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Why Indie Filmmakers Quit (And How Not To) · Indie Film Podcast

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Welcome to Indie Film Podcast For the month of August, we're
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going to be talking all about how indie film makers often have
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to play multiple roles. We'd all love to be on a set
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with every single position filled and multiple P as to help
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out when things get crazy, but that's not the reality of indie
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filmmaking. Oftentimes for indie film
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makers, your lack of budget is going to mean that cast and crew
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are a luxury. On that note, I'm Vic.
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And I am Chuck. Let's talk about skeleton crews.
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Victoria, What do you do if you have a cinematographer Cancel
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the night before a shoot? Well, Chuck, contrary to popular
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belief, I do consider myself a cinematographer, so if that
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happens to me, I'm picking up that camera myself and I'm
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shooting it. But I bet you have fun stories
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for us about this. Yes, I've actually had a
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cinematographer cancel the night before a shoot who we were
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relying on, and this was somebody that we were trying to
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recruit for a larger project. We went above and beyond as far
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as Lower Gentry Studios is concerned.
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That's a group of film makers I work with, which is my brother
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and sister-in-law. And we had a basically test
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shoot set up. I completely redecorated my
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spare bedroom to look exactly how the cinematographer wanted
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to have it look. But then the night before he
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said it's not quite what I want. Then there was a potential
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snowstorm that was coming in that didn't actually
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materialize. And so the vibe was we presented
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with this possibility of doing this feature film together.
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We wanted to do a trial workout. The stipulations were laid forth
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by the other party that this person wanted this done, this
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person wanted this done, this person wanted this in the short
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film script and wanted to do a trial shoot.
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And so I guess the, the lesson there was we had to cancel the
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entire thing because one, it was not ready to be filmed in the,
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the, the potential realm that that we wanted to have done.
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OK, wait, but hold on. So the cinematographer the night
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before tells you, well, the room doesn't look exactly the way I
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wanted and there's a snowstorm, therefore I'm not coming.
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Like what? Happened.
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Let's just cancel this. We should probably preemptively
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cancel this. And this was something that I
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was basically being the lead producer on.
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So I got a personality vibe on there, which The thing is, is if
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you're working on a skeleton crew and you're going to be
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shooting indie films, you want to make sure that everybody gets
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along exceedingly well. Ideally.
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Yes, because it's hard to have a shoestring budget and or no
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budget and also get things done in a timely manner if
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everybody's not working synergistically.
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Essentially is is is my experience, but the issue was
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that we set up this entire script, this entire story for
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the cinematographer. And when that person bailed, the
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decision was, do we carry on with this thing that we created
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that we're not excited about ourselves, or do we just cancel
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it all and find somebody else to be our cinematographer?
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And what we did was we ended up canceling the shoot and then
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prepping for our next feature film, which was was we speak.
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And that one did not look as good as the stuff that we
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released with people that specialize in cinematographers
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because again, my brother was directing and running camera
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and. From experience I can say that's
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that's not a pleasant situation to be.
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You don't get to give 100% of your all to either one at that
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point. No.
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And obviously you want to have everybody's position fill filled
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for films, but sometimes you just, if you want to get it
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done, you have to push forward. And that was kind of the lesson
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that we learned there. One, do the art that you want to
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do. Yeah.
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So that you're going to force yourself to push through when
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people or things fall apart around you.
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Yeah. And and two, don't.
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Don't count on anybody that hasn't proven that they can be
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depended upon. Also fair, though, I will say
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impending snowstorm and knowing the year that you're talking
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about and being in the city during that year and knowing how
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bad the snow was and how many times I got snowed into my home
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that year. I'm going to give a little bit
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of flexibility there 'cause if I had been in that cinematographer
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shoes, I probably also would have said, hey, so there's
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supposed to be a ton more snow tomorrow, Let's check in at
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whatever time and just make sure the roads are clear.
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And if that doesn't work, what other days can we immediately
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fill this with that work for everybody?
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Like let's have a backup plan ready to go.
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Yeah. And that was one of the things
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too, that if you're dealing with people that aren't problem
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solvers, but they like to point out problems, to me that's a big
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red flag when you're working with people that don't want to
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come up with solutions. They do enjoy pointing out
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issues with things like whether it be your set decoration
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skills, whether it be issues with the script, but they're not
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presenting any solutions. Like those are the type of
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people that I don't know. I get like a feeling that
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they're looking down their noise nose at me and I get a little
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upset. I don't get the feeling that
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they're looking down their nose at me.
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I get the feeling that they are not necessarily a creative
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problem solver because that was like in any industry.
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In any job I've ever had, whenever I was a manager,
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director, supervisor, whatever, that was, the one thing I made
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sure all my staff knew was, hey, if you have a problem, please
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bring it to my attention. But more importantly, bring me a
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few options for solutions. I don't care if they're not the
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right one, but we do need to think about how to solve it as
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opposed to just be focusing on the negative of here's a big
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problem. Yeah.
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Like, OK, that's great. But can you come up with maybe
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two or three options for what would fix that problem?
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Yeah. And I do want to point out too,
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that filmmaking, indie filmmaking can beat you down
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pretty heavily. And so it's it's easy.
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Something is a bigger like kick straight to your ego than indie
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filmmaking. Yeah.
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And so it sometimes it's hard for people to continue going on
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this. This particular person, I
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haven't seen them do any work in probably like the last five to
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eight years or so. So it's not like I don't think
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that that person was on the trajectory of continuing their
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work as a cinematographer. So it was extremely skilled,
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extremely skilled with a camera. And that was one of those
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things. This was our third
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cinematographer to bail on us for our our.
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Film shoots. At that point I would be like,
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is it me? Is it not them?
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Is it me? Oh.
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We didn't, we didn't ever look at it that way.
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I guess we always blamed it on them, but I think that's one way
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that you need to to carry forward.
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Is that's one way male and females, like indie film makers
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differ? Maybe.
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Oh, that, that could be part of it too.
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But we didn't let that slow us down because we already had a
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track record of completing things and having that that
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experience of other film makers pointing out issues, pointing
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out obstacles to that prevent them from moving forward.
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And I feel like that was a frustration that we ran into
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early on in the the Boise film scene is that, you know, there
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were, we were trying to do our best with what we had.
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And there were a lot of other people that were doing that too.
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And I'm sure others that are in filmmaking communities that are,
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that are burgeoning or even in, I would imagine outside of LA or
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New York, there's a groups of film makers that are doing their
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best to try to punch through and get their art done.
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And it's it's, it's one of those things.
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There are film makers or, you know, self-proclaimed film
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makers that will point out all the reasons why things can't
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work out and why it's so difficult.
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Yeah. And then there's the group of
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people that punch through and. They're like everything's a
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problem but. And everything always falls in
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that binary of film makers. No, either or.
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There is no in between. Yeah, that's fair.
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Well. OK, so I guess we should
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probably talk about Skeleton Crew because you and I have both
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been put in those situations where people don't show up and
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yet the project gets finished. Yes.
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And that's, I think the important thing is to limp
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through it. And I don't know, I think it's
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better to be embarrassed by something that you created than
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to not create it. I disagree.
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Yeah. Yeah.
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Well, I mean, don't get me wrong.
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Being embarrassed about your past work I think is a good
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sign. I think that means you've grown
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and your standards are continuously growing and and
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climbing higher, and that is a good thing.
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I do think there is that whole. Don't let the perfect be the
9:02
enemy of the good, right? Because nothing is ever going to
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be perfect. And you have to understand that
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sometimes things are good enough.
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But I've been on projects, as you know, a Co creator where
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it's not good, it's really bad and I would rather go back and
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fix it, even if it means missing a deadline.
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I would rather go back, fix it, do it right, make it better than
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release it in a yeah, it really sucks and we know it sucks and
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we're embarrassed about it, but here you go anyway, you know?
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I guess I could have clarified that question a little bit.
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So, so every time you create something, I feel like there are
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steps in filmmaking that you start with the script.
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You want to be happy with the script, so.
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Yes, do not think that you will fix your script on the fly
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during shooting. Good call.
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No, don't do that. And sometimes you can do some
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stuff. There's been some local stuff
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released where there wasn't necessarily a script, but the
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actors had history and improv. So you still want to have a
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character outline, motivations, things like that.
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If you're good enough on the family to be able to film that,
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then well, fine, do it. But you want to start with an
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idea or a script and be confident in that, or at least
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as confident as you can be. And then, you know, move on to
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shot listing, move on to the production.
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Make sure that you're happy every step of the way.
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But you are going to run into problems and you will run into
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weaknesses. And don't let the perfect be the
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enemy of the good. But also when you release
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things, it doesn't matter how much education you've had or how
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much time you've had on sets, if you're fulfilling roles that you
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haven't done before or working with a skeleton crew, extending
10:50
yourself greatly then, and you're in charge of it start to
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finish, you're going to have areas that need improvement no
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matter what. Yes, and some of those things
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you can't go back and fix very well in post so.
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No, especially for some projects that I'm thinking of
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specifically it it would have required reshooting a lot.
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And did you release them? It did end up getting submitted
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to the festival for which it was created, much to my protesting.
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Oh, but it did. You got it.
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You got it finished. It got done, it got done and it
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got submitted and now I don't believe is visible anywhere else
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and I certainly won't be sharing it anymore.
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Well, hey, I mean, that's, that's totally fine.
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And, and I'm, I know absolutely that I am very responsible for a
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lot of the mistakes in it. I know this, I'm very aware
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there were a lot of things in it I I would have changed and would
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have done better and wanted to. But hey, now those are mistakes
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that pay a lot more attention to Yes, the first time around.
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Do you think actually having had that project seen by other
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people makes you more mentally aware of preventing those
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mistakes? Specifically, do you think if
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you had hidden that project, do you think it would have made any
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difference as far as? No, I think it would still haunt
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me. OK, well, good.
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So hey, go out there. But to be fair, I'm also a firm
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believer that that I am probably going to be more critical of
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anything I make because I know what was in my head and what my
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head. And what exists in my head is
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just the cinematic masterpiece versus anyway.
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Especially, you know, if you're learning all the different
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aspects of lighting, sound design, camera placement,
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placement, all those aspects that you hear and see in a large
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budget production that maybe when you get started you aren't
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100% aware of how all that works, you know?
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No, no, I will never understand gaffing.
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Ever. I won't.
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I'm gonna keep learning and keep trying and keep working with
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really talented gaffers so they can hopefully glean some of that
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knowledge from them. But no, I'm not.
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I would never call myself a gaffer.
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Yeah. You you got to practice though.
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So I guess that's kind of what we're talking about today.
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We got really sidetracked. That was a bit of a rabbit hole,
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so back to Skeleton Cruise. Let's talk.
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Should we talk about famous things?
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Because that tends to be what people want to hear us talk
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about is just famous films and these.
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Big films, not the little indie stuff that you're working on.
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Yeah, exactly. So do you want to talk about
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favorite films that operated on Skeleton Cruise?
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Yeah, I have one that you're going to hate.
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Nice. Give it to me, Twilight.
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No, I'm just kidding of. Course that didn't have a
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skeleton crew. Hopefully.
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Wait a minute, hold on, wasn't that like grossly over budgeted?
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No, I'm kidding, I actually have no idea about the budget of
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Twilight. Please don't come after me
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Internet fans. I'm so sorry.
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My my favorite example is 1 You're not going to love because
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it's a Duplass film. Oh nice.
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Well I don't have anything. I don't have any issues with the
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Duplass Brothers films, I just have an issue with the way they
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present themselves as bootstraps.
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When it's more like not quite not silver spoon, but certainly
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like gilded shoelaces or gilded bootstraps, if you will.
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Absolutely. And I agree with that
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wholeheartedly. But Creep is a delightful film
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which actually surprises me because I hate found footage
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style movies. But Creep was one is 1 and they
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did it really well. So Creep is creepy is the best
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way to describe that. Which is a little bit of a let
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down. Sorry, but.
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Good name for a. Movie then it is so well fitting
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right so there's two actors in the whole thing in this cabin in
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the woods there is another voice actor and and she is credited as
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credited as such Katie Aselton Sultan I'm not 100% sure how to
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pronounce her name and I feel bad about that now but I I dug
14:56
around so much because they are on record as saying there were
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three people on this crew and it's found footage and two of
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them were the actors because you had was it Mark Duplass and
15:09
Patrick Bryce who both wrote it and they're the lead actors in
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it and they're carrying around this video camera within this
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cabin like interviewing this guy and or Patrick Bryce is
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interviewing Mark Duplass's character so they had Jason
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Bloom as a producer they do not say if he was on set or not
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according to IMDb there is an uncredited PA personal assistant
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to Mr. Bloom Bloom or Blum I never.
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It's OK. I'm sorry I'm.
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Say both. And I'm like, because I've heard
15:45
Bloom House, but I've also heard Blum House and I don't it's UM,
15:48
so Blum feels right, but I don't know it's.
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A producer, nobody cares about them anyway.
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Actually I have AI have a joke about that later on for Ren and
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Stimpy. Go ahead.
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Leave it to Ren and Stimpy jokes.
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That's thank you for bringing us back to the 90s for a minute.
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That's pretty nice. Of course.
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OK but there had to be a sound person because the sound was
16:08
good. But on the IMDb credits, there
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are 6 people listed in the sound department.
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So they might have fixed it, or they could have put labs on
16:15
possibly. Or done a lot.
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Of voice over but if it's if it's found footage they might
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have just added stuff in post. I don't know, but none of them
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was listed as an like a location sound mixer or location record.
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Nobody was location sound, everybody was post sound.
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So I don't actually know who the fuck the third crew member was.
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I can't figure it out. There were a lot of people in
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post. There were a couple of
16:39
producers, things like that. There were a bunch of marketing
16:41
people because they knew they needed to do marketing for it.
16:44
Yeah, but the whole thing, their budget was $500.00 for that
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film. Oh, wow.
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I mean, well done. Nice.
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So that was the production budget then?
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Yes, obviously. Dang, that's cheap, but then how
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do they get the marketing stuff behind it?
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Well, I'm assuming that took more money, and that's when more
16:59
of the producers come in, for sure.
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Yeah. I guess I'm going to jump around
17:03
before I talk about because we did have a question that we
17:06
wanted to talk about roles that are surprisingly easy but get
17:10
too much credit. Oh yeah.
17:12
In Hollywood, and that's where I wanted to point out producer.
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Oh my God. This is a quote.
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This is Stimpy from Ren. And Stimpy he was.
17:20
He was making a cartoon and Ren couldn't find where he needed to
17:24
fit in as far as in this like cartoon.
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Production wasn't going to be drawing it, He.
17:30
He doesn't have any creative thoughts or anything like that.
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So Stimpy suggests that he become the producer.
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And Ren says, what's that? And Stimpy says the producer is
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the guy who tells the artist what to do and later makes all
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the changes. And then when the cartoon's
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done, he takes all the credit. You know what?
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So that's what I think of when I think of the typical quote UN
17:51
quote producer, but also, yes, an indie film.
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You need a quality producer. To do the business end, I'm
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going to take that not personally coming off of being a
18:00
producer on a short recently. Thanks.
18:05
No problem, No problem. But a lot of times, like people
18:08
might not be aware of this, but a quote UN quote executive
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producer might just be somebody who gives a whole bunch of money
18:14
to the film. Yeah.
18:15
So that they're their son or daughter can get a small role in
18:19
it or whatever the case may be. Or they want the dividends off
18:23
the back end, or they're looking to get into the producers Guild
18:26
or whatever. Like there are a lot of reasons
18:28
people may or may not give money to films.
18:30
And you know what? I say that's great.
18:33
Rich people, keep giving your money to indie film makers.
18:37
But do it to support the artist. No, I don't care.
18:40
The money is going to spend the same.
18:42
Just give a. Yeah, yeah.
18:45
OK, Well then fine. You know what I am going to say
18:47
if we're jumping down to that question.
18:49
All right, I'm going to say it the director.
18:52
Director is overrated. I think the director is
18:54
overrated. As someone that has directed
18:56
films, I think if you have a quality assistant director, you
18:59
have a really solid cast, your DP is talented and your
19:03
production designer is killer. Your job is so easy.
19:07
All you have to do is just make sure that the actors do what you
19:13
want and if they're talented, that and you know how to express
19:16
yourself, that's going to be real easy because your AD is
19:20
handling all the day-to-day and the paperwork and all the chaos.
19:23
Yeah, but you're you're not tyrannical.
19:25
I've been on set with you. So you just kind of put things
19:29
in motion and let them go. Some directors I would say, and
19:32
I was going to bring this up, as far as skeleton crews are
19:34
concerned, Stanley Kubrick was was reported to be pretty
19:39
tyrannical is how I would describe.
19:41
It I feel like that might be putting it lightly based on what
19:44
I've heard. I guess I've never worked with
19:45
him. No, he's, he was, I don't know
19:48
if he was, he was not dead before I was born, but he was
19:50
definitely dead before I got into film making.
19:53
And so he did usually work with a skeleton crew.
19:57
And what that allowed him was more time to make the films
20:02
because he would get those larger budgets and then he could
20:05
do a whole bunch of. Shooting and if you look at a
20:08
lot of his movies like you know, just The Shining for example, it
20:12
was large location that obviously they had to rent, but
20:17
you know, minimal actors for each scene and he also used
20:21
minimal crew. But he also did 127 takes of one
20:24
particular scene. Yeah.
20:25
Which actually, I guess I've I've heard contrary evidence to
20:30
that where it's not. It's not like the single,
20:33
sometimes actors confuse a shot versus a scene.
20:37
So he might have been doing because you can easily have a
20:39
scene that they have to repeat over and over again.
20:42
But you you know, you have it set up with like 8 different
20:45
shots, in which case like 10 takes per shot is not that much
20:48
and then 80s not a lot. No, but I guess the way I've
20:51
always heard it was that that was it was the one shot was 127
20:56
takes. Oh, OK.
20:57
And I'm, I want that to be true because I want to imagine
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Kubrick as this tyrannical, sees himself almost as a demigod kind
21:06
of person. Well, I guess like don't.
21:08
Ruin that for me. Yeah, right on.
21:10
Well, I guess famously that's that's what people's impression
21:13
of him is. But he did work on a skeleton
21:16
crew, and I bet that his view as far as the importance of a
21:20
director varies greatly to yours, but I'm assuming it's
21:24
because of the way that he directs is vastly different.
21:27
Maybe that's it. Maybe my experience with
21:29
directors is like, I don't know, the other people are running
21:31
around on set doing a whole lot and all I'm doing on set is
21:36
directing. I feel bad.
21:39
Oh, because I'm like, I'm not doing that.
21:41
Gaffers taking care of lights, the DP setting up a shot.
21:44
I'm, you know, giving my input and my thoughts on it.
21:47
I'm talking to the actors, but I love what they're doing with the
21:49
characters. So there's really I'm just.
21:53
Open, open to the different possibilities that might come
21:56
out rather than being very specific on exactly how you want
22:00
to have everything delivered. So there's and there's wiggle
22:04
room there. But yeah, so that was my example
22:07
of famous films, famous film makers, worked with skeleton
22:09
crew. And then actually my brother
22:12
Elliot informed me that PT Anderson was inspired by
22:17
Kubrick. And if you actually look at his
22:19
films from Phantom Thread onward, there is no
22:23
cinematographer because he is the cinematographer and you
22:27
can't even see a cinematographer credit if you go through the
22:30
IMDb pages. Oh, nice.
22:32
OK, So what films would that include then?
22:35
I don't know, I forgot to write them all down and I don't want
22:37
to misquote because God forbid I say the wrong thing and then
22:40
turn this into a vertical video on the Internet and people flip
22:43
out at me about not doing my research and call me mean names.
22:46
They will. Like a maroon.
22:49
Oh wait, is that how that's pronounced?
22:51
I don't know. So do you have any ideas or have
22:55
any examples of overstaffed films that you wanna share that
22:58
you thought were like needlessly overstaffed?
23:02
So here's my problem. Yeah, I was looking for films
23:09
that were horrifically overstaffed.
23:12
OK. Or maybe not horrific.
23:15
Well, I was searching for the word horrifically overstaffed.
23:17
Which, by the way, Google did not love me calling it that, so
23:21
maybe that helped change my opinion too.
23:22
But I found a couple of examples that I really thought was
23:27
interesting, but I don't think it's bad.
23:33
OK, go ahead. So first one, and I know this is
23:37
a little bit of A twist for us because it's animated, but 2010
23:42
Tangled from Disney. OK, I haven't seen that one.
23:46
You're missing out. It's a really good one.
23:48
Oh my gosh. For a once in my life, I've seen
23:50
a movie that somebody else has not.
23:51
There we go. This makes me very happy.
23:54
Anyway, it's really cute and apparently was in the works
23:59
since 1996 was when they started development on it and the story
24:04
went through all sorts of different iterations and they
24:06
were drawing out different animated options and things.
24:08
They had to build new computer models just to make her hair
24:12
work and actually act like hair, which I've also heard something
24:17
similar for Merida and Brave, which is another Disney film.
24:20
The curly hair, the curly redheaded Princess.
24:23
She they had to design new computer models to be able to
24:27
handle the physics of her hair, which is cool.
24:30
Weird, but cool. However, Tangled had 600
24:35
animators working on it for the final product that was actually
24:38
released at 600 animators And for perspective, because I
24:41
needed it because I thought that 600 felt like a lot, but I don't
24:46
actually animate, so I don't really know.
24:48
Toy Story was another film that I thought was a really big
24:52
impressive jump in animation because it was the first really
24:55
in depth CGI that we saw. That one had 27 animators.
24:59
Oh OK, so this is a lot. More A lot more 20.
25:03
Times more animators than Toy Story.
25:06
Exactly which I guess I need to. Watch this movie.
25:10
What is this? What is the story like?
25:11
Rapunzel. OK, Yeah, it's Rapunzel.
25:15
There's a lot more lore to it. You can go down some rabbit
25:17
holes. I will not because Disney fans
25:19
will take care of that for me, but yeah.
25:21
Of well, let's do it. I love it when people leave fun
25:23
comments. Well, there's like this theory
25:25
that Elsa and Anna are kind of actually related to like some of
25:29
the family members from Rapunzel and like that whole Kingdom and
25:35
that's how the parents got lost. And then but then that goes down
25:38
a rabbit hole of like Tarzan. And there is so much weird stuff
25:41
about Disney thing. I'm not going to go that much in
25:42
depth. 600 animators versus 27 animators.
25:48
So to me that felt like a very large number.
25:49
But the movie is really good. So was it actually overdone?
25:53
I I can't say that that feels horrifically overdone.
25:58
And I don't know what their workloads were.
26:00
So I would need to know somebody who worked on the project to
26:04
know if that was overstaffed or know the perfect amount.
26:08
Right on. And then the other examples that
26:10
I found were pre CGI extras, right?
26:14
So Ben Hur, Cleopatra, Spartacus, Gandhi, they had
26:18
literally thousands of extras for these films because they
26:22
needed big crowds. Yeah.
26:24
And CGI wasn't there. And I all.
26:28
I honestly think that's kind of a good thing, too.
26:30
That's paying more actors and getting more people experience
26:34
and getting more people on set. Yeah.
26:36
So I have a hard time feeling like that was really, really
26:40
bloated and awful. But at the same time, if we can
26:43
start bringing down some of those costs of production with
26:46
things like CGI, is that going to be better long term for the
26:50
film industry? Because as we know, Hollywood,
26:52
Atlanta, all the big major studios right now, we're not
26:55
doing so hot. And maybe it's because we spend
26:57
too much money on this stuff, but I don't know if that's where
26:59
the bloat in the budget is. Yeah, I actually don't know
27:02
either because I don't have the the luck or history of having
27:07
worked with a lot of budget so notoriously overstaffed.
27:11
I looked up online. Possibly the longest credit list
27:16
in film history is Iron Man 3. The.
27:19
Tracks the tracks so hard. So just I'll just say Iron Man
27:24
3, was that movie necessary? Did it need to exist in this
27:28
universe, in the Marvel Cinematic Universe?
27:31
I don't know. Honestly, probably not.
27:33
Like, I don't. That was not the strongest Iron
27:35
Man film in my opinion. It really wasn't.
27:37
I did not like what they did with The Mandarin.
27:39
That was the one with the Mandarin, right?
27:41
I don't even remember. I do not like MCU stuff really
27:44
at all. I kind of, I kind of despise it.
27:47
It's. Heartbreaking.
27:49
Well, it's kind of like when I remember the what was the the
27:54
book series about the kids that would kill each other?
27:58
Hunt Hunter. Hunter's Game.
28:01
Hunting, oh, Hunger Games. Hunger Games.
28:03
Yeah. Yeah, so when that those books
28:05
came out, I was, I don't know, like in in my 30s and I got
28:10
admonished by my coworkers for not reading them.
28:13
And I felt like I just pointed out that those are written for
28:18
5th and 6th graders. So why are you admonishing me
28:20
for not reading these Hunger Games books?
28:23
Plus, I don't think the target audience for Hunger Games is 5th
28:27
and 6th grade. I think it's young adult, which
28:29
is like high school, junior high to high school.
28:31
Well, maybe, but I'm just saying that like, you know, the reading
28:34
level was low and this was at a counselling facility.
28:36
So these were masters level, you know, masters graduates that
28:41
read things at a, you know, like 8th grade level.
28:44
And it sounds like you're shaming people for what they're
28:46
reading, and that's not a good. Thing No.
28:47
They started the shame. They started the.
28:49
Shame. They were putting it on.
28:50
They were putting it on you for not reading though.
28:52
Yeah, shaming someone for not reading is never good.
28:56
You shouldn't shame people for it, but at the same time like.
28:59
Did you read those? Books.
29:00
Tell them what books you were reading and what books you did
29:02
enjoy and that you prefer. No.
29:04
You always just bully the bully. That's how you get it to, that's
29:07
how you get it to stop. And on that note, I'm going to
29:11
have to get back into the comments on when people are
29:14
calling me different colours anyway.
29:16
So Iron Man 3 MCU. I think my initial point was
29:21
people that are upset about my lack of appreciation for the
29:25
Marvel Cinematic Universe. Guess what?
29:27
I feel like that's a Saturday morning cartoon.
29:30
So. Yeah, and what's wrong with
29:32
that? What's wrong with?
29:33
Things there's nothing wrong with.
29:34
Excited about your childhood? And what's wrong with just
29:37
desperately wanting a hero because Lord knows the world
29:40
doesn't actually have them, so how cool would it be to exist in
29:43
a place where like, there are real heroes?
29:45
Maybe it's a societal addiction that we need to address because
29:48
all the money then gets funded into more and more Marvel and
29:52
not quite DCI. Don't know what the hell they
29:53
screwed up, probably because the characters weren't as good but
29:56
they just. They just messed all those
29:57
Superman's out now but. I actually have a theory about
30:00
that. Yeah.
30:01
My theory is people tend to because obviously Superman is #1
30:07
comic book character ever. And then I think Batman's number
30:09
two. OK, So like technically CC owns
30:14
the properties, but my theory is that when watching a movie,
30:18
people want something that they can kind of like cling to.
30:22
And Marvel heroes more often than not tend to get their
30:25
powers as opposed to being born with them.
30:28
Which means that technically it could happen to you too.
30:31
It's like the people waiting for their Hogwarts letter or the
30:34
people that are, you know, you're waiting for your super
30:36
powers or your moment or your big change thing.
30:39
So I think that that's just they're a little more hopeful.
30:42
Right on. Well, I will point out that the
30:44
first Iron Man movie I didn't mind too much because I had a
30:47
story. It was a good, it was a solid
30:49
story. Subsequently, I've watched some
30:50
Marvel Cinematic Universe films and you don't have to give the
30:55
character any back story. It assumes that the audience
30:58
already knows it. The action scenes are not very
31:02
well thought out in my mind and it's just kind of like it feels
31:07
like a whole bunch of marketing people that come up with bullet
31:10
points for a film idea. They get everyone excited about
31:14
it, they put it into whatever Marvel Cinematic Universe film
31:20
creation box, and then it just shits out the next film.
31:23
And that's that's how I feel about it.
31:26
So. You know what?
31:28
Maybe I need to watch. No, those are solid points.
31:30
I. Watched the Thanos thing because
31:32
literally I was teaching 5th grade and none of my students
31:35
would shut up about Thanos and so I watched that and I was
31:39
completely uninspired like this. If the writing was terrible,
31:43
like everything followed exactly how you knew it was supposed to,
31:47
there were no surprises. All it was was just
31:50
visualizations of these heroes that were going through ebbs and
31:53
flows without any real. It's definitely more of a payoff
31:57
for the fans. It is.
32:00
It's there for the fans. And if you're a fan of that,
32:02
that's great. Yeah, enjoy your fandom, lean
32:05
in, have fun. Yeah, but but don't don't
32:07
confuse it for anything more than than popcorn and
32:13
entertainment. Like, I'm not going to shame
32:15
people that watch Keeping Up With the Kardashians if they
32:18
understand, like what it is. Yeah, as long as you own it,
32:21
like, you know that this is, though I do have issues with
32:25
reality TV as a whole and what it's done to the entertainment
32:28
industry. I actually think that that has
32:30
been a big player in causing some problems, especially around
32:34
budget, because reality TV was so much cheaper and they weren't
32:37
paying writers and they weren't. Yeah, that's a good point.
32:40
So yeah, that. Was kind of a downfall of
32:41
society. Thanks.
32:42
MTV should have stuck to music videos.
32:45
Could have kept everyone on that tour bus.
32:47
We didn't care. We should probably actually just
32:50
kind of like skip some of these questions since we're going to
32:53
be talking about these points when we have our guests that are
32:56
going to be coming on in the next 4 episodes, which which
32:59
will be a lot of fun because we brought some other people from
33:02
the Boise film community that wear too many hats.
33:04
They are known for wearing an exorbitant amount of hats and
33:08
they are very interesting people.
33:09
I'm so excited for you to get to hear from a lot of.
33:11
Them and we'll have to share some of our own anecdotes at
33:13
that point of us wearing too many hats because we kind of
33:16
like subverted that a little bit in this conversation.
33:18
But I I had a good chat with you well.
33:20
Thank you, I had a good chat too.
33:22
Hopefully we didn't anger too many Disney or Marvel fans which
33:24
is now the same thing which I love.
33:26
It feels like a problem. Yeah, just just call me a maroon
33:28
if you need to. Actually, I do have a quick dive
33:30
update. Yes, we're officially passed a
33:32
lot of the monthly film festivals where it's done
33:34
really, really well, which is surprising.
33:37
Cool, but great. I'm happy about it but it is
33:41
going to be playing at the She Her Fest in Seattle which is
33:46
delightful. I don't know if it's an award
33:48
winner yet but they only selected 6 films.
33:49
It's their inaugural year on the festival.
33:52
Pretty stoked on it and also got accepted to the Portland Under
33:55
the Stars festival in August which is the sister of like the
33:58
LA Under the Stars, Austin Under the Stars.
34:00
It's their first year doing it in Portland and I'm really
34:02
excited that I got it to that one too.
34:04
So that'll be. Fun.
34:05
Well, congratulations. And for those that aren't aware,
34:07
Dive is the short film that you wrote and directed and produced
34:12
all on your own in February, March.
34:16
Yeah, something like that, yeah. So you're doing the festival
34:19
circuit, you're trying to do the traditional, like go to small
34:22
festivals and get notoriety and then turn it into a feature film
34:25
slowly so. Let's stay tuned.
34:27
Yeah, we're all following along with that and and following
34:29
along on the adventure and hopefully we get to see a
34:32
success story, but that'd. Be fun if it's.
34:34
If it's a failure like, we're used to it at this juncture
34:37
anyway, so whatever. Not worried about having another
34:39
failure under my. Not going to stop us, no.
34:44
On that note, should we end with this?
34:45
To sing to farewell. I think that sounds great.
34:47
Excellent. Bye.
34:48
Bye.