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Elon Musk Neuralink Update · Elon Musk Podcast

0:03
Welcome, I hope this is working. Welcome to neural link up live
0:10
update. We're going to tell you about
0:13
the progress of the first patient with neural link and
0:19
sort of your recap of of the progress there.
0:23
Then talk about what changes we were making for the second
0:27
patient, which we're hoping to do an implant in the next week
0:31
or so. And this is for our first
0:33
product, which is called Telepathy, which enables you to
0:36
control a computer or a phone just by thinking.
0:39
So let's in fact. So we'll start off with just
0:42
some introductions. DJ you want to start?
0:44
Hi everyone, my name is DJ Saul. I'm an electrical engineer and a
0:47
chip designer. By training I led the design of
0:51
first several generations of the neural link implant.
0:55
Currently I was on the founding team and currently a president.
0:59
I'm Matthew McDougal. I'm a practicing neurosurgeon
1:02
and head of Neurosurgery at Neurolink.
1:05
Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, head of branding
1:08
interfaces applications. And I'm bliss.
1:11
I'm a software engineer at Neurolink trying to figure out
1:12
how to turn brand activity into cool stuff in the world.
1:16
All right. Thank you.
1:16
Well, let's see. So we'll just get going into the
1:19
presentation. So our first product is sort of
1:25
like I said, we call telepathy, which is enables the person with
1:30
Neuralink implant to control their phone or computer just by
1:33
thinking. And once you can control your
1:35
phone or computer, you can essentially control almost
1:37
anything just and literally just by thinking.
1:39
So there's no eye tracking or anything.
1:42
It is purely, purely your thoughts.
1:46
So this is really quite, quite a profound device that can help a
1:52
lot of people who have lost the connection between their, their
1:55
brain and body. So imagine people like Stephen
2:00
Hawking, who you know, if imagine if he, if he could
2:04
communicate at the same speed as someone who had still had the
2:06
connection to their brain and body.
2:08
So it's really something that can help millions of people
2:13
around the world. And it's a, it's part of our
2:16
overall goal of enabling a very high bandwidth connection
2:21
between the brain and, and your and the rest of the world and
2:25
your computers. The long term goal to which
2:28
sounds a little esoteric, is to mitigate the the risk of, of the
2:33
civil civilizational risk of AI by having a sort of closer
2:40
biosis between human intelligence and digital
2:43
intelligence. But that, that'll take many
2:46
years along the way, we're, we're going to help solve a lot
2:50
of brain injury or spinal injury issues.
2:55
So, and then with our first product apathy, that's, that's
3:00
going to be really quite profound that there is also
3:04
potential long term for bridging the gaps or if there are damaged
3:09
or severed neurons being able to span the gap between the brain's
3:14
motor cortex to the spine to enable someone to use their body
3:18
again. I think that would be very
3:20
exciting. And it's, you know, that that is
3:24
something that is possible in the long term.
3:29
And then our second product, which we've demonstrated to work
3:34
with monkeys is Blind side, which would enable someone who
3:38
is completely blind or lost both eyes or completely lost their
3:42
optic nerve to be able to see. So that's that's something that
3:48
we hope to demonstrate in the future.
3:55
So let's just give you a sense of what the device is a way to
3:59
think about the neural link device is kind of like a a
4:01
Fitbit or an Apple Watch with with tiny wires or electrodes.
4:06
Those those tiny wires are implanted in the in the brain
4:10
and they read and write electrical signals.
4:14
So a lot of people think the brain is incredibly mysterious
4:19
thing. It's it, it is mysterious in a
4:21
lot of ways, but but it is actually, it does operate with
4:24
like electrical signals. So if you can read and write
4:26
those electrical signals, you can interface with the brain and
4:31
the devices is sized so that it is the same size as the as the
4:37
piece of skull that is removed. So if it's like a few
4:40
centimeters diameter of skull that's removed.
4:43
We replaced that with the device after implanting the tiny wires
4:48
with a surgical robot and that enables read write capability to
4:53
the neurons. Completely wirelessly.
4:55
Yeah, yes, exactly. It's completely wirelessly.
4:58
So like, I, I could, I could have a neural link right now,
5:02
you wouldn't know. And it it charges inductively.
5:06
So you could just basically have an electromagnetic ad that that
5:12
you charge the device with. So yeah, it's like an Apple
5:15
Watch. Exactly so.
5:17
Except that it's actually a much harder technical a challenge to
5:21
solve, given that there's limit as to how much heat the brain
5:24
tissue whereas in for. Phones and have a hot watch you
5:27
don't really care how much if. It's sitting on a table.
5:29
Sure. Yeah, it's also it's got to go
5:32
through scan and stuff as well in our case.
5:33
So it's, it is a tougher challenge to to charge and to if
5:39
I bandwidth communications given that it's got to go through skin
5:42
and hair and stuff. We have solved it.
5:44
We have solved it, yeah. So yeah.
5:49
Yeah. So our first step with the
5:51
telepathy is basically to unlock digital independence for people
5:57
with policies and to allow them control the computer just with
6:01
their mind without moving the body.
6:03
And our goal is to provide them the same level of control,
6:07
functionality and reliability that I have when I'm using a
6:10
computer, even better than the level of control I have.
6:13
And it's not a high bar. For you, just to be clear, this
6:17
guy, he's controlling this with his brain, so he's not like you
6:20
can't see his hands in this video, but he's not using a
6:23
mouse and keyboard. Just, you know, thinking about
6:25
how to move the cursor and playing Civilization.
6:27
No eye tracker. Right, there's no eye tracking
6:29
from I. Mean.
6:30
He's lost. He's like this is.
6:32
Watch this on. Twitter just thinking that's it
6:33
just. Thinking like just a couple
6:35
days. Cursor move here.
6:36
Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is like the last night or
6:38
two nights ago something. Yeah.
6:40
I think I think the way he also described it is he's using the.
6:43
Yeah. He has many more videos on his
6:46
on the platform. Definitely check them out.
6:50
Yeah, so you can string that live and also can talk and like
6:53
move his head without a problem multi time.
6:56
Yeah, you guys like if you join this live stream, you can ask
6:58
him questions, he'll he'll tell you all about what it's like to.
7:02
Also I think I haven't played Civilization myself, but I think
7:06
this is actually not easy mode. This is expert mode.
7:08
This is Emperor mode. Emperor mode if you have played
7:10
sift emperor mode. It's like the highest difficulty
7:12
level. The point is like this is a
7:13
commonly demanding task while live streaming, playing the
7:16
hardest mode of team and he's able to do that while moving.
7:19
Talking, engaging with you know the audience while playing.
7:24
One of the other games he likes to play a lot is chess.
7:27
I think it gets lost sometimes that he's actually playing
7:29
speed. Chess against me, yeah.
7:31
Which requires an incredibly high fidelity degree of control
7:36
and speed of control in order to be able to win.
7:43
So also another cool stuff about about our device is that we can
7:46
use it anywhere, anytime, also on a plane, during a flight,
7:50
while creating really cool means of care.
7:55
Also, our device unlocks things that previously were impossible
8:00
for our participants. For example, we're able to
8:03
connect him to his gaming consoles, which they Mario Kart
8:07
with friends and family and it was lovely to see them playing
8:10
together after years, but he couldn't do it since he's
8:14
injured. Imagine if you're sitting
8:16
umbrella over from the sky on a plane.
8:19
You look over, he's making a cat meme.
8:22
No hands, no movement. Yeah.
8:25
Live in a real world. Yeah, it's strange, strange
8:27
time. Yeah.
8:30
And he loves using the device and using independently daily to
8:34
watch videos, read, play games using the browser.
8:40
And the key metrics that we care is to make sure our device is
8:44
actually useful is to is basically the amount of hours
8:46
you use the device daily and weekly.
8:49
And we track it weekly since the since the surgery and on weeks
8:53
that he's not too busy and not travelling, he can even reach 70
8:57
hours of using the device a week.
9:00
This is amazing. And he would of course love to
9:03
use it more, but need to run resource sessions, he needs to
9:08
sleep sometimes and also of course to charge the device once
9:10
in a while. Hopefully we'll improve that
9:12
over time, I think. That maybe not obvious to people
9:15
who are watching this. Like it's a normal MacBook he's
9:17
controlling. This isn't like some limited
9:19
edition thing where there's only a few options like he can just
9:21
do anything that you can do on a MacBook Pro.
9:23
Same one I have on my desk. Actually, it's the exact same
9:25
one. And maybe another interesting
9:30
point is that on the first day he used BCI brain control, he
9:36
was able to break the previous world record for cursor control
9:40
is by using the brain. And recently he even doubled it
9:44
and was able to outperform about 10% of our engineered neurolink.
9:49
And you can be sure that we are very good in this game and very
9:52
quick. And if you want to check out how
9:54
well, how well you can do it, you can do it on our website.
9:58
And it's very addictive games. Yeah, it's a very simple game.
10:02
You just have to click on the square.
10:03
But but it's it's it's it's actually, even though it sounds
10:08
silly, it's it's quite a yeah, it can be quite a, it sounds
10:12
like it could be quite addictive.
10:13
And it's especially if you get a low score and you think there's
10:16
no way I got to. So I, I mean, anyone who wants
10:19
to try this, I recommend going to theneurolink.com website and
10:23
seeing, seeing if you can beat Nolan's record.
10:25
And it's that you will find that's actually quite difficult
10:27
to do so. And this is really with version
10:31
one of the device and with only a small percentage of the
10:34
electrodes that are that are working.
10:36
So this is, this is really just the beginning, but even the
10:40
beginning is twice as good as the world record.
10:43
This is important to emphasize the, you know, the media has a
10:48
habit of of saying that the glass is 10% empty, but but
10:53
actually it's 90% full. So I think it's really quite an
10:57
accomplishment of the neural link team to have achieved with
11:00
first with the first patient, the first device twice the world
11:05
record for the range computer bandwidth.
11:09
That's really an astonishing, an amazingly great outcome and it's
11:16
only going to be get better from here.
11:17
So the potential is to ultimately get, I think to
11:21
megabit level. So that's, that's part of the
11:26
long term goal of, of improving the, the bandwidth of the brain
11:29
computer interface. If you think about like how low
11:33
the bandwidth normally is between a human and a device,
11:36
it's the average bandwidth is extremely low.
11:38
It's it's, I said less than one bit per second over the course
11:43
of a day. If there are 86,400 seconds in a
11:45
day, you're outputting less than that number of bits to any any
11:50
given device except in perhaps very rare circumstances.
11:54
So the this is actually quite important for for AI, you know,
12:05
basically for for human AI, symbiosis is just being able to
12:11
communicate at A at a speed. Yeah, I can follow.
12:19
So yeah, just to emphasize again, he's performing at this
12:23
extremely high level with about 15% of his channels functional.
12:30
And so we want to mitigate any of the problems that led to that
12:33
situation. So, you know, the brain is a
12:37
fascinating organ. Share with you some of the
12:39
secrets about the brain. During any typical brain
12:42
surgery, a small amount of air is introduced into the skull.
12:47
That's because neurosurgeons like to have as much room as
12:50
possible around the brain. And so there's this little known
12:54
control mechanism of allowing the CO2 concentration in the
13:01
blood to rise a bit, which allows the brain to either
13:06
expand or contract depending on where you target that CO2.
13:10
But typically neurosurgeons will have the brain shrink by
13:13
lowering CO2. What we're going to do in our
13:16
future surgeries is keep the CO2 concentration actually quite
13:20
normal, maybe even slightly elevated, and that'll allow the
13:23
brain to stay its normal size and shape during surgery.
13:26
That should eliminate this air pocket that we saw in the first
13:29
participant. Now that air pocket we think may
13:32
have contributed to eating up some of the thread slack as as
13:37
the air bubble migrated to be under the implant, push the
13:40
brain away from the implant. And so that's easy enough to
13:44
fix. Another consideration that we
13:48
want to focus on for our upcoming participants is that
13:54
the brain, think of it like a really complex folded onion.
13:57
It's layer upon layer of sheets of neurons all over the surface
14:02
of the brain folded into this, you know, odd looking shape.
14:08
The folds of the brain travel down deep into the brain and and
14:12
along with it go those onion layers of neurons.
14:16
And if we insert very close to one of the folds where there may
14:20
be very useful information encoded in neurons, we may end
14:24
up travelling with our threads parallel to some of the layers
14:28
of neurons that we're most interested in, avoiding them
14:30
entirely. To avoid that possibility, we're
14:33
going to insert in our future participants more close to the
14:37
middle of the apex of the folds, ensuring that we're crossing the
14:43
layers of interest, layer five of the cortex.
14:45
I also think that it's important to highlight here those tiny
14:50
wires that Elon mentioned, They're fraction of a human
14:53
hair. They're very flexible,
14:55
intentionally so, because brains constantly moving and you want
14:59
the electrodes to be moving with the brain, causing less of the
15:02
scarring. And it's actually impossible for
15:07
a human neurosurgeon, however talented Matthew is to actually
15:10
maneuver them by. So we have a surgical robot that
15:13
we built that can actually precisely target them in any
15:16
three-dimensional space, XY as well as Z with Micron level
15:19
precision while avoiding vasculature so that you don't
15:21
disrupt the the and and cause immune response from happening.
15:25
So we we actually have the technology to be able to place
15:28
them exactly where we want them in three.
15:31
Yeah, it was truly amazing to see the surface of the brain
15:34
after the robot had inserted all the electrodes on the 1st
15:37
participant without a drop of blood.
15:39
Insight. It's really quite an
15:42
achievement. Yes, something that probably
15:45
most people don't realize is that the the brain appears to be
15:48
sort of somewhat undifferentiated.
15:50
So if you look at the cortex, it looks like a whole bunch of
15:53
folds that where, you know, maybe like it's, it's, it's not
15:58
obvious. Just looking at a take a picture
15:59
of the brain that, that, that it's the brain is highly
16:02
differentiated. That there's you pretty much
16:06
know exactly where the part of the brain is that controls your
16:10
right hand and your left hand and your leg and that kind of
16:13
thing or vision. It's actually quite precisely
16:19
located. It's not some people like might
16:23
think, look at the brain like, oh, it could be, it could be
16:24
anywhere. But actually we it's your brain
16:28
is highly differentiated, even though it doesn't look it's
16:33
yeah. Do you want to describe how we
16:35
actually where like how we identify where to drill the?
16:38
So we can we can put a patient that is considering this implant
16:44
into an F MRI, so functional magnetic resonance imaging
16:47
machine and ask them to imagine hand movements that you know,
16:51
because of the spinal cord injury don't happen.
16:54
But just imagining those hand movements causes these areas of
16:57
the brain to light up in the F MRI scanner.
17:00
And so we have a pretty good idea based in, in fact, for each
17:05
individual participant, which part of their brain is going to,
17:10
you know, respond to imagined movements of the hand.
17:14
And so we can map those imagined movements, much as we all do
17:17
when moving a mouse to controlling a cursor on a
17:20
screen, even without the use of a mouse.
17:24
Yeah. But anyway, I think it's kind of
17:26
an important point that like, it's not like you're the part of
17:29
your brain that controls your hand might be anywhere in the
17:31
cortex. It's this is not the case.
17:33
It's going to be in a very specific region and it's going
17:35
to be extremely common across people.
17:38
Precision is key too. Yeah, the left-handed,
17:43
right-handed in my mind too. Like if you're right-handed, you
17:46
want the device on the left side.
17:48
Yeah, the lateral side to the hand, that's dominant.
17:51
Yeah, the left side of your brain controls right side of
17:53
your. Body.
17:53
Yeah. Everything's crossed, yeah.
17:55
Another of the risk mitigations we're looking at in the future
17:59
is that, you know that the implant has a certain size, the
18:02
depth of the bottom of the implant actually thinner than
18:06
the average human skull. And So what we want to be able
18:10
to do is control the size of the gap under the implant if the
18:16
threads that travel from the implant into the brain as much
18:20
slack as possible. We didn't do this in the first
18:25
participant because we didn't want to, you know, manipulate
18:28
any of their tissue that we didn't absolutely have to in
18:31
upcoming implants, our plan is to or sculpt the surface of the
18:35
skull very intentionally to minimize the gap under the
18:40
implant such that the bottom of the implant travels perfectly
18:44
flush with the normal contour of the inner side of the skull.
18:48
That will put the implant closer to the brain, will eliminate
18:52
some of the tension on the threads and we think it will
18:55
reduce some of the tendency of threads to retract, right and.
18:59
We actually built the tool to do right.
19:01
Yeah, this is, this is actually, this is a very important detail.
19:05
You really want the the inner contour of the skull to be flush
19:11
so that the implant doesn't, there's no, the brain doesn't
19:14
want to pucker up into the into the gap.
19:16
That's really quite a big deal. So like like minimizing the air
19:23
pocket and the implant being flush with the the inside
19:27
contour of the skull is are two very important improvements.
19:31
The additional benefit here is that you know you do see some
19:35
amount of stick up what we call stick UPS.
19:37
So you minor bump in the head, but this actually eliminates it
19:40
even. Further, Yeah, yeah, I mean,
19:42
it's like really our goal is that that if you run your hand
19:47
over the top of the skull, you don't feel any, any bump, you
19:49
don't feel any, any device. And that even if someone was
19:53
bald, you wouldn't really even notice it.
19:55
And and then from the the inner inner contour of the skull that
19:59
the the brain or physical standpoint doesn't really notice
20:02
that there's a divot in the skull because there's no divot.
20:14
OK. Another aspect of the of the
20:17
human brain that you know, obviously differs from any of
20:20
the animals that we tested in is that the human brain is a lot
20:23
bigger. And so you may not realize that
20:26
that means that the human brain moves quite a bit more than any
20:32
of these other smaller brained creatures.
20:34
And so when we open the skull, we see the brain travel toward
20:40
and away from the robot, about 3mm in total as the heart beats
20:43
and and the breathing takes place.
20:46
And so that movement, you know, it, it adds a small challenge
20:50
for the robot in precisely choosing a depth to insert each
20:54
thread. It's not an enormous challenge.
20:57
And we've already upgraded the robots capabilities to be able
21:00
to even more precisely target depth in in even a very rapidly
21:06
moving brain with a high amplitude of movement.
21:13
You may think the most obvious mitigation for threads that
21:15
pulled out of the brain is to insert them deeper.
21:17
We think so too. And so we're going to broaden
21:22
the range of depths at which we insert threads.
21:25
So you know, for the very first participant, we had an enormous
21:29
amount of data from our animal work and we had very highly
21:33
optimized our insertion depth to maximize the crossing of layers
21:39
of interest in the cortex with the electrodes that were
21:42
recording from. Now that we know retraction is a
21:46
possibility, we're going to insert at a variety of depths
21:51
that even in several cases of differing amounts of retracting
21:55
threads, we're going to have electrodes at the proper depth
21:59
and with the deepest threads be able to track how much
22:03
retraction has occurred across the surface of the brain from
22:07
from each thread. And so we're going to, you know,
22:09
both have more threads in the right layer and have better data
22:13
on how much retraction has occurred.
22:15
If you're ABCI nerd, you might know that being able to control
22:18
individual Z depth per thread is not something that most neural
22:23
interface devices offer. Most neural interface devices
22:25
are kind of a static, fixed, rigid array that you push in and
22:28
all the electrodes are on depth. To be able to do this is
22:31
actually pretty pretty novel. Part of the robot.
22:34
Yeah, the historical approach is to actually pound in a sort of
22:38
bed of nails with an air hammer into the.
22:39
Brain, It looks crazy that that that is.
22:42
Yeah, just with a with a pneumatic hammer.
22:47
That's the this is it sounds kind of somewhat barbaric.
22:49
This is not what we do, but this is what's been done before is
22:53
literally just hammering in what looks like a better nails with
22:56
the brain, which actually works. It's astonishing that it
22:59
actually works. But I mean, some people like
23:01
manual, like DBS probes, you're just sticking in by hand.
23:04
Our research is just guiding them in.
23:06
Those are several, several orders of magnitude more volume
23:09
of brain tissue that you're destroying compared to what
23:11
we're doing. But that deep brain simulation
23:13
stuff does actually work, and it actually helps people a lot.
23:16
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a great product.
23:19
Yeah. I mean, I think we'll we'll be
23:21
able to do a much more finessed version of that down the road.
23:26
So I mean, it's really difficult like the, the the neural link
23:31
device is something that really absolutely minimizes damage to
23:34
the brain, absolutely minimizes the load on the patient.
23:38
And the goal is to allow someone to live a completely normal
23:41
life. They work that you won't even
23:43
notice that someone even has the device.
23:47
So like I said, we're restoring the ability to control your
23:50
computer and phone. That's how telepathy and then
23:54
next device being able to allow people to see that cannot see
23:57
before. And in fact, you could you could
23:59
allow people to see kind of like Dora the Forge in Star Trek in
24:02
any what? Whatever.
24:03
Infrared. Yeah, infrared, ultraviolet
24:07
radar. So.
24:12
So I think another way of saying it is that we want to give
24:16
people superpowers. So it's not just that we're
24:19
restoring your prior brain functionality, but that you
24:22
actually have functionality far greater than a normal human.
24:26
That's a super big deal. And I also think, you know,
24:29
often times the questions that we get a lot is why do you have
24:31
to actually go into the brain? What if you place it on the
24:34
surface or outside the skull? Basically the Long story short,
24:38
the physics of how it works, you really need to get the sensors,
24:41
which are these facing in the brain next to the source which
24:47
you're on as close to it as possible.
24:49
Otherwise what you get is you get a population response and
24:52
not be able to kind of do the level of control that we believe
24:55
of. Yeah, I mean, a good sort of
24:59
analogy would be like if you're trying to understand what goes
25:02
on in a factory, you kind of need to go into the factory.
25:04
You can't just put a stethoscope on the wall and try to figure
25:07
out what's going Like anything on the outside of the trying to
25:11
read things from the outside is like putting a stethoscope on
25:14
the wall of a factory, trying to understand what's going in the
25:16
factory. It's not going to be effective.
25:19
You got to be threads. You got to be in there.
25:23
So. But I just want to be emphasized
25:26
again, like the goal is to give people superpowers, not just to
25:31
restore prior functionality. So it's very exciting.
25:35
And I think that should give hope to a lot of people in the
25:39
world that the future is going to be exciting and inspiring and
25:43
the technology is going to give them superpowers.
25:46
I mean, that's that's amazing. Yeah, I guess it.
25:59
Is. Off yeah and and could can you
26:01
multitask but yeah in fact if you look at Nolan's streaming
26:04
and you can just check out Nolan's streams on on the X
26:08
platform he's multitasking all the time so he's playing video
26:12
games while talking and. Listening to podcasts?
26:15
Nice listening to podcasts. Yeah.
26:18
Yeah, exactly. So it's really just like if
26:21
you're using your hands and you can be, you know, playing a
26:24
video game while talking so. I mean, don't take that word for
26:27
it. Just go watch.
26:27
I mean, yeah, yeah, he's out there on the Internet doing his
26:29
thing. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
26:33
So can he do keyboard shortcuts or is it just the mouse?
26:36
Yeah, that's actually what we're working on right now.
26:38
Sure, so currently he's working with the mouse, but we are also
26:41
exploring and decoding more dimensions from the new
26:44
activity. Multiple clicks.
26:46
So to do shortcuts or just able to control more games, control
26:54
games with an Xbox controller. But also in the future we
26:58
expand, we plan to expand to decode text, not just the mouse
27:01
control, but also allow our participant to type much faster.
27:08
And yeah. Yeah, actually.
27:09
So maybe going back to the discussion of thread retraction,
27:12
you know, one of the very exciting parts to me about this
27:14
story is that we're able to do so much with 15% of channels.
27:17
You have more channels. What that actually offers you is
27:19
not just faster mouse control, because in the motor cortex,
27:22
neurons don't all represent the same thing.
27:24
So if you're trying to understand, like, you know, what
27:27
an individual finger is trying to do, you might or might not
27:30
have an Electro next to it. And the more channels you have
27:32
in the brain, the higher likelihood you have, you know,
27:34
representation or decodability of all fingers on the hand.
27:37
It's like you're trying to do something like output text at a
27:39
fast rate. It's something that matters a
27:41
lot for people who are completely locked in, who cannot
27:43
speak at all, who are trying to, you know, just say I love you to
27:46
them, to a loved one in their family or ask for a glass of
27:48
water or a scratch or whatever. You know, being able to type at
27:50
a faster rate is extremely important.
27:52
And the more fingers you have access to, higher probability.
27:54
You can do that officially. And so yeah, you know, I'm super
27:58
excited about high, how high the ceiling is you can that we can
28:01
get to as we resolve this standard traction issue.
28:04
Yeah, I mean we're like we're currently at approximately 1010
28:06
bits per second P great. But ultimately we want to get to
28:10
megabit and I think ultimately whole brain interface I think
28:17
you know, many years from now I think Gigabit level as possible.
28:21
So that's that's pretty astonishing.
28:26
You know, with this is still version one of our device.
28:28
As we mentioned, it's version one with only 15% of the threads
28:31
working. The the current device has 64
28:36
threads with 16 electrodes on each thread.
28:39
Our next device has 128 threads with with eight electrodes per
28:44
per thread. Because as we get more confident
28:47
about how, where exactly to place the, the electrode the the
28:52
thread, you, you need fewer electrodes per thread.
28:55
So we can essentially with the current with without substantial
28:58
changes, potentially double the bandwidth if if we are accurate
29:03
with the placement of of the threads and then our next
29:07
generation device will have maybe even.
29:09
More channels. Yeah, yeah.
29:11
So yeah. So next device for every four,
29:14
yeah, 3000 channels. So this will just keep getting
29:18
better and better really moving up I think in towards magnitude
29:22
in factors of 10 basically in in what kind of bandwidth.
29:26
So I think won't be, it won't be all that long before someone
29:31
with a neural link device can communicate faster than someone
29:35
who is has a fully functional body.
29:37
And yeah, so I think, you know, faster than the fastest speed
29:43
typist or auctioneer. The E sports tournaments are
29:46
going to be. Like you literally won't be able
29:47
to speak faster than someone can communicate with a neural link
29:52
telepathy device. It may be a very interesting
29:55
part of this. Basically we currently connect
29:58
to standard inputs to the computer through mouse and
30:00
keyboards, but very soon, as we will have a much broader
30:05
bandwidth, we need to think about new ways to actually build
30:08
the interface for their devices. This is something that we can't
30:12
accept. Yeah.
30:14
No, that's, that's a good point because the, the current input
30:18
devices are centered around human hands.
30:21
So it's like we've got these, you know, little meat sticks
30:24
that we move and there's a certain rate at which you can
30:29
move your move your fingers. And so we've got like the mouse
30:32
and the keyboard and with a joystick control, you know, like
30:35
Xbox controller or something like that.
30:37
But you really don't need that. You can actually, you don't.
30:42
You don't need, since you're no longer if you're, if you're not
30:45
trying to use your hands, you don't, you actually don't need
30:47
those conventional control mechanisms.
30:53
And so This is why like, ultimately I think you'll be
30:55
able to do conceptual telepathy like where you can communicate
31:01
entire concepts uncompressed to someone else with a neural link
31:06
or to the computer. Even today we have some problems
31:09
here where like, you know, if you don't feel the mouse
31:11
clicking under your finger, how do you know it actually
31:13
happened? Because you know, you're, you're
31:14
seeing it on the screen, but you don't actually feel the mouse
31:16
clip. You don't have the
31:17
proprioceptive feedback of, you know, the keys under your
31:19
fingertips or the trackpad under your.
31:21
There's all sorts of interesting UX challenges, how to actually
31:24
give the user some sense of what their decoder is actually doing
31:27
or what the Neuralink is actually doing.
31:29
I mean, they're trying to use. So wireless.
31:38
Yeah, it's Bluetooth. Just a Bluetooth connection,
31:41
just like how your normal Apple mouse or like Apple Magic
31:44
Keyboard connects to your computer.
31:45
Same exact thing, in fact in. Yeah, we can basically have this
31:50
exposed as an HID interface if we want.
31:52
HID is just the name of the protocol for like sending bits
31:54
from a mouse into a computer. Yeah, I can plug into basically
31:58
anything. Yeah.
31:59
I mean, I think we, we chose that interface because it's
32:02
ubiquitous. Yeah, basically any devices are
32:05
are we have Bluetooth capabilities.
32:07
Our our long term goal is to actually have our own protocol,
32:10
you know that is safe and secure.
32:12
But for now, you know we've chosen it for interoperability.
32:16
So the question is can a neural link chip repair the paralysis
32:19
in the long term? You know, we can't do that right
32:23
now. We have done sort of preliminary
32:25
work implanting a second neural link in the spinal cord and we
32:30
can restore naturalistic looking hand and leg movements in animal
32:36
models. But this isn't something that
32:40
is, you know, don't, don't hold your breath waiting for it.
32:42
It's going to be a while. We've got a lot of work to do.
32:45
But yes, there's no reason in theory that we can't repair
32:49
paralysis. Yeah.
32:51
I mean essentially to to, I mean it there's, there's no, there's
32:58
no physics barrier to fully solving paralysis.
33:01
That is perhaps a way to say it, that you've got signals coming
33:05
from your motor cortex that if they are transferred past the
33:11
point where the the nerves are damaged, essentially just it's
33:15
basically a communications bridge.
33:18
So you bridge the communications from the motor cortex past the
33:21
the point in the neck or spine where the nose are damaged.
33:25
And you should like it is physics.
33:28
It is possible from a physics standpoint to restore full body
33:31
functionality from a physics standpoint, it's a very hard
33:34
technical problem, but it, but it is, there is nothing that
33:38
prevents it happening from a physics standpoint.
33:45
So in terms of next phase of the rollout, well, we, we really
33:49
want to make sure that we, we make as much progress as
33:52
possible between each neural link a patient.
33:54
So this is, we're only just moving now to our second neural
33:57
link patient, but we, we hope to have, you know, if, if, if
34:02
things go well, high single digits this year.
34:06
And I don't know, maybe this is somewhat dependent on regulatory
34:10
approval and how how much technical progress we make, but
34:14
within a few years, hopefully thousands.
34:18
Yeah. And I think one thing that is
34:19
important to highlight is that, you know, it's not that we built
34:23
only one device and one surgery. We've done hundreds of surgery.
34:26
We've built thousands and thousands of devices even for
34:30
just the the ability to unearth any sort of low frequency
34:33
failure mode. So we have already been
34:36
investing very heavily in infrastructure to be able to
34:39
scale this thing on the device manufacturing side as well as on
34:42
the surgery side of things. We want to be able to help as
34:44
many people as quickly as we go through obviously the
34:47
appropriate hurdles that are regulatory challenges and
34:51
proving out the device with. Yeah, and the the device
34:56
implantation really needs to become almost entirely if not
34:59
entirely automatic in the same way that's a LASIK.
35:03
Eye surgery is done, you know, you don't have an
35:06
ophthalmologist with a laser cutter by hand that that would
35:09
be crazy. But the ophthalmologist overseas
35:13
the LASIK machine and make sure that the settings are correct
35:17
and then the machine does everything and restores your
35:19
eyesight. It's really remarkable how how
35:22
many people have had their eyesight restored with with
35:25
LASIK. And I think there's another one
35:26
called Smile. It's they they keep making it
35:28
better. We need to have something
35:30
similar for a Neuralink implantation so that you
35:33
basically sit down and whatever the, the, whatever kind of
35:36
upgrades or, you know, brain fixes are needed.
35:40
That's that's reviewed by medical expert.
35:44
Obviously we want to make sure that that is reviewed correctly,
35:47
but but it really needs to be automatic.
35:50
So you sit down and, and within 10 minutes you have a newer like
35:54
device installed very, very fast.
35:57
I mean, it's very sort of cyberpunk, you know, Deus Ex if
36:00
you played those games. When we'll start to interface
36:06
with other devices like wheelchair, it's a great
36:09
question. We're currently focusing on
36:12
controlling computers and unlock independence in the virtual
36:17
world. Of course, our plan is, as we
36:19
mentioned earlier, robotic arm and wheelchair to unlock
36:22
independence in the physical world.
36:24
This of course additional risk if you make your computer,
36:27
there's some additional risk to that, but we are working with
36:31
the FDA to allow us to be quite some.
36:34
Well, it seems like if if the wheelchair has an.
36:37
App. Well, the wheelchair just needs
36:38
to have an interface. It does, yeah.
36:40
So if if the wheelchair has a Bluetooth interface, you could
36:44
just Bluetooth interface to the wheelchair.
36:46
And and that's probably something we should do.
36:49
We're working on pretty soon, yeah.
36:51
It's really a matter of paperwork.
36:53
I'm showing that you can do it safely.
36:54
You don't want to drive off. A Cliff.
36:55
Well, I think we could. Well, we can limit the speed.
36:58
Yeah, Yeah. So it doesn't go careening off
37:00
into disaster, but you know, so just make it go slowly at first.
37:06
But yeah, so being able to sort of it really the New York device
37:11
just should work generally for anything that's got a Bluetooth
37:13
interface. Including potentially, an
37:17
Optimus. Yes, yeah, you're, yes, you
37:22
could communicate with Optimus. Yep, absolutely.
37:29
Optimus, we'll also be able to talk to optimists.
37:31
But like, but you could just, yeah, instead of talking just,
37:37
you could just beam it directly. Or if, if someone has lost the
37:40
use of speech, then, then they can still communicate to an
37:42
optimist. They can communicate
37:45
telepathically to Optimists or by Bluetooth.
37:49
And, and, and so even if someone has, you know, completely lost
37:54
the ability to speak, they could still control optimists or their
37:57
computer or phone. You know, also like if you have
37:59
an optimist and you have a neuron, you can just directly
38:01
map the brain signal to control of the physical arm of the
38:04
robot. And that's a very meaningful
38:05
thing. Like if you're, you know, folks
38:07
that have spinal cord injury, one of the biggest requests is
38:09
to be able to scratch yourself. It's something that quite
38:12
annoying actually. And if you have a scratch on
38:15
your face, you can't fall asleep until you scratch it.
38:18
You know, it's very convenient to be able to move something
38:19
physically towards you, to be able to scratch similar things
38:22
like eating food. You know, if you need somebody
38:23
to feed you very hard to have dinner with friends in a way
38:26
that is, you know, sort of a normal social experience.
38:30
And so if you can feed yourself, pick up a fork and actually eat
38:33
a piece of chicken on your own, you know, that's a big deal.
38:37
It prevents and saves a lot of interactions with caretakers and
38:40
other people in your life that you rely on to take care of it,
38:43
But it really increases you. I think an exciting possibility
38:47
long term also is to say if you take parts of the Optimus
38:51
Optimus humanoid robot and you combine that with a neural link,
38:54
let's say somebody has lost their arms or legs.
38:57
Well, we, we could actually attach an optimist arm or
39:00
optimist legs and do a neural link implant so that the, the
39:05
motor commands from your brain that go would go to your
39:08
biological arms. Now go to your robot arms or
39:10
robot legs. And again, you you'd have
39:13
basically cybernetic superpowers.
39:15
Actually, so the latency from the neural link to your hand
39:18
would probably be slightly faster than it is just to go to
39:21
your physical hand. So you can imagine like if
39:23
you're a piano player or AI don't know anything that
39:25
requires extremely fast, you know, hand movements that you
39:28
could actually have a pretty imbalanced right hand robotic
39:30
arm control versus left hand physical arm control because one
39:33
of them. Yeah, like I said, it's just
39:36
kind of a cyberpunk day of sex in the future where you have
39:39
cybernetic upgrades that are actually better than your
39:43
biological limbs. And it's certainly the, we'll
39:52
have a much, you know, as particularly as we expand to a
39:55
large number of of, of customers or patients for Neurolink, the
40:02
understanding of the brain will improve dramatically because
40:06
really there isn't a fine, very fine grained understanding of
40:10
the brain today because the, it's just the sensors aren't
40:13
good enough. You've got fMRI, which is pretty
40:16
good, but it's still not as good as actually having high
40:19
bandwidth electrodes in the brain.
40:21
Yeah, I think this is under appreciated as a research tool
40:24
to to move that whole effort forward of really knowing, you
40:27
know, what the physical substance of human thought is.
40:32
We don't know to the to the degree that we need to.
40:35
So Neuralink is actually a very powerful research tool.
40:40
Yeah, I mean, we, I think we can ultimately understand and and
40:46
fix it's quite severe psychosis or like if if somebody's got
40:51
like the if somebody's got like a.
40:55
Like a delusion that they have a chip in their brain, I.
40:58
Was. Wondering if you were going to
40:59
mention that one. We just want to be clear,
41:02
there's only one person with a new linked chip in their brain.
41:05
So for people out there who think we've put a chip in their
41:08
brain, we'd like to assure you or what it's worth, you probably
41:12
won't believe us, but we did not put a chip in your brain.
41:14
OK, So there's actually a remarkable number of people who
41:22
think we have put a chip in their brain, but we have not.
41:25
But in the future, if you would like us to put a chip in your
41:27
brain, which will perhaps help with the issue of thinking that
41:31
you have a chip in your brain, then we will be able to do so.
41:35
So there are people that have severe schizophrenia.
41:39
They've got basically things that their brain is
41:42
malfunctioning in some way. And, and this is actually due to
41:47
really like physical circuitry issues.
41:49
You can think of the brain as like really it's a, it's, it's a
41:53
biological computer. And if, if some of the circuits
41:56
are crossed, it's going to, you know, it's going to crash or
42:00
it's going to have issues that was not work.
42:04
But with a Neuralink device, we can fix those issues and, you
42:09
know, give someone who I think has to say severe schizophrenia
42:13
or or psychosis of some kind, allow them to live a normal
42:17
life. I think that is one of the
42:19
likely things in the future. So, yeah, I mean, yeah, you can
42:31
certainly imagine, like, I'm sure people have like, parents,
42:34
grandparents who've, you know, have memory that's not working
42:41
as well as it used to be. Sometimes they forget who who
42:44
their grandchildren are or what day it is.
42:46
And this is something that on your linked device could help
42:49
fix I. Mean that that's actually one of
42:52
the personal reasons in in in many way like forms of you're
43:02
you're literally losing your and then part of your item, which is
43:05
a just a very, very. Yeah.
43:11
And it's really just, it's a glitch in the biological
43:13
computer that is a fixable glitch like, like it's a short
43:18
circuit essentially. How does the device charge and
43:22
how long does the charge last? Yeah.
43:24
So the current version that Nolan has, it lasts but four to
43:27
five hours on a single charge, and it takes about 45 minutes to
43:31
charge. The thing we've learned from
43:32
Nolan is that that's actually one of the main limiters for him
43:35
using it more. It's actually pretty hard to use
43:37
a product more than like 70 hours a week.
43:40
But that's about what he has used it for in some weeks.
43:43
Yeah, 70 hours in a week, Yeah. I mean, just for context, like
43:45
you sleep roughly 8 hours a night.
43:47
So that's, you know, we're doing better than the bed.
43:48
Like the bed is 56 hours a week if you use roughly.
43:51
And so 70 hours a week if uses. I challenge you to think about
43:55
products that you've actually used for that duration.
43:57
But that's again, some of these points are worth like
43:59
emphasizing again, like the that Nolan, our first neural link
44:03
recipient, has used the neural link device for 70 hours in a
44:08
week, which is incredible. He probably won't enjoy the time
44:11
sharing his computer use publicly, but I.
44:14
Mean. I assure use for productive
44:16
things only, but actually so one of the things we've learned is
44:20
that in the next version of the device we really need to like
44:21
double or you know, increase that battery life.
44:23
And so I think DJ, the next version is going to be double.
44:27
Actually. Actually double.
44:28
Without without increasing the charge.
44:30
Correct in charging time to double the battery life, meaning
44:33
you should get roughly 8 hours of use.
44:35
And the goal is to actually get to all they use so you can just
44:37
charge maybe in your sleep or your sleeping pillow.
44:41
Exactly. As soon as you've got like 16
44:42
hours of usage, then you basically have 24 hours of usage
44:45
because it can charge while you're sleeping.
44:47
One of the things that's important, I think, to call out
44:49
here is if you're paralyzed, you can't, you know, put the charger
44:51
over your head yourself. And so it's important to think
44:53
about like it's not just a duration of better use, but also
44:56
can you recharge it yourself independently.
44:59
So we spend a lot of time thinking about how to make that
45:01
feasible because then that means that you can, this is what no
45:03
one does. You can use the device, charge
45:05
it, use the device, charge it, use the device without needing
45:08
anybody to come in and sort of help you with that, which is a
45:11
big deal if you're trying to play save until 5:00 AM at night
45:13
when your family's asleep. And the way in which he does
45:16
that is that there is a charger coil that's a big or you know
45:19
about this big, and we actually put it in the sleeve of a of a
45:24
hat. Like a beanie.
45:26
Or a beanie and then he wears it and then says with the voice
45:29
command charge. Charger energized.
45:31
That's the one he. Likes.
45:39
How would writing work? So so yeah, the current device
45:46
that Nolan has is reading. So it's trying to read his
45:51
essentially like worst movement from from one one hand.
45:55
That's also, you know, with pointing out like in the future,
45:58
like we're pretty cool to you can roll into a second implant
46:02
that would allow the other hand to be used and also have higher,
46:07
obviously higher active electrode count.
46:08
So then you can play two essentially play games two
46:11
handed because that's normally how you play games.
46:14
And but then with with writing, it's really just it's an
46:17
electrical impulse instead of like reading electrical impulses
46:20
from the neuron to you issue an electrical impulse, which is
46:24
obviously critical for vision. So vision is, is writing, which
46:27
is just triggering an electrical impulse in the vision part of
46:31
the brain and that like activates a pixel.
46:35
So we actually do have this working in monkeys.
46:38
So we had we've had it working with monkeys for a while now
46:41
where you can sort of flash a pixel and then you watch where
46:44
the monkey, obviously the monkey's like, what monkey's a
46:48
little surprised to see like, hey, there's a flash here and a
46:50
flash here, but it's gets used to it after a while.
46:54
But it just you can you can see that that the pixel is in the
46:57
right location because the monkey's eyes will dark to that
46:59
location. It's not on the screen, like
47:01
there's no pixel on the. Screen.
47:02
There's no pixel on the screen. Yeah, just like.
47:04
You just verify that that the that you're triggering a pixel
47:07
in the right part of the brain. So, you know, the initial
47:10
resolution for vision will be relatively low, you know, sort
47:14
of Atari graphics type of thing. But over time, it could
47:18
potentially be better than normal vision.
47:21
And then I guess in terms of some additional applications for
47:24
where writing to the brain can be useful order applications as
47:31
Bliss mentioned there is. Feedback.
47:32
There's a proprioceptive feedback, there's a tactile
47:35
feedback. Especially for a robot arm, Like
47:36
if you're trying to grasp a call right, you need to know you've
47:38
got it. Yeah, 1 to one egg.
47:41
It's an egg, Yeah. It's a very much a delicate
47:43
balance of not just initiating the movement, but getting the
47:46
feedback and controlling it accordingly.
47:48
So there there is a some meta sensory cortex that's right
47:51
adjacent to motor cortex that could could be benefit.
47:55
Motor movements, so any changes in neural growth after device is
48:08
inserted, we don't see any any signs of neural damage.
48:14
But I and I guess we, we have seen some rebound on some of the
48:20
electrodes, right? Correct.
48:23
And then also, I mean, I guess, I guess the brain is very
48:26
plastic. So it's not that plastic.
48:30
Well, it does diminish quite a bit after each 10/20.
48:35
Throughout childhood, especially when you get to about 25 rain,
48:42
really done cooking. Yeah.
48:49
But there are, There is a little bit of damage done with each
48:52
insertion, but it's a miniscule amount compared to anything else
48:56
out there. And so it's an easy amount of
49:01
damage recover from. And it's really only detectable
49:05
on cutting pieces of the brain after after the animal's no
49:11
longer alive and looking at them under a microscope, you can't
49:14
really tell during life that there's been any brain.
49:19
And another way to interpret this question, have there any
49:21
changes in neural growth after the device is inserted?
49:23
One way to interpret that is like the user learning how to
49:25
use the device. And I think on that side of
49:27
things, there's been tremendous progress.
49:29
He's put in hundreds of hours trying to figure out the best
49:33
way to use this device because he really thinks that, you know,
49:34
if he can figure this out, he can help share this knowledge.
49:38
I mean, he's like on Friday night at 8:00 PM, you know, he's
49:40
starting a session of like, you know, figuring out himself how
49:43
to how to push his own performance to the next level.
49:46
And that's really a unique learning process because there's
49:48
not many people in the world that have had the experience of
49:50
moving something. And.
49:52
So there's a lot of nuance to like, OK, how exactly should I
49:55
imagine or attempt to move my wrist to get the thing to Yeah,
49:59
he's really dialed that into a. Also, just the sheer number of
50:02
hours that he's even in the past six months, right?
50:07
In many ways, like, I mean, he's using it in his travel in his
50:10
plane, right? Effectively, PCI has left the
50:12
lab. Yeah.
50:13
Yeah, one of the questions is how close we're converting
50:16
thoughts into text. I mean, right, Right now it's
50:19
more about moving cursed from the screen on on a virtual
50:21
keyboard, but long term you should be able to really
50:26
estimate entire words faster than anyone could possibly type.
50:30
I'm able to type Hello World today but we're still in the
50:34
early days making that a posh experience.
50:38
I mean, the other things that we're looking at is sign
50:40
language, right? At the end of the day, it is a
50:41
movement of and into, right? Yeah, it's true.
50:48
Was the brain trying to naturally push the threads out?
50:50
I mean, this is sort of a universal feature of any implant
50:53
in the body. The body tries to reject it.
50:56
And the goal of the surgeons and the technology team is to fight
51:00
that. And so with artificial hips and
51:03
with, you know, screws in the spine, we've done a really good
51:06
job of finding biocompatible materials and techniques to fix
51:11
those implants in the body. I mean, past a certain age, it's
51:15
getting hard to find someone without some kind of implant,
51:17
you know, knee, hip, some kind of screws in their spine.
51:23
And so we've got this problem pretty well solved.
51:28
So to answer your question, yes, the body is trying to get rid of
51:31
any implant, but we can ensure that basically can't.
51:36
It's also worth highlighting that the threads have not
51:38
actually moved in the past five months.
51:43
There's, there's some still minor movements in terms of like
51:45
some maybe, maybe getting pushed in a little bit, pushed out a
51:47
little bit, but it's, it's more or less very stable and been
51:51
stable for. And the reason for that is, you
51:53
know, once you, once you do a brain surgery, it takes some
51:58
time for the tissues to come in and then, and then you know, the
52:00
art tissue or the neo membrane to actually come in and then
52:03
anchor the threats in place. And once that happens,
52:06
everything has been stable and seen much movement.
52:09
That's where the world record performance starts to come.
52:12
In Yeah, that was a couple weeks ago.
52:16
Yeah, the threats, like it is important that the threats be
52:19
extremely tiny. If they're extremely tiny, then
52:21
the brain does not. The smaller they are, the less
52:24
likely the brain is to react to to them.
52:26
So that's why you want the threats to be extremely tiny and
52:29
also to minimize any damage to neurons, so.
52:36
On that note, we do plan to actually share some of the, you
52:39
know, the tissue response in detail and some of the the later
52:43
upcoming updates. Yeah, it is quite a challenging,
52:48
it's challenging on many fronts to do something like this
52:51
because you're, you're trying to read and read and write
52:54
electrical signals, but you need to have the, the threads
52:57
themselves need to be like electrically isolated and and
53:05
not subject to corrosion in the body.
53:07
So like the, you know, just metal by itself is somewhat
53:11
subject to corrosion or, or being attacked.
53:15
So it's it's, it's like in terms of the various coatings and
53:18
things to actually make this electrode work while not
53:21
actually eroding it's performance over time is, is
53:24
very difficult. Human bodies are very, very
53:26
harsh environment, very harsh environment.
53:27
It's a, it's a bag of salt water with bad sensors that's elevated
53:31
temperature that is well regulated.
53:33
I mean, I'm sure people have experienced dropping their
53:35
electronic devices in the sea water and in an instant.
53:38
Yeah, yeah. So we're going to sort of wrap
53:42
this up soon if there's like a few few last questions, I guess.
53:49
So a good question. So what about upgrades?
53:52
So yeah, we do think it's going to be important to be able to
53:55
upgrade the device over time, just like you wouldn't want like
53:59
an iPhone 1 stuck in your brain forever.
54:02
You know, if you've got an iPhone 15, you probably want the
54:05
iPhone 15, not the iPhone 1. So I think triple over time will
54:13
be able to upgrade their, their neural link.
54:14
So we'll take the neural link device out and put a new one in.
54:19
And we, we have done this with some of our animals and they're
54:24
actually in one case we did with we, we upgraded device three
54:28
times and and with a pig. We did with a monkey as well.
54:32
He's able to do PCI. Yeah.
54:34
And he's, he's doing fine, Yeah. Pedro has the pedest implant.
54:38
Actually, he hit his, I think his record with the last.
54:40
Yeah, with the with an upgrade. So it still beat him though
54:43
Will. It still beat him.
54:45
Yes, this is true. Humans are top of the species
54:47
leaderboard right now. Pedro's like what, like eight or
54:49
something? Pedro's like 8.5 BPS, OK, but
54:52
it's a very high score. Yeah.
54:54
I'm not trying to put Pedro down.
54:55
And also to train a monkey to do that, It's like a whole
54:57
challenge on its own. We have like the best animal
54:58
care team. Yeah, just do 1/2 size.
55:01
We, we, we, we do our absolute best to take care of the, the
55:04
animals. And when we had like a USDA
55:09
inspector come through, she said that this was the, the nicest
55:12
animal facility she's ever seen in her entire life.
55:16
So breakfast. On an app like.
55:21
The the, the monkey orders room service.
55:23
Yes, yeah, we've we've we've monkey room service, which is
55:26
rare. We're the only ones who offer
55:30
monkey room service. So we really do everything we
55:32
can to maximize the welfare of the animals.
55:36
So all right, with that, thank you everyone for tuning in.
55:39
Hope you found this interesting.