Latest / Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast / MBA Wire Taps 334—Vietnamese teacher. Finance candidate, lack of goals. Boston or bust.

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MBA Wire Taps 334—Vietnamese teacher. Finance candidate, lack of goals. Boston or bust. · Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast

• 0:15
  Speaker A: Welcome to the clear Admit MBA Admissions podcast. I'm Graham Richmond, and this is your wiretaps for Monday, January 22, 2024. I'm joined by Alex Round from Cornwall, England. Alex, how are things going this week?
• 0:27
  Speaker B: Very good, thank you, Graham.
• 0:28
  Speaker A: I got to say, I'm already ready for spring. But in the meantime, this is going to be a very exciting week this coming week, because as you know, clear admit's having a little bit of a team event. We're going to do some strategic planning and I'm actually going to go to the US for that. So by the time this airs, I'll be in the US and I'm going to be also there to celebrate my mom's 80th birthday. So I'm actually really looking forward. My sister and I have been doing all this planning, so I want to give a shout out to my mom for her 80th. Hopefully the party goes well. We'll see.
• 1:00
  Speaker B: No. Fantastic. Congratulations to your mom.
• 1:02
  Speaker A: Yeah. So what's going on this week in stuff that people are interested in, like business school related admission stuff?
• 1:09
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, we're starting to see interview invites coming out from the programs that roll them out over a period of time. And we've seen quite a few. Well, a few invites coming out for Stanford. Yale's another one that's always early with interview invites and several other know, you've got programs like Harvard and Wharton Booth or whatever that wait till a specific date to release them. All those schools aren't ready yet, but those that trickle them out, there's lots of speculation that maybe they just look at some quick stats to get the real high caliber profiles into the interview process quickly. So we're seeing that the actual round two deadlines for all the top programs at this point have passed.
• 2:06
  Speaker A: Yeah, it's funny, a handful of days ago I was at INSEAd just for some meetings and stuff, and I always like, know, drop in on schools when I can. And so I went out to INSEAD and it happened to be their round three deadline date, which was last, you know, I think you had mentioned that that deadline was upcoming in our last episode. And so I was there and they were kind of. It's funny, obviously they didn't know the numbers yet because it was middle of the day when I was there or whatever, but it was just fun to see them. It was almost know kids on Christmas morning, like wanting to know how many candidates are they going to get, what are things looking like? And so that was kind of cool to hang out a little bit with the admissions team and see that in action. And obviously their campus. I don't know if you've ever been, Alex, but the Fontamlo campus in France here is really pretty amazing. So it reminds me of like a tuck. It's like off in the woods.
• 3:00
  Speaker B: Yeah, I do remember that nervous excitement, though, on round days, like, all right, how are we doing this year compared to last year, et cetera, et cetera.
• 3:12
  Speaker A: So other stuff going on this week aside from my mom's birthday is that we're running an event on Wednesday. So Wednesday, January 24, from eight to 09:00 p.m., Eastern, we're going to sit down with students from, what is it? University of Washington, Foster Dartmouth, Tuck, Georgetown McDonough and NYU Stern. And you can go to bit Lee, CA Realhumans to sign up for that event. Should be a lot of fun. It's just kind of an ask me anything where you can ask these current students what life is like in their programs and maybe any admissions tips they want to share. And then in February, we're going to have a whole slate of deferred enrollment and masters in management events with some of the best schools in the world, including Harvard and Wharton and Kellogg and Booth. So lots to come there. Stay tuned. Alex, on the website, we actually did a real humans with a school located in England, Manchester Alliance Business school. We connected with six students from Manchester. I don't know if you know this, you must know this, but do you know what the first two business schools that were ever created were in the UK?
• 4:17
  Speaker B: London and Manchester.
• 4:19
  Speaker A: Yeah. Do you know why? I don't know if you know the story behind this.
• 4:22
  Speaker B: Well, it was a government mandate. Not sure exactly why. Obviously, Manchester is considered to be the birthplace of the sort of industrial revolution from what understood.
• 4:36
  Speaker A: Yeah. The government, and I think in concert with the Queen, mandated that there needed to be two business schools created, and they wanted one in the north, which was Manchester, and one in the south, which was LBS. And that's why LBS sits on some land that belongs to the royal family in London. So in any event, I digress, but so we, the, the, I guess the MBA program at Manchester, they're about 96 students a year, so very small, 46% women, 94% international. So that tells you how they just get people from all over the world. And so we talked to six students, and I just wanted to read a quick quote. We connected with Charlote, who is from Oslo originally, and I picked her because she is a digital marketer, which I know might appeal to you, Alex, given your interests. And she said that she'd reached a point. She says, I reached a point in my career where I recognized the need to upskill myself to create new opportunities, which is why I decided to attend business school now. I also wanted to fast track my career and enhance my skill set. I took a pre MBA course prior to deciding, which helped me get a sense as to whether or not an MBA was something for me, which it definitely was. I recommend that if you're unsure if an MBA is something for you, just go take a class. It made me feel more secure in my decision. So I don't know what she took, but that's an interesting way to kind of explore management education is to just take something online or I don't know how she did it. But anyway, interesting advice from Charlote, who's currently at Manchester getting an MBA.
• 6:03
  Speaker B: No, I think that makes perfect sense. And I'd also say digital marketers and those that have lots of experience and expertise in digital marketing, it's absolutely fantastic. But oftentimes they get caught so much in the tactical weeds that it's really good for them to actually have a much more sort of robust, I think, strategic overview and insight in terms of how the business runs. So it makes really good sense.
• 6:31
  Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. And there are five other students we talked about Manchester. So if you're at all interested in Manchester's MBA program, which I think is kind of an know hero, I mean, it's a really good MBA program and people talk a lot about lbs and stuff, but Manchester is great. It's part of a really big, prestigious university. And so you can learn more by reading on our website. We also connected with, and this was really interesting, we connected with Arnie Longboy, who as part of an admissions director Q a series that we run. And he is now the director, executive director of admissions for NYU Stern's Abu Dhabi program. And I say it's interesting just because Arnie, as you may recall, used to work at London Business School. He was like David Simpson's boss, running kind of overseeing admissions for, I think many of, if not all of their admissions programs. Right? So he's left LDS, gone to Stern. And we had talked on the show about how Stern has launched this one year MBA in the, I think I want to say Arnie was actually at Chicago Booth before that. So he's now worked at three pretty big time MBA programs. And in the interview that we did with him, he just sort of explains further, like what this is, this one year MBA in the Middle east in Abu Dhabi at NYU Stern's campus there. And he says students will graduate with a fully accredited New York University diploma jointly conferred by NYU Stern School of Business. And NYU Abu Dhabi graduates will therefore be considered alumni of both NYU Stern and NYU Abu Dhabi. Those joining us in January of 25 will be part of the first cohort of this program. As such, the best fit will be those students who are not only academically qualified, but who also get excited by the potential of creating traditions for future intakes and in general have a growth mindset or are intent on developing one. So just kind of interesting he's settling into that role and I guess they're going to admit their first class. That'll start about a year from now, right?
• 8:25
  Speaker B: Yeah, I'd be really interested to see what the class profile looks like for that type of program.
• 8:29
  Speaker A: Yeah, same. I mean, I assume it'll be pretty regionalized, but just interesting. Yeah, very interesting. And then the last thing I wanted to mention on the website is we connected with three. We did this article called Tuck and finance and we talked to, like, three different tuck grads who are all working in investment banking at some of the big names. I've now totally forgotten which banks they're at, but they were the ones that you hear people talking about. And I learned that, like, a quarter of folks who graduate from Tuck are actually starting careers in finance, which we probably reported on that somewhere when we went through their careers report, but I was reminded of that. So it's just kind of interesting to hear how all these. Not only how their jobs are going, but also like, that transition from Hanover to New York City. So big, coming from the country to the city. So you can read that on our website as well. And then, Alex, I know you picked out candidates and we've got some really interesting debates and dilemmas to go over. But I did want to mention we got a review. So I don't know if this was. Remember, we got kind of coal in our stocking over Christmas. And then we got an email, a really nice email from someone named Charlote. And then we just got a review. I don't know who it's from, but their handle is Ranger 32 91. And they titled the review eager to listen every Monday on my drive to work. And it says, graham and Alex provide the latest information on business schools and provide invaluable insights for potential applicants. I love their takes on each unique candidate they profile, as it gives me a look into the stats and backgrounds of the applicants I'm applying with. I really appreciated their review of my profile this past summer as they provided me with great insights into how I should bolster my strengths and address my weaknesses. Keep kicking on, guys. And that's signed Ranger 3291. So there you go, another review.
• 10:18
  Speaker B: Alex, I love it. Absolutely fantastic. Thank you very much for that. I think that the assessment of why they like the show fits with what we're trying to do, right? Yeah, totally. And good luck to them. Hopefully they've got some good news. They didn't actually include that in their review.
• 10:40
  Speaker A: Yeah, I'm hoping that they. Well, maybe they applied in round one or two. So we don't know yet. But, yeah, best of luck to them and thanks for writing that review. If you want to send us any kind of emails or anything at all, info@clearadmit.com is the address to use. Use the subject line wiretaps. And then, yeah, again, please remember to rate and review us wherever you're listening. Alex, you want to get into the candidates now?
• 11:01
  Speaker B: Let's kick on.
• 11:02
  Speaker A: All right, so this is wiretaps candidate number one. So our first candidate this week is targeting five schools. Those schools are Berkeley, Duke, Oxford, UT, Austin, and Yale. This candidate has actually been a teacher teaching english linguistics and literature, if I remember correctly. Or kind of, maybe it's english second language. We'll get into the details, but. So an english teacher, this is a woman based in Vietnam. She has a 330 on the GRE and a 3.6 gpA. Has been working for four years. And that work has all happened, it seems, in Vietnam, went to a top university in Vietnam, made the dean's list all four years. Obviously, that GRE score, 330, it's a 164 quant, 166 verbal. She mentioned she's open to retaking. I don't know. I'll get your take on that in a second. Also does a lot of other things outside of work. Youth parliament program, mentored children in SOS Children's village when she was an undergrad, a teaching assistant at her alma mater, and a lot of mentoring, and then did a lot of part time english teaching. And then, you know, currently it sounds like it's been mostly working with international ngos and state agencies. A lot of translating and editing. Did some work for BCG even. But it seems like most of this is, like she says, currently teaching English in a rural province as a teach for Vietnam fellow. And so there's a lot of kind of english language teaching and translating in her kind of work experience, background, she'll have four years by the time of matriculation and wants to focus on how her background as a translator and teacher has made her more cognizant of educational inequity and thinks that maybe the MBA could equip her with hard analytical skills to help the kind of philanthropy industry, if you could call it that kind of scale, their impact. So working with philanthropic organizations and stuff. So, Alex, I'm going to stop there. One thing I did want to ask you very directly, though. She says she wonders if she's overrepresented as a female vietnamese candidate. So I wanted to ask you about that, but also just what do you make of her profile and her school selection?
• 13:30
  Speaker B: Yeah, I don't think she's overrepresented at all, whether it's by geography, by ethnicity, citizenship, by gender, and certainly not by experience and life experience and so forth. So I certainly wouldn't be concerned with that at all. I love this profile, quite frankly. Yeah, it's very nontraditional in terms of she's a lot of experience teaching and translation work and so forth. She's got a good academic profile. I would assume three six GPA. She did really well on the GRE at 330. And she has a really interesting plan. She's identified an issue, as you quoted. I think she's worked with well intentioned philanthropists who want to address this problem, I. E. Educational inequity, but are otherwise limited by a lack of coordination. Collaboration. So she sort of identified herself to fill this gap. And it seems like this could have a lot of impact and she's passionate about it. A lot of things that she's doing is related to that. She's going to get Rex from the CEO of her firm, her direct supervisor, and so on and so forth. I really love this candidate, Graham. I think she's going to come across as a very interesting candidate and frankly, I think she needs to target some M seven programs.
• 15:15
  Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. So one of the things in the comments, you had a little bit of an exchange with her on the website and one of the things you mentioned, gee, are you aiming high enough? And she said, oh, I don't have much of a business or consulting background and so I think I'm aiming too high. Right. And I think we need to really try to dispel that myth. So I could not agree with you more that first of all, academically very qualified. 333 six. Could she take business fundamentals or one of these courses to prove kind of quantitative competency or bolster that? Sure, wouldn't hurt. But otherwise, I have no concern academically about this candidate. And I agree with you. Work experience, incredibly interesting and very differentiated. I will say for the career goals. I think she's not, by the way, I didn't mention because she didn't indicate in her thing when she's applying, but in the comments she later shared that she's really not looking to apply for another year or two. So she has a lot of time to shape her candidacy. Now. If I were her, I would apply next fall in round one because I think she will by then. Well, she says four years of experience. Maybe she's already counting ahead to two years from now. But whatever the case, I think she could apply in a year's time and I feel like she could aim very high. I think she needs to figure out the goals, though. I think the long term goal of helping philanthropic organizations to really deliver on their mission and using kind of business analytics and things to do so great. But in the short term, what does that look like in terms of a concrete job? Is it working for a consulting firm that does a lot of work with nonprofits and kind of social impact type stuff? That's probably what it is. But anyway, she needs to sort of flesh that out. But to me, this candidacy potentially has Wharton, any of the top schools in the world on the list. That's how I would look at it, yeah.
• 17:11
  Speaker B: And my response to her when she said, she says, I think I may be aiming too high, I don't have much consulting business background. My response was directly, rather than worry about lack of consulting business background, focus on developing your leadership opportunities. Do you want to comment on that remark, Graham? I mean, to me, that's the way.
• 17:33
  Speaker A: To look at in mean, I gotta say, when I was reading files at Warden, this kind of candidacy is really refreshing. And the only thing that sometimes would worry me would be if they didn't have the academic chops. But here, three 6330. I mean, I'm not worried about that. Especially if she were to go out and take a business fundamentals or MBA math or something. And then when the leadership, yeah, I think, I don't really care if she's working at BCG or at Teach for Vietnam. What I care about is what sort of opportunities has she had to impact the organizations she's been involved with? And so, yeah, just taking on leadership opportunities, I think it's a common mistake that's made by candidates who are non traditional, is that they really underestimate their chances in an MBA. And the beauty of the MBA is that it's sort of for all, really. While it does appeal to obviously the bankers and the consultants, these programs are for everyone. So I think she has a great chance of getting into a top school and I would encourage her to just keep working on her Canada city leadership and her goals and then probably apply maybe next year or maybe the year after if she wants to.
• 18:40
  Speaker B: Very good.
• 18:41
  Speaker A: Yeah. All right, so let's move on. I want to thank her for her post and a great one.
• 18:45
  Speaker B: I think we have a crush on this candidate, Graham, maybe.
• 18:49
  Speaker A: No, I just think she's going to do well in any event. Yeah, thanks for picking that one out. Let's move on though, and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number two. So our second candidate is looking to start in 25, so probably not applying until next season, round one or something. They've been working in finance and they're not exactly sure what they want to do after business school. We'll get into that in a moment. They have twelve schools on the target list, and it's Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Duke, Harvard, HEC, Paris, INSEAd, LBS, NYU, Rotman in Toronto, and then Chicago, Booth and Yale. So a long list of schools at this point, but they're still a year plus out from applying, probably. They have a 730 on the GMAT and a 3.2 GPA. They have only been working for two years at this point, which is why they're not applying right now. They're located in India and they mentioned that they double majored in math and econ from one of the best public universities in the United States. Their overall GPA was a little above 32. Their economics GPA was 3.7. They also said they hold a Master of Science degree in economics from a top ten university in the UK, and it's a top 25 university in the world. In that master's degree, they earned a first class honors with distinction, and they're currently working in risk management in finance. So, Alex, I'll turn this over to you. This is an interesting candidate. They're a little bit younger, they are in India, presumably indian, but have done a lot of studying in the US and UK. So, yeah. What do you make of this candidacy?
• 20:28
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, they're going to have to be a little bit concerned about potentially being overrepresented in the pool, which means effectively to target the first round in the year that they're applying. So they know that now, so that should be fine. Their academic record is a bit of a mixed bag. I mean, I don't think a three two GPA at the undergrad level from the US is outstanding, especially for the schools that they're targeting. Obviously getting a master's degree with a first class honors distinction is going to help elevate that a little bit. And their GMAT is 730 is definitely at the median for all the programs they're applying. I think pretty much. I think that's fine. My biggest concern with this candidate is their length of work experience. So because I think they did a master's that's probably shrunk their work experience. So they've currently at two years, maybe that's at three or four years by the time they apply matriculate. But that then correlates with this idea that they don't have a really good post MBA plan. And we see that with candidates that are younger or have less experience, they might know what they don't want to do, I. E. What they're doing now, but they don't know what they want to do. And they'll use the MBA to try to discover that. So for applying for the very top schools, they really need to have thought through that plan much more effectively. The nice thing is they got a lot of time now to really do a real sort of deep analysis to figure all that out. They make a remark that they might want to continue on in finance, just not in the area of risk in which they're in now, but they might also want to do something different related to environment and sustainability. Now, obviously that's very sort of topical now in the world in which we live. But I would then push back to say, well, what sparked your interest in the environment, sustainability? What have you done in that sphere to date that has stimulated a potential interest? And if there is something there, and they have already done maybe some volunteer work or some other work related to the environment that they want to refocus on, I think that would be great. And I would also spend the next year or so as they pair their applications, getting more involved, whether it's in their extracurricular activities or whatever in that area. But yeah, I think my biggest concern, Graham, is this might well be a super smart candidate, but have they figured out their plan yet? Are they going to be able to really deliver a strong application for themselves?
• 23:44
  Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. They just have some work to do when it comes to, like you say, continuing to stay active outside of work, figuring out that career path and what the goals are, because they need to be specific. And then I think they are going to be potentially overrepresented. And while they did go to one of the best public universities in the US, a three two is a three two, it sounds like they had a challenging major in stuff, math and econ, but I would like to see what do you think about the GMAT? They have a 730 for some of the schools they're applying to. In fact, many of them, that's kind of just average, right? I mean, that's what some of these schools are reporting is their average. And so given that their GPA is low, would you recommend that while they're kind of working on their applications that they take another stab at the test?
• 24:31
  Speaker B: I mean, it's possible. It would depend to me how much work they put in to get that 730 if they just took it and that's what they got and it's hit the average, so therefore it's fine then. Yeah, maybe put some effort into it and make it one of those ridiculously incredible scores to help counteract a little bit that three two. But getting that master's degree also helps in this sort of calculus here in terms of. I think they can show. Well, certainly they can show that they're smart enough to handle the rigor of the curriculum.
• 25:07
  Speaker A: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
• 25:09
  Speaker B: But, yeah, having an outstanding GMAT is never going to hurt.
• 25:13
  Speaker A: Right. And I think you're making a very good point. I mean, clearly this person's qualified. Like, I'm not looking at that 730 saying, oh, I don't know if they can handle the curriculum. They have first class honors and their masters, and it's more starting to play the stats game them a little bit. But in any event. Yeah. So I think hashing out their goals and staying active outside of work, getting their stuff together, and they have time because they're not going to apply until, well, I guess the earliest would be next fall, potentially later than that. So we'll see how things evolve. But I think a lot of these are kind of classic things that you would see with someone who's early in the process and kind of not yet fully formed their ideas. That's why they have a large target school list, et cetera, which I assume they'll whittle down as well. All right, well, thanks for picking that one out. I want to thank them for sharing their post. Let's move on, though, because we have a doozy of a final candidate to discuss. So this is wiretaps candidate number three. All right, so this, Alex, you picked the decision wire entry, and as usual, it's a candidate who's undecided. Okay, so this person applied to Babson, Dartmouth, Duke, Georgetown, Harvard, Kellogg and UNC, as well as Boston University. And they're going to start school this coming fall. They aren't exactly sure what they're going to do after business school. I think they're planning on kind of staying in their current career, but moving, I guess. Well, they want to pivot into, like a marketing position, it sounds like, but they didn't give us a lot of specifics there. Maybe they did in some of the comments below, but in the entry, it's a little bit ambiguous. Their GRE score is a 316 and their GPA was a three four. This person is located in Boston. So I mentioned where they applied. Here's what happened. Okay. They got into Babson, and Babson is actually giving them $91,000. They also got into Georgetown, and at Georgetown they got a $60,000 scholarship. They got into UNC, Keenan Flagler, also with a 60 grand scholarship. And then they were also given a $90,000 scholarship at BU, which was the other school they'd applied to. So, pretty good results and a fair amount of money on the table. But here's where things get complicated. So, in the notes this candidate writes, I live with my husband and two young kids about ten minutes away from Babson. It would cost me $23,000 to go to Babson. I'm 35 and I'm only looking to use the MBA to pivot into a marketing position for the next ten years before I scale back. BU is the other school that I got into, and I would have to pay about 40,000 to go there. So a little bit more than Babson. It's a better program in my mind, but it's a messy commute. So I guess they live further from Bu. And then she says, or we'd reluctantly move to attend UNC or Georgetown, but would return to Massachusetts after the MBA. So, Alex. Yeah. There's a lot of moving parts here between young kids wanting to go back to Boston, having some offers in Boston, and then the scholarship money. So, yeah. How do you make sense of this dilemma?
• 28:26
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, this person looking to pivot into marketing. So I would really look at Bu and Babson and look at their career reports, maybe talk to some alums to see if they're doing what she wants to do to me. I wouldn't even look at McDonough and Keenan Flagler in this case. And the reason why I like this case and wanted to highlight it is it's a clear example of where, whilst we talk about tiers and the importance of tiers, each individual candidate's personal circumstance can definitely divert the decision such that a lower tiered program does actually make much better sense. So they want to remain in Boston post MBA they're in, and it's a family decision. So you'd be uprooting not just yourself, but your partner, your kids, and so on and so forth. So I think for all those reasons, I would focus much more heavily on my decision on Babson and Bu and really examine which is best going to allow them to pivot successfully into marketing. They only want to work for ten years post MBA before they start scaling back. So these are other factors to take into consideration and so forth. Babson looks like it might be the best option in this case, but I would scrutinize what sort of marketing roles are being had by folks coming out of absent, and if they are at the level and so forth that they're seeking, why not? Yeah, I don't know what a messy commute is, though. If it's just another ten minutes further, I would really focus hard on Boston University.
• 30:26
  Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. So I'm going to play devil's advocate and say that just for fun, right. So one thing that's jumping out at me is this idea of you mentioned you wouldn't even consider Georgetown UNC. And I'm going to just kind of go against that and know. I wonder if moving the family to a place like Chapel Hill for a two year adventure. MBA programs, especially programs in kind of settings like a chapel hill, I think are really great at fostering community. And so this would be kind of an adventure for the family. Hopefully the spouse, the husband could find work in the research triangle area, which maybe that, or maybe just work remote back up to Boston. But I'm just thinking it could be a really interesting adventure and it would definitely accelerate the career and kind of give her more of the kind of skills that maybe she's looking for. I'm a little more hesitant on Georgetown only because if cost is a factor, like DC is very expensive, it's an urban setting and so there'd be more challenges even for the kids education. I mean, there's a lot of things that would happen that might be different in a place like Chapel Hill. So again, I recognize that for this person, if they really are only going to work for ten years after business school and they want to be in Boston, maybe it makes sense to stay local. These schools like Babson and Bu have phenomenal local networks, so I get that. But at the same time I'm also just thinking of the prospect of an adventure as a family becoming part of a true kind of MBA program community that's close knit and the kind of connections and things that, that could lead to that would open up a whole host of new doors and things. So again, I think you're probably right that she's probably going to go to Babson or Bu.
• 32:09
  Speaker B: I'm going to provide the counterpoint to that. The alumni networks of Babson and Questrum are going to be much stronger in Boston than Keenan flaglers and they want to be in Boston. If they want an adventure, then go on a month's holiday.
• 32:28
  Speaker A: And then. So you're raising a really good question, is what about the Georgetown network and how does Georgetown have a better network? But yeah, it's challenging. I hear what you're saying. I mean, I think if they are dead set on spending the rest of their lives in. You know, I hear what you're just.
• 32:45
  Speaker B: What do you got against Boston, Greg?
• 32:47
  Speaker A: Oh, no, I don't, actually. I would probably prefer to live in Boston than trying to. Well, I'm trying know create debate here, Alex. We're trying to spice things.
• 32:59
  Speaker B: This. You're trying to get this show to go on for 40 again. I think we can wrap this up and say it's Babson versus question.
• 33:06
  Speaker A: Yeah, I think you're probably right. But anyway, it's good for. I just think it's important to kind of consider all these points. And that's why I'm sure you picked this out like such an interesting dilemma. Not the usual kind of decision wire post that we see. And it raises a really good point that, yeah, it doesn't always come down to prestige or tier or ranking and all that stuff, or even scholarship dollars. So in any event, thanks for picking these out along with mean, all these candidates were great as usual. Let's connect. In one week's time, I guess I'll be in America, so we'll have to figure that out and we'll do it all over again next week.
• 33:36
  Speaker B: Brilliant. Best luck, everyone. Stay safe.