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Transcript

Mountain Park · The Knife: A True Crime Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: This story contains adult content and language. Listener discretion is advised.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: He puts his hand on my shoulder and he's like,
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: you're going to go with these girls for a few hours,
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: and then the girls kind of starts to closing.
• 0:14
  Speaker 3: I'm like, get away from me, pushing back, and then.
• 0:17
  Speaker 4: He's like, well, we can either do this willingly or forcefully.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Knife. I'm Hannah Smith.
• 0:38
  Speaker 5: I'm patia Eton, and this week we speak with Meg Richter.
• 0:41
  Speaker 5: Meg was sent to a boarding school for troubled teens
• 0:44
  Speaker 5: located in the Missouri Ozarks. She now refers to the school,
• 0:48
  Speaker 5: Mountain Park Baptist Boarding Academy, as a military Christian cult.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Meg has begun to speak out about her experience and
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: has connected with other former students of Mountain Park. As
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: a note, this interview focuses on Meg's personal experiences at
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Mountain Park, but at the end of the interview we
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: do discuss a homicide that happened at the school the
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: year before Meg arrived.
• 1:11
  Speaker 5: Let's get into the interview.
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: So let's start kind of back before Mountain Park. I'd
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: love to get an idea of who you were as
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: a young person and what was your life like growing up.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Well, I grew up in South Florida, and I would
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: say that I had a very good upbringing as far
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: as you know, like financial resources or good schools and
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: things like that. I think though, where unfortunately I was
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: lacking was a lot of forensal supervision or just kind
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: of guidance and good role models in my life.
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: My mom ran the rape center for Broward County.
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: My dad remarried young, so he had a new wife,
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: you know, new kids, so my time with them was
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: kind of more going out to eat with my dad
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: or just random you know, visits it as house. But
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: I already felt like kind of left behind. So with
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: my dad kind of with his new life, my mom
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: helping other victims, which was amazing, but I always felt
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: like my mom was kind of saving the world while
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: leaving me behind. I would go out with my mom
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: late night if she was out drinking or other kids
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: are at school being able to focus on schoolwork. I
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: was like, well, man, I was out till two am
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: last night at the bar, you know, with all of
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: these adults, and I got started, you know, drinking young.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: My mom used to say mixed drinks don't count, so
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: you know, momosa is not a drink. Or you know,
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: these little baby beer cans they used to have back
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: in the day, they were just like these little tiny beers,
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: So like that didn't count.
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: But in reality, when.
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: You're you know, twelve years old and you're drinking, it
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: just makes it hard to be able to really be
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: who you're supposed to be at a young kid. By
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: the time high school rolled around, I didn't really feel
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: much of a need to go anymore. So I dropped
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: out of high school. I'm doing drugs, I'm drinking. I
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: have really no parental supervision whatsoever. In my life, I
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: did develop an eating disorder. I was Interrexican blimex. So
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: now I'm you know, doing drugs, I'm damaging my body,
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: and I'm dropped out of school. So my life is
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: pretty much just out of control and I'm a little angry.
• 3:20
  Speaker 3: I feel like as much as my.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: Friends, you know, would joke and be like, oh man,
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: you could really do anything and not get in trouble.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: So as much as it's like, oh, it's cool that
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: my house is a house to hang at, I would
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: feel sad at the end of the day when my
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: friends would have a good house to go home to
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: you know, someone would have parents be there or a
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: home cooked meal, so that you do tend to then
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: when you're alone, self sabotage and spiral.
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: Out of control.
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: And I just felt like my life really was kind
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: of a free for all. I got a little angry
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: that my mom at one point had gone on vacation,
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: so I basically took some of her checks and I
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: wrote them out to somebody I knew it was an adult,
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: and we started cashing them.
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  Speaker 3: We went wild. It is the summer before my sophomore
• 4:06
  Speaker 3: year in high school.
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  Speaker 2: I have nobody home, I have unlimited, you know, finances.
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: We're just cashing checks left and right. So we are
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: buying clothes. We had got someone to rent as a car,
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: so we're just really just having you know, a lot
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: of fun.
• 4:21
  Speaker 3: And enjoying life. But by now the bank has gone involved.
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: They've reached out to my mom.
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: So she comes back from her trip and she's just
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: furious all of a sudden. Now she wants to lay
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: down the law and she's like, I can't believe you've
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: been stealing money and you're just acting so wild, and
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: it's like, well, this isn't new, you know, like I've
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: been living this way for now almost two years, but
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: now that it's kind of coming down and everything is crashing,
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: it's like, oh my gosh, like we have to do
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: something about this.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: The incident with the fraudulent checks seemed to tip the
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: scale for Meg's mother. All of a sudden, there were
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: rules and she expected Meg to obey them, and like
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: most teenagers, Meg pushed back. In nineteen ninety seven, when
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: Meg was fifteen, she ran away from home. This prompted
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: her parents, who were divorced, to join forces and come
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: up with a plan. Meg's dad called her and told
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: her they were going on a trip to visit her
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: grandmother in Missouri. Meg adored her grandmother and so she
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: was relieved and excited, but once they arrived in Missouri,
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: something felt off.
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: Basically, we're driving up kind of a dirt road and
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of RVs and cabins around.
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  Speaker 3: So I asked my dad.
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  Speaker 2: I was like, well, I thought they lived somewhere else,
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: and he's like, oh, no, they moved not too long ago.
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: Were in the middle of nowhere, Missouri.
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: So I walk in just completely expecting to see my grandma,
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: and instead I am greeted by a group of girls,
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  Speaker 2: and they're very large girls. It's not like they look
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: like teenagers my age. They look like very you know,
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: like oh, are you eighteen to twenty. There's about, you know,
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: six to eight of them, and they're kind of standing
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: blocking the whole entrance, so it's like, oh, okay. My
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: first reaction, honestly, is that it's somebody from home and
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: something is happening, you know, like I'm kind of being
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: set up. I didn't hang around with some of the
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: best people, so I think, like I'm about to be jumped.
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: So I go to turn and I'm just like dad,
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: and somebody pulls him in another room.
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: So I'm worried for him, you know, and I instantly
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: go to turn the door to run the doorknob.
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: Though it's just turning, the door will not open. It
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: is locked.
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: Meg described a moment of pure panic. At first, she
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: believed that both she and her father were in danger,
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: and then a man approached her. He was in his
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: mid thirties with a calm demeanor that unnerved her. He
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: was clearly the person in charge. She would later find
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: out that his name was Sam Gerhardt, but he liked
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: to be called brother Gar heart.
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: And he puts his hand on my shoulder and he's like,
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: you're gonna go with these girls for a few hours.
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: And of course I'm like, no, who the fuck are you?
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: Where's my dad? What's happening?
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: And he's like kind of squeezing a little bit on
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: my shoulder, like patronizing middle aged man, you know, calm down,
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: it's okay, And I'm just like, first of all, why
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: are you so calm?
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: I'm freaking out.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: And then the girls kind of start to close in
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: a little bit more so I'm like, get away from me,
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: pushing back, and then he's like, well, we can either
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: do this willingly or forcefully, so as they go to
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: kind of grab me, I of course instantly start fighting.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: I am afraid.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: I'm also though, been through a lot, so I'm pretty tough.
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  Speaker 2: I feel like, okay, I'm I'm not going down without
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: a fight here, but I do they get me down
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  Speaker 2: to the floor so fast. I went from a brave
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: human beings instantly realizing that I absolutely like am nothing
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: compared to their strength.
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: When you just scratch this scene, honestly, it feels like
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: a scene in a horror movie a little bit. I
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: think you describe sort of your kind of freaking out
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: anxious energy really well, but like, what were you feeling
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: in that moment?
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: Really terrified? I mean when you talk about a.
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: Horror movie or just like being scared, or if you've
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: ever had this uneasy feeling. It was so much betrayal
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  Speaker 2: in one moment that sometimes it's hard to even grasp
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  Speaker 2: all of the emotions because in that moment, I go
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  Speaker 2: from being excited to see my grandma, which you're.
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  Speaker 3: Like, oh, you know, I'm already mentally struggling.
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  Speaker 2: I was on drugs, I have an eating disorder. My
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: life was spiraling out of control as a kid or
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: at any age. Honestly, I think some person that takes
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  Speaker 2: you when you're at your lowest and embraces you just
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  Speaker 2: with a hug or it's okay, it does so much.
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  Speaker 3: For a human being.
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  Speaker 2: And I needed that so bad and think that I'm
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: about to be warmly embraced by somebody that genuinely makes
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: me feel whole. And then to go from thinking something's
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: happening to my dad like that fast, like oh my god,
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: some person, a stranger's harming my dad. Granted, and we
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: weren't that close and our relationship wasn't that great. But
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: at the end of the day, it's still my dad.
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  Speaker 2: You know, I don't want him being harmed. I'm afraid
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  Speaker 2: now what's happening to him? And then within another split
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  Speaker 2: second to realize, not only is my dad allowing these
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: people to come torture me, he set this up.
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: So you put that together in that moment that he
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: had set this up, or did they say something to you,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: like explain why you were there?
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: Brother Gerhart?
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: He had mentioned, you know, we're going to talk to
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: your dad for a few hours while you go down
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  Speaker 2: with these girls, and they're just going to kind of
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: go over the rules and just kind of let you
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: know about this place while.
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: We show your dad around.
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  Speaker 2: And I'm just like taking that in, you know, like,
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: what are you talking about talking to my dad? Like, Dad,
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: let's go. He's just sitting down. He's not hey, are
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: you okay, He's not trying to get to me. He
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: is making no effort to see if I'm okay. He's
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: just okay, allowing this person to talk to me. So
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: where it didn't really quite all of the betrayal, you know,
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: come into play that I grasped.
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: It was the aspect of like, hey.
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: Why aren't you saving me? Why are you coming out
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: of that room? What is happening right now? Why are
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: you just standing there watching this. It's a really difficult
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: thing because you're like, wow, I thought this person loved me.
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: They're betraying me. These strangers are attacking me.
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: It's a lot of emotions to even feel and to
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: kind of grasp and realize at the same time.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can't even imagine. I think you actually described
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: it so well, the sort of split second way that
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: your brain was realizing, Oh no, yeah, this is not
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: random strangers attacking me and my dad. My dad knows
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: what's going on. I don't know what's going on, but
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: my dad clearly does. And now you're thinking he's in
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: on it, and that's such betrayal. Yeah, And as you
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: had described, you were already in a really like vulnerable position,
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: really needing love and support. Where were you basically what
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: did you learn about where you were and what was
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: going on?
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: So even then it was kind of a lot to grasp,
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: you know, I stand back up, and they basically kind
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: of guide me, you know, like holding me, every person
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: on each side through this basement and down a long hallway,
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: and then we go into this room where there's a
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: whole row of sinks, so there's just eight sinks in
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: a row, and then a room full of about thirty
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: five bunk beds. You know.
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: They're kind of guiding me basically back.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: There, holding me, and they're like, you're going to sit
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: in this chair and we're all going to sit around you.
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: And I was like, okay, well how long? And so
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: my dad comes like what's happening? When am I going
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: to leave? And that's when they start kind of just
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: breaking it down, as in, you're not leaving. This is
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: going to be where you're staying now. This is a
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: boarding school for teens. I grew up Catholics. So as
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: they start to kind of talk about their fundamental Baptists
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: beliefs and the rules of the school, I really am
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: just like, no, that won't be me. I'm sorry, like
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to be saying or that sounds horrible,
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: like I go out, I don't listen to Christian music.
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: I don't know what you guys were talking about.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: At this point, Mech said, the adults were nowhere to
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: be seen. She was surrounded by female students, some of
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: them told her they were orientation guides, which gave them
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: more status and power than the other girls. According to Meg,
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: she learned the rules of this boarding school not from
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: her parents, not from the adults who ran the school,
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: but from these other students.
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: First of all, they all look like they are dressed
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: completely alike. You know, they have on high shirts or
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: T shirts, and they're wearing kind of long shorts, and
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: they let me know their kulots and then they either
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: wear you know, coolots or skirts all the time. They
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: love Jesus, They're there to worship him all the time.
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: I'm like, what do you guys do for fun? And
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: they're like, well, we have Bible study or we memorize
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: the Bible. Sometimes they'll let us out in the yard
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: to play basketball. And then they like show me this
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: yard kind of out by a window and it's just
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: this huge chain link fifty foot tall fence and a
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: basketball court on concrete.
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: And I was like, so prison. I was like, is
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: that what this is? Is this the jail?
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: And I was like, you guys, it sounds like you
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: can't leave. And they're like, well, we go to bed
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: at nine. I was like, who goes to bed at nine? O'clock, like, Oh,
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: don't worry, you'll be exhausted because they work us all
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: day long. So you get up at five am and
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: I'm just like, oh my god. And at one point
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: I asked, you's the bathroom and I'm thinking, like, okay,
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: I'll just go to the bathroom.
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: They all stand up and follow me, and.
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: Even that it is basically a room of just stalls
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: with no doors, so it's just all these toilets lined
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: up with like little dividers in between, and then everyone
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: can see you. So I go obviously now to the
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: end of the row by myself, and they follow.
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: Me and they're like, oh, we have to watch you.
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: And they didn't even have like curtains on the shower
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: that you can see next door, so you can.
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: In my head, I'm just like, God, I hope my
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: dad comes like back.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: I hope like this was it, you know, like this
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: was the whole part of it, Like is this a
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: whole scene that like it's going to end, hopefully soon,
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: But instead I was down there for over five hours.
• 14:24
  Speaker 5: You mentioned that these were all students that you were with,
• 14:28
  Speaker 5: but that some of those students were also orientation guides.
• 14:31
  Speaker 5: What does that mean.
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: An orientation guide. Basically, they are someone that is supposedly,
• 14:36
  Speaker 3: you know, there to show you the ropes, but let's
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: be clear, they're there to keep you in line.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: If you were not doing your job as an orientation guy,
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: you then would get in trouble.
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: So it was a double edged sword.
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: Is a position because you're excited that you have a
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: higher position, so you're maybe traded slightly better, but now
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: you're also enforced to be torturing this other human being,
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: which is really horrible and awful. And then if you
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: don't do it correctly, you're still punished. But as far
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: as the orientation guy, they're there to tell you everything.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: This is what we do, this is what you wear,
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: this is what you say.
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: If you don't do this.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: Correctly, there's a punishment if you do do something wrong.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: They are the ones that then hold you to the
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: standard or make sure.
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: Somebody else does, which is difficult.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: Because again, you know, my orientation guy, she was very sweet,
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: but at the end of the day, she still then
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: is making me do certain things that you're just like, oh,
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: you know, there are some people that got orientation GUIDs
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: who are absolutely just horrific. There were people, you know,
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: I think if any of us have ever seen, I
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: think it's like the Stanford Project or people that get
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: a higher position of power. There are people that feel
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: bad about it, and then there are people that seem
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: like they genuinely loved torturing their new students.
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: Meg was at a place called Mountain Park Baptist Boarding Academy.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: It was established in nineteen eighty seven by Bob Wills
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: and his wife, Betty Wills. Bob and Betty Wills had
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: operated a different teen reform program that had been shut
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: down by the state of Mississippi. It was called Bethesda
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: Home for Girls and was founded by fundamentalist Baptist preacher
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: Lester Rolloff in nineteen seventy two. It was managed by
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: Bob and Betty Wills. In the nineteen seventies and eighties,
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: Bethesda became known in the area as the go to
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: place to send pregnant, unwed teenage girls. The Wills promised
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: to place their babies for adoption into Christian homes and
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: the whole thing was hush hush. The facility itself was
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: in rural Mississippi, only accessible by a dirt road. There
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: was a federal lawsuit and state investigation into Bethesda after
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: allegations of abuse arose. Former residents claim they were physically
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: abused and drugged at Bethesda, and that their babies were
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: forcefully taken from them after birth. In nineteen eighty seven,
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: state courts ruled that Bethesda operated as an illegal to center.
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: They took custody of the remaining students there and shut
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: the facility down. That very same year, Bob and Betty
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: Wills moved from Mississippi to Missouri and opened Mountain Park
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: Baptist Boarding Academy. This time, their daughter Barbara and their
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: son in law, Sam Gerhart or brother Gerhart as Meg
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: refers to him, joined them to run Mountain Park operations.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: And a lot of the part of where I say
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: the military part comes in would be from their son
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: in law, Sam Gerhart, because he spent years in the
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: military and he left the military and drove directly to
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: Mountain Park. He then started working there with his daughter
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: and their two kids and implementing his military aspect in
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: with the Christian thing. So everything that he has just
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: spent learning in the military, he decided to implement as
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: far as you know, waking up, going to bed, how
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: you eat, yes.
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: Sir, no, sir, no ma'am dropped down and give us,
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: you know, fifth pushups.
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: How was this legal for your parents to hand you over?
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: What documents did you later learn that they had to sign?
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: Not too long ago, was able to find the actual
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: contract that my parents signed. Basically this like eighty eight
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: page document saying we will turn over our child. They
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: sign over a power of attorney to these people, and
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: they sign this like eighty page you know something documented
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: a minimum we will keep her here a year. You
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: have all rights to her. We are giving up everything
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: of our daughter to you. And then they pay like
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: on this influctuating scale based on you know, your parents' income,
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: the tuition, and that basically I allow, by any means
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: necessary you to do whatever you need to get my
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: child to comply to obey by your rules.
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: All things basically go.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: So you had to be there for a minimum of
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: a year. And at what point did they tell you, you know,
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: you're going to be here for at least year.
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: When my dad was kind of leading, it's just kind
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: of like, oh, this is your new home and this
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: is where you're going to be and everything, and it's
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: really kind of other students that then are like oh,
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: you'll be here a year, but most parents make you
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: stay to graduation.
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: And that's when you're just like, oh, are you sure?
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: But then everyone that's been there has been there a
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: long time, so then you think like, oh, in the
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: contract it says you would forfeitnee money for the year,
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: so irregardless, you can come get your child after a month,
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: but you will be paying the whole year. So I
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: think that's where a lot of the kids other two
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: are just like, well, no one's going to come get
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: you because your parents already paid, and you're just like,
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: oh my god.
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: When my dad was saying.
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: Goodbye, it was part of my argument that I was like, well,
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: I don't even understand, Like my mom doesn't even know
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: how is this happening, Like she would never allow this.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: And that's where my dad was like, oh, well she
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: did sign off. She does know everything's okay. And it
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: took me a long time to really believe that aspect,
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: because again, I grew up with my mom, who's this
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: very independent woman, you know, Women's Hall of Fame. She
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: runs a sexual assault treatment center. You know, she is
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: like fault for like women's rights. So to be at
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: a place that is so anti female. I did not
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: believe that she really knew at all.
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: It was like, there's just no way this can't be happening.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: But when like month after month or year goes by,
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: you're like, okay, so you're just genuinely okay with what's
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: happening to me.
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: I think for people who weren't there, it's hard to
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: picture the specifics. So can you kind of just walk
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: us through, like what a typical day would look like?
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: Just what did you do?
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: We went to school actually year round, so if it
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: was summertime school, we always went to school. So we
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: would get up at six am. We were woken up
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: by a safety patrol person. Lights up, Go, go, go,
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: and then you have literally two few minutes from the
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: time lights go on to hit the floor. The first
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: thing you had to start off your day was, you know,
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: brush your teeth, go to the bathroom, and then you
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: had to go make your bed, which obviously had to
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: be you know, hospital corner, very crisp. You were allowed
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: one animal, your pillows had to be covered up, so
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: it's just every single thing that you did there was
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: some rule aspect to it. You had thirty minutes then
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: from the time we woke up and did everything to
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: be a Bible devotion, and then you had to line
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: up for count and breakfast for the day. You always
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: had to be reading your Bible, memorizing your Bible memory
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: while you were in line. When you would sing a song,
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: they would say a Bible verse, so say they said
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: John three sixteen, you had to know it. So they
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: would have staff members walking around while you're in line
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: making sure when they yelled the Bible verse that you
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: knew it. And if you didn't know it, you would
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: get in trouble. If you weren't singing along, you would
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: get in trouble. And then they would ask someone basically
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: to pray. And then after that we would stand and
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: wait in line, which even that the first day, I
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: was like, why are all the guys going while we
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: stand here and wait.
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: There were guys we weren't allowed to interact with them, but.
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: All of the men went first to eat first, then
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: all the guys students, and we would be sometimes waiting
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: in line for like an hour and a half just
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: standing there, being forced to read our Bibles while we
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: wait for all the men to get their food, and
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: then we finally got to eat. You had to eat
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: everything that they gave you, basically after we ate, even
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: that they had a tray checker, someone that would make
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: sure you ate all of your food, that you finish everything,
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: and that you're not keeping any civilware. So some would
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: make sure where the forks and the knives get put.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: And these are just things you don't even realize, like
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: are something that needs to be checked until someone is literally, hey,
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: you left this on your plate or where's your fork?
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: And then after that we would go back to the
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: dorm and each person had a different job responsibility. You
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: would have a job that had to do with the
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: kitchen aspect, so maybe somebody that did the dishes or
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: somebody that checked the food or whatever.
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: And then afterwards you had a dorm job.
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: And we did our dorm jobs after every meal, so
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: after breakfast, lunch to dinner, even if nobody used your job,
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: you still had to clean it. So if you had showers,
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: you cleaned the showers three times a day. If you
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: had toilets, you screw up the toilets three times a day.
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: So every one of us had a job position that
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: we had to do.
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: When we would get dressed for the day, we are
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: wearing pantyhose. You have to wear pantyhose every day. You
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: had to wear a long skirt two inches above the ankle.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: Proper shirts they couldn't be more than two inches below
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: your collar bone. So you imagine, like in Missouri, wearing
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: all of this stuff. And then your job is outside crew,
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: which is basically your now having a sweep and be
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: outside and do all this stuff, you know, Missouri summer heat,
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: wearing pantyhose to where dress shoeses you know, like meybe
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: like a loafer or something high heels, depending on the event.
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: And then we had a certain amount of time. By
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: the time you finish your.
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: Chores, you had a quick moment to brush your teeth
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: again and to get ready and to get to school.
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: To start out the school day again, we pray some more. Again.
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: Everyone stands up in front of this huge, you know, auditorium,
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: and we pray. We do the pledge allegiance to the
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: American flag, and then we do a pledge allegiance to
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: the Christian flag, and then someone would give a little
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: mini devotion again and then we would pray, and then
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: you'd begin your school day.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: According to Meg, there was very little downtime the entire day.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: Everything was scheduled, and her orientation guide was with her
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: watching her all day every day. She said, if a
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: student had to use the restroom outside of their scheduled
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: break time, they would receive a demerit.
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: If you got three demerits in a school day, you
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: would have to write what we're called lines, which was
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: basically they would either give you some form of Bible
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: verse or some type of quote, which a lot of
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: the times it was you know like while a student
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: at Mountain Park Baptist Boarding Academy, I will behave myself
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: in a studious manner, So you would have to write this, say,
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: three hundred and fifty times, and her hand would be cramping,
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: and there is no downtime, so you're having to find,
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: like in the shower, any moment you can to.
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: Really get this done.
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: And if you didn't get it done on time, they
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: would double it or triple it, or then they would
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: be like, well, now we're just gonna take away you know,
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: like sweets or sugar, which then that means like if
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: you have no sugar, you can't even have jelly on
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: your peanut butter and jelly sandwich just because you couldn't
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: complete your lines because you had to go to the
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: bathroom because you were on your period.
• 25:48
  Speaker 5: You know.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: I mean, like this is the vicious cycle that they
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: would just basically put you in to almost like keep
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: you down all the time, or that you feel like
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: you just can't succeed or you're making mistakes. We had
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: to raise for to get help. So if you forgot
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: your flag up, you can get into merit. If you
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: wanted a drink, you got into Merit. If you didn't
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: push your chair in, you got into Merit. So it
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: was just kind of really a very stressful thing while
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: you're trying to do school work. We would finish that
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: out and then you had more chores to do again,
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: and then we would have like an hour downtime, but
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: in that time you had to basically get your shower
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: taken and do everything before dinner. And then we would
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: have dinner and do the account again basically everything, and
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: then we would have a Bible study, which again then
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: there would be like a male staff member always hosted
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: Bible study, and we would go do that for about
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: an hour and a half two hours, and then after
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: that you had basically just enough time to get ready
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: for bed.
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: Wow, when you had a phone call, like with your
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: mom or your dad, did you tell them what was
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: going on? Did you ask to leave? How did that go?
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: First of all, you don't get your first phone call,
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: so you've been there between three and four weeks. And
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: then for myself, if your parents are divorced, you get
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: seven minutes with each parent, and that's once for every
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: two weeks. The phone calls are monitored. There's somebody sitting
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: there next to you, a phone monitor, who is not
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: only listening to what you're saying, but they are timing you.
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: In the contract actually that our parents signed, it gives
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: them a whole script sheet of if your daughter or
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: son says.
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: This, you hang up. If they say this, you hang up.
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: If they do this, hang up.
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: And it's already been instructed to me again by my
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: orientation guide and by other people. If you whine, you cry,
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: they've been told to hang up. So with several people
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: besides my orientation guide and the other person sitting right
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: next to me monitoring to me, I was terrified to
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: say anything. You want to say things, and you're trying
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: to almost like talking code or like in between the
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: lines of things that maybe they'll just pick up on.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: But you're so afraid to just right be like, oh
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: my God, please come get me, because you just know
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: they'll hang up. They have created this environment of just
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: total fear. I felt like I was in fight or
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: flight mode all the time, even at just.
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: The beginning, because it's like my dad just left me.
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: Will anybody believe me? Or can I say anything?
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: And they're really good about reminding you, all the staff,
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: all the students, all the time that there's nothing you
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: can say that's going to convince your parents.
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: To come get you. There's nothing you can do to
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: get kicked out of here.
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: This is just reinforced, Like I have heard this, you know,
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: a thousand times in the first few weeks I've been there.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: Meg told us that every once in a while, all
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: of the female students would be gathered up. She estimated
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: this to be between three hundred and three hundred and
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: fifty girls. The purpose of these gatherings, from her perspective,
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: was public humiliation. Students would be called out by name
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: and the staff would admonish them in front of all
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: the other students, and then the staff would encourage the
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: other students to join in. Meg said it became a
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: dreaded event, causing extreme anxiety for her. She remembers once
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: she was called out for something that she had mentioned
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: to her dad during a phone call.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: And all of a sudden, this one staff member is
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: just like, oh, what about Megan Richter? What was she
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: doing earlier? And then before you know it, this other
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: staff member stands up and she's like, I heard you
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: were telling your dad about your stomach and complaining I
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: didn't hear anything about this, like you didn't come to
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: medicine call.
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: And then I'm just like, oh my god.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh, I just mentioned to him sometimes
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: I get cramping and then I'm getting in trouble, and
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: I was like, how do you even know about this?
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: You know? And my dad had called her and was like, oh,
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: how come she's talking about her stomach?
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: And then when the staff members like, oh I heard
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: her on the phone talking about her stomach, and it
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: was just like, oh my god.
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: You know that fast where your parent.
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: May think they're doing something good, it just made everything worse.
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: Other students than feel like they get praised if they
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: say something negative about you, if you weren't making your
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: Bible memory, if.
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: You weren't doing school whatever this reason.
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: They would just all of a sudden be like, hey
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: you so and so stand up, and then it'd be
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: like does anybody have anything to say? Which can you
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: imagine in high school, taking the whole high school and
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: being like who all wants to say something about Hannah?
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: Just letting people say whatever they want about you, and
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: it just being like, well that's not true.
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: You shut up. You don't get to say anything.
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: And even if it's not true, you can just go
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: from being somebody that's actually doing good.
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: So like back on orientation, that's how fast it just worked.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: It really didn't matter your level or things you had
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: possibly accomplished. If somebody had a goal to take you down,
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: or if they felt that you weren't living them to
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: their standard, in a moment, you would just be back
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: at the bottom.
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: And that's what just made it so fearful all the time.
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that's horrible. The public humiliation, the power
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: of a group coming against you and saying like you
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: did something wrong is so scary at any time in
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: our lives, but certainly when you're a teenager, what did
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: that feel like? If you remember times when that was
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: directed at you, you know, what was that feeling when
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: that would happen.
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: You couldn't ever relax, you know, you just really didn't
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: know what was going to happen. I practically had to
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: like sit on my hands because I would be sweating
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: so bad. And you don't want then someone to think like, oh,
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: are you nervous because you did something? And you're like,
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: I'm nervous because I didn't do anything, Like I have
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: no idea, Like there is no truth here. There's no
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: one that's going to be like, oh no, it's okay,
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: even if it's just silly things, you know, like oh,
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: she likes to laugh too much, and it's like, how
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: is this something I'm being punished for? And it's like, well,
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: why do you think everything's such a joke? And it's like,
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: oh my god, I'm in hell. I'm just trying to
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: make things, you know, like manageable. Yeah, it's a lot
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: of pressure, especially even then when you're an orientation guy,
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: because you're worrying about somebody else's actions also getting you
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: in trouble. So it's just like, oh my god, I
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: have to please so many people all the time, and
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: I just don't even know who I'm supposed to be
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: sometimes at what moment To just get through this moment,
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: you had to basically become different people all the time,
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: for the different staff members, for the male staff members, for.
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: Just whatever it was.
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: You just had to basically be a chameleon, which is
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: really hard.
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: When you're trying to stay true to yourself.
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: Meg described an environment in which something as simple as
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: a nervous laugh might land her in trouble. She remembers
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: that disciplinary measures, both physical and psychological, to be cruel
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: and sadistic. She witnessed a girl being held down on
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: an ant hill, the bites from the ants leaving permanent scars.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: She also saw on more than one occasion, staff using
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: brillo pads on students as punishment, rubbing their skin raw.
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: And not all of this was done by the staff.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: She said, students were forced to abuse and harm each
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: other otherwise they themselves would be punished.
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: They would make us run for miles. People would be vomiting.
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: You know, you're out sometimes in the sun, you're doing
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: lunges back and forth for hours. If you got sick,
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: they would force you to eat your vomit. One of
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: the head people were people They would take their fingers
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: and just pound it into your chest, but other girls
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: would hold you back while they were doing it. One time,
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: one of my new students, they were putting it on
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: her ice bath, but then because she was my new student,
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: I had to hold her in the bath.
• 33:33
  Speaker 3: So like I'm being forced in an ice bath.
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: And this isn't like you know how now people, I
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: feel like like to sit in an ice bath and recool.
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: This is you know, you're in there for a long time,
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: returning purple. I feel like my body was shutting down.
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: If you didn't comply in some way. They would physically
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: force you to do whatever was necessary, by any means, really,
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: whatever they could to just get you to comply to
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: the rules. At the time, you didn't know how. But
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: it was found out they were drugging us with thorazine
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: and it was found in people's blood, and you're just
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: constantly reminded that no one is coming to get you.
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: In a lawsuit brought against Mountain Park in two thousand
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: and five, several former students claim that they were drugged
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: without their knowledge or consent while at Mountain Park. They
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: described being given pills by staff and forced to swallow them.
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: They also described feeling like zombies, gaining weight, not having
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: their menstrual cycles for a long period of time sometimes
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: six to eight months, noticing orange and purple colored urine,
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: and many more symptoms, all of which they also claimed
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: cleared up within two weeks to a month of leaving
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: Mountain Park. It's important to note that their parents, in
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: this same lawsuit, said they were told by sam Gerhart
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: that Mountain Park was a drug free facility. They were
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: also told that their children would be treated humanly and
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: that they would be notified of any changes in their
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: children's health, but said that they were not. One student
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: in this lawsuit needed hearing aids. She claimed she was
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: not believed by staff for months and was punished when
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: she could not hear directions.
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: You know, you just feel so degraded as a human
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: being sometimes that even if it wasn't all physical all
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: the time, the mental part sometimes almost felt worse. If
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: you've ever had just constant degradation bring down of you
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: as a human being, you just feel like you just
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: can't even go on sometimes mentally you just feel so
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: broken that you're just literally going through the motions of
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: being there.
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: It sounds truly horrific, and also it sounds like it
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: doesn't foster connection between the students at all because you're
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: pitted against each other. Yes, did you feel like you
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: were able to make friends?
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: You know, I would tell people.
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: I feel like I communicated a lot with my eyes,
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: you know, with certain people, and I really would try
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: as much as I could to help someone, know, like
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: I equally don't want to be here, you know, or
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: there are certain people that you feel like this connection
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: with and you're just kind of like, Okay, we're getting
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: through this together. But you're also just so afraid at
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: any point to show that or your true colors, or
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: to worry, hey, will they tell something you know on me?
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: Or is this a trait?
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: You know, you just feel like skeptical all the times,
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: as much as you're trying to form a type of relationship,
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: if it's real or not.
• 36:37
  Speaker 5: What was the response if someone one of the students
• 36:40
  Speaker 5: needed medical attention? You know, you mentioned that you were
• 36:44
  Speaker 5: having these stomach pains. How was that treated by Mountain Park.
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: Well, I started experiencing a lot of hives, and I
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: was just in constant stomach pain and I was sick
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: to my stomach. So I went through one month of
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: being sick for a few days and then kind of
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: it went away.
• 37:03
  Speaker 3: The second month came and I was pretty sick.
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: They did take me to the doctor, but then they
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: couldn't find anything wrong.
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: So then I kind of went through this for several.
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Months of just I'm not feeling good, I'm in constant pain, vomiting,
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: but it would only last about four to five days
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: throughout the month. Sometimes it would take me to the doctor,
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: I would be feeling fine, because it's not like you know,
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: a normal child where you're like, oh, sick, just go
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: right away. It's like, Okay, we'll let somebody know, we'll
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: see how bad it is if you need to go.
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: So sometimes by the time i'd finally get to go
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: to the doctor, I didn't even feel that bad. So
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: this one on for about a year that I would
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: occasionally finally get to go to the doctor and then
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: just go back to school. And they had opened a
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: sister school called Palm Lane, which was in Florida, which
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: is only a few hours away from where I lived.
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: So occasionally even my mom or my dad would come
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: over bring me back to South Florida for some testing,
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: and then.
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: Go back, which was just horrible in and of itself
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: because of anyone.
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: Most people, you go to the doctor and have an
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: unpleasant procedure, you want to go home, you want to relax,
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: like you want to take a bath. But for me,
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: it was like, oh, you did a colonoscopy this morning, Okay,
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: let's go back to hell this afternoon. So I did this,
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: like I said, for almost a year of just all
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: of these like horrible tests and then going back to
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: school and having to function like everybody else, which was
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: really difficult because not only then wohld my parents speak
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: streaming rude to me and unpleasant, like you're wasting our
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: time we drove all the way over here, or then
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: you know, the staff members will be like, oh, you're faking.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: You just want attention, And even some of the doctors
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: had told my parents, are you sure she's not just
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: looking for attention? Maybe you should get her, you know,
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: psychological help or see a therapist, so you can imagine,
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: then my parents would relay this stuff to the staff member.
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: So I was just extremely ostracized and just punished even
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: more for being sick, you know, like, oh, maybe it's
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: sin in your heart. You need to get right with Jesus.
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: You're obviously lying about things, and it was just like,
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: oh my god. And finally it was a day before
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: we were supposed to graduate, finally from this place, and
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: I was just in so much pain that I couldn't
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: even like participate or do anything.
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: And I was like, I'm begging you please, like take
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: me to the hospital or something.
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: So finally they take me and this doctor was like,
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: you know what, let's just take out your appendix. So
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: the doctor removes my appendix and it turned out my
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: appendix was fine, but I had a carconoid cancerous tumor
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: growing on it. So then they were like, oh, you
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: would have actually probably just died if we wouldn't have
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: taken this out.
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: No one would have ever known. And even that where
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: I thought there would have been some like relief or we're.
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: So sorry we doubted you or thank God, instead it
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: was just like Okay, well, now what you think you're special?
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: You know, because then I'm still at the school, and
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: then like, oh, well, you must think you're so special
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: taking all this time off for your doctors, and it's
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: like to go.
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: To my oncologist.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: So although it was like really horrible, it actually ended
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: up being the thing to save me and to help
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: me get out, because then they just started making me
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: feel so isolated and unwanted, like I was just so
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: tainted now from being sick, that they really more started
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: pushing me out, if that makes sense. Where before it
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: was like trapping me in, it's now we're done with
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: you in this aspect.
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: Were you eighteen at that point?
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: I was actually now twenty.
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: I was there and so I was twenty years old,
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: which I know it's confusing that most people think you
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: just leave at eighteen, but until that point, they make
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: it really so you can't leave. They kind of forced
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: until you graduate, which I'm graduate. I was graduating a
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: year late from everything in their system. But now then
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: it's like I had stayed on as a staff member
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: because I felt it's kind of indoctrinated in you that
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: you graduate, you either stay or you would go to
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: a Christian college.
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: So I had stay.
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: And your parents make you feel my parents, like you know,
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: it's telling anyone made me feel like they wanted me
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: to come home. And I'm so rainwashed at this point
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: that they the people that run this place that made
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: me feel this is where you're supposed to be, this
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: is what's required this is what's supposed to happen, and
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: anyone else I had seen show their true colors of
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: not wanting to partake anymore. It doesn't go well. All
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: the doors are locked, there's nowhere to leave. They make
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: that clear. You know this One person one time was like,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: I'm eighteen, let's go, and they're like, okay, find an
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: open door and there's no open doors. Well, those are
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: your parents closed and they don't want you to leave,
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: so you'd have to get naked. Oh, there's a police
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: officer waiting out front. It's going to arrest you. Because now,
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: in decent exposure, they work with local law enforcement, you know,
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: even the local sheriff. His wife worked at the kitchen.
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: The whole aspect of the town involved and feeling like
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: there's nowhere to go.
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: That's it. You have to remember.
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: As much as many people think like you're an adult,
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: you have free will, you don't think that. You don't
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: believe that your parents have signed away your rights. You
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: are locked up somewhere and think like, what's to say
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: they won't put me somewhere else?
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: And how long were you there? In total?
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: I was there for.
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: Total five years, from ages fifteen to twenty.
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: And those are pivotal years. Yes, you know, when you're
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: becoming legally an adult, and so, yeah, it makes sense
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: to me that your reality for so long was so
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: skewed intentionally by them that by the time you were
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: an adult, it still didn't really register. I'm an adult,
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: I have free will. It would have been difficult to leave.
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you about the involvement of the town,
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: you know, the involvement of like you said, the sheriff's wife.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: Was there any sort of political affiliation or involvement with
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: local politicians.
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: You know, it was a huge thing for them, even
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: making us go like campaign for certain people that they
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: would want to stay in office.
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: You know.
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: So there are different times where you know, everyone would
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: have to put on these shirts for certain people in
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: office and go door to door, go picketing and for
• 43:04
  Speaker 2: signs and be like, hey, make sure you vote for
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: this person because they know if this person's in office,
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: they're going to keep the school open. It's a very
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: vicious cycle of hey, we go to this doctor, Well,
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: this doctor's going to want the school to stay open
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: because you bring me thousands of patients a year. It's
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: a very unfortunately hand in aspect where then a lot
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: of people they know what's happening, they don't want to
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: say anything or like how does this all benefit all
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: of us? You know, when you talk about being eighteen
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: and feeling like an adult, I think one of the
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: most controlling things they did where most people feel like
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: they have a voice, is they controlled our voting. Myself
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: and several others that were eighteen. They put us all
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: in a room. They gave us our absenceee ballots, and
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: they watched who we voted for and demanded who we
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: voted for at that time.
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: You know, it's horrifying to hear that there were adults
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: in the community that were aware of what was going
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: on that we're willing to look the other way or
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: participate paid in it.
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: They would even go and recruit people that way as well,
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: like go to local churches and preach. You know, what
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: they were doing and that is, you know, the same
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: way that Lesser roll Off got the Wills is the
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: same way than the Wills and the Girl Hearts would
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: get staff members. There's no background check, there's no teaching involved,
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: you know, just like whatever.
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: And what did you later learn about your accreditation?
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: As far as graduating, they actually didn't even file with
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: a Board of Education.
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: So basically, once they finally did close down, you know,
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: I think there were some people while they were still
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: open that were able to get like their transcripts and
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: at least have some of the stuff count towards their education,
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: but as far as really anybody else, once they shut down,
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: there was no proof that we even went to school.
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: They didn't file with the Board of Education, there's no
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: record of anything. So basically, after all of that, the
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: four years I insert of having to go to their
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: horrible education, you still have to get your ged, none
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: of it even at all. So we had to go
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: through all of that for nothing.
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so you had to then go get your ged.
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: And how much did your parents pay for you monthly
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: or yearly?
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: It was fifteen hundred a month, and we're talking about
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety seven to two thousand and two.
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, obviously we know there's no easy way to get
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: over trauma. It's a long process. How long did it
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: take you to really start to unwind some of the
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: things that had been pounded into your head.
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: When I left, it was a lot of still the
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: fear of complying with what my parents wanted me to do.
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: You know, my mom's like, don't talk about it, just
• 45:41
  Speaker 3: get over it.
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: I had met somebody in church, I got pregnant right away,
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: and even that was instantly being pressured into marriage. I
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: felt like after my son started school, once he was
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: in pre K, I felt like by getting my own
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: group of people or meeting a teacher and realizing like
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: other people being like you aren't amazing for you're a
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: good mom, Like I have your back, I felt like
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: it started giving me a little bit of myself back.
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: It's now like ten years of just this abuse that
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: I felt like it kind of like washed over me
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: that I was like, I.
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: Don't have to do this anymore.
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: I sold all of my belongings and got a great
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: attorney and I got full custody of my son, and
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: I felt like that really started the first journey of like, wow,
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: I do not have to take this anymore. I was
• 46:30
  Speaker 2: mentioned in a lawsuit through things with Mount Park from
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: being someone's orientation guide that it kind of then made
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: me want to start processing and really started looking up
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: stuff about the school, finding news articles, and I felt
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: like that was the first time, you know that I
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: had not only realized like, oh, what the school was like.
• 46:50
  Speaker 2: I had started knowing I'd been through stuff and like
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: finding myself, but I just never really realized that other
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: people thought that the school was as bad, or that
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: other people had the courage, you know, sue them.
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: The two thousand and five lawsuit brought by five former students,
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: sued Bob and Betty Wills, along with Sam and Deborah Gerhart.
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: The former students claimed that they were both physically and
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: mentally abused at Mountain Park. It also alleges that Mountain
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: Park was a for profit organization that increased their profit
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: margin by putting students in charge of each other through
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: the orientation guide program, as opposed to hiring trained staff members.
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: This created an abusive environment in which kids were encouraged
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: to physically harm one another. Meg's name is mentioned multiple
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: times in this lawsuit since she was the orientation guide
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: to one of the students involved in the lawsuit. It
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: describes instances of Meg pushing and berating this student, but
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: Meg is not unique. Mountain Park encouraged orientation guides to
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: act this way to keep students in line. Meg has
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: had to process what was done to her at Mountain Park,
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: but she has also had to process what she was
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: forced to do to others.
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: You know, there's a lot of things you do in
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: survival that it's not you. You're just trying to survive. And
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: I always had felt so bad about what I had
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: done to survive, you know, being an orientation diet or
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: not leaving at eighteen. You know, you feel so bad
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: that sometimes you feel so ashamed of things you've done
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: that I didn't want to talk about it. That realizing
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: that even though I may have been a bad teenager
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: or I partook in these things to survive, that does
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: not make it okay what everyone else did to us.
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: They created an environment, and I felt like hearing just
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: females say it's okay or like you're amazing, you're strong,
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: was the first time I really realized that it was
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: okay to share, and then to be brave enough to
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: say I did make a mistake.
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: You know, in this moment or whatever you want to
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: call it, when you're in.
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: Survival, you're so afraid that I did have to become
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: somebody else, and yes, absolutely ashamed of who that person
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: was in that moment. That's not who I am. And
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: you know, I don't have to feel this shame for
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: what I did. Other people created this, They should feel ashamed.
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: I feel horrible, But in part of my feeling bad
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: is sharing what happened, is helping.
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: Other people not feel alone. You know, somebody asked me one.
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: Time, is there a day that goes by that I
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: don't think about Mountain Park?
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: And there's not.
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: I wish there were, But there are so many things
• 49:26
  Speaker 2: between a smell, a sight seeing my kids grow up
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: that it has made me realize just so much more
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: about what I would do, you know, like how I
• 49:35
  Speaker 2: am as a mom, and just things that we went
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: through and just how impactful those years were. That to
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: be able to take control of that trauma has been
• 49:45
  Speaker 2: crucial to my life. So when I'm reminded of certain things,
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: it's not like, oh my god, I want to crawl
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: on a hole. It's like, oh my god, I'm so
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: proud of myself.
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: That's such a good perspective, and I imagine it takes
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: a lot of work and time, especially when you we're
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: told so often that you were like bad or that
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: there was something wrong with you. It's hard to get
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: those messages, you know, out of our heads. Anyone who's
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: told that and especially told over and over and over
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: and treated so horribly. And you've also said that you
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: have connected with a bunch of other people from Mountain Park.
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: How often are you speaking with.
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: People a good amount?
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: I feel like a lot of people are now processing
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: a lot where I'm very thankful that I did process
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: it a few years ago, where I see a lot
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: of people processing it now, but it is very helpful
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: to be able to speak with them and kind of
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: relay certain things. Or there's been you know, a few
• 50:37
  Speaker 2: people I've helped get in, you know, like a trauma center.
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: It can be mentally draining, and sometimes it's really sad
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: to see so many people still struggling and trying to
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: navigate through it. It's very sad, but also very motivating.
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: Like this is why I feel like I've taken on
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: this kind of role, like this spokesperson of people that
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: went through mount Park to just share our story.
• 51:02
  Speaker 3: And it's been incredible. How many people actually from.
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: The same article that you found me will randomly reach
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: out for my boring school and are like, oh my god,
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: reading that made me feel like everything I've always felt.
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: You said it, and we've felt so great to be
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: able to show my loved one or my partner your
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: article and just be like, this is what I've been
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: trying to tell you about.
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: Mountain Park Baptist Boarding Academy was closed in two thousand
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: and four amid scrutiny over the use of corporal punishment,
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: but eight years prior to that, in nineteen ninety six,
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: there was a murder at Mountain Park. William Poutrelle or
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: will was sixteen years old when he was brutally murdered
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: by two of his fellow students, one of whom was
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: his orientation guide. Joseph Burris and Anthony Rutherford, who were
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: teenagers themselves at the time, were both sentenced to life
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: in prison. That was nineteen ninety six. One year later,
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: Meg arrived at Mountain Park. At the time, she knew
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: about the murder, but she didn't know details. She said
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: it was used as a threat by staff. She was
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: told she had a better chance of dying than successfully
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: running away from Mountain Park. Years later, she finally looked
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: into the details of the murder, and to her, it
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: seemed to confirm that Mountain Park created a dangerous and
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: violent atmosphere where something like this could take place.
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: Will was Joseph's new student, so Joseph was his orientation guide.
• 52:36
  Speaker 3: So their relationship already was that of Joseph having to
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: constantly get will you know to comply basically the other person.
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: Anthony had said to Joseph one day, like.
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: I can't do this anymore, like we need to run away,
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: like we have to get out of here, and the
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: three of them and another person not mentioned in the lawsuit,
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: all the four of them decided we're going to run away. Weird,
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: today's a day, this time we can when we're supposed
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: to be stacking.
• 53:03
  Speaker 3: Wood, let's get out of here.
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: So as it's time to happen and they're ready to go,
• 53:09
  Speaker 2: Will changed his mind and did not want to leave anymore.
• 53:14
  Speaker 3: Anthony was like, no, like we're leaving. Joseph had been
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: there less than a year before he got sent away.
• 53:21
  Speaker 3: His father had just passed away in front of him,
• 53:25
  Speaker 3: so he just was going through a lot mentally, so
• 53:28
  Speaker 3: when he hearned like we are leaving, we are getting
• 53:30
  Speaker 3: out of here, He's like, That's all I could focus
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: on that day, was just getting out of there. So
• 53:35
  Speaker 3: when Will was like, I'm not I'm going to go
• 53:37
  Speaker 3: tell and unfortunately in that moment they did take his
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: life and just pure fear of him telling on them,
• 53:46
  Speaker 3: you know, and that thought that they were not going
• 53:48
  Speaker 3: to get to be free. Their goal was if we
• 53:51
  Speaker 3: get out of here, we can get the police, like
• 53:53
  Speaker 3: what can we do to get the school shut down? Like,
• 53:56
  Speaker 3: we just have to get out of here.
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: And then when that did not happen, they did that
• 54:00
  Speaker 2: horrible act.
• 54:01
  Speaker 3: They instantly went and turned themselves in.
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: They said, what happened. The main person, brother Gerhart, then
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: called the sheriff.
• 54:08
  Speaker 3: They took him to jail.
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: His parents waived all rights, they allowed the girl hearts
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: to handle everything, and then.
• 54:14
  Speaker 3: You know, from there they were sentenced to life.
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: They weren't even allowed to mention any of the situation
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: im boarding school. We're not talking about the school, We're
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: not talking about their mental wellbeing. We're just mentioning these
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: are two troubled teens that are locked up in our facility.
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: You know, it's easy to paint anyone, obviously that's in
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: a trouble teen industry as a trouble teen, even if
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: they weren't, but especially if you had been in any
• 54:38
  Speaker 2: trouble whatsoever.
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: So from there then Joseph talked about his bomb wasn't
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: even there, you know, when they interviewed him.
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: She didn't make sure he had anyone else with it,
• 54:48
  Speaker 2: you know, except brother Gerhart, and they held him. I
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: think it was over, you know, twenty something hours in questioning.
• 54:56
  Speaker 3: At that point, it just didn't really go well.
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: So when I reached out to him and just to
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: find out more about it and if there was anything
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: I could do, I always felt like he's just the
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: one student still kind of trapped in captivity, and it's like,
• 55:10
  Speaker 2: I'm not condoning or justifying what you did with Will.
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: I just want people to understand how horrible these places are.
• 55:16
  Speaker 3: To create an environment.
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: That's someone that has never caused harm to any human
• 55:21
  Speaker 2: being in the world before, and now all of a sudden,
• 55:24
  Speaker 2: you're committing murder, Like what would create someone to go
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: to such a one to eighty of who they are
• 55:29
  Speaker 2: as a human being. So I was able to actually
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: go before the pro board. He had an opportunity to
• 55:35
  Speaker 2: be up for parole, and I went to Missouri, which
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: was my first time back after leaving Mount Park, and
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: I was able to share my testimony before the pro
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: board and just really helped them understand not speaking, you
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: know so much as you know his behalf or on him,
• 55:52
  Speaker 2: but really truly just testifying as this is what mount
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: Park was like. You know, I was here for five
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: years and this is everything I endured as.
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: A human being. For the pro Board to be like,
• 56:02
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's horrific. You know, I can't believe
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: these places exist.
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: So he was granted a release date, So I do
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: feel like, you know, it just was good even for
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: other people, hopefully to hear what that was like, what
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: that would do to somebody struggling.
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and has he been released yet?
• 56:20
  Speaker 3: Unfortunately it was a four year release date, so he
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: has one more year to go. Yeah.
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: I just really am grateful for you that you came
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: on here and shared your story with us and everything
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: and that you went through and that you're shedding more
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: light on what happened at Mountain Park.
• 56:39
  Speaker 5: That was such a mind blowing conversation with Meg. I mean,
• 56:44
  Speaker 5: she has clearly spent so much time and energy unpacking
• 56:48
  Speaker 5: what she went through there, and you know that's a
• 56:51
  Speaker 5: really brave and difficult thing to do.
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm so glad she spoke with us. There is
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: some stuff about Mountain Park out there on the internet now,
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: but there's not a whole lot. People are starting to
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: speak out about it. But I'm really grateful that Meg
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: wanted to tell her story.
• 57:06
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and we should mention to listeners that Meg transferred
• 57:10
  Speaker 5: from Mountain Park Baptist Sporting Academy in Missouri to a
• 57:14
  Speaker 5: sister school called Palm Lane Academy in Arcadia, Florida. We
• 57:18
  Speaker 5: didn't go into that in the interview, but did want
• 57:21
  Speaker 5: to note it. Meg transferred to Palm Lane hoping that
• 57:23
  Speaker 5: it would have better conditions, but it did not. She
• 57:27
  Speaker 5: was closer to her family when she was at Palm Lane,
• 57:30
  Speaker 5: so when she spoke about her parents then picking her
• 57:33
  Speaker 5: up to go to her oncologist appointments with her, she
• 57:36
  Speaker 5: was in Florida by then. Palm Lane Academy closed the
• 57:40
  Speaker 5: same time as Mountain Park in two thousand and four.
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I wanted to follow up about the lawsuit that
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: we mentioned in the episode that Meg mentioned. It was
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: a civil lawsuit brought by multiple former students, all female students,
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: Kaufman versus Mountain Park. You know, there was a lot
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: of allegations in that lawsuit. We mentioned some of them
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: in the interview. These students all alleged that they were
• 58:08
  Speaker 1: physically and emotionally abused, and there was also allegations that
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: they were drugged against their will and without their knowledge.
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: So I did look more into that civil case and
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: I spoke with an attorney who worked on the case
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: and represented Mountain Park. One of the attorneys who represented
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: Mountain Park, and he told me that they did go
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: to a trial, they had a jury trial, and ultimately
• 58:31
  Speaker 1: the verdict came back in favor of Mountain Park that
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: we fund. It is just like, how is that possible? Yeah,
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure. I wonder if they didn't have enough
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: physical evidence, I don't know, you know, how you would
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: prove that they were drugged. So ultimately that was what
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: happened with the case. There was one count of battery
• 58:52
  Speaker 1: against one of the students that the jury did come
• 58:55
  Speaker 1: back and say this did happen, but they didn't award
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: any damages, so none of those students got any money
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: from that. But the teacher was charged with battery.
• 59:03
  Speaker 3: Battery.
• 59:04
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it was actually Betty Wills. Betty Wills, Okay, Bob
• 59:07
  Speaker 5: Wells's wife, right. So they took over after Leicster Rollo
• 59:10
  Speaker 5: off it founded the school. They were like the headhun shows.
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so battery is not as like serious I
• 59:18
  Speaker 1: guess in the courts as like abuse. But it was
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: zero dollars damage, so they did say that they acknowledged
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: it that happened. So I just wanted to be clear
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: about that. When I asked Meg about this civil suit,
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: because as we mentioned in the episode, she was listed
• 59:32
  Speaker 1: in the suit. Her name was listed because she was
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: the orientation guide to one of the students who brought
• 59:38
  Speaker 1: this suit. And Meg said that she knew two of
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: the girls and that when this was happening, she had
• 59:46
  Speaker 1: left Mountain Park. She had a young child, her life
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: was still kind of chaotic, and at the time, she said,
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: a private investigator came to her home and she said,
• 59:58
  Speaker 1: you know, threatened her not to participate in the civil lawsuit,
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: not to testify. And Meg didn't, you know, she was scared.
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: She was still trying to like find her footing, so
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: she did not participate. There was one other civil lawsuit
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: against Mountain Park and the Willses. Federal jurors and Cape
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: Girardo awarded a student named Jordan Blair twenty thousand dollars
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: for allegedly being shoved against a sink by a staff member,
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: but that was the only thing that came up with
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 1: the civil lawsuits.
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 5: Damages are so important in civil suits because it's like,
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 5: how else do you make a business a little more
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 5: scared of not abiding by the law or mistreating students
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 5: in this case, a slap on the wrist? What does
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 5: that mean to a school who's using corporal punishment sort
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 5: of under this disguise of Christianity.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's also just the more we know about trauma
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 1: over time. A lot of these students they left and
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 1: they were dealing with it for years and are still
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: ill dealing with it. So being able to have resources
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: to go to therapy, I don't know, that's just really
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: important and damages would help a student with that, So
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: I think that's another aspect. Yeah, it's huge. Well, that
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: was a really powerful episode. You know, we did talk
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: about the murder that happened at Mountain Park at the
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: very end of the episode. We talked about that with
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: Meg and we were going to cover that at the
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: end here, but there was a lot to go into,
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: so we're actually going to talk about it next week.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 5: On an off record. We true to form just thought
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 5: let's find what we can online and Hannah ends up
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 5: calling the courthouse and going through about seven hundred pages
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 5: so we will be able to do a deep dive
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 5: with you guys.
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, when we were like we're not going to do
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: homework for these at records, it's like, well, I don't know.
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: Somehow I find myself reading through hundreds of court documents
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: because they can't help it. Yeah, can't help it.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 5: And you know, when Meg's story was already so intense,
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 5: and then to learn about the murder, it was like, okay,
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 5: well this is part of her story and her unpacking
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 5: what she really did go through and we needed to
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 5: sort of know more to really talk about it.
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So join us next week on the off record
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 1: and we will fill you in on that.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 3: Thanks for listening.
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 5: If you have a story for us, we would love
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 5: to hear it. Our email is The Knife at exactlyrightmedia
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 5: dot com, or you can follow us on Instagram at
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 5: the Knife podcast or a Blue Sky at the Knife Podcast.
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: This has been an Exactly Right production hosted and produced
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: by me Hannah Smith and me Paytia Eating.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 5: Our producers are Tom Bryfogel and Alexis Samarosi.
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 1: This episode was mixed by Tom Bryfogel.
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 5: Our associate producer is Christina Chamberlain.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 1: Our theme music is by Birds in the Airport Artwork
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: five and S a Lilac executive produced by Karen Kilgarriff,
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 1: Georgia Hardstark and Danielle Kramer