Latest / MBV President's Podcast / HANNAH DILLIMORE - From Finding a Trade to Victoria’s Top Apprentice

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HANNAH DILLIMORE - From Finding a Trade to Victoria’s Top Apprentice · MBV President's Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks to Exact the County for sponsoring this episode.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_01: Exact understands our industry inside and out.
• 0:05
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• 0:15
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• 0:25
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• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: That's right.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: You can call Exact on 1300-233-723 or click on the link in the description below.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: Founded in 1875, Master Builders Victoria has been supporting excellence in building and construction for generations.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: We represent professionals across Victoria and work together to shape a stronger future for our industry.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: In our President's podcast series, we'll bring you the latest news and share the stories of the people who make our industry great.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the President's Podcast.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Steve Peluso, president of the Master Builders Victoria, and a builder with over 30 years in the construction industry.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: This podcast is about real conversations with real people.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: No corporate spin, no scripted answers, and no bullshit.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_01: We talk to people across industry about what actually happens in construction the wins, the mistakes, and the lessons.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: So let's get into it.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_01: Today's guest is Hannah Dillamore.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: From New Form Still, Apprentice of the Year.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, thank you for having me.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: Before we go on, just I heard that there was close to this is how many people you beat.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_01: Close to 700.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_03: Really?
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_03: I did read in the email afterwards that there was a lot of apprentices there.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of apprentices.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: But your story, in just five years, you've gone from starting an apprenticeship in fabrication and welding, leading teams on site, helping mentor the next generation of apprentices.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: Now, your story isn't just about welding.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: It's about backing yourself, earning some respect, learning from great mentors.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_01: I've heard that you could have some really good ones.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: And proving that hard work and attitude can open doors in the industry.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: So today we're talking to you about leadership, apprenticeships, opportunities for young people, um, and what the future of construction holds.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: So welcome.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you for having me.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_01: I love saying that.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_03: It's got a nice ring to it.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: That's alright.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_01: Now, tell us a little bit about leading up to the apprentice apprenticeship or becoming a welder.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_03: Boilermaker, is that what you call it?
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um I'd like to say boilermaker.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think their trade is quite official anymore.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_03: They've split it in so many different fields.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_03: So officially um it's engineering uh in the fabrication trade.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm a fabricator and welder, yes.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, cool.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: But tell us before that, leading up to it, because apparently you would come to work with different colour hair.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_03: I've always done it.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_03: I've always had I've had purple hair, I've had pink hair, blue hair.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_03: It's just it's just fun, isn't it?
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_03: Usually in the summer, I kind of like to keep the excitement of summer and the colours of summer.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: So you you keep everyone guessing.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_03: I haven't done it for a little while, but um, yeah, I was thinking about it.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_03: I might do it again this around Christmas time, is usually when I do it.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: Don't tell anyone.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_03: No, I just I just rock up, see what they think.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: So, what did you do beforehand?
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_03: I was uh I did a course for well, I was a makeup artist um in special effects model.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: Can you fix me up?
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I don't know if any think of it.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: Alright.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um yes, I did uh my high school, I went through VCE just the normal way.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_04: Yep.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_03: Trade wasn't even on my mind at that point.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, um, went in and did a diploma in screen and media.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_03: That was a year's um year's work.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_03: In the meantime, through all this, I've working at Spotlight as well.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_03: I did work experience at Spotlight when I was like 16 and I'd been there for many, many years.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um if Spotlight wants to um sponsor us, we're happy.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Spotlight's great.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um and so I did my makeup course and then I was working in the industry for maybe a year, maybe not quite, and then COVID happened.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_03: Um, shut a lot of that down, a lot of um opportunities that I thought would be there kind of disappeared overnight, which was really, really upsetting.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_03: And um I it made me really be like, what am I gonna do?
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I don't know how long COVID's gonna go for, I don't know what it's gonna do to the industry, things are gonna change.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_03: I really have to think about what I want to do.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I had a few signs, I guess.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_03: Signs, I'd like to call them.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um I saw a few videos of people welding, and I was like, oh, that looks interesting.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_03: I wonder how hard that is to learn that.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and then I saw I spoke to a friend who's a boilermaker and he was talking and was like, oh, interesting.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_03: Sounds sounds interesting.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_03: And then I saw an ad for looking for um welders and boilermakers in Antarctica.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, oh, you can go to Antarctica.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_03: That's pretty cool.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's very cool.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_03: Um I was like, oh yeah, that's that seems interesting.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_03: Like if it can take me to Antarctica, like where else can I take me?
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_03: Where can I go?
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um and yeah, which really made me, yeah.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_03: I mentioned it to a few, a few people.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_03: I had a few interviews, a few different um fabrication places, and then I came upon new form, had an interview on the Friday, it started on the Monday, and I've been there ever since.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: So, but it wasn't always on your radar though, was it?
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_03: No, no, definitely not.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_03: It wasn't like literally it was because I'd seen I had yeah, because I really had to think about what am I gonna do?
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_03: I I don't know, I don't know what I wanted to do apart from like doing makeup, there was really nothing else on my radar at all, not just welding, like nothing.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay, and especially especially during those times.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, especially because yeah, a lot of industries, hospitality, like what what do you go into that you can think would have a stable industry no matter what?
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, which led me to, with all the science I had, led me to um welding and so what did your family think about when you come home and said you want to.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think they were very surprised.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um I've always been kind of like that.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_03: I'm a very crafty person and I do a lot of I've always done a lot of crafts.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_03: Any sort of craft in the world I've probably tried.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_03: So I've always been the type of person to be like, I'm gonna knit tomorrow, I'm gonna sculpt the next day.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_03: So I think they weren't too surprised that I was kind of pulled that out.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting, you mentioned craft.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_03: Now you made something to do with being a table.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_01: So can you tell us a little bit about that?
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so within a few months of being at New Form, uh, because we do a morning meeting every Monday, everyone gathers around, we all talk, and I was like, oh, I have something to ask everyone, please.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_03: A little like, okay, what's this apprentice gonna say?
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_03: It'll be interesting to hear.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_03: Anyone who drinks alcohol, drinks, um, soft drinks, can I have the beer, like the lids and the pull tabs off of any anything that you drink?
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, okay.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_03: They're all a bit like why?
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_03: That seems a bit weird.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, sure.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_03: I was like, I'm gonna make a table.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_03: So I had a friend who um yeah, I was like, I I I'd seen a video and I thought it looked really cool.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_03: Went, oh, I reckon I could make it, I could make that table.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and it wasn't exactly the same, it was just sort of an idea.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but it had to do with like the bottle caps all along the top, and you pour resin over it.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, so I made I made a table.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_03: So I I got I still have leftover bottle caps.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_01: So you can make more tables.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_03: I can make probably two more tables.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_03: I have so many.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: I have a whole box full of them.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um yeah, I got so many bottle caps from that.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_03: That was that was really cool when I finished it.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_03: I had to bring it in and show everyone.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_03: It was like, oh wow, it looks really, really cool because I had so many different kinds.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um, a lot of the same, like cut and draft ones, and so it didn't.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so you knew who the count and drafter and I kept a tally for um everyone.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_03: Originally my table wasn't gonna be as big as I made it because I had so many bottle caps.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_03: I kind of had to.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like, why not go pick or go home?
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I yeah, I gave gifted it to um my friend for his I think 21st.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, he loved it.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_03: It was great.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: Does he still use it?
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, he does.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_01: It must be really heavy though.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's a little bit.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it was, yeah.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, yeah.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_03: I tried to find like the lightest steel that I um that I possibly could.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_03: But even making the legs on it, I was quite ambitious with that as well.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_03: I'd never really made the legs the way that I had made them, and I decided I was gonna cut the steel and then take it home and try it at home.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_03: So first time I'd ever used um like a little portable arc welder as well.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_03: I'd never used it before, but I was like, I'm gonna do it at home all by myself.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_03: No help, no nothing.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just gonna try doing it.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_03: Come on, yeah.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it was a good experience, it was fun.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_01: So, what was the biggest surprise when you started the apprenticeship?
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um I thought it was really surprising and really interesting what skills carried over from my makeup course.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, yeah.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_03: You wouldn't think a lot.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, like makeup and welding are very, very different, fabricating very different.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yeah, there were a few things that that crossed over at the beginning that I was quite surprised about.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_03: Um, that you wouldn't really So give me an example.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um when you're doing metal and you've like welded something and you've ground it flush, you put um the stuff that we call bog over the top of it.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: I think you'll build it we call it builder's bog.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay, builder's bog.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_03: People who do cards will know what it is as well.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_03: Um, we put that on it.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_03: And the whole idea of like smoothing our feathering out the sides to make it just blend into the steel seamlessly.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_03: You do that with makeup.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_03: When you put uh prosthetic on the edges of the prosthetic, it has to look like someone's skin.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_03: So you feather it out and you blend it out and yeah, little little things like that.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_03: Not not huge uh different uh not huge similarities, but little little things like that.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's about the techniques, it's a it's a small little thing, isn't it?
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_01: That's pretty cool.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_03: Which are very interesting, yeah.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: Pretty cool, yeah, yeah.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_01: So uh most apprentices focus on learning, yeah?
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but you found yourself actually leading some teams fairly earlier on in your your uh career.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, a bit ambitious.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_03: How did how did that happen?
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um I mean, I can see why it happened.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_03: That's pretty obvious, but I think it came from learning.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_03: Like I I wanted to learn so much and I asked so many questions.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_03: It got to the point that the questions I were uh I was asking was like, okay, well, you might as well do it now.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_03: Like you've asked all the questions that you needed to ask to get yourself into that position.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_03: Why not apply what you're asking and and you try, you give it a go, you do it.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and yeah, I just had I think I've always sort of wanted to like see myself kind of leading leading a team as well.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think the responsibility I take quite a lot of pride knowing that they'll let me have that responsibility.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and that's where I wanted to end up.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, I think it was just a matter of yeah, on site, really just wanting to know everything that I could possibly know, what was going on, why things were done a certain way, getting more into the technical aspect of it.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'd be asking my bosses, like, what goes up in the office?
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_03: What are you doing up there?
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_03: Why are you doing it like that?
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: And it's so and that's how you obviously earn a lot of the respect on site too, yeah, by asking questions.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_03: I hope so, yeah.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_03: Because I even asked, um, I'm not I'm not afraid to ask other trades either what they're doing, why they're doing it.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um, because it it gives me a better understanding of why I'm doing what I'm doing as well, how it helps other people, how it like if I see something that might be now in my way, I know whether it can be moved or or whether we have to work around it, work with it, that sort of yeah.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_01: And that's the separation between a good leader and a poor one, really, isn't it?
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, I would say so, yeah.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_03: So people who go in just being like, nah, what I'm doing's what I'm doing, and it's not always not always the case.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_01: So any advice for any young people that want to be, you know, or go into that leadership, you know, next stage of their careers?
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: What so it's about asking questions, obviously it's the first one.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_03: Is my answer to everything, just ask so many questions.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: Learn as much as you can.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, because also find um by asking questions, learn as much as you can, have a real understanding of what it is that you're doing.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_03: So when you're asked about it, you have your answer.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_03: You can back yourself, you can you know you're confident in your decisions that you've made the right choice.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_03: This is why I've made it.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I'm sticking with it.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_03: If you have something better for me, please like let me know.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_03: But like, yeah, yeah, I'm confident.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: And it's important also to have a mentor, isn't it?
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, yeah.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_03: I've had a many, many, a many.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I would say some.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_01: Which one stood out?
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, when I started, there was another female apprentice, uh, Carly Attard.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_03: She actually won apprentices with a yeah a few years ago as well.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: So when I started from the same company.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, that must be breeding them pretty good.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, we did pretty well over in the board.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um, yeah, so uh Carly, she was um, I think especially as me going in quite young and then seeing her in the roles and in the positions that I wanted to strive and be in.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_03: It was um amazing to see another um girl in that position doing these jobs.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_03: Um she had because she'd sort of just finished her apprenticeship as well, um she kind of could relate a lot to like where I was because it'd only been a few years since she was in the same position as me.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_03: So a lot of the stuff that she had to teach me had to um like support me through was quite still quite relevant to her.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and that was that was invaluable going into like a male dominant dominated industry as well, having a female so close to kind of rely on and like ask questions to.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_03: She was always happy to answer all my questions.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um and then so yeah, Carly was amazing.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_03: And then apart from that, in the workshop, uh, we have just really good wealth.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_03: So we've got some really good fabricators.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_03: Um, one of them, he's actually a Welsh man, his name's Elgin.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_03: He um he's invaluable, he's uh he's yeah, just amazing.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_03: The stuff that he can do, you can ha hand of anything and he can just make it.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_03: You can tell you can explain something to him and he'll just be able to do it.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_01: He's got one of those lines.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_03: He's got gosh, does he have one of those minds?
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_03: And he's um on site, because he's the main installer as well, so yeah, on site he's like that.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_03: He can see a problem like three steps ahead of when it will actually happen.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_03: He's yeah, so a lot of the stuff that I had to learn from him was yeah, definitely like got me to where I am now.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: So are you mentoring anyone?
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_03: Um, in terms of mentoring, like when I'm in the workshop, uh, there's we've got two apprentices in there.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_03: So a girl, her name's Lily.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_03: She's um she's really amazing.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_03: I can see I see myself in her, I think a little bit.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, okay.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, she's really she's really, really cool.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: She's only 17.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and yeah, some again, all the questions that she's been asking.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_03: And because when I have a new apprentice, my first approach to them is ask me anything.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_03: Anything.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_03: Ask me everything.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_03: There's no such thing as a silly question, even if you think it's silly, it's it's not.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um I think because working with older people in the industry, and I'm sure I'll end up there at some point, but when you've been doing it for a long time, it's the really basic things that you forget.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_03: You can't not necessarily forget, but you take for granted.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_03: So how to use a grinder, how to use a hammer properly, how to, you know, like all these basic things that you think everyone should know how to do.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_03: When you start an apprenticeship, you really don't.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_03: Like, unless you've done a pre-apprenticeship, you really, you really, really don't.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I didn't.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: So to have Well you knew about feathering.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, exactly.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: Little things.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I did always help my dad in the garage, so I knew how to use a hammer and stuff.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, there's like little little things like that that people don't really they take for granted, they don't really think about that like it's really important when you first start out.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_03: That's why I like tell them, ask me all the questions.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_03: And she does, and she really does enjoy.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: I think she likes working with me as well because I'm so keen to like answer questions.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_01: That's pretty cool.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: So do you think the attitudes have changed?
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um in your five years, have you seen it shift?
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_03: Do you have like in terms of like in terms of like us to apprentices or apprentices to us?
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_01: Apprentices, both ways.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_03: Um, yeah, I think so.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_03: I think because I think for the better in a in a lot of cases.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: So how we are with apprentices, I think is definitely for the better.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: Like you hear about, oh, when I was an apprentice, I was getting coffee.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_03: I was I was sweeping for years before I even touched a tool.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_03: Like personally, I don't believe in that way of of doing it.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_03: Like, there's absolutely some discipline in that, like learning when to just, I guess, take a step back, clean up after yourself.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_03: That's a really good thing.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_03: But to just use them as like almost cheap labor, I don't agree with.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_03: You're doing an apprenticeship to learn, you're doing an apprenticeship to be a tradesman.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: Like if an apprentice doesn't show interest, it is really frustrating.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_03: I also sort of see it as if you've got no interest in me, why should I spend my time and have interest in you if you really don't care?
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but when you do get an apprentice that really wants to be learning and then they're just on a broom, where's the value in that for anyone?
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so I like really like to put yeah, more effort into like apprentices just straight up learning to begin with.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yeah, I have found uh there are a lot of kids coming in not really, and I don't know if they just don't understand what it takes to do a certain job.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's it's not it's not an easy job.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's not because I was gonna ask you that.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's not it's not an easy job, and you you really do I guess it's kind of like any job.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_03: If you don't want to be there, don't force yourself, yeah, don't and don't make everyone else part of that.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but it's it's the same anyway.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_03: Like we've had really, really amazing apprentices come in who just really take it and run with it, and you can give you I like I want to give all my time to them because you can just see that they're gonna be amazing.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_03: But um I wouldn't say necessarily it's changed, it's just like I obviously haven't been in the industry very long, but just with the five years that I've been, I I've just seen the both both sides of it.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_03: Both really people who really want to be doing it and people who really don't want to be doing it.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: The the separation is greater, I suppose.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and I think it's been like that the whole time.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_03: But again, also if if you're an apprentice really wanted to come in and do it, and then you're just put on a broom, you also have the whole like, well, what's the point of me being here?
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_03: It kind of kills the spirit as well.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, true, true.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so so what's keeping you motivated, or what do you think is going to keep you motivated to stay in the industry?
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_03: I think it is like the apprentices that are coming in, like seeing Lily doing her work and like learning, and um, as I said, sort of seeing me a little bit in it is it's it's really good to see, it's really nice to see.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and obviously, especially like having so many more women coming into the industry is really it's really awesome as well.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_03: Like every almost every site I go on now, there's at least one other girl, and it's like, yeah, yeah, that's cool.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_03: You go you do your thing.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_03: I'm so proud of you.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know who you are, I don't know what you've done, but I'm proud of you just being here.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_01: So that's obviously what excites you about it.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, 100%, yeah.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_03: It's yeah, I don't know.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: Don't ever get off the tools completely.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: No, because that's the problem we have.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we we have that problem, the industry in in a in as a whole.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: How do we keep you guys on the tools?
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and and a mixed.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's got to be mixed.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um so that's that's probably one of the the um biggest issues that we have as an industry and getting the new people coming up.
• 21:00
  unknown: Yeah.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_01: So it's people like you that that will obviously encourage that.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, which is what I want.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, even just from I think it needs to start from a younger from schools.
• 21:11
  unknown: Yeah.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_01: More.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_03: I think it is coming in a lot more.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_03: I've seen, um, I did an interview with uh Southwest TAFE, and that was a classroom full of well, the the youngest was 16, the oldest was 60.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_03: It was a very large range of ages, but there were quite some young girls in there that wanted to do trades.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_03: Like when I was in school, uh you could be a chef, you could be a a nail technician, you could be a hairdresser.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_03: That those were like my options.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_03: If I wanted to do the V Cal TAFE way, that's kind of what was given to me.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, never you could be a Sparky, you could be a plumber, you could be a welder.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_03: That wasn't even suggested at all.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it does start at school and at home too.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_03: I think yeah, a lot of people's minds sort of need a change as well.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_03: In that of like, yeah, women can do this and we're really good at it.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: You can say it out loud.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_03: We're really good at it.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, site stories now, I suppose we want to get into a little bit there.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, okay.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um now one project that was a standout that that I read about was the Zero Headquarters.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: Now sponsorship there.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um Zero Um Headquarters staircase.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, we did the case.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: So tell us a bit about that.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_03: That was the sort of first really big real job that first time I'd been on site, first time I'd seen a crane, it was that was really, really amazing.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_03: So um that was probably only a few months into my apprenticeship.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: So um I didn't know a lot.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_03: I but I learned so much on this one job.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_03: It went for months.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_03: We we built every so it was three, so a flight of stairs, a landing, a flight.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_03: There's three, three of those that we built fully, completely in the workshop.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_03: And I was so lucky I was allowed to work on every single aspect of it.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_03: There was no part of that stair that I hadn't touched.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_03: Which yeah, which was really, really awesome.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I got to use machines that I'd never used before, I got taught how to use those, and then I ended up like on them with someone else teaching them how to use it to press up um the treads for the stair.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_03: I was making the frames, I was um, I painted first time I painted really on it, I painted the whole stair.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_03: Um, we helped put it together again, worked with Elgin to build these three flights of stairs.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_03: Um it was kind of the first time I'd met him as well.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_03: So I was a bit like, oh I don't know, a new person who like has never met me is now gonna be like working with me for months on these stairs.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um that was just an amazing experience to yeah, have really built and like none of the other apprentices were really doing that at the time either.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_03: Like I really was, I did feel like a standout even just then um to be allowed to work on these stairs from literal start to finish.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um and no, sorry.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um yeah, so to be able to like like build them from scratch, like I was cutting the steel, um, we were tacking it together, welding it together, and then putting putting it all the components together.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and then when we got to site, I got give them my first hard hat, go on a site, um which was awesome.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um what color hair were you did you?
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um I it might have actually been pink.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_03: I can't really remember too much.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_03: I think it might have been pink actually.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_03: Um and my boss Greg, he came out as well, and he we he was really, really good.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_03: It was awesome that we were allowed, he was just kind of like, come on, let's stand off to the side and we'll watch the crane pick it up, put it into the building, and when it was going into the building, we're like, all right, let's go in, let's see it be like landed, and yeah, and then so you're building a portfolio for your own personal portfolio.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I I'm really really proud of that.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_03: That was just an amazing experience.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and it looked really good afterwards, especially once the stone went on it and everything.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: That was so just quickly on that, what was the biggest challenge on that job for you?
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_03: Um just not knowing stuff to like literally learning from scratch all these things, like just being at the start being asked, like, have you done this before?
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_03: Oh no, no, I haven't.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_03: And like saying that at almost every every stage should I not like as much as I'm like, yes, I'm really, really learning, it still gave me the whole like like I know not a lot.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_03: There's not a lot that I know.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so in a way, especially as first time I'd met Algin, he's kind of like, So what do you know?
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like I don't know, I don't know what I know.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_03: You asked the question, yeah, but like I want to know everything, so anything that you're willing to teach me, like please teach me.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_03: And that's it, that's his mindset as well, is that he'll teach whoever wants to be taught.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so that was yeah, so I think just like literally not knowing anything was the hardest part of that.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I can imagine that.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so what concerns have you got about where the the industry is heading?
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_03: Kind of um in a weird way, the opposite of what you said before about how like everyone on tools kind of eventually ends up not on them.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_03: I'm finding a lot more uh management on sites have never touched a tool.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um if that the the knowledge and the skill, or what you call it skill.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, like I don't understand how like you can be in charge of managing a team of trades when you don't actually understand the traits.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um like it's like reading it and learning at a university is valuable and it is really good, but you I just don't feel it translates very well to the like actually being there and understanding like the process um like what you should kind of do first, what like there's been a few things that have just yeah, made me sort of think like, have you have you ever touched a tool ever in your life?
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_03: Like, do you actually understand how that works?
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_03: And the expectations that they have of oh, that'll only take an hour's like no.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: So that could be a deterrent then for for young people coming into the industry too, couldn't it?
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_03: Because if you get a bad mentor or supervisor, yeah, you're kind of like like okay, is this what it is?
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_03: Like that's kind of not too great.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: Which is scary, I suppose.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um so where do you think in 10 years where what where's it gonna be?
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: In your view.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_03: Uh well this is the thing.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_03: Uh it's it's it really depends.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_03: Like, if the way that it's going with it, yeah, if with the way that it's going, it's just gonna be a lot of people from um uni who yeah have never touched a tool, like trying to um lead on site um all these, not necessarily not for like apprentices, for trades.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'm talking like management, like builders and stuff.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_03: Like yeah, it's just kind of a disconnect from like almost a I don't want to say clo classism isn't really the word that I'm trying to get at, but I can see that also being a thing where like all of management are all university students and all trades are obviously not to be very much like like because we're I feel like if you're a trader, you're already kind of looked down on a little bit as well, you're like a little bit dumb, like oh, you didn't go to uni, so you're not you're not smart.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like that's just gonna explode, like get a bit bigger.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's really gonna be like the class of trades who are, and even within the trades, we have a sort of like a oh, you're a sparky, you're a bit better than a welder, you know, that sort of thing going on.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_03: I think.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: They even have three colours, that's what they have to do.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_03: Everything's colour-coded, we can do it.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_03: It's so hard to eat a sparky.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yeah, sort of the same thing.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: We need them.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, oh 100% we need him.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_03: I mean we wouldn't be sitting here now if we didn't have them.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yeah, I feel like uh there'd be like way more of a divide in terms of um like r respect for different people for different trades for yeah, uh like management will almost turn the nose up at us tradesmen.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um which yeah, if if things do change, then that's fine, everything will probably be changed for the better.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_03: But if it doesn't, that's that is kind of where I see it.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: But I think AI is gonna start to help us.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: Are you using it?
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_03: I don't believe in AI, no, I don't think it's good.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: Well, it won't replace your hands.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_03: No, never.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: No, it couldn't.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_03: But no, I don't think it's good for the environment.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think it's good for um anyone.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_03: I think it makes pe it makes people dumber.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_03: Like, why if you if you can just ask AI, why go to university?
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_03: Do you know what I'm saying?
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like, why or the unis are probably worried at the moment.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_03: Everyone's going back to well, not everyone obviously, but like a lot of people are going back to um taking tests like writing, taking tests by hand.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_03: Kids are freaking out that they have to write a 500 page essay when it's like that that was nothing when I was in school, even just like I've only been out of school for 10 years, but it's still uh not even 10.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_03: Like, but it's yeah, it's kind of like I don't know, yeah.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_03: No, I don't I don't believe in AI.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_03: Controversial maybe.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: It'll have its place.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it'll have its place, and and you'll you'll be able to use it for you know for plans or documents and bits and pieces and how to do this and something new and so forth.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_01: So it'll have its place.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: But I um but yeah, interesting that you say that.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um so if there's parents listening to this podcast um and they're helping their daughter decide what career path to take, what would you say to them about the opportunities available in construction and the trades?
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um consider it.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_03: Don't pass it off as man's job because it's not and it's been shown that it's not.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_03: Um a lot of the time uh women have girls, females, we have a respect for the trades that men don't have anymore because it's not a given that we're in it.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_03: So we kind of already have a respect for the fact that we're allowed to, as much as I hate saying it, like we're allowed to be in these spaces, um, that a lot of people are like bosses um are recognizing that and seeing like, oh wow, the skill, the dedication, the craftsmanship, the um sorry, I don't know the word, but like the um like the respect that girls are having for this trade is invaluable and like the work that we're getting out of it is a lot better.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_03: Like a lot of um bosses are seeing that and are wanting women to start working for them because we are in some cases we are better.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's don't be scared about the whole they're not strong enough, you build muscle.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, it's it's a dirty work.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_03: Well, a lot of a lot of work's dirty.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_03: Like, you know, it's it's one of those it's one of those things where it's like if someone's good with their hands, this absolutely is such a good industry to go into it.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_03: Embrace it, yeah.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_03: Embrace it, just don't embrace it, yeah.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like the right person for the right job.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_03: Exactly, yeah.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_03: It's the case for for anything.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and yeah, I said, like more women coming into the industry, it's becoming a lot friendlier, I suppose.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_03: Um, there are still problems, but you get those problems in every every industry.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_03: Women, female dominated industries have their problems.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's one of those things is like you can be part of changing that as well.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_03: Like the more women that you see on site, the more um it's just normalized, um, which is amazing and which is so good.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um, yeah, don't like it can be so valuable for for girls to come into this industry and just have skills that you you can't learn anywhere else.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: And it doesn't have to be world, it could be painting, carpentry.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_01: I've got an apprentice carpenter.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um could be electrician, it could be anything.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, um I worked on we worked at Yarrow Valley Grandma.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_03: There was um a female plumber there, and she was doing twice the work as the boys that she was working with.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_03: She was amazing.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we used to have one.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so we're getting to the end.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um we have a sec uh uh a section of what what I call rapid fire.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: All right, so 60 seconds.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, yeah.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um I'm just gonna ask you some questions and just one you know, quick answers.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_01: So favorite project.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_03: Zero.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_01: Most underrated trade.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Welders.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_03: Fuck it.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_03: Sorry.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_03: Welders.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_01: Best advice you've ever received.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_03: Uh back yourself.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_03: Be confident in um in your decision and back yourself.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_01: Biggest lesson learned.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_03: Um you're gonna mess things up and we will make mistakes.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, learn learn from your mistakes.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_03: Like, yeah, my boss has been really good as well with that.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_03: Like, he almost wants you to make mistakes so that you do learn.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, I've made lots of mistakes.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_01: A dream project.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_03: I'd like to work on like a stadium.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, maybe, yeah.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_03: I do have a partner now, if he'd come with me, maybe.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but I'd like to work on like a stadium of some sort, that'd be really cool.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_01: Most important quality in an apprentice.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_03: Be curious, ask questions always.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_01: Most important quality in a leader.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_03: Answer the questions, answer any questions.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_03: Uh take your pride out of it.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_01: Good one.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_01: When thing one thing that the industry gets wrong.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_03: You can't take anyone on their word anymore.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_03: It has to be written down, you have to have a paper trail.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_01: One thing the industry gets right.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_03: Um well, not necessarily gets right right now, but is starting to get right is allowing females to be in the same spaces.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, final question.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: So if there's young apprentices listening to the podcast five years, ten years from now, and remembers only one thing that you've said today, what's that one thing you'd want them to know?
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_02: The same thing I've been saying the whole time.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_02: Ask questions.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_02: Ask all the questions, ask as many questions as you possibly can.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much, Alan.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, what you're doing in the industry is keep it up.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, keep it all up.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_01: Fantastic, thank you.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for joining us.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_01: If you've enjoyed today's conversation, please subscribe.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_01: Share it with someone in the industry, and help us continue having real conversations about the future of construction.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_01: Until next time, stay safe, keep building, and remember that buildings we create are important, but the people behind them matter even more.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_01: Speak soon.