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An Interview With football legend Barry Silkman · Team of the eighties

0:00
Taylor.
0:01
Oh, what a goal by Peter Taylor.
0:18
So long, long time I've.
0:21
I've known this fella.
0:22
Yeah, well, I think I was 15, 16 when I met him.
0:26
Brilliant character, great player, long career.
0:29
Barry Siltman.
0:30
Silky.
0:31
Great to have you on, mate.
0:33
How you doing?
0:34
Yeah, lovely to be a Spencer, gotta say, you've known me since you were 15.
0:37
That would have only made me one and it.
0:42
And let me tell you, if anyone believes that, they'll believe anything.
0:46
Yeah, no, yeah, I'm good, Spence.
0:48
I'm really good.
0:49
Really good.
0:49
Yeah, thank you.
0:50
Yeah, good.
0:50
You're looking very, very well and thank you.
0:53
I'll pop into your social and.
0:55
And I see you there now and again and looking fit, looking happy.
0:59
It's great to see it, mate.
1:00
And as always, shy and retiring as you are always, Spence.
1:05
Always, always.
1:06
Never been backward in coming forward, mate.
1:08
That's good for you.
1:09
My motto, I love it and I love it.
1:12
And I think everybody that follows you and, and knows you and knows your character, I think they all love it too.
1:18
Silky.
1:19
I don't know if you've seen any of these, but it.
1:22
I was in between projects out here in New York and I was thinking about doing something team of the 80s because it was such a pivotal part in Crystal palace.
1:32
And I just thought, you know what, I'll start chronicling that era.
1:37
And you, of course you was there, you were, you were like a senior pro when these kids were coming through.
1:45
Right.
1:47
So yes, we spent.
1:48
So I was like, I was like 28 and I was one of the senior players.
1:51
It was 20.
1:52
Well, I was 27, actually.
1:54
26.
1:55
27, but everyone coming through, Peter Nicholas, Ben, Terry Fennec, Nico Fenn, Vince, Kenny Sands, they're all kids.
2:07
And all of a sudden I went from being a young 26 to a very experienced, mature 26.
2:17
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
2:18
But it was strange.
2:19
I mean, I went there when I was 24, but at the time I was 26, I felt old because all these kids were in the team.
2:26
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
2:27
Did you, did you.
2:28
Where did you grow up, Silke?
2:30
You grew up in East London.
2:31
East London, yeah.
2:32
Petty Coat Lane.
2:34
Oh, did you really?
2:35
Yeah, used to go there as a kid.
2:39
Good, good.
2:39
I mean, good player at school.
2:41
Did, did scout see you at school, like being like something special or was it a.
2:48
It was.
2:48
That was really weird, Spence, because when I was a kid, when I was five, six years old, I used to sing a lot.
2:55
My mom was a singer.
2:56
She was a part time singer, so she used to Take me with her to, to pubs and stuff.
3:02
And I used to get up on stage and sing for maybe 5, 10 minutes with her on the, with her on the piano.
3:09
And I was 8 years old and it was the only, only twice we moved out of the East End.
3:17
Both times was for one year and this particular year we moved to a place called Tolworth in Surrey and I went to a school called Red lion school.
3:27
I was 8 years old.
3:29
And you know, it's really weird, Spence, because I remember this particular incident like it happened today.
3:35
It's just really weird.
3:37
I was running outside at dinner time with my friends and I was with the group of 8 year olds and the school team were practicing shooting at the goalkeeper.
3:46
And the goalkeeper, the goal was on a big.
3:50
There was a big wooden building and they had the goal painted on there.
3:56
And then there was big rubber mats and they were shooting and the goalkeeper was diving on these mats.
4:01
And as I was running past, the ball came to me and I passed it first time with the outside of my right foot into the goalkeeper's arms.
4:10
He was probably about 25 yards away.
4:13
And I remember the teacher went, hold on a minute, stop, stop, stop, stop.
4:16
And I stopped and he called me over.
4:18
He said, have you always been able to kick the ball that hard?
4:22
And I said, well, that wasn't hard.
4:24
I just passed it back to him and he went to me, where did you learn to play football?
4:30
I said, well, I've been playing since I was about three or four years old and I go to football.
4:35
My mum takes me every home game at Spurs.
4:39
So he said, I want you to come and kick the ball as hard as you can.
4:44
So I said okay.
4:45
So he put the ball down on the penalty spot.
4:48
I went up and smashed it.
4:49
The goalkeeper turned his back, the ball hit the wooden ball, didn't come out again.
4:53
He said to me, what, what class you in?
4:57
So I said, I'm in Mrs.
4:58
Brabham's class.
4:59
He said, so you're eight years old?
5:00
I said, yeah.
5:01
He said, you're playing for the school team on Saturday.
5:04
That's where it started.
5:05
And that's the first actual proper team game I had when I was 8.
5:10
And after the game, I remember the teacher said to my mum and dad, he will be a professional footballer one day.
5:21
It was right.
5:22
He was right.
5:23
And did, and, and did, did he put you out on.
5:26
Did you play out?
5:27
No, no, it happened by.
5:28
No, I played in central midfield, just went where I wanted.
5:33
And it was really strange.
5:34
I actually got my first Club I was 15, nearly 16, and I had no idea how you're supposed to go to a football club.
5:42
So I was happy playing on a Sunday and a Saturday team and a Sunday team, and I was happy.
5:48
I was helping in Petticoat Lane.
5:52
I was singing once or twice a week and getting like four quid, five quid was like a fortune.
5:59
Yeah.
6:00
And my dad one night went to a boxing do, one of these dudes where black tie and, you know, the.
6:10
All the amateur bouts.
6:11
It was a charity.
6:13
So my dad was invited and he went without my mum.
6:16
And when he got there, you have all the tables of 10 or 12 people and your names are out.
6:23
But when he met someone who he knew, he was talking to them.
6:26
When he walked to his table, the table was full up.
6:30
So my dad went to the organizer and said, somebody's sitting in my seat.
6:35
So he said, well, Sam, do you mind if you sit somewhere else?
6:41
So my dad said, no, I don't mind.
6:43
So they had a look around, they found a spare seat, sat my dad down during the course that evening, got speaking to the people on the table and the guy next to him on his right, he said, oh,
6:55
what do you do?
6:55
He said, I'm a football scout.
6:57
He said, who forced it?
6:58
Queens Park Rangers.
7:00
So my dad said, my son's a really good footballer.
7:03
And this guy said, well, every dad says that.
7:06
And my dad said, well, it's not what I say, it's what people tell me because I don't watch football.
7:11
My dad never watched football.
7:12
He said, I don't watch football and I can't even kick a ball.
7:15
So he said, okay, we're taking for a trial at Queen's Park Rangers.
7:19
They took me for a trial and that was it.
7:22
That kicked off my career.
7:24
Oh, lovely, lovely.
7:26
That was what, seven?
7:27
What was that?
7:29
That was late.
7:30
No, that was late seven.
7:31
1969.
7:33
70.
7:34
That was about 17.
7:36
Wow.
7:36
And then it just took off.
7:39
I went to Barnett.
7:42
I went to Wimbledon first, then Barnett bought me from Wimbledon, then Hereford bought me from Barnett.
7:50
All this was in one year.
7:52
Then at Hereford, we won the league.
7:55
I get called into the manager's office the end of the season and he said, silky lot.
8:00
I don't want to stand in your way.
8:02
Terry Venables has just got his first job at Crystal Palace.
8:05
He's desperate to make you his first signing.
8:08
Wow.
8:09
Do you want to go there and see him?
8:10
I won't stand in your way.
8:12
I traveled to London, went to see Terry, and he said, I want you to be my first signing, that was it.
8:20
I was at palace within three days.
8:23
Fantastic.
8:24
I was.
8:25
I mean, being out in Hereford, that was.
8:27
Must have been a big culture shock for you, like being a cockney boy out there, right?
8:31
Or was it.
8:32
Was it a nice town?
8:33
Was it a good release for you?
8:34
How did you feel being there at Hereford?
8:37
I just looked at this.
8:38
I was there to play football, Spence.
8:40
Right, right, right.
8:41
The lads were brilliant.
8:44
It was very quiet area.
8:46
I lived in Diggs, right, and my mum and dad had to subsidize me because the digs were costing the same as my salary.
8:55
So my mum and dad were actually giving me 25, 30 quid a week to live on.
8:59
And they never really had any money, so they were under pressure.
9:03
And then one of the players after half a season said, why don't you come and live with my wife and myself?
9:08
His name was Dixie McNeil.
9:10
Dixie was one of the.
9:11
One of the more experienced older players.
9:14
He was the goal scorer.
9:15
So I went there for six months, which got me right out the ship financially.
9:20
And I never really looked at it, you know, we went out a few times.
9:24
We used to go to a place called Mr.
9:26
Traces in Gloucester.
9:29
Their Traces, the nightclub in Gloucester.
9:32
We called it Mr.
9:32
Tracy.
9:33
Which traces nightclub?
9:34
We'd go there, you know, maybe every two weeks.
9:38
There was nowhere to go in Hereford for sure.
9:41
And I just used to be in bed at 9, 10 o' clock every night and I never looked at it, spent anything other than, I'm here to play football and one day I'm going to get a transfer and
9:53
if God's on my side, I'll go back to London.
9:55
And that is exactly what happened, Spence.
9:59
Yeah, and what a move, you know, like to go there.
10:01
Palace at that time.
10:04
Was Malcolm still there too?
10:06
Malcolm had gone terrier, took the.
10:09
Took the job.
10:10
And I always tell people the same story.
10:13
And I did this when Terry, God rest his soul, was alive.
10:17
I did a big thing for Stan Bowles.
10:19
I was a speaker at a big Stan bowls event and it was so strange because Terry was there and obviously he just started to have a little bit of a problem, but he didn't tell anybody.
10:34
And I tried to get him up on stage with me and he wouldn't get up.
10:37
And I said to everyone, this is a true story and Terry will verify this, which he did.
10:44
Crystal palace was Terry's first ever club.
10:47
His first signing he made.
10:48
First player he bought was me.
10:51
Terry's second club was Queen's Park Rangers.
10:55
The first player he bought was me.
10:58
Terry's third club was Barcelona.
11:00
I said, I'm still waiting.
11:06
I said, what happened there?
11:08
And Terry stood up, he went, that's true.
11:10
I went, I know it's true.
11:12
I said I was all right for palace and qpr, but when it come to Barcelona, you thought, well, that I think I better leave Silk behind.
11:18
He's not quite this class,.
11:22
Vince.
11:23
Did you.
11:23
Have you heard that story that Vince tells about Alan Ball taking him worthy club?
11:27
And then he gets to call when Ball, he gets to Man City and he thinks, oh fuck, he's going to give me one more chance.
11:32
He says, there's a, a Butlin's job where they want need a coach.
11:37
I'll tell you a funny story about Vin.
11:40
Vince will verify this because we still speak to each other.
11:44
Yeah, good.
11:44
And we still, we still talk about this.
11:46
And I don't call Invinc Hillair.
11:49
Okay, okay, okay.
11:50
So we're at the training ground one day and in them days people could just come and watch.
11:56
It's not like now where there's barriers up and yes, of course, guards on duty and all that game security people.
12:02
So this man turned up with this young boy and Vince and I, everyone was out in the training ground for some reason.
12:09
Vince and I were the last two out.
12:11
And as we come out, this guy's gone.
12:13
Excuse me, he said, can you tell me what one out there is Vince o'?
12:18
Hare?
12:21
So I've looked at Vince Vince, and I've gone to the guy who he said, vin Vincent o'.
12:26
Hare.
12:27
So I said, well, there's no Vincent o'.
12:29
Hare.
12:30
There's only Vince Hilaire.
12:32
And this is him.
12:33
And he's up and he's gone.
12:35
No, he said, you can't kid me.
12:38
The one I want is Vincent o'.
12:40
Hare.
12:40
He's my son's favorite player.
12:43
So I said, oh, it's invincible heir.
12:45
So this guy ended up walking out and asking people, who's Vince o'?
12:49
Hare?
12:50
They'll point at Vince.
12:51
And the guy said, I knew your real name was Vincent o', Hare, and to this day, Spence, I call Vince o', Hare, not Vince Hilaire.
13:01
This guy was adamant his name was o'.
13:03
Hare.
13:04
That's brilliant.
13:04
That's a, that's a great story.
13:06
And he was a good player, Vince.
13:08
He was a good player, mate.
13:10
You know, Vince, Vince, Vince gave me my first ever decent pair of football boots.
13:15
I never forgot him for that.
13:17
And you know what?
13:17
I.
13:17
They didn't fit me, but I made them fit.
13:20
Yeah, he was a great, great Lad, Vince.
13:23
But the best player out the lot.
13:24
We had some really good young players.
13:26
Billy Gilbert, Nico Fence, Vince, or she was not quite that standard, but good player.
13:35
The best one by mile was Kenny Sanson.
13:39
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
13:42
You being there, going back to that, you in the dressing room, I'm sure with your confidence and.
13:48
And belief, I'm sure use a huge help to those boys there.
13:52
Silky, you know what?
13:54
Do you know what Terry told me?
13:56
Go on.
13:58
Years and years later, Terry said to me, silk, you were a terrific player, but you weren't a top player.
14:08
But you know what?
14:10
You know why I signed you at palace and why I signed you at qpr?
14:14
I signed you for the person you were because I knew you would be a massive uplift in that dressing room at Crystal palace.
14:24
And you were.
14:25
And all the young players idolized you and they lived off of every word you said.
14:30
And the thing is, Silk, you've got unbelievable knowledge of football.
14:35
What he said, he said, I've never come across a player, in fact, I've never come across anyone who's got your knowledge.
14:42
And he said, when I went to qpr, we only had two teams underneath us, which was true.
14:49
He said, and I told Glenn Roda, I'm bringing in a player called Barry Silkman.
14:54
Do you know him?
14:54
And Glenn went, silky, of course I know him.
14:57
He said, he will take us up the table on his own.
15:00
Not his football ability, but he will give this dressing room a massive lift.
15:05
And all the young players, he will make them feel a million pound.
15:11
And that's right, we went there.
15:12
We never lost the game spent.
15:14
When I went to QPR, 13 games, we went from having two teams underneath us to 10th in the league.
15:22
Wow.
15:22
And I didn't know that at the time.
15:24
It was only when I finished playing that Terry told me all this.
15:29
So I didn't realize it at the time.
15:32
You know, even Vince now says to me, terry Fenneck said, sil, you were the best thing that ever happened in that football club.
15:39
Yeah.
15:40
Other than Terry Venables.
15:41
But I never looked at it like that then, because I was just me, Spence.
15:46
I just went in to give, you know, and make everyone feel that they were all worth millions of pounds and make everyone laugh.
15:55
Because the one thing footballers never do when it's not going well, they don't laugh and they don't smile.
16:02
I was there to make them laugh and smile so that they forgot about losing the last game and let's go and win the next game.
16:10
But I didn't realize that at that time.
16:13
Yeah.
16:13
No, your, your, your personality is.
16:16
Is infectious and it's effervescent and it was always up and.
16:20
And I.
16:21
I can always remember you having to laugh and a joke and.
16:24
And players, just the way they looked at you, I could tell that they just.
16:28
Re like he said, you know, they hang on your every word.
16:31
And I think that really that's what they did.
16:32
And I didn't realize that at the time.
16:34
It was only really when I finished playing.
16:37
I mean, I went sadly, Paul Hinscherwood Fish died a few years ago and I went to the funeral and a lot of the players had got very old.
16:48
Some hadn't changed that much, some had got very old, right.
16:51
And the lads said to me, they literally all of them went silk.
16:56
You know what?
16:57
We loved it with you at the club.
16:59
You could be a nightmare sometimes, but fuck me, you were funny and you really used to give us a lift and I didn't look at it like that, Spence.
17:07
I was just me.
17:09
You know, even now, my fiance, who's a lot younger than me by the way, she always says to me, you don't realize what you're like.
17:18
People hang on to everything you say.
17:21
You're so infectious.
17:22
But I don't even realize that now because I'm just me.
17:28
I don't know any other way to be.
17:30
When I was young, I think a lot of things that happen to you when you're young shape how you think.
17:35
Yeah, it's also partly in your DNA, but a lot of things that happen shape, shape your thinking in life.
17:42
And I always used to think something is not.
17:45
There's no gray area.
17:46
It's either black or white.
17:48
Something is either yes or no.
17:50
Now, later in life, you may say, you know what, I made a mistake there.
17:55
Maybe only one year later you say made a mistake there, but it wasn't really a mistake because at that time of making that decision, it was the right thing to do.
18:04
Yes, it may have turned out the wrong thing, but at that time it was the right thing.
18:09
So I've always been someone.
18:11
They've got no gray area, See the black or white, you get on with it.
18:15
If it turns out not the right decision, who cares?
18:18
Just get on with it.
18:19
Right, right, right, right.
18:21
Yeah, it's.
18:22
Yeah, fantastic, mate.
18:24
Really good.
18:25
After.
18:27
After palace, you.
18:29
Where did you go after Palace?
18:30
Silky.
18:30
I can't remember.
18:31
Was it qpr?
18:31
I went to.
18:32
I went.
18:32
No, I went to Pat.
18:33
I went from palace for a very short time to Plymouth with Malcolm Harrison.
18:38
That's right.
18:38
That's right.
18:39
And then I was only there a handful of games and came in one morning on a Monday morning and this guy comes in and he goes, I'm your new manager.
18:55
Where the Malcolm gone?
18:57
Yeah, he's gone to Marbella.
19:00
He'd gone to Man City.
19:01
Oh, where did you.
19:03
Yeah.
19:03
Never heard a word to anyone, Spence.
19:07
And the manager called me up in his office.
19:10
Bobby Saxton, his name.
19:12
He started off an absolute, turned out to be a really nice guy.
19:17
He got to know me and I got to know him.
19:20
And he started on the wrong footing with me because he didn't know me.
19:24
He presumed how I was, right.
19:26
When I played football, Spence, I played for one reason.
19:31
Two reasons, actually.
19:31
Two reasons.
19:32
One, I wanted to win.
19:35
Two, I wanted to be the best player on the pitch.
19:38
That's it.
19:39
That is it.
19:39
Win and be the best player.
19:41
I don't care if you're the manager, whether my mum was the manager, whether my auntie was the manager, I don't care.
19:48
I just want to win and be the best player.
19:51
And what he did the first day, called me into his office and he said to me, look, we don't know each other, but I can see that you're Malcolm's player, you're not mine.
20:05
And as far as I'm concerned, if Malcolm comes in for you, you can just go because you're his player.
20:15
And I went in.
20:16
I'm not going to call you gaffer because you haven't earned that respect.
20:21
I'll tell you what, Bobby.
20:22
I don't play because Malcolm's my manager.
20:25
I don't play because you're my manager or anyone's my manager.
20:28
I play because I love playing football.
20:31
I want to win and I want to be the best player on the pitch.
20:35
That's it.
20:35
If you don't want to play me, right, that's up to you.
20:38
It's your choice.
20:40
But don't ever cast me as somebody's player because no one owns me.
20:45
No one owns me now, right?
20:47
No one ever owns me.
20:48
And the only two people in my life can never tell me what to do is my mum and dad.
20:52
No one else.
20:53
Not you, not the chairman, not another manager, no one.
20:57
Just my mum and dad.
20:59
Finish.
21:00
I walked out the office.
21:01
He watched me train that week, but we didn't actually have a game for two weeks.
21:06
And then he picked me in the first team.
21:09
The first game that he played, he picked me, I played.
21:14
And I have to tell you something, he was a man because he walked up to me in front of all the players.
21:20
We won, I think three nil or three one.
21:23
And I got man of the match.
21:25
And he walked up to me in the dressing room and in front of everyone, he went, silky.
21:32
I was wrong about you and you were right and I'd like to shake your hand.
21:38
I took a big man to do that.
21:40
He shook my hand.
21:41
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
21:43
We then played shuffle Wednesday and beaten 5 nil.
21:46
I got man of the match in that.
21:48
And he walked up to me after the game in the dress room and hugged me and said, I only hope Malcolm doesn't come in for you.
21:56
But within days he did.
21:59
So I ended up then at Man City, but I got a lot of respect for Bobby Saxon, a lot of respect for him.
22:06
That's.
22:07
That's a.
22:07
That's a lovely story.
22:09
And I think he did the right thing to do, but as you just said, not many people can do that.
22:17
Tough time, was it, going to City in.
22:19
In that.
22:20
At that time, Silky.
22:21
They were struggling a bit, weren't they?
22:23
Yeah.
22:24
I got to tell you, Spencer's like anything, if you knew beforehand what, you know, after, maybe you'd have second thoughts.
22:30
But it was a massive club.
22:32
They were in turmoil.
22:33
Malcolm had gone in, thought there were a lot of players that had come to the end of career that needed moving on.
22:40
When I went there and started training with them, started playing, I thought Malcolm was wrong.
22:49
He thought Mick Shannon.
22:51
Yeah, I thought he thought Mick Shannon was gone and he wanted to get rid of him Asa Hartford.
22:57
He weren't sure about Peter Barnes.
23:00
He wanted gone.
23:02
There was a number of players he wanted gone.
23:05
And when I was training with him and playing the first few games.
23:09
First game was a.
23:11
First home game was at home to wolves.
23:14
We won 3, 2.
23:15
I scored.
23:17
I thought Malcolm was wrong.
23:19
And when I was with Malcolm after the game, on our own.
23:24
So I think you made a mistake.
23:25
Mel said, what do you mean?
23:27
I said, mick Shannon ain't gone.
23:29
Peter Barnes ain't gone.
23:30
I said, see him, Mick Shannon, he is some player, him now.
23:33
He said, his legs are gone.
23:34
I said, well, these legs are gone.
23:36
I don't know what half the other team are.
23:38
Then.
23:39
I said, I'm telling you, I think you made a mistake.
23:41
But he wouldn't have it.
23:43
And he started getting rid of players, bringing players in.
23:47
Some were very good, some were very average.
23:51
And I played, I think, about 20 games, something like that.
23:58
And Malcolm really let me down.
24:00
I've actually got a book out at the moment.
24:02
Spence called the not so Secret.
24:05
Yes.
24:05
Called the not so secret football agent.
24:07
And I've got this story in my book and it's about how Malcolm really let me down big time up.
24:14
We played palace at palace and he went missing after the game.
24:18
And I protected him with a chairman.
24:19
I made out he was ill, he couldn't come in.
24:22
We were playing Man United on the Saturday, then on the Friday, I picked him up from the station.
24:27
He looked like.
24:28
I can't tell you what he looked like.
24:30
He'd been out on the piss every night in tramps.
24:34
And.
24:37
He come in training that day, the chairman turned up.
24:41
He went wrong with the chairman.
24:42
Admitted that I had lied and that he wasn't ill, that he'd gone missing, that I tried to protect him.
24:48
Chairman come out and said to me, you're banned from the football club.
24:51
I never want to see you here again.
24:52
So I went from gonna play against Man United on Saturday and that was it.
24:56
I was out the club.
24:57
I was banned.
24:58
Wow.
24:59
Wow.
24:59
That must have been a real kick in the balls, mate.
25:01
Really?
25:02
Yeah.
25:02
I never spoke to Malcolm again.
25:04
Malcolm tried to approach me a few times and.
25:08
And then he got up on stage once at a big charity, we were both at a charity and he called me up on stage to.
25:18
To be with him and it was not.
25:21
I got up there, but I said to him, alton, I don't want to be here with you.
25:24
And then they had a charity match for him at palace and I got contacted by the guy that was doing the charity.
25:30
It was a couple, a guy and a girl.
25:32
And they said, the first name that Malcolm wants is you.
25:35
I said, I'll be honest with you, I don't want to help him.
25:38
He absolutely killed my career.
25:42
I said, I tried to protect him and he killed me.
25:46
And I thought about it.
25:48
Couple of lads called me.
25:49
Couple of the old players called me.
25:51
JC Jimmy Cannon.
25:52
Few of the boys called and said, silks, we want you to come and play with us.
25:56
Peter Taylor called me Spud.
25:58
So I went and played and I didn't really speak to Malcolm the whole night.
26:03
He come up to me a couple of times and I was very uncomfortable.
26:07
Spence and I had to walk away from him.
26:12
His wife left him because of it.
26:14
Wow.
26:14
I literally put my head on the line.
26:16
If someone buys the book and reads the whole story, they'd go, oh, my God, this seems like a fantasy story, but it actually happened.
26:23
Everything I've put in my book, which is a lot more than what we're talking about now.
26:28
Yes.
26:28
But he let me down big time.
26:30
Malcolm he let me down, really let me down big time.
26:33
Let himself down as well and let his family down because I knew his wife before he knew her.
26:38
Sally.
26:40
We were really good friends when Sally was.
26:42
Worked at the Playboy Club.
26:45
And I was a great friend to Sally and she was a great friend to me.
26:49
While we were in Plymouth.
26:51
I really, really helped Sally through some dodgy times at Manchester.
26:56
I really helped her, like, amazingly helped her and she amazingly helped me.
27:02
And she'd only just had a child at that time.
27:04
Sadly, Sally's passed away now.
27:06
She was young, passed away, just turned 50, I think.
27:10
And sadly it helped break her relationship up, what he done to me.
27:17
And it certainly broke my relationship up with Malcolm.
27:20
He was a real.
27:23
Not a nice man for doing what he did.
27:25
And that's why I had to leave Man City.
27:27
And then I ended up at QPR with Terry again, which was an amazing move for me.
27:34
It was like switching back to qpr.
27:36
Do you know, Fen had come and joined us.
27:38
Terry Fennec.
27:40
Budgie was in.
27:41
Budgie was in goal.
27:43
Mad Budgie.
27:44
It's like.
27:45
It was like going back there again.
27:47
Yeah, you had a few there, right?
27:49
Tony Seeley was there, right?
27:50
Yeah.
27:51
Jack, yeah, Jack was there, yeah.
27:53
Blackjack, he had the worst.
27:56
Terry said to me once, he ain't got a very good first touch, is he still?
27:59
I said, first touch.
28:00
His third touch ain't too good either.
28:03
The ball would hit his foot, hit his knee and hit his face and bounce out in front of him.
28:07
But what a great lad.
28:09
Blackjack was a great lad.
28:10
He couldn't play.
28:11
Couldn't play at all.
28:12
But he was a great lady.
28:14
Good lad.
28:14
Good lad.
28:15
Yeah.
28:15
He, he.
28:15
He was very close with.
28:17
What's his name?
28:18
Phil Alder.
28:19
He's very close, Phil, Yeah.
28:20
Yeah.
28:21
Noddy.
28:21
Yeah.
28:23
Your longest period, was it?
28:27
Is it late in, Oran, Silky late in.
28:29
Or Spence?
28:30
Yeah.
28:30
You had a good time there?
28:32
Had a great time there.
28:33
First year was poor, but then Frank Clark took over and he said, look, I'd like you to be my assistant manager, coach.
28:41
And had three years there and really enjoyed it.
28:43
Great lads.
28:43
No money.
28:44
I mean, we never earned money.
28:46
We didn't earn money there at big clubs.
28:48
But later on it was like, you know, chase the pound.
28:51
It was one of them.
28:53
Right, right.
28:54
And it was just a great time.
28:58
There were great lads, you know, because we was all struggling.
29:01
Already is.
29:02
We were all, you know, we had nothing really, but great bunch of lads.
29:09
I love the coaching side of it.
29:13
And had three brilliant years there.
29:15
Four Brilliant years.
29:16
But the last three years with Frank Clark were the best.
29:19
He's a, he's a real lovely guy, Frank.
29:23
Real football.
29:23
Really lovely guy.
29:24
Yeah.
29:25
Really good footman and.
29:26
And now physio.
29:27
He was, he was.
29:28
Physio was very good.
29:29
He wasn't in Charlie Simpson's class.
29:32
Bill Songhurst.
29:34
He was really good.
29:35
Song.
29:35
He was very, very good.
29:37
Remember once David Beckham turned up 1, 1 early one evening about 6 o' clock, as David Beckham then was at the Manchester United School of Excellence in London.
29:48
And what he used to do every two or three weeks he'd go out and spend a week in Manchester training there and then he'd come back and train with their school of excellence here.
29:57
And he was about 15 something at.
30:01
And his dad brought him to Lake Norton for treatment.
30:06
I said the Songy in life people have said things that has been a mistake but never a bigger one was said than what you said and we still laugh about it now.
30:17
Song, he was talking and he said to David Beckham, he said, Darry said, you, you love it.
30:22
Manchester United.
30:23
Yeah.
30:23
He said, I love it.
30:24
He said, what are you doing there?
30:25
You're never ever going to get a first team game.
30:28
Why don't you come to Leighton Orient?
30:30
He said, and if you're really good at 17, you're getting their team.
30:34
He said, you're just wasting your time at Man United.
30:36
No one's going to hear of you.
30:38
Wow, isn't that the crazy story?
30:42
And Bex was 15 at the time.
30:44
So in effect that's what, you know, that's the reality.
30:48
Normally you'd never hear him.
30:50
He ended up becoming the most well known player in the world.
30:53
The superstar.
30:54
Yeah, absolutely.
30:55
I said to Song, you've made some mistakes in your time solely, but that was the biggest one.
31:00
That was the biggest one.
31:01
When it's funny.
31:03
We'll go on to this in a little bit because obviously now you're a very successful agent and you've been a successful agent for a long time.
31:10
But when you talk about the disparity in money those days where like great, great players, they still had to go out and earn a living after the game and now.
31:20
And you'll see now, bang.
31:22
Average footballers that have one season and they're set for life.
31:26
Silky sometimes that's.
31:27
I mean I know that's like the same in every industry and this comes up in a lot of my chats but you know, when you've played the game, you played the game for a long, long time and, and
31:36
like Orient was in the.
31:38
Probably the middle of your playing career.
31:40
Correct, probably.
31:41
And towards the end.
31:43
Towards the end and.
31:44
And you're talking now.
31:45
He was there four seasons and like you still had to go out and find a living afterwards.
31:50
It.
31:50
It's a shame.
31:51
Right.
31:51
There's some really, really great players had to struggle.
31:55
Everyone.
31:56
Spence, you know, again, I me touch on this in the book.
32:01
I don't know one player.
32:02
I knew some great players.
32:04
Truly great players.
32:05
I'm talking about Charlie.
32:06
Graham Sooness.
32:07
What a player.
32:08
Kevin Keegan.
32:09
What a player.
32:10
Glenn Hodle.
32:12
Best player I've ever played against.
32:13
Tony Curry.
32:14
Best player I ever played with.
32:16
Stevie P.
32:17
Steve Paraman.
32:20
Emily News, John Toshak.
32:24
Steve Highway.
32:26
All these players were.
32:28
I could go on and on and on and on.
32:32
They all had one thing in common, all of them.
32:36
And that was all out to work at the end of their careers.
32:39
Yeah.
32:39
And they were like one of them.
32:41
Had to work and like, you know, people watching this, some people are going to notice.
32:46
There's going to be a lot of people that don't.
32:47
But they were like gods to their fans.
32:49
These players you just reeled off.
32:51
They were like.
32:52
They weren't.
32:52
They weren't like just not just gods to their fan spans.
32:56
These were truly fantastic players playing at mega clubs.
33:02
Yeah.
33:02
Liverpool.
33:03
Charlie.
33:03
Graham Souness, Liverpool Keegan.
33:05
Liverpool.
33:06
Tosha.
33:06
Liverpool.
33:07
Emily News, Liverpool.
33:08
Yeah.
33:09
Stevie P.
33:11
Tottenham.
33:11
Glenn Hoddle, Tottenham.
33:13
Tony Curry.
33:15
Qpr, Sheffield United.
33:18
You go on and on and on and on.
33:20
These were big clubs at the time.
33:23
Mega clubs.
33:23
Yeah.
33:24
Mega clubs.
33:25
Mega clubs.
33:27
Yeah.
33:27
Not one of them earn enough money, let alone to not work again.
33:34
Not one of them earned enough money to pay their mortgage.
33:38
Yeah, I know.
33:39
Isn't it incredible to pay the mortgage.
33:40
Off, to pay them all.
33:42
If you buy a house for 50, 60 grand.
33:44
70.
33:45
80 grand, you could only put like 6, 7, 8 grand out.
33:49
Rest was a mortgage.
33:51
Now, you know, without naming it, I've got some players now that they take home in their wage packet comfortably without any bonuses.
34:06
200, 250 grand a month.
34:10
Yeah, yeah.
34:11
And you're thinking, well, on 250 grand a month in four months out and buy a house for a million pound.
34:18
Yeah.
34:19
And they.
34:20
A lot of players now, and I'm not saying this in a detrimental way, but a lot of players now, after one year, if they wanted to, a lot of players could retire.
34:33
Yeah.
34:33
Give them three or four years, they could retire, their mum and dad would retire.
34:40
They could have a 4 million pound house.
34:42
They can have a boat it's actually quite scary.
34:45
Good luck to them.
34:47
Good luck to all of them.
34:48
Yeah, it's actually scary where I see players now.
34:53
They're all right, you know, they're all right.
34:55
They're not that good, they're not that bad.
34:57
They're on.
34:57
They're earning between 75 and 100 grand a week before tax, like 55, 60 grand a week after tax, 3 million pound a year after tax and I think they're all right.
35:09
Would they have gotten Palace's team when I was there?
35:12
No, not one of them.
35:14
No.
35:15
Would they have got immediate team?
35:17
Not one of them.
35:19
Would they have gotten QBR's team?
35:21
Not one of them.
35:23
They were like years behind.
35:24
The Tony Curry's, the Jerry Francis, the Simon Steinrod, the Vincey Leers, the Billy Gilbert, the Terry Fennecs, the Kenny Sansons, the.
35:33
The Ian Evans, the John Burridge.
35:36
Yeah, the Even players like Jeff Bourne, Ian Walsh, Swindy strikers.
35:42
Now, most of them couldn't live with swindy.
35:46
It's actually quite scary.
35:49
And we were so much fitter then than they are today, Spence.
35:53
Oh my God.
35:54
Fitness level when we played, you know, one thing I was.
35:57
And all the players.
35:59
Oh yeah, they're like light years behind now.
36:01
Light years?
36:02
Really light years?
36:04
Yeah, light years.
36:04
Light years.
36:05
Total light years.
36:09
None of them are fit, physically fit to run.
36:13
They hard now if a player covers.
36:15
A midfield player covers six miles in a game, they go, that's unbelievable.
36:19
He.
36:20
Yeah, Wow.
36:21
I play, I, I play now in an over 40s team at my age, most players, yeah.
36:28
Wow.
36:29
Do you know that not long ago I put a watch on my wrist in a game and I covered it up so that couldn't see it.
36:36
I wanted to see how far I run.
36:39
Now a Premier League player, midfield player, will run six miles.
36:42
That'll be a lot.
36:42
That'll be a lot.
36:44
Most run about five and a half.
36:46
I ran in this over 40s game, 5.9 miles.
36:50
Wow.
36:51
Wow.
36:51
So somebody actually explained to me how they're fit.
36:54
Wow.
36:55
I could be their grandfathers.
36:56
You know what?
36:57
None of them are fit, Spence.
36:58
None of.
36:59
Trust me when I tell you they went back and did the training that we did.
37:04
They would collapse after half an hour.
37:06
They'd be ruined.
37:08
They don't do any running anymore.
37:11
We used to do 20, 30 sprints, a session box to boxes, cross countries.
37:17
They don't do any of that.
37:19
Wow.
37:20
This is.
37:21
They look good.
37:22
They look good because of the food and the, and the weights and all that.
37:25
They look good but they're playing on carpets now.
37:28
Yes.
37:29
Yes.
37:29
Half the game is played in their own half.
37:31
Just passing the ball around to each other.
37:33
Correct.
37:34
The strikers hardly move.
37:35
The wide players hardly have to move.
37:38
Yeah.
37:39
If we played one ball backwards, if the next one didn't go forward, Terry, Malcolm, any, they'd go mental.
37:45
Everything was bang, bang, bang, the tackles.
37:48
Then players will tackle you across the top of your legs.
37:52
If they did that now, they get a red card.
37:54
Them days, referees, you say, get up, come, and you're right, you get kicked to pieces.
37:59
Players today get hit, they go down screaming.
38:03
The one thing we never wanted to do, Spence, when someone really hit us, we never, ever, ever wanted to fall on the floor.
38:09
Do you know why?
38:10
We didn't want the other player to see that he'd hurt us.
38:14
We wanted to say, yeah, go on, you keep fucking kicking me, you're not going to hurt me.
38:18
Yeah, that's how I was.
38:19
That's how a lot of players were.
38:21
Now somebody hits him and they scream.
38:25
What would happen if Mike Tyson would have hit him or Floyd Patterson or Joe Frazier?
38:32
What would happen if they.
38:33
Yeah, they'd lay there for six months.
38:36
Yeah.
38:37
No, I see all that nonsense in the game and it, and it's.
38:39
Well, it's disappointing.
38:41
It's disappointing because obviously the kids pick up on that as well.
38:44
But what you're, what you're saying right now is so, so crazy to me because I don't think anybody picks up on that because people naturally assume that with the dieting, the lifestyle, the, that players are way fitter now.
38:59
But this is really nowhere near it.
39:01
Nowhere near.
39:03
I tell you something very interesting.
39:04
I'll tell you something very interesting, Spence.
39:07
This is very interesting.
39:08
Yeah.
39:11
The best trainers of speed.
39:13
Because everyone tells me footballers are so much quicker today than they used to be.
39:17
Yeah.
39:18
Speak to any of the players that train with me.
39:20
Ask them if any of the players today could beat me in a 50 meter, 100 meter race.
39:25
Every player.
39:25
You say.
39:25
So they wouldn't have got near Silky.
39:27
They would not have got near him.
39:29
Right?
39:30
This is very interesting.
39:31
This is a fact.
39:32
This is not my opinion.
39:33
This is a fact.
39:36
The fastest or best, let's say the best coaches in the world for speed are athletic coaches.
39:43
That's what they're training for.
39:44
They're not training to play football.
39:46
Correct.
39:46
They're training them for speed.
39:48
Okay?
39:49
In the 1980s, the fastest hundred meter runner in the country was Linford Christie.
39:55
Right.
39:56
And before that it was Alan Wells.
39:58
Okay?
40:00
Runners today.
40:01
Runners today.
40:02
They have lighter shoes and they run on a faster surface.
40:08
Okay, right.
40:09
Over 110 meters.
40:12
The fastest runner in the country today is 2 meters quicker than Linford Christie was, with better shoes and better surface.
40:19
Over 55 meters, which is more or less 60 yards.
40:25
It means he was one and a half seconds quicker.
40:28
Okay, one.
40:29
Sorry, one second quicker.
40:32
Over 30 yards.
40:34
He was half a second quicker.
40:36
Over 15 yards, he's that much quicker.
40:40
So how comes the fastest man in the country over 15 yards, is that much quicker, yet somehow footballers have become yards quicker?
40:49
Can somebody explain to me how that happens?
40:52
How?
40:53
Look at boxing.
40:54
Let's take boxing, have a look at speed of punches and movement and accuracy.
41:03
Go back to 70s.
41:06
Ali, Frazier, Floyd Patterson, the heavyweights, Mike Tyson, all these people.
41:13
Yeah.
41:15
Ali was the quickest puncher you've ever seen.
41:18
Joe Fraser was an unbelievably quick puncher.
41:22
Yeah, really quick.
41:24
How comes that no one has improved the speed of punching in boxing?
41:29
How comes no one's improved the movement in boxing?
41:32
How comes no one's improved the speed of sprinters in athletics?
41:39
How come no one has improved the speed of tennis players?
41:42
From John McEnroe, Jimmy Connors.
41:45
Yeah, yeah.
41:47
Ilya Nastasi.
41:49
No one's quicker.
41:50
They're not quicker servers.
41:52
They're not quicker.
41:53
Tell us.
41:53
Yeah, not one sport in the world's become quicker except football.
41:58
Right?
41:59
Yeah.
41:59
Doesn't make sense, does it?
42:01
What are they talking about?
42:02
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
42:03
What on earth are they talking about?
42:06
So football is 10 yards quicker, but athletes are only 3 inches quicker.
42:10
Good.
42:10
Good luck with that one, Spence.
42:13
So you being on the other side of it, do you think that's all marketing?
42:18
Do you think that's all part of the.
42:20
The package, that football is so much better these days, so much quicker?
42:24
Do you think they've got to set.
42:26
They got to sell it?
42:27
And all us older players all know it's a load of rubbish, but if it's fed enough into the younger generation, they believe it.
42:37
Yeah, they believe it.
42:39
Yeah, yeah.
42:42
They get kicked once and there's a yellow card.
42:45
We had to get kicked by the same player 10 times before the ref even spoke to him.
42:50
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
42:53
No, it's.
42:54
The game has changed so much in that way.
42:56
And like I said, when you see the players getting tackled now and they roll over and they're screaming out loud,.
43:02
Honestly, Spencer, it's madness.
43:04
And not all of them do it, but a big majority do.
43:07
And they're playing today with footballs.
43:08
If you edit, it goes 40 yards.
43:10
Yeah.
43:11
And when we edit a ball, it only went 10 yards because it was like a rock.
43:15
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
43:16
I was speaking with.
43:18
Just going back quickly to the running and the sprinting.
43:21
I was speaking with Stevie Love and he said, you gave him the name Bionic.
43:27
It was you, Stevie Lovell.
43:29
I gave him that bonnet.
43:30
He used to sit out running at one pace.
43:33
And this was in marathon runs, long runs.
43:36
Started running and never stopped.
43:38
And I gave him the nickname.
43:39
I said, he's like the Bionic Man.
43:41
He starts running and never stops.
43:43
Yes, that was my name for him.
43:45
Bionic.
43:45
That's right.
43:46
He was.
43:47
He was affectionately saying, our Silky gave me that name.
43:49
He like was a training.
43:50
That's true.
43:51
I gave every.
43:52
Every club I was at, Spence, I gave everyone their nickname.
43:56
When I went to.
43:57
To.
43:58
To qbr.
43:59
Simon St Becomes Simple.
44:02
Yeah.
44:04
It was simple.
44:05
Yeah.
44:05
Everywhere.
44:06
Everywhere I went, I made a player a nickname.
44:10
None of them were called by their real names.
44:12
They all, all had.
44:13
After a week, everyone there had a nickname and everyone used to join in.
44:17
I started Bionic.
44:19
And within two weeks, everyone in the club, even Terry Venables, was calling him Bionic.
44:25
I love it.
44:25
Did you.
44:26
Did you give.
44:26
Did you give Rashid Spider or did he.
44:28
Spider.
44:29
Spider, yeah, yeah.
44:32
Spider Man.
44:33
Yeah.
44:33
Yeah.
44:34
Fantastic.
44:35
She looked like a spider.
44:36
He was all.
44:36
He was like this.
44:37
He was all arms and legs.
44:39
One day, you look like Spider Man.
44:41
That was it.
44:41
The boys went, Spider.
44:43
Yeah.
44:44
Fantastic.
44:44
I love it.
44:45
I love it.
44:47
What when you.
44:49
When you finish playing, did.
44:52
And I don't know this.
44:53
So when you finish playing, did you just transition into being an agent?
44:58
You did some managing?
45:00
No, when I finished playing, believe it or not, I become a greyhound trainer.
45:04
Wow.
45:05
For three and a half years.
45:06
And without going into the story, I want people to buy my book, then they'll see the story.
45:11
So without going into the story, I got into football because of three reasons.
45:21
A player that I played with at Southend, I was at Southampton one year, called Danny o', Shea, called me right out the blue.
45:30
My wife at the time, who sadly passed away when she was 50, 49, actually.
45:36
To life.
45:36
49.
45:37
She pushed me into it.
45:39
And I hadn't watched a football match for nearly four years and I got pushed into doing a.
45:46
Trying to help a player called Alan Kimball.
45:49
And I did.
45:50
All by coincidence.
45:52
Everything that happened was coincidence.
45:55
And I've done that deal.
45:56
And before I knew where I was, I took off.
46:00
The only thing I didn't understand, Spence, is what you could charge.
46:03
I could have been charging between 50 and 200 grand deals.
46:07
I was charging two grand.
46:09
I didn't have a clue what I was doing.
46:11
I saved Mill Wolf, I saved Millwall from going out of existence and I should have got 200 gram that the chairman gave me five grand and I thought, oh, that's good.
46:20
So I had no money.
46:21
I was plotless.
46:21
I was literally partless at the time.
46:23
We had a disabled daughter, sadly.
46:26
She passed away when she was five.
46:28
She passed away 1990.
46:30
Thanks, mate.
46:31
When?
46:31
In 1995.
46:33
And we were living off of her disability money, 62 and a half quid a week.
46:37
We just pop.
46:39
We're living in a piss, really.
46:42
Yes.
46:42
So, in effect, Spence, I didn't have a clue what I was doing.
46:45
And.
46:46
Right.
46:46
I.
46:47
I should have been able to retire after about six years and after six years, I'd earned about 120 grand.
46:54
I did not have a clue what I was doing and it took me five, six years to get the hang of it.
46:59
All.
47:00
Right, wow.
47:02
But then you went on to.
47:05
You went on to do very, very well and you still do very, very well as.
47:09
As an agent.
47:10
What.
47:10
What was the tipping point there where you thought, hold on a minute.
47:12
Like, did you have any advice?
47:14
Was there any other agents that would.
47:16
I'm.
47:17
I would imagine that agents aren't too forthcoming in trying to give another agent some advice, was that.
47:24
No, they're not.
47:25
I mean, you find out by trial and error, really, and then you see what other people are earning.
47:30
Yeah.
47:31
And I met a lot of agents and some very, very good.
47:36
Yeah.
47:38
But a lot of them not very good and.
47:41
Right.
47:42
A lot of them lie and they cheat and I suppose it's like that in all walks of life.
47:47
Right.
47:47
I think that the agent that helped me out the most when I was started was he wasn't really an agent, he'd become an agent at the time he was working for Millwall was a very old friend of mine
47:57
called Clive Berlin.
47:59
Okay.
48:00
When I was at Queen's Park Rangers, he lived right near me, so he was one of the first people to help me.
48:07
Penis A Harvey helped me, but at the same time he turned me over.
48:12
So he was of great help.
48:14
And at the same time of being a great help, he would tell you you were getting X amount of money.
48:20
In effect, he was getting five times what he told you.
48:23
So he was a great friend in one way, and I love him to pieces, but he turned me over big time.
48:31
So, you know, I've got to.
48:34
To understand all this as time's gone on and even Right through to today.
48:39
People contact you and they just lie out.
48:42
Out of their ass.
48:43
But because I know so many people now, I make one phone call and I find out that what they're telling me is complete.
48:50
Yeah, of course.
48:51
And you do.
48:52
You do deals now?
48:53
You do deals like worldwide, right?
48:55
Silky now?
48:56
Pretty much.
48:57
Yeah.
48:57
Everywhere.
48:57
Yeah, I just.
48:58
The last deal I did in January, I took pakatar from West Ham to Brazil for 42 million pound.
49:05
Yeah.
49:06
That was the.
49:07
The last deal I did in January.
49:08
But I'll.
49:09
Yeah.
49:09
I work all over the world now, Spence.
49:11
Yeah.
49:12
Yeah.
49:12
Do you do.
49:13
Do you think that.
49:15
You think they're shot now, Silks, West Ham?
49:17
Do you think they're.
49:18
They're gonna.
49:18
They're gonna drop now?
49:20
I gotta tell you, I'd hate to be out.
49:23
I wish I could say no, they will survive.
49:27
But it's completely out of their hands.
49:29
Yeah.
49:30
Minute they're relying on Tottenham getting beat at Chelsea and then getting beat at home to Everton and then West Ham beating Leeds.
49:40
It can happen, Spence.
49:41
In football, anything can happen.
49:43
Anything can happen.
49:44
Yeah.
49:44
Yeah.
49:44
If you said to me, silk is ten grand and you must bet that ten grand, what you going to back it on?
49:51
I'll back it on Tottenham staying up.
49:53
You know, it's interesting, I'd like your opinion on this because everyone's saying, oh, it's a good idea, Xavier Alonso going into Chelsea and he's going to be a manager.
50:03
I'm not so sure Xavier Alonso has been around long enough as a manager to go in as a manager as opposed to a coach.
50:11
What do you think about that?
50:14
I think they're very similar roles now.
50:17
Okay.
50:17
The manager is the coach.
50:18
The coach is the manager.
50:20
Do you know what, Spence?
50:22
Nothing surprises me in football anymore.
50:25
99 times out of 100, I'm right.
50:28
Yes.
50:30
There was an appointment that happened last year that I found really strange.
50:34
Go on.
50:34
Really strange.
50:36
Yet that person has gone in and won the league.
50:40
Oh, yeah.
50:41
Vincent Co.
50:42
Going to Bayern Munich, right?
50:44
Yeah.
50:45
Yeah.
50:45
Now, I.
50:45
I've never known a manager to have one season in the Premier League and get relegated and then end up in a job like Bayern Munich.
50:54
So in respect, you can say nothing shocks you anymore.
50:59
What I would say Chelsea is a very difficult club to manage.
51:03
They bought loads and loads of players.
51:07
I don't think the people buying them, the owners or the man who's working on behalf of the owner, I don't think he's got a clue about football.
51:16
I don't think anyone at the club in charge has got a clue about football.
51:21
I don't think the right hand knows what the left hand's doing.
51:25
And they just went and bought player after player.
51:28
They ended up buying about six wingers.
51:30
Well, who buys six wingers?
51:33
Something didn't sit right with me with all the players they were buying and it still doesn't sit right with me.
51:39
The only way for me that Chelsea can go forward is if out of their 25 first team squad, at least 12 of them are gone for the season after.
51:56
And this guy replaces four or five of the players and then the rest are made up with younger players coming through from the academy, stuff like that.
52:05
And I think they got whoever goes in there, it's got a massive job because there are far too many players and there's far too many players that are not as good as what their reputations earned them.
52:19
Quickly Silks I know you got a crack on, mate.
52:22
Best deal you've ever done as an agent that you thought, you know what everyone made, everyone did well out of that.
52:28
The club, the player, myself, like that was a great deal.
52:34
Been quite a few.
52:37
Very hard to name one.
52:38
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
52:40
I think if I had to hang my hat on one, yeah, it would have been getting Pacatar to West Ham because The club wanted 45 million pound and wouldn't take one penny less.
52:53
Not a penny less.
52:55
David Sullivan said, I'm going on holiday.
52:58
You have the authorization to go and do the deal.
53:01
Just don't pay 45 million pound and the player's salary.
53:06
Said, try and get him for 20,000 pound a week less than what they want.
53:11
Than they want.
53:12
He said, just do the best you can and when you've done everything, let me know and I'll say yes or no.
53:18
And I really worked.
53:21
I can't tell you how hard I worked on that deal.
53:24
And I ended up getting him for 10 million pound less than what David Sullivan said.
53:32
There were 7.
53:33
7 million on bonuses, but 5 of those million were impossible to achieve.
53:39
So West Ham and effect can only really pay 2 million of them, right?
53:43
And I got the player for 25 grand a week less than what they were asking.
53:49
So if you look at a deal over five years, I saved the club on what they were willing to pay, 16 million quid.
53:58
And I think that was probably.
54:00
It was the hardest deal I've ever done.
54:02
The agent who was working on behalf of Leon the selling club slaughtered me, said to me, you've absolutely raped us.
54:10
I managed to get the agent and Pakatar's got different Agents now, but his original agents were two guys who were half Brazilian, half Israeli.
54:20
They were a father and son.
54:22
They were absolutely brilliant.
54:24
They were really top class to deal with.
54:27
And it was a lot of work.
54:29
It was hard work, but it was a deal that I got over the line, that I never, ever thought I would get over the line.
54:36
And that was a really satisfying deal, because when I started it, it looked impossible.
54:40
And also Suchek, when I took Suchek to West Ham, he came over on the Friday.
54:49
Well, he come over just before the deadline and the deal collapsed, completely collapsed.
54:54
And I come up with an idea to keep the deal alive.
54:58
David Sullivan was very reluctant, but said, silk, you know what, try and do it.
55:04
And with the players agent Paul Pasca, we worked for West Ham against the chairman in the Czech Republic, and it was a very, very, very difficult deal.
55:18
Extremely difficult deal.
55:20
But we managed to get him on loan with an obligation that if West Ham stayed up, they take him.
55:25
Whereas they never, ever, ever wanted to let him go on loan.
55:28
They said, either sell him or nothing.
55:31
But he wouldn't sign.
55:33
For various reasons, the player wouldn't sign.
55:35
He said, I'll come on loan with an obligation to stay if you stay up, but I'm not coming.
55:41
And then you get relegated because they're already in the bottom three.
55:45
So working on that deal with Paul Pasca and with a guy called Andre was very difficult, but very satisfying because we worked so hard to get the deal done that.
55:58
And he went there and he done fantastic under Moisey.
56:01
And Moisey kept them up.
56:02
Both.
56:03
Both big, big players for West Ham as well, by the way.
56:05
Right.
56:05
Pakita and.
56:06
And Suchek.
56:07
Wow, big players.
56:09
Yeah.
56:10
Suchek has become a hero there, you.
56:12
Know, I would imagine David Sullivan, difficult man to do business with.
56:17
He used to.
56:18
So when I was at the club and I was at String fellas for years, he always used to be in or.
56:23
Great man, you know, always interesting.
56:25
Every Friday night.
56:26
I used to come with him a lot of times.
56:28
Every Friday night we'd come with.
56:30
Used to be a lot of times.
56:32
Okay, yeah, there was Dave, me, Paul Stone, who owned Circus Tavern, and an old boy called Harry, who, sadly, Harry has passed away now, but we used to come every Friday night and.
56:46
And a minder, right, with the Minder with the.
56:49
With the mustache.
56:50
I remember.
56:52
Yeah, every now and again.
56:53
Yeah, that was Harry.
56:54
Yeah, that was Harry.
56:55
I've known Dave now for 20, 32 years and.
57:06
Right, right.
57:07
He's always under pressure, Dave, you know, I love him to pieces, but he makes A lot of bad decisions in football.
57:14
He does make some terrible decisions, but I love him to pieces.
57:19
But I'm sure that he keeps saying, well, Silk is right, right, right, right, right.
57:23
But I'm going to keep going against him because one day he must be wrong.
57:26
Listen, if they go down, it'll be a real.
57:30
It's not great because I love Dave, West Ham, I don't support them, but I love the club because I've done a few deals there.
57:37
Not as many as what people think, but I'm very, very close with Dave as a personal friend as well, and I just.
57:44
It will be awful if they go down, but it's been out of their hands now and I'm not sure it's going to be a good outcome.
57:56
Is West Ham the club that you watch, Silk, or do you keep an eye out for the result?
58:00
Or do you.
58:00
Do you keep an eye out for the results of all the clubs you've played at over the years?
58:05
Every club I play for, I look at the results here.
58:08
Yeah.
58:09
Yeah.
58:09
The clubs I follow closely, the clubs I follow closest are qpr, palace and West Ham, because of my friendship with Dave, and also I was at West Ham when I was a kid.
58:25
I was there for a year.
58:27
Right, so.
58:28
So those three clubs I look at first, qpr, Palace, West Ham and Man City.
58:36
Before you go, Silky, remind me again, mate, of.
58:39
Of the book and.
58:40
And where you can get it.
58:42
I'll tell you now.
58:43
I'm gonna get you.
58:44
I'm gonna hold it up.
58:45
Called the not so Secret Football Agent.
58:50
Fantastic, mate.
58:51
David Sullivan said something to me that I really appreciated.
58:56
He read the book and he said, silk, I have to tell you something.
59:01
I really enjoyed the book.
59:04
And you wrote that from the heart.
59:05
And I can tell that you've written it, not somebody else.
59:08
I said, yeah, I did, Dave.
59:10
I wrote it.
59:11
And he said, I can tell it's really come from the heart.
59:13
He said, I really enjoyed it and I've told everybody that it's a really good read.
59:18
And everybody that's read it have come that I know that have read it have come to me and said, still not saying it because it's you.
59:25
We absolutely love the book.
59:28
Yeah, absolutely.
59:30
Listen, mate, it's been.
59:31
It's been absolutely lovely the past hour.
59:34
I've really thoroughly enjoyed it, mate.
59:36
Yeah, And I'm.
59:39
I'm glad things are still going well for you out there.
59:41
Really pleased.
59:42
Cheers, mate.
59:43
Thanks a lot, Silky.
59:44
God bless you.
59:45
Soon, mate.
59:46
God bless you.
59:47
Take care.
59:47
All the very best.
59:49
Bye, mate.
59:56
Sa.