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Mount Pisgah with Vince Barrows · The Occult Rejects

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: You see, something's going to happen. What's going to happen?
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Help?
• 0:15
  Speaker 3: What?
• 0:22
  Speaker 4: Help?
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Occult Rejects. Got a very very special
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: episode today. I'm very excited to get this guest on.
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: But before we introduce the guest, we will introduce the
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: other rejects that are joining us today.
• 0:36
  Speaker 5: And we got my man, the Headless Giant. What is
• 0:39
  Speaker 5: going on?
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: Sir?
• 0:40
  Speaker 5: How are you to go on?
• 0:42
  Speaker 4: Happy Sunday? Everybody just got off of my trialogus, which
• 0:46
  Speaker 4: happens every Sunday in the morning, So I definitely check
• 0:49
  Speaker 4: that out. Me and Ricardo and Ethan go over a
• 0:53
  Speaker 4: bunch of different topics that seem unrelated but always end
• 0:57
  Speaker 4: up finding their way back to each other.
• 0:58
  Speaker 6: That's awesome.
• 0:59
  Speaker 4: So I also have a Thursday show where I read
• 1:02
  Speaker 4: your occult emails and you can email them to me
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: at the Headless Giant Podcast at gmail dot com and
• 1:08
  Speaker 4: we will read them out on Thursday nights around seven thirties.
• 1:12
  Speaker 4: Check it out.
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, definitely send that email in And if you
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: didn't check out his trialog that he put out today,
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: go check it out after this. Thank you very much,
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: hell us. I appreciate you, sir and we got my
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: main Jules.
• 1:23
  Speaker 5: What is going on? Brother, Great to have you here.
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: Well, thank thanks for having me again. What's up, guys.
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: I'm Jewles, host of the Gray Pill Podcast. You can
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: find me on Twitter at gray Pilled Pod. I'm over
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: on Patreon. We do a lot of stuff over there.
• 1:39
  Speaker 3: Tonight Sunday Chaos, it's it's that Sunday. We do it
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: every other Sunday, so it's it's it's that time of
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: the month, nine o'clock on my Rumble channel. It's at
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: fire Pixie every Tuesday, I produce for a show called
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: Already Dead a thirty Central Jose Gallason and Austin p.
• 1:58
  Speaker 7: The card I got.
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: I got three or four guests I guess coming on
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: in the next few weeks, Esoteric, Eddie, Gray Horn, Pagan,
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: a couple other ones coming on, so yeah, just stay
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: tuned for those.
• 2:17
  Speaker 7: But yeah, Nick, thanks for.
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: Having me on again, man, of course, and it's good
• 2:19
  Speaker 3: seeing all you fellas here too, and it's good meeting you.
• 2:23
  Speaker 5: Oh, thank you, sir. And we got my man Rick Hardle.
• 2:26
  Speaker 5: What is going on? So actually I had to thank
• 2:28
  Speaker 5: Ricardo for this guest, So thank.
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: You, sir.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: Oh, not at all. It's it's I think that the
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: message that Vincent has to to tell us is quite
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: important and it's quite relevant to our times, especially in
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: regard of this apparent conspiracy to hide this kind of information.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: So looking forward for his presentation today, so you can
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: find me at he got cavery one at access. It
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: is on the screen. I would like to plug the
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: Universe Unveiled podcast. It's a feminine podcaster. I strongly recommend
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: it's a It's a lot of fresh air that on
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: on on YouTube, so I hope you all enjoy it.
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: And institute Finatal Philosophy dot org, where you can find
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: our magazine that is free for watching or download, and
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: also my books The Resonance Earth if you are interested
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: in megalitic structures and their functionalities and how they could
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: possibly work and start us theies about us humans and
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: how we relate to one another.
• 3:30
  Speaker 6: And thanks and how they.
• 3:33
  Speaker 5: Oh boy, somebody's repeating, all right, thank you very much, Ricardo.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: I appreciate that, and definitely definitely people go check out
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: his website and definitely check out Universe Unveiled. Two awesome
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: checks and they got you know, great stuff going on.
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: Definitely check out the show and uh ty Rome, my man. Nice,
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: but not least before the guests. How are you, sir?
• 3:54
  Speaker 8: What's up everybody. I'm glad to be here. Thank you
• 3:57
  Speaker 8: for having me, Nick Vince, I'm ready to hear what
• 3:59
  Speaker 8: you got to say. Man, I'm like saying, they are
• 4:02
  Speaker 8: very interested in this. I never heard about this until
• 4:05
  Speaker 8: just a few days ago, and I looked into it,
• 4:06
  Speaker 8: and I do have a couple of questions.
• 4:08
  Speaker 9: So yeah, I'm excited for this.
• 4:10
  Speaker 8: Everything you can find on me is on my website,
• 4:12
  Speaker 8: Rebirth of theWord dot com. And also my book Journey
• 4:15
  Speaker 8: through the Origins of History is on Amazon, and Ricardo's
• 4:19
  Speaker 8: books Resident Earth What Star Dust is also on Amazon.
• 4:23
  Speaker 8: Do not forget about that from What's your book as
• 4:26
  Speaker 8: much as you can Ricardo, like I said, thanks again, Nick, appreciate.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: It of course, of course, no, thank you all for
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: making it. I appreciate it. And finally, to the guest himself,
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: we got Vincent Barrow's coming on. We got Vincent's Barrows on,
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: So please, sir, let us know what your deal is
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: and where they can find any of your stuff that
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: you want to promote.
• 4:45
  Speaker 10: So yeah, thanks for having me here. And I just
• 4:49
  Speaker 10: finished up another blog talk about the the journal, I
• 4:58
  Speaker 10: mean a journey from China all the way to North America.
• 5:02
  Speaker 10: And Laurie had talked about this about a trip that
• 5:10
  Speaker 10: the Chinese took in fourteen thirty and this was a
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  Speaker 10: part of a time when the Chinese were voyaging out
• 5:17
  Speaker 10: with large treasure fleets and they made it all the
• 5:22
  Speaker 10: way to North Carolina. In Ashland, North Carolina, they found
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  Speaker 10: the site and they actually left a medallion there and
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  Speaker 10: it was inscribed with their symbol of the The Emperor
• 5:35
  Speaker 10: of China's symbol was on this medallion found near Ashland,
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  Speaker 10: North Carolina. This is a real thing that was documented
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  Speaker 10: in the journals of the Chinese explorers that date back
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  Speaker 10: to fourteen thirty.
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  Speaker 6: So they found the actual medallion there and.
• 5:52
  Speaker 10: They talked about the site and it had a lot
• 5:55
  Speaker 10: of details in their journal that matched the site and
• 5:58
  Speaker 10: the artifacts found out the correlate to what was described
• 6:03
  Speaker 10: in the Chinese journals. So things like in the journals
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  Speaker 10: they said the heralding of the blowing of trumpets, Well,
• 6:10
  Speaker 10: they found figurines of trumpets at the site. They found
• 6:14
  Speaker 10: figurines of Mongol horsemen riding horses, figurines or sculptures of
• 6:19
  Speaker 10: people riding horses that were adorned in Mongolian armor, and
• 6:27
  Speaker 10: they looked just like the Mongolian horsemen riding the horses.
• 6:34
  Speaker 10: They found an ancestor shrine literally with every single clan
• 6:40
  Speaker 10: of the Ananabe that was depicted in the journals and
• 6:46
  Speaker 10: described as well. Some of them had been They used
• 6:51
  Speaker 10: totems as their name of their clan or their symbol,
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  Speaker 10: like they had one that was called the catfish clan,
• 6:58
  Speaker 10: they had the eel clan, there was the deer clan.
• 7:04
  Speaker 10: Will go through examples, I'll show you what these look like.
• 7:07
  Speaker 10: But each of the clan symbols were depicted here and
• 7:09
  Speaker 10: they were found in the sculptures in North Carolina. And
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  Speaker 10: they also had this artifact that was called the Gehera churn,
• 7:17
  Speaker 10: which is a very specific artifact that they used in
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  Speaker 10: Tibet and China to make gerhura, which is like a butter.
• 7:26
  Speaker 10: They would churn the butter in a pottery bowl. And
• 7:32
  Speaker 10: this Gehera churn, well, it was found in North Carolina.
• 7:37
  Speaker 10: It's the only one found in this country that I'm
• 7:39
  Speaker 10: aware of, but it was probably from this treasure fleet
• 7:44
  Speaker 10: of the fourteen thirties from the Chinese as well. So
• 7:49
  Speaker 10: the Ashley, North Carolina treasure Medallion and all these other
• 7:54
  Speaker 10: figurines probably were placed there or at least contributed to
• 8:00
  Speaker 10: from this Chinese voyage of fourteen thirty and the real
• 8:06
  Speaker 10: Guallei origins had just talked talked with Laurie about this.
• 8:12
  Speaker 10: They had discussed a lot of these figurines and and
• 8:16
  Speaker 10: the story of the treasure fleet that went around the
• 8:18
  Speaker 10: south coast of Africa all the way up through the
• 8:21
  Speaker 10: Atlantic and then landed in Cohochia Mountains in Illinois, and
• 8:26
  Speaker 10: then from that point they went to Ashland, North Carolina,
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  Speaker 10: and they left this medallion in North Carolina. That was
• 8:36
  Speaker 10: that was found and it's real artifact that matches exactly
• 8:39
  Speaker 10: the journals of the Chinese.
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: So now you might have said this before, but and
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: I was looking at the chat just whatever it might
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: have escaped me. I didn't hear you.
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  Speaker 5: Say, how was this? And this was found by who?
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: Like this was discovered and like like has anybody important
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  Speaker 2: actually looked at it and been like, oh this is
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: from then?
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 9:01
  Speaker 10: Can can everybody see my screen? I am I'm gonna
• 9:05
  Speaker 10: try to share. Yeah, I share this PowerPoint slide and
• 9:08
  Speaker 10: I'll talk about who had found it when it was
• 9:11
  Speaker 10: found right. So this is Mount Pishka, North Carolina. It's
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  Speaker 10: the biggest artifact cash in the East coast. There there's
• 9:20
  Speaker 10: issues with museums removing things after they were after we
• 9:23
  Speaker 10: asked questions. They hid the results of the testing we
• 9:27
  Speaker 10: paid for and ordered they shut down future testing on these.
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  Speaker 10: Also there's evidence of DeSoto multi racial village of Cahok,
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  Speaker 10: Covik and Canuga meaning a mixed race ancestors shrine or
• 9:41
  Speaker 10: a place of meeting, place of many people. And so
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  Speaker 10: we have three D scans and interesting figures to show.
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  Speaker 10: So what we're talking about is three those there's four
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  Speaker 10: mountains on the site. There's Mathers Mound, which is the
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  Speaker 10: official site number thirty one h W one. There's Mound
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  Speaker 10: two which is previously Mound three which was Plot Mound,
• 10:04
  Speaker 10: and Mount five which is Wells Mound. In eighteen seventy nine,
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  Speaker 10: this place was excavated by Ben Valentine. So he was
• 10:14
  Speaker 10: a businessman. He was trying to make a museum. So
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  Speaker 10: he worked with the local residents mister Osborne and Burnett,
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  Speaker 10: and these were people who lived there at Mount Pishka.
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  Speaker 10: They found out about the site and they started activating
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  Speaker 10: the mountains and they found twenty five hundred figurines, and
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  Speaker 10: then the Smithsonian came in and they said, oh, these
• 10:31
  Speaker 10: are potstone. They're unlike any other artifacts, so therefore they're
• 10:35
  Speaker 10: all fake. And the Smithsonian claimed that they were either
• 10:40
  Speaker 10: planted there to dupe the Valentines or to make them
• 10:45
  Speaker 10: credulous of some lost mound building culture. And they so
• 10:51
  Speaker 10: they sent another archaeologist, Emmert, to debunk the mound builder myth.
• 10:57
  Speaker 6: And then.
• 10:59
  Speaker 10: They said they found someone to make similar stone carvings,
• 11:05
  Speaker 10: so therefore they debunked all of these twenty five hundred
• 11:08
  Speaker 10: figurines in James Mooney in nineteen hundred wrote the Necessity
• 11:13
  Speaker 10: of strict Silence on the conduct and describing the site
• 11:16
  Speaker 10: legends where people were little people were legion, so in
• 11:19
  Speaker 10: other words, he said, they can't talk about this. Even
• 11:22
  Speaker 10: in nineteen hundred they were not allowed to talk about it.
• 11:26
  Speaker 10: And the site basically was put away in a vault
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  Speaker 10: for one hundred and fifty years and no one did
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  Speaker 10: any research on it because it was debunked as a
• 11:36
  Speaker 10: hoax or a plant. And the Garden Creek Archaeological Site
• 11:42
  Speaker 10: was on along the Pigeon river and it had several
• 11:49
  Speaker 10: phases of archaeological studies after that. But what happened was
• 11:52
  Speaker 10: the crew came alongside in eighteen seventy nine eighteen eighty
• 11:55
  Speaker 10: and they started digging the site. And this is a
• 11:59
  Speaker 10: picture of the crew in the middle of James Mooney
• 12:02
  Speaker 10: and and Valentine. And they dug up this site. It
• 12:07
  Speaker 10: had petroglyphs along the side. There were like ugi style
• 12:11
  Speaker 10: petrick glyffs. They dug the mound up and they found
• 12:13
  Speaker 10: out it was a twin earth lodge and it had
• 12:19
  Speaker 10: human skeletons in the mound.
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: And I don't think, not to interrupt you, Sorry to
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: interrupt you, but I don't think. Did you think the
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: picture changed, because it hasn't changed.
• 12:27
  Speaker 4: No, it hasn't changed.
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 12:29
  Speaker 5: I was gonna say, just let you know.
• 12:30
  Speaker 6: I'm sorry.
• 12:31
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you're good, You're good.
• 12:31
  Speaker 6: I just don't want to let me see if I
• 12:33
  Speaker 6: can go back.
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: I was like, he's kind of hovering the cursor over nothing,
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: So I'm assuming he thinks that something that.
• 12:39
  Speaker 5: I thought it was just my eyes.
• 12:40
  Speaker 9: I don't have my glasses.
• 12:42
  Speaker 6: Oh, thank you for telling me. I'll try to try
• 12:44
  Speaker 6: to get this to change here.
• 12:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, we.
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: Didn't see the team nor the next slide.
• 12:53
  Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, I think you may want to go up
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: a couple of slides.
• 12:59
  Speaker 6: Uh oh no, sorry, I'm having a little bit of
• 13:04
  Speaker 6: technically cut back.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: No worries while you do that. I just want to
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: emphasize twenty five thousand figurines, Okay, no to two thousand
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: and five hundred.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: Is that it?
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: Right? Two hundred figures, two thousand and five hundred figurines, right,
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: it's it's unbelievable. It's it's one of the biggest, if
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: not the biggest found in the America's.
• 13:24
  Speaker 10: Right fings, right, the biggest archaeological cash on the East Coast. Okay,
• 13:30
  Speaker 10: can everybody see that sline?
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, now we can see it.
• 13:32
  Speaker 6: Yes, Okay, sorry about that.
• 13:34
  Speaker 10: So that that was the crew that was that was
• 13:35
  Speaker 10: out there on site to dig this place up. And
• 13:39
  Speaker 10: so they had around thirty people there on site and
• 13:43
  Speaker 10: they found these these petrogloffs and their ute petric gloffs. Wow,
• 13:51
  Speaker 10: there were this is so this is the mount itself
• 13:53
  Speaker 10: when they dug it.
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 13:55
  Speaker 10: This this was a twin earth lodge and there were
• 13:58
  Speaker 10: skeletons found in the mount on the sitting on the
• 14:01
  Speaker 10: side and there was also wooden coffin, so wooden coffins
• 14:06
  Speaker 10: were there and they found skulls human skulls as well,
• 14:12
  Speaker 10: and this is one that was shown to Elizabeth. She
• 14:16
  Speaker 10: did determine that this damage on the skull is post
• 14:19
  Speaker 10: mortem damage. So there's quite a lot of evidence that
• 14:23
  Speaker 10: this skull was damaged and it was taken out of
• 14:27
  Speaker 10: the grave or mound at some point and kicked around
• 14:32
  Speaker 10: her damage and it looks like a bullet hole right
• 14:36
  Speaker 10: on the side of the skull here would be about
• 14:39
  Speaker 10: a forty five caliber to sixty five caliber bullet hole,
• 14:43
  Speaker 10: and it has a cracked fracture on the other side,
• 14:45
  Speaker 10: which would be the exit wound or exit side of
• 14:48
  Speaker 10: the bullet impact. These discolorations of the white colors are
• 14:54
  Speaker 10: evidence of post mortem fractures, so this skull also had
• 15:02
  Speaker 10: impacts on the back of the skull. Elizabeth said though
• 15:06
  Speaker 10: that the skull the person was over forty it was
• 15:11
  Speaker 10: an adult male, and she hypothesized that the cause of
• 15:15
  Speaker 10: death was dental related blood poisoning.
• 15:21
  Speaker 6: In the skull.
• 15:21
  Speaker 10: In this picture here at the lower draw, you can
• 15:23
  Speaker 10: see it was heavily damaged and she said that would
• 15:26
  Speaker 10: have been a.
• 15:26
  Speaker 6: Horrific way to die.
• 15:28
  Speaker 10: But she believes that this person and initially tried of
• 15:31
  Speaker 10: blood poisoning and then these other impacts and things that
• 15:35
  Speaker 10: you're seeing are post mortem impacts. And you can see
• 15:39
  Speaker 10: there's even some scuffing and kicking and the browser damaged.
• 15:44
  Speaker 10: These she said are post mortem damages. So that's consistent
• 15:48
  Speaker 10: with the Desto expedition.
• 15:49
  Speaker 6: And when de Soto.
• 15:50
  Speaker 10: Came on site, he said his crew or with his conquistors,
• 15:55
  Speaker 10: took these skulls out of the burial and kicked them
• 15:58
  Speaker 10: around and shot them and did horrible things to them.
• 16:02
  Speaker 6: I mean, he was very disrespectful.
• 16:05
  Speaker 10: And but that might be part of the reason this
• 16:08
  Speaker 10: site has been kept secret for so long is that
• 16:12
  Speaker 10: it was you know, it was part of the DeSoto
• 16:15
  Speaker 10: conquistadors that lived there. And the timeframe of the site
• 16:21
  Speaker 10: is complex. It has things like masdons like you see
• 16:26
  Speaker 10: here Masdon figurines, and there were four of these found
• 16:32
  Speaker 10: in this cash of twenty five hundred figurines. There were
• 16:37
  Speaker 10: also things like bannerstones. Of bannerstones are archaic type of
• 16:42
  Speaker 10: artifacts from around four thousand BC, so we're talking six
• 16:47
  Speaker 10: thousand years ago when these these would have been made.
• 16:52
  Speaker 10: And the figurines also included. It looks like pipe group
• 16:59
  Speaker 10: smoking the water pipe and in a circular cross hatched pattern,
• 17:07
  Speaker 10: and on one and the other side is that bifurcated
• 17:09
  Speaker 10: semi circle and the figurines are shaking hands or having
• 17:15
  Speaker 10: advocations of peace. And this next one shows some of
• 17:27
  Speaker 10: them were apparently male and female figurines and inside of
• 17:31
  Speaker 10: a bear. I mean this is on one side it
• 17:33
  Speaker 10: shows these two holding hands and then in the bear.
• 17:38
  Speaker 6: The other side is.
• 17:39
  Speaker 10: A fully sculptured bear carving. And the majority of these
• 17:44
  Speaker 10: figurines were well they're all different, but they had this
• 17:47
  Speaker 10: cross hatching or nested chevrons, and some people say that's
• 17:51
  Speaker 10: the symbol for the bear or a ancestral pattern.
• 17:58
  Speaker 6: It's a common art motif that was used. And you
• 18:02
  Speaker 6: see a lot of.
• 18:03
  Speaker 10: Them show like humans being eaten by bears, and the
• 18:06
  Speaker 10: bear was one of the clans as we know, the
• 18:09
  Speaker 10: bear clean wasn't important and he should not big clean.
• 18:14
  Speaker 10: There were others like this that showed the puma or
• 18:16
  Speaker 10: cat and people holding pottery on their heads, like thus
• 18:21
  Speaker 10: carrying pottery like a water bowl. This one looks like
• 18:26
  Speaker 10: a lizard holding a staff, almost a Kimona dragon lizard
• 18:31
  Speaker 10: and these the lizard effigy was I mean, the lizard
• 18:34
  Speaker 10: was its totem.
• 18:35
  Speaker 8: The you that looks like the moon eyed people?
• 18:40
  Speaker 6: Man, do you know who that is? Yeah, that's right,
• 18:43
  Speaker 6: the mooneyed people.
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 18:45
  Speaker 8: The one in the middle looks like the mooneyed people,
• 18:49
  Speaker 8: like almost identical.
• 18:51
  Speaker 7: Who said the same as the ant people.
• 18:54
  Speaker 9: That's from the Cherokee legends.
• 18:57
  Speaker 10: Right, The Cherokee legends talk about the moon eyed people
• 19:01
  Speaker 10: in great detail, and a lot of these you'll see
• 19:04
  Speaker 10: that type of face MOONEI This depiction and legends are
• 19:12
  Speaker 10: very prolific about the moon eyed people in the Jerokeees
• 19:17
  Speaker 10: and in this area. And then there's also things like
• 19:20
  Speaker 10: these cross hatched vessels and teacups.
• 19:25
  Speaker 6: There were hundreds of these.
• 19:29
  Speaker 10: I mean, they're just so prolific, and they're all very
• 19:33
  Speaker 10: finely crafted. Every one of these figurines has charcoal or
• 19:38
  Speaker 10: smell of smoke on the surface of it, like it
• 19:40
  Speaker 10: had been in a fire. And well, like I mentioned this, Zithsonian,
• 19:46
  Speaker 10: as soon as they heard about the site, they sent
• 19:50
  Speaker 10: they sent this god down to debunk the site, and
• 19:53
  Speaker 10: they called these bogus in this article from eighteen ninety
• 19:59
  Speaker 10: to clar these are bogus articles and it and it's
• 20:03
  Speaker 10: a bird figuring. And there were others like pipe with
• 20:07
  Speaker 10: the hands cut off and the arms cut off, pipe figurings,
• 20:10
  Speaker 10: and they just declared them all hoaxes or bogus. And
• 20:15
  Speaker 10: this is one of the things that it's like, well,
• 20:17
  Speaker 10: why would someone fake that or make a bogus pipe
• 20:20
  Speaker 10: and a bogus bird. Well it turns out that they're
• 20:23
  Speaker 10: not bogus, and these have been authenticated. Now we've we've
• 20:28
  Speaker 10: used thermal iluminescence and authenticated these the pottery bowls and
• 20:35
  Speaker 10: the figurines where we had two positively authenticated as pottery,
• 20:41
  Speaker 10: and originally they were thought to have all been made
• 20:44
  Speaker 10: of stone, so thermo iluminescence would not have been a
• 20:47
  Speaker 10: viable option, but the pottery once in particular, we selected.
• 20:52
  Speaker 6: Yes.
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: Can I ask for a minute, do you know who
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: the scientists were involved in declaring those bogus?
• 21:01
  Speaker 10: Yes, it was Charles Raw and James Emmertentually. Charles Row
• 21:09
  Speaker 10: in eighteen eighty three wrote an article he said these
• 21:13
  Speaker 10: are fakes because there's nothing else like it, and he
• 21:16
  Speaker 10: said they're either carved by someone who was early historic period,
• 21:26
  Speaker 10: or or that they had been fakes, but he didn't
• 21:34
  Speaker 10: know who carved them and didn't study them. He just
• 21:37
  Speaker 10: kind of put them in the drawer and they were
• 21:40
  Speaker 10: not researched at all since then.
• 21:43
  Speaker 11: And it would interesting to see if somebody could foia
• 21:49
  Speaker 11: something with their names on it back then, to see
• 21:52
  Speaker 11: if there are any internal memos.
• 21:54
  Speaker 6: Oh, yeah, I done that. I have done that. I
• 21:59
  Speaker 6: have all their internal correspondence and everything.
• 22:02
  Speaker 10: And in fact, what they did was they sent James
• 22:07
  Speaker 10: Emmer to the site to debunk these, and he paid
• 22:12
  Speaker 10: somebody to fabricate new ones. He paid them about thirty
• 22:17
  Speaker 10: dollars dollars at the time, which is a lot, but he.
• 22:22
  Speaker 6: Said he paid them. And then.
• 22:26
  Speaker 10: And then they took these back to the Smithsonian and said, well,
• 22:29
  Speaker 10: there now we know we can pay someone to make them,
• 22:31
  Speaker 10: so therefore all the other ones are fake too, And.
• 22:35
  Speaker 6: It just was not studied after that.
• 22:39
  Speaker 10: And well now we know that they're not fake because
• 22:42
  Speaker 10: they've been authenticated. And he when he said that they
• 22:45
  Speaker 10: were stone, well it turned out that there's some made
• 22:48
  Speaker 10: of pottery as well, and there's a lot of different
• 22:52
  Speaker 10: stones that the others are made of. There's sandstone, some
• 22:56
  Speaker 10: are made of well stea type and Micah schist, and
• 23:02
  Speaker 10: there's some that look like greenstone. Even there's granite. So
• 23:08
  Speaker 10: they're made up a lot of different materials from a
• 23:10
  Speaker 10: lot of different areas, and the pottery ones in particular.
• 23:13
  Speaker 10: Now we know that they've been authenticated by Oxford Authentication.
• 23:17
  Speaker 10: We did the study this year and two of them
• 23:20
  Speaker 10: came back positive and it said that they were dated
• 23:24
  Speaker 10: to less than one hundred years ago in fire, in
• 23:27
  Speaker 10: being burnt in a fire, so there's evidence that.
• 23:31
  Speaker 6: This is a post production fire.
• 23:32
  Speaker 10: And when they were excavated, it looked like they had
• 23:35
  Speaker 10: all been in a building that burnt down and they
• 23:39
  Speaker 10: found out that see this is a quote when they
• 23:44
  Speaker 10: found them. They said, many of these have been burned,
• 23:46
  Speaker 10: and we should like to know if they were in
• 23:48
  Speaker 10: a particular area that the place that had the burning.
• 23:53
  Speaker 10: Of the objects that were found, we know that sometime
• 23:56
  Speaker 10: there was a general burning and even the best things
• 24:00
  Speaker 10: were there were put together for some reason fire applied.
• 24:03
  Speaker 10: So this is a quote from eighteen eighty and August twentieth.
• 24:08
  Speaker 10: Ben Valentine found these and he said, I cannot I
• 24:12
  Speaker 10: can I help thinking that this was the case with
• 24:15
  Speaker 10: all the first images, and whether that some of them
• 24:18
  Speaker 10: have been in soapstone or otherwise. The yellow and black
• 24:22
  Speaker 10: earth that they had been made from came from the
• 24:26
  Speaker 10: wall around the building, and he said that he didn't
• 24:31
  Speaker 10: see any sign of a hearth there and that the
• 24:34
  Speaker 10: stones were just laid there and burned. So this was
• 24:38
  Speaker 10: this was a building and it was burnt down. And
• 24:40
  Speaker 10: we know now De Soto burnt the building down in
• 24:43
  Speaker 10: fifteen forty, and so there's good evidence that these had
• 24:47
  Speaker 10: actually been burnt down at that time in fifteen forty.
• 24:51
  Speaker 6: And the thermal luminescence is something that has.
• 24:57
  Speaker 10: A limited accuracy, I gets to those small timeframes. So
• 25:02
  Speaker 10: this fire being a post production fire in fifteen forty
• 25:06
  Speaker 10: just proves that they're authentic and that they were they
• 25:10
  Speaker 10: were burnt after they had been put there in the mound.
• 25:15
  Speaker 10: And also subsequently the mound was carbon dated and the
• 25:20
  Speaker 10: carbon from the fire was determined to be from four
• 25:23
  Speaker 10: hundred and thirty years ago during the DeSoto expedition, would
• 25:28
  Speaker 10: have been the time front frame that the fire was
• 25:31
  Speaker 10: the carbon was found to be from.
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure if you said vincent, but when they
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: said one hundred years, then you have another email, a
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: lot of communication saying that the one hundred years could
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: also be one thousand years.
• 25:44
  Speaker 6: Right, that's right.
• 25:45
  Speaker 10: The Virginia conservators said, well, one hundred years on thermal luminescence,
• 25:49
  Speaker 10: it could be to the nearest thousand years because when
• 25:52
  Speaker 10: it's it's looking at the nearest thousand years to determine
• 25:57
  Speaker 10: the date on thermal luminescence. According to the Virginia Conserve,
• 26:00
  Speaker 10: so's a good chance that it's not saying that these
• 26:03
  Speaker 10: were fired after they were found, but that that just
• 26:07
  Speaker 10: confirms that it was fired within the last thousand years.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: And they focus only on the one hundred years.
• 26:14
  Speaker 7: I see.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: That's the funny part. They have this toto, but they
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: just focus on one hundred years because it's it's false.
• 26:19
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 26:21
  Speaker 10: The story behind that was interesting too, and we we
• 26:24
  Speaker 10: had waited over two months for getting these results back
• 26:29
  Speaker 10: they and we paid for the results within three to
• 26:32
  Speaker 10: four weeks, so they didn't provide the results. They kicked
• 26:35
  Speaker 10: it around and they wouldn't communicate with us, and then
• 26:39
  Speaker 10: finally they sent us this report on only two of
• 26:42
  Speaker 10: the ten figurines that we had paid for, saying that
• 26:46
  Speaker 10: they were less than one hundred years old. On the
• 26:49
  Speaker 10: therm alumin essence. And then so after asking questions, they
• 26:53
  Speaker 10: they said, we'll give you a refund, and it could
• 26:57
  Speaker 10: be one thousand years old. It's the same as saying
• 26:59
  Speaker 10: it's less one hundred. And then after that they said
• 27:02
  Speaker 10: no more testing will be provided or permitted, and so
• 27:06
  Speaker 10: they wouldn't allow any further testing. Then subsequently to that,
• 27:09
  Speaker 10: we found out that in fact, some of these figurines
• 27:12
  Speaker 10: are in the Smithsonian as well. So this site has
• 27:15
  Speaker 10: been split up between the Smithsonian, the Valentine Museum, and
• 27:20
  Speaker 10: the University of North Carolina. The ones of the Smithsonian
• 27:23
  Speaker 10: you see here on the screen, they didn't even admit
• 27:26
  Speaker 10: that they had them in their collection. After I asked
• 27:29
  Speaker 10: them literally a dozen times, where are these artifacts? I
• 27:34
  Speaker 10: want to research them, they wouldn't admit they're in their collection.
• 27:38
  Speaker 10: And then finally they did, about a month ago, admit
• 27:41
  Speaker 10: that these are in their collection. And they are figurines
• 27:44
  Speaker 10: that are like some of the best of the examples
• 27:47
  Speaker 10: of the cash from Mount Pishka, Like this is the
• 27:52
  Speaker 10: biggest great Bear cash figuring in existence, and so it
• 27:57
  Speaker 10: has its cross hatching lines on it, and it's like
• 28:03
  Speaker 10: holding it's touching this cross hatched object. And at first
• 28:07
  Speaker 10: I thought it could be a altered but it's possible
• 28:10
  Speaker 10: that that what they're doing is depicting a drum, like
• 28:13
  Speaker 10: a bear playing a drum, and the the cross hatching
• 28:20
  Speaker 10: is shown that it's a sacred symbol, like a spirit.
• 28:24
  Speaker 6: Mute spirit bete.
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: And and there's also the interesting fact that you found
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: out that there was communication before they replied to you,
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: to an individual and the Simsonian, right, that they tried
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: to suppress all of that information.
• 28:42
  Speaker 6: Yes, that's right.
• 28:43
  Speaker 10: The Valentine Museum, which had allowed us to do this testing, said, well,
• 28:48
  Speaker 10: we spoke to a scientist who told us to say
• 28:53
  Speaker 10: no further testing would be allowed, and that they've all
• 28:58
  Speaker 10: been and they said even material testing would not be
• 29:01
  Speaker 10: permitted because they've all been scientifically.
• 29:05
  Speaker 6: Reviewed by the scientists. And basically they said, no, we
• 29:08
  Speaker 6: can't do any more testing. We're not going to allow
• 29:09
  Speaker 6: you to do anything else.
• 29:12
  Speaker 10: And after that there's no more communication was received from them.
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because there was only two three hundred and ninety
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: pieces to be tested, so.
• 29:25
  Speaker 10: Right, and all these these figurines at the Smithsonian, they
• 29:27
  Speaker 10: woul they didn't know, they wouldn't let us see and
• 29:30
  Speaker 10: like this one in particular, see it's shown, he wrote
• 29:33
  Speaker 10: Emmertt wrote his name on it, and that was the
• 29:35
  Speaker 10: archaeologist at the time, and Ben Valentine in eighteen eighty wrote,
• 29:41
  Speaker 10: I hope that you will continue to save the objects
• 29:44
  Speaker 10: that have markings on them. So it looks like said
• 29:46
  Speaker 10: these people had had kept their accounts on the stones
• 29:49
  Speaker 10: with their crossmarks and other figures. As they say, Indians
• 29:55
  Speaker 10: cut notches on the trees to be a guide for
• 29:58
  Speaker 10: the objects and tell them the news left for their
• 30:01
  Speaker 10: by for the tribe, by their runners. So some of these,
• 30:05
  Speaker 10: like this one have what looks like written language on it,
• 30:10
  Speaker 10: and in comparison with the Cherokee script, well, this one
• 30:14
  Speaker 10: actually translates and these letters are Cherokee script, and it's
• 30:21
  Speaker 10: the word for the immortals per Chames Mooney book. And
• 30:26
  Speaker 10: these these words are me nev. The letters are actually
• 30:32
  Speaker 10: Cherokee on these and they translate to the immortals per
• 30:35
  Speaker 10: Chames Mooney book or someone those who do not die
• 30:39
  Speaker 10: and those who live forever.
• 30:41
  Speaker 4: So fitz it do you keep track of how many
• 30:44
  Speaker 4: different narratives this cash completely destroys.
• 30:50
  Speaker 10: I mean, this would destroy, this would rewrite the entire
• 30:53
  Speaker 10: history of the country, because it proves that there is
• 30:59
  Speaker 10: at least crossings. There's sub Saharan African animals in this cash,
• 31:05
  Speaker 10: there's time periods represented from the Ice Age in this cash.
• 31:10
  Speaker 10: I mean it's literally it's proof of Chinese voyages as well.
• 31:15
  Speaker 10: It's a ancestor shrine, accumulating thousands of years of figurines
• 31:21
  Speaker 10: into a single location. And it shows, like we looked
• 31:27
  Speaker 10: at the Bannerstones, I mean, this goes back into the
• 31:29
  Speaker 10: Archaic and even though the Masadons into the Ice Age
• 31:33
  Speaker 10: all the way up to Cherokee script in the eighteen hundreds,
• 31:37
  Speaker 10: and people say that Cherokees didn't learn script until.
• 31:40
  Speaker 6: Eighteen thirty and that it was invented.
• 31:42
  Speaker 10: Then well this was excavated and it has Cherokee script
• 31:46
  Speaker 10: on it, so it proves that in fact they were
• 31:49
  Speaker 10: writing this. And if it was from fifteen forties, then
• 31:52
  Speaker 10: that proves that the Cherokees had written language in fifteen forty.
• 31:56
  Speaker 10: So yeah, it destroys the whole narrative that they've been
• 31:59
  Speaker 10: telling us that it means had no written language, that
• 32:01
  Speaker 10: they had no intercontinental travel, that there's no African commerce
• 32:09
  Speaker 10: going on in between the natives in Africa or even China.
• 32:13
  Speaker 10: I mean this, this cash would destroy and rewrite the
• 32:17
  Speaker 10: entire history of this country.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: And you have the bannerstone that and that bannerstone has
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: a mark and if you follow the angle that was
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: represented in the image, it shows a precise alignment, right Vinton.
• 32:31
  Speaker 6: That's right.
• 32:32
  Speaker 10: The bannerstone that I showed earlier, it has the angle
• 32:36
  Speaker 10: for the minimum lunar declination at midwinter, and it's a
• 32:42
  Speaker 10: it's called the lunar standstill. So this angle was incized
• 32:46
  Speaker 10: on it and inscribed on the bannerstone, and it's this.
• 32:50
  Speaker 6: It's a.
• 32:53
  Speaker 10: It's an angle of the moon when it gets to
• 32:56
  Speaker 10: the minimum lunar declination at midwinter, so it's called the
• 33:00
  Speaker 10: lunar standstill archaeo astronomy. In archaeo astronomy, that's an important angle.
• 33:06
  Speaker 10: And it shows that they use this moon shaped stone
• 33:10
  Speaker 10: to record the history and the angle of the moon
• 33:14
  Speaker 10: at different times of the year. And this is something
• 33:17
  Speaker 10: that would have taken eighteen years to determine that angle
• 33:20
  Speaker 10: because it only happens once every eighteen years when the
• 33:23
  Speaker 10: moon reaches the minimum lunar declination that midwinter.
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: To dead alone.
• 33:29
  Speaker 4: As representatives of culture, so right, the eighteen years is
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: so important that's the full lunar cycle. That's the that's
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: the whole time it takes to go through all of
• 33:38
  Speaker 4: its motions in the sky and come back to the
• 33:40
  Speaker 4: same point over again.
• 33:42
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: And for those that don't know, dis vanderstones would be
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: placed on a pool, so it has a hole in
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: the middle of white fist right.
• 33:50
  Speaker 6: Has a hole in the middle, and it's.
• 33:53
  Speaker 10: It would either be placed on a pole and these
• 33:56
  Speaker 10: are actually shown on the.
• 34:00
  Speaker 6: The Welsh Butterfly.
• 34:01
  Speaker 10: They showed how they were used on a staff and
• 34:04
  Speaker 10: they would look at the angle and determine the time
• 34:07
  Speaker 10: of year, and the angle of the moon was important
• 34:12
  Speaker 10: and so they actually incised it with this angle.
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: My whole point is this is not primitive people. That's
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: being told that. That's that's right, right, absolutely, these are
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: that's the oldest artifact of the of the sash, right.
• 34:27
  Speaker 10: Well, it's it's the are archaic. It's an archaic timeframe.
• 34:31
  Speaker 10: I mean if the if the elephants are ice age,
• 34:34
  Speaker 10: then they might be older or the Masdons, I mean
• 34:38
  Speaker 10: those those figurines that look like masdons or elephants, they
• 34:41
  Speaker 10: could be older, but it's hard to say. And archaic
• 34:45
  Speaker 10: bannerstones are you know, a known artifact from the archaic
• 34:49
  Speaker 10: So that's one of one of the oldest ones for sure.
• 34:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: What I mean is for them, as they believe, so
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: that as they classify the side to them, the bannerstone
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: would be the oldest because the other ones are all fakes, right, So,
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: but they are also neglecting the bannerstone in itself when
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: it's we know it's a highly representative artifact of indicative
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: of culture and long years of learning.
• 35:14
  Speaker 10: Right, it's a culture, and it would have had to
• 35:18
  Speaker 10: have like an indigenous education to be able to know that.
• 35:23
  Speaker 6: Like, I have a theory, take a record of it.
• 35:28
  Speaker 4: I have a theory. What if this site was actually
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: sort of like a Native American museum, pre Columbia style.
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: So it's got all of these different influences from around
• 35:39
  Speaker 4: the world that show the importance of each one of
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: these symbols.
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: I was going to say, I've seen a lot of
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: like reoccurring symbols that I've seen in all these other
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: ancient cultures and civilizations, even some that are like kind
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: of remote.
• 35:53
  Speaker 7: So and that's a common theme that you see.
• 35:57
  Speaker 10: Yeah, man, yeah, absolutely, like the music and having their
• 36:01
  Speaker 10: own museum, I mean it's a great comparison there. And
• 36:06
  Speaker 10: in fact we have journals from De Soto, and we
• 36:09
  Speaker 10: have the journal from the fourteen thirties of the Chinese
• 36:14
  Speaker 10: visiting the site and they saw it, and so they
• 36:17
  Speaker 10: described these things that they saw, and the way they
• 36:20
  Speaker 10: described it was it was an ancestor shrine. And each
• 36:23
  Speaker 10: of these figurines were like self portraits of the chiefs.
• 36:28
  Speaker 10: Literally they represented how the chiefs were named. And so
• 36:34
  Speaker 10: each one having this clean symbol would be the carving
• 36:38
  Speaker 10: of the bear, or the carving of the links, whatever
• 36:43
  Speaker 10: their claim was, they carved that and it represented them
• 36:46
  Speaker 10: as a person. And there were three shelves full of
• 36:53
  Speaker 10: these that were reported in the DeSoto chronicles, three shelves
• 36:57
  Speaker 10: around the walls of the room.
• 37:00
  Speaker 7: Then these are names of the kings. Yeah, these are
• 37:03
  Speaker 7: the kind of like a king's list in some way.
• 37:06
  Speaker 6: Yes, like an ancient kings list.
• 37:08
  Speaker 7: That's cool, man.
• 37:09
  Speaker 6: And it was.
• 37:14
  Speaker 10: The Sodo chronicles talked about these in great detail. And
• 37:17
  Speaker 10: this would have been like the Soto's target. I mean,
• 37:19
  Speaker 10: he was going after there.
• 37:22
  Speaker 4: I was just gonna ask that that was a target.
• 37:26
  Speaker 6: Right, it was.
• 37:27
  Speaker 10: It was the first target de Soto went after. And
• 37:29
  Speaker 10: I mean he destroyed it. He burnt the place down.
• 37:32
  Speaker 10: And this these these figurines were like their royal lineage
• 37:38
  Speaker 10: and their royal selfsure or clan. They called it an
• 37:43
  Speaker 10: ancestors shrine. And he burnt the place down. Literally he
• 37:47
  Speaker 10: talks about it in his journal. He shot the walls
• 37:50
  Speaker 10: of this building and the skulls with his gun and
• 37:53
  Speaker 10: burnt the place down and left it there in ashes
• 37:56
  Speaker 10: and cinders. And it's clearly documented, and as the Soto chronicles.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: It wasn't the first time, right instant, because apparently this
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: site has been many times destroyed and rebuilt over, which
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: is also interesting, right And.
• 38:12
  Speaker 10: Some of the carbon dates found were from two thousand
• 38:16
  Speaker 10: BC and two five hundred years ago, so it looks
• 38:21
  Speaker 10: like this had been burnt down many times, and the
• 38:24
  Speaker 10: radiocarbon dates show the same type of thing that this
• 38:28
  Speaker 10: was thoroughly mixed. There were many layers of civilization. They
• 38:34
  Speaker 10: built buildings on top of buildings.
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: We have to think, why was this place constantly rebuilt
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: and constantly destroyed every time something new come into the scene.
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: So it was a hub of power or a symbol
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: of power or a symbol of culture that had to
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: be destroyed over and over again for someone to come
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: and try and research that to their own purpose.
• 39:01
  Speaker 10: Right like you show, it's near the lay lines to
• 39:03
  Speaker 10: Mount Pishka. It's also this This shows what the excavations
• 39:10
  Speaker 10: look like. And there were eight buildings built on top
• 39:13
  Speaker 10: of each other. Each one has a separate building structure
• 39:17
  Speaker 10: or footprint. So every time they built a building, they
• 39:20
  Speaker 10: and it was burnt, and then they built another one
• 39:23
  Speaker 10: at the same spot. And the place was thoroughly mixed,
• 39:26
  Speaker 10: so some of the layers on top were older than
• 39:29
  Speaker 10: the layers on the bottom. They they must have, you know,
• 39:34
  Speaker 10: reused earth that was earlier and put it on the bottom,
• 39:38
  Speaker 10: and then reused the old earth on top and just
• 39:40
  Speaker 10: continuously reworked this place. And so the twenty fire figurines
• 39:51
  Speaker 10: have you know, they've been split between the Valentine Museum,
• 39:56
  Speaker 10: the Smithsonian and North and the University of North Carolina,
• 40:00
  Speaker 10: and the ones at the University of North Carolina were
• 40:02
  Speaker 10: claimed by NAG proclaim In nineteen ninety nine. NAG proclaimed
• 40:07
  Speaker 10: them and got seven hundred of these figurines and burial
• 40:11
  Speaker 10: remains and the others at the at the Valentine Museum.
• 40:16
  Speaker 10: It's in Richmond, Virginia. Well, they had these on display
• 40:19
  Speaker 10: at the Valentine Museum up til two thousand and nine
• 40:22
  Speaker 10: and then they took them off display and now they're
• 40:24
  Speaker 10: all in a storage locker, so they haven't been on display.
• 40:29
  Speaker 8: And I just want, I just want to verify you
• 40:30
  Speaker 8: use the word NAGPRA, right.
• 40:33
  Speaker 10: Yes, Okay, NAGPRA did it, literally did a claim for
• 40:38
  Speaker 10: these artifacts and they claimed all the ones from the
• 40:42
  Speaker 10: site that were at the University of North Carolina.
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: Are those any different from the others that we have seen?
• 40:52
  Speaker 10: They're the same. I mean they're each one is from
• 40:57
  Speaker 10: the site, and they're figurines, sculptural figurines. And I have
• 41:01
  Speaker 10: some three D images I can show to kind of
• 41:04
  Speaker 10: give an idea of what they look like.
• 41:06
  Speaker 8: Yeah, bring those up because maybe some people that don't
• 41:09
  Speaker 8: know what NAGPRA is. So NAGPRA is Native American Grace
• 41:12
  Speaker 8: Protection and Repatriation Act, which basically is just, uh, it's
• 41:18
  Speaker 8: just a.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: Way for bureaucracy from hiding history.
• 41:25
  Speaker 10: Right, Yeah, that's right, I mean, it's it's a NAGPRA.
• 41:31
  Speaker 10: I mean, it's like you said, Native American Grave Protection
• 41:34
  Speaker 10: and Repatriation Act. They would they were formed to try
• 41:38
  Speaker 10: to stop people from excavating sites and protect the history.
• 41:42
  Speaker 10: But this site was thug up way back in eighteen
• 41:47
  Speaker 10: seventy ninete, eighteen eighty. So the ones that we were
• 41:53
  Speaker 10: taken and claimed the Eastern Band of Cherokee, the Eastern
• 41:59
  Speaker 10: bandit Cherokee claim that these were part of their ancestry.
• 42:03
  Speaker 6: But we know.
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: That they shown or not? Can we say that?
• 42:09
  Speaker 10: I mean they're not shown by them anymore, and I
• 42:14
  Speaker 10: mean by those that claim them.
• 42:20
  Speaker 6: No, as far as I know, they're not displayed or shown. Okay.
• 42:25
  Speaker 10: Can you see that that's the bannerstone and it has
• 42:28
  Speaker 10: this hole in the middle of it. Yeah, and this
• 42:31
  Speaker 10: is that line I'm telling you about, the line that
• 42:34
  Speaker 10: that's engraved at the angle of the minimum lunar declination
• 42:38
  Speaker 10: at midwinter, and so it even has you swhere on it.
• 42:46
  Speaker 10: So this is, you know, a truly great example of
• 42:50
  Speaker 10: a bannerstone. The this would this would be something they
• 42:56
  Speaker 10: couldn't fake. I mean, there's no way to fake something
• 42:58
  Speaker 10: like that. And so I have three D images of
• 43:05
  Speaker 10: these the show that you can look at it from
• 43:07
  Speaker 10: all sides.
• 43:09
  Speaker 6: That's crazy.
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: And for those who don't know, I didn't know either.
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: There are a lot of funner songs, yes, but because
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: it's a representation of high culture, they hide them because
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: it shows that the indigenous people have knowledge of astronomy
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: of and therefore they're just.
• 43:33
  Speaker 4: Because it's got to be something much deeper, because we're
• 43:37
  Speaker 4: looking at an ominous continuity that goes back into pre
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: Columbian history with trying to destroy this place and remake
• 43:44
  Speaker 4: something over it over and over again past Colombian history
• 43:48
  Speaker 4: back to fifteen hundreds, and then from the fifteen hundreds,
• 43:51
  Speaker 4: it's basically the same regime all the way up into Nagpra.
• 43:55
  Speaker 4: There is something very strange about this place, and it's
• 43:58
  Speaker 4: it goes back far in the history to not be noticed, you.
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: Know, well I can. I can tell you that the
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: points of this side to me is that it's a
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: very old site, much older than Pisoto. It has many
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: times been destroyed, most of it by fire. Curiously, it
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: has a conglomerate of cultures. It has peace representations in
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: periods as are documented as periods of war. So they
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: also don't understand that part. And the last two, the
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: last point that I have here, it can make later
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: because if if Nick, if you remember the researcher we
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: had about the gang. Do you remember that it showed
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: it showed the Yeah, it showed an image petroglyph on
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: a rock that looks like a ghost. And I've been
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: looking for for where I've seen that, and I've seen
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: that in Vincent Slide Show because that that image that
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: that Vincent showed us for those that saw that episode
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: is exactly the same as the one he showed in Asia.
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: That that representation on the rock, right, cool, I'm not
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: sure if you remember that.
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it looked like almost like a well it goes
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: in almost alien like.
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's it's what we find here on on
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: on Vincent's slide show. And I looked for it and
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: I couldn't remember what I've seen it and if it
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: has been on Vincent Slide Show.
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Danny Hullman did show that that that was
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: kind of weird. Yeah, Oh, Vincent, did you have something
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: else you wanted to pull up?
• 45:37
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm trying to pull up this. Yeah, the slide
• 45:40
  Speaker 6: show called Dodomegan.
• 45:41
  Speaker 10: Dodomegan is well, these are the ancestors, uh, figurines of
• 45:47
  Speaker 10: the Innam And it turns out there's there's a strong
• 45:51
  Speaker 10: correlation or a one to one correlation that these figurines
• 45:55
  Speaker 10: from the site are clean symbols. And so I went
• 46:01
  Speaker 10: through and compared it with the clan symbols. So there's
• 46:05
  Speaker 10: bear figurines, birds, wolves, BiCon, turtle, aquatic animals like fish, alligators,
• 46:13
  Speaker 10: there's squirrels, lynx and jaguars, spider daddy long legs. That's
• 46:18
  Speaker 10: even a clean symbol, and it's a figuring. There's snake figurines.
• 46:22
  Speaker 10: These others are like white rhino, kapi bara. There's alligator,
• 46:27
  Speaker 10: monkey or eight figurines. There's camel. These are the kind
• 46:32
  Speaker 10: of things that made me think they had to have
• 46:34
  Speaker 10: gotten these camel figurines from Asia Africa, where camels live.
• 46:40
  Speaker 10: I mean, I don't know when they last lived in
• 46:42
  Speaker 10: North Carolina, but things like the thunder.
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: Since the Ice Ah, they are supposedly extinct since the
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: younger dryat there were there were several species of camels
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: in North America.
• 46:54
  Speaker 12: But.
• 46:57
  Speaker 4: They they had all sorts of stuff in North America
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: way before that ice age. So this this could go
• 47:03
  Speaker 4: back a long time.
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, either it goes back from other cultures and things.
• 47:10
  Speaker 10: So I'm gonna show pictures of these that correlate with
• 47:13
  Speaker 10: the totems like the elk Okay. Well, the first is
• 47:16
  Speaker 10: the they have.
• 47:18
  Speaker 6: Elk or caribou.
• 47:20
  Speaker 10: And these are all just incredibly made figurings. They're tabular
• 47:24
  Speaker 10: like tablets, and they have this cross hash engravings on
• 47:27
  Speaker 10: all sides of them. And this one here like a
• 47:33
  Speaker 10: stag or deer, and there's the mole, there's mole figurines,
• 47:39
  Speaker 10: and there's different things like they are hard to identify
• 47:43
  Speaker 10: whether it's a buffalo or a bison. These look a
• 47:46
  Speaker 10: lot like bison figure buffalo figurines. They often have this
• 47:53
  Speaker 10: zigzag pattern on the side and carefully cross ashed. And
• 47:57
  Speaker 10: you can see these were in a fire. I mean
• 47:59
  Speaker 10: the surfaces are covered with soot from a fire. They
• 48:02
  Speaker 10: had all been burned heavily.
• 48:05
  Speaker 5: Interesting.
• 48:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I noticed that one that was a serpent looked
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: very similar to the Babylonian dragon that you see pictured
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: with mar Duke. And so do you know if these
• 48:19
  Speaker 3: if mute and myself, whoever these people were, if they
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: had some kind of system, like some kind of religious
• 48:30
  Speaker 3: system or I don't know, some form of God that
• 48:35
  Speaker 3: they worshiped that they tried to portray in their art.
• 48:42
  Speaker 10: Yeah, and I mean I think animism was what we're
• 48:45
  Speaker 10: seeing here, like when they represent themselves.
• 48:48
  Speaker 6: As that animal, and that was their spirit animal.
• 48:52
  Speaker 10: And so by carving this animal, they were carving themselves
• 48:58
  Speaker 10: and they were saying, like, I am and that is me,
• 49:01
  Speaker 10: and they are identifying that as their name.
• 49:04
  Speaker 6: And this is.
• 49:08
  Speaker 10: The custom that the Anesian nave did. Even like patrick
• 49:11
  Speaker 10: a picture or pictographic symbols from birch bark scrolls. The
• 49:16
  Speaker 10: Martin was one that they had depicted here in three D,
• 49:21
  Speaker 10: and things like the porcupine. Well, the porcupine is very
• 49:28
  Speaker 10: clearly depicted here and it's one of the best examples.
• 49:33
  Speaker 10: It shows the spikes of the porcupine in the back
• 49:36
  Speaker 10: and even these horizontal lines. Well the Chinese made similar
• 49:40
  Speaker 10: things like that in six hundred AD. So they had
• 49:44
  Speaker 10: porcupine figurines at the Smithsonian that looked almost identical to this,
• 49:49
  Speaker 10: and they were dated six hundred eight.
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: And you had that drhinosrous look like figuring just a
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: few slides.
• 49:56
  Speaker 6: Yeah, they're rightinnoceros.
• 49:59
  Speaker 10: So this one it looks as a cool rhino. It's
• 50:04
  Speaker 10: got a single horn on the front of its face,
• 50:06
  Speaker 10: just like a rhino. It was identified as a rhino
• 50:09
  Speaker 10: when they first found.
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: It because and then I discussed this with Vincent because
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: either they actually saw these animals, they were from the
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: area where this was made, or someone came from somewhere
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: and described to the person doing these figurines how it
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: looks like. So that's why it's not exactly as it is,
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: because it's someone describing what is what the animal looks
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: like on his land or what he saw when he
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: went to that land, and someone else is making the figurine.
• 50:44
  Speaker 10: Right like they were hearing it like a telephone line,
• 50:48
  Speaker 10: you know, they exactly there was something that they had
• 50:51
  Speaker 10: a visual image of, but they heard it from somebody else,
• 50:54
  Speaker 10: so they they may have been saying, well, that was mine.
• 50:56
  Speaker 10: I told him, I want you to carve me this.
• 50:58
  Speaker 10: So they were describing it the best thake of their ability,
• 51:02
  Speaker 10: and things like the rabbit, well, I mean there were
• 51:06
  Speaker 10: the rabbit Claan is a real and you should not
• 51:08
  Speaker 10: be clan and they had rabbit figurines that looked like
• 51:11
  Speaker 10: a stelle. There were other ones like this jack rabbit
• 51:17
  Speaker 10: and the mink figurines. There were foxes and even skunks
• 51:24
  Speaker 10: and skunk is a clan figurine as well. But these
• 51:28
  Speaker 10: are very well carved and created, and the squirrel figurine
• 51:35
  Speaker 10: the squirrel clan correlate. There were fishes, many aquadic animals,
• 51:40
  Speaker 10: and snakes.
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: They carved the mouth of the fish amazing.
• 51:48
  Speaker 10: Yeah, Like there was smiling. It was almost like a
• 51:50
  Speaker 10: human like smile on it. And a lot of them
• 51:53
  Speaker 10: had the human features on the faces of these figurines.
• 51:57
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: I was gonna say, it seems a lot like a
• 52:00
  Speaker 3: lot of these esoteric kind of you know, ancient drawings
• 52:05
  Speaker 3: and ancient thing you know, where you see the animals
• 52:08
  Speaker 3: as the human attributes and all that. These people saw
• 52:12
  Speaker 3: themselves or something about themselves in these animals. So I
• 52:16
  Speaker 3: think there's something spiritual going on there.
• 52:19
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 52:20
  Speaker 4: Well, Jules, if you think about it, shamanism is the
• 52:24
  Speaker 4: high priest of animism, right, this is a shamanistic sight
• 52:29
  Speaker 4: through and through, and that's that's why they've got these
• 52:31
  Speaker 4: human like faces, is they're putting their spirit into these things.
• 52:36
  Speaker 6: Right exactly.
• 52:37
  Speaker 10: Wow, this turtle, I mean, it looks like it's got
• 52:39
  Speaker 10: a human face is smiling on it, and so it's
• 52:42
  Speaker 10: really they were depicting themselves as the smiling turtle.
• 52:47
  Speaker 7: He's a happy guy.
• 52:49
  Speaker 10: Yeah, And so it ties right into the animism and shamanism.
• 52:54
  Speaker 10: Some of these have turtles on one side alligators on
• 52:57
  Speaker 10: the other. They're all different and.
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: You need it's alligator or a gecko.
• 53:03
  Speaker 6: Oh, it could be a gecko.
• 53:04
  Speaker 3: I was gonna say, Yeah, looks more like a little
• 53:07
  Speaker 3: lizard and.
• 53:08
  Speaker 10: The lizard clean was another clean symbol. Some of them
• 53:13
  Speaker 10: are like this. They're stella with human figurines holding up
• 53:17
  Speaker 10: what looks like a snake. And this one is a
• 53:21
  Speaker 10: two bears climbing up an obelisk. It looks like an
• 53:27
  Speaker 10: obelisk in the center. There's other ones of snake figurines
• 53:31
  Speaker 10: and what looks like a fox or some kind of
• 53:34
  Speaker 10: an animal with all these are different.
• 53:40
  Speaker 4: I mean they.
• 53:40
  Speaker 10: Were completely unique each one, but they correlated well with
• 53:46
  Speaker 10: the total.
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: Is that a headdress?
• 53:50
  Speaker 10: Yeah, this one looks like a headdress, like it's wearing
• 53:52
  Speaker 10: mohawk headdress or a.
• 53:53
  Speaker 6: Kind of a feathered headdress.
• 53:58
  Speaker 10: And there's some that have snakes on them on one side,
• 54:02
  Speaker 10: and they'll have a snake serpent. There were actually some
• 54:06
  Speaker 10: that had this criss crossing lines. This was kind of
• 54:08
  Speaker 10: hard to see, but it these having grave lines on
• 54:13
  Speaker 10: all sides. And this one looks almost like a turtle
• 54:16
  Speaker 10: or but it has a tail and you can see
• 54:21
  Speaker 10: how it's cross hatched as well. There were otter figurines.
• 54:25
  Speaker 10: This is one that's about two feet tall. I mean,
• 54:28
  Speaker 10: it's giant sculpture and it's kneeling like these otters are
• 54:34
  Speaker 10: touching cross hatched drum or a altar and kneeling and
• 54:40
  Speaker 10: touching their mouth with one pod and then the other
• 54:42
  Speaker 10: pose touching this.
• 54:46
  Speaker 5: Maybe the sinus silence or something.
• 54:50
  Speaker 10: And the third otter ap peers in between the two
• 54:53
  Speaker 10: the other two. So these are really great works of
• 54:58
  Speaker 10: art as well. I mean they're just incredible to see
• 55:01
  Speaker 10: the detail. And it's even it's hard to show the
• 55:05
  Speaker 10: detail because these are cross hashed all over on all sides,
• 55:08
  Speaker 10: and sometimes the lines are just fairly visible because they've
• 55:12
  Speaker 10: eroded away or been burned from the fire. And here's
• 55:18
  Speaker 10: one that's the Mermaian. Well, the Mermaian is a clean
• 55:20
  Speaker 10: as well. And this this looks like a man putting
• 55:23
  Speaker 10: his arm around his brother. And then this tail here
• 55:26
  Speaker 10: with a fish like tail. Well, the Mermaid is another
• 55:29
  Speaker 10: clean of the Eminave, so that's pretty unusual to see.
• 55:36
  Speaker 6: And this one looks like it has a beaver tail
• 55:39
  Speaker 6: and a fox head on it, an alligator.
• 55:42
  Speaker 7: Body composite creatures.
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they clearly remind me of some paintings done by
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: some actual shamans that are more or less contemporareous. The
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: damages are very, very very similar to these are astral projections.
• 56:02
  Speaker 4: You know, these are images they're getting from the deep unconscious.
• 56:06
  Speaker 7: Maybe you see these when you take ayahuasca or something.
• 56:11
  Speaker 10: Like this one being a crab like it has claws,
• 56:13
  Speaker 10: you know, and in like a craw fisher crab eyeballs,
• 56:17
  Speaker 10: and these dotted lines I mean you say like astral
• 56:22
  Speaker 10: protection projection as well. I mean this dotted type of
• 56:26
  Speaker 10: depiction was on many of these figurines as well. And
• 56:30
  Speaker 10: like the porcupine, well, one of the porcupine quills or
• 56:33
  Speaker 10: porcupine figurines look like this as well. So this could
• 56:39
  Speaker 10: be a symbol of a porcupine quilled embroidery on a cloak,
• 56:46
  Speaker 10: that the clean of the crab is wearing a cloak.
• 56:51
  Speaker 10: It's hard to say, but it's just a It's crab
• 56:54
  Speaker 10: is one of the totems of the emache Namby as well,
• 57:00
  Speaker 10: and the bears were the most common. I mean they
• 57:02
  Speaker 10: had almost one hundred of these bear carvings. Oftentimes there
• 57:07
  Speaker 10: are two bears facing each other, kissing or embracing. And
• 57:14
  Speaker 10: you see there there are so many of them like this.
• 57:19
  Speaker 10: Some of them have been damaged like this one has
• 57:21
  Speaker 10: part of the arm broken off and just damaged figurines,
• 57:27
  Speaker 10: and then some of them. See that this is about
• 57:30
  Speaker 10: a foot tall. I mean it's these two bear figurines,
• 57:35
  Speaker 10: and they even engraved the fur pattern on these.
• 57:42
  Speaker 4: The astrological significance for the bear figurines should be noted
• 57:46
  Speaker 4: as well. You know, this is all about the North Pole,
• 57:48
  Speaker 4: and even in North American Native beliefs, the bear is
• 57:53
  Speaker 4: indicative of North Pole symbolism as well. And you got
• 57:56
  Speaker 4: that crossover between the you know, uh, the pole, the
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: stone that you put on the what was it called
• 58:03
  Speaker 4: the signal stone that you put on top of the
• 58:06
  Speaker 4: pole that's atone there you go. So there's there's kind
• 58:13
  Speaker 4: of an astrological overlap.
• 58:15
  Speaker 6: Yeah. Absolutely.
• 58:17
  Speaker 10: And in this building where they were found, like I mentioned,
• 58:20
  Speaker 10: it was twin earth launches, well, they were aligned north
• 58:24
  Speaker 10: and south precisely with the North compass North, so they
• 58:31
  Speaker 10: they knew about the directions. They built this building in
• 58:35
  Speaker 10: alignment with the North, with the North magnetic north.
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: Aaro magnetic magnetic north right magnetic north, so they had
• 58:44
  Speaker 1: to know magnetism and have a compass.
• 58:48
  Speaker 10: Yes, And this one looks like a bear holding a
• 58:52
  Speaker 10: skull almost like you can see almost the nose is
• 58:56
  Speaker 10: empty from where the skull would be the human head.
• 59:02
  Speaker 10: And some of them were like links. Well, the Lynx
• 59:04
  Speaker 10: was another clean and this looks like a spotted leopard
• 59:07
  Speaker 10: or jaguar, possibly highly decorated.
• 59:10
  Speaker 4: Look at that.
• 59:14
  Speaker 10: And the Linkx clan is an important clean of the
• 59:19
  Speaker 10: ancient Aave as well. And these lines seem to emanate
• 59:23
  Speaker 10: from the heart. And on both of these it has
• 59:27
  Speaker 10: like branching lines from a cat or links figurine, and
• 59:33
  Speaker 10: a lot of the texts and literature about the Lynx
• 59:36
  Speaker 10: clean as they say they're the bloodline of the heart
• 59:40
  Speaker 10: or the Heart clan. Basically this has the lines emanating
• 59:45
  Speaker 10: from the heart to represent that clean symbol. There was
• 59:51
  Speaker 10: a wolf clean as well, wolf figurines, I mean this
• 59:54
  Speaker 10: is one of the original pictures from Valentine's book.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 6: The Wolf and Codeine figurines.
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 10: There's some that looks like crane two cranes facing each
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 10: other and an alligator down below it.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 6: And one interpretation of these lines.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 10: That could be the sound of thunder like booming across
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 10: the the sky.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 6: So I think they are using artistic for.
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 1: The water line. That could also mean the water lion.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 6: Yeah, it could be. And in this like a thunderbird
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 6: or angel. Almost.
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that looks like a depiction of some kind of
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 3: sky god or you know, sky people maybe.
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 7: Yeah, what do you think, Tyrone?
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I mean there's a you know, it's so funny.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 8: I'm actually right now on my Amazon because he was
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 8: he was bringing up some points that I was looking up,
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 8: and so I'm decided to order this this book, the
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 8: Oxford Handbook of American Indian History, and maybe I can
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 8: get some more of my answer.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 9: We could talk about that later. But yeah, they you know,
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 9: the Native.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 8: Americans do talk about sky people a lot, I mean
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 8: all the time. So, you know, I just wanted to
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 8: not I'm just more interested in into knowing because I
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 8: like Oxford so much. I really believe that they they
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 8: try to stay as true to the information as possible.
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 8: They're not they're not biased, and they don't try to
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 8: exaggerate or have a narrative.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 6: They just tell you everything.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 8: They even tell you that they'll contradict themselves by saying
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 8: something like we'll tell you this story and then the
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 8: next chapter it will tell you a whole different story.
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 8: So I'm looking at this book, so yeah, this is
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 8: this is interesting.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 10: And some of them, like the crane will the crane
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 10: symbol here and the human figure on the other side
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 10: that was a clean and the four tree was a clean.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 10: A lot of these figurines showed trees that were branching,
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 10: and Seanan just ask is that a being Nderston? Well,
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 10: there were bannerstones in this collection, but that wasn't an
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 10: example of one. I'll go back and show that one
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 10: that the four branches were on a lot of these figurines,
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 10: like this one of branching fork like branches, Well that's
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 10: a plan as well. There were herons and hawks as well,
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 10: and like this eagle or golden eagle figurine and a sparrowhawk.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 10: I mean they're really well created.
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: So this this is a hoax that was done for
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: thousands of years for different people and different cultures or
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: representatives of different cultures. It's the longest hole bakery of
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: figurines be known in history. It's it's going at least
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: for five thousand years and making images.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 10: Right, that's what the Smithsonian would like you to believe
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 10: from the time of route. Even up until I showed
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 10: them this presentation, he said, well, these could have been
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 10: planted there, and so we think they still were clinging
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 10: to Row's opinion even after I showed the authentication paperwork.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: What Yeah, it was horses, horsey wagons after horse wagon
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: after horsewagen, putting the twenty five hundred figurines in there,
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: just just to make bess up.
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I gotta know, what are the native stories about
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 4: this place. It has to have a lot of lore
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 4: and native oral histories at least a little bit, you know.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 10: Well, this is the Cherokee homeland, and I was just
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 10: going to show an example, like they have horses horseback riding.
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 10: But this this pretty much really confirmed it for me
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 10: because in nineteen fifteen, George High he came down there
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 10: and he excavated an apple tree on the mound, and
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 10: underneath the apple tree he found two layers of mica,
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 10: a sheet of red clay. Underneath that was a sheet
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 10: of white clay, and then a sheet of yellow clay. Well,
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 10: the clan symbols for the Cherokee are red paint, white
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 10: and yellow paint, and below that he found.
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 5: I think that's social the foile chemical colors too.
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 10: Yeah, he found a pit there was charcoal and burned bones,
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 10: and in that pit there were two sharks teeth, and
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 10: then there was also a thirty pound chirt nodule and
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 10: High in nineteen fifteen pretty much confirmed that this side
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 10: is in fact an ancestors shrine. This was after the
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 10: artifacts were all found, and you know, the head of
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 10: the National Science Foundation found this, so I mean it
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 10: pretty much it just proves that there's no way they
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 10: that this could be fake.
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: And shark ties do tell us how far is the
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: site from the.
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 10: Ocean, and it's hundreds of miles from the ocean. I
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 10: mean you're talking about western North Carolina, Okay, So they
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 10: these correlate well to the shark totem, and I mean
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 10: the shark totem was widespread as well, all the way
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 10: to Illinois. They had sharks tooth clubs and they the
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 10: sharks tooth was a clean symbol and it was used
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 10: in clubs that were embedded with sharks teeth as a weapon.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 10: So they would embed the sharks teeth in a maplewood club.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 10: And there was one found in Kochia Mountains in Illinois.
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: So that alone show us that the trade was fast
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: and they this site had influences or connections to it's
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: very distance, if and if even if only in America. Well,
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: the Aztecs had that as a common weapon as well.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: They had that that same stock club, the sharks.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 7: Teath that was like an on this one.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 10: I think it could be a bee or or I
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 10: don't know it's but it's a Eugene Walley clean symbol.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 6: Say the bee is one of their cleans.
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 7: Oh the bee, Oh, I see it now, and shaman
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 7: just put it on screen.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 1: He's also relevant if we read it.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 10: Some things like the pelican clean or depicted the owl clean.
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 10: Owl was a bringer of death. It was really something
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 10: that would be feared. And there were our effigies as well.
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 7: Harbinger.
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 10: Yes, the goose, the I guess white goose or a
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 10: Totem clan symbol for this one has two what looked
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 10: like robins or birds possibly phoenix uh facing the same direction.
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 6: There's even figurines.
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 13: Like this that some sort of a bird in sea
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 13: tight possibly a duck. There were geese figurines and even
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 13: figurines like grouses and turkeys. There's partridges and turkeys depicted.
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 6: I mean it was extensive.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: The guy that was faking this was very well traveled, right.
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 2: I can imagine that much time and all that to
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 2: maake it.
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 6: Yeah, this was a fake.
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 10: I mean, just to imagine the time it would have
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 10: taken to make this and why. I mean, these these
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 10: obvious weren't sold. They were literally put in a museum
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 10: and the Osborne residents didn't take any money for them.
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 10: They're the ones that helped dig this up, the Mount
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 10: Pitchkar relics. The miss Missus Osborne said, I won't accept
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 10: any money for these. You if you're gonna donate, if
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 10: you're gonna give me money, I'll donate to the church.
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 10: When she found and her husband found these and helped
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 10: them dig these up, so.
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 6: It wasn't like a financial fraud scheme.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 10: You know, these were in fact, you know, part of
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 10: a real site and it has been studied archaeologically for
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 10: you know, the next one hundred and fifty years.
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: Well, I've seen in the last days a conversation with
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 1: a lady from a museum. She was very clear, although
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 1: she was very open, but she was very clear that
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: anything that has not been dug up by proper archaeologists
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 1: during the years that they consider archaeology was a functional science.
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: To them, everything is considered as a as fake because
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: they considered if it is undisturbed soiled or disturbed soiled.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: In this case, the soil was more than disturbed because
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 1: they sort of left a mass in there and it
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 1: was done not by accredited archaeologists or within the dates
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: that they consider archaeology as a functional science. So I
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 1: think that's the main reason why they tried to put
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: this aside, and that's their argument to keep this as
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 1: fakes and not to integrate them into a proper contextual research.
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 6: Yeah, that's a good point.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 10: And an archaeology they say today they don't study treasure
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 10: or like you mentioned, if it's outside of the dates
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 10: of after nineteen hundred or even up to you know,
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 10: current times, they won't study what was dug up in
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 10: the eighteen hundreds. So it's it's not in their study
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 10: regime where they're just not willing to look at it.
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 10: And archaeology, I mean the fact that it was basically
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 10: drawed back in you know, eighteen eighty by the Smithsonian
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 10: that's that's their narrative.
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 6: They look at it as a data.
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 10: Point like they don't they don't even research it or
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 10: study it at all. But in fact it's one of
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 10: the most important sites in this country. And the correlation
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 10: with the DeSoto chronicles, and even before that, the fifteen
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 10: the fourteen thirty expedition of the Chinese to the site
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 10: really describing the what they found there as an ancestor
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 10: shrine and these are actually totems or the tribal totems.
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 10: It correlates well with with those narratives.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: Exactly.
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 10: And today, I mean the goal is though there's twenty
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 10: five hundred of these. Originally, well they like they wouldn't
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 10: admit the Smithsonian wouldn't admit that these were in their collection.
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 10: And you might have seen recently they've been auditing the
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 10: Smithsonian this on. It just started like after I asked
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 10: these questions about the collection. One week after that they
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 10: were audited, and now they're being you know, I think
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 10: this might be why, because for so long the Smithsonian
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 10: has just covered this stuff up and they have these
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 10: treasures from the past that they've drawed for so long.
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 7: Well, man, dude, they're pretty cooked there. I would say,
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 7: pretty compromised.
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 3: They they're the ones that have hidden all the giant
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 3: bones and you know, say that dinosaurs are real, which
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 3: we know that that's not true. But uh, and much
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 3: much more. But the Smithsonian is more like a government institution,
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure, isn't it.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 4: We see this constant pattern with the Trump administration where
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 4: it seems like he creates a crisis to start running
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 4: back up for the systems that are falling through, and
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 4: it seems like that's what he's doing now with the Smithsonian.
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 4: They can't really hide that they've been destroying history as
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 4: badly as they have for the past hundred years. So
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 4: they're providing a backup or some sort of outlet for
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 4: them to try and move this stuff around and get
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 4: it out off their books, because you know, it's very
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 4: vulnerable as an institution. They've been lying about this shift
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 4: for ever. You know. It's it's disgusting, that's right.
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 10: And and when Valentine brought this stuff to the museum,
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 10: he said, you know, he was just asking for their opinion.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 10: And and then he went to the British Archaeology, the
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 10: head of the British archaeologists, and they said, this stuff
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 10: is real.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 6: In Britain.
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 10: They wrote an article about it and they said, no,
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 10: it's it's all authentic, it's real. And then the Smithsonian,
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 10: you know, drowed it. And I think that the Smithsonian
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 10: row was upset the British archaeologist said this stuff is real.
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 10: So that's also what contributed to the drawer effect, and
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 10: they wanted it to to not be seen again.
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 1: True. And regards to what Handless said, I don't think
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 1: the problems of the Smithsonian were caused by government. They
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 1: were caused by the people that are ahead of this.
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 1: And the idea is that they defend but what they
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 1: think is proper and not proper. It's like it's like
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 1: Sahiroas for instance, in the eighties and the nineties and
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 1: the two thousands. It's not a matter of what the government,
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 1: because the government knows nothing about its eutology, right. It's
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 1: the people that are ahead and defending the narratives and
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 1: creating a cultural line for the country and his history
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 1: that has to maintain that line instead of keeping updating
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: it with new findings. So I don't think that this
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: other thing to the Simpsonian would cause many advances in
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 1: what is hidden there because the problem is the persons
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: that are on top of the Smithsonian and they are
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 1: not being removed. So in regards to what Jules, I
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 1: didn't understand what you said about dinosaurs not being real.
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 1: But my point wasn't that is that the dinosaur the sorry,
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 1: the giant bones, most of that. Yeah, we're destroyed the
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 1: giant bones. The Smithsonian destroyed most of them. So if
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 1: they have someone on their vaults, I'm not sure, because
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 1: they destroyed most of them. They collect them, actively collected them,
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 1: collect collected them to destroy those evidences in this case,
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 1: is so lucky that these figurines are not destroyed or
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: because Vincent, when you went there, they still show it.
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 1: You can still handle them and see them. You just
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 1: cannot test them anymore or do anything to them, just
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 1: you only can look at them.
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 10: Right, And I'm showing my screen how to kind of
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 10: show the location of the site, So Garden Creek Archaeological Site.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 10: See it's in western North Carolina, and so the distance
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 10: between you know, the the ocean and the site is
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 10: pretty extensive. And the fact that this has connections with Kahokia,
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 10: that Koche Mountains also had all that crosshatching on their
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 10: artifacts as well, and this was, you know, the Cherokee homeland.
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 10: The idea that the Natives had a museum is really interesting.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 6: Like they they.
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 10: Had a client basically a klan simple museum or an
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 10: ancestors shrine of showing their chiefs history and each one
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 10: represented that history.
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 6: But we know Ashville is nearby here and.
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 10: Well, the Cherokee villages were mostly burnt down in around
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 10: seventeen fifty. So when the Europeans arrived and then created
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 10: the United States by seventeen seventy six, the Natives were
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 10: kicked out. And then in eighteen thirty the Trail Tears happened,
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 10: So I mean a lot of warring was going on
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 10: throughout that time that you know, shows just how.
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 6: Populated the area was.
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 10: I mean, the Cherokey lived all through this area in
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 10: the Trail of Tears was in eighteen thirty when they
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 10: were forced out all the.
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 6: Way to Oklahoma.
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 10: But they still some stay behind and you know, still
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 10: have land there today.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 4: Is it it funny that Asheville is still a spiritual
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 4: hub for a bunch of hippies up in western North Carolina. Yeah,
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 4: I still have that kind of shamanistic feel to it.
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true. And it's also very interesting to need it.
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 1: While all historians that speak about this and this time period,
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 1: they all refer to all of the indigeness peoples were
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 1: at war one another. They were fighting for apparentley, for
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 1: this piece of lando, for control of the territory. And
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: what we found here is all the people sitated around
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 1: each other, holding hands or smoking from the same pipe
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 1: in the clear representations of peace. Right, That's one of
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: the things that they also used to reject the site.
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 4: It made them even angrier. The more peaceful they were,
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 4: the angrier they got they got.
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 10: Yes, So one of the possibilities in future studies, I
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 10: mean going to the site, It would be great to
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 10: look at it and get drone footage. But this site
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 10: was heavily studied, and I mean a lot of it
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 10: was excavated from nineteen sixty all the way up through
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 10: nineteen eighty three and then again even more recently. The
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 10: artifacts remaining at the Smithsonian, if they could be tested,
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 10: like if they would actually agree to a scientific testing
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 10: study of them, then.
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 6: There's an opportunity there.
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 10: If they could be carbonated, if any of that soot
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 10: or residue on the surfaces could be carbonated or even
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 10: the thermal luminescence study of the pottery examples there. I
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 10: mean that that could be another possible route of study
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 10: that would determine their origins.
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 1: They would just have to dig a little bit deeper
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 1: with the with the with the drill in order to
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 1: get to some part of the pottery that was not
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 1: affected by the fire.
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 10: Right, And because it tells you what the last burning,
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 10: last fired event was basically, so if these are made
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 10: two thousand years ago and then burnt in the building
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 10: one hundred years ago, it'll show that they're one hundred
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 10: years escence is one hundred years ago.
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 6: That's the last heated event.
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 7: Are these anywhere near the Blue Ridge Mountains? And yeah,
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 7: it is the spot.
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 6: I'll pull it up again here, I think I.
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 3: Had it pulled up bro I was gonna I think
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 3: I saw something that it was because there's been a
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 3: lot of paranormal activity there, like tons of big foot
• 1:20:02
  Speaker 3: side or you know, all all that stuff. Uh, And
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 3: you can chalk that up to what you want to,
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 3: But I just find that pretty interesting that you find
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 3: sites like these where there's been a lot of supernatural activity.
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: Well, Mount Peagash, as I shown in the before We're
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 1: alive is exactly where five lines cross each other, five
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: tillary clients, so that it's a it's a powerful sort
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: of place in terms of tilloric energy.
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 3: Okay, oh yeah, I'd love to visit it, man, to
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 3: be honest with you, that'd be.
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 1: Nice and and and vincent. I think it's also relevant
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 1: what you showed me, that this has this apparent ability
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 1: to whatever is being done inside to come outside as
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 1: a ghostly speak. Right, So there has this these channels
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: on on the structures that come onto the surf and
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 1: with allow to work as I don't know, like an
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 1: oracle place or a place where spirits spoke to those
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 1: to those around the buildings.
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 10: Right, It's surely it has a lot of power and
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 10: spiritual connection there, and apparently it has for many millennia.
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 10: He exactly kept on going back there and rebuilding the
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 10: site over and over again. So the building had been
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 10: rebuilt at least eight times at the same spot.
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 1: Eight times.
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 4: We got to build another one. Dude, you gotta do it,
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 4: help me.
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 6: To do Yeah, And.
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 10: I mean, it's it's an amazing site. It's important to
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 10: the history and prehistory of the world. I mean, I
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 10: think just the massive quantity of figurines there, and that
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 10: these were spanning the time frame from archaic all the
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 10: way up to historical time frame just shows the importance
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 10: of it.
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: Just see if I can share the alignments of the
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: Tillrik lines there. See if I can do it, I
• 1:22:20
  Speaker 1: think people will find it interesting.
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 2: Jo heall is Greenville, North Carolina? To that place is
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 2: ninety three miles. Yeah, that's where I live at Greenville,
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 2: I guess because I gotta go find my draw.
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 4: You gotta go find it, dude. It's a quest.
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 3: Someone said it has to Sedona, Arizona type of energy,
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 3: and that's what I was picking up out of it.
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 7: There's probably a portal there.
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, dude, you got your frequency generator. You gotta get
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 4: out there, the generator and your dowsing rods.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 1: Oh, let's go, Vincent. Is this Artigona or Westmore the
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 1: way the Mount Diash? Sorry, yeah, it's in.
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 6: Heywood County.
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 1: You have to tell me the other name that you
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 1: gave me before. What was it?
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 10: The Garden Center, Garden Creek Archaeological site.
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 6: What's going on here?
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 10: I'll just pull the fast one and change the name
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 10: from Mount a Garden Creek archaeological site.
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 12: Okay, okay, well, you know I thought about this, Okay,
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 12: I thought about this in a different way.
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 4: What if the most early form of deep state is
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 4: this sort of land claim monopoly, Right, So this play shows,
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 4: you know, contact with a lot of other cultures around
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 4: the world. So that would start to impact America's land
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 4: claim monopoly because you've got all these different influences landing
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 4: right there and being shown clearly. So by destroying that site,
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 4: you're sort of destroying any sort of land claims that
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 4: may have come along with that site.
• 1:24:26
  Speaker 10: Yeah, that's a really good point too. Like we know
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 10: that places in the Yukuhoqui Mounds like the piousoglyph were
• 1:24:37
  Speaker 10: purposefully destroyed because they didn't want it to be a
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 10: land claim. And this site in particular has a lot
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 10: of Subharan African connection with all the animals, like the rhino,
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 10: things like that. They don't want it to be a
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 10: land claim, possibly for African Native American culture, so they
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 10: destroyed it, and they basically destroyed it, put it in
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 10: the drawer and didn't want to talk about it for
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 10: one hundred and fifty years. And so yeah, I think
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 10: a lot of it is about manifest destiny and that
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 10: ideal that Europeans showed up and no one else here
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 10: they have the right to take all the land, and
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 10: it would it would be a good reason that they
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 10: may have used it with their manifest destiny theory to
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 10: just destroy it and cover it up.
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah. And if you know about the Society of the Cincinnati,
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 4: right across from there was the Cosmos Club, and the
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 4: Cosmos Club and Society the Cincinnati came up with the Smithsonian.
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 4: So before they were excavating these sites and knowing what
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 4: was inside of them and pulling out all of the treasures,
• 1:25:49
  Speaker 4: and then they created the Smithsonian as sort of like
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 4: locking the door behind them and making sure nobody else
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 4: figures it out with whatever remaining artifacts are left.
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 3: Well, they left a bunch of them in there.
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 5: Of them, just a few.
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 7: Ship compared to what they probably had.
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 5: It was probably like just leave it one box.
• 1:26:13
  Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, it's like even a penny out of you know,
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 7: of a dollar.
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 4: Vast majority of artifacts are in private collections. Don't let
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 4: the museums fool you. It's all private, sealed in vaults.
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 5: The good I think hobby lobbies.
• 1:26:28
  Speaker 4: Boy, yep, that ain't the first time.
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 7: So they have like the sud Marian.
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 1: You know, they actually had to give them.
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 9: They actually had to give some of them ships back too.
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 4: They caught that these were Dead Sea scrolls. They had
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 4: pieces of the Dead Sea scrolls in there.
• 1:26:52
  Speaker 7: Yeah, that's crazy, man to get that as now no man.
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 5: Wow, that's why they close on the Sundays they take
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 5: out the other facts. Dide.
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 4: You know what Hobby Lobby's defense was though, That's the
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 4: part I find most revealing is they tried to claim
• 1:27:11
  Speaker 4: that they were fakes, and they knew that they were
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 4: buying fakes, and so they tried to get out of
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 4: paying any money or paying these back by saying that
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 4: they were fakes. So this is a common common occurrence.
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 4: I think they just brad whatever's real as fakes and
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 4: then they collect it for themselves.
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 6: Right, that's what's going on here.
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 10: They call it fakes so they it doesn't have to
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 10: fall into nag for requirements or don't have to admit
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 10: that it's real.
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 9: See you brought up that word again.
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 8: So it's very interesting you bring up nagbro because I'm
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 8: you know, I'm on the fence on whether they you know,
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 8: it's too strict with the rules or if it's just
• 1:27:53
  Speaker 8: right or too lenient, right, you know you said, actually,
• 1:27:58
  Speaker 8: like at nine minutes at when we was nine minutes
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 8: into the show about Magpro and how artifacts were coming
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 8: up missing. Do you think it's more coming up missing
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 8: on you know, the natives are making them come up
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 8: missing or do you think that people are like how
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 8: the owner or CEO of Hobby Lobby was hoarding you know,
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 8: old artifacts and stuff like that, Like what is your
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 8: you know on that?
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I mean I think the issue is well these
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 10: I mean overall Nagpra, I think it had good intentions,
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 10: but it didn't allow studying to occur to the extent
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 10: it needed to. Like on skulls and things that were collected,
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 10: now all those are gone. And when I was in
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 10: Illinois over at the Dixon Mounds, the curators said that
• 1:28:47
  Speaker 10: it was basically a rocket. I'm trying to get things
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 10: and get the most money out of them. Nagpro claimed
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 10: a lot of the skulls and things from Dixon Mounds
• 1:28:56
  Speaker 10: and they had been on display for about fifty years,
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 10: so a lot of it. And he said this is
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 10: because they wanted money. And the tribes are in the
• 1:29:04
  Speaker 10: Nagpro group that was associated with the tribe. Basically they
• 1:29:08
  Speaker 10: were going after it from a financial standpoint. So unfortunately
• 1:29:13
  Speaker 10: a lot of this was lost, and it had been
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 10: partially due to financial reasons. But I think there's a
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 10: good reason to not destroy it. I mean, it needs
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 10: to be preserved, and I of course there was more
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 10: effort to study this and actually preserve it and then
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 10: present it in a real scientific way. The fact that
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 10: this site was claimed by Nagra from the part of
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 10: it that was in North Carolina. University of North Carolina
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 10: they had seven hundred of these and now they're gone.
• 1:29:51
  Speaker 10: I mean, no one knows where they are, if there
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 10: ever be if there will ever be studied again, or
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 10: if there's any if there's any in existence anymore. But
• 1:30:00
  Speaker 10: you see sometimes if you search the Mountiski relics, you
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 10: see examples coming up for sale and auctions. So there's
• 1:30:07
  Speaker 10: there's some that are being auctioned off and makes me
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 10: wonder if in fact they are just selling them. You know,
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 10: these been the ones that were claimed, ends up in
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 10: an auction, and so unfortunately it's it's a loss for
• 1:30:22
  Speaker 10: science and a loss for you know, history.
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 1: Well, I would say that Nacra as it was designed
• 1:30:31
  Speaker 1: if if it was a matter of okay, those are
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 1: sacred or sacred in viewed objects for us, right I'm
• 1:30:40
  Speaker 1: speaking them of some tribe. That doesn't mean that they
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 1: are not studied. That mean that we harbor them and
• 1:30:48
  Speaker 1: we keep them. And but we have to display them,
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 1: we have to show them, we have to allow for
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 1: them to be studied. Right, It's not something that we
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 1: can take and just disappear with it or sell or
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 1: whatever we want to do with them. But there is
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 1: a darker saying in Acra from my perspective, and that's
• 1:31:06
  Speaker 1: the point that I hit the most. That is the
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 1: fact that that does not justify why when now I'm
• 1:31:12
  Speaker 1: researching any of these subjects and I go to a
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 1: website and the image that is being described in the
• 1:31:20
  Speaker 1: text is gone because they consider that it is part
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 1: of Nacra and it was offensive to this or that tribe,
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: So they take the image out so we can no
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 1: longer see what is being described. And how long until
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 1: the description also be considered offensive and also disappears. And
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 1: why are they taking books, images from museums, from schools,
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 1: Why are they eradicating all the indigenous presence from the
• 1:31:45
  Speaker 1: minds of those that are not Indigenous people. We are
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 1: rebuilding a riff here between what our Americans are and
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: what Indigenous peoples are. How long until new generations don't
• 1:31:57
  Speaker 1: know what Indigenous peoples are?
• 1:31:59
  Speaker 5: Right?
• 1:32:00
  Speaker 1: So, because they are being removed from everywhere, it's not
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 1: a matter of artifacts, it's the information that is also
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 1: being removed, and that's what I'm against with mostly, and it's.
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 4: All just being warehoused, you know. I mean that's the point.
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 4: It's like, how are we honoring these cultures by warehousing
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 4: them and bureaucracy. It doesn't make sense.
• 1:32:21
  Speaker 1: Sure, and even for these cultures, we should have them
• 1:32:26
  Speaker 1: telling us about what it's their artifacts, it's their l rooms,
• 1:32:32
  Speaker 1: their inheritance. They should be getting information on their side
• 1:32:36
  Speaker 1: about these things. They should harbor them, yes, but show
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 1: them to us, show their culture, to go to schools,
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 1: make presentations, talk to us about their culture. Instead of
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 1: eradicating completely from society, that's what NACRA is being allowed
• 1:32:51
  Speaker 1: to do. So it's again it's not a matter of
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 1: the law itself. It's a matter of those that are
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 1: using the law for their own purpose and and us
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 1: once again, but it's it's there's no good and evil
• 1:33:03
  Speaker 1: on the law. It's it's only on the morality of
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 1: those that they are using it as an excuse for
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 1: them maneuvers.
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 10: Yep, yeah, that's absolutely right, well said, thank you.
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 5: Did anybody anybody have any questions? Anybody else?
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 10: Okay, someone's been asking about what is a bannerstone?
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 5: Oh yeah, I was going to go back and as
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 5: actually a while earlier.
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe even for people who are listening and don't
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 2: even know from the beginning.
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 5: Of the show.
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean I could show another picture.
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 10: But bannerstones were objects made in a shape of a
• 1:33:47
  Speaker 10: stone with a hole and it basically drilled through the
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 10: center portion. And they're often very symmetrical, and they were
• 1:33:55
  Speaker 10: thought to be put on a banner on a staff,
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 10: and so it got us name bannerstone from the the
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 10: shape of a banner on a staff. I'll try to
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 10: share my screen and kind of show what it looks like.
• 1:34:15
  Speaker 10: So these are the Mount Pishka bannerstones. These were all
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 10: found in Heywood County, and the one here at the
• 1:34:21
  Speaker 10: angle was from the Mount Pishka cash at Valentine Museum.
• 1:34:27
  Speaker 10: And and so they were often crescent shaped like this.
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 10: There's some that are butterfly shaped and these all have
• 1:34:37
  Speaker 10: a whole central perforation in the middle to put on
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 10: a staff. Some people say that they were used for
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 10: it's little counterbalance, but that there's not been a uh,
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 10: you know, a real good agreement about that in terms
• 1:34:55
  Speaker 10: of use. Like this one having the angle of the
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 10: minimum lunar declination that winter, well, that would mean that
• 1:35:01
  Speaker 10: it's most likely an astronomical angle that they had this
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 10: and it was like their totem or you know, an
• 1:35:10
  Speaker 10: important calendar symbol, and they have this line on it
• 1:35:17
  Speaker 10: which correlates to the minimum lunarsty install.
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 1: I've seen people defending that these were used as on
• 1:35:27
  Speaker 1: a pole in front of the chief stand, for instance,
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 1: as a representation of power, But the fact that they
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 1: have practical functions I think remove some of that idea.
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 1: Although I think that there are lots of banistons and
• 1:35:45
  Speaker 1: not all of them should have the same explanation because
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 1: they could have been made for different reasons, some for
• 1:35:54
  Speaker 1: astronomical alignment, some for representations of power, so it doesn't
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 1: have to be one explanation to all bannerstones.
• 1:36:03
  Speaker 10: Right, and and some people say they're clan symbols, like
• 1:36:07
  Speaker 10: each one represented their klan or their totem, the butterfly Klan.
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 3: The that looks like a moon right there, it's like
• 1:36:14
  Speaker 3: a crescent moon. Yeah yeah, yeah, man, that's pretty interesting.
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 10: And these these are there's published books about these that
• 1:36:25
  Speaker 10: spanned back to around nineteen hundred.
• 1:36:29
  Speaker 6: So if even this the Valentine Museum.
• 1:36:33
  Speaker 10: Today didn't know that this was a bannerstone until I
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 10: looked at it. I saw, hey, guys, this is a
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 10: banner stone, and they're like, what's the bannerstone?
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 6: They thought it was a figurine.
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 7: Wow, that's awesome man. That's yeah, that you were able
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 7: to bring that to them.
• 1:36:49
  Speaker 10: Yeah, it's like and one of the reasons that the
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 10: Smithsonian draward these was he said there was no known
• 1:36:57
  Speaker 10: artifacts in this collection. Well, the bannerstone is a known
• 1:37:01
  Speaker 10: artifact shape, so it's very good evidence that in fact,
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 10: these are known artifacts that are real and authentic, and
• 1:37:09
  Speaker 10: they shoend them a drawer.
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 1: There's books about this thing, so they should know what
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 1: they had.
• 1:37:16
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, Well, it's funny these other worldly artifacts are treated
• 1:37:23
  Speaker 4: with otherworldly irresponsibility.
• 1:37:27
  Speaker 7: Across the board.
• 1:37:31
  Speaker 6: Yeah. Yeah, that's a good point.
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 5: Oh, I thought that was just fun.
• 1:37:40
  Speaker 14: I just told this DC yesterday that it's It's like,
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 14: this is a real story of a motorcycle accident on
• 1:37:48
  Speaker 14: a roundabout and the guy lost his head along with
• 1:37:51
  Speaker 14: the helmet because of the impact.
• 1:37:53
  Speaker 1: And it was on the sidewalk. Well, sidewalk in Portuguese
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 1: is per saved. And so the policeman was writing the
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 1: report and he's sinking a saye is it tweet a
• 1:38:06
  Speaker 1: Z or two? Ass's how do I write this? And
• 1:38:09
  Speaker 1: so he kicked the helmet into the road and says, okay,
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 1: the helmet was on the road because he couldn't write
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 1: sidewalk because he didn't know how to write it.
• 1:38:19
  Speaker 7: He didn't want to.
• 1:38:19
  Speaker 1: Look bad on the report. So this is the same thing,
• 1:38:22
  Speaker 1: like this artifact belongs to an area that we don't study,
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 1: we don't understand. It is outside of our brother of
• 1:38:29
  Speaker 1: span of years. So either it doesn't exist or is
• 1:38:33
  Speaker 1: a hoax, and since it's there, it has to be
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 1: a hoax, right, and it's problem solved.
• 1:38:41
  Speaker 4: Well, we got to find out about what the locals
• 1:38:43
  Speaker 4: feel about this place, because I think if a lot
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 4: more people in that area knew what kind of travesty
• 1:38:50
  Speaker 4: is being carried out in their own neighborhood, I think
• 1:38:52
  Speaker 4: they'd be a lot more pissed off and looking for answers.
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 4: That's something that could happen really quickly too. Just by
• 1:38:58
  Speaker 4: getting these people a little but a where of their surroundings,
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 4: we can get some movement in the right direction going
• 1:39:05
  Speaker 4: on this this project, you know what I mean?
• 1:39:08
  Speaker 1: So are you suggesting that the people organize and create
• 1:39:10
  Speaker 1: a museum to collect it the most of the I mean,
• 1:39:16
  Speaker 1: it's so blatant and obvious that once you explain it
• 1:39:20
  Speaker 1: to them a little bit, I'll understand what's being taken
• 1:39:22
  Speaker 1: from them. Sure, and it's a tourist opportunity. If they
• 1:39:26
  Speaker 1: recreate the site itself, with the two rooms and the
• 1:39:29
  Speaker 1: connection with the true with the magnetic norths linking them
• 1:39:33
  Speaker 1: to with all the pieces inside. As they more or
• 1:39:35
  Speaker 1: less figure it out, it could be a profitable thing too,
• 1:39:39
  Speaker 1: not only cultural. So it might be an incentive.
• 1:39:44
  Speaker 4: Ashville is looking for an excuse to organize and you know,
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 4: band together against the federal government. Why can't you give
• 1:39:50
  Speaker 4: them this?
• 1:39:51
  Speaker 1: You know, Vincent, there's a challenge for you. A few
• 1:39:56
  Speaker 1: emails to be written.
• 1:40:01
  Speaker 10: Yeah, and I'm trying to share a screen here. It's
• 1:40:04
  Speaker 10: a depiction of what a good representation of what I
• 1:40:09
  Speaker 10: think a bannerstone was like. And this is from a
• 1:40:12
  Speaker 10: birch bark scroll of the Midi Wigan. So the Jibway
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 10: had these birch bark scrolls and they engraved them. And
• 1:40:20
  Speaker 10: so the bannerstone represented over here is on the top
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 10: of a banner or pole staff and it shows a
• 1:40:27
  Speaker 10: lodge and the path of the person with the arrow
• 1:40:32
  Speaker 10: it goes. He goes through the lodge and then back
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 10: and circles around. So there's a book called the Sacred
• 1:40:39
  Speaker 10: Scrolls of the Southern no Jibway and it uses a
• 1:40:42
  Speaker 10: lot of these symbols of the totems and like these
• 1:40:45
  Speaker 10: look like headless ducks I mean hanging or sitting there
• 1:40:50
  Speaker 10: and a serpent symbol. There's a lot of Egyptian. Yeah,
• 1:40:56
  Speaker 10: these are I mean it does. It looks like a
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 10: lot of into Egyptian type of symbols. And I mean
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 10: this person has that the headdress on a lot of
• 1:41:06
  Speaker 10: the figurines that are similar to these non Pishka figurines
• 1:41:10
  Speaker 10: have that type of head dress as well, so they
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 10: could bow and arrow was represented. And I mean, but
• 1:41:16
  Speaker 10: the banners don't what I wanted to show here, And
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 10: I mean this is like a banner that's coming up
• 1:41:22
  Speaker 10: out of the lodge at the top of the pole
• 1:41:26
  Speaker 10: and it's pointed upwards.
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 7: Uh that's so cool.
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:41:33
  Speaker 1: Could be a representation of the of the proper time
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 1: to hunt because of the of the man with the
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 1: bow of talk. I don't know.
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's depictions of an Egyptian barge that for some
• 1:41:45
  Speaker 2: reason this reminds me of because of this peace on
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 2: the bottom it actually has that sounds silly, but I
• 1:41:53
  Speaker 2: don't know. I've seen them depict barges with the type
• 1:41:55
  Speaker 2: of shapes in there that like the bottom and.
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 7: The little bow to Heaven thing.
• 1:42:00
  Speaker 13: Yeah.
• 1:42:00
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I think we're on the show.
• 1:42:02
  Speaker 7: With uh yeah, yeah about that the other night.
• 1:42:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was recently. Yeah, that image was on the
• 1:42:11
  Speaker 2: screen and I was like, yeah, I oh, why I
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 2: just remember that?
• 1:42:15
  Speaker 5: Good? Yeah, there it is right there at the bottom tyrone.
• 1:42:20
  Speaker 1: Haven't you seen that? Haven't you seen that that ball
• 1:42:25
  Speaker 1: crossed in the middle before on the left.
• 1:42:31
  Speaker 9: Yeah, I just I can't remember where though.
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 1: I can't remember either, but I think I seen that
• 1:42:37
  Speaker 1: somewhere and it's not fucking so.
• 1:42:40
  Speaker 8: No, I know what you're talking about, because I just
• 1:42:43
  Speaker 8: can't remember where I seen that. Because we actually talked
• 1:42:46
  Speaker 8: about it.
• 1:42:50
  Speaker 5: This is interesting.
• 1:42:50
  Speaker 1: It's a lot of common symbols in here. Interesting again
• 1:42:57
  Speaker 1: showing the universally universe, silly universitality is that it all
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 1: this fight.
• 1:43:04
  Speaker 6: So yeah, that's right.
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 10: And and a lot of the figurines correlate with the
• 1:43:09
  Speaker 10: birch bark scrolls, which were literally scrolls written on birch
• 1:43:14
  Speaker 10: bark that has been collected by the European sellers when
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 10: they came through the area. They found hundreds of these
• 1:43:21
  Speaker 10: scrolls all through Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, in Indiana, Illinois. They
• 1:43:29
  Speaker 10: were finding when they drained the swamps and as they
• 1:43:32
  Speaker 10: collected these, some of.
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 6: Them were.
• 1:43:37
  Speaker 10: Drawn on paper like what they were seeing that had
• 1:43:39
  Speaker 10: been engraved on the birch bark. And so this is
• 1:43:43
  Speaker 10: an example of that that they had many different forms
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 10: and shapes that they really or correlate to these figurines
• 1:43:49
  Speaker 10: from Mount Pishka.
• 1:43:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, at least two persons from on the church please.
• 1:44:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:44:01
  Speaker 5: Yo. There's actually I've noticed just throughout.
• 1:44:04
  Speaker 2: The last few months when people mentioning where they're from,
• 1:44:07
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of people from North Carolina actually that
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 2: listen to this on YouTube, and they've.
• 1:44:13
  Speaker 3: Been saying that they can see the mount from from
• 1:44:16
  Speaker 3: their backyard.
• 1:44:17
  Speaker 1: From their backyard, you can start selling tickets for them
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 1: to watch live.
• 1:44:25
  Speaker 7: That's why I say, that's.
• 1:44:26
  Speaker 9: Why I sent you that link. That's why. That's exactly
• 1:44:28
  Speaker 9: why I sent you that.
• 1:44:29
  Speaker 8: Link, Nick, because I've been noticing a lot of people
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 8: from your area.
• 1:44:33
  Speaker 5: If you were to.
• 1:44:33
  Speaker 2: Probably google which state has the most like witchcraft or
• 1:44:38
  Speaker 2: type shit like that, and I think you'll get North Carolina.
• 1:44:42
  Speaker 5: I think it. Honestly my opinion, I think it's a
• 1:44:44
  Speaker 5: reaction to the Bible Belt.
• 1:44:47
  Speaker 4: So this is true.
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 2: Probably so, but yeah, it is, it is, you know,
• 1:44:53
  Speaker 2: so it is. There was even nothing other that it
• 1:44:55
  Speaker 2: was one of the reasons why I even came to
• 1:44:57
  Speaker 2: the state. I figured, you know, it's kind of like
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 2: a smaller version of New York if I guess it
• 1:45:02
  Speaker 2: comes to witchcraft or whatever, and.
• 1:45:05
  Speaker 4: It's all centered around that Asheville area.
• 1:45:08
  Speaker 5: And yeah, you know what's really pretty big too, Charlotte Show.
• 1:45:14
  Speaker 5: It's really big for which stuff.
• 1:45:20
  Speaker 4: I wonder very interesting.
• 1:45:22
  Speaker 1: Any of the books that I have about anomalies include
• 1:45:25
  Speaker 1: North Carolina. Let me see uh history.
• 1:45:32
  Speaker 4: Five type. I guess my state's full of Satanists.
• 1:45:41
  Speaker 5: Okay, baggage.
• 1:45:43
  Speaker 3: My state's full of swingers, dude, it's okay.
• 1:45:49
  Speaker 7: Swingers.
• 1:45:49
  Speaker 1: And I have Colorado, Oklahoma and Wyoming this collection of
• 1:45:59
  Speaker 1: books about about anomalies that are very often related to sightings,
• 1:46:04
  Speaker 1: be it off wefos or cryptids or whatever. But no, no, no,
• 1:46:10
  Speaker 1: North Carolina.
• 1:46:13
  Speaker 7: I have to look into it now.
• 1:46:17
  Speaker 10: H m hm, Well I really appreciate the yeah and
• 1:46:24
  Speaker 10: talking about it and great.
• 1:46:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was like a it's just a ton and
• 1:46:30
  Speaker 2: tons and tons of like evidence, right, like all those
• 1:46:32
  Speaker 2: pieces that's crazy, all forgeries, what pieces.
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 5: It's like the Epstein files. It really don't even exist.
• 1:46:45
  Speaker 6: Yeah, they're not real.
• 1:46:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but.
• 1:46:49
  Speaker 2: That's you know, and I hate to bring it on
• 1:46:51
  Speaker 2: people's parade. But unfortunately, because Trump is the one tooting
• 1:46:55
  Speaker 2: about Smithsonian, I don't think that ship's going anywhere either,
• 1:46:59
  Speaker 2: is what it it's unfortunately, you know, but you know,
• 1:47:04
  Speaker 2: fingers crossed. I think it's gross, yo, But thank you
• 1:47:08
  Speaker 2: so much, Vincent. Again, that was like, really that was
• 1:47:13
  Speaker 2: impressive stuff. I mean do you think, I mean, going forward,
• 1:47:17
  Speaker 2: do you think like this might get some recognition eventually?
• 1:47:21
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I mean I'm hoping so that like maybe this
• 1:47:24
  Speaker 10: will get recognition for being you know, a true side
• 1:47:28
  Speaker 10: in the Smithsonian will issue a statement reverting their one
• 1:47:32
  Speaker 10: hundred and fifty years of calling it a fraud in
• 1:47:34
  Speaker 10: a hoax, and hopefully they'll acknowledge the importance of the site,
• 1:47:40
  Speaker 10: and maybe even the Valentine will put this material back
• 1:47:44
  Speaker 10: on display and show the public the importance of it. So, yeah,
• 1:47:50
  Speaker 10: it's a It's a really interesting topic. There's a lot
• 1:47:52
  Speaker 10: of complexity, and I think that's why it's difficult, because
• 1:47:54
  Speaker 10: there's just so much to it, so much history there.
• 1:47:57
  Speaker 10: But it's a really important thing, and you know, I'm
• 1:47:59
  Speaker 10: glad that the chance to talk about.
• 1:48:01
  Speaker 5: It, Oh for sure, for sure. I mean I really
• 1:48:03
  Speaker 5: wish you.
• 1:48:05
  Speaker 2: Don't really wish you the best of luck with this,
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 2: I mean some really impressive stuff, dude, So thank you
• 1:48:10
  Speaker 2: for bringing it on this show for real.
• 1:48:12
  Speaker 6: Thank you, Thank you everybody.
• 1:48:14
  Speaker 2: No, thank you, thank you Ricardo for suggesting them. You know,
• 1:48:17
  Speaker 2: very amazing stuff.
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 1: No, it's it's it's it's very impressive and Vincent has
• 1:48:21
  Speaker 1: done very digerent research to put his own resources to it.
• 1:48:25
  Speaker 1: We need more, Vincent's definitely, okay, absolutely.
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 2: Before we wrap it up, headless, let everybody know where
• 1:48:34
  Speaker 2: they can find your stuff and where they can send
• 1:48:35
  Speaker 2: that email it.
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 4: Thank you. This is amazing. I think this is one
• 1:48:39
  Speaker 4: of those topics that spans both left and right and
• 1:48:41
  Speaker 4: a lot of people can get behind it if they
• 1:48:43
  Speaker 4: just start believing in themselves in their communities. Again, right,
• 1:48:47
  Speaker 4: So you can find me on Thursday nights if you
• 1:48:51
  Speaker 4: check out my show. I read your occult emails. You
• 1:48:54
  Speaker 4: can send them to me at the Headless Giant Podcast
• 1:48:56
  Speaker 4: at gmail dot com. And also Sunday Trialogus, which I
• 1:49:00
  Speaker 4: do with Ricardo calv Audio and Ethan Indigo on Sunday morning,
• 1:49:05
  Speaker 4: so check that out as well.
• 1:49:07
  Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you very much. So I appreciate you
• 1:49:10
  Speaker 2: coming on and Jules, what is up my man?
• 1:49:14
  Speaker 7: All right, Vincey, that was a great presentation. Man learned
• 1:49:18
  Speaker 7: a lot.
• 1:49:19
  Speaker 3: I always learned a lot on this show, So Nick,
• 1:49:21
  Speaker 3: I appreciate the invite once again.
• 1:49:24
  Speaker 7: Guys, great boot pot on Twitter.
• 1:49:27
  Speaker 3: You find me on Rumble, YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, all
• 1:49:30
  Speaker 3: that Good Stuff Patreon.
• 1:49:33
  Speaker 7: On Saturday mornings, we do esoteric book reviews.
• 1:49:36
  Speaker 3: Nick swings by, he comes along, I got a couple
• 1:49:39
  Speaker 3: other guys in there with me. We go real deep
• 1:49:42
  Speaker 3: on some stuff Sunday Chaos tonight nine o'clock. Don't watch
• 1:49:49
  Speaker 3: if you're easily offended. Every Tuesday, I produce for a
• 1:49:53
  Speaker 3: parapolitical calling show called Already Dead. You can find it
• 1:49:57
  Speaker 3: on my channel as well as Underclass podcast in No
• 1:50:01
  Speaker 3: Way Jose channel.
• 1:50:02
  Speaker 7: It's at eight point thirty.
• 1:50:04
  Speaker 3: We do a call in kind of portion at the
• 1:50:06
  Speaker 3: end of the show where you can come on and
• 1:50:08
  Speaker 3: give your two cents about what we're talking about. A
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 3: lot of cool shit, a lot of deep like you know,
• 1:50:13
  Speaker 3: kind of cults and psyops and all all that good
• 1:50:17
  Speaker 3: stuff that I don't really get into on the regular,
• 1:50:19
  Speaker 3: so it's good to be there in the background to
• 1:50:22
  Speaker 3: kind of hear about it. But you got a lot
• 1:50:24
  Speaker 3: of guests coming on here in the next few weeks.
• 1:50:26
  Speaker 3: I usually go live on the weekends because I work
• 1:50:29
  Speaker 3: full time, so I'll just go, you know, subscribe to
• 1:50:33
  Speaker 3: my channel and just be on the lookout for any
• 1:50:37
  Speaker 3: upcoming shows.
• 1:50:38
  Speaker 7: I'm usually on here like two times a week, so
• 1:50:43
  Speaker 7: you find me on here as well. Again, Thank you, guys.
• 1:50:47
  Speaker 2: Of course, oh thank you, thank you. And for real people,
• 1:50:50
  Speaker 2: go check out his patreon for his his book stuff.
• 1:50:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, regardless the fact that I was even on there.
• 1:50:56
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's well done. So you know, if I
• 1:50:59
  Speaker 2: happen to join, which I will soon, as long as
• 1:51:01
  Speaker 2: I have that Saturday, I'll be there with him.
• 1:51:04
  Speaker 5: I really had a great time.
• 1:51:05
  Speaker 2: So go check out the patroon It's it's worth a
• 1:51:08
  Speaker 2: few bucks at of course, of course, of course, uh
• 1:51:12
  Speaker 2: and uh, my man.
• 1:51:14
  Speaker 5: Tyrone, what's going on, sir?
• 1:51:17
  Speaker 8: Any great presentation, Vincent. I enjoyed every moment of it.
• 1:51:20
  Speaker 3: Man.
• 1:51:21
  Speaker 8: I actually went and bought some books from Amazon based
• 1:51:23
  Speaker 8: off of you know what you was just sharing, because
• 1:51:25
  Speaker 8: a lot of stuff that you were sharing, a lot
• 1:51:27
  Speaker 8: of authors had wrote somewhat about it already, especially like.
• 1:51:31
  Speaker 7: When we were talking about the Moonlight people.
• 1:51:32
  Speaker 6: So I got me a couple of books on that.
• 1:51:35
  Speaker 6: So I appreciate the knowledge that you share today.
• 1:51:37
  Speaker 8: Everything you can find on me is on my website
• 1:51:40
  Speaker 8: Rebirth at theWord dot com, and also my book Journey
• 1:51:44
  Speaker 8: through the Origins of History can be bought on Amazon.
• 1:51:47
  Speaker 5: Really, thank you and Ricardo.
• 1:51:52
  Speaker 1: Well, I will start thanking Vincent's for accepting to come
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 1: and tells all about this fight. I think it's pretty
• 1:52:00
  Speaker 1: amazing and very high implications in terms of history and
• 1:52:05
  Speaker 1: shows us how much he is being suppressed and this
• 1:52:07
  Speaker 1: is just a small part of it. So imagine what
• 1:52:10
  Speaker 1: else can be suppressed if we can suppress twenty five
• 1:52:13
  Speaker 1: hundred figurines as hoax. So as to plug in, is
• 1:52:19
  Speaker 1: my time to turn the favorite down to Tyrone because
• 1:52:24
  Speaker 1: do buy his book. I think it's it's an excellent
• 1:52:27
  Speaker 1: one and just want to plug in the trialogues that
• 1:52:31
  Speaker 1: we do on Sundays. So if you messed today's episode,
• 1:52:34
  Speaker 1: go and check it out and thank you for having
• 1:52:37
  Speaker 1: me in it.
• 1:52:37
  Speaker 5: Oh no, of course, thank you for coming on and
• 1:52:41
  Speaker 5: joining us. Vincent.
• 1:52:42
  Speaker 2: Please let everybody know where they can get contact with
• 1:52:45
  Speaker 2: you or find any of your stuff.
• 1:52:47
  Speaker 10: Oh, thank you again for having me. And I'll be
• 1:52:52
  Speaker 10: on Twitter and talking about the site. There's there's I'll
• 1:53:00
  Speaker 10: post in the chat about my contact info after this
• 1:53:04
  Speaker 10: and be happy to share that. But yeah, it's a
• 1:53:07
  Speaker 10: great opportunity to share about the site and learn about it.
• 1:53:10
  Speaker 6: And again, thank you all. Loved y'all and appreciate you.
• 1:53:16
  Speaker 2: Of course, no, thank you very much. And before we
• 1:53:19
  Speaker 2: wrap it up, I do want to remind people just
• 1:53:21
  Speaker 2: to check. I'm not going to go through all of them,
• 1:53:22
  Speaker 2: but check the show notes or even the post on
• 1:53:25
  Speaker 2: YouTube or whatever. I've posted some stuff on social media.
• 1:53:28
  Speaker 2: There is a bunch of events that I will have
• 1:53:30
  Speaker 2: a booth at, but the one I do want to
• 1:53:32
  Speaker 2: remind the specifically October eighteenth, that'll be Fort Myers, Florida.
• 1:53:37
  Speaker 2: Charlie's Beyond Belief Brooke who's on Dark Florida podcast as
• 1:53:41
  Speaker 2: part of the Occult Rejects. She will be speaking there
• 1:53:44
  Speaker 2: and there will be a boot there and some of
• 1:53:46
  Speaker 2: us will be there. There's another podcast that might be
• 1:53:49
  Speaker 2: jumping into I don't want to you know, neflin Deth
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 2: Squad would actually be going to now, so you know,
• 1:53:57
  Speaker 2: I don't want to put them on the spot now
• 1:53:58
  Speaker 2: they don't show up, but it was like, well, you know,
• 1:54:00
  Speaker 2: next time, you guys are going blah blah blahlah. But no,
• 1:54:02
  Speaker 2: they hit me up and they might be going out too,
• 1:54:04
  Speaker 2: so it'll probably be a shit show back there by
• 1:54:07
  Speaker 2: the booth area then, so definitely a show up. Yeah,
• 1:54:11
  Speaker 2: let me plug that. And there will be a list
• 1:54:13
  Speaker 2: on the bottom again, like I said in the show
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 2: notes for the other events that will be in like
• 1:54:17
  Speaker 2: North Carolina, South Carolina and Jojo. But thank you all
• 1:54:21
  Speaker 2: again and uh thank you in the bottom uh, in
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 2: the chat, everybody that jumped in and that's what's up.
• 1:54:29
  Speaker 5: I really appreciate it. And uh yeah, Vincent, you really
• 1:54:32
  Speaker 5: uh you really killed it with that. I really appreciate it.
• 1:54:34
  Speaker 6: Man, thank you, thanks again. Everybody awesome.
• 1:54:38
  Speaker 2: Yes, and uh yeah, that's it. That's the end of
• 1:54:40
  Speaker 2: another record rejects until the next one. Everybody be well
• 1:54:43
  Speaker 2: later