Latest / Homestead And Heal Podcast / Ep 2: The Truth About Nourishment, Burnout & Women’s Health with Amber Magnolia Hill

Transcript

Ep 2: The Truth About Nourishment, Burnout & Women’s Health with Amber Magnolia Hill · Homestead And Heal Podcast

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Homestead and Heal.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Scott.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm Lindsay, and we live with our three children on a farm in Vermont.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: Our lives revolve around growing food and medicine, working with the body, and trying every day to live in deeper relationship with the earth.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: And now we're welcoming guests to our farm for intimate retreats where they can slow down and feel deeply into this earth-body connection.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: This podcast is about remembering something many of us have forgotten: that we're not separate from the natural world.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Our bodies are part of it.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: Our healing comes through it.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: And when we reconnect to both, our purpose often begins to reveal itself.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: Through conversations with herbalists, farmers, body workers, and people walking unconventional paths, we explore what it looks like to step outside the modern paradigm and build lives rooted in connection, healing, and reciprocity with the earth.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: So welcome, Amber.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: We're so excited to have you on the podcast today.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_02: I'm happy to see both your faces.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm a big fan and have been for a long time.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: And talking on Zoom, these sorts of things is still a little bit foreign for me.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: I'm always curious about the place where the person I'm talking to.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's it is, I appreciate this technology of being able to see you and talk to you.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: It is still a little odd for me, the whole internet relationships thing.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm just always curious where people are actually.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'd love to hear a little bit about what it's like where you live today, where you're calling in from.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: I'm in Nevada City, which is in Northern California.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's a rural county, gold rush history.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_02: Home to the Nissan people and the beautiful Yba River flowing through it.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's about two hours from where I grew up in South Lake Tahoe, California.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_02: So my whole life, people have assumed I'm from Nevada because first I lived in Tahoe.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_02: Now I live in Nevada City.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_02: But they're both to California.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_02: Unfortunately for me as a small business owner paying taxes.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm in my oldest daughter's bedroom right now.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: She moved away.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_02: She's 19 six months ago.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I put a curtain up, kept her mirror where it was, put this plant behind me.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_02: And so I use her room now, which is great.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_02: Although she's moving home in two weeks.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: So we're gonna have to figure a new situation out.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_02: And it's a beautiful sunny day here after quite a bit of rain.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I have a gorgeous view of a million pine and oak trees out my window.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: And anything else happening seasonally that has you excited for spring or well, yeah, spring is the best.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: Let's see, we have star jasmine in bloom and the last lilac just died.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_02: Oh we had mandarin blossom, so we had all three of those scents available to us for a couple weeks there.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_02: But the regular jasmine will bloom soon, it's budding.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: And that sounds so exotic and amazing.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: We got really lucky buying this house.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_02: We could tell right away that it had been stewarded by people who loved plants and just thought about earth tending in a really good way.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_02: So the house itself is surrounded by pollinator plants.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's awesome.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_02: That we didn't have to put in.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_02: So my husband was able to just focus on putting in our medicine gardens when we moved in.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_02: So it's yeah, it's so nice.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_02: And I found them on Facebook and thanked them, and we had a lovely conversation.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: That's amazing.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: Sounds beautiful.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: Our lilacs are they're like just budding out.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: The little tiny flower budlets are just appearing yesterday.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: So we're pretty significantly behind in our spring, but it is exciting right now.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: And in our house, we have four, even more than that, but four really massive lilacs and it's very exciting.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: Ancient lilacs in front of the house.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_02: That is exciting.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_02: And we had four at our last place that were huge and abundant, and just the butterflies.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_02: It was crazy how the butterflies would go off.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's just I love drinking lilac water and just yeah, just having them, having that scent around is really special.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_02: We had a really weird spring here.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: It got really hot.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_02: It was like the hottest March on record.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, wow.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_02: So things bloomed really early and then it got cold again.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_02: There was even a frost.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: Our friends lost their blueberries.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_02: They're farmers.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_02: So it was like a part of their income.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: So everything's just been weird this spring here.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's such an interesting.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: I would that sort of thing happens around here too, like when the apple trees or whatever are in blossom before it's gotten warm or when we get another then cold snap.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: And it is an interesting thing to be connected to the earth and to earth-based businesses and see how much the weather can affect things.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like some people just don't have any concept of that.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: But that is the case for us here too.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for introducing your place.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_01: And now we would love to introduce you and just mention how we found you and then have you introduce yourself.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: But I think for me, we were introduced to us by one of our former farm apprentices.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: And she just basically was like, you've got to listen to this podcast.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: It's amazing.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, we've become both very devoted listeners.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_01: I would say Scott, even more than me, just because I don't really listen to podcasts very often anymore.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_01: I just don't feel like I have the space.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: I'm often driving with a small child in the car listening to the farmer and the Dell on repeat.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: And Scott has much more time to just listen to something.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: You want to say anything about?
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's just it's a format that works for me.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: I can be out doing farm work and I have my phone in my pocket and listen to podcasts.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I've thought about that a lot.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: You've spent a lot of time with me on the farm, like listening to all these really amazing conversations and new ideas and things out on our place.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I feel like you're, to me, you're you're famous.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: I'm excited to he's fangirling, if that's a word you can use.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's not a word that I will use.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'll laugh.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_02: Wait, Scott, I have to ask because the the the podcast subject lately, I've been focusing a lot on women's health and midlife women's health.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_02: And is that still resonating for you?
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it is.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Most of my expertise is as a farmer and a grower.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what I feel most confident in doing.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: But I've been, I'm an aspiring herbalist.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: I have been studying for years now.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I think early on, when so I got into your podcast, I was really loving it.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: And then there would be like these very specifically, even early on, sometimes you'd have uh women's health particular sort of episode.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I I feel like maybe Lindsay heard me listening to one one time that was like, I forget what this is.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: Probably cycle health or something like that.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, it occurred to me, I'm like, is this appropriate for me to listen to?
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_00: And what I realized is that it's just if I'm if I am aspiring to help people with a holistic approach, then certainly I should be informed about what's going on in women's health.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: Lindsay's work is she works on men and women, but is has a focus on women's health.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I find all the conversations fascinating.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I have Hashimoto's diagnosis.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I do a lot of domestic stuff.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_00: I relate to a lot of the subject matter, even though I'm not female.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, it's still totally relevant.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: I I'm so interested in all of the metabolic health stuff because that's my interest in farming too.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: It gets down to the same things.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's like those elemental pieces of when we're talking about farming, it's microbiome energy transfer in the soil ecosystem.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: But that's born out of that, is all of the rest of what you've been talking a lot about nutrition and metabolic health.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so yeah, I find it all super fascinating.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: Still, it's still relevant.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: You've joked on your show that you have 12 male listeners, and that's it.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: I bet you have more than that, but maybe not.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: So we'd love for you to just mention who you are, what your work is in the world, and and just anything that feels really alive and exciting in your work right now.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I lived in Northern California pretty much my entire life, had a really mainstream 80s and 90s childhood, watching TV and eating processed food and engaging a lot with mainstream medicine and pharmaceuticals that had a real negative impact on my health.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_02: I'm at a place now at 45 where I'm really looking back and seeing the big picture of my life, and that I think I was born to a hypothyroid mom.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: I think I was born in somewhat of a state of burnout.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: And then my younger sister, two years later, definitely was.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: By my teens and the 90s, I just was really feeling like there's got to be more than this life that I've been living.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: I I yearned for connection with nature.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think I even articulated it at that time, but I didn't like the culture.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: So I just started shopping at the co-op when I lived in Sacramento.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: And then I got a job there in the wellness department and learned a lot about herbalism.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: That was my introduction to herbalism, is when I met my herb teacher, Cami McBride.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: And it's when I started becoming aware of food and farming issues and ideas around organics and things like that.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_02: And there were a lot of pieces missing for me at that time.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_02: I was vegetarian and vegan, went through my first pregnancy as a vegan, and basically ended up here in Nevada City almost 20 years ago now.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: Really love it here, and continued pursuing herbalism and herbal studies.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_02: Luckily, there's a lot of people like that up here.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's this community is thick with people interested in natural healing and really gifted, wonderful healers, and a ton of small farms, organic farms, and herbalists.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I was mostly making herbal body oils.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: That was been my main form and main interest of herbalism since I first studied with Cammy way back 20 years ago.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_02: And in 2012, I started listing them on Etsy, and then that slowly grew into mythic medicine, which when I got together with my husband, he joined me.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_02: And he was this amazing grower and gardener, which I did not know at first.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_02: And we were just already so into each other and then just amazed when we realized that our talents overlapped and really complemented each other.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: So over the years we now run the business.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's the two of us.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_02: We each have our roles.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_02: And then, yeah, three years ago at age 42, I experienced a total metabolic meltdown, complete energy crash.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_02: My body and the way I felt in my body and the energy I had available to me to meet my life just went over a cliff overnight.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, now I see all the things that led up to it.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_02: Again, going back to like my mother being hypothyroid when I was growing inside of her.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_02: And so I've slowly crawled out of that hole and learned a lot in that time.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I've been doing my podcast medicine stories since 2017.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: Loved having Lindsay as a guest a few years ago.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: And so I was always focused on like herbalism and earth connection and ancestral connection in the first years of the podcast.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: And those are all still there.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_02: And I'll focus more on those as time comes.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: But the last 10 or so episodes have really been like women's metabolic wellness and minerals and nutrition and eating enough, which turns out is the foundation.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: Totally.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: And just so needed all of that, I think, in the world, too.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: That conversation just seems like it's really present for people and really needed.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I love that.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: And an interesting unraveling evolution of those things.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: You saw something that excited you in the natural food store and in that sort of scene that was different from the over culture or whatever was more largely going on and followed that out.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: It sounds like your path was like you had that feeling of yearning, maybe for more earth connection as a kid or teenager?
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_01: Teenager, I'd say.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: Not really, not too strongly, like some people do.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: I think part of it, maybe that I don't know if this is an excuse, but there's snow on the ground nine months of the year up there.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_02: So we weren't spending a ton of time outside.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_02: I also think that because I was, I was like a low energy kid.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_02: I see that now.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_02: I spent a lot of time inside.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: I remember my grandma saying, Why do you always want to be inside on the couch when your sister and cousins are going outside to play?
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_02: I do remember like playing with dandelions in the yard.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: I remember little brown mushrooms coming up in the yard and just singing to them.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I would I would sing actually to flowers quite a bit because we have a lot of home videos from when I was like three or four.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_02: So there's a lot of me singing to flowers.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_02: So I guess there's that.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: But you really feel like it was your kind of energy state that dictated that disconnection, which is super interesting.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I wonder like how present that is for so many people.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, totally.
• 13:42
  unknown: Yeah.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_02: I was sick a lot too.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_02: I had a ton of ear infections.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: So just inside, like in pain, wondering why this is happening to me.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_02: But when I started studying herbalism in my early 20s, I remember, because that was like in the central valley of California where so much grows.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember thinking, that's too bad.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_02: Nothing grows in Tahoe except Jeffrey Pine trees.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_02: But then I went home that summer and I was like, oh my God, no, like all my friends are here, mugwort and yarrow and coyote mint and all these things that I didn't notice as a kid.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I can totally relate to that because I spent my high school and college years around Seattle and was so disconnected during those years.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I just know so little of the plants there.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: And same with growing up in Kansas, I feel for me, it was like I had like Earth Connection, then like long stretch of time without it, and then found it again.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: And for Scott, it was always present.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: And that's something we're exploring on the show is what are those threads of for some people, the first person we interviewed, it was like that that was present the whole time.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've had this curiosity like, what is the thing that disconnects us or has us more disconnected?
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I can see sounds like for you that the energy state and just like general health, it's so interesting, right?
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's not that feeling that earth connection can always just heal us, but like when we're unwell, we can't really connect in the same way to our environment to the earth, I feel like.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it's really interesting to me.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, being in a low energy state, you can't connect in general, yeah.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: You know, with other people as well.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_02: It's harder to open yourself to things and experiences.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: And then layering on top of that a snowy, cold place for nine months of the year.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: That's like its own piece of like high energy demand of being able to be out to enjoy the snowy.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: I'm the same, like I've spent most of my life here.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: I've lived other places.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: I did live in Northern California just for a year.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: I went to Humboldt State in 2003, two, 2003, 2004.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: And that part of the world is just so gorgeous and beautiful.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: I've barely been to Itaho, but I have been through there a little bit, and it just seems so gorgeous.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: But I haven't been there in the deep of the winter.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: But living here, I get it, it's discouraging by the time spring rolls around here.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's like we're so ready for it.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: And and I think, yeah, if you're in a low energy state, it can be hard to want to be out there in the winter weather.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: But you had enough drive within you that you had this yearning for that connection.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: So even though you were in that, yeah, 80s, 90s, mainstream watching TV, that was like a lot of my childhood too.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: Do you remember any moments that had you just like feeling that yearning?
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like that, obviously, like the natural food store, but anything before that just had you realizing like there must be more than this?
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: I think it was a big psilocybin experience that I had at 16.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_02: It was just like one moment.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_02: And it wasn't necessarily like the next day, I was like, nature, man.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_02: But that opened me up to, I don't know, like the more real human part of myself is I think the best way I can describe it.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: It that wasn't the turning point after which I was like, oh, this culture is super weird and it's not healthy and it's not feeding me in any way.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_02: So what can I find?
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: And then I just slowly made my way to these things like in my late teens, early twenties.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: And how about like with your like your parents or ancestors?
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: Do you know much about like their connection to the earth and how they related to the earth and or their bodies?
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: I know you've talked about your mom's relationship to her body.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder for like your dad or any ancestors beyond them.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: I cannot earth in any way.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, except that my dad was really good with houseplants.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: We have at least one of his in our home now that is that has been in my life since the 80s.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_02: And he would he planted flowers outside our house, and we lived on a road that a lot of people would drive by, so people would comment on my dad's flowers all the time.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's something.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_02: That is something.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_00: Totally something.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, they were like in pots and planters.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: He never put anything in the ground.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_02: And I never knew anyone who grew food in Tahoe until like in the last 10 years, I met someone who does.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_02: So there's not a lot of that happening there either.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't know anyone growing food until my 20s.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: No, I can't think of any experience of my mom's at all, though, or recall one.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder what one of the things I noticed for me with my own story was my dad having more earth connection, my mom having similar to how you've described your mom, maybe relationship to her body, but like maybe a little more openness or connection to her body than to the earth.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm fascinated about that too.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_01: Do you remember like relating to your body?
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_01: I know you said you were sick a lot.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_01: Do you remember hearing your parents talking much about their bodies?
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: Or do you remember relating to your body in other ways beyond that being sick often?
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_02: I don't remember my dad ever talking about his body at all, even when his body was completely falling apart the last 10 years of his life.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_02: He never, it was like he God, that's so interesting to realize right now.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_02: Was he even there?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_02: Was he even in it?
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, my mom, the only things that she talked about with her body, and this wasn't all the time, it wasn't like an ongoing diatribe from her mouth or anything, but just over the 18 years I lived with her, she was definitely unhappy with her body and thought she was too fat, even when she absolutely was not overweight at all.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_02: So she had a lot of food fear and we had no food culture in our house growing up.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_02: I think because of that, she was just so afraid of food.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_02: So it was nothing but processed food.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I was really disconnected from my body from a really young age, too.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I think the ear infections might have something to do with it.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: So painful.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_02: And now realizing that my dad was like that, and I definitely have the same intellectual leanings that he does.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: We're both just very cerebral people.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that as my intellect grew stronger, is that's what I fed as I got older.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_02: Except when I was about 17, I started having a lot of body pain, a lot of pain in my back, constantly seeking help and healing with that.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_02: And it only got better once I started remineralizing a couple years ago.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: I think it was calcium more than anything.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's an interplay of minerals, but I think I was really calcium deficient from a really young age and therefore was in almost constant pain for about 25 years.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: Pulling me even further out of my body, right?
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: Do you know anything about your grandparents or the lineage, your ancestors beyond your parents of their relationship with your yeah.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_02: No, I I know so much about them, and I knew all four of my grandparents and four of my great-grandparents.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_02: But I don't know.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_01: I can't Yeah, I guess I'm specifically wondering, and I don't have great memories of childhood, but I'm wondering, do you remember you know, any times you connected with them, with the earth, or with their body or your body?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_01: Just those threads, the ancestral threads, or just yeah, their relationship to those things.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, not at all.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_02: My grandma had a rose garden.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_02: That was lovely.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: But they were paying someone to maintain it by the time I was like old enough to be paying attention because they were pretty old at that point.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: They they would spend summers in Crescent City, Northern California coast.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_02: So we would go and pick raspberries and blackberries with my grandma so she could make jam and go deep sea fishing with my grandpa to get salmon and other fish that they would can.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_02: That's the earthiest, that's the earthiest thing that anyone in my immediate ancestry did.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: And then, of course, one more generation back from that, they they were all farmers, like most people were during that period.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: They were too far removed from me to have experienced them in that way.
• 22:04
  unknown: Yeah.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's just interesting.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_01: Scott has lineage so far back here in Vermont.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_01: And everyone, for the most part, had some sort of earth connection, whether it's like his dad as a hunter, his grandfather as a gardener, and those sorts of things.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't really know as much about my grandparents and further back lineage, but I can think of similar things like my grandmother having flowers that she really loved.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: And it's interesting to think about.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_01: For me, it's interesting to think of what are these little threads.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: We just know that the overculture is at some point it's like not that cool to be a farmer and you want to make more money and you want your body to look a certain way.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: And suddenly it's just like disconnection.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: I how many generations back is it, Scott, that your family's been in Vermont?
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um my kids are the seventh generation right here where we live.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: My pure maternal and pure paternal lines are my kids are seventh generation.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's like a lot of marrying in like later generations.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: So like an Italian family where my great-great, what is it?
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: Great-great-grandfather came and grandmother came.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_00: And then like their daughter married an Italian immigrant who came, and then like their son married.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: So it was like these Italian immigrants like marrying in like over generations sort of thing.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: That sticks with me that you've been there for so long.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: I've thought about that every now and then.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I also think about my parents were the first two people in my family to be born in California.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: Their parents were born here.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_02: And then I can trace all those lineages back, and I have.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_02: I've been doing genealogy for about 15 years now.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think about like the uprooting that's happening as my ancestors on all sides are coming farther and farther west over the years.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_02: And then by the time my parents are born, it's the baby boom time.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_02: And this is the time when people are really wanting to throw off the old ways.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_02: And when all these new kitchen implements are coming out on the market, and recipes for housewives of the 50s are just like how to do as little cooking as possible.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_02: And so every everyone that my my two grandmas really absorbed all that, and then my mom did as well.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_02: And by the time it got to me, there was literally no food culture left at all.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_02: And all we ate was processed food.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's interesting to me.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's like ending up in being in California, people who ended up during your grandparents', great-grandparents' generations, there was such a severe uprooting that had most people land there.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like the Dust Bowl and things that people were had some root were beginning to build roots in these places all over America and like quickly, violently were like pushed to look for opportunity further west.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: And so when those modern sort of conveniences came in, it seems like a kind of no-brainer that people would be quick to adopt that sort of thing because it was this like the allure of like convenience and ease.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: And their parents or their grandparents had like perhaps really hard lives being pushed off of their place and trying to find this new opportunity that often wasn't there except for anybody but the owners of these like giant operations.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, that all seems just really interesting.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I feel like for me, just having I just went to visit my brother in Austin, Texas, and it was like 30-minute Amazon deliveries and self-driving cars and stuff that I was like, whoa, holy shit, like Vermont is so far behind the time.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: But I think a lot about that uprooting within my own family too, because there my family went back a couple of generations in a few generations in Kansas where I was born, but I don't have any of that sense of rootedness that Scott has.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: And my mom's lineage was really all over the place.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like my grandmother on my maternal side was born in Montana, but then moved to Alaska.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_01: My mom was born in Alaska, I was born in Kansas.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_01: It was like big moves.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I think about it with the fascia and just the resonance that our bodies, like the waters of our bodies, feel with different land.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I've noticed that ancestrally, like mentioning that connection with England and just the certain sort of resonance I feel there.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: I do wonder if it's like my fascia and this connection to some part of my lineage.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: But for our kids, like they're just so seemingly rooted here, being this many generations in, at least on Scott's side.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I have nothing like that in my family.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's just interesting.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder for you, I don't know, do you have anything you wanted to go ahead?
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: You're you're deep in thought.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_01: I'm wondering when you had those initial co-op sort of experiences, if you have any specific stories or memories that you can think of where your mind was blown at this new way of living, if that makes any sense.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_02: I think it was the class I took with Cammy McBride during, it was just one class.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_02: It was like two hours.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_02: The co-op had this learning space right across the street from it.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_02: Anyone's listening who's familiar with the co-op now, this was the old building that it was in.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, one day I just saw the flyer up for make your own herbal body products and herbal oils.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, yeah.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: At that point, I just wanted to take everything in.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_02: And feeling the feel of an herbal body oil on my body during that two-hour class was just like, oh, this is everything.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_02: This is nothing I've never I've ever felt before.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_02: And it's so simple.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_02: You just put an herb and some oil and let time extract the medicine.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_02: And so that was my that was my introduction to herbal medicine making too.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: And be like, oh, people can just do this.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_02: This is available to us.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_02: Now that might sound silly, but even like when I first moved up here a year later, no one in Tahoe growing up made music or art.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_02: We just drank, we just partied.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_02: And when I got up here, my partner, his high school friends were all making music and art and had been throughout their entire high school.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_02: There's really creative culture in Nevada City.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, oh, oh yeah.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_02: Music is made by real humans.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's not just something that comes to me like packaged.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_02: This Eudora Welty, the old Southern author, she has this story of being a kid and realizing that books were written by actual people and didn't just come pre-formed, like from the heavens.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_02: And so it felt like that, being like, I can just make money.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_02: I'd never seen anyone do it before.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: I thought medicine was like the pill bottles that came from a shelf.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_02: So that to me was the beginning of the rest of my life.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: That's cool.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: Because and partially because did you find Cammy and what she was teaching and who she was to be like as inspiring?
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_00: Or was it really the feeling of wow, this stuff is so effective?
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: Great question.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, Cammy embodied this like earth mother that I did not have in my life growing up.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: And she was kind and wise and could answer any question.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_02: And it was just like a local regional legend because she had already been teaching for about 20 years at that point.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, and I wanted to be her.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_02: And I didn't know that I would get pregnant that year.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_02: I got pregnant a few months after that, actually.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_02: But I always knew I wanted to be a mom.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_02: I couldn't wait to have kids.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_02: So I really wanted to be the kind of mom who had that knowledge and could take care of those things for my kids.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_02: Unlike my own dear mother, who every time I had an ear infection took me back to the same pediatrician who gave me the amoxicillin again, and that went over and over and over and over and over.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: And neither her nor the pediatrician ever said, maybe we should try something different.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: And we, she and I did talk about that at one point before her death.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_02: And she's like, Yeah, I really because part of me did know that this isn't the right way to do this for you.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_02: But every time I took you back to the doctor, he assured me and he calmed me and he made me feel like I'm the expert, I know what I'm doing here.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_02: So I don't think that was conscious for me.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_02: But now looking back, I'm like, oh, I wanted to make sure that I could actually help my children.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_02: Whatever issues came up during their childhoods.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: I can relate to that piece.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: I wanted to ask you earlier if you were like treated with an antibiotics a lot for the ear infections.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mine was strep throat, and my mom was actually my mom was a nurse who worked at the hospital when I was really little and then worked as a school nurse and then did other work, like case management work for folks with disabilities later.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: And she liked that work better.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: But she was in nursing school in the 70s, and like when we got sick, that was just what you did was like go and get the antibiotic, whether it was viral or whatever it was.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: And she's come a long way.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_00: She's been open to being influenced by our philosophy of how we deal with our kids and our health and that sort of thing, which is inspiring to me.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: But I wonder, and it was amoxicillin.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_00: I had amoxicillin all the time as a kid for many years, eventually got my tonsils out, and I think that sort of cleared up the problem, Sam.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: But then, of course, it's another pretty heavy intervention that was pretty traumatic too, so painful.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_01: You also, even though your mom cooked a lot from scratch, she's the type of mom that wants everyone to be happy and so Uncomfortable.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: Uncomfortable.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: She says that Scott lived on cheese puffs and hot dogs.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_01: Is that right?
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, when I was very little.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_01: So even though she had the skills to cook and the knowledge, that was also an aspect of it.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for sure.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: I remember getting milkshakes, like sugary milkshakes when I was sick, because it was like help me feel better.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: And that was like the medicine that the immediate medicine that she wanted to provide was like comfort.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I just those sorts of things are interesting.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_00: I asked you the question about Cammy and being inspired by that because it's just like you mentioned a psilocybin experience.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_00: But a lot of teenagers have that sort of experience and don't then lean into a yearning for nature.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_00: Or maybe a lot do, I don't know.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_00: Probably they do.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, just always curious what inspired you to then see someone like Cami and be like so inspired by her and have that allow that to change the trajectory of your life is an interesting sort of question to me.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a great question because I hadn't thought it was definitely more like her resonance than the actual medicine making itself.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_02: And I was 24 and still figuring out who I was and who I wanted to be.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, I think now about these young girls who like Kardashians are their role models, and it's like I'm glad it was Cami for me.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, totally.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_01: And just that possibility that she opened up just by being an embodied earthy mama.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder, do you feel like when I hear you talk and when I think about Scott's story and my story too, I think about the different ways we were nourished by either our parents, our mothers, the earth.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: You both have relationships with your moms where you felt like very loved and cared for.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like when I've heard you talk about your mom, you had that really deep relationship with her.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_01: And yet there was this medical intervention that was a challenge.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so I wonder like when you started to discover the herbal body oiling and bring in more of that earth connection, do you feel like that's what got you from that point to being 42 or however old you were when you had that health crash?
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_01: Is that what kept you afloat all those years, even though you were still in pain?
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I just wonder how much that earth connection was really so key in nourishing you.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_02: I think it helped, but I would actually say that I think my mom's love was a much bigger, yeah, played a much bigger role in keeping me afloat for all that to even after she died 10 years ago.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_02: Again, as you get into middle age and you can really look back on your life in a new way, I'm like, oh, yeah, there were all those things, but I was totally held in a field of love my entire childhood from both my parents, but mostly my mom, and then also my grandparents.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_02: And that that just gives you to not have childhood trauma gives you such a solid foundation, and I think that has carried me through in ways I never understood until all those people were gone and until I was a mother myself.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, that's a good question.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_02: I do think about that.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_02: I don't even though I wasn't in that total crash day that I entered three years ago where I had to spend most of the day in bed, I could barely function in my life.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_02: I was functioning a lot lower than I could have been, and a lot lower than most people.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_02: I just thought I'm really sensitive.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just not very movement oriented.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just a really still, calm, observant person.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_02: And then looking back now, I'm like, no, that actually was abnormal.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_02: And it wasn't just my innate personality.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_02: It was the adaptation that I had been in for so many decades.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_01: Do you find yourself just interacting with the environment in a really different way now with your energy building?
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_02: No, because I and maybe I will as it continues to build, but I think the main way that I've always interacted with nature and experienced nature is awe.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_02: And that never left me.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_02: That never, even in the depths of it, I could always find, especially this time of year, especially spring.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_02: Just that magic.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's the only like is that an ancestral connection.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_02: Earth connection, ancestral connection.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_02: It's like the feeling is one of magic.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_02: But when I try to dig down into what that actually is, because I'm not talking about supernatural magic, it's just awe.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_00: I can relate to that so much.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: That's the most amazing medicine for me is awe of nature.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_00: And of ancestors.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_00: And your podcast was the first time I heard my mom grew up really close with her family and her grandparents and their way of life to some extent.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like there was always this specialness around as kids, her and her cousins would go and they'd have Sunday, Sunday like dinner or whatever.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_00: It was a thing that like they're extended.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_00: Every Sunday.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_00: Every Sunday for her whole life growing up on the farm.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: And she just always like, I could just see that it was always this thing when she would talk about stories from then.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_00: It was special to her.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_00: And her aunts would all fight like crazy.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's like the four Italian sisters, they would fight like crazy.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it was always this thing.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_00: And my grandmother has passed, and one of her sisters, but two of them are still living, and they still fight with the nieces and each other and all this.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_00: But just this like really rich, intact sort of culture.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_01: Around awe.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: I lost me treatment of that entirely.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_00: But just yeah, so hearing about people like that, there's like these practices of ancestral medicine or that other people care about this stuff was so refreshing for me to hear.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: But I feel like that is for me like the most important medicine and one that comes really easily to me as being in awe of nature, being able to be out there, especially once it's like not winter, more so even.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_00: But I guess, yeah, part of the reason we were excited to have you on here is I think what you're sharing out in the world in the podcast is like one, really brave.
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_00: You don't shy away from, or you don't seem to anyway, shy away from subjects that like can be like somewhat controversial.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_00: And but just you approach it with so much, I feel like rootedness, like honesty and speaking to the nuance that it seems like from afar that you must have an intact relationship with the natural world and with yourself in your body.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because to be able to share your voice so openly, I think is such a such such an amazing gift that I know I personally struggle with more, like getting my voice out there in general.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_00: I often feel like maybe I don't have much to say that is of interest to the rest of the world.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_02: Which is what I said to you guys before we press record, and that's how I feel all the time.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_02: I think maybe you're like me, Scott, and that I can do that on the podcast because I'm in conversation with someone else.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's like I whatever is in me can be pulled out in that way.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_02: Where, like you say, using my voice.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I feel like I don't do that because I don't do it on social media is how I'm framing it.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_02: I cannot bring myself to Lindsay.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_02: You're so good on social media, and you actually you come through and your heart comes through, and I am like, I love this woman so much.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess I used to be able to do that, but the way it's changed now, I just that is not that doesn't feel like a safe place for me to share.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_01: But let's also talk about the fact, sorry to interrupt, let's talk about the fact that you are bringing up super controversial topics of whatever, all sorts of things, gender, probably veganism feels controversial or doing these things in a low energy state.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_01: That's big space to hold for the energy of the world.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_01: If we really think of everything being energy and you're introducing these concepts to people and starting conversations around the world, around these topics, and you're in a low energy state in your body, that's huge.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_01: That's big, I think.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I it's funny too, because I would say, no, I really shy away from controversial topics.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because of course, there are so many more like I could talk about that, of course, I have opinions about that I just don't like bring into that space.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_02: But another thing I learned about myself at this point in my life is that I just really care about the truth.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_02: That the truth really matters to me.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I I don't care if I'm wrong.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_02: If I find out I'm wrong about something, it's like great.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_02: Now I can know the truth about it.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_02: Now I'm not like believing something that's not true anymore.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_02: That's all I care about.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_02: I have no ego about being right or wrong about something.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas the modern internet has incentivized people to not care about truth and to only care about their side or being right about something, in which case we completely lose the nuance that is part of every single aspect of culture and of life.
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_02: Especially like as time goes on, societies get more complex and our problems do get more complicated, which means they're more nuanced, which means there's actually not like a yes or no or right or wrong answer to a lot of the issues that we're facing culturally right now.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: We just have to talk about them and say, well, I think maybe this is a little better than that.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_02: So let's go this way.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_02: And so yeah, I really want to keep that alive in the culture when so many people are uh going the other way.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's I think that's the most important thing, like you said, because the reality is truth gets so fuzzy.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: And the way we think of truth is like, I am right, you are wrong.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_00: This is the way to perfect health.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_00: Only this, or whatever it is.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: We are so prone in our modern American this today, in our culture, to be like, I am right, you are wrong, we are good, they are bad.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_01: Evidence, science, whatever it is.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: This particular thing, whatever it is, when the truth is really so much more nuanced and so complicated and so not like broad strokes across every person or every situation.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you really do an amazing job of like delving into that space in your show.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_01: I guess I'm curious when you just to go back to awe a little bit.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_01: I'm wondering if you find that awe.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_01: I just spent oh, the last three days doing a bodywork training for practitioners, and that was a word that came up a lot.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_01: And especially from me, was just like I'm in awe of the human body and like what it can hold and what it can release.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I also don't have Scott has had more chronic health struggles than I have.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: I don't have as much of that years of I don't know, I I did have years of pain, but like nothing as significant as what you're describing.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so I just wonder, can you feel that awe with your body to still find those awe moments with your body and just appreciating it?
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_01: Has that shifted over the years as you've remineralized awe toward my body or like bodily?
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_02: No, I can't.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_02: But I would say that during I'm just I feel like I'm on the precipice of even better health.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_02: So I going back to the antibiotics, so I just got a stool test results with my recent guest, Ashley Wilkin, who's amazing.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I had very little good bacteria.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, almost none, which makes sense because of all the antibiotics I had as a kid.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's been like that since the beginning.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_02: I've also taken many as an adult.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_02: And just in the last 16 days of stopping gluten, eating more fiber, and eating more polyphenols, I've had a serious reduction in digestive symptoms.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sleeping better and I'm just feeling more like myself.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: So, Lindsay, I think that might be in my near future because I know longer, and I know it's only been 16 days, but it's been consistent that whole time.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_02: So basically, my gut is not in a constant immune reaction state anymore, as it has been for who knows how long.
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_02: I think.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: There this element of chaos that I've been living with symptoms is going to go away, and my body's gonna feel less like foreign and chaotic to me.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's already happening.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_00: That's amazing.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_00: That's exciting.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like it has to shift because at least what I see in the body and with the fascia is when we are going through the most chaotic states, it's that chaos just grows and grows, and then suddenly things just reorganize and settle, really.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_00: That there's an opportunity for it to reorganize in a more positive situation.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_01: It does take that chaos to come to that new kind of equilibrium.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_01: I love that question in the moment.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_02: That's such an interesting question for me to sit with and take forward.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's I probably haven't felt awe toward my body since I was nursing my last baby.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, just I am still breastfeeding.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_01: And then also I was just with 12 women over the weekend and seeing all of their different bodies, the traumas they've held, the emotional traumas, the physical traumas, the birthing, the everything, and just the capacity that we have as humans.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_01: But breastfeeding absolutely is just such an easy place to see and experience that odd.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_01: And it was interesting, one of the women in my training who I don't know how old she is, but late 20s, early 30s, maybe.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_01: And she was like, we were doing a breast pull and she was like asking, where does the milk come out?
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, wow, yeah.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, we need there's it's just interesting because once you start breastfeeding, you get to know your breasts pretty well.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a whole new world around that.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_01: But that culture is not intact as well, like seeing for many people, seeing women birth, seeing women breastfeed.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_01: But to just over the weekend, my appetite was really strange.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_01: I had kind of strange digestion going on, probably coming off the end of this trip to my brother's house eating all foreign food to me and getting a little bit of like a cold or something, cold symptoms.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_01: And so I wasn't even eating nearly as much food as I normally do, and still am making plenty of milk and the body in that way is just such a miracle.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_01: And the fact that you grew babies, even in your low energy state as a vegan, whatever it is, and they're like beautiful beings on this earth.
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I like to bring it back to that because I feel awe with earth absolutely.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_01: But I think because I witness bodies in their healing moments, it's easy for me to see that.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's also easy for me to relate to, even though it's not my own experience, to relate to the to what it would feel like to be in a, I don't want to say like a fight or a battle, but just in a state where you were like, what the fuck is going on with my body?
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_01: And why do I feel this way negatively?
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_01: So I get that too.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_01: I absolutely get that.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_01: And all the confusion and you talk over I was gonna say it's more confusion than battle.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_00: Confusion and just the information landscape that you talk so much about on your podcast.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's just there's we somehow got on this subject on the last interview, and we were talking about my thyroid health and and it was with kiddists and kiddists.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_00: And just about how recently I got a lab result.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_00: I I've been taking the synthetic thyroid hormone for almost two years now.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's or something like that.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_00: And after really resisting it for a long time, I tried a lot of other things, and my TSH just kept climbing and climbing.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_00: It was like way off.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so I eventually started taking the synthetic, and it actually worked really well for me.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, within days, I was like, oh my gosh, wow, all these things on the farm that I was just getting so down about, feeling like I'm never going to be able to chip away at my to-do list because I'm just so low energy.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_00: I just don't have what it takes.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have that energy I had in my 20s to make a living farming.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_00: It just, and it was like a slow slide.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't really, I just had less energy over time.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm still in some state of that, and sometimes I feel better or worse.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_00: But I'd been feeling relatively good.
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_00: And then a month or two months ago, I had some lab work done, and my numbers were like totally screwed up.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_00: I can't, and now my mind is wrapped into feeling again confused.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I'm doing the things, and I'm like feeling good, but the numbers don't show that.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like it was like it was such a downer for me.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_00: It was just so bad for me to see those numbers actually.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't know, probably good.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_00: I adjusted the dosage of my medication and it seems to be working better.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_00: But there's so much, I think our condition, the abundance of information out there and discerning what's true for us and what makes sense for us, and all of that, I feel like has the potential to contribute so much to our poor state of health and just general feeling of disempowerment around our health.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_02: I want to say too, Lindsay, that question and you talking about that.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_02: I have awe for women's bodies in general in abundance.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_02: In abundance.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's also interesting to realize, oh, but I don't apply that to my own self.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sure that's pretty common.
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's definitely really common.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, and it's an interesting, yeah, like I said earlier, just that that inquiry and like how we're nourished, and you speaking about being really nourished by your mother's love.
• 49:36
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, I do feel like I experienced some childhood trauma.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_01: I also was nourished by my mother's love.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_01: I do have people that I come across in my work that really didn't have love.
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it's really challenging for them to overcome that experience growing up.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_01: But how, yeah, how connection to our earth, connection to the earth, connection to the body, and then all these other pieces, like the food we eat, the way we're loved, like all of those, it's like the it's like the love languages, but it's like the nourishment languages.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's like there's so many ways we are holistically nourished as people and are able to keep going.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_01: And even just for you talking about meeting Cammy.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I had this experience when I was in college.
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_01: We didn't record part two of our own story yet, but I met all these community gardeners and I was just like, oh my God, I want what they have.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_01: They are they just have it figured out.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_01: Just you could see the vitality and their connection and their sense of belonging.
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, to just think about how these different, how even for you meeting Cammy and having that vision of possibility of what life could look like might have nourished you so much to keep you going towards a life that you knew could be so fulfilling for you.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's really cool to think about those little, it's like the little breadcrumbs that lead us on our path and nourish us, even the possibility nourishing us.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_00: And she took you under her wing.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_00: It sounds like more specifically, you've told the story a lot about her calling you out about being vegan and just having the, I don't know, that's to be able to, she could see that it wasn't working for you and and told you.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_00: And it felt like it was really critical for you, your evolution and nourishing yourself better.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_00: Isn't that right?
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_02: That is right.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: So I met her for that two-hour class in 2005, and then two years later in 2007, when my oldest was a baby, I took a year-long apprenticeship with her, where I would drive to her home then in Vallejo, like an hour and a half away from here, one Sunday a month.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_02: And we'd be there for I think eight hours a day and just did all sorts of stuff.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it was the second class.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: I was nursing my baby at lunch outside at one of her picnic tables, and she came and she sat in front of me and she looked at me and she said, You're vegan, aren't you?
• 51:56
  SPEAKER_02: He said, Yeah.
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_02: And she said, I can tell by looking at you, and I can tell that it's not working for you as a postpartum breastfeeding woman.
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_02: And it just like that just hit me because I had felt that in my body for a while, but I couldn't bring myself to make that change.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_02: I was so in that idealism around it, and it's simplified because food has always been very complicated and fraught for me.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_02: So it just simplified my food choices to be vegan too.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_02: I looking back now, I think I didn't want to bring all those new food groups in that I'd have to prepare and deal with and learn about.
• 52:33
  SPEAKER_02: And learning how to cook meat was not something I was taught to do.
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_02: I've literally only been cooking meat on my own for the last year or so.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_02: Luckily, my husband does.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_02: So he's been doing that for me for 13 years.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, it was like this sort of maternal tough love moment where she's saying something brave to me, because a lot of people don't want to say things like that to people.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I just took it and needed it, and it nourished me in the moment.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_02: It like nourished my heart that I was being seen and cared for in that way and being given permission to do something that I'd been wanting to do for a while.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_02: And so she said, if I go in my house and get you some sardines right now, will you eat them?
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I said yes.
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_02: And she did, and I did, and that was the beginning of that leg of like renourishing.
• 53:17
  SPEAKER_00: That's amazing.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_01: I just wanted to ask about the legacy that you're bringing forward with your daughters, their connection to the earth, their connection to their bodies.
• 53:28
  SPEAKER_01: I just want you to celebrate yourself a little bit because I'm sure that you are setting them up for a beautiful life of connection.
• 53:36
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 53:36
  SPEAKER_02: More so with my youngest.
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_02: My oldest is 19 now, and a lot of her childhood was being in a difficult relationship, and then being a single mom and having no money, and then having a new baby, who, of course, gets more of your focus.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_02: And then she was with her dad part-time.
• 53:55
  SPEAKER_02: So she doesn't so much have the earth connection that I would that I thought when she was born that I would imbue her with.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_02: But she she's lived in Costa Rica for the last six months.
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_02: She financed her move down there with a friend and goes to the ocean every day and got scuba certified and is fishing and cooking a lot for herself.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_02: And then the youngest is at a nature school.
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_02: So that is so cool.
• 54:21
  SPEAKER_02: She's outside all day when she's there.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_02: They'll they will have some shelter if it's really raining.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_02: And she, I'm just in a much more stable like relationship and financial place with her.
• 54:32
  SPEAKER_02: We're not moving once a year.
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_02: So she's gotten to know our gardens and our land in that way.
• 54:37
  SPEAKER_02: And then, yeah, with like embodiment I've and food and nutrition and taking care of yourself.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_02: That is such a huge focus for me with both of them.
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I tell them both explicitly at nine and 19, I don't want what happened to me to happen to you.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I want you to go into childbearing if you do that extremely nourished.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_02: I want your child childbearing experience to be so good and your baby to possibly be like a more settled baby than a baby who comes in undernourished and like already in a state of burnout, which can happen.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_02: And they both have really heard that.
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_02: They both kind of roll their eyes at me sometimes, but also are willing to hear it.
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like I got to turn my oldest daughter's food story around before she left home because she grew up watching me not really cook and restrict different food groups based on whatever dietary ideology I was buying into at the time.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_02: And even though I was never restricting her food in any way, she's around that just happened to me and my mom.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_02: She picked up on it.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so the last year before she left home, we just had a lot of conversations around nourishment.
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I made sure she knew how to feed herself before she left home.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_02: And so she she does.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm that I if I did nothing else right, that they can feed themselves as adults, because that was not a skill I had when I left home.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_01: It feels really that's so important.
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_01: Let's see.
• 56:07
  SPEAKER_01: We just a couple more questions.
• 56:09
  SPEAKER_01: Just wondering if you want to speak to anything really specific with your work that you're really excited about moving forward, either the podcast or if you want to speak any more on your amazing herbal body oils or any other products.
• 56:25
  SPEAKER_01: I I know I really love the mugwort and redwood oil.
• 56:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's just one of my favorites.
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's so special.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_01: And we don't have, we have mugwort, but we don't have redwood.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: So it's a beautiful thing for for me to receive from across the country and be able to bring onto my body.
• 56:41
  SPEAKER_01: But is there anything you want to say about any of that?
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, get a little California in that bottle.
• 56:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:47
  SPEAKER_02: No, we're in a there's not a lot of new or exciting things on the horizon right now.
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_02: We're just continuing to sell the medicines and it is harvest season and it's about to be more of harvest season.
• 57:00
  SPEAKER_02: So that is always fun because you get to work with the plant and feel it and smell it when we're making it always like the mugwort, the redwood, the yarrow, just the sense as you're making the medicine is you're like in an altered state during those hours.
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_02: So I look forward to that.
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm I kind of took a break from the podcast.
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_02: I just did it sporadically for a few years while I was in that really low energy state.
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_02: And it feels good to be back doing it regularly.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_02: I really love the conversations I'm having, much like this one, and have some plans for improving the podcast.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess that's probably what I'm most excited about.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's a weird time to be a small business owner in the health space, the alt health space, and to be creating the digital product and it's free, but the podcast be because of these algorithm incentives and how hard it is to capture people's attention.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_02: So we're experiencing the business downturn that we're trying to figure our way out of because we love doing what we're doing.
• 58:08
  SPEAKER_02: And we want to continue offering those products and this podcast to people, but there are only sources of income.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_02: So it has to work for us in that way to continue doing it.
• 58:19
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's yeah, we're in a weird place with our offerings actually around that.
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_02: Do people even want this anymore?
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_02: Is this still a viable thing in 2026 that you can make a living doing these things?
• 58:31
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have any sort of thoughts around is there just more stuff out?
• 58:36
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 58:36
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have thoughts around what's going on at all?
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_00: Around that.
• 58:41
  SPEAKER_02: We've really been trying to figure that out.
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_02: The women I talk to who have similar businesses are also experiencing a downturn.
• 58:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not saying it's happening to everyone, but it is happening to a few of the people I know who are in the same space.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_02: Cost of living is up 25% in California since COVID.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's only slightly less than the rest of the country.
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_02: So that's hitting a lot of people, including us, of course.
• 59:05
  SPEAKER_02: And but one thing that might be specific to us is that we went to a new website.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_02: We switched websites in November, spent like all of last year on this new website migration and new labels and everything.
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that messed up our SEO.
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_02: So we're gonna be working with someone all next month to try and clean that up.
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like fingers crossed, it was just that.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe it was just that.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_02: Cause yeah, our medicine sales are way down.
• 59:31
  SPEAKER_02: Although we continue to hear from people every day who are like, I love it so much.
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_02: I can't imagine my life without this product, these products.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_02: And so we know the products are good.
• 59:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's just and it's a changing marketing landscape, right?
• 59:45
  SPEAKER_02: Nothing that was working a few years ago is working now.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_02: So I don't know.
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_02: We're just in that space of like, how do we figure this out and make it through this weird cultural economic moment?
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I wonder if we used to experience this at the farmers market cyclically around when things were like politically really chaotic or people would stop buying as much at the farmer's market.
• 1:00:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I wonder if it's just there's so much going on in the world right now and people are a little bit kind of freaked out and maybe keeping it a little closer to home, not spending as much or no?
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_01: I agree with you that I think that marketing landscape is it's just tricky.
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_01: And you can have a, I don't know.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_01: I see because I am active on social media, I see certain people that you you're following and things like that can grow so massively.
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_01: And but for me, that's part of my path is sharing my voice in that way on finding bigger platforms to speak on.
• 1:00:45
  SPEAKER_01: As weird as that is to say, it's like I can just feel that is part of my path and my evolution as a human.
• 1:00:52
  SPEAKER_01: And some of it is marketing and some of it is whatever, share just sharing more of the hope, hopefully sharing my heart, like you said.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_01: But I do think it's yeah, it's tricky, it's interesting.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_01: It's like all the AI stuff too.
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's that it's replacing people's brains and changing people's brain wiring, it feels.
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_01: I know it can never replace people's bodies, which is positive in my mind.
• 1:01:16
  SPEAKER_01: But it's uh it's a really interesting thing to witness the way people are using AI and just the way it shows up, the way I can see that people are using it.
• 1:01:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm an inquiry around it.
• 1:01:29
  SPEAKER_01: I I have used it.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_01: I do sometimes use it.
• 1:01:32
  SPEAKER_01: I try not to because I just find it just knowing the resources that it uses in the world and that I have children that I'm trying to, but certain amounts of AI, it's like you can't even opt out, it feels like at this point.
• 1:01:45
  SPEAKER_01: So anyway.
• 1:01:46
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe the pendulum will really swing.
• 1:01:48
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe people will be like really feeling that and want real things more, like real heart-made medicine by real people doing the right thing.
• 1:01:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the thing is that it's like my experience with when I found Earth Connection, and maybe I don't know if this is the same for you, Amber, but once you feel it and once you feel like a beautiful, handmade, heart-made medicine on your skin, there's no going back.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_01: So it's it's but it is just getting it into the hands of people, getting it in front of them, getting it so that they see it and getting it so that they want it and that they feel the desire for it when there's so much else out there for so much marketing for what people should desire.
• 1:02:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's tricky.
• 1:02:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_02: Speaking of AI and then the sort of Earth Mom and Medicine Woman resonance that I had with Cammy all those years ago, she actually sent me this video.
• 1:02:43
  SPEAKER_02: I reposted my stories a few months ago, but it's some company that makes some shit herbal product has made this AI character that you can't tell unless you know what you're looking for, who's this grandmotherly woman who's giving advice.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_02: And it's and I'm like, they did a great job with her.
• 1:03:02
  SPEAKER_02: She is what people who people want to be getting earth wisdom and herbal wisdom from.
• 1:03:08
  SPEAKER_02: And she's oh, honey, you've got to use turmeric and do this, and then it's it's a fucking Amazon storefront.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_03: Oh no.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_02: And they've they already have amassed a ton of followers.
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's very disturbing.
• 1:03:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I think like having come off this weekend with 12 women for three days and just being in person, like I feel like being with people in community is really what is going to in community and in connection with the earth and connection with our bodies, is like where I have to keep orienting and trusting that the strength of those things is going to save humanity, lack of a better word.
• 1:03:49
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just curious, just to close up, if there's any advice that you wish you would have gotten early on in your life or in your journey with your health, anything around earth body, basically thinking of the people that we're thinking of our listeners potentially being people who are inspired by earth body path and what you would maybe tell someone that is getting intrigued by a different sort of lifestyle than this mainstream that we've been talking about.
• 1:04:23
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if this is the exact right answer for that question, but the framework I wish I had from childhood was around food and the healthy relationship with food and viewing food as fuel for my body and as getting the nutrients I need.
• 1:04:41
  SPEAKER_02: Because I know that seems really basic, but I didn't understand that until I was fully into adulthood.
• 1:04:47
  SPEAKER_02: Food was just to not feel hungry.
• 1:04:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I can't imagine how different my life would have been if I had realized what food actually is and how it actually connects me to the earth, how food is just elements and minerals and elements that the earth is made up, that the cosmos are made up of, and that are also what my body is made up of, and that it matters what I put into my body in that way.
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_02: And that this is literally what becomes my body.
• 1:05:18
  SPEAKER_01: Earth becoming body.
• 1:05:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_01: How we are Earth.
• 1:05:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:05:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's amazing and beautiful.
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we'll provide some major aha moments for people.
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's awesome.
• 1:05:29
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks so much.
• 1:05:31
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so is there any anything you would like to share as to where people can find you, learn more?
• 1:05:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like your website, and we can put this in the show notes as well.
• 1:05:44
  SPEAKER_02: But if you want to share it globally, yeah, our website is mythic mythicmedicine.shop.
• 1:05:50
  SPEAKER_02: We're in the midst of migrating the old website, more stuff from it to the new one, so we can get rid of the old one because we were retaining the old one as the podcast home.
• 1:05:59
  SPEAKER_02: But that's Part of what's messing up our SEO.
• 1:06:02
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, mythicmedicine.shop.
• 1:06:04
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, you can find the Medicine Stories podcast wherever you're listening to this podcast and Mythic Medicine on Instagram.
• 1:06:12
  SPEAKER_02: Not that I ever post there, but maybe in the future.
• 1:06:17
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe.
• 1:06:17
  SPEAKER_02: No, I do post there a little bit.
• 1:06:19
  SPEAKER_02: I just really prefer these long-form voice conversations.
• 1:06:24
  SPEAKER_02: So I put a lot more of my effort into podcasting than social media right now.
• 1:06:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I really appreciate as a patron of your podcast on Patreon what you put into that space as well.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_01: So I'll just prop that up because very early on in listening to your podcasts, it just became so obvious that it was worthy of a at that point, maybe it was like$6 a month or something.
• 1:06:50
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what your levels are at now.
• 1:06:52
  SPEAKER_00: It was like two dollars a month.
• 1:06:53
  SPEAKER_01: Two dollars a month at the beginning.
• 1:06:56
  SPEAKER_01: And now it's still, I don't know what I pay.
• 1:06:58
  SPEAKER_01: I don't even notice it, but it feels very valuable to give you$10 a month or whatever it is to support your podcast and to see those additional conversations that happen and conversation really.
• 1:07:12
  SPEAKER_01: There's a I know with a couple of the stories you've shared, there's a lot of conversation amongst listeners and it's a great community.
• 1:07:20
  SPEAKER_01: So I just want to I want to mention that.
• 1:07:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:07:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I couldn't highly enough recommend the podcast and the medicine you guys make.
• 1:07:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's all so good.
• 1:07:29
  SPEAKER_00: And the cool thing about podcasts is you were pretty far into it, like years into it before I started listening to.
• 1:07:34
  SPEAKER_00: I think I've listened to, I think I've listened to all your episodes, and some of them multiple times, like you can just go back to the body.
• 1:07:43
  SPEAKER_01: He's a super fan.
• 1:07:44
  SPEAKER_00: The Perdita Finn episode I've listened to is probably the most because it's just a subject that's really fascinating to me.
• 1:07:51
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, yeah.
• 1:07:52
  SPEAKER_02: Do you follow her on Substack?
• 1:07:54
  SPEAKER_00: She's uh I don't.
• 1:07:55
  SPEAKER_02: She writes pretty regularly on Substack.
• 1:07:58
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you guys.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_02: See, this is it's really nice to be reminded that there are real people on the other side of the podcast microphone and the real people that we're sending these medicines out to.
• 1:08:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think talking about in-person stuff, Lindsay, I'm like, I feel like it's time to move there again, maybe because I was doing a lot of that at the beginning.
• 1:08:18
  SPEAKER_02: And then now that I'm sleeping again, maybe I could travel more and start going to more in-person things or just having more energy to show up in that way sounds really good to me.
• 1:08:28
  SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
• 1:08:29
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for being on our Homestead and Heal podcast.
• 1:08:33
  SPEAKER_01: And we're so grateful for you.
• 1:08:36
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much, both of you.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_01: I'm really happy to talk to you.
• 1:08:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thank you.
• 1:08:41
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for listening to this episode of Homestead and Heal.
• 1:08:45
  SPEAKER_01: If you loved it, please help us spread the word by subscribing to this podcast and leaving us a review.
• 1:08:50
  SPEAKER_01: For more information about our work, visit homesteadandheal.net.
• 1:08:55
  SPEAKER_00: We're wishing you the life of your dreams, one that feels deeply rooted, fully alive, and connected to the earth beneath your feet.