Latest / DA CREW Podcast / DA CREW PODCAST SEASON 1_ EPISODE #57_HOSTBLAQUE DIAMOND_(SHOW #9)

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DA CREW PODCAST SEASON 1_ EPISODE #57_HOSTBLAQUE DIAMOND_(SHOW #9) · DA CREW Podcast

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M hm oh. So, authors, here's your chance to get to your
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work seen across the world. Be a part about fifty united authors of aspiring
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authors. Make between the seats spends your chance to have your your view and
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your work the broadcast through Algol work M Welcome, Welcome, Welcome everyone to
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the Crude Podcast Network for episode fifty seven, our thirty first season. I'm
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Black Diamond, the host of Basic Black after Dog. Here we have a
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laxed conversations about family changes, cultural customs, and parenting styles. Now there
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are times when I will discuss sensitive topics and occasionally have guests and fringe dropping
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by. Tonight I have more than fringe dropping by. I have not one,
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not two, but three well respected mentors and advocates and absolute innovators in
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the mental health field. My first guest elder I see A. Ragsdale is
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always on the lookout for solutions that exist not only in the mental health arena,
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but also solution in all arenas. She creates a culture of innovation across
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the entire mental health spectrum, and Pastor Windell Fields is constantly seeking new knowledge
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of what's going on and the mental health feel and pouring his knowledge into the
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black community. What sets him apart from many is how he maximizes his reach
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into black men's mental health. And last but not least, and least but
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not last is mister Andrew four Day Watson. He drives with a positive attitude
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and remains in high spirits even when conditions are less than ideal for our young
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black men's mental health. He doesn't assume that something won't work simply because it
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hasn't been done. He gets the job done and it doesn't matter whether it's
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here or there there. He brings others along for the ride because he knows
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that good is not far behind. Welcome, Welcome, welcome, and thank
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you for being here tonight. Thank you so much for having us. Yes,
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thank you, thank you. It's a pleasure and honor to be a
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monst some wonderful people that's trying to make change and trying to make change for
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the better. So it's an honor pleasure. Thank you so much, elder,
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it is wonderful to meet you as well as others. But but oh,
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this lady right here in the glasses I'm in I'm in the glasses world
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too. Oh yeah, that she is, she in that red over that
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Oh yes, ma'am. Yes, Black dias, it is my honor.
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You guys will be given insight to many who may not understand the mental health
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of our black community, of our black men. Now, Black Americans are
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often overdiagnosed with severe mental illness such as schizophrenia, and they're often underdiagnosed for
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move related disorders like depression and anxiety. Let me ask you, all Black
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men less likely to be orfered medication for their diagnosed even when appropriate and covered
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by healthcare. It's been my experience in the field that that's not necessarily the
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case. But what I do find is that the stigma around black men taking
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medication is more so that the arrant more so than being offered the opportunity to
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have access to it. I know that in my clinics specifically, many of
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our doctors are very open to prescribing, you know, African American males the
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medication that they need. However, I recognize that it oftentimes takes a lot
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more psycho education for them to really understand and a lot more encouragement for them
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to be open and willing to the idea of taking medication. So I still
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think we have work to do in our community with just debunking some stigma and
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just providing clearer education around what it means to be on medication, how the
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medication is supposed to be utilized to be more helpful, and how therapeutic services
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works in direct connection and collaboration with the medication to get the best outcomes for
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the individuals who are taking it. Okay, Okay, So I appreciate Elders
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so much for what she's saying. I'm going to come from it from a
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person with lived experience with this, and when it comes to medication, I
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can talk about me, but when it came to me, I knew about
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medications, and tell you the truth, I was afraid of them. I
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my mom was diagnosed with bipolar but yes, bipolar one at that time.
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They have a different name for it now. But in this, you all,
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I saw some of the changes in behavior. I saw some of the
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changes in gestures and things, and in that it made me afraid to take
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mass because I saw her my mom reacted to her medications, and in that,
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you are I'm gonna be honest. I took my first medication and it
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was a scary experience. It was so scary that I felt like you all
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would be like moving as normal, going here or going there, and I
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felt like I was molasses and I was slow to move even my response was
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slow how and I got scared. And for ten years, it was in
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two thousand and eight, ten years, I said, I ain't gonna do
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that. I ain't gonna do that, and I won't do that because I
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don't like this field. And yet if I was hurting myself so much for
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those ten years, because say that again, please so we can hear you,
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I said, for ten years, I was miserable because I refused to
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take medications at that time because I didn't find the right one for me.
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And oftentime that happens where you know, there's no miracle pill, you know,
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and some people believe that the minute they take medication, boom, it's
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going to change everything. Even when it's a medication that can keep you stable
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for a while, sometimes it still changes where certain certain medications may have to
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be changed, certain medications may have to increase. So there's always the possibility
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of that happening with us. Um do you believe when we just and thank
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you so much for telling us and sharing it with us, because not many
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people would, not many men would tell or admit that they've been taking medication,
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that they feel as though that they needed something at this time. Do
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you believe when we discuss mental health in the black community that we are culturally
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sensitive when it comes to assessment and diagnosis? Is that directed towards me to
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you? The one? This panel is open, it's open, and this
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is just the way we're gonna go through both of you. Doesn't matter.
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You want to take it first, faster, repeat the question, repeat it?
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What's one more time? Okay? Do you believe when we discuss mental
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health in the black community that we are culturally sensitive when it comes to assessment
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and diagnosis? Noum, some some, not all people are insensitive. They
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just see us as oh, he got a problem. Yeah, I'm gonna
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listen to the subject matter. Okay, yeah, you show these symptoms,
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yeah, chat check chat. All right, um, this person diagnosed with
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get sophrenia, bipolar depression and put them on this match next. Now some
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I didn't say all now, but some people actually do that. I've seen
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that. So just a little bit background, thirty years in the mental health
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and substance use world, and I've done odd jobs in that, and I
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would take our clients to the mental health center to assist an aid, and
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the people that were there, they just looked at them as a number.
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They didn't see them as a person, a person who has right now a
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difficulty concentrating, a difficulty expressing themselves, just a difficulty. And I'm being
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the mouthpiece and I'm being the community liaison between the two entities because people are
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sometimes not at all are insensitive, and especially to black men. Instead of
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seeing what happened? Do you? They'll say, why are you here?
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M So you know, now that's some of my experience, Elder, what
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you got to say about it? You know? I find that, um,
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this question is really really amazing because I'm in the process of working on
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my dissertation for my PhD and one of my well, actually my topic is
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the cultural um insensitivity that we have towards African American women. And I know
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that this topic is really related towards men. But the problem that I find
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in the field is that a lot of the tools that we utilize for assessments
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are not culturally relevant, They're not culturally appropriate. They were developed by people
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who are not African American, who do not understand the light other African Americans.
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And so what I find is that they're not even in a position to
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ask the right quiet. Oh he's hitting it, you know some people okay.
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And because they're not asking the right questions, they're also not equipped and
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trained to utilize the right tone, the right body language, all of those
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things when you talk to a black man, because the way that you come
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at a black man in the mental health facility is not the same way all
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the way down to your body language that you can utilize when you're talking to
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even a black female or their white counterpart. Gender is not important. So
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the tools we have are just inadequate. Um currently, Not only are the
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tools that we have an adequate understanding cultural responsiveness, understanding cultural theories, we
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don't have appropriate cultural theories that even understand the plight of African Americans, how
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they've been raised, how they do different things. For example, there's a
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theory that talks about how in the African American community, if you were even
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violated by another African American, most people will not even report that person because
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that there's a loyalty to someone I was just based on the same color,
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even though that person violated you. Because the system does not represent you,
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you would still rather be loyal to that culture or that person within your community.
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So even as a community, I feel like we need to have more
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community responsiveness to certain traumas and certain things that African American males are going through.
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And I also think that there needs to be more education even within our
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culture for how we need to be handling our black men, how we need
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to be communicating with them, supporting them in the language that we as women
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are utilizing when we're engaging and interacting. So I just think across the board
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that there's just an inadequate amount of education, cultural responsiveness, and cultural sensitivity
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for African American men and the issues that they faced with concerning their mental health.
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Sorry, I know that, no, no, no, no.
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You know. Prior to us coming on, I was talking to el to
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Pastor about trying to understand more of the black man, and I said,
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most of the time I work on things or work on projects, and when
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I try to get involved and try to walk in that space of that individual
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person, whatnot. And I tried to understand the black man a little bit
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more by trying to walk in his space. But it's scared, man.
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I jump right out, and that was on the mental health though. I
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said, wow, I hear some of our black women saying certain things about
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our black men, and many of them may be going through mental health.
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But I guarantee you if they was to try to take that walk, they
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would come out with a different perspective. Because I had just for that short
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period of time, I jumped out and I was like, whoa. It
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was just it was chilling, to tell you the truth. It really was
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to know what they're dealing with and know how we even view them when certain
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things happen, and we view them when certain things don't happen. So it
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was a wake up call for me. So I suggest that some people try
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to take that walk as well. Black men, they express fear and caution
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regarding regarding government agencies. This being caution could be seen as paranoia or irrational
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fear. Is it taken out of context when we talk about the black experience
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pastor no no, no, no, no, to hear like the experiments
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that they did to African American men at Tuskegee. Now that I still hear
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that, and guess what, I was born at Tuskegee, and I get
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up there and I hear that. Wait a minute, they did what school
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that I went to? And it's like, why would someone do that to
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a human being? A human being? But they didn't see us as a
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human man. They saw us more as just dumb property. And when you
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have that mentality, you're not going to be sensitive to the black man's experience
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because you base it all on a system that's really, as Elder May mention
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earlier, it caters to a certain type of color race, and it's by
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their standards, it's not by the African American standards. And it's causing us
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to be in competition, always causing us to be in comparison, always causing
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us to always have to overperform, and we better not underperform. And so
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it gets into our everyday do this, do that? If I don't do
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this, then this. If I do do that, it's a catch twenty
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two? How can I get a break? And so you know what my
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culture says, do a little blunt, do a little alcohol. You can't
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afford that medication. There's not enough of us in that system. So why
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would we want to come out and share and be vulnerable? And oh new,
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I'm gonna sit back relax and enjoy this ride that I got with this
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weed or this alcohol or whatever other substance I can get to. It's cheaper,
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it's faster, Yeah, self medication, yep, And I don't have
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to worry about I might have to worry about some side effects. But at
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least everybody else go through it in the at least I know it. But
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you know, men, if you keep doing what you're doing, you don't
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get any results except the same stuff. But in order to get different results,
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you gotta try different things. And the black experience I don't know.
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I don't know, Black Diamond, I really don't know. Elda. Can
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you repeat the question one more time for me? Yes, I can.
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Black men the express fearing caution regarding government agencies. This spearing caution could be
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seen as paranoia or rational fear. Is it taken out of context when we
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talk about the black experience. I just don't think that the way the media
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continues to portray African Americans, that we can separate that, or that we
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can place blame on how men respond when you have issues like George Floyd or
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several of these other black men that we consistently see just get gunned down or
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just brutally handled, mishandled and mistreated, and the lack of a response from
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governmental agencies, the lack of appropriate responses even from the presidential office. From
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you know, there's different spaces. I think that those public messages continue to
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validate African American mistrust in the government and mistrust in the system. So I
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think that it is insensitive to call someone's fear irrational because until you've had their
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experience, what is fearful to me may not be fearful to you. And
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so there is a space of privilege and the space of entitlement when I feel
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that I can then begin to judge your emotional response to a trauma that I
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have never personally experienced. So, you know, I think that your question
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was actually very layered, and I'm trying to keep my answer, you know,
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as possible. Yeah, I'm trying to keep it as the sinct as
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possible because there's so many different layers, you know, to what you're saying.
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Because the media plays an important role, and I think that the media's
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role is to continue to validate the black man at a certain subpar image of
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himself. So no matter how many black men we have that are great dads,
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great husbands, great businessmen, great entrepreneurs, great men of God.
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What the media will consistently show you are show you as the ones that are
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not, the ones that are not meeting the standards. And so I think
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that those things just continue to de edify our people. It continues to shift
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the narrative of our identity, and it just continues to keep us at a
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lower space, expecting lower outcomes and not having the access, or the resources,
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or even the ability to even dream that something bigger or better can happen.
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So no, I think that a lot of their fears are very much
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so validated through the media. So with each killing of a black person captured
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on screen, African Americans are fighting harder than ever to protect and prioritize their
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mental health. Do you believe that black men and women are exhausted and they
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would rather not seek mental health treatment. Well, I think it's not that
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you don't want the mental health treatment. I think it's also, well,
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what will this person think of me? Right, Because when you're a man,
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men are told to be self sufficient. Men are told that you're supposed
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to have it all together. They're not given permission to cry as little boys,
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you know, and a lot of times there, I said, a
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lot of women who oftentimes are raising little boys make their sons almost like their
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men, And so little boys never even have the opportunity to even properly grow
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and develop emotionally the way that they need to, because unfortunately, oftentimes their
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moms or the women in their lives have a certain need or a certain amount
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of responsibility that they require their sons to have prematurely. So what you oftentimes
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have are under development, under emotionally development, who are now faced with being
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men who sometimes have what we like to call adolests and response just a certain
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situations because when they were an analysts and they were not properly trained, they
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were not properly taught, and they will not give the space to even be
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able to appropriately express themselves. So you know, it's just like with every
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stage of development, if you don't properly complete that stage, it will re
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emerge and show up again at another stage in your life. So, like
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I said, your questions are amazing, but they're just so layered, and
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I'm trying to keep my answers honestly, like ass to sink, so like
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we're not here like for hours on end. No, that's that's fun,
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because with all of that being said, some black women are exhausted. They
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don't want to support they don't They just tie it of the same thing over
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and over again. So I definitely get it. What's your take on that
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pass? Well? As I look at it and as I listen, I
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was reminded of this cartoon that I had seen. And in the cartoon,
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it showed a little boy with his mom, and the mom said, little
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boy, little boys don't cry. You're a man, and so therefore you
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have to be a man, and you don't cry and you don't show any
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emotion. So this is what the mom was telling the little boy. Then
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it switched to the little boy being a grown man, and here it is
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he's with his woman and she's like, you don't open up to me.
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You're you're not kind, you're you're you're insensitive. You just don't say anything.
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And we wonder why men are not able to be mature in the way
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they express themselves, how they show anger, how because society has told us
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and always be strong. It's sort of like a construction worker, didn't you
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do y'all know that the construction worker field. It's one of those fields that's
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growing in the number of people taking their lives through suicide. Well, no,
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I didn't know that. In this you all, they always gotta be
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a tough person. So therefore they can't show emotion, they can't show pain,
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and so therefore if they do do that, then they're considered weak.
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But yet also in construction they're considered is this person good enough for the job,
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And so they can't show any pain, they can't show any emotion.
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They always have to go because I got to provide for my family, and
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if I don't provide for my family, I'm gonna look bad upon And then
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if I get upset about this that I'm gonna look bad for that. So
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therefore, when I go to sleep, I can't sleep because I got so
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much things on my mind here and there, and so therefore I can't get
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enough sleep, and I mean so much pain and I can't be vulnerable.
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So you got construction workers who have to do those long hours and sometimes travel
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to another state and be isolated from their families for a long periods of time
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and then come back home and where you've been. You don't understand this person
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need this that person needs that, and and and he's supposed to be the
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rule of the house. And it's like all I do is bring the money,
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y'all spend it? Who do I go through the talk to? Yeah,
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that's gonna be happening to our truck drivers too, because they're always on
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the road and they're traveling and being out a distance. And I'm gonna piggyback
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on what you had said about you noticed it was a cartoon where this woman
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was telling her son not to cry. And I grew up with five brothers
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and I was told that all the time, what you're crying for? Now?
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Forgetting that I'm a girl, you know, so I'm going to cry.
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But they would say, what you're crying for, You're not supposed to
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be crying. And that's just the way that I grew up, that you're
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not supposed to cry. And I'm a woman at some point in time,
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but those labor pains hit, it was crying that was different then. So
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it was just that's the way that that grown up just you don't cry.
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You take it like I'm a female, but you take it that way.
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You know, you're supposed to be as strong as the rest of us,
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you're this, you're that, you know, forget that I was a female,
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so to some degree I agreed with them, depending on what it was.
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But growing up now, I can't see me telling my son or my
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grandchildren. My grandson's the same thing. You're not supposed to go right ahead,
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It's okay. It's a beautiful thing, you know, because that means
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you're in touch with what I'm in touch with. And that's okay, especially
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when you're in relationship. So that to me, that's it's okay. And
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black guy, you gotta look at it like this too. Either that person
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is going to implode or they're gonna explode because they haven't learned the skills or
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the abilities on how to deal with this stuff that's going on on the inside
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as well as in my mind, because I got emotions, I got a
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wheel, and and I got this culture that's around me, and we're not
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jiving right now, we're not connecting, and and it's making me anxious.
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I don't know which way to go. And so the man's play is still
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woof and and and elder they yell, there, you're fabulous. You know
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that right, You know that right, you know that right? Because you.
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You're putting it down, and even though the questions are layered, as
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you say, you're giving us a more of a context to put it in.
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To help people understand about a man's plight, a black man's plight.
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It's different, it's different, it's different, different strokes for different folks.
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As they say, yeah, so true, so true. So if a
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practitioner were to interpret this perspective as a symptom, like say, paranoia,
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and they turn to the ds IN five, could they diagnose a patient with
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something else? Now I have to go that's our expertise right there. Yeah,
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say your question differently. I just want to make sure I clearly understand
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what you're saying. Say an African American male was to go to a therapist
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psychiatrist with their experience as far as being a black man, could they interpret
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their perspective as a symptom of just being paranoid? You know, that's just
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that black man being paranoid. Because so they just looked at the DSM five
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and said, you know, that's one of those symptoms. So if you're
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just paranoid, it's not like that, would they diagnose them with something else?
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Saying that, No, they're depressed or maybe say they may have schizophrenia
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or anything like that. So one of the things that I love is that
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the mental health field has really started cracking down, meaning that they're not allowing
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us to just look at one aspect of a man's or a person's life and
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then come up for diagnosis. They really make you look at many facets of
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a person going all the way back a childhood, and they're now requiring a
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lot of different screening tools, a lot of different assassinments to try to help
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give you like a broader, bigger picture of where person is coming from.
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Unfortunately, you know, in every field, you do have lazy practitioners who
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may just kind of like skim through the information, may just try to skim
30:11
through the experience and just place a label on a person without doing the work.
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But if you find an amazing practitioner, there are resources out there that
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will begin to almost like an union pill a person back so that you can
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really pimpoint all of the symptoms and make sure that the symptoms are culturally relevant,
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for example, in an African American community. And you know, just
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certain Christians, right, so, because we have to consider Christianity as being
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a part of a person's culture. If you believe that you hear God,
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if you believe that God speaks to you, that could be considered schizophrenia to
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someone who's not spiritual or who does not believe in a God that can clearly
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speak to his people. So there's a lot of different tools that are now
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utilized among mental health practitioners, like spiritual assessments, cultural assessments ACES, which
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goes back and traces your trauma all way back to childhood, racial assessments.
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There's so many different tools that are really good practitioner who wants to really treat
31:07
the whole person and make sure that they get the diagnosis right so that the
31:11
interventions in medication can all be in line to provide the best treatment. They're
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gonna do the work to really make sure that the diagnosis that they're giving you
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is one that encompasses the whole person and not just an assumption. But that's
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when it becomes really important that we as individuals learn how to advocate for ourselves
31:29
and that we as an individual don't just accept the labels and we don't just
31:33
accept the treatment, but we say, hey, I don't like how this
31:36
feels. I want a second opinion. I do want to talk the to
31:38
a therapist, but you're not it for me. And instead of just giving
31:41
up and throwing that whole process away, you gotta be willing and patient to
31:45
stick with it until you find what works for you, whether it's medication,
31:51
the diagnosis, or the practitioner. Talking about labels, you know, I'm
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thinking about how they labeled our black boy saying they have ADHD. Quickly.
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It's quick to say that they have ADHD and have no idea what's going on
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with them. And some of the parents are just taken it and saying,
32:15
oh, yeah, he has ADHD because it just seems to be something that
32:19
all other children that's their age have and or diagnosed with to the same year.
32:23
So what I want, Oh, I'm sorry, I'm sorry to go
32:28
ahead. Well, I just wanted to say, but you gotta look at
32:30
it from that parent's point of view, which is unfortunately they tied up the
32:37
behavior of themselves and they don't know how to deal with it. And so
32:39
they go to the name and they say, oh, this is what they
32:43
got, Okay, Well give me the medicine so I can go on and
32:45
give it to them because this boy is off the chain. This girl is
32:50
off the chain, and I'm tired. Do you understand? Do you understand
32:53
how many times I've had to go up to the school to deal with this
32:58
situation of behavior. I'm tired, just and then next thing you know,
33:05
oh I can't afford. Oh, but yet we're gonna get you on this.
33:09
That's another story, we elder what you wanted to say, Elden,
33:15
So so what I want to say is that we have to understand that resources
33:20
are connected to diagnosis, and without certain diagnoses, parents are not going to
33:25
get certain resources that they need for their children. When children get labeled with
33:29
something like ADHD. Now the school has a certain amount of responsibility, a
33:32
certain amount of resources that they're now able to offer the family to provide them
33:37
with assistance. You now have offered up this family an opportunity, possibly for
33:40
disability for the child, so that the parent may be able to work a
33:44
little bit less and then supplement their income with that, and then just a
33:47
plathora of other resources. But what I will say is that the same exact
33:52
behavior of ADHD, it looks exactly the same as trauma. And what we
33:58
have is we have a bunch of trauma tides black boys running around that we're
34:01
labeling as ADHD simply because the behaviors look the same. So yes, if
34:07
I've been watching people get murdered outside my house, if I watch crack kids
34:10
going in and out, if I'm being abused, if I'm being touched,
34:14
Yes, I can't focus at school. No, I cannot sit down in
34:15
my seat. No I cannot regulate my internal behavior. No I do not
34:20
have good social skills. Yes, I'm withdrawn. No I'm not sleeping properly.
34:23
No, I'm not eating properly. And all of those things look like
34:27
ADHD. But the truth is is that I'm traumatized and I'm scared, and
34:30
there's no real diagnosis outside of PTSD that you can give to these African American
34:35
kids that will also do as pastors set, which is give them the medication
34:38
so that they can calm the inside down long enough to be able to give
34:43
them the tools to help them process and learn the proper coping skills for how
34:46
to even understand what's going on and then teach them how to move through it.
34:50
So that's what I'm saying. When you talk about mental health, they're
34:52
layers and layers and layers that you really have to pull back, including looking
34:58
at the eternal environment that that child is even coming out of, in the
35:02
amount of support that they may or may not be getting at home, and
35:07
or whether or not it's the person that they're living with at home. It's
35:09
also traumatized trying to now parent and comfort a traumatized person. So there's just
35:15
a lot of different factors that impact the mental health. Oh, elder,
35:22
oo, elder, who see, I gotta make it sort of funny for
35:29
you because it's a serious subject that we're talking about. It's very serious and
35:32
and but yet if we if we we gotta be quote unquote sensitive to the
35:39
people who we are talking to, because we can be putting them through trauma
35:44
right right now. It's but the thing about it is, elder, are
35:50
you able to talk about aces adverse childhood experience? We can talk about that
35:59
ray after this commercial, because this is getting good. And I told you
36:02
that my panel was gonna give you some insight and not even't lie about that
36:07
because listen to what they're saying. That's gonna We're gonna take a quick commercial.
36:10
We'll come right back, okay, Frank, tune in to Basic Black
36:27
after dark and she has a special episode on mental health June is second,
36:31
twenty twenty three. First up, As I said Ragsdam, she is creating
36:37
an environment where helly deliverance, restoration and renewal can take Later, the lineup
36:40
is set and revivals in place. She's not playing any games with her special
36:45
guests, but the end my Father's House conference on June twenty second, twenty
36:49
third, and twenty fourth, she's bringing out a squad of heavy hitters to
36:52
move you and to forgive it being forgiven or forgiven again. You already know
36:57
it's about to go down and you're in for a tree. Its spurs three
37:00
life changing days and teaching, building and healing. Who's going to be there
37:04
thought profit, purpose coaches, entrepreneurs, survivors, business therapeutic and purpose coaches,
37:09
authors, motivational speakers, educators, and you register to day and here's
37:15
some of the people that's going to be there, which just next step we
37:29
have Andrew Foiday from Life Unlimited. It is a therapeutical organization specializing an African
37:35
American agents sixteen to twenty six seeking to unlock your potential and life. They
37:39
help you obtain the knowledge, skills, and resources needed to navigate the world
37:44
today. Life someone the feature you design. Life is also a glass root
37:47
ever to engage African American families introduced crime and conservation, smers, poverties and
37:52
many other social ills Lagani Community in Baltimore City as a whole. Mister Fariday
37:58
is in lifsing clinical social work and it's trained to work with adolescents and adults
38:01
eight to sixteen to sixty five, the primary folks on African Americans. Last,
38:07
but not least, Mister Windale Field for windre Feels Enterprises. He is
38:12
prolific. He is a powerhouse. Windare Feels is they forced to be reckon
38:15
worth. With over thirty years of experience in mental health and substance use services,
38:21
he is the CEO of Windale Fields Enterprises and certified Addiction Recovery Empowerment Specialists
38:25
and the certified piers specially for addictive disease. He offers life coaching, mental
38:31
health and substance abuse coaching, suicide prevention and awareness training, Hang of Resolution,
38:37
Blueprint Services and Respect Institution of Jordan Presentation his slogan and title for his
38:42
co author best selling book There's No Health Without Mental Health anology then and mental
38:46
health. This is a show you all do not, won't you miss?
38:51
Please tune in to basically Black after Thought. All right, you can go
38:58
ahead and get back to it. Thank you, thank you, thank you
39:00
for joining us. If you've just joined us for the first time, you
39:04
are going to be in for a treat with both of my guests. Pastor,
39:08
when Dell Fields and Elder, I see a Ragsdale. They have been
39:12
given us insight into black men's mental health and when not getting about our young
39:16
black boys, Pastor, you had left off by saying you wanted Elder to
39:22
talk a little bit more about ACES. Yes, I wanted to talk about
39:25
a little bit more about ACES. That is adverse childhood experiences. And she
39:36
can tell it's an assessment tool, but she can go more into it.
39:40
But I tell you, as she talks about this, I can really relate
39:46
to these things that she's going to be talking about. And as she talks
39:52
and finish up with it, I'll show you some of my story because it's
39:55
going to hit almost everything that's about Say, okay, well, I'm glad
40:01
he had so much faith about my intelligence of ideality to speak to this.
40:07
If he just threw me on the spot without telling me this is what he
40:09
was going to talk about. But this is basically like a seven to ten
40:15
question questionnaire that you would ask a person, and it basically wants to know
40:20
what how many traumatic experiences have you had from the time of your birth up
40:23
to eighteen years old? And so it can ask a myriad of questions as
40:28
far as how did your dad treat your mom, like, did you ever
40:31
see her slap, hit by, throw hers at whatever? Same thing with
40:37
your mom to your dad. It could be the people in your household go
40:39
to jail, did they come out of jail? Did they experience Have you
40:45
experienced someone being hurt? Were you touched by somebody? Did you touch somebody
40:49
else? Did you feel that you had someone to properly care for you?
40:52
Did you It just begins to ask you all of these questions. And this
40:57
tool was developed and has been utilized in Actually it's one of our mandatory tools
41:00
that we utilize in my organization because research has shown that individuals that score highly
41:07
on this question there have poor physical health outcomes. Not only do they have
41:12
poor physical health outcomes, it's also a great indicator to talk about the level
41:16
and quality of your mental health outcomes, the quality of your relationship outcomes,
41:22
and the amount of self care usually that you're able to utilize them fund yourself.
41:27
And what we found is that in the African American community, many of
41:30
the questions that were acts have been normalized as functional normal behavior, and it
41:35
takes a long time to even educate a person to help them understand, no,
41:39
baby, you were traumatized. Yes, I understand your mom beat you
41:43
with the belt, minded too, Yes I understand we came out normal.
41:46
Yes, I understand that dad was in and out of jail because a lot
41:50
of black men are. And we begin to normalize those things without understanding that
41:54
each and every time we've had those experiences, it literally wears away at the
41:59
fabric of who you are. It wears away the fabric of your mental health,
42:04
and we begin to become what I call the walking traumatized. So we
42:07
show up and traumatized ways. We show up at work, that way,
42:12
we show up at school that way, we're parenting that way. We're constantly
42:15
on Our systems are constantly repped up, and we're constantly moving, which makes
42:22
us more susceptible for things like hypertension. It makes us more susceptible for things
42:27
like high blood I'm sorry, I set hypertension, but also diabetes, heart
42:30
disease, and a number of cancers. Because our body is constantly traumatized.
42:36
When your body gets repped up from a trauma, there's also supposed to be
42:40
an ability for it to calm back down. When you are traumatized after one
42:45
after the other after the other, your body never learns how to regulate and
42:50
calm down. So because it stays at that hyper aroused since all the time,
42:54
you're literally wearing down your organs at a way that your counterparts who are
43:00
not experiencing traumas at the same rate are not experiencing. So you're already kind
43:05
of like running uphill, trying to be healthy, trying to maintain your day.
43:08
And what I also want to make sure people know that the ages have
43:12
also shown us through the research is that how black people express depression versus how
43:16
white people express depression are two totally different things. Most of the time.
43:22
If someone is having a rough day and you're a Caucasian, and you're a
43:25
Caucasian female, but you have a husband who also works to pay the bills,
43:30
guess what, I'm not going to work today. I need to lay
43:31
down. I'm gonna just watch TV. I'm gonna take a me day.
43:35
Someone else come get the kids because I'm overwhelmed. A lot of times African
43:39
Americans do not have the same social capital or financial capital to take that time
43:45
apart to get a break from the kids, and so we're constantly functioning when
43:49
our body is actually trying to shut down. And so what we begin to
43:52
label as the angry black woman, the angry black man, really it's just
43:55
the sad, depressed and overwhelmed individual that just does not have the resources or
44:00
the opportunity to take a break, to step away from life. And we're
44:04
being judged from layers and from behind certain glass ceilings that people just don't understand,
44:09
which goes back to your first question about cultural responsiveness and cultural sensitivity to
44:15
how things happen and how we're viewed in the mental health world. Yeah,
44:20
I would like to donate right now to the organis that I want to swipe
44:24
the car. I'll tell you my cash chap when this is over, it
44:30
down, put it on anybody out do the same thing. You know,
44:35
it's just amazing when you talk about asans that if the average person was just
44:39
to take that test themselves. They may be surprised that they were trying to
44:45
as a child. You know, we're walking around thinking, oh, I'm
44:50
an adult now everything is okay, I'm good. Take the test and see
44:53
where you at and see where you fall pastor you said you had a story
44:59
to tell us. Yep. So just to emphasize what she's saying here,
45:04
it is when I was born, I weighed two pounds ten ounces. It
45:07
was a forced labor type of thing, and my mom had eclamps here.
45:12
She didn't have the claps, she had eclampsy or which is where the blood
45:15
pressure is really high. Mom went in and out, fainted, incontinence,
45:21
all of that, and it was I was a rough, rough birth for
45:27
her. And it ended up that the doctor had to go to my grandmother
45:31
to ask who do you want to live? Do you want your daughter or
45:37
the baby to live? And my grandmother said, in faith, both of
45:40
them going to live. And sure enough, I was putting two pounds ten
45:46
ounces. My whole body could fit in a baseball cap. So that's what
45:52
trauma. Then we go on, I get out of it, start living.
45:58
I got bullied because of my size and my weight. Trauma then got
46:04
up there and ended up being molested by both men and by women. Trauma.
46:12
Expectations were low on me, and nobody didn't really think I would do
46:16
anything in life, from the doctor who said that I would row up having
46:22
developmental disability issues all the way to well window he got coming sense, But
46:31
that book, since nah. It took a teacher when I was in high
46:36
school to tell me what's wrong with you? You're a smart young man.
46:40
That changed my whole perspective all night. And then when I went to college
46:45
at Tuskegee, it ends up you all got kicked off because why I was
46:51
searching to be accepted and I got kicked out, went to another school,
46:59
got kicked about that because I had an operation and I couldn't recover quit I
47:06
got sent home, sadness, disappointment, all of that. So I became
47:13
a minister. I covered up by being at the job that I've been at
47:17
for thirty years and more. And I ended up getting that job, being
47:28
in the ministry and got married. You all some wonderful things now, pastor
47:36
they wonderful, But yet you know the part about it that flips on it
47:40
said is that I got divorced, I got ridden up on the job,
47:45
and then the ministry because of the league the lead, it broke up the
47:54
church. So it led me to all these things. So all the things
48:00
that we were talking about, those aces, you can see how they're just
48:04
building and building. And when I got that Arrears letter, meaning that old
48:08
child support for that three year old, it was over my head. I
48:14
couldn't take it no more and I decided to take my life. And to
48:20
this day, God is the reason why I'm alive because he told me still
48:27
alive for your son. Those two words, your son. That's what kept
48:31
me alne. But that didn't mean I didn't hit the tree, didn't mean
48:36
that I didn't damage my car. And that's when I decided to say,
48:45
that's not how the story ends. But those aces, you all, y'all
48:52
can hear it in my story. That's real. I recommend people to sit
48:59
down, get that tool and just take it. You know, it's an
49:01
amazing tool. You know, I use it, We use it where we
49:06
at work, and it's something that I honestly feel as though people really should
49:12
so they can get a little bit more insight to themselves. I want to
49:15
talk a little bit not a lot about talk therapy. It provides a client
49:20
but the opportunity to discuss feelings and emotions. This is especially vital to Black
49:23
men who often do not feel that they can express themselves and be vulnerable in
49:28
addressing their lived experience. If not talk therapy, then what what what you
49:34
know? If they didn't focus on talk therapy, what would they have?
49:37
What tool would they use? I hear you said aces already? But to
49:42
some it may help, but to others it may not. Where do you
49:47
think they should go from there? If they find that it's not working for
49:51
them? You know, they are all different types of therapy that they have.
49:54
Now a lot of men find peace. We're working out getting your endorphins
50:00
up, you know what I mean, like as a way of escape.
50:02
There's music therapy where a lot of individuals who can lose themselves literally in music.
50:07
There's biblio therapy where you can write. There's saying therapy, there's dance
50:14
therapy, and we're finding that sometimes because the trauma lives in your body,
50:17
sometimes people don't have the grace to be able to relive it by using words
50:22
to tell the story. But there's so many other creative ways there's aren't therapy.
50:25
There's a lot of different ways that individuals can, you know, just
50:30
get the trauma offer them and out of them until they're ready to engage in
50:34
talk therapy. So I don't always recommend talk therapy as being the first layer
50:38
of therapy for everyone. But there are different options that are available. And
50:45
that goes back to when I was saying, if the first option does not
50:47
work for you, advocate for yourself and keep looking, keep trying on different
50:52
things until you find that thing that works for you. For some people and
50:57
may be working with animals, they now have animal therapy where people go they
51:00
brush the horses, you know, they go with nature, and some people
51:05
go hiking because just being um, getting the vitamin D from the sun,
51:09
being around trees, um, what is it called grounding yourself, having your
51:14
feet actually touching the earth is very peaceful and grounding for people. You know,
51:19
some people lose themselves and like the yoga experience or like the pilates experience.
51:22
So there are so many different options for individuals who are motivated to want
51:28
to get the trauma off of them, out of them and get help.
51:31
I just recommend keep going until you find what works best for you, and
51:36
I'm sorry, go ahead past them. I can occur with her. I
51:42
found out that therapy wasn't what I thought it was going to be, even
51:46
though I tried it twice and I thought it was more of Coming to America.
51:52
The first scene where Eddie Murphy says, hey, let's talk and tells
51:58
the Feema, So, what what color do you like? And she says,
52:01
what whatever color you like? That's what I thought therapy was. Whatever
52:07
you like, whatever you like. No, I need some guidance here because
52:12
right now I don't know which way to go, and you just telling me,
52:14
well, we can sit down and talk about whatever you want to talk
52:16
about. At that time, I didn't understand. But that's what I thought
52:21
therapy was, and so I didn't. I didn't do therapy. I didn't
52:25
take mad I didn't do therapy. But I was miserable for ten years.
52:32
And what made the difference people telling their stories like I did not only that
52:39
I had a loving, kind supervisor who knew that something was going on,
52:46
and they volunteered to take me to the doctor's appointment. It's not working as
52:52
comp stuff this, She said, you appeared to be depressed, wonder and
53:00
I don't mind helping you. I'm a person that lives with depression. And
53:07
she said, I'm willing to go and take you to the doctor and I
53:12
said no, I say, but I've gone myself. She said, give
53:16
me a doctor's excuse. And I went to that doctor, Earl Thurman.
53:23
That man, he broke it. He broke my fear, He broke all
53:28
of it by just saying, mister Fields, I would love to help you.
53:34
Will you allow me to help you? And that's and that that formed
53:39
our relationship. And I've been taken by medication every since. And it's that
53:46
plus doing a holistic approach, eating right, sleeping well, expressing things like
53:55
she said, art all of those, writing a book. Those things really
54:01
did help me. And I'm thriving. I'm telling you all, it's a
54:07
miraculous thing to see and do and feel when you have those outlets, those
54:15
supports. I still another support that I believe that's happening. Religion and spirituality
54:23
are very important in the black community. However, there are some who believe
54:27
the importance of religion and spirituality as coping has also been named as a reason
54:32
many African Americans do not seek formal mental health services. Has the Black Church
54:37
been used to cope with a mental health concern or as a reason to not
54:43
discuss the mental health issue at all and that the Lord will take care of
54:46
it some I can tell you that in my experience of helping others, the
55:00
church would be the last place I would have gone because of how they look
55:07
at it. Everything is demonized. You got a spirit of depression, you
55:10
got a spirit of this, that and the other. And I'm if I
55:14
come to you, I'm looking for guidance, empowerment, help, But yet
55:21
all I get is you're a demon or. We don't know how to deal
55:30
with that. But yet throughout the whole Bible you see people with depression and
55:37
mean schizophrenia behavior. I mean, it's all through the Bible. And I'd
55:44
like to recommend a book, a book called Grace for the Afflicted by Matthew
55:52
Stafford. Wonderful book and it has showed you how to understand relate to spiritual
56:01
matters in Christianity pertaining to mental health. Wonderful book. But thank you.
56:10
As a society, how can we improve the Black mental I'm sorry, as
56:15
a society, how can we improve Black mental health? All right, Elder,
56:20
it's your turn now. I think it's by normalizing the conversation, normalizing
56:27
the conversation. Not only do we need to normalize the conversation, we need
56:31
more people to be willing to be vulnerable, to be honest, and when
56:35
people are we need to make sure that we have language to be supportive,
56:38
to create safe spaces for one another, and we need to increase our capacity
56:43
to hold space for others. We have to do that because oftentimes we don't
56:50
hold space for other people well, and we don't treat others properly when we
56:53
see them break down. I often think about Will Smith and when Will Smith
56:59
had his emailotional breakdown, the amount of people who make fun of him,
57:02
the amount of people who you know, talk poorly about him, who just
57:06
kind of took shots at, you know, this man who showed a certain
57:09
level of vulnerability. I just think that as a people, we just need
57:13
to increase and improve our grace capacity for one another. So until we can
57:20
do that, and until we can be open and honest about who we are
57:23
and where we are, I just don't think we're going to make the improvements
57:28
as a people across the board. Well said, thank you so much.
57:32
If we do not address black men's mental health, we risk further inequality and
57:37
marginalization of this population. As our young black boys and black men are already
57:43
more likely to be overlooked and underserved in the healthcare system, Not addressing their
57:47
mental health needs can lead to greater disparities and access to care, poor quality
57:52
of life, and long term damage to physical health and well being. We
57:58
must ensure that the Black community has access to culturally competent mental health services and
58:04
that their voices are heard in the conversation about mental health. I want to
58:08
thank my guests for joining me on this very special topic of black men's mental
58:13
health. For mental health services specific to black wellness, visit elder Ica Ragsdale
58:19
at i am designed for Purpose dot com. She's helping clients accomplish their goals,
58:25
find their voice, and heal from various past traumas past. The Windell
58:30
Fields at Windelle Underscore Fields at yahoo dot com provides training to learn about practical
58:37
ways to improve mental health and personal well being. If you are someone you
58:43
know is experience a mental health crisis, call or text nine eight eight the
58:47
Suicide and Crisis Hotline. Tune into Basic Black after dark on June sixteenth,
58:53
when we will be speaking with some amazing couples about the power of love.
58:58
Also remember to share, like, and follow and subscribe to the Crew podcast
59:02
Network. This is Black Diamond with Basic Black after Dark. We bring when
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we bring you safe, relaxed spaces where you can engage openly and candidate.
59:13
After eight after dark, Basic Black after Dark all new podcast show with your
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host, Black Diamond