Latest / The MMQB NFL Podcast / Mike Tomlin OUT as Steelers Head Coach. What's Next?

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Mike Tomlin OUT as Steelers Head Coach. What's Next? · The MMQB NFL Podcast

0:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome, M&PV NFL podcast emergency edition with Albuquerque, I'm Conoror.
0:12
[SPEAKER_01]: That's fun to say, isn't it?
0:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess in our world, we never really get to do the Walter Cronkite, you know, president was attempted to be a assassinated Gerald Ford thing, you know, but my Tomlin stepping down is the head coach of this year.
0:28
[SPEAKER_01]: It was just kind of as close as it gets for us, you know?
0:30
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're just the nerds in the corner of the news.
0:32
[SPEAKER_00]: I've been there before, like, and I remember having to get on planes back in the day and something would happen.
0:40
[SPEAKER_00]: I have to drop everything.
0:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's not a lifestyle that is very compatible to having three children.
0:47
[SPEAKER_00]: So it was interesting when I was outlasted.
0:51
[SPEAKER_00]: The
0:52
[SPEAKER_00]: when your boss is looking online at flights for you, and there's no, like, well, you know, like, maybe I'll take this five o'clock sick.
1:00
[SPEAKER_00]: I see a 130 out of Logan that'll get you in to Appleton, Wisconsin by 6pm.
1:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Damn it, he saw it.
1:08
[SPEAKER_00]: So I go, go.
1:10
[SPEAKER_01]: the I was thinking about this the last time I remember and it happened with the jets and so when I was at NFL Network and you were at NFL Network I know that you got dispatch there and I don't know if you were there already but I remember seeing you there but the last time I was emergency dispatch because of a breaking story I've been working for NFL Network so I wasn't at the jets or the giants buildings but they said you have to get to the jets now can you guess what it
1:40
[SPEAKER_01]: You would have were there together big story.
1:43
[SPEAKER_00]: We were there to get.
1:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay What I don't know if I don't know if I don't know if I'm firing of Rex the firing of Rex Ryan.
1:51
[SPEAKER_01]: No, we're here.
1:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It was after Rex.
1:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, was it?
1:54
[SPEAKER_00]: I was good as it was it was it I K When she was with got punched in the face.
2:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah
2:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Listen, we're, I had to take a look at the guys.
2:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I can and I'm poli, right?
2:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I can and can poli.
2:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
2:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
2:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
2:10
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where it was.
2:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
2:14
[SPEAKER_01]: This is bigger.
2:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I promise the animals of the New York.
2:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's like, like that was.
2:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Some teams are moving on from their first-head coach in 19 years and other ones.
2:26
[SPEAKER_01]: We're still talking about that time that they wanted to guys punch another guy in the face.
2:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Because that started the Fitz magic thing there.
2:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
2:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I love Fitz, Fitz through for like 3500 yards and they won 10 games that year.
2:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's a huge contract to spew between them and Fitz in the offseason.
2:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, drag, I think it'll like June.
2:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
2:46
[SPEAKER_00]: And the owner basically forced them to resign Fitz.
2:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's amazing.
2:53
[SPEAKER_01]: But we're here to talk about Mike Tomlin and the Pittsburgh Steelers Albert and you have a great piece up on just kind of the magic of Tomlin and I want to talk about that in a minute.
3:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I have one, well I guess, two now, one where we're just examining the opening in and of itself and then I have a couple candidates who
3:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I think would be interesting fits there and then also re-wrote my head coaching predictions and and rank those head coaching jobs.
3:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's start there.
3:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I have the Steelers Albert as the fourth best job in this cycle behind Baltimore 1 Atlanta 2 Giants 3.
3:35
[SPEAKER_01]: What's say you?
3:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think it depends on what you're looking for.
3:39
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I, you go look at this two different ways.
3:43
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, the first one is just the existing roster, right?
3:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And from that perspective, this is not an easy job.
3:51
[SPEAKER_00]: You,
3:52
[SPEAKER_00]: you don't have a ton of players where, and this is always my barometer, how many guys are on the roster that you can say will be there in three years, right?
4:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, because I think that's a good way to look at it and really get like the 30,000-foot view of what you're building with and what you're building around.
4:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And like, I look at the Steelers and who is that?
4:12
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like their center, who's fantastic, but the center, Zach Frazier.
4:16
[SPEAKER_00]: It's, you know, their right guard, Mason McCormick, I think he's gonna be there.
4:21
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if DK McCas is going to be there in three years.
4:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if Alex High is going to be there in three years.
4:26
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if Patrick Queen is going to be there in three years.
4:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Keanu Benton, like a good young defensive line.
4:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, I mean, like at sort of what you're looking at.
4:36
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, you know, there's a ton of age in that roster, you know, and it's not just Aaron Rogers, it's Jalen Ramsey, it's TJ Wat, it's
4:44
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, as Cam Hayward, a guy's that you've relied on, and I went back and looked at this over the weekend before the Steelers even played, and by the time we get to March 8 of the 22 guys who are starting for the Steelers are going to be 30 or 30 or 30 or older, and that's in the NFL and massive numbers.
5:04
[SPEAKER_00]: So from an out roster standpoint, you don't have a long term quarterback.
5:08
[SPEAKER_00]: And you've got a lot of people you have to replace there.
5:13
[SPEAKER_00]: And you don't have a lot of cornerstone pieces that are young at
5:17
[SPEAKER_00]: premium positions.
5:18
[SPEAKER_00]: You could argue maybe the one could be Joey Porter Jr.
5:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
5:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's see that level of player we'll see.
5:25
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's one half of it.
5:27
[SPEAKER_00]: From a roster standpoint, you have a long way to go and there's no easy path to quarterback.
5:33
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not like the Raiders where you have the number one tech.
5:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
5:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Flipside ownership strong.
5:39
[SPEAKER_00]: They're going to be patient or at least you think they're going to be patient I think the one caveat with that is that like my Tom and walked into a pretty ready main situation that was never tested you know what I mean like with Mike like I don't know how and I and Bill Cower one right away so we can say they're going to be patient but we don't know what their tolerance would be for having like a five one season followed by a four one season in the name of rebuilding right they've never really had to go through that but I mean I think just based on who they are
6:08
[SPEAKER_00]: you assume that they're going to be patient.
6:11
[SPEAKER_00]: They're going to let you carry out a plan.
6:13
[SPEAKER_00]: And from that perspective, I think it is a good job because it's a flagship franchise.
6:20
[SPEAKER_00]: The ownership support is there.
6:22
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think it's just sort of what your priority is.
6:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it winning right now?
6:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Or is it, which is like a John Harba, right?
6:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Like if you're John Harba, you want to win right now.
6:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Or do you want to go to a place where, you know, maybe you're going to have a little run way to to to to build I am I think this because I've reached out to a couple people who are familiar with the runes and their process and stuff.
6:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that the big question was, are they going to follow Dan's path way for hiring a coach and Dan was always
6:59
[SPEAKER_01]: I want him to be young, I want him to be assertive, and I want him to come from the defensive side of the ball, 35 or younger.
7:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, battleship commander, battleship commander, right?
7:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you had Bill Cower, 34 from the chiefs, you had Mike Tomlin, 34 from the Vikings, both of those guys lasted a really long time, both of those guys want to Super Bowl.
7:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
7:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, but the league has changed, and I think
7:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I go back and forth on this, because when, and this is a weird example, but when Joe Judge left the giants, I had written at the time, this is probably the end of your Parselsian, I'm going to smack the table and you're going to do what I tell you to do kind of head coach.
7:44
[SPEAKER_01]: And Joe wasn't exactly that, but I think that Joe was kind of trying to conjure a little bit of that.
7:52
[SPEAKER_01]: is the NFL so different now that the Steelers have no choice, but to jump into the game of, I gotta get, I gotta get a Ram's offensive coordinator.
8:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I gotta get someone connected to this thing.
8:04
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think it has, because I think you can look at the playoffs, you can see that, you know, Demiko Rions and Mike Vrable are still standing.
8:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
8:13
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think Demiko Rions and Mike Vrable are like the natural
8:20
[SPEAKER_00]: are sort of the, like, they're the natural successors in the lineage of someone like Parselle's.
8:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you can't, like the one thing that's a little tougher to pull off now will be my way or the highway, but like these guys are program leaders that are sort of cut in the same cloth where they're going to be, their, their programs are tough and demanding.
8:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, but it's like done in a way where you're wrapping your arms around guys, you know what I mean, like, and you're able to build relationships.
8:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's what frail and to me, though, are really good at, um, so like I think it's changed a little, but I don't think.
9:01
[SPEAKER_00]: like this is going to require a, we're blowing up what we've always done and we're going to do it completely different, you know, because I still feel like this way, Connor, I think, Baltimore and Pittsburgh are different than the rest.
9:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And that, like, I think those franchisees almost require a coach more to morph more to what they are than the organization to sort of bend itself to fit the new coach.
9:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Does that make sense?
9:31
[SPEAKER_00]: It does.
9:32
[SPEAKER_00]: It goes back to like Tomlin and oh seven, Tomlin's roots were Monty Kiffin, Tony Dungee, Tampa 2 couldn't have been more different than what the Steelers had been defensively.
9:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Mike Talman or Tane Dicklebo, they ran a Steelers defense going forward.
9:52
[SPEAKER_00]: There was no, in two years, we're going to be this hampered defense.
9:55
[SPEAKER_00]: They ran these Steelers defense.
9:58
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, same thing, John Harbaugh gets to get to Baltimore.
10:03
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, he's got the Jim Johnson Blitz heavy, smaller defensive line, an aggressive upfield, all of that from Philly, right?
10:12
[SPEAKER_00]: And he gets to Baltimore, and the hang on to Rex Ryan, and has the Ravens defense changed much since then.
10:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's evolved, right, but like John and both John and Mike
10:26
[SPEAKER_00]: they melded what they melded and evolved what they've done to fit where they went.
10:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I think that's what makes the Pittsburgh and Baltimore jobs a little bit different than the other seven that are available.
10:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
10:42
[SPEAKER_01]: It's so interesting, right, because you have and I hate to keep going back to this, but I just want to reset the table for a second.
10:55
[SPEAKER_01]: coaching cycle, Albert, saying, okay, now in my candidates list, I said a six to 10, and weren't nine, right?
11:03
[SPEAKER_01]: But in the back of my mind, I'm thinking six, right?
11:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Like six is, you know, 10, you'd have to go pretty batch it crazy.
11:10
[SPEAKER_01]: And the path to nine or 10 was always 75% of the AFC North turning over.
11:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
11:17
[SPEAKER_01]: in the back of our minds it was sure it was act Taylor right was probably going to be one of those guys.
11:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Zach is now the only coach in the AFC North that is held on to his job.
11:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
11:27
[SPEAKER_01]: He's the only coach in the AFC North.
11:28
[SPEAKER_01]: He's the only only head coach in the AFC North, right?
11:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And the Browns are over here and I think they're going to do something interesting and we could talk about them in a minute, but you literally have the best rivalry in the NFL, the best modern rivalry in the NFL.
11:42
[SPEAKER_01]: And both these teams are hiring a head coach for the first time in at least 18 years simultaneously, and they're going to be interviewing the same candidates.
11:51
[SPEAKER_01]: How awesome is that?
11:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, isn't that the coolest thing ever?
11:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, now it's organization versus organization, but it's process versus process.
12:00
[SPEAKER_01]: It is, it's going to be so fascinating.
12:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And God, like, as sad as it is to see because I saw a tweet about this yesterday, like, I feel old now.
12:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Certainly that now that Tom would and Harbar out of the NFL and like every guy that I remember watching in high school in college is now either on TV or
12:23
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, that part of it is a little bit of a bummer, but if you cover coaching and you're passionate about this industry, like I am and I know that you are, like this is, this is turned in from the lame cycle to legitimately, like,
12:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and these are, I mean, it is interesting when you look at like just what this is laid bare to now, which is, um, so Andy Reed, who was the longest tenure to coach in the NFL,
13:00
[SPEAKER_00]: when he was fired by the Eagles in 2012 is now again the longest tenure of coach in the NFL and like by far right so he's now achieved that with two different franchises which is insane like I I like being able to having that sort of like like staying powers incredible you know who's number two who's a tie
13:28
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I mean, it's just, I think it speaks to the instability.
13:32
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the number wound up being about when I counted it up yesterday.
13:37
[SPEAKER_00]: 22 of the 32 teams are going to have different coaches than they had at the start of 2020.
13:44
[SPEAKER_00]: going into the year.
13:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, which is crazy, you know?
13:48
[SPEAKER_00]: So having these two jobs open, I think is I think this was always going to be like a little bit of a different cycle anyway, you know, where it was going to force creativity, right?
14:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Like because there weren't the obvious hires, and we've talked about this, like variable and benjons and we're
14:07
[SPEAKER_00]: obvious hires last year, like I don't think it took a ton of skill to identify those guys, you know, um, this has been a site, this, this, this was setting up as a cycle that looked at least like it was going to require some creativity, um, now harbors out there to fancities out there.
14:22
[SPEAKER_00]: So maybe those are more obvious answers.
14:25
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll talk about Tom on in a second, but, um,
14:29
[SPEAKER_00]: the last time, the Ravens and Pits, the Ravens and Steelers hired coaches, they saw it outside the box.
14:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Like Harbond, Tomlin, we're not conventional hires at the time.
14:38
[SPEAKER_00]: And I believe, I might have this wrong, I believe.
14:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Those two were being interviewed for the first time for head coaching jobs, and they landed those jobs.
14:49
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's something I think to keep in mind here, and where these two teams go.
14:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's again, it's in a market where I think it was in a market that was already requiring creativity from teams to get it right.
15:07
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15:23
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15:37
[SPEAKER_01]: This guy is on fire right now.
15:39
[SPEAKER_01]: He's being some of the best throws that I've ever seen a quarterback make in the postseason.
15:44
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15:47
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15:51
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15:56
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15:59
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16:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Make picks win money.
16:02
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's go there first.
16:03
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's what's next for Mike Tomlin, which I think is less interesting than what's next for Pittsburgh, but I wanna hit both of these and then a little bit about the waterfall effect here on the head coaching market.
16:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm pulling up my list of,
16:22
[SPEAKER_01]: my list of candidates who I think can replace Mike Tomlin, you and I know a little bit of a peek behind the curtain.
16:29
[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about this as I was writing it as as as we do.
16:33
[SPEAKER_01]: We like to share information, talk about I like to learn from Albert and in here where he thinks.
16:38
[SPEAKER_01]: But so here's my list and I'm going to save the most interesting name for last.
16:44
[SPEAKER_01]: One is certainly Brian Flores.
16:51
[SPEAKER_01]: And he said that Brian Flores is the best coach in the NFL that doesn't have a head coaching job hands down.
16:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Flores is a linebacker's coach in Seattle for that year after the whole Miami.
17:01
[SPEAKER_01]: It's part of the part, right?
17:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Or Pittsburgh.
17:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.
17:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
17:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Then I have Jesse Minner.
17:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I've Chris Shula, who I know that you like for this job.
17:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, I think Kubiak, just in case they go offense, Jeff Halfley, um, Nate Sheelhouse, because I think he's starting to gain some traction as, uh, as it name that team's registered at her Baltimore's really interested in Nate, um, and that maybe that's a direction that they go into kind of pivot and go offense, whatever, whatever.
17:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, and then there's, uh,
17:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Ezreal Evero because, and then the last name that I want to talk about, but the reason that, and you, I talked about this with you yesterday, Evero is a highly regarded defensive coordinator from a bad football team.
17:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's been his story perpetually since he left the Rams as a safety coach.
17:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I think the year that they won the Super Bowl from Namasteck, and he goes and takes his first big DC job for Nathan's get with the wrong team.
17:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, if you remember that season,
17:59
[SPEAKER_01]: like they're holding the 49ers to like 13 points, but the Broncos are just scoring eight, you know?
18:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And so then he, you know, makes the second decision that again, like he's the centerpiece of this dream team Frank Reichstaff that they created in Carolina, but that whole thing falls apart, but he stuck there and he can't get out.
18:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And so he's just made the best of it.
18:22
[SPEAKER_01]: And Evaro is probably the one candidate on this list that reminds me of Mike Tomlin,
18:27
[SPEAKER_01]: That Vikings team that he was the defensive coordinator of was 6 and 10 before he came to Pittsburgh, right?
18:33
[SPEAKER_01]: He was not a well-known assistant, and if ever it would go in there, and that's the only reason I put him on the list.
18:41
[SPEAKER_01]: But...
18:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's get to Marcus Freeman.
18:43
[SPEAKER_01]: This is what I want to talk about, okay?
18:45
[SPEAKER_01]: If you could build a Steelers head coach in a laboratory, it is Marcus Freeman.
18:52
[SPEAKER_01]: He is young, he's a battleship commander.
18:55
[SPEAKER_01]: He's had a top 11 defense and college football, each of the last three years, which is really hard to do at Notre Dame.
19:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I am a Notre Dame fan, trust me, I know that.
19:05
[SPEAKER_01]: He took this team to the national championship and the first year of the CFP playoffs.
19:09
[SPEAKER_01]: He has played in the, I think he was a practice squad training camp guy.
19:14
[SPEAKER_01]: So he knows what it's like to be at the bottom run of the roster in the NFL.
19:17
[SPEAKER_01]: He's great at relating to people.
19:20
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that he, this is just the perfect job for him.
19:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And if he's going to leave, this is the job that he leaves for.
19:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'll give you the floor because I think this is interesting.
19:32
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, so I, like, I've got like some ties to him.
19:38
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know Marcus Freeman personally, so, but like, he went to school or he went to school.
19:45
[SPEAKER_00]: I would say these.
19:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Those of you who are wondering.
19:47
[SPEAKER_00]: I would say, I would say like, if he's gonna leave Notre Dame, it's for Ohio State or the NFL.
19:53
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't think like he had any intention to go back on his word that he gave Notre Dame when the giant giants and titans by the giants and titans did reach out and did express interest and I think we're in on Marcus Freeman and Marcus decided that this was not the right time.
20:11
[SPEAKER_00]: They've got a really good team coming back.
20:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I think if there's one team that would give him pause and make him think, do I really wanna walk away from this?
20:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And Mike caused him to go to Notre Dame and I hate, I hesitate to say go back on your word because I don't think he's like that but like, this is just too much, this is too unique in situation.
20:33
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's Pittsburgh.
20:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, like I think a lot of things to have to line up there, obviously staff is part of it, you know?
20:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, but he makes a ton of sense.
20:47
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think, you know, again, like you said, he looks like a still a scoach.
20:53
[SPEAKER_00]: He carries himself like a stealer's coach.
20:55
[SPEAKER_00]: He has the same sort of command that Mike variable hat or I'm Mike, variable that, um, that, that, that, that, like, someone has, like just the way he carries himself.
21:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, it makes tonosense.
21:08
[SPEAKER_00]: It makes tonosense.
21:09
[SPEAKER_00]: So if I'm the sealers, I'm making that call.
21:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, here's the other thing.
21:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, and not to pivot right off of that, but
21:17
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're looking for young defensive coaches, this isn't a bad year.
21:20
[SPEAKER_01]: This is like the best year.
21:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
21:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It's go like I look down the list of names and like Jeff Hathley, Chris Chula, Anthony Campanelli, Jesse Mentor, EZero Evero, Matt Burke, like I, and not all of those guys fit Pittsburgh, but like if you're looking for a young defensive coach with some presence, this is a good year to be looking.
21:46
[SPEAKER_00]: you could do worse and she was an interesting one to me and I had mentioned before this was a name I heard I think I wrote it two weeks ago like if the Pittsburgh game job comes open this is a name I think they'd be interested in um Chris really worked his way up with with with the Rams which I think mirrors my Tom one you know and for a guy with that last name if you look at his background
22:14
[SPEAKER_00]: like, oh yeah, he was just shoved up the ladder, you know.
22:17
[SPEAKER_00]: So he started as an assistant line backers coach at Ball State was a grad assistant at Indiana for three years.
22:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Went to John Carroll, his grandfather's alma mater, where he was defensive coordinator in 2014, then gotten to the NFL as a QC under Mike McCoy in 15 and 16, then went and joined his best friend
22:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think Sean would mind me telling this story.
22:47
[SPEAKER_00]: So a couple of years ago, when Raheem Morris left for Atlanta and Chris Shula was elevated to defensive coordinator, I said to Sean,
23:02
[SPEAKER_00]: like that's awesome.
23:03
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so happy for Chris right and Sean stop me and said just don't talk about it that way because that's not what this is you know I'm like what do you mean and he's like everybody's gonna think that this is just me it's like this now what this is like Chris had to learn it more than anyone else because right new because he knew what the optics were gonna be that this is his buddy this is his college roommate this is the
23:30
[SPEAKER_00]: that Chris Shua has had it with the Rams.
23:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, it's sort of similar to Mike Tomlin's background where Mike really had to work his way up.
23:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Assistant linebackers coach for two years, outside linebackers coach for two years, linebackers coach for a year, task game coordinator and defensive backs coach, so he got to experience it in another position.
23:48
[SPEAKER_00]: in 22, then in 23 he goes back to linebackers coach and now he's the past rush coordinator, right?
23:56
[SPEAKER_00]: So like he was getting experienced at all levels of the defense and then he becomes a coordinator.
24:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
24:03
[SPEAKER_00]: So I just think like this is it's just an interesting name, you know, and I think Chris has presence.
24:12
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he's been able to get the most out of people there.
24:15
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying he's going to be the guy, but I think like if you're looking back at what the sealers have done, and again, Mike Tomman was a non-obvious hire.
24:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Like Mike Tomman was in 2007, it was my 30-year cover in the league, got him old, but just to take words out of your mouth.
24:34
[SPEAKER_00]: But everyone assumed at the time that Ken was in Hunter Ruskrum was going to get that job, because the sealers had such great success under Bill Cower, and then they hired a guy who
24:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And it worked out.
24:47
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, like I think that there's a, it mirrors, it mirrors a little bit what happened in 2007.
24:53
[SPEAKER_00]: So he'd be a name to watch.
24:56
[SPEAKER_01]: So so this is a good, this is a good point to bring this up.
25:00
[SPEAKER_01]: So Chris Shula over the last, over the last two years has had the 10th best defense in the NFL.
25:10
[SPEAKER_01]: If you do,
25:11
[SPEAKER_01]: uh, opponent EPA per play, which I think at this point is kind of like the gold standard or whatever of measuring that.
25:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, and for people who say like, again, he had to come into a really difficult situation.
25:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, the optics were strange, like you mentioned, and it's not only the McVey thing, it's the shula thing, which I know that he spent a lifetime trying to, trying to get away from, you know, um, and,
25:36
[SPEAKER_01]: So he comes in and he makes this the 10th best defense in the league without air and Donald.
25:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, Ricky Morris, with air and Donald during his time as the defense coordinator was 14th.
25:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, this defense got markedly better.
25:53
[SPEAKER_01]: during that time that Chris Shula took over and you could argue has gotten worse in terms of person.
25:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Now again, they've got some young talent on this building, but like the secondary Albert, like, is not what it was.
26:06
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you're missing Aaron Donald from the equation, like no jail and Ramsey.
26:10
[SPEAKER_01]: No jail and Ramsey, like, come on.
26:12
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I mean, I mean, I was going to good job.
26:14
[SPEAKER_01]: He's done a good job.
26:15
[SPEAKER_00]: It's also like the development of young talent.
26:16
[SPEAKER_00]: you know what I mean like it's like you're bringing in younger guys and a lot of them weren't first round picks now there are a couple that were right like so Jared verse was a first round pick and his altar talented and so like maybe you don't give them the same credit for that but Kobe Turner has turned into like an all-pro level defensive tackle.
26:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Braden Fisk comes in as a second round pick by her and young.
26:37
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe was a third round or Nate Landman was somebody that they kind of picked up off the scrap heap.
26:42
[SPEAKER_00]: and he's been like phenomenal for them this year.
26:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Cam Kenshin's in the backhand like they like he is consistently developed guys and gotten more out of guys and that's that's something that I think gets under I just feel like that part of it like because
27:00
[SPEAKER_00]: it's not something you can see on TV gets underrated by fans like your ability to develop players right like who is consistently taking young guys and making something of them regardless of where they were drafted or how they were acquired right and I think the Rams have done an exceptional job of that on defense and if you look like really for the Rams it's
27:26
[SPEAKER_00]: strategically to spend less resources on the offensive line and the back end of the defense it's just the way that they've done it the last few years right and so like that requires coaching that requires playing sound that requires making things work you know and I think Chris has done a phenomenal job when it comes to that part of it for sure.
27:47
[SPEAKER_01]: So Chris, I think, is a name, I think, halffully, I think the folks are good name too for them.
27:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Halfly is a name there, the one thing that I've heard about Jeff from this cycle is that, listen, it didn't end well with the Packers certainly.
28:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And the optics of giving up 20 points in the fourth quarter of a game is not great in the postseason.
28:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't you think if you're making decisions based on that, that's the right thing.
28:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Then if you're making decisions based on that advanced Joseph isn't the defensive coordinator of the Broncos right now, right?
28:19
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and I get that.
28:21
[SPEAKER_01]: But I heard he above a lot of other people is just knocking his interviews out of the park.
28:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what we expected of him, right?
28:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we thought that he was going to come in there and interview well.
28:31
[SPEAKER_01]: He interviewed well last year when he had those opportunities.
28:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think that's a name.
28:40
[SPEAKER_01]: to this, and my god Albert, like this is like, so I just added,
28:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I message to my laptop, because a lot of questions about that.
28:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, this is like talk about being old.
28:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Because now like the kids.
28:59
[SPEAKER_01]: It's important to have that.
29:00
[SPEAKER_01]: It is just important to have that.
29:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Because when you're going on a phone call, you can see who's texting you, which is good.
29:05
[SPEAKER_01]: That, that.
29:06
[SPEAKER_01]: But the downside to it is what I'm talking to you and it's the searching structure coming here.
29:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Because 600 people being like, well, okay, this person's interviewing here today.
29:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-
29:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I got thrown off, but this one was from our buddy James Palmer, like James, come on, we're recording here.
29:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Can you leave me alone for a fight?
29:23
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm kidding.
29:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I love James, but I want to double back on this one thing for Marcus Freeman before we get to some of the other candidates here.
29:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Marcus, and this is true of a lot of other coaches who have left college to go to the NFL.
29:38
[SPEAKER_01]: If Marcus is involved, you're not going to know.
29:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Period.
29:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because you can't leave Notre Dame.
29:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you can't just go to Notre Dame and all the recruits and everything with the transfer portal and all this and be like hold on one second guys I'm just gonna go over here to look at the Steelers job.
29:58
[SPEAKER_01]: What the Steelers would essentially have to do is they would have to go through their process
30:04
[SPEAKER_01]: and they would have to determine that after all of that, Marcus is their guy, and then they would have to like with the force of the Millennium Falcon, like blow into South Bend, pick them up, and just leave, right?
30:16
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's not one of those things.
30:19
[SPEAKER_00]: It's similar to, well, yeah, I mean, Brian Kelly interviewed with the Eagles and that didn't come out until after the head coaching site bill of Ryan, I think that year interview with the eagle, I believe that's right, like it was it was right in there, yeah, maybe he was maybe that was.
30:35
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that was like, and sometimes it becomes a little bit more well known.
30:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, like, Matt rule was an example where everyone knew he was leaving Baylor to go to the NFL.
30:42
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, so it wasn't as much a secret, but Matt Campbell was another one.
30:46
[SPEAKER_00]: If you remember, like, it came out like how strong candidate he was for the Lions a couple of years ago.
30:51
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're right, Connor, I mean, it's vital for these college coaches if they're going to do this like they can't go through this every year because it not only does it create a problem for them with their current players like it gives their you know their rivals a weapon to use like oh well this guy was trying to leave for the NFL last year you don't think he's going to do that again, you know what I mean like right so like he can't afford to have that happen in some ways.
31:20
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's complicated because the you would have to have the process complete and be fully compliant with everything to make that happen.
31:31
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?
31:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you have to satisfy the running rule and all of that.
31:37
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's similar to, like, if you're going to trade for Matt LaFlor, right, right, like, so, like, for the Falcons of the Dolphins who have connections to them to trade for Matt LaFlor, more or less, what they'll have to do, I think, is go through next week and then make the determination, like, we're not in love with any of these guys.
31:55
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, like, let's pick up the phone and call the Packers and now you're already ruining real compliance and maybe you can work something out.
32:01
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, so if you remember, that's how the Sean Peyton thing played out.
32:05
[SPEAKER_00]: The Sean Peyton thing was late in the process, you know?
32:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
32:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the Sean Peyton thing was late too, right?
32:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Because wasn't there the Dameco Ryan's factor in there a little bit too, where I think that too.
32:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Which by the way, would have been, wouldn't have been a bad hire for the Broncos.
32:20
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if you're final two or Sean Peyton and Dameco Ryan's like, that's, yeah, you did a pretty good coaching search, you know, if your other ones are like, yeah, Benny from Ben Meegey State, then I think you got a problem here.
32:31
[SPEAKER_00]: But so I asked, by the way, do you know who the other two big names were in the Raven
32:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Jason Garrett because I was covering the cowboys at the time and I remember what a big deal it was and Jerry Jones actually had to give a way to fill up to raise because after he paid Jared Jason Garrett this day Garrett was making more than way.
32:56
[SPEAKER_00]: God, so it was probably Jason Garrett and what is this 2008.
33:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I was a sophomore in college, so... Oh, seven, think about it.
33:14
[SPEAKER_00]: What happened in those seven?
33:17
[SPEAKER_01]: What happened in those seven?
33:20
[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't like Mark Tressman, was it?
33:22
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no, no.
33:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Like somebody, like legitimately broke all the records.
33:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Was that Adrian Peterson?
33:29
[SPEAKER_00]: No, like some like a team broke all the records.
33:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Or a quarterback broke records.
33:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Or a receiver broke records.
33:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, the New England Patriots, duh, was it Josh McDaniels?
33:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, a year ahead.
33:46
[SPEAKER_00]: And so Josh McDaniels and Jason Garrett both pulled their names out of the Raven search and that helped lead them to John Arbaugh.
33:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Man, that's
33:58
[SPEAKER_00]: got and now Titans fans when they hear Jason care to like no, stop, but Jason was like I mean Jason was the prodigy back then like he had worked for Nick Sabin as a quarterback scoach in Miami and then Jerry hired him in 07 before he hired Wade and if you remember then the next year I think it was or maybe it was the same year the redskins at the time hired
34:29
[SPEAKER_00]: The residents at the time hired hired Jim Zorn and Jim Zorn and to an undetermined role and he went from like an undetermined role.
34:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
34:41
[SPEAKER_00]: He's going to be the offensive coordinator too.
34:43
[SPEAKER_00]: He's going to be the head coach and they're great first year.
34:47
[SPEAKER_00]: That was that was a fun team.
34:48
[SPEAKER_00]: The I think Jason Campbell was a quarterback and
34:53
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a hip hip hooray thing, if you remember, and then eventually that ended in, oh, I can remember for so seven or eight, but then in oh nine, that Jim Zorn, lead Washington team, was the biggest crap show I think I've ever seen.
35:07
[SPEAKER_00]: That was the, if you remember, that was the team where Albert Haynesworth was literally lying on the middle of the field, in the middle of a play.
35:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm Monday, I football like a beach dwell, like a legit and really just quit on the team in the middle of a play.
35:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Man, and it's weird too because I think we laugh, but like there's probably four candidates that are going to get jobs in this market that will wind up being like the gyms on of this era and we're just obsessed with it and we're in it now and only one of these teams is going to end up knocking it out of the park.
35:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think it also goes to show you though that like.
35:42
[SPEAKER_00]: This whole thing about having like an offensive guy or a quarterback Scott like that's not new You know what I mean like there were a couple of homeruns that people hit with Sean McVay and Kyle Shanahan nine years ago But that existed long before then and there have been a lot of swings and misses there too You know like doesn't really guarantee you anything to hire the young offensive guy The
36:07
[SPEAKER_01]: So I was talking to someone in the industry actually before we popped on and I was like, let's go over the kind of, what do you call the, like when an earthquake happens?
36:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, and you're measuring like the impact of it, like the, let's go over the friction scale of this, the aftershock maybe, where it's like, okay,
36:29
[SPEAKER_01]: like describe to me like what's going to happen in the next couple days.
36:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think I was in line with this where the person said, Harba goes and then Domino's really start falling.
36:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
36:42
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, but but I don't think that Pittsburgh and Baltimore necessarily are in that.
36:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that they're, I don't think they're going to be reactive.
36:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I don't think they're going to be reactive either.
36:52
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think either of them are going to be reactive.
36:54
[SPEAKER_00]: I think you're
36:57
[SPEAKER_00]: two teams are going to take a measured approach and do all their homework and are going to really look, like, really look.
37:06
[SPEAKER_00]: I know Atlanta feels really good about where it stands on John Harbaugh.
37:10
[SPEAKER_00]: I know Tennessee feels really good about where it stands on John Harbaugh.
37:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I know the Giants feel really good about where they stand on John Harbaugh, who's actually going to get them.
37:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And has any of those teams quietly satisfied the Runea rule yet, which requires a lot of, I mean, at this point you would have had to have gone and found two coaches who don't
37:35
[SPEAKER_00]: and interviewed them in person and like you know basically running around in the rule like the Patriots did last year.
37:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have evidence that those teams have done that.
37:45
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have to wait till at least next week to get a final call there.
37:51
[SPEAKER_00]: But once that domino falls you could see other things starting to fall into place because I think when the
38:01
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, you know, and then, and once those two go, like, let's just say for our argument, say, Harbugger is the giant's defense.
38:09
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes to the Titans, right?
38:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
38:12
[SPEAKER_00]: If that happens, then, okay, like, what does it land or do?
38:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Does it land a, do they call the Packers on Matt LaFlor to see if he's available?
38:20
[SPEAKER_00]: If that contract negotiation hasn't gone the right way yet, right?
38:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think that the Packers are in good faith negotiations with LaFlor,
38:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Does that work out like are they willing to pay him 15 to 20 million dollars?
38:33
[SPEAKER_00]: So Atlanta then kind of gets put in this spot where it's like, okay, like then they walk in their GM, I would guess a being an Ian Cunningham, and now like who do you hire if you're not if you don't wind up with Harbaugh?
38:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, I do think like, okay, does a halfly come off the board?
38:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Does a, does a shoal come off the board?
38:55
[SPEAKER_00]: How much of it's related to who's in the playoffs and who's not?
38:58
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?
38:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, does that piece of it?
39:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Because remember, you can't do the second interview.
39:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, let's say the Rams go to the Super Bowl.
39:06
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't do the second interview with Chris Schuel in person until after the championship came then, you know?
39:11
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's just like all kinds of moving parts.
39:13
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm not sure how this all, I'm not sure how this is all going to fall in the place.
39:19
[SPEAKER_01]: by the way, a plain tracker guy, dug analytics on Twitter two hours ago, said that Steve Tish's
39:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Steve Tish's private jet had touched down at Baltimore, Washington International Thurgood Marshall Airport.
39:37
[SPEAKER_00]: So just say, I love flight aware, it's flight aware, like flight aware is, so that's generally a college thing, because people like have like the boosters playing planes, tail numbers or whatever, and generally like in college, it's more obvious because it's
39:55
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, somebody could be just flying from Baltimore.
39:58
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, why do you just keep flying to like Louisiana?
40:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is this guy flying from the green?
40:03
[SPEAKER_01]: He loves it.
40:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
40:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is this guy flying from the Gainesville Municipal Airport to Tuscaloosa?
40:08
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?
40:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, it's a little less obvious with if you do the flight of wear a game in the pros, but I'm all for it, flight of wear and that you say that Connor's going to make me make a couple calls here.
40:25
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... yeah so the giants can uh... break this open today Albert uh... they have satisfied the renewal requirements uh... and they would be able to higher john harbour today uh... and let don't let him leave the building season commenced uh... i think this is going to be interesting uh... and god bless joshian i love that saying they'll let him leave the bill it's like locked the doors he's in here
40:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you know, John, we're not leaving without a contract.
40:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Scott's heart was like feeling for like a door like he's in soft for, you know, he's just like, Oh, God.
41:00
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, does that mean you're like following them to their car?
41:07
[SPEAKER_01]: uh uh the visual is great we're like imagine if you stepped in and it was just like like you ever see the purge like as soon as it turns midnight like everybody's doors to shut in this is big metal things like ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch
41:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And so here in the in the northeast and I feel so back so I was actually talking to a coaching candidate about this not long ago that was saying Joe Shane is a good guy like he's he's good at his job, you know, and and and maybe he hasn't made he's become like the Pinyata for giant he's become the Pinyata for giants fans right and now the narrative has been set
41:47
[SPEAKER_01]: that it all comes down today to John Harbaw meeting Joe Shane face to face for the first time and so if he leaves then everybody's just going to demolish this poor GM and again, poor as a relative term.
42:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, this guy's financially wealthy.
42:04
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know spiritually wealthy, but he's you know
42:06
[SPEAKER_01]: You that comes with the rigors of the job.
42:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, but to frame it that way, I don't think is necessarily correct.
42:14
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I mean, yeah, it's just like, but this is these are the stakes that we're playing with back to the Steelers and back to Mike Tomlin.
42:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I think the Pittsburgh goes through full search.
42:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
42:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Someone slammed dunked to me yesterday, which is what the kids are calling it when my list came out and they were like, see Adam Sheffield just said, Marcus Freeman's not leaving, like, nice job.
42:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, well, again, I think they're shades of gray here.
42:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that there's the way that he has couched it.
42:44
[SPEAKER_00]: At least in my opinion, I think there's a little bit of a little, not to cut you off, but I think the transfer portal, like, closes in a few days.
42:51
[SPEAKER_00]: So, like, you, you have to keep the genie in the bottle, too.
42:56
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like, that's the reality of it.
42:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
42:59
[SPEAKER_01]: So, I mean, I, I, I, I wouldn't put Marcus Freeman out, and, and Adams, the best.
43:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I, I'm not,
43:05
[SPEAKER_01]: disputing Adams reporting.
43:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure what he's saying is true in this moment, but I don't think this is the I if I had to guess and this is just a guess.
43:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think this is the last we've heard of Marcus Freeman and the Steelers fair.
43:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think it's you know, I think the Steelers would not be doing their would not be doing their jobs if they didn't you know take a look at Marcus Freeman as a potential had to coach and candidate there.
43:33
[SPEAKER_01]: The the other side of this is Tomlin.
43:35
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he's gonna go do it's no secret that he's gonna go to TV But I did see a funny tweet from a buck and years fan that is like holy shit We're gonna hire Mike Tomlin next year and just keep going 9 and 8
43:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's just destined to happen like Tomlin did start his career in, uh, in, well, we had his formative years really in Tampa before he went to Minnesota.
43:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, uh, and I don't know if that ends up happening, but I do imagine Tomlin probably taking the Sean Peyton route here.
44:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you agree?
44:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think so.
44:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I did talk to one person who knows him pretty well yesterday, who said, I,
44:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't envision him in TV and this person thought it would be more likely that he would take the year off and just go travel and visit different college programs, different NFL teams and kind of use his quote unquote gap here that way.
44:34
[SPEAKER_00]: you know I I also think like look like we don't know and I don't think Mike himself knows how he's going to react to to being in this position.
44:45
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean like I I still remember Bill Cower you know when he
44:51
[SPEAKER_00]: when he walked away from the steel or it's after the oh six season, and it wasn't considered a matter of if it was when he's going to come back.
45:01
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you remember like Omar Khan, who was Kevin Colbert's lieutenant at the time, there was this okay Omar Khan and Bill Cower are going to go together to the giants.
45:12
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is when Tom Kaufland's job security was in question, okay Omar Khan and
45:18
[SPEAKER_00]: and Bill Cower are going to go together to the dolphins, so those rumors were out there and all the while, you know, Cower went back to North Carolina, was with his family, had a comfortable television job.
45:36
[SPEAKER_00]: And he just never went back.
45:39
[SPEAKER_00]: John Gruden, who, you know, Tomlin worked for, same sort of thing, right?
45:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Like where everybody thought, okay, he's gonna jump right back in.
45:48
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a football life for, and he found a comfort level outside of the sport.
45:52
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I don't think, like, I think Mike's intention is to coach again any year, you know, I think that would be his intention.
45:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe somebody can convince him to coach this year, I think, he'll certainly get some calls, you know?
46:05
[SPEAKER_00]: But like I don't think like any coach can know what it's like to be out of that he called it the whole right his office was the whole to be out of the whole like and to live a different life like they don't know how.
46:22
[SPEAKER_00]: they're going to react to that.
46:24
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, so we'll see what happens on that with that piece of it, but I would think like he would come back in 2020, 7 and be the hottest coach on the can't on on the circuit and wind up coaching somewhere else, you know, on that fall.
46:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, but again, I don't think it's like a sure thing that that he would necessarily jump right back into it.
46:45
[SPEAKER_00]: In a year, if, you know, with the perspective of what it was like to be out for a year after being in that pressure cooker for almost two decades, this is, um,
46:57
[SPEAKER_01]: It's so funny because Coach's, Mike Tomlin hasn't not coach since 1994.
47:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, that's a long time.
47:04
[SPEAKER_01]: That's nearly my entire lifespan.
47:06
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like a quarter of Albert's.
47:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And when you do something like that for so long and you are accustomed to... You remember the Roosevelt administration like I do?
47:19
[SPEAKER_01]: When you do something like that and you get accustomed to its rhythms, it's interesting like when someone like Tomlin, like I remember always remember the story of Joe Montana going to TV and he walked off the set like in the middle of a broadcast and someone was like why did you do that?
47:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's like because I'm Joe Montana like who the hell is that?
47:38
[SPEAKER_01]: I tellin' me, you know.
47:40
[SPEAKER_01]: That my opinion isn't right.
47:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm the greatest quarterback in NFL history and I think some people do struggle with that see if you're Mike Tomlin I think for a while with that to be honest.
47:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I do think Brady's struggling with it Even though he's gotten so much better.
47:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, figuring out the game But I do think that you know, and it's Smith struggle with that right and you know if you're Tomlin and you are sitting there in the Fox studio with 13 other guys on that table at this point like how big is that
48:08
[SPEAKER_01]: god damn second to be this year of fiends up going to fox like you know you're gonna have Terry Bradshaw being like no, no, my god don't tell you this and like it's just gonna be like Dude I I want a super bowl like I don't need to sit here and I don't know whether that's gonna happen or not But it's one of those things.
48:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe excellent at it like it'd be so good at it Maybe excellent at it, but I again like is it is it appealing to him
48:38
[SPEAKER_00]: So passionate about football and about people and like about everything that like that Give him you know and has given him
48:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I, like, to me it's like not out of the realm of possibility that he would be really intrigued with the idea of like, I'm gonna go spend the fall, I'm gonna spend a week here, I'm gonna spend a week there, I'm gonna spend a week there, and like I just hear about him, like, you always hear these stories about him on the pro-day circuit and how much he energizes him to be around these college programs, right?
49:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Because he gets to see the, the, the different ways to do it, right?
49:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I guess to see, like how kids are coming up and how kids are learning,
49:17
[SPEAKER_00]: He's that passionate about that in the spring, like, maybe to appeal to him to do a full year of that.
49:25
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?
49:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, it's just like, you know what I'm going to go and I'm going to go and just kind of spend a year around football.
49:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And that wouldn't, like, by the way, preclude him from doing TV the year after.
49:35
[SPEAKER_00]: So I don't, I think all of the networks will be after him and they should be 100%.
49:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I said, the EVX on at it, but like I think sort of all things are on the
49:46
[SPEAKER_01]: I love this, by the way.
49:49
[SPEAKER_01]: So we have the John Harbaw flight track her up.
49:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And so... Sir, it's not like a Twitter account or something like there was for Twitter either.
49:59
[SPEAKER_01]: There's several, okay, in multiple languages, okay.
50:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Update, Steve Tish's plane just took off from Baltimore to return to New York.
50:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It was stationary at the Baltimore Airport for 45 minutes.
50:13
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have information yet, but everything points to the fact that the plane went to go pick up John Harbaugh for a formal interview in New York today.
50:22
[SPEAKER_01]: We have stationery, we've stationery, tarmac time.
50:27
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the God bless America.
50:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, 45 minutes would indicate that it was just there to pick someone up.
50:32
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's actually some good sleuth and, right, like, right.
50:35
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's what it would indicate.
50:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Like it was just, it was only there to pick someone up.
50:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I forget about fueling, right?
50:41
[SPEAKER_01]: You'd have to fuel and that problem would take a couple minutes.
50:44
[SPEAKER_01]: But would you have to fuel it though?
50:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Because as a short flight, so maybe you wouldn't have to refuel or to get back to New York.
50:50
[SPEAKER_01]: God, you imagine if like if you're the guy who manages Steve Tish's private jet,
50:57
[SPEAKER_01]: and you forget to put gas in it while you're going to get hardball like that's uh that's a getting your ass fired moment you know it's like hold on hold on I just got to hold on I just got to fill this thing with gas a lot of words.
51:10
[SPEAKER_01]: They probably just drop you out of the plane into the swap lands on the way home.
51:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Goodbye.
51:15
[SPEAKER_01]: See you later.
51:16
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, guys.
51:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, this was fun.
51:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Merges is a long way to expect it, but that's all right.
51:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but when you get us yacking about the head coaching industry and about this, this is just what's going to happen.
51:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Mike Tomlin out as head coach of the Steelers mutual separation.
51:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to be following this as the days go on.
51:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Hardball Watch continues.
51:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Hell, we might be, we're finishing this at 10 o'clock, 10 30 on, on what is this?
51:44
[SPEAKER_00]: to host today Wednesday 10 30 Wednesday morning time and space me nothing to me at this point by the time for hardball watch this is hardball watch day eight I think because you don't count that Tuesday right because that was the day they got fires not a hardball watch yet but hardball watch texted part of the next day so this is day eight all I know is that when
52:05
[SPEAKER_01]: When John Harbock signs with the giants today, I will absolutely be out for a run or running an errand with my family at the grocery store.
52:17
[SPEAKER_01]: So whenever that happens, John Harbock will be the head coach of the giants.
52:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Enjoy.
52:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Have a good day.
52:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for checking in on the emergency