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Why do Friendships Feel Different Now? · Conversations Beyond Borders

• 0:09
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, I'm Susan.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm Laura.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to Conversations Beyond Borders.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: We're at season two, episode seven, Laura.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, Susan, what's the conversation about this time?
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, I've been thinking a lot about friendships lately.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: I was thinking about when I'm closest to now and how different friendship feels at this age than it did, let's say 20 or 30 years ago.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: Back then, so much friendship seemed to happen because our lives were happening in the same places.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_01: We worked together, our kids were friends, we lived nearby, we were at the same hockey games, school events and parties, you know, whatever it was.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: And now I think I want something different from friendships.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be able to be myself inside my friendship group.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: So this one's important, Laura.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_01: You and I have talked a lot about just wanting to be ourselves: the good, the bad, the ugly.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: We definitely want to laugh with a friend, but we also want to know that they have our back when things are tough.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: I don't want to come to a friend and feel judged or feel that we can never disagree.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: No more posturing or performing.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_01: Right, exactly.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: The kind of people who don't need an explanation if I disappear for a few days, the ones I can laugh ridiculously hard with, but also sit quietly beside.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_01: We need a safe space with each other.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_01: I agree.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: Laura, have you noticed that what you want from friendship now is different from what you wanted 20 years ago?
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, definitely.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I would say yes and no.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: I would say what hasn't changed is I still want women in my life that can mentor me.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I also want, you know, the ones that are, you know, a few years ahead of me in life.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: But I also want women in my life that I can mentor, lift up, and offer my life lessons learned.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: But what has changed is I'm definitely more selective about who I let in.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: Ah, that's funny.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: But you know what?
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: Strangely accurate.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: I don't remember deciding, okay, these are my new friendship requirements, but somewhere along the way, what makes someone feel really close to me has changed.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: No, that makes sense.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: I would say as I've gotten older, I pay more attention to how I feel around someone.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to waste my time around people who suck.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, seriously.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I think about how I feel when I'm in the same space with people.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: Can I truly be myself?
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like you said, you know, can I relax?
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: Do I feel they understand me?
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: Or do I walk away feeling completely drained?
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like hanging out with energy suckers.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, right.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't think that necessarily means anybody did anything wrong.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: Just maybe friendship just changes because we change.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: Before we talk about what friendship looks like now, let's go back a little and look how earlier friendships were formed.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: Laura, have you noticed that what makes someone a good friend at this age may be completely different from what made someone a good friend 20 or 30 years ago?
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know, as we said, earlier friendships were often built around shared lives, school and work and kids and sports and neighborhoods, and you know, the couples, the careers, the schedules.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes friendship happens simply because we're standing beside the same woman every Tuesday afternoon.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_01: But now maybe we're paying attention to something different.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I would agree.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: I would agree.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: I will say, you know, my friendships today look completely different than they did in my 20s and 30s.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, back then I was raising kids.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: So a lot of my friendships came from those kid raising circumstances.
• 4:19
  unknown: That's right.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they were they were my peer moms, they were PTA moms, they were hockey moms.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we, you know, we were walking through the same season of life together, raising kids and trying to figure it out.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: But I also had that group that got together once a month for Bunko.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: That's so funny.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_01: I moved to Colorado and some ladies in the neighborhood invited me to play Bunko.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: I had no idea what that game was about, but I can tell you through those connections, I developed good friends.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: And even some of those ladies are great friends today.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: But you're right, through various circumstances, as you mentioned, other friendships fall away too.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: Laura, did having children create friendships you assumed would last forever?
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, absolutely.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: I met women because of my kids who are still very important in my life today.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I gotta say, as I prepared to record this episode, I really thought about your statement about friendships changing because of no fault of anyone.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I found that to be a little bit of a triggering statement for me.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_00: Oh no.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, you know, as as I reflected, I would say that I found that I had a bit of a mixed bag of reasons people left my life.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: I have a few people completely turned their backs on me during some of the most difficult times because for them, supporting me was way too hard for them.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: Oh boy.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: And and I will say, some expected, um, but others did surprise me.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: Susan, so how would you say your friendships have changed?
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I'd say my friendships have changed because I know myself better now, and I'm less interested in competition or the comparisons.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: Oh boy, of friendships, maybe that I had had.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: I'm more interested in genuine connection.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_01: I also value friendships where we can talk about the things we once have left unspoken and just be honest with each other.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: I am invested in the work now of a real friendship.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's great.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, have you found you're less tolerant now for friendships that require a lot of maintenance?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: Because you know we have those people.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we do.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: That's a tough question because as we get older, maintenance has a whole other meaning.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: True.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: I have a lot of maintenance.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_01: I say earlier friendships may have been more concerned about how much work does it take to manage a friendship with someone.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: And then you may bow out of a relationship that just requires too much work.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: Today I have matured and recognized what true friendship can look like.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: I have a dear, dear friend who's in a wheelchair, and the things I may do for her or with her are acts of love.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: I can tell her that I'm spent and she hears me.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's beautiful.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: Is that maturity or are we simply protecting our capacity?
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: Well, honestly, I think it's both.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: As we discussed in our last episode, we can't ignore how capacity, our ability to physically or emotionally fulfill a commitment, affects decisions.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_01: But aren't we supposed to be wiser as we age, Laura?
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_01: I have learned to trust myself and trust the people I have in my circle.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: So I would say both, but while preparing for this episode, you spoke of friends that have lasted through completely different versions of yourself.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe you want to share that.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: Those people that have been in my life for a very, very, very long time.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: So my friend Darcy, I've known her since we were six years old.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: Her family moved to the neighborhood, and we have, you know, like normal people with lives as they evolve.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you've got kids, you get married, you move away, you come back.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: So she has been a constant drifter, or we have been constant drifters in each other's lives.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: But she knows all of me.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: She knows all of me.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: She probably knows me the best out of everybody.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's good to have that touchstone in your life.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um but I will say there's also uh another group of people, my Colorado friends, you know, you, Sarah, Jan, Robin, Kate, um, you know, and and my friend Susie.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's so funny because Colorado is where we we moved away from, I'm gonna put dare quotes here, home for the first time.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: And Colorado is really where I came into myself and understood who I was.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's why all of you Colorado friends are so important.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and why the friendships were really solidified because for me it wasn't on such a surface level because I was going through some some changes of my own.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: No, that's fair.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: They're they're important.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think it's a good reminder that friendships they don't all follow the same path.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_01: That some grow and change with us, some are meant for a particular chapter and some evolve.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_01: And and like I said, some become family.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so we've acknowledged that friendship changes for all kinds of reasons, and they can look very different than our earlier ones, but some of the changes are harder to explain or even to talk about.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_01: Not every friendship ends with an argument.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes nothing happens, and that's almost harder to understand.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I agree, agree a hundred percent.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: I have people in my life I still consider friends, even though we don't interact regularly anymore.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think it's just one of those things I've learned as I've gotten older.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: Friendships don't necessarily end just because they've changed.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I will say, you know, I've had a lot of different seasons in my life: a move, a marriage, a divorce, another move, building a career.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_00: And each transition definitely changed some of my friendships.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: I've lost some along the way, some simply became more distant, and I've gained others I never could have anticipated.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: Susan, can I share a couple of my favorite examples?
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, please do.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: I I, you know, I think our our listeners want to know more about our lives and and how we are managing friendship in midlife.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: So go ahead, Laura.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: Well, so so one of the things I found really surprising is when my I don't know, calling my second husband, my current husband.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: Current husband almost sounds like there's gonna be another one down the road.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um about just Greg.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: I was gonna say, we'll just call him Greg.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: So when when Greg and I got married, we found that the people that showed up from the people we invited was such a huge surprise.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: And mostly because we we were in a completely different state than most of the people that we invited.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so um, you know, there's people, you know, like you and Dawn showed up, you know, my other Colorado friends, Sandy and Sarah Goldberg showed up, um, and then a bunch of Greg's college friends.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: And so it was like this moment that either re-energize some friendships or introduced me to some of Greg's college friends.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so now there's a couple of the couples that I met through Greg that um we we get together once a year.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: And oh, it's just been great, it's been a blast, and I've grown to absolutely love these people.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: So that's been uh that was that was very unexpected.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: And then my granddaughter brought me her other grandparents into my life.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's pretty cool.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's amazing.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: It's amazing.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: Kent and Jennifer are just the best, and they would not be my life if it wasn't for for my CC.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: So definitely I've been grateful for that journey.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: So, so I've learned that our lives change, our friendships naturally shift, and sometimes there's loss in that, but there's also this really beautiful possibility that new people can enter your lives in ways you've never expected.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: I absolutely agree.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_01: Staying open to the possibility of new friendship, I think is a really critical part of this podcast because there are so many factors that we don't always have control of that impact our friendship circle.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: You know, our health changes.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_01: I have friends that have lost spouses, we have different financial circumstances, different lifestyles, and heaven forbid we not include politics.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_01: Oh god.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_01: How that has divided um, you know, families, friends.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's tragic to me.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, me too.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: There are the friends that keep reaching out, even and eventually realizes she's the only one reaching out.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: There's just so many ripple effects of things like that in our lives, and then the harder questions.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: So, how do you know when a friendship is just going through a quiet season versus you've actually outgrown each other?
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's that's an interesting distinction.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: I can definitely answer this question mostly because when I moved here to Colorado, obviously, there was distance between me and all of my childhood friends, my high school friends, my college friends, our family friends.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and distance can really change how you view a friendship.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_01: Because some, you know, I go I can go home and that regardless how many calls or emails or birthday wishes we've extended to each other, we just pick right up.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then there are others that need those closer connections than you can sometimes offer.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and losing a friend can really hurt, really hurt.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yet we don't really have rituals or even language around friendship loss.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: There's no divorce or the official breakup, but sometimes there's not even a conversation.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that's happened for me and a few friends in Canada that I was that I was pretty close to.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: You just slowly realize that maybe we're not friends anymore, but we're just we're not making time for each other, and that's an important part of friendship, and just doesn't really can affect that.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: But I don't know if you've experienced this, but it's it's a heavy, heavy discussion around friendship that does deserve some room in this conversation.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: No, for sure, for sure.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: And and I do know exactly how this feels.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: There were two women in my life who I expected to be in my life forever.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: One unexpectedly abandoned me.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: It was that just what you're talking about.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: There's no phone call, there's no nothing, it's just kind of poof gone.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then the other one just disappeared.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: And when I think about these two women, um, I have to say the one, the first one who abandoned me, I I look back and it it doesn't bother me at all.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but the one who just disappeared, I mean that that one hurts.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think about her all the time, and I really, really miss having her take up space in my life.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um for whatever reason, she she has just always felt like home for me.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we had she was one of my Colorado friends, and so we have friends in common, and I've talked to the other friends that that we had in common, and nobody knows what happened.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's just so so it's not it's so it's nothing personal, right?
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's not like she's you know, I'm the only one or I did anything or she's mad at me.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: Or something's going on in her life you don't even know about.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly, exactly.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: And then that's even to me, even worse, because it's like I would love to be there and support her, but how can I do that?
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, how can I do that?
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: And and so that that one, that one's a tough one.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_00: That one's a tough one.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: She um, I I yeah, I would love to have her back in my life.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, um, yeah, but it's so so it's funny, it's funny because we spent a lot of time talking about the friendships that changed, but we're also at an age where we may actually need to meet new people.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's so true.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: And can we talk about how weird that is?
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: What making friends at this age?
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's it's where we're supposed to where are we supposed to find them?
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I actually have an answer for that one.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: Or at least I have an idea.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: It may not be an answer, but I have an idea.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: Because we've moved to a new state, yes, I'm I've decided, you know, after we've gotten all settled in and you know, I've got a little bit of brain space, um, I've I'm planning to conduct my own little experiment.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_00: You are I am, I am, and so since I have to start over socially, I've decided that I'm not gonna sit around and wait for just somebody to randomly show up at my door, and I actually need a strategy.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: I can't wait to hear about this strategy because man, where are we supposed to find them?
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: What you meet a woman you really like, you have a great conversation, then there's this bizarre moment should we exchange numbers?
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Then should I text her?
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_01: Then maybe she's just being friendly.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: It's practically dating.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think in this new strategy and this way to find new friends, is vulnerability a part of the friendship?
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: So I would say before some life experiences, I would say yes, but this has turned into a difficult one for me.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I have misjudged a few people.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I've overshared traumatic life events and ended up feeling very judged about how I handled them.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I will say I'm definitely a bit more guarded than I used to be.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's fair.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um let's just ask a few questions and see if we're actually ready to take on this new strategy.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: Would you be willing to make the first invitation when it came to reaching out to a new friend?
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: I would be very comfortable with that.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: Good.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: Good.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: So let me ask you: do you think online friendships become real friendships?
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: I honestly think they can.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think I think there are a lot of people who are isolated in their lives and may not have the opportunity to, you know, talk to a new friend.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um maybe they have a hobby, but it's not shared in their area.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: But I've known from first personal experience, I was involved with a group.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um we were getting involved to make courses, and she was uh she spun yarns.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: I was gonna say, this is your wool lady, it is my wool lady.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um I remember your wool lady.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and I was shocked in that group how close we got.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't because we had to be really vulnerable, we just had to share our lives and know that the people that were in that group were there with the same desires, let's say, and we're motivated to share and to learn.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, I think online friendships can be real.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think we need friends of different ages?
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: I would absolutely say yes, and actually, you even validated that by what you said with your online group and your friends, because I will guarantee you these people were of different ages and have walked in different segments of the common goal that everybody had and were able to mentor each other one way or the other.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I would I would definitely say yes, we we need friends of different ages.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_00: Do all our friends need to know every part of us?
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I tend to say not necessarily because there are some things that I will share with with a group of friends, but that's because they've been parents and are now empty nesters.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think they would understand my struggles and my challenges.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but not every friend can relate to what I'm going through.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's knowing yourself.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_01: So who do we reach for first after all of these questions?
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I've got to say, for me, I don't have one person that's my go-to for everything.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: Because there's so many different parts of my life.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I've been fortunate to build friendships along the way that connects to those different parts of me.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: But if I, you know, called you about this, you know, big work accomplishment, you're not gonna have any freaking clue, you know, what big You know how big of a deal that is.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: But if I called my friend Marcy, who's who's also an analyst and has done my same work, she's totally gonna get it and be able to celebrate back with me, right?
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then I would say I've got people from my childhood who have walked through so much of my life with me, like Darcy that I was talking about earlier.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so there's history you can't just recreate.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: You can't but and I've also been really fortunate to recently reconnect with a couple who are older than me.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: And as I was growing up, they were my pillar people in my life when I was a teenager.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's awesome.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's amazing.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's a it's amazing.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it's been one of those incredibly surprising, true blessings of this move because we bought the place and had no idea they were less than five minutes.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: Less than I I think it takes me three minutes to get to their house.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: You are kidding me.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, they used to be neighbors in um the house that my mom's in, and then um I babysat for them when they after they moved, and their kids were a little bit older, and then um I got married and moved away, and they moved out of out of eastern Washington, and we lost touch, and then to have this incredible full circle circle moment.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um and and there's just something about being in their space, and I and I know, but a lot of it's because of the history, but it just calms me, grounds me, and and fills my soul.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's just it's like I said, just absolute true blessing.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that is absolutely so that's incredible how an an older friend has come back into a newer chapter for you.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: Have you had new friends that you haven't known after 50?
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: I've definitely made a few.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I have my friend first, hairdresser second, Jen, who you know.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I do.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: Who did our hair for our branding shoot?
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, my neighbor Cheryl, my acupuncturist, um, Dr.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yvonne Scarlet, and my friend Jenny.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_00: Can I share with you the funny story about how I met Jenny?
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: I think you need to.
• 24:14
  unknown: I think.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_00: No, you're gonna say no, and then everybody's gonna be like, what?
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so so pre-COVID, I traveled weekly for work.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: You sure did.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I was on a job that took me from San Diego to Rochester, New York every week for a little over a year and a half.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so one of those weeks, I was flying through JFK direct to San Diego, and I ended up sitting next to this woman named Jenny.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: Now, you know, the JFK to San Diego flight's a little bit long, and we immediately clicked.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so by the time we got off that plane, we exchanged the phone numbers, we were best friends, we texted each other.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_00: She grew up in San Diego, her parents live in San Diego, and but she lives in New York.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so anytime she'd come to town, she would call me, we would get together.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: Her and Greg and I have had dinner together, and this woman came to Maine with her boyfriend from New York.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, no, Jenny is is is great.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: So um it's uh again, you know, it's just about being open, right?
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's about being open and you never know who you're gonna click with.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be in the strangest of places, the strangest of times.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_00: And it has been.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um but Susan, what about you?
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: Are there any new friends in your life?
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_00: I know you picked up pickleball.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: The interesting thing about pickleball, and I want to say this to our listeners, is that I absolutely love to play pickleball, and I have a few college friends as well.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_01: When we get to um together, we play pickleball.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: But friends in pickleball are not what I would consider fitting into a friendship criteria.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: We laugh, oh my goodness, we obviously play hard.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and when there's very little time in between games, we might chat.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: But quite honestly, it's it's it's a group of friends that just help me forget about maybe the heavy parts of life.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: I can show up, I never know who's gonna be there.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's a drop-in situation, I never know who's gonna be there.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: Half the time, I can't remember names given the age we're at, but quite frankly, it doesn't matter.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's it's we can have friendship with a lot of people, or we can just be friendly with everyone.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's just um, it just, you're right, feeds something in my soul that that um reminds me of of who I am because I've always been very social.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: And it was scary walking into a pickleball drop-in scenario because I didn't know anyone, so it's provided this sense of self and strength and confidence that um comes from a group of people that I don't necessarily hang out with beyond pickleball.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's awesome! That's awesome.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_00: But I also love that um they give you that time and space to kind of disconnect from the rest of the world and just be present with them.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, no, that's great.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: That that's uh that's the friendships change, and I think if we can, as you said, keep your eyes open for opportunities to be social, be friendly, and not worry about now I've got to replace my best friend.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think, I think, I think maybe friendship isn't getting smaller, maybe it's just becoming more honest.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_01: We're simply getting clearer, I think, about the people we can laugh with, we can be quiet, disagree with, lose touch with for a little while, and somehow still find our way back.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe some of the most important friendships in our lives aren't necessarily the ones we've had the longest, they're the ones where we don't have to work quite so hard to be ourselves.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the ones we can completely exhale.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, those are my favorite kinds.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and we'd love to hear what this looks like in your life because these conversations were never meant to end with the just the two of us.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_01: You're a part of them too.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: So tell us, have your friendships changed as you've gotten older?
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: Have you lost friendships that you thought would always be there?
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_00: Have you made a wonderful new friend later in life?
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_00: Or maybe you've simply realized that what you need from friendship is now different.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: Come join us in the Conversations Beyond Borders Facebook community and tell us.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes the best part of these conversations is realizing how many other women have been thinking the very same thing.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, and if you know a friend who is listening to this episode and immediately say, Oh my gosh, this is us, send it to her.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: You can find Conversations Beyond Borders with Susan and Laura on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, iHeartRadio, and YouTube.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're enjoying season two, follow or subscribe wherever you're listening so you'll know when our next conversation is waiting for you.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time, keep wondering with us because none of us has midlife completely figured out.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: And we're not supposed to.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_00: See you next time.