Latest / The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination / JFK ASSASSINATION - Ep. 322 - Everyone... Everywhere... All At Once

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JFK ASSASSINATION - Ep. 322 - Everyone... Everywhere... All At Once · The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: I don't know what he's up to. It's picking me
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: like chickens, shocking me like corn, strowing me like an ice.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: I don't do sit ups, I don't do chill ups.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: I don't do.
• 0:17
  Speaker 3: Nothing but get up through them guts with my jahns on.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Bruh the hell did you talk about it?
• 0:26
  Speaker 4: Then?
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Anybody? I'm letting all y'all know my exercise is eving
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: your thighs.
• 0:31
  Speaker 4: Brother, believe that, bro, it's all about it. He's out
• 0:38
  Speaker 4: to me.
• 0:39
  Speaker 3: They jim bee choke bee and it's I'm gonna be man.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: That's tim meant j Ben yoll.
• 0:47
  Speaker 5: I mean they show me joke be and then you're
• 0:50
  Speaker 5: gonna be and I'm gonna be the show be got me.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Hu d.
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: Selo show Kille.
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: Oh thank you, Roger Sir.
• 1:23
  Speaker 4: Here we go. What is up? Everybody? Welcome in, Welcome
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: into the Lone gum And Podcast. This is episode at
• 1:31
  Speaker 4: number three hundred and twenty two. Everyone everywhere, All at once, Yes,
• 1:37
  Speaker 4: play on the great movie title. Everything everywhere, all at once.
• 1:46
  Speaker 4: As we revealed in our Wednesday show, we're going to
• 1:48
  Speaker 4: be talking about Captain Westbrook, Lieutenant Jerry Hill, and some
• 1:54
  Speaker 4: of their antics that took place on November twenty second,
• 1:57
  Speaker 4: nineteen sixty three. Because they are a little suss these
• 2:01
  Speaker 4: are actually two members of the Dallas Police Department, euse me,
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: who happened to be at all three crime scenes. Yet
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: they did not travel together, which is interesting.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Allegedly allegedly.
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: Yes, but we'll get there, I promise. But before we do,
• 2:20
  Speaker 4: Joe I want to.
• 2:22
  Speaker 6: Dip one over to the other side so we can
• 2:27
  Speaker 6: welcome in some of our ever faithful and lovely listeners.
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: Tiny Dancer is in the house. Trays in the house.
• 2:39
  Speaker 4: What's up? See? James is in the house. Paula Jane, Hi, Paula,
• 2:46
  Speaker 4: Paula Alph of sixty six. Mike, what's up? Buddy? Jack
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: is here for the first time in a couple of weeks.
• 2:54
  Speaker 4: Welcome back, sir, Yes, glad to hear the boss.
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: Let up on you little bit.
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Big Scott's in the Hello Scott, Great Scot Uncle
• 3:07
  Speaker 4: is in the house. What's a bunkled? And yeah, Mike, uh,
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: we do know where trouble being joey'scars are. We're here, baby,
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: We're here.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: We are on your screen, ready to drop some fire.
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: Sally is in the house. From across the pond. But
• 3:33
  Speaker 4: she moved she dipped.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: Wait wait she moved from where I thought she moved.
• 3:38
  Speaker 4: From England to northern Ireland.
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: I believe, so that would be maybe an hour closer
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: to us.
• 3:46
  Speaker 4: I think it's the same.
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: Well, Sally is staying up late nonetheless.
• 3:53
  Speaker 4: So yeah, somewhere I'd like to visit before I die.
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: Definitely Ireland. It's beautiful.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: It is Scotland, and yeah, I mean the whole area. Yes,
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: Ireland is an island, of course, but yes.
• 4:14
  Speaker 4: Chris is in the house. Chris Barton. Hello, Hello, Hello sir,
• 4:19
  Speaker 4: Thank you sir, good evening. God bless you as well.
• 4:24
  Speaker 4: Colleen the Rocket Queen is here. Always a pleasure to
• 4:29
  Speaker 4: have Colleen back. Yeah. So that's about it for the
• 4:36
  Speaker 4: folks that is here for right now. I'm sure more,
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: many more will join us as we get along. So Joe,
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: how was you week, my friend?
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: It was okay, it was okay. We got our first
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: snow here today in the northeast, which is always interesting. Thankfully.
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: I got new tires like two months ago. And uh
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: it's really icy and uh kind of terrible to a
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: couple of errands.
• 5:08
  Speaker 4: But other than that headlight.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 5:13
  Speaker 7: No comment.
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: On the status of that.
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: I was just.
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: Grateful that it was light enough that I didn't have
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: to put my headlights on for these errands, which I
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: conveniently ran in the middle of the day because of such.
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: But uh, yeah, no, all is good, uh in the
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: in the hood, in the northeast, how.
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: About you, sir, Yes, Sally, definitely, definitely, it's on the
• 5:45
  Speaker 4: bucket list, that's for sure. Yeah, we know Colleen, We
• 5:54
  Speaker 4: know Colleen. Glad you're here. That means you're doing somewhat well.
• 5:58
  Speaker 4: So that is always good news for us. Yes, welcome back.
• 6:02
  Speaker 4: We miss you when you're not here.
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: For sure, for sure.
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: All right, let's move the chat overly back out of Yeah.
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: So, and by the way, nice Christmas background you.
• 6:16
  Speaker 4: Have here, Rob. Well, tis the season, Joe.
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: The season, and it's very festive.
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: I like it.
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: And I think next Friday will be uh, I guess
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: two days after Christmas.
• 6:34
  Speaker 4: But apparently we still don't know what we're gonna do
• 6:37
  Speaker 4: next Wednesday for the members only show. We are going
• 6:40
  Speaker 4: to do one. It's either going to be Wednesday night
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: like normal, or it shall be earlier in the week
• 6:47
  Speaker 4: Monday or Tuesday. But we will do a post and
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: let everybody know.
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: For sure.
• 6:54
  Speaker 4: For Shizzy, Yeah, all right, Joe. First up, I wanted
• 6:58
  Speaker 4: to I came across an arresting document that pertains to
• 7:02
  Speaker 4: the last show that we did, right when Paul Abbott
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: was here and we were talking about Ruby shooting Oswald
• 7:10
  Speaker 4: in the basement, right, So I was always curious, and
• 7:19
  Speaker 4: I came across this article and I don't know for
• 7:24
  Speaker 4: the life of me, who in the hell wrote it.
• 7:27
  Speaker 4: It might have been Ian Griggs from dp UK, who
• 7:31
  Speaker 4: sadly has passed on, but I believe this is an
• 7:35
  Speaker 4: old dealer. Plus the Echo article, but he goes in
• 7:41
  Speaker 4: depth about the search of Ruby's person immediately after the shooting,
• 7:45
  Speaker 4: so they see, he says, within seconds, within seconds of
• 7:49
  Speaker 4: Oswald's shooting, Ruby had been hustled away to the jail
• 7:52
  Speaker 4: office and searched, which was standard police procedure, and fulfilled
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: three basic purposes. Firstly, to take possession of anything that
• 8:00
  Speaker 4: may be of evidential value. Secondly, to seize anything which
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: with the prisoner may cause injury or damage to himself
• 8:09
  Speaker 4: or others.
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: Right if he had another weapon, right yeah.
• 8:14
  Speaker 4: And thirdly to take him to take from him anything
• 8:18
  Speaker 4: with which he may harm himself. Yes, also, yes, apparently
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: Ruby according to the official record of Billy G. King
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: no relation to Billy Jean King, the tennis player, but
• 8:37
  Speaker 4: Billy G. King, who was the assistant jailer. Ruby had
• 8:41
  Speaker 4: been searched by Kenneth Hoak, a jailer at Dallas City
• 8:46
  Speaker 4: Police Department, on November twenty fourth, on the fourth floor
• 8:48
  Speaker 4: of the Dallas City Police Department, which houses the jail. Okay,
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: now we know Ruby had some money on him, right,
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: but we don't know We didn't really get into how
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: much we speculated, right, But when the property found on
• 9:12
  Speaker 4: Ruby's persons was listed, it consisted of thirty four items, dude,
• 9:17
  Speaker 4: that he had on his person, thirty four. Many of
• 9:23
  Speaker 4: these items, however, consisted of more than just one single object. Okay,
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: so this dude was weighted down with shit in his pockets. Okay,
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: let's see here. He did have listed a large roll
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: of money mentioned by Detective Archer, and that was an
• 9:47
  Speaker 4: accurate description. It was exactly that. It amounted to cash
• 9:53
  Speaker 4: in the form of nine one hundred dollars bills, forty
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: twenty dollars bills, thirty ten dollar bills, two five dollar bills,
• 10:04
  Speaker 4: and four dollar bills for a whopping grand total of
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: twenty and fourteen dollars in his pocket at the time
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: he shot Oswall. That's what we thought, too bungle, But
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: it's more. It's much more, much, much more so. He
• 10:18
  Speaker 4: had two grand cash in his pocket roughly at the
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: time he was arrested, right, which equals out to today
• 10:26
  Speaker 4: money like twenty grand. Who the fuck walks around with
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: twenty grand in their pocket unless you're balling, you know
• 10:33
  Speaker 4: what I'm saying, Like, yeah, straight balling. I don't know,
• 10:40
  Speaker 4: I don't know, not me, you know, And I'm fairly
• 10:44
  Speaker 4: certain that you know, that's like not I mean, that's
• 10:49
  Speaker 4: way more than like one night's take at the fucking carousel,
• 10:52
  Speaker 4: you know what I'm saying.
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he wasn't like on his way to make a deposit,
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: especially on Sunday.
• 11:00
  Speaker 4: Seems to me way more. I mean, do you know
• 11:03
  Speaker 4: how rare one hundred dollars bill was in nineteen sixty three.
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: I'm guessing pretty rare, yeah, you know, and.
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: Probably just as rare today as you know, getting a
• 11:18
  Speaker 4: thousand dollar bill, which they did make, right, but you
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: never see them. This dude had nine of them in
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: his pocket, Nine one hundred dollar bills, in nineteen sixty three.
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: People were not visiting the Carousel Club and dropping one
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: hundred dollar bills, you know, unless they're straight banging, you know,
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: like the entire staff I digress. Several Ruby's items of
• 11:48
  Speaker 4: personal jewelry confirmed his determination to maintain a quote classy image. Joe,
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: there was a ring with three diamonds, a fourteen carried
• 11:59
  Speaker 4: golden diamond. Look who threw a wristwatch? The culture wristwatch? Wristwatch?
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: There's another liberty lobdy word risk whistwatch. His necktie was
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: described as one hundred percent silk, Joe, and he had
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: two thie class, one silver and one gold. He also
• 12:22
  Speaker 4: had normal items on his persons, such as a comb,
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: several pens, some keys, a pair of spectacles much like
• 12:30
  Speaker 4: these right here. Let's see what else did he have.
• 12:37
  Speaker 4: Ruby's pockets appeared to have been crammed with a great
• 12:39
  Speaker 4: variety of business cards, receipts, photographs, letters, and assorted papers.
• 12:48
  Speaker 4: One of the most important, of course, was listed as
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: follow as a Western Union telegram date stamped eleven sixteen
• 12:54
  Speaker 4: am at November twenty four to sixty three, addressed to
• 12:57
  Speaker 4: Karen Bennett, Western Union Fort Worth for twenty five dollars
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: from Jack Ruby, thirteen thirteen and a half Commerce Street. Yes,
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: that is how it appeared, including the time era. The
• 13:09
  Speaker 4: telegram had actually been dispatched at eleven seventeen am. And
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: the Carousel Club address was wrong for some reason. All right,
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: so that is how much he had on his person. Okay,
• 13:26
  Speaker 4: Now they did search Ruby's car, and I asked the
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: question last week where did Ruby park his car? And
• 13:35
  Speaker 4: Paul said it was across the street, which to me
• 13:38
  Speaker 4: intimated that it was parked right on the street, right across,
• 13:43
  Speaker 4: you know, from like the basement entrance, right. I mean,
• 13:47
  Speaker 4: that's the way he made it sound. But according to
• 13:53
  Speaker 4: this document, right at the time of this incident, Jack
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: Ruby owned and drove a nineteen and sixty all the
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: Oldsmobile Tudor white in color, bearing the nineteen sixty three
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: Texas license of PD six seventy eight. According to the
• 14:15
  Speaker 4: Dallas FBI office, the search of Ruby's Oldsmobile where he
• 14:18
  Speaker 4: had left, which he had left in a parking lot
• 14:23
  Speaker 4: on the northwest corner of Maine and Pearl Streets, was
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: carried out by Detective Richard Swain Junior and other detectives.
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: The problem here is that there was no such person
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: on the strength of the Dallas Police Department. The only
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: Richard Swain was a lieutenant in the Burglary and Theft Bureau,
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: and his duties on November twenty fourth are clearly described
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: in his official reports Chief Curry dated the fourth of December,
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: and they do not include searching Ruby's car, okay. And
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: the testimony of Lieutenant Vernon Smart of the Auto Thing Bureau, however,
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: he is mentioned as being present at that search, So
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: there's a little discrepancy there, okay. And then it goes
• 15:11
  Speaker 4: on to state a little further down, Okay, the initial
• 15:21
  Speaker 4: stages of the attempted search did not proceed smoothly of
• 15:24
  Speaker 4: Jack Ruby's car, and the warrant commissioned testimony of two
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: car park attendants, one John Daniels and one Theodore Jackson
• 15:38
  Speaker 4: makes amusing reading as they describe how they watched the
• 15:41
  Speaker 4: actions of the police during the search of the car.
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: It then says that Ruby had parked his car in
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: the All State parking lot okay, situated on the northeastern
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: corner of Maine and Pearl, directly opposite the Western Union Office.
• 15:59
  Speaker 4: So from my memory, Joe, I believe the Western Union
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: office was like Caddy diagonally Caddy corner from the entrance
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: to the basement, you know, over on the other corner.
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: So if this parking lot was across from the Western Union,
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: I'm guessing it would have been over this way a
• 16:21
  Speaker 4: little bit. I mean, it's still kind of close by
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: the basement, but definitely not on the street, you know
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: what I'm saying, Like, Yeah, it wasn't parked right on
• 16:30
  Speaker 4: the street, you know, to where he would have could
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: have pulled up and then dipped in there quickly somehow,
• 16:35
  Speaker 4: you know what i mean. Yeah, wherever he parked in
• 16:38
  Speaker 4: his parking lot, he had to walk. You know, that's
• 16:42
  Speaker 4: not a huge distance, but you know, maybe, yeah, something
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: like that at least. Yeah. So see, they said there
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: was no parking attendant there when he parked his car
• 16:56
  Speaker 4: on the lot a little after eleven am. As we
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: shall see d D. He removed his keys munition, but
• 17:03
  Speaker 4: he did not lock the car. He left Sheba on
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: the front seat of the car. He did, however, remove
• 17:10
  Speaker 4: his Revolver from its usual place in the trunk of
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: the car and take it with him. According to Larry Crayford,
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: one of Ruby's Carousel Club employees, Ruby always kept his
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: revolver in a moneysack in the trunk of the car. Okay,
• 17:26
  Speaker 4: so then we slide on over to the trunk of
• 17:33
  Speaker 4: Ruby's car. Let's see. So this was a kind of
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: like a weird situation. Okay, So Lieutenant Smart, the guy
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: was in charge of the burliary and theft division who
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: actually searched Ruby's car, so that he began his search
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: of the car by opening the glove compartment. But Ruby
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: had mentioned that he kept a key to the trunk
• 18:04
  Speaker 4: in the glove compartment. Yeah, so the glove compartment itself
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: contained Ruby's wallet. Okay, so Ruby did not have his
• 18:13
  Speaker 4: wallet on him, He had a thick roll of cash
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: in his pocket, some business cards in the trunk key.
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: The wallet, described as a billfo billfold, contained Ruby's driver's
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: license and several cards of ID, but no cash. Underneath
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: the wallet, Lieutenant Smart found a single General motors key.
• 18:35
  Speaker 4: After trying it in the ignition and switch and finding
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: it did not fit, he rightfully assumed it would fit
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: the trunk, and he proceeded to search the trunk before
• 18:42
  Speaker 4: continuing to the interior of the car. Okay, so they
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: asked him Bert Griffin when he was. They asked Lieutenant
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: Smart during his warm commission testimony. They said, well, what
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: did you see when you opened that trunk? And he replied, well,
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: some paper bags and some bank sacks, and just full
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: of junk, except there was a set of keys laying
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: right down in the open. Our mister Ruby does not
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: appear to have been the world's tidiest man. One of
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: the keys on the key ring found did fit the
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: car's ignission. Lieutenant Smart also found quote the money, and
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: he took possession of it as instructed, okay, leaving the
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: vehicle where it was. He returned to city Hall and
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: handed over the wallet, the keys, and the money. So
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: he goes into the glove compartment to find a key
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: to the trunk, and in the trunk he finds the
• 19:39
  Speaker 4: keys to the car. Okay, yep, and apparently found more
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: money in the car, not just the equivalent of twenty
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: grand in Ruby's pocket, and he was arrested. Okay. So
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: he had thrown everything inside a large grocery bag that
• 19:59
  Speaker 4: he had also found in the tr runk of the car,
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: and he counted the money out and initialed it. It
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: was found that the money in the trunk amounted to
• 20:09
  Speaker 4: eight hundred and seventy three dollars and fifty cents, including
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: approximately seventy three dollars in silver and four hundred dollars
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: and five dollar bills. It's like eighty five dollar bills.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: Very weird combinations of money here. So basically Ruby had
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: on him in total approximately twenty nine hundred dollars in
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: cash in silver, which would equal in today's money twenty
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: nine or thirty thirty thousand dollars. Yeah, which is a
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: lot of money, Yeah.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: Especially when you think I think Ruby was kind of
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: aware that whatever he was told to do was going
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: to be some type of suicide mission, right. So you know,
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: we've talked about the safe in his in the Carousel
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: club and other things and money he had in there,
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: but that seems like an awful amount of money to
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: leave to the authorities. Really is what you're doing.
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And he was specifically sent out there because when
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: they were questioning Ruby and searching him, he specifically told
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: him to go to the car to get his dog,
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: get the money and his car keys, and bring everything
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: back to the station. He was worried about his dog,
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: he was worried about his money, and apparently he left
• 21:45
  Speaker 4: his car keys in the trunk in his haste to
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: get to the basement. Yeah, he.
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: Left the car doors unlocked, but put put the key
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: to the trunk, or put the keys in the trunk
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: and the key to the trunk in the glove compartment.
• 22:04
  Speaker 4: It's yes, Poorsheba was found hiding underneath of a newspaper
• 22:10
  Speaker 4: on the front seat.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: Okay, under a newspaper in the front seat, Yeah, okay.
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: Also found in the trunk where fifty nine numbered permanent
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: passes to the Carousel Club for a great variety of people,
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: including Dallas District Attorney Bill Alexander, Andy Anderson, manager of
• 22:29
  Speaker 4: the Adolphus Hotel, Dallas Police Patrolman Ray Hawkins, and several
• 22:34
  Speaker 4: local media people press and radio, and some more local businessmen.
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: They also found a pistol holster that they described as
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: musty and moldy for a snubnosed revolver. They also found
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: a set of aluminum knuckles.
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: A is that like brass knuckles from the sixties?
• 22:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah, just different? Yeah, they found actually they found three
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: different pair. They found what they described as a set
• 23:07
  Speaker 4: of aluminum knuckles and a set of used aluminium knuckles,
• 23:12
  Speaker 4: and a bank zipper bag containing a brand new set
• 23:15
  Speaker 4: of aluminium knuckles.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: Oh, how do you tell if a pair of aluminum
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: knuckles is used?
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: They might have a little blood on them, a little
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: you know, flesh with blood. Okay, okay, just dance, who
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: the hell does? Yeah, but he had a brand new
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: pair that was in a bank zipper bag. Also in
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: the trunk a Victor adding machine. Uh, and also several
• 23:47
  Speaker 4: crutch or chair leg rubber tips. Yeah, there's a mystery
• 23:56
  Speaker 4: for you, tiny dancer. Also also found was one dog muzzle,
• 24:04
  Speaker 4: one umberella, one radio, one partially filled can of varnish stain,
• 24:12
  Speaker 4: one pair of long white Ladies gloves Joe, one black
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: plastic ring coat, one paper for sale sign, one white
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: bathing cap, one pair of brown golf shoes size ten
• 24:29
  Speaker 4: and a half, one pronographic record entitled Figure Control for Women,
• 24:37
  Speaker 4: one carton containing several hundred and eight x ten glossy
• 24:40
  Speaker 4: photographs of exotic dancer Jada, and one twist waist exerciser.
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: There was also several sortied items of gentlemen's clothing, including underwear, slacks,
• 24:55
  Speaker 4: sports jackets, and two piece suits, and, keeping with Ruby's
• 25:03
  Speaker 4: use of the trunk of his car as his office,
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: numerous bills, papers, document stationary business cars, accounts, receipts, slips
• 25:10
  Speaker 4: of paper bearing phone numbers, bank dress, telephone bills, newspaper
• 25:14
  Speaker 4: clipping stamps, envelopes eight excuse me a gv A contracts,
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: parking tickets were also found. He even had Carousel Club
• 25:23
  Speaker 4: certificate of occupancy and his Texas Liquor Control Board permit
• 25:27
  Speaker 4: in there. The final part of the car to research
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: appears to have been the ash tray. This was found
• 25:33
  Speaker 4: to contain quote, twelve cigarette butts, some filter tip, others not,
• 25:38
  Speaker 4: some bearing lipstick traces, others not only brand names readable on.
• 25:43
  Speaker 4: There was Winston who was responsible for the lipstick traces,
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: I wondered, Joe George, Senator Shirley. I just okay, So
• 26:02
  Speaker 4: that's that's it. I just wanted to kick off the
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: show and tie up a little loose endside because I found,
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: you know, a legit inventory of Jack Ruby's shit, so
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: basically almost thirty grand on his person, which is.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: Crazy, Yeah, especially when when you consider the amount of
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: debt he was allegedly.
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: In, yes, possible using those rubber tips as who knows,
• 26:36
  Speaker 4: use your imaginations, you dirty minded people. Uh and yes,
• 26:49
  Speaker 4: for the newer folks. Locals did not work very well
• 26:52
  Speaker 4: for us due to our size. We had begging a bit,
• 27:00
  Speaker 4: but their restrictions on certain things such as live shows, yeah,
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: and various other things based base it is based off
• 27:12
  Speaker 4: of your membership numbers, and for us to grow over there,
• 27:17
  Speaker 4: it would have been substantially harder than to just do
• 27:21
  Speaker 4: what we do here. And you know, everything is here
• 27:26
  Speaker 4: already anyway, the Locals thing will be up for the
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: people that paid for it. And I would just tell
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: everybody he cancel your ship over there and just come
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: over here and join the membership show. Because we we
• 27:41
  Speaker 4: had a banger this past Wednesday, didn't we jail?
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: We always do.
• 27:47
  Speaker 4: Yes, we gave the people that money's worth. It was
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: almost a two hour show, and we went into all
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: kinds of stuff that you know, we just don't have
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: time to or the inclination to talk about here on
• 28:00
  Speaker 4: Friday nights.
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and we always say like, okay, we're going to
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: keep this members only to like half an hour.
• 28:07
  Speaker 7: Maybe one hour, and then.
• 28:11
  Speaker 4: Boom two hours in. Yeah, it is what it is.
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think there was a comment, I think
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: it was from Paula hold On Well Chris said this
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: might be an alias of some guy. But I look
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: like a member of the Beastie Boys.
• 28:32
  Speaker 4: Okay, but the dead one.
• 28:40
  Speaker 7: I don't know, Mike.
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: Or king ed Rod.
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: That beats me here. Oh and Paula was asking I
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: think she was asking why she couldn't view the members only.
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: I believe paul Or you are of the spook level
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: and for our members only, we have the instead of
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: the five dollars one, the ten and the top tier
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: level for members only.
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: But I think we're doing like you can upgrade your membership.
• 29:21
  Speaker 4: I think Sally did so if you, if you're already
• 29:23
  Speaker 4: a spook, you can upgrade to a covert operator for
• 29:26
  Speaker 4: five more bucks a month, I believe. And you have
• 29:29
  Speaker 4: access to everything that we've already done, plus all the
• 29:32
  Speaker 4: new stuff as well.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: Yes, yes, And I think Tiny just explained it very
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: well there.
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: And Joe still hold on Where to Go still the
• 29:48
  Speaker 4: best title for an episode ever, George power Bottom, it's
• 29:55
  Speaker 4: up there all of an episode too. Let me tell
• 29:57
  Speaker 4: you that was a fun one.
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it is up there. It's a It's a funny
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: episode for sure.
• 30:05
  Speaker 4: Damn right.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: And Chris also said I look like him in my
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: partner's bedroom. Close basement close. So all right, well thank
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: you for that, sir.
• 30:25
  Speaker 4: Let's get into some William Pinky Westbrook if you will.
• 30:29
  Speaker 4: That's your name, pinky man, What the hell is going
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: with that? I mean, is that what you're working with?
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: Or I mean very possibly. I think it was his
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: name due to his like complexion, Like his pink complexion
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: is what I know. No, you know, like some of
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: those people that like, I don't want to say the
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: wrong thing like that, just get like really red or
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: pink in the face.
• 30:55
  Speaker 4: Sometimes maybe you're in the seven little rosation.
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's what it was referring to, but
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: that's only allegedly what I read. So but yes, mister Westbrook,
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: Captain William Roy Westbrook, and he's a very sus character
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: in the DPD. And I'm not sure if he's number
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: one for me, Rob, but I think he has to
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: be top three for sure, and a lot of people
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: have done a lot of great research on him.
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: Of course, this is what it looked like for people
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: who don't know. He's on the left giant forehead. His
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: nickname was not only Pinky, it was also five head
• 31:57
  Speaker 4: he had say which four? It was more than it,
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: it was a five hit I had couldn't even cover
• 32:04
  Speaker 4: that thing up, Joe, Yes, sir.
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: I have a couple more as well. And he was
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: born in November of nineteen seventeen, died in nineteen ninety six.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: And he worked for the DPD for about twenty five years,
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: which is a long time of course to work for
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: the DPD.
• 32:37
  Speaker 4: He was.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: So he was part of like the personnel bureau and
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: he hold on, let me bring this up real quick.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: So he was the captain of the uh personnel bureau,
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: and uh, his task was not really of a detective,
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: it was more of administrative.
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: And uh, Joe, real quick, Joe, hold on, sure, sure?
• 33:16
  Speaker 4: That so great. That's a great comment here from James.
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: We love great comments.
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: One bitcoin monthly you can be in the mini men
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: splinter group that we're going to form. That's right, I'll
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: tell you what. You donate a bitcoin per month, I'll
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: personally storm the capitol. Okay, I promise you. Yeah.
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: What what is the bitcoin now? Like one hundred grand?
• 33:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, yeah, the storm is happening naked for one
• 33:53
  Speaker 4: hundred thousand dollars a month. Yeah, just baby Crockett hat on.
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: Definitely nothing to sneeze at.
• 34:03
  Speaker 4: For sure, dat continue. Sorry, that's okay.
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: We we love a good comment here.
• 34:14
  Speaker 4: And yeah, Paula is now a covert operator. She upgraded. Yeah,
• 34:19
  Speaker 4: thank you, Paula.
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: Paula, you are the best and also my designated driver.
• 34:28
  Speaker 4: To what ten other shows now that we've done since
• 34:31
  Speaker 4: we started.
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: This, Yeah, I think we've at least we have eight,
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: but I missed one famously last week last week.
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: But but I still did it by myself, so it's
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: still yes, yes, yes, and uh being tiny, it was
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: just me and tiny. That's it.
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: Hey, that's all you need. Really, it is tiny because
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: she she crushes.
• 34:56
  Speaker 4: Guest co host for the evening Tiny Dancer.
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: Deep stay Tiny, we love you.
• 35:07
  Speaker 4: We'll do it for ninety thousand, It's okay.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, a little bit of a discount. So of course,
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: you know, a lot of things have been written and
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: talked about about Captain William Westbrook, most famously his being
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: a personnel officer and being kind of an indoor not
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: on the street guy was everywhere in the during the
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: events of November. The afternoon of November twenty second, nineteen
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: sixty three, from the TSBD to the Tippet shooting to
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: the Texas Theater and even until Sunday morning in the
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: basement of the Dallas Police Station, where, of course, Lee
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: Harvey Oswald was famously murdered on live TV by Jack Ruby.
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: And you know, very very suss things going on with him.
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: But let me read a couple more things here and
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: then we will go into his movements and his warrant
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: commissioned testimony. So it's funny you mentioned rob Ian Griggs
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: because he's done or he did a lot of research
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: on the DPD in Westbrook, and this is what he
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: has to say here. According to British policeman and JFK
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: a researcher, Ian Griggs, he just Westbrook worked as the
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: personnel as it was described as working in the DPD
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: Personnel Department. And this was actually a tiny bureau just
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: down the hall from the homicide offices, and was under
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: command of the ubiquitous Captain William Roy Westbrook. He had
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: under his control one sergeant and I'll get into him
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: in a little bit, two detectives, one patrolman, and three
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: female civilian clerical workers. He described the work of the
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: bureau as background investigations of applicants and the investigation of
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: personal complaints. I feel that most readers will be familiar
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: with most my widely published paper just another day at
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: the Office. We're going to read a couple of things
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: from that as well. At the time of the JFK assassination,
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: Westbrook was the captain of the Personnel Bureau and the
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: DPD Training and Research Section, and he heard about the
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: assassination when he was at the DPD headquarters. And we're
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: gonna get into this in a second, but said, because
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: there were no cars, he had to walk to the
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: TSPD And all right, so let's get into that. Now,
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: let's start some of this on.
• 38:34
  Speaker 4: You start getting into that. Yep. Randy asked why you
• 38:39
  Speaker 4: call it the lone Guming Podcast when it's all about conspiracy,
• 38:42
  Speaker 4: will real quick, real quick for you. When I started
• 38:49
  Speaker 4: doing the show ten years ago, it was just me
• 38:53
  Speaker 4: in a microphone. So the title is somewhat ironic because
• 39:00
  Speaker 4: of course the loan Gumman is a theory perpetrated by
• 39:05
  Speaker 4: loan nutters, right, So I thought it wasn't just a
• 39:09
  Speaker 4: stupid me being stupid with the ironic title, And now
• 39:12
  Speaker 4: it's even more stupid than ironic, considering there's two hosts
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: to the Loan Guman Podcast.
• 39:18
  Speaker 5: That.
• 39:18
  Speaker 4: That's all. It doesn't get any more deep than that.
• 39:22
  Speaker 4: But thank you for your question, sir.
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know, I love the name because you know,
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: we've talked about possible loan gunman's, say like Thomas Crooks
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: or the other guy Rourke whatever, the second guy in
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: Florida or the guy in the United Healthcare CEO killing
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: and were they loan gummans or were they not? So
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: it's it's a very relevant title.
• 39:52
  Speaker 4: It's the one technicality we can use to branch off
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: from the JFK conspiracy and still be technically talking about
• 40:00
  Speaker 4: loan gunment.
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: And shadow band at the same time.
• 40:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but we don't pull that card much. We don't
• 40:09
  Speaker 4: really stray too much off topic.
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: No, no, soh so we know Westbrook was not only
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: at the tippet scene. And I have a good video
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: that was sent by a front of the show that
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: will shout out with shortly about that.
• 40:28
  Speaker 4: Uh oh, I'm sorry, uh oh, what happened? Randy says wrong.
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: The lone gunment theory is a fact, not a theory
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: in my opinion, So Randy must be a loan nutter. Well, Randy,
• 40:45
  Speaker 4: if you keep listening to this show, we're going to
• 40:47
  Speaker 4: change your mind. Just all we ask is that you
• 40:50
  Speaker 4: have an open mind. That's some of the things we discuss,
• 40:53
  Speaker 4: that's all. And sometimes we do have real life loan
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: nutters on the show. Lone nutterers love me. I'm friend
• 40:58
  Speaker 4: with a lot of them. You might be the next one.
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: So he's hanging there with Grandy Okay, Yeah, we love low.
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: Nutters and anyone that has an open mind and kind
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: of open to hearing more context about this topic that
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: we all share. Interesting. So let's start, sir, with the
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: warrant commissioned testimony of Captain William Roy Westbrook.
• 41:31
  Speaker 4: You can cut have to William in the Roy just
• 41:33
  Speaker 4: call him Captain Westbrook.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: Now, yes, Captain west Yes, yeah, yes, like that actually
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: makes it easier for me, sir. So one of the
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: first questions, mister Joseph Ball is interrogating Westbrook, and this
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: actually happened to Dallas. They didn't bring him to d C.
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: But he was an ununiformed officer on that day and
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: most days. So if you see a picture of a
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: DPD officer in uniform, it's probably it's not Westbrook. And
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: Westbrook says, no, I was not in uniform. Mister Ball
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: Where were you when you heard the president had been shot?
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: Captain Westbrook, I was in my office and missus Kinney,
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: one of the dispatchers, came into the office and told us,
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: of course it was the same as everyone says. We
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: didn't believe it until a second look at her and
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: I realized it was. So there was a little confusion
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: because everyone became rather excited, right quick, Yeah, I bet.
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: But somebody I don't know who it was came into
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: my office and said they needed some more men at
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: the TSBD. But he didn't go to the TSBD immediately.
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: He said, he sat around for a while. He doesn't
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: specify how long, not knowing what to do, because of
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: almost all of the commanding officers and supervisors were out
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: of this city hall. And I finally couldn't stand it
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: any longer, Westbrook says, So we started to the TSBD
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: and believe it or not, and that is up to you,
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen. He walked to the TSBD, which is
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: about twenty minute walk. It's a little more than a while,
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: but we will hear later someone said that he actually
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: a sergeant under his control actually said that he was
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: driven there with Westbrook. So This is a major point
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: of contention, and definitely not one that I have disguised.
• 44:03
  Speaker 4: We don't know, but it must be about timing for
• 44:07
  Speaker 4: some reason. I don't know why.
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: But yeah, so that's the thing, Rob, Like, why why
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: would you lie about that? It doesn't seem irrelevant, That's.
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: One thing you wouldn't forget And why did you lie
• 44:19
  Speaker 4: about it?
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: Right unless you work doing something else at the time
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: and you needed.
• 44:27
  Speaker 4: To cover Yeah, whatever you were doing, you know, yeah,
• 44:33
  Speaker 4: a little bit.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean that's the only thing that really
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: makes sense, But that is, of course speculation. Westbrook continues,
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: There wasn't a car available, so I walked from City
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: Hall to the TSBD, and I would stop on the
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: way down where they would there would be a group
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: of people listening to someone's transistor radio, and I would
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: stop and catch a few false reports, might say, at
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: that time, until I reached the building. So he's kind
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: of saying that as he was walking down he was
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: stopping and like huddling with other people on the street
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: that were listening to a radio, or or famously like
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: in the JFK movie where they were like looking at
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: the live broadcast for information. But why would a DPD
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: captain have to do. That really doesn't make sense.
• 45:33
  Speaker 4: He must have forgotted radio too, well he.
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: He he wasn't. He was definitely an administrative type.
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: So but.
• 45:46
  Speaker 4: That we can carry all that ship in his suit pockets,
• 45:50
  Speaker 4: Westbrook could have carried a radio, That's all I'm saying.
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: Oh for sure, yeah, so uh, Westbrook continues. He contacted
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: his sergeant, Sergeant RD. Stringer, and was standing afront and
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: then went into the building to help start the search.
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: He's talking about the TSBD and Westbrook was on the
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: first floor. He had walked down an aisle and opened
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: a door onto an onside outside loading deck, loading dock.
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry, and when I came out of this dock,
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: one of the men hollered and said there had been
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: an officer killed in Oak Cliff. Of course they are
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: referring to JD. Tippett. Yes, Westbrook continues, Well, then of
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: course I ran to my radio, so maybe he did.
• 46:43
  Speaker 4: On hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. So
• 46:50
  Speaker 4: if he had a radio, he had to hear the
• 46:52
  Speaker 4: police chatter about everything that was going on. So why
• 46:55
  Speaker 4: would he need to stop along the way and over
• 46:58
  Speaker 4: listen to news reports? Makes no sense.
• 47:03
  Speaker 8: Whatsoever, but continues, Yeah, and why would he could say,
• 47:09
  Speaker 8: like I listened to an officer's radio, but he said,
• 47:13
  Speaker 8: my my radio.
• 47:16
  Speaker 4: So that set it down somewhere and then went back
• 47:18
  Speaker 4: to it, or he left it in the car that
• 47:20
  Speaker 4: he went there in and went back to it.
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, which makes more sense. It's it's yeah,
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: very susswording here. And he might have unintentionally contradicted himself,
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: but you think I think so, yes, sir, Well, of
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: course I ran to my radio because I am the
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: personnel officer, and then that and that then became of
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: course my greatest interest right at the time.
• 47:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah, fuck the president. We got an officer down. M Yeah.
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: And many people have theorized that the tip Tippot shooting
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: was to kind of uh get a lot of the
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: Dallas Police officers h hyped up upset, right, like motivated,
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: because we've heard a lot of I think it was
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: Levell that said this that the DPD a lot of
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: the officers were more upset about the Tippet murder than
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: they were about the murder of the president.
• 48:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so brother down.
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and uh and so Sergeant Stringer and I
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: and some patrolman I don't recall his name. Then drove
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: to the immediate vicinity of where Officer Tippett had been
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: shot and killed. Of course, the body was already gone,
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: the squad.
• 48:57
  Speaker 4: Car was still there.
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: And on one occasion, as we were approaching the squad car,
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: a call came over the radio that a suspicious person
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: had been cited running into the public library at Marsalis,
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: Marsalis and Jefferson. So we immediately went to that location.
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: And it was a false kind of report, and it
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: was just one of the Actually it was one of
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: the employees of the library who had heard the news
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: somewhere in the radio and was running to tell the
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: other group about Kennedy.
• 49:36
  Speaker 4: Okay, So we.
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: Returned to the scene, and here is where I met
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: FBI agent Bob Barrett.
• 49:46
  Speaker 4: So they went to the tipo scene. They left there
• 49:48
  Speaker 4: and went into the library, and then they came back
• 49:51
  Speaker 4: to the tipo scene.
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: Yes, okay, and yeah, he met his support, his subordinate,
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: Sargan Stringer, and FBI agent Barrett, and they were all together.
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: And then an eyewitness to the shooting of the officer
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: from across the street, a lady came to the car,
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: a lady, and she was telling us how.
• 50:19
  Speaker 4: This happened, Helen Malcolm, Hell, lady, was it, well, we
• 50:24
  Speaker 4: will see.
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: Was your car parked at the time. It wasn't my car,
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: we didn't have one. I don't know where this officer
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: went after he let us out at the scene. So
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: he's saying he doesn't know who drove.
• 50:41
  Speaker 4: Him initially because they had to called a ride to
• 50:48
  Speaker 4: the library and then back, and then they were dropped
• 50:51
  Speaker 4: off again at the Tippet scene, and then that officer left.
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: I think he's saying that the officer that drove him
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: from the church back to the tip of scene, he
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: does not know who he is. But he's very vague.
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry the library, not the church. Yeah, I'm sorry
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: at the library, thank you, sir. But he's very vague
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: in all of this, like you're not going to find
• 51:15
  Speaker 1: specific details in his testimony of who was where and
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: then even who was with him during when he heard
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: about Kennedy for the first time. And let's see, an
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: officer drove us to the scene. Mister Westbrook says, were
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: you when this lady came up to you? Who was
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: an eyewitness? Mister Ball asks Westbrook. We were at the
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: squad car Tippets squad car. It had never been moved.
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: Mister Ball. You were near tenth and Patton, Westbrook, and
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: she was telling us what had occurred. Do you remember
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: her name? No, the other officers got it. Was it
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: a missus Markham? It could have been, sir, I don't recall,
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: Westbrook says, because I directed someone there to be sure
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: and get her name for the report. But she lived
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: directly across the street, and she told us, or was
• 52:20
  Speaker 1: in the process of telling us how it occurred, what
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: she had seen when someone hollered. A patrolman hollered quote,
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: it just came over the radio that they got some
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: It then came over the radio that they've got a
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: suspicious person at the Texas Theater. So, of course Westbrook,
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: similar to Croy, who doesn't know where he got who
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: handed him the wallet, right, some random witness a legit
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: wallet right, Westbrook also did not get that witness his name.
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: And I guess this excuse here is because he thought
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: the other people did. And it could have been Markham.
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 53:10
  Speaker 4: And since we're here and we're talking about the wallet, Joe,
• 53:12
  Speaker 4: I just wanted to question inject something really quick.
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And I got the video after if you want, okay, yeah.
• 53:22
  Speaker 4: When we're talking about the wallet, I came across something
• 53:24
  Speaker 4: that somebody talked about. And nobody ever actually claimed that
• 53:31
  Speaker 4: Oswald's wallet was found at the tipp And murder scene
• 53:34
  Speaker 4: until FBI agent James Hosty published his book as Simon
• 53:37
  Speaker 4: Oswald in nineteen ninety six. While writing the book, Hosty
• 53:42
  Speaker 4: collaborated with fellow former agent FBI agent Bob Barrett, who
• 53:46
  Speaker 4: we know was with Westbrook. Barrett and Barrett alone claimed
• 53:50
  Speaker 4: to Hosty that he thought he were called DPD Captain
• 53:53
  Speaker 4: Westbrook rummaging through a wallet at the tip And murder scene.
• 53:56
  Speaker 4: While asking Barrett if he knew anything about an Oswald
• 53:59
  Speaker 4: or a high Yeah, Hosty speculated that Westbrook probably gave
• 54:05
  Speaker 4: this wallet to officers at the Dallas Theater when everyone
• 54:08
  Speaker 4: converged on the scene to arrest Oswald. Hosty undoubtedly did
• 54:13
  Speaker 4: not want to openly refute or dispute the matter with
• 54:15
  Speaker 4: his old friend Barrett and gave him too much benefit
• 54:17
  Speaker 4: of the doubt. Barrett admitted to Hosty that he did
• 54:21
  Speaker 4: not see any of the contents of this so called
• 54:23
  Speaker 4: wallet at the crime scene, and because he thought he
• 54:27
  Speaker 4: remembered discussing in an Oswald or a hidel at the
• 54:31
  Speaker 4: Tippet scene. He assumed that the wallet Westbrook was rummaging
• 54:34
  Speaker 4: through had to have been Oswalt's. Here's where the speculation
• 54:37
  Speaker 4: falls to pieces. Though Captain Westbrook passed away in nineteen
• 54:43
  Speaker 4: ninety six, and Hosty did not consult Westbrook at all
• 54:47
  Speaker 4: on this matter for his book that came out in
• 54:49
  Speaker 4: nineteen ninety four. So if Captain Westbrook was indeed in
• 54:52
  Speaker 4: possession of an Oswald wallet at the Tippet murder scene,
• 54:56
  Speaker 4: he'd know full well that it would be absolutely crucial
• 54:59
  Speaker 4: to the invent instigation that he'd document the finding of
• 55:02
  Speaker 4: Oswald's wallet at the scene of a murder. It would
• 55:05
  Speaker 4: be the piece of evidence that broke the case wide
• 55:08
  Speaker 4: opened for them. It would be a focal point of
• 55:10
  Speaker 4: police interrogation of Oswald. Example, Lee, why did we find
• 55:16
  Speaker 4: your wallet next to a murdered police officer. So let's
• 55:21
  Speaker 4: go a little further. Westbrook never ever put any such
• 55:24
  Speaker 4: thing in a report anywhere that week or ever. And
• 55:28
  Speaker 4: if Westbrook was in on a plot to frame Oswald,
• 55:30
  Speaker 4: don't you think he made a certain to point out
• 55:33
  Speaker 4: the discovery of that wallet at the crime scene. The
• 55:36
  Speaker 4: planting of a wallet with Oswald's real and fake IDs
• 55:40
  Speaker 4: would have been absolutely paramount of importance. Wouldn't Westbrook be
• 55:44
  Speaker 4: on the horn with police headquarters describing the suspect based
• 55:47
  Speaker 4: on the discovery of these IDs. Wouldn't he be making
• 55:51
  Speaker 4: it obvious that the killer left his wallet behind if
• 55:53
  Speaker 4: planting or discovering the wallet was his role. The most
• 55:57
  Speaker 4: luckily scenario here is that agent Bob Barrett, decade after
• 56:00
  Speaker 4: the fact, misremembered the setting and sequencing of certain events
• 56:04
  Speaker 4: and speculated erroneously that Oswald's wallet was found by Westbrook,
• 56:07
  Speaker 4: because as we know, not only was Westbrook at the
• 56:11
  Speaker 4: Texas Theater for the rest of Oswald, so was Bob Barrett.
• 56:16
  Speaker 4: In all likelihood, the original version was correct all along,
• 56:20
  Speaker 4: that Oswald's wallet was removed from his pocket in the
• 56:22
  Speaker 4: police car by the guy I'll be talking about, Gerald
• 56:26
  Speaker 4: Hill when he refused to give his name to multiple
• 56:29
  Speaker 4: officers present in the vehicle. So I just wanted to
• 56:36
  Speaker 4: throw that out there for the loan nut perspective.
• 56:40
  Speaker 7: Joe, Okay, thank you sir. Yes, you're welcome, all.
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: Right, So let's just continue here. So after that they
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: heard on the radio they had a suspicious person in
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: the Texas Theater, and we are continuing here with mister
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: Westbrook's warrant commission. I think this is the last slide
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: on that. Let's see, let me say uh. Westbrook says
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: it could have been Sir, I don't recall, because I
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: directed someone there to be sure and get her name
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: for the report. But she lived directly across the street.
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: He is referring still to the witness.
• 57:36
  Speaker 4: That had nope.
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: Westbrook continues, Then Sergeant's Stringer, I and Agent Barrett got
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: in another squad car and I don't know what officer
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: was driving this one again. But then when we arrived
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: and we're approaching the Texas Theater, I directed the patrol
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: to turn down into the alley instead of going around
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: to the front, because I had figured there would be
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: a lot of cars in the front. There were two
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: or three at the back. I think he meant two
• 58:13
  Speaker 1: or three cars. So I and Barrett and Sergeant Stringer
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: went to another door, and I n Barrett. We stopped
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: at the first one. We got out. We walked to
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: the first entrance, this was the nearest to us, and
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: we walked into the door. We met an employee of
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: the Texas Theater. Again I do not know his name,
• 58:36
  Speaker 1: but it was taken and he pointed. I don't think
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: I said anything to him. I think he said to me.
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: And he is ranting here in his warm commission testimony,
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: Westbrook continues, quote the man you are looking for now
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: right here, Barrett and I became separated for a short
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: minute or two. I think he was on the other
• 58:55
  Speaker 1: side of the stage, and I'm not for sure, but
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: this boy, report ordered. He pointed to a man he
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: was sitting about in the middle, middle of the row seats,
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: pretty close to the back, and he said, that is
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: the man you are looking for. So again, not a
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: lot of context here from from mister Westbrook. And although
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: I have something else on his UH or on the
• 59:32
  Speaker 1: Texas Theater. So of course this is reading from Ian
• 59:38
  Speaker 1: Gregg's article. Captain Westbrook's day of action was not over
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: the FBI special agent Barrett that accompanied Westbrook through the
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: side doors into the theater, which I think means not
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: the front. So for some reason they know not to
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: go through the front, and we know a lot of
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: officers did go through the front, but for some reason
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: they were parked in the back, and we know there
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: are these reports of another person being taken out of
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: the back. So interesting that Westbrook decides to park in
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: the back because he thought it would be more convenient. Again,
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: this is an administrative.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah, this is not a homicide detective or a street
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 4: cup Yeah.
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: Someone with a lot of Yeah, but like street knowledge, right, yeah,
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: but he seems to have had a lot today or
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: on that day.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 4: For sure. He was a pencil pusher, yeah, a deak
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 4: nerd if you will.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he was definitely a facilitator for sure. And mister
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 1: Ball asked Westbrook in his work mission testimony, what side
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: of the the theater were you on, like what steps
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: I was facing the audience? I would be on the
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: right side, and were you facing the screen? If you're
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: facing the screen? Westbrook said he would have been on
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: the left and the man that was pointing out to
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: you was sitting in the aisle facing the screen. At
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: this point, Captain Westbrook resisted the obvious reply that there
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: would have been a little point in someone indicating the
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: man had his back to the audience. Captain Westbrook then,
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 1: in his work misson testimony, goes on to describe Oswalt's arrest,
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: of course, famously by patrolman McDonald. Right, he was the
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: one that stuck his thumb in Oswalt's alleged revolver.
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 4: Right, Well, not his thumb, but the skin in between
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 4: your thumb and your finger, the little webbing.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: Oh really, that was it?
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 4: That that hurt like a motherfucker too.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that is that would not be fun,
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: allegedly allegedly.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 4: Let me do this.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: So but actually we're out. Before I continue, I forgot.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 4: To play him video. I'm sorry, let's watch the video.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we're getting out.
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry because Alex is in the house this evening,
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 4: and he was kind enough to yes, you ready the
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 4: footage to Joseph here this evening, So thank you Alex
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 4: for the footage. Yes, without further idea, let's roll it
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 4: and see if this thing is a wallet or a
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 4: notebook or what the hell is it? Joe, let's see it.
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 1: Yes, And as I was searching for this super last second.
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 4: I asked to make that little screen than that I won't.
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 1: I asked Alex like half an hour before the show
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: started if he could sendulus and he did. And Alex
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: Harris is the man. Thank you for coming through, sir,
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: so here we go. This is a w f A,
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: a footage of the a couple of things. But but
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: the tippets scene and this did not come out Rob
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: until after Hosty. Right, it wasn't really it might have
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: been out there, It wasn't realized until after host He
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: stated that in his book, right.
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 4: I don't know. Okay, you're putting more as we go.
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 1: Okay, check and maybe correct this. Those are my words,
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 1: not yet.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 4: The police cars pulling into that area.
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 9: Once the report went out that this man was holed
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 9: up in Oakcliff, we all went out in the motorcade.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 5: This is the first building that he was reported in.
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 5: It's an old junk shop, won't.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: That is the jacket ye, which Captain Westbrook also conveniently
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: found allegedly allegedly kiming.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 9: This is the jacket that the man was wearing. He
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 9: discarded it as he ran down the street. An eye
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 9: witness here said that he had seen the man go
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 9: into the building, and this is the rear of it.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 5: The officers converged on it. Once again.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: Let's make a point here.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 4: Now this is the film.
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 1: I pause it, Rob, No, what.
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 4: I thought you were staying in the obvious that you
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 4: paused the video.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 7: Oh I was going to.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: Say, I believe the plane closed. Officer on the left
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 1: is Westbrook right here.
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 4: Yes, okay, pink, yes, assume the brain film.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 7: It is a suspect.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 5: This is a suspect.
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 9: Yes, they saw this man running in and out the
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 9: dancer the description of the original man.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 5: No, this this is an eyewitness.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 4: Yay.
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 9: The man that is being interrogated gated here said he
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 9: saw the man run down the street. Of course, everywhere
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 9: we went the crowds converged and hampered operations quite a bit.
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 1: This is this So this is the Tippet murder scene.
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 1: I believe the squad car is on the right, his
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: squad car, his car. His car was dark colored.
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 9: Okay, scene where the police officer was shot. The car
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 9: that you see in the background there belonged to the
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 9: police officer. And this woman said that she's.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 4: Not that lady. I'm sorry, wrong, wrong, scene that's not
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 4: Markham is It doesn't look like it.
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 5: No.
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 4: I remember Helen Markham looking rather lovely, and I would
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 4: say that one's not, but pray continue, well it could
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 4: have been the other. I mean, she's decent, but she's
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 4: not like Hella Markham hot, you know.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 1: Right, A Hella Markham's sixty three hot? Right?
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: I remember, guys, Uh, Westbrook.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 9: Is not in the uniform scene A man answering the
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 9: description of the man that was later captured, run up,
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 9: stop the officer and then shoot him. About that time,
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 9: another report came in that there was to the Texas
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 9: Theater further down the block with a shotgun over his arm.
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 5: Of course, everybody broke and ran down into the area.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 1: That is this right here. I don't know if it's Westbrook.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 4: I don't know, No, it's it is not that big time.
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 5: This gun that you see on the.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 9: Right, yeah, background here in this officer's hand is the
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 9: one that allegedly was used to shoot the police officer.
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 9: This is the officer's billfold that was found lying on
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 9: the ground right alongside of.
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 4: The carse Now they just identify that as JD. Tippett's
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 4: billfold that was laying beside the car. Rewinded. Just just
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 4: the cooney here there, Joe, sure hear it again?
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 9: Listen up, folks, and is the one that allegedly was
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 9: used to shoot the police officer. This is the officer's
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 9: billfold that was found lying on the ground right alongside
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 9: of the car. The prime investigators here are fingerprinting the
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 9: car and hopes that they could possibly lift a print
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 9: to use. Now we're inside of the Texas Theater. Of course,
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 9: everything is black. The movie is going on.
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 5: Police suddenly jumped.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 9: This man and started to drag him out of the theater,
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 9: hustled him out to the car. As the crowd broke
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 9: and started to mall the police officers and grab this
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 9: man trying to run with him. They shouted murder and
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 9: just almost anything to try and get at this man.
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 9: As you see here, the officers hustled him into the
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 9: car and as fast as they could from this Texas
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 9: Theater and hope that time another report came in that
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 9: there was a man had the Texas Theater further down
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 9: the block with a shotgun.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 4: Over what are you doing over there? Where?
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 5: His arm across everybody broke and ran down into the area.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 7: At the time.
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 9: This gun that you see in the background here in
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 9: this officer's hand is the one that allegedly was used
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 9: to shoot the police officer.
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 5: You think that's this is the officers that was found.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 4: I'm just saying what the guy said.
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 5: Lying on the ground right alongside again to the car.
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 9: The crime investigators here are fingerprinting the car and hopes
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 9: that they could possibly lift.
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry, killed the video. Okay, so they're saying this
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 4: tip is wallet. What kind of makes sense if you
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 4: think about it in these terms. So not only did
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 4: the police never say that they had found an Oswald
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 4: wallet at the Tipp crime scene. Now maybe they didn't
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 4: because Oswald had one on and when they arrested him
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 4: with the Texas theater and the creation of two billfo
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 4: two billfolds with Oswald Id's in him would make it
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 4: look like they framed him, you know what I'm saying,
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 4: And maybe that's why they didn't say anything. I don't know,
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 4: but this is contemporaneous of you know, the whole scene,
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 4: and they're saying it's tip, it's billfold. Now why that
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 4: makes sense in a sense is Okay, you can imagine, okay, tip,
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 4: it gets shot, right and the alleged murderer flees. Okay,
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 4: you have all these witnesses to the tip of shooting
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 4: right multiples, and there's reports that people are going over
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 4: to see or to help try to help him use
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 4: his also using his car radio to you know, radio
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 4: in and say hey, there's his officer down whatever. And
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 4: obviously with his wounds, he died rather quickly, if not immediately,
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 4: you know, to to the body one of the head. Somebody,
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 4: either a witness or you know, a stand or by
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 4: may have pulled Tippet's wallet out of his pocket to
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 4: identify him, okay, just to see who he was. It
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 4: could have been done by the people that came to
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 4: pick him up from the funeral home and they forgot
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 4: it on the ground. It could be a number of things.
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 4: If it's tip it's wallet. If it was an Oswald wallet,
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 4: you know, then of course having two wallets is a
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 4: problem because nobody carries two wallets, So it would have
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 4: looked like somebody was trying to frame him, or they
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 4: had a problem of Oswald being impersonated, which leads into
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 4: a whole different conspiracy rabbit hole on its own. So
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 4: they just forgot that wallet, moved on with the one
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 4: found on them at the Texas Theater Oswald and had
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 4: the IDs in it and all that jazz. So that's
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 4: all I wanted to add to that.
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 1: I think it's plausible, Honestly, I think it's very plausible.
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 1: I think it could. This might not be the most
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 1: conspiratorial statement, but I think that could possibly explain the
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: different wallets. Of course we do not know. But I
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: have a couple more slides here, sir.
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 4: And welcome to the Joe Show everybody.
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 7: Yeah, I know, right, yeah, why is this coming up?
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 1: I'm going to read one thing here from Bill Simpach's
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 1: work really quickly, state secret, which you can find on
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 1: Mary Ferrell Foundation dot org. Two Dallas police officers and
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: a colleague should have been considered prime suspects. The planners
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: couldn't run this operation with our friends inside the Dallas
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 1: office who had access to the evidence. One of them
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: is Captain quote Pinky Westbrook, who was at the scene
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 1: of the Tippets Lang and the Texas theater. I have
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 1: a few problems with Westbrook. He was a personnel officer
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 1: in charge of internal investigations. Westbrook had access to all
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 1: of the police officers internal files. Such a person has
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 1: a lot of power. Uh, I'm just gonna stop there, Rob. Yes, So,
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 1: if you were another intelligence agency and you wanted to, say,
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 1: put one of your guys in ah infiltrate them into
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: the DPD, how would you do it? Well, you would
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 1: have to have the connect of the personnel officer and uh,
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 1: you know it's when you think about people like Kroy
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 1: or what's the other one, uh, the picture guy, uh
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 1: roscill White, like who would where would you kind of
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 1: put them if if that was indeed what was going on, Well,
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 1: you would have to have the contact of someone like
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 1: a Westbrook to kind of put them in the uh
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 1: positions where they could carry out their missions. So it
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 1: makes sense. And continuing, no one has ever offered a satisfy,
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: satisfactory explanation to why Westbrook was out on the field
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 1: that day, much less how he suddenly appears that the
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: Tipic crime scene. More importantly, there is no explanation for
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: his handling of the Oswalt wallet Oswalt's wallet. He wrote
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 1: no report explaining how we received the wallet from Officer
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 1: Kenneth Croy, who was who received it from a quote
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 1: unknown man. Westbrook goes on to become the man in
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 1: charge of the arrest scene at the Texas Theater, and
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 1: then the wallet at the Tippet scene that we just
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 1: showed the quick video of disappeared until it reappears in
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 1: Oswalt's pants pocket after the capture supposedly found again by
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 1: suspect number two, polygraph chief Paul Bentley. But one last thing,
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 1: So Westbrook worked for the DPD until nineteen sixty five,
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 1: So you're talking two maybe two and a half years
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: after the DPD. And guess where he ends up.
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 4: Rob where in Vietnam.
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 1: As allegedly part of Operation Phoenix. And on the extreme
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 1: right here this is allegedly a photo of Westbrook.
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 4: Chaulnsea Holt. I'm joking. You never know these things, Joe.
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that doesn't surprise me, unfortunately. But the person
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 1: in the middle with the hat and the white shirt
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 1: is alleged to be none other than CIA paramilitary legend
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 1: David Morales.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 4: Well, there's an interesting connection, Joe.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 1: So if if it is indeed true that Westbrook and
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 1: Morales are in this photograph, I believe this is sixty six,
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 1: you have to think.
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 4: Was he either a second, Joe, keep this photo up
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 4: there for a second. Sure, sure, I'm gonna do something
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 4: real quick. Hold on, I want to do a little.
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 1: Can I yap as you do something?
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 4: Well, hold on a second, because all right, So the
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 4: photo that I just put up is from nineteen sixty
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 4: three of Westbrook Okay, you're telling me a year and
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 4: a half later. Now keep your photo up there. Okay,
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 4: so you're telling me a year and a half later. Roughly,
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 4: this is supposed to be Westbrook.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: Sixty three to sixty six, right, I mean.
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 4: Yeah, sorry, So yeah, two and a half years later. Yeah,
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 4: he looks like he has much more of a receiving
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 4: hairline in sixty three than in sixty six and a
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 4: much more wrinkled face.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 1: Based on the picture of the middle with the sergeant. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: you know, I thought of that. But what if the
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 1: the hat that he's wearing in the middle, you know,
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: his hair is kind of like on the right hand side,
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 1: like like kind of like what's it called like when
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 1: you put it up in the front.
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 4: I mean, if you put that hat on that dude's
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 4: head on the right at the right angle, I think
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 4: it would pair up pretty well. It's possible. I wouldn't
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 4: say it's conclusive, but it's possible. I'm just playing the
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 4: Devil's love nut advocate. I like it. I like it.
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and we have you know, he was uh he
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: did go to work as part of Operation Phoenix and
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 1: the uh, the South Vietnam Police working with you know
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: a lot of our police and and the CIA. Of course,
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 1: the USA I D is a CI cut out. So
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: was Westbrook possibly ah given some type of reward for
• 1:19:00
  Speaker 1: a job well done and and get the super exclusive assignment?
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 1: Maybe was he part of the plot before?
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 4: Was he all along? Joe?
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 1: I'm not claiming either. I'm just saying it seems that
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 1: he definitely was rewarded for and and you know, if
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 1: you're in a picture with David Morales, you have to
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 1: be somewhat sus Yeah, someone's sus And Alex Harris is
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 1: calling me. Should we take this live? Sir?
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 4: Sure? Just keep it brief?
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 1: Okay, Hey Alex? How are you? You are alive right now?
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 4: F y?
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 1: Hey?
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: I wanted to say something.
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 4: Sure, can you hear barely? Okay?
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 2: Speak of.
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 3: There's a few main points I want to go over
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 3: that you guys didn't seem to go over that kind
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 3: of matter in what you're talking about it with.
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 4: Please go after Paul Joe's fault.
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 2: Yes, so as you guys probably don't know, you didn't
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 2: point it out that film was taken by wfa's Ron Ryland,
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 2: who happened to be there.
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 3: He's the one narrating the film in the video I
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 3: sent you, he's the one that identifies.
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 2: The walllet as Tippets. Uh, he was, you know, actually there.
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 4: That's a fair point.
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 2: And that film was showed around two thirty two forty
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 2: five pm on the day of the assassination on WFA.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 1: Okay, so like an hour fifteen minutes after tip it was.
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was shown right after the brinter came in
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 2: I do that interview.
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 4: And then they broke for that piece of film footage. Hmm.
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 1: Do you have any thoughts of why?
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 4: Uh?
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 1: So, so are you of the belief that it was
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 1: Tippet's wallet and not a duplicate Posswalt wallet And honestly,
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure. I'm just I'm just asking, you know.
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 7: That's the thing.
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 3: I they got so much wrong in the news on
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 3: that day because they were rushing through to get everything out.
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 2: So it could be tip It, it could be Osive Olds.
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, it could be somebody else's.
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 3: But because ron Ryland was there and because he says
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 3: it was tipp Its, I tend to agree with that.
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 1: Uh, that makes sense to me for sure. I mean,
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 1: it makes it's plausible to me.
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 1: And Alex, do you have any contexts to Jim Eule
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: who was allegedly in the car with Westbrook and uh
• 1:22:18
  Speaker 1: maybe Stringer and the unknown officer. I believe he worked
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: for the Dallas Morning News. I found some stuff on him,
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 1: but it was not conclusive. Do you have any thoughts
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 1: on him and his kind of ride along with with
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 1: Westbrook that day?
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 9: Uh?
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 2: No, I haven't heard of this guy before.
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 1: What was that name again, Jim Ewell e W E
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 1: L L. I think his real name is James, but
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: it's Jim and he was in the car with Westbrook.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 1: I believe he jumped in the car from TSBD to
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 1: the uh Tippet area and I had I had a
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 1: couple of things on him, but I've already taken up
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 1: way too much time, so ah but maybe.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: I was just interested because apparently this guy from the
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 1: DCM just just kind of jumped in Westbrook's car, and
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 1: of course he didn't know who drove him, or who
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 1: was driving or what officer, yeah, anything, But yeah, Well
• 1:23:33
  Speaker 1: it's interesting.
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 2: I'll definitely look into that guy. I see what I
• 1:23:36
  Speaker 2: can find.
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, let's let's follow up on not for sure, And
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 1: thank you for calling. I know our audience loves you.
• 1:23:46
  Speaker 1: And we love when you add that context, and you did.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 4: Thank you.
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 1: I seriously appreciate it, and of course thank you for
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 1: sending me that video.
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 2: So thank you.
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 1: Talk to you somebody, Yeah, go by, but.
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 4: All almost like a real radio show, Yeah, calling in
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 4: and yeah yeah all right.
• 1:24:14
  Speaker 1: Well I'm sorry, sir. Uh, why don't you continue? I
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 1: have one slide that might I might pull up later
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 1: in regards to the person you were going to use speaking.
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 4: About in your pants, and you can whip it out later.
• 1:24:26
  Speaker 1: That's exactly what I was staying.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 4: Here we go the next dunk we're talking about. Here
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 4: is Gerald Hill, Okay, Lieutenant Gerald Hill of the Dallas
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 4: Police Department. This is him, uh, leaning out one of
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 4: the windows of the school book Depository exclaiming that they
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 4: had found a rifle. Everybody, Hey, everybody, this would be
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 4: Gerald Hill as well, uh at a press conference and
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 4: and he allegedly said some things there that he probably
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 4: shouldn't have said. But we'll get into that, I promise.
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 4: And this is interesting, Joe. So Paul Bentley is the
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 4: one chomping the cigar right with his head, you know,
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 4: right up next to Oswald, was like like he's trying
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 4: to take a selfie with him or something. Yeah, and
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 4: then we have Gerald Hill in the background with the
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 4: hat on on the right and the dark colored super Okay,
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 4: that is Gerald Hill, all right. So we have him
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 4: at the school book depository, we have him at Oswald's arrest,
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 4: and he was also excuse me, at the tip murder scene.
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 4: So I came across an article from the Fourth Decade,
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 4: which nineteen ninety four January. I don't know the article
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 4: name or who wrote it, of course, because I'm an idiot,
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 4: but this was somebody looking back on some conference in
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 4: the early nineties that brought a lot of the reporters
• 1:26:08
  Speaker 4: and news people back right to talk about their experiences
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 4: that day, and the person writing this stated that for
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 4: them that the highlight of the day was to see
• 1:26:21
  Speaker 4: Gerald Hill in action. Okay. On the day of the assassination,
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 4: Hill was a Dallas police sergeant. He assisted in the
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 4: investigations at the Texas school Book Depository, depository and the
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 4: Tippet murder scene, and was one of the officers who
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 4: apprehended Oswald at the Texas Theater. On this day, Hill
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 4: had an answer for everything. On three occasions, he stepped
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 4: up to the microphone to feel challenging questions, and also
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 4: adds that I found none of his answers to be
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 4: particularly satisfactory. So, Gerald, and apparently Tom Aliah, who famously
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 4: made a movie about you know, finding the rifle on
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 4: the sixth floor, and you know a lot of great
• 1:27:15
  Speaker 4: interior shots of the sixth floor right at that time
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 4: the Aliah film persistent mentions that the chicken bones had
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 4: actually been found on the fifth floor and not the
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 4: sixth floor, which is interesting, right, yeah, And he says
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 4: that this, of course, would suggested evidence had been moved
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 4: up to the sixth floor to give the impression of
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 4: a cold blooded killer eating his lunch while waiting for
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 4: his victim. Gerald Hill explained Alia's observation by revealing that
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 4: the chicken bones had been found on both floors. Okay,
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 4: so take that for what you will. A lot of
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 4: people eating chicken back then. Apparently no watermelon found at
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 4: all in the school depository that day, I think. Okay,
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 4: moving on, I'm getting us canceled.
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 1: Job that might have been subtle enough to knock you
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 1: never know.
• 1:28:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah, we'll see. So next up, we have a FBI document.
• 1:28:37
  Speaker 4: It's report from a special Agent John McHugh from the
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 4: San Francisco office. Okay, Okay, set forth is a verbatim
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 4: transcript of an edited tape recording made November twenty second
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 4: of a long distance telephone interview between radio news director
• 1:28:57
  Speaker 4: of the Sacramento Radio station and Sergeant Gerald of the
• 1:29:00
  Speaker 4: Dallas Police Department. In this recording, Sargent Hill described his
• 1:29:04
  Speaker 4: part in the capture of Lee Harvey Oswald on November
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 4: twenty second, and some of Oswald's comments subsequent to his apprehension.
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 4: So On June tenth, nineteen and sixty four, Chet Casselman,
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 4: news and Public Affairs director of the radio station KSFO,
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 4: San Francisco, made available to special Asia mchew and edited
• 1:29:34
  Speaker 4: copy of a tape recording of a twenty five minute
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 4: radio program entitled quote Death in the Morning, which was
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 4: presented over radio station KSFO at six forty five pm
• 1:29:47
  Speaker 4: on November twenty second, nineteen sixty three. Featured in the
• 1:29:51
  Speaker 4: above mentioned tape recording, according to mister Castleman, was a
• 1:29:54
  Speaker 4: telephone interview between Bob Whitten, the radio news director of
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 4: radio station KCRI and Sacramento, and Gerald Hill of the
• 1:30:02
  Speaker 4: Dallas Police Department. Mister Casman advised when mister Whitten was
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 4: formally associated that mister Witten had been formally associated with
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 4: radio station kr LED in Dallas and had contacted Sergeant
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 4: Hill by long distance call on the day of the
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 4: president's assassination occurring or seek hearing. Sorry. The interview, which
• 1:30:22
  Speaker 4: after editing, was placed on the above mentioned program, and
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 4: which is set forth verbatim below. Now, of course we're
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 4: not going to go through this entire twenty five minute
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 4: interview because that would be ludicris, but we will hit highlights.
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, can I stop you, sir, and thank Sally for
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 1: the super chat. Merry Christmas guys, thanks for all your shows.
• 1:30:49
  Speaker 1: Merry Christmas everyone, the fifty plus people joining an on
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 1: us right now talking about JFK on this Friday night,
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 1: that's what we do.
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 4: Such appreciate it. Thank you you, Yes, and you and
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 4: yours as well.
• 1:31:05
  Speaker 1: Yes, I heard Christmas and London is epic or in
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 1: England or in London specifically.
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 4: Possibly too bad she's not there anymore. Still Church Christmas
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 4: in Ireland is equally.
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, I'm sure she's been. She's been. You
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: can let us know, Sally. But thank you again, Sorry, sir.
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 4: The first call that I got, so this is Jerald Hill.
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 4: Right off the bat of this interview, he says, the
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 4: first call that I got was the President had been
• 1:31:38
  Speaker 4: shot and the shot had come from the School of
• 1:31:40
  Speaker 4: Depository at Elman Houston. They sent me down there. It's
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 4: a little vague, right, yeah. Uh. I started in with
• 1:31:50
  Speaker 4: a couple of deputy sheriffs and we were checking the
• 1:31:52
  Speaker 4: building with as well as a bunch of other officers.
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 4: But one of those deputies and I were lucky enough
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 4: to find the window where the shots were fired from,
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 4: and also the three shells laying on the floor, and
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 4: I went back down. We secured the scene to report
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 4: to the inspector so he could get the crime lab
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 4: and everything there. And while I was there talking to him,
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 4: a call came out that an officer had been shot.
• 1:32:21
  Speaker 4: Some citizen was using the police radio. That call came
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 4: out the acting Lieutenant and oak Cliffe and I were
• 1:32:28
  Speaker 4: together standing there talking to the inspector, and he ordered us,
• 1:32:32
  Speaker 4: being that we had all the police in town pulled
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 4: down there to Elm Street. He ordered us to leave
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 4: the investigation of the President's shooting and get our asses
• 1:32:41
  Speaker 4: to oak Cliffe. We did. When we got out there,
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 4: the officer had already been picked up, he got a
• 1:32:48
  Speaker 4: description of the suspect, or we got a description of
• 1:32:51
  Speaker 4: the suspect and started following his path of egress as
• 1:32:56
  Speaker 4: best we could. We had information that he was in
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 4: one of two houses that were vacant over on East Jefferson,
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 4: so we went in over there and called for some
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 4: more help to cover off the buildings and everything. We
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 4: shook those down and he wasn't in there, And when
• 1:33:14
  Speaker 4: we got a report that he was in the library
• 1:33:16
  Speaker 4: at Marcellus and Jefferson, So he was on to say
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 4: for those people who have heard the description of the man,
• 1:33:24
  Speaker 4: or from people who had heard the description of the man.
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 4: We got to the library and found out that there
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 4: was another false alarm. So obviously he was with Westbrook
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 4: at this point. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I believe that's
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 4: who he's referring to. A third call came in that
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 4: he had been seen entering the Texas Theater. So Bob
• 1:33:44
  Speaker 4: Barrett from the FBI and I went to the theater
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 4: and everybody else outside. We started checking out the patrons
• 1:33:53
  Speaker 4: in the theater. The movie was still rolling, and on
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 4: the third one that McDonald started to approach, he was
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 4: sitting in the third row from the back in the center.
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 4: Just as McDonald got to him, he jumped up and yelled,
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 4: this is it, motherfucker's this is it. He struck McDonald
• 1:34:10
  Speaker 4: in the face and grabbed for a pistol, which he
• 1:34:13
  Speaker 4: had under his shirt. McDonald yelled, and all seven I
• 1:34:17
  Speaker 4: was got into a fight and finally got him subdued
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 4: and handcuffed, disarmed, and then handcuffed. We were then instructed
• 1:34:25
  Speaker 4: by a captain to get him out of there and
• 1:34:27
  Speaker 4: get him to Central station as fast as we could.
• 1:34:30
  Speaker 1: Stop her up. There was only one captain there as far.
• 1:34:34
  Speaker 4: As I know.
• 1:34:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, I continued, Yes, I believe, right, yeah, yeah,
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 1: I mean they asked him, were you the ranking officer there,
• 1:34:47
  Speaker 1: and he said, I guess I got there could have
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 1: been another one, but I believe he was the only
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 1: captain there.
• 1:34:53
  Speaker 4: Okay, uh oh, hold on, what do we do? Nothing?
• 1:35:02
  Speaker 4: That was a false alarm on my part. Hey, like
• 1:35:07
  Speaker 4: accidentally opened Spotify and I was like, oh my god,
• 1:35:10
  Speaker 4: it's gonna start playing music.
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like yeah, like the church false alarm that Westbrook
• 1:35:17
  Speaker 1: had to investigate.
• 1:35:19
  Speaker 4: Yes, thank you, James. I. I for those listening very closely,
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 4: you should know when I'm embellishing and when I am not,
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 4: sometimes you got to spice up the conversation a little bit,
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 4: you know what I'm saying. Joe, of course, yeah, yeah,
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 4: he says. Incidentally, Paul Bentley was in on it with us.
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 4: Then we got him outside. I don't know whether the
• 1:35:45
  Speaker 4: people in the neighborhood had just heard about the president's
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 4: death or whether they had heard about Blank. I'm sure
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 4: they'd heard about the presidents too. But there were six
• 1:35:54
  Speaker 4: to eight hundred people outside the Texas Theater by the
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 4: time we came out. That's a lot of fing people.
• 1:36:04
  Speaker 1: That's a lot more than I thought would have been there,
• 1:36:06
  Speaker 1: you know, you think like maybe fifty one hundred and
• 1:36:10
  Speaker 1: six to eight that's like a concert crowd.
• 1:36:16
  Speaker 4: I mean, the the streets had to be filled, you know,
• 1:36:20
  Speaker 4: like crazily. But whatever, Just going by what he says here.
• 1:36:32
  Speaker 4: The other and some more officers had to be pressed
• 1:36:34
  Speaker 4: into service right quick, who didn't actually have their hands
• 1:36:37
  Speaker 4: on him, but forced the crowd back so we could
• 1:36:40
  Speaker 4: get him in the car without anybody touching him. We
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 4: brought him down and turned to him out, turned him
• 1:36:46
  Speaker 4: and the pistol and everything over to Captain Fritz, the
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 4: boy that we apprehended for shooting. Tippett is an employee
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 4: of the book library where the shots that killed the
• 1:36:56
  Speaker 4: president were fired from. He was seen on the floor
• 1:37:00
  Speaker 4: below the window where the shots were fired from fifteen
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 4: minutes prior to the shooting. He was a former US
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 4: Marine marksman. He defected to Russia in nineteen fifty seven.
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 4: Now this is Gerald Hill talking out of his ass
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 4: on November twenty second to the media. Yeah, six forty
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 4: five pm on.
• 1:37:22
  Speaker 1: Frank, Yeah, yeah, that televised thing. Yeah yeah, ye.
• 1:37:28
  Speaker 4: So he's got a lot of his facts wrong here,
• 1:37:30
  Speaker 4: but that's okay, and return to the United States approximately
• 1:37:34
  Speaker 4: a year ago with a Russian bride. I understand he
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 4: did admit in the interrogation a while ago that he
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 4: was an active communist, which I doubt he did, But okay,
• 1:37:47
  Speaker 4: mar Marxist. He has not admitted to the shooting of
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 4: the president or the governor or the police officer. But
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 4: a gun was found on the sixth floor where it
• 1:37:59
  Speaker 4: had been hidden, I've been told, and I can't verify
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 4: this either way. It was an officer. It was made
• 1:38:05
  Speaker 4: in Argentina. Now, folks, we all know that a man
• 1:38:11
  Speaker 4: liquor carcano is made in Italy. Tur in Italy, I
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 4: believe to be specific? Uh so, okay, made in Argentina
• 1:38:24
  Speaker 4: would make it a mouser?
• 1:38:28
  Speaker 1: What it were a mouse made in Argentina?
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 4: It might have been an Argentine mauser interesting, okay, or
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 4: German mouse. I don't know who chat would know? So
• 1:38:40
  Speaker 4: chat where? What rifle was made in Argentina? I don't
• 1:38:45
  Speaker 4: tell me. It was an Argentine main liquor carcano? Yeah,
• 1:38:51
  Speaker 4: and there was at him talking out of his ass too, okay, of.
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 1: Course, of course, but there was a surplus of the
• 1:38:57
  Speaker 1: carcanos because they were not really efficient, which is why
• 1:39:01
  Speaker 1: they were so cheap.
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and at this time he could have still heard
• 1:39:04
  Speaker 4: them calling it a mouser as well, right, which who knows?
• 1:39:11
  Speaker 4: The man, I understand, had resorted to violence before and
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 4: possibly shot another policeman somewhere else where did they get
• 1:39:20
  Speaker 4: that fact from? I don't know.
• 1:39:27
  Speaker 9: Uh.
• 1:39:28
  Speaker 4: He won't admit to anything other than being a communist, Okay.
• 1:39:39
  Speaker 4: He started screaming brutality as soon as we got the
• 1:39:43
  Speaker 4: handcuffs on him, And when we got down here and
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 4: started to frisk him, the only thing he said was
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 4: when I told you I was a communist. I told
• 1:39:51
  Speaker 4: you everything I'm going to tell you, or words to
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 4: that effect, and also I want a lawyer, and I
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 4: demand my rights. With circumstances being as they are, with
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 4: all the other situations together, I firmly believe that we
• 1:40:05
  Speaker 4: got the man who killed the President of the United States.
• 1:40:11
  Speaker 4: So then he asked him, Jerry, did you talk to
• 1:40:14
  Speaker 4: him Annie? And he says, well, Bob, he's very arrogant,
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 4: very arrogant. We offered him an opportunity. On the way
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 4: to the station. We told him there was going to
• 1:40:25
  Speaker 4: be a large number of photographers there, and we quite
• 1:40:28
  Speaker 4: naturally automatically everybody thinks brutality when if you catch a
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 4: cop killer, you know, So we told him that there
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 4: would be photographers there and if he wanted to hide
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 4: his face, we would hold him loose en though we
• 1:40:42
  Speaker 4: were going to hold him, but he could bend over
• 1:40:45
  Speaker 4: and hide his face against his chest, or you know,
• 1:40:47
  Speaker 4: just bend over where they couldn't get a clear view
• 1:40:50
  Speaker 4: of him, or something like that. And this he refused
• 1:40:53
  Speaker 4: to do.
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 1: Okay, yes, that doesn't make sense to me. Is when
• 1:41:00
  Speaker 1: you think about Lee Harvey Oswald in the DPD over
• 1:41:05
  Speaker 1: the weekend, definitely didn't say he was a communist first
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 1: of all, but definitely wouldn't come out and say I'm
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 1: a communist, but I want to hide my face. It's
• 1:41:21
  Speaker 1: just not consistent in terms of his behavior, you know
• 1:41:27
  Speaker 1: what I mean, Like it's.
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 4: They're trying to frame it like he's proud of what
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 4: he did.
• 1:41:31
  Speaker 1: Right, But that's what I'm saying, I'm sorry, thank you
• 1:41:33
  Speaker 1: for catching me.
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 4: But he didn't.
• 1:41:35
  Speaker 1: He wasn't proud of what he did when he was
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 1: in front of the cameras. So this is he's proud
• 1:41:42
  Speaker 1: of what he did based on.
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 4: The Yeah, he'd say that. Yeah, he didn't get doing anything,
• 1:41:52
  Speaker 4: so he didn't really have anything to be ashamed of.
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 4: If he didn't do anything, why are you worried about
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 4: hiding your faith?
• 1:41:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it doesn't line up, is my point here.
• 1:42:02
  Speaker 4: So yeah, he said while he would not admit to anything,
• 1:42:04
  Speaker 4: he seemed very arrogant and proud of what was happening
• 1:42:07
  Speaker 4: to him. Again, of course they're framing it like, you know,
• 1:42:09
  Speaker 4: he's this diabolical killer. He said. He did not show
• 1:42:15
  Speaker 4: any signs of nervousness at all. He continually made threats
• 1:42:18
  Speaker 4: against the officers all the way downtown and I rode
• 1:42:22
  Speaker 4: in the car with him about the brutality and his
• 1:42:24
  Speaker 4: rights and made the statement. When we started questioning him
• 1:42:27
  Speaker 4: about killing the officer, he made the statement, he said,
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 4: I don't have to tell you anything. He says, well,
• 1:42:37
  Speaker 4: Captain Fritz, the Secret Service and the rangers and the
• 1:42:40
  Speaker 4: FBI have all questioned him, and the halls out there
• 1:42:43
  Speaker 4: are alive with people, quite naturally, and they have moved
• 1:42:47
  Speaker 4: him upstairs for a little while. I'm sure that later
• 1:42:51
  Speaker 4: today they'll bring him back down and interrogate him some more.
• 1:42:54
  Speaker 4: But they want to go out to his house and
• 1:42:56
  Speaker 4: check and find his car and all that stuff. You see,
• 1:43:00
  Speaker 4: you know, if they could find any more things. At
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 4: the time being, I understand that is being done quite rapidly,
• 1:43:06
  Speaker 4: and some of the plate pieces are falling into place
• 1:43:08
  Speaker 4: pretty good. Again. This is all at six forty five
• 1:43:13
  Speaker 4: pm on November twenty second, nineteen sixty three. And of course,
• 1:43:20
  Speaker 4: you know, he says. His reaction is that it's it's
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 4: a tragedy that it ever had to happen. But at
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 4: the same time, if it did happen, and if this
• 1:43:30
  Speaker 4: man turns out to be the one, we'll feel that
• 1:43:33
  Speaker 4: we sort of took the blot off of our face
• 1:43:35
  Speaker 4: a little bit by being able to catch him ourselves
• 1:43:39
  Speaker 4: so quickly. Yeah, it's nice little park, right, yeah, right.
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 1: And just to follow up, rob our chat comes through
• 1:43:50
  Speaker 1: like they always do, and there was an Argentine mouser.
• 1:43:55
  Speaker 4: That's what I thought, and make sure.
• 1:43:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you would I just I think, oh opto economists,
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 1: thank you and James Smith. Argentina was licensed to manufacture
• 1:44:11
  Speaker 1: the mouser in the World War Two.
• 1:44:12
  Speaker 4: Era for its military Sweet that's why we love our chat.
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 1: Thank you guys.
• 1:44:19
  Speaker 4: Well, that's an odd fact for him to spout out
• 1:44:21
  Speaker 4: there that not a lot of people would probably have
• 1:44:23
  Speaker 4: known at the time, you know, unless they had something
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 4: concrete you think. M h, I don't know, just just
• 1:44:31
  Speaker 4: uh throwing it out there. I will skip that because
• 1:44:38
  Speaker 4: I know you folks like the juicy bits. You always
• 1:44:42
  Speaker 4: like the juicy bits. Let's see here. Thank you, sir.
• 1:44:52
  Speaker 1: Gave me a score on the ring. Update. The Rangers
• 1:44:54
  Speaker 1: are playing the Dallas Stars.
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 4: Oh god, is it hockey season again already?
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 1: I haven't mentioned it. It's been hockey season for months,
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 1: like to spare you, I haven't mentioned it, but because
• 1:45:06
  Speaker 1: someone in the chat, a member said it I had
• 1:45:10
  Speaker 1: to acknowledge. You cannot see.
• 1:45:15
  Speaker 4: Rob's season just ended, and here we are again, Rob.
• 1:45:20
  Speaker 1: You'll be happy to know that the Rangers lost like
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 1: eleven out of their last thirteen games, so you won't
• 1:45:26
  Speaker 1: have to go into the playoffs probably this year. Yeah
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 1: about it. You cannot see his eyes roll under his
• 1:45:36
  Speaker 1: hat and glasses, but they are rolling.
• 1:45:47
  Speaker 4: What do I have here? Okay, that's just some other nonsensicals. Yeah, Sally.
• 1:45:58
  Speaker 1: Sally said Marxism is different to communism, and of course
• 1:46:02
  Speaker 1: we can go back to his mid August interview where
• 1:46:08
  Speaker 1: he really specifies the difference.
• 1:46:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, obviously doesn't like being called a communist.
• 1:46:15
  Speaker 1: Right, so why would he tell Hill that he is.
• 1:46:20
  Speaker 1: That doesn't make sense. But they might have not known
• 1:46:23
  Speaker 1: the difference, right, They might have considered both of them
• 1:46:26
  Speaker 1: the same thing. Those say far right or whatever DPD officers.
• 1:46:32
  Speaker 4: I don't know. Bob is not a Raiders fan per se,
• 1:46:38
  Speaker 4: but he's not a Raiders hater either. Great. I used
• 1:46:45
  Speaker 4: to be a Redskins fan growing up, since they're my
• 1:46:48
  Speaker 4: local team, But after they've continually sucked for thirty plus
• 1:46:52
  Speaker 4: years and my poor cholesterol field heart couldn't take it
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 4: anymore I decided to be done with them.
• 1:47:05
  Speaker 1: Well, you have a new quarterback, like a top ten Daniels's.
• 1:47:10
  Speaker 4: The goddamn name of the team. Okay, we're done, we
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 4: are done. Screw screw the commanders.
• 1:47:20
  Speaker 1: You've got to be more optimistic. You have a new owner,
• 1:47:24
  Speaker 1: and you have a rookie quarterback that might win Rookie
• 1:47:27
  Speaker 1: of the Year.
• 1:47:28
  Speaker 4: I don't technically have a team anymore.
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 1: Okay, I'm trying to help.
• 1:47:32
  Speaker 4: I know, I know. Well, December the fifth, nineteen and
• 1:47:36
  Speaker 4: sixty three, Lieutenant, let's see. Sorry, Sergeant, keep calling lieutenant.
• 1:47:42
  Speaker 4: For some reason, Sergeant Gerald Hill wrote to mister Jesse Curry,
• 1:47:47
  Speaker 4: the Chief of Police, a summary of his day of
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 4: two and a half weeks prior, Sir. At approximately one
• 1:48:02
  Speaker 4: fifty five Friday, November twenty second, I was in the vicinity.
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 4: It just happened to be in the vicinity of the
• 1:48:07
  Speaker 4: Texas Theater in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas, looking
• 1:48:11
  Speaker 4: for the suspect and the slaying of Officer J. D. Tippett.
• 1:48:15
  Speaker 4: By police radio, I received information the suspect was at
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 4: the Texas Theater and I responded to the location. On arrival,
• 1:48:23
  Speaker 4: I was told that the building was covered off outside
• 1:48:25
  Speaker 4: and to go inside the theater and look for the suspect.
• 1:48:29
  Speaker 4: Once inside, I requested either an usher or an assistant
• 1:48:32
  Speaker 4: manager to turn on as many lights as possible. Detective
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 4: Paul Bentley and I and his cigar, along with some
• 1:48:39
  Speaker 4: other uniform officers, went to the balcony of the theater.
• 1:48:43
  Speaker 4: We checked to see that all the fire exits were
• 1:48:45
  Speaker 4: covered and that a check of the patrons was being made,
• 1:48:50
  Speaker 4: and then we started back to the lower floor to
• 1:48:51
  Speaker 4: see the situation at that location. About that time I
• 1:48:56
  Speaker 4: reached the bottom of the stairs, I heard an officer
• 1:48:57
  Speaker 4: yell I got him, and I also heard a struggle.
• 1:49:03
  Speaker 4: I ran inside the lower floor of the theater and
• 1:49:04
  Speaker 4: saw several officers attempting to restrain a parson. Someone yelled
• 1:49:08
  Speaker 4: that the man had a pistol, and then I joined
• 1:49:11
  Speaker 4: the fray of the other officers in attempting to complete
• 1:49:14
  Speaker 4: the arrest. I heard someone else say that they had
• 1:49:16
  Speaker 4: a gun. Officers McDonald, Hudson, Hawkins, Walker, Carol Lyons, Bentley,
• 1:49:24
  Speaker 4: Barrett from the FBI, and I noticed he didn't say.
• 1:49:28
  Speaker 4: Westbrook succeeded in subduing the suspect, and while the other
• 1:49:33
  Speaker 4: officers held the suspect. Officer Ray Hawkins and I handcuffed
• 1:49:37
  Speaker 4: the suspect. Captain Westbrook instructed us to get the prisoner
• 1:49:45
  Speaker 4: away from the location as soon as possible. So there
• 1:49:48
  Speaker 4: you have it. Joe Westbrook was controlling the scene inside
• 1:49:52
  Speaker 4: of Texas there.
• 1:49:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm think its war commission. He said he
• 1:49:56
  Speaker 1: got separated from Barrett for a second. But they were
• 1:49:59
  Speaker 1: on different aisles, right, So you think about a couple
• 1:50:02
  Speaker 1: different seating things, and they were in different aisles. So
• 1:50:05
  Speaker 1: Westbrook was there. But interesting they don't mention him. Well,
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 1: he just did well before in the list.
• 1:50:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Officers Walker, Lyons, Carol Bentley and I flanked the
• 1:50:21
  Speaker 4: man and also protected him from the front and the rear.
• 1:50:25
  Speaker 4: In this formation, we moved through the lobby of the
• 1:50:27
  Speaker 4: theater and out to a car parked in front of
• 1:50:30
  Speaker 4: the theater. We placed the suspect in the rear seat
• 1:50:33
  Speaker 4: of the car, with Officer Bentley on his left and
• 1:50:36
  Speaker 4: Officer Walker on his right. I sat in the center
• 1:50:40
  Speaker 4: of the front seat. We call that bitch. That's the
• 1:50:49
  Speaker 4: most uncomfortable place to sit in the car. As Officer
• 1:50:56
  Speaker 4: Carroll started to get out of the car, he pulled
• 1:50:57
  Speaker 4: a snubnos revolver from his belt and handed Tommy. He
• 1:51:01
  Speaker 4: stated that this was the suspect's gun and that he
• 1:51:04
  Speaker 4: had obtained it from Officer McDonald immediately after the suspect
• 1:51:07
  Speaker 4: was subdued. When the pistol was given to me, it
• 1:51:10
  Speaker 4: was fully loaded jack and one of the shells had
• 1:51:14
  Speaker 4: a hammer mark on the primer. I retained this gun
• 1:51:18
  Speaker 4: in my possession until approximately three fifteen Friday, November twenty second, when,
• 1:51:22
  Speaker 4: in the presidence of Officers Carroll and McDonald, I turned
• 1:51:25
  Speaker 4: the weapon over to Detective Baker of the Homicide and
• 1:51:30
  Speaker 4: Robbery Bureau. At the time the pistol was released to Baker, McDonald, Carroll,
• 1:51:34
  Speaker 4: and I had all marked it for id purposes. In
• 1:51:37
  Speaker 4: the presence of McDonald and Carroll, I marked the side
• 1:51:40
  Speaker 4: of the casing on all the shells, which were also
• 1:51:42
  Speaker 4: turned over to Detective Baker. At that time, respectfully submitted
• 1:51:46
  Speaker 4: Gerald Hill, Sergeant of Police Personnel Bureau. So Gerald Hill
• 1:51:54
  Speaker 4: was one of Westbrook's sergeants in the Personnel Bureau.
• 1:52:00
  Speaker 1: Hmmm, Joe, interesting, I thought it was that guy's stringer,
• 1:52:06
  Speaker 1: but he could have, of course, had more than one.
• 1:52:08
  Speaker 4: But that's the way Jerry Hill signed the letter to Curry.
• 1:52:12
  Speaker 4: So and what was that early December December fifth?
• 1:52:16
  Speaker 1: December fifth, okay, yeah, and Rob, before you continue, we
• 1:52:22
  Speaker 1: have to thank mister Gary Peters who gave us a fifty.
• 1:52:26
  Speaker 4: Dollars super holy Hannah Garry Peters man. Yeah, wow, thank you.
• 1:52:34
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much. We appreciate it. And I don't
• 1:52:37
  Speaker 1: like to interrupt you, but that was working.
• 1:52:40
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you can interrupt me anytime you want.
• 1:52:44
  Speaker 1: I'm going to clip that. Oh, I'm gonna clip that
• 1:52:47
  Speaker 1: before the fifty dollars. Then, thank you Gary.
• 1:52:54
  Speaker 4: Let's see. So when Jerald Hill first went to the
• 1:53:00
  Speaker 4: school book depository, this is interesting, Joe, you liked this.
• 1:53:04
  Speaker 4: He got permission, okay from Captain Westbrook to go to
• 1:53:10
  Speaker 4: the scene of the school book depository and bring along
• 1:53:13
  Speaker 4: with him officers Joe Field, Jim Valentine, and a reporter
• 1:53:17
  Speaker 4: from the Dallas Morning News Jim E. Well you will.
• 1:53:22
  Speaker 1: That's the guy I told you that had jumped in
• 1:53:26
  Speaker 1: the car with Westbrook on the way to the typic thing.
• 1:53:32
  Speaker 4: And yes, I'm just reading it to you. The way
• 1:53:36
  Speaker 4: is it is here? Okay. So he who wrote this,
• 1:53:40
  Speaker 4: but okay, obviously made a mistake when he arrived at
• 1:53:45
  Speaker 4: the scene, he stated he caught up to Captain Fritz
• 1:53:47
  Speaker 4: in a variety of other officers. Entering the building, He
• 1:53:50
  Speaker 4: and two Sheriff's deputies Boone and Mooney worked from the
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 4: top down, while Fritz and his men worked from the
• 1:53:55
  Speaker 4: bottom up searching for evidence. After checking the seventh floor,
• 1:54:00
  Speaker 4: I mean not a damn thing, Hill said that someone
• 1:54:03
  Speaker 4: shouted here it is upon finding a stack of boxes
• 1:54:06
  Speaker 4: by a window. He went on to find three spent
• 1:54:10
  Speaker 4: shells on the floor. This finding prompted him to go
• 1:54:13
  Speaker 4: to the window and shout for someone from the crime lab,
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 4: resulting in the photo of the top right of the
• 1:54:18
  Speaker 4: shelves blah blah blah. By the time he made it
• 1:54:21
  Speaker 4: down street level, someone and from the crime lab had
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 4: arrived and Hill would soon be on his way to
• 1:54:25
  Speaker 4: the next scene at the Tippet murder scene. So I
• 1:54:32
  Speaker 4: believe Hill was traveling in Valentine's car. I believe it
• 1:54:37
  Speaker 4: was suspected and there's lots of questions whether or not
• 1:54:43
  Speaker 4: this could be the car that showed open in front
• 1:54:45
  Speaker 4: of Oswald's rooming house and did the old tit tit right?
• 1:54:50
  Speaker 4: But the numbers don't match from that car to Valentine's
• 1:54:54
  Speaker 4: and I don't think they're even close to be honest
• 1:54:56
  Speaker 4: with you, even for a blind old lady.
• 1:54:59
  Speaker 1: But no, I I came across Valentine. I think it
• 1:55:06
  Speaker 1: was it was a two to seven the car number.
• 1:55:10
  Speaker 1: But but Valentine is is in the equation, and I
• 1:55:15
  Speaker 1: think he might have been with Westbrook when he first
• 1:55:21
  Speaker 1: heard about the shooting of JFK.
• 1:55:24
  Speaker 4: So sorry, sir, Oh you're fine. So let's see, all right,
• 1:55:33
  Speaker 4: let's let's get to the juicy bits. Enough is enough?
• 1:55:39
  Speaker 4: You have some juicy bits.
• 1:55:41
  Speaker 1: You always save him for the end.
• 1:55:44
  Speaker 4: Is there any other way, Sarah?
• 1:55:46
  Speaker 1: No?
• 1:55:47
  Speaker 4: Okay, Okay, let's do this juicy bit first. I got
• 1:55:53
  Speaker 4: two juicy bits, but this one is.
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 1: I'm refraining from making a really bad joke.
• 1:56:03
  Speaker 4: Yes, okay. Now let's fast forward to the HSCA for
• 1:56:11
  Speaker 4: a minute and talk about Gerald hill testimony to the Okay, Okay, Now,
• 1:56:20
  Speaker 4: I came across a very interesting document from the Househole
• 1:56:25
  Speaker 4: of Committee on Assassinations and this is a resolution for immunity. Now,
• 1:56:35
  Speaker 4: this is what I'm talking about. When they were uh,
• 1:56:37
  Speaker 4: some some people that they interviewed, like Lauren Hall, the
• 1:56:42
  Speaker 4: HCA were given immunized testimony, which means that anything they
• 1:56:46
  Speaker 4: say cannot be used against them in a court of law.
• 1:56:49
  Speaker 4: They cannot incriminate themselves, Okay, thus denying them the right
• 1:56:54
  Speaker 4: to use the Fifth Amendment to protect them. Okay. So
• 1:56:58
  Speaker 4: this is basically they had to say the truth, but
• 1:57:03
  Speaker 4: no matter what they said, they could never get in
• 1:57:05
  Speaker 4: trouble for it. So this is what immunized testimony is.
• 1:57:10
  Speaker 1: So is this emotion.
• 1:57:13
  Speaker 4: At least eight members must vote in the affirmative. So
• 1:57:17
  Speaker 4: apparently they went by individuals and they had to vote,
• 1:57:23
  Speaker 4: and at least eight members must vote in the affirmative
• 1:57:25
  Speaker 4: for that person to receive a resolution for immunity for
• 1:57:29
  Speaker 4: their testimony. Okay. So it says resolved that Council on
• 1:57:37
  Speaker 4: the Staff is authorized to apply to a Court for
• 1:57:39
  Speaker 4: an order conferring immunity upon compelling testimony in accordance with
• 1:57:44
  Speaker 4: eighteen USC. Se six thousand and two. Ats from the individuals.
• 1:57:56
  Speaker 4: Number one is Carl Mather, who was J. D. Tippitt's buddy,
• 1:58:03
  Speaker 4: worked at Collins Radio and his car was seen with
• 1:58:08
  Speaker 4: apparent Oswald double driving it not very long after the
• 1:58:11
  Speaker 4: assassination occurred, which is always crazy. And Edward K.
• 1:58:16
  Speaker 1: Moss was he the one on guard duty or no, no,
• 1:58:23
  Speaker 1: but it was the Thunderbird that like it was registered
• 1:58:28
  Speaker 1: that car back to him. He was a friend of
• 1:58:30
  Speaker 1: Tippett and I believe Westbrook red Ford Falcon.
• 1:58:34
  Speaker 4: Of four Falcon things thunder I think he's like lived
• 1:58:38
  Speaker 4: down the street from Tippett, was very very good friends
• 1:58:42
  Speaker 4: with Tippitt and his family.
• 1:58:43
  Speaker 1: Well, he was the one that actually consoled Marie Tippett
• 1:58:47
  Speaker 1: after she got word that he was killed. He stayed there,
• 1:58:52
  Speaker 1: his wife went there, his wife left, He stayed there
• 1:58:55
  Speaker 1: to console, which it's kind of backwards in nineteen sixty
• 1:59:00
  Speaker 1: three terms, right to expect the wife.
• 1:59:01
  Speaker 4: To stay there. I mean, you just go home.
• 1:59:03
  Speaker 1: I got this, Okay, yeah, okay, thank you.
• 1:59:07
  Speaker 4: Yeah. So on this list, of course a carl Amos Mather,
• 1:59:12
  Speaker 4: Edward Moss, who I have no idea who in the
• 1:59:14
  Speaker 4: hell that is maybe the chat does neither Judith Campbell Exner,
• 1:59:21
  Speaker 4: who was who was getting stocked by Sam g and
• 1:59:25
  Speaker 4: Conna and John F. Kennedy at the same time, and
• 1:59:27
  Speaker 4: probably a spy for Germany. So there's that. Okay. So
• 1:59:34
  Speaker 4: the reason that they wanted to give Carl Mather immunity
• 1:59:38
  Speaker 4: is this, So on all these lists and all these
• 1:59:42
  Speaker 4: immunity forms. They have to do a name or an
• 1:59:46
  Speaker 4: AKA also known as Dayton, place of birth, social Security number,
• 1:59:52
  Speaker 4: FBI D number, if any scheduled or anticipated date of hearing,
• 1:59:56
  Speaker 4: reason why in likelihood the witness is apt to claim
• 1:59:59
  Speaker 4: the Fifth Amendment. Okay, so this is what they're worried about.
• 2:00:04
  Speaker 4: For Carl Mather, it was a close friend of JD.
• 2:00:07
  Speaker 4: Tippetty car with the license plate registered to matter was
• 2:00:09
  Speaker 4: reportedly near the scene of the shooting and engaged in
• 2:00:12
  Speaker 4: allegedly suspicious activity and a man who very much resembled
• 2:00:19
  Speaker 4: Lee Harvey Oswald was driving it. Mather has denied to
• 2:00:23
  Speaker 4: the FBI and the committee investigator there's car was any
• 2:00:26
  Speaker 4: anywhere near the scene, despite his license plate number being
• 2:00:29
  Speaker 4: reported as such. So that's why they wanted to give
• 2:00:34
  Speaker 4: him immunity, hoping that he would tell the truth. But
• 2:00:38
  Speaker 4: he didn't.
• 2:00:40
  Speaker 1: Next, you don't give you don't give someone immunity if
• 2:00:43
  Speaker 1: you don't think there's a benefit to it, right, right,
• 2:00:46
  Speaker 1: Like You're not just giving some random skafooza immunity, right.
• 2:00:50
  Speaker 4: Some witness, These are very interesting people with some interesting things.
• 2:00:54
  Speaker 4: If they would actually tell the truth, you know, like, right,
• 2:00:57
  Speaker 4: all right, dude, why is your car he with some
• 2:01:00
  Speaker 4: guy that looks like Lee Harvey Oswald driving it at
• 2:01:03
  Speaker 4: this time on this day? You know, do you have
• 2:01:05
  Speaker 4: a good answer for that?
• 2:01:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 2:01:07
  Speaker 4: And they would want him to tell the truth.
• 2:01:09
  Speaker 1: Right, or at least yeah, give him the opportunity to
• 2:01:13
  Speaker 1: even though even if he doesn't, right, it's a shot
• 2:01:18
  Speaker 1: in the dark.
• 2:01:19
  Speaker 4: Next up Judith Campbell Exner. The reason that they want
• 2:01:23
  Speaker 4: to give her immunity is this involved with Sam Giacana
• 2:01:28
  Speaker 4: and President Kennedy may have been intended to be used
• 2:01:32
  Speaker 4: by the mob as a method to blackmail kennedy administration
• 2:01:37
  Speaker 4: or obtained information about it that means aka spying. That's
• 2:01:43
  Speaker 4: why they wanted to give her immunity. Next up is
• 2:01:47
  Speaker 4: Marina Oswald Porter, wife of Lee Harvey Oswald. She has
• 2:01:51
  Speaker 4: testified at least three times in the past or I'm sorry,
• 2:01:54
  Speaker 4: at least twice in the past, and there are many
• 2:01:58
  Speaker 4: inconsistencies between the new stories she has told. She may
• 2:02:02
  Speaker 4: claim the fifth if pressed very hard to explain her
• 2:02:06
  Speaker 4: inconsistencies in her stories. Next up Howard Brennan. Now we
• 2:02:15
  Speaker 4: all know that he told the agency to basically go
• 2:02:18
  Speaker 4: fuck themselves and that he was not coming to Washington.
• 2:02:27
  Speaker 4: So this is why they wanted to give him the
• 2:02:28
  Speaker 4: fifth He has already made it clear in phone conversations
• 2:02:32
  Speaker 4: that he will cooperate with the House of Committee on
• 2:02:35
  Speaker 4: assassinations only when he wants to do so, and not
• 2:02:40
  Speaker 4: when we asked. Okay, whatever, I respect. Next up is
• 2:02:48
  Speaker 4: Patrick Dean, the guy who was in charge of the
• 2:02:52
  Speaker 4: basement security during the shooting of Lee Harvey Oswald.
• 2:02:57
  Speaker 1: Uh.
• 2:02:57
  Speaker 4: The reason they wanted to give him immunity is because
• 2:02:59
  Speaker 4: he was in charge of security in the basement of
• 2:03:01
  Speaker 4: the Dallas Police Department during the transfer of Lee Harvey Oswald.
• 2:03:05
  Speaker 4: He had known Jack Ruby for thirteen years prior to
• 2:03:08
  Speaker 4: sixty three, and he was a uniform sergeant in the
• 2:03:11
  Speaker 4: downtown area of Dallas. Dean's possible involvement in an intentional
• 2:03:16
  Speaker 4: or negligent action which led to the shooting of Lee
• 2:03:21
  Speaker 4: Harvey Oswald might make him invoke the Fifth Amendment. Quite possible, right, Yeah.
• 2:03:27
  Speaker 1: And they're saying whether it's intentional he let him in,
• 2:03:30
  Speaker 1: or whether it was by complete negligence of not doing
• 2:03:34
  Speaker 1: your job or letting Jack go because you knew him.
• 2:03:38
  Speaker 1: I think that's what they're saying right either or but
• 2:03:41
  Speaker 1: they're offering him immunity either way.
• 2:03:44
  Speaker 4: Yep. Next up, Jean West aka Jean Oust. The reason
• 2:03:51
  Speaker 4: they want to give her the Fifth Amendment is West
• 2:03:58
  Speaker 4: was a friend of Lawrence Myers and was with him
• 2:04:01
  Speaker 4: in Dallas the weekend of the assassination when they saw
• 2:04:05
  Speaker 4: Jack Ruby twice on eleven, twenty one, sixty three. And
• 2:04:11
  Speaker 4: she had also received a phone call from David Ferry
• 2:04:14
  Speaker 4: a month prior to the assassination. What's her name again,
• 2:04:20
  Speaker 4: gene Ace. I've never heard of her before. Her meetings
• 2:04:25
  Speaker 4: with Jack Ruby could have been part of general or
• 2:04:27
  Speaker 4: specific discussions concerning the need to kill Lee Harvey Oswald. Thus,
• 2:04:31
  Speaker 4: she may be reluctant to discuss any peripheral criminal involvement
• 2:04:34
  Speaker 4: or knowledge for fear it might incriminate her more deeply. Basically,
• 2:04:40
  Speaker 4: she was a mob associate in Chicago, but she was
• 2:04:45
  Speaker 4: visiting Dallas that weekend with Lawrence Myers, hum who was
• 2:04:54
  Speaker 4: a known Ruby associate from Chicago. All right, Next up
• 2:04:59
  Speaker 4: we have here in Carlin Well. The reason they wanted
• 2:05:03
  Speaker 4: to give her community is she was a dancer at
• 2:05:06
  Speaker 4: the Carousel in nineteen sixty three, and she called Jack
• 2:05:09
  Speaker 4: Ruby for a salary advance, resulting in money order being
• 2:05:13
  Speaker 4: sent to her just before Lee Harvey Oswald got shot.
• 2:05:18
  Speaker 4: She also called Ruby the night before the shooting of
• 2:05:20
  Speaker 4: Lee Harvey Oswald and secured five dollars from a garage
• 2:05:25
  Speaker 4: attendant who made a time stamp for sept It is
• 2:05:29
  Speaker 4: possible that Karen Bennett's action was geared to provide Ruby
• 2:05:32
  Speaker 4: with a non premeditation defense, or was even more sinister.
• 2:05:36
  Speaker 4: In either event, it is likely that she would have
• 2:05:38
  Speaker 4: taken the Fifth Amendment if her involvement indicated that she
• 2:05:41
  Speaker 4: was a principal or an accessory. Next up, Jalla Janet Conforto, Right,
• 2:05:51
  Speaker 4: they wanted to give her community a dancer at the
• 2:05:55
  Speaker 4: Carousel in sixty three.
• 2:05:57
  Speaker 7: Fire here, guys.
• 2:06:00
  Speaker 1: You start to see a pattern, you know of who
• 2:06:02
  Speaker 1: they're offering immunity to. Yeah.
• 2:06:06
  Speaker 4: Dancer at the Carousel Club in sixty three, fired by
• 2:06:09
  Speaker 4: Jack Ruby after a dispute over her act. Possible firsthand
• 2:06:16
  Speaker 4: knowledge of criminal activity of Ruby or Ruby associates may
• 2:06:20
  Speaker 4: cause her to be reluctant to testify openly about her
• 2:06:22
  Speaker 4: previous silence about such knowledge. In addition, she may have
• 2:06:26
  Speaker 4: been in prostitution or narcotics or gambling activities which might
• 2:06:30
  Speaker 4: make her invoke the fifth But we want to know.
• 2:06:35
  Speaker 1: Or all of the above.
• 2:06:36
  Speaker 4: How you cannot show your butthole in this club anymore.
• 2:06:40
  Speaker 4: You're fired.
• 2:06:42
  Speaker 1: And if you do, you'll got immunity.
• 2:06:45
  Speaker 4: Yes, next up, this is an interesting one, Joe immunity
• 2:06:52
  Speaker 4: for Harry Olsen. Oh. Harry Olsen was a member of
• 2:06:56
  Speaker 4: the Dallas Police Department who subsequently married an employee of
• 2:06:59
  Speaker 4: Jack Ruby's. Olsen would visit Ruby's club frequently, and on
• 2:07:05
  Speaker 4: late November twenty second to night, Olsen had a two
• 2:07:09
  Speaker 4: or three hour conversation in a car with Jack Ruby.
• 2:07:14
  Speaker 4: It is possible that Olsen's conversation with Ruby could be
• 2:07:17
  Speaker 4: construed as having encouraged Ruby to kill Oswald, which may
• 2:07:21
  Speaker 4: be of such a nature to inspire him to invoke
• 2:07:24
  Speaker 4: the fifth Amendment. Olsen was allegedly guarding in the state
• 2:07:29
  Speaker 4: very near the Tip murder scene as well.
• 2:07:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah that was him, not motherson, Yes, yeah, yeah, So
• 2:07:38
  Speaker 1: hold on.
• 2:07:42
  Speaker 4: You may be saying to yourself, Rob, why are you
• 2:07:44
  Speaker 4: going through all this horse shit? Because the last one
• 2:07:48
  Speaker 4: that they gave immunity to was Gerald Hill.
• 2:07:54
  Speaker 1: I wasn't saying that. I think this is fascinating list.
• 2:07:57
  Speaker 4: Oh shit, what's up? Ed ed the dudes in the house.
• 2:08:04
  Speaker 4: What's up, buddy. We gotta get your ass back on
• 2:08:05
  Speaker 4: the show. Holler at your boy. The people love you
• 2:08:09
  Speaker 4: and so do we. So reach out to me. Man,
• 2:08:12
  Speaker 4: we gotta get you back on the show. Brother, Big
• 2:08:17
  Speaker 4: bad Josh was the only reason or the only person
• 2:08:19
  Speaker 4: fired and this whole god awful assassination. Yeah, totally. Yeah.
• 2:08:26
  Speaker 1: Did he go to California after that?
• 2:08:28
  Speaker 9: With uh? Was it?
• 2:08:30
  Speaker 1: Kathy Kay?
• 2:08:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah? They I believe William Turner from Ramparts tracked him
• 2:08:36
  Speaker 4: down in California and interviewed him like in sixty seven
• 2:08:41
  Speaker 4: for the Garrison investigation. We might have to do a
• 2:08:47
  Speaker 4: show on him in the future, Joe. So, the reason
• 2:08:50
  Speaker 4: they gave Gerald Hill immunity for his testimony.
• 2:08:56
  Speaker 1: Scott Scott with a great comment showing the.
• 2:09:00
  Speaker 4: Rights and there, folks, is your comment of the ninth.
• 2:09:06
  Speaker 1: Thank you, Scott Scott. You are the man who's a
• 2:09:09
  Speaker 1: great hang out with you at Lancer and.
• 2:09:12
  Speaker 4: Thank you for that. Yes, so again, the reason they
• 2:09:17
  Speaker 4: were trying to give Gerald Hill immunity that he was
• 2:09:21
  Speaker 4: employed by the Dallas Police in sixty three. He was
• 2:09:23
  Speaker 4: present during the arrest of Harvey Lee Harvey Oswald. He
• 2:09:27
  Speaker 4: also knew Jack Ruby and would frequent the Carousel Club.
• 2:09:33
  Speaker 4: Hill's possible involvement in, or knowledge of payoffs to the
• 2:09:40
  Speaker 4: Dallas Police Department, or the providing of misinformation to authorities
• 2:09:44
  Speaker 4: investigating the assassination or the shooting of Lee Harvey Oswald
• 2:09:48
  Speaker 4: make it possible that he would invoke the Fifth Amendment.
• 2:09:54
  Speaker 4: So what are these alleged payoffs to the DPD? Was
• 2:09:59
  Speaker 4: Ruby paying off the Dallas police to leave him the
• 2:10:01
  Speaker 4: fuck alone? Possibly?
• 2:10:07
  Speaker 7: Very possibly?
• 2:10:08
  Speaker 4: Maybe that's why he had a big old wild in
• 2:10:10
  Speaker 4: his pocket that day when he showed up with the
• 2:10:13
  Speaker 4: Dallas Police basement. Maybe he kind of pays them out. Yeah,
• 2:10:18
  Speaker 4: there's os Well, I can kill it now. Shit who Yeah.
• 2:10:22
  Speaker 1: And like we talked about Rob, I mean it really was.
• 2:10:26
  Speaker 1: I don't know how you could view that as none
• 2:10:28
  Speaker 1: other than a suicide mission, right, even if you were
• 2:10:32
  Speaker 1: friendly with every DPD person, there were live TV cameras.
• 2:10:38
  Speaker 1: I mean, you you can't imagine that you think you
• 2:10:42
  Speaker 1: get away with something like that, even if you thought,
• 2:10:45
  Speaker 1: like the low Nutt narrative says that people would consider
• 2:10:48
  Speaker 1: you a hero for preventing Jackie from coming back and
• 2:10:53
  Speaker 1: testifying at the truck whatever, right, Like, It's just it
• 2:10:56
  Speaker 1: doesn't make sense. So why he would leave, especially he
• 2:11:00
  Speaker 1: was in financial trouble. Why are you leaving all this
• 2:11:03
  Speaker 1: money in your car unless, just like you said, it
• 2:11:09
  Speaker 1: was possible.
• 2:11:10
  Speaker 4: Path yes, all right, And the last thing I got, Joe,
• 2:11:18
  Speaker 4: because I'm not too sure what happened with Gerald Hill
• 2:11:26
  Speaker 4: after this, Okay, because much like Westbrook, I believe he
• 2:11:37
  Speaker 4: left the Dallas Police before nineteen sixty eight. So sometime
• 2:11:45
  Speaker 4: in sixty seven, sixty six, sixty seven he left the
• 2:11:48
  Speaker 4: Dallas Police, same time frame as Westbrook. Okay, but he
• 2:11:54
  Speaker 4: didn't go to Vietnam and hang out with David Morales, Okay,
• 2:11:59
  Speaker 4: not that type of He stayed much closer to home.
• 2:12:03
  Speaker 5: So this.
• 2:12:05
  Speaker 4: Comes from a memorandum for the record, Okay, this is
• 2:12:12
  Speaker 4: a Garrison document from Stephen Jaffy, investigator concerning Gerald Hill.
• 2:12:17
  Speaker 4: In my recent interview in Chicago with Richard Sprague, where
• 2:12:20
  Speaker 4: he recounted to me details of his Dallas investigation in
• 2:12:24
  Speaker 4: January of sixty eight, mister Sprague told me that the
• 2:12:27
  Speaker 4: group which is investigating the assassination in Dallas, that means
• 2:12:30
  Speaker 4: the part of Garrison's team that is investigating the assassination
• 2:12:34
  Speaker 4: in Dallas have told him they have solid proof that
• 2:12:40
  Speaker 4: policeman Gerald Hill was involved directly in the assassination and
• 2:12:45
  Speaker 4: the related cover up of the facts about the assassination itself.
• 2:12:50
  Speaker 4: Sprague told me that they are aware that Gerald Hill
• 2:12:52
  Speaker 4: was at the site of the assassination in Dealey Plaza
• 2:12:55
  Speaker 4: and also later at the site of the shooting of
• 2:12:57
  Speaker 4: Officer Tippett and also the rest of Lee Harvey Oswald
• 2:13:01
  Speaker 4: at the Texas Theater. After Oswald's arrest, gerald Hill was
• 2:13:06
  Speaker 4: supposed to have ridden in the police car with Oswald
• 2:13:09
  Speaker 4: down to the police station, which he allegedly did. Hill
• 2:13:15
  Speaker 4: is no longer with the Dallas Police Force. He is
• 2:13:19
  Speaker 4: now in charge as the nightman in charge of guarding
• 2:13:26
  Speaker 4: the film library at TV station KRLD in Dallas. Sprague
• 2:13:36
  Speaker 4: also knew of various places where Gerald Hill visited inquiring
• 2:13:40
  Speaker 4: about film footage of the assassination. So Hill was going
• 2:13:45
  Speaker 4: around Dallas and collecting films concerning the assassination, and he
• 2:13:51
  Speaker 4: was also employed as the knight watchman at KRLD of
• 2:13:56
  Speaker 4: the TV film library that they had Okay television cameraman
• 2:14:04
  Speaker 4: Sandy Sanderson had taken film footage for KRLD in sixteen millimeters,
• 2:14:10
  Speaker 4: including an arrest, and also including film of the finding
• 2:14:13
  Speaker 4: of the rifle. Sprague has viewed the film by Sanderson
• 2:14:17
  Speaker 4: and said that these important scenes have been omitted and
• 2:14:20
  Speaker 4: no longer exist for the public viewing. Sprague feels that
• 2:14:25
  Speaker 4: since Hill has had such an extensive control over various footage,
• 2:14:30
  Speaker 4: that he might be instrumental in omitting various sections of
• 2:14:33
  Speaker 4: footage from several different people's films, thus him having access
• 2:14:38
  Speaker 4: to so many at the TV film library at KRLD.
• 2:14:45
  Speaker 4: The group in Dallas has also concurred in Sprague's feeling
• 2:14:48
  Speaker 4: on this. So, how's that for the last juicy bi
• 2:15:00
  Speaker 4: the evening? So instead of hanging out with Morales in Vietnam,
• 2:15:04
  Speaker 4: this cat is kicked back at night guarding the TV
• 2:15:08
  Speaker 4: film library, going through various films of the assassination and
• 2:15:12
  Speaker 4: editing them or making them disappear or collecting them or whatever.
• 2:15:16
  Speaker 4: Isn't that crazy? Gerald Hill?
• 2:15:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I had no idea about that. That is crazy,
• 2:15:24
  Speaker 1: and it makes you think about It makes you think
• 2:15:28
  Speaker 1: about like the the other part time jobs that a
• 2:15:32
  Speaker 1: lot of these policemen had, right which is like guarding
• 2:15:35
  Speaker 1: this or that or being a security guard. At whatever
• 2:15:41
  Speaker 1: club or whatever. But for him to leave the DPD
• 2:15:48
  Speaker 1: just to do that, it's yeah, I mean, I don't
• 2:15:53
  Speaker 1: know what to think about that for sure, but he
• 2:15:55
  Speaker 1: is definitely in my top three SUSS list for sure,
• 2:16:01
  Speaker 1: with Westbrook for sure, in the DPD.
• 2:16:09
  Speaker 4: Absolutely. So that's all we got for you. Sorry we
• 2:16:12
  Speaker 4: went a little long, but you know that's what we
• 2:16:14
  Speaker 4: do here. We gotta give you the juicy bits. We
• 2:16:17
  Speaker 4: gotta give you the meat of the sandwich. Sometimes it's
• 2:16:20
  Speaker 4: a very thin, it's a very thin sandwich which is
• 2:16:24
  Speaker 4: more bread than meat. But tonight it was more meat
• 2:16:26
  Speaker 4: than bread with a lot of condiments thrown on top.
• 2:16:31
  Speaker 4: Maybe a little cheese, little mayonnaise, little mustard, little pickles, tomatoes,
• 2:16:36
  Speaker 4: little onions, a little lettuce. You know what I'm saying.
• 2:16:39
  Speaker 4: It was fat ass sandwich Joe, that one. And like
• 2:16:44
  Speaker 4: I said, I purposely did not monetize this video just
• 2:16:49
  Speaker 4: for Christmas' sake, so you can watch us without any ads.
• 2:16:53
  Speaker 4: So if you're gonna see ads, there ain't from us.
• 2:16:56
  Speaker 4: They're from YouTube. Thank you, sir. So Merry Christmas to all,
• 2:17:03
  Speaker 4: and we shall see you before Christmas. Though again at
• 2:17:09
  Speaker 4: some point next week we'll let you know we will
• 2:17:12
  Speaker 4: discuss after the show.
• 2:17:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll do something for members only and we will
• 2:17:18
  Speaker 1: be back next week on the twenty seventh, two days
• 2:17:24
  Speaker 1: after Christmas, for another great, informative, entertaining podcast from your
• 2:17:37
  Speaker 1: boys at the Lungum And.
• 2:17:39
  Speaker 4: As per the always hope you enjoyed it again our
• 2:17:43
  Speaker 4: best from hours to yours. Have a great holiday, but
• 2:17:47
  Speaker 4: at least say, well chat before that problem. So with
• 2:17:51
  Speaker 4: that being said, Joe, go get your goddamn dog.
• 2:17:58
  Speaker 1: I gotta wait till the music starts.
• 2:18:01
  Speaker 4: She should know to come running when she hears his
• 2:18:03
  Speaker 4: music start playing.
• 2:18:04
  Speaker 1: By now, I got a train here like that. She
• 2:18:06
  Speaker 1: she has been really good and just sleeps on the chair.
• 2:18:09
  Speaker 1: So and whenever I get hurt.
• 2:18:15
  Speaker 4: Gry, she did dance time.
• 2:18:33
  Speaker 9: The greatest lies are told in the name of truth,
• 2:18:36
  Speaker 9: the greatest crimes are committed in the name of justice.
• 2:18:39
  Speaker 2: The quotation could be used for.
• 2:18:42
  Speaker 7: Him or against him in this strange case.
• 2:18:44
  Speaker 4: Good night.
• 2:18:53
  Speaker 1: H m hm.
• 2:19:05
  Speaker 2: H.
• 2:19:06
  Speaker 4: And there's the awkward ending.
• 2:19:08
  Speaker 1: Yes, thank you as everyone, guys, Thank you as always, guys.
• 2:19:12
  Speaker 1: And if we don't talk to you before Christmas,