Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Missing Audrii, 11, Tied to Rock 'Swirling' in River, PANTS FOUND at RIVER'S EDGE

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Missing Audrii, 11, Tied to Rock 'Swirling' in River, PANTS FOUND at RIVER'S EDGE · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grease.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: Did eleven year old Audrey Cunningham ever have a chance?
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: Her mother is now posting heart wrenching messages about how
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: she quote failed her daughter.
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: The father had her.
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: Living in his home with his grandparents, and in the
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: backyard is a Nazi Aaryan brother covered in hate tattoos,
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: who would take her to school alone in the car.
• 0:53
  Speaker 4: With him with a sex offense.
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: In the last hours, we learned that this eleven year
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: old little girl.
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: Do any of you have little girls or.
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: Little boys that are or were eleven years old? This
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: little girl's body was weighted down with a rock tied
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: by rope to her body.
• 1:23
  Speaker 4: Who could do that to.
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: An eleven year old little girl?
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: I mean, take a look at this guy.
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: Would you leave your child alone with him, much less
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: put her in the car with him, give him access
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: to your home with your child asleep in the bed
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: around him.
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: I mean, think about it.
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: One of his last offenses on his rap sheet. Oh yeah,
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: he got a sweet plea deal, didn't have to register
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: as a sex offender.
• 1:57
  Speaker 4: And walked free over an over and over and over
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: and over. But this time he had access to a home.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: And was caught in the bed with a minor child,
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: a girl, and had taken off her underwear and PJ bottoms.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: Now he has access to Audrey, and now Audrey is
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: dead at the bottom of a river, weighted down by
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: a rock.
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, Texas.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: It's on you. You have the DP death penalty needle.
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: You're gonna use it?
• 2:35
  Speaker 4: Are you gonna let him.
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: Somehow slip out of this too?
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: Because all of his other crimes, most of them were
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: in Texas, and he walked, He skipped out of the
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: courthouse free as a bird.
• 2:48
  Speaker 4: He ran hopscotched.
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: Out of the jail each time. And now Audrey is dead,
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: I mean, is he Greace? This is crime Stories. Thank
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: you for being with us here stories and on serious
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: sex sem one eleven. Wow, what we have learned overnight
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: by taking a long hard look at a formal affidavit
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: used as an arrest warrant. Wait till they perform those searches,
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: but right now joining me in addition to an all
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: star panel to make sense of the evidence as we
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: know it. Right now, this lady is a hero, the
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: lady that called police when she spotted that's Nazi Arian
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: brother sex perv who I believe murdered an eleven year
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: old girl, Audrey. I believe he raped her, and I
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: believe he weighted her body down with a rock that
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: threw her body in the river. Joining me right now
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: is Leslie Gaskins. She is an ex Une employee and
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: she's the one that called nine one.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: And landed his rear in behind bars.
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: Of course, then he started lying and lying and lying,
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: but despite his lies, police managed to find Audrey's body.
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: Leslie Gaskins, thank you for being with.
• 4:16
  Speaker 5: Us, Thank you for having me.
• 4:18
  Speaker 4: Les Gaskins.
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: This, ma'am, tell me what happened when you see the
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: defendant covered in all his tattoos. I don't know if
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: you could see his swastika or not, But tell me
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: what happened when he came into your exion.
• 4:33
  Speaker 5: So it was just a few dollars in change for gas,
• 4:37
  Speaker 5: it could have been a couple of beers on my
• 4:39
  Speaker 5: real sure, because I didn't know that he was significant,
• 4:43
  Speaker 5: that he was so ugly. I keep saying that he's
• 4:47
  Speaker 5: just so ugly and so creepy looking that you just
• 4:51
  Speaker 5: don't forget his face, and it just I don't know,
• 4:55
  Speaker 5: his face just stuck with me. And then the next
• 4:58
  Speaker 5: day when I saw his mug shot and they said
• 5:01
  Speaker 5: to call if you had seen him. I called right there,
• 5:05
  Speaker 5: didn't even hesitate.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: What when he came into your ex son? Are you
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: saying that it was either for gas or beer?
• 5:13
  Speaker 6: Yeah?
• 5:15
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yes, Sam, And I'm.
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: Curious, hello, let me get right in him. What time
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: of the day did he come in?
• 5:23
  Speaker 5: It was after nine o'clock I believe, I'm.
• 5:28
  Speaker 4: Not real sure, nine am, nine pm.
• 5:31
  Speaker 5: Im. I am, my work today shift that day?
• 5:34
  Speaker 4: Question?
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: Was this on February fifteen, the day Audrey went missing?
• 5:41
  Speaker 5: Yes, ma'am, Yes, ma'am, Yes, ma'am, I work today shift
• 5:45
  Speaker 5: that day.
• 5:46
  Speaker 4: What time do you go in?
• 5:47
  Speaker 5: I go in at five fifteen in the morning.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: So you're their first thing in the morning. Now, February fifteen,
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: I believe was a Thursday, correct, yes, ma'am. So you're
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: there at five am, five fifteen. You get everything opened
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: up and ready.
• 6:03
  Speaker 4: What were you doing?
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: Were you behind the counter when he came in?
• 6:07
  Speaker 5: Yes, ma'am.
• 6:08
  Speaker 7: There was a line of people and he was just
• 6:10
  Speaker 7: in the middle of the line.
• 6:12
  Speaker 4: Did he smell of alcohol or anything else?
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: Pots? Cigarettes?
• 6:17
  Speaker 5: No?
• 6:18
  Speaker 7: No, I didn't notice, and he wasn't dirty like they said.
• 6:23
  Speaker 5: When he got went to the mechanic shop. He wasn't
• 6:27
  Speaker 5: dirty and all that either.
• 6:29
  Speaker 4: So this is nine a m.
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: Trying to place him that time in the line of
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: events that we have so far.
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: Do you recall what he was wearing.
• 6:40
  Speaker 5: I don't. I don't.
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: What about him stands out to you?
• 6:45
  Speaker 5: His face, his fear, his eyes. He has like a
• 6:51
  Speaker 5: crazy eye.
• 6:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah, does one look one way and one look the
• 6:54
  Speaker 4: other way?
• 6:55
  Speaker 5: It kind of does just them.
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: I've tried to figure that out because in some pictures
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: they look like they're both looking at you, and in
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: others one looks like it's looking off.
• 7:05
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 7:06
  Speaker 5: Yeah, And I think he's kind of was kind of
• 7:09
  Speaker 5: a regular here. I think I've seen him in here before.
• 7:13
  Speaker 4: What's your recollection?
• 7:14
  Speaker 7: Because I remember his eyes.
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: The eyes, Yeah, the first time I saw his eyes.
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: They're very light and blue and they're piercing and there's
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: just something off.
• 7:26
  Speaker 4: Now. Could you see all of his tattoos?
• 7:30
  Speaker 7: No, ma'am, I don't think I could. I think I
• 7:32
  Speaker 7: could see the like a little bit around his neck.
• 7:36
  Speaker 7: I think he had a T shirt on. He didn't
• 7:38
  Speaker 7: have a tank top.
• 7:39
  Speaker 4: Did you my chance see his hands?
• 7:41
  Speaker 5: Yeah, but I really didn't pay that much attention, darn.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: I'm wondering if there were any scratches on his body,
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: on his neck, his chest, his arms, his hands.
• 7:53
  Speaker 4: He did he have on.
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: A long sleeve shirt?
• 7:55
  Speaker 8: No?
• 7:56
  Speaker 5: I don't think so.
• 7:57
  Speaker 4: Did he say anything to your recollection ever.
• 8:00
  Speaker 7: He was getting You know, it's four thirty three in gases?
• 8:06
  Speaker 7: Keep sticking in my head, okay, so or thirty three
• 8:09
  Speaker 7: in gas?
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: At that time you noticed him and you remembered him
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: because because of his eyes and his tattoos and what
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: happened next he leaves.
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: You don't think any more about it until when.
• 8:21
  Speaker 5: Until I saw him on the on the on Facebook
• 8:29
  Speaker 5: the next morning.
• 8:30
  Speaker 4: What did you say?
• 8:31
  Speaker 5: His my shot saying if you'd seen him, he was
• 8:36
  Speaker 5: the last scene with Audrey. If I had, if you
• 8:40
  Speaker 5: had seen him, please call and so I did you do.
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: Know that by you calling, that's how police found him, right, ma'am?
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: Are you concerned at all about the possibility of him
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: getting out on bond?
• 8:56
  Speaker 4: Now?
• 8:56
  Speaker 5: I would hope not. I would hope not. Please not.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: Would it concern you if he gets out on bond,
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: if he's walking free.
• 9:05
  Speaker 5: Yes, yes, definitely yes. Why because he's dangerous, he's crazy.
• 9:10
  Speaker 5: He doesn't need to be out and.
• 9:12
  Speaker 4: You're a witness.
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, did you ever meet or see Audrey or her
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: father or mother or grandparents?
• 9:21
  Speaker 7: I know my daughter is friends with Audrey's mother, and
• 9:26
  Speaker 7: we have known Audrey when she was smaller, but not
• 9:29
  Speaker 7: seen her here recently.
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: Why wasn't the mother living with her?
• 9:34
  Speaker 5: I have no idea. I have no idea because it
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: sounds late to me. She was in a worse situation
• 9:41
  Speaker 5: than if she would have been with her mother.
• 9:44
  Speaker 4: You know, does the mother live in town there?
• 9:46
  Speaker 5: He lives in Livingston, I believe.
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: Okay, with a population of a little over five thousand people,
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: how far away.
• 9:52
  Speaker 4: Could it be?
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: Do you know how the dad knows the perpetrator friend?
• 10:00
  Speaker 5: If you look on their face on his Facebook, they
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: have Uh he's been tagged in posts of the dads
• 10:09
  Speaker 5: for years. It looks like like they were friends.
• 10:13
  Speaker 4: So they go way back.
• 10:15
  Speaker 7: Yeah, and like, uh, the grandma.
• 10:18
  Speaker 5: I think it was posted a picture where he went
• 10:21
  Speaker 5: on vacation with them to Florida last year.
• 10:23
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I saw that.
• 10:24
  Speaker 5: Isn't that crazy? That is just I just don't understand.
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: I guess that's one word for it.
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: You are hearing the voice of Leslie Gaskins, the excellent
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: employee who saw the suspect on the morning that Augie
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: goes missing and called police. Miss Gaskins, thank you. I
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: hope you are prepared to testify.
• 10:44
  Speaker 7: Yes, ma'am, absolutely, I will do my part. He shouldn't
• 10:49
  Speaker 7: have never been out anyway, not with his rest. He
• 10:52
  Speaker 7: should have never been out.
• 10:54
  Speaker 4: Miss Gaskins, thank you so much.
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: Prime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: Adjoining us sound all Star panel to make sense of
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: what we know right now but overnight, this is what
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: we learn.
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: Listen.
• 11:20
  Speaker 9: According to court documents, Don Stephen McDougall used a rope
• 11:24
  Speaker 9: consistent with a rope seen in his vehicle two days
• 11:27
  Speaker 9: earlier during a police traffic stop to tie a large
• 11:31
  Speaker 9: rock to the body of Audrey Cunningham to weigh it
• 11:34
  Speaker 9: down in the Trinity River.
• 11:35
  Speaker 10: Investigators were able to locate the body of Audrey Cunningham
• 11:39
  Speaker 10: in the Trinity River by using cell phone records and
• 11:42
  Speaker 10: video analysis, but they also needed help from the Trinity
• 11:45
  Speaker 10: River Authority to lower the level of the water on
• 11:47
  Speaker 10: the river so divers could find Audrey.
• 11:49
  Speaker 9: After removing her body from the Trinity River, Sheriff Byron
• 11:53
  Speaker 9: Lyons said she was taken to the Harris County Medical
• 11:56
  Speaker 9: Examiner's Office in Houston to determine the cause of death.
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: Running US an All Star panel, but first to Bob Price,
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: joining US associate editor senior news contributor Breitbart Texas.
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: Bob, thank you for being with us.
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: Tell me about the rock that was used to weigh
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: down this eleven year old girl's body.
• 12:16
  Speaker 11: So, Nancy, I suspected that he had used some kind
• 12:20
  Speaker 11: of a weight or device to tie her down. I
• 12:22
  Speaker 11: asked Sheriff Lyons about that during the press conference on
• 12:27
  Speaker 11: Tuesday when they announced that they had found her body,
• 12:30
  Speaker 11: and at that time he did not want to disclose
• 12:34
  Speaker 11: the information as to what he had used to weigh
• 12:36
  Speaker 11: her down, but he did not deny that she had
• 12:40
  Speaker 11: been held underwater by some type of apparatus and stuff.
• 12:43
  Speaker 11: So now we know that there was a rope used,
• 12:46
  Speaker 11: a rope that was seen in his vehicle two days
• 12:48
  Speaker 11: before during a traffic stop, which again re emphasizes that
• 12:53
  Speaker 11: the avoidability of this tragedy had there been an arrest
• 12:57
  Speaker 11: warrant for mister McDougall on an aggravated assault where he
• 13:01
  Speaker 11: stabbed an individual back in August and was identified by
• 13:05
  Speaker 11: the victims as the attacker in this assault, there would
• 13:09
  Speaker 11: have been a warrant for him during that traffic stop,
• 13:12
  Speaker 11: and he would have been in jail two days before
• 13:14
  Speaker 11: her death.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: You know what, I've been torturing myself all night long
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: about could as should have? Would we have been looking
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: at the affidavit attached to a warrant and gleaning information
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: about the death of this eleven year old girl and
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: what was transpiring during the time after daddy leaves the
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: house and the defendant is there alone with the little girl.
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: Joining us right now.
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: Tim Miller, the founder of Texas Equa Search, who actually
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: went and searched, searching the waterways trying to find Audrey.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: Tim Miller, thank you for being with us. You've done
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: so many water searches. Tell me about this search and
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: the discovery of her body. When you were using sonar
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: looking through the water there, which has a pretty good
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: current to it, could you tell at that time she
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: was weighted down?
• 14:12
  Speaker 12: Well, Nancy. When we got involved in that, the sheriff
• 14:15
  Speaker 12: actually called the Friday and said he needed our help,
• 14:18
  Speaker 12: and we had many many ground searches. Saturday, we found
• 14:22
  Speaker 12: something right along the shoreline which ended up as being evidence.
• 14:28
  Speaker 12: So where that was found. I decided I need to start, so.
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: Nark, Okay, why are you talking about the Hello Kitty backpack?
• 14:35
  Speaker 12: No, something else, not the backpack. What we found something
• 14:40
  Speaker 12: right at the edge of the I don't want to
• 14:42
  Speaker 12: disclose that. Now.
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: Was it a shoe? Was it clothing?
• 14:46
  Speaker 12: It was clothing? So I decided I wanted to start
• 14:51
  Speaker 12: so dark.
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: Was it odd? Was it a girl's clothing?
• 14:54
  Speaker 12: Yes, bam, and it definitely is evidence one said, is
• 15:00
  Speaker 12: it is?
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: I mean, hold on, just a second, hold on, just
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: a second, joining me, director of Victim Services. They're in Texas,
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: joining me out of Houston. Andy Cohn, longtime colleague, Andy,
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: the girl's clothing. He obviously the girl was sex assaulted.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: That why would she not have clothing on? Why would
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: her clothing be separate from her body? Yeah, I mean,
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: this guy needs to be on death row.
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: It's not the first time. Andy. What in the hay
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: is going on in Texas?
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: This guy had a fence after offense, after a fence.
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: And now I'm hearing from Tim Miller article of clothing
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: found at the edge of the river. And Tim Miller, who,
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: by the ways, the crime victim himself, His daughter was
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: murdered is out there and sees this.
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: What's going on?
• 16:02
  Speaker 13: You know, Nancy, there's a reason we have the death
• 16:04
  Speaker 13: penalty in the state of Texas.
• 16:06
  Speaker 8: And McDougall is now the poster boy why we have
• 16:10
  Speaker 8: to death?
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: No, no, no, you can blow your horn about Texas
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: and justice.
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: But why was this guy of you? Why was he
• 16:19
  Speaker 4: out free?
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: He had already crawled in between the sheets with another
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: little girl and taken off for underwear and pjs.
• 16:26
  Speaker 4: He's got one offense after the next, after the next accidents.
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: The man is using meth for Pete's sake. I mean,
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: the Nazi tattoo alone should have gotten him kicked off
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: the property.
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: That didn't work.
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: But that said, don't start preaching to me about Texas
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: eyes of death penalty.
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: I wouldn't know what this guy's doing, not walking around.
• 16:46
  Speaker 8: To start with, the State of Texas failed eleven year
• 16:50
  Speaker 8: old Audrey Cunningham.
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: No issue or lah blah.
• 16:55
  Speaker 8: State of Texas failed this ten year old girl back
• 16:59
  Speaker 8: in two and seven, who he evidently was trying to
• 17:03
  Speaker 8: sexually assault, and he got a sweetheart deal. He got
• 17:07
  Speaker 8: sweetheart deal after sweetheart.
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: How did you know she was ten years old?
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: I didn't know that' had have been made public.
• 17:14
  Speaker 14: Yes it is.
• 17:14
  Speaker 8: I'm looking at it right now.
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: Yes, we were trying to protect her identity. I will
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: send you another ten year old girl. And you're very.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: Similar to Audrey correct, very similar. And now this, I mean,
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: you know what, Andy khn.
• 17:33
  Speaker 4: My dad, God rest your soul.
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: Daddy would a killless guy if he had tried to
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: get in bed with me or my sister or brother.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: I don't understand why he got a cheap pleader. And
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: on the cheap plead deal, Andy con he didn't even
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: say I'm guilty. They let him plead no loa contendre. No,
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: he wouldn't even admit what he did.
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: I mean, talk about a sweet deal, Texas.
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: Just this is my rariand and.
• 18:01
  Speaker 13: They cut it down to enticing a child, which isn't
• 18:04
  Speaker 13: even an offense that you have to register for. And
• 18:06
  Speaker 13: that brings us to what we're going to be doing
• 18:09
  Speaker 13: next legislative session. And I made a promise and I'm
• 18:12
  Speaker 13: going to continue their promise that we are going to
• 18:16
  Speaker 13: name a bill.
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: Please.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: You know you think I trust a bunch of politicians
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: in a room together, No, I trust me.
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: I mean I trust you, Andy, I know you're going
• 18:25
  Speaker 4: to do the right thing to.
• 18:26
  Speaker 8: Make it happy.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: Okay, Can I get to legislation? Let me guess it's
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: going to be called Audrey's Law. Yeah, that's I don't
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: love the child dead, so she could have a law
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: named after her.
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: I want her alive.
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: I can't have what I want now. The only thing
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: I can get is a death penalty. That's the only
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: thing we can work toward now. But that said, you
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: can tell me about your legislation later, and don't worry.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: I respect what you're doing. I value what you're doing.
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: I want you to do it, but I guarantee you
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: if you leave one little crack in that legislation, some
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: defense attorney's going to find a way around it so
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: it won't apply to their client. Think about that, Tim Miller.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: Can I get back to the search.
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you just.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: Got me so upset thinking about her being separated from
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: her clothes. Now, I don't know what piece of clothing
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: it is. It could have been a shirt, it could
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: have been her pants, it could have been her underwear.
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: But when you.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: Said it's definitely evidence, that makes me think it could.
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: Have been her underwear.
• 19:36
  Speaker 12: Well, it was definitely clothing. And it's definitely hers. So
• 19:40
  Speaker 12: I decided to start to it side Scamstone.
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: Is it her pants?
• 19:45
  Speaker 15: Uh?
• 19:45
  Speaker 12: Yeah?
• 19:46
  Speaker 4: Why does an eleven year old girl not have her
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: pants on?
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: He raped her? He raped her. This animal raped this
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: eleven year old girl. Okay, back to the search. Guys
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: who are talking about sonar, think about you've seen if
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: you have it, gone fishing yourself, You've seen it on
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: the fishing channel.
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: You can't miss that.
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: It's twenty four seven three sixty five people are fishing.
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: It looks like a blurry iPad screen. They even have them.
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: You can hold in your hand the size of a
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: cell phone and it looks great. But then you can
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: see black spots. Some are a lot more sophisticated, but
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: those spots are objects in the water. Now, Tim Miller
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: has state of the art. Okay, tell me what happened
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: to me?
• 20:38
  Speaker 12: Well, I started so round in that area, and of
• 20:41
  Speaker 12: course the railroad was high, the current was strong, and
• 20:44
  Speaker 12: it's like, oh my god, is she gonna wash away?
• 20:46
  Speaker 12: Or what? Sunday?
• 20:48
  Speaker 8: I got.
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: What I thought was, what did you see that made
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: you know it was Audrey Well?
• 20:54
  Speaker 12: On Sunday when I sold around, I didn't know it
• 20:58
  Speaker 12: was Audrey the conditions or the worst so you could
• 21:00
  Speaker 12: ever imagine it was Sonar. So I went back to
• 21:03
  Speaker 12: the same exact spat in the image I got. I
• 21:05
  Speaker 12: couldn't get it again. I couldn't get again. I literally
• 21:09
  Speaker 12: went through that area more than eighty times. And then
• 21:13
  Speaker 12: I got another image and I said, oh my god,
• 21:17
  Speaker 12: I said, I could make out Waids and arms.
• 21:20
  Speaker 4: Now hold on, Tim Miller.
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: You know we don't say OMJ on CS crime stories,
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: but go ahead. Oh what did it look like, Tim Miller?
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: How could you tell that it was a child versus
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: something else?
• 21:33
  Speaker 12: No, I could make out the body. So I went,
• 21:39
  Speaker 12: but it wasn't as clear because of the currents, because
• 21:42
  Speaker 12: of where it was. It was difficult at best. So
• 21:45
  Speaker 12: that I kept sold out and so on Arm. And
• 21:49
  Speaker 12: then Monday I so nut again.
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: It got Tim what went through your mind when you
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: spotted that?
• 21:54
  Speaker 12: You must have just I knew it was her, but
• 21:57
  Speaker 12: I couldn't repeat it. And it's like, how come if
• 22:00
  Speaker 12: they were shutting there, it's got to stay there. And
• 22:03
  Speaker 12: so I got with the divers on Monday and the
• 22:08
  Speaker 12: Texas Rangers. I showed them the image.
• 22:10
  Speaker 4: Did you go down yourself?
• 22:12
  Speaker 8: No?
• 22:12
  Speaker 12: I didn't dive. I don't even take a bath, but
• 22:15
  Speaker 12: I'm pretty good at shouldar.
• 22:16
  Speaker 4: But let me ask you a question.
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: So you guys are diving in a fast current in
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: the river.
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: Correct.
• 22:24
  Speaker 12: Well, on Monday, when I showed the damage and we
• 22:26
  Speaker 12: all got together, they said, oh my god, I think
• 22:30
  Speaker 12: you're right. I think it's abody. We have to dive
• 22:32
  Speaker 12: about it. Well, the currents were so strong and the
• 22:36
  Speaker 12: river was high that they could never get to that image.
• 22:41
  Speaker 12: So then they decided to shut the bed.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: It's hard, man, I've done dives in fast currents and
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: rivers and it's it's not like on TV.
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: It's really hard to do that.
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: Much less to get was she all the way down
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: at the bottom because.
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: Of the rock?
• 22:58
  Speaker 12: It was tied off to that road.
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: She was tied onto the roape.
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: And at the other end of the road was a rock.
• 23:04
  Speaker 12: Yeah, And so then her body was the rock on.
• 23:07
  Speaker 4: Her body and tied to her body.
• 23:10
  Speaker 12: Now I was on the rope.
• 23:12
  Speaker 4: Okay, question, go ahead.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: So the body, Audrey's body was not on the bottom
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: of the river on the river bed. The rot was
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: on the river bed, and she was in the water.
• 23:25
  Speaker 12: She was in the water, and so she was just
• 23:28
  Speaker 12: swirling and swirling in there, and that's why I could
• 23:31
  Speaker 12: never picked that saving image at the saving fast spot.
• 23:35
  Speaker 12: But I'm going to tell you the best thing he did, Nancy.
• 23:39
  Speaker 12: The best thing he did was tire off and weighth
• 23:42
  Speaker 12: her down because if he wouldn't have done that, and
• 23:46
  Speaker 12: she would have floated that current go four miles an hour,
• 23:53
  Speaker 12: in twenty four hours, she would have been ninety six
• 23:55
  Speaker 12: miles away, So.
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: That, just like Natalie Holloway, were fine.
• 24:00
  Speaker 12: The best thing he did for the search efforts was
• 24:04
  Speaker 12: to go ahead and waiter down otherwise again in that current,
• 24:09
  Speaker 12: and it's just take it. She would have popped up
• 24:12
  Speaker 12: at night when nobody was there in twelve hours, she
• 24:15
  Speaker 12: would have been fifty miles away. So you know, it
• 24:18
  Speaker 12: was a blessing in disguise. So yeah, when I got
• 24:24
  Speaker 12: that on it again, they dove on Monday. They could
• 24:26
  Speaker 12: not even get to it because of the occurrence. They decided
• 24:29
  Speaker 12: to shut the day and once the water go down
• 24:32
  Speaker 12: and the next day would I guided there. They found her.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: Jim, what do you mean when you say she was
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: swirling and swirling?
• 24:42
  Speaker 12: Well, if you can imagine in a current and there's
• 24:46
  Speaker 12: a big swale there. It's between the railroad bridge and
• 24:49
  Speaker 12: fifty nine South Bridge, which is close together, so the
• 24:53
  Speaker 12: water coming around them pilings and stuff just created a
• 24:57
  Speaker 12: huge eddy So she was down there just basically almost
• 25:01
  Speaker 12: going in circles and moving around and moving around. And
• 25:06
  Speaker 12: that's why it was so hard to get her at
• 25:08
  Speaker 12: the very saved location because what her bodies at the bottom,
• 25:13
  Speaker 12: it's going to stay at the bottom until it starts
• 25:15
  Speaker 12: gasting up and then it'll start moving. So I would
• 25:19
  Speaker 12: go back to the same exact spot and she wasn't there.
• 25:23
  Speaker 12: I go again and then get it located in another area,
• 25:26
  Speaker 12: and she would.
• 25:27
  Speaker 14: She was just moving.
• 25:29
  Speaker 12: She's just moving around, and I anticipate if she wasn't
• 25:35
  Speaker 12: being found, of course she would have never floated, and
• 25:38
  Speaker 12: as bad as the sounds of fish life and turtles
• 25:41
  Speaker 12: and stuff would have you know, she would have just
• 25:46
  Speaker 12: ate that body and she would have been found. So
• 25:49
  Speaker 12: it was huge effort with everybody, and you know what, Nancy,
• 25:55
  Speaker 12: God just put us in the right place at the
• 25:58
  Speaker 12: right time.
• 25:58
  Speaker 4: Kim.
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: Not everyone knows that you lost your daughter.
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: So when you get a case like this, what does
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: it mean to you that you found Audrey? You're the
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: one who spotted her on sonar.
• 26:19
  Speaker 12: Well, you may get me a little bit choked up
• 26:22
  Speaker 12: right now. And when I got home, I said, Laura,
• 26:28
  Speaker 12: thank you, just thank you, because if you were still
• 26:32
  Speaker 12: like I wouldn't be doing this. Were you there, I said,
• 26:34
  Speaker 12: thank you, Laura, because of the image and what we got.
• 26:38
  Speaker 12: That's why the divers were there. And again I'm not
• 26:42
  Speaker 12: saying this to pat myself in the back. There's no
• 26:45
  Speaker 12: ego involved in it. Again, I've just been blessed by
• 26:50
  Speaker 12: God with a you know what He's given me, and
• 26:54
  Speaker 12: and I'm pretty good at that sonar. I'm not an expert.
• 26:58
  Speaker 4: Enna, you don't have to pat your own back.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: If it had not been for you spotting her on
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: the sonar, she could have come loose from that rope
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: and she would have been gone, Like you said, in
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: twelve hours, she'd be fifty miles away and we would
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: never have the answer to what happened to Audrey Cunningham,
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: and this savage, this brute would walk free to attack
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: another child.
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: And you know another thing, Tim, we know.
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: Of these two little girls ten one, eleven, very similar
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: in physicality. We don't know how many others are out
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: there because you and I know Tim Miller, then only
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: one I'd of say eight or nine sex assault victims
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: come forward, and that is a conservative figure. You are
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: hearing Tim Miller, my friend, my longtime colleague who runs
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: Texas equ Research. Everybody on the panel jump in. We
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: got a lot to get through. First of all, to
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: Joe Scott Morgan, renowned professor Fresi is joining us out
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: of Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: book on Amazon, and start of a hit series body
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: Bags with Joe Scott Morgan. Joe Scott. Right now, we
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: don't have a cod cause of death. She's still at
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: the Harris County morgue. But you know, and I know
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: they know the cause of death. They probably knew the
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: cause of death the moment they looked at her. I'm
• 28:40
  Speaker 2: guessing asphyxiation of some sort. But let me talk to
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: you about a toxicology. Did he dope her up with
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: let's just say ben a drill or.
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: Something like that.
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: B you heard what Tim Miller said from Texas EQ
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: Research the water tempts.
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: Were very low.
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: How did that help or hurt?
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: Had there been any fish activity on her? I don't
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: see how she's in a swirling eddie. Just you know what,
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: you know more than me on this. Joe Scott just
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: hit me.
• 29:19
  Speaker 14: First off, I hope that the knots were not untied,
• 29:22
  Speaker 14: that's seen. I hope that.
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: Oh, yes, yes, yes, I hope.
• 29:27
  Speaker 14: I hope that the rock was not disengaged. Because when
• 29:31
  Speaker 14: when we work cases and they arrive at the morgue,
• 29:34
  Speaker 14: we want all of the elements present so that we
• 29:37
  Speaker 14: can fully appreciate, you know how, for instance, with her,
• 29:40
  Speaker 14: how she secured you think about the forensics of not tying.
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: Plus Joe Scott, what about potential DNA on the inside
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: of those knots.
• 29:50
  Speaker 14: Yeah, and that's quite interesting, depended upon how long she
• 29:54
  Speaker 14: had been in there, and not so much she but
• 29:57
  Speaker 14: those knots. Were there any protected faces in there? My
• 30:01
  Speaker 14: right now, my gut would say no. But Nancy, there's
• 30:03
  Speaker 14: a saving grace here. And Tim had brought this up.
• 30:06
  Speaker 14: And this is the beauty of this this you used
• 30:12
  Speaker 14: term savage. That was kind that article of clothing that
• 30:18
  Speaker 14: was left on the shore there, If it was relatively
• 30:24
  Speaker 14: intact and it was not super saturated with water, there
• 30:29
  Speaker 14: might be a chance that you can find some foreign
• 30:35
  Speaker 14: DNA on there and that may.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Can you place be it just got really completely drained case?
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: Please speak to me and regular talk.
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: Are you talking about when.
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: You say I don't you're talking about sperm, You're talking
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: about saliva. You're talking about epifilial skin cells, hair, any
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: fiber from his clothes, It could be on her pants.
• 31:06
  Speaker 4: Is there some other DNA I'm missing?
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: Hair, fiber, skin, sperm, blood, sweat.
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: Is there some other dnation I'm missing?
• 31:17
  Speaker 14: Well, also one of them?
• 31:19
  Speaker 4: Hold on, I think Tim's jumping in.
• 31:21
  Speaker 12: Tim, Yeah, can I break in real quick?
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: Please?
• 31:23
  Speaker 12: Actually whether the Texas Rangers yesterday and stuff's been doing
• 31:26
  Speaker 12: Alfi David and giving all the pictures to suffer the trial.
• 31:31
  Speaker 12: And one of the things that we talked about is
• 31:34
  Speaker 12: thank god that water was as cold as it was,
• 31:38
  Speaker 12: because if he's sexually as solted her, there's passively going
• 31:42
  Speaker 12: to be able to get steaming from her.
• 31:44
  Speaker 4: Good point.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, Joe Scott, I hate to treat you like a computer,
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: but that's more data that has been input into that
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: brain of yours. Now spit it out as best as
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: you can.
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: We'll all try not to enter out. Go ahead unless
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: we have to.
• 31:57
  Speaker 14: No, that's okay?
• 31:58
  Speaker 7: Sure?
• 31:59
  Speaker 14: Yeah, So And one other thing here, I think that
• 32:02
  Speaker 14: that's that's really pertinent is the fact that that garment
• 32:06
  Speaker 14: was found on the shore. I'm really wondering, Nancy, if
• 32:09
  Speaker 14: he had not picked that spot to you know, commit
• 32:14
  Speaker 14: commit this savage attack on her, that that's the location
• 32:18
  Speaker 14: where he may have stripped her and have done whatever
• 32:21
  Speaker 14: he did to her that you had previously mentioned. And
• 32:25
  Speaker 14: if that's the.
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: Case, you see it right there.
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: I would think that he would attack her and sex
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: assault her in the car or in some covered area,
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: not in the open area along the river bank.
• 32:36
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 32:37
  Speaker 14: Yeah, but I think very there at this point. I
• 32:41
  Speaker 14: don't think that anything can be discounted though we don't
• 32:44
  Speaker 14: even have a cause.
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: You're right, But tell me what we do know, well,
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: what we will get from that body.
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah, well I can tell you this right.
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: Now when you don't know a horse. Look at his
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: track record. He tried to sex assault the other little girl.
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: So he tried to sex assault this little el Okay,
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: that's not a leap of imagination.
• 33:04
  Speaker 4: That's his track record.
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: Yes, And why else would he have her what to
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: sit in his car and play solitaire, to play tit
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: and watch TikTok Hell No, he attacked this girl. That's
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: why she didn't have her pants on. So what evidence
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: am I gonna get?
• 33:20
  Speaker 14: Well, given the fact that she is found in a
• 33:22
  Speaker 14: body of water, I think that it is going to
• 33:24
  Speaker 14: be very difficult to have success with a rape kit
• 33:28
  Speaker 14: if he ejaculated within her person. Okay, and she's nude
• 33:33
  Speaker 14: in the water. We don't know that at this point.
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: Are you telling me they can't retrieve sperm from her
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: vagina or rear?
• 33:39
  Speaker 4: End?
• 33:39
  Speaker 14: I mean, listen to what Tim just said. A second ago.
• 33:41
  Speaker 14: Her body was swirling around, Nancy, I.
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: Mean, would go into her vagina.
• 33:47
  Speaker 14: Of course it would. Of course it would, and it does.
• 33:50
  Speaker 14: And let me throw one more thing at you if
• 33:52
  Speaker 14: if that isn't enough, you're talking about a small child.
• 33:55
  Speaker 14: She's and I hate to say this, Nancy, but she's
• 33:58
  Speaker 14: greatly dilated at this point in time.
• 34:00
  Speaker 4: If in fact, she was talking about her vagina.
• 34:03
  Speaker 14: Yes, Nancy, I am. And so that's okay, man.
• 34:06
  Speaker 4: Spit it out. I just okay.
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: Now, Actually you're making sense.
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: If her vagina is dilated because of the water, is
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: that what you're saying?
• 34:14
  Speaker 14: No, No, because of the sexual assault, because of.
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: The sex assault.
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: You're saying that's how water could penetrate the because ladies,
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: think about it, When you get in the bathtub, you
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: do not get water in your vagina.
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: Same thing here.
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: But what Joe Scott is saying, I think is that
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: because she we believe, had been raped, her vagina is
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: now dilated and water could enter and destroy the evidence.
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: Oh dear lord, unless there's some evidence on her pants,
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: is that right?
• 34:46
  Speaker 14: Yes, it is in one other area here that might
• 34:48
  Speaker 14: be a bit more protected, believe it or not, might
• 34:51
  Speaker 14: be her fingernails. I think that with nail clippings in particular,
• 34:55
  Speaker 14: because that's kind of a hooded area. If everybody will
• 34:57
  Speaker 14: just look at their fingernails, if she scraped him, there
• 35:00
  Speaker 14: might be a possibilities that's still trapped beneath her fingernails.
• 35:04
  Speaker 14: That's kind of a long shot, but that's what I
• 35:06
  Speaker 14: would be thinking as well, Scott.
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: Why don't we have a CEOD yet?
• 35:11
  Speaker 14: I think that they're taking their time with it. You know,
• 35:14
  Speaker 14: one of the things I thought about, and you know
• 35:17
  Speaker 14: this is way off topic. I'm really and they have
• 35:21
  Speaker 14: to consider this. I wonder if she was placed in
• 35:23
  Speaker 14: there alive. I don't know that, and they're trying to
• 35:27
  Speaker 14: make a determination as to whether or not perhaps she
• 35:32
  Speaker 14: had taken on water in life and they would find
• 35:36
  Speaker 14: evidence of that in her lungs. Also, there's a test
• 35:39
  Speaker 14: that we do in the inner ear at autopsy that
• 35:43
  Speaker 14: we check for drowning. I think that part of that
• 35:47
  Speaker 14: is that's what's complicating this to this point.
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: And also the subitation a matter of removing the lungs
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: and weighing them to see if they're wet.
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah you can't and there's this standard empty.
• 36:02
  Speaker 14: Yeah it does. However, what they will want to do, Nancy.
• 36:06
  Speaker 14: Also with drowning to confirm it is we look for
• 36:10
  Speaker 14: what are called diatoms, and that's these little creatures that
• 36:14
  Speaker 14: exist in the water that you take on and you
• 36:17
  Speaker 14: have to look at them microscopically. So I'm wondering if
• 36:20
  Speaker 14: that might be part of it as well, NaNs.
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: I mean, whatever lives in the river water, whatever microscopic
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: organisms would now be.
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: In her lungs. Yeah, and that now what is the
• 36:31
  Speaker 3: inner ear test for drowning.
• 36:33
  Speaker 14: Well, that you would actually have water contained within the
• 36:37
  Speaker 14: inner ear, and so that's part of the drowning process
• 36:41
  Speaker 14: as well, And so that's something that we would want
• 36:43
  Speaker 14: to consider, and that they're looking at I can tell
• 36:46
  Speaker 14: you they're being very third with us.
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: Joe Scott jump in as we move along, But I
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: want to talk about this affidavit joining.
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: You right now.
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: High profile lawyer out of Livingston, Atlanta, Shadwick, former j
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: former prosecutor, legal analysts for Breitbart in Texas, Atlantashadwick dot
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: com LANDA thank.
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: You for being with us.
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: Have you read the Affidavid, I've got a few things
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: I want to ask you about.
• 37:12
  Speaker 4: This guy is so full of crap.
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: Because we hear police say this is where you're going
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: to come in Lee Reaber that they were able to
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: place a defendant with the victim. Now how through cell
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: phone data? We know that through other digital information and
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: through information from him. But I am telling you right
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: now he was lying through his teeth. The information they
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: likely got from him is from his cell phone. Because
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: triangulation doesn't lie, pings don't lie.
• 37:55
  Speaker 4: This guy lied through his teeth.
• 37:57
  Speaker 6: Well they've got him now. I mean he at the
• 38:00
  Speaker 6: bridge with cell phone data at the pens. I mean,
• 38:04
  Speaker 6: you can lie all you want to, but you know, unfortunately,
• 38:07
  Speaker 6: I mean, I mean unfortunately, he tied her to a
• 38:13
  Speaker 6: rock and that's where the body was found, they're going
• 38:16
  Speaker 6: to be able to ping his cell phone, get video
• 38:22
  Speaker 6: footage of that two thousand and three blue suburban and
• 38:28
  Speaker 6: placed him there. And now that vehicle is in the
• 38:32
  Speaker 6: custody of law enforcement authorities and you know they are
• 38:37
  Speaker 6: combing it.
• 38:38
  Speaker 4: You know, I want you to.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: Look Lanta at paragraph five, Shell show through investigation, that's
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: the cop it's see. Affient investigations were able to determine
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: through cell phone data, video footage, and other forensic evidence
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: that McDougall lied about his whereabout guide and activities.
• 38:57
  Speaker 5: Yeah, they got him.
• 38:58
  Speaker 4: He flat out law all right.
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: And another thing, take a listen to our friend at
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: crime Online, Rachel Benia.
• 39:06
  Speaker 10: According to kat rk Don, Stephen McDougall was seen in
• 39:10
  Speaker 10: a Livingston mechanic shop near Highway fifty nine the day
• 39:13
  Speaker 10: Audrey went missing. Workers at the shop said McDougall was filthy,
• 39:17
  Speaker 10: covered in dirt and acting suspicious. He was there trying
• 39:20
  Speaker 10: to get a part for his blue Chevy Suburban.
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: So we know that he was completely filthy at mechanics shop.
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: What about that Lanta filthy with what because he had
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: been down there at the river bank getting rid of
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: a body.
• 39:34
  Speaker 6: Well, absolutely, that's evidence of where he was beyond you know,
• 39:39
  Speaker 6: having cell phone pigs and video footage.
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: Now they've got.
• 39:44
  Speaker 15: Him covered in a lake, river.
• 39:49
  Speaker 6: Mud and so saying he's stealthy. So the guy said smart,
• 39:54
  Speaker 6: he didn't even bother to clean up anything before he
• 39:57
  Speaker 6: goes out to get a part for a car.
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: I'm very curious about what we know.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: Regarding that video footage and the cell phone pings. Bob
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: Price joining me, Associate editor, senior news contributor, Breitbart Texas. Bob,
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: do you know that the pings absolutely place him on
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: that bridge, because based on what Tim Miller is saying,
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: he didn't throw a body off a bridge, he went down.
• 40:43
  Speaker 11: On the river bank, right, and with the clothing found
• 40:47
  Speaker 11: on the river bank and not tangled up in the
• 40:49
  Speaker 11: grass along the river's edge, we know that he was
• 40:53
  Speaker 11: up on that bank and probably placed her or pushed
• 40:56
  Speaker 11: her into the water with that rock attached. Not only
• 41:00
  Speaker 11: the cell phone day to confirmed that though he took
• 41:02
  Speaker 11: the police to that location on Saturday and said that
• 41:06
  Speaker 11: that was one of the places they'd been. Now, he
• 41:08
  Speaker 11: lied about some other things, but he admitted that he
• 41:12
  Speaker 11: was at that location. The interesting thing about him.
• 41:15
  Speaker 4: Getting a part please, my dear sweet boy.
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: He only did that when they showed him, Hey, your
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: phone is paying right here?
• 41:22
  Speaker 11: Oh sure, probably probably so bad.
• 41:24
  Speaker 4: It volunteer, and he lied through his teeth man.
• 41:27
  Speaker 11: So he was at this car shop getting parts for
• 41:29
  Speaker 11: his car. He went on Facebook that day and started
• 41:33
  Speaker 11: selling off a bunch of his personal belongings. He was
• 41:35
  Speaker 11: planning to run at that point, and unfortunately the police
• 41:39
  Speaker 11: caught up with him before he had a chance to flee.
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: Lee Reber's joining us at a new Alexandria, Virginia mobile
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: device forensic expert and CEO of Oxygen Forensics, Inc. He
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: is the author off Listen to this Mobile Forensic Investigations,
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: and he's a host of a podcast which is great,
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: by the way, Forensic Happy Hour. Lee Reber, thank you
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: for being with us. Lee, Explain to me how much
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: can I rely on pings? How accurate are they? Can
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: they place him at that river bank? Hey, Tim Miller,
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: how close were Audrey's pants to the bridge? Were they
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: thrown from the bridge or would he have had to
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: go down to the river bank.
• 42:28
  Speaker 12: Got to go down to the river bank and it
• 42:31
  Speaker 12: was actually in the water, So it was saturated with water.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: Oh, Joe Scott Morgan is not going to like that
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: because that could have gotten rid of any forensic evidence
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: linking the defendant back to her pants.
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: But that said, I'll go back to you in a second,
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: Joe Scott.
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: Lee Reeber explain to me how accurate is the pinging process?
• 42:52
  Speaker 16: Yeah, I think you know, if you look at the triangulation,
• 42:55
  Speaker 16: I mean that's it could be accurate. It could be
• 42:59
  Speaker 16: very accurate. What I think is more important is the
• 43:02
  Speaker 16: forensic evidence that's going to be from the device itself
• 43:05
  Speaker 16: when they go and do the collection of that, because
• 43:07
  Speaker 16: those are just GPS devices that could put you, i
• 43:11
  Speaker 16: mean a meter to the location. So I think that
• 43:14
  Speaker 16: utilizing obviously identifying being able to Kee's lying because it's
• 43:20
  Speaker 16: the location. But once they have that device in their
• 43:22
  Speaker 16: possession and do the processing of that, it's going to
• 43:25
  Speaker 16: show I mean, there might be photos, and the photos
• 43:28
  Speaker 16: have exit data, it can show location. They can have
• 43:32
  Speaker 16: just a simple from the data that's on the device,
• 43:37
  Speaker 16: any applications that we're utilized and showing GPS location. So
• 43:42
  Speaker 16: I think the data from the device itself will be
• 43:45
  Speaker 16: way more important than looking at, say the data from
• 43:49
  Speaker 16: the towers.
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: Great question, Bob Price joining us Breitbart, what year is
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: this Pervs Chevy suburban?
• 43:57
  Speaker 11: So the sheriff announced that they were looking for information
• 43:59
  Speaker 11: about this two thousand and three dark blue Chevy suburban
• 44:03
  Speaker 11: that he was seen driving in belongstick got it?
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: Two thousand and three?
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: Okay to Lee Reeber, mobile device forensic expert. Remember the
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: Alex Murdoch trial. How much we learn from his NAV system?
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: You can even tell Lee, and you and I talked
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: about this.
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: You were awesome.
• 44:22
  Speaker 4: When Murdach got in.
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: His car, his SUV, to leave the scene of the
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: double murder where he murdered his wife and son, the
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: NAV system will even show him opening the car door,
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: closing it, cranking up, putting the car in drive, driving,
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: screeching out of the crime scene, slow righting, driving like
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: a bat out of hell, slowing down. It showed when
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: he let his window down electronically, which I argue this
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: when he threw Maggie Murdoch's cell phone out the window,
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: let the window back up, and then high tailed it
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: to his mother's house twenty eight miles away. It showed
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: when he cranked back up, got back in and went
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: back to the crime scene and went, oh, dear Lord
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: in heaven, my wife and son or dad, let me
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: call nine one one. It was all a lie.
• 45:14
  Speaker 4: But those nav systems are amazing.
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: Is there such a na sism in a tooth NAV
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: system in a two thousand and three suburban?
• 45:20
  Speaker 16: Well, the vehicle itself. I mean in two thousand and four,
• 45:25
  Speaker 16: you know, or if you remember the on Star systems,
• 45:27
  Speaker 16: you know they had on Star systems. I know the
• 45:30
  Speaker 16: two thousand and four Chevy suburban has an on Star.
• 45:34
  Speaker 16: They all have computers with the nav systems.
• 45:37
  Speaker 4: Of the two thousand and three.
• 45:38
  Speaker 16: Yeah, even in two thousand and three, I'm just saying,
• 45:40
  Speaker 16: and you know, as old as the two thousand and
• 45:43
  Speaker 16: three we had on Star navigational systems that are running
• 45:47
  Speaker 16: on all those opening doors. It be treasure trove along
• 45:50
  Speaker 16: with the data from the mobile device busted.
• 45:55
  Speaker 17: For sure.
• 45:56
  Speaker 2: They better get on that subpoena to Chevy right now,
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: because remember at trial all that evidence. They had asked
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: for it long ahead of time, but they got it during.
• 46:07
  Speaker 3: The trial or right before the trial. The defense almost
• 46:10
  Speaker 3: got to keep it out.
• 46:12
  Speaker 2: Hey word to the wys in Texas Lanta, Andy Conye
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: passed this along. Get the nav system information. Now, by Price,
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: what can you tell me about text messages between Audrey's
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: bio mom and McDougall.
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: Apparently he was offering.
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: For the two of them to meet, stating that the
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: little girl wanted to see her mom and coincidentally offering
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: to meet at the spot by the river where the
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: little girl is found.
• 46:48
  Speaker 11: So I've seen some of those posted on social media,
• 46:52
  Speaker 11: and clearly he was trying to entice this mother down
• 46:56
  Speaker 11: to that river. Now that raises a question that about
• 46:59
  Speaker 11: when is the actual time of death for Audrey. Did
• 47:02
  Speaker 11: he do something to her the night before and was
• 47:05
  Speaker 11: trying to get the mom down there to do something
• 47:07
  Speaker 11: with her as well. You know, there's a lot of
• 47:09
  Speaker 11: things that could come into play here, but clearly he
• 47:12
  Speaker 11: was trying to meet up with her and using Audrey
• 47:15
  Speaker 11: as bait if you will, to get her down there
• 47:17
  Speaker 11: to meet with him.
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: We know from what we also, Bob Price kept stressing,
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: don't tell anybody. Quote as long as no one says
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: anything about it being set up, no one would even know,
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: and she Augie wouldn't say anything.
• 47:30
  Speaker 11: And that's the moo that this guy has. He grooms people,
• 47:34
  Speaker 11: family members, children. All of this We know from what
• 47:37
  Speaker 11: was said yesterday on the show, that he assaulted a
• 47:39
  Speaker 11: woman by groping her at a public party, a married
• 47:43
  Speaker 11: woman just months before this. We know that he was
• 47:47
  Speaker 11: at the birthday party of another eleven year old child
• 47:51
  Speaker 11: just months before this happened. He's hanging around all of
• 47:55
  Speaker 11: these types of people down there. The father has a
• 47:59
  Speaker 11: criminal conviction for assault causing bodily injury. You know, maybe
• 48:03
  Speaker 11: that's how they met somewhere.
• 48:05
  Speaker 3: But you're saying Audrey's father has that conviction.
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: Yes, so my speculation that they met in the penitentiary
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: could be accurate. What's another thing that's very disturbing about
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: these texts between Audrey's by a mom and the defendant
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: McDougall is he is saying, I will take her to
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: school and have you on the phone. I will take
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: her to school tomorrow. This is Wednesday night. The next
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: day is the day he was supposed to take her
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: to school, but whoops, she ended up.
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: Without her pants dead in the river.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: And he's talking to the mom the following morning, the
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: day of the murders.
• 48:40
  Speaker 4: Good morning.
• 48:41
  Speaker 2: They're still planning to meet up with the girl, and
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: he says have you He says to her. Have you
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: seen Audrey? I dropped her off at the bus and
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: she didn't get on and hasn't gotten home.
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: So he's lying in these texts to the mother.
• 49:00
  Speaker 11: Bob, Yeah, if his lips are moving or his fingers
• 49:03
  Speaker 11: are touching a keypad, he's lying. And that's been consistent
• 49:07
  Speaker 11: throughout this whole thing, this whole area. The people in
• 49:11
  Speaker 11: the courthouse told me that there's thirteen sex offenders that
• 49:15
  Speaker 11: live within a very short radius of this house. This
• 49:19
  Speaker 11: father and another father are exposing their children to these
• 49:23
  Speaker 11: types of people on a regular basis and putting these
• 49:27
  Speaker 11: children in dangerous situation.
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: I got a question about a photo for you, Lana Shadwick.
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: Chris McDonough joining us from the Cold Case Foundation, former
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: homicide detective and host of the Interview Room on YouTube.
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: I've seen photos of the dad, according to Bob Price,
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: has a conviction for assault. Was it Aga Salt or
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: assault Bob.
• 49:53
  Speaker 11: The salt causing bodily injuring and misdemeanor misdemeanor.
• 49:56
  Speaker 3: Then they wouldn't have met in the pen maybe the
• 49:58
  Speaker 3: county jail.
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: But Atlanta and Chris, have you seen the photos of
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: Audrey's dad with the defendant.
• 50:09
  Speaker 17: Yes, I've seen the photo, Stancy.
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: Yes, the photo is of the defendant McDougal and Audrey's
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: dad with whom she lived. They've got their arms around
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: each other, all of his prison tattoos, his swaska, all that,
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: and plane view. They're hugging each other and they're shooting.
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: It looks like the ab Arian brother. But that said,
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: they're wearing matching bracelets.
• 50:37
  Speaker 4: What kind of romance do those two have?
• 50:39
  Speaker 17: You know, that photo is obviously pretty disturbing, Nancy, And
• 50:43
  Speaker 17: for this strip bag in order for the State of
• 50:47
  Speaker 17: Texas to quite frankly hang a millstone around his neck
• 50:51
  Speaker 17: and toss him into the seat, I think it's important
• 50:54
  Speaker 17: not only that they look at what we call suspectology
• 50:57
  Speaker 17: and kind of dissect what his past is, but I
• 51:00
  Speaker 17: think this case is going to revolve and end up,
• 51:04
  Speaker 17: you know, balancing out on whether or not that child
• 51:07
  Speaker 17: was alive when she was put into that water, because
• 51:10
  Speaker 17: that opens up a now an investigation into other potential
• 51:15
  Speaker 17: crime scene locations, the house, the car.
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: Why do you think at all handes on whether she's
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: dead or alive when she's done in the water, Because.
• 51:23
  Speaker 17: Dead now, because you have the like doctor Morgan was
• 51:26
  Speaker 17: talking about the chances of getting greater forensic and or
• 51:31
  Speaker 17: circumstantial evidence to put this guy away increase when you
• 51:37
  Speaker 17: have crime scenes that you can actually collect that type
• 51:40
  Speaker 17: of evidence. Like, let's just use the cigarette butts for
• 51:42
  Speaker 17: an example, that he bought at the gas station. Where
• 51:45
  Speaker 17: are those cigarette butts? If he bought cigarettes, where is
• 51:50
  Speaker 17: you know, his air filter? Is there evidence within that
• 51:53
  Speaker 17: air filter that placed him underneath that bridge through you know,
• 51:58
  Speaker 17: bringing in a botanist.
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: Well, we've got hold on, Please wait a minute, Chris McDonough.
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: We have his pings placing him at the location where
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: the child's body is found. Right, we have him being
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: the last one with.
• 52:17
  Speaker 17: Her, right, and that's all great evidence.
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: We have him stating he had her in the car.
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: So what did she do? Go tie a rock around
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: your waist and throw herself off the bridge?
• 52:28
  Speaker 17: No, but that's all great evidence.
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: No, there's evidence right now to convict him.
• 52:32
  Speaker 4: Are you kidding me? Totally agree? You think we can't
• 52:34
  Speaker 4: prove this case without DNA?
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: We can, But how would you like the DNA is
• 52:39
  Speaker 2: just the icing on the cake?
• 52:40
  Speaker 17: Auntie? How would we what I know? If I put
• 52:42
  Speaker 17: a package in front of you in court, you would
• 52:45
  Speaker 17: shred this guy. But how would you love to find
• 52:48
  Speaker 17: semen in his truck where maybe that's where the sexual
• 52:52
  Speaker 17: assault took place.
• 52:54
  Speaker 4: And maybe we find her DNA or on his clothing.
• 52:58
  Speaker 4: Have you thought of it?
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Joe Scott, we stopped at the body.
• 53:04
  Speaker 4: What about his clothing?
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: Well, you don't think there's any fibers from her on
• 53:11
  Speaker 2: his clothing? No epithilial cells, no blood, no nothing, hair, hair, anything?
• 53:19
  Speaker 4: What about it? Joe Scott helped me out.
• 53:21
  Speaker 14: Brother, It's possible that you could. Here's the problem, as
• 53:25
  Speaker 14: admitted earlier, you were talking. One of the guests had
• 53:29
  Speaker 14: mentioned how filthy he was and encrusted with all of
• 53:32
  Speaker 14: the s dirt.
• 53:34
  Speaker 4: But yet he was clean at the gas station.
• 53:36
  Speaker 3: Interesting, go ahead.
• 53:38
  Speaker 14: So we don't know what the status of the clothing are.
• 53:41
  Speaker 14: Is it possible that they could collect something from her,
• 53:45
  Speaker 14: from this precious little angel that may have made its
• 53:47
  Speaker 14: way onto him, Yes, that's within the realm of possibility,
• 53:51
  Speaker 14: But we don't know how much due care was taken
• 53:54
  Speaker 14: with us clothing, if in fact they have collected those
• 53:56
  Speaker 14: clothing from him or from wherever he was dombed solid
• 54:00
  Speaker 14: at the top.
• 54:01
  Speaker 4: Got something?
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: What about the rope, the rope. I mean, Lana Shadwick,
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: you're the high profile lawyer. Well, even a trash bag
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: can be traced back to the lot, the group of
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: trash bags that were created, manufactured at what plant, in
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: what city, on what day, and whether it was the
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: same thing with car paint. Yes, you think they can't
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: do the same thing on rope. You think they can't
• 54:30
  Speaker 2: match up the rope and you know he cut it.
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: You think that somebody like Joe Scott Morgan can't take
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: the one end of the rope that was tied around
• 54:39
  Speaker 2: her body and the other end of the rope that
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: was in his car. They already said it's the same
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: rope and put it together and see forensically that they
• 54:48
  Speaker 2: match perfectly.
• 54:50
  Speaker 6: I think he can.
• 54:51
  Speaker 7: He can.
• 54:52
  Speaker 4: I mean, I'm just a JD.
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: I'm not a crime lab scientist, but even I can
• 54:56
  Speaker 2: figure that out.
• 54:57
  Speaker 14: Nancy's here's another beauty part to the rope depended upon
• 55:01
  Speaker 14: how well they treated it and they removed it from
• 55:04
  Speaker 14: her body. Did you know that if she was tied
• 55:08
  Speaker 14: up with that rope anti mortem prior to death, there's
• 55:13
  Speaker 14: going to be evidence of that that you would not
• 55:16
  Speaker 14: necessarily see with a post mortem tie up, So she's
• 55:19
  Speaker 14: got an upbraided area that's got any associated hemorrhage with
• 55:22
  Speaker 14: it or anything that's an indication that she may have
• 55:24
  Speaker 14: been alive when she was tied up and secured at
• 55:27
  Speaker 14: that point.
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: I got another idea for you, Jackie can hold up
• 55:30
  Speaker 2: your note. I can't take credit. It's Jackie's something about
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: the fact that he was clean at the gas station
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: after he was filthy at the mechanics. Depending on which
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: was first the shacken or the egg, does that mean
• 55:47
  Speaker 2: he then disposed of the body and was the body in.
• 55:50
  Speaker 3: The truck for disposal.
• 55:52
  Speaker 2: I find it really hard to believe it's top at
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: a gas station with a dead body in the car.
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: That said that means something, Lena Shadwick, I don't know
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: what it means yet.
• 56:02
  Speaker 4: Well, but I will find out what.
• 56:03
  Speaker 6: It means in circumstantial.
• 56:06
  Speaker 15: Evidence and direct evidence of him being by the river,
• 56:11
  Speaker 15: by the lake, beyond the cell phone data and any
• 56:13
  Speaker 15: video footage and that sort of thing. You've got him
• 56:16
  Speaker 15: placed at a station where he's all clean in the video,
• 56:21
  Speaker 15: and then he's.
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: Tell me something I don't know, tell me something. Can
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: there be neglect charges or felony neglect charges neglect that
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: ends in death filed against the father and plays. Don't
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: everybody start screaming at me, you're blaming the victim.
• 56:39
  Speaker 4: I am a christ Okay, but I know this girl
• 56:41
  Speaker 4: is dead.
• 56:42
  Speaker 6: Injury to a child by negligence orough missions are fellony
• 56:46
  Speaker 6: one in the state of Texas.
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: So you will this fit that if the dad had
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: knowledge of his record, could he be charged with felony
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: the neglect ending in death on a child?
• 56:59
  Speaker 5: Certainly if knowledge?
• 57:01
  Speaker 4: Okay, but your father have knowledge?
• 57:04
  Speaker 6: They got a romance going on, that's right, got the
• 57:09
  Speaker 6: same headbands on the same bracelet, the same headbands.
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: Okay, Andy Cohn and a nutshell. You know how I
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: hate talking about legislation because of the Audrey case.
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: What do you hope to a help.
• 57:23
  Speaker 8: That we do end up bringing focus on offenders like mcdougle,
• 57:27
  Speaker 8: who somehow escaped from having the label of sex offender
• 57:31
  Speaker 8: on him. Maybe if he had to register back when
• 57:35
  Speaker 8: he committed the offense of enticing a child in decency
• 57:38
  Speaker 8: with a child, when he evidently was trying to sexually
• 57:41
  Speaker 8: assault a ten year old girl years ago, maybe that
• 57:45
  Speaker 8: would have raised alarm bells at this time. Maybe the
• 57:48
  Speaker 8: community would have known more about mcdoogle. Who knows, maybe
• 57:53
  Speaker 8: the parents, I don't know, but at least we would
• 57:55
  Speaker 8: have known about his criminal history and his propensity to
• 58:00
  Speaker 8: do sexual deviant acts around young girls. So what I
• 58:05
  Speaker 8: hope to do next session is to take this case,
• 58:09
  Speaker 8: make it a.
• 58:09
  Speaker 16: Catalyst for game.
• 58:10
  Speaker 8: I set a nuts shell, catalyst for change, and add
• 58:14
  Speaker 8: the offense.
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: You know what I hate, Andy Kahn?
• 58:18
  Speaker 3: You know what I hate?
• 58:20
  Speaker 2: Would a could a should have? Yes, I want you
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: to champion that and I want it to pass. Maybe
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: another little girl will be saved. Would a could a
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: should have? Can't bring Audrey cunning hand back.
• 58:37
  Speaker 8: Multiple opportunities were failed.
• 58:39
  Speaker 4: As thrill, We wait.
• 58:42
  Speaker 3: As justice unfolds. Goodbye,