Latest / Scam Goddess / The Fraudulent Fashion Founder w/ Margaret Cho

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The Fraudulent Fashion Founder w/ Margaret Cho · Scam Goddess

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Scal come from Scam, come right from.
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: Goddess.
• 0:19
  Speaker 3: Whats popin Congregation, It's your girl. Lacey Mostly aka Scam
• 0:23
  Speaker 3: God is back with another installment of comedy podcast all
• 0:26
  Speaker 3: about robbery, fraud and those who practice it. Sometimes we
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: love them, sometimes we ate them. We will find out
• 0:31
  Speaker 3: along the way. In Congregation, we have a returning member
• 0:37
  Speaker 3: of the congregation back here today, a stand up comedian,
• 0:40
  Speaker 3: actress and musician on the show. You've seen her on
• 0:44
  Speaker 3: All American Girl, thirty Rock, Will Trent Fire Island, all
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: her amazing stand up comedy specials, and so much more.
• 0:51
  Speaker 3: She has an album out now called Lucky Gift. You
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: can listen to that right after this episode. Congregation. Okay,
• 0:57
  Speaker 3: she got some hymns.
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: For the church. I know that's right.
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: And you can catch her live on her Chola Garchy
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: stand up comedy Tour, happening now through August. Yes, come
• 1:06
  Speaker 3: on Shologarky, an icon, a comedy legend.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: She is.
• 1:09
  Speaker 3: Congregation, Please stand up, out of your pews, your seats,
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: your cars, and welcome Margaret Show back to the show.
• 1:16
  Speaker 4: Hi Margaret, Hi, I love you, thank you.
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: Yes, we'll be more so happy that you're back.
• 1:21
  Speaker 4: I'm so grateful to be back.
• 1:23
  Speaker 3: I this is random, but and I know it's like
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: an old thing that you did and you're always popping
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: and moving and shaking, but your arc on thirty Rock
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: was one of my favorite random bits ever. And I
• 1:33
  Speaker 3: watched thirty Rock a lot, like over and over again
• 1:35
  Speaker 3: because I just think it's a show. It was just
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: so many like ak forty seven rounds of jokes and.
• 1:41
  Speaker 4: Oh, thank you, thank you.
• 1:42
  Speaker 5: It's like, yeah, it's like a comfort show.
• 1:44
  Speaker 4: For a lot of people.
• 1:45
  Speaker 5: Like it's one of those things that you kind of
• 1:48
  Speaker 5: want to watch before you're going to sleep, cause it's like,
• 1:50
  Speaker 5: you know, we need things that are comforting, and we
• 1:52
  Speaker 5: need things that are we know are funny from a
• 1:55
  Speaker 5: simpler time.
• 1:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so but thank you, thank you that it was
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: a lot of fun to do.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: It's iconic.
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: I've always wanted to do something like that where like
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: people can watch it for years and years to come,
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: you know what I mean, Because like there's so many jokes.
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: Every time I watch it again, I find something new
• 2:10
  Speaker 3: and funny about you, about everyone, and so it's very it's.
• 2:13
  Speaker 5: Yeah, maybe it's so funny. It's a really it was
• 2:15
  Speaker 5: a really fun thing to do.
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you. Thank you for bringing all the talents
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: in the world.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: We appreciate it.
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: Now I have to ask you, Margaret, like, since we've spoken,
• 2:25
  Speaker 3: you know, what's your relationship with scam has been. Have
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: there been any that have been quite titillating to you?
• 2:30
  Speaker 3: Or has anything happened to you? Could literally be anything.
• 2:33
  Speaker 4: So this is very rare.
• 2:34
  Speaker 5: I actually jumped into the DMS of a very famous
• 2:37
  Speaker 5: person who I wanted to date, and I've never done this,
• 2:41
  Speaker 5: but we started talking and I gave them my phone
• 2:44
  Speaker 5: number and then I got a text right away, but
• 2:48
  Speaker 5: it didn't seem like it was from that person. It was, Hi,
• 2:52
  Speaker 5: I'm so glad that I have your number and I
• 2:55
  Speaker 5: just want to see what you're doing. And it didn't
• 2:58
  Speaker 5: sound like the same person, and I was like, this
• 3:00
  Speaker 5: is not the same and I didn't want to go
• 3:02
  Speaker 5: in the dams.
• 3:02
  Speaker 4: Did you text me? Like?
• 3:03
  Speaker 5: I didn't want to say anything like that, Like I
• 3:05
  Speaker 5: just was like, I just let it sit on it.
• 3:07
  Speaker 5: And then I waited for a day because I thought
• 3:09
  Speaker 5: it was one of those texts like you know, hey,
• 3:11
  Speaker 5: we're supposed to go golfing.
• 3:13
  Speaker 4: Or you know, like we're.
• 3:16
  Speaker 5: Like, okay, I'll meet you at the doctor's office, you
• 3:18
  Speaker 5: know those things, and it sounded like one of those.
• 3:21
  Speaker 5: But I also had just given this person of my
• 3:24
  Speaker 5: damns my number, so I did. It was so awkward,
• 3:27
  Speaker 5: so I like waited a day and then finally I
• 3:31
  Speaker 5: wrote back and I'm like, is this the person that
• 3:33
  Speaker 5: I was talking to?
• 3:34
  Speaker 4: And they're like, no, it's Roberta.
• 3:36
  Speaker 5: And then it was a picture of like a beautiful
• 3:39
  Speaker 5: Asian woman.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: Oh Lord Jesus, and it.
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: Was like one of those fits, and I was like
• 3:43
  Speaker 4: so angry.
• 3:44
  Speaker 5: So the movie star didn't work out, and but I
• 3:48
  Speaker 5: was so mad that it with a timing was that
• 3:51
  Speaker 5: I thought it was that person?
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: So was this a chance?
• 3:54
  Speaker 3: With the camera just kind of got like some kismet
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: luck and it was a coincidence.
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: Total coincidence, total incidents.
• 4:00
  Speaker 5: But I actually get those things pretty often, like those
• 4:04
  Speaker 5: weird fishing texts like this is the doctor speaking and
• 4:07
  Speaker 5: you have an appointment, or you were supposed to meet
• 4:10
  Speaker 5: up and play golf, or hey mom, dad, is this
• 4:13
  Speaker 5: your number? Still, like, I get so many of those,
• 4:17
  Speaker 5: and I think it's because I got scammed before a
• 4:18
  Speaker 5: few years ago during the pandemic, when I tried to
• 4:20
  Speaker 5: buy a cat online.
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: I remember you telling you about that.
• 4:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah, when I tried to buy a cat online. So
• 4:25
  Speaker 5: I think I'm on a register where people are like,
• 4:28
  Speaker 5: she's an easy marksmers.
• 4:31
  Speaker 3: Like the data breach, I'm I'm fully convinced. I'm putting
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: on my tin hat, but I'm fully convinced that those
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: data breaches are literally just companies selling our information and
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: then acting like, oh my god, we don't know who
• 4:41
  Speaker 3: did it, but just so you know, like we gave
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: them everything once you bought that, you know, Toyota Cameron, Like,
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: what do you mean?
• 4:50
  Speaker 5: You're right, You're totally right, because that's that's exactly what
• 4:53
  Speaker 5: they've been doing. But it's like I've just been breached
• 4:55
  Speaker 5: so many times because I refuse to change my number.
• 4:58
  Speaker 5: I don't really know how to do any think, like
• 5:00
  Speaker 5: I'm very like lax on stuff. So I definitely And
• 5:04
  Speaker 5: I've been to gam before, and you know that cat
• 5:07
  Speaker 5: scam got me for a couple of thousand dollars.
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so that one out. Everyone wanted to pet, everyone
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: wanted someone to cuddle. We were all indoors. It's like,
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: it's are the nastiest scams to do. It's like people just.
• 5:19
  Speaker 5: Connecting a little animal and showing me all these two
• 5:23
  Speaker 5: pictures of kiddies, and so it was just very it
• 5:26
  Speaker 5: was rough, so I think, but you know, when you
• 5:28
  Speaker 5: get marked this like somebody who can be conned, they
• 5:31
  Speaker 5: never want to let you go.
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: Oh no, once they think they can get you once
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: to say, they'll just spend the block again and again.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: And I feel like with.
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: This situation, it's unique because this is one of the
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: scams that I haven't ever gotten to the end game of,
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: like when you talked about the like oh I'm your mom,
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: or oh the doctor. I've gotten the golfing one a lot,
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: or it's like hey girl, like you're late for lunch
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: and I'm like, I don't know who this is, and
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: they're like, oh, it's me so and so then they
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: send a picture and it's always some conventionally attractive, you know,
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: like East European woman.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: And I try to keep it going, like I've tried
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: a couple times.
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: The next time, I'm not going to fail because I
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: got a little too cocky and I was like talking
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: back to the person and I was like, oh girl,
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: like I don't know, but just seemed cool, like we
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: should link up, like we should have gone for whateverever.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: I got pretty far in the conversation because I'm trying
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: to figure out what do you want? Yeah, what do
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: they want?
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: And so I was so excited because I got pretty
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: far that I put a screenshot on my Instagram store
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: and I was like, y'all, I'm getting close. Soon as
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: I put that screenshot up, they were like, oh, never mind, Uh,
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: this is the wrong person, and they stopped talking to me,
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: and I'm like, fuck, they must be watching my stories.
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: This is somebody who somehow has gotten my information.
• 6:34
  Speaker 4: I was like, yeah, they put it together.
• 6:37
  Speaker 5: They were like, this is too easy, because what they
• 6:39
  Speaker 5: want is somebody that's old, who's lonely, who's vulnerable that
• 6:44
  Speaker 5: they can build a relationship with. I mean that's basically
• 6:47
  Speaker 5: they're just looking for an entry into conversation where they
• 6:50
  Speaker 5: can either talk you into doing some kind of bitcoin
• 6:54
  Speaker 5: crypto investment scam or something to that effect.
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: Like they want to take you to what's they want
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: to take you to?
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: Signal They definitely like never go to a second location
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: that works with the phones as well on exactly what
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: my phone Bookie like, we're not going to with.
• 7:07
  Speaker 5: That, We're not going to what'sapp We're not going to signal,
• 7:11
  Speaker 5: we're not going to telegram now there it is exactly
• 7:14
  Speaker 5: like that's where they kill you in the second location.
• 7:16
  Speaker 5: So we have to be very very aware. But that
• 7:19
  Speaker 5: I think they're just looking for people who are lonely.
• 7:21
  Speaker 5: They don't like it when people actually actively try to.
• 7:24
  Speaker 4: Waste their time.
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: Yea, you know, no.
• 7:28
  Speaker 4: Aware of it. Yeah, they're aware of it.
• 7:30
  Speaker 3: And the thing too is that I feel like when
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: you said the part about like you don't change your
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: passwords and you don't change your number, like I absolutely
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: understand that. And for those people out there who are
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: you know, doing what Marcatchell's doing, who are part of
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: the trologarchy you know, tickets right now, y'all. Yes, I
• 7:49
  Speaker 3: think that it's not a bad thing to operate that way.
• 7:53
  Speaker 3: Just know that if a scammer emails you or reaches
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: out to you and it's like hey I have your
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: password or hey I have your number, Hey I know
• 8:01
  Speaker 3: where you live, if they had enough information to take
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: anything from you, they wouldn't reach out to you, right,
• 8:06
  Speaker 3: So don't get scared, don't engage. I've had people send
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: me photos of myself and we're like, I know this
• 8:13
  Speaker 3: is you and I'm gonna expose you. I don't respond
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: to that email because okay, do it was your time
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: in that picture and it's.
• 8:20
  Speaker 5: Not I'll give it that like I mean, like it's
• 8:25
  Speaker 5: like that's That's what's really sad is when people really
• 8:27
  Speaker 5: get stuck with fear and they're like so afraid that
• 8:32
  Speaker 5: their friends are family are going to find out about
• 8:34
  Speaker 5: certain things or whatever, and it's just that's a that's
• 8:37
  Speaker 5: a whole other level of scam that's like sextortion or
• 8:40
  Speaker 5: extortion where it's really that's really evil and that's unfortunately
• 8:44
  Speaker 5: the reality for a lot of like teenagers.
• 8:48
  Speaker 4: Now have to deal with that kind of stuff, which
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: I think.
• 8:50
  Speaker 5: I mean, I'm I'm just so glad that I'm sort
• 8:53
  Speaker 5: of like numb to it and I don't really care.
• 8:56
  Speaker 5: But yeah, people can get you can get done with
• 8:59
  Speaker 5: that that kind of stuff.
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, because I mean, that's one of the biggest currencies
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: in scams is fear and shame, shame, especially because shame
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: is like like the next step of fear, you know
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: what I mean. So it's like fear is the root,
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: but shame is like the mask. It's like the fear
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: is that you're going to be embarrassed. So I absolutely
• 9:18
  Speaker 3: understand people want to cover that up. But that's how
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: a lot of scammers continue to get away with things.
• 9:21
  Speaker 5: It's because how they operate, it's their ammunition, and it's
• 9:24
  Speaker 5: it's really I mean that that's really sad. But yeah,
• 9:27
  Speaker 5: the fact that that exists in is such a big industry.
• 9:30
  Speaker 5: They make millions of dollars, and I.
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: Mean, look at our president, look at all these model
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: people still hanging on. And it's simply because they're so
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: ashamed to say that they got got and that they
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: were foolish.
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: And then there's some people who are.
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: Just like, look, I want the world to burn, like
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: I didn't get what I was promised in the white contracts,
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: so all the brown's gotta die. You know, you got
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: those people, But then you also have the people who
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: are like, no.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: I believe in him.
• 9:53
  Speaker 3: I don't know what the fucking stands for, what the
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: fuck is doing. But they're just like, I don't want
• 9:56
  Speaker 3: to be proven a fool. I'm too ashamed, right, So
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: I'm too a shame.
• 10:00
  Speaker 5: It's just they're embarrassed. It's a sunk cost fallacy. You know,
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: they bought so and so and do it so much.
• 10:06
  Speaker 5: They bought so much Trump merch and they can't go back.
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And also like I don't know why didn't realize
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: when the president kept selling the merch like once he
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: was in office, Like, bro, this is a griff. I
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: had one Obama T shirt and I wore it. Oh,
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: I had two because it was cute. It was two
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: little different ones because the first was for both elections.
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: For one for different elections because the first lecture I
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: couldn't vote, and then the second I could. But I
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: like block walked and phone bank and did whatever I
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: could the first one. But like I had those two
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: T shirts. I don't know where those shirts are. Like
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: I would wear one to work out every now and then.
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: But like, why are y'all wearing merch? Like y'all going
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: to his concert every day? Like you don't think that's strange.
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: You don't think that's strange. He always he got a
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: gold shoe for y'all, he got a card, he got
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: ear rings, bigcoin. You don't think it's weird. He's slanging
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: Like like imagine if you were in the White House
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: and the President was like bro man from Martin and
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: he just opened his coat and he was like, hey, y'all,
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: the president got all this stuff for y'all. Watch I
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: want two for five, five for thirty, Like what are
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: we doing?
• 11:00
  Speaker 5: But he's such a scammer. It's like he's scammed that. Yeah,
• 11:04
  Speaker 5: he's scawing so much.
• 11:06
  Speaker 3: But the shame of it all is like, really, what
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: I wanted to like link in with, and I'm sorry
• 11:10
  Speaker 3: that it didn't work out, Like what you're shooting your shop?
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: I mean, you got to respond, so okay, I did.
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: I did. We had it.
• 11:15
  Speaker 5: We had a nice conversation, and it's just it was
• 11:18
  Speaker 5: really it was the first time I had ever done that.
• 11:20
  Speaker 5: But that's why I just got got by the scammer,
• 11:23
  Speaker 5: because it was the timing.
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they got looked at.
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: They got really lucky, and I could have just fallen in.
• 11:28
  Speaker 5: But it's it's good. It's good that it didn't work out.
• 11:31
  Speaker 5: I mean, I just really expect scams. I listened to
• 11:34
  Speaker 5: your podcast so much and watch your TV show so
• 11:37
  Speaker 5: much that I just I think everything is a scam,
• 11:40
  Speaker 5: which is really you're educating the people. We now we're
• 11:43
  Speaker 5: in the congregation, we think everything is a scam, so
• 11:45
  Speaker 5: we're always looking out for ourselves.
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think in some way everything can be
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: a scam. That doesn't mean everything is a scam, but
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: everything can be a scam.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: Which, yes, I don't want people to.
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: Be like pessimistic or like scared, but I think having
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: that mentality exactly what you just said at Margaret, like,
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: I love that that's what you took.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: From it, because that mentality keeps you safe.
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: Because the people who think it could never happen to me,
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: that's what happened. So because you see all these red flags,
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: you're like, it could never happen to me, It could
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: never happened to me. And it's like, no, baby, it's
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: happening to you right now. And because you refuse to
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: believe it would, you're gonna wake up one day and it.
• 12:18
  Speaker 4: Did exactly exactly.
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Scared God, Lit's get into our historic hoodwink today. Today
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: we're gonna be talking about Fashion CEO Christine Hunsicker aka
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: the Birnie Madoff of Fashion.
• 12:39
  Speaker 4: Ah.
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: Yes, Christine wasted three hundred and fifty million dollars of
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: investor money lied about her company's net worth, and when
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: the other executives at the company found out, they left
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: her in charge for months.
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: So once they busted her.
• 12:53
  Speaker 3: They were like, well, okay, so she is giving fashion
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: Christine's got Yes.
• 12:59
  Speaker 4: She's very she's also very stock photography.
• 13:02
  Speaker 5: She's very very it's giving very stock photographer like stock photography.
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: Yes, you're absolutely right. Like this could definitely be like
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: a lanscrafter's commercial.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: Like I could go into like an eye doctor and
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: they would have her photo up.
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: I don't think those passes have prescription.
• 13:18
  Speaker 5: But no, no, but it is very like I, I,
• 13:21
  Speaker 5: you know, I need some I need a twenty twenty
• 13:24
  Speaker 5: vision and I, you know, it's very like an.
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: Ad she's given me barista at a local cafe employee
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: of the money. Yeah, yeah, definitely, definitely so the hunt
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: Sticker proxy. So Christine was born in Pennsylvania, Okay, shout
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: out to PA and went to Princeton, Okay, where she
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: played field hockey and learned German for her medieval studies minor.
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: All of this is adding up with this photo.
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: I'm seeing Princeton, I'm seeing field hockey, I'm seeing medieval studies.
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: Because ma'am, what was she gonna do with that?
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: It's like two thousand and seven, But okay, sure. So
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: one of her jobs was a project manager for right Media,
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: an online advertising startup in New York. She was promoted
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: to president before Right Media was sold to Yahoo, but
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: eight hundred and fifty million dollars in two thousand and seven. Now, Yahoo, see,
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: y'all made a lot of bad financial decisions because I
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: never even knew about Right Media. I don't think they
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: deserved eight hundred and fifty million of your dollars. No,
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: never seen this logal life. No, No, Yeah, Yahoo made
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: a lot of poor decisions.
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: I mean they're still hanging on. I know. I still
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: have my email over there for spam.
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: That's good. That's good.
• 14:32
  Speaker 3: And anytime I signed up for like a clothing laying,
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: you know, and they're like, we want to sign up
• 14:36
  Speaker 3: for a discount, I'm like, oh, yeah, here's my Yahoo.
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: Oh that's a good idea. That's smart.
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: So after taking a year off to get Scooba certified,
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: this lady just be doing anything. She's Yeah, she took
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: a job at another tech startup called drop dot io and,
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: an online file sharing service that was purchased by Facebook
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: for ten million dollars in twenty ten. Why wasn't I
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: just making up tech stuff with boring logos in the
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: early two thousands, because.
• 15:04
  Speaker 4: That's what everybody was doing. They were just fine.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: The guys were buying it up.
• 15:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah, they was spending money on that.
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: Like Mark Zuckerboody bought this, Like I've never seen this
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: on Facebook, never dripped to drop Oh.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: This was genius.
• 15:17
  Speaker 4: Man.
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: We should have just been buying up domains in two thousand.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: What are we doing?
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: I should have got with Dan Capatrick told us. She said,
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: go go Daddy, get these get these domains. And I played.
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: So she got school certified, right, she got dropped. Dot
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: Io sales up to Mark Zuckerberg's and Zuckerberg had really
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: only bought it because he wanted to hire one of
• 15:37
  Speaker 3: their employees, Sam Lesson. The rest of the company shut
• 15:41
  Speaker 3: down and the employees were laid off, so this was
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: a vanity purchase. So Sam was like, if you want
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: to get me, you got to get my company. Love
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: how this works for people. In twenty eleven, Christine finally
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: launched her own startup, and this was called gwynny Bee,
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: a subscription service renting every day to women's sizes ten.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: To thirty two.
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: For a monthly fee, you could get a few items
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: of clothing sent to you with a prepaid return package,
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: so when you send those items back, your next batch
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: would ship and Gwinny Beee would take care of washing,
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: dry cleaning of all the stuff that you returned. They
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: also had a size Advisor tool which would recommend a
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: size to pick like from each brand, and Christina hit
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: the jackpot again.
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: Honestly, Christine got hella ideas.
• 16:28
  Speaker 5: Like this is actually a good idea, though, I mean,
• 16:30
  Speaker 5: it's just hard, you know, especially like mid size or
• 16:33
  Speaker 5: plus size. It's hard to find those basics that you like.
• 16:36
  Speaker 5: It's also hard to go out, you know, shopping and
• 16:39
  Speaker 5: stuff like that, like.
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: The because in the store they only carry up to
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: a certain size. A lot of people don't have the
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: you know, they don't go block the plus size, yeah,
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: or plus size to them is like a.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: Fourteen and that's where they stop.
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: And it's like, yeah, so if you can't bite in
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: the store, it's hard to find online sourcing it all
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: together at one place, and at least when I'm looking
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: at it the web site right here, the outfits and stuff,
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: especially for the time this is like early two thousands.
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: This is what the girls were wearing, you know what
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: I mean. There's Jean jackets, even those like tops with
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: the kind of like pre like what would you call
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: that little bean that you nick at the top with
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: the hombornment.
• 17:18
  Speaker 4: Yeah, or you know they've got a cold shoulder.
• 17:21
  Speaker 5: Yeah, they're gonna give you a cold shoulder, Like they're
• 17:23
  Speaker 5: always gonna have a cold shoulder. I don't know what
• 17:25
  Speaker 5: that is, but yeah, Like the the whole thing about
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: it is it's hard to find plus sizes that are cute,
• 17:30
  Speaker 5: that are if you want to change up your look
• 17:33
  Speaker 5: that often.
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: It's nice.
• 17:34
  Speaker 5: I mean I think that it's nice for you know,
• 17:37
  Speaker 5: for people who are the size to feel like, oh
• 17:41
  Speaker 5: I'm being accommodated, I'm being sold to.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: This is good.
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: This is a good idea, especially because of our demos
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: in America, a lot of people are plus size, and
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: then their clothing is treated like an afterthought and it's
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: I have some plus sized friends somewhere in the industry
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: you're always talking about. They were like, I don't understand
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: why they think that plus size people want to wear
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: cheat a print all the time. I don't understand why
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: they think we need ruffles. They love to put a
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: ruffle on it. A cheetah parent like you said an
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: exposed shoulder. Yeh're like, We'll let you show a little
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: top of the shower.
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: Girl. How you getting them? Yeah?
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: Like yeah, so this is a genius idea to me.
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: Damn girl, why yes, going to crime? You're doing something
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: good for the community. So Project Runway Fashion Startup. So
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: this is when Christine Christine, she becomes a Yeah, she
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: becomes a rising star in the fashion world. She was
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: on Crane's New York Business forty under forty list.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: What I tell you about them list.
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: If somebody try to put you on the list, or
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: if your publicisers try to put you on a forty forty,
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: thirty and thirty are going to jail.
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: You're going to jail. Just look up the pipeline. Don't
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: do it.
• 18:43
  Speaker 4: That's right.
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: So she she got on the forty under forty list
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: and was one of Ink's most impressive women entrepreneurs and
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: was recognized by the National Retail Federation as a pioneer
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: shaping the future of retail.
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: I agree with all of this.
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: In twenty sixteen, she appeared as a judge on Project
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: Runway Fashion Startup.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: Okay, she was over there, Hidi, damn wow? Yes? And
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: wait is it? Nagal it zoom in on that photo.
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: Oh no, that's another white man.
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: But okay, so this is the more fashion runway startup business.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: This is like the shark Tank of fashion.
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, because now of these people look like models, no shade,
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: it's just like you, no looks.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: So yeah, so she's on there like the shark Tank
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: for clothes. Interestingly, the other investors and judges on the
• 19:31
  Speaker 3: show decided Christine had the best poker face because she
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: was good at saying one thing backstage and doing another
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: on camera.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: So Christine was on top of the world. Gwinnie Bee
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: worked well.
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: Her users enjoyed it, and so of course it was
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: time to make a change. I wonder what they mean
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: by poker face.
• 19:49
  Speaker 6: Let's see, Harry has an amazing poker face, but Rebecca,
• 19:55
  Speaker 6: she doesn't let you in on what she's thinking about.
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: I'd have to say Christine had the best poker face.
• 20:00
  Speaker 6: The best poker face is Christine. You never know what
• 20:02
  Speaker 6: she's thinking. Sometimes she's quiet and you think she's completely disinterested,
• 20:06
  Speaker 6: and then she surprises us all by begging the biggest investment.
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: Who had the best poker face? Obviously me, she surprised us.
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: We would talk a little bit in our boardroom.
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: We would speak off camera and then I would come
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: on and do something completely different than what I had
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: just committed to.
• 20:22
  Speaker 5: She would come out in surprise us. We realized that
• 20:24
  Speaker 5: we've got to be a little more careful and less
• 20:26
  Speaker 5: candid in the boardroom.
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: So this is giving me like a little bit of
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: shade of like we all made a decision of what
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: we were going to put in investment wise, and like
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: she was like, yeah, tell me how your idea, tell
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: me your idea, that's your idea. Yeah, that's crazy. I'm
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: thinking the same as you. I'm thinking the same as you.
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: I like what you're thinking. And then she get out
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: there and be.
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: Like I want it all.
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: Totally totally.
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: It's kind of unscrupulous.
• 20:51
  Speaker 4: It's very unscrupulous. It's very unscrupulous.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: It was giving like, how can we say that she's untrustworthy?
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: Like she's cut.
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: Wrote, she watched the money, that's all she cares about.
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: They was all basically saying like, yeah, Christine lying us,
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: Christine us every day totally.
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: If Christine talking, you lying mm hmm.
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: But we love that. We love that. I was like, oh,
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: I gotta start stepping up, my lie game. No, okay,
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: So I don't know why if things are working, don't
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: keep expanding on these things and working on these things.
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: But clearly she's a serial entrepreneur, which is my loving
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: title for scammers who have to keep moving into other fields.
• 21:30
  Speaker 3: So she starts something called Castle with two aids. She
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: rebranded gwinnibee as Castle. Instead of being a subscription clothing
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: rental company, it would be the tech that helped existing
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: brands run their own subscription services. Christine called it clothing
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: as a service or CAST okay, and that's why she
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: renamed the business Castle.
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: Castle was supposed to.
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: Manage all aspects of the service for retail partners, from
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: consumer facing web sites to the cleaning and shipping of
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: garments to custom service. Retailers like Express or Ralph Lauren
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: would pay Castle a per user, per month fee to
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: run their rental services. Each retailer would set their own
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: monthly subscription rate to like from forty nine ninety five
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: to one hundred and sixty dollars a month for three
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: or four items. Christine and Castle was like it was
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: like a high growth private company doing BOFO business for
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: like Express, Ralph Lauren and Taylor Banana Republic Vince and
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: they were providing retail rental technology behind the scenes, but
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: customers would never know Castle was involved.
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: So basically she realized.
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: That with gwinny Bee, she had made all the infrastructure
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: to do this like rental clothing type situation. Then she
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: was like, well, why am I doing this for one
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: company when I get my hands up in their my
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: business and the consumer doesn't even need to know. So
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: they keep to keep their brand equity and I get
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: to get my coins. And this kind of reminds me
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: of like, I don't know if this is a secret,
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: but you know, when you get styled for an event
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: or something, sometimes you decide you want to purchase the
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: look because you like the look and you don't have
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: it in your closet. But other times there are certain
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: stores that your stylists can go to pull things for
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: you to wear, and then they're dry cleaned and they're
• 23:15
  Speaker 3: returned and you pay a certain percentage of the whole price,
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: but you don't pay for the whole thing because you're
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: not going to keep it.
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: Because sometimes when you photograph something is.
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: Dead or you know, once some outfits that are so
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: extravagant that I'm like where am I gonna wear this again?
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, So it's like that, but for the average
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: everyday consumer, which I think is pretty cool, and I
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: think that saves on waste.
• 23:35
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and it's it's better in the long run. So
• 23:38
  Speaker 5: then fast fashion just becomes actually just slow fashion. Everybody's fashion,
• 23:42
  Speaker 5: so you know, it doesn't have that like disposability factor.
• 23:46
  Speaker 5: If there's like a bunch of different people wearing it
• 23:48
  Speaker 5: per season. I think it's a good idea.
• 23:50
  Speaker 4: I mean for like just the climate change of it all.
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so it does end up in a landfill or
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: on a barge or you know, some positive aspects to Yeah,
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: tied up as.
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: A fashion nova in the ocean, like.
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, now the seals are tied.
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: To win te Okay, No, they don't want to do
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: it no more.
• 24:10
  Speaker 6: Bob.
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: Run So her revenue projections for twenty four or twenty
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: twenty four and twenty twenty five were seven hundred and
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: ninety three million and one billion dollars, and she said
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: that clothing as a service, like as a company, had
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: hundreds of millions in cash on hand as of the
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: mid like twenty twenty fours. So these kinds of numbers
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: got her a three hundred and fifty million dollar venture
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: capital like investment from you know VC's including Peter Teal,
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: you know, notorious great guy Peter Teal who says, who
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: says that, I'm not sure we need humanity no more.
• 24:51
  Speaker 4: We'll god, oh, I'm not sure we don't need miss Peter.
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: Till she needs to go, Like if we made so
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: sick of her, you sor why you lead the way
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: Peter's in the end of you start and.
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: Then we're gonna come after you. We're gonna be in line.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: We gon be in line, but you jump first, and
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: then we gonna. Yeah.
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: Elon's friend of me and backer of the Steroid Olympics,
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: which we've covered on this show.
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: But you know, getting this money. Christine was lying.
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: So now that I know where the money is coming from,
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: it's fine. So, according to a number of losses that
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: led to bankruptcy and probably the demise of the whole company, Castle,
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: Christine led investors or Christine lied to investors from February
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: twenty nineteen up until now, the company was actually not
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: working and she just pretended that it was.
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: I mean a lot of companies do that.
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, Like do we think Arby's is really working.
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: Who's who's going to Arby's?
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: Is it a drug?
• 25:51
  Speaker 6: Friend?
• 25:52
  Speaker 5: People who love write roast beef, But I think, you
• 25:55
  Speaker 5: know it's I think roast beef is not really working either.
• 25:57
  Speaker 5: I mean, who's really going to dying on a rough beef?
• 26:01
  Speaker 4: Hell?
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know who is roast beef every
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: day with their homegirls?
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know.
• 26:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you're right, the roast beef industry and RB's like,
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: what kind of clusion y'all got going on?
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: What are y'all transferring in that beef?
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: Yes, because you know, the FDA ain't opening that beef
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: of trying to get a taste. What kind of drugs
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: are y'all smuggling into the country?
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: We know.
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: So she gave these investors falsely inflated income statements, fake
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: audited financial statements, fictitious bank account records, and sham corporate records,
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: which I think is pretty interesting that you could do
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: that up until today, because that's like an old school
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: branding made off where they were literally cooking the books.
• 26:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's incredible.
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: So she was doing sham bank statements in the twenty twenties.
• 26:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's pretty bold.
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: Props She told one investor in August of twenty twenty
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: three that Castle reported an operating profit of nearly twenty
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: four million dollars in the second quarter of twenty twenty three,
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: when it's operating.
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: Profit in that quarter was actually less than thirty thousand dollars.
• 27:00
  Speaker 5: Oh wow for the year overall, Oh my god, the
• 27:05
  Speaker 5: company was operating at a loss of.
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: Eighty million dollars at a loss in the like Girl
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: the livees.
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: One fake bank account screenshot which Christine showed an investor
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: showed that Castle had nearly two hundred million dollars in
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: available cash at the time they actually had.
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: Less than two hundred thousand dollars.
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: Uh huh.
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: So she was just like, add some zeros to that, just.
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: Add that's all she did.
• 27:31
  Speaker 5: Not even that really creative. She just added a couple
• 27:34
  Speaker 5: of zeros. That's so great.
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: It really is is now I think about FALSI find
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: a bank statement if everything else looks agend.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: All you did was just going there and add one
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: little zero.
• 27:42
  Speaker 4: That's all.
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: Move a move a comma out easy, classy, classy. So
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: fake financial supported Christine's story that Castle was about to
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: go public and get bought by a bigger company.
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: In twenty twenty three, she.
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: Was confronted over providing an investor with a fake audit,
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: and she claimed it was a one time error. You
• 28:02
  Speaker 3: know how that one time you give somebody a fake audit,
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: everybody made some misteakes.
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: You know, it happens.
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, one time you give them a fake audit and
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: you're like oop swooped.
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: The doo, and then it's gonna be real the next time.
• 28:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah.
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: So in twenty twenty four, she forged a board director's
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: signature to raise more than twenty million dollars for the company.
• 28:24
  Speaker 3: So now she's forging signatures. I mean, maybe all these
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: side quests that she took are really payd off. I
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: don't know where the medieval studies is happening, but maybe
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: it's like in subterfuge.
• 28:33
  Speaker 5: Or just like adding maybe they did that in the
• 28:36
  Speaker 5: the Middle like ages is just add zeros.
• 28:39
  Speaker 4: Did they have zeros then? But they just got mad?
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: No, they they have zeros. They have zeros then? Yeah,
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: So that's how she learned how to.
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: Like fuck with the coffers and you know, make it
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: seem like the king had coin when the king was broke.
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: So she made more than two hundred and seventy five
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: million dollars from misinformed investments before forming another company called
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: P one eighty in twenty twenty four. But P one
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: eighty only existed to infuse Castle with more cash before
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: its investors couldn't discover the fraud. So she was like,
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: y'all get involved in P one eighty, this is my
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: new thing, and then she was basically.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: Robing Peter to pay Paul.
• 29:16
  Speaker 3: Okay, I don't even know what P one eighty does,
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: but it does sound like they're gonna turn it around.
• 29:21
  Speaker 4: Sounds like that.
• 29:22
  Speaker 5: That really hard workout, remember that hard work X Yeah,
• 29:27
  Speaker 5: I thought that's what it was.
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: Really hard. It was hard as fun is that Sean?
• 29:33
  Speaker 4: Oh, Sean, it was u There was also insanity. It
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: was similar to insanity.
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: Very insanity. One of them was Sean King or what
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: was his name, Sean something like that.
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: Shawnte. My favorite thing about Shawnte with Shauncey was very gay.
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: But Shanty wanted to keep his market and so I
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: think he thought he had some pretensively straight But it
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: was so funny because because we knew he was gay.
• 30:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you could just see it, you could feel it.
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: But he will always be trying to play off his
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: heterosexuality while he was working with oh ye ladies, and
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: I was.
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: Like, Sean, they're so cute.
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: I love them.
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: Everybody knows you're gay. The man, the women, we don't care.
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: The workout is killing fring. It's great.
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: It was a hard workout.
• 30:21
  Speaker 3: It was hard as hell, and honestly, like I feel
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: like even straight men know that if you really want
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: that great gym body, your your instructor is going to
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: be a gay man.
• 30:30
  Speaker 4: Yes, you have to, you have to go to the
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: homosexual world.
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: Yes, because they take the body seriously.
• 30:36
  Speaker 4: That's right, That's right.
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: Yes. So.
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: Brendan Hoffman was a seasoned fashion executive who previously led
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: companies like Vince and Wolverine worldwide. He launched the company
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: P one eight inspired by a meeting with Christine. She
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: told him Castle was a thriving business with a subscriber
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: base in the hundreds of thousands, proprietary technology, and reported
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: one point four billion dollars in like evaluation. So, after
• 31:03
  Speaker 3: Brendan formed the company and gave Castle a twenty five
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: percent stake in it, he noticed unauthorized fun transfers from
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: its bank accounts, including one point four million dollars and
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: five hundred thousand dollars was drawn in June of twenty
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: twenty four. Then nine hundred fifty thousand dollars and four
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: hundred fifty thousand dollars was drawn in July of twenty
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: twenty four, and two transfers totaling one point three million
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: dollars wired to Christine's personal account in January of twenty
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: twenty five. She was using the money to cover losses
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: and make it look like her company still had money
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: to spend. So the Brendan guy who came in and
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: he was the one who developed this P one eighty
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: inspired by Christine, he was like, Okay, I'm gonna give
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: you all this coin. We're gonna open his bank account.
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: Christine was like, thank you so much. This is salt wonderful, Brandon. Now,
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: don't you don't need to look at the bank accounts
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: no more? Because ma'am, what do you mean you took
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: one point You took one point four million dollars and
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: five one hundred thousand dollars in June. Then in July
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: of that same year, you took nine hundred fifty thousand
• 32:07
  Speaker 3: dollars and four hundred fifty thousand dollars you took. You
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: took all that money in two months and thought he
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: wasn't gonna notice.
• 32:14
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And then by.
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: January twenty twenty five year it took another one point
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: three million, and you just thought he wasn't gonna notice.
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: No, No, Like what Christine was bold as hell.
• 32:24
  Speaker 5: Well, it's less than she's been taking from everybody else, Like,
• 32:27
  Speaker 5: it's actually less. So it does seem like a little
• 32:29
  Speaker 5: bit to her.
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: That's true, because yeah, you're right in the grand scheme,
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: like three hundred and fifty million.
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: If I'm working with three hundred fifty million, then I'm
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: like one point four.
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: That's like a little that's like it's like fourteen.
• 32:41
  Speaker 4: It's like a change that falls in between the couch cushions.
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: It's really not that much.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you're not gonna notice one point four. No, you're
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: not gonna notice two pointson, you know what I mean. Like,
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: so this is the long process of her getting kicked out.
• 32:53
  Speaker 3: We're getting to her getting caught in her getting outs. Also,
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: can we just stop for a second and look at Brendan.
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: He was the one who created P one eighty.
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: Brendan.
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: He kind of gives me like rube vibes. Like remember,
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: Christine's got the poker face, right, yes, yes, this guy,
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: see he has the opposite of a poker face.
• 33:11
  Speaker 5: Yeah, he's definitely you know, he's got a lot of
• 33:14
  Speaker 5: people going, hey, you know what you're late for golf?
• 33:17
  Speaker 5: I thought you were going to meet me on the
• 33:18
  Speaker 5: golf course. He's got a lot of people like that
• 33:20
  Speaker 5: in his dams and on his phone.
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: He's got yeah, he's got like please like me face.
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: He's got like, yeah, I got money from Daddy and
• 33:29
  Speaker 3: I'm trying to be a big businessman and so I'm
• 33:33
  Speaker 3: in tech.
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: But like clearly not his gifts.
• 33:36
  Speaker 3: Like there's no way that I believe this man made
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: all his money on his own, Like he's not a bootstrapper,
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: Like he's trying to keep up with He's like the
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: he's like reminding me from like a was it who
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: is the brother in secession? The older one who kept
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: trying to run for president and shit, Oh yeah, yeah,
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: he's got that of just like he's spending Daddy's money
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: and trying to be a big successful man.
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: Oh what a rube.
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: So the long process of getting kicked out, So Christine
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: in late twenty twenty four, a money manager who worked
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: at Castle that worked for like an investor at Castle,
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: tried to double check the company's past audits and wasn't
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: able to not a four h four.
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: Clicked on the page and was like not found.
• 34:21
  Speaker 4: Oh.
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: He started asking more questions and brought it to the
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: company's board of directors. The board included John Hennessy, the
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: former president of Stanford University and a current director of
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: Google parent company Alphabet. Soon after, Hennessy quietly quit the
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: board and was replaced. So Hennessy is said, so I
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: ain't right. And there's nothing worse to a rich person
• 34:47
  Speaker 3: than realizing that they're not as smart as they thought
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: they were, and that you can get rich without necessarily
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: being the most highly intelligent person. So instead of Hennessy
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: being like, here's been stroll a lot of money.
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: Just money, he was like, I'm going to back to
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: Saint Barts. I go like to just blow the whistle
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: because he don't want to be ashamed.
• 35:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: So sometime during this transition, an investigation was launched and
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: Christine apparently admitted to the board which she had done.
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: She said, Okay, look I've been running at a little
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: little Ponzi, just like a tiny Charles, you know. And
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: so investors were never told about the board transition, the investigation,
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: or the fraud. So she told the board, Hey, this
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: is what I did. I've been stealing, I've been robbing,
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: and I've been you know, crying, and they're like, Okay,
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: let's keep this on their hush. Let's not tell any
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: of the investors. Honestly, I'm on board. We don't need
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: to warn Peter Teal. No, now we need Peter off
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: the planet.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So many of these board members did hear from Christine,
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: who somehow still had her job and was still asking
• 35:52
  Speaker 3: them for more money. So she was like, oh, what
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: is I still work here? Can I have some more money?
• 35:57
  Speaker 5: The audacity, it's really amazing. It's amazing, Like, what would.
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: You do in the situation if you're caught you say
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: I did it?
• 36:05
  Speaker 4: I would say at this point, I would say I did.
• 36:07
  Speaker 5: Look, I I made a mistake and I did it,
• 36:10
  Speaker 5: and what can I do to make it right? Instead
• 36:13
  Speaker 5: of oh, can I have some more money? Like that
• 36:15
  Speaker 5: is where you show your whiteness, Like that's really that's
• 36:18
  Speaker 5: mighty white of.
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: Her mighty white. Yeah, it's pretty palm going. But yeah,
• 36:23
  Speaker 3: so maybe she was trying to get that money to
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: make it right.
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: Maybe she was.
• 36:26
  Speaker 5: Still maybe maybe that's true, that's true, But how do
• 36:30
  Speaker 5: you make it right at that point like that?
• 36:31
  Speaker 4: I mean it's like, really, when are you.
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: Gonna come up with three hundred fifty? You need more
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: than that?
• 36:36
  Speaker 4: Actually yeah, yeah, I mean it's giving me.
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: Like a gambling mentality, you know, like when people lose
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: a lot of money that keeps.
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: Going to the ACM because they're like, I just had
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: a kid.
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: I know.
• 36:47
  Speaker 5: Maybe that's what got her into this, the the adrenaline
• 36:50
  Speaker 5: of like, okay, keeping it all like going, like keeping
• 36:54
  Speaker 5: the bruise going.
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: Because she had a successful company with Winnie Winnipu.
• 36:59
  Speaker 4: What did I She didn't know she had been successful.
• 37:03
  Speaker 5: And she sort of identifies as successful too, like that's
• 37:06
  Speaker 5: her identity, you know, And so that's why she thinks
• 37:09
  Speaker 5: that this is possible.
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: And I bet you being in those types of rooms
• 37:14
  Speaker 3: and like everyone's looking for their own type of currency
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: when it comes to power. So let's say you don't
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: have a lot of money, you can be very religious
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: and piety can give you power.
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: Let's say you're you also don't have a lot of money,
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: but you're very beautiful.
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: Being beautiful can give you tons of currency.
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: In this world, Let's say you kind of fugly, but
• 37:33
  Speaker 3: you own a fortune five hundred. You know, there's rooms
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: that you're gonna walk into and they're like, oh, chip, oh,
• 37:38
  Speaker 3: they're gonna ship all bay all.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: Back, you know.
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: Like so I feel like in the fashion industry, like
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: no shade. But she wasn't gonna be given all that.
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: That's why she was on the fashion for the behind.
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: The scenes people.
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: But in this world, like they don't care what you
• 37:54
  Speaker 3: look like. It's like, how much money do you have?
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: What's your you know dat? Racial, I don't know what
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: you're hy like?
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: These are their.
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: Turn onwards and so yeah, and you know another in
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: other lanes, it's like what are your follower accounts? And
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: that's your power those spaces. So I could see her
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: being addicted to.
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: That, of course, of course, but you know, so she
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: asked us for a woman stand bit.
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: Christine was forced to resign from Castle's board in December
• 38:17
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty four and formally resigned as chief executive in
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: March of twenty twenty five. That's when the company finally
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: told shareholders what was going on. I find it quite
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: interesting that they let her resign before they told the shareholders,
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: because it seems like Christine would be an excellent scapegoat
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: for all of this.
• 38:31
  Speaker 5: Right, Well, she used to blame for all of this.
• 38:33
  Speaker 5: I mean she you know, that's who should they should
• 38:35
  Speaker 5: bring in. I mean that's who they should blame because
• 38:37
  Speaker 5: it is her fault.
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but what does she have on them? Because I've
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: never seen men not throw a woman under the bus.
• 38:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that'll do it for that the fun Yeah, for sure,
• 38:46
  Speaker 4: for sure.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: Oh, I'll just I tripped the lady and threw under
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: the bus this morning.
• 38:49
  Speaker 3: Now I don't know her, and the just ah, No,
• 38:51
  Speaker 3: she was a lady, like God, can't they just.
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: Let her go like this?
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: So Castle filed for Chapter seven bankruptcy in June of
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty five, leaving investors with worthless shares. Oh look
• 39:03
  Speaker 3: at her, Oh looking shame that whatever she was doing,
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: all this crime really.
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: Sucked the life out of her. Because Christinea look like
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: she used to.
• 39:10
  Speaker 4: No, she doesn't look like a stock photo anymore.
• 39:13
  Speaker 5: No, she was all just yeah, sad, bummed, She looks stressed.
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: She look like she was stressed in every day. She looked.
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: She'd bite her nails in her sleep. She wake up screaming. Yes,
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: that's how she wake up everyone. I need some coffee.
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: It's just the norm.
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: So she's been charged with fraud, aggravated identity theft, and
• 39:36
  Speaker 3: false statements. If you don't know what aggravated identity theft is,
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: it's one of my favorite terms. It's like basically when like,
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: remember she forged some board member signatures and stuff, right,
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: that's the aggravated identity theft.
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: And so she was released.
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: On a million dollars bail after pleading not guilty to
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: scamming investors out of three hundred million dollars in what
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: would be one of the biggest startup frauds of all time.
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: As a condition of her bail, well, she is not
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: allowed to contact any former employees or investors. Now they
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: do say any former They didn't say she couldn't start
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: up a new tech company, did she?
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: I don't know? That is That is as much as
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: we have so far.
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: This is an ongoing case. So she has not been
• 40:17
  Speaker 3: sentenced or charged. You know, Okay, she's been calling charge.
• 40:20
  Speaker 3: She hasn't been sentenced rything yet, So she's currently out
• 40:23
  Speaker 3: on bail and I don't know what she's doing. They
• 40:24
  Speaker 3: should have said, sh she can't have no access to
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: Wi Fi because clearly the internet is well just laid
• 40:28
  Speaker 3: against in trouble.
• 40:30
  Speaker 4: Right right. I don't know. I wonder what happens, Like,
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: you know, she gonna go to prison.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: We'll see.
• 40:35
  Speaker 3: I mean, honestly, I don't want her to go to
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: prison just because of the people that she stole from.
• 40:43
  Speaker 4: Peter Tielken's Yeah, who cares.
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: Employees, the furloughed and princes. I feel bad for them.
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: I hope they got a good little cute little check
• 40:51
  Speaker 3: while they could. But everybody else, Yeah, then get in
• 40:54
  Speaker 3: the bin.
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: Where would you rate the scam as far as like
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: ethical unethical?
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: Do you like Christine?
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: I kind of like her. I kind of like her.
• 41:03
  Speaker 4: I like her the same way that I like Elizabeth.
• 41:06
  Speaker 5: Holmes, Like I'm like, you know what, the amount of lying,
• 41:11
  Speaker 5: you know, the people you're getting money from, all those things,
• 41:14
  Speaker 5: Like I agree with the people that she's ripping off, Like, yeah,
• 41:17
  Speaker 5: they deserve it.
• 41:18
  Speaker 4: And also.
• 41:21
  Speaker 5: You know, it is the the sheer audacity is kind
• 41:23
  Speaker 5: of a wonder, Like it's just It's pretty amazing how
• 41:27
  Speaker 5: much we'll uh empower the liars because we want to believe,
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: you know, we just are.
• 41:35
  Speaker 4: We have an addiction to believing, you.
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: Know, we really do.
• 41:38
  Speaker 3: I Mean, the one thing I will say about Eizabeth
• 41:40
  Speaker 3: Holmes is this was buried a lot, is that she
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: did try to run some of those like tiny thing
• 41:43
  Speaker 3: blood tests on real cancer patients, and that's me was
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: so fucked up. And they did not get new justice
• 41:47
  Speaker 3: or any money. So that's the only reason that I'm like,
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: fuck her. But everything else you do with the investors
• 41:52
  Speaker 3: and the Black Turtle next, I'm like, right, House is
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: like that's.
• 41:57
  Speaker 5: Fun Yeah, she totally hate that. It's really funny. Like
• 42:01
  Speaker 5: it's like, yeah, that's totally fine.
• 42:03
  Speaker 3: But seeing that people want to believe, I think that
• 42:04
  Speaker 3: is so beautiful because I see that every single day.
• 42:08
  Speaker 3: It's like, we form these parasocial relationships. And I joke
• 42:11
  Speaker 3: about that all the time with this podcast because I
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: want you to form a pa of social relationship.
• 42:14
  Speaker 4: Me.
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: Now, I'm sure about my house, I'm gone, you know, yeah,
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: but we.
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: Could be besties on the phone, Like we can chat
• 42:21
  Speaker 3: while you're on your drive. What I'm talking about right now, Girl, Yeah,
• 42:24
  Speaker 3: traffic is crazy right now.
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: I in it.
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: Oh, I know, I know, what's your baby knowing one
• 42:29
  Speaker 3: put the podcast on the one room for the baby
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: to listen to, and they put it on another rooms
• 42:32
  Speaker 3: like there's most streams.
• 42:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's so cute.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: That's cute. That kind of thing, I understand. But I'm
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: very honest about it.
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: But I feel like with celebrities and celebrity culture, we
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: get to this place where we have invested kind of
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: a little bit of our personalities into these people, and
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: so when they start doing something that is inappropriate or wrong,
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: it's very hard for us to believe it. I mean
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: in business, especially, like you can say the same thing.
• 42:56
  Speaker 3: It's like, I want to believe that this is going
• 42:58
  Speaker 3: to be the next big company. I want to believe
• 43:00
  Speaker 3: that I'm invested in the next bigcoin. I want to
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: believe that I'm on the ground floor of something because
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: I want to, you know, have that success.
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: So yeah, I'm gonna say, Christine, girl, all.
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: Your side, and I know you were indicted and we're waiting.
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: We're waiting for this trial because I need to see
• 43:17
  Speaker 3: but I'm praying for you. I hope that you don't
• 43:19
  Speaker 3: have to go to a white collar jail because I
• 43:22
  Speaker 3: don't want to see you in there to play tennis
• 43:24
  Speaker 3: with Lizzie. I want to see you free just because
• 43:26
  Speaker 3: you scam Peter Cheele like, I don't know that's Robinhood.
• 43:29
  Speaker 5: And that Yeah, I think that is Robin Hood. Yeah,
• 43:31
  Speaker 5: good for her, good for her?
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: Yes, all right, Well we always ask at the end
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: of this podcast, Margaret, where would you like people to
• 43:39
  Speaker 3: find you?
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: Social media? Obviously your tour, like, let the girls.
• 43:42
  Speaker 4: Know people can find me.
• 43:45
  Speaker 5: I'm on tour and you can get tickets on Margaret
• 43:47
  Speaker 5: Show dot com. I'm on Instagram at Margaret Underscore Show,
• 43:51
  Speaker 5: and I'm on TikTok at the Margaret Show.
• 43:54
  Speaker 3: Yes, and y'all, I'm also going on tour with Live Nations,
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: so you can get those six some Live Nation dot
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: Com at Scam Goddess starting in the spring. And then yeah,
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: watch my TV show Scam I salon Hulu right now, y'all.
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: And then the book Scam got It. You can get
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: it on audio, you can get a paper or hardcover.
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: And then that's where I be plugging everything going Dutch.
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, on Fox.
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: You can watch that Thursdays, nine thirty U Pacific.
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: I should know these things.
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: But yeah, going Dutch on Fox where I also kind
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: of play with cameras, So get into the things in congregation.
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: I want you to get out there and I want
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: you to stay. Don't stop, Christina, Okay, hold on to
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: that scheming.
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Beautiful.
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: Bank Goddess, bang Fried, fuck Peter two, Scam Goddess, Scam
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: got his Stars and it's hosted by me Lacy Mosley
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: aka Scam Goddess.
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: Our producer is Jessica sis Neros, and our audio engineer
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: is Rich Garcia.
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: Research for the show is conducted by Kate Doyle Stay
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: schemin