Latest / Sharri / Sharri | 14 October
Transcript
- 0:07Speaker 1: Good evening.
- 0:07Speaker 2: Thanks, Andrew. Well, powerhouse show tonight. James Patterson, Matt Canavan,
- 0:12Speaker 2: Michael Schellenberger from the US and Michael Kroger. And a
- 0:17Speaker 2: lot coming up. There's tensions tonight between the Prime Minister
- 0:20Speaker 2: and his Treasurer. Home Affairs Minister Tony Burke is under
- 0:24Speaker 2: fire over social cohesion grants to hate preachers. And it's
- 0:28Speaker 2: trial by fire for President Trump's new press secretary. We'll
- 0:32Speaker 2: get into all of that. But first, to the dysfunctional
- 0:36Speaker 2: relationship between Anthony Albanese and Jim Chalmers. It's now spilled
- 0:41Speaker 2: into the public domain. I've been speaking to you for
- 0:44Speaker 2: over a week now about the deteriorating partnership. between the
- 0:48Speaker 2: Prime Minister and the Treasurer. It is troubled. And today,
- 0:53Speaker 2: this personal relationship, this growing enmity has been exposed publicly,
- 0:59Speaker 2: with Albanese and Chalmers each giving conflicting accounts over who
- 1:03Speaker 2: decided to backflip on the ATO's disastrous credit card ban
- 1:08Speaker 2: for bills. Albanese last night publicly took the personal credit
- 1:15Speaker 2: for this reversal of a bad policy to begin with.
- 1:19Speaker 2: Have a look.
- 1:20Speaker 3: Andrew did text me last Thursday morning. And by Friday morning,
- 1:27Speaker 3: we had an announcement. And that was an example of
- 1:34Speaker 3: a relationship that takes time to develop as well, that
- 1:37Speaker 3: trust where you can have a discussion saying it's in hand.
- 1:41Speaker 3: I agree with what you are saying.
- 1:45Speaker 2: But this is a version of events that was disputed
- 1:48Speaker 2: by Chalmers today, who said it wasn't the Prime Minister's
- 1:51Speaker 2: captain's call, but a team decision.
- 1:54Speaker 4: Were you rolled by the PA?
- 1:56Speaker 5: No, not at all. And it is true that there
- 2:00Speaker 5: were discussions with ACCI on Thursday. We were involved in
- 2:03Speaker 5: some of those discussions at office level. They were engaging
- 2:06Speaker 5: with my team on... Were.
- 2:09Speaker 4: You overlooked by ACCI?
- 2:11Speaker 5: If you just let me set it out for you,
- 2:13Speaker 5: Prime Minister and I were in discussions on Wednesday of
- 2:15Speaker 5: last week. He had a view, and I agree with it,
- 2:19Speaker 5: that we needed to step in to provide this longer
- 2:22Speaker 5: transition period to allow the ATO the time.
- 2:25Speaker 6: To get it right.
- 2:27Speaker 5: We had the same view. We had the same view.
- 2:31Speaker 2: So either Albanese received a text message from the head
- 2:35Speaker 2: of the Australian Chamber of Commerce on Thursday and it
- 2:38Speaker 2: was that text message that prompted the government to backflip,
- 2:42Speaker 2: or Chalmers had been looking at this for a couple
- 2:44Speaker 2: of days while he was overseas and working on changing course. Well,
- 2:49Speaker 2: Albanese later walked back his comments under pressure in question time.
- 2:55Speaker 3: The Treasurer and I had a discussion last week.
- 2:59Speaker 7: We convened.
- 3:01Speaker 3: The Expenditure Review Committee and we unanimously, right across the
- 3:07Speaker 3: leadership of the government, agreed that the decision by the
- 3:12Speaker 3: ATO to have a limited period of pause on the
- 3:22Speaker 3: ban that had been imposed.
- 3:25Speaker 2: But Albanese's initial deliberately inflammatory comments also detracted from a
- 3:30Speaker 2: major speech Chalmers gave where he said that One Nation
- 3:34Speaker 2: voters deserved empathy and respect.
- 3:38Speaker 5: Our role as progressive people is not to scold those
- 3:41Speaker 5: who see appeal in that message. It's not to mock them,
- 3:44Speaker 5: dare I say cancel them, or talk down to them.
- 3:47Speaker 5: And you do that by starting not from a place
- 3:50Speaker 5: of smug, Now, to.
- 3:57Speaker 2: Most of us, of course, it is obvious that all
- 3:59Speaker 2: voters deserve respect. But Chalmers needed to specifically say this
- 4:03Speaker 2: because Labor does have a tendency to mock Pauline Hanson
- 4:07Speaker 2: and her supporters, just like how the Democrats were patronising
- 4:11Speaker 2: towards Trump and his voters. Of course, with Hillary Clinton
- 4:15Speaker 2: famously describing MAGA voters as the basket of deplorables. Well,
- 4:21Speaker 2: Labor figure Cameron Milner writes that Albanese's insecurity and jealousy
- 4:25Speaker 2: meant he couldn't let Chalmers have the news cycle with
- 4:29Speaker 2: his plan to tackle One Nation. And Cameron also reiterates
- 4:32Speaker 2: that there's a lot of discussion still in Canberra about Chalmers'
- 4:36Speaker 2: own future. He writes there's already been plenty of briefing
- 4:40Speaker 2: by disaffected MPs and ministers complaining of Chalmers' poor performances
- 4:45Speaker 2: and Albanese's regular briefing against and kneecapping of his treasurer.
- 4:51Speaker 2: Chalmers is under pressure, his time remaining as Treasurer a
- 4:55Speaker 2: point of open speculation in Canberra. And he says Chalmers
- 4:59Speaker 2: knows the risk he's taken by contradicting his Prime Minister.
- 5:05Speaker 2: We've been speaking for over a week now right here
- 5:08Speaker 2: about the relationship between the pair. The discussion about Chalmers'
- 5:13Speaker 2: future is because Albanese knows Labor is in trouble over
- 5:17Speaker 2: the economy and the cost of living. And the polls
- 5:20Speaker 2: also show that Albanese personally is extremely unpopular. Although, of course,
- 5:25Speaker 2: you don't need polls to tell you that. But the
- 5:28Speaker 2: point is Albanese is blaming his treasurer. He's openly criticising
- 5:33Speaker 2: him to business and political figures, as I reported exclusively
- 5:38Speaker 2: last Thursday. Now, on the one hand, it's not unusual
- 5:43Speaker 2: for a Prime Minister and Treasurer to have a difficult relationship.
- 5:47Speaker 2: This was the case with Josh Frydenberg and Scott Morrison,
- 5:50Speaker 2: as Josh told me in my interview with him on
- 5:52Speaker 2: Monday night. And John Howard even spoke about his relationship
- 5:58Speaker 2: with Peter Costello yesterday at Frydenberg's book launch.
- 6:02Speaker 8: When I was Treasurer, I thought Prime Ministers were a
- 6:05Speaker 8: pain in the neck. And when I became prime minister,
- 6:08Speaker 8: I thought treasurers occasionally were a pain in the neck.
- 6:11Speaker 8: It's just the nature of the relationship.
- 6:15Speaker 2: Look, it's a funny line, but an important insight. So
- 6:18Speaker 2: a testy relationship isn't unusual. But here's the difference. This
- 6:23Speaker 2: is a live situation. We don't know yet how it
- 6:27Speaker 2: will all unfold and whether the Treasurer will survive. Because
- 6:33Speaker 2: Albanese is a ruthless political operator. As hopeless as he
- 6:38Speaker 2: truly is as Prime Minister, he's equally sharp and brilliant
- 6:43Speaker 2: at the politics. There's no rival he wouldn't shaft or
- 6:47Speaker 2: throw under the proverbial bus. And it seems the Treasurer
- 6:52Speaker 2: is in his sights. I'll come back to that shortly.
- 6:58Speaker 2: But now the Albanese government is under fire for giving
- 7:01Speaker 2: more of your hard-earned taxpayer dollars to Islamic organisations promoting extremism.
- 7:07Speaker 2: In revelations today, a group called the One Path Network
- 7:12Speaker 2: received more than $ 300, 000 in taxpayer funding from Home Affairs
- 7:15Speaker 2: in April. The Daily Telegraph reports the funding was intended
- 7:22Speaker 2: to strengthen social cohesion while increasing tolerance and understanding between
- 7:26Speaker 2: individuals and groups in Australia. But you've got to ask,
- 7:31Speaker 2: why would this organisation be given money to strengthen social
- 7:35Speaker 2: cohesion when it's published highly offensive commentary like this?
- 7:41Speaker 9: Zionists are Jewish supremacists, as some scholars call them.
- 7:48Speaker 7: Are mortal enemies of Islam.
- 7:50Speaker 6: In fact, many would argue that there's no moral difference
- 7:54Speaker 6: between putting people in gas chambers and burning people alive
- 7:59Speaker 6: inside tents. I don't know about you, but I kind
- 8:01Speaker 6: of get Nazi vibes.
- 8:04Speaker 2: And in another video, a speaker said the spate of
- 8:07Speaker 2: anti-Semitic attacks across Sydney were just fake.
- 8:12Speaker 7: It was all a sham.
- 8:14Speaker 6: And the lie came crumbling down. The entire saga and
- 8:19Speaker 6: string of attacks were nothing more than the doings of
- 8:22Speaker 6: an underworld, organised crime network, trying to mislead the police
- 8:27Speaker 6: and manipulate government resources. It had absolutely nothing to do
- 8:32Speaker 6: with anti-Semitism.
- 8:35Speaker 2: Of course, when the Jewish community is being targeted, that
- 8:39Speaker 2: is anti-Semitism. But do clips like that sound like promoting
- 8:43Speaker 2: social cohesion? I mean, it's quite the opposite. And in fact,
- 8:47Speaker 2: The Telegraph calls it Labor's gift to Jew hate and
- 8:52Speaker 2: inside how you paid for them to spread hatred. But
- 8:57Speaker 2: one of those speakers, Kamal Saylor, has hit back tonight
- 9:00Speaker 2: at The Daily Telegraph editor Ben English and bizarrely me
- 9:05Speaker 2: for these reports today.
- 9:07Speaker 6: This is a disgusting fat lie. The Daily Teller trash
- 9:11Speaker 6: just ran a full front page and double page image
- 9:14Speaker 6: spread with my face on it, accusing me of being
- 9:17Speaker 6: a Jew hater and anti-Semite.
- 9:21Speaker 2: But this is a broader issue than just one case.
- 9:25Speaker 2: The telly reports that the Albanese government has overseen a
- 9:29Speaker 2: tenfold explosion in multicultural grants, totalling more than $ 325 million
- 9:36Speaker 2: since coming to power. A staggering 94% of the money
- 9:40Speaker 2: has flowed into Labor-held electorates. Mr Burke's South West Sydney
- 9:45Speaker 2: electorate of Watson was among the biggest beneficiaries, receiving approximately
- 9:49Speaker 2: $ 45 million in funding, the bulk of the money going
- 9:54Speaker 2: to Islamic groups. And this, of course, comes as the
- 9:58Speaker 2: Albanese government refuses to say that it will stop funding
- 10:02Speaker 2: to the Islamic centre linked to the fly Dubai co-pilot. Now,
- 10:07Speaker 2: the co-pilot, who's accused of nearly causing a 9-11 style
- 10:11Speaker 2: terror attack, well, he's told UAE investigators that he was
- 10:15Speaker 2: radicalised in Australia and And the imam at the centre
- 10:19Speaker 2: he attended has made despicable comments like this.
- 10:23Speaker 10: I've always believed that these Zionists are not normal. They're
- 10:27Speaker 10: blood-sucking human beings.
- 10:30Speaker 2: They're scavengers.
- 10:32Speaker 10: They're not humanists, I swear by Allah. 82%, not 20%
- 10:35Speaker 10: or 15%, 82% believe in ethnic cleansing. And as we
- 10:37Speaker 10: spoke about last night, of course, it too has received
- 10:40Speaker 10: taxpayer funding.
- 10:48Speaker 2: Well, I thought it was interesting. I found this out today,
- 10:50Speaker 2: that back in February, a Victorian Liberal Senator, Evan Mulholland,
- 10:55Speaker 2: gave a condolence motion, a condolence motion on the Bondi
- 10:59Speaker 2: terror attack. And then he spoke about how he wanted
- 11:02Speaker 2: to reflect on the issue of anti-Semitism. And he raised
- 11:06Speaker 2: this very preacher in Parliament.
- 11:09Speaker 11: We certainly on the opposition side do not believe that
- 11:12Speaker 11: organisations whose leaders have expressed such hatred have should be
- 11:16Speaker 11: worthy of taxpayer funds, as has happened under this government.
- 11:21Speaker 11: We certainly do not believe these kind of individuals should
- 11:25Speaker 11: be given relevance or endorsements by the way of multiple
- 11:29Speaker 11: ministerial visits and multiple government MP visits, as has happened
- 11:34Speaker 11: in recent years under this government.
- 11:37Speaker 2: And then under parliamentary privilege, Evan made this point. He
- 11:42Speaker 2: linked the extremism of hate preachers with terror attacks like Bondi.
- 11:48Speaker 11: Hatred like this should never, ever be tolerated. Tragedies like
- 11:55Speaker 11: this don't happen out of nowhere. They begin with hateful
- 11:58Speaker 11: bile like this.
- 12:00Speaker 7: And the Liberals and Nationals.
- 12:02Speaker 12: Know where the line is.
- 12:04Speaker 11: And you will never see us associating with so-called leaders
- 12:08Speaker 11: who have spewed such hatred, and I would say incitement,
- 12:13Speaker 11: about our Jewish community here in this state. If we
- 12:16Speaker 11: don't know where the line is and we don't take
- 12:19Speaker 11: a stand and call it out for what it is,
- 12:22Speaker 11: because it might be politically inconvenient, we're not serving our
- 12:27Speaker 11: duty as elected leaders and we will end up with
- 12:30Speaker 11: more Bondi's.
- 12:33Speaker 2: I mean, well said. But the Albanese government has been
- 12:37Speaker 2: inexcusably weak on this issue, giving grants worth hundreds of
- 12:41Speaker 2: thousands of dollars to organisations promoting extremism. These grants are
- 12:45Speaker 2: often in the name of social cohesion. I mean, it's
- 12:48Speaker 2: a joke. Yet the so-called hate preachers are often openly
- 12:53Speaker 2: hostile to Western values, to Australian values. And even now,
- 12:58Speaker 2: with more centres being exposed every day, Tony Burke did
- 13:03Speaker 2: not say that he'll stop the funding to that centre
- 13:06Speaker 2: in Melbourne. He's passed the buck and shifted all of
- 13:09Speaker 2: this onto his junior colleague, Anne Ali. And she has
- 13:14Speaker 2: today confirmed that the grant given to One Path, the
- 13:18Speaker 2: network in Sydney we spoke about, at least that will
- 13:22Speaker 2: be terminated.
- 13:23Speaker 13: In April, the Albanese government handed a $ 300, 000 grant to
- 13:27Speaker 13: the One Path Network. Why on earth did the minister
- 13:30Speaker 13: give taxpayer funding to a group spilling hate-filled lies about Jews?
- 13:35Speaker 2: The decision that the member refers to was a decision
- 13:38Speaker 2: that was made by the department. The department has now
- 13:41Speaker 2: sent One Path a notice of intention to terminate. This
- 13:45Speaker 2: is a massive issue. It's a much broader issue. There
- 13:48Speaker 2: are dozens and dozens of grants... And these are home
- 13:52Speaker 2: affairs grants. Tony Burke is the minister. He needs to
- 13:56Speaker 2: sort this out and quickly. Well, for more on this now,
- 14:02Speaker 2: I'm joined by Shadow Defence Minister James Patterson. James, thank
- 14:05Speaker 2: you very much for your time. As I said, this
- 14:08Speaker 2: is a serious issue and one that you personally first
- 14:11Speaker 2: exposed at least a year or two years ago, the
- 14:14Speaker 2: fact that taxpayer-funded grants were being given to organisations promoting
- 14:18Speaker 2: extremism and What needs to be done about this?
- 14:23Speaker 7: You're right, Shari.
- 14:23Speaker 9: It was two years ago in Senate estimates that I
- 14:26Speaker 9: put to the Department of Home Affairs that they had
- 14:29Speaker 9: given taxpayers money under so-called social cohesion grants to organisations
- 14:34Speaker 9: that were promoting hatred of the Jewish community, anti-Semitism and extremism.
- 14:39Speaker 7: And at the time, I just thought it was sloppiness.
- 14:41Speaker 7: I thought it was carelessness.
- 14:42Speaker 9: I thought the department was not doing adequate due diligence
- 14:46Speaker 9: and they were handing out taxpayers money to organisations who
- 14:48Speaker 9: never should have received it. This has now happened so
- 14:51Speaker 9: many times. This is now continuing to happen even after
- 14:55Speaker 9: Bondi that it is very difficult to say anymore that
- 14:59Speaker 9: it's just incompetence, that it's just laziness, that it's just
- 15:02Speaker 9: a failure to do due diligence. It looks to me
- 15:05Speaker 9: like it's deliberate. And I don't think it's a coincidence
- 15:08Speaker 9: that the person ultimately responsible, the minister ultimately responsible, is
- 15:12Speaker 9: Tony Burke. And it is his electorate which is a
- 15:15Speaker 9: primary beneficiary. He would know these organisations and these leaders
- 15:19Speaker 9: better than anyone And given the previous failures of Home
- 15:22Speaker 9: Affairs to adequately vet organisations, he should have taken a
- 15:26Speaker 9: personal interest to make sure that not one cent of taxpayers'
- 15:30Speaker 9: money went to an Islamist extremist organisation. The fact that
- 15:34Speaker 9: it has is his responsibility, that he must own and
- 15:37Speaker 9: he must take responsibility for.
- 15:39Speaker 7: Tony Burke owns this.
- 15:42Speaker 2: By the way, I put questions to him today about
- 15:45Speaker 2: any links he has to OnePath and he came back
- 15:47Speaker 2: strongly and said he's got nothing to do with them,
- 15:50Speaker 2: no relationship with them whatsoever. So just adding that in there.
- 15:54Speaker 2: James Annerley said in Parliament that she's looking at using
- 15:58Speaker 2: the technology that screens visas to screen grants. Do you
- 16:03Speaker 2: think that this seems like a good solution? Or is
- 16:06Speaker 2: there another way? I mean, these grants weren't issued under
- 16:09Speaker 2: the Coalition government, were they?
- 16:12Speaker 9: We didn't have this problem when the coalition was last
- 16:14Speaker 9: in power. We were not handing taxpayers' money over to
- 16:17Speaker 9: Islamist extremists who were using it to undermine social cohesion
- 16:21Speaker 9: and damage our national unity. It's only been a problem
- 16:25Speaker 9: under Labor in recent years. They should have known from
- 16:27Speaker 9: 7 October onwards and they should have known from two
- 16:29Speaker 9: years ago when they got this warning in Senate estimates
- 16:32Speaker 9: that their processes were not up to scratch.
- 16:34Speaker 7: The fact that it's only now.
- 16:36Speaker 9: long after Bondi, long after, in my view, extremism like
- 16:41Speaker 9: this contributed to events like Bondi, that they are now
- 16:44Speaker 9: saying that they maybe look at some technology that might
- 16:46Speaker 9: fix this. They just shouldn't have given this money in
- 16:49Speaker 9: the first place. There's no excuse for it and political
- 16:51Speaker 9: leadership from the ministerial level should have stopped it.
- 16:54Speaker 2: And just finally, quickly on this issue before we move
- 16:56Speaker 2: on to other topics, quite extraordinary that your colleague Evan
- 17:00Speaker 2: had spoken about one of these places months ago in
- 17:04Speaker 2: the Victorian Senate.
- 17:07Speaker 9: That's exactly right. Evan's shown great leadership in the Victorian
- 17:09Speaker 9: Parliament on this issue. He's courageously called this out and
- 17:12Speaker 9: copped a pretty serious backlash from the Labor Party in Victoria,
- 17:16Speaker 9: who have knowingly associated with these extremists as well, plus
- 17:20Speaker 9: some elements of the Muslim community in Victoria who do
- 17:24Speaker 9: have extreme views and should be condemned for them. And
- 17:27Speaker 9: he was ahead of the curve in calling this out,
- 17:29Speaker 9: in warning people about it, and they should have heeded
- 17:31Speaker 9: those warnings.
- 17:32Speaker 2: Yeah, indeed. Just before we went to air tonight, the
- 17:35Speaker 2: Coalition had a major win, it looks like. The reports are, James,
- 17:41Speaker 2: that you've managed to team up with the crossbench in
- 17:44Speaker 2: the Senate to block Labor's changes to private health insurance.
- 17:49Speaker 2: So can you tell us what's happened here and how
- 17:51Speaker 2: this will impact on the more than three million older
- 17:54Speaker 2: Australians who were looking at premium rises of hundreds of dollars?
- 18:00Speaker 7: That's right, Shari.
- 18:01Speaker 9: So in their wisdom, the Albanese government decided that the
- 18:03Speaker 9: best way to save money was to take away rebates
- 18:06Speaker 9: from pensioners and self-funded retirees who use private health insurance,
- 18:10Speaker 9: and in doing so, take pressure off the public system.
- 18:13Speaker 9: Australians aged 65 and over were going to be paying
- 18:16Speaker 9: up to $ 800 each more, $ 1, 600 for couples.
- 18:20Speaker 7: For their private health insurance in the middle of a
- 18:23Speaker 7: cost of living crisis in.
- 18:24Speaker 9: This incredibly mean-spirited move by the Albanese government. But they
- 18:29Speaker 9: have been defeated in the Senate today, led by the
- 18:31Speaker 9: Liberals and Nationals, but supported across the chamber by other parties,
- 18:35Speaker 9: including the Greens. And it has left Mark Butler in
- 18:38Speaker 9: a very embarrassing place. I mean, this guy's been trailing
- 18:40Speaker 9: his coat as a future leader of the Labor Party.
- 18:43Speaker 9: to replace Anthony Albanese, and his signature budget savings measure
- 18:47Speaker 9: has just blown up in his face, and so it
- 18:49Speaker 9: should have, given how cruel it was to older Australians.
- 18:54Speaker 2: I just want to go back to the comments that
- 18:56Speaker 2: the Treasurer made about One Nation in that speech. I mean,
- 18:59Speaker 2: we know both major parties are really struggling to know
- 19:02Speaker 2: how to respond to this new phenomenon of the rise
- 19:06Speaker 2: of One Nation. The Treasurer says Labor shouldn't mock One
- 19:10Speaker 2: Nation voters.
- 19:11Speaker 11: I mean.
- 19:11Speaker 2: Quite an extraordinary thing to have to say. But it
- 19:15Speaker 2: is the case that the Coalition doesn't know how to
- 19:17Speaker 2: react to the rise of Pauline Hanson either. How do
- 19:21Speaker 2: you think the parties should respond?
- 19:25Speaker 9: Well, our primary political opponent is the Labor Party. The
- 19:28Speaker 9: purpose that the Liberal Party exists for is to get
- 19:30Speaker 9: the Labor Party out of office and to govern well
- 19:32Speaker 9: for Australians. But One Nation is also a political competitor
- 19:36Speaker 9: for us that seems very intent on trying to take
- 19:39Speaker 9: seats off the Liberal and National Party, judging by the
- 19:42Speaker 9: amount of time they spend in our seats, even though
- 19:45Speaker 9: they say that their aim too is to get rid
- 19:47Speaker 9: of the Labor Party. And so when One Nation... makes
- 19:50Speaker 9: policy errors, when they say silly things, I think they
- 19:53Speaker 9: can and should be called out upon that. But I
- 19:55Speaker 9: agree with the Treasurer that voters must always be treated
- 19:58Speaker 9: with respect, that they have legitimate grievances with our political system,
- 20:03Speaker 9: with the direction of our country, that they have understandable frustrations,
- 20:06Speaker 9: including with the Liberal and National parties, and that we
- 20:09Speaker 9: need to listen to them and do better to earn
- 20:11Speaker 9: back their trust and support.
- 20:13Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's extraordinary that some of the Coalition's
- 20:16Speaker 2: best performers, like Andrew Hastie, who should have a big
- 20:22Speaker 2: future ahead of him, I mean, he could be gone
- 20:24Speaker 2: at the next election because of One Nation's campaign. Just finally, James,
- 20:29Speaker 2: you've introduced a bill today which would give both houses
- 20:33Speaker 2: the power to block the sale of key military sites. Now,
- 20:36Speaker 2: you've done this amid this battle to save Victoria Barracks,
- 20:40Speaker 2: which you've had a petition on, you've been campaigning on.
- 20:43Speaker 2: I mean, given so many very experienced war veterans have
- 20:48Speaker 2: spoken out against this, it is hard to believe that
- 20:50Speaker 2: the Defence Minister, Richard Miles, is digging his heels in.
- 20:55Speaker 9: Shari, when I first came on your program to discuss
- 20:57Speaker 9: this several months ago now, there were about 11,000 Australians
- 21:01Speaker 9: who'd signed my petition. As of tonight, it's up to
- 21:04Speaker 9: 108,000 Australians who have said, Australia's military heritage belongs to
- 21:09Speaker 9: all of us. It is not the plaything of the
- 21:11Speaker 9: Labor Party and it should not be flogged off. And
- 21:14Speaker 9: none less an authority as Sir Peter Cosgrove, the former
- 21:17Speaker 9: Governor-General and Chief of the Defence Force, has called out
- 21:20Speaker 9: Richard Miles on this.
- 21:21Speaker 7: So to give effect to the.
- 21:23Speaker 9: Wishes of those Australians, I've introduced the Protecting Australia's Military
- 21:26Speaker 9: Heritage Bill in the Senate today. And if it passes,
- 21:30Speaker 9: it will allow the Senate or the House of Representatives
- 21:32Speaker 9: to stop the sale of any individual base by making
- 21:36Speaker 9: it an instrument that has to be issued by the
- 21:38Speaker 9: finance minister, which would be disallowable. This means if the
- 21:41Speaker 9: government wants to sell a military base, they actually have
- 21:44Speaker 9: to make the case for it.
- 21:45Speaker 7: They can't just unilaterally do it.
- 21:47Speaker 9: If there's a legitimate case for selling some unused block
- 21:50Speaker 9: of land, fine. But that does not include Victoria Barracks,
- 21:53Speaker 9: Sydney or Melbourne. It does not include HMAS Penguin. It
- 21:56Speaker 9: does not include Irwin Barracks. It does not include so
- 21:58Speaker 9: many other precious items of heritage around our country. And
- 22:02Speaker 9: if you want to add your voice, please visit senatorpatterson.com.au
- 22:05Speaker 9: to sign the petition.
- 22:07Speaker 2: Yeah, it's an important petition. I was going to ask
- 22:09Speaker 2: you for a reminder about the link for viewers, but
- 22:11Speaker 2: you've done that there. Yeah, it is really important. All right.
- 22:16Speaker 2: James Patterson, great as always to have you on the program.
- 22:18Speaker 2: Thank you. And let's turn to some other news now.
- 22:21Speaker 2: And One Nation's ranks are slowly being filled with Liberal
- 22:24Speaker 2: defectors or failed coalition politicians. Paul Sakar reports that those
- 22:30Speaker 2: hoping to stand for One Nation at the New South
- 22:32Speaker 2: Wales election include former Liberal candidate Catherine Deaves. You remember
- 22:36Speaker 2: she was controversial. Former Liberal Senator Holly Hughes and former
- 22:41Speaker 2: New South Wales MP Lou Amato. And I'll just mention
- 22:44Speaker 2: Holly did reveal on this program for the first time
- 22:47Speaker 2: that she was putting herself forward as a One Nation candidate.
- 22:51Speaker 2: Joining me for more now is former Victoria Liberal Party
- 22:54Speaker 2: President Michael Kroger and News24 host Joe Hildebrand. Great to
- 22:58Speaker 2: see you both.
- 22:59Speaker 3: Good evening.
- 22:59Speaker 14: Great to be here.
- 23:00Speaker 15: How are you?
- 23:00Speaker 2: Michael, you know, from Barnaby Joyce to Holly Hughes, disgruntled
- 23:05Speaker 2: former Coalition politicians are turning to One Nation.
- 23:12Speaker 1: They are.
- 23:12Speaker 15: And in the Upper House, I think they need 4.5%
- 23:14Speaker 15: to get elected. So they might win 27. They'll probably
- 23:18Speaker 15: win six seats in the Upper House in the New
- 23:20Speaker 15: South Wales Parliament out of 42.
- 23:20Speaker 1: So.
- 23:22Speaker 15: They're going to be a very significant bloc. But that's
- 23:24Speaker 15: how these parties form, disgruntled people. And, you know, they
- 23:31Speaker 15: build up their numbers as more and more people get disgruntled.
- 23:34Speaker 15: And that's what's happened here. But the answer, by the way,
- 23:38Speaker 15: to the whole issue of, you know, should the Liberal
- 23:40Speaker 15: Party be chasing One Nation? Should it not? What should
- 23:43Speaker 15: Taylor be doing?
- 23:43Speaker 10: Yeah.
- 23:44Speaker 2: There's a very.
- 23:45Speaker 15: Simple answer to all this, which is just to change
- 23:47Speaker 15: the conversation. Think of something new to say. A new
- 23:51Speaker 15: policy idea, something inspiring. For as long as you keep
- 23:55Speaker 15: talking about immigration, you will lose because the electorate have
- 23:58Speaker 15: decided that Hansen's 30 year crusade against mass immigration, especially
- 24:05Speaker 15: Muslim immigration, which he says has been too much of,
- 24:08Speaker 15: the electorate have said, she's correct. If we want to
- 24:11Speaker 15: vote on what immigration is an issue, we're voting for Hansen.
- 24:14Speaker 15: There's no point the Liberal Party making this a big issue.
- 24:17Speaker 15: So perhaps they should change the conversation and think of
- 24:19Speaker 15: some new ideas and have a new front. For example,
- 24:23Speaker 15: means testing every single federal government payment for a start.
- 24:30Speaker 2: It's a good point because, Joe, I remember last week
- 24:33Speaker 2: there was a poll and I can't remember exactly whether
- 24:36Speaker 2: it was our poll at News 24 or the Resolve one,
- 24:39Speaker 2: but one of the polls had cost of living as
- 24:41Speaker 2: an issue and The coalition was still, you know, ahead
- 24:45Speaker 2: of either Labor or One Nation on that. So voters
- 24:49Speaker 2: still think that they would turn to the coalition to
- 24:53Speaker 2: fix the economy. This is the biggest issue. So this
- 24:55Speaker 2: is where the fight needs to be for the coalition.
- 24:58Speaker 14: Yeah, absolutely. And you've seen the coalition sort of change
- 25:00Speaker 14: tack a bit on this. Angus Taylor has been talking
- 25:02Speaker 14: about the coalition's economic credentials as opposed to One Nation.
- 25:06Speaker 14: I mean, cost of living is front and centre in
- 25:08Speaker 14: every poll. It's front and centre in Labor's own internal
- 25:11Speaker 14: polling as well. The question is, who do you blame
- 25:14Speaker 14: for cost of living? Is it Anthony Albanese? Is it
- 25:16Speaker 14: high immigration? Is it a combination of both? So that's
- 25:19Speaker 14: when immigration comes into it. It's not an issue that
- 25:22Speaker 14: people just throw out there straight away. It's cost of
- 25:24Speaker 14: living and managing the economy, that sort of stuff. The
- 25:28Speaker 14: interesting thing, I suppose, with the defection of Liberals to
- 25:31Speaker 14: One Nation is that it exposes the sort of catch-22
- 25:36Speaker 14: at the heart of One Nation's rise and indeed the
- 25:39Speaker 14: Liberal Party's survival, which is that if One Nation is
- 25:43Speaker 14: just going to be basically the coalition but with a
- 25:46Speaker 14: different name and the same people who left the coalition
- 25:49Speaker 14: because it wasn't right-wing enough for them or conservative enough
- 25:51Speaker 14: for them, it will end up being just another kind
- 25:54Speaker 14: of mainstream political party and then you might have a
- 25:57Speaker 14: rump of Liberal sort of moderates And unless those parties
- 26:02Speaker 14: form a coalition, there is no way they'll be able
- 26:04Speaker 14: to form government. And so we'd end up turning into
- 26:07Speaker 14: something resembling, you know, a European parliament. And then One Nation,
- 26:11Speaker 14: of course, by acting like a mainstream party or having
- 26:13Speaker 14: to become one to get the seats it needs, have
- 26:15Speaker 14: that kind of discipline, professional politicians, then it's suddenly not
- 26:19Speaker 14: the maverick party.
- 26:20Speaker 2: Which is what we've seen a bit in the UK
- 26:22Speaker 2: with 5% of the vote coming off reform and going
- 26:24Speaker 2: to restore.
- 26:25Speaker 6: Exactly. Yeah.
- 26:26Speaker 2: All right, I want to talk about Josh Frydenberg. We
- 26:28Speaker 2: haven't spoken about him yet. Tonight we're 26 minutes in,
- 26:31Speaker 2: so new record.
- 26:32Speaker 14: Got to fulfil our contractual obligation to Josh Frydenberg.
- 26:35Speaker 2: No, there's nothing like that, Joe.
- 26:36Speaker 7: I know.
- 26:37Speaker 2: Look, his book NPR Tour has... It's unnerving the Liberals.
- 26:42Speaker 2: It's all everyone's talking about. Is he going to come back?
- 26:45Speaker 2: But the Liberals are furious that he's dared to write
- 26:47Speaker 2: a book, dared to get some publicity for it, and
- 26:50Speaker 2: here's even what Anthony Albanese said in Parliament today.
- 26:54Speaker 3: You can't turn on a TV without seeing Josh Frydenberg.
- 26:58Speaker 3: He's out there every single day.
- 27:02Speaker 2: Look, it's the midpoint of an Albanese term, and surely
- 27:06Speaker 2: that must be the best time to release a book
- 27:08Speaker 2: like this. It doesn't interfere in the federal election. And
- 27:12Speaker 2: as for the Victorian state election, Michael, I mean, as
- 27:16Speaker 2: the former president of the Liberal Party yourself, does anyone
- 27:20Speaker 2: seriously think that Victorian voters heading to the polls in
- 27:23Speaker 2: some 50 days' time are going to be thinking about
- 27:26Speaker 2: Josh's book then?
- 27:27Speaker 3: No.
- 27:29Speaker 15: No-one's thinking about Josh's book on November 28th. It will
- 27:34Speaker 15: have zero impact on the Victorian state election. And, by
- 27:40Speaker 15: the way, it's a low-profile book launch. I've just come
- 27:44Speaker 15: from the Melbourne launch where at the Malvern Town Hall
- 27:47Speaker 15: there's a mere 650 people at his book launch.
- 27:51Speaker 2: Amazing.
- 27:51Speaker 15: So including the AFL great Gerard Healy, who gave a
- 27:56Speaker 15: magnificent speech, Jennifer Westacott, who spoke beautifully, No, it's not
- 28:01Speaker 15: interfering with the state election in the slightest. And I,
- 28:05Speaker 15: for one, would welcome Frydenberg back into Parliament, that we'd
- 28:09Speaker 15: be going so well that we don't need people like him.
- 28:11Speaker 6: Really?
- 28:11Speaker 2: We're on 20%, Sharon.
- 28:12Speaker 7: Exactly.
- 28:13Speaker 2: Exactly.
- 28:14Speaker 15: I mean, we had the worst ever result we had
- 28:17Speaker 15: last May and we got 32%, right? So what's that?
- 28:23Speaker 15: 17 months on, 17 months on from the last election,
- 28:27Speaker 15: we've gone from 32 to 20 or to 22 on
- 28:28Speaker 15: a good day.
- 28:31Speaker 16: Mm-hmm.
- 28:31Speaker 6: Really?
- 28:32Speaker 4: Yeah.
- 28:32Speaker 15: I don't think that's going well. That would be my view,
- 28:35Speaker 15: that things aren't going well.
- 28:36Speaker 3: Yeah.
- 28:36Speaker 15: The fact that there are some people apparently saying to
- 28:39Speaker 15: the newspapers off the record that they don't want Frydenberg back,
- 28:43Speaker 15: goodness me, wow.
- 28:45Speaker 2: Yeah.
- 28:45Speaker 12: Good luck to them.
- 28:47Speaker 2: I agree with you, Michael. I said, you know, the
- 28:50Speaker 2: party would be lucky to have him return. But, Joe,
- 28:53Speaker 2: I think it just shows how threatened... all those Liberals
- 28:57Speaker 2: are who are coming out against, who are leaking against him.
- 28:59Speaker 14: Yeah, I think it's pretty obvious that Angus Taylor is
- 29:03Speaker 14: not going to be Prime Minister of Australia. I think
- 29:05Speaker 14: Josh Frydenberg is a huge talent. As you know, we're
- 29:08Speaker 14: both friends of Josh's and we're both at the book
- 29:10Speaker 14: launch yesterday. I wrote a column saying that he could
- 29:13Speaker 14: be the Liberal Party's great white hope, whether he would be,
- 29:17Speaker 14: you know, considered right wing enough to bring a whole
- 29:20Speaker 14: bunch of, you know, disaffected voters from my nation from
- 29:25Speaker 14: the right. Maybe not. But I think it's because he's
- 29:27Speaker 14: just got those rock solid economic credentials. And he's clearly
- 29:30Speaker 14: someone who thinks about politics, thinks about Australia, thinks about
- 29:35Speaker 14: policy responses in a way that we haven't really seen
- 29:39Speaker 14: from the Liberal Party. much since 2022. So I think Scott,
- 29:43Speaker 14: I think Josh Frydenberg and also Andrew Hastie are both
- 29:46Speaker 14: big talents and the idea that the Libs might be
- 29:49Speaker 14: trying to knock off one of them and one nation
- 29:51Speaker 14: is trying to knock off the other is passing strange.
- 29:54Speaker 2: No, I completely agree. I mean, and just to reiterate
- 29:57Speaker 2: how much I agree with what you said, Michael, I mean,
- 29:59Speaker 2: if the Liberals had a primary of even in the 30s,
- 30:03Speaker 2: you know, but 40%, fine, they don't need Josh, but
- 30:06Speaker 2: they need all the help they can get.
- 30:08Speaker 1: Of course.
- 30:09Speaker 15: Can I just make one other point? I said to
- 30:11Speaker 15: someone the other day, when was the last time an
- 30:13Speaker 15: Australian political leader gave an inspirational speech, a spine-tingling inspirational
- 30:20Speaker 15: speech which grabbed, you know, the thoughts of a nation,
- 30:25Speaker 15: unified a nation, you know, built people as one behind
- 30:29Speaker 15: a speech.
- 30:30Speaker 6: Yeah. When?
- 30:31Speaker 2: Josh Bondar.
- 30:31Speaker 15: There's only been one.
- 30:32Speaker 6: Yeah.
- 30:32Speaker 15: There's only been one that I can remember. Maybe Hawke
- 30:36Speaker 15: over Tiananmen Square, you know, what's that, 35 years ago.
- 30:40Speaker 15: But Frydenberg's speech is the only speech I can remember
- 30:43Speaker 15: that in the modern era, which was an inspirational speech
- 30:48Speaker 15: and people looked at him and thought, my God, that
- 30:50Speaker 15: was just a magnificent address for the times.
- 30:55Speaker 6: I agree.
- 30:55Speaker 7: So if they don't want him back, well, good luck
- 30:57Speaker 7: to them.
- 30:57Speaker 2: I agree. I was standing there in person watching it
- 31:00Speaker 2: and I was floored and I thought, I have never
- 31:03Speaker 2: seen anything like this in my lifetime. Joe Hildebrand, Michael Kroger,
- 31:07Speaker 2: thank you both so much. I also just wanted to
- 31:10Speaker 2: quickly let you know, or at least Melbourne viewers, that
- 31:14Speaker 2: we are having a Melbourne book launch for our book
- 31:16Speaker 2: Bondi Terror. The opposition leader and maybe the next Premier,
- 31:20Speaker 2: Jess Wilson, is launching it. My colleague... Andrew Bolt is
- 31:25Speaker 2: our brilliant emcee. Senator James Patterson will be there too.
- 31:29Speaker 2: If you'd like details, please message me on Instagram privately
- 31:34Speaker 2: just with the title Melbourne Book Launch and I'll send
- 31:37Speaker 2: you the link to register.
- 31:39Speaker 1: All right.
- 31:40Speaker 2: Still to come, President Trump's press secretary faces a hostile
- 31:43Speaker 2: White House press pack. Now there's speculation she won't last.
- 31:47Speaker 2: Plus why Matt Canavan is accusing the Albanese government of
- 31:51Speaker 2: coming after Australian pineapples. What's he talking about? It's after
- 31:55Speaker 2: the break. Well, in breaking news, New South Wales Premier
- 32:01Speaker 2: Chris Minns has tonight said he'll scrap stamp duty for
- 32:05Speaker 2: businesses forced to restructure as a result of the Albanese
- 32:08Speaker 2: government's controversial tax changes. Now, the Albanese government today tabled
- 32:13Speaker 2: legislation to put a minimum 30% tax on trusts, plus
- 32:16Speaker 2: the overhaul of negative gearing. And many people in businesses
- 32:20Speaker 2: would be looking to restructure. But the problem is if
- 32:23Speaker 2: they restructure their trusts, they may be liable for stamp duty.
- 32:27Speaker 2: So the New South Wales government has announced a state-based
- 32:30Speaker 2: relief scheme, the first state to do so. And Mark
- 32:33Speaker 2: Burris broke this story a little while ago.
- 32:36Speaker 14: The men's government saying, look, if we get re-elected, we
- 32:39Speaker 14: will ensure that this unintended consequence state government.
- 32:44Speaker 2: Tax, otherwise known as stamp duty, will not be applied.
- 32:47Speaker 7: That's the bottom line.
- 32:49Speaker 2: And Nationals leader Matt Canavan joins me now. Matt, this
- 32:53Speaker 2: is quite complicated, but basically Chris Minns is helping Jim
- 32:57Speaker 2: Chalmers out.
- 33:00Speaker 17: Well, Jim Chalmers is hurting the taxpayers of New South
- 33:03Speaker 17: Wales too. Keep in mind that someone has to pay
- 33:05Speaker 17: for this and That means there are fewer resources in
- 33:08Speaker 17: New South Wales to fund public services thanks to an
- 33:10Speaker 17: Australian government decision. And so why would the federal government
- 33:15Speaker 17: make tax changes which put at risk hospital services, education services,
- 33:20Speaker 17: road upgrades in New South Wales?
- 33:23Speaker 7: And all states are affected by this.
- 33:26Speaker 17: State revenues are already way down thanks to the impact
- 33:28Speaker 17: of the capital gains tax changes, the negative gearing tax
- 33:31Speaker 17: changes on property markets. This is a massive disaster, this budget.
- 33:36Speaker 17: And you've got to ask yourself, Shari, at a time
- 33:39Speaker 17: of almost a historic cost of living crisis, a historic
- 33:45Speaker 17: fall in our productivity performance, declining real wages and living standards,
- 33:49Speaker 17: why is the Australian government so focused on making so
- 33:53Speaker 17: many complicated tax changes that it destroys economic confidence and
- 33:57Speaker 17: imposes large red tape and administrative burdens onto small business
- 34:03Speaker 17: to such an extent that the state governments have to
- 34:05Speaker 17: bail them out for it.
- 34:06Speaker 7: Why are they doing that?
- 34:08Speaker 17: That is not the priority. It should not be the
- 34:10Speaker 17: priority for our Australian government right now. They should be
- 34:12Speaker 17: focused on getting inflation down, focused on getting productivity up,
- 34:16Speaker 17: focusing on ending mass migration so we don't have to
- 34:20Speaker 17: prop up our economic statistics with artificial numbers of people.
- 34:25Speaker 17: That should be the government, that should be the focus
- 34:27Speaker 17: of this government. It will be the focus of a
- 34:28Speaker 17: Liberal and National government, I can tell you that, Angus
- 34:31Speaker 17: Taylor and I and our team have a plan to
- 34:33Speaker 17: do all those things, to lower taxes, to get energy
- 34:36Speaker 17: prices down and productivity up and to end Labor's mass
- 34:39Speaker 17: migration too.
- 34:41Speaker 2: There's no question. I mean, the actual cost plus the
- 34:44Speaker 2: loss of productivity from businesses having to comply with all
- 34:47Speaker 2: these tax changes is just extraordinary. Matt, the Coalition is
- 34:52Speaker 2: vowing to scrap a rule that forces planning authorities to
- 34:56Speaker 2: consider the climate impacts of coal burnt overseas. Matt, you're
- 35:00Speaker 2: saying that Australian businesses shouldn't have to report on emissions
- 35:04Speaker 2: that they can't control.
- 35:07Speaker 17: Yeah, look, this has been a little notice change that
- 35:10Speaker 17: this government has made. It's at odds with where most
- 35:13Speaker 17: of the rest of the world is going, but this
- 35:15Speaker 17: government is effectively requiring large businesses to to report the
- 35:19Speaker 17: emissions of all of their customers and suppliers. Now, what
- 35:23Speaker 17: that means then, of course, is that for, say, a
- 35:26Speaker 17: large business like a bank, they have to go to
- 35:28Speaker 17: all of the people they provide finance to and ask
- 35:31Speaker 17: them to tell the government what their emissions are. So
- 35:34Speaker 17: farms and small businesses who bank with a certain company
- 35:38Speaker 17: will have to go and report to their bank what
- 35:40Speaker 17: their emissions are on their farm or in their small business.
- 35:42Speaker 17: We're already seeing an army of consultants reporting licking their lips,
- 35:48Speaker 17: turning up at Farmgate saying, hey, we can do your
- 35:51Speaker 17: emissions reporting for just the knockdown price.
- 35:54Speaker 7: Of $ 3, 000. I've heard this report.
- 35:56Speaker 17: And that might not sound like a lot, but when
- 35:58Speaker 17: you add that up and all the other costs, well,
- 36:01Speaker 17: it is a lot for a farmer who might be
- 36:02Speaker 17: struggling right now with the fuel prices going up.
- 36:05Speaker 2: Absolutely.
- 36:06Speaker 17: And we've got to keep in mind none of these
- 36:08Speaker 17: jobs that are created in the consultant class produce anything.
- 36:14Speaker 17: They don't produce any food. They don't make any products.
- 36:16Speaker 17: They don't serve any people at a cafe or a restaurant.
- 36:19Speaker 17: It is all just waste and it's one of the
- 36:21Speaker 17: reasons our productivity is through the floor. And so we
- 36:24Speaker 17: would scrap all these requirements and so that small businesses
- 36:27Speaker 17: don't have to increase their compliance costs to meet this
- 36:31Speaker 17: government's net zero obsession.
- 36:32Speaker 2: All right. Let's talk pineapples, Matt. Sentence I never thought
- 36:36Speaker 2: I'd say on air. But the Albanese government has a
- 36:39Speaker 2: proposal to allow imports of decrowned pineapples from India and Indonesia,
- 36:45Speaker 2: and you are campaigning against this. So why are you?
- 36:52Speaker 17: Well, I think we don't need foreign pineapples in this country.
- 36:55Speaker 17: I love good, fresh, local Australian pineapples. We've got plenty
- 36:58Speaker 17: of them. There's no shortage of them. They're not even
- 37:01Speaker 17: affected by shortages like other fruits sometimes are. And you
- 37:05Speaker 17: just can't protect against these diseases. So you mentioned there
- 37:07Speaker 17: that pineapples have to be de-crowned. And someone will also,
- 37:11Speaker 17: apparently under the rules that the Labor government are considering,
- 37:14Speaker 17: have to hand-pick all the leaves off the bottom of
- 37:16Speaker 17: the pineapple. Now, the problem there is, as we demonstrated
- 37:19Speaker 17: on air, as you can see just on your screens,
- 37:23Speaker 17: you can't necessarily get rid of all the leaf tissues
- 37:25Speaker 17: with your hands. And obviously people can make mistakes. It
- 37:27Speaker 17: only takes one pineapple with a disease called heart rot
- 37:30Speaker 17: to come into this country. It's actually called the exploding
- 37:33Speaker 17: pineapple disease. And we don't want that in our country.
- 37:36Speaker 7: We don't need.
- 37:36Speaker 17: Diseases here, which would put at risk our own local
- 37:39Speaker 17: pineapple industry. And today we've called on the government to
- 37:43Speaker 17: scrap this foreign pineapple import plan. I don't think we
- 37:46Speaker 17: need Indian or Indonesian pineapples. We can rely on good
- 37:49Speaker 17: Australian ones this summer and this Christmas. Get out there
- 37:51Speaker 17: and eat them as it gets warmer.
- 37:53Speaker 2: They're sweet already. That's for sure. It looks like you
- 37:55Speaker 2: would have eaten a lot of pineapples today in Parliament
- 37:58Speaker 2: House in Canberra.
- 38:01Speaker 17: They were beautiful, although it was a bit cold here today, Shara.
- 38:04Speaker 17: It wasn't exactly tropical weather.
- 38:06Speaker 2: Oh, well, it's bad weather in Sydney as well, that's
- 38:10Speaker 2: for sure. All right, Matt Canavan, great to see you.
- 38:13Speaker 2: Coming up, can Trump's new press secretary handle the heat?
- 38:16Speaker 2: And Michael Schellenberg is here in studio accusing the government
- 38:20Speaker 2: of sinister censorship plans. That's next. Welcome back with a
- 38:27Speaker 2: highly controversial digital duty of care bill is said to
- 38:30Speaker 2: be introduced to Parliament tomorrow. American journalist Michael Schellenberger has
- 38:35Speaker 2: travelled to Australia to argue against these laws. The communications minister,
- 38:40Speaker 2: Annika Wells, even gave him a name check.
- 38:44Speaker 4: Welcome to the country, Michael, if these reports are true.
- 38:48Speaker 4: If your products are safe, this costs you nothing. And
- 38:51Speaker 4: it's not about what people say. It is about what
- 38:53Speaker 4: platforms do. We are regulating the machine here, not the message.
- 38:58Speaker 2: And I'm pleased to say Michael joins me at the
- 39:00Speaker 2: desk now. And I am genuinely happy to see you here, Michael.
- 39:03Speaker 2: She probably isn't, given your extensive reporting on this issue.
- 39:07Speaker 2: I mean, you've been really exposing... sinister side of this
- 39:13Speaker 2: legislation that both the eSafety Commissioner and the government have,
- 39:17Speaker 2: I mean it's in the legislation, the use of sock
- 39:19Speaker 2: puppets or bots to change the narrative.
- 39:23Speaker 12: By far the craziest thing because two years ago when
- 39:25Speaker 12: I was here pointing out the problems with this misinformation
- 39:28Speaker 12: bill they wanted to crack down on these fake accounts.
- 39:32Speaker 12: Now the government wants to use fake accounts in an
- 39:35Speaker 12: unlimited way to essentially run disinformation campaigns because it's all
- 39:39Speaker 12: completely deceptive, clearly motivated by the fact that when you
- 39:43Speaker 12: go to the news articles about various government policies, the
- 39:46Speaker 12: replies are mostly negative. The replies on the prime minister's
- 39:51Speaker 12: ex account Instagram are negative. So they want to, they
- 39:54Speaker 12: want to flood the zone with their own voices. I've
- 39:56Speaker 12: never seen anything like this. And that, you know, that
- 39:59Speaker 12: plus the, just the broad remit that they give themselves
- 40:02Speaker 12: to censor basically anything they want under this legislation, they
- 40:05Speaker 12: could censor the news around the Bondi massacre, you know,
- 40:08Speaker 12: and like that is insane. And that's what they're basically
- 40:11Speaker 12: saying is anything that could cause harm or they said
- 40:14Speaker 12: copycat killings. So it's just an absurd bill.
- 40:17Speaker 1: Yeah.
- 40:18Speaker 2: And we've seen, tech giants in the past censor the news.
- 40:23Speaker 2: I mean, the origins of COVID, a topic both of
- 40:26Speaker 2: us have reported on extensively, and the tech giants completely censored,
- 40:31Speaker 2: you know, the fact that it was created likely in
- 40:33Speaker 2: a laboratory. But now you've got the tech giants leaning
- 40:37Speaker 2: towards free speech, so the governments are stepping in.
- 40:40Speaker 6: Right.
- 40:41Speaker 12: Well, I mean, look, it's like they censored Harvard Medical
- 40:44Speaker 12: University professor, for saying that if you have COVID, you
- 40:47Speaker 12: don't need the vaccine because of natural immunity, something we've
- 40:50Speaker 12: known about for 2,500 years. We had Facebook executives telling
- 40:54Speaker 12: the White House that we were even taking down true
- 40:57Speaker 12: stories of vaccine side effects. Mark Zuckerberg came out January
- 41:00Speaker 12: 2025 saying they were not going to do this anymore.
- 41:03Speaker 12: They were going to go to the X system of
- 41:04Speaker 12: community notes, which is crowdsourced fact-checking. The Albanese government hates this.
- 41:09Speaker 12: They want to control what people say online. It's so
- 41:12Speaker 12: base and it's so petty. It's I think it's a
- 41:15Speaker 12: sign of desperation as well. They just really feel like
- 41:18Speaker 12: if they can't control social media, they can't control the narrative.
- 41:21Speaker 2: Yeah, and we've seen. I mean, more than any government
- 41:24Speaker 2: or politicians that I can remember, really, you hear the
- 41:27Speaker 2: Prime Minister and his ministers often speak about misinformation and disinformation.
- 41:32Speaker 2: They complained about this so heavily during the Voice campaign,
- 41:35Speaker 2: you know, when they were trying to get an Indigenous
- 41:37Speaker 2: voice to Parliament. They blamed misinformation for the fact that
- 41:40Speaker 2: didn't get up.
- 41:41Speaker 12: Well, and the mask slipped when he was at the
- 41:43Speaker 12: United Nations, right? Because he actually went on and said, oh,
- 41:45Speaker 12: it's to censor the extremes, the polarization. He made it
- 41:49Speaker 12: very clearly about politics. Then the next day he was
- 41:50Speaker 12: asked about it and he said, oh, I didn't say that. So,
- 41:53Speaker 12: I mean, if he wants to stop missing disinformation, maybe
- 41:56Speaker 12: he should stay quiet because he's a big source of
- 41:59Speaker 12: it himself.
- 42:00Speaker 6: I mean... Yes.
- 42:01Speaker 2: Well, yeah, he has been known to... I don't know
- 42:04Speaker 2: if we can directly accuse him of lying, but saying
- 42:06Speaker 2: the opposite of what was true, even on the most
- 42:08Speaker 2: basic things like falling down the stairs or not falling
- 42:11Speaker 2: down the stairs.
- 42:11Speaker 13: Right.
- 42:12Speaker 2: But just one piece of... A line in this legislation
- 42:16Speaker 2: basically gives the minister the arbitrary power to remove or
- 42:21Speaker 2: censor information that she considers would be serious..... would cause
- 42:25Speaker 2: serious harm.
- 42:27Speaker 12: Well, and I was joking, you know, that, like, we
- 42:29Speaker 12: all feel sad or offended by the news, but I mean,
- 42:32Speaker 12: that's not the basis for censorship. I mean, anything can
- 42:37Speaker 12: hurt your feelings. So what are we doing here? I mean,
- 42:39Speaker 12: we're regressing to children.
- 42:41Speaker 2: It's crazy. It's crazy. I do want to speak to
- 42:44Speaker 2: you about this issue that actually is dividing even the
- 42:46Speaker 2: Republican Party in the US. And this is the live
- 42:49Speaker 2: stream execution of a, of a, can I call him
- 42:53Speaker 2: a terrorist, Nidal Hassan, responsible for the murder of 13
- 42:58Speaker 2: people in Texas. Now, as a free speech advocate, I'm
- 43:02Speaker 2: keen to get your thoughts on this. What do you think?
- 43:05Speaker 2: Should this be live streamed?
- 43:06Speaker 12: I mean, I haven't heard an argument not to do it.
- 43:09Speaker 12: I've never been a big death penalty guy myself. I've
- 43:11Speaker 12: always been against that. I don't like the state doing
- 43:15Speaker 12: executions in general, but it is a public execution. And
- 43:20Speaker 12: I think if you don't want to watch it, you
- 43:21Speaker 12: shouldn't watch it. No one's presented any evidence to me.
- 43:24Speaker 12: I mean, it was sort of suggested in a meeting
- 43:26Speaker 12: in Canberra by some some Labor Party staffers that it
- 43:29Speaker 12: could result in copycat killings. But what are we talking
- 43:32Speaker 12: about here? Like by governments copycatting it?
- 43:35Speaker 2: So this is the meeting you had with the staffers
- 43:38Speaker 2: for the Albanese government.
- 43:39Speaker 6: Yeah.
- 43:40Speaker 12: And so I was kind of like, well, what do
- 43:43Speaker 12: you what is it that you don't? Why do you
- 43:45Speaker 12: want to censor it? And this has been a big
- 43:47Speaker 12: part of the problem with the whole government is that
- 43:49Speaker 12: they can't give a good reason why they even need
- 43:51Speaker 12: this bill. One of the reasons that Annika Wells gave
- 43:54Speaker 12: was that, well, 14-year-old girls are getting eating disorders. Well,
- 43:58Speaker 12: you just, they have been enforcing a ban on under
- 44:00Speaker 12: 16 for the last year. So why is that even,
- 44:03Speaker 12: they can't seem to find any rationale for it, which
- 44:06Speaker 12: is why everybody's looking for ulterior motives.
- 44:08Speaker 2: I actually don't mind, very controversial thing to say, I
- 44:11Speaker 2: don't mind the death penalty in some scenarios where it's
- 44:14Speaker 2: very clear cut that someone has done evil, has committed
- 44:17Speaker 2: a lot of murder. I personally wouldn't watch it, but
- 44:20Speaker 2: I don't really have a view on whether or not
- 44:22Speaker 2: it should be. I don't think the media would would
- 44:24Speaker 2: cover it in any case. But should it be on
- 44:27Speaker 2: the Internet? But now it seems like the president might
- 44:29Speaker 2: be saying, you know, it's not going to be live streamed.
- 44:33Speaker 2: He seems to be reversing course a bit.
- 44:35Speaker 12: I'm sure they're looking at the polls. Everything right now
- 44:37Speaker 12: has to be viewed through an eye toward what would
- 44:39Speaker 12: help with the elections. Uh, but I just, you know,
- 44:42Speaker 12: there was a ruling member because Julian and grant your
- 44:44Speaker 12: safety commissioner tried to pull from the entire internet, this
- 44:48Speaker 12: terrorist attack, um, from X and, uh, they basically, the
- 44:52Speaker 12: courts ruled against her and they said that she couldn't
- 44:54Speaker 12: do that. So it seems to me, I mean, I,
- 44:56Speaker 12: I don't, if you could show me that there was
- 44:58Speaker 12: some harm caused by showing that otherwise, Don't let your
- 45:01Speaker 12: kids watch it.
- 45:02Speaker 7: Don't watch it if you don't.
- 45:02Speaker 12: I don't want to watch it.
- 45:03Speaker 2: No, I don't want to watch it.
- 45:04Speaker 12: I don't know why we would want the government.
- 45:06Speaker 7: To censor it.
- 45:06Speaker 2: Yeah. Just finally, French riots. There's tens of thousands of
- 45:10Speaker 2: students rioting in Paris. And in fact, even Greta Thunberg
- 45:14Speaker 2: apparently joined the action. We're looking at some of the
- 45:17Speaker 2: scenes on the screens right now. I mean, what does
- 45:20Speaker 2: this tell us about the state of France right now?
- 45:23Speaker 12: Well, I think Greta solved climate change and the issues
- 45:26Speaker 12: in Gaza. So now she needs something.
- 45:28Speaker 2: A new cause.
- 45:29Speaker 12: Yeah, she needs a new cause. Hopefully she'll turn to
- 45:31Speaker 12: AI after this.
- 45:32Speaker 6: Yeah.
- 45:32Speaker 12: I mean, look, these were protests that were explicitly and
- 45:35Speaker 12: deliberately organized by the party of Jean-Luc Mélenchon, who's the
- 45:40Speaker 12: radical left candidate. And it's worked. It's made him so
- 45:43Speaker 12: that he'll make it probably pass the first round of
- 45:46Speaker 12: elections next year in France. But School funding in France
- 45:51Speaker 12: has only gone up. The number of pupils per class
- 45:54Speaker 12: has only gone down. This couldn't possibly be about school
- 45:57Speaker 12: funding because they've only been increasing it. It was always
- 46:00Speaker 12: about politics. It was always about creating disruption to support
- 46:03Speaker 12: this particular far-left party. So I just think the media
- 46:06Speaker 12: coverage has been dishonest. We also discovered that the French
- 46:10Speaker 12: government has been putting millions of dollars into French news
- 46:13Speaker 12: media companies.
- 46:14Speaker 2: So just like here, just like here. Well, if this
- 46:18Speaker 2: means Greta's off Israel, I'm happy. All right, Michael, thank
- 46:21Speaker 2: you so much.
- 46:22Speaker 7: Thank you, Sherry.
- 46:23Speaker 2: After the break, Trump's new press secretary stepped into the
- 46:26Speaker 2: lion's den for the first time and will she get
- 46:29Speaker 2: over her nerves? It's after the break. Well, Katie Zachariah
- 46:36Speaker 2: had her first press conference as President Trump's press sec today,
- 46:40Speaker 2: and despite her TV experience, it's safe to say it
- 46:43Speaker 2: wasn't her best performance.
- 46:46Speaker 16: I am so honored to work for President Trump and
- 46:50Speaker 16: the American people as the new White House press secretary.
- 46:55Speaker 16: I want to thank President Trump for his trust that
- 47:00Speaker 16: he has placed in me, I have wanted to work
- 47:04Speaker 16: for him for a very long time.
- 47:08Speaker 2: And News 24 contributor Kosha Garda joins me now. Kosha,
- 47:12Speaker 2: Trump said she did a good job. He's standing by her.
- 47:16Speaker 2: But there is speculation about how long she's going to last.
- 47:19Speaker 2: Do you think this is just nerves?
- 47:23Speaker 1: Probably, I would say, majority of it is noise, Shari,
- 47:26Speaker 1: just because, you know, the vultures or the sharks, I
- 47:28Speaker 1: should say, were always going to be out there circling
- 47:31Speaker 1: for whoever would take this very high-profile, highly visible role
- 47:34Speaker 1: from Trump. She did make herself an easy target, for sure.
- 47:38Speaker 1: I think even supporters of her think she could have
- 47:41Speaker 1: done better. There was room for improvement. But I say,
- 47:43Speaker 1: I'm sure you have similar stories from when you got
- 47:46Speaker 1: started into this business. I certainly say it. It's not
- 47:48Speaker 1: really that easy to get in front of camera and
- 47:51Speaker 1: speak off the cuff, extemporaneously, be natural, et cetera. And
- 47:55Speaker 1: she doesn't actually, in the scheme of things, have that
- 47:57Speaker 1: much experience in terms of on camera. expertise. She's done
- 48:00Speaker 1: a little bit, but she was a lawyer. She worked
- 48:03Speaker 1: in different nonprofits. She worked in China for a little bit.
- 48:05Speaker 1: She was an advisor to the Trump media company. And
- 48:08Speaker 1: I'm sure she was loyal and probably behind the scenes,
- 48:11Speaker 1: did good work and caught Trump's attention. So he threw
- 48:14Speaker 1: her into the lion's den. If she gets some time,
- 48:17Speaker 1: I'm sure she will improve. But we also know that
- 48:20Speaker 1: Trump is not shy to pull the trigger if he's
- 48:22Speaker 1: unhappy with you. So I'm sure she's feeling a trying
- 48:28Speaker 1: to improve rather quickly.
- 48:30Speaker 2: Speaking of Trump pulling the trigger, the U.S. ambassador to Greece,
- 48:33Speaker 2: Kimberly Guilfoyle, has stepped down. This is after the allegations
- 48:37Speaker 2: in The Wall Street Journal that Greek shipping billionaires have
- 48:40Speaker 2: been giving her money, taking her on lavish trips. I mean,
- 48:43Speaker 2: I've read these stories. They're extraordinary. There were also reports
- 48:46Speaker 2: in The Wall Street Journal that she asked a businessman
- 48:49Speaker 2: to pay off a $ 100, 000 credit card bill, Kosha.
- 48:54Speaker 1: Yes, she is, of course, vigorously denying these. However, it
- 48:58Speaker 1: should be said that these reports are in The Wall
- 48:59Speaker 1: Street Journal, certainly a more serious publication. Before that, they
- 49:03Speaker 1: were in The Daily Mail, which is maybe a little
- 49:05Speaker 1: bit more salacious. But these are not exactly left-wing publications
- 49:08Speaker 1: that are out to get her. So it certainly has
- 49:11Speaker 1: made people take notice with it. And just the specificity
- 49:14Speaker 1: in it has the ring of truth. I'm sure all
- 49:16Speaker 1: of that will come out in due course and be
- 49:19Speaker 1: further investigated. and probed. But as we said, Trump is
- 49:22Speaker 1: not shy to pull the trigger. He has done that
- 49:24Speaker 1: for her. She's somebody who was in the Trump orbit
- 49:27Speaker 1: for a long time, of course, was engaged to Don Jr.
- 49:30Speaker 1: and all the rest of it. So I think for
- 49:31Speaker 1: him to have made that move there, this seems to
- 49:34Speaker 1: be a case of where there's smoke, there's fire, or
- 49:37Speaker 1: at least just the The perception of it is not
- 49:39Speaker 1: helpful for something like being the ambassador to Greece, which
- 49:42Speaker 1: should really be a non-controversial position that doesn't add extra
- 49:46Speaker 1: noise around Trump. There's plenty of that already, and that's
- 49:49Speaker 1: why he's made his decision.
- 49:50Speaker 2: Turning to Democrat Ilhan Omar, who had her home raided
- 49:55Speaker 2: in that pre-dawn raid by ICE agents. Now, it's believed
- 49:58Speaker 2: this is about alleged immigration fraud. What's the latest on this, Kosha?
- 50:03Speaker 2: What has come out?
- 50:06Speaker 1: The latest on this, there have been rumors for a long,
- 50:08Speaker 1: long time that she potentially committed fraud by allegedly, reportedly
- 50:12Speaker 1: marrying somebody related to her, her brother. There were some
- 50:15Speaker 1: rumors that also her father maybe falsified information when he
- 50:19Speaker 1: filed their paperwork for the family when she was a
- 50:21Speaker 1: minor and they immigrated to the US as refugees. So
- 50:25Speaker 1: that was sort of the source of this. She potentially
- 50:28Speaker 1: also making false statements later after that when she naturalized
- 50:31Speaker 1: in 2000 and all of that with her brother. There's
- 50:33Speaker 1: a second vector around financial fraud, which the DOJ under
- 50:37Speaker 1: the Biden administration also looked into, later abandoned, but they've
- 50:41Speaker 1: looked into that. And now again, under the Trump administration,
- 50:43Speaker 1: it's picking up heat again. I just find the timing
- 50:46Speaker 1: of this very interesting. The raid at her house had
- 50:49Speaker 1: to take place after a warrant signed off by a judge.
- 50:52Speaker 1: So this is not just the Trump administration, but a
- 50:54Speaker 1: federal judge signed off on the warrant that allowed them
- 50:57Speaker 1: to go in and raid her home to get paperwork
- 50:59Speaker 1: around that. So this is definitely picking up heat. And
- 51:02Speaker 1: the timing so close to the midterms is interesting. If
- 51:05Speaker 1: this turns into something where they denaturalize her or this
- 51:08Speaker 1: problem becomes bigger, it would definitely be a big deal.
- 51:10Speaker 6: Yeah.
- 51:11Speaker 1: All right.
- 51:11Speaker 2: Kosha, thank you so much. Fascinating stories in the US today,
- 51:14Speaker 2: no question. All right, look forward to seeing you all
- 51:17Speaker 2: tomorrow at 8pm. And for now, it's Kayla Bond filling
- 51:20Speaker 2: in for Paul Murray.