Latest / Patriots Catch-22 / Patriots Catch-22 2/26: Davon Godchaux Trade Report, Eliot Wolf Reaction, Latest Buzz from NFL Combine

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Patriots Catch-22 2/26: Davon Godchaux Trade Report, Eliot Wolf Reaction, Latest Buzz from NFL Combine · Patriots Catch-22

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: Lazar and Alex.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Barth Blazarre and Blazarre. Everybody nailed it.
• 0:14
  Speaker 3: He joined us always.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: Buying our bark.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Here's Evan Lazar and Alex bars in Tennessee.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: In said Kevin Byard. For years was rabel and say
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: that again.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Kevin Byarn tired, Yeah to buy art on the A.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Why do you harp on that?
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: Does it make?
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: I have never heard of I'm rolling here, you.
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: Said his continue Kevin Byrn, Whatever you want to go on?
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Right? Yeah. I love it when I know in the moment,
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: and I knew last week, Oh this is going to
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: be the teaser for next week. I love it when
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: I guess it.
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: People say we bicker too much, but to me, that's
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: the best part of the show. That's the whole as
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: you just made you. Are you settled? Are you settled
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: in your your your laptops plugged in? Everything? Is I
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: am all good looking for Bradley, just like jump through
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: hoops for you.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: I don't know why I scheduled like the the nerdiest
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: thing drafting I was gonna do right before the show,
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: because of course it was gonna run long. Uh, interview
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: with the land Zerline from NFL dot Com. Coming to
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: the Sports Up later. But uh, it's been fun and
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: I'm ready to go. Let's do it. Catch twenty two
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: from the Combine.
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: Talk about talent. That was a talent move right there. Hey,
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: can you plug this in for me? God brutal.
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: I would have done nor the plug store. All right,
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: you guys have a much bigger table in Weed. You
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: got this whole setup. It's nice, helmet, it's nice.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: I like it all right. Well, obviously we are live
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: here from the Indiana Convention Center at the NFL Scouting Combine.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: This is pretty cool. This is pretty cool. This is
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: another look mom, we made it moment right now doing
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: a live show from the Combine. This is right in
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: our wheelhouse obviously, where.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: We've done live shows from now so we've done previous employer,
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: super Bowl, previous employer Yeah right, yeah, Shrine bol grind Bole.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: I feel like there's one more or am imagining that.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: I don't know which we got it next year, Senior Ball,
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: I'm speaking that into.
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: That would be great.
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: I spoke to you coming to the Combine to exist.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: You're not going to do that for the Senior Bowl
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: next year, so we have a lot to talk about.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: We actually just had a little bit of Patriots breaking
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: news right off the top of the show, so we'll
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: get today here in a second, and uh, just a
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: lot to talk about over the last couple of days.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: We don't have phones today, so just if you're calling in,
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: you're not going to hear from us. Sorry, you don't
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: have phones, but we do have emails, so hit us
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: up on the emails at podcast at Patriots dot com
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: if you want to tune in on the emails and
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: weigh in, I should say on the emails, we can
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: do it that way for this week. But before we
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: get really rolling here, it's our favorite ad read of
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: the week. Hey Pats fans. If you want to see
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: Toyota's best offers, including those not seen on TV, go
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: to buy Atyota dot Com is Toyota's official website for
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: deals for the official vehicle of the New England Paige.
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: It's Toyota let's go places and easy to drink, easy
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: to enjoy, but like the official beer sponsor of the
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: New England Patriots. So I was gonna start with.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: This looks good by that I just finally pulled up
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: my com He's got a great job.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: Good they do a good job. So I was gonna
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: start with Elliot Wolf, who we just heard from about
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: an hour ago or two hours ago, I guess now,
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: And we got to talk to him here at the
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: table as well, and that will be up on Patriots
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: dot com here shortly. So that was an exciting conversation
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: really quickly, total NERD moment for me. With Elliott here
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: at the table, I asked him a question about Travis Hunter,
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: and one of the questions I asked, what I was
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: asking him specifically about, was do you have to do
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: two different scouting reports for him, like one as a
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: corner and one as a receiver and fill out a
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: completely different form for each. And he actually said that's
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: exactly how they did it. They had their scouts in
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: Colorado mentioned Macro in Colorado scouted Travis Hunter and had
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: submitted two different scouting reports on travel.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: I mean that makes sense. Maybe eventually these kinds of players,
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: because I think this is going to become I don't
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: know that it will be ever common, yeah, but I
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: mean Travis Hunter is a nobody's played two ways like
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: this in a long time. Maybe you'll start getting like
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: three or four of these guys in the nation every year.
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: And you know, I don't think Hunter's gonna play both
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: ways in the NFL full time. I don't think anybody
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: can play both ways full time in the NFL. But
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: it is going to you saying that if you'll allowed
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: me to nerd out for this whole thing is just
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: nerding out.
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, welcome to the combat.
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: I do wonder if if you know, because Travis Hunter
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: is gonna inspire more kids to play this style football,
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: and how does that impact the scouting process? Like I
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: thought it was interesting, Elliott Well said today, and we're
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: the only two people on the planet who would find
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: this interesting besides maybe him. Yeah, but it was an
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: interesting point. He was asked about just the landscape of
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: nil and in current college football, and he said, well,
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: you know, when guys transfer, we actually get more data
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: on the players because it used to be you'd ask
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: one coaching staff and you were to take that one
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: evaluation for what it was. Now you're gonna hear from two, three,
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: maybe four different coaching staffs about a player, So you
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: get a wider range of information. You may be able
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: to get confirmation you able to be able to get
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: conflicting reports, which allows you to go deeper. So I
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: thought that was that was interesting on a I don't
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: know how much it impacts the Patriots. I don't know
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: what that means. They're gonna draft more transfer guys. Most
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: guys are transfer guys at this point. I don't think
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: you'd be picking in that regard. But I thought that
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: was interesting from him today too.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: So we'll get some more takeaways here about Elliot Wolf
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: and Mike Rabel yesterday speaking to the media basically doing
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: like a media car wash. He was available for essentially
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: like an hour of time between all the different things
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: that he's stacked together there in that short period of time.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: So we'll talk about that too. But before we get
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: into all of that, the breaking news right now from
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: Ian Rappaport NFL Network. I'm gonna just read the tweet
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: because I find the way it was phrased Alex to
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: be really interesting. Here, the Patriots have given defensive tackle
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: Devon Godshaw permission to seek a trade, sources said. This
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: is according to rap Sheet. There has been contact with
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: interested teams, and this is a line that I found
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: really interesting. The veteran is likely on the move given
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: the team's defensive scheme shift. So they got a lot
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: about this on the show. I tried to ask Rabel
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: about this yesterday. He didn't want to necessarily commit himself
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: to one direction in terms of four to three, three four,
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: all that different kinds of things. But use the word
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: he used to describe defensive coordinator Torell Williams yesterday was aggressive,
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: that he coaches aggressive defensive lineman. Now, I guess you
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: could look at that and you could be aggressive with
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: your hands, you could be aggressive with power, you could
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: be aggressive in different ways. But the way that I've
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: taken it, and then obviously we've discussed the Tennessee tape
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: and going back to Tennessee and looking at the four
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: to three, the one gapping, the different things that they
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: did in Tennessee, it does sound like Godshaw a prototypical
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: three four Belichick two gapping nose tackle, that base eater,
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: that is a space heater. Great way to put it.
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: That's not going to be a fit in this scheme.
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: To put that line in there, particularly about the scheme shift,
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: I found really fascinating.
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: And it's funny we were just talking about was this
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: two hours ago, we were talking about Devon gottshat because
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: I talked to Cameron Jackson, the defensive tackle from Florida
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: we've talked about on the show. Was that the Senior
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: Bowl guy like and we were kind of arguing. I
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: was like, Oh, he's a defensive lineman. You guys like, no,
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: he's just like just a defensive tackle, the nose tackle.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: But he he is, I guess, but he's he's not
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: the same kind of player as Barmore. He plays with
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: more athleticism, he's more rangy, he's not quite as powerful,
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: even though he's like three hundred and thirty five pounds.
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: And I think it is that tone shift towards the
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: I mean, let's do it day one, day two, day three,
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: Mason Graham, Deon Walker, Cam Jackson, Right, that's what we do.
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: That kind of player is gonna be a fit, whereas
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: your true nose tackles now maybe aren't. Yeah, and I
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: just one more thing, yep, I do like I think
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: it is getting ahead of them for a team. And
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: Ellie Wolf talked about this earlier where they put players
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: in bad situations at times last year gotchaf They are
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: making this change, probably not going to be in a
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: good situation New England schematically, they're giving an opportunity to
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: get out rather than try to make it work, try
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: to put the square peg in a round hole and
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: potentially have a problem down the line.
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: That's a good sign. Yeah. So usually you know in
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: their four to three in Tennessee at least they played
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: a lot of overfronts right where you have a three technique,
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: so that's a player that's gonna line up over the
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: outside of the guard right right outside of his on
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: his outside hip, and then you would play with a
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: one technique which is shaded into the A gap, so
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: instead of straight up on the center, you're now off
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: into the A gap a little bit in between that
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: gap there. And when you look at that type of player,
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: typically you do talk about somebody that's more aggressive, that
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: gets up the field, that's shooting the gap right versus
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: just trying to hold the point of attack and build
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: that wall and mirror and react to the movement of
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: the running back. So you look at this class and
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: you do start to think about some of these guys
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: that might be fits in more in that penetrating fund
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: and you know, maybe granted like in terms of order
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: and all that. I don't know if all these guys
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: are gonna be available where the Patriots could pick them,
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: But obviously Mason Graham at the top I think fits
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: that mold.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: Actually give me a interesting nugget I just got from
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: Uzzer Line. Yeah, he has Walter Nolan ahead of Mason Graham.
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: So I was gonna bring up Walter Nolan next. I
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: I think there are some things about Walter Nolan I
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: don't love. I think when he gets uh, he stalls
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: out sometimes in his pass rush and his bull rush
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: because he gets too high, and he's kind of one
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: of those guys that's you know, he's either gonna hit
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: it and you know, fire off the ball and he's
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: gonna be immediately in the backfield, or he's gonna get
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: stood up and that's gonna be the end of the
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: rep for him. I don't typically like I like those
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: guys that have that like second reaction ability that they
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: can kind of keep going and have that motor. Mason
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Graham is I think a motor guy in that respect,
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: but Walter Nolan is the next name I was going
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: to go to. You know, one of those types of
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: players that can really get up the field really shoot gaps,
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: you know, and we can go on down the line here.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: There's there's so much talent on this defense to line class.
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: Where where do you put Dion Walker in this? Because
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: he's built like the three fourteen gaping nose tackle, but
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: he doesn't play like it.
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: So I Deon Walker if I had to just think
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: about a Patriot comp a little bit, He's not. He's
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: a tough player to con He's not built exactly the same.
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: I'm just talking about roll right specifically to roll. Like
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: remember when they tried to make Danny Shelton into like
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: a two gapping nose tackle and that just wasn't really
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: great for him, and he was more of, you know,
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: play a primary gap and either shoot it or hold
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: it or whatever at that primary gap. I look at
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: Dion Walker as a similar type of player.
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: He's quicker though, uh.
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: Maybe Danny Shelton was.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: Was am I underestimating Danis.
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: Shellon maybe a little bit? I mean not not like
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: not saying that Danny Shelton was Vince Wolfe.
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: Or you know how I feel about Dean Walker.
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, but yeah, I think that I see what
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: you're saying that, Yeah, you know, you think of a
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: player like that, and you think of him being not
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: a finesse player necessarily, but not as agile or as quick,
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: but more powerful and you know, block eating or space
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: eating as you said earlier. I could definitely see that
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: one being a part of it. You know, just a
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: couple of other guys, uh Peebles from UH was in
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: Virginia Tech, right, Yeah, you know those types of players.
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: You know, those guys can really get up the field
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: and get off the ball and fly off the ball.
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: I think this is a welcome thing for the Patriots,
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: I really do. I think, you know, for two reasons.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: Primarily one, early down pass rush. If you're gonna two
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: gap and you're gonna read and react and hold up
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: blocks and things like that, you're inherently gonna have a
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: hesitation to pass rush. And with the amount of pass
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: rush or amount of passing that teams do on first
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: down nowadays, whether it's play action or just straight dropback,
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: that I do really think, you know, SAPs the pass
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: rush ability of your early down pass rush because you
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: have to hold up you know, you're holding the block
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: and then you're reading pass and then you're probably ripping
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: through or something like that. To get to the quarterback.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: So there's that little bit of hesitant. The other thing
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: I would say that I like about, you know, one gap,
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: being more aggressive. You see all around the league now
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: the Shanahan outside zone, wide zone team offenses, and when
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: you look back at that Super Bowl against the Rams
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: in twenty eighteen, the line that Belichick kept using on
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: the sideline is get vertical, right. You have to penetrate
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: against that kind of scheme. You can't try to hold
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: up blocks against wide zone. That's playing into the strength
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: of the scheme. What you want to do is get
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: up the field, penetrate the backfield, and throw off the
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: rhythm and the timing of the blocks that way. So
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: with all these wide zone teams across the league, and
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: with all these teams throwing a ton on first down,
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: I like being more aggressive. I think this is the
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: right way to go.
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: I think so too, And I guess along similar lines,
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: like when we talked to Rabel yesterday, he was asked,
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: you know, about his blitz philosophy, and he said, it's
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: more about when you do it than how much you
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: do it, which is code for, among other things, you
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: don't plan on blitzing a ton if you don't plan
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: on blitzing a ton. You have to get home with four,
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: which is something where the Patriots, they were either worse
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: in the league or among the worst in the league
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: last year at getting home with.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: There were twenty ninth in overall pressure rate and thirty
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: first or thirty second and four man.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so it was down there. So to Von gotcha,
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of things he does well, that's not
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: an area where he's gonna help you. So if you're
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: gonna be doing more of that, yeah, you need a
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: more dynamic player in that spot.
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a couple more names just to throw out there
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: at this spot because now if Godshaw's on the move,
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: they're reinventing this defensive line here on to fly, I.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: Really what's left him. Most of these guys are free agents,
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: that's true. Although the one guy I look at who
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: is who I would bring back from the group is
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: a free agent. Is I almost said, Danny Shelton, Danny Aquala,
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: Daniel quality. He fits this.
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so you look at this, you know this defensive
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: line class. I think everybody you speak to, and Elliott
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: Wolf said this to day as well on the podium.
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: It's the strength of the class, the defensive line class.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: I think there was something like forty two guys or
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: something like that here today that talk to us at
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: the podiums like it's the strength of the class. And
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: with that in mind, you know Day two is gonna
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: have a lot of starting talent. Daniel Jeremiah right now
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: has twenty four starting grades on defensive linemen, So that
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: means that you're gonna get defensive lineman that can start
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: in the NFL into Day three of the draft. And
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: that's why I've said over and over again that I'm
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: not the biggest fan of the Mason Graham pick at four,
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: not because I don't like the player, but because it's
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: such a deep class that I think you're gonna get
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: players that can make an impact on Day two. You know,
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna butcher his name probably, but JJ Peguez from
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: Old miss is another one. I mentioned Peebles, Darius Alexander
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: from Toledo. But these are the types of guys that
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: are those one tech three techniques and that can do
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: these types of things.
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: I'll even say on the like that extends to the
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: edge too. Yeah, and a guy I was really impressed
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: with today is Princely umin me, Yeah, from Ole Miss.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: We talked to him today and he kind of broke
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: down his process and how he approaches you know, the
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: the chess match with tackles and things like that, and
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: talked about being aggressive and those sorts of things. So
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: I'm with you, Like Mason Graham certainly a good player,
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: but the drop off for Mason Graham to the guy
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: you're gonna get later on, even if you move up
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: right into the twenties and you take a guy like
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Jack Sawyer or you take a guy like Darius Alexander,
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: whether you want to go edge, mid or whatever, right right,
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: that drop off is not nearly as significant as all right,
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: like you didn't take well Campbell, How high up do
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: you have to go to get Ursery or Connery?
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: And then what are you doing?
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: Like I like Anthony Belton, but Anthony Belton's really raw
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: and he might be a right tackle, he might not
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: be a left tackle. You're like, the Anthony Belton equivalent
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: on the defensive line probably isn't going till day three.
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: It's a better player, right Well.
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: I'm saying that caliber of play here.
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, all right, So that's a devon Godshai can
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: obviously wait and on that and the emails. Like I said,
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: but just the news off the top of the hour
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: here the Patriots have given Devon Godshaw permission to seek
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: a trade and as Ian Rapaport put in his tweet
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: scheme shift and also look sounds like this might get done,
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: you know, like there might be a trade partner here.
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: There there is some interest across the market. Let's get
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: into Elliott Wolf. He spoke here today, Like I mentioned,
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: that's up on patriots dot com and on our YouTube
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: channel if you want to check out the full press conference.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: Just right off the top before we get into some
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: of the specifics about what he said in terms of
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: free agency in the draft, I couldn't help but notice
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: sort of a mirroring to Robert Craft's press conference at
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: the end of the year, and that is just right
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: off the top opening statement ownership of.
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: We messed up. We got we I I I messed up?
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah right, And I thought the line obviously that was
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: harrowing was him saying every single time Drake may or
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: Jacoby brissetid took the hit, he felt responsible, you know,
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: and I think he shares a lot and what the
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: fans are thinking I understand it doesn't make every fan
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: feel better about the fact that, you know, he's still
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: empowered here in this organization in the front office. He's
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: still gonna have his detractors, and he's still gonna have
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: people that don't want him in a position of power.
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: But with that being said, I think that's the right
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: thing to say in his position. There's really nothing else
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: you can't say besides that.
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: No, there isn't. And I'm glad he said it. And
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: I don't remember if we talked about this last week
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: on the air, off the air, whatever. Yeah, Like one
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: of the big things I was looking for coming into
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: this week, coming into today was if Eli will still
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: his final say, which sounds like he sort of has
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: a version of it. What did he learn from last year?
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: You have to look at last year and say, I
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: need to do this differently, I need to do this differently,
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: I need to do this differently, I need to do
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: this better, I need to do this more, I need
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: do this less right, and on and on and on,
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: And I kind of figured it was going to be
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: a read between the lines, like the kind of thing
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Felgre and Mascow nuts for right, Like we're gonna read
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: between the lines as he was really saying, Nope, he
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: gave it to us.
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: He gave it to us.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: Talked about player development with the rookie class Jalen Polk,
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: He said that, he literally said they stunted his growth
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: with Jalen Polk. Talked about missing intel, bad intel on
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: the free agent class Chooks, A kor Force on a
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: Taki Taki, kJ Osborne, things we talked about this year.
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: Those players, well two of them were not who the
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: Patriots thought they were when they signed him. Another guy
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: was an injury and maybe something happened with the medicals
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: something like that. Yeah, the injury on Taki Taki is
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: a good point in terms of that detail, in terms
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: of the background. So now look, how often do I
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: say this about anything they do saying the right things. Great,
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: you gotta do something about it. But he basically came
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: out and laid out, here's everything I did wrong in
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty four. And you don't do that unless you're
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: gonna change your approach, or unless the team's gonna change
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: its approach. Right, And maybe some of that is the
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: influence of Rabel, Ryan Cowden or even Stretch Right, but
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: he came out and said things that we've talked about
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: and fans have talked about, and we were like, they
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: did this wrong. He came out and I did this wrong,
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: And you don't see that often.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, in terms of the thoroughness and the free agency class,
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: I do think that that's an area that Ryan Cowden
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: is going to be involved in and is here for,
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: is to add another guy that basically has a general
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: manager resume and that can come in and be able
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: to evaluate pro talent and be able to help put
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: together those types of scouting reports and evaluations and things
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: like that. So I thought that was very interesting. The
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: Jalen Polk line, I thought was also fascinating from a
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: team building roster building perspective with Batman one, which is yeah, yeah,
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: but that's what we get into a lot in this
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: show in terms of the roster building, right, And I
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: asked him a follow up about it in our interview
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: about sort of the the old cliche and football of
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: you address needs in free agency and you draft best
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: player available, and when you get to the draft, and
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: the takeaway that I had from the Jalen Polk statement,
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: which was we probably put too much on his plate
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: too early was they didn't go out in free agency
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: or in the veteran market and add a high enough
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: talent to starting caliber receiver that they didn't have to
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: throw Jalen Polk right into the into the fire as
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: a second round pick. This is not Marvin Harrison junior, right,
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: This wasn't a top five, top ten talent in this draft.
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: This was a second round pick and a cluster of
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: wide receivers and they basically, you know, into his Dark
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: Knight analogy, it kind of expected him to be the hero, right,
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: to come in and save the day. When you look
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: across the board at their their approach last offseason from
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: the draft, free agency to the draft, you could say
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: that at quarterback that Drake may had to be the hero.
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: You could say that at wide receiver that Jalen Polk
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: had to be the hero. And you could say that
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: about left tackle with Kayden Wallace. Like they kind of
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: left it all up to the draft, and I think
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: they definitely recognized so they recognize it, but like you said,
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: you have to go out there and do it.
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: I remember talking about this last year. We were doing
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: the whole draft and develop thing right with the Packers,
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: and it was that works really well. Like you can
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: do that over time, because if you've been doing it
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: for long enough, you build up this foundation and you
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: have a security blanket you can go from there. You
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: can't really start from scratch with draft and develop. You
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: need to use free agency to create a base. Get
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: that floor, get those first guys in so you can
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: develop behind them, and then ideally from there if you
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: don't want to be big players in free agency, or
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: you just want to rely more on the draft, which
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: by the way, is what most teams do is rely
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: primarily on the draft. Now it's okay, Well, the guys
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: we drafted and developed five years ago were developed and
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: they're now up top, and we're gonna bring guys in
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: behind them. We're gonna bring guys in behind them, and
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: you create the pipeline. But it has to the pipe
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: has to sit on something. Yeah, and there was no
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: base for it to sit on last year. And you know,
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: we've made the comp and I've heard other people this
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: week make the comp when I've asked about what would
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: you know a realistic successful offseason be for the Patriots
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: not they signed the top seven free agents, right, realistic?
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: And I've had you know, more than half of the
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: people have responded with some form of you look at
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: what Washington did right where they signed seven to ten
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: what somebody called them, I think nuts and bolts free agents.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: These guys weren't superstars, but they were keeping everything together right.
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: They were foundational. They were stabilizing presence guys, quality starters,
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: quality solid players. Not superstars, but those kind of guys
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: that seems to be especially in this class where there
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: aren't those superstars, and the free agent class keeps shrinking
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: every day. We're here with T Higgins and Ronnie Stanley
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: and and those guys expected to go back to their teams.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: John Schneider laughed yesterday when asked about DK Metcalf. So
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: that hurt me a little bit, But like, that's what
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: the Patriot's gonna have to do. It's gonna have to
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: be meat and potatoes. Get that floor set, and then
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: you hope that you develop guys and elevate them where
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: you know they're your leaders in two or three years,
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: and now you're trying to draft guys to fill in
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: the pieces around them.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I look, we all kind of bring up the
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: Washington comp a lot, and I get that it's probably
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: a little bit of a broken record, but you just
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: look at what they were able to do and bring
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: in six, eight, ten, just quality NFL veterans. Again, we're
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: not talking about future Hall of Famers all pro level players.
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: That'd be great if they could land all one of
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: those T. Higgins type or whatever, but we're just talking
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: about quality NFL players that way. There, when we get
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: into the draft, if a drafted tackle on Day two,
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: it's not they're not expecting that tackle to be the
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: starting left tackle on day one of the season. You
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: know they have a Cam Robinson or an all Rector
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: Baun exactly.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: I you want your second round pick to be an
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: impact player. You can't have a repeat of Jalen Polk.
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: But the only guy I talk about this sometimes where
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: there's year one starters, right, and there's Day one starters,
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: and that's different. You're the only guy that you you
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: really are banking on being a Day one starter as
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: your first round pick, especially picking as high as they
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: are this year, right, Day two guy should be a
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: year one starter. He should be a key contributor by
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: the end of the year. But you usually want to
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: have a little wigger room with those Day two guys, right,
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: and then Day three guys are project players, but they
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: need to do more. It shouldn't be the rookie class
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: supporting the free agents, or it shouldn't be Yeah, it
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: shouldn't be the rookie class supporting the free agents. It
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: should be the free agent supporting the rookie class.
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think, yeah, you got that.
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: I think right.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: I think he got it all right. The other couple
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: things that stood out to me, and then obviously you
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: can add on if there's things that I missed from
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: Elliott Woolf. I think the other big topic and discussion
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: is what the heck is gonna happen in the top
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: three of this draft, because last year, not only did
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: it feel like it was, it made as much as
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: we might have talked about Marvin Harrison Junior and other
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: options for the Patriots at three overall. Last year, Let's
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: face it, we did that because we had a show
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: to do today and there was time to film, right,
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: That's why we did it. If we really got down
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: to brass tacks, that made more all. Drake may or
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: a quarterback there, whether it was May or Daniels, was
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: kind of always going to be the pick.
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: I remember JJ McCarthy days.
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: It was I was kind of always going to be
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: the pick in my opinion, looking back, we're not taking
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: a quarterback.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: So this year they took the right one, which is good.
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: Not only is there uncertainty about the top three and
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: who's going to go ahead of them on the board,
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: there's also not a lot of consensus about who they
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: should actually take it for. So this is a completely different,
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: open ended type of year.
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: I think one of those fuels the other right, because
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: you still have groups of people and I'm not even
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: talking like just regular fans. I see people in the
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: media still putting Abdual Carter at four, still putting Travis
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: Hunter at four. Hunter maybe a little bit, we can talk.
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: Carter's not getting a four. I know he gets there
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: in a PFF simulators. Sometimes he's not getting the four.
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: So like this, this is what I this is. That's
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: why I think there there's kind of debate because when
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: you put those aside, when you put Carter and Hunter aside,
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: which unfortunately I think we need to do. This is
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: not me saying they shouldn't draft them. They're good players,
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: but if you put those two a side, it's campbellin Graham,
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: and there's that Ted McMillan camp. He's gonna test this week.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: It seems like like.
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: This few guys. I mean, we'll see when he talks,
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: I guess, but one of the few guys. Just to
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: sidetrack real quick, there's a lot of guys not testing
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: that are in the top ten.
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: Which I guess right now, especially in this class.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: Whether it's injury related. You know, Abdua Carter is still
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: getting over an injury from the College Football Playoff. It
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: sounds like Mikel Williams might be in the same boat.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: Jalen Walker today said that he's gonna hold off until
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: his pro day. So a lot of these guys are
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: not testing.
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: But when it comes to McMillan as again, as of
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: right now, what he is it like three thirty. Yeah,
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: on Wednesday he is. That's the one guy I thought
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: wouldn't test because he's not he doesn't win with athleticism. Yeah,
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: that's not a Krent trade and that's all the combine it.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: Unless he thinks he's gonna go out there and run
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: routes that make scouts cry, which maybe he will, maybe
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: they're that crisp, but he like it's it's gonna make
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: or break when when he works out right, because either
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: gonna run like a four four five and we're all
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: gonna be okay. Hello, And Mike Vrabel yesterday talked about
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: contested catch when he mentioned receivers first thing he mentioned
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: contested catch, or he's gonna run like a four to
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: seven and we're gonna start calling him a tight end.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: So the debate really, to me, I actually think there
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: is some clarity to go back to the original point
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: when you take the Carter and Hunter part out of it,
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: which realistically we probably should be doing. It's Campbell and Graham.
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: That's the debate. We know they want to go trenches.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: We know they need to go trenches. You probably you
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: have what is the big the best player at the
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: biggest need on the board, and you have the best
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: player at a non premium position on the board. And
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: I I think that's really the debate. Now it gets
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: really crazy, Evan and I don't know if we'll see
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: this gets really crazy. Like I said, we shouldn't earmark
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: neither of those guys to fall right, we're pushing those
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: guys in the top two, but we're also kind of
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: penciling in a quarterback for that third spot. Who's the
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: third pick? If there's no quarterback in the top three,
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: Is there a chance they don't get to choose between
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: Campbell and Graham?
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: No, I don't think so. I hear what you're saying
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: in terms of like going through scenarios.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: But I'm saying like, that's more like it's more likely
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: to me at this point. And I know I'm going
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: back on what I said a couple of weeks ago,
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: and I'll probably go back on it again in two
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: weeks because that's how weird this quarterback class is. Yeah,
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: right now, I still think there's one. I still think
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: it's gonna be exactly one quarterback in the top three.
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: But if i'd ask you, is it more likely to
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: go in the top three or it's more likely none
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: go in the top three?
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: Which would you pick two or none?
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: I guess none, but.
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: I go no, That's what I'm saying. But I think
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: it's gonna be one. So the Browns. All the reporting
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: here right now is that the Browns are are zeroing
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: in on quarterbacks at two and at three.
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: The Giants. The wild card is Matthew Stafford, in my opinion,
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: with the Giants.
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: Who apparently was hanging out with Tom Brady.
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: Right. So if the Giants Matthew Stafford, then that obviously
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: takes them out of the quarterbacks run. If the Giants
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: don't and the Raiders land Matthew Stafford behind them, then
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: that takes the Raiders out and makes the Giants probably
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: even more willing to take a quarterback there when you
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: look at you know, to go kind of in order
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: here of what you were saying. When it comes to
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: Ted McMillan, I don't think that there's a lot of buzz,
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: especially relative to the last couple of years here in
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: Indy with the combine about this wide receiver class. I
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: feel like this is as subdued of reactions as I've
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: ever seen about who do you like in this receiver class?
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: You know, who excites you in this class? I do
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: think that if Luther Burden didn't have the season he
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: had last year, Thank you, Brady Cooked, and then he
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: would be a more exciting prospect of people. But for
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: what I have, you know, put together here, there's just
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: not a lot of people that are they light up
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: when you start talking about the wide receiver class.
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: I feel like every day we've been here. The wide
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: receiver class has gotten worse in terms of what I'm hearing.
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: Like I talked to somebody today actually liked McMillan, actually
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: really did, but said he had no other receivers graded
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: in the first two rounds. Yeah, like he's saying, because
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: I asked him about it, Buca, Golden, and Burton. Yeah,
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: And I said, like, you know, who do you like
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: from that group? He was like, you know, honestly, I
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: have them all greatest third round picks. So it's people
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: are really doom and gloom to the point where I've
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: kind of been wondering, not for the Patriots, but you know,
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: the league as a whole. This draft is, meanwhile, so
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: deep at tight end. Are there gonna be teams that
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: look at this and just when you pass Catcher gonna
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: take a tight end. I think that that's gonna be
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: the thought process for at least some teams that need
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: a wide receiver.
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: It's definitely possible. I just look at this entire receiver
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: class and I think everybody has their question mark, which
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: is what makes people pause. You know, obviously Ted McMillan
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: is explosiveness speed, downfield speed, top end speed especially, I
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: think Ted McMillan. When he gets going, can build up
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: speed to a decent level, but he's just not an
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: instant accelerator and he's not going to run through defenses
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: because of that. He's not going to win against press
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: on the outside consistently over the top because of that.
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: Then you get into burden. Who's got this. Everybody's just
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: trying to figure out what happened last year? Was it?
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: Brady Cook? I think both of us kind of feel
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: like that had a lot to do with it.
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: I'll tell you it reminds me of Jordan Addison.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, his this some of the I don't want to
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: I guess antics on the sideline, like I don't he.
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: Got I would call it. He got visibly disengaged at times.
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it taken himself out of games.
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: I think I saw. I think Zeroline had in his
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: NFL dot Com scouting report talks about like he got
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: bored with the offense.
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let me see. I think that was so uh
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: A Mecha Abuka is a really solid, well rounded wide receiver,
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: can block, has great hands, uh, knows how to run
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: rouse understand spacing and zone concepts and things like that.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: But he's not a dynamic round runner. He doesn't have
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: great speed, he's not a great separator. You know. The
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: comp that I kind of settled in on with him,
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: I kind of see some Jackson Smith and Jigba there. Yeah,
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: but if I also kind of see a little bit
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: of like you know, prene issues Juju Smith Schuster, Right,
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: that's just that kind of solid, well rounded guy. But
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: that's not a guy that you take in the top
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: ten or top twenty and expect to change the dynamic
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: of your offense. And then with with Matthew Golden, you're
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: really banking on his college football playoff run being the
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: player that he's going to be for the rest of
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: his career. Like that, that's what you're thinking, is that
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: those four games where he went off from the championship
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: with SEC championship, right, I forget what Yeah, well he
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: was he was good before that too, just wasn't as consistent, right,
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: So they asked the championship done stringing games together on
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: is I think one hundred and thirty yards per game
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: for him in those games and he was just off,
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: you know, insane production.
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: By the way, zerline on Luther Burden, I haven't here
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: and I'm just reading part of it here he takes
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: snaps off in short circuits routes if he's not the
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: primary option, but can separate and succeed on all three
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: levels when it's his time. And then he has a
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: quote it was from an NFC scout. I think he
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: got bored with that offense. His playing styles like Jerry Judy,
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: but with Alman Ross, Saint Brown's hands and toughness.
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: Interesting comps. Yeah, I uh, that's definitely what I hear
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: a lot about here. You know in India about this
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: wide receiver class is that there's just everybody's got a
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: flaw and everybody's got some concerns about this class. So,
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: just talking out Wolf again, I asked him, you know,
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: is there a coverage dictating receiver? Is that number one
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: wide receiver for you guys? Uh in this draft? And
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: he was kind of lukewarm about it. And that's sort
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: of the reaction and I get that. Yeah, And so
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: if it's not T Higgins, you know, where did the
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: Patriots turn? I think is an interesting question. Uh, what
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: was the other thing that you said? I had a
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: thought on that. I don't know if I said a
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: bunch of things. And right, just we're we're rolling here
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: is what we're doing.
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: I'll say, to your point, where do the Patriots turn
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: at receiver? I'm okay if they don't add that guy
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: this offseason. And I know nobody wants to hear it, right,
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: but they were never gonna get this whole thing built
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: up all the way in one off season. It's too much,
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: too much to do. Just realistically, they weren't gonna get
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: it done. It's I would rather them instead of throwing
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: good money after bad and being like, all right, T
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: Higgins isn't here, Chris or is a bit Stefan Diggs
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: the best receiver available. Yeah, he's thirty one coming off
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: a knee, but we need to get the best receiver available,
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: because that's what we wanted to do coming in. Just
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: get the best receiver and like overpay and commit yourself
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: long term to Stephan Diggs. Rather than doing that, I
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: would rather see them Neither of these are ideal, but
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: I'd rather see them looking at it and say, the
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: receiver he wants not in free agency, the receiver he
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: wants not in the draft. Schneider's laughing when people are
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: asking about DK Metcalf. Let's just hammer the trenches. Yeah,
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: let's build up this offensive line, defensive line, linebackers, let's
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: add another corner, let's get a safety. Right, and now
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: next year, say they have eight nine boxes to check them,
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: pulling those numbers out of thinner right, all right, we
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: got seven of those checked. Now we can go all
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: in next year. And whether it's giving up a bunch
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: of picks for wide receiver who's available via trade, or
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: flying up the boards to get one of these receivers
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: and what projects to be a much better wide receiver draft.
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: Now you can do that because all these other issues
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: were taken care of. It's gonna be frustrating watching again.
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: And they still should do something. Can you get a
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: guy like Darius Slayton or Chris Godwin on maybe a
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: one year deal? Right? Or maybe there's somebody who you
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: don't love the floor in the third round, but you
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: feel good about the ceiling, you feel good about Todd
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: down and coaching him, and you're like, we'll take the
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: shot here, but not burning a premium asset on a
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: position when you know, all right, we'll we'll just spend
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: like crazy eat this next year when we have more options.
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: I hear, I agree with a lot of what you said.
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: Let me throw this one scenario just to just to facilitate.
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: As Felger likes to say, right driving the bus, would
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: you be out on thinging a little bit outside the
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: box that wide received? Hate this? Am I and taking
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: a risk on a veteran guy. And I have a
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: couple of examples who come with some concerns. I'm gonna
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: hate this, but are in that pre agent year and
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: then if it works out, maybe you pay them. And
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: you don't pay him right away. I mean, who's the
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: player like Chris Alave No, Christian Watson with Green Bay?
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: Oh what am I giving up for Watson? Second round
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: pick this year? Maybe something else? No?
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: You think you do Barmore for Watson?
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: No, not with the blood clots stuff.
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: That's true. Not Barber, not Barmore, gotsha No, not straight up.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: But you'd have to get.
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: More like godshot and a fourth for Watson.
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: I think he'd have to take more than that.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: All right?
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: Then?
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: No, I'm out on Watson. Jamo, Yeah, yeah, I take
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: a shot on jameson Williams. I don't know how well
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: he fits in McDaniel's old offense. Maybe if they're changing things,
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: like he's a better fit for if they're gonna bring
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: in some of the stuff Rabel did and some of
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: the stuff Todd Downing. Did you know I'm a big
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: Jameson Williams fan. I would take a shot on Jameson Williams.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: You could sell me on that. We're talking like thirty
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: eight for Jamison Williams. Sure, if you get your tackle
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: and free agency are at four, Yeah, I would do that.
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: The reason why I bring that up is a because
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: that the listeners. Is there anybody else?
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: There was one more? I'll look it up in a second.
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: The reason why I bring that up is because we
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: talk so much about t Higgins, We talked so much
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: about Ted McMillan, and just realistically, it just doesn't feel
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: like that's gonna be right for the Patriots with Ted
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: at four.
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: Overall, it just seems high, I think everybody, and not
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: just for the Patriots for anything, right exactly, It just
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: seems high for the player right now. You know, some
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: people have him as low as like twenty and then
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: you know twenty five.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: You know that range, like.
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: He's a fringe top ten player in this draft.
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: Where like Zay Flowers and JSN and Addison and those
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: guys went a couple of years ago. I think he's
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: better than that, yep, to be fair, but regardless, it's.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: Weird because he's so good. He really is elite at
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: a lot of things. Yeah, but it's just not athleticism.
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: And that's weird because in the last five ten years, like,
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of wide receivers who are just good
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: by being athletes and maybe aren't the most technically skilled receivers.
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: And that's kind of the way the league is gone.
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: So we're so used to looking at those guys. As
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: the example, you look at a guy like Tyreek Hill, who, like,
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: I don't know, is Tyreek Hill exactly like teach Tape
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: for a wide receiver the way he goes about it,
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: nor just but he's so dominant athletically, and that's been
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: the mold. That's all right, I'm gonna find a great
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: athlete and teach him how to play receiver. And now
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: here comes Ted McMillan, who's the totally antithesis of that,
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: who is very polished, who is very physically dominant, but
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: he's just not that top tier athlete that we're used
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: to these top receivers being.
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: Okay, I'll give you the last name, yep, George Pickens. No,
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: see Pickens is those are the four that I and
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: there's a lot more actually that are in this pre
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: agency class. It's a pretty good I always say, yeah,
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: it's not gonna it's a year before they're unrestricted. It's
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: this twenty two class, right, Yeah, that none of those
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: guys are actually gonna hit full. Alex Pearce that class too, right,
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: Alex Pierce, he might be you know DK you know
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: is on this list.
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: He wasn't in that class now. But because of the
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: way Pickens to me is like he'll have like a
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: one hundred yards nine hundred yards in a season, and
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: five hundred of them will come in three games. Those
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: guys bug me like you need he's not reliable.
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: You don't like that when he's on.
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: Well, ironically it's what Ted McMillan was last year. Yeah,
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: when he's on, he's on, but he's not reliable. I agree,
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: he's not reliable. But my point of bringing this group up,
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: they all have different like supercharged uh what's his name
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: from the Bills on the Jaguars now gave Davis George
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: Pickens just super charge game. Davis Supercharged gave Davis, I
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: don't those guys don't do it for me. That's the
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: number two. They're great, not as number one.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: So the reason why I bring those guys up, though,
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: is that there's hurdles for the Patriots at wide receiver
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: to make this happen. Not necessarily make it happen this offseason,
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: but just to take a swing. You know, where they
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: are in the draft, like, just doesn't make a lot
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: of sense at four overall in this class. The fact
• 40:51
  Speaker 2: that for the top flight, top of the market guys
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: T Higgins for example, if he does shake free, we
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: know how with Calvin Ridley and Brandon Nayuk right like,
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: they're not a draw right now for that player.
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: Oi Wolf did say they are more of a draw now,
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: we'll see.
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: I'll believe it.
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: When he said Drake may is gonna be a significant
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: part of the pitch.
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: I buy that.
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: Who knows what he really wanted, but the reporting was
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: he didn't come here because he didn't know what the
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: quarterback situation was.
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: Sure, but at the end of the day, they're still
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: a notch below being like a top flight Yeah okay, yeah, yeah, okay.
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: So you look at these receivers, but sorry. Let me
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: just I don't think it's gonna be like AYUK where
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: they offer the most money and still don't get them.
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: I just don't know that yet. Like I have to
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: see it to believe it, you know, like I I
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: don't know where.
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: We think that they offer like four or five million
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: dollars a year to the next closest team. A receiver
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: would say, no, different positions might be different.
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: It depends on who the other teams are.
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: T Higgins gonna take a discount to go? I mean
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: who I get who has that kind of money to spend.
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: Everybody's got money to spend.
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: That's true.
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of caps space around the league. But
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: my point being is that that that group did I
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: do named. You know, they all have sort of you know,
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: a lava aid, you know who knows right, you know,
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: with the injuries. Jameson Williams has was hurt to come
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: into the league and has kind He's been good in flashes,
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: but hasn't been consistently great. Uh. Pickens is his own thing,
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: right with the attitude stuff and everything. Those are maybe
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: the types of high ceiling swings, you know, those dart
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: throws that they might need to throw at it. Don't
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: commit the money right away, right like you don't don't
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: sign them to that monster extension right away and make
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: them prove it a little bit. Right if it doesn't
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: work out their free agents at the end of the year.
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: You have some control there with the franchise tags or
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: whatever the case may be. And you you have an
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: upside player there in that room. You know, you have
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: a guy that has a real ceiling to him in
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: that room. I just I'm just saying as an unorthodox,
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: think outside the box approach because of the way that
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: this class ever received.
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: You've been sell me on jameson Williams because one like
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: he had the gambling thing, and I think it was
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: tough to come back from that, but you hope that's
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: in his past, right, you do your due diligence on there.
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: But I actually forgot about that. I was just thinking
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: about the play, like.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: When he stays he's inconsistent and different way that Pickens
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: is inconsistent. Yeah, he'll put together like consecutive of good
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: games and he gets hurt and then it takes him
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: a minute to get going again. And then he gets
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: hurt and it takes a minute to get going again, right,
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: but if you feel like you can keep him healthy,
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: he's a good player. The other thing they need above
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: all else, they need speed. They need speed on the
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: offensive side of the ball. And can I call Jamison
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: Williams the top five fastest receiver in the league?
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, top ten. I'm comfortable. Definitely.
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: He's not Tyreek Hill, but he's up there.
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So all right, that's the receiver take YEP of
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: the week for you. I just want to wrap up
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: Elliott Wolf here. Is there anything else that stood out
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: from Elliott Wolf that we haven't mentioned here yet?
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: I mean we kind of talked about the the Jalen
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: Polk stuff. Yeah, I just to apply that forward, Like
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: all right, cause this how much do I talk about
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: this Drafting the right players only half the battle. You
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: got to develop them. And that's case in point. They
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: didn't put the player in a position to succeed. They
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: overwhelmed them. Ellie Wolton literally said, we stunted his growth,
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: use that exact phrase. So it sucks that happened, obviously,
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: but like, now you know what that looks like. Now
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: you know what the consequences are. They need to be
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: much more cognizant when they draft these guys, and even
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: guys they're already drafted, they didn't at least entirely stunt
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: Drake May's growth last year, but like they need to
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: be aware of And I guess it goes back to
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: what we talked about off the top about not putting
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: too much on the rookies. But like, you can't ask
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: these guys to save your franchise day one. You gotta
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: have a development plan for these players. You gotta be
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: able to move them along in a way that makes
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: sense or you're gonna have more busts. Yeah, so I
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: thought that was it goes back to we talked about
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: the beginning. It's this self awareness from Wolf I thought was.
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: Encouraging. I guess would be the word. Yeah, that's totally fair.
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: All right, let's uh, let's talk a little bit about
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: yesterday with with Mike Rabel as well. And uh, I
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: think one of the bigger questions too that we have
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: to tackle. And I hate talking about this kind of stuff.
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: I'm not gonna lie to you, but the final say
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: conversation is going to be a conversation on your station
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: and pieces like that, and uh uh, just knowing Elliot
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: Wolf's background with the Green Bay Packers and with his
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: father and all that kind of stuff. Uh. Typically speaking,
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: that relationship between coach and general manager is the coach says,
• 45:38
  Speaker 2: these are the types of players I need, you know,
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: I need. I need a receiver that does X y Z.
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: I need a one tech nose tackle that can shoot gaps.
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: I need this, I need that, And the general manager's
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: job is now to go to the grocery store and
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: go shopping for that. I don't think. My my point
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: being here is even though you might say an act.
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: We had Mike Greece on our Draft countdown podcast that
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: we're doing here at the Combine, and he said that
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: he said that you know from his sources that it's
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: in Elliot Wolf's contract that he has final say on
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: the roster. So that was a contract that was signed yesterday.
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: And again this is reporting. Just this just happened, oh
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: yesterday last year.
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, those are two very different stories. They did that
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: yesterday like that, okay, last year. That makes a lot
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: of sense.
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: So when he when he signed his contract last year
• 46:37
  Speaker 2: and they gave him the promotion and all that stuff,
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: it's been a long so when he signed that last year,
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: that was the wording Ese's sourcing. That was the wording
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: in the contract. So unless something changed drastically, then by
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: the letter of the law, that's how it would go.
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: Except I would say things did change drastically there's a
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: new coach.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm talking about unless they rewrote a concert. But
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: here's the thing about final say.
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: We don't talk about final say in the sense of
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: a dictator, right, it's more and different organizational structure differently,
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: but final say, especially in the collaborative approach they talked about,
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: and Frable and Wolf have both used the term collaboration
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: here last couple of days. That's not going anywhere. It's
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: more Okay, three of us want this guy, three of
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: us want that guy who's the tiebreaker, Right, it's the tiebreaker,
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: not the overseer. Yeah, if you have Mike Vrabel and
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: Ryan Cowden and you have Elliott Wolf, and two of
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: those guys come from the same background in tennessee things
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: the same way, how often do you need a tiebreaker?
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: I guess it's a good question, and there's a lot
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: of ambiguity here, right, But I what I get back to,
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: and that I'm not trying to pour water on the
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: cold water on it right. But what I really do
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: like is that it's a situation where Rabel is the
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: one that's dictating the terms of their personnel. Right, this
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: is the kind of guys we need, This is the
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: kind of players I need, This is the type of
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: skill sets that we're looking for. And then Elliot Wolf
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: is going to go into the talent pool. He's going
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: to make a list of you know, here's the five, ten,
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: fifteen guys. Rabel and the coaching staff will watch it
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: and then it'll come to an agreement of this is
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: our this is our stack, right, Like, this is our list, right,
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: and I think that list is going to be let's
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: call it proof read by Mike Rabel.
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: So who's making the final decision there in that process?
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: Which is the last decision? I would say that it's Rabel.
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: In the sense that the ranking of the board might
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: be his final QC of the board would be Rabel.
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: And then it's Elliott Wolf's job to go and I
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: I know, to compile the board and I know some
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: people hate this word, but like to go find the
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: value right of like, okay, you know, can we get
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: this player that that you know where he's going to
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: go in the draft. Can we get this player at
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: that number?
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: And that's what it needs to change if it's and
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: this is where the final say thing gets vague, right,
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: So okay, Elliott Wolf, it's up to him to decide, Okay,
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: well we can get this player for this much or whatever.
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: What if Mike Rabel goes to him and says, let's call,
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: off the top of my head, Jevon Holland, Right, yeah,
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: we need Javon. Mike Frable says, we need Jon Holland
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: on this football team for me to have execute the
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: plan that I want to execute. I need Javon Holland.
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: Go get me him. Pay over market? Right like there?
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: Does Li Wolf then go back and it's not really
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: the value we can get you know, this other safety
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: for more value? Or does Mike Rabel get to it? Nope,
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: this is the guy we're paying for, you know, talking
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: about being aggressive and free agency things like that. That's like,
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: I guess where it would be where would be interesting?
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: I hear what you're saying. I just wonder if there can't.
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: I think it's easier to come to a consensus than
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: people realize they can't.
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: I think it's that's all. I also think it's more
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: about so like Ellie Wolf said, he wouldn't force players
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: on Rabel, right, I think it's more about like he said,
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: Rabel is going to be the one who kind of
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: picks the pool right and and does the ring.
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: I would say that he's the one that narrows it down, right,
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: Like what Wolf is gonna look at the whole pool,
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: Rabel is gonna he's gonna give a list to Rabel.
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: Rabel if it's a defensive player, you know him and
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: Terrell Williams will watch the tape and say, this is
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: our guy, this is the guy we prefer, this is
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: our guy. If we don't get the guy that we prefer,
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: you know, tears or clusters of players. So like to
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: hear Javon Holland. Example, Let's say they they go in
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: on Javon Holland and they offer him a a competitive
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: market contract, but they just don't land the player. Right, Okay,
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: you know we cross him off. Who is the next
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: best freeze guy from Minnesota?
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: I forget?
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: But yeah, but like right, like that that's the type of.
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: But I do wonder if Arabel can say, like, these
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: are the spots where we're not budget right, budget where
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: this is where I almost feel like it's to compare it.
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: You're gonna hate this to compare it to the Major
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: League Baseball draft. I don't even know if you know
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: how this works with why nodding. So you have based
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: on where you're picking, because you're not trading picks, like
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: everybody has the same picks in each round. Right, So
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: you're slotted X amount of dollars for the draft because
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: each slot is worth a certain amount of money.
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and so what some teams will do.
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: It's called drafting overslot or underslot because you hear ahead
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: of time what players are gonna want for assigning bonus
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: in each pick. And what teams will do is sometimes
• 51:37
  Speaker 1: teams will like underslot their first pick and then they
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: can pay all the rest of the guys more to
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: ensure they get them, because you don't you don't always
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: sign all your draft picks. Right. I wonder if there's
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: spots where Mike Vrabel looks at it and says, you know,
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: all right, this is what we budgeted for safety. Right,
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: we can take some money out of the guard budget.
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: Right right, if you want to go find your value guard,
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: go find your value guard. Safety is where if you
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: need a little more money, move other money, put it
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: to safety. That's we're going like who has who makes
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: that call? And that to me sounds like Rabel just
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: based off what he said yesterday.
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So the other element, and we just talked a
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: lot about wide receivers, and so I probably should have
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: segued into this. But the other element with wide receivers
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: that I still continue to hear from Rabel that that
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: really stands out to me is catch radius, contested catchability.
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: And I think when people hear contested catchability they think
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: it just jump balls. It's not just it's finishing in traffic.
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: It's finishing in tight covering, catching through contact. Right, Yeah, exactly.
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: It can be a thing where like that the corner
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: is wearing you on your back, right, all right, hands
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: to yourself, all right, grow it here.
• 52:43
  Speaker 2: And and so you hear that a lot. He mentioned
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: again that he doesn't want Drake May to have to
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: be pinpoint accurate on every single throw. He wants to
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: have some accuracy erasers at the wide receiver position. The
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: player that he continues to describe as a J Brown.
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: He does every single time he describes a wide receiver.
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: He describes AJ.
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: Brown really does. Yeah, So obviously a J. Brown is
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: a J Brown top five receiver in the league.
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: Like he said, if you find one walking down the street,
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: let me know, right, you know, like they don't grow
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: on trees.
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: I'm looking, Mike, I'm looking. I'm watching it. Then I
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: don't think you're here yet.
• 53:19
  Speaker 2: But if you had to think of the archetype or
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: the mold of the type of receiver that Mike Rabel
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: continues to say he wants, it's a J. Brown, which
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: is obviously a good one to pick. Now to piggyback
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: off of that, he mentions AJ Brown, and he also
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: mentioned that typically you need to draft that player that
• 53:44
  Speaker 2: that player we all know it's not gonna come available
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: in free agency. Now that being said, he's not a J.
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: Brown after the catch, he doesn't move like AJ Brown.
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: But in terms of catch radius, accuracy, erasing contested catchability,
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's also T Higgins, right, So like I
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: would imagine that they would have a ton of interest
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: in T.
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: Well, that's also Tem McMillan. It's also Teed McMillan, who
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: has drawn some comps to I've seen like Drake London, right,
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: is the big one and that sort of receivers. So,
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: like I did perk up when I heard him say
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: contested catches. Tem McMillan, we'll be talking more about him
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: at four. Yeah, I don't know about that, but like, right,
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: so Trey Harris maybe is the guy who should talk
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: more about if that's what they're gonna prioritize.
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: I just find it interesting. And I'm sure there's you know,
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: there's a list, like it's not I'm sure his only
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: prerequisite for drafting or signing a receiver is in contested catchability.
• 54:38
  Speaker 2: I'm sure there's other things on that list, but it's
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: not like speed or separation or anything like that.
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: That's the key. And I agree into an extent. But
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: you know what, because.
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: If you just look at the stats and look at
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: the metrics, Yeah, so much of the of the targets
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: in the NFL are contested because of there's great cover
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: players like corners are really good. So in the league,
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: you're not gonna get to get all these wide open
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: gaps and zone coverages, and you're gonna see a lot
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: more man to man and you're gonna be in crowds
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: a lot more because that's the that's the talent level
• 55:12
  Speaker 2: that's on the field. So I think people here can
• 55:15
  Speaker 2: test the catches. They were all, oh, no, Nikhil Harry,
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: you know, something like that. But I do think that
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: you have to look at it and say, you know,
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: that's a lot of the targets in the league.
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: And that kind of player stylistically is a really good
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: fit with Drake May. Yeah, like when you talk about
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: helping the quarterback, it's gonna allow you to maximize his
• 55:34
  Speaker 1: arm strength because he can test parts of the field
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: where you know, even if you're a great receiver, there's
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: just certain parts of the field you know you're gonna
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: get one on one coverage, you're not gonna have help,
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: you're not gonna have double whatever. And now it's all right,
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: maybe he's not wide open, but Drake May can access
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: those parts of the field. Most quarterbacks can't, and you
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: can trust the receiver even if he's not wide open,
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: to make a play on the football.
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: All right, So that was wide receivers were the frable. Yeah,
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: it was there anything else I missed?
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: There's a bunch, but vrabel I just loved the tone
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: of I like they didn't put a timeline when asked
• 56:05
  Speaker 1: about the rebuild. But said sort of in the same answer.
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: I want to win.
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: Everybody wants to win. We're here to win, right, So
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: don't put a timeline on it because you don't know
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: what's gonna happen. But there is urgency, right. And I
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: also like the way he laid it out. He gave
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: kind of the classic we want to win our division,
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: we want to host playoff games, right, that sort of thing.
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: But they're two three years away from that. He added
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: one other thing. Somebody asked him at the very end
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: because he mentioned, you know, so, oh, you mentioned winning
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: the division, So how do you catch the bills? Like,
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: what do you do? I thought he gave a great
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: first step. He said, we need to win our home games.
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: We need to make sure Let's Stadium a tough place
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: to play. Patriots are seven and seventeen in the last
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: three years in home.
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they haven't been good enough home, they haven't been
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: good enough anywhere.
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: No, But like the first step is the gimmes, you
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: gotta win at home. Yeah, you got how many games
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: are like well, this just should win game that they don't. Right,
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: Just win the should wins, and then you can get
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: to the mit wins, and and then you can get
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: to like the real tough ones. But most games at
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: home are should win games essentially. You look at their
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: home schedule this year, not difficult, not typical. They should
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: be over five hundred at home. Do they finish over
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: five hundred for the season.
• 57:14
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: We've got a long way to go in this offseason,
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: but they should be over five hundred at home. And
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: I loved it Vrabel said that because I think that's
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: something fans feel, Like Chillette Stadium, It's never gonna be
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: what it was Brady and Bill and you drive in
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: on a Sunday night and you see the stadium come
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: up over the trees and all that, and you know,
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: Peyton Manning and other guys have told that story about
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: what it was like driving up.
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: But very wax poetic of you.
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: You've never heard like Peyton or I think it was
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: Ray Lewis talk about that like it just comes out
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: of nowhere. You're in like a neighborhood and then Boom
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: Stadium and it's like dark and five about lambeau Field,
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: I've heard about you too, But like I digress, winning
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: at home is a really good first step, like as
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: a year one goal, right, winning the division this year.
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: Be great, Be great, that's a big step. Finishing over
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: five hundred a home is like a solid realistic goal
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: in year one for Mike Rabel. I think, okay, so
• 58:05
  Speaker 1: a couple more things from Rail. I just pulled up
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: what I wrote yesterday so that we can get to
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: everything here. The other big sort of tidbit nugget right
• 58:13
  Speaker 1: off the top is that he is.
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: Planning on having Terrell Williams call the defense. So Terrell Williams,
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: Patriots defensive coordinator, He's going to call plays on the
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: defensive side of the ball. So Vrabel as expected, I
• 58:26
  Speaker 2: would say, going into that CEO head coaching style. Now,
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: I still think that he's gonna have a lot of
• 58:34
  Speaker 2: input on the defense, and especially with Josh McDaniels as
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: the offensive coordinator, where somebody as experienced as Josh running
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: the offense, I still think that he can kind of
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: pass that to him and focused on defense with Terrell Williams.
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: But it's another it's that style again, right where they're
• 58:53
  Speaker 2: gonna have an overseer, a CEO head coach in theory,
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: if you have a head coach, and I think this
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: is sort of where it missed the mark. And then
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: in terms of style with Gerrod Mayo, if you have
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: a head coach that can that can touch every aspect
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: of the team like Bill could and could really impact
• 59:09
  Speaker 2: every aspect of the team and have knowledge and have
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: uh you know, I think rabels that he feels like
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: he has a fundamental or a tip that he can
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: give to every single position group on the roster when
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: and you hear stories about that, yeah, from him in terms.
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: Of the offensive line last year in Cleveland.
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: So when you have a coach like that, uh, then
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: that can be a really beneficial way to go about things.
• 59:31
  Speaker 2: But I would just what is your reaction to to
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: Terrell Williams calling to Spens a first time play caller.
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: I should mention that, sure, So I mean the fact that.
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: It doesn't worry me because I think if if it
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: is too big for him, Mike Vrabel's right there to
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: step in, And I don't think Mike Vrabel would be
• 59:46
  Speaker 1: afraid of stepping in if he needs to. Not to
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: say that, I think he's gonna give Terrell Williams a
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: short leash. I think he's gonna let him learn. But
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: if it becomes clear that he's not the answer, I
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: could see Vrabel stepping in. I also just thought it
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: was interesting the way Rabel talked about it, because he said, like, yeah,
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: he's gonna call place. He's the defensive coordinator. He's coached
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: aggressive defensive lineman. I believe he said that in order.
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: It's like, Okay, coaching defensive lineman to be aggressive and
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: calling plays are two different things. But it's like, or
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: is this defense? Does that mean that the defensive style
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: is gonna be catered towards and built around aggressive offensive lineman?
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 1: And now we add the Devon Godshaw news here twenty
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: four hours later when I say offensive.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: It's been a long week. Yeah, uh James.
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: Devon god twenty four hours later, and it's like, okay,
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: So I think, and you see this all that, you
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: see this with offensive coordinators covering different backgrounds defensive coordinators, like,
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: you're gonna become an offensive coordinator. But if you started
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: as quarterbacks coach, your quarterbacks guy, start as a tight
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: ends coach, you're a tight ends guy, right, Start as
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: a linebackers coach your linebackers guy. I don't think Troll
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 1: William is gonna be an exception. That's kind of the
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: vibe by gott was He's gonna put his guys in
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: position to be the stars of this defense. They are going.
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 1: That doesn't mean Christian Zalz is going anywhere because he's
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: a star, but they are gonna build this around. We're
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: gonna get a bunch of studs up front and let
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 1: them loose, and we're gonna call it on those eyes
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: being able to be effective play in and play out.
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: Will they get to the full extent of that this year,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: I don't know, probably need two offseasons to put that
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: thing together, but that's kind of it was another sign
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: that that's what the defense is going to be.
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: Stylistically, Yeah, I just think, you know, in terms of
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: the scheme and things like that. Defensively, the one hesitation
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: I have with a guy like Terrell Williams calling plays
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: is that his background is basically solely in defensive line.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: Right. Well, he was an assistant head coach, Andy was
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: a run game coordinator.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but he has coached the front seven the defensive
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: line most of his career. So what you do worry
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: a little bit about is how well does he know
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: the back end and how well does he know marrying
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: coverage and rush and all those different types of things.
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: It's one thing to be able to draw pressure, right
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 2: like that, that's great, Like it's a big part of
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 2: football nowadays, simulated pressure as creepers, all that good stuff.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: But how does he marry the back end in the
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 2: front end so that it all fits together and makes
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: sense and our coverages are matching up with our rushes
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 2: and we're not leaving ourselves schematically broken in that sense
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: when it comes to scheme and play calling. That I'm
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 2: not saying that I'm panicking about it, but that's what
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: I'll be watching early on in the season is how
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: well he kind of marries those two things together. Because vastly,
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: vastly different experience levels in the NFL, but a lot
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: of young defensive line coaches like a DeMarcus Covington that
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: turn into play callers struggle with that early on and
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 2: as play callers, right And you know, maybe Trell Williams
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: has done more play calling than I know of. You know,
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: I don't believe he's called plays at least at any
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 2: sort of consistent significant amount in the NFL. But maybe
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: that that I'm mistaken on that last thing here on
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: on VRABEL And then we have tons of emails coming
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: in and all that good stuff. When he was with
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: us yesterday here at the table, I asked them about
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: the the innovations and the scheme tweaks on offense for
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: the Patriots, and we talked a little bit about Drake
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: May and and mobile quarterbacks and sort of his stance
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 2: on running quarterbacks. And he said point blank that May
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: needs to prove that he can stay healthy. And he's
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: made a big deal about sliding and all that kind
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: of stuff.
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 1: Posted or he talked about the Red Sox.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: The slip and slide, and he said that, you know,
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 2: they have to be cognizant of the volume of making
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 2: him the primary ball carrier, so not like holding the
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 2: backside or you know, just as a threat to run,
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: but actually being the primary ball carrier. But that said,
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 2: he said, they'll be design quarterback runs, they'll be moving
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: pockets like, they will amplify Drake May's mobility. They will
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: coach ways for his second reaction in his off script
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: playmaking to take hold and be impactful. So they are
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: not they're not harnessing it like they are harnessing it.
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: They're they're not afraid of it. Yeah, they're not holding
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: him back I do think, and I've talked to this
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: for it. I think there's a tipping point there. I
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 1: don't even go too far in that direction because now
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: you're reckless. So it'll be interesting to see what the
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 1: balance is. But I even said last year, like it's.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: A thin line.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: They weren't even close to getting the line, Like they
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: had so much room to even get up near the
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: line in terms of running him too much. So we'll see.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: That'll be interesting to watch, all right.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 2: I think that does it on the on the vrabel
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 2: and on Elliott Wolf. So we'll take some of these emails.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: We'll talk some prospects and stuff like that for the
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 2: second hour. But before we get into it, I got
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: gotta pay the bills some more here and find this there.
• 1:04:36
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• 1:04:39
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• 1:04:43
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• 1:04:46
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• 1:04:48
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• 1:05:04
  Speaker 2: to fill the football sized hole in your heart? I mean,
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: we got a lot of football this week, but we're
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  Speaker 2: still missing football. Why not spend the off season designing
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  Speaker 2: your day, your dream game day den with Bob's Discount
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  Speaker 2: and stock up for next season with Bob's Discount Furniture,
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 2: the official furniture store of the New England Patriots. I
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 2: got to tell you, after two and a half days
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 2: at the combine, those reads are a lot harder. I'll
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 2: take a half days in the combine.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 1: I could use one of those comfortable like couches.
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: A lot harder to do.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: Ready to put my.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 2: Feet up, A lot of what is right? Like we
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 2: had to You know you do you probably need it
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: telling me playing act.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: I'm cleanly shaved for the first time, for which I
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: didn't want to do. My trimmer broke and now everybody's
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: seeing what was under there, and yeah I needed the steps.
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 2: Oh my goodness. All right. So some of these emails
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: here that we can get into. I wanted to start
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: here with Nick emailed in about Andrew Berry, the Browns
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: general manager, made some made some waves yesterday when he
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 2: said that they view Cleveland I've used Travis Hunter as
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: a wide receiver, and you know, he's kind of surprised,
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: I guess, and we've sort of been talking about this
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 2: a little bit that it's not more consensus given the
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 2: positional value. What did you think of Berry saying that,
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: because I think he's kind of the first top decision
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 2: maker to just come out and say I prefer him
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 2: as a wide receiver.
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: So, first off, combine moment for me talking about the
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: son a podcast by my table on Radio Row yesterday
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 1: went with Andrew Callahan. As I'm saying it, andrews eys
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: get kind of wide and I'm like, you know it
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: was Barry that said that, right. He goes, yeah, it
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 1: was just right behind you while you were saying it
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: that was fun. Doesn't surprise me because I think for
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 1: the Browns that makes sense. The they had like one
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: of the few positions that they're kind of set with
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: this corner they've Denzel Ward knew some. They got a
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 1: couple of good corners over there. They don't really have
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: a ton at receiver beyond Judy, so they need a
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: receiver more. He probably is a better fit for the
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 1: Browns at receiver. That makes sense. But if they're gauging
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 1: it that closely, every time it's doing their every team
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 1: is doing their due diligence. If they're gauging at that closely,
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: is that a sign that he's you know, maybe the Browns.
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: I know he said they might be locked in on quarterback,
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: but are they considering Travis Hunter. Yeah, they've gotten to
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 1: that point of the evaluation.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 2: I think it's great that somebody, you know, because I've
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: been on the Travis Hunter wide receiver train for a while.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: I think it's great to hear that from a general
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: manager because I do you watch the tape like he's
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: a dynamic impact wide receiver in my opinion, at the
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 2: next level, and they're not a lot of those in
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: this draft. We just mentioned that, but I think he
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 2: can truly be one of those guys that I would
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 2: put into a similar tier, yeah, as some of the
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 2: guys last year, you know, Roma Dune Day, Brian Thomas Junior.
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 2: I probably wouldn't put him in the neighbors Marvin Harrison
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: junior tier, but I have him right in that mix
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 2: for you wide receiver four, you know, wide receiver three,
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 2: something like that in that draft last year. And it's
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 2: interesting that somebody would say that. Now. The tricky part
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 2: is it's much easier in my opinion, to major in
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: corner and minor and receiver than he is to major
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 2: in receiver and minor in corner. So if you're gonna
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: play him at wide receiver predominantly and he's gonna major
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 2: in playing receiver, like, what's the plan to get him
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 2: involved on defense? Or you're just saying we don't need it.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: So we've kind of talked about like two minute drills
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: right obvious past situation late in games, but so much
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: of playing corner is feeling out the receiver over the
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: course of the game, and you don't get to do
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 1: that if you're only playing at part time. So it
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 1: is worth considering that if he's playing corner, he might
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 1: just be be playing corner the one I wonder, and
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 1: I don't know if he would go for this. If
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: you're gonna play a part time at defense, he playm
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 1: at safety, And do you just tell him against certain
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 1: teams in certain spots we're gonna push up top because
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 1: he can play true centerfield. I think he can play
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 1: true single high. He doesn't really do it at Colorado,
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: but I just look at his athleticism, his instincts is
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 1: ball skills. I think it translates if you give enough
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 1: time to work on it and practice. Do you just
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: say you can cover the whole field right sideland a
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: sideline when we get into third and fifteen, when we
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: get into a two minute drill, when we get up
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: twenty one teams throwing, we're just gonna throw you back
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: there on the back end and have you patrol deep,
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: and then that allows us play ten up front.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 2: So you're essentially asking him to be like a more
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 2: souped up Deron Harmon.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: I was gonna say that, well, I was gonna go
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 1: too far. I was gonna say part time ed Reid.
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: But somewhere somewhere between the two, yes.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 2: But those are two very far poles. But like Deron,
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 2: Harmon is the guy that on third and month he
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 2: was gonna play up top. Is Devin to play robber,
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 2: Patrick Chunk play in the slot and play tight ends
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 2: and things like that, And that's how they kind of
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 2: all got to their sweet spots in that defense, you know.
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 1: And when the Patriots, right, I just think if you're
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: gonna do it part time, because part of playing part
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 1: time alsome he's practicing a part time right, Yeah, I
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: feel like that's an easier role to just sort of
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 1: step into and get your individual assignment versus playing corner
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 1: where you really have to study, Like you don't you
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: still to study receivers, but like we hear, like great corners, right,
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: Steph Gilmore has talked about this, Christian has alwas talked
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: about this. Gilmore especially would talk about like, yeah, if
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: this guy's foot was at this angle when he was
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: lined up versus like two degrees differently this way, like
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 1: I knew what route he was running, right. That takes
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 1: hours and hours and hours to study. And Travis Hunter
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: is a film junkie. We know that he's talked about
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 1: that a lot. But you gotta study a lot of
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 1: film on offense too, because you're probably doing that for
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 1: the opposing corner. So to be able to do both
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: of those things, it's tougher is if you're at safety,
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 1: you're just kind of back reading the picture in front
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: of you. It's more big.
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: Picture, Okay, I could see that. All right. A bunch
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 2: of questions about this, and I'm glad that the emailer
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: has brought it up because, like we've been saying, my
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 2: mind kind of let it, let it slip when we
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: were on the breaking news part of the show. But
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 2: Harold Landry, it sounds like that he is going to
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: be on the trade block on the move that came
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 2: out earlier this morning, and obviously a very huge connection
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 2: to Mike. I think Mike drafted Herod land.
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 1: I believe, I know Landry had the most sacks of
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 1: any Titan during Verble.
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 2: Ninety nine point nine percent. Sure that I think you're
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 2: pick uh now, some.
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 1: Of the the that's you know, sort of the pro
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: right of you know, familiarity with Rabel, familiarity with the system,
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 1: productive in the system still had I want to say,
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: nine sacks last year.
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 2: I mean, not a big pressure guy last year, but
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 2: still cleaned up a little bit. Uh with the sack numbers,
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 2: so non sacks yep, and twenty eight years old, so
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 2: not not ancient, right, Like I you know, we were
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 2: talking about this earlier and I was like, isn't he
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 2: like really old?
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: Thought he's forty?
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, I was, I was obviously exagger.
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but even forty exaggerating means you think he's like
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 1: thirty three, thirty five.
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought he was like his into his thirties
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 2: because I just feel like I've been familiar with the
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 2: player for a long time. I guess I'm you know,
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 2: time flies. The downside, I suppose, is the seventeen point
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: five million dollars that he's due on his rest of
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 2: his contract over the next two years. He's I think
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: he's that's it's it's seventeen point five next year. I
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 2: don't know what it is in the second year. Regardless,
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 2: he's not a seventeen point five million dollars year player anymore.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 2: And on top of that, if you're also giving up
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 2: some sort of trade compensation to make it happen. Now,
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 2: usually these stairdowns can end in just an outright release,
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 2: maybe post June one cut something like that when team,
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: you know, the team recognizes we're not gonna get anything
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 2: for him, or you know, we'll just let him lose.
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 2: So maybe that could be the case, and you know,
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: he just becomes a free agent and were able can
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 2: sway him to come here to play with him and
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 2: Terrell Williams again. But what are your thoughts overall now
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 2: that I laid it down on Harold Er?
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean they need multiple pass rushers. Is he
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: their answer at the top, you know, the guy you're
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 1: building it around. Probably not. Is he a really good
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: second guy, really good clean up guys you like to
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 1: call it. Yeah, he would be. And he's a guy
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: we talked earlier about. You know how desirable the destination
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 1: the Patriots really are in free agency and sometimes you
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 1: know how many times we've done this with players last
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 1: couple of years. You can't just wait for him to
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: get cut. You can't just wait for me forree agency
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 1: because he won't sign here. You get a trade for him, Landry,
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: you can sell. They should be able to sell Landry
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: by putting him back, like you said with Mike Grabel
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 1: and Terrell Williams. Not worth paying seventeen million, especially if
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: you're giving up something on top of that. But he's
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 1: a guy that I feel pretty comfortable that if he
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: got to free agency, New England be his top destination
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: because to sell to him, like I say, he's a
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 1: younger guy, one year, come here to a system you
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: know you can succeed in. You've proven to have success
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 1: in sign a one year deal. We're gonna get you
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 1: going again. We're gonna get your double digit sacks and
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 1: boom you go next year and you get paid at
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: thirty here or somewhere else, right. That would be my
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 1: pitch to Harold Landry.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: So I do think there are maybe some injuries that
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: have piled up there for Landry to just you know,
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 2: a lot of usage, a lot of miles over the
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 2: last couple of years. But out of all the hypothetical
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 2: this you know name you know just became available via trade,
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: I kind of like this one the most, probably just
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 2: because of the familiarity with the scheme in freegel that
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 2: it just feels like we just talked about this off
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 2: the top of the show, that six eight, ten quality
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 2: veteran starter contributors in free agency or the veteran market,
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 2: that's what he is right now. That's what Harold Landry
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 2: is right now, that's a multiplayer. So you acquire Harold Madry,
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 2: maybe you restructure the contract for the year to make
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 2: it more digestible for the Patriots, not that they need
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 2: the cap space, but just from a value standpoint to
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: your point, maybe resets his value and now you have
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 2: a guy in Harold Landry that can play the role,
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 2: that can play the position, and you're not panicking that
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: you need an edge rusher in the draft necessarily. Now,
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 2: if abdual Carter falls to you, you still take Abdual Carter,
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 2: but you're not in this hole all got, you know,
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 2: where's the pass rush coming from? The Other thing I
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: like about Landry just you know, looking at his stats
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 2: last year and some of the tape that I've seen
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: of him from last year, he's one of those guys
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: that's really good at cleaning up. Like he's not necessarily
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: gonna be the guy that gets the primary pressure. But
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 2: just assuming you know, fingers crossed, And I guess we
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: should talk a little bit about bar Moore two and
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 2: his status. You know, if you do have a Christian Barmore,
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 2: if you do have Keon White, they're gonna pick a
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 2: defensive lineman or a defensive front player in the in
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 2: the top one hundred, whether it's Day one or day two,
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 2: they're gonna pick somebody. So if you have these guys
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 2: that can all bring that immediate disruption, it is Harold
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 2: Landry the guy that can mop up and just get this,
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: get the quarterback, you know, on the ground. Nine Sacks
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 2: suggests that he could still probably do that. Yeah, so
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 2: I like all those things with Harold Landry. I'm for
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: this one. Like usually I'm not for these, like Cooper Cups,
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: Joey Bosas, like.
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 1: Those types of things.
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 2: Young enough, and yeah, I like this one a little bit.
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 2: All right, another email here, Bill and san Diego said,
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 2: you know, in order, you know, we were talking about
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: Hunter majoring and wide receiver and minoring in corner would
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 2: be a little bit challenging. He know, he he brings
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 2: up guys like Troy Brown. Now Troy Brown was at
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 2: a desperation. Yeah, that that was different.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 1: He played corner out of desperation, and if I remember correctly,
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 1: his wide receiver role decreased in those games.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 2: I would think so.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 1: But it wasn't like he was doing that. He had
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 1: a limit. What he was otherwise doing.
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it just feels like to me, uh, the examples
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 2: of like Troy Brown, uh, the example of Julian Edelman
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 2: even right, like.
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 1: M wasn't playing receiver at the time, but not full time.
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 2: Those things were done out of desperation because the Patriots
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 2: were decimated by injuries at cornerback. Yeah, and so they
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 2: had they needed bodies. That that's not you're asking. You're
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: hoping that Travis Hunter is gonna make an impact on defense, right, Uh,
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 2: you know sort of like what when when Marcus Jones's
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 2: mood lights on offense? Right, like that that sort of thing,
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 2: the spark. Yeah, I I don't think that I get
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: what the email are saying that it's been done, you
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 2: know the other guy that it's it's been done. The
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 2: other way that some people bring up is like Champ Bailey, right,
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 2: who who it in college? Like Travis Hunter did and
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 2: then did it very minimally, but like did it.
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 1: A little bit like kind of like remember Champ Bailly
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 1: doing any NFL?
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah he has. And that's like a comp that some
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 2: people I've used for for Hunters in generally just overall
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: Champ Billy all right, A couple of prospect you know
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 2: type emails here getting in Mark from Connecticut, one of
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 2: our our very loyal listeners. Uh. He brought up Harold
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 2: Fannon Junior at a bowling Green And the reason why,
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: you know, I think it's a good topic is because
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 2: one of the three positions Elliott Wolf mentioned at the
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 2: podium that he likes in this draft, defensive line, was
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 2: kind of in its own tier, right. He was very
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 2: high on the defensive line, tight end, and running back.
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 2: So he kind of feels like the consensus I think,
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 2: I think that's pretty safe consensus sort of answer there.
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: But Harold Fannin's in that group with Elijah Royo and
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 2: Mason Taylor and gunner Helm gunner Helm that they're all
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 2: kind of us together there on day two. The thing
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 2: that scares me a little bit about Harrold Fannon is
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 2: him in this offense particularly. Yep, it's a little John
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 2: now Smith.
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 1: That's my comp form, I mean, regardless of the Patriots,
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 1: like overall, that's that's the come.
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I like you hear you know, a little bit
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 2: John new Smith, a little bit of Isaiah Likely like that,
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 2: you know, type of player.
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: Scheme touch player he is. He wasn't used that way
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 1: in college, but like in the NFL.
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 2: That yeah, you know you hear some crazy like, oh
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 2: he's kind of you know, got some Travis kelcey at
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 2: the top of the route, Like I, I guess no
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 2: one's Travis kelce Uh So I don't as Kelsey isn't even.
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 1: The player people talk about Travis Kelsey.
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 2: But the point being a I like the player in general.
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 2: You know, with Fannin, if I was just grading the
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 2: player for a generic football team, you know, like a
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 2: created team, I would say that I like the player,
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 2: but I do worry about that type of guy. Maybe
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 2: it's just some Johnny Smith PTSD.
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 1: We've talked about, like for a long time, Josh McDaniels.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 1: That's kind of been the blind spot is the scheme
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 1: touch guys. He hasn't figured him out. I also, and
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 1: I think this comp goes both ways. There's a little
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 1: Kyle Pitts in his game too, So.
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I could see that. I think Kyle Pitts is
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 2: more bigger and like more of like a receiver playing.
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 1: But like I fan in for the Patriots to me,
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 1: if they're gonna get a tight end, they should get
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 1: their kind of tight end. If you want to add
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 1: that element to the offense. Find a slot receiver or
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 1: find like get that guy later, get a guy like
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: Kevin Bartholomew. Where you're not wasting such a high pick
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 1: or not I should say wasting, but risking such a
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 1: high pick.
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, if I had to take a tight end and
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 2: not range of the draft, I'm not a I'm also
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 2: you know, I'm not a huge Arroyo guy, because I mean,
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 2: I think Royo is is a receiver playing tight end.
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 2: You know. I think that he can he can really
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 2: get up the seam. You know, he can really run
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 2: the you know, stretch the field vertically from inside the formation.
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 2: He can run crossers and run away from defenders that way,
• 1:20:02
  Speaker 2: especially in the middle of the field. Ye I see
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: this skill set, and I see what everybody's you know,
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 2: excited about with the Royo. But I'm a little bit
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 2: intrigued by Mason Taylor, Like I see a little bit
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 2: of everything there, like the body type. I don't think
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 2: he's a great blocker yet, but I think he's got
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 2: the body type to be a good blocker. And I
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 2: think he's got some receiving upside, athletic upside. I'm also
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: a sucker for the pedigree thing like with his father
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: and all that.
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: And I think everything you hear about him in the
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 1: LSU And I know we went down this road last
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 1: year and it didn't work out. But I do think
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 1: if there's one thing they're in a copy from last
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 1: year's draft, and people are probably rolling their eyes, but
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 1: if there's one thing you're in a copy, Remember we
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 1: came away from the draft like they drafted the leaders, right,
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 1: Jalen Polk for you know, the bad play. He was
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 1: supposed to be this guy that was, you know, a
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 1: little more mature than the average rookie. Obviously, Drake May,
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 1: Joe Milton, character guy.
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: It was a lot of these not the whole draft,
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 1: but a lot of these guys. You you know, people
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 1: raved about how they were in the locker room. You
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 1: hear a lot about that with Mason Taylor, that he
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 1: was like a big part of the culture at LSU,
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 1: which has always been a strong culture program even when
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 1: the team's maybe not that good. So I that, like,
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 1: I would like to see them continue to do that
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 1: because these players you're drafting this year are still foundational.
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah that's fair, all right. This is from Noah in Toronto,
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 2: that's saying that I underrate Drake London because Drake London
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 2: is usually my Teed McMillan co Drake London is a.
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 1: Really good number two wide receiver, really really, so you know, he.
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 2: Has his stats here. I didn't realize he had thirteen
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: hundred yards last year. But it's also in seventeen games.
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 2: But who else they throw the ballt in nine touchdowns,
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 2: darnahld Moody. Don't disrespect Darnald this is one.
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 1: Other guy, all right, Darnah Moody. They don't exactly have
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 1: a wide range of targets.
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, So the way I look at it, and Noah
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 2: said he would be thrilled with Drake London at the
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 2: number four pick. He has a case this year that,
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 2: given the talent at the top of the draft is
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 2: what it is, you could make a case that a
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 2: Drake London type player is a good pick in this class.
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 1: Well, you know, I'll be honest, that's the case. I've
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 1: been making a tackle, right. I've said, if Will Campbell
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: becomes Nate Solder, he's your starting left tackle for ten years.
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 1: And maybe he's not an All Pro, but he's like
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 1: solid and you don't need to replace him in whatever
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 1: in this draft, I'll take that guy at four. So
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 1: if I'm gonna say i'll take that guy at for
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: a tackle, I think I kind of have to say
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: I'll take that guy fo it receiver, right, you're a
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 1: little take corner. We'll take cornered now. But now that
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 1: being said, if I had to choose between that tackle
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 1: or that receiver, like equal caliber players, which position this
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 1: We talked about this, I think last week, right with
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 1: the tie breakers, yeah, give me the tackle. Yeah, if
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 1: they're the same caliber player, I will take the tackle.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 1: But I can't say that, you know, Will Campbell being
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 1: Nate Solder would be this great success, while Teed McMillan
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 1: being Drake London would be a bust. I don't think
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: I can say that.
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 2: That's that's very noble you, that's very fair objective. Now
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 2: when I say that, I.
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 1: Don't get yelled at for being a hypocrite.
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 2: When I say that about Drake London and Ted and
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 2: all that, I think I where I'm coming from is
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 2: if I'm taking a receiver at four, overall, I need
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 2: to be able to project Julio Jones, Calvin Johnson like
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 2: I need to be able to project.
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 1: I don't think it's fairly.
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 2: If you're going that high in the draft, like that
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 2: guy needs to turn into a Jamar Chase. Like you
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 2: need to be talking about a superstar receiver.
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 1: I mean, you just named who, just say Calvin Johnson
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 1: and Julio Jones and Jamar. Yeah, I'll give you Jamar
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 1: for like, all right, whatever, semantics.
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 2: It's semantics, but you need to be projecting. In my opinion,
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 2: the ceiling there.
• 1:23:43
  Speaker 1: Needs to be different between wide receiver and tackle. That's
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 1: a fair point.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 2: I didn't think of that, And now I'm taking covered
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 2: my I covered my ass now. I I just that's
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 2: the way I look at it with receivers.
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 1: Why why don't you look at that way?
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 1: I think i'll tell you why. I know why, I'll
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 1: tell you.
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 2: I don't know what to say. You're you're right, it's
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 2: a fair.
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 1: Point because you value tackles more than you value receivers.
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 1: I value tackles a little bit more. And I also
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 1: would say that there's different avenues to acquire receivers that.
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 2: Have teed McMillan's skill level. It's tougher to get to tackle,
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 2: and I just I gotta be honest, and this is
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 2: probably not the best way to approach it, and this
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 2: is probably why I'm not in charge, and I shouldn't be.
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 2: But the bottom line is is that I'm kind of
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 2: sick of watching Drake may on his butt, like like,
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 2: you got the.
• 1:24:37
  Speaker 1: Frame, that's value.
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 2: There you go. You got the franchise, right, like you
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 2: need to protect the franchise now, You're right. Though, if
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 2: we're gonna say that we would take Will Campbell in
• 1:24:45
  Speaker 2: this draft even though he's not a joalt level prospect,
• 1:24:47
  Speaker 2: that we kind of have to say the same thing
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 2: about Drake London not being in Molik Neighbors level prospect
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 2: right or Marvin Harrison junior level prospect. But that's just
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 2: the way I look at receivers. Here's the next one
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 2: from Kyle and Pembroke, also a regular listener. Uh. The
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 2: other name it's being floated around the combine this week
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 2: in terms of veterans available on the trade market is
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 2: Jaiyir Alexander. I'll say this off the top, I love
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 2: Jay Alexanders. That guy's a dog. So do you remember
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 2: that guy's a great player, but he's been hurt and
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 2: that you know he's he hasn't really played like a Tony.
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 1: He did and he got suspended for it, but I
• 1:25:25
  Speaker 1: loved it. He like they were playing back.
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 2: I think it was.
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 1: They were playing in Carolina, where he's from, and the
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 1: Packers like rotate. They don't have defined captains for all
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 1: six spots. They rotate guys or something like that. Yeah,
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 1: and he wanted to be a captain at home, but
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 1: he wasn't. But he went out for the coin toss anyway,
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 1: and they asked Hi about and he was like, I
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 1: decided I'm a captain. Like as nuts as that sounds like,
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 1: you need to think that way to be a corner
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 1: in this league. You need to have that level of
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 1: confidence to be an elite corner in this league. If
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 1: another position did that, I might feel differently. A cornerback
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 1: saying no, efitt, I'm a captain of this team. That
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 1: kind of rules. I'm sorry. That kind of rules so
• 1:26:10
  Speaker 1: healthy Gyre Alexander is a baller. He's only twenty eight
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 1: years old. Now here's the games that he's played in
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 1: the last four seasons.
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 2: Seven games. Seven games he played sixteen and twenty twenty two,
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 2: and he went to the Pro Bowl and was a
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 2: second Team All Pro four games, So three out of
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 2: the last four years he hasn't even made it half
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 2: the season, and at that price tag and for the
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 2: level player that he this is why he's available, right,
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 2: Like this is Russ is why he's available. So I
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 2: don't for that reason, I might be out. You know,
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 2: he's not healthy, he's not available, he doesn't play. But
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 2: I do love the player when he is healthy. So
• 1:26:48
  Speaker 2: I don't know if they did something like JayR Alexander
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 2: am I, I'm not going to be I'm not gonna
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 2: be mad at It's kind of like what I was
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 2: saying earlier about receiver with like a lave and Jamison Williams,
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 2: and like, if that's a swing that they take on
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 2: a veteran player and and hope that it works out,
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 2: then I really like he won that.
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 1: Coins won that.
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 2: Uh he was he was. He was a clearly great
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 2: player in his draft like.
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 1: That unbelievable player. I've always been a fan of him.
• 1:27:15
  Speaker 1: Unbelievable player, underrated.
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 2: All right, Uh, Patty, Patty chimes in, So Patty, you
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 2: couldn't get him on the phone, so I got him
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 2: an email. Uh. His Dion Walker comp is Alan Branch
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 2: What do you think of that one.
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 1: I think Alan Branch was more of like that true
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 1: nose tackle. Maybe I'm under selling Alan Branch. I don't
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 1: remember him being that athletic, good player, though underrated player,
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 1: underrated championship player for the Patriots. He's a big part
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 1: of that defense when they won the super Bowl with him.
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 1: But I don't know that i'd make that comp Yeah,
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 1: that's fair. Great player though great player. Not enough people
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 1: talk about Alan Branch and how much he did for
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 1: the Patriots. So good name Paul Patty.
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 2: Okay? Uh so, uh, Paul is is upset about Elliott Wolf.
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 2: This is not Paul Parillo. This is another an Paul.
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 2: Just just for the record, that wasn't as bad as
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 2: you know, me breaking news on behalf of my grease,
• 1:28:05
  Speaker 2: which was not what.
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 1: Yesterday signed a contract as Mike Grave was going to
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 1: the boat.
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 2: Okay, okay, let's not put it back out there and
• 1:28:12
  Speaker 2: confuse people more.
• 1:28:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 2: Anyways, uh you know, he he lays it out here.
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 2: I don't need to get in. We all know. The
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 2: particular is the draft wasn't good last year. Free agency
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 2: wasn't good last year. Wolf owned that today. So I'm
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 2: not breaking any News with that, but he asked the
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 2: million dollar question, which to be fair, you know, towards
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 2: the end there with Drod Mayo, we got the same question. Yeah,
• 1:28:34
  Speaker 2: you know, what does what does Elliott Wolf bring to
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 2: the table? You know what what makes you feel like
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 2: you know he's the right man for the job. I
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 2: think the one thing that I always go back on
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 2: with Elliot Wolf And when we were talking to him earlier,
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 2: this is his thirty first combine. Yeah, because he's been
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 2: coming to the Combine with his father since he was
• 1:28:53
  Speaker 2: a little kid, and he told a great story about
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 2: how his father had him tracking broad jumps one of
• 1:29:00
  Speaker 2: the combines that he was at when he was still
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 2: you know, a kid or teenager or whatever, and for
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 2: whatever reason, the the the official record keeper lost the
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 2: broad jumps that didn't have him. So the only person
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 2: that recorded every single prod jump at the Combine that
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 2: year was a young Elliott Wolf. So the NFL used
• 1:29:21
  Speaker 2: Elliott Wolf's broad jumps at the Combine. That's that's it.
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 2: It's the pedigree, right, It's the bloodlines and the fact
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 2: that out of everything that you could say about last offseason,
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 2: all that he he's been around it and he's got
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 2: a resume of an NFL general.
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 1: And like any field sports are not, there's an element
• 1:29:43
  Speaker 1: of it that's political. And this is a guy that
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 1: has been around and knows people and when you want
• 1:29:47
  Speaker 1: to try to trade, when you're trying to you know,
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 1: navigate through the agents and the gms and this and that.
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 1: He's been on those roads. Ryan Cowden has as well,
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 1: but not for as long Mike Rabel has been a
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 1: head coach, so he's done it to an extent. Elie, Well,
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 1: it's been around the block with these guys. He knows,
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 1: he knows the ins and outs.
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a it's a fair email, Paul like, yeah,
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 2: you know, it's a fair question.
• 1:30:07
  Speaker 1: Is that he's out to prove himself right? Is that
• 1:30:09
  Speaker 1: all enough to give him like full control of the roster?
• 1:30:12
  Speaker 1: I don't think so, but I I he doesn't bring
• 1:30:15
  Speaker 1: nothing to the table.
• 1:30:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. Uh. Luther Burden question, uh yeah from Jeremiah.
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: You know with the buzz around the combine right now
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 2: that Luther Burden could fall out of the first round,
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 2: are you interested at thirty eight? Yes? Yeah, me as well.
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 1: I would be interested in slight trade up as well.
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 1: I think he's He's everything you've wanted them to having
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 1: a receiver for a while. Oh yeah, explosive, H three
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 1: level playmaker. It's got that attitude and in a good way.
• 1:30:45
  Speaker 1: I know it showed up in a bad way last year,
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: but in a good way. And I the quote from
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 1: the scout about he's you know, he got bored with
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 1: Missouri's offense assuming they use him in the role. I
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 1: think they would use him in and that guy's not
• 1:30:57
  Speaker 1: getting bored. And Josh mcdames, it's gonna be one hundred
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 1: running target if I was going to say thirty or
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 1: four hundred, thirty hundred and forty. So I really like
• 1:31:06
  Speaker 1: Luther Burden. There was a time where I considered him
• 1:31:09
  Speaker 1: the best receiver in this draft. I'm not quite there anymore.
• 1:31:12
  Speaker 1: I think the gap between him and McMillan, though for
• 1:31:15
  Speaker 1: me is small, is smaller than his for a lot
• 1:31:17
  Speaker 1: of people. Yeah, I think for the right I wouldn't.
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 1: I would need to know the team. I don't know
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 1: that he's a blanket first round talent, but I think
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 1: on certain teams he's certainly worth the first round pick
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: if you have certain infrastructure in place. But to get
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 1: him in the second at this point, if I'm any
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 1: team to get that skill set in the building, absolutely absolutely,
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 1: I think.
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 2: He with the right coaching.
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 1: It's not going to step in day one and do it,
• 1:31:38
  Speaker 1: but I think with the right coaching, he can be
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 1: a game changer.
• 1:31:40
  Speaker 2: He's when Luther Burden is right, or actually just say
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 2: twenty twenty three Luther Burden and he was right the
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 2: whole season. He's an easily top twenty, top fifteen talent
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 2: in this class. I think that that goes out saying
• 1:31:54
  Speaker 2: he's what I love about Luther Burden and that type
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 2: of receiver as you were talking about, just a three
• 1:32:00
  Speaker 2: level separator, Like you can hit him on quick hitters
• 1:32:02
  Speaker 2: over the middle of the field and he'll catch and
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 2: run with it for an explosive. And the route at
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 2: the top and he can catch and run with it
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 2: for another explosive. Like any route can be a touchdown. Yeah,
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 2: he's got that ability to dynamic playmaking ability everywhere on
• 1:32:16
  Speaker 2: the field. Yeah, all three levels of the defense, crossing routes, digs,
• 1:32:21
  Speaker 2: you know, big digs, things like that, verticals, quick touches,
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 2: scheme touches, you know, quick hitters, scheme touches, all of it.
• 1:32:28
  Speaker 2: I love the player he got thirty eight. I mean,
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 2: it's a no brainer to me because you're getting a
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 2: guy that's first round talent. That's when you pick those guys.
• 1:32:36
  Speaker 1: I will say he might fall throd that though if
• 1:32:41
  Speaker 1: he got further, like does he get if he falls?
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 2: If he falls further than that, then it's more than
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 2: just what happened last.
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 1: Does he get the eighty Mitchell treatment?
• 1:32:49
  Speaker 2: Like he could?
• 1:32:50
  Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying, Like that wouldn't surprise me. And
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 1: that's there. I do have a roll thumb. At a
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 1: certain point where we hear some things, we don't hear everything.
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 1: The guy starts falling that far, it's like, all right,
• 1:32:59
  Speaker 1: somebody knows something.
• 1:32:59
  Speaker 2: I'd yeah, all right, David and Madrid's got a couple
• 1:33:03
  Speaker 2: questions for us. But first before his actual questions, Uh,
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 2: he says he's loving watching Barth at the combine. He
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 2: said that you look like a kid in Disneyland. Uh. Hey,
• 1:33:14
  Speaker 2: we gotta like, we gotta, you know, talk about this
• 1:33:17
  Speaker 2: for a second, like what what what's your favorite part
• 1:33:19
  Speaker 2: so far that you're willing to share on here? What's
• 1:33:23
  Speaker 2: your favorite part so far about about your first combine?
• 1:33:26
  Speaker 2: This is big news, people, want to know.
• 1:33:28
  Speaker 1: So this is cool right now again, to talk to
• 1:33:31
  Speaker 1: lanzer Line was awesome.
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that was super cool.
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 1: Uh And and some of the other other interviews that
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 1: I did Mark Ross this morning was awesome. Jeff Howe.
• 1:33:39
  Speaker 1: Yesterday I talked to some of the local guys as well,
• 1:33:42
  Speaker 1: do more talking about prospects. Interesting because I feel like
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 1: you can be looser with these guys than maybe you are,
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 1: like a guy that's already like it's not quite media
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 1: Monday at the Super Bowl where things get really off
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 1: the rails, but there is like I would surprised how
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 1: many college football writers are here and guys asking about
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 1: what can you tell us about your teammate? What can
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 1: you tell us about you know this guy? What can
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 1: you tell us about facing this guy? So like I
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 1: feel like that relaxed the environment a little bit, so
• 1:34:13
  Speaker 1: being able, Like I was asking a bunch of the
• 1:34:15
  Speaker 1: defensive linemen today. I know you're making fun of me
• 1:34:17
  Speaker 1: for asking him if they met with the Patriots, But.
• 1:34:19
  Speaker 2: Did you see that guy? I'm sorry to interrupt you,
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 2: but there's a guy walking around that had a sweatshirt
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 2: on and said have you met with and then like
• 1:34:29
  Speaker 2: a fill in the blank and I really want to
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 2: buy one because after today, I don't know what the
• 1:34:35
  Speaker 2: Patriots no.
• 1:34:36
  Speaker 1: But I that's not how So I was asking about well,
• 1:34:42
  Speaker 1: I asked a couple of guys, and I got some
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 1: good answers, like what is it like how different is
• 1:34:46
  Speaker 1: it when you meet with Mike Rabel or a guy
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 1: that's coached in this league, a guy that's played in
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 1: this league versus a guy that hasn't. And so that's
• 1:34:53
  Speaker 1: where like TJ. Sanders was telling me that he hasn't
• 1:34:56
  Speaker 1: met with the Patriots here, but he met with him
• 1:34:57
  Speaker 1: at the Senior Bowl, and Mike Rabel was literally coaching
• 1:35:00
  Speaker 1: up and telling him like parts of his game, like hey,
• 1:35:02
  Speaker 1: if you do this differently, this will improve. And you know,
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 1: obviously that's football coaching, but a guy that's played can
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 1: give that insight. I also really enjoyed asking some of
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 1: the linemen, like who is the best offensive lineman you faced?
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Right, I do actually like that question, I was teasing.
• 1:35:18
  Speaker 2: I got.
• 1:35:18
  Speaker 1: I especially made a point because he can't talk to
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 1: everybody who's like eight, ten, twelve podiums at once, so
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 1: it's tough to get to everyone. So I tried to
• 1:35:25
  Speaker 1: make a point to do that with the SEC guys.
• 1:35:27
  Speaker 1: A lot of Will Campbell, a lot of Calvin Banks.
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 1: Those are the most of the answers. Tyler Booker from
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 1: Alabama was a guy I got a couple of times.
• 1:35:36
  Speaker 1: The interesting one is a good note for the Patriots.
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 1: So I mostly asked the edge guys because I wanted
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 1: to hear about the tackles. But I did ask a
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 1: couple of interior defensive guys. I want to say it
• 1:35:45
  Speaker 1: was Nick Gordon who said this, but I don't remember exactly.
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 1: Cooper Mays, who's the center at Tennessee, who is the
• 1:35:52
  Speaker 1: brother of Cade Mays, who I really liked in the
• 1:35:53
  Speaker 1: draft a couple of years ago, son of coach. Patriots
• 1:35:56
  Speaker 1: might need a center on Day three, they might be
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 1: looking there. Cooper May's at A couple of guys, tell me,
• 1:36:01
  Speaker 1: interior guys, tell me Cooper Mason. Tennessee was a tough battle.
• 1:36:04
  Speaker 2: So there you go. I actually did ask Kyle Canard, Canard,
• 1:36:10
  Speaker 2: you're the name guy. Yeah, I did ask Kyle Canard
• 1:36:13
  Speaker 2: about Will Campbell, his matchup with Will Campbell last year. Yeah,
• 1:36:15
  Speaker 2: he got him as good as anybody. Yeah, he got
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 2: him with a couple of times, crossing his face on
• 1:36:19
  Speaker 2: the inside. Those are like the clips that you see
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 2: of you know, he Will Campbell over sets. Like if
• 1:36:24
  Speaker 2: you wanted an example of that, a tangible clip example,
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 2: you go to that game and pull the Kyle Canard
• 1:36:31
  Speaker 2: l's that Campbell took. And he was kind of diplomatic
• 1:36:35
  Speaker 2: about it. You know, he didn't exactly, you know, go
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 2: too hard at Will Campbell, but he said its a
• 1:36:39
  Speaker 2: good battle and you know, just the iron sharp and
• 1:36:42
  Speaker 2: iron that type of thing. So I do like that question.
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 2: It is interesting, you know, ask the corners, the receivers,
• 1:36:46
  Speaker 2: the receivers, the corners, you know, the tackles with the
• 1:36:49
  Speaker 2: edge rushers, you know that sort of thing.
• 1:36:51
  Speaker 1: So there was one really interesting answer I got from
• 1:36:53
  Speaker 1: Princely woman me Ellen from Little Miss, who said Will
• 1:36:57
  Speaker 1: Campbell and I asked. He said he'd never seen a
• 1:37:00
  Speaker 1: tackle run block like that. And obviously we're you know,
• 1:37:03
  Speaker 1: we're talking about these guys, his pass boxers and protecting
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 1: Drake May. But he said he'd never seen tackle like
• 1:37:07
  Speaker 1: that aggressive and that ferocious in the run game. So
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 1: that was interesting perspective. Okay, give it what you will, but.
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 2: Do you have an all podium Honestly, this is big
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 2: at the combine he got to give an All podium on.
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 1: So we've only talked to one group me. Ellen was
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 1: really good. Yeah, he had some good insight. He's very conversational. Yep.
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 1: Scrton was really good. Kind of talked about his background,
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 1: how he got here's the guy wh's played a lot
• 1:37:34
  Speaker 1: of different position. Gave some insight into that and Ben
• 1:37:38
  Speaker 1: SAAL's I got to talk. There was a line for
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 1: Ben Saws. I had to wait, No, you did it? Yeah, no,
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 1: there was a lot. Legitimately there was. I think he
• 1:37:47
  Speaker 1: was from Pittsburgh. The guy he must have been from
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 1: Pittsburgh got in front of me because I heard him
• 1:37:50
  Speaker 1: asking other players about Steelers. But yeah, I got like
• 1:37:55
  Speaker 1: three or four questions. Ben SAAL's intense guy. And if
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 1: they want like intense people, guy, don't get me wrong,
• 1:38:00
  Speaker 1: he was, but intense.
• 1:38:03
  Speaker 2: We're getting this is a Bomber moment.
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the little Bomber moment means at the in the
• 1:38:08
  Speaker 1: college Bombers where we went to school.
• 1:38:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, mister Frog's behind the camera back there.
• 1:38:14
  Speaker 1: He's you you gonna put a betch on your all
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 1: All podium team. So it's betch. I think it's batch.
• 1:38:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah that it's not bech, it's betch yeah. Uh anyway, anyway,
• 1:38:27
  Speaker 1: like you want your kickers to be intense, right and souls.
• 1:38:29
  Speaker 1: You know. I asked him what it's like to be
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 1: elected kicker, Like, turn't that many guys? He goes, I
• 1:38:33
  Speaker 1: just want to be a great kicker. I was like,
• 1:38:35
  Speaker 1: all right, I get that. And you know, I was like,
• 1:38:37
  Speaker 1: an answer, you kicked an a paraphrase, kicked an Akracher stadium, Like,
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 1: how does that help you in Lincoln? It's good for
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 1: my resume, it's you know, respect his dam like he
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 1: was just all business.
• 1:38:47
  Speaker 2: I do have to mention this, and I don't. I
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 2: don't think he'll mind. But my favorite thing about the
• 1:38:52
  Speaker 2: combine is that like somebody that has not watched a
• 1:38:57
  Speaker 2: second of film will just completely judge a guy off
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 2: of his podium presence and just be like, I'm out,
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 2: so one no socks comes after Mason Graham goes at
• 1:39:07
  Speaker 2: the podium and we can't draft that guy. And I
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 2: was like, what do you mean. He's like, I won't
• 1:39:13
  Speaker 2: I won't go too much into what he said, but
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 2: that that's what he said. And I was just laughing
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 2: so hard, and I was like, I mean, other than
• 1:39:20
  Speaker 2: maybe Travis Hunters, probably the best tape in the entire draft.
• 1:39:24
  Speaker 2: And I will say this about Mason Graham though the
• 1:39:27
  Speaker 2: backup no socks, just a just a teeny weeny bit.
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 2: I he he came as advertised in terms of his
• 1:39:35
  Speaker 2: his demeanor and his personality. I don't necessarily think he's
• 1:39:41
  Speaker 2: he's not gonna be a ten year captain like Will Campbell,
• 1:39:44
  Speaker 2: right like, I don't think he's gonna be our big, raw,
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 2: raw guy speaking of the devil no socks on the
• 1:39:49
  Speaker 2: on the scene. I don't think that he's gonna be
• 1:39:52
  Speaker 2: one of those types of guys that's not necessarily a
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 2: bad thing. But I couldn't help but feeling when when
• 1:39:58
  Speaker 2: Mason Graham was up there that if Belichick was still
• 1:40:01
  Speaker 2: in charge, this is just one of those guys that
• 1:40:04
  Speaker 2: is going to quietly go about his business. He's gonna
• 1:40:08
  Speaker 2: be in the building at six a m. He's gonna
• 1:40:10
  Speaker 2: work his tail off, He's gonna be an excellent football player.
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 2: It's not the flashy pick. It's not you know, the
• 1:40:15
  Speaker 2: only difference between him and Gonzalz is Gonzalz was awesome
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 2: at the combine in terms of the workout. But he's
• 1:40:21
  Speaker 2: not going to be the best athlete. He's not going
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 2: to be a first off the bus guy. He's not
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 2: going to be a raw, raw vocal leader. But he's
• 1:40:27
  Speaker 2: just gonna get crap done. He's just going to be
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 2: a really good football player. If they still have any
• 1:40:31
  Speaker 2: of that Belichick DNA in terms of that sort of thing,
• 1:40:34
  Speaker 2: then I could see them gravitating towards Mason Graham. If
• 1:40:37
  Speaker 2: if Rayone wants guys like him, like like Rabel, then
• 1:40:40
  Speaker 2: that then that's not then it's Mike Campbell or yeah.
• 1:40:43
  Speaker 2: Uh the other the guy that I would say my
• 1:40:47
  Speaker 2: all podium guy of the day, Jalen Walker from Georgia.
• 1:40:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I couldn't. He had bigger crowd anybody. I think
• 1:40:53
  Speaker 1: he had a bigger crowd than Graham. I couldn't get
• 1:40:54
  Speaker 1: close enough to hear.
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 2: I mean, I loved him already on tape, you know,
• 1:40:57
  Speaker 2: so I was already kind of swooning a little bit.
• 1:40:59
  Speaker 2: But listening to him talk about some of the conversations
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 2: that he's had with teams here at the Combine about
• 1:41:07
  Speaker 2: his role at the next level, and he just was like,
• 1:41:10
  Speaker 2: I can play four different positions on the defense, at
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 2: a high level. You know, he can play off the ball,
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 2: he can play edge. He said he thinks he can
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 2: play nickel if you want him to. And then you
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 2: know Nicol Sam yeah, you know, like a strong side
• 1:41:22
  Speaker 2: nickel player. Yeah, yeah, you know, and I believe them,
• 1:41:27
  Speaker 2: like like he's that kind of athlete you see, you hear,
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 2: you know, sometimes you hear some Jamie Collins, like in
• 1:41:33
  Speaker 2: terms of athletic freakish athleticism comparisons with Jalen Walker. He's
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 2: an excellent, like third down situational pass rusher. I don't
• 1:41:41
  Speaker 2: think that he's a full time edge player, but he's
• 1:41:42
  Speaker 2: an excellent situational passer. Then on early downs he can
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 2: play off the ball linebacker. So in that sense, you
• 1:41:49
  Speaker 2: have like kind of that high tower Collins, you know,
• 1:41:52
  Speaker 2: type of hybrid player. I get that it's probably not
• 1:41:56
  Speaker 2: the the need pick, you know, in terms of tackle,
• 1:42:00
  Speaker 2: edge rusher things like that with Jalen Walker. But I
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 2: just all those Georgia guys, you just get up to
• 1:42:06
  Speaker 2: the podium and they're so polished and yeah, so all
• 1:42:08
  Speaker 2: the NFL training has already gone through their veins in
• 1:42:11
  Speaker 2: terms of, you know, how to handle the media and
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff, and he's an awesome player.
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 2: He's gonna be a really good player in the league.
• 1:42:17
  Speaker 2: I think any other takeaways we talked about Mason Graham.
• 1:42:22
  Speaker 2: That was important. I wanted to fit that in there
• 1:42:23
  Speaker 2: than from today or yesterday before we talk about what's ahead.
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 1: We can get to what's said.
• 1:42:29
  Speaker 2: All right, So tomorrow on Thursday, we have the defensive
• 1:42:33
  Speaker 2: backs and we have the tight ends. It's kind of
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 2: a sneaky big day.
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 1: Bryson has bit ten am. That's the one I'll be
• 1:42:39
  Speaker 1: you know, I'll be around obviously for all of them,
• 1:42:40
  Speaker 1: but that's the one I'm interested. I think we're gonna
• 1:42:42
  Speaker 1: get some goo stuff.
• 1:42:42
  Speaker 2: Sneaky big day, really really great tight end classes we
• 1:42:46
  Speaker 2: talked about a little bit today.
• 1:42:48
  Speaker 1: You know who's on that list too. We could talk
• 1:42:50
  Speaker 1: to tomorrow and he's gonna be in the same spot.
• 1:42:52
  Speaker 1: Ben Salz was to Robbie Oots.
• 1:42:54
  Speaker 2: Robbie Oots full back, Robbioots.
• 1:42:57
  Speaker 1: Is he listened as the fullback. I meant to check that.
• 1:42:59
  Speaker 2: No, he's listened with the tight ends.
• 1:43:01
  Speaker 1: Okay, he's a full back.
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's a full back.
• 1:43:04
  Speaker 1: But he's like, I get we're talking about you want
• 1:43:05
  Speaker 1: that kind of hybrid guy that's going to play full
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 1: back but catch some passes and move around the formation. Yeah,
• 1:43:11
  Speaker 1: you could take Harold fann In at thirty eight. Yeah,
• 1:43:13
  Speaker 1: you want a lot less risk. I'm not going to
• 1:43:15
  Speaker 1: say the same upside, but like, you know, decent upside.
• 1:43:19
  Speaker 1: Go get Robbie Hoots in the six or seventeen. Yeah.
• 1:43:21
  Speaker 2: He so, Bill O'Brien used him as like a base.
• 1:43:23
  Speaker 2: O'Brien every as a full back. And I think I
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 2: can tell this story now because he's not with the
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 2: Atriots anymore. But Bill O'Brien, Alex and I were at
• 1:43:31
  Speaker 2: the Shrine.
• 1:43:31
  Speaker 1: Bowl, can I can I tell this story first real quick? Yeah,
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 1: so I forget who you were watching. You were watching
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 1: somebody from Alabama. This was like two drafts ago, and no,
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 1: I was watching the Alabama offense because Bill O'Brien was
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 1: their offense. Oh that's what it was.
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And you text me who's forty seven and on
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 1: the Alabama offense? This is one of those floaded Alabama teams. Yeah,
• 1:43:50
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, you're really texting me about like you
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 1: of all people, really text me about the fullback, Like, yeah,
• 1:43:55
  Speaker 1: Robbi Oats is great, but you're love you about you
• 1:43:57
  Speaker 1: were you were all exa. It's so because he's fun.
• 1:43:59
  Speaker 1: He's not your kind of player. He's fun.
• 1:44:01
  Speaker 2: I love fullback. So Alex and I are at what's
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 2: the name of the hotel again the the the the
• 1:44:10
  Speaker 2: beam with the beam Beam were the Luxor. So we're
• 1:44:16
  Speaker 2: staying at the Luxor Hotel at the Shrine Bowl and uh,
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 2: we're there, you know a couple of years ago and
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 2: Bill belichicking the coaching staff were at the Shrine Bowl
• 1:44:24
  Speaker 2: and we're walking into the main hotel lobby to the
• 1:44:28
  Speaker 2: doors and a car pulls up in front of us
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 2: and who gets out of the car below it's.
• 1:44:33
  Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien, Like a day or two after they hired
• 1:44:36
  Speaker 1: right Ray had.
• 1:44:36
  Speaker 2: Just hired him as the offensive coordinator. He gets out
• 1:44:39
  Speaker 2: of the car to you know, join the coaching staff
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 2: in Vegas, and me, being you know, the big j
• 1:44:44
  Speaker 2: that I am, I was like, I'm gonna go say hi, right,
• 1:44:46
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna go say hi to Bill O'Brien. So I
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 2: go up to Bill O'Brien and I say, hey, hey, Bill,
• 1:44:52
  Speaker 2: you know Evan Lazar Patriots dot Com. Just wanted to
• 1:44:55
  Speaker 2: introduce myself. And he goes oh yeah, I I I know,
• 1:44:59
  Speaker 2: I know who you are. And I was like you do,
• 1:45:01
  Speaker 2: like you just got here, what do you mean and
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 2: he goes, yeah, I read, I read what you wrote
• 1:45:05
  Speaker 2: about my offense on the website. Don't do that again,
• 1:45:09
  Speaker 2: and and I was like okay, and he was like yeah.
• 1:45:14
  Speaker 2: He was like, you know, sequencing plays and like you
• 1:45:16
  Speaker 2: gave away too much. And I was I was like,
• 1:45:18
  Speaker 2: all right, yeah, noted. I will never do that again,
• 1:45:21
  Speaker 2: I promise. But the way that I figured out how
• 1:45:24
  Speaker 2: he was sequencing the plays was through robb uots because
• 1:45:27
  Speaker 2: his usage of about robbi oots was he was building
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 2: up to something with robb you oats and then they
• 1:45:32
  Speaker 2: ran like a bluff screen or something like that and
• 1:45:35
  Speaker 2: hit it for like a fifty yard touchdown later in
• 1:45:37
  Speaker 2: the game. And I was like, wow, that is a
• 1:45:39
  Speaker 2: tremendous sequencing of plays, Like that's awesome. So yeah, that
• 1:45:44
  Speaker 2: that's a little Bill O'Brien's story. So I have the
• 1:45:46
  Speaker 2: tight ends tomorrow, So oh yeah, don't do that again.
• 1:45:50
  Speaker 2: Just like that, I was like like I'm white as ghost.
• 1:45:53
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh god, Tyler Warren tomorrow, Polston Lovelan, Uh,
• 1:45:58
  Speaker 2: those will be big. And then obviously at eleven am
• 1:46:03
  Speaker 2: on tomorrow. On Thursday with Group four A, we got
• 1:46:06
  Speaker 2: Travis Hunter at the post main event, so that would
• 1:46:09
  Speaker 2: be the main event. And I'm just fascinated. I'm really
• 1:46:12
  Speaker 2: interested to look at you to his get his answer
• 1:46:17
  Speaker 2: on the million dollar question.
• 1:46:18
  Speaker 1: But like he's gonna say, he's gonna say he wants
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 1: to play both ways. He's gonna say, you know, I
• 1:46:22
  Speaker 1: feel comfortable playing both ways. Wherever the team needs me,
• 1:46:25
  Speaker 1: I'll go.
• 1:46:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:46:26
  Speaker 1: The real answer is gonna be what we hear out
• 1:46:28
  Speaker 1: of meetings. I think, yeah, it will be interesting to
• 1:46:30
  Speaker 1: hear him answer the question. I just wonder, you know,
• 1:46:33
  Speaker 1: he's gonna get up there. You're probably right, he's gonna
• 1:46:35
  Speaker 1: see I think he's gonna say he's not gonna close
• 1:46:38
  Speaker 1: any doors because he doesn't help himself if he closed
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 1: any doors.
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 2: He's gonna say he wants to play both ways.
• 1:46:42
  Speaker 1: Yep. And I think because he's but that he's but
• 1:46:44
  Speaker 1: that he's up for like he's comfortable with whatever. Yeah,
• 1:46:47
  Speaker 1: I I wherever the team needs him.
• 1:46:50
  Speaker 2: I just wonder if if you know, he'll get asked, obviously,
• 1:46:55
  Speaker 2: why are you with the defensive backs? And I think
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 2: we both have kind of gone over on this show
• 1:47:00
  Speaker 2: about the schedule, logistics and stuff. Maybe it's as simple
• 1:47:02
  Speaker 2: as that, And yeah, I'm interested to see what he
• 1:47:04
  Speaker 2: says when he's you know, pressed on that a little
• 1:47:06
  Speaker 2: bit about what position he's gonna play. You know, we
• 1:47:09
  Speaker 2: mentioned some of the deeper tight ends today and we
• 1:47:10
  Speaker 2: got asked about Fanning, but you know, there's a little
• 1:47:13
  Speaker 2: his tight end class is great. You know, there's gonna
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 2: be a lot of good tight ends to talk to tomorrow.
• 1:47:17
  Speaker 2: Bryson nesbit at at ten am is a good shout
• 1:47:20
  Speaker 2: by you. That's a good one as well. Is there
• 1:47:23
  Speaker 2: any other you know corners safeties? And then I do
• 1:47:26
  Speaker 2: want to talk about the workouts tomorrow getting underway as well.
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 1: Some of the Senior Bowl guys, just because there were
• 1:47:32
  Speaker 1: some guys that really wasn't as familiar with that stood
• 1:47:34
  Speaker 1: out at Senior Bowl. Mac McWilliams, who I know you
• 1:47:36
  Speaker 1: like from UCF. He's a corner, but I think you
• 1:47:39
  Speaker 1: think mac McWilliams could play a little free safet if
• 1:47:41
  Speaker 1: you need him too.
• 1:47:43
  Speaker 2: Definitely could play Nickel.
• 1:47:44
  Speaker 1: I don't know about free safety, but like they used
• 1:47:46
  Speaker 1: to move John Jones back there at times. Yeah, not
• 1:47:48
  Speaker 1: single high but like a split state. You think he'd
• 1:47:50
  Speaker 1: be a split safety. Maybe he definitely has the ball skills.
• 1:47:55
  Speaker 1: He reminds me a little bit of John Jones a
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 1: little bit. Yeah, he's a little bit longer, I feel
• 1:47:58
  Speaker 1: like than John Jones, Yes, looking at his body type.
• 1:48:01
  Speaker 1: But I hear but like Mac McWilliams, I want to
• 1:48:04
  Speaker 1: hear from uh, the Texas kid who's not getting enough
• 1:48:09
  Speaker 1: nearly enough tench for the Patriots right now, Texas long week,
• 1:48:12
  Speaker 1: the Texas safety. Oh boy, I'll look it up for you. Uh,
• 1:48:16
  Speaker 1: Andrew mccooba. Oh yeah, And mccob I just want to
• 1:48:19
  Speaker 1: kind of because he is a little bit of a
• 1:48:22
  Speaker 1: rarity in that you don't see that many guys that
• 1:48:24
  Speaker 1: were like true free safeties in college football anymore. All
• 1:48:27
  Speaker 1: these guys are coming out as highbrids. But mccouba kind
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 1: of was a true free safety. So how he views
• 1:48:32
  Speaker 1: himself coming to the league. He'd be a great fit
• 1:48:34
  Speaker 1: for the Patriots. And it if Schevan what time Chevon
• 1:48:39
  Speaker 1: Rebel talks, he where he's at. If he talks, he's
• 1:48:42
  Speaker 1: not gonna work out right like I would, just I
• 1:48:43
  Speaker 1: don't think. So he's at eleven twenty tomorrow. Okay, yep,
• 1:48:50
  Speaker 1: so just kind of see where because he's an I
• 1:48:52
  Speaker 1: don't know how much you studied him. I haven't done
• 1:48:54
  Speaker 1: as much as i'd like to. But from what I've seen,
• 1:48:56
  Speaker 1: physical guy like he well for he's my kind of
• 1:48:58
  Speaker 1: corner like reminds me you remember how much I love
• 1:49:00
  Speaker 1: TREEQ willen right six three long arms plays man plays press,
• 1:49:05
  Speaker 1: a small school guy transfer it he on tape. It
• 1:49:10
  Speaker 1: does not look like he should fall to thirty eight.
• 1:49:12
  Speaker 2: Doesn't look like it.
• 1:49:13
  Speaker 1: If he hadn't torn his ACL he wouldn't have he'd
• 1:49:15
  Speaker 1: be clear first round pick if he does fall to
• 1:49:18
  Speaker 1: thirty eight. You know, I've been pretty insistent when we
• 1:49:21
  Speaker 1: talk about Josh Simmons that the Patriots top three picks
• 1:49:24
  Speaker 1: need to play this year. But if Shavon Revel, you know,
• 1:49:27
  Speaker 1: if it's he'll be back in October, that's a really
• 1:49:32
  Speaker 1: interesting pick. At thirty eight, he might be the best
• 1:49:33
  Speaker 1: player on the board. That would be a really interesting pick,
• 1:49:36
  Speaker 1: assuming he's on the right track recovery wise.
• 1:49:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So you know, defensive backs, I think the Senior
• 1:49:42
  Speaker 2: Bowl guys too are are you know? Obviously I watched
• 1:49:44
  Speaker 2: those guys up close, so I'm interested. I am interested
• 1:49:48
  Speaker 2: in a little bit just to hear, you know, from
• 1:49:50
  Speaker 2: Will Johnson, because I mean, I don't think it's right
• 1:49:53
  Speaker 2: for the Patriots, but I still, you know, just he's
• 1:49:56
  Speaker 2: actually going at the at the same time as Travis Hunter,
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 2: so that's gonna be tough. But with Will Johnson, I
• 1:50:02
  Speaker 2: just there's some questions there that probably wouldn't have existed
• 1:50:05
  Speaker 2: if he could have just came out after winning the
• 1:50:07
  Speaker 2: National Championship Game. You know, long speed, you know, man
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 2: to man ability, you know, to cover routes down the
• 1:50:13
  Speaker 2: field and vertical routes and stay attached and all that
• 1:50:16
  Speaker 2: good stuff. But I think a lot of that and
• 1:50:18
  Speaker 2: I you know, I mentioned I meant to say this
• 1:50:20
  Speaker 2: with Luther Burdon too, those young breakout players, and this
• 1:50:25
  Speaker 2: is a big feather in Luther Burden's cap, especially at
• 1:50:28
  Speaker 2: the receiver position. If you're a young breakout player and
• 1:50:32
  Speaker 2: you break out before your draft eligible, like the year
• 1:50:34
  Speaker 2: before your draft eligible, uh tip. You know, there's a
• 1:50:37
  Speaker 2: lot of examples of that junior season being kind of
• 1:50:39
  Speaker 2: a letdown, Like you know you're gonna go to the NFL,
• 1:50:42
  Speaker 2: you know you're probably gonna be a first round pick.
• 1:50:44
  Speaker 2: You just don't have the fire, like you just don't
• 1:50:46
  Speaker 2: have it. And I wonder a little bit of that
• 1:50:49
  Speaker 2: with Will Johnson. He's not as fast, I don't think
• 1:50:52
  Speaker 2: as he's not gonna run like Christian Gonzales did, but
• 1:50:55
  Speaker 2: he kind of glides like that, you know where it
• 1:50:57
  Speaker 2: doesn't look like he's kind of effortless, like he's not
• 1:50:59
  Speaker 2: trying sometimes, but I think he is. I'll get you
• 1:51:02
  Speaker 2: this one too. This will just be interesting.
• 1:51:04
  Speaker 1: I bet the majority of the big ten corners will
• 1:51:08
  Speaker 1: get asked what it was like covering Jeremiah Smith. Yeah,
• 1:51:10
  Speaker 1: and maybe some of the teams they play in college
• 1:51:11
  Speaker 1: football playoff too. And obviously Jeremiah Smith's not in the draft,
• 1:51:14
  Speaker 1: but I think we'll get some interesting answers from that.
• 1:51:16
  Speaker 2: Okay, So then tomorrow night or tomorrow afternoon, Yeah, starting
• 1:51:21
  Speaker 2: at three o'clock is the defensive line and linebackers are
• 1:51:24
  Speaker 2: gonna go through their authetic testing and on field drills.
• 1:51:28
  Speaker 2: Who are you looking for in that CLA just gotta
• 1:51:31
  Speaker 2: say like hunger down somewhere if you want to watch
• 1:51:33
  Speaker 2: the whole thing, because that's a big group the long night. Yeah,
• 1:51:38
  Speaker 2: but those guys are all really talented.
• 1:51:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah they are. I don't know that there's any one
• 1:51:42
  Speaker 1: specific guy. I just think the group collectively has a
• 1:51:45
  Speaker 1: chance to impress. I guess I don't want to see
• 1:51:47
  Speaker 1: some of these linebackers and coverage Barrett Carter, Chris Paul,
• 1:51:50
  Speaker 1: guys I've talked about quite a bit, uh Bo, jeff
• 1:51:56
  Speaker 1: You know, you watch these guys cover in and they're
• 1:52:00
  Speaker 1: mostly covering running backs and they do a good job.
• 1:52:03
  Speaker 1: But the cover responsibilities for linebacker in college are generally
• 1:52:06
  Speaker 1: pretty different than they are in the NFL. And you know,
• 1:52:09
  Speaker 1: running backs aren't running that many routes in college, so
• 1:52:12
  Speaker 1: you get to see him against some more routes. You
• 1:52:13
  Speaker 1: get to see HM against guys that are truly specialized
• 1:52:15
  Speaker 1: in that we're not every college team has that guy.
• 1:52:18
  Speaker 1: So that's usually pretty telling to me from the linebackers, right,
• 1:52:21
  Speaker 1: is how do they look in the coverage drills.
• 1:52:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Jeffrey Boss is an interesting player.
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 1: But this a good lineback draft. You know, I'll give
• 1:52:27
  Speaker 1: you another all podium guy. Actually he was awesome, Johad Campbell.
• 1:52:30
  Speaker 2: From alabab Because I would have forgotten.
• 1:52:33
  Speaker 1: I'm also a big Jihog Tampbell fan, Like I really
• 1:52:36
  Speaker 1: like that player a lot too.
• 1:52:38
  Speaker 2: And I like a lot of these linebackers are just
• 1:52:40
  Speaker 2: not like me.
• 1:52:40
  Speaker 1: Well, you mentioned with and it's not but you mentioned
• 1:52:42
  Speaker 1: with Campbell, Johad Campbell that or you were mentioning her
• 1:52:46
  Speaker 1: like if Rabel wants the guys who are wired like him, Yeah,
• 1:52:49
  Speaker 1: Jehad Campbell, I think fits that. Listen Campbell Campbell, top
• 1:52:52
  Speaker 1: of the draft, sign me up.
• 1:52:53
  Speaker 2: He's uh, he's one of those players that I think
• 1:52:56
  Speaker 2: is uh, you know, getting like knocked for certain things
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 2: in his film. Consistency, things like that, you know, play
• 1:53:03
  Speaker 2: in space and coverage. Like, I think he's a much
• 1:53:05
  Speaker 2: better player than some of the where I see the
• 1:53:07
  Speaker 2: ranges and the mock drafts and stuff going sometimes He's a.
• 1:53:10
  Speaker 1: Guy that I wonder if the range is like if
• 1:53:12
  Speaker 1: it was ten years ago, yeah, and the nerds hadn't
• 1:53:15
  Speaker 1: devalued linebackers.
• 1:53:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's had to get that shot in at the troupe,
• 1:53:20
  Speaker 2: just had to.
• 1:53:20
  Speaker 1: He's a clear first round pick. Yeah, and now he's
• 1:53:23
  Speaker 1: like fringy first maybe second. To me, that's just the
• 1:53:26
  Speaker 1: devaluing of the position and nothing more.
• 1:53:28
  Speaker 2: Okay, a couple of other guys, uh, just to mention
• 1:53:31
  Speaker 2: here in terms of the the drill tomorrow. Shamar Stewart
• 1:53:35
  Speaker 2: from Texas A and m is in my from everything
• 1:53:39
  Speaker 2: that you hear, Yeah, Shamar Stewart's about to put down
• 1:53:41
  Speaker 2: an insane, like Trayvon Walker esque combine. Okay, so he
• 1:53:45
  Speaker 2: is an absolute freak athlete and he's he's long, he's big,
• 1:53:50
  Speaker 2: and he's super charged. Right, so he's gonna put down
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 2: a great combine, and a lot of uh, you know experts,
• 1:53:57
  Speaker 2: you know, are predicting that it already kind of getting
• 1:54:00
  Speaker 2: ahead of it, that his combine is going to be
• 1:54:02
  Speaker 2: so good that all of a sudden, he's going to
• 1:54:03
  Speaker 2: be like a top ten pick, right, Like he's gonna
• 1:54:05
  Speaker 2: have that kind of freakish type of athleticism. The other
• 1:54:09
  Speaker 2: guy that I'm just interested in because like, you know,
• 1:54:11
  Speaker 2: big guy, move fast right, Yeah, Kenneth Grant from Michigan.
• 1:54:14
  Speaker 1: So he's not getting nearly enough attention because everybody wants
• 1:54:18
  Speaker 1: talk about Mason Graham.
• 1:54:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:54:19
  Speaker 1: Part of the reason Mason Graham looks so good is
• 1:54:21
  Speaker 1: Kenneth Grant playing next to him.
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 2: Kenneth Grant from Michigan. I believe he was on was
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 2: on the freaks list, should be, Yeah, I from everything
• 1:54:31
  Speaker 2: that you hear and you see some of the pursuit
• 1:54:34
  Speaker 2: down the field and things like that that he has
• 1:54:36
  Speaker 2: on film where he chases guys down. He is gonna
• 1:54:39
  Speaker 2: have a ridiculous workout tomorrow and he's gonna be a really,
• 1:54:43
  Speaker 2: really freaky athlete.
• 1:54:45
  Speaker 1: I'll put in. I always like watching the jumbo defensive tackles, right,
• 1:54:48
  Speaker 1: Dean Walker, Cam Jackson. Those have been my guys. See
• 1:54:52
  Speaker 1: what they do.
• 1:54:52
  Speaker 2: So he's not as big, and I know he got
• 1:54:55
  Speaker 2: a rap, but he's not as big as Jordan Davis.
• 1:54:57
  Speaker 2: So it's not gonna be like downybody's Jordan Davis. It's
• 1:54:59
  Speaker 2: not gonna be that, you know, jaw dropping that that
• 1:55:01
  Speaker 2: guy that side. But he's a big, big boy and
• 1:55:04
  Speaker 2: he's gonna put up a great time. He's gonna run
• 1:55:07
  Speaker 2: really well shorten day of sub five, don't forget that.
• 1:55:10
  Speaker 2: So Kenneth Grant is my guy to watch other than
• 1:55:13
  Speaker 2: Shamar Stewart, But Kenneth Grant I just lasting on him.
• 1:55:16
  Speaker 2: He doesn't have the production that Mason Graham did, like
• 1:55:20
  Speaker 2: on the Ball production, but when you watch the tape,
• 1:55:23
  Speaker 2: he's he's doing a lot of dirty work, you know,
• 1:55:25
  Speaker 2: a lot of dirty work. He's a tough guy. To move.
• 1:55:27
  Speaker 2: He's really athletic, all right. So that does it here
• 1:55:31
  Speaker 2: today for this edition in Catch twenty two. We'll be
• 1:55:33
  Speaker 2: back in studio next week to recap all of this
• 1:55:36
  Speaker 2: stuff at the Combine and Free here in Indianapolis. We
• 1:55:40
  Speaker 2: gotta get you some shrimp cocktail.
• 1:55:41
  Speaker 1: Yep, I know I've still done that.
• 1:55:43
  Speaker 2: That's on the list. You can't leave India without some
• 1:55:45
  Speaker 2: shrimp cocktail. And I'm sure both of us are gonna
• 1:55:48
  Speaker 2: want one of these by the end of today. So
• 1:55:51
  Speaker 2: easy to drink, easy to enjoy. Bud Light, the official
• 1:55:54
  Speaker 2: beer sponsor of the New England Patriots. We'll see you
• 1:55:57
  Speaker 2: guys next Wednesday, back to our normal time in studio
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 2: well Atlets Stadium. But until then, have a good weekend. Bye.
• 1:56:03
  Speaker 3: Thank you for downloading this podcast. Subscribe on Apple, google Play,
• 1:56:07
  Speaker 3: and everywhere else you listen. Like the show, Please rate
• 1:56:10
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• 1:56:14
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• 1:56:17
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• 1:56:20
  Speaker 3: and more podcasts.