_01: I think like it's easy to say, it doesn't have to be that serious.
25:55
SPEAKER_01: And then I think what happens is these brands build, they build platforms, it's where they're getting clients, it's where they're growing their business.
26:03
SPEAKER_01: And so then when things start not performing how they did last month or whatever, like they can get in their head and be like, well, it's not working.
26:12
SPEAKER_01: This is my livelihood, and then we're like, it's not that serious, and they're like, but it is.
26:17
SPEAKER_01: But I think that like that's where the long-term vision comes in, and that's where diversification comes in.
26:25
SPEAKER_01: Like the brands that you've worked on, they have emails, they have other they're doing they're doing paid ads, they have other funnels in which they can rely on when maybe that organic content is taking a little bit of a hit.
26:39
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
26:40
SPEAKER_00: And even as maybe an independent service provider, someone with a smaller business or smaller brand, my advice is always you cannot only rely on one platform or only your organic content as your only source of marketing.
26:54
SPEAKER_00: You can't do that.
26:56
SPEAKER_00: Um oftentimes I think social media managers or social media management agencies are treated as the entire marketing department for a small business.
27:03
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, dude, I run your Instagram.
27:06
SPEAKER_00: Like this, I'm not your funnel.
27:08
SPEAKER_00: If your website is bad, if your actual service and product are bad, don't get me saying that.
27:14
SPEAKER_00: How could you say that?
27:16
SPEAKER_00: Like we have bigger problems, we have bigger fish to cry.
27:19
SPEAKER_00: Um, if something is broken at any level of the funnel, you're not gonna, it's you're setting yourself up for failure, right?
27:25
SPEAKER_00: So you've got to have those checks and balances.
27:27
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, with regards to every platform, there's a balance to be struck between I need to be on everything and posting every day on every single platform.
27:34
SPEAKER_01: Because not gonna, you know, you won't be able to maintain that on your own.
27:38
SPEAKER_00: You can't be an expert on every platform.
27:39
SPEAKER_00: I would say if you're starting out in the beginning, get really good at two that are relevant to your industry.
27:45
SPEAKER_00: Relevant to your industry is also another thing because, like, if you install glass for per se, or if you're like if you're doing a trade, your target market isn't like the spiritual baddies like on Instagram.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: You need to run some meta ads and get in the Facebook groups, right?
28:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like oh, that's so funny.
28:04
SPEAKER_01: My husband works for a mechanical engineering firm, and like I've just talked, I we joke about it sometimes because people are like, everyone needs to be on social media, and I'm like, no, because nobody gives a shit about what you do, like you would never find a client on Instagram.
28:24
SPEAKER_00: No, you're not gonna they're not the old men like looking by your services are not for their businesses, are not gonna be in your Instagram DMs, they don't have Instagram on their phone.
28:34
SPEAKER_01: No, and like the architects aren't following the companies that they want to work with.
28:40
SPEAKER_00: Like, no, no, different how it's going.
28:43
SPEAKER_00: That's terrible marketing advice, yeah.
28:45
SPEAKER_00: It's different, different in different industries.
28:47
SPEAKER_00: And again, if you're a big company with the resources, I think we've seen all those like kind of blue-collar accounts that make like funny TikToks because they have a Gen Z running their social media, and that's become a bit.
28:58
SPEAKER_00: However, I would argue, like, I don't actually know how high the ROI on is then.
29:02
SPEAKER_01: No, I mean, they're not like they're honestly probably not getting much business from it, but the owners are probably like, hell yeah, we went viral, and you know what?
29:15
SPEAKER_00: Go and viral.
29:16
SPEAKER_00: Live it up, live it up, have fun with it.
29:19
SPEAKER_00: Who cares?
29:20
SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna hate on anyone like going viral or getting or on social media for awareness purposes because again, that does serve a purpose, like there is benefit to that, but yeah, when everyone's like, I need to be on every platform giving my 100% to everything.
29:34
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, you go and try that and you let me know how sustainable that is for you.
29:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's just not gonna be.
29:42
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god, yeah.
29:43
SPEAKER_01: Okay, I feel like actually we should maybe talk about because I feel like we already talked about strategy, like kind of in the meme stuff.
29:50
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
29:51
SPEAKER_01: Um, so maybe it will dip into like spiritual insanity.
29:54
SPEAKER_01: Do you wanna like do you wanna tell your story of spirituality?
29:58
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
29:59
SPEAKER_00: All right, so that's oh, what an interesting question.
30:01
SPEAKER_00: Like story of spirituality.
30:03
SPEAKER_00: Um it all starts with getting sober.
30:07
SPEAKER_00: Um, I had my first attempt, loose, loose attempt at sobriety when I was about 21, I think.
30:16
SPEAKER_00: I went to treatment, I went to rehab, and then after starting my meme account, um, it wasn't really my choice to go to rehab.
30:23
SPEAKER_00: I think every things had things had blown up though.
30:26
SPEAKER_00: Um, I was I had a pretty bad drug and alcohol problem, like to say the least.
30:31
SPEAKER_00: And so I went to treatment.
30:32
SPEAKER_00: COVID was a great time to go to rehab because there was nothing to do, and so I wasn't really missing out on anything.
30:39
SPEAKER_00: But anyways, I was really young and I was not ready.
30:41
SPEAKER_00: When you're 20, 21, you're a child.
30:43
SPEAKER_00: Um, yeah.
30:45
SPEAKER_00: You're a child.
30:46
SPEAKER_00: I still're 26.
30:48
SPEAKER_00: So I yeah, literally.
30:50
SPEAKER_00: So I was not ready.
30:52
SPEAKER_00: And I think I will only say like 12 step is a is a major part of my story, and that's all I'll elaborate on there just out of respect for the fellowship.
31:01
SPEAKER_00: Um, but it has done wonders for me and it it has saved my life.
31:06
SPEAKER_00: Um, however, yeah, I dipped in and out of like treatment and like sobriety and like wanting to be sober and then like not caring and then wanting to blow my life up.
31:16
SPEAKER_00: Um and then when I decided to really get sober, or this is like I'm not speaking very eloquently right now, but that's okay.
31:27
SPEAKER_00: Three years in and out is what I'll say.
31:29
SPEAKER_00: Like I went three years in and out of like severe drug and alcohol problems and almost lost my life like numerous times.
31:34
SPEAKER_00: And when you're, as we say in like my world, like a real addict or a real alcoholic, the consequences don't keep you sober, like it doesn't register.
31:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you don't care, you don't care.
31:46
SPEAKER_00: You have to get to your own bottom, and babe, you can always keep digging, always keep digging.
31:51
SPEAKER_00: No, yeah.
31:53
SPEAKER_00: Um, however, interlaced throughout those periods, I would go through long periods of like abstinence and you know, I would read all the books and do all the things, and like I read The Secret when I was 10.
32:03
SPEAKER_00: Like, you should see my bookshelf.
32:04
SPEAKER_00: It's like A Course in Miracles, like Eckhart Tole, like all the books, all the things.
32:08
SPEAKER_00: So I've always been a seeker.
32:10
SPEAKER_00: I have always been to a fault to some extent, looking for something like outside myself.
32:15
SPEAKER_00: Um, I would say this sounds so weird to say, but I have, you know, found a god, a higher power of my own understanding.
32:21
SPEAKER_00: I'm not kind of dipped in and out of everything.
32:24
SPEAKER_00: I think I could never commit to one like full religion because it doesn't feel right.
32:30
SPEAKER_00: And for those who can, I think that's like very beautiful and very wonderful, but it just it never landed with me.
32:35
SPEAKER_00: Um but when I was 2023 March, um, my story of getting sober actually, I flew across the country to see some of my old college friends.
32:46
SPEAKER_00: And you know, on this trip, I had been sober for seven months prior to this, been abstinent, not sober and doing emotional work, sober and like doing the hard stuff.
32:56
SPEAKER_00: And so I got on a plane to go see my old college friends, and this was gonna be my like test.
33:02
SPEAKER_00: I was gonna see, am I a real adapter alcoholic?
33:05
SPEAKER_00: Like, am I really gonna do my thing?
33:06
SPEAKER_00: And you know, within the first 24 hours of I get on the plane and I start making all these rules for myself around like drinking and drug use.
33:15
SPEAKER_00: That's not normal for people.
33:18
SPEAKER_00: No, like people who are you're like red flag, red flags, yeah.
33:23
SPEAKER_00: People who are normally consume like alcohol normally, um, don't have to make rules around their drinking.
33:31
SPEAKER_00: And so my whole thing was like, okay, I'm not gonna drink like alone or before 1 p.m.
33:36
SPEAKER_00: or like in my hotel room alone before 1 p.m.
33:38
SPEAKER_00: without food, blah, blah, blah.
33:39
SPEAKER_00: And then I break all these rules within 24 hours.
33:42
SPEAKER_00: And then I obliterated my relationship with two of my best friends who I went to go see.
33:48
SPEAKER_00: Um I like the trip extended much longer than it should have.
33:52
SPEAKER_00: I got myself into some really dangerous situations.
33:55
SPEAKER_00: But then when I came back, um I considered that to be like I had my very, not my very first, but a very spiritual experience where I was like, I'm done.
34:04
SPEAKER_00: You know, I was in a hotel room, dark hotel room alone by myself, consuming every substance like known to mankind.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: And alcoholics and addicts will talk about this that it stops working.
34:15
SPEAKER_00: And I don't even mean like, oh, the party wasn't fun anymore.
34:18
SPEAKER_00: It stopped being fun a long time ago.
34:21
SPEAKER_00: Um, like no one would drink with me anymore because I was a nightmare.
34:24
SPEAKER_00: Um, but it stopped being fun, yeah, stopped being fun a long time ago, but it stopped working in the sense that I could no longer feel like the good effects that I wanted produced by alcohol.
34:34
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, I remember standing there and thinking, I like I don't have an option anymore.
34:39
SPEAKER_00: Either I'm going to get sober or I'm gonna like myself because this is no way to live.
34:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:46
SPEAKER_00: This I truly believe I was like picked up by God and put back down to Vancouver is where I'm from.
34:54
SPEAKER_00: Um and since then I've been on a journey again, called step as a part of my story.
35:00
SPEAKER_00: That's what I'll say there.
35:01
SPEAKER_00: But I have been like oh my the sobriety journey sounds so weird.
35:06
SPEAKER_00: Um, but through a program of action is what I will say as well of like helping others, like doing the deep internal work and getting force and like a higher power of my own understanding is how I've been able to find like fulfillment and joy in this life.
35:20
SPEAKER_00: Um I often find that the most spiritual people, whatever that even means, like are the most like simple though.
35:27
SPEAKER_00: I think the internet has gone off on the the deep end how it does with like the crystals and like the oh my god, it's true.
35:37
SPEAKER_00: Some of the most spiritual people I know just are like are drinking black coffee and smoking cigarettes in a parking lot.
35:42
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
35:44
SPEAKER_01: You know what?
35:45
SPEAKER_01: I've never like I mean, yes, I've I've known this, I've seen this, but I've it's funny just to hear you say it because it's so true.
35:54
SPEAKER_01: And I think like I think people have good intentions, like the spiritual coaches, the spiritual leaders.
35:59
SPEAKER_01: Like, I I have some in my life that I love, but there are others that I think have like uh uh the I don't know if it's money, I don't know what it is, has gotten to them to a place where it's like, what are these crazy things that we're doing?
36:15
SPEAKER_01: Like you can just literally sit and be spiritual.
36:18
SPEAKER_01: Like it's not, it doesn't have to be a big deal.
36:20
SPEAKER_00: And go help someone for the love of God.
36:23
SPEAKER_00: Like go get outside of yourself.
36:27
SPEAKER_00: Um, I think modern spirituality, whatever that even means, again, the spiritual aesthetic that has taken over the internet is so rooted in self-obsession and like gotta find myself, gotta find myself, gotta find myself.
36:38
SPEAKER_00: And don't get me wrong, I I've gone off on those tangents and it's easy to get sucked in, but like you will find yourself in service to others in some capacity.
36:46
SPEAKER_00: Like, again, and that could be doing what you love because God doesn't want you miserable, God doesn't want you broke, destitute, or miserable.
36:53
SPEAKER_00: I also think there's a lane of spirituality that thinks it is more noble, ethical, or virtuous to be like to not have any wants or desires or not have money.
37:04
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, that no, we are on this earth to experience like material pleasure as well.
37:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and like you're not gonna find yourself searching through everyone else's journeys.
37:17
SPEAKER_01: Like, I think what happens is people are like, I'm trying to find myself.
37:20
SPEAKER_01: So, like, I'm gonna try this, I'm gonna try that, I'm gonna try this, I'm gonna try that.
37:24
SPEAKER_01: And it's like, I think you're gonna find yourself when you just like go for a walk.
37:28
SPEAKER_01: Let go, like super when you just when you stop trying to find yourself, like that's when you're gonna find yourself because you're just you're just clouding up your mental, emotional, spiritual space with like different tasks and checklists when like you don't need that.
37:45
SPEAKER_00: This all works.
37:47
SPEAKER_00: I I don't purport to understand how the entire universe works.
37:50
SPEAKER_00: In my experience, yeah, the best answers come when you are in that state of like oftentimes like forced into that state of super surrender, and like I do not know what the answer is, I don't know what I want, I don't have clarity, or I don't think I have clarity, and you just fully let go.
38:08
SPEAKER_00: And it's hard, it doesn't mean that it's easy.
38:12
SPEAKER_00: Um I think there, yeah, there's a huge amount like of books, literature, resources.
38:17
SPEAKER_00: I really, if people want like a spiritual coach to pay for, I'm like, okay, but please, before you invest 9,999 in manifestation coaching, I would really encourage you to go read a Course of Miracles, like, go read the Secretary.
38:36
SPEAKER_00: Go read the word, your word is your wand.
38:39
SPEAKER_00: Go read the like$20 books that all of these people are basing their courses off of.
38:45
SPEAKER_00: Um I just think there's so much out there that people can use to educate themselves or like go to church, go to like something like just be careful.
38:55
SPEAKER_00: If something sounds from a coach like it's too good to be true, it is.
39:00
SPEAKER_00: Um, the spiritual coaching industry has gotten absolutely out of Instagram.
39:09
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, like people charging six figures per year to regurgitate super attractor by Gabby Bernstein is just nonsense.
39:19
SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's just like not even morally right.
39:21
SPEAKER_01: Like, what?
39:22
SPEAKER_00: No, absolutely not.
39:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think like everyone's like spiritual journey is so different.
39:29
SPEAKER_01: I was raised super religious in a very conservative religion in a very small town in Utah.
39:35
SPEAKER_01: So, like, oh yeah, I I was raised like cult vibes basically, and but I always knew from a very young age that I was spiritual, I always knew I was clairvoyant.
39:47
SPEAKER_01: Like my parents would tell me stories of me seeing our deceased ancestors in my room when I was a child.
39:55
SPEAKER_01: Like they were like, that's weird, you know?
39:58
SPEAKER_01: That's a lot of and so they're like, is she okay?
40:02
SPEAKER_01: And I so I always kind of knew that about myself, but being, you know, trained and basically grown up in a religion, there was so much guilt and shame and conditioning put on me.
40:16
SPEAKER_01: Um, no fault really of my parents.
40:17
SPEAKER_01: They were just doing what they thought was the best.
40:19
SPEAKER_01: Oh, really the fault of the patriarchy in that religion, but that's something for another day.
40:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
40:27
SPEAKER_01: But like, you know, and so for me, it was like breaking out of that.
40:31
SPEAKER_01: Like, I didn't have like a breaking point or like the lowest point.
40:35
SPEAKER_01: It was more of like a deconditioning and a repatterning of like, oh, I don't if something's not working out for me, it's not because I was a bad friend to someone at one point.
40:47
SPEAKER_01: It that I'm just a human having a human experience, and that was the craziest part of my spiritual journey was being like, oh, these are like boundaries that a religion put on me and thoughts put on me.
40:59
SPEAKER_01: And I I don't have to agree with them anymore.
41:03
SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't have to totally follow them anymore, you know?
41:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because first of all, that's wonderful and that's beautiful, and I'm very glad you've been able to find your way back to like source or spirit, um, a higher power of your own understanding despite religious conditioning and maybe some trauma, because I know that can be very, very hard for people.
41:22
SPEAKER_00: A major barrier to God for people is what people have been told about God or universe or source, like their whole life.
41:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's hard.
41:30
SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, so that's beautiful.
41:33
SPEAKER_00: But uh we often hear this like religion is man-made, like spirituality is it's from God, and it doesn't who made who made it?
41:40
SPEAKER_00: Like you can't, right?
41:41
SPEAKER_00: And there is some spirit and spirituality interwoven into certain religions, but again, like when you put boundaries or restrictions on self, then or like really hard, firm rules, which you think everyone else should live by.
41:54
SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm not here to tell anyone else how to live.
41:57
SPEAKER_00: I think there are so many paths, so many paths, and none of them are wrong.
42:02
SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, I think I I found God obviously through getting to my lowest of lows.
42:11
SPEAKER_00: Um or it never really landed, I never really saw how like God and the universe were working in my life until they had to pick me up, until I fully surrendered to like I clearly don't know what's best for my life.
42:29
SPEAKER_00: I can't be in control anymore.
42:31
SPEAKER_00: No, a hundred percent.
42:32
SPEAKER_00: You can take the wheel, and so I think now, as someone who also firmly has like a manifestation practice and a belief in like alignment and manifestation and bringing about our desires, there is a balance with that, and then surrender and letting go.
42:47
SPEAKER_00: I also think, as the internet does, the internet hath taken it too far, and like we're meant to just like manifest and constantly bring about more things and things and things.
42:55
SPEAKER_00: You can't live like that, you will go crazy.
42:57
SPEAKER_00: There is something to be said for sitting with what you have and enjoying the manifestations that have been brought about and really getting in touch with what you actually want.
43:08
SPEAKER_00: Because we can manifest things we don't want.
43:12
SPEAKER_00: In fact, we do it all the time.
43:14
SPEAKER_01: Especially, I feel like if you're forcing, like you know, I think that's one thing is like if you're forcing clarity, it's not coming.
43:23
SPEAKER_01: That's that's when you're gonna like manifest something you don't really want because you're like you're searching for something that you don't know.
43:29
SPEAKER_01: And I love what you said about like you have to know what you want.
43:32
SPEAKER_01: And you may go through periods of time that you don't really know, and you're just kind of like in this in between of like, I don't really know, but I know I will know eventually.
43:44
SPEAKER_00: And that's when you turn it over.
43:46
SPEAKER_00: And turning it over doesn't mean it's easy, it's really hard.
43:50
SPEAKER_00: Um, but I think blind ambition and blind hustle are also not good, and they don't bear the result.
44:00
SPEAKER_00: That you want them to.
44:02
SPEAKER_00: Um, like, yeah, I've I've just seen that a lot.
44:05
SPEAKER_00: And when I'm trying to manifest things and I'm like, I don't even know why I want that.
44:09
SPEAKER_00: Like, what am I doing?
44:10
SPEAKER_00: And then I shame myself for like not knowing what I want.
44:12
SPEAKER_00: And then again, I'm in this like self-obsessed shame spiral and it's not helpful.
44:16
unknown: No.
44:17
SPEAKER_00: No.
44:17
SPEAKER_00: No.
44:19
SPEAKER_00: And also, I think, again, the internet hath taken it too far with regards to like, oh, like, watch your thoughts, watch your thoughts, like be careful of your thoughts.
44:26
SPEAKER_00: And then you think if you have one bad thought, you're gonna manifest it.
44:30
SPEAKER_00: And to me, that is just like that's like old school religious conditioning, too.
44:33
SPEAKER_00: Like, if I have a bad thought, like I'm gonna go to hell.
44:35
SPEAKER_01: No, yeah, but you can just let it go.
44:39
SPEAKER_01: You actually like don't have to do anything, you can just be like, oh, whatever, like moving on.
44:45
SPEAKER_00: There is there's so much on the manifestation topic.
44:48
SPEAKER_00: Again, I think it's been very like misconstrued by popular culture and society.
44:52
SPEAKER_00: And I think I would want any any also like spiritually anxious baddie, you can let it go sometimes, and you don't always need to be manifesting or like pulling tarot or like buying new crystals.
45:05
SPEAKER_00: It's okay to let it go, and the most spiritual thing you can do sometimes is nothing.
45:11
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
45:13
SPEAKER_00: Yep, sing it.
45:16
SPEAKER_00: Nothing.
45:16
SPEAKER_00: It's hard.
45:18
SPEAKER_01: It is so hard.
45:19
SPEAKER_01: I that's been a huge part of my journey lately.
45:22
SPEAKER_01: Like I'm a Capricorn, I have a Capricorn stellium.
45:25
SPEAKER_01: What's your chart?
45:26
SPEAKER_01: I have a uh I don't like know it in order, but I have a I'm a Capricorn sun, Capricorn rising Scorpio moon.
45:36
SPEAKER_01: Okay, and I have a Capricorn stellium and an Aquarius stellium.
45:40
SPEAKER_01: So you could say I'm spiritually insane from birth because I have so much like, like I said, I'm clairvoyant.
45:48
SPEAKER_01: I'm very connected spiritually, but then I have this like Capricorn logistical, make it make sense structure strategy side.
45:56
SPEAKER_01: And they are always, they are always at war with each other.
46:00
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, ah, but I've been um a couple episodes ago, I had Tang and Claire on here.
46:06
SPEAKER_01: If you guys are interested, you should go listen to that one.
46:07
SPEAKER_01: They're with the breath work coaches that I've been working with.
46:11
SPEAKER_01: And that's been a big theme for me.
46:13
SPEAKER_01: And all of my breathwork journeys is like surrender.
46:16
SPEAKER_01: You have to slow down, you have to create more space and do nothing.
46:23
SPEAKER_01: It's really hard.
46:24
SPEAKER_01: Which feels insane.
46:25
SPEAKER_01: If you're a Capricorn, you will understand.
46:27
SPEAKER_01: But it's like I can't like doing nothing is like the most painful thing in my whole life.
46:32
SPEAKER_00: It's also just societal conditioning, too.
46:35
SPEAKER_00: And I get it because I'm also like um a huge proponent of the aligned hustle.
46:44
SPEAKER_00: Like, I think again, there has been this sh swing the other way, and like, oh, we just need to like rest all the time, and I just want to rot in bed all day, and like I do not desire to like do labor.
46:54
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I do, but just the labor that I want.
46:56
SPEAKER_00: Like, I want to build what I want and have the hustle that I'm gonna consent to, because that's different, right?
47:02
SPEAKER_00: Um, so but I do find it very hard to like slow down.
47:07
SPEAKER_00: So if you reframe it as productive, as like, yes, it's actually a cheat code.
47:13
SPEAKER_00: It's a cheat code, it's gonna get me closer to making more money to doing what I want.
47:16
SPEAKER_00: It will work that way.
47:17
SPEAKER_00: You won't believe it till you do it, though, right?
47:20
SPEAKER_00: Um creating space for like something to emerge.
47:23
SPEAKER_01: It's tough, but it's so hard, and I think it's hard to like if you are in the spiritual world and you see these manifestation coaches that are like uh manifest, manifest, manifest, it's like what I think I need to manifest rest.
47:35
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, like you don't always have to be doing something.
47:39
SPEAKER_00: You need it because your life just can't be about just bringing about more.
47:44
SPEAKER_00: I there's a couple things that have happened in my life since I got sober in the last, I guess, like two and a half years that I manifested these things a long time ago, or I kind of brought them into consciousness a long time ago, and they they don't come to fruition like until years later.
47:59
SPEAKER_00: You don't know how or when these things are gonna come through, and like you need to let go of what it looks like because I had no idea how I was gonna get where I got.
48:10
SPEAKER_00: I had no idea how I was gonna end up working like in social media or living in the city that I do.
48:15
SPEAKER_01: You don't know, no, or like meeting your partner, like you just you don't know.
48:20
SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of times too, like people want to manifest money, and it that I this is something you and I have been talking in our DMs about a couple of times with manifestation books and like money manifestation books, yeah.
48:30
SPEAKER_01: But I've been really trying to like tune my energy towards money and make it like a really positive, abundant relationship.
48:39
SPEAKER_01: Yes, and I think people, you know, they're like, I want to manifest a million dollars, and it's like, okay, that's great, and you can totally do that, but it might take 10 years or it might take 15 years, like you don't know what that how long that journey is gonna take, and like universe, God, whatever source, like they're not gonna give that to you until you're ready.
48:59
SPEAKER_01: So you can't rush it.
49:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, identity alignment is another really big one that like if you if your identity is somewhere here of like I some people have a lot of work to do around like money conditioning, most of us do if you operate in general society.
49:17
SPEAKER_00: But if you're over here and you're like the economy is bad, capitalism bad, economy bad, like government bad, everything bad, bad, bad, money bad, evil.
49:26
SPEAKER_00: How are you gonna get to like over here where it's like I'm a millionaire, I'm abundant, I am wealthy?
49:32
SPEAKER_00: These are completely opposite viewpoints.
49:34
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you have a lot of work to do in between that space to get to here.
49:40
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's like if you have negative connotations around money and wealth and people who are wealthy, you will not get where you want to be.
49:48
SPEAKER_01: Like if you're the kind of person who's like, I hate rich people, or like rich people treat people bad, or like I don't know, like you I because a lot of people do feel that way, right?
50:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's like then you're you're literally putting a block up for like receiving that money.
50:06
SPEAKER_01: Instead, I would say, like, go talk to those people, like go be in rooms with those people, see how they really are, see, see what see what they're doing.
50:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, see what they talk about.
50:17
SPEAKER_01: It anyone can be a bad person.
50:19
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't the money doesn't make you bad.
50:22
SPEAKER_01: Like, you just probably don't know the full story, and so you're putting a judgment on them that may or may not be true, totally.
50:30
SPEAKER_00: And more or less money does not make you a more or less virtuous person.
50:36
SPEAKER_00: I always say that.
50:38
SPEAKER_00: And so if you have ideas around money, one also being hard to obtain, work, work more, work harder, more money.
50:45
SPEAKER_00: Um, and if I just grind myself into the earth, then I will have a lot of if that's your paradigm, if that's your paradigm around what it takes to become wealthy, your reality will reflect that.
50:57
SPEAKER_00: We know that, right?
50:58
SPEAKER_01: So true.
50:59
SPEAKER_00: Money, like again, building a business and doing your own thing, it does require hard work.
51:02
SPEAKER_00: Um, it's not just like sit in my room and manifest and do nothing.
51:05
SPEAKER_00: It does, there is actually a lot of action required.
51:08
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, the way the money can flow in is like we need to loosen our grip on that.
51:13
SPEAKER_00: And I think if you have a lot of negativity around like business, capitalism, money, you need to get to a place of neutrality.
51:20
SPEAKER_00: Like the jump into proponent is not in your reach if you're in a place of negativity.
51:25
SPEAKER_00: Like, get to a place of like money is neutral, get there.
51:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
51:29
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god, that's so that's so good and so real.
51:32
SPEAKER_01: I think that's true, like with so many things.
51:34
SPEAKER_01: Neutrality is such a powerful tool that I honestly feel like that's one of the biggest struggles with society.
51:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, is people are there's absolutely no neutrality because people associate neutrality with laziness, with I'm doing nothing, I'm stuck, whatever.
51:51
SPEAKER_01: Like that's that's what people connect with neutrality, but like you can have neutrality in so many situations.
51:59
SPEAKER_01: I talk about this to my husband all the time.
52:01
SPEAKER_01: I'm just like, you know, I don't, I actually don't care about that.
52:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
52:09
SPEAKER_01: And that feels amazing.
52:10
SPEAKER_01: And there's some people that care, and I'm gonna leave that to them.
52:13
SPEAKER_01: They can care about that one.
52:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like I you just have to learn the art of neutrality in order to, yeah, decide what your opinions, what your thoughts are, what you want.
52:23
SPEAKER_00: Like we definitely walk every path, and we can't take on all of the work of the world.
52:31
SPEAKER_00: I think activism is a beautiful ministry, but it's not mine.
52:35
SPEAKER_00: Again, earlier when we spoke about staying in your lane, that applies to a lot of things.
52:40
SPEAKER_00: We don't need to be everything to everyone to every cause.
52:44
SPEAKER_00: No, we don't even live like that.
52:47
SPEAKER_00: We don't, as public people, need to take a public stance on every cause.
52:51
SPEAKER_00: And if anyone pressures you to do that, you can just or like, oh, you have an audience that makes you accountable.
52:57
SPEAKER_00: You have to speak out.
52:58
SPEAKER_00: No, I don't.
52:59
SPEAKER_01: No, you don't.
53:00
SPEAKER_00: No, you actually also shouldn't.
53:03
SPEAKER_01: I I'm so with you on that.
53:04
SPEAKER_01: I I think I I might have actually spoken about this, I can't remember.
53:08
SPEAKER_01: But um talking about like people pressuring influencers to speak on political issues and things like that.
53:17
SPEAKER_01: And it's like, I can see where you're coming from, people.
53:21
SPEAKER_01: I can see where you're coming from.
53:23
SPEAKER_01: You got this influencer by engaging with their content, whatever, to this point, and now you want them to be your king or your queen that goes and fights for whatever you believe in.
53:35
SPEAKER_01: And that's actually just not how it works, and it's also not productive to force someone into an opinion for the sake of you liking you, you have the option and you have the control to block, mute, unfollow, not support them.
53:52
SPEAKER_01: And that's what I would encourage you to do.
53:54
SPEAKER_01: Like, if you think they don't align and you don't want to support them, don't support them, but don't force them to say something that they don't know about, that they don't agree with.
54:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's not helpful for anyone.
54:04
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, absolutely.
54:06
SPEAKER_00: I totally get it.
54:07
SPEAKER_00: Like, there have been some things obviously that have gone on in the world that people have been up in my DMs even as a meme account, like pressuring me to speak about.
54:15
SPEAKER_00: And there was a time like years ago when I would have, but now I'm like Me too.
54:20
SPEAKER_01: No, yeah, me in 2020 was a different girl.
54:23
SPEAKER_01: I I was fighting people on the internet, like I and my life was really miserable.
54:28
SPEAKER_01: Like, I was not having a good time because every time I got on the internet, I was like trying to force people to believe what I believed and speak about what I wanted them to speak about and agree with me.
54:40
SPEAKER_01: And I was very like, I was mad and I was like obsessive, and it really was not a healthy way to exist.
54:50
SPEAKER_01: And like I had to come through that extremely charged place to a place of neutrality to then be like, okay, I can help with the things I believe in through these ways, and that's what I want to do.
55:05
SPEAKER_01: And I'm not gonna try to convince all of you to agree with me 100%.
55:10
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
55:11
SPEAKER_00: We don't need to be experts on everything, and again, at the end of the day, like it's not productive.
55:17
SPEAKER_00: Like, I am a person on Instagram, I'm an account on Instagram, and nothing I do is moving the needle with regards to activism in a space that I'm not an activist in.
55:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's like no, yeah.
55:30
SPEAKER_01: I love that.
55:31
SPEAKER_01: I feel like that's gonna be so nice for people to hear.
55:34
SPEAKER_01: I've had so many clients come to me lately that are like, oh, like I just feel this way or that way.
55:39
SPEAKER_01: Like, what do I do?
55:40
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, you don't have to do anything.
55:44
SPEAKER_00: Nothing.
55:45
SPEAKER_00: I mean conversations for the dinner table, maybe.
55:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
55:49
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, you actually don't have to do anything, it's okay.
55:52
SPEAKER_01: And we need more of that.
55:53
SPEAKER_01: We also need more nuance.
55:55
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the internet doesn't like nuance.
55:58
SPEAKER_00: Um, I always say the middle isn't marketable because everyone, no, everyone wants they like polarization, right?
56:07
SPEAKER_00: And like polarizing figures, like look at like Elon Trump, like Kim Kardashian, they're all you either love them or hate them.
56:15
SPEAKER_00: Um so there's something to be said for polarization and success.
56:18
SPEAKER_00: However, it doesn't have to be that way.
56:21
SPEAKER_00: I think we are taught these narratives about success, and especially I'm really noticing in like the business space right now.
56:28
SPEAKER_00: There's two camps.
56:29
SPEAKER_00: There's either the Alex Hormosy, Alpha Sigma Grenz said 24 or 7.
56:35
SPEAKER_00: Literally do not take breaks.
56:37
SPEAKER_00: You have to hate your life, you need to work seven jobs at a time, and that's how you're gonna be successful.
56:42
SPEAKER_00: I was I'm not gonna hate on hormose, though.
56:44
SPEAKER_00: He has some stuff that's some good stuff, yeah.
56:46
SPEAKER_00: Um see, nuance, nuance, and then you have the other camp that's like rest is everything.
56:54
SPEAKER_00: I hate capitalism and manifestation and like woo-woo-woo, and you just like money, mindset, abundance, you never have to do anything, and just like it's all in your head.
57:05
SPEAKER_00: This is also not correct.
57:07
SPEAKER_00: Um, there is a middle, and unfortunately, the middle is like consistent, aligned, hard work, and people, that's not interesting.
57:15
SPEAKER_00: People don't want to hear that, they want the magic bullet.
57:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's like solving my problems now.
57:21
SPEAKER_01: Do it now.
57:23
SPEAKER_01: No, I know.
57:24
SPEAKER_01: I think I I like to tell people to like some of my clients that have more like polarizing stances on things.
57:30
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, you're gonna people are not gonna like you.
57:33
SPEAKER_01: There's gonna be people that don't like you, and that's okay.
57:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, and I think it is as an audience member, you're you have to bring the nuance.
57:44
SPEAKER_01: You have to decide what you wanna take from each of these people, just like you're saying.
57:49
SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, I like these manifestation coaches, I like some of the things they say, I like some of the things Alex Hermozzi says, and I'm gonna make my own, I'm gonna synthesize that and make what works for me.
58:01
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
58:01
SPEAKER_01: And I think like I'm like, are they gonna teach the kids like how to do that in school?
58:08
SPEAKER_01: Because they're somebody needs to teach the kids.
58:11
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, yeah.
58:12
SPEAKER_00: Unfortunately, I don't think they're doing that.
58:15
SPEAKER_00: I don't think or Mosey or Gabby Bernstein are making it into the classroom.
58:19
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, we need to teach the kids that they don't have to a hundred percent agree with everything.
58:29
SPEAKER_01: They can make that you can take stuff from all the different buckets and then you can make it yours.
58:33
SPEAKER_01: You don't have to subscribe to one or the other.
58:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
58:38
SPEAKER_00: There are there are more ways to do this, yes.
58:41
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
58:42
SPEAKER_01: Okay, I love that so much, and thank you for sharing your journey.
58:45
SPEAKER_00: That's yeah, I mean that was like small excerpts.
58:49
SPEAKER_00: Um, I had to be careful, like, I'm always careful about how much I speak about 12 step.
58:53
SPEAKER_00: All I will say is like it's a part of my story, and if you are struggling, I would very much um say that just my life is very good as a result of having that in my life.
59:05
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love that.
59:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I feel like your story will help so many people like just find find wherever they're at in their journey and connect with you there.
59:15
SPEAKER_01: And um, yeah, is there anything else you wanted to add before we close out?
59:19
SPEAKER_00: I don't think so.
59:20
SPEAKER_00: I think we've covered everything.
59:21
SPEAKER_00: I could talk to you for hours.
59:22
SPEAKER_00: I feel like we are literally on the same page about everything about like spirit, social, business.
59:29
SPEAKER_00: Like, I get it.
59:30
SPEAKER_00: Yes, uh, yeah.
59:31
SPEAKER_01: I know you just got married, hey?
59:34
SPEAKER_01: Yep, just got married.
59:36
SPEAKER_01: It's been a great, it's been a great time being married.
59:39
SPEAKER_01: I feel like I've just entered into a new era of my business, which anyone who's listening to this, you'll all probably see it, but like just a new evolution of like scaling and restructuring and um some new offers to support my life moving forward because things could be changing.
59:58
SPEAKER_01: Um, but yeah, I really appreciate having you on and having your insight.
1:00:02
SPEAKER_00: Amazing.
1:00:03
SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me.
1:00:05
SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, baby's first podcast.
1:00:07
SPEAKER_00: I think it went well.
1:00:08
SPEAKER_01: She slayed.
1:00:09
SPEAKER_01: And everyone go follow Callie.
1:00:12
SPEAKER_01: Follow Existential Spices.
1:00:14
SPEAKER_01: I'll link it too, so you guys can find it.
1:00:16
SPEAKER_01: But one of my favorite accounts.
1:00:18
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
1:00:18
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
1:00:19
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
1:00:20
SPEAKER_01: Okay, bye.