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Let's Talk with Carl Lee - The NIL Impact & College Sports Revolution · WCHS Network Podcasts

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you gotta work.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: You gotta work. Bry Son is mine, gotta show. Everybody
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: is my son, k you gotta work, right Son. Another
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: mile sag of Dogs Day.
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  Speaker 3: Welcome to Let's Talk with Carl Lee. Join Karl alongside
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  Speaker 3: frequent co hosts Lisa Odie and Hollis Lewis as they
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  Speaker 3: explore dynamic conversations with guests from all walks of life.
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  Speaker 3: Let's Talk is proudly brought to you by Attorney Frank Walker,
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: Real Talk, Real Experience, Real results. Visit Frank Walker law
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  Speaker 3: dot com. The conversation starts now. This is Let's Talk.
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  Speaker 4: Hello, ladies and gentlemen, This is Carle with Let's Talk.
• 0:49
  Speaker 4: And I have one of my hosts in the in
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  Speaker 4: the building today.
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  Speaker 5: So far, I have Lisa Odie.
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  Speaker 4: The Queen.
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  Speaker 6: How are you, God, how are you?
• 0:58
  Speaker 4: I'm doing fun crazy day. Yes we are day. Yes
• 1:02
  Speaker 4: we're missing Hollis. We're not sure, you know if he
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: will come in at some time. But you know, some
• 1:09
  Speaker 4: people have really important jobs then they have to they
• 1:11
  Speaker 4: have to make big decisions, so he might be helped
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  Speaker 4: making some decisions.
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  Speaker 5: Lisa.
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  Speaker 4: To me, this has kind of been like a crazy
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  Speaker 4: kind of a week in conversation, and I know that
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  Speaker 4: you have done a little bit of a little bit
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  Speaker 4: of research on I guess the whole do we do
• 1:35
  Speaker 4: we still call this transfer stuff? Is this kind of
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  Speaker 4: like still all in that same vein?
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  Speaker 6: I mean, I think it's all. Yeah, it's affecting coaches,
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  Speaker 6: coaches different levels of the D one, D two, D three,
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  Speaker 6: is changing the whole landscape of collegiate athletics and the
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  Speaker 6: way that players are brought into this. I should say, all.
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  Speaker 4: Right, well, let's we're going to have Ryan play a
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  Speaker 4: clip for us to kind of hear what a coach
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  Speaker 4: is talking about and what his thinking is. Okay, and
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  Speaker 4: then we'll we'll kind of come back and try to
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  Speaker 4: see what if there's any common ground that we can
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  Speaker 4: find here. Okay, all right, if we'll get well, we'll
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  Speaker 4: play this clip and we'll be right.
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  Speaker 7: Back physically, mentally, emotionally. But I'm exhausted. I've tried every
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  Speaker 7: which way to keep this going, and I know I'm
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  Speaker 7: going to be asked a lot of questions, but I
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  Speaker 7: want to answer them before I'm even asked. What shocked
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  Speaker 7: me beyond belief was after we made it to the
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  Speaker 7: final four, just eighteen months ago. The very first time
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  Speaker 7: I met with the players, eight of them decided they
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  Speaker 7: were going to put their name in the portal and leave.
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  Speaker 7: I said, don't you like it yet?
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  Speaker 8: No?
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  Speaker 5: I love it.
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  Speaker 7: I love Miami, It's great.
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  Speaker 4: But the opportunity.
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  Speaker 7: To make money someplace else. That created a situation that
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  Speaker 7: you have to begin to ask yourself as a coach,
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  Speaker 7: what is this all about?
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  Speaker 5: The question what is this all about?
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  Speaker 6: What is the ye exactly?
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  Speaker 4: I think that ultimately is the major question, and I
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  Speaker 4: think for parents and for kids who are buying into
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  Speaker 4: this reality, what what is the goal?
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  Speaker 5: What is the what is the end goal here?
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  Speaker 6: Well? I think I think he even answered his own.
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  Speaker 6: The answer was in the clip, and the answer is
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  Speaker 6: another four words, the four words that you just questioned,
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  Speaker 6: you know, or actually five? What is this all about?
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  Speaker 6: Four words? Opportunity to make money and more money? I mean.
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  Speaker 6: The problem is there are no regulations with the Nile.
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  Speaker 6: There are now rules with the transfer portal, so to speak.
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  Speaker 6: There are some, but they're very very lenient, very light,
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  Speaker 6: And I feel like we're in an era where players
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  Speaker 6: are their loyalty is not to a team or to
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  Speaker 6: a coach, but to money. And when they see the
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  Speaker 6: opportunity to go somewhere else and thrive even though they
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  Speaker 6: liked Miami. You know, he directly asks those players, you know,
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  Speaker 6: it is it where you are? Do you not like where?
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  Speaker 6: You know Miami? Their answer is, yes, we love it here,
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  Speaker 6: but we have an opportunity to make more money somewhere else.
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  Speaker 6: So that's that's your answer to everything when it comes
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  Speaker 6: to all of these questions, it's about money.
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  Speaker 4: Well, and it's so it's like, Okay, anybody who's working
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  Speaker 4: a job and somebody who who will come to you
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  Speaker 4: and invite you to come and do the exact same
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  Speaker 4: thing there, but they're going to pay you more, exactly,
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  Speaker 4: and so it would be no different, you know, it's
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  Speaker 4: it's it's exactly the same thing. But the problem with
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  Speaker 4: this is what we used to say, it's just sports,
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  Speaker 4: you know, and now it's not just sports.
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  Speaker 5: Now it is you have officially made it about the money.
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  Speaker 4: I'm totally into, you know, paying athletes at the collegiate level,
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  Speaker 4: totally into it.
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  Speaker 5: But the reality of.
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  Speaker 4: Me getting a milk going from five hundred thousand dollars
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  Speaker 4: at the school I'm at and then a million dollars
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  Speaker 4: at a team who will will outbid that team and
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  Speaker 4: give me a million dollars. Where am I going to go?
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  Speaker 4: I'm going to the million dollars. That should not be
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  Speaker 4: That should not be something that's available. Negotiating where to
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  Speaker 4: play in collegiate sports is not something that I think
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  Speaker 4: should happen. You can't even do that in the league.
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  Speaker 4: You've got to play out your contract before you get
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  Speaker 4: had an opportunity to potentially go to another place for
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  Speaker 4: more money.
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  Speaker 6: And it goes back to what I just said a
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  Speaker 6: minute ago about regulations. They're very light. There aren't any really.
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  Speaker 6: I mean, they're allowed to go whenever they want to
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  Speaker 6: go and wherever they want to go, and they don't
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  Speaker 6: have to fulfill any type of, like you said, a contract.
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  Speaker 6: They go and at at you know, whim. So the
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  Speaker 6: issue for me also, I think it's kind of sad
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  Speaker 6: to hear this coach, the coach of the Miami you know,
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  Speaker 6: Hurricanes and head coach. He's an old school coach. You
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  Speaker 6: can tell that. You can tell he's got a little
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  Speaker 6: gray in his hair, and from the video clip, I
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  Speaker 6: know you guys couldn't see that, but you know he's
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  Speaker 6: a seasoned coach. Let's put it that out there. You
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  Speaker 6: got a season coach and he's successful. I mean he
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  Speaker 6: took these guys, these these kids to the you know,
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  Speaker 6: to the what final four?
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  Speaker 5: Yeah?
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  Speaker 6: Eight what? Eighteen months ago? He said, right, yea, And
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  Speaker 6: he's got eighteen players looking him in the eye and
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  Speaker 6: eight of them say sorry, we love you, we love
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  Speaker 6: it here, but we got to go. And that's got
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  Speaker 6: to be heartbreaking for a coach that comes from seasons past,
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  Speaker 6: before the nil, before the transfer portal, when they had
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  Speaker 6: kids that were loyal to their school. And I'm not
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  Speaker 6: throwing it at the kids. I'm not saying that they
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  Speaker 6: don't have loyalty. I'm just saying priorities have changed. The
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  Speaker 6: game has changed, and so for these older old school coaches,
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  Speaker 6: the games leaving them too. And it's just a it's
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  Speaker 6: a progression of what's happening in the collegiate world with
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  Speaker 6: all of these other factors.
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  Speaker 4: Now, there's such a thing as too much freedom in
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  Speaker 4: sports for the simple.
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  Speaker 5: Fact that.
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  Speaker 4: Even at the high school level, right, we see coaches
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  Speaker 4: walking away simply because you can't manage the ability to
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  Speaker 4: move from one place to another. Sure, and even if
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  Speaker 4: we took the money out of it, but you have
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  Speaker 4: the opportunity to just in one season you played for
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  Speaker 4: one team, The next season you play for another, The
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  Speaker 4: next season you play for another. You can't.
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  Speaker 5: Let me rephrase that.
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  Speaker 4: I wouldn't want to be bothered by that thought process
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  Speaker 4: every season of who's gonna leave, the stress, the stress
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  Speaker 4: of it, because I don't know if I got to
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  Speaker 4: find if I'm playing back, you know, if it's basketball,
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  Speaker 4: do I gotta get a center? Do I got to
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  Speaker 4: get another point guard? Do I got to get a
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  Speaker 4: star point guard? Because my guy was so good, but
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  Speaker 4: he he's going somewhere else.
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  Speaker 5: You you have.
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  Speaker 4: Ruined You've ruined sports because of money. There could easily
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  Speaker 4: be a system set up to where it's I'm paying
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  Speaker 4: fifty dollars and you're paying fifty dollars.
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  Speaker 5: So now the question for.
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  Speaker 4: The athlete is who do you want to give your
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  Speaker 4: fifty dollars? Sure, well, they live in my community, right,
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  Speaker 4: it's easier for them to get back and forth to
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  Speaker 4: practice in the school and all that kind of stuff.
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  Speaker 6: It's the family, yes, all that, so.
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  Speaker 4: We're likely they're going to stack you know, and even
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  Speaker 4: if like, I don't know what would make me want
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  Speaker 4: to leave? And again being old head. I don't know
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  Speaker 4: what would what would make me think about leaving? And
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  Speaker 4: again I go back to Marshall and again we beat
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  Speaker 4: this subject up so much, but I can't.
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  Speaker 5: It drives me crazy every time that I see it.
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  Speaker 6: I think this is a new light on it. Though
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  Speaker 6: our conversation has been about you know, players with ian
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  Speaker 6: Io and with the portal not having regulations and rules.
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  Speaker 6: But now we're seeing it affect successful.
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  Speaker 5: School, successful schoeaking.
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  Speaker 6: About those mid coaches that are getting rated. Now we're
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  Speaker 6: seeing these This is University of Miami that made it
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  Speaker 6: to the final four losing eight of their players. I mean,
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  Speaker 6: now it's it's not just affecting your mid tier, smaller schools,
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  Speaker 6: it's affecting your successful successful levels. Yeah, and that's a
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  Speaker 6: new light on it, Like we've not really seen that
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  Speaker 6: happen in the past, and now we're starting to see
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  Speaker 6: a real push for these players. They're leaving schools that
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  Speaker 6: they're it's not about winning at all, no, obviously, Like
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  Speaker 6: I could see you going from a mid tier school
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  Speaker 6: to Ohio State. You know, of course the money is
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  Speaker 6: part of it, but also the winning successful part of it.
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  Speaker 6: You know, being a part of a team that that's
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  Speaker 6: going to probably be in the national championship talk every year.
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  Speaker 6: Now you're looking at those teams having a chance of
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  Speaker 6: losing players that you didn't think about that angle before.
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  Speaker 6: So to me, now it's really going to be pressure
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  Speaker 6: on the coach even more so, not just to win,
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  Speaker 6: but to keep players right And how do you do
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  Speaker 6: that in this in this format?
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  Speaker 5: But well, let me let me And that's a great point.
• 11:02
  Speaker 5: And I'm going to add to that.
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  Speaker 4: If I'm in the administrative piece of the governing body
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  Speaker 4: of whatever level it is, what is it that I'm
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  Speaker 4: not What is it that we're seeing that they're not
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  Speaker 4: seeing right, Like you're under saying, like, how is it
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  Speaker 4: possible that we're looking at it and we can see
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  Speaker 4: that it's wrong?
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  Speaker 5: And I'm sorry.
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  Speaker 4: I think that there's a large majority of folks who
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  Speaker 4: are on our side.
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  Speaker 9: Now.
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  Speaker 4: I think there are some folks because they've they've done,
• 11:35
  Speaker 4: they've made that move themselves, they want to okay it.
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  Speaker 4: That's fine, I give you that. But when you look
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  Speaker 4: at the overall structure and how it is collapsing.
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  Speaker 6: Yes, you can't ignore that, right especially I mean, like
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  Speaker 6: I said, now, you're looking at schools that were winning.
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  Speaker 6: I mean, it's not like you're moving from the school
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  Speaker 6: that there's no chance you're going to get to the
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  Speaker 6: final four in basketball? Are there's no chance you're going
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  Speaker 6: to get to the national championship the football championship. They're
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  Speaker 6: moving from a school that's successful to a different school just.
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  Speaker 4: Just on money, just based on money, more money.
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  Speaker 6: And I don't I don't understand why we can't fix
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  Speaker 6: that or at least adjust it in some manner.
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  Speaker 4: Do you think it's worse in basketball versus football?
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  Speaker 6: Oh?
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  Speaker 5: Absolutely, I think so too.
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  Speaker 4: I think because again to your point, of the eight
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  Speaker 4: players you're talking about, I mean, if I'm not mistaken,
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  Speaker 4: five of those guys probably star starters.
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  Speaker 6: Yeah, so that's your whole team.
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  Speaker 4: Because if you haven't been seen, right, so it may
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  Speaker 4: be your top eight, right, you know, because.
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  Speaker 6: That's the whole team. You deesimated your whole team.
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: Yes, yes, And so now not only do you you
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  Speaker 4: got to find somebody to replace them, but you have
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  Speaker 4: to find legitimate players. Right that you may have to
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: even pay more than what you were paying the guys
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  Speaker 4: who left for more money.
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  Speaker 6: Right, it's possible. Well, here's my other question, and this
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  Speaker 6: is is this legal. I don't know. So according to
• 13:15
  Speaker 6: the video clip that we just heard, these players just
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  Speaker 6: told their coach they were entering the transferred portal. They
• 13:21
  Speaker 6: didn't say they were going to a specific solid point. Okay,
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  Speaker 6: So is it possible that they already know they've already
• 13:27
  Speaker 6: had these schools reach out to them and say, hey,
• 13:29
  Speaker 6: you enter the portal, You're you're welcome here. Is that
• 13:33
  Speaker 6: a thing that's part of this now? Is that legal?
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  Speaker 6: I mean? Is that?
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: Like?
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  Speaker 6: Is it? I don't know it? That's what I'm asking you.
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  Speaker 6: I mean, there's a lot of things that to me
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  Speaker 6: shouldn't be legal to me. If you're entering the portal,
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  Speaker 6: you need to be transparent about it. Like, if you're
• 13:50
  Speaker 6: gonna do it, then you need to tell your coach. Hey,
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  Speaker 6: this school reached out and said they're gonna give me
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  Speaker 6: this much money, not just the generic Hey, I'm going
• 13:57
  Speaker 6: in the portal.
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  Speaker 4: If I'm saying I'm going into the portal to your
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: and I think you're I think you're right right. If
• 14:04
  Speaker 4: I say that I'm going into the portal, Okay, that's fine.
• 14:09
  Speaker 5: You're going in blind exactly, and.
• 14:12
  Speaker 4: You're hoping that somebody will bid on you. Yes, and
• 14:15
  Speaker 4: give you more money.
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  Speaker 6: But do you think that's the case.
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  Speaker 4: I do not think that's the case, exactly. And so
• 14:20
  Speaker 4: to the point that you're making legal illegal, you're contacting
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  Speaker 4: my players, right and basically saying, well, you know how
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: much are you making? I'm making twenty five thousand.
• 14:35
  Speaker 6: We'll do fifty yeah, exactly, and so yes.
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  Speaker 4: And tell you boys or your girls, Hey, we'll double
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  Speaker 4: theirs too, exactly. And now all of a sudden, I
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  Speaker 4: mean eight players from a basketball team, Yeah, that's good.
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  Speaker 5: There's only five starters.
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: So you're taking three guys who were either playing a lot, right,
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: So you're basically.
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  Speaker 6: Part of the line up, just not the starter, right.
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: You're going after the whole meat of the team.
• 15:05
  Speaker 6: And and those guys are not just gonna generically, like
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  Speaker 6: I said, enter the portal without They're not gonna risk
• 15:11
  Speaker 6: what they have at Miami without knowing they got something
• 15:14
  Speaker 6: better down the road.
• 15:15
  Speaker 4: There's no way if I'm if I'm the sixth seventh,
• 15:18
  Speaker 4: eighth man. Maybe if I'm not, if I'm that guy,
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: I'm I'm My fear is if I if I can't
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: play here, then okay, maybe I want to try to
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: go play.
• 15:33
  Speaker 6: Down legitimate okay, right, because.
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: I'm not gonna maybe maybe I can play up, But
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: if I'm already a starter, why would I The only
• 15:47
  Speaker 4: reason I'm going to move is.
• 15:48
  Speaker 6: Money, exactly, And you can't tell me that they've already
• 15:52
  Speaker 6: not got something in place waiting for them. All they
• 15:55
  Speaker 6: have to know.
• 15:57
  Speaker 4: I agree, there's no I'm not jump. I'm not telling you.
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: I may say, Okay, I'm going to get into the portal, right,
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: and then maybe I can find out what's happening in
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: the portal.
• 16:08
  Speaker 5: Somebody might bid two.
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: Dollars, But why would I go without knowing?
• 16:15
  Speaker 6: Right, you're not You're not going to risk that, and
• 16:19
  Speaker 6: I'm already a show. I guess that's okay, that's that
• 16:21
  Speaker 6: that's my that's my question. And I probably need to
• 16:23
  Speaker 6: research that and get back. And maybe Hollius, if he
• 16:26
  Speaker 6: was here, he knew the answer. Bit. I guess that's
• 16:29
  Speaker 6: a thing. I guess that's that's allowed.
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: And I thought there was a recruiting and I think
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: what you're thinking of is the recruiting right rules that
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: doesn't allow you. I didn't think that they allowed you
• 16:40
  Speaker 4: to actually go after a player that's already on, that's
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: already already at another school. Like I thought that that
• 16:48
  Speaker 4: and and maybe somebody can tell us different. Maybe you
• 16:52
  Speaker 4: know you can, you can reach me at let's talk
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: with Crawley facebook page and give me some information because
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: I don't know that, but I would at least I
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: would absolutely think you almost that's no I mean you're
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: communicating with somebody else's player who's under quote contract exactly
• 17:14
  Speaker 4: and saying to ask. So I'm going to come in
• 17:16
  Speaker 4: and ask you. Okay, so Lisa, how much are you making?
• 17:19
  Speaker 4: I'm making five hundred thousand? All right, I'll tell you
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: what you come. You come, I'll I'll give you a.
• 17:24
  Speaker 6: Million, right right?
• 17:26
  Speaker 5: Why wouldn't you come?
• 17:27
  Speaker 6: Well, of course you are. I mean that that's a
• 17:29
  Speaker 6: no brainer. But, like I said, my legitimate concern and
• 17:33
  Speaker 6: also it's really not fair to the school they're leaving.
• 17:36
  Speaker 6: I mean, the school has a right to know if
• 17:38
  Speaker 6: you're going to go from you know, you already know
• 17:40
  Speaker 6: where you're going to. In my opinion, that coach has
• 17:43
  Speaker 6: a right to know where you're going, and why not
• 17:46
  Speaker 6: just the I'm going in the portal.
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: A friend of mine said this, and I thought that
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: I thought it was kind of an interesting piece. All
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: transfers should have to go through a central location process.
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: Like so, if you're interested in transferring, okay, you have
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: to I have to come to your your board and say, okay,
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: I am transferring. Have you had any conversation with any
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: team prior to that? And if you say yes, then
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: now okay, then what was what was that conversation?
• 18:27
  Speaker 5: And depending on what you say, that could be denied.
• 18:32
  Speaker 4: Or proved however that would work depending on the conversation,
• 18:37
  Speaker 4: because again I don't how do I I thought it
• 18:41
  Speaker 4: was totally illegal to talk to someone's a player from
• 18:46
  Speaker 4: another team that's already on scholarship and and you come
• 18:52
  Speaker 4: in and you recruit them from.
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: From me, right, I don't.
• 18:57
  Speaker 6: Yeah, it doesn't make sense. Like you said, if we're
• 19:00
  Speaker 6: going to get into the legality legalities, yeah, you know,
• 19:03
  Speaker 6: then then you really need to look at it as
• 19:05
  Speaker 6: contracts and we're breaking contracts and.
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: And so so what happens now if we start talking
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: about high school in IL, like to now, all of
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: a sudden, do this at the high school level, right,
• 19:22
  Speaker 4: And I could see parents, I could see players being
• 19:25
  Speaker 4: super excited about it. I could see coaches like, oh
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: my gosh, please don't let it happen, right, you know.
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: And I know that we've talked about this, or West
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: Virginia has talked about this themselves, right you know.
• 19:39
  Speaker 5: And I've had calls.
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: I've had calls about in I own money participating, I
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: won't do it right, you know. I don't even care
• 19:47
  Speaker 4: if it's down to the to the youth level.
• 19:50
  Speaker 6: I can't even imagine the high school world would want
• 19:52
  Speaker 6: to get into this mess until the collegiate level gets
• 19:55
  Speaker 6: it right, because it's definitely not right there. It's not fit,
• 19:59
  Speaker 6: it's it's.
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: Please say that again, So please say that again, and
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: for all the listeners, please hear what she's just saying.
• 20:06
  Speaker 6: Please until they fix it at the collegiate level, the
• 20:09
  Speaker 6: high school world does not want to be a part
• 20:11
  Speaker 6: of this, seriously, and I don't know if they ever
• 20:15
  Speaker 6: do so many things. We're talking about kids, you know,
• 20:18
  Speaker 6: at least at the collegiate level, these are adults. I
• 20:21
  Speaker 6: mean they're eighteen. Yes, they're legally yes, I want to
• 20:24
  Speaker 6: say not adults, but they're semi adults. But at least
• 20:27
  Speaker 6: they're legal and they're able to participate in a contract.
• 20:31
  Speaker 6: Can you imagine the kids that are under eighteen and
• 20:33
  Speaker 6: the parents having the family would have to be involved
• 20:35
  Speaker 6: in that totally. Yeah, and it just it would be
• 20:39
  Speaker 6: a myriad of problems that.
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: They the kid was the Only thing the kid would
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: know is he's getting recruited right from a team who's
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: willing to pay him, whether the school's paying him where
• 20:54
  Speaker 4: he's at or paying more than what the school's paying you. Now,
• 20:57
  Speaker 4: so you're so you're in the hall bragg about that,
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: you know, to your buddies, and you're thinking that you're leaving.
• 21:05
  Speaker 6: And where's the money coming from? I mean, you can
• 21:06
  Speaker 6: you imagine the disparity at the high school level economic gosh,
• 21:11
  Speaker 6: you know, I mean these consolidated schools, the money is
• 21:14
  Speaker 6: available to take these kids from these smaller high schools.
• 21:17
  Speaker 6: I mean, they wouldn't. I just don't know how could
• 21:19
  Speaker 6: it could work?
• 21:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because you because you're going to get every best
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: player from every small top school high school that may
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: be winning three and four games a season primarily because
• 21:32
  Speaker 4: of that kid all of a sudden he leaves. Yeah,
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: well we're talking South Charleston, right. You know, the kids,
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: the kids who were interested in leaving, even without money,
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: they take their skill set. Now you're playing young kids
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: and now everybody's like, well, the coach or the coach
• 21:50
  Speaker 4: at only won one game in two games in two seasons.
• 21:55
  Speaker 5: With who that's it you He didn't get a chance
• 21:59
  Speaker 5: to show his coaching ability.
• 22:01
  Speaker 4: And let's be honest, coaching ability requires athletic kids, kids
• 22:06
  Speaker 4: who can play, sure, not young not young kids who
• 22:10
  Speaker 4: not hadn't played since middle school. Right, So you're in
• 22:13
  Speaker 4: high school for the first time, and now all of
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: a sudden you're starting in the game, and Lisa, I
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: promise you, my fear in that whole system is a
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: young kid forced to play because kids have left, and
• 22:30
  Speaker 4: he gets she gets.
• 22:32
  Speaker 5: Hurt, right, drastically hurt because.
• 22:35
  Speaker 4: They're not strong enough, they haven't had a chance to
• 22:37
  Speaker 4: really truly work out, they're not physical, they're just not
• 22:41
  Speaker 4: physically and mentally ready, and they're unaware of what that
• 22:45
  Speaker 4: kind of contact is going to be when you get there, right,
• 22:49
  Speaker 4: And that's so unfair to those kids.
• 22:53
  Speaker 6: And I know for a fact, I mean Hollis has
• 22:55
  Speaker 6: even mentioned this in previous shows that they are doing
• 22:58
  Speaker 6: in IE on some states. Yeah, yes, I would be
• 23:01
  Speaker 6: curious to know how that works. That's something that we
• 23:03
  Speaker 6: could explore and maybe talk more about.
• 23:05
  Speaker 5: But even what is that limit? What is that limit?
• 23:08
  Speaker 6: But they're bigger states too, I mean, you think about
• 23:10
  Speaker 6: how small our state is. I mean, it would be
• 23:12
  Speaker 6: detrimental to high school football athletics period, really, And I think.
• 23:16
  Speaker 4: I've said this once before, but I'm not I will
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: not participate. Just in case you're anybody's asking, I'm not
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: participating in helping pay a high school athlete, right, I'm sorry,
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: I just not, matter of fact, not even a collegiate one.
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: I played for free.
• 23:38
  Speaker 5: Until I got to the pros.
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: And the guys are making more money on nil money
• 23:44
  Speaker 4: than I was making my.
• 23:46
  Speaker 6: First year in guarantee it. I guarantee it.
• 23:49
  Speaker 5: So how am I supposed to feel? I can't be
• 23:53
  Speaker 5: for it.
• 23:53
  Speaker 6: Is mind boggling, It truly is. I don't even know
• 23:56
  Speaker 6: how to wrap my head around half of the things
• 23:59
  Speaker 6: that are going on in the collegiate world with all
• 24:01
  Speaker 6: of that, But to think that they would even consider
• 24:04
  Speaker 6: it in our state is just it would just be
• 24:08
  Speaker 6: it would be scary.
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: Right, all right, ladies and gentlemen, we are going to
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: take a quick break, and we will and our and
• 24:16
  Speaker 4: Hollis Lewis will join us, I think by phone, so
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: we'll be right back.
• 24:19
  Speaker 10: All right, Let's face it, bad things happen to good
• 24:22
  Speaker 10: people seriously injured in a car accident, trucking accident, or
• 24:25
  Speaker 10: even wrongfully arrested. Life happens, and when it happens to you,
• 24:28
  Speaker 10: you will need sound legal advice and aggressive representation. That's
• 24:32
  Speaker 10: when you call Attorney Frank Walker at three zero four
• 24:35
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• 24:38
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• 24:41
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• 24:44
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• 24:47
  Speaker 10: online at Attorneyfrankwalker dot com.
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: Let's Talk with Carl Lee is probably presented by Attorney
• 24:54
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• 24:58
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• 25:02
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• 25:08
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• 25:13
  Speaker 3: tune in Thursday nights at seven or Sunday evenings at
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: eight for Let's Talk with Carl Lee. Now back to
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: their conversation, Well.
• 25:22
  Speaker 11: We're not recruiting any high school basketball players, not this year,
• 25:26
  Speaker 11: We've already recruited Rubin Lefty. Come on, we're building from that.
• 25:31
  Speaker 11: This year, we're not even looking at a high school
• 25:33
  Speaker 11: basketball player because we're losing Davon Gadari and Aaron You
• 25:38
  Speaker 11: can't replace them with high school kids.
• 25:40
  Speaker 8: Let me make this public service announcement to every single
• 25:45
  Speaker 8: high school recruit.
• 25:48
  Speaker 4: The biggest and I.
• 25:50
  Speaker 8: Mean the absolute biggest threat to you, guys.
• 25:56
  Speaker 4: Has been to transfer portal.
• 26:00
  Speaker 8: Like Rick Bertino is a veteran coach, he understands what
• 26:03
  Speaker 8: comes with an.
• 26:05
  Speaker 4: Entitled ass high school recruit.
• 26:08
  Speaker 8: He don't want them headaches. His hair is already fill
• 26:12
  Speaker 8: with just for men hot in that damn gray. We
• 26:17
  Speaker 8: don't want to have to be able to go into
• 26:19
  Speaker 8: these homes of players that's not trying to better themselves
• 26:23
  Speaker 8: in their households.
• 26:25
  Speaker 4: Because this is the thing.
• 26:27
  Speaker 8: When you're recruiting a person who already knows it's time
• 26:30
  Speaker 8: to perform, versus a player who's trying to say, what
• 26:33
  Speaker 8: can y'all give me to perform? Its coaches never really
• 26:39
  Speaker 8: needed you, and it's all a conditional relationship under the
• 26:45
  Speaker 8: right conditions is the reason why they're recruiting you like
• 26:48
  Speaker 8: they're recruiting you. You don't know unconditional love. It's everything
• 26:54
  Speaker 8: in life has a transaction attached to it.
• 26:57
  Speaker 5: Don't let that flower your head.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: And let me just say this as we get started
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: here and Hollis Lewis is on here now as well.
• 27:13
  Speaker 5: Basketball, there has been what is it you got?
• 27:20
  Speaker 4: Auburn has one freshman, They've got one freshman. They've recruited one.
• 27:24
  Speaker 6: Freshman, one freshman.
• 27:26
  Speaker 4: Duke has three, Alabama has one, Texas Tech has one.
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: Everybody else in the conference has zero freshman. Freshman recruited
• 27:42
  Speaker 4: freshmen to play?
• 27:44
  Speaker 6: Are those freshmen from hostals?
• 27:47
  Speaker 4: Those are high schools.
• 27:49
  Speaker 6: Because they could be a freshman from another well no,
• 27:50
  Speaker 6: I guess they couldn't be a freshman from another school.
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: You're right, Okay, so there's only ten of the ten teams, Okay,
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: you have one, two, three, four teams have freshmen.
• 28:02
  Speaker 6: Wow.
• 28:03
  Speaker 9: No, we're talking about the top top ten teams.
• 28:05
  Speaker 5: The top team.
• 28:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, the top ten teams got it. So if if
• 28:11
  Speaker 4: if Holli's if you think that you're really good and
• 28:13
  Speaker 4: you think that you can go to the top ten.
• 28:19
  Speaker 5: Yeah, because they're not.
• 28:22
  Speaker 4: Like they're not taking them. And I think we need to,
• 28:26
  Speaker 4: we need to really understand what that looks like and
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: how that's how that's playing out.
• 28:34
  Speaker 5: Am I right?
• 28:37
  Speaker 9: Yeah? I think the thing is is like I just
• 28:40
  Speaker 9: think the nature of recruiting and how we're viewing quote
• 28:46
  Speaker 9: unquote collegiate athletics is just different now. You know, if
• 28:50
  Speaker 9: you're at a power five, now you're essentially playing professional sports.
• 28:57
  Speaker 9: So if you're at the Duke's you even used the
• 29:01
  Speaker 9: Alabama you are a professional athlete now, and you know
• 29:08
  Speaker 9: there is a pathway to get there, but it may
• 29:11
  Speaker 9: not be as you just articulated. It may not be direct.
• 29:14
  Speaker 9: It may not be out of hospital. You may have
• 29:16
  Speaker 9: to go to JUCO or NAII or Division two and
• 29:20
  Speaker 9: work your way up, you know, sort of like a
• 29:22
  Speaker 9: exager bos and he went to the kid out of
• 29:24
  Speaker 9: South Charles. He went to a non power five Jacksonville State,
• 29:28
  Speaker 9: did perform very well there and then eventually landa the
• 29:31
  Speaker 9: w give you a power five. So I think the
• 29:34
  Speaker 9: pathway to get there is just different now. So now
• 29:39
  Speaker 9: there's extra steps.
• 29:41
  Speaker 6: You know. What this reminds me of Hollis is almost
• 29:43
  Speaker 6: like a farm system for like professional baseball, because you
• 29:47
  Speaker 6: have the little leagues and that's where the players have
• 29:49
  Speaker 6: to start and prove themselves before they're taken up into
• 29:51
  Speaker 6: the big league. So that's basically what this has turned into.
• 29:56
  Speaker 4: You have Auburn has one place. It took one freshman,
• 29:59
  Speaker 4: yet Duke took the Alabama took one, Texas Tech took one,
• 30:04
  Speaker 4: Saint John's zero, Iowa State zero, Tennessee zero, Texas A
• 30:08
  Speaker 4: and M zero, alab and Florida zero.
• 30:12
  Speaker 9: Wow.
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: I mean, you're talking some some and this is basketball,
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: and you're talking some pretty big schools.
• 30:21
  Speaker 9: And I think the thing the other part of that,
• 30:23
  Speaker 9: like sort of the other side of the coinna that
• 30:26
  Speaker 9: is that as a coach now because again these are
• 30:29
  Speaker 9: these are big money endeavors, there's a lot of money
• 30:32
  Speaker 9: on the line. There's always been money on the line
• 30:33
  Speaker 9: as far as you know TV and you know further
• 30:36
  Speaker 9: you get conference championship, so there's always been like a
• 30:38
  Speaker 9: little money on the line. But now when you're talking
• 30:41
  Speaker 9: happen to spend, you know, particularly hundreds of thousands or
• 30:46
  Speaker 9: possubly million dollars of filding a team you know far
• 30:50
  Speaker 9: as nil is concerned. So there's a lot of money
• 30:53
  Speaker 9: on the line. So you as a coach, you have
• 30:55
  Speaker 9: to get that right. You can ill afford. You can
• 30:58
  Speaker 9: ill afford to waste money on the player essentially, so
• 31:01
  Speaker 9: you have to get it right. So you're not going
• 31:03
  Speaker 9: to spend that money on an unproven commodity. You at
• 31:06
  Speaker 9: least got to get some some game, pay some collegiate
• 31:09
  Speaker 9: games and say, hey, this guy can perform at this level.
• 31:12
  Speaker 4: And let me let me get let me give you
• 31:14
  Speaker 4: this little sidebar here. Okay, you know, because there's this,
• 31:19
  Speaker 4: you know, there's this rush to aau ball and all
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: this kind of stuff. Now this is not me saying this,
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: but I do tend to agree. So it says that
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: now that you now that you're looking at this, is
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: there any real reason for kids to.
• 31:36
  Speaker 6: Play aa you hmm, that's a good question.
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: Does it really matter who who you play au for,
• 31:44
  Speaker 4: because at the end of the day, they're not taking
• 31:46
  Speaker 4: high school anyway. So let's just say and and and
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: I know you're going to go in I think you
• 31:51
  Speaker 4: will probably be pro that, Hollis. But but my thing
• 31:54
  Speaker 4: is you're playing aau ball middle school, youth level middle school,
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: So and that's about as far as you can go
• 32:02
  Speaker 4: unless you do high school, which I don't think you
• 32:05
  Speaker 4: can do both there, So okay, So so you're gonna
• 32:11
  Speaker 4: okay and which I which I totally disagree because one
• 32:14
  Speaker 4: if the games, if the games come, if they conflict,
• 32:17
  Speaker 4: especially basketball.
• 32:18
  Speaker 5: They're gonna go to the AAU first because they because
• 32:20
  Speaker 5: they think.
• 32:20
  Speaker 9: That's more visible playing. They're not playing a you during
• 32:24
  Speaker 9: the basketball season, A.
• 32:26
  Speaker 5: Well travel travel.
• 32:28
  Speaker 9: Yeah, that's after you once you get to high school.
• 32:32
  Speaker 4: I don't know that's I'll take your word on it,
• 32:35
  Speaker 4: but I don't think that that's totally.
• 32:36
  Speaker 9: Not You're not there. There is no a basketball right now.
• 32:39
  Speaker 9: It's high school basketball. Then a you start to be.
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: All right, I'm gonna okay, I'll take your word for that.
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: I just but but here's my thing. If you know this,
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: and again to the earlier segment about you know at
• 32:56
  Speaker 4: at that there isn't that high school players are being
• 32:59
  Speaker 4: look over and you're doing a you at such a
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: young age, are you really what are we? What are
• 33:07
  Speaker 4: we getting out of that?
• 33:09
  Speaker 6: I mean they're building fundamental skills. I mean I think
• 33:12
  Speaker 6: the earlier you start that, the better, right, I mean
• 33:14
  Speaker 6: the better you can only get better at it. The
• 33:16
  Speaker 6: more you do something, the more you practice and play.
• 33:19
  Speaker 5: See.
• 33:19
  Speaker 4: I think that I think that's what's your fear do
• 33:21
  Speaker 4: you think I think that's see, I.
• 33:22
  Speaker 5: Think that's training. I don't think that that because when.
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: You play, you're not working on your shot. You're going
• 33:29
  Speaker 4: to shoot your shots. You're playing defense. You're not practicing defense,
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: you're just playing defense. And I think that I think
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: that you need more work on those, on those skill
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: sets than.
• 33:42
  Speaker 9: Playing because I think what happens is is that I think,
• 33:47
  Speaker 9: and I agree with you a lot of times when
• 33:49
  Speaker 9: people are playing, Hey, you're just putting up shots, You're
• 33:51
  Speaker 9: just playing games. You're not actually working.
• 33:53
  Speaker 6: What's the point. Why would you spend so much money
• 33:56
  Speaker 6: on that and travel?
• 33:56
  Speaker 5: And Tom, I think because they think that.
• 33:59
  Speaker 4: I think they think it's going to be more more
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: basketball games, more football games, the better the kids going
• 34:03
  Speaker 4: to be.
• 34:04
  Speaker 9: Okay, No, but and I also think before now, before
• 34:08
  Speaker 9: what we're di sperience now, that was exposure. So now
• 34:11
  Speaker 9: you can go to the previously you can go to
• 34:13
  Speaker 9: these AU camps and different things in tournaments, and it
• 34:16
  Speaker 9: would be college coaches there, you know what I'm saying.
• 34:19
  Speaker 9: So you can figure out a way you can get
• 34:20
  Speaker 9: exposed and get some exposure, particularly when you're in the
• 34:23
  Speaker 9: high school level. But that may not be the case now,
• 34:26
  Speaker 9: so I think probably what's going to end up happening
• 34:29
  Speaker 9: again for those elite players, they're going to continue to
• 34:31
  Speaker 9: play against the best in the in the countries, right,
• 34:34
  Speaker 9: But if you're not at that level, your time spent
• 34:37
  Speaker 9: probably is going to be better spent working on your
• 34:39
  Speaker 9: skill set and your athleticism as opposed to just playing games.
• 34:45
  Speaker 6: And they don't practice in aau on those things. You
• 34:47
  Speaker 6: don't feel like they just play.
• 34:51
  Speaker 5: Practicing.
• 34:52
  Speaker 4: I'll say this for me, Okay, all the work that
• 34:56
  Speaker 4: I would put in so that when I got to
• 34:58
  Speaker 4: practice could do all of the things that was required,
• 35:04
  Speaker 4: I'll oversee you football, and it's hard to actually train
• 35:09
  Speaker 4: kids to do this. It's even hard to even get
• 35:12
  Speaker 4: him into three point stance. We're talking football shooting the
• 35:15
  Speaker 4: right way to shoot because some of them can't get
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: the ball. They got to shove it up to the
• 35:19
  Speaker 4: and it can't get to the rim. So there's not
• 35:23
  Speaker 4: a lot happening at the lower levels. It's just they're
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: winning or losing and they're playing games. Practice you try
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: to work on those drills. I see the kids in
• 35:34
  Speaker 4: the gym dribbling, but again it's hard for them to dribble. Dribble,
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: it's hard for them to get the ball up. I mean,
• 35:40
  Speaker 4: so it's just and I even I'll even go to
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: the extent to say playing a scout wants to see
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: you play a game because he wants to see who
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: you are.
• 35:54
  Speaker 6: If you're good at the mats. Not now, not at
• 35:56
  Speaker 6: that level. No, not at that level, not even high
• 35:58
  Speaker 6: school like you can.
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: Yes, just like the conversation we had earlier, right that
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: they're not even recruiting high school. You know, it's getting
• 36:08
  Speaker 4: to the point they're not even bringing high school guys
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: to be part of Do you.
• 36:12
  Speaker 6: Think this will hurt the AAU industry? I mean, I mean,
• 36:15
  Speaker 6: that's that's a lot of money, no people spent.
• 36:17
  Speaker 9: I don't think, I think because what happens is now
• 36:20
  Speaker 9: AU is about I think more than again, I'm not
• 36:24
  Speaker 9: going to take kids aren't getting looked because there may
• 36:26
  Speaker 9: still be like lower level collegiate programs at these time.
• 36:30
  Speaker 9: It's different things in nature, but AU travel sports have
• 36:34
  Speaker 9: become like you know, tourism has come like they have
• 36:38
  Speaker 9: built into parents vacation now. So if you if you
• 36:41
  Speaker 9: got a bunch of kids or they all play sports,
• 36:43
  Speaker 9: that's part of like sort of the summer vacations we
• 36:46
  Speaker 9: used to take, like the vacation to the beach or
• 36:48
  Speaker 9: grandma's house. Now you're going to you know, play some
• 36:50
  Speaker 9: games somewhere. Okay, So I think it can still it
• 36:54
  Speaker 9: still has some benefit, but I think that the benefit
• 36:58
  Speaker 9: that maybe that it had five or ten years go
• 37:00
  Speaker 9: isn't there. And I would say, and I would advocate
• 37:03
  Speaker 9: to parents, you know you need like if you have
• 37:05
  Speaker 9: a kid and that kid wants to, you know, play
• 37:07
  Speaker 9: Division I sports at a high level, I would say,
• 37:11
  Speaker 9: you probably are the town's gonna be better spit working
• 37:13
  Speaker 9: on your athleticism, playing multiple sports, being the best athlete
• 37:17
  Speaker 9: that you can be, and then finding your pathway to
• 37:20
  Speaker 9: you know, whatever sport that you can fit into, because
• 37:23
  Speaker 9: the better athletes you are, the more options going to
• 37:25
  Speaker 9: have even within that particular sport.
• 37:27
  Speaker 4: There's there was a there was a young kid that
• 37:30
  Speaker 4: was in the U Sports program who I've talked about
• 37:34
  Speaker 4: him back in the day when he was still with
• 37:38
  Speaker 4: us and he's gone on to middle school and going.
• 37:40
  Speaker 5: On to high school. He had so much talent, you know,
• 37:47
  Speaker 5: he was he.
• 37:49
  Speaker 4: Him, him and his dad would be in the gym,
• 37:52
  Speaker 4: you know before i'd come into work.
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: They're already in the gym, finishing up, working out. Okay.
• 37:57
  Speaker 4: Now, the thing that was a gonna be his challenge
• 38:01
  Speaker 4: was going to be was getting him taller, you know,
• 38:04
  Speaker 4: And he's still getting a little bit taller.
• 38:08
  Speaker 5: But he has all the skill set.
• 38:10
  Speaker 4: He's as good or better than all most all kids,
• 38:13
  Speaker 4: whether it be football or basketball in the city.
• 38:16
  Speaker 5: Who's played in our city teams.
• 38:18
  Speaker 4: Okay, he's probably the best athlete that we've probably had
• 38:22
  Speaker 4: come through there, and and and not just athletic, but
• 38:27
  Speaker 4: sports smart. Right, the challenge he has is can that
• 38:32
  Speaker 4: skill set and that's smart sports smart? Is that enough
• 38:37
  Speaker 4: for somebody to overlook maybe height and weight and all
• 38:41
  Speaker 4: those kinds of things. Possibly, yes. And I only bring
• 38:45
  Speaker 4: that up is because sometimes you know, it's you have
• 38:51
  Speaker 4: to accept the reality of where you are. But but
• 38:54
  Speaker 4: the physically pieced, the physical piece.
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: But then you gotta go and put the work in.
• 39:00
  Speaker 4: He could outshoot, he could probably outshoot a ton of
• 39:04
  Speaker 4: high school kids at three.
• 39:05
  Speaker 5: He probably from a three point shot.
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: He probably can out dribble some of the point guards
• 39:11
  Speaker 4: that that they that that are starting in high school, right,
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: you know. Now, again he's gonna have to get some hype.
• 39:18
  Speaker 4: He's gonna have to get some weight, but hopefully that'll happen.
• 39:22
  Speaker 4: But that's the kind of kid that when you see
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: it and you can for me, I can appreciate the
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: work that he puts in. I just don't see that
• 39:31
  Speaker 4: with a lot of kids. I don't see parents getting
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: up early in the morning bringing them to the wreck.
• 39:36
  Speaker 4: And there's some, but I don't see that. I don't
• 39:40
  Speaker 4: see kids out on the out on the road, running,
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: you know, in the morning, in the cold, in the rain.
• 39:46
  Speaker 5: I don't see that.
• 39:48
  Speaker 4: Maybe I'm overlooking it, maybe it's just not the reality.
• 39:52
  Speaker 4: But I think all three of us agree that it's
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: not just skill set. It's not just talent. You've got
• 39:58
  Speaker 4: to be physically a able to perform, and that requires
• 40:03
  Speaker 4: being in shape.
• 40:06
  Speaker 9: But see, I think it's bigger than that. Man. I
• 40:08
  Speaker 9: see a lot of kids who are talented. I see
• 40:10
  Speaker 9: a lot of kids who are you know, putting in
• 40:13
  Speaker 9: the work in going to trainers, like you said, spending
• 40:16
  Speaker 9: money on a you doing these things to get better.
• 40:19
  Speaker 9: I think the problem is is that, like I said,
• 40:22
  Speaker 9: when you're going through the programs and you're actually a
• 40:25
  Speaker 9: hostile kid, that's collegiate ready, and you have dreams of
• 40:28
  Speaker 9: going to Division one, a Division one school, but that
• 40:33
  Speaker 9: path is not there directly as it once was. So
• 40:36
  Speaker 9: now you gotta go, you go, you gotta go Division two,
• 40:39
  Speaker 9: you gotta go small division one and work your way up.
• 40:42
  Speaker 9: At that point, it's not necessarily all about talent and
• 40:45
  Speaker 9: work that point, it's about your mindset. And if you
• 40:47
  Speaker 9: haven't had talent, like I said, if you haven't had
• 40:50
  Speaker 9: to struggle, if you haven't had to overcome, if you
• 40:52
  Speaker 9: haven't had to actually get yourself to a point where
• 40:55
  Speaker 9: you can face that adversity and know how to deal
• 40:59
  Speaker 9: with it and fight, then it doesn't really matter anything
• 41:02
  Speaker 9: else that's happened to me.
• 41:04
  Speaker 6: Right to your point, Hollis, you're absolutely right about all
• 41:07
  Speaker 6: of those things. But also these coaches, they're not gone
• 41:11
  Speaker 6: are the days of going to knock on people's doors
• 41:13
  Speaker 6: and visiting, you know, the high school kid and the family,
• 41:17
  Speaker 6: Because now we're in a different world. That family, that
• 41:20
  Speaker 6: kid who hasn't proven themselves yet, there's still a kid.
• 41:23
  Speaker 6: There's still probably a lot to learn maturity wise, and
• 41:27
  Speaker 6: they want to know as far as nil, what what
• 41:29
  Speaker 6: do you have to offer me? Whereas you know, like
• 41:32
  Speaker 6: Rick Patino said in the clip, he wants these kids
• 41:35
  Speaker 6: that have already proven themselves, and they're there because they
• 41:38
  Speaker 6: want to. They're they're there saying what can I do
• 41:41
  Speaker 6: for you, coach? So it's a whole different Like you said, mindset,
• 41:44
  Speaker 6: it's it's part of maturity. And these these coaches that
• 41:47
  Speaker 6: are at elite programs, they don't want to have to
• 41:49
  Speaker 6: put in the work of dealing with the freshman and
• 41:52
  Speaker 6: all the problems that come along with that, especially one
• 41:54
  Speaker 6: that's unproven.
• 41:56
  Speaker 4: And and there, and to that valid point that that
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: that high school kid that's going into college because he
• 42:04
  Speaker 4: thought he was good or she was good.
• 42:06
  Speaker 5: In high school, they think that they can come in Mom.
• 42:09
  Speaker 4: Dad thinks that they can come in and because I
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: know how good my kid is, so I'm sure they
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: can come in and and and play for.
• 42:17
  Speaker 5: W U right now?
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: Really, yeah, no, you you you can't. Yeah, I mean
• 42:24
  Speaker 4: and and and I and I'll ask you both this question.
• 42:27
  Speaker 4: Do you think that the reality of parents, Let's say,
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: I don't care where high school. Do they really understand
• 42:35
  Speaker 4: the skill set and talents of collegiate athletes. I don't
• 42:39
  Speaker 4: care if you even go to D three do you
• 42:43
  Speaker 4: think they understand exactly what's happening out there? Have they
• 42:46
  Speaker 4: have they looked at or watched and gone to a
• 42:49
  Speaker 4: game to actually understand like the physicality of it, the
• 42:54
  Speaker 4: skill set of it if it's basketball, and and say,
• 42:58
  Speaker 4: I'm not sure my son is quite ready for that
• 43:01
  Speaker 4: yet or is in that space. Have they done their
• 43:05
  Speaker 4: research yet?
• 43:08
  Speaker 9: I think they have. Man, I don't think there's any
• 43:11
  Speaker 9: false free conceptions when it comes to collegiate athletics. I
• 43:16
  Speaker 9: think they have some of those when it comes to
• 43:19
  Speaker 9: like high school and you know whether your kids are
• 43:22
  Speaker 9: going to be good from middle school to high school.
• 43:24
  Speaker 9: I think we see that a lot obviously. But I
• 43:26
  Speaker 9: think when you're talking about collegiate athletics, I don't think
• 43:29
  Speaker 9: it's a mystery no more. You know, we see kids
• 43:32
  Speaker 9: now they're not just taking They're just not just looking
• 43:35
  Speaker 9: for the Wzu and Marshall offers or the higher states
• 43:38
  Speaker 9: or what they're taking a lower level Division one office.
• 43:40
  Speaker 9: They're taking a Division two offers because they realize, hey,
• 43:44
  Speaker 9: I don't have to be stuck here. If I performed,
• 43:46
  Speaker 9: then I can move. So I think the reality you're
• 43:49
  Speaker 9: setting in and it's here because they know that hey, coaches,
• 43:53
  Speaker 9: the scholarship that we're available for high school recruits have
• 43:57
  Speaker 9: been cut in half, and that like Hans you just
• 43:59
  Speaker 9: mentioned previously, at some top programs, they've been cut by
• 44:03
  Speaker 9: seventy five ninety percent. So they realized that, hey, I'm
• 44:07
  Speaker 9: going to have to take a different pathway to get
• 44:09
  Speaker 9: to my desired destination.
• 44:12
  Speaker 6: And if you think about it, it's almost a I
• 44:15
  Speaker 6: don't want to say a smarter way to do it,
• 44:17
  Speaker 6: because sometimes I don't think those that's smart and I
• 44:20
  Speaker 6: portoole go in the same same sentence. But in a way,
• 44:24
  Speaker 6: this is if there's anything positive you can take out
• 44:27
  Speaker 6: of it. I feel like those kids coming out of
• 44:29
  Speaker 6: high school going to a smaller school, you know, a
• 44:33
  Speaker 6: more of a hometown type of feel setting at those
• 44:38
  Speaker 6: at those lower levels, those those you know, the the
• 44:40
  Speaker 6: Jucos and all those different types of schools. It gives
• 44:43
  Speaker 6: them time to mature, time to realize, you know, it's
• 44:47
  Speaker 6: kind of like a stepping stone, and they can they
• 44:49
  Speaker 6: can kind of work through those, you know, the freshman
• 44:52
  Speaker 6: kind of things that kids go through, being away from home,
• 44:57
  Speaker 6: trying to absorb being on their own independent. Some of
• 44:59
  Speaker 6: these kids now have had to do that before taking
• 45:01
  Speaker 6: care of themselves balancing you know, school, in sports and
• 45:05
  Speaker 6: work or whatnot, so in a way that you know,
• 45:07
  Speaker 6: instead of being thrown into a duke or in Ohio
• 45:10
  Speaker 6: State right out of the gates. Sometimes that's kind of
• 45:12
  Speaker 6: a demise for some kids. Do you guys not agree
• 45:15
  Speaker 6: that it can be too much?
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: Yeah? I could.
• 45:17
  Speaker 4: I could see that, And I'll say this, Hollis. I
• 45:21
  Speaker 4: was on the phone with with with Damon Booker and
• 45:24
  Speaker 4: a couple of other guys Charles Smith today for for
• 45:30
  Speaker 4: for just another reason, and one of the reflections that
• 45:36
  Speaker 4: they all have is the early morning running. You know,
• 45:41
  Speaker 4: all of those kinds of things that in their mindset
• 45:44
  Speaker 4: now that that was the that's the fun of it.
• 45:50
  Speaker 4: They can remember that, you know, all the punishments and
• 45:53
  Speaker 4: who got in trouble at what and what I what
• 45:56
  Speaker 4: I would say to them or what I did with them.
• 45:59
  Speaker 5: They they remember all of those kinds of things.
• 46:03
  Speaker 4: And I told them like when I look back at
• 46:07
  Speaker 4: Marshall and what I dealt with with Marshall.
• 46:09
  Speaker 5: It's the same thing.
• 46:10
  Speaker 4: You don't even necessarily remember or even need to talk
• 46:14
  Speaker 4: about the games or a play you made or anything.
• 46:18
  Speaker 5: What you get from sports.
• 46:21
  Speaker 4: Is the is the structure of it all discipline, the discipline,
• 46:25
  Speaker 4: and you get to reflect on, you know, how the
• 46:28
  Speaker 4: coach yelled at you, how much the coach made you run.
• 46:32
  Speaker 4: That actually is the ground level of of I think
• 46:38
  Speaker 4: collegiate sports, high school sports. If you can get that,
• 46:43
  Speaker 4: if you have that, you've had an experience. To me,
• 46:46
  Speaker 4: it's not even so much about winning. It's not even
• 46:49
  Speaker 4: so much about being on the best team or what.
• 46:52
  Speaker 4: You know, how many people actually get to be on
• 46:54
  Speaker 4: the best team. Only that team. Most of everybody else
• 46:58
  Speaker 4: is either second or the bottom, you know, And even
• 47:02
  Speaker 4: if you had bottom, you still get the experience. You
• 47:05
  Speaker 4: get to say, we won this particular game, you know,
• 47:10
  Speaker 4: and I can remember how happy everybody was. And to me,
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: that's all sports is. That's all it has to be.
• 47:20
  Speaker 4: All it has to be to me, is just a
• 47:22
  Speaker 4: happy memory, you know, and reflecting on all of that.
• 47:28
  Speaker 4: And very few people will make it from middle school
• 47:32
  Speaker 4: youth football, to middle school, middle school, the high school,
• 47:37
  Speaker 4: high school.
• 47:38
  Speaker 5: The college, college, the pro.
• 47:42
  Speaker 4: If you can come out of any one of those
• 47:44
  Speaker 4: and you can find a moment of happiness, then to
• 47:49
  Speaker 4: me and pride and pride, did you give your all.
• 47:54
  Speaker 4: I can remember being cut. I remember getting cut and
• 47:57
  Speaker 4: in Minnesota's like my third year and I got and
• 48:01
  Speaker 4: I was like, all right, if I get back in,
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: if I get another opportunity, I will make sure this
• 48:08
  Speaker 4: will never happen again. And it wasn't that I wasn't
• 48:11
  Speaker 4: in shape, It wasn't any of that. It was just
• 48:12
  Speaker 4: the fact that they thought somebody was better. I get
• 48:15
  Speaker 4: back and now I get an opportunity to say, this
• 48:18
  Speaker 4: is never gonna happen again. I'm gonna outwork any and
• 48:21
  Speaker 4: everybody possible moments, those negative moments, you can benefit from
• 48:27
  Speaker 4: those things. Sure, And I think I don't know if
• 48:30
  Speaker 4: we have. And I think and I'm saying that to
• 48:32
  Speaker 4: say that, I think that some of our kids now
• 48:35
  Speaker 4: they have to realize when something goes negative, you can
• 48:39
  Speaker 4: turn that into a positive.
• 48:41
  Speaker 5: But if you stay in the negative, you got nothing.
• 48:46
  Speaker 4: And and I think I'm one hundred percent right on
• 48:48
  Speaker 4: that one, Hollis, Can you can you fight me on that?
• 48:53
  Speaker 9: No? No, I think you're right. Like I said, I
• 48:55
  Speaker 9: think that's the issue. Now. It's like, like like I said,
• 48:59
  Speaker 9: if you you are a you know, a good athlete,
• 49:02
  Speaker 9: now you have a Division one caliber, you may not
• 49:07
  Speaker 9: get that look now like you may not. You may
• 49:11
  Speaker 9: not get that look that you think he deserves coming
• 49:14
  Speaker 9: out of high school. So the challenge for you now,
• 49:16
  Speaker 9: and that's like, you know, if you have the prerequisite height,
• 49:19
  Speaker 9: skills and everything else, then you may have to go
• 49:22
  Speaker 9: to a different path. You may have to go through that.
• 49:24
  Speaker 9: You may not have to. You may be somewhere where
• 49:27
  Speaker 9: it's not as glamorous or you're not getting any And again,
• 49:30
  Speaker 9: not everybody's getting that nil money. It's not like it's
• 49:32
  Speaker 9: just like everybody's getting that. Most college athletes are still
• 49:36
  Speaker 9: you know, living, So you may have to go to
• 49:39
  Speaker 9: a different path in order to get there. You may
• 49:41
  Speaker 9: have to show that resiliency. And the thing about it is,
• 49:45
  Speaker 9: regardless of anything else, can you stay in the rain?
• 49:48
  Speaker 9: Can you deal with it? Can you overcome fight to
• 49:51
  Speaker 9: get to where you think you deserve? And I think athletes,
• 49:54
  Speaker 9: now that's going to be the contest, and unfortunately for
• 49:59
  Speaker 9: a lot of athletes, they're not going to be they're
• 50:01
  Speaker 9: not really going to experience that level of adversity until
• 50:04
  Speaker 9: they get to college because we've made you know, youth
• 50:09
  Speaker 9: league and middle school and high school programs a lot
• 50:11
  Speaker 9: more comfortable than they want worse as far as the
• 50:14
  Speaker 9: amenities and everything else. Right, So that's that's gonna be
• 50:18
  Speaker 9: the great divide as to whether you can mentally stand
• 50:22
  Speaker 9: uh to get to the place that you think you
• 50:24
  Speaker 9: ought to be.
• 50:26
  Speaker 6: Yeah, you have to have perseverance for sure. But but
• 50:29
  Speaker 6: I also stand I'm going to stand by what I said.
• 50:32
  Speaker 6: You know, like I said, this may be a good thing.
• 50:34
  Speaker 6: It's it's gonna build better players. I mean to me,
• 50:38
  Speaker 6: if you have to go from the high school level
• 50:40
  Speaker 6: and then you have to fight your way to uh,
• 50:42
  Speaker 6: you know, a D two up to a D one,
• 50:44
  Speaker 6: and then you know, to more of the elite colleges,
• 50:47
  Speaker 6: you've got to naturally work harder and be better than
• 50:50
  Speaker 6: everybody else on the landscape. So to me, it may
• 50:54
  Speaker 6: it may improve you know, the quality of college basketball
• 50:58
  Speaker 6: that we see.
• 50:59
  Speaker 4: Well, and I I'll close this out on this one,
• 51:02
  Speaker 4: I think, unless somebody wants to comment back on it.
• 51:04
  Speaker 4: You know, again, I go back and I look at Marshall,
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: and I look at the games that we lost, you know,
• 51:12
  Speaker 4: and how bad we felt about losing them, and you know,
• 51:16
  Speaker 4: not having you know, a winning record and all of that.
• 51:20
  Speaker 5: But to you, all's point it.
• 51:24
  Speaker 4: What matters is what you do, how you respond to
• 51:30
  Speaker 4: those situations. You know, we again, we didn't have the
• 51:34
  Speaker 4: ability to leave, so you only had one or two options.
• 51:38
  Speaker 4: You could keep playing take all the losses, or you
• 51:41
  Speaker 4: could quit and become a student. You know, and I
• 51:45
  Speaker 4: think you know most of our guys, a lot of
• 51:50
  Speaker 4: guys stayed. And the bond that we have in that
• 51:55
  Speaker 4: idea of being quote a foundation of success at Marshall.
• 52:02
  Speaker 4: Whether you want to call it that or not, we
• 52:03
  Speaker 4: call it that. I think we're we get to be
• 52:08
  Speaker 4: proud because we were part of of the rebuild. We
• 52:11
  Speaker 4: don't get the we don't get the luxury, we don't
• 52:13
  Speaker 4: get the rings, we don't get all that.
• 52:15
  Speaker 5: But but what.
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: We know is we know we took the losses, we
• 52:19
  Speaker 4: kept the program going. You're part of the We're part
• 52:22
  Speaker 4: of the legacy. And I think you know, and I
• 52:25
  Speaker 4: and I and I and I feel like that's that's
• 52:28
  Speaker 4: something that being part of a team, regardless win or lose,
• 52:33
  Speaker 4: there's opportunity to learn something and be a better person
• 52:38
  Speaker 4: by it. Because winning and losing at this point to
• 52:41
  Speaker 4: me in my life, which is which is a horrible
• 52:43
  Speaker 4: thing for me to even try to be a coach
• 52:45
  Speaker 4: because all that matters to me is the kids are
• 52:48
  Speaker 4: working hard. We're doing the best we can do, and
• 52:51
  Speaker 4: I'm good with it. So, you know, but people, you
• 52:54
  Speaker 4: know again, people want to win, Halis.
• 52:56
  Speaker 6: I want to hear him say that after the Vikings
• 52:58
  Speaker 6: losing the playoffs next year.
• 52:59
  Speaker 4: Too, I'm gonna make the prediction We're going Super Bowl.
• 53:06
  Speaker 5: So I'll make that.
• 53:08
  Speaker 4: I'll put that out there right now. How had you
• 53:11
  Speaker 4: got anything else?
• 53:11
  Speaker 9: Man? No, that's it.
• 53:14
  Speaker 4: All right, ladies and gentlemen. We're gonna get out of here.
• 53:16
  Speaker 4: We appreciate you being here. We'll get back with you again.
• 53:20
  Speaker 3: Let's Talk with Carl Lee is probably presented by Attorney
• 53:23
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• 53:27
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• 53:31
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• 53:34
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• 53:37
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• 53:42
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• 53:45
  Speaker 3: eight for Let's Talk with Carl Lee.
• 53:48
  Speaker 4: If you fall, does it dough? For get back up
• 53:50
  Speaker 4: for your feet.
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: Anything will be a win, yup, even the feet that
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: say shit's a bath for you.
• 53:55
  Speaker 4: Wis ververy sweet. Couldn't play with big kids. I had
• 53:57
  Speaker 4: to sit in the street and watch from a disk.
• 54:00
  Speaker 4: Just put over time. I grew.
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: If I put in the work in no time, I'm doing.
• 54:04
  Speaker 4: Everything that I worked in prayer. I'm okay.
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: If you ask me how did I do it, I'm
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: gonna say. You gotta work, crime shine, just mine gotta show.
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: Everybody is my time hein in. You gotta work, cry shine.
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: Never mind who talking died this day line, don't talk.
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: You gotta work. You gotta work. You gotta work. You
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: gotta work, You gotta work. You gotta work.