Latest / The Art of Adjusting® Podcast / Episode #87: Speed Limits Aren’t Permission Slips In A Storm

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Episode #87: Speed Limits Aren’t Permission Slips In A Storm · The Art of Adjusting® Podcast

• 0:06
  William Auten: Hello, I'm Bill Auten of Auten Claims Management.
• 0:09
  Chantal Roberts: I'm Chantal Roberts of CMR Consulting, and welcome to the Art of Adjusting Podcast.
• 0:14
  William Auten: Today we're going to talk about life as an insurance adjuster from the perspective of property, auto, liability, or workers' compensation adjusters.
• 0:22
  William Auten: Our goal is to bring interesting topics in the world of claims adjusting to people who are working as an adjuster now and to people who are considering a career as a claims adjuster.
• 0:32
  Chantal Roberts: Oh my God, Bill, you are just the cutest.
• 0:35
  Chantal Roberts: I'm like stanning right now.
• 0:38
  Chantal Roberts: You are just the cutest.
• 0:40
  William Auten: We still don't know what standing means.
• 0:42
  William Auten: It's one of those uh Gen Z terms, I guess.
• 0:45
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, it's a it's a Gen Z term.
• 0:47
  Chantal Roberts: And of course, I have to be all hip and all with it and jiggy, which is totally not a Gen Z term, but it means it's the combination of stalking and being a fan.
• 1:00
  Chantal Roberts: It's what Gen X used to call fangirling.
• 1:03
  Chantal Roberts: You know, like, oh my God, I'm fangirling so hard, even if it was a guy who was fangirling.
• 1:08
  Chantal Roberts: Um so standing means that I'm stalking you, and then um I'm because I'm a big fan, so I'm stanning s t-a-n-n, because it it does sound like stand being like you're standing somewhere, but no, I'm stanning because you're just so cute.
• 1:24
  William Auten: That's not creepy at all.
• 1:26
  Chantal Roberts: No, it's not creepy at all.
• 1:27
  Chantal Roberts: And so everybody needs to go to the YouTube uh videos to to watch the podcast and be sure to like, subscribe, comment, share, blah, blah, blah, because it helps the algorithm pick everybody up.
• 1:42
  Chantal Roberts: And you know, we want more than our 15 listeners that we have now.
• 1:46
  Chantal Roberts: So, um, but and then you get to see how cute Bill is.
• 1:50
  William Auten: Yeah, you can check out and criticize my wardrobe.
• 1:53
  Chantal Roberts: No, he is just adorable today.
• 1:56
  Chantal Roberts: Okay, because you know why is because we are talking about winter driving.
• 2:00
  Chantal Roberts: Yes, and and he is all just like geared up.
• 2:04
  William Auten: And what I want to know is ready to roll, man.
• 2:06
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, literally, literally ready to roll.
• 2:08
  Chantal Roberts: What I want to know is are you outside in the New York winter so that you won't get hot, or are you just gonna have to like take your coat off later on?
• 2:17
  William Auten: Because I'm gonna roast my coatas off here.
• 2:20
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, yeah, your little your little bootet off.
• 2:24
  Chantal Roberts: Okay.
• 2:24
  Chantal Roberts: So um, yeah.
• 2:26
  William Auten: In the in the uh uh um in the vein of of Stan and Gen Z, um, I will just say uh six seven.
• 2:34
  William Auten: Although this is this is that's alpha.
• 2:36
  William Auten: Yeah, that's alpha.
• 2:37
  William Auten: So this alpha.
• 2:38
  William Auten: Okay, that's alpha.
• 2:38
  William Auten: So this is eighty episode eighty-seven.
• 2:41
  William Auten: Woo-hoo! Um yes.
• 2:44
  William Auten: Uh is there a tie in there?
• 2:46
  William Auten: I have no idea.
• 2:47
  Chantal Roberts: No, no, there's not.
• 2:48
  Chantal Roberts: We there's no eight seven.
• 2:50
  Chantal Roberts: We um except if you if you say, Um, why was number why was number nine scared of the number eight and it's because uh seven eight nine or or or why yeah, uh why was number six scared of number eight because seven eight nine.
• 3:08
  Chantal Roberts: Anyway, yeah, I don't remember.
• 3:11
  William Auten: Seven is the new 67.
• 3:12
  Chantal Roberts: No, let's let's quote it.
• 3:14
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, let's let's start it um with all of our hipness that we've got.
• 3:19
  Chantal Roberts: Right, right.
• 3:20
  Chantal Roberts: So yeah, we are gonna be talking about winter driving, which is apropos, because as everybody knows, we we kind of record this a little bit earlier, and uh everybody in the south, in the midwest, uh are getting is getting ready for this big winter storm that's coming.
• 3:39
  Chantal Roberts: Uh in fact, yeah.
• 3:41
  William Auten: So we're we're recording this prior to the storm release date.
• 3:45
  William Auten: So the day we're recording this is the day that everybody's supposed to just about get hit.
• 3:50
  William Auten: Um, so who knows by the time this episode goes live, who knows how many other 100 car pile ups there will be across the nation.
• 4:00
  William Auten: Exactly.
• 4:00
  William Auten: None, hopefully zero people.
• 4:04
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, because they're really encouraging everybody to stay off the roads.
• 4:07
  Chantal Roberts: I know here in in in the Kansas City metro area, it's supposed to hit about 6 p.m.
• 4:12
  Chantal Roberts: uh Friday night, and we record on Fridays.
• 4:15
  Chantal Roberts: So yeah, I um we've already been to the grocery store, you know, already ordered our stuff, uh, planned to hunker down.
• 4:24
  Chantal Roberts: Last weekend was really cold, and uh Aaron and I did a little you know, all day date kind of deal, but this time we're just we're hunkering down and staying in.
• 4:35
  William Auten: Well, I know this winter is um back to what I would I wouldn't say unusual, I would say back to normal.
• 4:41
  William Auten: I would say over the past five years or so, we've had unusual weather in terms of snow.
• 4:47
  William Auten: We just haven't had much.
• 4:48
  William Auten: Uh and I know that because the boots that I used to use to to clear the driveway and and run the the snowblower um are gone.
• 4:59
  William Auten: They I threw them away because they were getting old and stuff, and I never replaced them.
• 5:03
  William Auten: Uh uh this morning I went out and I bought new ones.
• 5:07
  Chantal Roberts: Oh, did you now?
• 5:08
  Chantal Roberts: I was gonna say, do you regret credit now?
• 5:10
  Chantal Roberts: Did you have to go get some?
• 5:11
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah.
• 5:12
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah.
• 5:12
  Chantal Roberts: So yeah, we're gonna be talking about winter driving and for auto liability, first party auto, uh, and then bodily injury, which we've talked a little bit about in the past.
• 5:24
  Chantal Roberts: We're gonna focus on again how weather conditions change the duty of care, which again, we even talked about last week a little bit when I was using the example of a friend of mine who lives in an apartment complex, and they are under the firm belief that the landlord needs to go out in the middle of a blizzard and be clearing sidewalks, and that is not the case.
• 5:47
  Chantal Roberts: Um, and and often how claims are misevaluated because of the weather conditions.
• 5:55
  Chantal Roberts: And and so um, Bill, why don't you, since you're you live up north more and I'm a wilting southern flower, why don't you take it away?
• 6:04
  William Auten: Well, um, so when you're uh dealing with claims, the winter claims are going to affect you know general liability and auto and first party property for that matter, too.
• 6:16
  William Auten: But we're talking about auto today and uh uh specifically these conditions that lend themselves to accidents.
• 6:24
  William Auten: So um I don't know if you knew this or not, but you should go slower when the roads are slippery.
• 6:30
  William Auten: I mean, like apparently a lot of people don't realize that.
• 6:33
  William Auten: And uh I was just um it was just about a week ago.
• 6:37
  William Auten: The weather here was really bad, and uh I came around the corner nice and slow and I pulled into the parking lot here at the office.
• 6:43
  William Auten: And as I backed into my spot, I saw this car going like uh spiraling down.
• 6:49
  William Auten: Unfortunately, she didn't go off the road, she kind of just settled down and uh and slowed to a stop.
• 6:57
  William Auten: But um yeah, the weather conditions uh have more of an impact on driver safety than than a lot of people unfortunately realize.
• 7:07
  William Auten: And this particular storm is hitting in an area where people just aren't used to that kind of weather.
• 7:12
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, because I think it essentially in the South, uh we basically have 10 snow plows between, you know, all of us, all of the states.
• 7:24
  Chantal Roberts: Uh and and we kind of share.
• 7:26
  Chantal Roberts: Um, because we are we are all related, you know, with there's only a the trunk, like I said.
• 7:31
  Chantal Roberts: Um and and I joke about Arkansas only having one snowplow for the entire state.
• 7:37
  Chantal Roberts: But um, you know, it it is true, we don't know how to drive, but if you think about it, it's not just the winter weather that you should slow down for.
• 7:47
  Chantal Roberts: It's it's for anything.
• 7:48
  Chantal Roberts: If it's pouring rain and you cannot see, you know, five feet in front of you, you need to slow down.
• 7:54
  Chantal Roberts: If it's foggy, you need to slow down.
• 7:57
  Chantal Roberts: And and I know we're not saying this to tell claims adjusters to slow down.
• 8:03
  Chantal Roberts: What we're saying is as claims adjusters, when you have an accident that has been reported to you, uh, that, you know, an insured has rear-ended uh a claimant, for example, in its foggy conditions.
• 8:18
  Chantal Roberts: Well, we need to be knowing, you know, did the did the claimant have blinkers, hazards on?
• 8:24
  Chantal Roberts: Is is that one of the reasons why the insured rear-ended, or was the insured going 55 in a 55 speed limit, and they should not have been, something to that effect, you know.
• 8:34
  Chantal Roberts: Um, so it it it really does impact the way that you look at negligence.
• 8:40
  William Auten: Yeah, uh weather conditions, um, they're not a defense uh in most cases.
• 8:46
  William Auten: So um so this uh this pileup that happened recently, 100 vehicles, I can't remember which state that was.
• 8:54
  William Auten: Um it just happened, I should know.
• 8:57
  William Auten: But um regardless, it was a massive pile up of cars, many people injured.
• 9:03
  William Auten: I believe there were fatalities as well.
• 9:05
  William Auten: And um can anybody involved in that in that pile up or any any similar pile-up claim that the weather contributed to their um their crash?
• 9:23
  Chantal Roberts: Oh that's a that's a great question.
• 9:25
  Chantal Roberts: I think it would be a part of it, but but honestly, it's the and we talked about this b uh what was it early when you came back because I felt that there were so many people who had forgotten what the rules of the road were.
• 9:45
  Chantal Roberts: Uh whatever, we can look that up real quick, but um that particular episode.
• 9:52
  Chantal Roberts: And it was the fact that yes, you need to be paying attention, or yes, the weather can be bad, but you also need to be paying attention and and and going slower.
• 10:05
  Chantal Roberts: So I don't think the weather can be 100% at fault because there's always going to be that first person who starts it, even if they're spinning out, like you said, that woman who was spinning out, there was nobody else around her.
• 10:17
  Chantal Roberts: Uh, but she was she, if someone would have hit her, she would have been the cause of the accident because she was going too fast for conditions.
• 10:24
  William Auten: Right.
• 10:25
  Chantal Roberts: So um, yeah.
• 10:28
  William Auten: So in in a in a pile up scenario, well, let me ask you this on dry roads, somebody in front of you uh loses control of their vehicle, spins out, and uh winds up on their side in the middle of the road.
• 10:45
  William Auten: The vehicle is tipped over on its side in the middle of the road.
• 10:49
  William Auten: And um dry day, bright sunshine, and you hit that car.
• 10:56
  William Auten: That's your fault.
• 10:57
  Chantal Roberts: That's your fault, yes.
• 10:59
  Chantal Roberts: Because then you, I mean, both they were not, you know, driving safer conditions, but but you weren't keeping an adequate watch, you weren't, you know, paying attention to the to to the events around you, maintaining a safe distance.
• 11:15
  Chantal Roberts: And that episode number, by the way, uh was episode number 83.
• 11:20
  Chantal Roberts: It came out on Thursday, December the 4th, 2025.
• 11:24
  Chantal Roberts: So okay.
• 11:25
  Chantal Roberts: I mean, just recently, if we're on like 20 or 87, so yeah, yeah.
• 11:31
  Chantal Roberts: Shows how good our memory is now that we're old.
• 11:33
  Chantal Roberts: Um, but but that's my that's my thinking.
• 11:38
  Chantal Roberts: Um one of the things that I think is really important, I don't think we talked about last time, but I think we should, and it goes to what we're talking about now, is that you know speed limits are are m maximums and they're suggestions, and and sometimes there are minimums, but even those are suggestions.
• 12:01
  William Auten: Yeah, you're you you cut out there when you said the word minimums, but I I Yeah, minimum, sorry.
• 12:05
  William Auten: That's what you said.
• 12:06
  William Auten: Yeah.
• 12:07
  William Auten: Um yeah, for a highway, you know, divided highway where the speed limit's 70 miles an hour, um, going 30 miles an hour is not a good idea, especially at night.
• 12:19
  William Auten: Um and and accidents do happen because of that.
• 12:23
  William Auten: And I've handled I've handled, I can think of at least two fatalities where that happened during um bad weather.
• 12:32
  William Auten: So it was snowing really hard, visibility was bad, the roads were slippery, a car was going very slow.
• 12:38
  William Auten: In both cases, it was an elderly person.
• 12:41
  William Auten: Why they were out on the highway, I do not know.
• 12:44
  William Auten: Um and both of them were one was re rare re-rented by a tractor trailer, the other case was a um it was a waste disposal truck, so a garbage truck, basically, a big uh larger one.
• 13:00
  William Auten: But nonetheless, um I it's hard to it's hard to impute liability on the person who's going slow, but um if there's a law in place, you gotta obey that law.
• 13:14
  William Auten: That law is there for a reason.
• 13:16
  William Auten: Um you can still it's still tough to to impart liability on on someone who gets rearrented ever.
• 13:24
  Chantal Roberts: Yes, yes, unless it's one of those swoop and squats.
• 13:28
  Chantal Roberts: Now, there is such a thing as going too slow, um, but we're not gonna confuse confuse issues.
• 13:36
  William Auten: Well, I mean that's that's um that's exactly what we're talking about, I think.
• 13:40
  William Auten: Uh if you're again, these are divided highways with a speed limit of five miles an hour or something, and they were they were going um probably what they thought was safer conditions.
• 13:52
  William Auten: Witnesses were pegging them at probably 30 miles an hour.
• 13:55
  William Auten: Um tractor trailer comes up over a rise, can't see them till the last minute, uh especially in bad weather conditions.
• 14:04
  Chantal Roberts: Right.
• 14:05
  William Auten: And um, so you could argue all day that truck should not be going the speed limit, they should be going well under because of the conditions.
• 14:14
  William Auten: Right.
• 14:14
  William Auten: Um and I would argue that even at night you should be slowing down.
• 14:19
  Chantal Roberts: Uh absolutely.
• 14:20
  Chantal Roberts: There's deer, there's you know uh well, yes, and and especially in the okay, so let's talk about this one thing that I have never and you've explained it to me before, and I still don't understand it.
• 14:31
  Chantal Roberts: Because again, southern.
• 14:33
  Chantal Roberts: Um black ice.
• 14:36
  Chantal Roberts: But you know, I would think even in the dark you couldn't see black eyes, but you but i infamously you can never see black ice or something to that effect.
• 14:46
  Chantal Roberts: So can you explain what black ice is and sure how that impacts everybody?
• 14:53
  William Auten: Yeah, so asphalt, um when when asphalt is dry on a sunny day, it kind of has this, especially around here because of the salt we use during the winters, it kind of has a grayish, dark grayish kind of a color to it.
• 15:09
  William Auten: Um when you get it wet, if you spray water on it, it suddenly turns darker.
• 15:14
  William Auten: You know, it looks black because of the because of the liquid on it.
• 15:18
  William Auten: And um when it the temperatures reach freezing, water can melt and run onto that road and turn it that dark black color, but it just looks wet.
• 15:30
  William Auten: It doesn't look like it's ice.
• 15:32
  Chantal Roberts: I see.
• 15:33
  Chantal Roberts: Okay, okay, okay.
• 15:34
  Chantal Roberts: So you're thinking it's rain water and you can just you know slush on through it or whatever, and maybe it's ice and you lose traction.
• 15:43
  William Auten: Right, as opposed to the the picture here, uh where in my background here, right, right.
• 15:49
  William Auten: Uh you can see there's some white on there and some ice.
• 15:52
  William Auten: Um, that's different.
• 15:54
  William Auten: That's you know, fairly obviously covered with some slushy, messy stuff.
• 15:59
  William Auten: Black ice is a little more mysterious because it just looks like it might be wet.
• 16:03
  William Auten: Right.
• 16:03
  William Auten: And that can happen in parking lots where people slip and fall as well.
• 16:07
  William Auten: Uh, not just um true.
• 16:10
  Chantal Roberts: So again, also uh bonus points if y'all are watching the podcast, and uh that's this is the way that you get to see great pictures that normally we don't ever show.
• 16:22
  Chantal Roberts: You just get to see our smiling faces.
• 16:25
  Chantal Roberts: Right.
• 16:25
  Chantal Roberts: But yeah, um, exactly.
• 16:29
  Chantal Roberts: So yeah, we've we've talked about okay, so now I understand it.
• 16:32
  Chantal Roberts: The the black ice basically it looks like the road is wet, so you speed up, but this is when you actually lose control of your car because it is actually ice, not a wet road that you would still have traction on.
• 16:47
  William Auten: Right.
• 16:47
  Chantal Roberts: Um, yeah.
• 16:48
  William Auten: Another thing I I would like to talk about is uh the effect of diesel spills or oil spills on icy roads.
• 16:57
  William Auten: And I've experienced that before, and it is not like anything you could imagine.
• 17:02
  William Auten: It it is like um I I went to the scene of an accident.
• 17:10
  William Auten: I it wasn't on the claim I was handling, I just happened to come across a scene where a car had slammed into the side of a truck and one of the tanks broke open and spilled diesel fuel everywhere into the road and into the intersection.
• 17:27
  William Auten: And um three or four more cars had already slid off the road because of the conditions, and and no one really could figure out why, because it didn't look like it, it just looked like a wet road.
• 17:41
  William Auten: Like all the road was wet with a black ice mix.
• 17:45
  William Auten: Um but as soon as a car touched this oil, it instantly lost control and just spun in circles.
• 17:54
  William Auten: It was amazing.
• 17:55
  William Auten: I saw three cars do that.
• 17:56
  William Auten: Oh wow.
• 17:58
  William Auten: I I backed up and went the other way, turned around and went the other way because it was very clear to me that you were not getting across that oil spill without spinning out of control.
• 18:08
  William Auten: Um, so that's something to be aware of too.
• 18:12
  William Auten: Uh how you would know, you know, what are the how would you ever know that there's oil there instead of just ice?
• 18:18
  William Auten: Um, the only I think way you would know is if there's an accident right next to it with a big diesel truck.
• 18:24
  William Auten: Um that might be your only signal.
• 18:28
  William Auten: Um, or if you watch the vehicles ahead of you and they're spinning out of control, that might be a pretty good indication as well.
• 18:34
  William Auten: Exactly.
• 18:34
  William Auten: Amazing to watch how people lost control um in those conditions.
• 18:40
  William Auten: So I think oil on just a dry road in the summer probably is going to be a little bit slippery too.
• 18:46
  William Auten: But man, during icy weather conditions, forget it.
• 18:49
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, I have never seen it because the the diesel fuel spills that I have always worked have always been pollution.
• 18:58
  Chantal Roberts: And it's because the the driver fell asleep and went off the road, or uh it's windy and the wind toppled the truck, uh uh something to that effect, or they were involved in an accident and the fuel was spilt.
• 19:14
  Chantal Roberts: And in that particular instance, it was always a pain because we had in our policies an absolute pollution exclusion.
• 19:24
  Chantal Roberts: So we would never be able to pay for it.
• 19:28
  Chantal Roberts: But to pay for FYI adjusters, if you don't know this, to pay for pollution uh or the diesel fuel spill, it's kind of expensive.
• 19:40
  Chantal Roberts: Because what the tow very expensive, what the tow company or hazmat or whomever has to do is they usually have to get, I think like four feet underneath the where it was last wet.
• 19:53
  Chantal Roberts: You know, so I mean they're taking a huge chunk of the ground out for contaminant purposes.
• 19:59
  Chantal Roberts: And they're having to take it to a hazmat facility.
• 20:03
  Chantal Roberts: And you know, that is in and of itself is expensive.
• 20:07
  Chantal Roberts: Um, and if you don't have an absolute pollution exclusion, there are a lot of sublimits on um these kind of diesel fuel spills or pollution cleanup issues.
• 20:20
  Chantal Roberts: And nine times out of ten, um I guess it's the EPA or whoever kind of has that super lien where they might clean it up and then file a lien against your file, kind of like what we talked about with CMS with the fund.
• 20:36
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, yeah, the Medicare Medicaid kind of lien.
• 20:39
  Chantal Roberts: And so you've got a whole nother issue right there.
• 20:42
  Chantal Roberts: Anyway, my point is pay attention, talk to your insured early.
• 20:47
  Chantal Roberts: It's gonna be expensive.
• 20:49
  Chantal Roberts: Let them know what your limits are.
• 20:52
  Chantal Roberts: If it's zero, if it's yeah, we can pay 10,000 bucks and then you're gonna be out 90,000.
• 20:57
  Chantal Roberts: I don't know.
• 20:58
  Chantal Roberts: However, it's gonna be, you need to let them know and have that conversation early.
• 21:03
  William Auten: Yeah, and it's not just soil.
• 21:05
  William Auten: Um, if you know, of all you know, I've handled, I don't know, hundreds of them over my career, and the majority of them happen near some kind of stream or waterway.
• 21:17
  Chantal Roberts: And it's like it's drawn to it, right?
• 21:20
  William Auten: Yeah.
• 21:20
  William Auten: Oh my gosh.
• 21:21
  William Auten: That cleanup involves, you know, they they put these um bumpers or whatever.
• 21:27
  William Auten: Yeah, the bumpers to the that uh soak up the oil off the surface.
• 21:31
  William Auten: Luckily, it floats, right?
• 21:33
  William Auten: So it's all off the surface.
• 21:35
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah.
• 21:35
  Chantal Roberts: Um, and uh, but God help you if there's fish in there and you know, blah, you know, beaver dams and oh geez.
• 21:44
  Chantal Roberts: That's a great topic that I know absolutely nothing about, but I will be happy to talk for an hour and act like I know what I'm talking about.
• 21:52
  William Auten: It would be great to get somebody from uh maybe from a hazmat company that does the does the um the actual remediation.
• 22:01
  Chantal Roberts: So if someone knows someone, email us.
• 22:04
  William Auten: Yeah, I haven't had a claim like that in so long.
• 22:06
  William Auten: Um, I have some old contacts I could probably reach out to.
• 22:10
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, but let's make our listeners do some work for us.
• 22:14
  Chantal Roberts: Right.
• 22:14
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah all 15 of them.
• 22:16
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah.
• 22:17
  Chantal Roberts: Um, so so we've talked about uh key winter conditions, we've talked about driving too fast for conditions, you know, following the distance and our chain reactions.
• 22:28
  Chantal Roberts: Um, you know, that is also important.
• 22:32
  Chantal Roberts: And one of the things that you had mentioned that I think is important, we've talked a lot about uh in previous episodes is just because you've gotten a ticket or just because the insured has gotten a ticket does not mean they are at fault for the loss because the law may say one thing, and of course, determining liability or negligence is a totally different thing.
• 22:58
  William Auten: Sure.
• 22:58
  William Auten: A very simple example is it would be that uh two two cars are are speeding uh next to each other, and and one car changes lane suddenly, um, and they both wind up getting speeding tickets, but the speeding isn't what caused the accident, it's the it's the driving into the site of the other vehicle that caused it.
• 23:20
  William Auten: So um yeah, just uh uh traffic violation doesn't necessarily equate to liability.
• 23:30
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, uh yeah, and there's and and even if and why this is important too is uh oftentimes the insured may not be at fault.
• 23:41
  Chantal Roberts: Um and so they have filed a claim against the other party, and uh I don't know, for whatever reason, that insurance company won't accept liability, so they come to you as the adjuster, you go ahead and work your claim and then you subrogate against the at vault party.
• 24:00
  Chantal Roberts: But the but the insured happens to have gotten the ticket, and so the at vault party is like, we're not at fault, we didn't get the ticket, you got a ticket.
• 24:09
  Chantal Roberts: That's when you need to to educate the other adjuster, tell them to come listen to us, um, you know, because we obviously know what we're talking about, and they need to educate themselves, right?
• 24:21
  William Auten: So um, so damage to your car and to other cars isn't the only hazard.
• 24:26
  William Auten: Uh, the other morning I was coming to work and I go past one of our favorite restaurants every morning, and I noticed a big blue tarp on the side of the building.
• 24:33
  William Auten: And I uh uh followed up with the news that day.
• 24:36
  William Auten: And uh that morning, somewhere around four o'clock in the morning, somebody lost control on the icy road and uh swerved all the way to the left and hit the curb and then bounced back and recovered and crossed all all four lanes again and drove right into the corner of the building and took out the kitchen.
• 24:53
  William Auten: So oh, that's terrible.
• 24:55
  William Auten: And then they drove away.
• 24:57
  William Auten: So we knew we did it.
• 24:59
  William Auten: Oh no.
• 25:00
  Chantal Roberts: Well, we're gonna be one of my yeah, this isn't one of my claims, but um we're gonna be looking for a car up in northern New York that has some a lot of damage.
• 25:11
  William Auten: It's a lot of damage covered in uh fryer oil, yes, because it took out took out all their fryers.
• 25:17
  Chantal Roberts: Oh my, oh my, yeah.
• 25:19
  Chantal Roberts: Um, because all of that can happen.
• 25:22
  Chantal Roberts: Um and again, it's not just a winter thing.
• 25:25
  Chantal Roberts: Um, I've had a lot of claims, well, not a lot, but claims where people have lost control of their car, drunk driving, whatever, and they have gone through a living room, for example.
• 25:38
  Chantal Roberts: And again, you and I have talked quite a bit.
• 25:41
  Chantal Roberts: Um, often the uh auto insurer will not want to take on the building, you know, the repair of the building.
• 25:51
  Chantal Roberts: Well, I mean, that is the property damage from your insured driving through my living room or my kitchen or, you know, whatever.
• 26:02
  Chantal Roberts: However, the insured, uh, being the homeowner or your favorite diner, could also file a claim with their property insurance, get everything repaired, and then they subrogate against the auto owner.
• 26:22
  William Auten: Yeah.
• 26:22
  William Auten: Um, so I've been on both sides of that claim, that type of claim.
• 26:27
  William Auten: And um my advice is that if you own the building, um you're better off going through your own insurance carrier and letting them subrogate because for a lot of reasons.
• 26:40
  William Auten: The biggest one is you're gonna have less of a fight with your own insurance carrier than you will with the other side because they're gonna be arguing, potentially arguing, that some of the some portion of this was not their insured fault.
• 26:54
  William Auten: They can maybe say, Well, there was a deer that ran out, and that was an act of guy, or some other car made us lose control.
• 27:02
  William Auten: You know, you don't want to have to deal with right that fight.
• 27:06
  William Auten: Let your insurance company deal with that.
• 27:08
  Chantal Roberts: Yes.
• 27:09
  William Auten: Uh, even if they did accept a hundred percent liability, now you're subject to um actual cash value only.
• 27:15
  William Auten: Thank you.
• 27:16
  William Auten: Yes, I was getting ready to say that.
• 27:18
  William Auten: Yeah, you've got your um if you have replacement costs on your home, you're gonna wind up with more benefit from your own policy because you pay extra for that type of coverage.
• 27:29
  Chantal Roberts: And and you mentioned this, um, and and we're talking as if we're talking to the insurance, but also as an adjuster, you should know when you are pursuing subrogation against that at fault party being the auto owner that has run into your insured's building or home or whatever.
• 27:48
  Chantal Roberts: You're absolutely right, Bill.
• 27:50
  Chantal Roberts: They only have the auto only has ACV, um, actual cash value for third-party liability, it's it's not RCV.
• 28:00
  Chantal Roberts: So while you, as the insurance adjuster for the homeowner or the restaurant may have paid RCV, uh, go ahead and subrogate for RCV, but understand that if if the auto owner uh the atfault carrier takes 100%, they're only going to pay ACV.
• 28:22
  Chantal Roberts: So that don't get upset.
• 28:28
  Chantal Roberts: That's the way their policy is written.
• 28:31
  William Auten: Well, that's the that's all that's owed under the law, is that they only owe to indemnify you for the you know, the actual cash value is kind of like um what your financial uh loss is, really.
• 28:45
  William Auten: Um and that's a whole other conversation, I guess.
• 28:49
  William Auten: But exactly that's all they owe you.
• 28:51
  William Auten: So um absolutely.
• 28:54
  Chantal Roberts: And and and remember, our replacement cost value, our insured pay a premium for that.
• 29:02
  Chantal Roberts: They're you know, they're not paying a premium to the other insurance company to get replacement cost value.
• 29:07
  Chantal Roberts: So um, again, that's the that's the difference when we're when we're talking subrogation.
• 29:12
  William Auten: And you may say, well, I'm not really worried about the depreciation on it because my house is brand new, so they can't depreciate it by much.
• 29:21
  William Auten: Well, you know, depreciation may be in the eye of the beholder, too.
• 29:26
  William Auten: And do you really want to have to have that argument with some other adjuster?
• 29:31
  William Auten: And you really want to have your claim reduced by that much because chances are it's going to be a lot more than your deductible would be on your own policy.
• 29:39
  Chantal Roberts: Yes.
• 29:40
  William Auten: And your deductible you will actually get back if your carrier is successful in subrogating.
• 29:47
  Chantal Roberts: Exactly.
• 29:47
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah.
• 29:48
  Chantal Roberts: So as the uh insurer for the fault-free party, the homeowner, the restaurant, whatever, you do need to subrogate for everything, even the things that you don't necessarily pay for.
• 30:07
  Chantal Roberts: Um, that's what we did at least.
• 30:09
  Chantal Roberts: You know, the deductible, if there's anything that we didn't happen to cover, non-coverable expenses or whatever, I say, hey, this is what you would owe directly to the insured so that the insured would be wholly indemnified.
• 30:21
  Chantal Roberts: This is what you owe us.
• 30:23
  Chantal Roberts: And and then we get into a whole different podcast about how to make the insured completely whole, but we're talking about winter storms.
• 30:32
  William Auten: Right.
• 30:33
  Chantal Roberts: That's what we're talking about.
• 30:34
  William Auten: Right.
• 30:35
  William Auten: You you're good to steer it away because I I had another story about it that we won't get into that.
• 30:40
  William Auten: Oh my goodness, that for another day.
• 30:42
  Chantal Roberts: Absolutely.
• 30:43
  Chantal Roberts: So we're talking too about um parking lot losses.
• 30:46
  Chantal Roberts: I mean, it also you got cars in parking lots, you've got people who are slipping and falling in parking lots.
• 30:53
  Chantal Roberts: And we did do a slip and fall one earlier.
• 30:56
  William Auten: Um, so you even have stationary objects like uh shopping cart correls and um bollards that protect gas.
• 31:05
  William Auten: Is that what they're called?
• 31:07
  William Auten: Bollards?
• 31:08
  William Auten: Yeah, those pipes that stick out of the ground, they're painted yellow and they're full of concrete.
• 31:12
  William Auten: Yeah, you can call them bollards now if you want.
• 31:19
  unknown: Bollards.
• 31:19
  Chantal Roberts: B-A-L-L-A-R-D-S.
• 31:21
  William Auten: I think it's B-O.
• 31:23
  Chantal Roberts: Oh.
• 31:23
  William Auten: B-O-L-L-A-R-S.
• 31:25
  Chantal Roberts: So it's kind of like bollocks.
• 31:26
  Chantal Roberts: Kind of ball.
• 31:29
  Chantal Roberts: Okay.
• 31:30
  William Auten: Yeah.
• 31:31
  Chantal Roberts: Okay.
• 31:31
  Chantal Roberts: All right.
• 31:32
  William Auten: Uh so um all those stationary objects are things to uh to slide into if the condition, if you're going too fast for conditions.
• 31:41
  William Auten: Um so don't do that.
• 31:44
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, don't do that.
• 31:45
  Chantal Roberts: Um, you know, and there are again, we uh talk about the duties that are owed, which which we've again we've spoken about these sorts of things.
• 31:55
  Chantal Roberts: You don't have to, as the store owner, have to go out in the middle of a blizzard uh and put down salt or whatever.
• 32:02
  Chantal Roberts: And by the way, FYI, uh, I have heard that again, this year there is a shortage in the northeast for salt, ice melt, you know.
• 32:13
  Chantal Roberts: Uh, and I think that's something that should be taken into consideration when we're talking about these sorts of determining negligence and determining how much negligence.
• 32:26
  Chantal Roberts: If if we are all hoarding it down here in the south because we don't know what to do, um, and oh my gosh, it's Snow Megiddon.
• 32:34
  Chantal Roberts: Um, so we get you know 25 packs of it and and things.
• 32:38
  Chantal Roberts: Um, so the North doesn't get it.
• 32:41
  Chantal Roberts: I think that that's something that that we as adjusters should take into consideration.
• 32:46
  William Auten: It's uh it's happened, it happened last year.
• 32:49
  Chantal Roberts: Yes.
• 32:49
  William Auten: Yes, and we have cases right now from last winter where we're we're kind of making that argument that look, our insured was salting every day until they ran out of salt.
• 33:00
  William Auten: And then when they ran out of salt, there was nothing more they could do.
• 33:04
  Chantal Roberts: Right.
• 33:04
  Chantal Roberts: Because it's there's a shortage.
• 33:06
  Chantal Roberts: And then that's when, like we were talking about earlier, you need to be aware as the person who's walking in, you don't walk into a store in high heels or something.
• 33:19
  William Auten: So personal responsibility is a thing.
• 33:27
  Chantal Roberts: Excuse me.
• 33:28
  Chantal Roberts: I was coughing.
• 33:29
  Chantal Roberts: Um so what about you know pedestrian duty versus uh vehicular duty?
• 33:39
  William Auten: Pedestrian duty versus vehicles.
• 33:41
  William Auten: Well, usually you're pedestrian are you uh in in what kind of scenario, I guess.
• 33:46
  Chantal Roberts: Well, I guess usually um pedestrians have the right of way in most cases, you know, uh regardless, even if there's not especially at a crosswalk or whatever.
• 34:01
  Chantal Roberts: Uh but I don't know, you're just not supposed to just run them over because they're crossing in the middle of the street.
• 34:08
  Chantal Roberts: Right.
• 34:09
  Chantal Roberts: It's just like, I don't know, that kind of thing.
• 34:12
  Chantal Roberts: Um especially like I don't know, parking lot issues.
• 34:15
  Chantal Roberts: There are people walking versus you trying to pull in and uh get around a person or something like that.
• 34:24
  William Auten: I'm sure there's a lot of case law out there involving pedestrians who step in front of moving vehicles and um and whose fault that might be.
• 34:34
  William Auten: Um and I'm sure the arguments go something like, well, the the operator of the vehicle has a higher duty of care because they're operating this, you know, three or four thousand pound machine at speed.
• 34:49
  William Auten: And um you know, they have to be aware that uh pedestrians can walk out into the road and and they need to be able to uh operate safely if that happens to avoid that that collision.
• 35:02
  William Auten: I think that's pretty much how the argument goes.
• 35:04
  William Auten: There may be some cases out there where the driver could not have done anything that the the you know kids that run between parked cars, you know, the the chase the ball, you know.
• 35:18
  William Auten: Um but I I think in most cases you're gonna find liability on the uh uh heavier liability on the on the driver car.
• 35:27
  William Auten: Yeah, for sure.
• 35:28
  William Auten: Yeah.
• 35:29
  Chantal Roberts: So and and keep in mind we're in a if we're in a parking lot, you shouldn't be driving that fast, regardless.
• 35:35
  Chantal Roberts: But two, um, yeah, if we're talking about children, even on a street, uh children always have a higher, you know, threshold of duty, like they would if uh it was a uh I don't know, a um oh, what am I thinking?
• 35:52
  Chantal Roberts: Like trespass or or something like that.
• 35:54
  Chantal Roberts: They're not really considered trespassers because they don't know any better.
• 35:58
  William Auten: So there's one pet peeve I have.
• 36:00
  William Auten: There's a town, a municipality locally, uh it's a it's a small city, it's um kind of a big village, but it's technically a city.
• 36:10
  William Auten: And they installed these crosswalks with yellow signs and yellow flashing lights, pedestrian crosswalks across four lanes of travel.
• 36:20
  William Auten: And um what I noticed is that and the speed limit's only 30 miles an hour.
• 36:27
  William Auten: Um but what I noticed is some people just stepping out into traffic because these flashing lights are there and uh one woman has been killed.
• 36:40
  Chantal Roberts: Oh no.
• 36:41
  William Auten: There may have been other um other accidents, but I know at least there's one fatality.
• 36:46
  William Auten: There may have been more.
• 36:47
  William Auten: I think I think that there is some responsibility on a person crossing a busy highway, no matter what signage is there, to at least look, you know.
• 37:02
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, oh absolutely.
• 37:03
  William Auten: I again make sure you're not gonna die.
• 37:07
  Chantal Roberts: Right.
• 37:07
  Chantal Roberts: And again, um, it's hard to argue if if the person is deceased, but if you're able to take a recorded statement of the other person, the pedestrian, yeah, again, it all comes back to just because you were in an accident doesn't make you 100% not negligent.
• 37:30
  Chantal Roberts: You know, you still have the duty to look both ways to cross the street.
• 37:34
  Chantal Roberts: Um yeah, just like the person in front of you has a duty not to slam on their brakes.
• 37:42
  Chantal Roberts: Now they they can maybe a child did run out in front of them.
• 37:46
  Chantal Roberts: Um, they've got a duty not to hit the kid, um, but they also have a duty to be driving at a safe speed, just as you have a duty to not be following too closely.
• 37:55
  Chantal Roberts: I mean, it it's all a balancing act, but that doesn't make you 100% at fault all the time.
• 38:01
  William Auten: Um when the weather's bad, all those factors get have to be adjusted.
• 38:05
  William Auten: Oh, absolutely.
• 38:06
  William Auten: Because now where three car lengths was a safe distance, now maybe it's five, six, seven, eight.
• 38:13
  William Auten: Exactly, depending on and that you're actually going much slower.
• 38:17
  William Auten: Everybody collectively has to be going much slower.
• 38:21
  Chantal Roberts: Um yeah, so I am wondering um about like an adjuster checklist.
• 38:28
  Chantal Roberts: Like what we're we're giving a lot of information for our listeners to to think about, but is there something that they should be getting 100% of the time on these kind of claims, or maybe not 100% of the time, but I mean the majority of the time.
• 38:46
  William Auten: Sure.
• 38:46
  William Auten: I'm glad you asked because I have five items for a checklist.
• 38:49
  Chantal Roberts: Well, there you go.
• 38:51
  William Auten: Shall I read them off?
• 38:52
  Chantal Roberts: Yes, please.
• 38:53
  William Auten: All right.
• 38:54
  William Auten: Uh, weather reports at the time of the loss.
• 38:57
  William Auten: Um, try and get a report that shows you hourly and uh so that you can actually pinpoint what it what the weather was doing at the time of the accident.
• 39:07
  William Auten: Um okay, I'm gonna interrupt real quick.
• 39:10
  Chantal Roberts: I recommend uh weather underground because uh it does have, and it's like I think it's wxunderground.com, but you can Google Weather Underground and it'll get you there.
• 39:24
  Chantal Roberts: But it does have a feature if you if you scroll down where you can put in a particular day, uh and uh and it'll give you the time, the wind speed, all of that kind of stuff.
• 39:36
  Chantal Roberts: It's not quote unquote official.
• 39:38
  Chantal Roberts: You would probably need to get an engineer if it got to be a serious case like a death, but at least at that particular point in time, you could get that weather report, even for a time.
• 39:52
  William Auten: Um, so we use that to um they pull their data from um NOAA so.
• 39:59
  William Auten: So the website we use is nce.noa.gov.
• 40:06
  William Auten: Perfect.
• 40:07
  William Auten: We'll put that in the show notes.
• 40:08
  William Auten: That's the National Centers for Environmental Information, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.
• 40:16
  William Auten: Yeah.
• 40:16
  William Auten: Federal website.
• 40:17
  William Auten: So it was down for a piece there when the federal government shut down.
• 40:22
  William Auten: And uh right now we're still um a little disturbed because all our reports uh are still held up in their system some for some reason.
• 40:34
  William Auten: Uh but that's where we generally go for the weather reports.
• 40:37
  William Auten: And uh and you can get them certified there too.
• 40:41
  William Auten: Um you can just print them, but uh but if you get them certified, you get an actual document that states that they are certifying that it is the correct data for that day.
• 40:51
  Chantal Roberts: That's great.
• 40:52
  Chantal Roberts: Good information.
• 40:53
  Chantal Roberts: We'll put it in the show notes.
• 40:54
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah.
• 40:55
  Chantal Roberts: Sorry for interrupting, but what's the second one?
• 40:58
  Chantal Roberts: What's the second one?
• 41:00
  William Auten: Second one.
• 41:00
  William Auten: Um visibility conditions.
• 41:04
  William Auten: So the weather report is probably gonna tell you what the fog conditions or snow or rain or whatever.
• 41:11
  William Auten: Um, and then time of day was this before sunset, after sunset.
• 41:16
  William Auten: Um, all those factors are gonna make a significant difference as well.
• 41:19
  William Auten: And um just environmental conditions.
• 41:23
  William Auten: I don't know if you remember um a couple years ago we had the the uh smoke from the wildfires up in Canada.
• 41:31
  William Auten: Yeah, actually created a fog around here that was just like a regular foggy day.
• 41:36
  William Auten: It was really bizarre.
• 41:37
  William Auten: People were driving around with headlights on and everything in the middle of a summer day.
• 41:40
  Chantal Roberts: Wow.
• 41:41
  William Auten: So um, you know, be sure you're aware of those conditions and you should be if you're talking to the people involved, hopefully, they'll they'll be able to tell you what was going on there.
• 41:52
  William Auten: And then you can do some searches of news reports and weather reports and all that to verify what you're being told.
• 41:59
  unknown: Okay.
• 41:59
  William Auten: Uh third, uh road maintenance timing.
• 42:03
  Chantal Roberts: So where would we get that?
• 42:06
  Chantal Roberts: Would we contact like the the county or the state?
• 42:10
  William Auten: It depends on the road that you're on.
• 42:11
  William Auten: If so, I could say uh so we live my house, is on it converges at the intersection of two towns.
• 42:19
  William Auten: So we have uh we have a town, uh one town plows one part of our road, and then because we live on a corner, and then the other town plows the other road.
• 42:28
  William Auten: Um so it's it's either one of the local towns for us.
• 42:33
  William Auten: Uh it could be county if it's a county road, or it could be a state road, like the New York State throughway, for example, is all state vehicles and and plowed by state uh employees.
• 42:44
  William Auten: So you would have to get records uh from there.
• 42:48
  William Auten: That would in New York, that would just be a FOIL request uh to that min municipality.
• 42:54
  Chantal Roberts: That's a Freedom of Information Act, which we did have.
• 43:02
  William Auten: Yeah in New York.
• 43:03
  William Auten: Okay.
• 43:04
  William Auten: But same thing pretty much the same thing.
• 43:06
  William Auten: It's just uh the FOIA is uh, I believe a federal uh regulation.
• 43:11
  William Auten: Um let's see, um vehicle damage patterns.
• 43:18
  William Auten: So if there is a um impact damage to the rear bumper of a car, chances are that they were rear-ended.
• 43:29
  William Auten: Yes.
• 43:30
  Chantal Roberts: Ah, you know.
• 43:31
  William Auten: Uh unless they unless they spun around and slid backwards into a guardrail.
• 43:36
  William Auten: True.
• 43:37
  William Auten: So uh, but anyway, the the location of the damage can tell you a lot about um the mechanics of the accident and and what really happened.
• 43:44
  William Auten: If all four corners of the car were damaged, chances are that thing was spinning out of control somehow.
• 43:50
  Chantal Roberts: I am looking.
• 43:51
  Chantal Roberts: We have done a freedom of information um episode.
• 43:59
  William Auten: Yes, we had we had our expert on who specializes in that.
• 44:03
  Chantal Roberts: And so I was trying to see if I could find it real quick, and that's what I'm looking off screen for.
• 44:10
  Chantal Roberts: And of course, naturally I can't find it, but that's okay, no big deal.
• 44:15
  Chantal Roberts: Um there you go.
• 44:20
  Chantal Roberts: We'll we'll just look for it, I guess, is what I'm gonna say.
• 44:24
  Chantal Roberts: Okay, so anyway, you said vehicle um damage patterns, very important.
• 44:28
  Chantal Roberts: Um road maintenance timing, also important.
• 44:31
  Chantal Roberts: I would also say um with that, you can look for because this is what tripped my my mind to start going with the the FOIA or foil um information is to uh look for like the cameras, um, because some light poles or or or light what are those um signal lights have cameras on the top or whatever, and you can you can see w what the conditions were like.
• 45:07
  William Auten: Yeah, there could be uh camera footage uh in local stores.
• 45:10
  William Auten: We've done that before.
• 45:11
  William Auten: You know, an accident happens into in front of a convenience store.
• 45:15
  William Auten: We go in and ask, do they have any footage from that day?
• 45:18
  William Auten: And if they do, can we get a copy of it?
• 45:20
  William Auten: Um sometimes they're very helpful, other times they'll say, Well, uh corporate says you need a subpoena.
• 45:26
  William Auten: So whatever.
• 45:28
  William Auten: Um trucks, uh plow trucks, a lot of them have dash cams and things of their own as well.
• 45:35
  William Auten: And there may be footage from that if um if that's relevant, you know, if they're close to the accident or going by the accident.
• 45:43
  Chantal Roberts: Right.
• 45:44
  William Auten: Um and then ultimately witnesses, you know.
• 45:48
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, perfect.
• 45:50
  William Auten: Uh a statement consistency with physics is the fifth item.
• 45:54
  William Auten: So you're talking to an insured or claimant and they're describing how things happen.
• 45:58
  William Auten: And uh if it just doesn't make physical sense that the accident could possibly happen in the way they're describing, um, you know, maybe but maybe they're just having a hard time verbalizing the mechanics of it because when you're sitting in a car experiencing it spinning or rolling or being impacted, um what you are feeling may be different than what actually is happening.
• 46:29
  William Auten: Right.
• 46:30
  William Auten: It could be some latitude has to be given uh to the to the person giving the statement.
• 46:36
  William Auten: But ultimately, um you've got to decide whether what they're saying could possibly be um uh in line with what you're seeing in terms of the position of vehicles and damage and all that.
• 46:49
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, yeah.
• 46:50
  Chantal Roberts: And I would say um the statement consistency with physics is also going to be closely tied with your vehicle damage patterns because it should, you know, match.
• 47:04
  Chantal Roberts: And remember, physics doesn't necessarily change, not that I know of, um, except if we're doing like some kind of quarks thing, and I don't even want to go into into that sort of well, when diesel fuel spills on an icy road, physics get a little weird.
• 47:21
  Chantal Roberts: It does get a little weird, but also it's every motion stays in motion kind of deal and equal and opposite, yada, yada, yada.
• 47:30
  Chantal Roberts: So there you go.
• 47:31
  Chantal Roberts: Um, that's the extent of my physics knowledge.
• 47:34
  Chantal Roberts: I took football physics at Baylor.
• 47:36
  Chantal Roberts: It was, it was, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 47:39
  Chantal Roberts: It was, it's, it was called football physics, and it was the um basically the the physics for all the liberal arts majors and the football players.
• 47:48
  Chantal Roberts: Um, so all the football players were guaranteed to get an A.
• 47:51
  Chantal Roberts: Uh, the rest of us just basically either got a C or better.
• 47:55
  Chantal Roberts: Uh but yeah, he he he would use Star Trek and and football to explain physics.
• 48:03
  Chantal Roberts: So not the not the pre-science or not the science major physics that was obviously harder, um, not the math people major, you know, that took it that was obviously harder.
• 48:15
  Chantal Roberts: No, we got um we got Star Trek and uh football to explain physics to us.
• 48:24
  William Auten: Well to wrap things up, I've got three talking uh this is talking lines here, but these are three key points that we want to drive home for this episode.
• 48:32
  William Auten: One is that conditions matter than posted speed limits.
• 48:36
  William Auten: So if your insured says I it wasn't my fault, I was I was going the speed limit.
• 48:40
  William Auten: Well, maybe you shouldn't have been going that fast.
• 48:42
  William Auten: Right, right, right.
• 48:43
  William Auten: Uh tickets, uh tickets inform claims, they do not decide them.
• 48:48
  William Auten: Yes, I agree.
• 48:49
  William Auten: It kind of gives you some information about what happened, but doesn't necessarily point to who was at fault.
• 48:54
  William Auten: And then the last one is um winter driving increases the duty to anticipate.
• 49:01
  William Auten: So that's the duty that we all have.
• 49:03
  William Auten: And if you breach that and you fail to anticipate properly, um you can't blame the weather.
• 49:10
  Chantal Roberts: Absolutely.
• 49:10
  Chantal Roberts: I would totally agree with all of that.
• 49:12
  Chantal Roberts: So this uh great talking lines and things to consider for our adjuster checklist, and uh we will be sure to put the uh notes or the websites in the in the show notes.
• 49:26
  Chantal Roberts: So, you know, winter claims, you know, they look kind of simple, but they're not really.
• 49:32
  Chantal Roberts: There's there's a lot of things that need to be balanced, a lot of ideas that need to be balanced, a lot of conflicting ideas often that needs to be balanced.
• 49:41
  Chantal Roberts: And we have to be really disciplined in our decision making in an in our investigation, making sure that we are being fair and unbiased, because that's literally what we're supposed to be doing.
• 49:55
  Chantal Roberts: Because even if the insured says, oh, it's totally not my fault, if the evidence shows that it's their fault, we need to go ahead and accept liability, even though the insured's gonna be mad at us.
• 50:05
  William Auten: Right.
• 50:05
  Chantal Roberts: That's what we got to do.
• 50:06
  Chantal Roberts: Uh, because it does prevent us from making bad decisions, which may end up getting us into a bad faith situation.
• 50:15
  Chantal Roberts: And then I get involved and really I'm doing this so that I get I put myself out of a job, you know.
• 50:21
  Chantal Roberts: Um, so we're gonna continue on with our winter talking uh next podcast, which will be on February 12th.
• 50:32
  Chantal Roberts: We're gonna be talking about heating hazards, fires, and uh the facts of like having maybe a hostile fire rather than a friendly fire and homeowner liability.
• 50:44
  Chantal Roberts: So again, uh thank you, Bill.
• 50:47
  Chantal Roberts: So um love the outfit.
• 50:50
  Chantal Roberts: Love the fact that we're gonna maybe I'll do a heating thing.
• 50:53
  Chantal Roberts: I don't know.
• 50:54
  Chantal Roberts: Anywho, um, join us in two weeks.
• 50:57
  William Auten: You could dress up as the tin man.
• 50:59
  Chantal Roberts: Oh, I could.
• 51:00
  Chantal Roberts: I could work, yes.
• 51:02
  Chantal Roberts: Um, so join us.
• 51:04
  Chantal Roberts: Be sure to like, sub, um, subscribe, comment.
• 51:08
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah, all of that kind of fun stuff.
• 51:10
  Chantal Roberts: Yeah.
• 51:11
  Chantal Roberts: We'll see you later.
• 51:13
  William Auten: All right, take care.
• 51:15
  Chantal Roberts: Bye.
• 51:16
  William Auten: Thanks for joining us on the Art of Adjusting Podcast, where we talk about life as an insurance adjuster.
• 51:21
  William Auten: Hit that subscribe button real quick and tell all of your adjuster friends to check this out as well.
• 51:26
  William Auten: For independent adjusting services, go to www.autin.claims.
• 51:30
  William Auten: And for anyone interested in working as an independent liability adjuster, go to the contact us tab to join our roster.
• 51:39
  Chantal Roberts: So this wraps up another Art of Adjusting podcast.
• 51:42
  Chantal Roberts: If you enjoyed this podcast or this episode, please give us five stars and a review.
• 51:48
  Chantal Roberts: It does help the algorithm pick us up.
• 51:50
  Chantal Roberts: In the meantime, you can contact me at theartofadjusting.com for consulting and training purposes.