Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Why actor Robert Wagner is now a 'person of interest" in Natalie Wood's death

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Why actor Robert Wagner is now a 'person of interest" in Natalie Wood's death · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel
0:09
Speaker 1: one two. Actress Natalie Wood is dead at forty three,
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Speaker 1: the apparent victim of a drowning accident of Santa Catalina
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Speaker 1: Island in California. Bob Shell Now, after years of investigation
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Speaker 1: in the Last Hours, movie and TV star Robert Wagner
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Speaker 1: named a person of interest in the horrific drowning death
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Speaker 1: of his wife. Movie icon Natalie would, I'm Nancy Grace,
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Speaker 1: this is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us.
0:46
Speaker 1: What led them to finally announce a person of interest?
0:51
Speaker 1: Many people arguing that's uh legal cop talk jargon for
0:57
Speaker 1: a suspect MS street swirling around the night that Natalie
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Speaker 1: would seemingly falls from her boat, her yacht the Splendor,
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Speaker 1: or from its dingy and dies in the dark waters
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Speaker 1: around Cataline Island, which is really l a Los Angeles County.
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Speaker 1: What really happened? The autopsy report didn't jive with the
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Speaker 1: theory it was an accidental drowning, according to many. Right
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Speaker 1: now breaking news that may have led police to name
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Speaker 1: her husband, Robert Wagner, TV star, a person of interest.
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Speaker 1: Joining me an all star lineup, Cheryl mccolluman, director of
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Speaker 1: the Cold Case Institute, who has personally investigated the case.
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Speaker 1: Alexis Tourez Chuck, investigative reporter with Radar Online dot Com
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Speaker 1: and special guest, the author of Goodbye Natalie, Goodbye Splendor,
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Speaker 1: Natalie's yacht's name Marty Ruley, First two you, Alexis Tourez Chuck.
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Speaker 1: The l A County authorities now naming TV star Robert
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Speaker 1: Wagner as a person of interest in a potential homicide.
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Speaker 1: What happened, Alexis so The police have said they recently
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Speaker 1: have received hundreds of new tips, and they have two
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Speaker 1: new witnesses that have come forward and that have given
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Speaker 1: them enough information that they're saying that they are now
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Speaker 1: determining this to be Natalie's death to be a suspicious death.
2:29
Speaker 1: They say that these witnesses have provided a completely different
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Speaker 1: account of what happened that night, and that they are
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Speaker 1: so credible that they've reopened this case and they're going
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Speaker 1: to investigate it as a death, a suspicious death. Guys,
2:40
Speaker 1: this is a major bombshell, a major bombshell. In the
2:47
Speaker 1: last hours, we learned new witnesses reportedly tail detectives they
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Speaker 1: saw TV star Robert Wagner arguing with his then wife
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Speaker 1: Natalie Wood on his boat, their yacht, the Blender, just
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Speaker 1: moments before she drowned in a horrific incident. He is
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Speaker 1: now named a person of interest by the l A
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Speaker 1: p D. The drowning death long deemed quote suspicious by police,
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Speaker 1: but they never did anything about it. But six years
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Speaker 1: ago they suddenly reopened the investigation. Was it from pressure
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Speaker 1: from the press? I know last year at crime con
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Speaker 1: um that we had in Indianapolis, we focused an entire
3:33
Speaker 1: evening along with Cheryl McCullum's wine and crime. She did
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Speaker 1: the wine, I did the crime. Uh, Cheryl McCollum. We
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Speaker 1: focused completely that entire night with the help of about
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Speaker 1: a hundred and fifty amateur sleuth to dissect the case
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Speaker 1: and joining us. What's her sister, Lana? I think this
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Speaker 1: is a right call, Nancy. I think it's overdue back
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Speaker 1: to Alexis tourest chock radar on line dot com. Any
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Speaker 1: idea who the new witnesses are. The police have been
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Speaker 1: very very tight with this information, but one thing that
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Speaker 1: they said some more information that one of the witnesses
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Speaker 1: heard crashing and yelling from Robert and natalie stateroom. So
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Speaker 1: that is somebody who was probably on a boat right
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Speaker 1: next to them. So they because they could hear this.
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Speaker 1: So this is a huge, huge change. They've never said
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Speaker 1: this before, but they heard this yelling crashing in the room,
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Speaker 1: showing that there was a fight going on between the
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Speaker 1: two of them, even though Robert has said there wasn't one.
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Speaker 1: Here's the thing, Alexis Torres Chuck. If they are saying
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Speaker 1: that this is a homicide, there are only a few
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Speaker 1: legitimate suspects, and they would be the people on the boat.
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Speaker 1: The people on the boat were the boat captain who
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Speaker 1: I interviewed extensively, Christopher Walking, her co star, Natalie's co
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Speaker 1: star in Brainstorm, and Robert Wagner and Natalie herself. Um,
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Speaker 1: I really do not believe it's the boat captain that
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Speaker 1: leaves to people Walking and her husband Robert Wagner. Now,
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Speaker 1: at first the boat captain Davern didn't come clean, but
5:14
Speaker 1: I got a hold of him, and this is what
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Speaker 1: Natalie Wood's boat captain, the yacht master tells me on
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Speaker 1: HLN Dennis What happened that night? Was there an argument
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Speaker 1: on the yacht? Yes, that night, there was a there
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Speaker 1: was an argument that actually started the day before, but
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Speaker 1: that particular night in the afternoon, Christopher Walking and Natalie
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Speaker 1: they had gone ashore to a restaurant which was the
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Speaker 1: only restaurant on that part of the island, and the
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Speaker 1: tension was building throughout the whole weekend of Robert Wagner
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Speaker 1: being jealous of Christopher Walking and and uh, that afternoon,
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Speaker 1: Robert Wagner and myself we joined Christopher Natalie at the
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Speaker 1: restaurant for dinner. And we had dinner, we had drinks. Um,
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Speaker 1: Robert Wagers was time to return to the boat. Uh,
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Speaker 1: Natalie want, they want, We all kind of want to
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Speaker 1: stay a little longer, but r J said no, We're
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Speaker 1: going to go back to the boat. So we all
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Speaker 1: went back to the boat. You know, I want to
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Speaker 1: go to Marty Rule. Special guests joining me in addition
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Speaker 1: to Cheryl McCollum and Alexis Rest guys for those of
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Speaker 1: you just joining us. Bombshell Now TV star Robert Wagner
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Speaker 1: named a person of interest in the death of his
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Speaker 1: wife Natalie would Marty Ruley, author of Goodbye Natalie, Goodbye Splendor.
6:46
Speaker 1: You can find it on Amazon dot com. It just
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Speaker 1: struck me, guys, you're hearing me speaking with Natalie's boat
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Speaker 1: captain Dennis Davern Marty. Why is it that everybody wanted
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Speaker 1: to stay at the restaurant have a good time, but
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Speaker 1: Robert whitness is no, we're going back, so everybody just
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Speaker 1: packs up in leaves. Why why is that he wanted
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Speaker 1: to get back to the boat because he what he
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Speaker 1: told Dennis that night was he didn't like party in
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Speaker 1: in public, which didn't correspond with them many years before
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Speaker 1: that he partied in public at the restaurant. He was
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Speaker 1: jealous of Natalie and Christopher walking and it carried over
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Speaker 1: into every activity they had that weekend. But what I
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Speaker 1: would like to address are these two witnesses in question
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Speaker 1: here that the l A detectives are talking about. Now.
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Speaker 1: These two witnesses came forward very early after the case
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Speaker 1: was reopened, and they substantiated Dennis de Verne's claims of
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Speaker 1: the arguing on the boat not only for Saturday night,
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Speaker 1: but also for Friday night. One of the things that
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Speaker 1: happened with me, because it was in the media huge
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Speaker 1: at the time when the case was reopened, that you
8:06
Speaker 1: know about the book Good By Natalie and about the
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Speaker 1: case being reopened and the testimonial packages and the petition.
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Speaker 1: So a lot of people who wanted to let the
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Speaker 1: l A County Sheriff's Department know their claims or accounts
8:23
Speaker 1: and stories about Natalie and r J called me first
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Speaker 1: to see if I thought they should turn in their
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Speaker 1: account to the detectives. I would just listen, and I
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Speaker 1: always advised everyone to turn their story into the detectives.
8:43
Speaker 1: And one time I received a call from a man
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Speaker 1: who said he witnessed Natalie's murder. I did not even
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Speaker 1: talk with him. I highly recommended he called the detectives.
8:56
Speaker 1: I gave him the number. I pleaded with him to
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Speaker 1: do that. These two witnesses in question have their accounts
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Speaker 1: that are very credible, correspond exactly with Dennis de Verne's story.
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Speaker 1: But yet the department feared that in a courtroom, any good,
9:18
Speaker 1: high powered attorney defense attorney could ride them about why
9:23
Speaker 1: they waited thirty years. But there's reasons why they waited
9:26
Speaker 1: thirty years, good reason why they waited. They always felt
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Speaker 1: uncomfortable about Natalie's death, but the case was closed, closed,
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Speaker 1: the case was labeled accidental. They thought, okay, so they
9:39
Speaker 1: probably investigated, knew the argument had nothing to do with
9:42
Speaker 1: the death. When the case was reopened, they thought their
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Speaker 1: story was important and they are credible witnesses. And now
9:52
Speaker 1: Robert Wagner is named the person of interest in Natalie's death,
9:56
Speaker 1: as he was for several years not named but thought
10:00
Speaker 1: of as the person of interest, but now he's publicly named.
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Speaker 1: So what I think I'm hearing, Alexis Torres Chuck writer
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Speaker 1: online dot Com, is that witnesses came forward to Marty
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Speaker 1: Ruley after she published her book and after the case
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Speaker 1: was reopened several years ago, she advised these witnesses to
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Speaker 1: go to police. It is her belief that these are
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Speaker 1: the two new witnesses that police are relying on to
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Speaker 1: name Robert Wagner a person of interest. Is that correct, Alexis, yes.
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Speaker 1: And that's the thing is the police had close the case,
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Speaker 1: and they hadn't done anything for decades, and then all
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Speaker 1: of a sudden, they opened a back up and people
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Speaker 1: finally came forward. They thought this is something that I
10:44
Speaker 1: had witnessed all these years, only these are witnesses. There's
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Speaker 1: also been so much media pressure, Alexis. I mean, we've
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Speaker 1: highlighted it here, we have highlighted it at crime Come
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Speaker 1: with thousands of people attended. Take a listen to what
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Speaker 1: else the boat captain tells me happened the night Natalie
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Speaker 1: drowns dead. Listen, we all went back to the boat. Um,
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Speaker 1: I tied the dinghy up on the swim platform with
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Speaker 1: a ball line and a stern line, and we all
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Speaker 1: went inside the boat and opened a bottle of wine,
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Speaker 1: put the kettle on for some tea, because now they
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Speaker 1: like to have tea before she went to bed, and um,
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Speaker 1: the jealousy was. It was just getting so so tense
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Speaker 1: that Robert Wagner had picked up the bottle of wine
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Speaker 1: and smashed it right in front of Natalie and Christopher
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Speaker 1: on the coffee table. And at that moment, Christopher stood
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Speaker 1: up and he went directly to his stateroom, and that
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Speaker 1: was the last I've seen him for that whole night.
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Speaker 1: At that point, Natalie was devastated, and she went into
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Speaker 1: her stateroom and Robert Wagner had followed, and they were
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Speaker 1: arguing in the stateroom that night. Robert Wagner and etally
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Speaker 1: would uh ferocious fight going on. You turned up your
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Speaker 1: music so they would not think in your mind that
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Speaker 1: you were eaves dropping or trying to hear them. But
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Speaker 1: you did hear them? Yeah, yes, I did. Um, And
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Speaker 1: I kept the music going, but I could I could
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Speaker 1: still hear the arguing, and then the arguing one onto
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Speaker 1: the F deck, and moments later everything became silent. So
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Speaker 1: I thought that maybe they were making up, and maybe
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Speaker 1: they were going to go to bed and that was
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Speaker 1: going to be the end of it. So I waited
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Speaker 1: for a little while, and I still had the music on,
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Speaker 1: and I decided, well, I'm going to go down below
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Speaker 1: and just I'm going to go to the F deck
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Speaker 1: and just see if heard of things okay. Robert Wagner
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Speaker 1: was standing there, leaning his back against the back of
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Speaker 1: the boat, facing the facing the boat, and he said
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Speaker 1: that that Natalie was missing, and when I go search
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Speaker 1: the boat. So I immediately went to my stateroom, thinking
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Speaker 1: that maybe she went to my stateroom because she felt
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Speaker 1: maybe that she was safe there because the night before
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Speaker 1: Natalie and I had gone ashore and we stayed at
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Speaker 1: a hotel because there was arguing the day before as well.
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Speaker 1: So I came back and I told Robert Wagner that
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Speaker 1: Natalie was nowhere on the boat. I looked in Christopher stateroom,
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Speaker 1: I looked in the other empty stateroom and she wasn't there.
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Speaker 1: So I said to Robert Wagner. He said to me,
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Speaker 1: he said, well, he said that dinghy has gone too. Well,
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Speaker 1: I I just I just knew that Natalie was so
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Speaker 1: deathly afraid of water and not really kay will have
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Speaker 1: taken that boat by herself. But he said the boat
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Speaker 1: was gone, and she was gone. And I said, let's
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Speaker 1: turn on the searchlight. We had a very big searchlight
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Speaker 1: and I said, let's turn on the searchlight to see
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Speaker 1: if we cannot if we could see her. And he says,
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Speaker 1: we're not going to do that. He said, no, that's
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Speaker 1: from HLN. You know what's very odd. Cheryl McCullum, director
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Speaker 1: of the Coal Case Institute, that Robert Wagner, according to
14:28
Speaker 1: what the yachtsman Dennis Davern says to me, he wanted
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Speaker 1: to move the yacht the night before in a dark,
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Speaker 1: very windy, high tide condition. And Natalie said, no, why
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Speaker 1: did he want to move the yacht under those conditions
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Speaker 1: the night before? And she felt so strongly about it, Cheryl,
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Speaker 1: she left. She left. She did not want to stay
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Speaker 1: on the yacht the night before her death, and she
15:05
Speaker 1: slept in a hotel, Nancy. There's a couple of things
15:07
Speaker 1: that stick out. Again. People have got to remember they
15:11
Speaker 1: divorced one, so people need to focus on why that happened.
15:16
Speaker 1: They had major issues before. You and I both know
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Speaker 1: you go back twenty four hours and look at this
15:22
Speaker 1: thing twenty four hours before. She's a hotel because she
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Speaker 1: does not want to be on that yacht with Robert Wagner.
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Speaker 1: That's powerful to me. That means this fight, this argument,
15:36
Speaker 1: this situation has gone on and own for hours. The
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Speaker 1: thing that resonates for me after talking to Marty and
15:45
Speaker 1: talking to Dennis and talking to Lorna, I know good
15:48
Speaker 1: and well, then Natalie Wood would have never taken a
15:52
Speaker 1: dingy by herself. I know that she would have never
15:55
Speaker 1: tried to go to a restaurant that was closed, wearing
15:59
Speaker 1: a nightgown and no wonderwear and wild though with no
16:03
Speaker 1: money and nobody with her. She would have gone and
16:07
Speaker 1: got dnnis if she was trying to leave on her own. Well.
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Speaker 1: What what strikes me to Marty Ruly, author of Goodbye Natalie,
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Speaker 1: Goodbye Splendor, is that I've never really thought of it
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Speaker 1: this way. She did not want to stay aboard her
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Speaker 1: own yacht that she commissioned, an intricate detail about how
16:27
Speaker 1: it was decorated and fitted. She did not want to
16:31
Speaker 1: stay on her yacht the night before, she got off
16:34
Speaker 1: the yacht and chose to go stay alone in a
16:37
Speaker 1: hotel room on on Land, then stay on the yacht
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Speaker 1: with her husband, Robert Wagner. She comes back the next
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Speaker 1: day hoping things have calmed down, and she's dead that
16:47
Speaker 1: night under cover of darkness. And that's that's a good
16:51
Speaker 1: point Sheryl made. On Friday night, she asked Dennis to
16:55
Speaker 1: take her ashore in the dinghy. It would stand to
16:58
Speaker 1: reason on Saturday night, if she was leaving the boat
17:01
Speaker 1: in the dinghy, she would get Dennis to assist her.
17:05
Speaker 1: The dinghy had the headlight was broken, It wasn't. She
17:10
Speaker 1: didn't even know how to start the dinghy. It takes
17:13
Speaker 1: a lot to start that type of dinghy. So it's
17:17
Speaker 1: that she was leaving to go star gazing. As the
17:21
Speaker 1: first report that ever came out suggested star gazing. Yes,
17:26
Speaker 1: I've never heard. You never heard that she wanted to
17:29
Speaker 1: get star gazing. The first report in the media in
17:35
Speaker 1: one was Natalie took the dingy to go star gazing.
17:39
Speaker 1: It's just her deathly fear of water. That would never
17:44
Speaker 1: ever have happened Dennis. She would have gotten Dennis. Now,
17:49
Speaker 1: Natalie may have been okay, afraid of you know, every
17:53
Speaker 1: day intruders or the possibility she's a mega star, but
17:57
Speaker 1: maybe she was also afraid her husb Spent might show up.
18:01
Speaker 1: He did fly to North Carolina when she was spilming
18:04
Speaker 1: on location to try to catch her in some devious
18:08
Speaker 1: act and did not happen. She was there working as
18:12
Speaker 1: she always did. So that Friday night, Natalie was very uneasy,
18:17
Speaker 1: um at some points crying and trembling. She she was mad,
18:22
Speaker 1: she was angry, she was hurt, she was scared, and
18:26
Speaker 1: there was a reason for that. And one of the
18:28
Speaker 1: new witen not new witnesses necessarily, but one of the
18:33
Speaker 1: woman who came forward, who was one of the two
18:35
Speaker 1: witnesses being talked about, now saw the argument on Friday
18:39
Speaker 1: night as well. So now there's corroboration for Friday night
18:43
Speaker 1: argument and Saturday night death argument. You know, in my experience,
18:48
Speaker 1: Sheryl McCollum, when victims say things like I'm afraid, I'm
18:52
Speaker 1: afraid he's gonna kill me, they're right so many homicides
18:56
Speaker 1: that I personally prosecuted the victims. We're afraid not lot
19:01
Speaker 1: like Stacy Peterson. She told people, Drew Peterson is going
19:05
Speaker 1: to kill me. I'm a dead woman. I'm dead. She
19:09
Speaker 1: knew it was going to happen. But there's so many
19:12
Speaker 1: things that just don't make sense. You've told us many
19:16
Speaker 1: times about when you lost John David at the toy
19:19
Speaker 1: store and what mode you went into. If Robert Wagner
19:24
Speaker 1: wanted me to honestly believe, did he searched that yacht
19:29
Speaker 1: for Natalie believing she was missing, then why didn't he
19:34
Speaker 1: go to Christopher Watkins State Room. She never once went there.
19:38
Speaker 1: She never once woke him up. She never once said
19:41
Speaker 1: will you help them find her? That by itself to
19:46
Speaker 1: furs again, our investigation and the horrific drowning death of
19:57
Speaker 1: movie icon Natalie would why did it have to happen?
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Speaker 1: check out legal Zoo where life meets legal. I've always
22:06
Speaker 1: been terrified. Still am of of water, dark water, seawater, bombshell.
22:13
Speaker 1: Now police have now stated that TV star Robert Wagner
22:17
Speaker 1: is a person of interest in the death of his
22:21
Speaker 1: movie star wife Natalie Wood, who died in a horrible
22:27
Speaker 1: drowning incident in the choppy dark waters off Catalina Island.
22:32
Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, Natalie's sister Lana, a star
22:38
Speaker 1: in her own right, confronts Robert Wagner and it's caught
22:44
Speaker 1: on tape by Writer Online dot Com. Listen, all, okay,
22:48
Speaker 1: I just wanted to ask me one thing. I'm really sorry.
22:52
Speaker 1: I know the pain that you're coming through and that
22:55
Speaker 1: I'm going through. You know, I know this has not
22:57
Speaker 1: been any easier for you. I know with that, but
23:02
Speaker 1: everybody is going to drive me absolutely insane until everybody knows. Now,
23:11
Speaker 1: why won't you speak to the detectives. They're super guys.
23:15
Speaker 1: Clear yourself, if you can. Would you even bring up
23:18
Speaker 1: anything like that because I'm hound you with it every
23:21
Speaker 1: single day? Know what have I done? Do you know
23:26
Speaker 1: we have a family? Yes, yes, I know I'm not
23:30
Speaker 1: a part of it, thank you, but yes we have
23:33
Speaker 1: a family. I'm amazed you to even talk to me.
23:37
Speaker 1: Why wouldn't I talk to you. I've don't even since
23:40
Speaker 1: you were since I was a child, I've known you. Yes, yes,
23:47
Speaker 1: can they go away? I don't know the young man.
23:54
Speaker 1: I have talked to everybody. What I don't know, Kevin
23:59
Speaker 1: and Ralph Kip. I don't accuse you anything murdering her,
24:04
Speaker 1: of taking all these positions. It's incredible. I can't believe
24:07
Speaker 1: that you'd do something like that. I just can't believe.
24:10
Speaker 1: But r J, you've You've changed, your story changed. You
24:15
Speaker 1: never said anything to you. He never for one minute
24:19
Speaker 1: stopped and said this is what happened. I know it's
24:22
Speaker 1: gonna hurt me to me, said what happened? Every everybody?
24:33
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ. No. Alexis torres Check joining me from right
24:41
Speaker 1: our online dot Com investigative reporter, Alexis what happened when
24:45
Speaker 1: Lana Turner confronted Robert Wagner face to face about the
24:50
Speaker 1: death of her sister. She finally was able to do that.
24:53
Speaker 1: She was able to see him in person and say, Robert,
24:56
Speaker 1: why are you not talking to detectives They had reopen
25:00
Speaker 1: in the case. This is after two thousand eleven they'd
25:02
Speaker 1: reopen the case. And she says, why are you not
25:04
Speaker 1: talking to them? What is wrong? You are changing your
25:07
Speaker 1: story so many times, and instead of addressing her, which
25:11
Speaker 1: is what he's done for over thirty years, stonewall her.
25:14
Speaker 1: If he just said, why are you doing this? We're
25:16
Speaker 1: family and she's so upset, she's crying. She said, we're
25:19
Speaker 1: changing your story. This isn't fair. You have you have
25:22
Speaker 1: to talk to the detectives, and he just basically stonewalls
25:26
Speaker 1: her again and again. Alexis, when you analyze what she
25:30
Speaker 1: said when she confronted him, what do you think is
25:33
Speaker 1: the most significant portion Robert actually says to Alanna. He says,
25:37
Speaker 1: you've accused me of murdering her, and that's why he
25:40
Speaker 1: doesn't want to talk to her, talk to police, which
25:43
Speaker 1: is the only time he's probably ever said the word
25:46
Speaker 1: murder about this situation. It's a shocking admission on his party,
25:51
Speaker 1: even though he doesn't say I murder her, he says,
25:53
Speaker 1: you accuse me of murdering her. So he knows that
25:56
Speaker 1: people feel this way about him and his her own
25:58
Speaker 1: sister take a listen to Natalie's sister, Lana would tells us,
26:04
Speaker 1: why have you said that Robert Wagner has not cooperated
26:08
Speaker 1: with police? Why do I say it because they've never
26:11
Speaker 1: spoken to them. I don't know why he keeps saying
26:14
Speaker 1: he did. It boggles my mind that day he didn't
26:18
Speaker 1: speak to them. And what when it happened? Whoever arrived
26:23
Speaker 1: that it was somebody from the Corner's office, and there
26:26
Speaker 1: was there were those, there was that detective Rasher Um.
26:31
Speaker 1: They arrived on the boat. They did not question anybody.
26:35
Speaker 1: They took an accounting from everybody. When did you see her?
26:40
Speaker 1: Last one has happened. I'm terribly sorry if you lost
26:42
Speaker 1: Mr Wagner. Um he was. Then he and Christopher were
26:46
Speaker 1: flown back to the mainland and it was Dennis de
26:49
Speaker 1: Byrne who had to identify Natalie's body, which it horrified me. Um,
26:56
Speaker 1: I mean, I can't, I can't. It's I know, it's
26:58
Speaker 1: wrong for me to want someone to react how I would.
27:03
Speaker 1: That's just flat out wrong. But It boggles my mind
27:08
Speaker 1: that you wouldn't as a husband, as a lover, as
27:11
Speaker 1: a friend, as a dog owner, that you wouldn't rush
27:15
Speaker 1: to the side of someone it's passed away and won't
27:19
Speaker 1: hold them and want to be there. So I don't understand.
27:23
Speaker 1: Since that time, he has not spoken to police. No,
27:27
Speaker 1: the only time he has spoken to police was that
27:31
Speaker 1: the day. He has never spoken to them. Let me
27:34
Speaker 1: ask you this, Lana. Is it true that detectives told
27:39
Speaker 1: you they were very close to making an arrest in
27:41
Speaker 1: the case. Absolutely. They came to my home and said
27:47
Speaker 1: that they had everything they needed for an arrest and
27:51
Speaker 1: that the district attorney would not move forward. And I said,
27:55
Speaker 1: I don't understand, and he said, please get a word
28:00
Speaker 1: out because they feel that there's something going on. And
28:06
Speaker 1: I said, fine, if somebody asks me, I will, I
28:09
Speaker 1: will tell. So they came to your house and said
28:11
Speaker 1: they have enough for an arrest, but the d A
28:14
Speaker 1: is sitting on it. Did you believe that they were
28:18
Speaker 1: referring to Robert Wagner? Did they tell you as Robert Wagener? Oh?
28:21
Speaker 1: Of course, yes, yes, they told you as Robert Wagen said.
28:25
Speaker 1: For those of you just joining us, Robert Wagner now
28:29
Speaker 1: named a person of interest in Natalie Wood's death. To
28:32
Speaker 1: Marty Ruley, author of Goodbye Natalie, Goodbye Splendor. You know
28:37
Speaker 1: their relationship was so tumulchous. I remember Lana telling me
28:44
Speaker 1: that very often Wagner would say things like, oh, asked Natalie,
28:50
Speaker 1: she's the star. Yes, Robert Wagner was not only jealous
28:56
Speaker 1: of other men that Natalie starred with, but he was
28:59
Speaker 1: also jealous of her celebrity, her iconic stardom, something that
29:04
Speaker 1: he always wanted. He always wanted to. He always attached
29:08
Speaker 1: himself when speaking and later in writing to the Hollywood greats,
29:14
Speaker 1: little anecdotes here and there about um Betty Davis or
29:19
Speaker 1: um David Niven. Uh, even beyond that Carrie Grant. He
29:25
Speaker 1: liked associated himself with old Hollywood Spencer Tracy and the
29:29
Speaker 1: Hollywood greats. And he never achieved that level, but Natalie had.
29:34
Speaker 1: So there was this deep jealousy for many different reasons
29:39
Speaker 1: within his persona when when it came to Natalie, and
29:44
Speaker 1: sometimes he would it would come forward when he would
29:48
Speaker 1: say things like that, where do you want to go
29:50
Speaker 1: to dinner? Net Um tonight? Well as Natalie, she's the star.
29:56
Speaker 1: She chooses first, it was just a little sarcastic way
30:01
Speaker 1: of demeaning her and and all of her accomplishments. He
30:05
Speaker 1: wanted her to be a stay at home wife. Natalie
30:08
Speaker 1: was Hollywood, she was all about She worked from childhood
30:12
Speaker 1: and then became a successful adults star. So it just
30:17
Speaker 1: wasn't fair to do that to her. He called her
30:21
Speaker 1: aspirations career demons. It wasn't. She was a star since
30:26
Speaker 1: the time of her death, Marty, what is the trajectory
30:31
Speaker 1: of Robert Wagner's career vince Natalie's death? He has You know,
30:36
Speaker 1: he toured doing Love Letters Play with Stephanie Powers and
30:40
Speaker 1: then with his now wife Jill st John Um. He
30:45
Speaker 1: had a short lived show Lime Street, which was cut
30:49
Speaker 1: short when Samantha Smith was killed in the plane crash,
30:53
Speaker 1: and not much else than that. He has guest roles
30:58
Speaker 1: on a few sitcoms and and c I s which
31:03
Speaker 1: um ironically he played the father of who played him
31:09
Speaker 1: in the Mystery of Natalie Wood movie, so he who
31:13
Speaker 1: plays bull now. So it's kind of amazing, Cheryl McCollum
31:17
Speaker 1: that Robert Wagner's career went on. I don't know, but
31:21
Speaker 1: if he hears the thing. I think it's important that
31:25
Speaker 1: people break this down and forget Natalie Wood and Robert
31:29
Speaker 1: Wagner for a minute. And when you hear that somebody's
31:33
Speaker 1: truly not searching the yacht, and they're not turning on searchlight,
31:37
Speaker 1: and they're not calling the coast guard for help, and
31:40
Speaker 1: they're not themselves screaming their name and almost throwing themselves
31:46
Speaker 1: in the water looking for her, that should be very
31:49
Speaker 1: telling to people. It's very telling to me. And also, Cheryl,
31:52
Speaker 1: if this had been anybody other than so called Hollywood royalty,
31:57
Speaker 1: they would have been picked up immediately. You're the last
32:00
Speaker 1: person with the victim. The autopsy doesn't match up to
32:05
Speaker 1: the story. I mean, according to Laanna, her own sister,
32:08
Speaker 1: she was definitely afraid of the water. She would do
32:11
Speaker 1: some water scenes, but she hated it and insisted the
32:15
Speaker 1: water be uh below her chin at all times. And
32:21
Speaker 1: for somebody like Natalie who put on hair and makeup
32:25
Speaker 1: just to go to the grocery store, she's often pictured
32:27
Speaker 1: with one of the like a silk scarf tied around
32:29
Speaker 1: her head, very glamorous, because she would not go out
32:34
Speaker 1: unless she was totally um in here and makeup. Because
32:39
Speaker 1: she wanted to maintain that image. She always stayed very petite,
32:43
Speaker 1: well dressed, perfectly groomed. No way with this woman have
32:46
Speaker 1: gone out on a rubber dinghy in the middle of
32:49
Speaker 1: the night in the ocean water wearing a flannel gown,
32:53
Speaker 1: a puffy jacket, socks, wool socks, and no underwear. I'm
32:58
Speaker 1: just telling you you would not do that. What else
33:02
Speaker 1: stands out to you, Sheryl McCollum with the autopsy versus
33:07
Speaker 1: the story that was spun at the time, the amount
33:10
Speaker 1: of injuries to her body. Number One, she has injuries
33:14
Speaker 1: to the front and back of her legs. Um she
33:17
Speaker 1: doesn't have head trauma, which means she didn't hit her
33:20
Speaker 1: head and fall into the water. She does have injury
33:24
Speaker 1: to her face. One she has injuries to her wrists
33:28
Speaker 1: and her ankles and her knees again front and back,
33:31
Speaker 1: which is so then you're trained to look for in
33:33
Speaker 1: domestic violence cases injuries in the front and back of legs.
33:37
Speaker 1: There were you know, like three hundred c ss of
33:40
Speaker 1: urine in her body, which forensically they need to be
33:43
Speaker 1: able to explain. So stop right there. Regarding the amount
33:47
Speaker 1: of urine in her body, that's very significant. Wine. Most
33:51
Speaker 1: of the time when someone drowns, their body's voids naturally
33:56
Speaker 1: at death, so it may be indicative that she was
34:00
Speaker 1: conscious when she went in the water. So again that's
34:03
Speaker 1: something they need to look at very carefully. They need
34:07
Speaker 1: to look at her injury and her height. And this
34:10
Speaker 1: is something I talked with her Nandez about. It was
34:13
Speaker 1: great they went to the splenda, but every one of
34:16
Speaker 1: them were like six one six two six three. Natalie
34:20
Speaker 1: was tiny. She was a little petite lady. So where
34:26
Speaker 1: she would line up on that yacht is not where
34:29
Speaker 1: they would have lined up. And where she would have
34:31
Speaker 1: lined up on that dingy is not where they would
34:34
Speaker 1: have lined up, especially if that dingy were in water.
34:38
Speaker 1: So it's imperative that you look at it from the
34:41
Speaker 1: standpoint of what would it have been for her. I
34:49
Speaker 1: need all the energy I can muster to continue giving
34:53
Speaker 1: it my all being a mom of two and investigating
34:58
Speaker 1: the major crimes across our country like Natalie Woods tragic drowning.
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36:28
Speaker 1: I need it. Doug pulled up and got out of
36:31
Speaker 1: his boat. Where is she? I asked him. Doug looked
36:35
Speaker 1: at me. She's dead. R J. My knees went out.
36:41
Speaker 1: Everything went away from me. Now we're heading back to
36:45
Speaker 1: the police investigation ongoing into the tragic drowning of Hollywood
36:51
Speaker 1: star Natalie Would new witnesses now emerging. According to police,
36:56
Speaker 1: This has led investigators to deem her death a suspicious
37:01
Speaker 1: death and name her former husband a person of interest
37:05
Speaker 1: TV star Robert Wagner. For years, mystery has surrounded Natalie
37:11
Speaker 1: Wood's death. Natalie Wood nominated for three Academy Awards. She
37:16
Speaker 1: started West Side Story, Rubble without a Cause, so many more.
37:20
Speaker 1: Her death went down on the weekend after Thanksgiving. She
37:24
Speaker 1: was on board a yacht with her husband, Robert Wagner,
37:28
Speaker 1: another Hollywood star Christopher Walkin, and the boat captain who
37:32
Speaker 1: you've just heard from speaking to me, Dennis Davron. After
37:36
Speaker 1: a night of heavy drinking, Natalie found floating dead in
37:40
Speaker 1: the cold water around Catalina Island. This is right off
37:44
Speaker 1: the southern California coast. At first it was ruled an accident.
37:47
Speaker 1: The case was then reopened just six years ago to
37:50
Speaker 1: see whether Wagner or anyone else played a role in
37:55
Speaker 1: her death. That's right, Nancy, As you said, the reopened
37:58
Speaker 1: investigation now has been going for six years and just recently,
38:02
Speaker 1: Los Angeles County Sheriff's Detective Corona talked to CBS forty
38:07
Speaker 1: eight hours about what has been uncovered and what the
38:10
Speaker 1: result is. Do you believe Natalie Wood was murdered? I
38:14
Speaker 1: think it's suspicious enough to make us think that something happened.
38:20
Speaker 1: Do you believe that Robert Wagner knows a lot more
38:22
Speaker 1: about what happened to his wife than he's ever said? Well,
38:25
Speaker 1: I think he absolutely does, because he's the last one
38:27
Speaker 1: to see her at the time of the incident. Her
38:31
Speaker 1: death was ruled an accident. This new information is substantial
38:39
Speaker 1: no for us, and we want to take another look
38:40
Speaker 1: at the case. So over the last six years, have
38:45
Speaker 1: you been able to get even more evidence that makes
38:48
Speaker 1: you question that this was an accident? We have There
38:56
Speaker 1: are witnesses who were nearby the splendor that evening set
39:01
Speaker 1: in the water somehow, and I don't think she's got
39:04
Speaker 1: in the water by herself. Now. One of the witnesses
39:07
Speaker 1: that have come forward describes hearing yelling and crashing coming
39:12
Speaker 1: from the couple's stateroom. After that, separate witnesses here a
39:17
Speaker 1: man and a woman arguing on the back of the boat,
39:22
Speaker 1: and believe that was Natalie Wood and Robert Wagner. Now
39:27
Speaker 1: I'm not just pulling this out of thin air. I'm
39:30
Speaker 1: getting this from a Sheriff's Department spokesperson, Nicole Nishita. She
39:35
Speaker 1: is telling us what the witnesses are saying. The statements
39:38
Speaker 1: differed from the original version of events. Why why was
39:44
Speaker 1: a different story told at the time? And if there
39:49
Speaker 1: is a person of interest? Is that just a nice
39:52
Speaker 1: way Cheryl McCollum of saying suspect is a definite we
39:58
Speaker 1: are putting a light on this man. They've never said
40:02
Speaker 1: that before, so it is definitely a step in the
40:05
Speaker 1: right direction. Now, Natalie's sister Laana keeps telling me Robert
40:08
Speaker 1: Wagner has not cooperated. Wagner says he has, but investigators
40:13
Speaker 1: say Robert Wagner has not been interviewed since the investigation
40:16
Speaker 1: was reopened. That's six years ago. They tried ten times,
40:22
Speaker 1: at least, they say, to interview him in two thousand thirteen,
40:25
Speaker 1: he refused why. He denies all involvement in Natalie Wood's death.
40:33
Speaker 1: No charges have been filed against him. His publicists declines
40:38
Speaker 1: to comment at this hour. But with conflicting versions of
40:43
Speaker 1: what happened, uh, it's not that much of a conflict.
40:48
Speaker 1: Because Wagner writes in a two thousand memoir that he
40:54
Speaker 1: and Walkin argued that night so severely, Alexis Torres Chuck
41:00
Speaker 1: right or online dot Com that Wagner smashed a bottle
41:05
Speaker 1: a glass in front of Natalie, and Natalie mortified at
41:10
Speaker 1: this display in front of her guest, Christopher Walking, her
41:13
Speaker 1: co star. She gets up and goes to her room
41:15
Speaker 1: and shuts the door. So he admits there was a
41:18
Speaker 1: violent argument that night. That's not in conflict anymore, Alexis.
41:21
Speaker 1: But it's his version of it, and so far, it
41:24
Speaker 1: seems like what these new witnesses coming forward are completely
41:27
Speaker 1: contradicting what he's saying. He's saying that it was a
41:29
Speaker 1: fight with Walking and Natalie was mad. But what the
41:33
Speaker 1: witnesses are saying is it was a fight with Natalie,
41:35
Speaker 1: and they're not saying that he was fighting with Walking. Yeah,
41:38
Speaker 1: you know what, subtle but very important distinction, Alexis. You're
41:43
Speaker 1: so right now, Marty Ruley. We have heard rumors of
41:48
Speaker 1: people in the boat next to them hearing a woman's
41:52
Speaker 1: voice saying help out in the water, and a man's
41:56
Speaker 1: voice saying sure, honey, we're coming, kind of start santastically.
42:01
Speaker 1: We've heard a lot of rumors. But this seems to
42:04
Speaker 1: confirm those rumors. Marty, Yes, the rumors of an argument
42:09
Speaker 1: that which are not rumors anymore. There was an argument
42:13
Speaker 1: that Saturday night, but I'm not so sure that Natalie
42:18
Speaker 1: was crying for help save me from drowning, as was
42:22
Speaker 1: once reported, because um the person who reported that did
42:27
Speaker 1: not stand behind that claim. When push came to Sheldon
42:31
Speaker 1: the case was reopened. It's possible they heard the arguing,
42:35
Speaker 1: like these other two witnesses heard the arguing and misconstrued it.
42:41
Speaker 1: Or I thought that they heard Natalie in the water,
42:45
Speaker 1: But as Cheryl explained that three d c cs of
42:49
Speaker 1: urine in Natalie's bladder that was overlooked in the autopsy
42:54
Speaker 1: report makes it highly unlikely that Natalie was heard screaming
43:00
Speaker 1: from the water. They may have heard the argument on
43:02
Speaker 1: the back of the boat. You know another thing, Selma
43:05
Speaker 1: calling Her body was covered in bruises. The boat was
43:08
Speaker 1: found with the oars still attached. It had never been
43:15
Speaker 1: put in I guess in common parlance drive or even reverse.
43:19
Speaker 1: It was in neutral. I don't even think it have
43:22
Speaker 1: ever been turned on. It looked like it had just
43:25
Speaker 1: been untied and let loose. But she didn't get in
43:29
Speaker 1: that boat, no way. Um. And there's a lot I
43:34
Speaker 1: think that would show that if they would try to
43:37
Speaker 1: recreate it again with somebody of her stature. Here's the
43:41
Speaker 1: bottom line for me, Nancy. Dennis de Verne has come forward,
43:45
Speaker 1: he's talking, he has taken to polygraphs, he has passed.
43:50
Speaker 1: Christopher Walking has come forward and cooperated. Marty's talking, You're talking,
43:55
Speaker 1: everybody's trying to talk. Robert Wagner is the only person
44:00
Speaker 1: and not talking and not coming forward. So the cloud
44:04
Speaker 1: of suspicion is tremendous at this juncture. We all know,
44:08
Speaker 1: Cheryl that just being a person of interest is not
44:11
Speaker 1: enough two allow police to force him to talk. You
44:16
Speaker 1: can't force anybody to give a statement now if it's
44:21
Speaker 1: a witness. If it's a witness, you can hold them
44:24
Speaker 1: in contempt if they refuse to testify because they a
44:27
Speaker 1: witness doesn't have a right to the Fifth Amendment to
44:30
Speaker 1: invoke the fifth. But right now, there's no way they
44:34
Speaker 1: can force him to talk. And he's not talking. If
44:36
Speaker 1: it's if he's innocent, why not talk. But here's the
44:38
Speaker 1: great thing, Nancy, They've got his original statement, they've got
44:43
Speaker 1: interviews that he gave where he said, yes, she must
44:46
Speaker 1: have hit her head and got knocked out, and telling
44:48
Speaker 1: the water. They've got his new book where he says
44:52
Speaker 1: he smashed the wine bottle, so they know his story
44:56
Speaker 1: has changed by his own hands, which Cheryl was just
45:01
Speaker 1: saying is so important, because the reason Robert Wagner won't
45:06
Speaker 1: cooperate in the new investigation is because if he does,
45:12
Speaker 1: he knows he won't incriminate himself. He's already incriminated himself
45:17
Speaker 1: enough And it's the strongest circumstantial case a crime investigation
45:25
Speaker 1: could have. And I hope that celebrity won't interfere with
45:32
Speaker 1: how they move forward. And I don't think that his
45:36
Speaker 1: age should have anything to do with holding back or
45:40
Speaker 1: the years and decades between the actual death and the
45:44
Speaker 1: new investigation, because a crime is a crime, and he
45:48
Speaker 1: should be held accountable as any average joe would be
45:52
Speaker 1: in this type of a death. What is telling is
45:56
Speaker 1: Dennis Davern, the yacht captain, who tells me we didn't
46:02
Speaker 1: take any steps to see if we could locate Natalie.
46:05
Speaker 1: Wagner didn't want me to call the coast guard. He
46:09
Speaker 1: has trucked to me not to turn on the searchlight.
46:12
Speaker 1: He says it was a matter of we're not gonna
46:15
Speaker 1: look too hard, and we're not going to turn on
46:17
Speaker 1: the searchlight. We're not going to notify anybody right now.
46:20
Speaker 1: The cover ups started immediately. Robert Wagner knew what happened,
46:25
Speaker 1: and his fear was for himself, not for his wife
46:31
Speaker 1: who was in the dark ocean. She feared her entire life.
46:35
Speaker 1: Cheryl McCullum way in to prove what we're saying about
46:38
Speaker 1: Natalie's frame of mind and how she would have never
46:42
Speaker 1: gone out in bed groow'. We told those folks at
46:45
Speaker 1: Wine and Crime go online right now, try to find
46:49
Speaker 1: a bad picture of that woman. It doesn't exist. She
46:54
Speaker 1: was lawless all the time. She would have never ever
47:00
Speaker 1: left like that would not have happened. And they can
47:03
Speaker 1: also go there's a UM. There's an interview with UM
47:08
Speaker 1: Robert Uh Sunday check hymn Uh. Robert played bullet Sunday
47:16
Speaker 1: at John Thomas Redford where Robert Redford. They're at a
47:21
Speaker 1: party and he boots Natalie up playfully and just runs
47:25
Speaker 1: and leaks in the pool with her. He said he
47:27
Speaker 1: always felt horrible about that because he did not know
47:30
Speaker 1: how debilitating you know, water was for her. Even a
47:34
Speaker 1: swimming pool she was afraid of. She didn't even like
47:37
Speaker 1: to get in her own pool. And Beverly Hills, she
47:40
Speaker 1: was that afraid of water. So these are all things
47:44
Speaker 1: you can hear them say. Pull up Robert Wagner, watch
47:48
Speaker 1: him talk about her, and really listen to what he says.
47:52
Speaker 1: You're gonna come to your own conclusion that, Okay, this
47:55
Speaker 1: is kind of creeping me out because what he's saying
47:58
Speaker 1: and what we know he did at night or bizarre.
48:01
Speaker 1: And here's the only other thing, Nancy. He did not
48:04
Speaker 1: go and identify Natalie at the Morgue at the next
48:09
Speaker 1: of ken he said, Dennis to burn. Well, in my
48:13
Speaker 1: mind that that's just incredible. That's incredible behavioral evidence. He
48:18
Speaker 1: has not been shunned by Hollywood. But you know, Hollywood
48:24
Speaker 1: doesn't write the criminal code, and Hollywood is not going
48:28
Speaker 1: to be sitting in that jury box that it ever
48:30
Speaker 1: comes to that as of now, through his publicist Robert
48:34
Speaker 1: Wagner and says he is innocent and had nothing to
48:37
Speaker 1: do with Natalie Wood's death. He is not a suspect.
48:41
Speaker 1: He is a person of interest. Nancy Grace Crime Stories,
48:46
Speaker 1: signing off Goodbye friend,