Latest / The Ambitious Coach Lab / The Swiss Army Knife Coach: How to Deliver Value Leaders Actually Feel - Bill Green

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The Swiss Army Knife Coach: How to Deliver Value Leaders Actually Feel - Bill Green · The Ambitious Coach Lab

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the Ambitious Coach Lab, powered by Nightmare.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Dr.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: Cam Lawton.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: Each week we explore the real tactics, tough conversations, and breakthrough moments that drive coaching success.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: Let's jump into today's episode.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: All right, well, we have Bill Green with Effect Advisors with us today.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: I met Bill at an event in Greenville, South Carolina.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: Almost by happenstance, he was speaking on a panel and we were sponsoring the event, and we all went out to eat afterwards.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I was just so impressed with the content that you shared, and really just you as a person, and was just intrigued by your offering and how you you frame your coaching practice.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: So when we were starting this uh of just thinking about people to bring on, you were one of the first people that came to mind.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm super excited.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna talk through a little bit about how you have grown your practice and how it's evolved over the years, and talk through how your offering has evolved with that, too, of two of the core competencies of running a practice.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: But before we get in, let's just talk a little bit about Bill and your journey of how you got to where you're at today.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thank you, Cam.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for having me here today.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I enjoyed meeting you too in Greenville.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to believe that was uh just in April, but really enjoyed the afterglow with you and the rest of the panelists and getting to know each of you better.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I'm glad to be here today and I appreciate the invitation.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, as you know, I mean, I uh I've I've gotten to where I'm at.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: I've been nine years now in my practice.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I started Effect Advisors in 2016.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: After 15 years as a coach in the corporate world, I coached in the in the healthcare uh sales industry and uh field representatives and account management teams uh for a long time.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: And ultimately, I kind of decided, maybe in my mid-40s, that that I wanted to do uh professional coaching for entrepreneurial organizations for a living when I turned 50.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: That was sort of my my my goalpost.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: And and I did.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: I started uh officially kind of doing it full-time uh when I turned 50.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: But uh my first client ever was a soccer dad that pulled me from the sidelines and said, I'm starting a business with a client of mine in construction.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I know project management and estimating, but I don't know how to lead teams and build organizations.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: I could use your help.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I thought we were going to have a beer and give a few tips or something like that.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: And as it turns out, he really kind of wanted me to be what I later kind of learned to be a coach, facilitator.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and so I worked with that organization for about a year and a half on a variety of things, and I reached a point where everything I had learned in my corporate career, 23 years, 15 in leadership, you know, was kind of all I had.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I happened to run into a friend who had a friend that was an EOS implementer.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: And uh he invited me to join his practice, and I became certified as an EOS implementer in 2018 and kind of brought that into my practice.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: That was my first official sort of tool, I guess.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I did that for three years with this client and and uh several others subsequent to that, and really began to see the value of coaching and especially coaching with frameworks and tools that were intentional and meant to create a certain outcome.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm really, really grateful for that experience.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, my practice has grown uh since then uh in a variety of directions.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, really what I do now is help organizations and their leaders translate strategy and culture so that it's relevant to everyone in the organization.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: And my goal is to help uh business leaders flip frustration into freedom for them and their people.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: I help leaders tap into the genius of their front line so they can upgrade their bottom line.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: And that's my my aim right now.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: And and I've really evolved uh to that level at this point uh in my career.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: But uh I really am really grateful for the experience I had uh with EOS back in 2018 to give me that sort of context about what's available and what's important.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's fascinating.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, uh really a long-standing career in coaching from a variety of different angles.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: And that probably leads to uh a, I don't know, the word that comes about is like a tool belt, but like of a variety of different things that you can tap into from that longevity of experience in actually doing the practice of coaching others.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: That's true.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: And ironically, I spent, you know, like many uh middle-aged men, you know, I turned 55 this past October, uh, coaching my children and and youth sports, all three of my adult children in various ways over a decade or more.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so you learn a lot coaching, working with other parents as volunteers to coach and really just understanding what motivates people, what drives them, you know, what does a plan look like?
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: What does a strategy look like?
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: How do you execute in ways that get the outcome that you look for?
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't think there's really any opportunity to coach where you can't take a lesson from it and apply it uh in the right situation.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I can't, I would be lying if I said I didn't find a number of occasions in coaching multi-million dollar businesses and very, very successful entrepreneurs where I haven't relied on a moment I had with a six or eight-year-old during a T-ball game, because it's not a lot different.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's just different ages and different levels of understanding.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: But I think coaching is a very important uh piece of a leader's development uh as our tools and frameworks and systems.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so uh I definitely feel like it to your point, the the experience that I've had while varied, even going back to high school, you know, working summer camps and various things that I did through college.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: And there's always a way to kind of uh glean experience and and apply it in situations to get better outcomes for people.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_00: And that's really what I'm committed to.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's funny you you say the sports thing.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: I had been kind of toying this idea of so my high school basketball coach has moved into to actually being a college coach now.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: And he and I have stayed in touch, you know, and I've just loved the success he's seen.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, do I bring him on to kind of talk through just some of the psychological aspects of coaching college athletes that applies to?
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, I don't know, I feel like that's probably way off base, but then you bring that up on your own, and I didn't even prompt you on that.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so like maybe that is a conversation that's gonna be beneficial because there is, there are obviously, you know, differences, but there are aspects of motivating people and understanding that in practices that that probably translate across the business to from you know the the court or field to actually business related things because you're dealing with people, which is really a primary focus.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: But tell us a little bit about where you're at with your practice right now.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like what are some of the the next steps or the next you know goals that you have for for the coming years here?
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and Cam, I think you just kind of hit a key point there in answer to your question.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: And and really, I think the thing that I'm really digging into these days is that very observation you made about, you know, even the the athletic coach and youth coaching is to get better outcomes, whatever it may be, to score a goal, win a game, get the trophy, win the championship, or grow your business by X percent, it really is important to get people who are you're asking to go with you to be engaged and inspired and motivated to do it with you, not for you, not despite you, not to prove anything to you, but rather to have them join you and to grow your business with your people.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: So, really what I'm focusing on right now is taking the work that I do with leadership teams in the C-suite, you know, three to five, maybe seven people who are sort of setting the strategy for the organization and getting that clear so that we can translate it to the rest of the organization and build a culture where the people who are on the front line of the business every day, interfacing with the customers and clients, doing the work, packing the boxes, loading the trucks, driving the trucks, whatever it is that they do, feel just as engaged and clear about where there is for the organization as the people who are sitting in the boardroom.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I like to say ultimately, helping organizations translate strategy and culture so that it's relevant to everyone in the organization, so that you can tap into the genius of your front line to improve your bottom line.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you don't have everyone pulling in the same direction, now they may not pull the same relative degree of strength.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: They may not pull with the same, you know, resilience and innovation and all the things that maybe top-level leaders do, but you want everybody pulling in the same direction.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: And when you have that, you get good things.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: So, my primary focus right now, my practice is looking for ways to take what's happening in the boardroom, go down to the showroom floor and start asking around and seeing if it's resonating.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: If it is, let's keep doing it.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: If it isn't, let's go back to the lab and figure out how we can tighten it up so that everyone feels compelled to do it.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: Because in the end, Cam, I'll tell you, you know, it's not something I'm necessarily boasting about, but my little middle son's six-year-old soccer team, uh, long story short, we went three seasons, which there were two sections in each season, so six full seat sections without one loss.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: And never once did our team ever say at six, seven, eight years old, we want to win every game, or that we want to win it all.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: I started somewhat out of frustration when the kids were playing around and not paying attention by just huddling them and asking them, what do you want from this?
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: Your parents signed you up for this team.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: What do you want from this?
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: And they said, try your best and have fun.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: And that was about all I heard.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't hear win a trophy, go on to be Lionel Messi, go to play college soccer.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_00: They said they wanted to try their best and have fun.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: And so, as a coach of that team, I felt like I owed it to them to deliver that.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: And you know what happened?
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: They tried their best, they had fun, and they won 32 games in a row with one tie.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's great.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's uh I I played soccer kind of all throughout and had the opportunity to play it in college as well.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I always bugs people the tie.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's like you can go through a whole game and it can end zero to zero.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_01: I know, I know.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: But uh no, that's that's great.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: I I love that.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: So, I mean, kind of talking through you, you one of the core competencies that we believe at 90 of building a successful coaching practice is is having a clear vision, understanding your why.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_01: And one thing I I appreciate about you, and I caught this in the first time that I met you, is you're crystal clear on your why.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you've talked about it a couple of times already in this conversation, but can you talk a little bit about how you've just you've evolved that over the years of of how you've come to just a crystal clear understanding of what you offer, what the problem you solve, and how you came to that?
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I appreciate that question, Cam.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, really my vision, my why stems from the 15 years where I led uh people in the corporate world and really it kind of was was inspired by these young uh kids that I coached when I was uh when my kids were younger.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: You know, when when people feel inspired to be there and they're uh they're able to live to their full potential and be who they really are, magic happens.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, my why is to help 10,000 people thrive authentically at work every day by 2030.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: So ultimately they can realize their full potential and find freedom.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: Because, you know, I think freedom means different things to different people, right?
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: Some people, freedom is freedom of money, sometimes it's freedom of time, freedom of relationships, or freedom of purpose, uh, for example.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of the day, I want people to be authentic, be real, be genuine, know that they can show up and be who they are.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: And when everyone is aware of what's happening in the organization and why, it's a lot easier for the leaders to lead, but it's also a lot easier for the people who are following those leaders to want to follow them.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: So I really believe uh firmly that if I can do my best to help leaders create an environment where their people love the company vibe, they really, really thrive in it.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, the customers and clients for that organization are gonna love the company more and the people will continue to deliver.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I, you know, like Simon Sinek says, he's famous for saying, when when the people, when your uh if your your customers won't love your company unless your employees love it first.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: And that's really what I like to do with my clients is make that happen.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's such a good I uh I'm glad you brought that up because that is such an important part.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: You can tell when you walk into uh a grocery store and the first there, there's no culture whatsoever.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just they're there, it's a paycheck for them.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, versus calling some, I'm just you know, a services, a landscape company maybe in an area, and the culture, they've done the work to develop that culture, and you can feel that all the way through the process from the first time you talk to maybe a secretary or a scheduler or something all the way through, and you can see the work that's been done.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_01: Do you see that a lot of the gap?
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, obviously, there's a lot.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, most coaches are working with leadership team members, right?
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: Typically we're thinking strategically, like you mentioned earlier.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: But there is that disconnect of going from, you know, all right, we've set, we we're we're really important.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: We want to get our core values established.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: We want to understand, we want to have a good culture.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: But do you feel a lot of leadership teams, maybe owners, visionaries, whatever, um, have trouble getting that down to to say the front lines?
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_01: We can take it kind of all the way down.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that obviously must be a struggle for most companies.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Cam, that is true.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that that, those words, you know, like how do I find a way to get what's in my head, in my heart, in my gut, and maybe those things that are in the minds of my leadership team to resonate throughout the rest of the organization.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: That's probably the most common thing I hear when I'm talking to business leaders, either people that are interested in working with me or a coach, or people that I'm working with, is my company is generally doing well.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not terribly dissatisfied with the outcomes we're getting.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: My people are great.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: I love them.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: They seem to love working here, but something just feels off.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, I literally had about three or four clients in a row about a year ago describe it as a vibe, a company vibe.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so that resonated with me because I thought, you know, I love like cool restaurants and churches and, you know, buildings and architecture and a cool bar or something like that.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: You just, it's a cool vibe and you just like being there or being around the right kind of people.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: You mentioned it earlier, you know, and so I think, you know, what I learned is that, you know, for leadership teams to stop fighting fires that are coming up in their business and really work on rekindling the flame that caused them to start the business in the first place and help to ignite that same flame in the hearts and minds of the people that work there.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: That's really what this is all about.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, success through heroics, just kind of like gripping hard and hoping that you just pound it through and everyone will eventually submit and go along, is exhausting.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: And there's no reason to live your life like that.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: So I think, you know, when I think about strategy, it's it's a big term.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: So is culture.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: Those are two big terms that are often, you know, used to describe a number of things.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: But I think strategy is really about tools and systems, frameworks and structures that allow you to carry the flame.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's sort of like a duffel bag you take to the gym so your tennis shoe doesn't fall out or you miss your sock or something.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: You have some way to carry the thing that you're you're bringing forward, but you also need a soul to help keep it alive, to keep that energy, that vibe going, so that you can grow your business with your people using simple tools to align vision and strategy, because that ultimately where you're going doesn't matter if there's no path to get there.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: Grow healthy leaders that that feel like they're part of the thing and and they're not being told what to do or just, you know, kind of going along for the ride.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: They're they're contributing and then getting more of the right things done every day.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: Because if we can get more done and people feel like they're contributing to the to the thing, then ultimately the team is fueling the fire.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: They're the fuel for that flame.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: And that you, as a founder, a visionary, or owner, can do what fuels you.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: That's the freedom I talked about earlier.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: And that breakthrough ignites in the company and people get to where they want to go.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just an altogether better experience.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_01: On that note of the strategy and culture side of things, how does that, you know, you're doing a lot of work with business leaders and management teams on that.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: How does that translate into your own coaching practice of how you approach how you've grown your your practice of aligning those two together?
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I love that.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's funny because I I feel like my natural tendency is to want to be kind of people focused.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's just my nature.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'm an Enneagram too, and you know, all of the uh personality tests would suggest that I'm kind of a people person.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_00: So I would be much more inclined to want to kind of spend my time talking about core values and culture and how people are feeling.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: But in my experience of doing that uh over the nine years that I've been coaching in my practice, including all of the time that I coached in the corporate world, if you don't have a good strategy and a clear vision for where you want to go with the business that's got some numbers and metrics and goals and targets, then the culture you create doesn't really matter because it's just a bunch of people being happy.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: Imagine the soccer team that's trying their best and having fun, but they're getting their butt kicked every day.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: And then suddenly they don't really have fun because losing isn't fun.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then they start bickering because they feel like they're letting each other down, and then they don't start trying their you have a negative impact when people don't know where there is and why it matters.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: So the strategy is just that like, how do we plan to win in the environment that we're in?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: And what's it gonna take for us to do that?
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: How do we do it?
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: What is it, what's the measurement we use?
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: So you have to have strategy.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so, not to say that that wasn't something that I had in my practice before, but I think I might have overswung a bit on the culture piece because that's where my passion was.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: But what I would find is that as cultures got stronger, if the results didn't improve or the strategy wasn't clear, it wasn't sustainable.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_00: So I began to really think more about how do we put strategy and culture together, because the the famous Peter Drucker quote, allegedly, is culture eats strategy for breakfast.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and I like to think it more as culture meets strategy for a cup of coffee.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, they go together.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_00: Culture and strategy travel together.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: You really can't have one without the other.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: And my experience has taught me, especially over the last two to three years, that when the strategy is clear, the culture becomes stronger.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: When the culture is strong, the strategy strategy gets achieved and executed.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: So you really, it's a yin and a yang.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I think it's important to kind of recognize that there's really two key ways to create value in an organization, which is really what strategy is about.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_00: And the one way is to uh increase the the customer's willingness to pay.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: So on that value stick, you you you delight the customer or the client, which everybody wants to do, and you create value, or you can uh decrease the willingness to sell.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_00: So by increasing employee satisfaction, people don't want to leave your organization to go sell their skills and services elsewhere because they love being where they are.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: So if you can do both, increase the customer's willingness to pay and drive value for the customer, and decrease your employees' willingness to go elsewhere by making the job better and the culture stronger, you create more value in your organization.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what every single business leader wants is more value, more profit, more margin, and longer sustainable uh success.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that segues, I mean, so perfectly into uh another core competitive sea, which would be offering, right?
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: Of how you the value stack, the the services you're gonna offer, the pricing, all of those things are kind of come together in in the offering.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: But you have described yourself as uh a Swiss Army knife for organizations, and that's such a great analogy.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: But can you talk a little bit about what that means to you and how that applies to how you've structured your offering to companies as you're trying to work with them as far as coaching?
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate that question, Cam.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I think the idea of a Swiss Army knife comes to mind only because it has multiple uses and it and it does a lot of things well.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: I should first say that a Swiss Army knife knife also doesn't do some things, right?
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: So if you had a Swiss Army knife out in the wilderness, let's say, it wouldn't necessarily start a fire for you, but it might allow you to cut some sticks to rub together to start a fire.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: So there are certainly things in my practice that I don't claim to do, right?
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not a marketing expert.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: I have people I trust who I would refer my clients to around marketing, financial issues, you know, like fractional CFO type stuff.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: I don't get into the weeds around that kind of stuff.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: HR, et cetera.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_00: So having said that, I think what my Swiss Army Knife does is helps organizations either get stronger in six key shifts that I talk about in the organization.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: One of the things I like to talk about in my organizational identity approach to my practice is making shift happen.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: And making shift happen in six key areas, really.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: And those six areas in the Swiss Army Knife are the destination.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: Where are you headed with this organization?
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: Are you clear on where there is?
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: Because people don't want to follow a plan that doesn't have an indicator of where there is.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: Are you designed in a way that you can get there?
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: Is your structure right?
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have the processes in place?
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: And are you making the right bets to make that destination achievable?
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_00: The third area is cadence.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: Are you communicating with one another with the right people and having objectives that are uh able to be met each quarter that get you incrementally along that uh short kind of uh burst of energy to move along the continuum?
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: In your ethos right, do you have the right corporate identity?
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: Are are your core values strong?
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: And do you understand your purpose to where everyone else can align?
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_00: The fifth area is score.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_00: Are you keeping track of that which matters?
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Are you matter?
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_00: Are you measuring what matters most and modifying along the way?
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_00: And then finally, and perhaps most importantly, the sixth shift is people.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have the right people who are growing and healthy?
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: Is the culture supporting it?
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: Are you developing and investing in their leadership?
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: And are you problem solving on a regular basis so that those six shifts can help you take that Swiss Army knife and turn some random sticks and leaves into a raging fire, even if we don't have gasoline or a match?
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um that's really what my practice is all about is making shift happen 90 days at a time.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: And um you mentioned offerings.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: Do you mind if I speak to you please do?
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: So one of the things I've learned um in the last six months or so is that, you know, people want to know there's going to be something they can grab onto today.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: And start seeing some immediate response.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: And what I would what I learned, Cam is I had clients that I would start with without necessarily any kind of evident endpoint, where they would say, we started noticing improvement in the way we communicate with one another within 45 days, or we started seeing uh a lot of the the bickering that was happening organization uh it get erased within 90 days.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I developed a program uh mid-year this year called Shift in 90.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: And that's really what it does is it says, what is it that you want to have happen in the next 90 days that isn't happening right now?
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: And when I talk to prospects and clients, they'll tell me, well, I'd like to see A, B, and C.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: So what I do is I take that Swiss Army knife and I say, well, these are the three things that we need to do in the next 90 days to make that shift start to happen.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: And so we begin kind of engaging with the various tools in my toolbox to make that shift happen in 90 days.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: And then about day 60 to 75, we start talking about what does the next shift look like?
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: And then we get into a cadence of 90 day shifts that move an organization from where they are to where they want to be.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: It might take six months, it might take four years, but at the end of the day, we're we're doing it 90 days at a time.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: And as I said earlier, going down to the front line and asking how is this resonating, going back to the to the C-suite and saying, is it hitting the bottom line in a way that we need it to?
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_00: So shift in 90 is really just a way to uh identify the opportunities in smaller incremental uh ways that keep people engaged uh in the the leadership team and in the organization so that shift can happen and they can get to where they want to go.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I love that.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thank you for sharing and kind of going into detail.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: Great number of choice, if I might say so myself.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: Everything good happens in 90 days, right?
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, right.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_01: No, but there is, I mean, there's something to be said about the power of 90, right?
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: There's something about 90 days that the brain can wrap its head around and we can make a lot of changes in that period of time that really make a substantial impact.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_01: So there's something, there's something to be said about that.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I love that model of all right, hey, we have these specific things that we can go in and talk about, and then let's figure out what shift we want to go and then that adjustment.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_01: But as you're having conversations with clients, how do you determine, based on what they say, for more short-term engagements of hey, this is a short-term solution that we're gonna go into more, hey, this is this is multiple shifts over multiple 90-day periods.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: Because I mean, I'm sure you go into certain ones where it is a is a mess.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: That yeah, that's a very good question, uh, Cam.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: And I do think that every organization that I've dealt with anyway comes to me with a pretty clear idea of the end that they have in mind.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: They can say that I want I literally had a uh a current client come to me uh as a prospect and say, would you facilitate our leadership retreat?
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I said, I would love to, but tell me a little bit more about what you're looking for.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: And they said, Well, and I said it's gonna be one day, and we're gonna bring three people in from all over the state, and we want to work on strategic planning, team building, culture, D E and I.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: And if we have time, we want to get into um exit strategy.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, in one day.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, Well, is that too much?
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, well, it depends because that's a lot to do in one year.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_00: So tell me a little bit more about how you would prioritize that.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: And then they went on to describe the real pain, which took it from the thing that they want to be the outcome, the result of the work that we were going to do in this one day leadership retreat.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: And they started talking about what's happening in the present that they see as barriers to the long-term outcome that they see.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: So I love the way you framed the question: is this a short-term engagement?
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: Is this a long-term engagement?
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the answer is really yes.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's just what prompted me to think more about shift in 90 is getting, like it kind of goes back to baseball on AJ.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_00: You can't hit a home run without touching first base.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we have to get to a place where we get confidence that we can execute on a 90-day initiative first.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: When we start building that muscle and that confidence, we can go to another 90-day initiative.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, and guess what?
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: Now suddenly that pain point you talked about is getting better.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: And you can see clearly the outcome is in the horizon.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_00: So it might be that that 90-day shift, the first one, like in the case of this particular client, we got together and had a two-day session.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: We took, took a one-day session into two and kind of built a roadmap.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_00: We we talked about their structure, we talked about their destination, we talked about their ethos, their people.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_00: And we kind of just kind of went around the six shifts and we built up a one-page roadmap.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: And then they executed for 30 days and said, we need help how to do this better.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_00: So we got together again and went over some fundamental tools that you would find in 90, for example, the same exact tools that are in 90.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so now this client's kind of getting into a quarterly cadence where we're refueling every single quarter by looking back on the past quarter to see where the gap and the gain is, learning how to grow and develop as a team through an exercise that we bring into the to the fold.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_00: And then we set objectives for the next 90 days, not unlike, you know, uh Rocks and EOS, for instance.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: So it becomes a matter of now they can see that they can execute in 90 day increments.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_00: And now that we want D E and I and we want exit strategy and we want a culture and a team building and a strategy, it's happening 90 days at a time.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: And they have confidence that they don't have to eat the elephant in one giant bite.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it becomes a matter of looking at the long-term outcome that you seek, which I call transformation.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to have a transformation.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to be better off in six months or two years or five years than you were on day one.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_00: But let's realize you're not going to get there.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: And one, you can't hit a five-run home run.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's just not possible.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: So we have to take it and increment.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: So it is a short-term commitment for a long-term expectation, but I think it becomes a matter of rolling those short-term commitments into something that you can say, we're better off now than we were a year ago.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: And that's that's the win.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: Talk a little bit about what there's uh one part that kind of piqued my interest of how you navigate it.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: So when you got into that client and they're like, hey, we want to do this, this, and this, and this and this, and try to get it done in one day.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: Then you mentioned something where you said that that it as you kind of progress through, you really got to the root of the issue, right?
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like a counselor would, right?
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: Where you're being in our therapist, where you're going in and and talking through.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_01: But I think one of the most important questions that you can ask is, hey, you know, why is that important to you?
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: Or, you know, that type of question and framing it in your work.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_01: But do you have a specific, maybe not formalized process, but how do you get to that point where, all right, you kind of know you're working in the surface level where where this is a you know, a top level, it's just a leaf of a deeper rooted issue.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_01: How do you get to that to where you can then move forward where you're in that emotional aspect and you know that, all right, this is what the solution actually, you know, the next steps need to be.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm so glad you asked that question, Cam, because I think that anybody who seeks help doing anything has an emotional attachment to the outcome they're not getting.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: I'll I'll use like if you're trying to lose 10 pounds or get in shape, right?
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: There's a reason you join a gym or hire a personal trainer or sign up for a 5K or whatever it may be.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_00: And that reason is your health isn't optimal.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: You're not feeling good about yourself.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: You have a hard time breathing, walk in the stairs, your clothes don't fit, whatever.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_00: You got a wedding coming up and you want to fit into a tuxedo or a dress, whatever the thing may be.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: But the point is, I think it would be irresponsible for a coach not to recognize what is the pain you're experiencing and what is it preventing you from having?
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: That's not the same as saying capitalizing on someone's pain or exploiting someone for being in pain.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: It's to say, is the and it's very important because is this pain causing enough grief in your life that you're willing to do something about it?
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you hire a coach or use something like 90 or any other tool to help you along a continuum from here to there, and it's not relieving a pain, you quit.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you stop.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: And why why invest in something you're not going to use?
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_00: So it's really important, and I like to get to that at some point today, it's like that the person signing up for the coaching has to want to do something with it.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_00: Otherwise, it's a waste of both people's time.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_00: So I'll say, yes, I have a process, and it it's probably been the biggest shift in my practice in nine years.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it was about two years ago that I learned about uh a program called NEPQ.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: I don't even remember what it stands for.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_00: Jeremy Minor is the the the founder and creator of it, but I I thought it was really cool.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was an Instagram post, but uh a neuroemotional psychological questioning, I think is what it is.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: Nice.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: Sounds fancy.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it does.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: But it really boils down to I think what any good human would would do.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: And it's really six questions.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: Number one, what is the problem?
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_00: What tell me the problem that you're facing?
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: How would you describe the pain?
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_00: And how you say it is dependent upon your personality and who you're talking to.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: But you're asking them to associate the pain.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: Does it hurt your shoulder?
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_00: Is it in the tip of your nose?
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: Is it your ear?
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: Is it your knee?
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: Tell me, and what's it limiting you from doing?
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: I can't run, I can't sleep, whatever.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so what is the pain?
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: Number one.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: Number two, what have you tried to alleviate this pain?
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: Has it worked?
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: What have you got?
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: Number three, what impact is this pain having on your life personally and professionally?
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_00: You're getting to a place where the people are starting to connect the pain to a real outcome, right?
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: Number four, if you could have an ideal solution to that pain, what would it look like for you?
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_00: The the fifth question ultimately is if you do nothing, what would you expect to happen?
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: What are the consequences of doing nothing to alleviate that pain?
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: And the final question is, are you open to solutions?
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's it's really been a very casual, non-rehearsed kind of checkpoint in my brain as I'm talking to people, even over a cocktail or at a at a networking event, just to kind of have that conversation a way that says, are you aware of the pain?
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_00: Can you describe it?
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_00: Have you tried anything?
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: Are you just hoping it goes away?
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: If if I were to help you, would you do something with it?
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_00: And if it did, what would it, how would it change your life?
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: If you do nothing, how would it change your life?
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: And then inevitably, I think the people who are genuinely serious will say, Yes, I would like to know what you do because it sounds like you might have something that can eliminate this pain.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I always like to say, if I don't, and I know what your pain is, I'd be happy to tell you someone I know who could help you.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_01: That goes into that.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_01: Understanding the deep-rooted Don Miller has a framework story brand.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you're familiar with it.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: But he talks about, and this is more from a marketing perspective.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_01: So you're method, obviously, when you get into conversations tapping into that, but like he talks about the you know, the external problem, then the internal problem, and the philosophical problem that people consider.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_01: And most people live, you know, especially in marketing, we talk about the external problem.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_01: That's fine and Danny.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I have you know, weeds in my yard or whatnot.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_01: The internal problem is, yeah, I'm actually kind of embarrassed because my neighbor is, you know, retired and has all the time in the world to work on my yard, and my yard's, you know, or his yard and my yard looks like you know, garbage because I have so many weeds.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then there's this philosophical side of thing, which is like, I mean, I deserve to come home and like love my yard.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there's something that's like just that, like, it should be this way.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that framework because it goes through and it kind of taught like there's just deeper levels of how people make decisions is really what it comes down to.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's important as a coach to get to that level and understand just because someone talks through something, that's most likely a surface.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: You've got to connect that emotion with it.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_01: And that's, I think, where a lot of the decisions are going to be made that that's that's the true pain when you get that emotion out.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the reason why that is so important, Cam, is that if you're not experiencing the pain to the point you're willing to do the hard work it's going to take to get rid of it, then the transformation doesn't occur.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_00: And the coach isn't really the person who is delivering the transformation.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: They're delivering the tools and the resources and the facilitation and the teaching and the coaching for the transformation to occur.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_00: The transformation occurs by you.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: So if you hire the personal trainer, me helping you lift a weight or run a marathon is only that.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's you doing the weightlifting and the marathon running that ultimately gets you the medal and the reward that you seek.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's a part of coaching that I think gets overlooked.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I can tell you that, you know, that's something I've really come to appreciate in the last two to five years, three to five years, is that it's really less about tools and frameworks and me and what I'm doing, and more about your willingness to learn and do the things that we are talking about.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: Because that's why I think the question you asked is so important.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_00: If you're not connecting to the emotional need you have as the person seeking coaching, right, then the best coach in the world isn't going to deliver for you because you're not going to do the work anyway.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_01: It goes straight into the that idea of a right fit client, right?
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_01: They're willing to, you know, you can have the best business development and marketing strategy out there, but if they're not willing to make that step and implement, you've got to gauge that in conversations that they're going to be willing to put that work in because it's going to be frustrating for everybody involved if they're not.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_01: So on the topic of just creating uh a value proposition, if you will, yeah.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_01: What would you say and recommend to to coaches as they're going through to get clarity on that?
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_01: What would you say is the most important question or most important aspect of getting clear on your value prop?
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I getting clear on the value prop, Cam really goes back to a question you just asked me.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's such a brilliant uh context that you set with that previous question because I think the value proposition is not about your tools as a coach.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: I will tell you that when I first read traction and became certified as an EOS promoter, I'm like, this is the coolest thing I've ever seen.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_00: If everybody did this, you know, the world would be better.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I had a hard time getting clients in the beginning because I was so focused on convincing people that this was the greatest thing in the world, right?
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: A Swiss army knife doesn't mean anything if you're if you don't can't or if you don't go out into the wilderness.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_00: What do you need a Swiss Army knife for if you don't have to cut down branches and rub them together to start a fire?
• 37:16
  unknown: Right?
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: Or fillet a fish or whatever the case may be.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_00: Open a beer can, a beer bottle.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_00: So having the best tools in the world don't mean anything unless people have a good reason to use them.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so I would say I think the the most important thing is to recognize that coaching is about enabling transformation for people.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: It it you're just the conduit, as Daniel Miller would say.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_00: You're the guy, you're not the hero.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: And you could be the best coach in the world, the most motivational, inspirational, knowledgeable, wise, action-packed, tool-filled person ever.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that doesn't mean anything unless the person who hires you achieves transformation.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_00: So going into a coaching arrangement, I think you have to ask yourself first and foremost, how can I provide transformation?
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_00: That's the value proposition.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_00: Is this person going to be better off at the end of our engagement than they were at the beginning?
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: And how will I know?
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_00: More importantly, how will they know?
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_00: And even more importantly, will they tell me and everyone else we are better because of that?
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's what I think it's about.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's not about this cool widget or this gadget or Swiss RBs.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: Man, that's such a good word.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, coaching enables that transformation, going in and enabling that company to take those next steps.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_01: But I think part of enablement is a willingness to put in the work and going in.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_01: That's such a great tango.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_01: So uh I always like to finish things of of kind of going back in more reflection.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um you were were going back in with rookie bill, uh just starting out in coaching at, you know, whatever age uh you started, but take all the lessons and experiences and knowledge that you have now.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_01: What advice would you give yourself and as you get started?
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I've learned a lot in the nine years I've been doing this, you know, professionally, and then another six or so that I kind of got myself geared up and ramped up to do it.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_00: So it's coming up on 15 years that I've been really dedicated to my practice and 30 plus years of coaching.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the one thing, and there's a lot, there's way more than one thing, but the one thing I would say to rookie bill or any coach starting out wanting to be a coach is a piece of advice that I picked up from David Baer, B-A-Y-E-R, David Baer.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_00: And he said, be indifferent to the outcome.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and and on the surface, that sounds like bad advice, but I think if you're so concerned about what you want in coaching, you're missing the point.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's really important about what the client wants and your ability to allow that to happen.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I think the mistakes you make when you are not indifferent to the outcome is you might rush to get the client and maybe it's the wrong fit for them or you.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_00: You might talk more than you're listening.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: You might offer tools instead of solutions.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_00: You might, you know, uh do things for them instead of having them experience the pain so that they get out of it themselves.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_00: So it becomes hard to enable that transformation when you have an outcome you want.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_00: This is not about you.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so often I think, especially really good coaches, really energetic, enthusiastic, inspirational coaches, those that people from the outside see and say, Oh, I would love that to be my coach, you know, like uh, you know, Nuke Rockney or, you know, it's going back in time, or there's millions of good examples in sports.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Fiery, Vince Lombardi, you know, that's what you see is the inspiration.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: But what you don't see oftentimes is how hard those people had to work to be the player that they were for that coach, because that coach wasn't about him or her.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: That coach was about the player.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I think being indifferent to the outcome to me means that when you put your desire as a coach, even if your desire is to see the client get better aside, it doesn't say be uh uh ignore the uh outcome, be indifferent to the outcome.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to succeed, but it isn't about me, it's about you.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to succeed?
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: And what are you willing to do?
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_00: Because I will help.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: I think I can help and I will do my best.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I would say going back as a rookie, I would say to be more indifferent to the outcome would have made me better faster and allowed me to experience more transformation sooner than I have.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm grateful for that experience because, you know, you learn a lot.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's a great word.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_01: Be indifferent to the outcome.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's applicable to a lot of things in life.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but no, I I totally can see that of that, you know, and I think a lot of coaches, I mean, probably are if we it'd be interesting to do a study on coaches and Enneagrams, because I think probably a lot are twos, right?
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_01: Helpers, rescuers, faculty.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, it comes from a place of wanting to help, right?
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_01: But I think there is a lot of wisdom to letting the client run through that and get to that point and understand.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_01: Again, it goes back to what we were talking about in offering.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_01: They've got to come to that conclusion that they've got to need help and put the work in.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_01: So that's that's a really good word.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_01: Tell me on a on a more maybe personal level, what what's a lesson you're in the middle of learning currently, right in this moment?
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_00: Well, one of the things I love about uh doing what I do, Cam, and I love your question.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_00: What what is a lesson I'm in the middle of learning right now is that I feel like I'm always learning.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I, you know, when I talk about uh helping people thrive authentically at work, part of that means really never reaching your potential, but always striving for it and realizing that wherever there is, there's always somewhere else to go.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not the same as, you know, running a marathon that's 26.2 miles and just saying, well, I'm gonna run 26.3 because everyone else stopped at 26.2.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think going beyond the expectation or going beyond your potential for the sake of doing so is what uh what I'm talking about.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_00: But what I'm learning right now is the idea of stretching uh myself so that I can grow.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think in context, especially of what we've talked about today, the more I stretch myself and grow as a coach, the better I get as a coach.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: And the more confident I am that, you know, maybe not offering the solution, but knowing that the solution is there and helping the client see it without them feeling like they were stupid, you know, it that it gives me confidence.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that I've had, you know, four or five examples recently where I would just, you know, say answer, uh, pose a question to a client.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_00: And the reaction was like, well, why didn't you just tell me the answer?
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm Like, because then you wouldn't have received it the same way.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so there's this certain element of knowing that you've sort of stretched yourself into a place where, like, this is this is new and unique for me.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's uncomfortable, but I feel confident because I worked hard to get here and I'm gonna let it happen.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so now that when I get good at that and it becomes second nature, then I'm gonna stretch a little harder.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_00: So I think, you know, the thing that I'm in the middle of learning right now is the more I stretch myself to my potential, there's always another centimeter I could go.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_00: And doing that makes me better and better and better.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I just want to continue to be better for myself so I can be better for others.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that's something that I'm in the middle of learning right now, is that you're never done.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: You're never done.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, I resonate with that so deeply.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Bill, thank you so much for just a great conversation.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate you giving us a sneak peek behind the curtain of how you evolved your vision and and just I think it's such a unique experience of having a long-term career in coaching and how you've walked through that and gotten crystal clear on your offering and walking through the process.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_01: We will link out to um a couple things that you mentioned, but especially those those questions.
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_01: I think there were six questions uh that you asked.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_01: I think that will be invaluable to coaches to be able to start to work through that from a mental framework of going through that process with clients.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_01: But if people want to get in touch with you, uh, what's a great place to reach out to you?
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_01: So if they have questions, whether it's clients or coaches that want to.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for sure for sure.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: I think the best place to get in touch with me would be at www.shift in 90, s-h-f-i-t-in-n 90.com.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_00: Uh shiftin90.com would be a great place to catch up and connect.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um certainly, uh I don't know if you'd probably include links in the show notes and things, but you know, my LinkedIn profile and things like that.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_00: But absolutely uh I'm happy to uh to connect in any way and help coaches and and prospects learn more about how they can uh ultimately split frustration into freedom and get to the place where their front line is helping to upgrade their bottom line.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_01: Love that.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Bill, thank you so much again.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_01: 100% an example of an ambitious coach, which is more.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Al, love the title.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_01: If you are an ambitious coach and are interested in learning more, we will link out to a lot of resources that Bill has referenced, other things that 90 has for you.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_01: And if you ever want to just get in touch and talk through this, maybe talk through some of, hey, I'm kind of working through, I need to get my offering figured out, or hey, I'm still thinking about my vision.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_01: How would we recommend kind of walking through that?
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_01: That is what we are all about, helping coaches build ambitious coaching practice.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_01: So feel free to reach out to me.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_01: You can reach out via email.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_01: I will put this in the show notes, but happy to set up some time to talk with you.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_01: But I appreciate you listening.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_01: Hopefully you uh learned a lot.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_01: I know I did.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_01: So hopefully everyone has a good rest of your day and uh take care.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see you on the next one.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's it for today's episode of the Ambitious Coach Lab.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_01: My hope is that something here helps you sharpen your craft and keep building a coaching practice you're proud of.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_01: Before we wrap, a quick thank you to our sponsor, 90.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_01: If you're coaching leadership teams, having your clients run their entire world in 90 truly elevates your work.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_01: Vision, rocks, scorecards, issues, it all lives in one centralized place.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_01: The clarity keeps your clients aligned between sessions and makes every conversation you have with them more focused and more impactful.
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_01: I've used 90 with over 500 leadership teams, and I can tell you it makes great companies better and great coaches even more effective.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_01: Feel free to use promo code AC20 for 20% off.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_01: Again, that's AC20 for 20% off.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for hanging out with me today.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Cam.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_01: Cheering on as you grow your ambitious coaching practice.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see you next time.