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16 - Final Fantasy V: Job System, Friendship, and Fun · Mythic Mind Games

0:03
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Mythic Mind Games, an extension of
0:06
Speaker 1: the Mythic Mind Fellowship, which pursues wisdom in the paths
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Speaker 1: between primary and secondary worlds. I'm doctor Andreel Snyder, and
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Speaker 1: I'm glad that you're here. All right, Welcome back as
0:19
Speaker 1: we continue with our Final Fantasy series today. Talking about
0:21
Speaker 1: Final Fantasy five, David wasn't able to join us today.
0:24
Speaker 1: He's off on a trip and for some reason didn't
0:27
Speaker 1: want to join us at two in the morning from Ireland.
0:31
Speaker 1: I'm here with Micah and you know, so Final MEC five.
0:34
Speaker 1: We've already talked about this a little bit that there's
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Speaker 1: kind of this pattern that they have go into these
0:38
Speaker 1: first set of games where one, three, and five play
0:43
Speaker 1: around with with jobs, right, Like I mean, one is
0:45
Speaker 1: when it first gets introduced, you can't it's not very malleable,
0:47
Speaker 1: but you at least get to pick what you're going
0:49
Speaker 1: to be for the entire game. And then in three
0:52
Speaker 1: we start to get that variability where we can switch
0:55
Speaker 1: jobs and try out some different tactics. But then five
0:57
Speaker 1: is just a whole new thing where they take that
0:59
Speaker 1: and now you're mixing and matching different skill sets and
1:03
Speaker 1: there's just so much customization that goes into like how
1:06
Speaker 1: you play the game. At the same time, I would
1:09
Speaker 1: say that story takes a dip. Two, four, and six
1:12
Speaker 1: are really the story driven games. But that being said
1:15
Speaker 1: that there's still something compelling about five, and so I
1:19
Speaker 1: guess that that's my broad level comments on this game.
1:23
Speaker 1: So I know right now, Michael, you are close to
1:25
Speaker 1: the end of a playthrough, so tell me your thoughts
1:29
Speaker 1: about this game.
1:30
Speaker 2: Yeah. So I have played Fantasy five fully before. It's
1:34
Speaker 2: just that was several years ago when I was in
1:36
Speaker 2: high school. So I've been replaying it recently to kind
1:39
Speaker 2: of refresh myself on it. And I remember like thinking
1:43
Speaker 2: this was like the fun Final Fantasy, like like you said,
1:46
Speaker 2: not as deep on story, but still enjoyable to play.
1:49
Speaker 2: But as I've been going back through it, I've been
1:51
Speaker 2: legitimately impressed. First of all, it is just as fun
1:54
Speaker 2: as I remember, and I think it might be, in
1:57
Speaker 2: my opinion, the most fun to play of all the
2:00
Speaker 2: Final Fantasies across the entire series. But also like the
2:04
Speaker 2: story has more to it than I remembered from before.
2:10
Speaker 2: I've been trying to think through like some of the
2:11
Speaker 2: themes as you go through and it's it's pretty light
2:15
Speaker 2: in general. But I think what's most interesting to me
2:18
Speaker 2: about found phasey five is where it sits in the
2:21
Speaker 2: course of like the whole series, like file Facy is
2:25
Speaker 2: not a continuous story between games, right, but fun Maasy
2:29
Speaker 2: five feels like this transition nexus point in the series
2:34
Speaker 2: to where up until five, the series was pretty lighthearted,
2:40
Speaker 2: like even four when it got more in depth, it's
2:42
Speaker 2: like goofy enough that you don't take it too seriously.
2:47
Speaker 2: And there's this continual theme of theme in all the
2:50
Speaker 2: stories where it's always like you got to find the
2:53
Speaker 2: four crystals and do something with them, and five, I
2:56
Speaker 2: think is the last game that really does all of
2:58
Speaker 2: those things, because six, I don't even remember crystals being
3:03
Speaker 2: a thing in six, but they were in like just
3:05
Speaker 2: about everything previous. But like, the crystals are only really
3:09
Speaker 2: relevant for the first half of the story, when it
3:12
Speaker 2: feels a lot like three, were you're just going on
3:14
Speaker 2: Goofy adventure after Goofy adventure and they're kind of disconnected
3:16
Speaker 2: until all the crystals are accounted for. Then the bad
3:19
Speaker 2: guy gets unleashed, and then it's like things take not
3:23
Speaker 2: a hard right turn, but it does feel like there's
3:25
Speaker 2: a big shift, so like you go, suddenly you're in
3:28
Speaker 2: a completely different world, and that world has this interesting
3:32
Speaker 2: relationship with the one you're from to where they were
3:35
Speaker 2: kind of they tried to seal up the bad guy
3:38
Speaker 2: by and they were kind of kicking the can down
3:39
Speaker 2: the road in the process, and they realize, oh no,
3:41
Speaker 2: we actually had to deal with him, and they feel
3:44
Speaker 2: bad about like putting your world through a bunch of trouble,
3:46
Speaker 2: Like all the main characters deal with their fathers dying,
3:49
Speaker 2: Like that's a very recurring theme in this game of
3:52
Speaker 2: facing death and the villain Xteth, although he's kind of
3:57
Speaker 2: generic in some ways, like he's very in your face
4:01
Speaker 2: and like you feel the frustration of the characters as
4:05
Speaker 2: they're dealing with him just being a jerk to them
4:08
Speaker 2: all the time. And there is a kind of sense
4:12
Speaker 2: of like the whole light in the darkness theme that
4:16
Speaker 2: the series in general likes to play with, to where
4:19
Speaker 2: it's like there's this overwhelming force that is going to
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Speaker 2: destroy the world and we feel him destroying like all
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Speaker 2: the stuff we care about, and so can we face him,
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Speaker 2: deal with all the loss we're going through and move
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Speaker 2: through this? So I like how well it conveys that emotion,
4:38
Speaker 2: even though it's pretty quick and not super in depth
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Speaker 2: about it.
4:43
Speaker 1: As you said, there's definitely continuity with what came before
4:46
Speaker 1: you got the crystal thing, but there's kind of a
4:48
Speaker 1: twist on it where previously the crystals were corrupted and
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Speaker 1: until you have to go purify them, get rid of
4:54
Speaker 1: the fiend, and put things back in the right order,
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Speaker 1: whereas this time, you know, the crystals keep breaking. It's
5:00
Speaker 1: how you get jobs. So that's cool, but obviously it's
5:03
Speaker 1: not a good thing in the story. And this is
5:06
Speaker 1: where we really get some clear environmentalism coming out here,
5:10
Speaker 1: Like the reason, the fundamental reason why these crystals are
5:12
Speaker 1: breaking is because they're being utilized for industry of various kind,
5:17
Speaker 1: like their energy is being harvested and used in order
5:20
Speaker 1: to build up the various kingdoms that are really responsible
5:24
Speaker 1: for stewarding them. Well, and we see how this is
5:27
Speaker 1: really going to play out in you know, f F seven,
5:30
Speaker 1: where we're extracting too much energy from the earth and
5:33
Speaker 1: you know that's leading in the direction of cataclysm, and
5:37
Speaker 1: so we definitely see that working out here. And then
5:40
Speaker 1: once you once all the crystals break, that's when X
5:44
Speaker 1: Death is released X Death, who like is a tree
5:47
Speaker 1: or was a tree, and then he is a tree
5:50
Speaker 1: again when you fight him in the end. Maybe you
5:53
Speaker 1: can lucate this a little bit. What is xtath as
5:56
Speaker 1: far as you understand him?
5:57
Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, I was literally just reading out by stuff
6:00
Speaker 2: right before I got on the call because I was like, okay,
6:02
Speaker 2: because the gave doesn't really explain him super well. So
6:06
Speaker 2: as I understand what happens with X Death is like,
6:09
Speaker 2: at some point in the distant past, there was some
6:13
Speaker 2: civilization that kept putting like these evil souls into this
6:16
Speaker 2: tree in the forest for some reason. I don't know why.
6:19
Speaker 2: It was like just meant to be a container for him.
6:21
Speaker 2: I guess it's even trapped. But all those evil souls
6:24
Speaker 2: kind of just built up over time, and then the
6:28
Speaker 2: tree itself became an evil manifestation. Instead of like sealing
6:32
Speaker 2: those souls away, it just became all of them and
6:35
Speaker 2: all of their evil combined. And so in practice, X Death,
6:40
Speaker 2: like he manifests is kind of a warlock, but he's
6:44
Speaker 2: kind of a Satan type character, like all he wants
6:47
Speaker 2: to do is destroy and just be as mean to
6:51
Speaker 2: everybody as possible. So yeah, like you said, he's a
6:58
Speaker 2: little kind of ambiguous, like beyond that, he's not a
7:01
Speaker 2: very in depth character. He's not as interesting, he's not
7:03
Speaker 2: as fun as Kefka, and he's not as emotionally complex
7:09
Speaker 2: as like a Sepharroth. He's just full of like all
7:12
Speaker 2: this angst. He's just like, I hate people and I
7:16
Speaker 2: want to kill the world, and that's his whole shtick.
7:20
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I just recently finished my run of f
7:24
Speaker 1: F six, so I'll save that. But I mean in
7:27
Speaker 1: the Kefka top and there's a lot of continuity there
7:30
Speaker 1: in their personality and foremost perhaps in that they have personality,
7:38
Speaker 1: whereas X Death is still more of this archetypal force,
7:42
Speaker 1: which is largely what we've been dealing with so far
7:44
Speaker 1: in Final Fantasy, where even if there is some personal
7:47
Speaker 1: antagonists in the story, usually it ends up being like
7:50
Speaker 1: a force as such that you're fighting against. And you know,
7:54
Speaker 1: that's kind of what X Death is. He's like the
7:58
Speaker 1: a corrupted spirit of nature, which it goes back to
8:01
Speaker 1: this environmentalism theme of when you misuse the earth, well,
8:05
Speaker 1: now the earth is going to return the favor back
8:08
Speaker 1: on you, right, It's going to become twisted it's going
8:10
Speaker 1: to become hostile towards you. And so there's definitely that
8:14
Speaker 1: very very archetypal theme here, which I think accounts for
8:16
Speaker 1: the fact that he has a very ambiguous kind of
8:19
Speaker 1: origin story identity because he's not really a person. He's
8:23
Speaker 1: more of a force as such. I mean, even his name,
8:26
Speaker 1: like X Death what a name for a villain. So
8:30
Speaker 1: it's a very Final Fantasy villain name. What I mean,
8:33
Speaker 1: we can talk about it just kind of what makes
8:34
Speaker 1: the game fun. But I mean, while we're still sticking
8:36
Speaker 1: on some story and theme, would you say that this
8:39
Speaker 1: I mean, how does this relate to what's happened so
8:42
Speaker 1: far and the major themes that we've been talking about
8:44
Speaker 1: in Final Fantasy? Would you say anything that advanced is
8:46
Speaker 1: anything different?
8:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you've already alluded to how it starts playing
8:52
Speaker 2: with environmental themes, which I don't remember if that's really
8:56
Speaker 2: come up in prior games. It may have somewhere and
8:58
Speaker 2: I'm just forgetting. But yeah, I've also thought of the
9:00
Speaker 2: Pomba C seven connection when I was playing through it. Interestingly,
9:08
Speaker 2: just to stick on that one for a moment. Interestingly,
9:10
Speaker 2: the environmentalist themes are not as in your face in
9:12
Speaker 2: five as they are in seven, Like it's very subtle,
9:17
Speaker 2: it's you have this notion. You particularly see it with
9:20
Speaker 2: I think the Fire Kingdom to where they're like just
9:23
Speaker 2: trying to exploit the fire crystal as much as possible
9:25
Speaker 2: so they can somehow power a ship, which in that
9:28
Speaker 2: world is actually a little interesting bit of world building,
9:31
Speaker 2: like it's a big dealer trying to figure out different
9:33
Speaker 2: ways to power ships because they have no wind at
9:34
Speaker 2: this point because the wind crystal has collapsed. So so
9:40
Speaker 2: there's kind of like they're shifting to exploit different things
9:43
Speaker 2: because different parts of nature are falling apart. But like
9:47
Speaker 2: later on, like the main character Barts or Butts if
9:51
Speaker 2: you're going by earlier translations and trying to make jokes
9:53
Speaker 2: about it, Barts feel some guilt on behalf of his
9:57
Speaker 2: world for exploiting the crystals, and he talks to this
10:01
Speaker 2: sage Guido who's a turtle who's really fun later on
10:04
Speaker 2: about it, and Geto talks about like you just talking
10:07
Speaker 2: about like okay, well Acteth got freed and now we
10:09
Speaker 2: have to deal with him barss Like it's because of us, right,
10:11
Speaker 2: because we explained the crystals. And then Ghetto says it
10:14
Speaker 2: really interesting. He says something like it's like you're it's
10:19
Speaker 2: like you're giving yourself too much credit for how this happened.
10:23
Speaker 2: He says, like these were made to seal him, they
10:25
Speaker 2: were expected to break at some point, like these things
10:29
Speaker 2: were not going to last forever, and it kind of
10:33
Speaker 2: implies like the real problem is we have to figure
10:34
Speaker 2: out how to actually permanently deal with this problem and
10:36
Speaker 2: not just keep kicking the can down the road. And
10:39
Speaker 2: so that kind of shifts the focus away from environmentalism
10:43
Speaker 2: more to like we need to deal with the practical
10:46
Speaker 2: problems that are in front of us, And it does
10:51
Speaker 2: go into like you could actually you could draw some
10:53
Speaker 2: interesting inferences on that about like anthropological global warming and
10:57
Speaker 2: stuff like how much impact do we actually have on
10:59
Speaker 2: the environment, Which I don't think the game's really trying
11:02
Speaker 2: to get you to ask those questions in depth. But
11:04
Speaker 2: it is interesting to me that it doesn't just like
11:06
Speaker 2: point the finger and say, hey, you mess with nature
11:09
Speaker 2: and therefore you're the bad guy, which sometimes it feels
11:11
Speaker 2: like seven does that a little, so it's less confrontational.
11:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's fair that that. I mean, there's
11:18
Speaker 1: a give and take that on one hand, there is
11:20
Speaker 1: this environmental exploitation, but at the same time something seemed
11:23
Speaker 1: to be inevitable, like this is going to happen. Maybe
11:26
Speaker 1: we're speeding it along. I mean, I don't even know,
11:31
Speaker 1: like did this when did this game come out?
11:34
Speaker 2: Even I want to say it was like nineteen ninety
11:36
Speaker 2: four or something. I can find that really quick, but yeah,
11:40
Speaker 2: it was mid nineties.
11:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I mean, I again, I don't get the
11:46
Speaker 1: impression that global warming has to be directly tied into this,
11:49
Speaker 1: but I suppose those conversations were definitely going on.
11:52
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was nineteen ninety two, by the way, I
11:55
Speaker 2: just found.
11:55
Speaker 1: It, Okay, ninety two. I don't know, where do you
11:58
Speaker 1: want to go with this?
11:59
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. That was just one of the things
12:01
Speaker 2: I guess about themes in general, and that was the
12:03
Speaker 2: one my brain was thinking about. But I was looking
12:06
Speaker 2: up like because before we started the series, I tried
12:08
Speaker 2: to write down what do I think are like the
12:10
Speaker 2: overall recurring themes in the series, and I could see
12:13
Speaker 2: all of them in fan Behas five, Like there's the
12:17
Speaker 2: this is not just fant phase is a common one
12:19
Speaker 2: in Jebts, but like the themes of friendship and working
12:22
Speaker 2: together to overcome hardship. The whole light in the darkness
12:25
Speaker 2: thing that I mentioned, what does it mean to live
12:28
Speaker 2: and die? You see that in five because again people
12:31
Speaker 2: are coping with death, both of their family and loved ones,
12:35
Speaker 2: a couple of loose pets, and like, how do we
12:38
Speaker 2: move on the relationship between nature and technology, which is
12:42
Speaker 2: kind of what we were just discussing, wrestling with our identity.
12:47
Speaker 2: That one's an interesting one because you see that one
12:49
Speaker 2: with Ferris, who you first meet as a pirate, and
12:55
Speaker 2: I don't know if at the time they were thinking
12:59
Speaker 2: about anything related to transgenderism or something. I tend to
13:02
Speaker 2: think they probably were not, But it's like now you
13:05
Speaker 2: would read that a little different than you might have
13:06
Speaker 2: a Ninetydentty two. She's think as a man the whole time.
13:10
Speaker 1: I definitely think this game is being made today that
13:12
Speaker 1: perhaps play out a little bit differently than it did then.
13:16
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know what the modern JRPG scene
13:20
Speaker 1: is like in that realm.
13:21
Speaker 2: I don't know.
13:22
Speaker 1: I mean, do they tend to get really progressive or
13:25
Speaker 1: I don't, I don't know.
13:26
Speaker 2: Not Usually in transgenderism Japan in general is fairly conservative.
13:30
Speaker 2: All right, that's what those kind of things. So that's
13:33
Speaker 2: why I don't think that's what they were going for.
13:35
Speaker 2: But I think there is a notion of identity in
13:36
Speaker 2: terms of like what kind of a life do you
13:38
Speaker 2: want to live? And they just happened to she just
13:42
Speaker 2: happens to be dressing as a man as part of
13:44
Speaker 2: trying to do that, because it's kind of like it's
13:46
Speaker 2: a it's a man's world kind of theme going on
13:48
Speaker 2: with her. I think, so it's like you need to
13:50
Speaker 2: dress ups a man to accomplish things.
13:52
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean initially when I was playing this game,
13:53
Speaker 1: you know, as a American in twenty twenty five, I
13:56
Speaker 1: was like, what's what's happening here? But yeah, I think
13:59
Speaker 1: that you're exactly right that they're not really getting into
14:01
Speaker 1: any of that. It's just that she had to she
14:04
Speaker 1: she had to cope to to survive in her environment.
14:09
Speaker 1: I just think it's kind of funny how long it
14:12
Speaker 1: takes for the characters to figure out she's a woman.
14:14
Speaker 1: I mean, it seems kind of obvious just from the
14:15
Speaker 1: s price. Yeah, so that that is interesting. And then
14:19
Speaker 1: of course Bart's I mean he's struggling with his own
14:21
Speaker 1: identity as he comes to understand who his father is.
14:25
Speaker 1: And and then of course there's there's a is it golf?
14:31
Speaker 2: I say galoof, but I leave sure what the correct
14:33
Speaker 2: pronunciation is.
14:34
Speaker 1: We'll roll with it that we get the the amtiesia
14:38
Speaker 1: thing again, which which mile Fancy likes to play with,
14:41
Speaker 1: where he doesn't know who he is, and it's ultimately
14:44
Speaker 1: through remembering his granddaughter that he recovers a sense of
14:48
Speaker 1: identity if I remember correctly, Is it when he sees
14:52
Speaker 1: sid in his grandson that like triggers something in him?
14:56
Speaker 1: Or am I d.
14:58
Speaker 2: Specific with the s A meeting? I do know? Like
15:02
Speaker 2: there's a really interesting like he doesn't really fully recover
15:04
Speaker 2: his memories until his daughter Crial like literally comes in
15:08
Speaker 2: like crashes the meteor into the the airship that they're
15:11
Speaker 2: on and helps. Right, he starts to get like some flashbacks.
15:15
Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, he does have flashbacks. And there's a
15:18
Speaker 2: really interesting part early on, like super early, like you're
15:22
Speaker 2: in this cave where you encounter a siren who like
15:24
Speaker 2: hypnotizes everybody by showing projections of people they care about,
15:27
Speaker 2: and it shows him Crial, his daughter or his granddaughter.
15:31
Speaker 2: But because he still hasn't recovered his memories, he doesn't
15:33
Speaker 2: know who it is, and so it doesn't affect him,
15:35
Speaker 2: so he's able to save everybody. So his amnesia actually
15:38
Speaker 2: saves their lives, which I thought was an amusing play
15:42
Speaker 2: on that concept.
15:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's kind of interesting that the siren could read
15:45
Speaker 1: his mind even though he couldn't.
15:47
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it knew more than he did.
15:49
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, and that that's a good plot mechanic because
15:55
Speaker 1: that's right, that's why he couldn't be enchanted or bewitched
15:59
Speaker 1: by the siren, because because he couldn't remember. Yeah, and
16:02
Speaker 1: so and again that plays into the theme of family,
16:05
Speaker 1: of friendship, of relationships, that it is that that relationship
16:10
Speaker 1: with his granddaughter that helps him to recover a sense
16:13
Speaker 1: of who he is. And then you know, eventually he
16:17
Speaker 1: sacrifices himself, and you know, we saw a lot of
16:19
Speaker 1: that in four. But what's perhaps unique about this is
16:22
Speaker 1: that he doesn't come back. There's no miraculous recovery. He
16:26
Speaker 1: actually dies, which I don't remember in four. Doesn't everyone
16:30
Speaker 1: who dies, No, they don't all come back, but he's
16:34
Speaker 1: he's definitely one of the most enduring characters who dies
16:37
Speaker 1: in File phases so far. Although I feel like they
16:41
Speaker 1: kind of cheat it by his granddaughter, like inherits all
16:44
Speaker 1: of his skills that he has.
16:45
Speaker 2: Yet they become interchangeable mechanically, which from a player's perspective
16:50
Speaker 2: is appreciated because it's really sucks to invest a lot
16:53
Speaker 2: into a character, and this game is all bout investing
16:55
Speaker 2: in your characters and getting them built up in all
16:56
Speaker 2: these different classes, just to lose all that because my
16:59
Speaker 2: character is just annoying. So I'm kind of glad they
17:02
Speaker 2: did it, even though it's really weird from a story perspective.
17:06
Speaker 1: Right, which again I think goes to the idea that
17:10
Speaker 1: this game is really good on gameplay become story sometimes
17:14
Speaker 1: for the purpose of enhancing gameplay. Yeah, So I don't know, what,
17:18
Speaker 1: is there anything else plot wise that you think we
17:20
Speaker 1: should dive into or thematic house I.
17:24
Speaker 2: Was trying to think. I think we've hit most of it,
17:26
Speaker 2: like going going on characters like this isn't like so
17:29
Speaker 2: much thematic kind of thing, but I just really like
17:32
Speaker 2: the characters in this, Like this is a surprisingly funny
17:36
Speaker 2: game in a way it's written. This is the game
17:40
Speaker 2: that introduced Gilgamesh and right, who's kind of a recurring
17:44
Speaker 2: character in later games of this series, and he used
17:47
Speaker 2: to meet him as like this villainous general of Exteth's
17:52
Speaker 2: army about halfway through, and at first he looks he
17:56
Speaker 2: looks really intimidating. He's got like all these weapons strapped
17:59
Speaker 2: to his back, and the note the feeling you get
18:03
Speaker 2: from him is like, this is the ultimate warrior we're
18:05
Speaker 2: facing off against. But then he's just goofy is all
18:08
Speaker 2: get out, Like he randomly flees from battle because he's like, oh,
18:14
Speaker 2: you guys are more trouble than I thought. Uh. Later on,
18:17
Speaker 2: you fight him and he's got he thinks he's gotten
18:20
Speaker 2: like a legendary weapon Excalibur, but then when he hits
18:22
Speaker 2: you with it causes like almost no damage, and he's
18:25
Speaker 2: like this weapon sucks. What is going on here? Yeah? Yeah,
18:31
Speaker 2: But then you beat him and you get in it's
18:32
Speaker 2: called the Escalipore as opposed to the actual Excalibur that
18:36
Speaker 2: you get much later. But yeah, then he has like
18:40
Speaker 2: this falling out with x death and Extend banishes him
18:42
Speaker 2: to the void, which the Void's a big deal later
18:45
Speaker 2: on in the game. But then I haven't gotten back
18:49
Speaker 2: to this my replay, but I know, like later you
18:51
Speaker 2: meet him again in the void, and he's kind of
18:55
Speaker 2: just having all these like this existential exploration of like
18:58
Speaker 2: what he is, like when he wants to be and
19:00
Speaker 2: he's like, hey, can we be friends, and it's just
19:04
Speaker 2: like really heartwarming, and then like he sacrifices himself to
19:07
Speaker 2: help you fight like another boss because so like this
19:10
Speaker 2: evil like villains general like somehow like he really just
19:15
Speaker 2: wants to like be the best warrior he could be
19:17
Speaker 2: and have fun doing that. And then he just wants friends.
19:21
Speaker 2: It's like he doesn't really want to be a villain.
19:22
Speaker 2: He's just he's such a fun character. It's like I
19:25
Speaker 2: think he's one of the best things about this game.
19:27
Speaker 1: No, yeah, absolutely, I absolutely agree. By the end, he
19:32
Speaker 1: just he's so needy. He just he just wants to
19:34
Speaker 1: go hang out with you, and you know, he talks
19:38
Speaker 1: about each of the main characters and like the things
19:41
Speaker 1: that make them great and things he admires about them.
19:44
Speaker 1: And I feel like he is like such a good
19:46
Speaker 1: representation of the spirit of this game, because, as you said,
19:50
Speaker 1: it is very light. It's it's funny. It's even even
19:54
Speaker 1: though the games of four that's have had their light moments,
19:57
Speaker 1: they really capitalize on that as opposed to I would
20:00
Speaker 1: say four tends to be a bit more on the
20:02
Speaker 1: serious side overall, it tend it tends to take itself
20:06
Speaker 1: more seriously, whereas five is just so much lighter. I
20:08
Speaker 1: feel like this Gilgamesh character just really encapsulates that intensity
20:14
Speaker 1: that well becomes very much softened and giving over to levity.
20:18
Speaker 2: Yeah.
20:19
Speaker 1: I very much enjoyed his character. And he returns again
20:22
Speaker 1: in some other fun fantasies. Is that right?
20:25
Speaker 2: Yeah, he does. I couldn't tell you what they all
20:26
Speaker 2: are off the top of my head. I want to
20:28
Speaker 2: say he appears in twelve, which but I haven't plate twelve,
20:32
Speaker 2: but I most recently saw him and he should up
20:35
Speaker 2: been found. He he seven Rebirth, the second of the remakes,
20:38
Speaker 2: and there's like a whole side plot with him, and
20:40
Speaker 2: he's basically the same character. Like you fight him and
20:43
Speaker 2: then he's like, oh, you're a trouble than I thought
20:44
Speaker 2: you were, and then he just kind of runs away,
20:45
Speaker 2: and it's really comedy because he's a gigantic like super warrior,
20:49
Speaker 2: like just scurrying off. And so, yeah, they keep the
20:53
Speaker 2: same character, so you could tell Square knows that he's
20:56
Speaker 2: a really fun character, and so they just like to
20:59
Speaker 2: reuse him when they can.
21:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, even in tactics there are only some Easter Egg
21:03
Speaker 1: references to them. Yeah anything else from five Yeah, I
21:13
Speaker 1: was I was trying to think because, like you and
21:16
Speaker 1: I have both said, like, the game is generally lighthearted,
21:18
Speaker 1: but it does get surprisingly dark at times.
21:23
Speaker 2: I think one of the more emotionally like significant moments,
21:27
Speaker 2: like it's when I remembered from when I was younger
21:29
Speaker 2: and I just played through the scene again. I was like,
21:31
Speaker 2: this is actually pretty well done. It's like after there's
21:35
Speaker 2: this interesting thing that happens where exteth like forces like
21:38
Speaker 2: these two worlds to merge back together because apparently that
21:40
Speaker 2: they originally like overlaid on top of each other so
21:44
Speaker 2: that he can like access the void. And then once
21:46
Speaker 2: you go back, you suddenly you meet him again and
21:50
Speaker 2: he starts accessing the void, which is basically a way
21:54
Speaker 2: of generating black holes, and he just goes and starts
21:57
Speaker 2: wiping out a ton of villages like all of a sudden,
22:00
Speaker 2: and like the main characters have like watch from their
22:02
Speaker 2: airship as he does this, and he wipes out multiple
22:04
Speaker 2: people's home downs, and when he wipes out Bart's hometown,
22:08
Speaker 2: like you really feel it because when you visited that
22:11
Speaker 2: earlier in the game, it felt very emotionally significant for him.
22:13
Speaker 2: You have flashbacks to his parents, his old friends, he
22:16
Speaker 2: went to visit his mom's grave, and it has like
22:19
Speaker 2: there's a unique music track that plays in that village
22:22
Speaker 2: that's really memorable. And so when he wipes that out,
22:25
Speaker 2: like you kind of feel it. A Bart's gets mad,
22:28
Speaker 2: like just the one of the maddest scenes like I've
22:32
Speaker 2: ever seen from a protagonist. Like he yells like exta stop,
22:36
Speaker 2: and like he gets he gets to the wheel of
22:40
Speaker 2: the airship and he just like flies it like Kamakazi
22:43
Speaker 2: around the world, like just yelling like how mad he is,
22:46
Speaker 2: and the others have to come in and called him down.
22:48
Speaker 2: And that's when you start like pulling together in the
22:51
Speaker 2: final act to try to get all the stuff you
22:52
Speaker 2: need to go face him. But yeah, like when you
22:55
Speaker 2: play it, you're like, yeah, Bart's, I'm with you, I'm mad,
22:58
Speaker 2: Let's go get this guy.
23:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that right there, that the whole void concept.
23:03
Speaker 2: It is.
23:04
Speaker 1: It really called back to I'm gonna the way back
23:06
Speaker 1: to one with you're fighting chaos, You're now you're fighting
23:09
Speaker 1: the void. It's kind of the same sort of thing right,
23:12
Speaker 1: the formless and the void, that that's what chaos is,
23:14
Speaker 1: is that which is out of order. And so you
23:16
Speaker 1: have now ex death gaining the power over chaos. And
23:20
Speaker 1: so it's the same basic idea of playing out here again,
23:23
Speaker 1: but also we get this this cosmic devastation that's going
23:27
Speaker 1: to play out again in six and and in some
23:30
Speaker 1: subsequent titles where you really feel like the enemy is
23:34
Speaker 1: winning in a very strong way. That that kind of
23:37
Speaker 1: way that as as Bart's experiences, it gives you that
23:40
Speaker 1: that sense of despair that you know, at best you
23:44
Speaker 1: have hope against hope, and that is something that I
23:47
Speaker 1: very much appreciate. And we've talked about this briefly before,
23:51
Speaker 1: this idea that like it. It doesn't look like the
23:54
Speaker 1: good guys are going to win, but we're just going
23:57
Speaker 1: to keep on going anyways. You know, it's the same
23:59
Speaker 1: reason why I like Tolkien, same reason I like the
24:01
Speaker 1: Northern Entails in general. We definitely see that playing out
24:04
Speaker 1: here that I'm gonna keep going even though it looks
24:06
Speaker 1: like we're gonna lose, that doesn't matter, because well what
24:08
Speaker 1: else do we have? And so you get that endurance
24:11
Speaker 1: and hope as well as just that sense of devastation,
24:14
Speaker 1: and so I do feel like that they handle that
24:17
Speaker 1: pretty well in this game. That for a game that
24:19
Speaker 1: tends to be more lighthearted.
24:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that kind of like what you alluded to,
24:24
Speaker 2: That's what I was gonna talking about that earlier where
24:25
Speaker 2: it feels like it's kind of a transition point for
24:28
Speaker 2: the series. It's like you can almost see like the
24:31
Speaker 2: switch flip when it goes from like classical like earlier
24:35
Speaker 2: in the series kind of like let's go find the crystals,
24:38
Speaker 2: beat the villain, to like we have some more melodramatic
24:41
Speaker 2: things we want to play with, and then like six
24:44
Speaker 2: is where it fully invests in that Six is just
24:48
Speaker 2: a very melodramatic game, and it does the destroy the
24:52
Speaker 2: world thing much further than five goes, which we'll talk
24:56
Speaker 2: about that more when we talked about that game. Seven
24:59
Speaker 2: is also pretty melodramatic. Eight I haven't played, but I
25:02
Speaker 2: get the impression it's pretty melodramatic. Nine is more closer
25:06
Speaker 2: to classic Final Fantasy, but still like it's still kind
25:09
Speaker 2: of in that new mold, and it kind of just
25:11
Speaker 2: keeps going in that trajectory where they were really focused
25:15
Speaker 2: on story and presentation, and one thing like, because I
25:19
Speaker 2: think about this sometimes with the Final Heasy series is
25:21
Speaker 2: sometimes I feel like the series gets a little pretentious.
25:25
Speaker 2: But five is still in an era where it does
25:27
Speaker 2: not feel pretentious at all. It feels like, hey, we're
25:29
Speaker 2: just here to like have a fun game and maybe
25:32
Speaker 2: tell it kind of a neat little story with some
25:34
Speaker 2: ideas we're playing with along the way. Later games, sometimes
25:37
Speaker 2: it feels like they got a little too proud of
25:40
Speaker 2: themselves and like they think they had something profound to say.
25:43
Speaker 2: I'm like, it's not that profound, guys, but five has
25:46
Speaker 2: no pretension there. It's just it's it's just like, hey,
25:50
Speaker 2: we're just having fun here.
25:52
Speaker 1: Yeah. And that's a good point that when they're talking
25:55
Speaker 1: about Final Fantasy or novels or whatever, when someone's trying
26:00
Speaker 1: to be deep and profound, they're typically not going to
26:04
Speaker 1: be deep and profound. Like, the way that you really
26:06
Speaker 1: achieve profundity is by just setting out to tell a
26:09
Speaker 1: good story, by not taking yourself seriously. That that allows
26:13
Speaker 1: your world to actually be more serious, more more artistic.
26:18
Speaker 1: It doesn't even have to be high art. But like
26:20
Speaker 1: you know, except in five, that they're not taking themselves
26:22
Speaker 1: that seriously, and so doing they actually, I mean, you
26:24
Speaker 1: know now that we keep talking about it more, I
26:26
Speaker 1: mean they tell a decent story. It's not not a
26:28
Speaker 1: complicated story. It is, as say, fun first and foremost,
26:32
Speaker 1: but like there is there's some virtue here, that there's
26:37
Speaker 1: some wisdom here, that there's something worth i mean extracting
26:42
Speaker 1: and having conversation about. And so yeah, that's that's a
26:45
Speaker 1: good point.
26:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, as I was saying, like before we started, like
26:50
Speaker 2: I think I'm like one of the bigger found Bus
26:52
Speaker 2: five defenders in our group. And really five is kind
26:56
Speaker 2: of one of the neglected games of the series, right
26:58
Speaker 2: because we did get it early on in America and
27:01
Speaker 2: so we don't have that really inter reial nostalgia about it.
27:04
Speaker 2: And like you said, it's not as story focused as others,
27:06
Speaker 2: and people tend to remember the stories for finally they
27:09
Speaker 2: get a little more. But yeah, Fi I've had a
27:12
Speaker 2: had a big impact. I know in Japan, like they
27:14
Speaker 2: listens like one of their favorite games over there, and
27:18
Speaker 2: there is it does have kind of a cult following.
27:21
Speaker 2: Like I know there's there's like this yearly like charity event,
27:25
Speaker 2: which I don't know if it's still going on. I
27:26
Speaker 2: think it is like called like poor Job Fiesta, where
27:30
Speaker 2: the idea is like people will vote on like these
27:36
Speaker 2: different player combinations of jobs, and someone has to go
27:39
Speaker 2: in and go play through the entire game using exactly
27:42
Speaker 2: those jobs and never changing and it's kind of a
27:46
Speaker 2: game that's like fun to do that way. So there
27:49
Speaker 2: is kind of a it's like it's not widely as
27:52
Speaker 2: loved as the other games, but like there's people like me,
27:55
Speaker 2: I guess who really love this specific one because it's
27:58
Speaker 2: doing really unique fun things.
28:01
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, I will say that this is the
28:02
Speaker 1: one final fantasy that I've played so far in this
28:04
Speaker 1: run where as soon as I finish it, part of
28:06
Speaker 1: you wanted to go back and play it again, just
28:09
Speaker 1: because you know, it is so fun is to experiment
28:11
Speaker 1: with totally different tactics. I mean, you know, in three,
28:14
Speaker 1: when you could change your jobs, it seemed pretty clear
28:18
Speaker 1: that they were setting you up for like certain combinations
28:21
Speaker 1: that at certain times, whereas five, I mean, obviously sometimes
28:24
Speaker 1: certain combinations will work better, but there's so much more
28:27
Speaker 1: versatility in playing the game how you want to play
28:29
Speaker 1: the game. You know, when Welfort you talk about tactics
28:34
Speaker 1: in the discord, but you know, once you get there.
28:37
Speaker 1: I'll be interested to hear your thoughts, because it very
28:39
Speaker 1: much takes the job system a five and just puts
28:41
Speaker 1: that on steroids with how much you can customize things,
28:44
Speaker 1: and that really just does make for a much more,
28:49
Speaker 1: I guess, subcreative kind of gameplay where you get to
28:52
Speaker 1: decide what kind of characters you have, what kind of
28:55
Speaker 1: party you have, and that allows a bit more investment.
28:58
Speaker 1: Even if the the characters you don't necessarily investing as
29:02
Speaker 1: much in, you're getting more invested, and I think that
29:05
Speaker 1: there's definitely some gameplay value in that, and I definitely
29:08
Speaker 1: understand why it would be a favorite.
29:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, it does feel like they're definitely tried to take
29:13
Speaker 2: the ideas from three specifically and flesh them out more.
29:16
Speaker 2: Three like had cool ideas that weren't fully baked. Like.
29:21
Speaker 2: There were a couple of problems and how it did
29:23
Speaker 2: its job system. One is that it made it. It
29:28
Speaker 2: didn't do much to encourage you to change jobs, except
29:30
Speaker 2: by some jobs just being better than previous ones. So
29:34
Speaker 2: like the games, the jobs you get early on you're
29:36
Speaker 2: not really supposed to use later on. I think in
29:38
Speaker 2: the later versions, like the Pixel remaster we played, they
29:41
Speaker 2: tried to balance that out a bit, so the early
29:43
Speaker 2: jobs were more viable, but by the time you get
29:45
Speaker 2: like what like Ninja is one of the pod classes,
29:47
Speaker 2: like that's meant to be like an in game class,
29:49
Speaker 2: Like Everyondy's just gonna be Ninja's five. Though, they're like,
29:53
Speaker 2: we're gonna make everything work and we're gonna have a
29:56
Speaker 2: ton of jobs. And the best thing I think think
30:00
Speaker 2: they did was they made it so you learn skills
30:02
Speaker 2: from some jobs that can then be attached to other
30:05
Speaker 2: jobs when you set to them. So it's like I
30:09
Speaker 2: can have a summoner that also uses white magic. I
30:12
Speaker 2: can have a Mystic Night that can steal that sort
30:16
Speaker 2: of thing. And so there's all these different ways to
30:18
Speaker 2: mix the match different abilities. And although Final Fantasy itself
30:23
Speaker 2: kind of got away from this mostly except for like
30:25
Speaker 2: Fantasy Tactics or things like that, when they brought back
30:28
Speaker 2: job systems in some fashion, usually they would have characters
30:30
Speaker 2: like out of Jobs. There are is like a branch
30:34
Speaker 2: of RPGs that came out of this design concept, which
30:38
Speaker 2: I think started with the DS game four Heroes of
30:41
Speaker 2: Light to where they really wanted to do like five's
30:45
Speaker 2: job system again, and then later on they went and
30:48
Speaker 2: they bravely default, which also kind of follows up five's systems,
30:53
Speaker 2: and more recently, Octopath Traveler is a recent one, which
30:58
Speaker 2: is a really weird name, but that one, although it's
31:01
Speaker 2: not exactly like five's kind of system, it does have
31:04
Speaker 2: this notion of like everybody has it's like identified with
31:08
Speaker 2: a job, but then they can learn stuff from other
31:10
Speaker 2: jobs and so you can still mix and match. So
31:12
Speaker 2: although Found Fantasy itself has not done like a ton
31:16
Speaker 2: more with like interchangeable jobs, like, there's plenty of other
31:18
Speaker 2: Square series that clearly are spinning off of that concept.
31:22
Speaker 2: So there's different heritage there.
31:24
Speaker 1: Yeah, and at some point I'll bring it into other JRPGs,
31:30
Speaker 1: but I just haven't made it there yet. Well, I
31:35
Speaker 1: figured this would probably end up being a bit of
31:37
Speaker 1: a shorter conversation, But I mean, is there anything else
31:40
Speaker 1: from five? I know, I appreciate you that you're you're
31:42
Speaker 1: really carrying this. I just have a whole lot this game,
31:45
Speaker 1: Like this is what I say about that's very helpful. Uh,
31:49
Speaker 1: is there anything else that you feel like we should discuss?
31:54
Speaker 2: I think like one thing I was thinking about and
31:57
Speaker 2: I don't know like how much there is to go
31:58
Speaker 2: into this, but when we were talking about like Xteth
32:02
Speaker 2: coming from a tree, like, it occurred to me like
32:05
Speaker 2: there's a lot of like mythology and like fantasy stuff
32:08
Speaker 2: that revolves around trees, Like have you come across that much?
32:12
Speaker 2: Andrew like, I don't know if Tolkien was ever as
32:14
Speaker 2: much of a tree guy.
32:16
Speaker 1: I mean, well, I mean so early and you got
32:19
Speaker 1: the trees of Allan or so there's that. Of course,
32:23
Speaker 1: you've got ends and the forest have some kind of
32:26
Speaker 1: sentience to them, and even I guess, I guess this
32:29
Speaker 1: potential tie to extath themes. I mean, like you know,
32:32
Speaker 1: the nature itself could become corrupted and twisted and you know,
32:36
Speaker 1: turned against what is good and those who are trying
32:38
Speaker 1: to do good, or even you know, the mountain itself,
32:43
Speaker 1: you know, was working against the Fellowship because it was
32:46
Speaker 1: just something about nature itself was corrupted. And so yeah,
32:50
Speaker 1: we could definitely see that. And as far as the
32:53
Speaker 1: tree theme, I mean, obviously in various mythologies, you know,
32:57
Speaker 1: trees are significant, you know the you know you just
33:00
Speaker 1: ill or or whatever, and so yeah, I mean I
33:04
Speaker 1: guess that there is a pretty large tradition of tree
33:09
Speaker 1: importance that we can pull in here.
33:13
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, Like I said, I don't know totally what
33:15
Speaker 2: to dig into. That is just like that that got
33:16
Speaker 2: me thinking about it, Like I think of like, what
33:19
Speaker 2: was it the Norse who had yeeked your cell? Like
33:22
Speaker 2: the world tree or something that I know is like
33:25
Speaker 2: a major one you see in a lot of RPGs
33:27
Speaker 2: play with that one. I don't know the X stuff
33:30
Speaker 2: really comes out of that though, but I mean it
33:31
Speaker 2: gets closer to like a dark ent like what you
33:34
Speaker 2: were talking about.
33:35
Speaker 1: I mean, I suppose. I mean, a tree itself is
33:37
Speaker 1: a symbol of natural life, which is how why it
33:41
Speaker 1: plays into so many different mythologies and fantasy tropes or
33:46
Speaker 1: kind of archetypes in that it is a tree itself
33:48
Speaker 1: is sort of an archetype as this the life that grows,
33:54
Speaker 1: you know, that protrudes out out of nature, that that
33:57
Speaker 1: which is the world's soul, so to be. And so
34:03
Speaker 1: that it kind of makes sense that we could also
34:05
Speaker 1: play around with the idea of you know, what happens
34:08
Speaker 1: when life is corrupted to the point where that which
34:11
Speaker 1: should symbolize life now get inverted to symbolized death right,
34:15
Speaker 1: and so you know, X death is an inversion of
34:18
Speaker 1: what nature is supposed to be.
34:21
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good way to look at it. Feel
34:22
Speaker 2: like that could be arguably like something they thought of
34:25
Speaker 2: in the themes, since it is like there is very
34:28
Speaker 2: much a death versus life and oblivion versus reality kind
34:33
Speaker 2: of thing. And so yeah, that kind of inversion and
34:35
Speaker 2: that perversion of what is what is meant to be
34:38
Speaker 2: good does make some sense there. And yeah, he also
34:44
Speaker 2: carries the satanic notion if he comes to kill him,
34:47
Speaker 2: steal and destroy, right, because that's what he's doing like
34:49
Speaker 2: the whole time. So what was your favorite combination of
34:56
Speaker 2: jobs when you played it? I don't know how long
34:58
Speaker 2: it's been since you've gone through it.
35:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm trying to remember. I mean my I mean,
35:03
Speaker 1: obviously the most effective is the jobs you get the
35:05
Speaker 1: very end, as you said, like the Ninja and the
35:09
Speaker 1: It's like some kind of what are the last jobs
35:11
Speaker 1: you get?
35:12
Speaker 2: Well, three was the one where Ninja was the last.
35:14
Speaker 2: I think five Ninja relatively early. I want to say
35:17
Speaker 2: it's like a third Crystal Samurai. I'm thinking it later.
35:21
Speaker 1: Okay, Yeah, So I honestly I don't remember. So what
35:26
Speaker 1: were yours?
35:27
Speaker 2: Uh? So for me, like I'm not quite an end game,
35:29
Speaker 2: so I'm still like running around the different ones, but
35:31
Speaker 2: I think right now because I've got like some super
35:35
Speaker 2: sword that like if you don't run away much during
35:37
Speaker 2: the game pro tip if you play, like if you
35:40
Speaker 2: play the game for the first time, don't run away
35:42
Speaker 2: ever from battle, and then later on you'll get a
35:44
Speaker 2: sword that will be obscenely powerful if you've never run
35:46
Speaker 2: away from battle. So I've got that one, and I
35:50
Speaker 2: think like that can only be equipped to the night
35:52
Speaker 2: So even though it's like one of the starting ones,
35:54
Speaker 2: like I have it on that with like two handed,
35:56
Speaker 2: so it just causes tons of damage. I think I
35:59
Speaker 2: have like a Summoner White with white magic user, and
36:07
Speaker 2: the the Geomancer is really fun and I wish it
36:11
Speaker 2: was more useful than it is, so I don't get
36:13
Speaker 2: as much use out of that. I'm trying to build
36:16
Speaker 2: up my Blue Mage, so I've got I guess we'll
36:18
Speaker 2: just say a blue Mage in there, and uh and
36:22
Speaker 2: then like either one that like flips between Black major
36:27
Speaker 2: or White Mage and has time magic. Time Mage was
36:32
Speaker 2: a really interesting class that they had in here, where
36:33
Speaker 2: they were like, let's break out these this magic that
36:35
Speaker 2: usually we associate with. I guess a mix of white
36:38
Speaker 2: light and dark and then make that its own magic type.
36:41
Speaker 2: So that's where like Haste and Teleport and things like
36:46
Speaker 2: Comet go, right, So they were trying to subdivide it
36:49
Speaker 2: further to make more interesting combinations.
36:51
Speaker 1: Ohso one thing that I enjoyed, I think it was
36:53
Speaker 1: the the thief that could do that attack where they
36:56
Speaker 1: do like four attacks in a row, and so I
37:00
Speaker 1: would give that to a ninja who is already dual wielding,
37:02
Speaker 1: so then you just keep slice and dicing. So that's
37:06
Speaker 1: a fun, little cheap move. Yeah, yeah, I just can't
37:10
Speaker 1: remember specific details.
37:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's part of the fun, right is finding these
37:14
Speaker 2: broken combinations of things, And I know, like one of
37:17
Speaker 2: the things you're supposed to do. It's like once you've
37:19
Speaker 2: mastered enough classes, you reclass someone into Freelancer, which is
37:23
Speaker 2: fully customizable, like you can access all the weapons and
37:25
Speaker 2: abilities of everything, and you get to attach like whatever
37:30
Speaker 2: whichever two abilities that you want to it. Right. So yeah,
37:35
Speaker 2: it's just it's super flexible if you put the time
37:37
Speaker 2: into it.
37:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's definitely. It's a lot of fun. Was this
37:42
Speaker 1: one ever like remastered into any other like ports or anything?
37:47
Speaker 2: Uh, well, there was the version I originally played, which
37:50
Speaker 2: was the GBA version, so that's still essentially the Supertest game.
37:54
Speaker 2: But they had I think four extra bonus classes in
37:57
Speaker 2: that version only that you could get at the very end,
38:00
Speaker 2: and I don't I don't remember what they were. I
38:01
Speaker 2: would say one was like Pirate or something, or like
38:05
Speaker 2: cannon Ear or something like. So I kind of want
38:07
Speaker 2: to go back and check that version because it's like,
38:09
Speaker 2: how interesting were those drips?
38:10
Speaker 1: I don't actually don't know.
38:12
Speaker 2: But yeah, it's not gotten anything like for did to
38:14
Speaker 2: where like there was like a DS three D remake
38:18
Speaker 2: of that one. They never got to that with five,
38:20
Speaker 2: so they kind of stopped at that one. But it'd
38:23
Speaker 2: be cool to see a remake of it. I don't
38:24
Speaker 2: know that I want like a final phasey seven remake
38:26
Speaker 2: kind of situation, but like, do it like HG two
38:29
Speaker 2: D style or something. And I think I think people
38:31
Speaker 2: would enjoy this, like optopaths popular and it's got the
38:35
Speaker 2: job thing going on, so I think they could make
38:36
Speaker 2: it work.
38:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely. Well, I don't I don't know that I
38:42
Speaker 1: have much else. Do you do you have anything else?
38:44
Speaker 2: Yeah? I think we've gone through most of my thoughts
38:47
Speaker 2: but yeah, it's just like Falsy five. It's like it's
38:51
Speaker 2: very under I don't know if I would say underrated,
38:53
Speaker 2: but it's like underappreciated. I feel in the series, like
38:57
Speaker 2: if you just want like just a fun, fun JERPG,
38:59
Speaker 2: it's like one of the best ones in that category.
39:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely, and I definitely recommend that people pick it
39:05
Speaker 1: up if you haven't already, or return to it if
39:07
Speaker 1: it's been a while. It is it's a lot of fun.
39:10
Speaker 1: I think that even though I prefer six, like we're
39:15
Speaker 1: talking about next time for the story, I agree that
39:19
Speaker 1: out of one through six, five is definitely just the
39:22
Speaker 1: most fun to play. So definitely recommend that. All Right, Well, Loka,
39:27
Speaker 1: I appreciate you really carrying this conversation. I look forward
39:32
Speaker 1: to next time when we get back into a real
39:35
Speaker 1: focus on the story with six, and I think we'll
39:37
Speaker 1: probably have a couple additional people join us for that one.
39:40
Speaker 1: All right, So thank you and I'll see you then
39:43
Speaker 1: or if not, maybe on the next Star Wars conversation.
39:46
Speaker 1: What happens, all right, we'll duck to Thanks all right,
39:53
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening or watching if you're over on YouTube.
39:56
Speaker 1: If you appreciate the things that we do over here
39:57
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