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Words with Kel Richards – 6th June · Words with Kel Richards

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Sounds and now a night's Words with Cal Richards. Yes
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: words with Kel Richards, and Kel of course is with
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: us every Thursday night to talk words. And don't forget
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: his fantastic website which has links to all of his
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: great publications. You get a daily missive from him oz
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: words dot com dot au.
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: Good evening, sir, good evening, sir. Really nice to be here.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: Now, let me just mention this headline I saw in
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: the Telegraph, because this this this list of the Bougist.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: And I'm told everyone here says, I've got someone saying
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: to me it's b o u G and it's a
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: hard g. Now I think it's a b o u G.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: I s t bougist. Francis has heard it, Charlie's heard it.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: A lot of the younger people here have used it.
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: It's kind of a play on bourgeois.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: I think exactly. Tell us, well, it is a plan
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: on bourgeois. Quickly, Da dashed into the Oxford database, as
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: one does, and discovered they've found it back in nineteen
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: sixty six when it started off as Black American slang,
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: and it was a contraction of bourgeois. So you were bougie.
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: The s the eest at the end, it may well be.
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: The Telegraph added, bogie has been a common expression. When
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: it was first coined in America, it was meant as
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: a disparaging expression, right. In other words, it was putting
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: you down because you thought you were better than other
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: people or whatever. And mind you, not all of the
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: dictionaries agree with that. The Cambridge says belonging to or
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: typical of the middle class, especially in giving a lot
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: of importance to money, education, social class, and in liking
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: or what expensive and unusual things. Mind you, the Urban Dictionary.
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: The Urban Dictionary thinks it's disparaging. The Urban Dictionary says
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: bougie means people pretending to or thinking they are high
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: class when they're really not and they don't realize it.
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: Sydney's bougie is hot spots for celebrities.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: There you go.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: So that was the headline they came up with, and
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: I looked at it and I thought, ah, I've got
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: the personal perfect person that running the rule over this one.
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: And there's a lovely line here in the Cambridge Dictionary
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: which says, quote oat milk, sawy milk, almond milk, bougie.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: People like any milk that doesn't actually come from a cow.
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: That's that's being bougie.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: All right, let me go. George's got something on this.
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: Hello George, Yeah, John, I know you like your soul music,
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: so it's thought. I I think you're talking about boogie
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: and kel that's correct.
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: But the very very well known and much.
• 2:36
  Speaker 5: Late seventies soul classified the pit's called Bougie.
• 2:41
  Speaker 6: Borgie, and that's exactly.
• 2:44
  Speaker 5: They were talking about that song. It's a classic song.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: Sydney's Bougie Bougie. This is Gladys Knight and the Pips
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: from the late seventies. Where might try and find a
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: bit of that if.
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: We can, Yeah, that'd be great. Yeah, because and I
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: presume what he's doing in the song is putting down people,
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: because at that time it was definitely meant a disparaging term.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: George's lines are a little bit dodgy, but we got
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: the message. Ye, we walk down and have a listen
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: to that one. Well done, Thank you so much for that.
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: One three one eight seven three is the number word
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: of the week. It's often a word, it's often just
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: a phrase. This week it's a phrase and I'm very interested.
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: Out of sorts. I mean, we all are occasionally out
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: of sort.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: Hey, feeling like kell I've been out of sorts?
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly like that, older than I would have thought.
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: Goes back to sixteen twenty one, covers a multitude of conditions,
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: both physical and mental. The Oxford that says it means
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: not in the usual normal condition of good health or spirits,
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: that kind of thing. But why sorts now? One theory
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: is talking about being in or out of sorts? Goes
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: back to the early days of printing, when type metal
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: type was set by hand, and you had two cases,
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: the top case with the upper coast letters in and
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: the bottom case with the lower case letters in, and
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: those metal letters, individual letters on metal were called sorts.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: When your case was getting low, if you've been setting
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: a lot, you were running out of sorts, and so
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: you couldn't keep typesetting because you were out of sorts.
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: There's a nice joke that Benjamin Franklin of all people,
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: makes because he was a printer, about being out of
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: sorts and referring to printer's type setting his sorts. So
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: that may well be the source of it.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Okay, all right, so there you go, out of sorts. Now.
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: Just Brian had this one I'm interested because I've got
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: a young man who I know well, Dave his Dragon Supporter,
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: lives in my area, and I know when he often,
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: usually when someone's dropped the ball on whatever, he goes, Oh,
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: spare me days. He's spare me days. It's a really
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: old expression, isn't it.
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: It's a very ies of you expression. It goes back
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: to about nineteen sixteen, which means it quite possibly was
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: born in the trenches. It may have begun as a
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: digger expression. There's a brilliant book I've got called Digger Dialects,
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: and I've got to admit I should have gone there,
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: and I didn't go there, but about nineteen sixteen. It
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: was originally it's sort of meant to be in a
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: expression of surprise. But it grows out of the fact
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: that the word spare originally meant protect protect me from injury.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: Oh really spare me So another words in a oh
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: you know the days again made if this is going on,
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  Speaker 2: Oh the days are getting to spare me days was
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: the idea, I don't want all this, don't inflict this
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  Speaker 2: on me, Spare me days. So that's what it grows
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  Speaker 2: out of.
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: Fantastic, all right, what I want to do is take
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: a break, come back in the moment. We've got people
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: on the line who want to talk to you directly.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: Kel got questions on the text line. We've got emails
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: as well, and I've got one from earlier in the
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: week and one of our programs that I harvested as well,
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: So I'm picking stuff up all week for you, so
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: we'll get a ruling as well. Where's my here it is.
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: I've got the ready to go very good at twenty
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: minutes past ten on three seven three is the number
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: of thanks to George with the Bogie Bougie, that song
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: from Gladys Knight and the Pipsica, A little bit of
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: the little bit of the chorus of that one, have
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: we here? It is? There it is, and they've just
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: adopted it a bit or adapted a bit with bougiists.
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: So there you go. All right, fantastic, Thank you so
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: much for.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: That, John, You and I and all the other baby
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: boomers listening. They've just learned something that we didn't know
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: we have.
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: Actually, yeah, and maybe a few genex's as well. I suspect.
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: Let's go to John. Hello, John.
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: Oh kel Hi, John seventy a seventy four IP fan
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: by the way.
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: Ah, all right, well all that music would have been
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: played on the Great four IP. Yes, yeah, color Radio
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: four IP wasn't.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: Wise home of the good guys.
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: Yes, you're a bit of a character. Back then your
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: voice wasn't as beautiful as it is now. But anyway, as.
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: I got it took. As I get older, both visually
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: and verbally, I get closer to George Cloning. It's just
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: the way it is.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: There, you go, all right, fantastic.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: Between Gympie and mirror Borough, they have bees roads signs
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: that are trivia questions on them. I always got the answer,
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: but I could never get the question because the sign
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: was hidden by a bit of tree. The word petreature, petriture.
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: I'm trying. I'm trying to stump you here.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: You want to get there?
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: This is like how do you spell it? I know
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: the answer, but I wanted to see if I could
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: get stump kill on it.
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm trying to pick it up, So how do
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: you spell it? E?
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  Speaker 3: E T R I C H O R.
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: Okay, I've got a feeling. Now I haven't opened up
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: the Oxford yet. I've got a feeling It is the
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: smell of coming rain. It's like the smell of the
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: dust and the coming rain when a rainstorm is approaching.
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: Am I getting close? Oh?
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  Speaker 3: Mate? A class plus he.
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: Didn't open his computer. I can verify it very good,
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: that's what it is.
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  Speaker 4: I see.
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: It's a wonderful word, isn't.
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  Speaker 3: I can't believe. I can't believe you got that?
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: So how would you use it? Petrature is the smell?
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: So so you could just you could be walking around
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  Speaker 1: with your mat petri.
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: Sure there was a whiff of petra. Sure there a whiff?
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: Is that a here's a John?
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: And it really is the case when rain is coming
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: you can often smell it. There was there was a
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: smell in the air, and I think it is dust
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: that's been stirred up by rain that's falling not too
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  Speaker 2: far away. And you can spell rain coming, can't you? John?
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, I didn't think there'd be a word for that.
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's wonderful that there is.
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  Speaker 1: Can we write it down?
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  Speaker 3: I'll tell you what, mane. That's I'm just beside myself
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: that you got it. That's good enough for me.
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: Very good mate, that I looked it up A long,
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: long time ago, ten, ten, fifteen years ago, and suddenly
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: that brain cell opened and reminded me of what it was.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: All right, look and look, thank you for very much, John.
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: And in fact we've got David's senses a note petriture, smell
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: of wet roads. So that's what we're talking about here.
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: And I can verify this because over the years on
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: radio there have been people who've had armies of researchers
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: and so when someone asks the question, they go no,
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: I think about that, and the answers to being provided.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: But kel had nothing, nothing open, nothing, So well done,
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: very good.
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: I'm still looking at poop. That's what I've got to
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: open on my computer.
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: Well, lang on, you've given this away, so can we
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: This came Look, this was a couple of days ago,
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: and I know this happens. I reckon every few months.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: Somewhere in the country. There's a debate, there's an argument.
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: There's a dispute over people picking up after their dogs,
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: and it can they're variations of whether they should be
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: putting it in people's bins, whether people do the fake
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: pick up, what you do with the stuff that's in
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: the bags. But the concern that one of our listeners
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: and Clinton Maynard was dealing with this on the Drive
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: Show and he was taught with the concern of one
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: of our listeners was not about the issue, but more
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: about the language that Maynard had used to have a listen.
• 9:56
  Speaker 7: I'm in trouble with Danny. So Danny's just sent a
• 9:58
  Speaker 7: text business saying it's dog poo. Pop is American? Please
• 10:01
  Speaker 7: only use the word pooh. I was trying to actually
• 10:04
  Speaker 7: censor myself there. I thought maybe poop was an easier
• 10:07
  Speaker 7: way of getting away with saying pooh. Okay, Danny, I'll
• 10:09
  Speaker 7: stick to it.
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: Dog pooh.
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: He said it all there, so we have poop and pooh.
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: But poop is pup American?
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: No, No, it's British. Recorded from eighteen ninety. It comes
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: from a Germanic source word quite common in Germanic languages,
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: and it always means the same thing, defication, although it's
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: got two meanings. It either means defication or it means
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: breaking wind, so the meanings are very tasteful. But there's
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: there's similar words in Afrikaans and Dutch and so on,
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: so it comes from a Germanic background. It's British, it's
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: not American, so you know no problem. Clinton is allowed
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: to hear.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: He's right, and the fellow that took him to task
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: is wrong.
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: The man who said it was American is wrong.
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: Very good. You mentioned an excellent word there, because sometimes
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: I'll find myself, you know, when you're something egregious happens.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: That's a great word itself. So something happens and you
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: want to say that, it's usually a politician has and
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: you want to say they have sahat, I might say
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: it on their constituents. Yes, And so I said, well,
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: they've defecated on their constituents, and I think that's actually even.
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: It's actually got a bit of a bit of style
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: about it, and that's what they have actually done.
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: It's a very powerful way of saying it because no
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: one can complain you're using bad language because you're not.
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: But what you're saying is something very and you're saying
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: it in a classy way. So keep it up, John,
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: Very good.
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: Very good. Now, Tom is when I said pedants, start
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: your engines at the start of this hour. One of
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: my favorite pedants who textas is Tom now, and he's
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: raised something that I've said a lot. I said, I'm
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: beside myself I've got to say, I'm beside myself. Now.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: Our fellow who has got their answer, said he was
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: beside himself. Tom says, I hope you should have replied,
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: I hope you both enjoy the rest of the night.
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: But that's an interesting expression, isn't it.
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: We have talked about this once before, and it goes
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: back to the idea that somehow, rather you'reitor, your soul
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: gets so distressed it sort of exits your body and
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: parks itself beside you. It goes so it goes back
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: to the Middle Ages, goes back a long way. But
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: it's that kind of idea that I'm so distressed, I'm
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: beside myself.
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, And can.
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: I say with Formula one racing, they used to say, gentlemen,
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: start your engines, and because we have to have gender
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: non specific terms, and us drivers start your engines. And
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: I think it's not as good.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but what's going to happen when because there are
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: women who are driving, And in fact we've had this
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: conversation actually in the same way that it's taken a
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: long time. Now we have probably the best riders in
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: the country, a couple two or three this Jamie Carr
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: James MacDonald. It's logical that women would be as good
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: as jockeys as men because especially because of the weight
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: issue and the way they ride the horses. That reason
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: why women would be able to be as good as
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: a Formula one driver as a male.
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: It depends entirely on how much strength is involved, because
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: if you've got a Y chromosome, on average, people with
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: Y chromosomes tend to be like larger, faster, and stronger
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: than people who lack a WHY chromosome. And I don't
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: know how much strength is involved in driving the Formula one.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: Come with the driving, it's well, I mean there's a
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: bit of endurance, but it's also very much a I
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: think it's a skill thing. Oh waka, I think we
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: might raise it in the Formula one report. We do
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: that later in the week. That most interesting, But it
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: is gentlemen, start your engine or pittance start your engage.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: And there was a lovely that said, a shivered awn
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: your spine, didn't a gentleman start your engines? Exit and
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: those huge thunderous engines would start.
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: Exactly all right, Let's go to Oh, Brian's got a
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: beauty here? Hello Brian?
• 13:35
  Speaker 6: Yeah, good, evening Collen John Hi hi uh with my
• 13:39
  Speaker 6: girlfriend on the weekend and she said jump in Jehosaph.
• 13:42
  Speaker 6: Brief conversation, we don't know who Jehosaphat is and what
• 13:45
  Speaker 6: he was jumping.
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: Okay, it's it's what's called a softened blasphemy. People were
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: saying expressions like that in order to avoid using the
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: names of God or Jesus in blasphemous expressions. Jehosaphat was
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: a prophet in the old test to it. I think
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: the jumping part was simply added as a kind of
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: alliterative thing jj, nothing more than that, and it was
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: invented in order to express surprise and without blaspheming, so
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: that when it comes from the eighteen hundreds.
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: There's so many of those.
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: Well, the world is full of them because we went
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: through a period when, particularly the Victorian news, when people
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: were very sensitive about blasphemy, and they kept inventing all
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: kinds of things.
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: Right, very good jumping Jehosaph. Fact, yeah, it was, because
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: that's not like the It was the cartoon where you had,
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: oh there's one where there was an expression and now
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: it's gone out of my head. It might have been
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: Foggorn leghorn or someone used to say something like that.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: But jump in Jehoseph and I'll try and remember what
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: it was. I've got a few on the text line
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: here book Toney's talking about Peter Landy's saying rugby league
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: is rugby league, which is probably just the way he speaks,
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: but it's actually now become endearing. People actually now referred
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: to it as rugby league. That's the way he says
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: the league.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: Yes, I remember Neville Ran turned the word police into
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: a one syllable word. It was always please, please, please please.
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: Now the saying I like the cut of his jib.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: This is I like the cut of.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: His jib from sailing, from the idea that the jib
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: is the front sail on a sailing ship of the triangut,
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: a sign right at the front. That's the jib. And
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: if you've got a really well rigged ship, then then
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: it's really well set up. And you like the cut
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: of his jib.
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: Ye codswallop.
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've talked about this and looked up lots of things.
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: That's there's all kinds of stories about this. There was
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: a mister Cod who was one of the earliest bottlers
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: of soft drink, and he used to. In fact, he
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: was famous because he used to seal them with a
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: round glass marble, And so little boys then proceeded to
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: break the marble out of the bottle top so they
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: could play marbles with them. But it was now it
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: wasn't It wasn't an alcoholic drink, so it was regarded
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: as not as good. It was wallop, and it was
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: made by mister Coyd. It was Cod's wallop. That's the
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: popular story. The dates don't actually fit. It's a lovely story,
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: and I wish it was true, but it appears not
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: to be true. It's probably just a jocular nonsense invention
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: saying this is nonsense, and the stories all came along later.
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, kill a brown dog. It would kill a brown dog.
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: Or something that's really bad. A bad smell, a bad taste,
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: bad enough to kill a brown dog. Why a brown dog,
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Why black or white dogs would be
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: immune is beyond me. I really, I really can't cast
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: a lot of light on that.
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Doug is asking this one about hard liquor. So
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: we talk about hard liquor. We understand strong liquor, but
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: hard liquor has because that's A, and I'm assuming the
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: hard liquor is maybe A. I would assume that's a
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: reference to spirits as opposed to wine or beer.
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: I think it's simply a reference to alcohol, because soft
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: drinks are non alcoholic. Yeah, so once it's got alcohol
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: in it's it's hard licor it's a hard drink rather
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: than a soft drinks. In other words, it's to do
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: with her. It's safe for children and adults.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Yosemite, Sam was the person I was thinking of.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: But I've got what was the refrain that you sementy Sam?
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: It wasn't jump and jojosaphats, it was something else, I think,
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: So thank you very much for that. Yeah, suffering sacotash.
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: Thank you, suffern succotash. That was a great one, which
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: was Yosemite Sam. Denise is saying this. She sends a
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: text here saying crescendo is a lovely musical word. She
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: puts in a couple of I think that's my wife. Hope,
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: my wife's not listening. Which is a Is that a crotchet? No? Anyway, Okay.
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: Sacotash, by the way, is a dish of corn and
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: beans cooked together. The name for it comes from a
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: North American Indian word or Native American word known in
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: America from the late seventeen and suffering suckertash is just
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: one of these illiterative things that makes it sound like fun.
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, we're going to go down because someone say,
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: I think that was snuggle puss?
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: Was it a snaggle puss?
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: Snaggle puss? And then we've got your seventy said, I'm
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: going to try and pull these together in a moment.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: So because there was snagglepuss, wasn't that snaggle puss?
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: Exit stage right, stage left, even Yeah, exactly.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: All right, let's take a break, come back in the moment.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: We've got more to do here and plenty of questions
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: that have come in during the week. We're talking words
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: and language here with Kel Richards at twenty three minutes
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: to eleven. Yes, Christunda means so, it means gradually louder.
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: A few people have said that I played the viola
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: many years ago and that would be beautiful to play.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: To get hold of that. Also, Sylvester the Cat. Quite
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: a few people are saying thank you on the text
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: line and also on email. Suffering suck atash was said
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: by Sylvester the cat and Snagglepus was heavens to Murgatroyd.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: Steve's on the line, is that what you're saying to us?
• 18:58
  Speaker 4: Steve, Yeah, I believe that suffering sacotash was what they
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: call a minced metaphor, so instead of blaspheeming was a
• 19:13
  Speaker 4: metophour for suffering Jesus.
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: So it's in that basket we've talked about kill all
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: those expressions where they're they're sort of substituting words.
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: It's a bit hard to know. One of the reasons
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: is that there's a number of these expressions, and I
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: think heavens to Murgatroyd would be one of them that
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: were actually invented by Hollywood writers of cartoons sitting around
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: a table and saying we need we need a saying
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: for this bloke to come up with. What's he going
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: to say? This guy, this guy's got to have something
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: to say, what are we and tossing ideas around them
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: coming up with phrases. So a whole lot of the
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: phrases can only be traced back to their cartoon characters.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: So they were actually coined in the first place by
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: the writers of those cartoons. They came out of you know,
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: I don't no longer boozy something.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it'd be lots of fun all. Thank you, Steve.
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: That's really interesting because and we've got off the usual
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: tangent we go on. Here we've got someone saying this
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: is Colin not quite the same as yes, Sandriti Sam.
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: But Captain Haddock, the sea captain friend of Tin Tin
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: used to say thundering typhoons and blistering barnacles whenever he
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: was annoyed about.
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: Something, and if it got really bad, it was thousands
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: of thundering typhoons.
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: I think, yes, yeah, and look this is uh is Algernon.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: I think your fine sylvest of the cat. Yeah, and
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: you're seventy sound you varmint And galute. Galute is a
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: great word, isn't it? Galute?
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: Yes, and I think it's a real word. I'm just
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: very quickly flicking at an awkward or uncouth fellow. Is
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: a goalute. It goes back to eighty o eight and
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: they and the Oxford says its origin is unknown, but
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: they suspect it started in the navy, the British Navy.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Snaggle puts heavens to Murgatroyd. So I guess that.
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: That's again we're talking mate, all that stuff.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Thomas just checked here. Hard liquor consensus is it's
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: distilled spirit like vodka, Jim Run whiskey and tequila which
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: got a high alcohol contrayt soft liquors of beer and wine.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: So that makes sense.
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that would make sense. That would make sense.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, Oh what he's saying here, he got here,
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: very very good. Someone's just sending me a note about
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: the his battle, like in knocking up the Powerball numbers tonight.
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: I think in the end, well, it's a hundred million
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: dollars next Thursday, so you have another crack in the
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: then Gen's called in with one, which well, let's throw
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: it up to the jury.
• 21:34
  Speaker 5: Hello, Jen, Hi John high cow By my word, I
• 21:42
  Speaker 5: used to say fuck in the eighties.
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: A cocoa, yep iffing a cocoa.
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: Never heard it, never ever heard it? In what context?
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: What did she what was? Did she mean it to mean?
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: What?
• 22:00
  Speaker 6: I don't.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Was she was? She was she editing the effing bit
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: for meaning something else? Do you think maybe.
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: So?
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: Was she saying it which she was angry or irritated?
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: Or was it meant to be flippant, she was angry, irritated.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: Okay, that might be one that they've just invented themselves.
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: And there are a number of sayings. When I did
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: that research for language around Australia regional dialects, a lot
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: of sayings are just family sayings and they're just cooked
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: up in the family. Everyone in the family knows them
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: and everyone in the family says them, but outside the
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: family they're completely unknown. This may well be one of
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: those most interesting.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: All right, look, thank you, but if anyone knows, if
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: anyone's heard it, otherwise it would be likely to be
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: something as you say, just within.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: I did a book called word Map which I did
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: with the together with the Macaura Dictionary, which which picks
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: up a whole lot of these things about it around Australia,
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: and we had people nominate things on a website and
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: a lot of people nominated really interesting expressions else ever
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: heard of because they were family express.
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: Within their own family. Yes, really really interesting. Galuse I
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: love that word galute jumping Stanley, someone's saying so very good.
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: Never heard that?
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: No, never very good. Please don't do that to me.
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: Now there's a couple that we've got as homework or
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: emails that have come in. One of them is people
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: talk about someone colliding with a tree, and I thought
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: collide meant that both subjects had to be moving and
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: people are always scrambling to rescue survivors. So this is
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: just a couple of different ones there. So what do
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: you make of those?
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: Okay, their complaints about what journalists do. The one about
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: you can't use collide unless both objects are moving is
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: one of the great myths of journalists. On every young
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: journalist comes in and if it writes a story about
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: a car colliding with a tree, and some smart old
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: journalists so a sun sogn the word is allied. Collide
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: only means when both objects are moving. Now there's a
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: grain of truth in it. When they started it applied
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: to maritime law and ships at sea, if two ships
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: were in motion and hit one another, they collided, and
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: if one of them was in motion and not the other,
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: they alided. But in fact, in common English that passed
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: away centuries ago, and colliding can be applied to any impact.
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: So when that smart ole journalist in the newsroom says,
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: you can't say collide because the tree wasn't moving, telling
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: him is wrong you can. It's perfectly okay. The other
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: one he was talking about was scrambling. He complained about
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: after an earthquake or a natural disaster, there are rescue
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: workers scrambling to find survivors. The word scramble literally means
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: to move hastily and in disorder. Now, I think it's
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: a pointless journalistic cruiser, a cliche, because eggs can be scrambled,
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: not rescues. Rescues are often really well organized, very systematic,
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: and so the one thing they're not is a scramble.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: Very good. Now, for Notre Dame Notre Dame.
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: So okay, it's Notre Dame in France, and most English
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: speakers would say Notre Dame.
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: The Americans say no to day they say Notre Dame.
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, and we say Notre Dame.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: Because they've got their very famous college, haven't they.
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: They've got Notre Dame, Notre Dame University, which is one
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: of the great universities in America. So, and it's theirs.
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: They can pronounce it anyhow any way they want. It's
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: just that they're wrong. They're Americans.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: It's their college and then university I can call it.
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: They can describe it the way they want to, can't they?
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: Or you're going to turn up at their.
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: And correct them all? Not not when their football teams
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: just want a big match.
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: Now, all right, so look, I think we've we've got
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: we've got three and a half years left. I think
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: we're going to raise a collection of basically a couple
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: of months accommodation. If is you can look after him,
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: get in the accreditation. I want you to be in
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: that White House press room and start correcting Donald Trump. No, no,
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: mister president, kel Richards from Kel Richards from the Channel
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: nine radio network. You're actually pronouncing that I've got a
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: problem with the policy, but you're not saying it correctly.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: Can I just explain? I'd love that to have.
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: You know how long I'd survived. Donald does not take
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: correction well.
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: Exactly, So it would be entertaining, though, wouldn't it.
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: For about ten seconds after us? For you? It would
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: be not for me?
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: Okay, all right, Well I can think about it. Neil
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: twelve to eleven. Now there's just three that I don't have.
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: They're linked hoon goon and hooliganism. So I don't know
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: hoon goon, hooligan, hooliganism.
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: The officially they're not too sure where the word hohon
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: came from. It's common in Australia, also common in New Zealand,
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: but not known outside this country. I made of mine
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: was driving an English friend of his around Melbourne once
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: and some raced across the front of him in his
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: car and my friend said, oh, look at that hoon,
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: and the Englishman was totally baffled. I had no idea
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: what he was talking about. There have been lots of
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: guests guesses is what it as to what it came from.
• 27:17
  Speaker 2: Maybe Goon was the start of it. That's a possibility.
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: But one of the other suggestions is it comes from
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: the creatures in Galliva's travels called the Winhams spelt hou,
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: so the idea that the Winhems, but the Winhams are
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: very good characters in Gallova's travel so that seems unlikely.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: The goon story goes back to only to the nineteen twenties.
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: There's no real clarity as to where it came from.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: The suggestion that the Oxford people came up with is
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: they think it might have started off with being someone's
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: surname and it was picked and it was used. There
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: was an America a cartoonist who drew a cartoon called
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: Alice Dagoon, which was popular for a long time, and
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: she was fairly dumb apparently, so that that probably put
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: it into circulation. But the actual source of the that
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: gw N name is really unclear.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: All right, very interesting, and look, I've got where is it?
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: I mentioned galute one of our texts, just saying Ray
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: used to use it. Ray Hadley called Don haw And
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: a galute one of his rants, and he's look he
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: actually well, my former colleague James Willis were playing at
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: Massy Park one day and someone took a photo and
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: sent it to the Great Man and we were described
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: as a pair of galutes because we were I think
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: we were struggling that day and someone sent him a
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: send him a scorecard. So anyway, so that is a
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: great expression galute. I guess not that offensive, is it? Galte?
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: No? No, no, it wouldn't be actionable. I mean it
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: started off as navy slang. It's not dreadful.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: All right, Debra, you've got one for us, have your yes.
• 29:01
  Speaker 6: Yes.
• 29:03
  Speaker 8: My sister and I were talking today. I rang about
• 29:05
  Speaker 8: a year or so ago about we were laughing about something.
• 29:09
  Speaker 8: My mum used to say when we worked up for
• 29:11
  Speaker 8: crying out for sink.
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: For crying down the seat.
• 29:15
  Speaker 8: Or I actually got the answer to what that actually means.
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: Say the expression again.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: For crying out for seak, for crying down the seat.
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: You know you talk about it for crying out loud.
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's obviously a variation on crying out.
• 29:30
  Speaker 8: Loud whenever we barked up for crying out for sink.
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: Obviously, it seems to me she was intending to shed
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: a huge number of tears and needed an open plughole
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: to cry over. But it's not an expression I have
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: ever heard before. I'm going to write it down and
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: see if I can do a bit of research on
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: that one.
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: For this it's a possible, Deborah. It's one of those
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: ones where your mum kind of adapted it for her
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: own use for your family.
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: Oh no, she said it was an English then, right, Okay.
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: Anyway, I've written it down in the notebook. I'll do
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: a bit of digging.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: Okay, very good, There you go. We'll find out what
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: the story is in relation to that one, because often
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: and we often get feedback from other people who have
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: actually used it themselves.
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: The best research team we have for your listeners.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: Okay, all right, Debora, Kel's going to have a look
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: at that one and see if you can find anything.
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: We were mentioning terms that what Ray used to use,
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: continuous call tom. This is one Daryl's raised and I
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: know they did it brew haha, which is brew haha.
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: It's great word, yeah, better around since eighteen ninety comes
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: from an exactly similar French word, which was written and
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: sounded the same. And the French word means commotion. Some
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: experts say it started in the French medieval theater, when
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: it was used as a cry uttered by the devil
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: when he leapt onto the stage, threatening to bring commotion
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: to the scene. Now, if that's correct, it was probably
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: an invented word, coined by an actor or a playwright
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: to sound threatening or something like that. But from the French.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: In English and still with us, all.
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: Right, look, there's a pile of things here. I just
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: want to touch on a couple. This is no brainer,
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: which we often use where you say okay, it's a
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: no brainer, so as in this is something should know
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: that answered that one.
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: The listener who wrote to us Martin was concerned that
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: it was an offensive expression. We're saying there are some
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: people with no brains, and he mentioned in bracket someone
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: by the name of Joe Biden, whoever that may be.
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: And I can reassure Martin it's not an offensive expression
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: because it's not about people. It's about ideas. It's not
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: people that are no brainers. It's ideas that are no brainer.
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: So it just means something very obvious coined in America
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: not all that long ago, nineteen fifties, to say this
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: is so obvious it stands out you don't need to
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: engage the brain to understand it. So Martin relaxed. It
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: is not offensive.
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: It's one of my former colleagues here used to describe
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: people as brain dead, which I think is a pejorative term,
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: and I think it's pretty He's basically saying the blakes,
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: yeah stupid or the person stupid. So anyway, we won't
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: go to that one anymore. And look, abstropolis, abstropolis. That's
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: a lovely word, abstropolis. And I've only got maybe can
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: we save it to next week. I've only got twenty seconds, Like.
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: I can do it in twenty seconds. It's older than
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: you might think. Recorded seventeen twenty seven, appears to be
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: a jocular comic variation of an other word obstreperous, which
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: is older, comes from a Latin source word meaning troublesome.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: The Oxford says obstropolis originally meant having an obstreperous mouth.
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: So there you are.
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: There you go, all right, Kel will do it again
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: next week. Thank you.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: Talk to you there,