Latest / New Worlder / Episode #94: Rodrigo Pacheco

Transcript

Episode #94: Rodrigo Pacheco · New Worlder

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: This is the New Worlder Podcast and I am one of your hosts, Nicholas Gill.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: Co-host Juliana Duque will be joining shortly.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_01: Today we are speaking with Rodrigo Pacheco,
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: the chef behind Boca Valdivia and Puerto Cayo on the coast of Ecuador.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of chefs say they want to preserve landscapes, but Rodrigo is actually doing it.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_01: He is literally acquiring land and rewilding it in the hopes of turning it into one
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: of the world's largest biodiverse edible forests.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: I first met the guy about 10 years ago at a conference in Quito.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: At the time,
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: all of the contemporary Ecuadorian chefs were trying to get international attention
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: and get on the list and basically get famous.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: Then there was Rodrigo, who could have cared less about those things.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_01: It was still very early on in this project,
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: which is on a remote beach,
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: but he was already talking about connecting with nature and utilizing biodiversity.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: He seemed totally out of place among the others.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_01: It was still early on in the life of Boca Valdivia.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: The 100 hectares of land he bought, a former pepper farm, was heavily degraded.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: Much of the surrounding tropical dry forest was cut down.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: There was little wildlife.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: But in a decade,
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: he has turned it into a thriving landscape,
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: which,
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_01: through the accrual of new land,
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: now reaches up to the cloud forest.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: I was there earlier in the year and I saw it with my own eyes.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: He now uses more than 150 edible plants from this landscape throughout the year on his menu.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_01: While the heart of Boca Valdivia is a restaurant,
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: where he and his team cook from a rustic wood-fired kitchen adapted from native
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: ones and serve tasting menus alongside nice wines and cocktails,
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: to call it just a restaurant would be lacking.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: The experience there involves a journey.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: Many hours before you start eating, you start to experience the landscape.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: You immerse yourself in it.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: You traverse it by fishing in the sea and tasting termites off a stick and hiking through the forest.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: You connect with this landscape long before you sit down and take a single bite.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: And when you do sit down,
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: there isn't some long,
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: drawn-out explanation of what you're eating because you've already lived it.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: Rodrigo has lots of other projects that have spun off from Boca Valdivia.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: He has a restaurant in Quito now called Foresta.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_01: He was on the Netflix cooking show, The Final Table.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_01: He has created a mini documentary series with indigenous leaders.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_01: He is a goodwill ambassador in Ecuador at the Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_01: He says because he lives in the middle of nowhere that he has a lot of extra time
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_01: on his hands,
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: which most other chefs don't.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny how the less busy you are sometimes, the more you can get done.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'm still trying to figure out how that works.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: If you haven't subscribed to my newsletter,
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: just go to newworlder.com or search for New Worlder on Substack.
• 3:33
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• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: Again, that's newworlder.com.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: Also look for my books, such as the Latin American Cookbook at bookstores or online.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: There are links to those in the newsletter as well.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: And before I forget, the video of this episode will be on YouTube.
• 3:55
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• 3:58
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• 4:02
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• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: Every little bit helps us get seen and keep this thing going.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_01: Enjoy the show.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: Music
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, Rodrigo.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_02: Hi.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_02: Hello, Nick, Juliana.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_02: How are you?
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_02: I am good.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: I am here in Ecuador saying hello and happy to be able to share some of my vision today.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm excited to talk to you more in depth.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: Where are you at right now?
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: Are you in Puerto Cayo?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: I am in the Manaví province.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm in the city of Manta at the moment, in the southern coast of Ecuador.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_01: Right, yeah.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: So Manta is like the largest city closest to where your restaurant and project is.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: Right, okay.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: I imagine your kids go to school in Manta and things like that.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: This year, yes.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_02: But for 10 years, they've been going to the very small rural schools around Puerto Cayo.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_02: But this year, they're in Manta, yes.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, gotcha.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: All right,
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: so I first met you,
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: I was trying to think,
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: probably like 10 years ago,
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: probably something like that.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_01: I remember Boca Valdivia was probably just started or something like that.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_01: Does that sound about right?
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, yes.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_02: I met you at a culinary event in Quito.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_02: A little more than 10 years ago.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: And Boca Valdivia like just started or like it hadn't been going long, right?
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_02: It hadn't been going so long.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah,
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_01: it was at a conference in Quito and,
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: and like I met you and then like,
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_01: we hung out a bit and I thought like,
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: wow,
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_01: this is,
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_01: this is really incredible what you were doing.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_01: And even though it was like so very early on,
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: 10 years ago, like I was, I was still kind of blown away by the things you were talking about.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I tried so many times to come visit.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like I looked for flights,
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_01: it was like,
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: tried to get different assignments and for whatever reason,
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: it just like never worked out.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like I was never in Ecuador that much, at least, you know, with enough time to, to come over and
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: It just never worked out.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_01: And earlier this year, I was finally able to come.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, it was like, I was so looking forward to it.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_01: And like, you know, it was everything I expected it to be and more.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_01: Before we get into,
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_01: that experience and like what I did when I was there,
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_01: let's talk a little about what Boca Valdivia is.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's better coming from you.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_01: So where is it and what is it?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, thank you.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for recognizing my work and thank you for visiting.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: So it was great to see you from close.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: Boca Valdivia is,
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't,
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if,
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: and we can debate that in a deeper way along this conversation,
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_02: but I don't know if it's a restaurant restaurant.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_02: or if I wanted to be a restaurant,
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_02: I think Boca Valdivia is a source of wisdom,
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_02: is a source of connection,
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_02: is a container that is able to connect people with nature,
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_02: is a place where there's a harmony between all living beings.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_02: And the center of this ecosystem is an ecosystem.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: Actually, I want to call it like that.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's an ecosystem that I design over time where the kitchen is the heart,
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_02: but it's also surrounded by life,
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: by biodiversity,
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_02: by values,
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_02: by people that represent the past life.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: And also, of course, through the art we do
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: the contemporary version of the culinary arts,
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: inspired of the ancestral wisdom,
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_02: but always looking towards the future.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_02: So it's an ecosystem that is friendly, that is where the pantry is actually outdoor.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: There's a lot of foraging,
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_02: there's a lot of plants,
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_02: and we get to learn from the cycle of life of all these multiple species.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_02: and then apply this wisdom around the embers because mostly what we prepare is made
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_02: with the embers in this ancestral kitchen that is kind of the opposite of my
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_02: learning in the professional world where I was able to be more in touch with technology,
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: Michelin stars and beautiful kitchens,
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_02: which I obviously value,
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_02: but this is kind of the back to basics version of gastronomy that I decided to apply.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: So just to pull back for a second.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: So the project, we'll just call it that for now.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's not exactly a restaurant.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: I totally agree with you.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: And that was one of my questions later on.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: And we can maybe get to that, but it's,
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's near Puerto Cayo, which is what, like two hours south of Manta?
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: An hour south of Manta?
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's 45 minutes from Manta, from Manta Airport.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: And it's right on the coast.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: There's a hotel residential development that's part of Boca Valdivia too, right?
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: Las Tenusas.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: That's like right on the coast.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: That's like the beachfront area.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: And
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then the entire project, though, spans like how many hectares?
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_02: My wife and I,
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_02: we founded a 50-hectare ancient farm that has oceanfront,
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: but also it has more of the inside part of the land.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: So it's 25 hectares on the beach side.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: side and then 25 hectares on the other side of the road all together face to face
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_02: it was an ancient pepper farm and then we started to transform a house into a hotel
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_02: and then into a project that started to to to
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: to build more and more towards a larger accommodation,
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_02: some real estate attached to the hospitality business,
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_02: and then agriculture and restoration of the ecosystem.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: So the whole project is a 50-hectare piece of land.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the core of it that you started 10 years ago.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_01: And at the time, I guess when I met you,
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: you were cooking there already and but the land was very different I imagine like
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: you you didn't you didn't have it for that long it was still probably degraded in
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: in a lot of areas so you you've had to do a lot to kind of get it to the state
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: where it is now
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: Is that correct?
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_02: That's correct.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, you could tell that in the soil.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_02: The soil was dry, was degraded, was empty.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: And then there was no vegetation, no wildlife, no kitchen there, no hotel, no customers, no nothing.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_02: So we developed the whole concept of this, including the training of the people who were actually the...
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: the guys that work in the construction,
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_02: so the guys that work in building this infrastructure on the beachfront,
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_02: those are the guys that we ended up training for service,
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: for cooking,
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_02: and it was amazing to
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: to, to be able to, to do it that way.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_02: Uh,
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_02: not the easy way necessarily,
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: but,
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: uh,
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_02: uh,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: a very,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: a very important experience of my life has been to,
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_02: to share,
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_02: uh,
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: all that I've learned and also learn from these guys,
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_02: They're locals, they're fishermen.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and so it has been an amazing journey, but the, the land itself was very, very degraded.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: And, um,
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: And today is a different story.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_02: There's a full ecosystem that has over a decade of restoration.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: And there's also the plantation and implementation of this biodiverse edible forest
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_02: way of life that then expanded to a conservation project that has more hectares.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_02: And we're looking forward to bring it to a larger scale.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: So...
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: So what was your experience as a chef before that?
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like before you take in this very big visionary project, like did you work elsewhere in Ecuador?
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: I know you went to culinary school in France, right?
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, like you staged with Michelle Brahe.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: Is that right?
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah,
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: first I did a bachelor in Chile for hotel and restaurant management for four years,
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: but already knowing that I was going to study culinary arts after.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_02: It was a planned journey.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: And then I went to Lyon, and I went to the Paul Bocuse Institute in Lyon.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_02: So I lived in France for another four years, and I did a second bachelor of culinary arts and management.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I did some nice internships in Alain Chapelle,
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: in the Martinez Hotel in La Palme d'Or,
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: then in Michel Brass.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_02: I also went to Pierre Gagné in London.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_02: and had a like a nice view of this of this high-end michelin stars but of course
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: very very inspired in michelle brass he he kind of became my good friend and and we
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_02: were aligned in in the values in how we see nature how we appreciate biodiversity
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: um and then i came to ecuador
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_02: I never worked in Ecuador for anyone.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_02: I came directly and opened a small hotel and restaurant right beside an erupting volcano at the time.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: in a little town called Baños de Aguasanta.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_02: And the volcano,
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_02: the Tungurahua volcano was very,
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: very active during my three year period where I opened that very small hotel.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_02: It had six rooms and we served like 40 people for lunch and dinner.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: But it was a really nice comeback to my culture, to Ecuador, especially
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_02: living this experience of of being beside an erupting volcano where i i saw things
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: that really blew my mind and made me really really connect with with my country
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_02: again and after that i came directly to the coast to portugal and and started this
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_02: other other journey of of a larger scale of more land and and all that we have been
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_02: speaking about so
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: So like 10 years ago, there wasn't really that even much interest in gastronomy in Ecuador.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: in Ecuadorian ingredients,
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: in kind of...
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like Ecuador wasn't really like on the map like Peru was.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: There wasn't really so much attention.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: Even like the high-end cooks in Quito, they weren't really cooking Ecuadorian food.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: It was still kind of very international.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: There wasn't so much pride of...
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: of what you guys had.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you were the first one that I saw that was really talking about it.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_01: But how do you do that?
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: How do you get people to pay attention from all the way on the coast,
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_01: where you're basically in the middle of nowhere,
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_01: where you are at?
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's impressive that you were able to
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: just get this idea off the ground because I think it is a really,
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: really big,
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: bold idea and you started,
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: I think,
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_01: pretty early on,
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: way ahead of anyone else talking about things like this.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: Was it a challenge?
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure it was.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, of course.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_02: It's like opening a trail, right?
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_02: You grab your machete and
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_02: And you have to open the first trail, which is really hard.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_02: You get beaten by wasps, you get blisters in your hands, but also you are opening a path.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't say,
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_02: I never said I'm the first one doing this,
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: but what I think I brought in is the vision on how we actually have been important
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_02: in the gastronomic world for thousands of years.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe not in the contemporary world of gastronomy, Michelin stars, or the list.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_02: But then,
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_02: the ancient cultures,
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_02: the pre-Hispanic cultures that inhabited Ecuador,
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_02: especially the coast of Ecuador,
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_02: such as the Valdivia culture.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_02: So if you investigate about the Valdivia culture,
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_02: you will find out that it's called the mother culture of the Americas.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_02: So 7,000 years ago,
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_02: these guys were pioneers in the domestication of plant species,
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_02: meaning agriculture,
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_02: in pottery and navigation.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_02: And the society is a matriarchal society that lasted for
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_02: for about 2000 years, which is the same than our era, right?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_02: But we kind of like skip that part of the past and then we focus in the gastronomy
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_02: that was more influenced by the colonization and then the Republican type of cuisine,
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_02: Which is a bit of the mix between the
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_02: the ancient cuisine, the colonization techniques that came in, but then also the Republican.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_02: But what happened before?
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: And that was my first question a long, long time ago, over a decade.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: What was happening before?
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: And when I start asking myself that question, I start
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_02: becoming a sort of like an archaeologist and start digging into the ground
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_02: literally and also finding all sort of special elements and tools and then
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_02: investigating and reading and talking to more professionals from all over the world
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_02: about the importance of the pre-Hispanic cultures of Ecuador and how advanced they were.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_02: And then I found amazing, amazing information about the origin products of Ecuador.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_02: the first domestication of products that then with globalization,
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_02: with navigation,
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_02: they became part of Europe and in different places.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_02: And now they're actually the base of the most prestigious cuisines in the world, right?
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_02: But then the products came from here, from around us.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: And since we were pioneering the navigation in the American continent,
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_02: we navigated all the way to the north and all the way to the south and brought,
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_02: of course,
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: expanded the biodiversity that was part of Ecuador,
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: considering that,
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_02: as you know,
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_02: Ecuador belongs to the equator.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_02: And the more biodiversity you find on the planet is actually the closer to the equator.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_02: And the less biodiversity is as you approach the pole.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_02: So Ecuador, by
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_02: by gravity is one of the most biodiverse countries in the world per square meter.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_02: And that helped expanding the biodiversity also around the world.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: And also we brought in different species that then our culture adopted,
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_02: like the bananas,
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_02: the plantain,
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: or the citrus.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_02: Those are not original species from here, yet they became very popular for gastronomy in Ecuador.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we have to look deeper.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_02: We have to see our ancestral past to really understand what's going on in the
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: present and how we can bring this into the future,
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_02: And that's what I've been doing over the past 10 years.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: And just to be clear, I was speaking of contemporary culinary culture.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: No one,
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: obviously,
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: everywhere else in Ecuador,
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: people are still cooking,
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: native things and making amazing food.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_01: But, you know, contemporary culture was very much like there may like sushi and Peruvian food.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_01: And like there wasn't really this kind of inner inward look there.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, and so when I was there, so let's move to that.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: So when I came to Boca Valdivia earlier in the year,
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: as you said,
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: it's,
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_01: is it really a restaurant?
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I mean, you do serve food and, you know, and people sit down and eat and drink wine.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: So there is a restaurant there, but is that the most important part of what you do?
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's...
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's just a small part of it, really.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's a big... We can debate that all day, but it's bigger than a restaurant.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's not just a restaurant.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_01: The only place I can think of that kind of equates to that kind of restaurant
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: experience is maybe Mill in the Peruvian Andes,
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_01: what Rogelio and the Mato team are doing there.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so when I came...
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: Immediately we went to the beach,
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_01: we went fishing with nets,
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: it required everyone that was there,
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: including staff to grab hold of these nets and to,
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: to really immerse themselves in the ocean and,
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: feel the waves,
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: the strength of the waves and,
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: get wet and everyone worked together to catch fish and,
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_01: And we did, we caught it.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: It was pretty rough, like the waves.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's probably always a little choppy there, I guess, but, but yeah, and it was fun.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: And we, we caught fish that way and, you know, you later serve them.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: And then after fishing,
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: we,
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: we,
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: we went hiking through the coastal dry forest and,
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: there was like a guide went with us and talked about the different plants and,
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: we ate termites off a stick,
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: live termites.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, that was nice.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: And, uh,
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: And then we,
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: we got to the area where the restaurant was and we got to see what was growing in
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_01: their gardens,
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_01: all of the different fruits and herbs and,
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: tropical tubers.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: And,
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: but there was this very educational aspect to this,
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_01: this very education through experience and not just like blasting you with
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: information before serving a dish.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like I don't, I think when you actually serve the food, there wasn't,
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: It was like normally,
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: like you just brought a dish and said what it was,
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: but you kind of already lived through what the ingredients were and before,
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: sitting down to eat them.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: So it was like it came off in this very natural way of serving and eating rather than just like,
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: going sitting down at a fine dining restaurant and,
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: you sit there for 10 minutes as they explain over and,
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: what's going on and who the farmer was and blah,
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_01: blah,
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: blah.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: And then by the time you actually eat,
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: it's like,
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_01: you've just,
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: you're bored,
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: like sometimes that happens,
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: but that didn't happen here.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_01: It was like very natural and in, in just, you know, it felt good.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I felt like I, I, I,
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: I knew a lot before I actually sat down and ate.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: So why is this kind of educational experience important to a meal at Boca Valdivia?
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think art in general, and that includes culinary art, should have...
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_02: the mission of transmit information that society needs to learn.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_02: The aesthetic part of art is nice.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: I recognize it.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_02: But if it doesn't have a purpose behind, for me, it remains only aesthetic.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_02: And that is vain for me.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_02: While when you share
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_02: when you transmit knowledge, experiences, wisdom through what you do, you're adding a lot of value.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_02: You're also inspiring future guardians of the planet,
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_02: either to support your mission or to create their own.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_02: You kind of shake the soul of people.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, Boca Valdivia, as you experience, is a six-hour experience.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_02: So you cultivate a special ingredient for good food, which is hunger.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_02: Also, the fact that there's a physical aspect of it, and then there's the trail.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_02: These are important layers that are curated,
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_02: especially for people to leave things behind,
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_02: to start questioning even,
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: where am I going?
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_02: I thought I came to a restaurant.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: I've heard so many comments while I'm guiding this tour and I'm laughing and I'm like...
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_02: And then people plant a tree and then...
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_02: But then,
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_02: you've been kind of doing physical things and connecting with nature for around
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_02: three hours,
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_02: four hours.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_02: So, of course, the first thing you receive is this fresh drink and biodegradable.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_02: And then, of course, your body is ready to...
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_02: to receive them.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_02: And that's exactly what I wanted to do because food for me is very ceremonial.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: I always wanted Boca Valdivia to be sort of like the house of the shaman, right?
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_02: Not calling me the shaman, right?
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_02: But I'm an apprentice of a shaman.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: But I mean the fact that you go is not the place where you raise your hand and you ask for something.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_02: It's a place where you listen
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_02: where you actually,
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_02: you will get a menu that is unique for that day,
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_02: that is provided by the chef and the team,
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_02: and there's basically no way to change it or question it,
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_02: So it kind of seems a little bit dictatorial, but in a way, if I wouldn't do that, how would I use
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_02: 150 species of plants,
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_02: like if I put to choose,
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_02: the guests might go for the traditional and then the biodiversity will remain
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: unknown for most of the people.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_02: So that's how we try to share the information, experience and putting your hands onto it.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_02: Grabbing a fish with your hands from the ocean is actually not too many people have
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_02: experienced that in their lives,
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: especially
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_02: as part of our culinary experience.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: So all this is actually very thought for people to really, really feel.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, eating is such an intimate act.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you put something in your mouth, you know, you put it inside your body.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_02: Why are we taking it for granted?
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_02: So I always wanted to sort of like break the glass on those old thoughts on the
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_02: on restaurants wanting to be like other restaurants,
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: and then you just see it all over the place.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then I was always a rebel that I'm like,
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to,
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to have a restaurant that is similar to anything.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_02: I want to,
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_02: to actually change the vision of the person who is coming here.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_02: So hopefully most of the people get the message,
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_02: appreciate the humbleness of the experience,
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_02: the humbleness of the ingredients and the effort we do,
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_02: not only obtaining the food from the origin,
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_02: but also carving the dishes and carving the straws and all this,
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_02: that is an extra work that usually in kitchens is not part of the journey.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_02: So it might not be perfect,
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_02: but it's different,
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_02: it's authentic,
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_02: and I think it's an opportunity to use my creativity to transform the world
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_02: positively somehow.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: So, Rodrigo, I have, like,
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: 20 different questions.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, what you do, you're trying to answer at least 100 questions.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: And you're tying together at least 20 projects and all these, right?
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: So I wrote an article about Boca Valdivia and you in 2018.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was for Avianca magazine.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I think Boca Valdivia and the restaurant was the,
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: the focus of the whole project,
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_00: but you have developed so many branches of it.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously everything is connected, but you're an ambassador for the food and agriculture organization of
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_00: the United Nations.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: You have been in shows.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: You have this educational mission.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_00: You collaborate with other organizations that are interested in similar missions and with similar values.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, right?
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_00: 100 things.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_00: And you also, I think you have developed with your team, and that's one of my questions, who
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_00: Who is your team?
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: Bioeconomy, edible forest, shelter.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: I was looking at the graphic you have putting together all these concepts,
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_00: and I was curious about how did you put together all this ecosystem in this graphic
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_00: that reflects the ecosystem you just described it for us.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: Second, what is a workday?
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: How does it look?
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_00: when you are there so that we have a better idea of all what you do,
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_00: although you have been talking about it.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: Third,
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: you kind of already mentioned the message people should get when it goes there,
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: but I will ask you to repeat that message.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: If nothing else,
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_00: what people should get from these different experiences,
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_00: because there is so much,
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: so much,
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: right?
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_00: And thanks.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for your curiosity.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah,
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_02: I love to talk about my team because one time someone asked me,
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_02: what's the most amazing dish that you have created in your career?
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_02: And automatically and spontaneously, my answer was Waltep.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: which is my sous chef that he had worked with me for, for over 10 years.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_02: And he, it was funny because how I met him, he was fixing the roof, right?
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm like, bueno diaz.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_02: So he was fixing the roof and then he saw me cooking.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_02: So he started just looking.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_02: And then one time he, he said to me that maybe he,
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_02: He wanted to do half of the maintenance work and then maybe half in the kitchen.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_02: So he started approaching the kitchen.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_02: And one day,
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_02: one of the cooks went partying or something,
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_02: one of the young guys,
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_02: and didn't arrive to work.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_02: This was before we arrived to Tannousas.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: This was in Banyos in the volcanic project.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: So then I'm like, Walter, you're in today, brother, because the other cook didn't show up.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_02: So here, here's my vest.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_02: So he had my vest with my name.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_02: So he was a second Rodrigo Pacheco, huge vest, you know, and he was so scared.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_02: And then I always wanted this, even in my first project, the kitchen was outdoor.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_02: I wanted people to connect and see,
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_02: I don't like to be inside and just see the cooks licking their fingers.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I think the best way, not being angry with the
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: with the kids in the kitchen,
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_02: the best way to supervise their work is their own customers,
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_02: the invites that are looking to them.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_02: So they feel empowered,
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_02: so they are not licking their fingers and they're not cleaning their hands in the apron,
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_02: So I've always wanted that.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_02: So for Walter, it was obviously the most adrenaline adventure he has ever been.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_02: And since then, he started coming back to the kitchen and he stopped doing the maintenance and
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_02: well he's cooked with me in africa and you know like we have had an amazing journey
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_02: but he also brought a lot of wisdom because he he's a he works the land he's an
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_02: indigenous guy right so he also showed me many many important things and lessons
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_02: and
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_02: So after him,
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_02: there was these other kids that started,
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_02: when we started planting the forest,
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_02: I hired some of them just to help in the agriculture part.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_02: And then I said, okay, you bring the harvest to the kitchen.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_02: And then I said, please wash the harvest when you arrive to the kitchen.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_02: And then we were busy, so wash the harvest and then start peeling.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_02: And that's how they started getting in.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_02: At the beginning, they didn't say anything back to me.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_02: I would say, David, please.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_02: He would stay quiet.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, are you going to answer me sometime?
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_02: It took them five years to answer back something to me.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_02: So it has been...
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_02: just such a, I don't know how to describe it.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's a unique journey to be able to,
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_02: to transform these kids and,
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_02: see how they,
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_02: they,
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_02: they gain self-confidence and technique and,
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_02: but they're so humble and so nice.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_02: I love to work with those guys.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_02: So my whole team, basically in Boca Valdivia, they haven't finished primary school.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_02: They finished, I think, second grade of primary school and then they didn't continue.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_02: So,
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's nice, you know, because sometimes people say, oh, I study here, I study there, I did this.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_02: And then they're pretty bad in the kitchen.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_02: You know, they don't want to work.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_02: They think they know everything.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_02: Well,
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_02: these guys,
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_02: they saw that opportunity,
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_02: the opportunity that they have in their life to be part of such an important mission.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_02: So they embrace it and they don't let go.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_02: So that's how I would describe my team.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_02: Then my, yeah, I do a lot of things because I decided to move to the countryside.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_02: So I don't spend a lot of time in the car.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_02: And that gives me a lot of extra time to do extra things.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_02: And also I've been exploring nature from very early stage of my life.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_02: So that's, I think that there's two sorts of wisdom.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_02: Because let's talk about knowledge and wisdom really quickly.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_02: Knowledge comes in a box today, right?
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_02: And you tap how to do a sauce in the internet and you'll get the information right away.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_02: While wisdom, you only obtain from two sources.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_02: One is nature.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_02: And second, the indigenous people of the world.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_02: So I've been in contact with both for plenty of time.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_02: And that's how I obtain the energy and the wisdom to do more things that are connected, as you said, but
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_02: Now we have a pretty big thing going on in terms of conservation and all that.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_02: So we'll get into that later.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_02: But my everyday is that, is exploring the ecosystems.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_02: I'm always riding something, either my surfboard or a motorbike or a horse or whatever.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_02: I like
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_02: to be writing something.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_02: And then that way I connect with the different ecosystems that are around me.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_02: And then I also, I like to cultivate.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_02: I enjoy harvesting.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_02: I follow the cycle of life of the planet, of the plants, of the animals.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_02: And then that's how I define my role as a human and as a chef in today's world.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_02: So that's how I manage my every day.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_02: And then your third question was... The message people should... Related to the message.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: So,
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_02: people are so disconnected from nature that it makes me sad,
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_02: the ego and all this,
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_02: especially from people coming from the cities and,
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_02: oh,
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_02: I've been in that restaurant,
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_02: who cares,
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_02: like...
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_02: I became this guy,
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_02: and I even isolated myself from some of the Ecuadorian kind of,
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_02: gastronomy scene because,
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_02: and I think there's a lot of amazing cooks and all that,
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: but every time I was invited to an event or something,
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_02: there are these talking bad of someone,
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_02: people talking bad about these ones,
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_02: and so I really,
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_02: really,
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_02: I left all the groups, all the things, and I said, I focus on my mission.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_02: Now I'm getting back and getting more friends again, but I've been isolated for a decade.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_02: This allowed me to first to understand what is the message that I'm getting,
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_02: to digest it,
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_02: and then to transform it in a message that it will be useful for the wellness of
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_02: the present and the future generations for children.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_02: And that's it,
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_02: how we need to embrace the biodiversity,
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_02: how forests are so important,
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_02: not only for a kitchen,
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_02: but for the planet.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_02: I encourage entrepreneurs to establish the triple bottom line economy,
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_02: people,
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_02: planet,
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_02: but also at culture.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_02: I encourage leaders to take bold decisions.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_02: for environmental transformation.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_02: So I, you know, my passion for cooking became smaller than my purpose.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_02: My purpose became bigger.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I used my passion and I used my,
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_02: I hope,
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_02: my talent for culinary arts to nurture this bigger thing,
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_02: this bigger mission that I have in life,
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: which is to expand,
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: to reconnect,
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_02: to strengthen people.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_02: to protect ecosystems and cultures.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_02: So that is the message I'm spreading through.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_02: And if you see the press kit and if you tap my name in the internet, that's exactly what you will get.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_02: It's nature connection,
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_02: it's biodiversity,
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_02: it's expanding this conservation project,
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_02: respecting nature,
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_02: and creating a type of gastronomy that is harmless,
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_02: that lives in harmony with the surrounding universes.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_02: that is using the elements,
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_02: some of them very,
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_02: very humble,
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_02: to be able to transmit and to convey these important messages.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_02: So I don't know if I'm doing good or bad, but I feel happy.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_02: I feel happy with what I do, and it has cost me a lot to do so many things.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, cost me energetically, but also the reward of this is
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_02: is the transformation, right?
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_02: When I go to Boca Valdivia, the guys are days off.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I go there, I see a deer, I see a monkey.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_02: I feel that I created the space for them to come back.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_02: So those are the small things that keep me going.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_02: All this motivation, this passion, this purpose, that's what I integrate into the food.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_02: and try to share it with much intention to every guest I have the opportunity to cook with.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_02: So that's the message.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_01: It began as 50 hectares,
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_01: but eventually you started to have a bigger vision of what this could be,
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: and you started acquiring more land,
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_01: How did,
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_01: I guess,
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_01: what was the moment when you started to think,
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_01: okay,
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: this is bigger than just these 50 hectares than just this kind of hospitality
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_01: project and moved into more of a conservation project?
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_02: The source of this is contention,
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_02: is a reaction that comes from devastation that I see around my surrounding territory.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I see how the depredation of nature has affected so much worldwide, right?
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_02: We're talking worldwide.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_02: the more I think that this project can get into a bigger scale,
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_02: that is my personal mission to contain this devastation.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_02: Because, you know, this is not like a trendy thing, right?
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like, cooks love trendy things, right?
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_02: Restaurants love trendy things.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_02: But when you plant a forest, it will stay there for over 100 years.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_02: So think about it.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I leave a little question for the audience and for you guys.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_02: If Boca Valdivia,
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_02: which is a humble restaurant,
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_02: you put your feet on the earth,
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_02: we cook with embers,
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_02: we only serve 12,
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_02: 20 people,
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_02: and we have been able to protect 150 hectares of forest,
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_02: what can a big restaurant,
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_02: what can a big hotel chain do?
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_02: Or what can we all do together?
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_02: and why we're not doing it.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_02: I leave that as a small reflection for everybody.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_02: And then I add an anecdote to this because recently I was invited to some event in
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_02: Canada and some guy straightforward asked me like,
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_02: He owned a bunch of restaurants.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, do you have enough to say?
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_02: Because I didn't have Michelin stars because the Michelin guide is not in Ecuador.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I wasn't part of the 50 best list, probably because my restaurant is very isolated.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_02: So we're a 50 best discovery restaurant.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I respect that, but I'm not like drooling for that, right?
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_02: So I said, I do have enough to say, especially one thing.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_02: How many hectares do you protect?
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_02: conversation over and we became really good friends and actually we're working
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_02: together now in the project so for me now is is about that is about okay you're a
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_02: great chef your dishes are beautiful your restaurant looks amazing you're in the 50
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_02: bed lip bravo now how many hectares are you protecting that's the question i'm
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_02: asking so you know more and more i i i just go to the to the essence of things and
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_02: uh and and that's how i i
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_02: I move in life.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_02: And now we have important challenges coming ahead.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, there's a lot of talking, right?
• 46:43
  SPEAKER_02: I also do a lot of talking now,
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_02: but I have to sustain this in the dish,
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_02: in my creativity,
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_02: in the service,
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_02: in the experience.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_02: So it's a compromise to when you talk, then you need to prove what you're saying, to walk the talk.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_02: So I take on the challenge, but this is, yeah,
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_02: kind of like adding a little bit of more information for all of us to understand
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_02: how this works and what's my role and why we have been expanding this to over 150 hectares.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_02: And now I'm going to the New Year Climate Week to present the project, to bring it up to 2,000 hectares,
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_02: And then to become a worldwide land bank of edible forests where you can add
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_02: different forests from all over the world and make the largest,
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_02: biggest,
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_02: the biggest biodiverse edible forest in the world.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_02: So that's kind of the journey at the moment.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_01: All of these kind of like really fascinating,
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_01: important people work with you kind of on this project or at least kind of associated.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like evolutionary biologist, Dr. Justin Yeager,
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_01: There's an environmental defense lawyer, Julio Prieto.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_01: Do these people just start,
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_01: once you start talking about these things,
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_01: do they just kind of come out of the woodwork and somehow they find their way there
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_01: and they're like,
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be involved?
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_01: What is their association exactly?
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_02: You know the Ernest Shackleton story?
• 48:18
  SPEAKER_02: So he put a sign before his expedition.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_02: He said,
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's dangerous.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_02: We might not come back.
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_02: Nights of darkness.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_02: And then whoever showed up was the right people who joined him.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_02: And he didn't lose any of the team later.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_02: So it's sort of like that.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_02: When I get to these people, I tell them that this is tough.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_02: We have so many challenges.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_02: We have so many needs and lots to do.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_02: But this is the reward.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_02: This is the purpose in terms of spiritually and energetically and all that.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then I get the right people to join.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_02: Now we need to expand the team.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_02: So we are also, but we need to afford that.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_02: So we need, there's a funding issue.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_02: There's also a connecting issue,
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_02: but I do a lot of connection,
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_02: but now I'm in the funding part so I can extend my team a little more and get more
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_02: of Justin,
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_02: get more Julio's.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_02: and more people that are,
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sure that are there and they have the drive to transform the world positively,
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_02: but maybe they don't have a container to do it.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_02: So we got to meet each other at some point and make this happen in a bigger scale.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_01: So a lot of like the land acquisition and stuff, like technically, how does that even happen?
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_01: Is it like through grants or what?
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_02: Well, good question.
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_02: It almost cost me my marriage because at least 50 hectares, I bought it with my personal efforts.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then when I almost lost it,
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_02: I created a foundation,
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_02: which is Boca Valdivia Foundation,
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_02: which is the right vehicle to get funds and to acquire land and to manage these
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_02: environmental projects.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_02: But then you have to make a foundation.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_02: In Ecuador, it's not like in the U.S.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_02: that you get a foundation and you receive a mail one week later with your foundation.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_02: Here it takes you a year and a half or two years of many, many challenges.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_02: And it's the second that I do so.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_02: Again, putting my backpack and walking this trail.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_02: to have the right vehicle to do the right things.
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_02: And now it's better.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_02: So through the foundation, we have already acquired around, let's say, 60 more hectares.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_02: And we have plenty more to acquire and to protect.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think more restaurants should kind of start to work with these kinds of things?
• 51:02
  SPEAKER_01: Because, I mean, it's...
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_01: There's only so much you can do with the income of a single restaurant,
• 51:10
  SPEAKER_01: especially one that only serves,
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what you serve a week,
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_01: but no matter what it is,
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_01: even if you're full every day,
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_01: there's only so much land you can buy.
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_01: So you do have to work with, think outside of the box a little bit, I guess.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think more restaurants that want to kind of achieve something bigger that
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_01: just isn't related to their
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_01: you know, direct business should be thinking this way.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_02: Of course,
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_02: gastronomy is the continuation of agriculture and agriculture happened to be the
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_02: number one responsible for global warming.
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_02: So that means gastronomy is also accountable for global warming.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's a must that all leaders,
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_02: not only from kitchens,
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_02: but for every organization,
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_02: start an environmental transformation program.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_02: process within their organization it means building better practices in terms of
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_02: food waste right and then we have the sustainable development goals it's just a
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_02: pretty easy guide that we can all follow the sdgs but we we should all be
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_02: supporting environmental projects we should all be containing climate change why is
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_02: no one speaking about climate change and one time i got a
• 52:46
  SPEAKER_02: Someone who told me, why you as a chef, why do you talk about climate change?
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_02: You are a chef.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, stop, please.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I am a chef, but I'm a human.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_02: I'm also a citizen of the world.
• 52:59
  SPEAKER_02: Everybody has the right to speak about climate change.
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have to be a scientist.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have to be an expert.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_02: You have to be a human that concerns, that is aware of things.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why I invite more chefs, more restaurants to contribute and to retribute a small part.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_02: And it can be done in many ways.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_02: That's why we are creative, right?
• 53:28
  SPEAKER_02: We should be creative for solving the problems of the world as well.
• 53:33
  SPEAKER_02: So I think every restaurant has the moral responsibility to contribute to the good health of nature.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's actually the right and the duty.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's not only... I mean, when this person asks you why you're talking about this, if you're a chef...
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_00: that's part of people understanding what a chef, what a cook is in the end, right?
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_00: Which is beyond the restaurant,
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_00: beyond feeding people,
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_00: or what to feed people,
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_00: no matter the context,
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_00: means,
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_00: right?
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not only a right to talk about climate change,
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_00: but actually a duty,
• 54:15
  SPEAKER_00: as you say,
• 54:16
  SPEAKER_00: as a human,
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_00: as a chef,
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_00: as a
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_00: Whoever is using this earth, right?
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll say when you...
• 54:26
  SPEAKER_00: I want to highlight something you said,
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_00: which is you're going to the basics and the message for people is go closer to nature,
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_00: connect with nature,
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_00: understand it and just be there,
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_00: right?
• 54:41
  SPEAKER_00: But I think connected with that is like who has the wisdom
• 54:45
  SPEAKER_00: about nature, that it's more helpful now.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_00: And that seems to be indigenous communities.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_00: And you describe it in this like beautiful way, wisdom, right?
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_00: Which is different from knowledge.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I think this all makes sense together when this person was asking you about climate change.
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's what the answer is in that wisdom too.
• 55:09
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_02: There are 5,000 indigenous communities around the globe,
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_02: and they are the guardians of more than 80% of the world remaining biodiversity.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_02: And they have been resilient.
• 55:21
  SPEAKER_02: They have been adaptive in the sense of creating food systems and agri-food systems
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_02: that live in harmony with nature.
• 55:30
  SPEAKER_02: And they have been doing that for thousands of years.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_02: And we do have this concept still that says, well, we need to help the indigenous communities.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_02: Wrong.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_02: They need to help us.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_02: We need to ask them for help.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_02: And that means we need to integrate them.
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_02: We need to consider them.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_02: That's how I created the first table, this initiative that is a mini documentary series.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_02: I've already done two, one in Ecuador and one in Toronto in Canada.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_02: where we bring in the importance of transmitting the indigenous wisdom,
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_02: not only to the younger of the indigenous community,
• 56:07
  SPEAKER_02: but also to non-indigenous communities,
• 56:10
  SPEAKER_02: because they have,
• 56:11
  SPEAKER_02: by example,
• 56:13
  SPEAKER_02: been leading the conservation of our ecosystem for thousands of years,
• 56:17
  SPEAKER_02: period.
• 56:18
  SPEAKER_02: And that's how we need to follow their guidance.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_02: We need to follow, we need to respect, and we also need to stop making this a folkloric thing.
• 56:27
  SPEAKER_02: It's about a deep respect.
• 56:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's about providing the value that they deserve,
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_02: providing the space,
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_02: the opportunity also for them to develop economy,
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_02: to utilize their products without interfaces.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_02: The cook has a lot of responsibilities outside of the kitchen.
• 56:48
  SPEAKER_02: And that's how I see gastronomy today.
• 56:51
  SPEAKER_02: The cooks are too...
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_02: to focus on what happens inside,
• 56:55
  SPEAKER_02: and that's how their vision gets taught,
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_02: and they cannot see beyond that.
• 57:01
  SPEAKER_02: And that's especially considering the indigenous wisdom and all that.
• 57:07
  SPEAKER_02: I think this is an essential part of our mission as chefs, is to integrate them more and more.
• 57:13
  SPEAKER_02: And you will see these documentaries I'm building,
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_02: and I'm going to do more episodes in different parts of the world,
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_02: with joy is a message that is shared through gastronomy, with happiness.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's not like an activism that is sad and resentful.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_02: No,
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_02: it's just promoting a good relationship with the indigenous people of the world,
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_02: with good relationship with the flora around us,
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_02: in a joyful way.
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_01: When I was there, you said one of the aims of Boca Valdivia is to
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_01: connect ecosystems that have been cut off from each other.
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_01: What do you mean by that?
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_01: And what's the ultimate goal?
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_02: The ultimate goal is to protect, to restore, to reconnect, to strengthen ecosystems and cultures.
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_02: These are very important pillars of what we do.
• 58:20
  SPEAKER_02: And that's how we move.
• 58:22
  SPEAKER_02: First is protecting.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why the acquisition of land is important for us around us.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_02: But we also have to focus on policy.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_02: And it gets very political at some point.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe it's weird for you guys to interview a chef that is talking about these things.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_02: But I think it's time.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's time for all leaders to start, you know, waking up and start contributing and retributing to
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_02: with climatic solutions that should come from civil society.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_02: You know, governments are walking in circles.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_02: That's why the world is like this right now.
• 58:57
  SPEAKER_02: So the fact that we point to them,
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_02: oh,
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_02: the president here,
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_02: the major there,
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_02: what are we doing in our fridges?
• 59:04
  SPEAKER_02: What are we doing in our homes, in our companies?
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_02: Are we really doing important transformation?
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_02: So once we stop pointing at the others and point to ourselves, then we can start.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_02: And then talking about gastronomy,
• 59:18
  SPEAKER_02: it's not only about the purpose and contributing,
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_02: but it also becomes like a sort of like a endorsement stamp for your work,
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_02: It gives you added value.
• 59:27
  SPEAKER_02: So it's also a return of the investment.
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_02: It's not just dedicating some funds or some energy or some, just because you're a good hearted.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's also something that will bring important things to your life.
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_02: It will bring, and it happened to me too, and I must say that too,
• 59:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's all good at the end.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's a 360 degrees of honor to act like this.
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_02: It goes beyond the list.
• 1:00:02
  SPEAKER_02: I think we would need many hours of maybe a couple of bottles of wine to be able to
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_02: talk about all the important things and all the things that are going on in my
• 1:00:14
  SPEAKER_02: projects and also how important is your role to
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_02: giving us this space, this platform to express ourselves and hopefully touching the soul of a few.
• 1:00:27
  SPEAKER_01: Where do you see this project in, I don't know, 20 years?
• 1:00:33
  SPEAKER_01: What's your hopes for it?
• 1:00:35
  SPEAKER_02: The next 20 years?
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, what I envision is a huge forest.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_02: It's a reconciliation with wildlife.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's the preservation of water resources.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_02: is abundance in terms of nutrition, is beauty, is shade, is all the good things.
• 1:00:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's how I see it.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_02: But we do need to expand it into a proper scale.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_02: 150 hectares is a pretty big piece of land, let me tell you.
• 1:01:07
  SPEAKER_02: And what happens in one hectare is so amazing in terms of biodiversity.
• 1:01:12
  SPEAKER_02: What happens in 150 hectares is important.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_02: But then still small in the sense that the predation rhythm, it goes faster, it goes stronger.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_02: I've seen forests of, let's say, 100 hectares being put down in two days, in 48 hours.
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_02: So that's how we can relate the scale of the actual project would actually be needed.
• 1:01:44
  SPEAKER_02: In 20 years, I want to see 5,000 hectares of edible forest, at least.
• 1:01:51
  SPEAKER_01: Julie, do you have any other questions?
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_00: yes,
• 1:01:58
  SPEAKER_00: but I think the message is clear,
• 1:02:01
  SPEAKER_00: and I would like people to keep that message clear,
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_00: because I think Rodrigo has said very,
• 1:02:07
  SPEAKER_00: very important things for people to reflect about and to act upon.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I think that's enough to process.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_02: Definitely.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_00: I will wait for the bottle of wines too, whatever that is.
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_02: Looking forward to it.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, likewise.
• 1:02:32
  SPEAKER_01: Let me know when you have your dates.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thank you for everything.
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_01: Let me know when your time in New York is scheduled and hopefully we can meet up.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_02: I heard you I'll write a note with you while in New York and then hopefully we can
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_02: have a personal chat together with a nice drink so thanks for this space and very
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_02: very honored to share with you guys
• 1:03:03
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, everyone, for listening.
• 1:03:05
  SPEAKER_01: I hope you enjoyed that episode with Rodrigo Pacheco from Boca Valdivia in Puerto Cayo, Ecuador.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's a little bit south of Manta.
• 1:03:13
  SPEAKER_01: If you're in that area, I highly recommend checking it out.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_01: They have a hotel there, too, Las Tenusas.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's the same property.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_01: You can get a beautiful beach vacation out of it and eat some pretty killer food.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_01: And thanks to Juliana Duque, my co-host as always.
• 1:03:32
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks to Pat Buzzard who provided the music for the show.
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_01: And please subscribe to the newsletter.
• 1:03:40
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• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_01: Share us.
• 1:03:41
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• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_01: This episode will be in video on YouTube.