Latest / The People Run Podcast / #73 What Does It Take to Become One of the World's Best Marathoners? | Zouhair Talbi

Transcript

#73 What Does It Take to Become One of the World's Best Marathoners? | Zouhair Talbi · The People Run Podcast

• 0:01
  SPEAKER_01: So here.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the People Round Podcast, man.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: First off, congratulations.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: You just coming off winning the great North Run, man, in a 59-47.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: First time in the UK.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: Walk me through the race, man.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: What was going through your mind?
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, thank you for having me.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um so for me, like I'm I I like to call myself uh specialized in marathon.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_03: So that's the primary distance I uh train for.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_03: And along the way, I like to put you know small goals like milestones to hit before the big goal.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_03: And um this one was the last pretty much the last race I want to do before New York City Marathon to like see where I am in fitness, and you know, just I like to do, you know, this is something I learned from some gray runners, and I try to apply for myself.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_03: It's like you you need you need a race where you um get the same thing you're gonna do in the race, the big one, you know, like the same shoes you're gonna wear, you probably wanna like try them, you know, the socks you're gonna wear, the you know, the tight.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_03: If it's a new tight, you never wore them.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_03: You probably wanna try them.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, you know, maybe you're taking some supplement.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know, like some you know, uh a lot of people talking about big carbs, you know, you don't wanna wait until the day of your big you know, your big day, then you can you wanna try that.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_03: You wanna try it in an environment that it simulates the the the big one, right?
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_03: Like like a lot of um anxiety, the mo you know, the emotions, the stress that goes through the race, that can that's how you test uh a lot of things.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_03: I think um it was perfect uh timing for me.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_03: So um went there, no idea how fast I would go or if I can win.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_03: It's just more like this is the best fitness I've ever had in you know coming up to a build.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_03: You know, like when you just crush the workout, you know that it's a good sign.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_03: But living in uh you know 6,000 feet altitude, you don't really know what's the real split, you know, what's yeah, what you're gonna what you're gonna run in uh in a race day.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_03: So but I was ready mentally and physically to like go after the race and uh what happened is um you know uh walking you through the race, the first 5k was fast.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_03: We went through the 5k in 1347, so that's that's yeah, it was it it was a it's more downhill in the first 5k before we start like going up, but it's still like it was a lot of pressing on the pace.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_03: Uh I was just following at that point, just being behind the pack and trying to like you know just see what's going on, you know, because you don't know everyone's fitness.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_03: So after the 5k, um I would say yeah, around 5k, uh we start the hills, and they can feel that the pace that we start with is start slowing down a little bit, and I was like, I feel fit.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_03: I think I think I want to keep going in the same pace and see what's gonna happen.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_03: Because it felt it felt a not too comfortable, but comfortable enough to finish the half marathon.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I that's my thinking process at that point.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_03: So I was in that gradual uphill.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_03: I was starting I start pressing on the pace, and sure enough, like after five miles, I can see just me and Mutisu, which is the second guy who finished second game.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_03: That's the only guy that uh stayed with me on that pressing mode, pushing on the pace until around five miles.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_03: And from there we were side by side until the last mile.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_03: I was not trying to leave him, he was not trying to leave me during the race.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_03: He was like, we were we were running fast enough where both of us thinking this is a good pace to take it to the finish.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_03: And I mean, three months ago, I'm like, this is the winner last year.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, I he has a lot of experience, he's fast, he won London marathon, he finished second in New York City marathon.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_03: He's like, you know, and I was like, no, I cannot let that get in my mind.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_03: Today is my day.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_03: That's this conversation I I had with myself during the race, and I'm like, I just need to save as much energy until the last two miles, uh, then push as hard as they can until the finish.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think trying to understand what he was thinking, he's probably thinking, well, uh maybe we can just wait until the last kilometers and they can kick like last year, which he did it last year.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_03: Me, two miles, two kilometers to go, it was a long, like a steep downhill.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_03: Then you turn to the finish.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_03: Man, I went flying on that downhill.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_03: So I made a small gap.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_03: We turned, I pressed more, then yeah, that's how I um so he's probably thinking he's gonna wait until 1k to go.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_03: I pressed 2k to go, and um yeah, that's how I won the race, and I was basically a box that I checked in this training bill, like just saying I'm I'm fit.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_03: I just need to keep keep building until New York.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_03: So that's how things went.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: Man, a lot to unpack there.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_01: First off, I love the idea of you know, you always hear train in the long run, wear the shoes, but you're doing the whole thing, the mental side of the training, the anxiety, the food, the race environment.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: So I love that there.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um want to ask you like, is it experience as you're thinking through the race, what makes you make all these mental changes in a race?
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_01: Push here, don't push here, um, hold with this pace.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: I feel good.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how do you get so good at doing that?
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_03: I I will say it comes with experience.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_03: That's the first thing.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_03: I made mistakes in the past, yeah.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I regretted not pushing in certain races, in certain, you know.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_03: You're like, I wish I followed them when they did that move, you're right, at 5k, because they slow down at you know at 7k.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_03: Because now I I can understand that there is a certain pace, it's just like a surge, which means they're gonna change the pace for about like a kilometer or less, like half a mile.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_03: Then they're gonna slow down to the previous pace or even slower, you never know.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so you need to train for that type of uh moves, and that's what I try to do in training, you know.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_03: But when I came from track to the roads, I was fit, maybe fitter than a lot of people, but they still beat me in the race because they just have more experience.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_03: They just you know, they break you mantle.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_03: You're like you're in a uh like you can see a big uphill, you're like, they can push, and you say, Oh like it's too much, why I would push right now, you know.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_05: Gotcha.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_03: Then you will give you a gap, and you're never gonna close that gap.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it's just sometimes hard when you're by yourself and trying to like get to the person next uh in front of you.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I will say the decisions I make during the race, it's different every time.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_03: I can't tell you this is what I'm gonna do, or this is how the race is gonna go.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's more like you gotta react to the pack and also you gotta do your moves the way you feel, you know?
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_03: Because when I did that big move, I knew the course.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_03: That's that's I think one thing that helped me is I study the course.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_03: I know I know what if I go that big downhill, there is no uphill after that, you know.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's straight until the f like it's flat until the finish.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_03: So studying the course can help as well.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_03: Like knowing, hey, um if they didn't move the hair, I probably don't want to fall out because it's the hell's still long, you know.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_03: It depends.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, you gotta know yourself, your training, and yeah, make that.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know if I answered your question.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: No, it definitely doesn't.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_03: It's very hard to like give you like what definitely does, man.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_01: You you took uh put a lot of nuggets there of like knowing the course, knowing when to make those moves, experiences obviously gonna help racing a lot is definitely gonna help for sure.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because you you're making those changes and you learn from them, as you mentioned.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: So what was that final like?
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: You're hunting down this final stretch, you make that turn, as you mentioned, the crowd's roaring, maybe you hear the announcer name, everyone the the noise is loud, you see the finish line.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_01: What was going through your mind when you're like, I know I won already?
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's definitely, you know, before before I uh like the start, the race organizers came and said, you know that no American won this race before.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_03: Like this one, that's gonna be the you know, you're gonna make history like the first American to win this race, and it's a big race.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_03: It was like um, like when I was hearing, for example, Meb uh talking about in his book talking about marathons, he always like bring up oh they run Grey North run seven weeks before or six, you know.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_03: It's always a race you can do, a big race, a big half marathon you can do before New York.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_03: So it was very noun, and yeah, um at when I was just with him, I know I can be first when I was with Motisu at final stage.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_03: I know I can be first or second.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_03: But second, no one brings second ever.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_03: If you don't win a race, you know, it's it's hard.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_03: It's hard to like they don't call you a champion, it's it's very hard to like have that you know moment after the moment and legacy after, yeah.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_03: So I was I was dreaming it like be while we're still racing.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like I was dreaming it.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_03: Like I I can see myself going to the finish line first, and I feel like when it gives him that gap, from there is more like just motivation.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_03: Like I I need to get to the finish.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like sometimes I would rather be the first push into the finish than being the one who hands someone in the straight in the in the finish.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I just when uh like I I will say 1k to go, I quick look back and I can see that he's probably not gonna catch me.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_03: It's like it's it's a little bit far, and they know I'm I'm gonna win.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_03: It's like if you watch the finish line video, like 400 mirrors, I was I was like happy.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_03: I was like, wow, I'm I'm gonna win today.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, it's great.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_03: I uh you know we did a long travel, you know.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_03: It's worth it when you win.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: Definitely adds to the reward, man, coming all the way from out here out to a very long flight, time uh come home with not just the medal, but the win and legacy of the American winning, yeah, for sure.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: So here, how has your mindset changed now that you're becoming one of the fastest American marathoners?
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: You you crushed Boston and it's kind of known now, like, hey, he's he's coming.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_03: I uh I think I'm I just my mindset is like I'm an ambitious person.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_03: I I always like to put bigger goals than than what it's I don't know, I can then like anytime I put a goal, I achieve that goal, but then the same day when I achieve that goal, I immediately switch to a bigger goal, right?
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_03: And that's why I say, you know, I keep myself humble, like get back to work, uh get back to uh you know my team, and nothing changes, just go back to my team, they say congratulations one day, and let's say we get back to work, training, and for me, I think, yes, I'm one of the best right now.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but I'm not one of the best in the world.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_03: I think that's that's my goal, that's what I want to become, you know.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_03: Like putting that big goal.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_03: I'm running New York City Marathon, and I'm like, you know, I'm asking myself the same question.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_03: What what what's gonna take for me to become one of the best?
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: And I work toward that goal, and it's just steps sometimes time.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_03: You need a lot of time, you need to work, you know, no injuries, keep building and improving in a lot of things.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_03: So I I try to ask myself those right questions, what what I'm lacking, what what's in my training, what what I'm like not good at, and they need to work more on.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_03: Um I like to get a lot of feedbacks from people that knows me, you know, run uh with me and like or close friend and like that knows running, they're like, okay, yeah, you need to do this, or you need to do more of this, or you know, I like to improve and yeah, and I want to stay where I am now, like what as one of the best American.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_03: I will definitely uh like defend that title, but the goal is to be one of the best in the world.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_01: So yes.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that makes me want to ask you, then, right?
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like when you look at the world and you you're doing your research and you're being reflective, what do you think separates the top five versus the top ten?
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: You know, f from five to ten and then top five.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: Because they're all doing high mileage, training at altitude, check, nutrition, you know, fueling, good fuse.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: What separates it?
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_03: I I ask myself that question a lot of time, and I think I can give you what I find out, right?
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_03: If we're gonna talk about the best 0-1% or in running, or like we let's say we're talking about all the runners that run, you know, under 204 in the marathon, or like under 58, right?
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_03: People run 57, or I think number one is the talent.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_03: They're so talented, like they're they're not like a normal person, you know.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_03: It's like that kid that you see in high school breaking all the records in high school, right?
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_03: Like they're that type of person with less training, you know, and then one of those people.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm like, okay, I checked that mark.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um I was yeah, I was basically a star in high school.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_03: I I uh I did like you know, uh I ran 345 in 345 in 1500, which is like that's equivalent to four minutes in the mile, right?
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_03: As a high schooler.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_03: I ran um A10 in um two uh like 3K.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_03: And that's like what's like that's under nine minutes, so it's fast times, and um I finished 14th in the world championship cross-country.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_03: So I was a cross-country guy as well, um, as a high schooler.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_03: So those um showed me that I have the talent.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_03: So what what else we can you look just the most of those guys, their environment, right?
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_03: Their environment helps because you can see and believe that this guy did it.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_03: Like he he's like in Ethiopia, for example, there is a group where you can find the Olympic champion, the world champion, the you know, and there's a young guy, for example, Kijel Shah, just start training and you start training with Olympic champion.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_03: Kijelsha saw that he's training with the Olympic champion, and he can be him in training.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_03: So, what stops him from not being, you know, one of the best?
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_03: When you start like shifting, you know, your mind that it's possible, and this is the training they did.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_03: You you you know that you're knowledgeable, you know the training they've been doing, it's not like a secret, you know.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yes.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_03: It used to be like, I don't know how I'm gonna get there, but I'm talking about someone, example, in Ethiopia, still young, he can find the team, the training, you can do the same training, the same, like a lot of advice if you're surrounded.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_03: I think they have a higher chance from becoming one of the best, yeah, right?
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_03: Where someone, if you're solo, you're talented, but you're solo, you don't have a team, it's hard.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_03: It's funny.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_03: Because my shift came when I started with you know the American Distance Project here in Colorado Springs.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm training with Hillary Bohr, he won six times the national champion.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_03: He he finished sixth in the Olympic Games.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_03: You know, that's an example.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_03: I am uh in the same team, I have you know uh uh Bernard Katira, he went to the Olympics World Championship.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Paul Chilimo, he won two you know two medals.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_03: When I joined the group, I saw them.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_03: We talked about training, they weren't nothing crazy, more like their training hard.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_03: That's you know, because I could not keep up with them in training when I just joined the group.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_03: They were they were fast.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_03: They were, you know, I remember we did like 10 miles a tempo run.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_03: I never did 10 miles tempo run in my entire life.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_03: I did it and did it 10 miles in uh 453 average.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_03: 453 average.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_03: I told them this is a race.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_03: I can literally search that weekend somewhere in the world, that's gonna be a winning, you know, winning time.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for sure.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I I don't wanna I wanna keep answer your question in you know, just walk you through my mind.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_03: I think the environment helps, the belief that you can actually become one of the fastest.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_03: The hard work, I think also it comes to the individual.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_03: Like when you go home, what do you do?
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_03: You know, do you sleep early, right?
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_03: Do you eat right?
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_03: No one is watching you, no one no one is coming to knock your door in the morning to go do your runs.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_03: No, like my coach is not is not never gonna tell me how many miles you did this week.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_03: He expects from me to do the mileage.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_03: I'm required to do.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_03: So then it comes to the individual how bad you want it or you know, like what type of person you are, because you can have the environment, the talent, the the money, the time, everything else, but you're not you're missing one of the you know this.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_03: I think there is six or seven aspects to become you know great.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that top, yeah.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_03: The biggest one is the belief.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_03: You be you have to believe that you're gonna do it.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_03: Otherwise, you're always gonna hand it to someone.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_03: You can go until the finish, you know, then hand it to someone.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_03: Be like, I cannot not me.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: That that nails it perfectly, right?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: Because everyone's doing the work, but you gotta have those other things you mentioned, and what's happening when no one's watching is very important for sure.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, absolutely.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's something that you need to remind yourself all the time.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_03: It's like you know, you you know that you know that you're supposed to roll out, right?
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_03: Like or do the boots.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_03: You have the boots, you bought them, you know?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_03: You have them in the house.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_03: You know you gotta do them.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_03: No one is gonna come and tell you, hey, do them today, or you know.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_03: It's It's a lot of small details if you can be a person who can you can totally live like a normal life.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_03: You just you need to be you know reminding yourself what you should do, right?
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: Do you hear walk me through uh Boston, man?
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: You had obviously uh a great finish in Boston, but I I saw a post where you wrote, like when you were recapping it, man, at one point mile 23.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um what was going through then?
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: I just want to finish this, but you still finished amazingly in Boston.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think the marathon is um its final stage is is waves, is like is like a lot of mental fight, you know?
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_03: It's like ideas come to your mind.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously your body is shutting down, you know, you're like, but I think that fight, like, as you said, the 23 miles the body is telling you, hey, you gotta you gotta slow down now.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_03: It's you're you're gonna crash.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_03: That's my my mom telling me you're gonna crash by by like 25 miles, you you're gonna walk or something.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_03: It's just I'm going at fast pace and the body's hurting, but um it's just sometimes you gotta like you know find that that motivation, you know, that why you're doing this, why are you being trained for this?
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_03: Like we we like to say three months, right?
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I trained, but honestly, for 17 years or something, you know, when I start running, I wanna I'm I was building year after year, and you wanna you know be in that top runners in the world.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_03: So it's yes, uh at that point in Boston Marathon, like from 23 miles to 26 miles is more like I just need to stay controlled, stay, you know, don't freak out, just keep pushing and uh hold your position.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_03: And I I you know I looked up and I can see uh uh an Ethiopian guy named Kuros, who finished fourth in front of me.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_03: He was right in front of me, not too far.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_03: So I was like, I gotta catch him.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_03: I never did, but he basically pulled me to the finish, you know, to run a fast time.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_03: So um I was like, I'm gonna get him a 40k, and uh 40k I'm gonna get a 41k.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_03: And he was looking back.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_03: I can I can I can see that he's tired as well, but you know, it's uh it was a great day, uh the weather was good, so people are you know pushing and nothing to stop you, you know.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_03: It's not like windy or or hot or you know, it's yeah.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: What did that race teach you at Boston?
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_03: He taught the race taught me that I I can do it.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's just like whatever I put in mind, you know, I can achieve it.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_03: Like two or three in the marathon.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_03: I I used to believe that it's not it's it's a different planet.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's not for me.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I'm a regular runner, I'm like putting all those excuses, like, oh, you know what, I'm you know, I have I have a baby home, you know, ex just excuses.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_03: I I don't sleep I sleep eight hours, but but there is days where you know I woke up at night, you know, you always try to find certain excuses to not do big things, and that race taught me that you just need to look at the big picture, do the basic things that you're supposed to do, and don't worry about the small details.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: Like you couldn't have a bad night, one time, it's okay.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_03: You can have you didn't eat well for two days, it's okay.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_03: You you didn't finish so certain workouts, it's okay, but the big picture is like you're building for something big because one workout or one bed race cannot define you, and that's the example.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_03: I went to Chicago thinking I'm gonna run some fast time.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_03: I was fit, and uh by 37k I had stomach issues, and uh I literally stopped and threw up and get up and move.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_03: It was a mess until the finish.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_03: And in the same race, Connor Mans won, um, broke the record, yeah.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_03: You know, and I was with him for 35k, and you know, no one's gonna care.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_03: You care about you know who did well that race, and it's okay, you just need to give back and believe that your moment's gonna come as well.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_03: You just need to not, you know, like I mean, I would just wanna give this to anyone that's not training well right now or not running good races.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_03: I think if you believe that you can do it and just keep, you know, get from that moment you are in that it's bad, it's not gonna be bad all the time.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_03: You're gonna get through it somehow and you're gonna build through your goals.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_03: But I feel like the big picture is more important than bad race or bad workout, or you know.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, keeping it consistent and thinking long-term, bigger picture, like the race.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: That's it.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_03: That's the key.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that's the key right here, because if you don't do that, you're always gonna be changing.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_03: Example, I didn't finish well in Chicago, I'm gonna blame the coach.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna be like, you know what?
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_03: This work is now working for me.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna get back and go try to find another coach and light another environment, and that's not the right answer.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_03: It's like just get back, you know.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, it worked for last few years, so you can work for more.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_03: You just need to keep away, yeah.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: Do we hear someone sees 203 marathon, just one 5947?
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: How does that all work?
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I saw you recently you put a big 130-mile training week.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how do you put that all together?
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: Some big workouts in this block, too.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, that's what I want to say.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_03: If someone look at me right now and say, What the heck is this?
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_03: 130 miles and it's just round 59.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_03: I was running in a high level for 17 years.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_05: Yep.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_03: So if you're not matching, if you're not matching everything I did in the past, you cannot just jump to the conclusions, right?
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_03: It's years and years of work, right?
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_03: I was as I said, I uh like when I start running, I was still running fast times.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I uh I wanna give you an example so that way you so 2014, right?
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_04: It's a long time ago.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_04: I run 1329 very fast, yes.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_03: In the 5k you know 12 years ago, right?
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I've been I've been that fast 12 years ago.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_03: The truth that people don't tell you is like you cannot keep improving as you improve from young age.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_03: You know, when you get to certain paces, it's very hard to like improve.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_03: You just improve a little bit, you know, a little bit each year, a little bit each year.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_03: But if you stay enough in the game, I think you can get there.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_03: But 1329 and 20, I think some people never like they were not runners.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_03: And at that at that time, and they start running.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_03: I'm talking about running consistently.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_03: I never have like a year where I did something different.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_03: I was just a runner for this entire time.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_03: So if someone sees that, yes, it's years and years of sticking around, of disappointment in races and learning more, or finding new goals.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_03: And just just I love this sport.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_03: I wanna I loved the challenge too.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_03: I love to like get a new challenge and try to get it, and you know, and I it never it I never like I was getting paid through running just in the last years, last few years, right?
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_03: Not not like when I was I think you gotta love what you're doing first.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_03: Even you don't get paid to do it.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_03: I think plus stay long enough, and it's possible.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, if someone see two or three and they're running 220, yes, it's possible to run two or three or even faster, but you need to match uh the history, everything else, right?
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_03: Like exactly Kajel shall just run under two hours.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_03: I don't do I it's crazy, but the guy ran 13 flat ten years ago.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, right?
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_00: That's a great point.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_03: You ran he's he's been building through this day, this moment, you know.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know, like do you is people think okay, you get to a certain point and that's the bar and there's you know you're gonna start going backwards?
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think so.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think I think not if you're consistent as you're saying, yeah.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_03: You will have to like you know, if you do things right, I think you're gonna keep improving, yeah, no matter what.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_01: No, I love that there, and you know, on that same subject, right?
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_01: Years and years in building, we cover one.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: But like, what would you say people underestimate when it comes to the marathon?
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: One is we just covered, hey, it takes years of progress and consistency.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: What else?
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_03: Um if if I'm I would say it takes years, but also it it does not like the same year or the same bellow.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you gotta you gotta give it time, right?
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like train correctly for the marathon, you know, try to get your long runs, you know, try to do uh the fueling right.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you train the fueling, then in the race you can use them.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_03: Basically, there's a whole like formula, you just need to follow just three months basically before your marathon.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and you're gonna give yourself the best shots to run well, right?
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_03: And now, as you said earlier, everything is not a secret anymore.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_03: Everything like it's online, everything the knowledge is there.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_03: You just need to build what works for you, you know.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_03: I can't I'm just gonna give you an example.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_03: You're working at 7 a.m.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_03: I cannot come and say, hey, you can't if you don't run at 9 a.m.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_03: You cannot yeah, you cannot make basically you cannot make it hard for people.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_03: You gotta see what works for you.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe you're not gonna do enough mileage, right?
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_03: You need to see what's what things you can work more on, right?
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like how you can get the fitness higher, right?
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny you say that.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_01: I just found that out recently, the answer to that question.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of cross-training is the answer that I found so far.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um I will do the same.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_03: I will do the same.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_03: If I don't have time, yeah, yes, I will do a lot of cross-training.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: If you're standing up a lot, which means you need to do a lot of recovery, you know, like exactly more things when you come home.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you're standing up all day, you still have a run.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_03: I think, yeah, uh, it's specific to each one, but one thing we're gonna share is result does not come like that.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_03: Just one day it's gonna come.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_03: I think you gotta work for it.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, like eat right, like you know, sleep well.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_03: That's injury prevention.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_03: That way you're not getting injured, you know, like um wear right shoes.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I don't know.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's honestly we can like pick one thing and it's a not an a whole new podcast, right?
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: So I I think the overarching, as you said, man, is just spend the time.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_01: You're gonna have good times, bad times, just stick in and it'll come.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, you gotta stick in a I think also you gotta find motivation, you know.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um being around people that motivate you and um, you know just give you that energy, you know.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_03: Like, yeah, um I cannot do it by myself.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_03: That's that's I always I always think like that.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_03: Like any result I do right now, I cannot just I tried it one year, like my first marathon, I was in Oklahoma and I had no teammates, I was by myself and I was training, and I just did to transition from a tanker runner to a marathon, and I it's hard, yeah, you know.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_03: There's certain days where I just start crying, I'm like, this is tough, but I cannot give up because I didn't then I I did so many things and I still have a little bit more, you know, to get my goal, and it's not easy by yourself, and I don't advise anyone to do the same thing.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_03: I think if you wanna uh achieve a goal in running, you need at least some easier runs, find you know a teammate, uh someone you know, you know, and run with them.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_03: That will help the cycle.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_03: It's gonna be more enjoyable.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_03: Otherwise, it's boring and it's tough, and and the splits, you know, I gotta hit this split, and if you don't, you know.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_03: If you don't and you're by yourself, you're gonna be mad.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_03: Where you can be a teammate, uh someone next to you, be like, ah, it's okay, or the weather is bad today, or you know, it's find a way to like make yourself fall good, but yeah.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_01: So get a team, run with some people, maybe some coaching, you know, have someone do paces with you, um, a whole team makes it work.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: Correct.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that's for every level.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_03: I think you know, every level you can find people at the you know, at that level where you can run train with.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_01: Let's talk New York.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_01: New York is coming soon.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, coming off a run, uh, the Great North front here with the win.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how are you feeling leading up to New York?
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_01: The fitness sounds like it's in check.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think it's gonna be a very interesting um, you know, race in my career.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_03: I I usually come to the race really underdog, whatever, you know, you're not even in top 10, you know, no one is talking about you.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_03: I think I'm you know, build now a name where you start getting more serious, you know.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_03: Uh get a lot of people expect things, you know.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_03: But for me, no pressure.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna go there, I'm gonna try my best.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_03: That means I'm gonna find the race, I'm gonna use all everything, mental toughness, whatever.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna, you know, push hard, um you know, and see what's gonna what's gonna happen.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_03: I think uh physically I'm ready, mentally I'm preparing myself, and um it's gonna be a new, you know.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_03: I just I just like this year I can feel like my body's a lot more stronger, right?
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_03: Like, and I just I'm excited to see and just test it out in in a race like New York City marathon.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_03: That's it's gonna be exciting.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: What if these uh races in the lead up like Great North Run, you did Falmouth as well?
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_01: What uh what if they told you about the fitness heading into New York?
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I mean, uh depends how you go to the race, right?
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_03: When I went to Falmouth, I'm not a a 10K runner.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_03: I don't call myself a 10k runner right now.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_03: I did not do specific workouts for the 10K.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_03: I mean it was seven miles, but that distance, like yeah, I still come up with a third place.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_03: I run through the 10k like in 2750.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_03: That tells me, hey, you're a lot stronger this year.
• 38:59
  unknown: Yeah.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_03: Like without without using the big guns, you know, without using all those fancy fast workouts, you still can come up with this and you're timing you're still working on timing your fitness right, like on the on the perfect day, right?
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_03: On the day you want it.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_03: Because sometimes you don't want to get too fit early, right?
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_03: Like I don't wanna start pushing too hard early and then you get tired before before the race and then you're exhausted, yeah.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so that's a good good good uh thing happen in Falmouth.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_03: And the Great North run, same thing, it's like testing your body in a longer distance, see how your body like reacts by you know, you know, like in an hour range.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_03: Um but I'm still like training for the marathon.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like I do a lot of 25 miles, um, I do a lot of long workouts, so this is yeah, everything is it's included in the training.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_03: Like there's races are very like included in the races, so it's it's if I'm gonna say one thing, is it's gonna be a motivation boost for my marathon.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's a great race to to have a good day in an amazing environment.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I'm from New York originally and I've done New York.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_01: You're gonna love New York Marathon, man.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, I love New York as well.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_03: I uh when I go there, just the energy there is crazy.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's always, you know, it's it's it's a good city, and um yeah, and the race itself, it's I run the half marathon uh three times there, and uh yeah, it's always it never disappoint.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_03: It's just always I always come from there happy.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_03: That's awesome.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_01: What does uh success look like for you here come November 1st at New York?
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_03: Number one podium.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_03: I'll stay at the podium.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_03: That's the success.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_03: If I finish in the podium, okay, that's gonna be a success.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_03: If I really fought, like I did a good race, but still didn't finish in the podium, it's still, you know, it's still good because going back to what we were talking earlier, it's the big picture.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not really just training for one race.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_03: I'm I'm training to get developed to a bigger and bigger fitness, and I think no matter what happened, I'm r already enjoying this process.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_03: I'm already like liking what I'm doing right now in this process, and I just I just I saw like a quote that or I think it was a video, but it was a quote in the video that's saying like actually the race is gonna be just just like the well like the result itself, right?
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_03: It's already gonna be shown in the training building to that race.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_03: And the race is just a certificate handed to you, right?
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_03: Like, hey, congratulations, you you made it, but I think those three, four months leading to the race, that's when the work is done, you know.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like I think the race itself, it's more being smart, follow the surges, just being ready, uh mentally for the race.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_03: But physically, I think you need to get ready right now in this period where it's far away.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_01: We we talked about earlier about like knowing with experience now, covering moves and stuff like that.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_01: You're getting mentally ready now.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_01: Wanna run a scenario by you?
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like, let's say you're approaching the final miles here, like when do you know it's time to come in in New York?
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_01: Do you know the course already?
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_01: Are you worried about any of the field?
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_03: So I d I know a little bit the course, but I still need to go and just check the final three miles.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_03: I know there is a gradual uphill, like going to Central Park, and in Central Park there is a few hills, but I'm not I'm not sure specifically where H1 is is there.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_03: But making it with them until the last mile, let's think that's it's gonna be already uh the best result I will have in a major marathon.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_03: Because I never made it with the pack until, you know.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_03: We're running Boston, uh, you know, John Courier just left from uh 20 miles.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_03: So uh you know, yeah, it was um you know, I ran Chicago, you know, Kiplemo, uh And John Career, they went, you know, the race always been I never had that feeling.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_03: But one thing I know about myself, the more it gets closer to the race, the more I get more ambitious to win.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_03: So if I'm in the last stage and I'm in the pack, I think.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I just you'll go off with them.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_03: My body just go you know, I get the um like a new third that I don't have.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_03: Like even I feel like I'm tired, I just want to finish the race, I still can pull something um out of nowhere.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_03: Out of like being fatigued, tired.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I don't know.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_03: Hopefully, uh yeah, hopefully uh I will be with with the pack until the last mile.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_03: That means I have a chance to win.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_01: That's exciting, man.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_01: I'm excited for you and and waiting to watch.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um here, when all this is over, we talked about running for the bigger picture, man, and trying to be one of the the best period.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_00: What do you want people to remember or hope remember when it's all done?
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_04: Um you mean just the race or running period, career.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_03: Oh running.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_03: I I think I got to a point in my life right now or in career that I have uh a chance, I got closer to do some legacy, you know, some something that like winning, for example, New York, winning Boston, Marathon, you know, I it's early to say the Olympic Games, but that's still one of my dreams.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_03: Like winning the Olympic Games, winning world championship, something with that meaning, right?
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_03: Like big thing.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_03: And that's something I wanna do.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_03: And how I want people to remember, I just someone never let it go, right?
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_03: Someone gonna I wanna talk to you next, you know, and be like, I've been running for 25 years and finally did this or this, and I just want the wanna give up and wanna through this process wanna inspire other people, you know.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_03: Especially from you know different backgrounds.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um I'm an immigrant, I came from Morocco, I immigrate to the state, I I have different journey than other people.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_03: I can inspire someone like that, or I just inspire someone um that you know have similar, you know.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_03: I was in NEIA um, you know, um division, not NCA division one.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_03: I wanna inspire some people like you know, do you just look at the result and be like, oh yeah, he was in this college, he was here, or I just feel like just trying to fight I mean place higher in marathons or like run some fast times bringing other people to believe that it's possible.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_03: That they can I think if I can achieve that um like by the end of my career, that would be uh amazing.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_03: But to be to have that platform to bring other people or motivate people, you gotta you gotta basically have something big in your career, like winning something big.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_01: You here, man.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate you taking the time, man, to come on the podcast and chat with me.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, especially soon after the race, man.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_01: Congrats again.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_03: Uh yeah, I uh we we said we're gonna uh do a podcast, but we never do as a week time, but there we go.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_03: We uh I was like thinking before the race, but I think it works after the race as well, so it's it's perfect.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's perfect.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_01: Now you got another win, man, and I'm excited, like I said, for you in New York.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_01: You got New York coming.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_01: I know you got a run here after this, man.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um, thank you for coming on.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, thank you for having me.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_01: There you guys, thanks for tuning in.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_01: Uh catch you on the next one.
• 48:14
  unknown: You know, doesn't sort of interface.