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The Problem With Disney Erasing Moana’s Curls · We Are Spiraling

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: This is Priya Anand and we are spiraling.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: In this show, we use curly hair as a lens to investigate our world.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: If you're listening for the first time, hi, this is one of our mini sodes, a handful of minutes long.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_00: We also have full feature-length episodes in our feed about why so many people are secretly curly and the real reason boys and even old men are getting perms.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Disney releases its live-action Moana remake this week.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: And back when the trailer came out in the fall, one thing jumped out to me immediately.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: Moana's character in the animated version has long flowing curls.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: Catherine Lagaya, the actress who plays her in the live action, is a perfect match.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: She has amazing hair, dare I say, it flows down and curls like Hyacinth Blooms.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_00: And if you listen to episode one, you might get that reference.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: But in the trailer, it was clear in an instant that they're not using Catherine's naturally curly hair.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: I wrote on my substack back then at WeArtSpiraling.com that Disney is complicit in suppressing curls on screen.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: Hollywood generally almost never portrays curly hair on leading women.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_00: They, and I'm gonna refer to the industry writ large here, don't really like it and view curly and they view curly hair as unruly.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: Celebrity stylist Matthew Collins, who works on film and TV sets, he explained this to us in episode two.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: He said curly hair is looked at technically as more disheveled.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: But in the case of Moana, it was honestly a bummer to see that even the animated character with natural curls couldn't be represented with real curly hair.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: So Rolling Stone recently asked Catherine LaGaya and director Thomas Cale why they had her wear a wig.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: Cale jumped in before Catherine could respond, and he said they shot for 80 to 90 days.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: Catherine was going in and out of water tanks, doing different scenes back to back in completely different parts of the film.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: He said, in a world where you can't exert real control making a film, it's a way to have a little bit of it.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: He added that Moana has about 30 different hair looks throughout the movie.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I think we're all reasonable enough to understand that shooting a movie is complicated.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: Scenes are shot out of order, you might be bopping back and forth between different takes.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: In the case of Moana, water tanks from completely different parts of the movie over the course of a single day or even an afternoon, maybe.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_00: But here's the thing: Disney had to create really complex custom CGI to get Moana's curls right in the animated version.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: So why was it so hard to actually show curly hair in the live action?
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: Curly hair or any hair doesn't actually look exactly the same from minute to minute.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: So scene to scene, I don't quite understand that logic there.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: Because they could have had a curly wig that got wet and a curly hair that stayed dry.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's the part of the explanation that doesn't make sense because they were able to get The Rock a curly wig.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I know everyone has thoughts and feelings on that, so that's all I'm gonna say about that one.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: But you might be thinking, what's the big deal?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: They didn't give Moana a curly enough wig.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: And the thing is, it actually is a big deal because Disney princesses for so long looked exactly one way, and representation does matter.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: In this case, it wasn't even about creating representation.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's the thing.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's that Disney decided to erase the representation.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: So, what does that tell little girls who watch Disney movies?
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: That they shouldn't be curly either, or that they should view it as something to change about themselves.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: On this show, we covered the damaging impact that the Princess Diary's transformation of Mia from curly and therefore undesirable to attractive after hair straightening when she becomes a princess.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_00: And that transformation taught little girls to be grateful that technology exists to transform them.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: So to me, this whole Moana situation just smells like Hollywood creating unrealistic beauty standards once again and giving us a weird excuse afterward, where basically, unless you're a wax figure at Madame Toussaud's and you look exactly the same at all moments in time, it's not gonna work.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: And the thing is, we don't actually need more of that.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: We've had enough of that.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: I think what most of us actually want is something real.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_00: So, by the way, I do want to make sure to include how Catherine feels about this and what she said in the interview because Thomas Cale jumped in before she could speak.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: And she said that once I was in this wig, once I'm in this costume, that I really am Moana.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: I think it helped me kind of channel her and see her, or sorry, and see myself a little bit differently through her.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe there were things that, you know, Catherine couldn't do, but Moana could do.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_00: Legaya is herself of Samoan heritage, and she was cast in this role at age 17, and she called it an honor.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: This is a multi-generational issue, though.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: This issue of curly hair not being shown on screen and actresses being transformed.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_00: And seeing actresses like Catherine Lagaya with her curls, seeing Zendaya wear her curls in certain movies, it does make a difference.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: And also, they're just beautiful.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_00: So we should push to free Moana's curls.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: If you didn't check out our last episode before this one, it's about why some animals have curly hair.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: It features poodles, a curly lion, alpacas, bison, and curly pigs.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Check it out in your feed and send me all your questions about curly hair, our culture, and anything else you'd like me to dig into in one of our next episodes.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Priya at WeArespiraling.com.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: This show is produced by Citizens of Sound and hosted by my upcoming hair care line, Myura, which launches this fall.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so excited.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: I quit my job reporting on Silicon Valley to investigate curly hair across all fronts almost two years ago.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_00: And it's been such a joy to see the show reach people.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm excited that Mayura can soon too.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: Beam Music by Lopgun.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: You can find him in any of your streaming apps.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: And see you on Instagram and TikTok.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: Our show handle is in the show notes.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: Talk to you soon.