Latest / Call Her Tatty / Getts, Girls & Getting What You Deserve 👠 | Call Her Tatty ft. Gity Kogan

Transcript

Getts, Girls & Getting What You Deserve 👠 | Call Her Tatty ft. Gity Kogan · Call Her Tatty

• 0:00
  Hi, Shafelaz. This episode of Caller Tati is not for the kinder luck. It is for
• 0:06
  adult and mature audiences only. We dive into sensitive topics that are only
• 0:14
  appropriate for adults. There is a stichle-nivele pet, but we do bleep out most of it.
• 0:20
  Enjoy! Kudaf, are you to judge me? They have not found a hatter for how to get a woman to get.
• 0:29
  Even though this podcast is still new, I know there are people from very different backgrounds
• 0:33
  listening and I think that your perspective can really tap into all those backgrounds.
• 0:37
  People look to other people for their happiness and they don't look at themselves and say,
• 0:43
  I am causing my own unhappiness. Hi, Shafelaz. Today, I have an amazing guest. She is one of my best
• 0:50
  friends from LA. She is a rock star attorney and she literally makes me push my pants because
• 0:56
  she is so funny. Everybody, this is Giddy Kogan. Giddy, welcome! I just want to clarify,
• 1:03
  am I one of your best friends or am I one of your best friends from LA? I don't have friends here,
• 1:08
  so you're my best friend. There we go. Okay, let's start with that. I just want to say I am so
• 1:13
  nervous to be here. Why? It's not my first podcast. We actually had to have a cocktail before we
• 1:19
  started this. We did. I'm just nervous because, like, look at me, like, denim, white t-shirt. I came
• 1:25
  in in my, like, Jordans. You're all decked out. I'm ready. I'm ready for a peace out program.
• 1:31
  You're literally ready to go. I'm ready to go. I'm not even wearing my ring. I'm nervous.
• 1:36
  Yeah. I'm prepared. No, you look fabulous. You're also Miami. So, like, this is, like,
• 1:41
  totally chill. Like, who knows where this is going to go today? We really don't know where it's
• 1:45
  going to go. A. Okay, so Giddy, I'm very happy you're here, Miami, because I literally never see you.
• 1:52
  So, it's a really, it's a real treat for me to have you. It's a real treat for you,
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  being Miami with me, especially like when we could just, like, chill, go to the beach and, like,
• 2:02
  by the way, this was, like, not a podcast where we arrange you're going to fly here specifically
• 2:09
  for a podcast. It was kind of, like, oh, you're here. Let's just do a podcast because, like,
• 2:14
  hey, we know each other for forever. And we just talk, like, nonstop about, like, stupid things,
• 2:18
  so, like, whatever. But also, I think, like, you just have, like, a lot of knowledge that I feel,
• 2:25
  like, I feel the world needs to hear and your perspective on a lot of things. And, you know,
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  I just know that, like, I have a very vibrant audience and they're from literally all different
• 2:38
  walks of life. And even though this podcast is still new, like, I know there are people from
• 2:42
  very different backgrounds listening. And I think that your perspective can really tap into
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  all those backgrounds. So I think that I have my foot in so many different worlds,
• 2:51
  right, because my parents are Ukrainian immigrants. I was born in Ukraine,
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  first generation, whatever that means, and my mom doesn't speak English. I really just
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  transverse the world of having onto Bay Siaco, but I also am an attorney between stepkids
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  and life and whatever. It's like, I, I hit so many different boxes on any given day. Right.
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  That, like, I either can connect with people because I come from so many different worlds,
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  or I can't connect with them because they feel like, well, you didn't grow up in my world
• 3:26
  so you don't understand. Right. But I'm not really looking to, like, connect with everybody. Like,
• 3:30
  that's okay. Like, everybody can stay in their own universe and no one has to come into mind.
• 3:34
  And that's fine. But I feel like you can have a deep understanding of people's backgrounds,
• 3:39
  even if you haven't lived it because you either worked on a case that you had to, like,
• 3:45
  really put yourself and inject yourself in somebody else's shoes, or you had to just understand,
• 3:53
  like, people's perspectives. So, you know, the hardest part of my job is that I put myself
• 4:01
  into my client's shoes because I think that to be a good family law attorney and to understand
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  that this is the most complicated something in anybody's life and you understand this. And I,
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  I mean, I guess we could say this, like, I was your attorney for your first divorce and it was
• 4:19
  quite simple. But even in that, I had to put myself into your shoes and to understand that even
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  something that's super basic and super not complicated, it is the end of somebody's hope and dream
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  in this one, in this one moment, you know. And so I have to put myself in people's shoes. And I
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  think that the fact that other attorneys don't makes them callous, makes them sloppy, and it
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  makes them not understand how important this is for their client. And until I became a partner
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  as much as I understood it, until I lived it, I couldn't understand it fully. And now I don't
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  know that I could ever go back words, you know, like I will always see that perspective, not from
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  my perspective, but from the perspective of watching a parent suffer when, you know, something in
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  custody doesn't go their way. Because I watch my clients suffer. And it's only the good parents
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  and the good people that suffer. How often do you ever come across a divorce case where it seems like
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  it's going to be smooth sailing? And like they just don't even want to fight about anything,
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  like they just want 50, 50 custody split the assets down the middle. How often does like a clean
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  divorce happen? So I tend to get, so my referrals really come from opposing counsel and they come
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  from my own clients. I don't advertise and I don't seek out cases. And so I'm not known for those
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  cases. The people who hire me have complex financial matters. Or most of the time they have very
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  complex custody issues. So unfortunately, I don't see enough of the, I just want this and we're done.
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  I love those cases. Yeah. They're fast. And I feel like I, because I can work efficiently, like I
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  can help people like in and out be done. And when my friends come to me, I do it very quickly.
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  And sometimes I have had both of my friends sitting in my, like literally at my kitchen counter
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  and I have done their divorce for them. We have mediated the divorce. We submitted the
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  people work literally just two weeks ago. I had two friends that I've known forever. They've both
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  moved on. I had them sitting in my kitchen. We finalized their judgment. I submitted it to the
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  court and we walked out of my house and went to dinner to celebrate the divorce that I just submitted
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  for them. And so I love that. I love that I was able to do that for them. But I don't get enough of
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  that. Do you see, like, is there like an even split? Do you see most of these, especially when
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  they're children involved? Do you see that it mostly gets ugly? Or do you see that it's like,
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  whatever, like each case is just, you know, its own thing. And each case is its own thing. And I
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  think that what initially is sometimes not ugly, sometimes when you add in like a new partner
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  or something happens or, you know, somebody has like gone to the wrong type of therapy or
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  gone to a wrong therapist. Does that happen often? Or they got really bad advice? I think so. I
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  think that people pick therapists generally that they align with, right? Like you want the
• 7:40
  person who's going to tell you what you want to hear. Right. They want to hear it. They don't want
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  somebody to give them like the truth. Right. You don't want someone who's going to tell you like
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  take breath. That's probably not a good way to look at things. Right. Because that's not helpful.
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  Right. To you when you're going to therapy, I think, so I think that people generally pick
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  therapists that they align with. I mean, I see that a lot in my clients, like they definitely
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  pick therapists they align with. Right. And so when you're in that position, you know,
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  and so sometimes that you could have had a really amicable divorce and then you come back
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  and you're just no longer amicable. Do you feel like you're almost like fighting for yourself
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  when you're with your client? No. So I, I used to have a mantra that was not my monkeys,
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  not my circus. And that's how I get through the day. That's how I'm able to do what I do during
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  the day and then come home to my family and turn that off. Right. Because it's not fair to my
• 8:33
  family for me to come home and to be living that. Right. So when I'm in court, I'm in a different
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  element. Like you and I right now, like we just had a cocktail and I could talk about this.
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  If I had court tomorrow, I would not be drinking today. I'm just, I'm in a very different,
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  when I walk into a courthouse, I am the shark that my clients pay me to be. They want their
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  money sport. Yeah. And they're like, oh, like don't take it offensively, but like there's always
• 9:00
  like the animals that they compare me to whether it's a shark or a snake, which I always think is
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  a little, yeah, no, that's offensive. They're personal pit bull. And I'm just like, I mean,
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  animal bark. You don't have me on a leash. You could bark if you want. No, I'm trying to
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  give you on a leash. You're not trying to give me on a leash, but that's just, that's my element.
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  Yeah. And then obviously when you're dealing with a couple that doesn't have children or assets,
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  would you say that those just tend to just be easier, just the nature of the divorce? No,
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  no. Really? What do people fight about already? Thank God my divorce was so easy,
• 9:38
  peasy, lemon, squeezy. Honestly, there was just no fighting. I've had people fighting over China
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  that was used over 30 years of marriage. Like it was so immaterial, people who want to fight,
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  fight, right. And it's like, oh, what's like the stupidest thing people fought over that really
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  just China? To me, that China fight, considering how long the marriage was like, I remember telling
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  my client, I'm like, this is offensive. I'm not even, I'm not even going to talk about it. And he
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  was like, no, but it says, and I'm like, I was like, a family heirloom. No. Oh, but his mother bought
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  it like 27 years ago. Was it like China for me? It was like wedge wood. And I, you know what I mean?
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  At least make it a mess. But even if it was a mess, like that's like, I would fight on China. I
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  would fight for my arm as you would have fought for your arm as dishes. I would, well, like, yeah,
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  I would you would have I would you would have fired me had I not wanted to fight for your arm. That
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  wasn't even like a fight. That wasn't even like a fight. That was just like, they're mine. They're
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  mine. So for me, it's very like, you know, I found the value in that for myself. Obviously, like,
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  but I don't want to value in that. Like, but I don't find value in that as the lawyer and like,
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  I don't want to do that. I don't want to represent people who want to do that. Okay. Well, you
• 10:59
  ready represent to me. Yeah. Delay. So Lee, she gets the arm as dishes. I just want you to know.
• 11:05
  Well, I got them anyways. So maybe I'll get a platter out of it. You know, my big platter shattered
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  pissed. You know, by the way, like, you had that custom made, like, love seat, that gray one.
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  I have it. I still have it. You still sit on it. I do. And any time anybody compliments,
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  like, anybody, like, you heard from your divorce. I literally said it. Like, I got it in my best
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  friends' divorce. It's comfy. Yeah. And then I had your kitchen aid food processor for forever.
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  So, you know, what's funny? I gave you a kitchen aid. And then it gave Shira kitchen aid.
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  I also got some very sister-in-law. I also got some very expensive blender from your divorce.
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  It was very happy about it. I gave a lot of my stuff away. And then I kept a lot. Those were the
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  only three things I wanted. I wanted that couch. Also, like, when I moved to New York, I wasn't going
• 11:51
  to shut up with it with me. I really wanted that food processor for potato gogo. I gave someone
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  in my Bosch. Someone got me a Bosch. And I gave it to Esther. Did I? Yeah. I never made
• 12:00
  a call on my own. Trust me. I know. I still never made a call on my own. I'm too, like, I don't
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  know. I make no need for it. Some PTSD in the hollow world for me. I make no need for bread,
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  whatever. I don't know. I like buying it. I can't bake. What's the funniest thing that ever happened
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  in a courtroom? So, as representing this guy, God, we had been in trial for months and months and
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  months. And he was young. He was funny. He was ridiculous. We totally should have won. We didn't.
• 12:27
  The judge hated him from the start. And as the judge is reading the order, my client stands up.
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  And he's like, who the f**k are you to judge me? And I remember, I just went like this, like,
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  face palm. And I was like, oh my god. Oh my god. Like, why? Why does this happen to me? And like,
• 12:48
  ever since then, I swear he like started like some cosmic thing where like, weird tidbits like
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  this come out of my clients. And I just sit there like, all right. I'm just okay. You do you.
• 13:01
  I told you not to talk. And here you are talking. That is absolutely. Who are you to judge me?
• 13:07
  Yeah, I feel like there are other people that I know who like actually would say that. Yeah. Yeah.
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  Okay. So, we know that you deal with divorces and you deal with people in different communities,
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  different religions and backgrounds. And I know you have dealt with bastons in the past.
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  What are your opinions on baston during divorces? Okay. So, I think my skirt's too short for me to
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  actually have credibility answering this question. But I do want to answer it. So, I want to
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  preface my answer by saying that I have the utmost respect for rabbinic authority. I do.
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  I think that there is extreme power in having somebody who can guide you along the guidelines of
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  Torah and look, to me, religion, whether or not it's an opiate for the masses, at least Judaism to
• 14:08
  me is a guidebook on how you should conduct yourself and how you should live your life.
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  I agree. And it's not necessarily about halachhan and hashqafah, but it's the concept of however you
• 14:20
  do shawbis, whether it's your shomer, you know, your shomer f***ing shawbis, Big Lebowski, right? 10,000
• 14:28
  years of organized religion right there. But like, if you're whether you're a shomer shawbis,
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  you know, kehalah start to finish or you just do a Friday night dinner because your spouse isn't
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  Jewish, whatever it is that you are doing in your life, the concept is it's family, it's unity,
• 14:47
  it's consistency, it's honesty and integrity. That is what Judaism is and should stand for, right?
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  And so to me, rabbinim are the people who are supposed to not so much even that they embody it,
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  but they are supposed to teach us how to make the decisions that follow that path to honesty and
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  integrity. And so when I say that, it actually is extremely painful and uncomfortable for me
• 15:16
  that butte did have really neglected the issue of a get. And I say that because I know so many
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  people in Los Angeles, and I know rabbinim by name and by face, who I can tell you, give
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  hete rim to people in the community that because they let's say have like whatever they consider
• 15:38
  to be psychological problems or emotional issues, they give them a header in terms of like
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  things that we consider to be chelah shawbis, like they could use their phone, they could
• 15:50
  watch TV, whether it's with a shinoi or they could talk to Siri and whatever, you know, they have
• 15:55
  their housekeeper tuning on for them, rabbinim give hete rim for things that are like, for literally
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  shmira's shawbis, something that is part of aseras hadibros that's straight from the Torah.
• 16:07
  And yet the same butte did, the same rabbinim, the same people who sit on like the highest court
• 16:15
  of religious authority in, you know, in our cities, they have not found a header for how to get a
• 16:23
  woman a get. That to me is it's unacceptable, it's inexcusable, and it makes no sense. And I
• 16:30
  spoke to a get-refuser once who said to me that the way he justified with holding the get is that
• 16:38
  well my wife can be friends with men, she can talk to men, she can go out with men, the only
• 16:43
  thing she can't do is have a sexual relationship with a man. And I'm just sitting there like, but
• 16:49
  that is the premise of what you hold her change to, you hold her change to your relationship.
• 16:55
  Right. And I sometimes wonder if butte did really view it that way that like we're not keeping her
• 17:00
  from living her life, we're just keeping her from moving forward in that one aspect of her life.
• 17:06
  So what's the big deal? And I think it's a huge deal and I think that like it's not about a movement
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  and I'm not gonna talk about what I think or don't think of like certain get-movements and people
• 17:17
  who are involved in those movements. I'm just saying that butte did in Rabbonim have an
• 17:21
  highest to our community to find that loophole because we are like full of loopholes. Yeah. And we
• 17:28
  know it. We have loopholes for everything. Right. We're going to have loopholes for Shmira Shabbos when
• 17:33
  it comes to whamma. We have kosher elevators. If you can get into an elevator on Shabbos, you can find
• 17:39
  a way to give a woman her get when her husband refuses and want, you know, and if men have the
• 17:45
  heads or may a rub on it, women should have the same. Right. I don't understand where that loophole
• 17:50
  is missing and I would love for some love to be able to explain it to me. Maybe I should have a
• 17:55
  rub on my podcast and we can ask in that question. I would love that because that is something that
• 18:00
  actually is very, it's very hurtful to me as somebody who grew up in this system and who really
• 18:08
  has a respect and a love and appreciation for it that like we have so tainted I think Orthodox
• 18:16
  Judaism with our inability to find a way to give women a get. But you've also seen like the inside
• 18:26
  of like obviously stories and people and, you know, people in communities left to talk about,
• 18:32
  oh they know what's going on and you could very well be on the case of something and you're like
• 18:39
  it's not all that it's cracked out to be. Look, I am having not only being a family lawyer but also
• 18:46
  being a litigant. I very much or having been a litigant I should say and having been the partner
• 18:51
  of a litigant. I very much understand the concept of there is her version, his version and the reality.
• 19:00
  And it doesn't mean that either person is lying. It's just like you and I could listen to the same
• 19:07
  thing and have two different takeaways because our brains just processed it differently. Yeah,
• 19:12
  sometimes somebody is straight out lying. Right, you know, like I wasn't drinking and then they
• 19:17
  got arrested for a DUI. No, you were definitely drinking. Right, because you don't just get drunk.
• 19:23
  Right. But then, you know, but it's not always that direct. Right.
• 19:28
  I think the whole get refusal thing probably just has to do with the fact on revenge,
• 19:33
  but do you believe in any sort of revenge during a divorce? If somebody wanted to get not
• 19:38
  necessarily with a get but anything else, you know, people are capable of such cruelty to one
• 19:43
  another. But I can't imagine that if you really had loved someone that hard, right, that you could
• 19:50
  have it in you to wreck their lives with with vengeance. Right. No matter how hurt you are,
• 19:57
  no matter how devastated you are, if you truly and honestly and wholeheartedly loved someone,
• 20:06
  should not be able to take that kind of revenge to ruin their lives, no matter what they've done to
• 20:14
  you. But love and hate, their opposites, but they're also the same. So to me, love and hate are
• 20:20
  the same. Their opposite spectrums of the same intensity. It's in difference. That's the opposite
• 20:29
  of love. I think I think that, you know, to when you love somebody and then they do something to you
• 20:36
  that's that's cruel. That's, you know, that's unforgivable, you know, like betrayal after betrayal.
• 20:43
  You can feel hatred toward them, but that hatred only comes because you also love them. Right.
• 20:52
  But to me, where that line is drawn is the indifference. It's when I don't give up anymore.
• 21:01
  Like you can literally go crawl in a hole and die. I don't care. Right. You can go jump off that
• 21:08
  bridge. I don't care. That's the opposite of love. Do you think that the indifference comes after
• 21:16
  the hate or like do you think that it that like there's like a timeline for that? If you're lucky,
• 21:23
  you get two indifference. I think that's a blessing if you become indifferent. Yeah. Yeah.
• 21:30
  I think that if you loved someone and you lost them, whether you walked away or they walked away
• 21:36
  or they created a scenario where you had to walk away, I think that the biggest blessing is
• 21:42
  is that you hope that one day you are indifferent to them because you want to move on and you want to
• 21:48
  just like, I don't know if it's that you want to move on or you just don't want to feel
• 21:52
  that that hurt. Right. And again, I don't know about other people. I know about me and I feel
• 22:01
  things very intensely. But I also, I'm indifferent very quickly with your clients. Can you see if they
• 22:09
  genuinely love their spouse during a divorce? Because they feel that rage and can you tell if they
• 22:17
  actually never loved their spouse? Because they're just so indifferent. Can you sense that?
• 22:23
  When I see the indifference, they know that I see it or I sense it. And they defend it before I ever
• 22:32
  like make a comment about it because they generally don't comment about it. I don't really
• 22:36
  write. That's not your place. That's not your place. Right. But they'll like say something like,
• 22:40
  I'm sure you're hearing the way I'm saying it. Like you don't understand. It's been years and
• 22:44
  it's been whatever. Right. And so I think that at some point it grows into indifference. I think
• 22:50
  it's also easier to be indifferent when you're the person who leaves. Right. Meaning like when you
• 22:56
  didn't have a particular reason, like, you know, if you walk it on something and you see something
• 23:00
  you shouldn't see or you found out something you shouldn't found out when you leave, you're not
• 23:05
  going to find that indifference place in life and your soul quickly. Right. But if you're the spouse
• 23:11
  who left because you were just unhappy, you'll probably get to indifference pretty quickly.
• 23:17
  So the couples who actually loved very hard and then something obviously just makes them
• 23:27
  and all of it. Is there anything you can pinpoint to which is like, could it be money? Could it be
• 23:33
  expectations? Is there anything specific that is usually a common theme why people and
• 23:40
  relationships that were one to really party? So I think that that's the question that people love
• 23:46
  to ask me. And from what I see, whether it's my divorced friends, my divorced clients, I think
• 23:58
  people have unrealistic expectations of other people and they also are not self-aware.
• 24:05
  People look to other people for their happiness and they don't look at themselves and say,
• 24:11
  I'm unhappy because I'm unhappy. Right. I am causing my own unhappiness. People don't recognize
• 24:20
  their part in their own emotions. People do shitty things. There's no question. But someone
• 24:27
  else is not responsible for how you feel. Your reaction is entirely your own. Your reaction may
• 24:34
  be appropriate for somebody's behavior, but that's still your reaction. You can walk in on something
• 24:41
  that is relationship ending that you did not expect and you can leave gracefully. You can collect your
• 24:50
  belongings and leave gracefully and quietly or you can be a sociopath and you can grab somebody's
• 24:57
  like golf clubs and beat someone. I'm saying like, you could. Right. I'm saying like, you know,
• 25:02
  you are responsible for your reaction to it. You can leave gracefully or you can leave
• 25:11
  in handcuffs. Right. You know what's funny? Tell me. We usually just laugh our asses off and now we
• 25:16
  got like really deep and like serious. And like I like it, but like also like I was expecting this
• 25:21
  to be like so much more like we could be so unhinged together, but you're asking me like very emotional
• 25:27
  questions and I know we got very emotional. I think it was the wine. It could have been the wine.
• 25:32
  I'm not a wine drinker in here. Okay. So last night I went on my Instagram and I asked people to
• 25:37
  give me questions so I can hand them over to you. Love free legal advice. We're going to do free
• 25:43
  legal advice. So tune in. No, it's not legal advice. I want to be clear. I am not handing you
• 25:47
  on that. Well, you know what? You can reach out to Getty. You're looking for an attorney,
• 25:55
  but you're going to pay. She doesn't do pro bono work ever. I use don't expect. I used to do
• 26:01
  pro bono. It's not like a thing like she's not a Tadaka. Yeah, that's my favorite. You're not
• 26:07
  a Tadaka. No businesses are Tadaka unless they are a Tadaka. My favorite is when they like
• 26:11
  they want me to do the case for free, but like the person who they're asking to fund the litigation.
• 26:17
  Yeah. They don't want to ask them to cut a bigger check because I mean that's money. Right.
• 26:22
  So that's money, but my time is not somehow money. It's okay. So we're going to address some
• 26:28
  questions that I have received in my Instagram questionnaire. Let's do it. What's the most
• 26:33
  unusual clause in a prenup or divorce settlement? So people do have these weird like sex clauses.
• 26:41
  Like, you know, it's always like when it's an older guy and like some like... And he can barely
• 26:47
  see anything anyway. No, man. He's like in his 50s and his 60s. And the girls like inner 20s
• 26:54
  are early 30s. Like some hookery type relationship. Like clearly she's not marrying him for his
• 26:59
  personality. She's marrying for his looks. What are you talking about? Clearly not that either,
• 27:04
  but you know, and like they want provisions about how many times a week or a month just to put out.
• 27:09
  And I just sit there and I'm like, guys, it's not enforceable in the state of California. No,
• 27:13
  there's all these like problems with it. I'm not going to put it in there, but you know, people ask.
• 27:20
  Have you ever seen like a weight clause? I give someone gets like too fat. I have yet to see one,
• 27:25
  but it doesn't mean that it's not there. Do celebrities fight more over money or custody?
• 27:30
  They use custody as leverage. So they fight for the custody for the leverage that it gives them.
• 27:37
  And the clout. Because like obviously they want to be the better parent, especially when they're like...
• 27:41
  Yeah, when it's really like... They're like all over the media. Like nobody wants to be named as like
• 27:45
  the terrible parent. Right. When it's really like in TMZ. It's the nanny. Can we just give custody to
• 27:50
  the nanny and everybody like goes away, thinks like let's just do that. So you work with a lot of
• 27:56
  high-profile people, celebrities. What's like the... I don't want to say a lot. Like I want to be clear,
• 28:01
  like I don't want to pretend that. Handful. Yeah. I have like one or two like whatever and then
• 28:07
  I have athletes. Okay, but there's celebrities in their own like in their own right or athletes,
• 28:11
  baby mamas. What's like the number one reason why you think those high-profile athletes,
• 28:16
  celebrities get divorced? Is it infidelity? You know, that's like so hard. It's... I feel like a lot of
• 28:24
  times there's a new partner in the picture that pushes an agenda. Okay. I think that they fight
• 28:31
  about custody. I think there's always a little bit of like a financial element with the custody
• 28:36
  because of the support and all of that. But you know, really? Like it's such a cliche,
• 28:42
  but like stars, they're just like us. They aren't just like us. They eat, they eat, they poop,
• 28:46
  they like do everything. They literally like they have the same bullshit. It's just on a more
• 28:52
  public platform. Right. But then again, people with like, you know, you give somebody 500 followers
• 28:58
  on Instagram and they have a public profile. Right. And then all of a sudden they're getting
• 29:02
  everyone's a content creator. Everyone's a content creator. Get a job. Okay. And then we can talk
• 29:07
  about like how hard you work. Oh my god. Okay. How many baby mamas are the most baby mamas you've ever
• 29:14
  had to deal with in a court situation? Like six baby mamas. Seven. Seven. Seven. Seven. Seven. How
• 29:20
  many children? I think nine. I'm gonna leave it at that because I might give the rest of it away.
• 29:25
  Oh, seven. Yeah. And do they get like equal per child? No. Because they're in different states.
• 29:33
  Oh, some different made a lot of different area codes. He's yeah. Yeah. A little like yeah.
• 29:39
  Yeah. It's just like ludicrous as it. I have a question for you. Can I ask you a question?
• 29:43
  Oh my god. Ask me. Ask me not anything, but most things. Do you know that I don't know your
• 29:48
  favorite song? I have been friends with you for almost two decades. And it depends on like the day.
• 29:54
  Like what song? Like what? Let me see your heartstrings. I'm like, Spotify right now. And I'll tell you
• 29:59
  other than Lave Tahor. Like what song? Tugs at your heartstrings. Now, just so everybody knows,
• 30:05
  you and I have been making music videos to Rick Ross's rich bitch keep doing that. Literally
• 30:11
  2014. It's a great song. It was very well produced. I'll tell you what it is. It's a Travis Scott song
• 30:18
  because I clearly look like a huge Travis Scott fan right now. Okay. It's actually,
• 30:22
  I listened to it maybe a hundred times in the car. It's called guidance. Can I hear it? Yeah.
• 30:27
  I must have played it like 50 times already. Why is that your favorite?
• 30:34
  Anyways, why? Tell me why that's your favorite. I think there's just something about the tune.
• 30:39
  There's something about like the vibe. But then I'm going to get over it in a week and then I'm
• 30:43
  going to find some other stupid song that I'm going to like. Okay. I don't know. I'm like, I'm a
• 30:47
  huge music person. But I'm also like into really weird genres. Like I love rap. Yeah. I love
• 30:52
  we love rap. I love pop. By the way, like yesterday when I worked out in the morning, she started
• 30:56
  playing Britney Spears and I'm like, oh my god. Like I and I was just like singing along. I wasn't
• 31:01
  like spitting and working on. But yeah, I definitely love rap hip hop. Lave Tahor. Lave. No. I like
• 31:11
  Lave Tahor. Like music like for like the Jewish genre. But would I like go on my spot
• 31:18
  to find like, would that be like my first pick? Like are they in my library? No. I feel like music
• 31:23
  is a very emotional personal thing and whatever. Like I say that and like I listen to Travis
• 31:29
  Gotten Rick Ross and that's my emotional personal connection right there. Which sounds really messed
• 31:36
  up. But I think like also like when I work, I like listening to really hard rap because it's like
• 31:41
  gets me like in the vibe. And then like I look like this. When I drive to court, I love to listen to
• 31:48
  Eminem. It's like, but that makes sense. Because that's what I used to listen to when I was studying
• 31:53
  for the bar. Like that's my hype, my hype music. Right. That's Eminem. So I'll tell you the truth.
• 31:57
  I'm just going to pull this up. Like won't back down Eminem is like my like so hype music for
• 32:02
  court. Okay. So if I mean like a chill mood, we're like, I feel good. I love Fred again. Do
• 32:08
  you know who that is? No. Okay. Great DJ. Okay. He's like so he's like very like low profile. But
• 32:14
  like if you know his you've heard his music before, but he's like not like he's like not performing
• 32:18
  at like music festivals. Love him. Like I love Teddy Swims in Chris Stabilton. But like when I'm in
• 32:24
  my feels, it's always two songs ever since high school. It's always going to be Mariah Carey my
• 32:31
  all. Okay. Like that song, you know, I just think about it how much I loved it at 16. It like
• 32:37
  represented my teenage inks. Yeah. But like as an adult in a relationship, like to me, it's like it's
• 32:44
  it like touches my soul. Mm hmm. That and then sober by pink. They don't make music like that
• 32:51
  anymore. No. And like and I know we sound old and oh my god, what a cliche. But like really
• 32:56
  pinks sober. Like when I'm when I'm up at 2 a.m. Yeah. And if no one's home, that's when I'm
• 33:03
  blasting through the house because it's it's intense and it's powerful and it's and it's real.
• 33:09
  Yeah. You know, and like music isn't real anymore. Yeah. It's just you know who told me they're like
• 33:16
  you should sing on your podcast. You have a great voice. Remember when you used to copy Britney
• 33:21
  spheres. Yeah. But you can't. But it's like Koleisha. We can put a disclaimer. Don't tune in
• 33:29
  if you're a man and you're not my father, my husband or my brothers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 33:36
  No. Ellie Schwabel literally told me like on your podcast, you must sing something. I'm like
• 33:40
  Ellie, I can't. I wish Ellie Schwabel was here right now. We can have a really one a moment podcast.
• 33:45
  He's so funny and I want to be in this studio when Ellie is on your podcast. And there's a
• 33:49
  shaman. That's just a shaman. Yeah. I love music. So funny. I really do think that I like music.
• 33:58
  It's like hormones. Tell me. It changes all the time. Like sometimes you want something this.
• 34:04
  You're not always in the mood for like a good piece of cake. Sometimes you're in the mood to eat.
• 34:09
  Always always. I mean. Oh, it's amazing. But like music like changes and I think it has to do with
• 34:14
  your emotions and it has to do with like where you are and what are you doing at that time?
• 34:20
  Like is everything in your life going good? Because like if everything in my life is going good and
• 34:24
  I'm like chill and I'm not worrying about anything, I put on like good like house music and like,
• 34:30
  you know, vibe and then what I'm angry when I'm mad at put on like breaking Benjamin.
• 34:34
  So I have a question. All right. So I have a question for you. So diary of Jane. I love that.
• 34:40
  I love that. But I have a question. Literally I put it on in the car. So it was like, what are you
• 34:43
  listening to? Like this is this is all tentative. This is this is the music. I listened to when I'm
• 34:47
  like angry at the world and I'm just like, and then like, I feel better after listening to it.
• 34:51
  But do you turn on the song because of how you're feeling? Or does the song? I want to feel more sad.
• 34:57
  Okay. So this song. Okay. So like if I'm sad and I'm listening to a song,
• 35:00
  I want to feed into it. Yes. And that's how that's like my therapy. Like I want to tap into it.
• 35:06
  I don't want to deny the feeling. I want to tap into it. I want to acknowledge it. I want to
• 35:10
  experience it. And eventually I have something else that I'm going to bitch about. So like I feel
• 35:17
  like, but I feel like everyone does that. Everyone listens to music. Like when they're sad. They
• 35:21
  listen to a sad song. They're not going to listen to Uncle Mashi when you're sad. You're going to
• 35:24
  listen to my all by Mariah Carey. Like you're so worthy of I think when you want to keep drinking.
• 35:29
  Yeah. Right. Right. No, but like to me, it's like if I want to if I just turn on my shuffle.
• 35:35
  If a sad song comes on, I immediately like embody like that feeling of that song.
• 35:43
  And sometimes like I'll have to like actually like talk to myself and be like,
• 35:48
  this is not like we are not doing this today. Like today is not that day.
• 35:54
  Today is not the day. Yeah. Today there's there's way too much that has to get done.
• 35:59
  Can't be sad to that. Schwitz or McVaugh.
• 36:03
  This or that. Especially when I'm going into the ocean and you're yelling after me.
• 36:09
  There is nothing more disturbing about that because there's always like five from people around.
• 36:14
  And they always actually think I'm going to the McVaugh. Because you literally yell from like a mile
• 36:19
  into the beach. You're like, yeah, like kosha kosha. I think it was funny.
• 36:24
  It's incredible because I don't know. That's like that's just sums up our relationship.
• 36:28
  Literally. Am I going into the ocean and you yelling kosha? I sometimes say those things before.
• 36:34
  Which is the craziest thing you ever said to someone and you're like, oh wow, I should not have said that.
• 36:39
  So this one time this guy got on the stand. This is my first like multimillion dollar trial. That was like
• 36:44
  10 days solo trial. It was a baby lawyer. It was like five years in. The partners gave it to me
• 36:51
  for God knows what reason. It was like, no, they were like, we have really good malpractice
• 36:57
  insurance. Go. You know, like they really believed in trial by fire. So whatever.
• 37:01
  I'm doing this trial. The guy gets on the stand and I catch that the tax return that his lawyer
• 37:10
  just handed him is a different tax return that was in the exhibit book that we exchanged. And by
• 37:14
  the way, it actually happens to me pretty recently that in opposing council, doctor two different
• 37:19
  pieces of evidence. And I am strongly debating like reporting her to the bar. I just, I have my own
• 37:26
  personal reasons for not wanting to. But like when I see that, like I don't let that go. And I will tell
• 37:32
  everybody in the family law community that this lawyer doctor's evidence. Wow. I will.
• 37:37
  It's a big no no. It's like you lose your license over that. You should be able to, but they don't,
• 37:42
  which is like horrifying to me. But so this guy testifies about it. Clearly the wrong tax return.
• 37:49
  I start catching him and lie after lie after lie. Okay. And then the guy literally admits to lying
• 37:57
  on his tax returns. And he says, well, my lawyer and my accountant told me to do that. Not me.
• 38:03
  I wasn't a lawyer. Okay. And the judge stops the proceedings. And he's a council. Everybody in
• 38:08
  chambers. Wow. And so he brings us in. And he turns to the other lawyer. And she's not saying
• 38:15
  anything because we all know that she definitely told him to lie about it. She's like notoriously
• 38:21
  dishonest. And then he looks across those a lot. I do. And then he, the judge looks at me and I'm
• 38:27
  like, you're on her. I'm just going to say that my frozen forehead just moved a few inches when
• 38:31
  he started talking. And like in my head, I was like, that was funny. But like, oh, my God,
• 38:37
  like this judge used to be the presiding judge a family law. And I just said that I look like I
• 38:43
  literally look like a did and he started laughing. And I was like, Oh, thank God. But like in that
• 38:49
  moment, like I just thought like, you know, it was funny. Yeah. It was funny. Yeah. You know,
• 38:55
  that is funny. And I don't know how professional that sounds. But you know what I feel like. And so,
• 38:59
  you know, we need to keep them engaged. Is that a way to keep them engaged? Like a good judge.
• 39:03
  Like, so I infuse, I try to infuse like a little humor. You should. Because number one,
• 39:09
  because the worst is not pleasant. So like, at least think of funny. First of all, it wakes up
• 39:12
  the judge. Right. They'll remember that I asked that question. Okay, strategy. They'll focus.
• 39:17
  Right. And also like, honestly, sometimes you do it awake myself up because like you sit there
• 39:22
  and you're like on day four and you're like, Oh my God, I cannot keep listening to the same
• 39:26
  shit over and over. This is a waste of everybody's time. This is a waste of everybody's money.
• 39:31
  And sometimes like, I'll stop in the middle and I'll just be like, I really think at this point,
• 39:36
  we should all be done. I mean, this is now becoming a total waste. Like the things that these
• 39:41
  people are saying are on or don't even make sense. Right. That's always like Ms. Kogan. I'm like,
• 39:45
  what? Like this actually doesn't make sense anymore. Like we've totally lost track of why we're here.
• 39:50
  You know, everybody's, you know, like I recently had like a celebrity case. And he had like
• 39:55
  three lawyers there every day, two partners and then sometimes like a fourth associate of roller
• 40:01
  self-in. And I'm just sitting there like, like, this is a show for that. Like, why are we even here?
• 40:07
  This is just a bill of billing venanza. And I'm sitting here like, my God, this girl cannot afford
• 40:13
  like 10 days of this side show anymore. Yeah. But not up to me. Have you ever had like a weird,
• 40:22
  they're all weird? Yeah. Have you ever had like a situation where you had people get divorced
• 40:30
  and when they're splitting assets, like a guy wants something back from the girl that like just
• 40:35
  makes no sense? All the time. Like a guy asked for like a shatel back that ever happened to you?
• 40:40
  Yeah. Like a mother-in-law was like, I want the shatels. And you're like, really?
• 40:45
  Like what are you gonna do with them and sell them, I guess? I don't know. Like jewelry I can
• 40:49
  understand. But like all of it, like, I'll just look at my client and be like, just give it back.
• 40:54
  It's like, don't even bother fighting for it. No, because I don't want to be the mother-in-law.
• 40:57
  The amount of money they're not to spend on you to fight for it. The matter is, no, because I don't
• 41:00
  want to be the lawyer. The fight's about it. Right. Like I don't want to be that person. It's not
• 41:04
  even that. It's like, it's honestly, I went to school for seven years. Yeah. It is beneath me.
• 41:10
  Right. It's beneath my dignity. Like I don't want to do this. You know, there was like a season where
• 41:14
  I represented a lot of like guys who had kids with strippers. And like every day, I would sit there
• 41:20
  and I would be like, I cannot believe that I went to school for seven years to literally sit here
• 41:25
  and discuss this level of trash bucket behavior. You know, or like, like, you know, like laughing
• 41:32
  because I can see you like just being like, yeah, you know, or like, like, oh my god, like when I,
• 41:36
  like, when you see the Instagram posts and they become exhibits and I sit there and I'm like,
• 41:40
  how are you this dumb? You are a grown-ass woman. Why are you posting this shit on the internet?
• 41:46
  Wait, but we'll get yourself together. Oh my god.
• 41:49
  And people post stuff on the internet. First of all, we both understand that just because
• 41:52
  someone puts something on the internet, on the internet, doesn't necessarily make it true, right?
• 41:58
  Sure. Obviously. I mean, most of these influencers that I follow, like, they're not living these
• 42:03
  great mirror. Like, so let's say, like, I'm no influencer. Right. I know this. I don't know. What do I
• 42:06
  have, like, 200 followers? I don't even know. Right. But like, people, and I don't say this for
• 42:11
  cloud. I say it because it actually makes me uncomfortable. Okay. People will like stop me at like
• 42:15
  the kosher maker on a Friday. Be like, oh my god. Good to you again. You love this, like, fabulous
• 42:19
  life. Oh my god. You're so cool. What fabulous life forces? I don't know. Like what fabulous life
• 42:24
  do I live because you saw me posting from a golf course because we went away for the weekend.
• 42:28
  Right. Do you have any idea how many hours I have to work to be able to afford that? Do you
• 42:33
  understand what a 90-hour work week is? Do you understand what it means to run a law firm and
• 42:39
  have a payroll? Do you understand what it means to have to coordinate custody weekend so that you
• 42:44
  can get that 48 hours somewhere? And by the way, how do you know it's glamorous? How do you know
• 42:50
  that I didn't go there for a day? But that's the point. They base it off of Instagram. You know,
• 42:54
  and so like the other day, like, I happened to have posted that I came to visit you. And I was like,
• 42:59
  you know, it's an incredible blessing that when your life is falling apart that you can go, like,
• 43:03
  visit your best friend and whatever. And yeah, you know, and like on one hand, I am not
• 43:07
  want to share emotions or opinions or politics on Instagram. But I also think that like people
• 43:14
  have this like contorted like misconception of like just because you see me in a pretty car
• 43:21
  with nice things or whatever that you assume that like my life is perfection. You know what?
• 43:27
  It took me a really, really long time to get to where I am, to find my person, to find my place
• 43:33
  in life, to build my family, to start realizing a dream. And it is all a tremendous blessing that I
• 43:42
  have. Everything that I have, literally it every single thing that I have is from Husham. Everything.
• 43:52
  And, you know, there's like, I'm going to butcher it. But like there's the tamaruk saying of like,
• 43:57
  you know, like the otomiyodi, like a suli, like something, something. It's like that. Like the work
• 44:02
  of my hand is what's given me this. That's not true. Yes, I am an extremely hard worker. You will
• 44:10
  find very few people who work as hard as I do. That's for sure. But that ability to work and that
• 44:16
  work ethic is is the brocha that I have from Husham. That is that is a straight blessing that I
• 44:22
  have. That like that's not me. That's that's something I was born with. I was born into a family
• 44:27
  where that was ingrained in me. I was blessed with with parents that instilled very specific values
• 44:35
  in me. And so that's where that comes from. That's it's all a brocha. So don't look at my Instagram
• 44:39
  and be like, so bottom line. Don't assume everything on Instagram just came to somebody just easy
• 44:47
  peasy and like you didn't earn it and work for it. Like no, like there's a story behind those posts.
• 44:53
  Let's talk about you for one quick second. What do we talk about there? Nobody handed you what you have.
• 44:58
  And nobody here. Nobody here. You currently currently hold down two jobs. Yes. Blee Einharan knock on wood.
• 45:09
  You work. I do. And nobody handed you that. And you've seen me work the past few days.
• 45:15
  And I think nobody in your life other than Zoli knows as well as I do, then nobody handed that to you.
• 45:22
  Right. Irrespective of how you grew up and where you grew up, today where you are and your personal
• 45:32
  accomplishments are all you. No one handed that to you and no one knows that better than me.
• 45:38
  That is your hard work. But that's why it's the Atadishmaya. It is 100% Hashem handing you
• 45:43
  brochas. But I'm just saying like, no, but I definitely people don't know that. You know, like and for me,
• 45:50
  I am so afraid of Einharan. Yeah. Terrified of Einharan. Okay. Not because I have whatever, but just
• 45:57
  because like I have worked so hard and for so long to get where I am and to have what I have and
• 46:04
  who I have beside me. But I am so afraid of Einharan, the evil eye, that like I'm afraid, you know,
• 46:11
  like I'll never post a manicure with like my car emblem in the back ever. Did I do that? You
• 46:17
  probably do. No. You painted your car and then you posted it on a bag after doing it. I definitely
• 46:22
  rolled my eyes when I saw those friends when I bought my car. First of all, it was the first time
• 46:29
  in my life. I put a down payment on a car and I was like, wow, I'm an adult. You've got to
• 46:35
  understand. I know. I know. I never owned something that was mine like that. I got it. So I felt
• 46:45
  like proud of myself, but I don't want to be that person. But like, you know what? If I earned it
• 46:51
  and I earned it honestly, I should have no shame being happy and enjoying it. And even a little
• 47:00
  publicly. And I don't think you should have shame. I just I so fear Einharan because people
• 47:08
  I think they're levels to it though. There's some people who are like excessive and then there's
• 47:12
  some people who will post like they're on a nice vacation. They are wearing a new expensive dress
• 47:19
  and it will it won't be like I know bro jeans in a white shirt. But I'm saying like there are
• 47:25
  people who are like overly exposing their lifestyle to a point where it's like we know like they
• 47:30
  are a major credit card debt like there's no way they can afford it. And then there are people
• 47:35
  who will want to share either with their close friends or just the friends up they follow them on
• 47:40
  Instagram or Facebook or whatever. They'll like they're on a nice vacation or they bought themselves
• 47:46
  a new Birken or and you know what there's nothing wrong with it. I don't want to share their joy
• 47:51
  like by the way these are like just because we're like gonna run out of time soon like unboxing
• 47:55
  videos for the most part. I find them super super cringe. I love watching unboxing videos when
• 48:01
  there's a girl or a guy and they bought themselves something that they say up for and they work for
• 48:06
  it and they're just happy. And it's like I just want to like experience that level of happiness
• 48:10
  because I love stuff. I love stuff. I love stuff. And especially like stuff that let's say
• 48:15
  I want to buy for myself like I want someone else to go buy it first and like test it out for
• 48:19
  like actually buy it. But like I want to like I love it. I enjoy that because it's like I understand
• 48:26
  the feeling and it's like I'm happy for them like I'm not jealous like I'm happy for them and it's
• 48:31
  like no I get it like I can like I don't know like I can relate to them. I understand because when
• 48:38
  you tell me you went to a sample sale my first response is always send me pictures. No but sample
• 48:43
  sale. Yeah. And it's Mammage and Avira to not go to a sample sale. It's an Avira to not get
• 48:49
  the mitsia. You know I feel like the same Rebunem who don't require people to give a get. We'll
• 48:55
  find the heads are for you to tell you that you should buy it. You should you go where those shorts
• 48:59
  because you bought them on sale. It was a mitsia. And they were those shorts. But the the thing is
• 49:05
  I'm your Rob you know this you call me for your you're my Rob you have to call me for your
• 49:10
  it's so funny to me because now that we're like actually like running out of time and we got into a
• 49:16
  really yeah you have to catch flight but like now we're like in a conversation that I actually
• 49:20
  enjoy because like we both love stuff and like obviously like I what a lot of people don't even
• 49:25
  know about me is like I love finding deals I don't spend you love deals I love deals I love deals
• 49:31
  more than anything I don't like spending full retail and I rarely do because it Mammage hurts my
• 49:38
  Nishama to like waste money on something when I know I can get it for like at least half off. But
• 49:43
  I also like I also made good connections with people in the fashion world who like hook me up
• 49:48
  with like an extra 50% off by the way like I went to that our conversation at the
• 49:51
  Webster today oh yeah she literally was like ready to give you like the entire collection. Oh
• 49:57
  honey I'm there tomorrow morning. I know no but like I made the connections like the fact that like
• 50:03
  but also like even if it's like receiving a hundred dollars like I'm going to go return the
• 50:08
  shoes that I bought for a hundred and twenty dollars more to sex because the next day they went
• 50:13
  undiscount again so I'm going to go order a new pair and then return the pair that I paid
• 50:17
  a hundred an extra hundred twenty dollars for because it Mammage hurts me to spend the extra
• 50:22
  hundred twenty dollars you know why because that hundred twenty dollars I can get to Zidaka.
• 50:26
  Also that one hundred twenty dollars you could put toward a new pair of Chanel flats that
• 50:30
  doesn't go on sale. I know who I'm dealing with. Girl map. I know who I'm dealing with. Get
• 50:36
  you. We did one out of time. Oh thank god. I'm so scared. No I really want to do this again
• 50:44
  because I feel like the booze is going to hit and then God knows what I'm going to say. No I
• 50:47
  think this was more like fun of like it started out like super serious got more fun and like
• 50:52
  then everyone's just like oh you just like are some materialistic yeah yeah I am you know what
• 50:57
  because I like it and it makes me happy and you know what it's cheaper than therapy. I
• 51:02
  don't ever I support that. It's for the very strong way. I support retail. There has been so fun.
• 51:08
  Gitti Kasehnia Kogen. Gitti okay it's Gitti. Get the Lester. Kasehnia Kogen thank you. Have
• 51:15
  a good lunch for coming on call her Tati and I am very happy you came to Miami. You spent
• 51:23
  the last couple days with me. We spent a lot of quality time together and I hope that you come
• 51:29
  back here very soon. Zoltan thank you for going out of town so that I could have her all to myself.
• 51:36
  Hava Kavaora. Always a pleasure. Pleasure. Oh it's Roch Choresh today. Happy Roch Choresh. Yes.
• 51:43
  Happy Roch Choresh. All right.