Latest / The Follow-On / ‘Put the Drive Away’ - Isa’s honest truth about Bazball after England’s horror loss in Ashes opener

Transcript

‘Put the Drive Away’ - Isa’s honest truth about Bazball after England’s horror loss in Ashes opener · The Follow-On

0:00
Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to another episode of Fox Crickets podcast
0:03
Speaker 1: The follow On. My name is Courtney Walsh. I'm a
0:05
Speaker 1: senior journalist based out of Melbourne but currently in Perth,
0:08
Speaker 1: and I'm talking to Ishauer, who is from the UK.
0:10
Speaker 1: Played eight Tests, took twenty nine wickets, another eighty three
0:14
Speaker 1: Ody eyes and twenty two t twenties for England. But
0:18
Speaker 1: you're based in Adelaide after being in Perth. It is
0:20
Speaker 1: that sort of start touring ashes, isn't it, with people
0:23
Speaker 1: spread around the country. How are you?
0:25
Speaker 2: I'm very well, yes, obviously still trying to process and
0:30
Speaker 2: understand what happened in Perth, but yeah, very quickly after that,
0:34
Speaker 2: it's a case of okay, what am I going to
0:36
Speaker 2: do in my time? And a good friend of mine
0:40
Speaker 2: is playing a show in Adelaide sound Fender, so I've
0:44
Speaker 2: come to watch him.
0:46
Speaker 1: I think it's a very very good way to get out.
0:48
Speaker 1: I had some friends who saw him in Melbourne I
0:51
Speaker 1: think a couple of weeks ago, and rave reviews and
0:54
Speaker 1: judging by the reaction just walking around the streets of Perth,
0:58
Speaker 1: there's been some pretty doleful Wish fans walking around. So
1:01
Speaker 1: you've done well. Yeah, well, I mean Marshall broadcast, did
1:05
Speaker 1: you get out and get to Adelaide.
1:07
Speaker 3: There are a.
1:08
Speaker 2: Few different options. I mean that there's so many things
1:10
Speaker 2: to do in Australia. That's where you know the tourism
1:13
Speaker 2: comes in. Right West Island. There were you know, there
1:17
Speaker 2: was some chat about maybe flying to Bali.
1:20
Speaker 3: Adelaide.
1:20
Speaker 2: Obviously Adelaide Hills and you can go into Wine country.
1:24
Speaker 2: So yeah, it does offer the tourists an opportunity to
1:28
Speaker 2: go and see the country.
1:30
Speaker 1: It's quite the it's almost like a space of circus
1:33
Speaker 1: or you're talking about Sat Fender. It's like a music
1:36
Speaker 1: act packing up after if a Test finishes so rapidly
1:39
Speaker 1: the Aussie cricketers were or at the next morning they
1:42
Speaker 1: were you know, Travis Head was mobbed at Adelaide Airport.
1:46
Speaker 1: I'm not sure if you were mobb when you arrived
1:47
Speaker 1: in Adelaide, but a lot of the Fox staff I
1:50
Speaker 1: know that they were packing up and basically vacating Perth
1:52
Speaker 1: Stadium within fifteen minutes of that match being finished. The
1:56
Speaker 1: English cricketers have had to stick around because they had
1:58
Speaker 1: a Lilac Hill match that they're get out to the
2:01
Speaker 1: golf course. Yes, so let's raise some my brows. But
2:04
Speaker 1: it's just such a dramatic sort of production. It's almost
2:07
Speaker 1: it is almost like a traveling circus.
2:09
Speaker 3: It really is.
2:10
Speaker 2: I'm not quite the cult hero that Travis Head is Courtney,
2:16
Speaker 2: but so I just kind of slipped on in there
2:19
Speaker 2: were like arrived at an laid airport.
2:22
Speaker 3: But yeah, for the England boys and.
2:24
Speaker 2: Especially you know when they came into this series with
2:26
Speaker 2: so much hope and you know, there was so much
2:30
Speaker 2: anticipation about how they would play at the start of
2:32
Speaker 2: the tour. Knowing that you know, previous successful teams they've
2:36
Speaker 2: they've won the first Test or they've come away with
2:38
Speaker 2: a draw. Well, we know that's never going to happen
2:40
Speaker 2: with this England team. But the fact that they were
2:42
Speaker 2: in such a good position to have suddenly you know,
2:45
Speaker 2: lost the game in two sessions in the manner that
2:48
Speaker 2: they lost, that will definitely be It feels like you're
2:52
Speaker 2: in a tumble dryer at it's all just coming at
2:56
Speaker 2: you and before you know it, it's just hit you.
2:59
Speaker 2: So I don't know whether it's a good thing that
3:02
Speaker 2: they have twelve days between you know, test matches, because
3:06
Speaker 2: you often just end up steering on it. There was
3:08
Speaker 2: a bit like Australia last year and they were stunned
3:10
Speaker 2: by India and you know that the papers were getting
3:13
Speaker 2: stuck into the Australian team, you know, not tough enough,
3:18
Speaker 2: what have you. But then they came into that next
3:19
Speaker 2: Test and that's you know, the sign of a brilliant
3:21
Speaker 2: teams that they were able to bounce back really well.
3:25
Speaker 2: England have to do that. There's no other option. They
3:27
Speaker 2: don't currently hold the ashes, so they have to find.
3:30
Speaker 3: A way of.
3:33
Speaker 2: Parking that almost I don't want to say forgetting it
3:37
Speaker 2: altogether because there are so many lessons and learnings from
3:39
Speaker 2: that Test match, but they do need to kind of
3:43
Speaker 2: think clearly about how they're going to try this win
3:45
Speaker 2: this next one, especially Australia who have an unbelievable pigball record.
3:50
Speaker 2: They played so many of them, and that in itself
3:52
Speaker 2: is a thing. Tactically, England can't just assume that they
3:55
Speaker 2: will go into the Prisbone Test imagining that the the
4:01
Speaker 2: Test is going to go a certain way and the
4:03
Speaker 2: pitch is going to play a certain way, because the
4:05
Speaker 2: pig board just brings in so many different variables and
4:08
Speaker 2: it becomes a session by session situation, and I actually
4:12
Speaker 2: don't think England did that enough in the last test.
4:15
Speaker 2: You know, when the heavy roller wears off, we know
4:17
Speaker 2: that it's going to do a little bit more.
4:19
Speaker 3: England.
4:19
Speaker 2: If they'd have just hung in there for that afternoon session,
4:21
Speaker 2: they could have reached the rewards in the evening session.
4:24
Speaker 2: A bit like Travis's head. So I think it's one
4:28
Speaker 2: of those situations where they're just going to be clearer
4:31
Speaker 2: on how they're looking to throttle up and throttle down
4:35
Speaker 2: rather than trying to be all out attack.
4:38
Speaker 1: We'll get onto the big burning questions I suppose leading
4:41
Speaker 1: into Brisbane, but just a couple of quik ones. I
4:45
Speaker 1: suppose since we last saw you were last summer in Australia.
4:48
Speaker 1: I was remember being in Paris midway through the year
4:51
Speaker 1: and commentating with a good friend of yours at Roland
4:53
Speaker 1: Garros Gig seven. It turns out you're a lady of
4:55
Speaker 1: many hats. You do a lot of things through the summer,
4:58
Speaker 1: and even in terms of already there was a big
5:01
Speaker 1: event here the night before at the Camfield. I think
5:03
Speaker 1: you're doing the same thing again in Rismon as well.
5:05
Speaker 1: But what have you been up to? What do you do.
5:07
Speaker 1: What were you doing at role and garrissing the middle
5:10
Speaker 1: of middle of May or likely well that was.
5:13
Speaker 3: My preparation for Wimbledon, actually, Cordy, so.
5:16
Speaker 1: You're a servaler.
5:20
Speaker 3: I loved it.
5:21
Speaker 2: I mean it was the first time I've been there.
5:22
Speaker 2: You know, being in Paris is always fun anyway, but
5:26
Speaker 2: just to kind of be around the clay courts and
5:28
Speaker 2: just get kind of accustomed to who was doing well
5:31
Speaker 2: or not, it's always a good lead in the Slam
5:35
Speaker 2: at Wimbledon. So yeah, I guess another string to my
5:39
Speaker 2: boat getting involved in tennis coverage, and I've absolutely loved it.
5:44
Speaker 2: But you know, with the cricket, I know that I
5:47
Speaker 2: don't need to be preparing for three months in advance
5:50
Speaker 2: to be on top of everything because I've obviously done
5:54
Speaker 2: so much of it and I've played the game. Whereas
5:56
Speaker 2: with tennis, I find as soon as Wimbledon's over, I
5:59
Speaker 2: kind of just put the notebooks away and then it's
6:02
Speaker 2: onto cricket season again. So it's really just a case
6:06
Speaker 2: of you know, sokia and all in and terminology, you know,
6:10
Speaker 2: just being able to talk tennis I think is really
6:12
Speaker 2: good and obviously great to see you down there as well,
6:17
Speaker 2: which came as.
6:17
Speaker 3: A bit of a surprise.
6:18
Speaker 2: And look, it's always fun seeing people that you know
6:21
Speaker 2: on the circuit. You know, at the Olympics as well,
6:25
Speaker 2: you know, I was bumping into different people from different
6:27
Speaker 2: countries Australia and New Zealand and so forth. So yeah,
6:32
Speaker 2: it's always, it's always you know, you talk about it
6:34
Speaker 2: being a traveling circus with the cricket, but with the
6:36
Speaker 2: tennis it's it's quite similar.
6:40
Speaker 1: One of the things I wanted to ask you about
6:42
Speaker 1: giving your role as a broadcast run a commentator, there's
6:45
Speaker 1: been a couple of viral images that have come out
6:47
Speaker 1: of Perth of your competriots. One of your colleagues, Michael Vaughan,
6:53
Speaker 1: in his reaction midway through Stuart broad there is a
6:57
Speaker 1: meme that he's circulating around social media, even just Arrival
7:01
Speaker 1: Network that think they just trying to stomach what was
7:06
Speaker 1: going on. Do you feel of what happens sometimes when
7:09
Speaker 1: you're called on camera or is it just great to
7:11
Speaker 1: have that sort of reaction that I suppose that interaction
7:13
Speaker 1: that shows how normal and natural it is for everyone
7:17
Speaker 1: from commentator to fin to those in the middle of
7:19
Speaker 1: the emotions sort that go with cricket and sport.
7:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, well I've been doing this a long time now, Courtney,
7:24
Speaker 2: and I still forget that the camera's on me in
7:27
Speaker 2: the commentary box especially, and they've been doing the Fox box,
7:31
Speaker 2: which kind of shows us all in our emotions as
7:34
Speaker 2: and when we're calling. Because I'm the kind of lead commentator,
7:38
Speaker 2: I call the action straight away, so you can hear
7:40
Speaker 2: my energy levels go up quite a lot, and when
7:44
Speaker 2: you're watching in the context of the fox box sometimes
7:46
Speaker 2: you can't really appreciate why I've had to go to
7:48
Speaker 2: that level because it's just come out of nowhere. You know,
7:51
Speaker 2: England losing three wickets in the space of eleven balls
7:54
Speaker 2: is just crazy, so naturally you have to be sort
7:59
Speaker 2: of loud and on it and you kind of raised
8:02
Speaker 2: with the levels of the crowd as well. So yeah,
8:06
Speaker 2: I got caught out for the Women's Ashes a few
8:08
Speaker 2: years ago. There were a lot of different images of
8:11
Speaker 2: me with a camera Test match. When it ended up
8:14
Speaker 2: being a draw, England were winning it convincingly, then all
8:16
Speaker 2: of a sudden Australia came back in. Then it was
8:19
Speaker 2: looking like Australia were going to win, and then to
8:21
Speaker 2: kind of have the sense of relief that they came
8:22
Speaker 2: away with a draw. You know, you go through every
8:26
Speaker 2: single emotion under the sun, you forget the cameras on you,
8:29
Speaker 2: and I guess you know we're trying to be partisan,
8:33
Speaker 2: but in an ASHES series, you know, our natural kind
8:38
Speaker 2: of emotion comes through sometimes as players that have played
8:42
Speaker 2: the game. So yeah, I mean stir abroad. I was
8:46
Speaker 2: in exactly the same kind of feeling inside. But obviously
8:51
Speaker 2: I'm trying to call the action as well, so I
8:54
Speaker 2: have to bring my professional hat to try and call
8:58
Speaker 2: it as best as I can.
8:59
Speaker 3: So does sound too biased?
9:02
Speaker 1: I can tell you the extends to the written press
9:05
Speaker 1: as well. I had the good fortune of sitting a
9:07
Speaker 1: couple of seats down from a former English captain, Mike Atherton,
9:12
Speaker 1: who writes brilliant brilliantly for The Times in the UK.
9:15
Speaker 1: And after Joe Root fell on the first day and
9:19
Speaker 1: I think England were four down, the response was very succinct.
9:23
Speaker 1: One curse word with an O before it, and it
9:27
Speaker 1: was like, yep, that sums up that situation. But it
9:29
Speaker 1: continued on and I guess, well we get towards the cricket.
9:34
Speaker 1: There's been lots of conjecture as to what England should
9:38
Speaker 1: do in terms of their preparation for Brisbane for the
9:41
Speaker 1: pink Ball Test. A couple of players were playing at
9:45
Speaker 1: like like a couple of fringe squad members Bethel Pots
9:49
Speaker 1: and Tongue. They've been released to go and play a
9:51
Speaker 1: match in Canberra, a pink ball matching Canberra against a
9:54
Speaker 1: Cricket Australia or a prom Minister's eleven sorry in Canberra.
10:00
Speaker 1: People have been asking why doesn't the rest of the
10:02
Speaker 1: squad go? I think Ben Stokes was pretty blunt when
10:04
Speaker 1: he said, no, that we believe in what we're doing.
10:06
Speaker 1: Stewart Law, the former I suppose Australian batsman who I
10:09
Speaker 1: think had English heritage. He said, I think they're doing
10:12
Speaker 1: the right thing. Because the Canberra pitch, it bounces pretty
10:14
Speaker 1: low compared to Brisbane at the Gabba. You're going to
10:17
Speaker 1: get them up around your sort of chest type. So
10:20
Speaker 1: many different views as to what they should do. How
10:23
Speaker 1: do you assess it? Is it as much of a
10:25
Speaker 1: whirlwind as what we saw in the first few days.
10:27
Speaker 1: It's pretty tricky.
10:28
Speaker 2: You have to think about the preparation they had coming
10:30
Speaker 2: into the protest, and Lilac Hill certainly wasn't getting as
10:34
Speaker 2: much bounces as the per Stadium. So and you saw
10:38
Speaker 2: it in the manner of England's dismissals. You know that
10:42
Speaker 2: that kind of edge came into play in the Channel,
10:46
Speaker 2: especially when they gave me the extra bounce Australia. So
10:50
Speaker 2: you know Brisbane will be similar conditions, not as much
10:55
Speaker 2: bounce as maybe per Stadium. But for me, the biggest
10:58
Speaker 2: thing is around the tax elements of a pink ball test.
11:02
Speaker 3: Now.
11:04
Speaker 2: I you know, whatever they want to do in terms
11:07
Speaker 2: of preparation, but they have to be thinking clearly about
11:12
Speaker 2: what they might come up against at different stages of
11:15
Speaker 2: the Test match. Day one, day two, afternoon session, evening session.
11:20
Speaker 2: When is when is that light going to come down,
11:23
Speaker 2: When is it going to start to do a little
11:24
Speaker 2: bit more. Think about the Australians. You know, it played
11:28
Speaker 2: into Australia's hands. You think about what they would least
11:32
Speaker 2: want to do in that first Test and it's Mitch
11:34
Speaker 2: start bowling lots and lots of overs, having to go
11:37
Speaker 2: to the short ball. They were, you know, thankful in
11:39
Speaker 2: the sense that Brendan Doggett was able to come in
11:42
Speaker 2: and bowl that short ball when it got a little
11:43
Speaker 2: bit flatter and they got off the hook the bowling
11:48
Speaker 2: attack in my opinion, by not making them keep coming
11:52
Speaker 2: back to bowl more rovers and I think you know,
11:56
Speaker 2: Mitch start recognized that he knew he had to take
11:58
Speaker 2: early wickets for them, so keep putting a dent into
12:01
Speaker 2: that batting order. So without comings in Hazerwood, I think
12:05
Speaker 2: coming into that Test match they would have been concerned
12:09
Speaker 2: about how it would play. So the fact that it
12:11
Speaker 2: finished in two days, Mitch Stark is still fresh as
12:13
Speaker 2: a daisy, You've got potential pac comings coming into the
12:16
Speaker 2: next Test match. It played right into their hands. I
12:20
Speaker 2: think for touring teams you've always got to think about
12:22
Speaker 2: what does the opposition least want to do, and that
12:27
Speaker 2: they don't want to resort to the short ball so
12:29
Speaker 2: early on in a series for a sustained effort because
12:32
Speaker 2: they want to make sure they last for the four
12:34
Speaker 2: or five Tests. I also think the next Test probably
12:39
Speaker 2: plays into Australia's hands again because of the different stages
12:43
Speaker 2: of a pink ball day night Test, in the sense
12:45
Speaker 2: that when you're bowling in those at those times you
12:48
Speaker 2: want to be bowling a little bit fuller and Mitch
12:50
Speaker 2: Stark is the best at that.
12:52
Speaker 3: You know, he averages seventeen.
12:53
Speaker 2: He's taken eighty one wickets in however many pink ball
12:56
Speaker 2: tests he's played. He is the king of the pink
12:59
Speaker 2: ball and the fact that he's been able to get
13:01
Speaker 2: into some nice rhythm at Perth means that he's going
13:04
Speaker 2: to be He's going to be the key, key element
13:07
Speaker 2: for Australia when it comes to the bowling department. And
13:12
Speaker 2: so that's what I'd love for England to be thinking
13:14
Speaker 2: about more rather than what's just happened. How can we
13:18
Speaker 2: put pressure back on the Australian team. And it isn't
13:21
Speaker 2: always all out attack with the bat. Sometimes it does
13:25
Speaker 2: mean let's back for two sessions here, let's get through
13:28
Speaker 2: to the next day so we're in a position to
13:30
Speaker 2: really make the most of the day conditions. And I
13:34
Speaker 2: really hope that that that's what they're thinking about.
13:37
Speaker 1: I think in your career you took around two hundred
13:39
Speaker 1: weekts or so across all formats for England. How would
13:44
Speaker 1: you have felt about having to back up within thirty
13:46
Speaker 1: overs or so? Is there a concern And it's been
13:50
Speaker 1: raised by a few people about the fact that baseball
13:53
Speaker 1: is brilliant to watch, and it's been successful at different stages.
13:56
Speaker 1: Wasn't so successful in Perth, but they were in positions
13:59
Speaker 1: where they could gone on with it. But just that
14:01
Speaker 1: the strain on the bowling attach. You know, they were
14:04
Speaker 1: all down on pace and the second day after being fast,
14:07
Speaker 1: furious and particularly fearsome, to then come back down to
14:11
Speaker 1: the packa being on the second day, how hard is
14:13
Speaker 1: it for a fast bowler And is there a concern?
14:16
Speaker 2: Well, you just saw it in the way they bowled
14:19
Speaker 2: in that fire linings. Look, Travis had played brilliantly, Let's
14:23
Speaker 2: make no bones about that. But if you look at
14:24
Speaker 2: the highlights and where they pitched the ball to him
14:26
Speaker 2: for all his boundaries, you're going to see a similar pattern.
14:30
Speaker 2: You know, the short balls weren't getting up that they
14:33
Speaker 2: weren't you well directed a lot of the time. I
14:36
Speaker 2: know he played some unbelievable shots as well, and I'm
14:38
Speaker 2: not taking anything away from his innings, but you know
14:42
Speaker 2: most of the bowler's pace was down and it is
14:44
Speaker 2: a consideration.
14:46
Speaker 3: At the same time, I understand.
14:48
Speaker 2: Why England want to play this positive brand of cricket
14:52
Speaker 2: and it's what has saved been well in the past
14:54
Speaker 2: and it can really put pressure on Australia. But it's
14:58
Speaker 2: recognizing the key moments in the game when you've got
15:02
Speaker 2: your foot on the throat, which Australia do all the time.
15:05
Speaker 2: It's knowing that that afternoon session they were ninety nine
15:09
Speaker 2: for one ahead. Can they just get through that session?
15:14
Speaker 2: Back two sessions and that's all they needed to say
15:16
Speaker 2: to each other. It's just bat two sessions and they
15:20
Speaker 2: would have batted Australia out of the game. Now. I
15:26
Speaker 2: imagine it's quite a tough thing to do when you're
15:28
Speaker 2: in the mindset trying to be positive, you want to
15:30
Speaker 2: feel bad on ball and you don't want to take
15:34
Speaker 2: away the simplicity of some of the players who just
15:38
Speaker 2: seeball hit all. So I feel like the messaging to
15:42
Speaker 2: different players probably needs to be different and what works
15:45
Speaker 2: for them to say, actually, I want to get.
15:48
Speaker 3: Through to the next session.
15:49
Speaker 2: I'm going to put away my drive for the minute
15:51
Speaker 2: because they're bowling in some good areas, good channel and
15:55
Speaker 2: I want to make sure i'm there so I can
15:57
Speaker 2: capitalize in this evening session. When you know that the
16:00
Speaker 2: bowlers are a lot more fatigued, it's not going to
16:03
Speaker 2: be doing as much. The ball is going to be
16:06
Speaker 2: a bit softer, and so it's it's really just understanding
16:10
Speaker 2: yourself is a better to know how to apply yourself
16:13
Speaker 2: in different situations. And I'm sure they would have thought
16:16
Speaker 2: about that on the back of that last Test, and
16:19
Speaker 2: I just hope that they have. But also sorry, as
16:23
Speaker 2: you mentioned, you know, if anything, I don't think they
16:27
Speaker 2: would have thought about the kind of length of time
16:31
Speaker 2: for the bowlers because they're quite There were quite a
16:34
Speaker 2: few of them. They had four frontline quicks plus Ben Stokes.
16:38
Speaker 2: But you just saw the impact it had, even when
16:41
Speaker 2: they're bowling five six kilometers an hour slower. It just
16:46
Speaker 2: brought Australia into the game and so it's something they
16:49
Speaker 2: will need to consider ahead of this excest.
16:53
Speaker 1: One last one in England. I'm doing an extended series
16:56
Speaker 1: on the two thirsand and five series for supports dot
16:59
Speaker 1: Com that they're you and that famous triumph by England.
17:03
Speaker 1: England lost the first Test, but Michael Vaughan told the players, hey,
17:07
Speaker 1: we took twenty wickets here, yet we didn't better as well?
17:11
Speaker 1: Canvince Stokes in the English hierarchy take from this. We
17:14
Speaker 1: had Australia under the pump twice in that match. We
17:18
Speaker 1: were in position. Is that the way they bounced back
17:21
Speaker 1: in Brisbane.
17:23
Speaker 2: There's no doubt that, you know, they will have to
17:26
Speaker 2: put themselves into a positive frame reminder, and I think
17:28
Speaker 2: part of the frustration for not just them but everyone
17:33
Speaker 2: watching was the fact that they were in such a
17:34
Speaker 2: good position and it was a real opportunity and they
17:37
Speaker 2: just didn't close it out. So absolutely they will take
17:41
Speaker 2: those positives that the way England bold is some of
17:44
Speaker 2: the best fast bowling I've seen on Australian pictures from
17:47
Speaker 2: a touring side in a very long time as a unit.
17:51
Speaker 2: You know, we had just Berit Bremer here last year
17:53
Speaker 2: and here is a one man bad. But the fact
17:56
Speaker 2: that everyone looked like they were bowling with consistency, with aggression,
18:02
Speaker 2: with pace, I think that was probably the most exciting
18:05
Speaker 2: thing from the Test match. And so how do they
18:10
Speaker 2: really try and channel that focus to make sure they're
18:12
Speaker 2: getting that more often than not for the remaining part
18:16
Speaker 2: of this.
18:16
Speaker 1: Series Australia, despite that famous win, they've got some concerns
18:22
Speaker 1: and some questions and some things to consider as well.
18:26
Speaker 1: It was when Kowaja is clearly to be concerned. You
18:28
Speaker 1: had English make good runs at Lilac Hill against the
18:34
Speaker 1: English Lions a century and unbeaten one fifty odd Matthew Renshaw,
18:38
Speaker 1: who some thought was probably unlucky or potentially unlucky to
18:41
Speaker 1: miss a spot in the squad. He made one hundred
18:44
Speaker 1: in a pink ball Sheffield Shield match. Travis Head at
18:48
Speaker 1: the top of the order. Many things to consider there
18:50
Speaker 1: from that front. How do you think they'll play it,
18:52
Speaker 1: What do you think happens in terms of the Head
18:54
Speaker 1: Kwaja sort of situation and perhaps a change in the
18:59
Speaker 1: middle order with potentially you know, English coming in and
19:02
Speaker 1: Hidstone at the top.
19:04
Speaker 2: Well, I think they've got two options either as Mcauhaja
19:06
Speaker 2: plays or he doesn't, and that depends on his fitness.
19:10
Speaker 2: But I think if he is fit then he will
19:14
Speaker 2: play because he's got too much experience for Australia, but
19:18
Speaker 2: also at Brisbane and at the Gabba and in pinball
19:22
Speaker 2: matches too as a batter. So if he does play,
19:26
Speaker 2: then he should open. But there's no reason to say
19:30
Speaker 2: that down the line. Travis Head can't open the batting
19:33
Speaker 2: for Australia and it's it's actually quite amazing that they've
19:36
Speaker 2: they've potentially found found an option there in him. So
19:41
Speaker 2: they're probably the two things that need to be looked
19:43
Speaker 2: at from an Osmakawaja point of view. And then I
19:47
Speaker 2: think depending on fitness, it depends how Cameron Green's pulled
19:52
Speaker 2: up after that last Test. It depends how fit Pack
19:55
Speaker 2: Cummins is. Do they want to risk him in this
19:58
Speaker 2: Test match knowing that Josh Hate might not be around
20:02
Speaker 2: and there's Murders that you might not be around for
20:04
Speaker 2: the whole series. So it really is a case of
20:11
Speaker 2: how they're trying to manage their bowlers, what they're trying
20:14
Speaker 2: to do in terms of supporting them. The pink ball test,
20:17
Speaker 2: as I said, couldn't have come at a better time
20:19
Speaker 2: for this Australian team because it means that they can
20:22
Speaker 2: just bowl some nice lines and then let the ball
20:24
Speaker 2: do the talking, you know, in twilight conditions and in
20:27
Speaker 2: the evening. And Nathan Lyon, who's been pretty good in
20:31
Speaker 2: pink ball tests as well, does get extra bouncer on
20:34
Speaker 2: the Brisbane surface and can probably bowl a few overs
20:38
Speaker 2: because it didn't bowl too much in Perth. So that
20:42
Speaker 2: means that you do have a few options. Do you
20:46
Speaker 2: look at b Webster again, you know that that's an
20:49
Speaker 2: option too, But I think Jake Weatherall did enough in
20:52
Speaker 2: that last Test to worry, you know, another opportunity here.
20:56
Speaker 2: But I think a lot of the decisions around Australia's
21:01
Speaker 2: team will center around fitness.
21:03
Speaker 1: Probably we had Brendan Doggett debut for Australia alongside whether
21:07
Speaker 1: or you touched on whether orl than the sick and
21:09
Speaker 1: he needs and how he showed some good signs. I
21:11
Speaker 1: think he spoke about the confidence of the head sort
21:14
Speaker 1: of when Trevis Head said a bit an unleashing and
21:17
Speaker 1: almighty I suppose raw out there. What do you make
21:21
Speaker 1: of Brendan dogget on debut.
21:24
Speaker 2: Look, I think Brandon Doggett was brilliant. I mean, he
21:26
Speaker 2: nearly got a wicket with his first ball, and someone
21:30
Speaker 2: you often find it with players that have been around
21:32
Speaker 2: the circuit and they come in and they don't necessarily
21:35
Speaker 2: get phased by the occasion. Look it probably you know
21:39
Speaker 2: was quite an anxious feeling and always nerves around a
21:42
Speaker 2: Test debut. But the fact that he was kind of
21:45
Speaker 2: just able to slot into his line and length I
21:48
Speaker 2: think just shows you know, he really backs his own game.
21:51
Speaker 2: But the fact that he was able to come in
21:53
Speaker 2: later on, because as I mentioned Mitch Stark was probably
21:57
Speaker 2: reluctant to go to the short ball sustained short ball
22:00
Speaker 2: theory because he knows he's got to stay fit for
22:02
Speaker 2: five Test matches and so who else were they going
22:05
Speaker 2: to look to, Not Scott Boland. So Brendan Doggett was
22:08
Speaker 2: the guy that came in after lunch. I think it
22:11
Speaker 2: was that first that first day and he was able
22:14
Speaker 2: to change up his length and all the short stuff
22:16
Speaker 2: and he was tracted a few wickets on the back
22:18
Speaker 2: of that, which just took pressure off the rest of
22:20
Speaker 2: the bowling attack. I think I think he did his
22:27
Speaker 2: role and he fulfilled his role really well. He's able
22:29
Speaker 2: to get the ball moving both ways and I think
22:32
Speaker 2: that just offers just something else to this Australian attack.
22:37
Speaker 3: In the absence of Cummins and Hazelwood.
22:41
Speaker 1: The toss it's a pink ball test. I mean here
22:44
Speaker 1: in Adelaide, I was thinking the last two tests of
22:47
Speaker 1: covered outside of Melbourne. Now I was in Sydney last year,
22:49
Speaker 1: but the last week test outside of Melbourne Adelaide pink
22:53
Speaker 1: ball Perth two days. My hind was whirling in Adelaide
22:57
Speaker 1: that they can be really confusing beasts pink ball taste.
23:00
Speaker 1: They can go rapidly, but things can change by the conditions.
23:04
Speaker 1: It can be pleasid during the day and then all
23:06
Speaker 1: of a sudden their ball has demons.
23:09
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly right. And the toss is so crucial it
23:11
Speaker 2: becomes even more crucial in the pink ball test.
23:14
Speaker 3: You know you win the toss.
23:15
Speaker 2: You want to bat first because then you can dictate
23:18
Speaker 2: terms in terms of how how long a you're batting
23:21
Speaker 2: for now. If England we're batting first, you want them
23:24
Speaker 2: to go into the next day because you know they
23:28
Speaker 2: get the day conditions twice then and you have an
23:31
Speaker 2: opportunity to dictate, like I said, and maybe declare just
23:36
Speaker 2: before tea when it's starting to get a bit darker
23:40
Speaker 2: the lights are coming on. Twilight hits a little bit
23:42
Speaker 2: earlier I think in Brisbane, so you know you're really
23:46
Speaker 2: thinking about the timings when you want to put the
23:48
Speaker 2: opposition in. That's if they get there. But you know,
23:54
Speaker 2: batting first means that you do have the opportunity to
23:57
Speaker 2: try and dictate terms. If Australia were batting first, you
24:01
Speaker 2: know England, I think we're back themselves.
24:03
Speaker 3: Tory involve all Australia out before the second day.
24:07
Speaker 2: But that's where Australia's experience comes into play. They have
24:12
Speaker 2: players who can really make the most of the flatter
24:15
Speaker 2: conditions but then understand how to play, you know, when
24:20
Speaker 2: it is doing a little bit more so. Again similar
24:23
Speaker 2: for the Bowl as they're going to have to adjust
24:25
Speaker 2: based on based on different times of day.
24:30
Speaker 1: Just finally, yeah, I did touch about talk about you
24:34
Speaker 1: had a function over here in Perth with your charity.
24:37
Speaker 1: Can you tell us a little bit about the charity
24:39
Speaker 1: and also I think we've got another event coming up
24:41
Speaker 1: in Brisbane and let us know if there's any others
24:43
Speaker 1: coming up. What is the charity for and how can
24:46
Speaker 1: people I suppose get involved.
24:49
Speaker 3: Yeah, So the charity is called Take a Lead.
24:51
Speaker 2: I founded it a few years ago now, we became
24:54
Speaker 2: a charity in twenty twenty three and really the purpose
24:58
Speaker 2: is to advance epity and diversity in and increased participation
25:01
Speaker 2: for women and girls. Now that seems quite broad, but
25:04
Speaker 2: actually it came on the back of me looking at
25:07
Speaker 2: my own personal journey and recognizing that I'm one of
25:13
Speaker 2: six players of an ethnically diverse background that have ever
25:15
Speaker 2: played for the England women's team, and I was kind
25:17
Speaker 2: of wondering.
25:18
Speaker 3: Why that was.
25:20
Speaker 2: And if it wasn't for my parents' support when I
25:23
Speaker 2: was younger, I probably wouldn't have stayed on the pathway
25:26
Speaker 2: their support. But also players that are on the pathway
25:30
Speaker 2: that really kind of took me under their wing. So
25:32
Speaker 2: what I did I kind of dropped down to community level.
25:34
Speaker 2: I was looking at the interest for salva Asian girls,
25:38
Speaker 2: but they weren't necessarily taking that step onto the pathway,
25:40
Speaker 2: and so I wanted to create something that was going
25:43
Speaker 2: to help support that journey. But also I recognized that
25:46
Speaker 2: to solve that problem you need to bring everyone with you.
25:49
Speaker 2: And the stat that came out from Women in Sport
25:52
Speaker 2: the girls between the age of ten and fifteen drop
25:55
Speaker 2: out a sport twenty percent more of a rate than boys.
25:59
Speaker 2: And then I spoke to Morer Dodd, who's a former
26:01
Speaker 2: Matilda's player. She came out with this really interesting quote
26:07
Speaker 2: that I really resonated with, which was girls, sorry, boys
26:12
Speaker 2: need to be competitive to feel like they belong. Girls
26:16
Speaker 2: need to feel like they belong before they can be competitive. Now,
26:19
Speaker 2: I was really really lucky in the sense that I
26:21
Speaker 2: had the support from my mum and advice from her
26:24
Speaker 2: at key moments on my journey where I probably wanted
26:27
Speaker 2: to quit. But if you don't have that, then it's
26:29
Speaker 2: quite easy to kind of leave the game and leave
26:31
Speaker 2: the sport.
26:33
Speaker 3: So really we're about trying to make sure.
26:35
Speaker 2: Every environment is as good as it can be on
26:37
Speaker 2: first entry to cricket, and it's about providing opportunities for
26:43
Speaker 2: girls and women at every level because we know there's
26:46
Speaker 2: underrepresentation at every level. So the biggest thing that we
26:49
Speaker 2: do is we have a Champions program. We pair up
26:52
Speaker 2: young players coming into the pathway from unprivileged minority backgrounds
26:57
Speaker 2: with players that sort of tear wanted the two counties
27:01
Speaker 2: that they're on the pathway already they're eighteen plus. We
27:04
Speaker 2: train them up, we recruit them, we train them up,
27:05
Speaker 2: they go and deliver workshops and after three sessions with
27:08
Speaker 2: these players, they've built These young girls have built self esteem,
27:12
Speaker 2: confidence and they identify more as cricketers and there's a
27:16
Speaker 2: real team unity there in the team sessions. So it's
27:20
Speaker 2: really about wanting to try and keep girls in cricket
27:24
Speaker 2: after they have first access to it. So that's why
27:27
Speaker 2: we partner with all the charity partners. They provide the
27:29
Speaker 2: free to access cricket. We take them out of that
27:31
Speaker 2: and we provide workshops for them. And so what we're
27:34
Speaker 2: trying to do on this tour is to try and
27:36
Speaker 2: engage interest, raise awareness and to increase the fundraising so
27:42
Speaker 2: that that can support our programs for next year. But
27:45
Speaker 2: I know that there are similar challenges here in Australia,
27:48
Speaker 2: so that's why the raising awareness is really important. And
27:51
Speaker 2: we've got an amazing donor, Rick Johnson, who has kind
27:55
Speaker 2: of set this tour up.
27:57
Speaker 3: He's a girl dad, he's.
27:58
Speaker 2: Got two daughters and he just wants to make sure
28:01
Speaker 2: that they have a better support system for them to
28:05
Speaker 2: stay in cricket and whatever that looks like. And yeah,
28:10
Speaker 2: we're trying to bring girl dads with us on the journey.
28:13
Speaker 2: And he has said that whoever donates, he will donate too,
28:17
Speaker 2: depending on who they are. So if it's you know,
28:22
Speaker 2: a general member of the public, he'll donate a certain amount.
28:24
Speaker 2: If it's a domestic cricketer two hundred and fifty pounds,
28:28
Speaker 2: test cricket of five hundred pounds, and if he comes
28:31
Speaker 2: across Kylie Minogue, then I think he's going to donate
28:35
Speaker 2: five round into the charity. So if you've got any
28:39
Speaker 2: if you've got any Kylie contacts, then that would be great.
28:44
Speaker 2: But look, yeah, we did an event in Perth. We're
28:47
Speaker 2: going to do one on the second of December at
28:50
Speaker 2: Babylon in Brisbane. Alan Border and Matthew Hayden are going
28:54
Speaker 2: to be there. We're going to do a panel chat
28:56
Speaker 2: and a few others from the world of cricket. But yeah,
29:00
Speaker 2: you can get your tickets if you go to Rick's
29:02
Speaker 2: Ashes on Instagram. That's where you can find tickets and
29:06
Speaker 2: support what we're doing.
29:08
Speaker 1: And it's a fantastic cause and it's something having even
29:11
Speaker 1: just seen with the indigenous crickets, you know, the second
29:14
Speaker 1: Indigenous and talking to Hannah Darlington from from Sydney who
29:19
Speaker 1: comes from an indigenous background, but she's talking about trying
29:21
Speaker 1: to raise and add and broaden the diversity among cricket
29:25
Speaker 1: in Australia and it's it's got to be something that's
29:29
Speaker 1: only for the good. So good luck with that. Hopefully
29:33
Speaker 1: get along to Babylon. It's a brilliant, brilliant venue as well,
29:37
Speaker 1: and you know we might need some entertainment before that
29:39
Speaker 1: test because let's hope it goes for three days or
29:41
Speaker 1: four days Yeah, we'll see.
29:45
Speaker 2: Might the odds on it going five days thoughts, Courtney,
29:49
Speaker 2: I'm not.
29:49
Speaker 3: So sure that we're lucky.
29:56
Speaker 1: Well, look, I know you've got you've got some stuff
29:59
Speaker 1: to do. Look, thanks so much for joining the Fox
30:02
Speaker 1: Sports podcast the follow on. You're going to be the
30:05
Speaker 1: lead commentator across the KO Sports Summer of Cricket for
30:08
Speaker 1: the next four tests. This fabulous, intriguing Ashes series. But
30:12
Speaker 1: more importantly, good luck tonight. Have a ball at Sam Fender.
30:15
Speaker 1: I hope it is one last rollicking concert to finish
30:19
Speaker 1: off the what's been a great tour.
30:21
Speaker 2: Well, he's heading to Perth, so if people are listening
30:23
Speaker 2: to this and they're still in Perth, he's on on
30:27
Speaker 2: Friday night.
30:27
Speaker 3: I think it is.
30:29
Speaker 2: That's just down the road from where I am. That
30:35
Speaker 2: that'll be their last gig of the tour, so that
30:37
Speaker 2: that's going to be properly a Walkers.
30:39
Speaker 1: I love it. Well, look, I have a ball tonight,
30:41
Speaker 1: and again, thanks so much for your time. Really appreciate it.
30:44
Speaker 3: Thanks Courtney,