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How the Kentucky Derby Became a Thing · Ridiculous History

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  Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to
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  Speaker 1: the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so
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  Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Let's hear it for our number
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  Speaker 1: one Horsey boy, the Main that just won't quit, our
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  Speaker 1: super producer, mister Max Williams. Main.
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  Speaker 2: Congratulations, Ben, you finally have after four and a half years,
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  Speaker 2: and you hit me with one. I just don't know
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  Speaker 2: how to respond on that one. The main part I
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  Speaker 2: can hit you on, but the Horsey Boy, I just
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  Speaker 2: yeah me Bud.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: Max is speechless for the first time ever.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah he still speaks.
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  Speaker 3: No, Hey, guys, Irma Gert, it's the Kent Turkey Derby.
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  Speaker 1: Ah, yes, yeah, that is none other than mister Noel Brown.
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  Speaker 1: Uh Noel, do we have a sound cue for you yet?
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  Speaker 3: Can it be that Horsey nay like from Insane in
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  Speaker 3: the Membrane? You know?
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  Speaker 1: Yeah?
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  Speaker 4: For this what it must be, I mean for all times.
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  Speaker 4: I'm cool with that as well. I'm totally I'm more
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  Speaker 4: a Horsey boy than Max to be fair be.
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  Speaker 2: Wow, oh wow, I agree completely and I don't even
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  Speaker 2: know what means, but I agree.
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  Speaker 3: Nobody does esa.
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  Speaker 1: We're working out Horsey Boys Uh.
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  Speaker 3: You know the horse girl phenomenon. That's the thing.
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  Speaker 1: There's shout out Shane Gillis. Uh. Folks over on this
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  Speaker 1: show they call me Ben Bullen, And we've all been there.
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  Speaker 1: You know. You wake up one day and you say,
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  Speaker 1: you know what, forget about work. It's nice outside. I
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  Speaker 1: want to put on a fancy hat. I want to
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  Speaker 1: maybe drink mint jus and I want to watch a
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  Speaker 1: bunch of panicked horses run around in a circle.
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  Speaker 4: You had me up until a nice day outside, and
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  Speaker 4: then it was quite the leap to fancy hat meant
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  Speaker 4: and paniced horses and a circle.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're not the most fancy hat guys ourselves.
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  Speaker 4: I'm just saying, whoever came up with this as as
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  Speaker 4: a wake up activity, they must have had something going on.
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  Speaker 3: I almost willing to bet we're going to talk about
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  Speaker 3: exactly what that was.
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  Speaker 1: I want to set up. Yeah, it's as tad specific.
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  Speaker 1: But as you said, Noel, there is an annual event
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  Speaker 1: that all Americans just sort of except as normal. It's
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  Speaker 1: called the Kentucky Derby. And today we're gonna learn whether
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  Speaker 1: or not it is ridiculous. Spoiler it is?
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  Speaker 3: Boy? Is it ever? And what better way to start
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  Speaker 3: a ridiculous.
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  Speaker 4: Topic than with an absolutely ridiculous historic name. You think
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  Speaker 4: it's ridiculous, I mean, dude, the question you immediately asked
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  Speaker 4: yourself is like, who is this guy related to? And
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  Speaker 4: we answered that very quickly. We're talking about, of course,
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  Speaker 4: none other than Colonel Merriweather Lewis Clark Junior is only
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  Speaker 4: related to one of them, William Clark. But he got
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  Speaker 4: Lewis up in there too, And I believe Lewis's first
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  Speaker 4: name was Merriweather.
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  Speaker 1: You know, I didn't think about that. You are absolutely I.
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  Speaker 3: Was having to look it up.
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  Speaker 4: I'm almost positive that's the guests Merriweather, Lewis and William Clark.
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  Speaker 3: How come he's got didn't have a William in there?
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  Speaker 3: His dad was William. Yeah, he really loved his boy, Merriweather.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the colonel who is the grandson of
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  Speaker 1: William Clark grandson. Yes, yeah, he is perhaps known from
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  Speaker 1: a semi famous Lewis and Clark expedition, which of course
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  Speaker 1: informed the much more important thing Oregon Trail.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, love it, Dysentry.
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  Speaker 1: All day, Terry Ford, the River. So this guy is
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  Speaker 1: originally from Kentucky. We'll call him Junior. He is a
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  Speaker 1: man of means. He wants to see the rest of
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  Speaker 1: the world, and unlike most Americans at the time, he
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  Speaker 1: has the ability to travel across the pond.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, and I don't think we go on specifically what
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  Speaker 4: his business was, but being a descendant of that famous line,
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  Speaker 4: I imagine he was born into money.
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  Speaker 1: He was not pushed for means. You know, they weren't
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  Speaker 1: sweating the spoons nor the light built in eighteen seventy two.
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  Speaker 1: Our but a junior travels over to England and he
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  Speaker 1: witnesses a locally famous horse race in Epsom Surrey. It's
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  Speaker 1: called not the Kentucky but the Derby Steaks, and people
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  Speaker 1: in the know usually just call it the Derby. And Max,
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  Speaker 1: as we're going on, we're going to lean on you
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  Speaker 1: as our sportsman expert for few of these da.
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  Speaker 2: I mean you, I wouldn't expect anything otherwise, but you know,
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  Speaker 2: Kentucky Derby. I understand it. I also don't.
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  Speaker 4: Like it's kind of like one of those things like NASCAR,
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  Speaker 4: where it's really easy to reduce it down to this
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  Speaker 4: notion of watching people drive a car around in circles,
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  Speaker 4: and it's not until you drill down into the stats
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  Speaker 4: and the mechanics of it all. And like again, if
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  Speaker 4: we're looking at the horse horseboy side of things, the
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  Speaker 4: breeds and the prowess.
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  Speaker 3: Of these beautiful creatures.
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  Speaker 4: But as we're going to get into I don't know, man,
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  Speaker 4: I can definitely get a little more behind people being
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  Speaker 4: into cars than this kind of parading of these specimens.
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  Speaker 2: It's one thing to get here at the top NASCAR
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  Speaker 2: has and Indie racing, Formula One racing has is quantity.
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  Speaker 2: There is a lot of racing Kentucky Derby.
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  Speaker 3: I had no idea we're going to get to that.
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  Speaker 3: It's like all about the day.
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  Speaker 4: It's like it's like the it's like hanging out in
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  Speaker 4: the fish lot and then the Fish Concert's like moments long,
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  Speaker 4: it's all.
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  Speaker 1: About the lot, barely about the concert, and folks Nola
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  Speaker 1: is saying fish Phis, that's it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, not
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  Speaker 1: a parking lot with fish, but a parking lot full
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  Speaker 1: of people who are fans of the jam band Fish,
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  Speaker 1: which I think lots of. I like a lot of
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  Speaker 1: their records.
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  Speaker 3: I you know what.
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  Speaker 4: I was actually just talking with some friends last night.
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  Speaker 4: I would absolutely go see the Bandfish. I never have,
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  Speaker 4: but I would do it.
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  Speaker 3: There. I think they're interesting.
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  Speaker 1: Make a weekend of it. So look the original Derby
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  Speaker 1: over there in Surrey. It is first run in seventeen eighty.
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  Speaker 1: It continues today. For now, all we need to note
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  Speaker 1: about this is that it was and is open to
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  Speaker 1: all three year old horses, which sounds very young for humans,
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  Speaker 1: but is perfect racing for race horses. This inspires Junior.
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  Speaker 4: Who, by the way, I was just looking at his
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  Speaker 4: CV a little bit ben and he was known for
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  Speaker 4: being a little bit touchy and had more than a
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  Speaker 4: few occasions where he threatened people with guns. Yes, yeah, oddcat,
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  Speaker 4: for sure. I definitely moneyed, which you know, we'll do
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  Speaker 4: that to you if you're not careful. So Junior later
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  Speaker 4: did travel to Perry, where he hooked up with the
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  Speaker 4: French Jockey Club, because much like cycling, the French are ahead.
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  Speaker 3: Of the curve in this particular sport as well.
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  Speaker 4: That had been formed in eighteen sixty three, and the
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  Speaker 4: French horse Boys had formed the nation's greatest horse race
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  Speaker 4: up until that point, the Grand Prix de Pelis.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the premiere race for the entire country.
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  Speaker 1: It's needless to say Junior is impressed. He makes it
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  Speaker 1: back to the United States and he found something called
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  Speaker 1: the Louisville Jockey Club and he forms this which is
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  Speaker 1: kind of like a country club kind of thing, we
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  Speaker 1: could think of it that way. And he's hoping to
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  Speaker 1: raise monetary support to build racing facilities. He's walking back
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  Speaker 1: into Kentucky and talking to the well healed people and
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  Speaker 1: he's saying, look, they got awesome horse races in Europe.
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  Speaker 1: This leads to the foundation of Churchill Downs, which is
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  Speaker 1: named after John and Henry Churchill because they're the guys
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  Speaker 1: in that meeting who donated the land for the track.
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  Speaker 1: And I believe Clark lived with their family for a
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  Speaker 1: time or he had a real close connection to their family.
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  Speaker 1: So at first this whole.
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  Speaker 4: Enterprise was a right right out, right out of the gates,
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  Speaker 4: was a phenomenal success. The horse folk from the region
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  Speaker 4: would come out. It's sort of one of the only
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  Speaker 4: games in town. They stood up and took notice. Unfortunately,
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  Speaker 4: things did go a little bit sideways, not too far
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  Speaker 4: along in this when a nouveau riche gold rush tycoon,
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  Speaker 4: like a dude that was made his money in the
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  Speaker 4: gold rush named James ben ali Hagen had a bit
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  Speaker 4: of a dalliance with some gambling operations. Ben, maybe this
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  Speaker 4: is this is something that you found. This is an
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  Speaker 4: interesting tale.
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  Speaker 1: Oh yes, Nipun left behind James Ben Ali Hagen, Turkish
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  Speaker 1: national made his money in the gold Rush, and he
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  Speaker 1: ran a foul a full of sketchy gambling monopolies.
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  Speaker 3: I will, Ben, I will, all right, Well here we go.
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  Speaker 1: So it's a bit of background. It's eighteen eighty six.
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  Speaker 1: There's another guy named CM White. CM White purchases like
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  Speaker 1: a EP level monopoly on what they were calling pooling privileges.
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  Speaker 1: That's the right to leave gamble on Kentucky Derby horse races.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's funny. I still call like office pools. You know,
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  Speaker 4: I got that pool that's right. I guess that is
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  Speaker 4: a gambling term. Yeah, I guess it's sort of like
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  Speaker 4: the ante. It's like the pile of money that everyone
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  Speaker 4: contributes to and then the winner takes all right.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, just so, uh, this guy White, he pays
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  Speaker 1: at the time, in eighteen eighty six, thirty thousand, six
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  Speaker 1: hundred US dollars to control gambling at the emerging Kentucky Derby.
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  Speaker 1: And I think we need a bit of an infletion calculator.
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  Speaker 4: Can we get a boop, Max, dude, boom, there it
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  Speaker 4: is when you do it.
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  Speaker 3: A low dulcet boop of masks.
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  Speaker 1: Love when he does it? Live all right, Sue. Thirty thousand,
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  Speaker 1: six hundred dollars in eighteen eighty six is equivalent to
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  Speaker 1: drum roll noel, you got it.
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  Speaker 4: Oh, it's a million bucks roughly fifty million, fifty and
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  Speaker 4: forty five, which still seems like a bargain to get
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  Speaker 4: on the ground floor of what would ultimately be a
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  Speaker 4: multimillion dollar operation. Dude anigar long term, right, I mean right,
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  Speaker 4: this dude is so mafia about it. He says, okay,
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  Speaker 4: I've got the rights. And he goes to every bookie
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  Speaker 4: working at the Kentucky Derby and he says, you guys
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  Speaker 4: have to pay me one hundred dollars straight up just
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  Speaker 4: to work at this track, just to take bets, and
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  Speaker 4: just to be clear, And this is maybe a sort
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  Speaker 4: of a statement and a question. A bookie is a
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  Speaker 4: book maker, and it's not inherently illegal, like there are
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  Speaker 4: sports books operations, and so there are legal ones and
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  Speaker 4: then there are illegal ones. But I think a lot
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  Speaker 4: of times when people throw around bookie they're thinking about
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  Speaker 4: the ones that'll like break your legs if you don't pay.
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  Speaker 3: Up, right.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, The idea is you take bets from the general
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  Speaker 1: public on any number of you usually sporting events. But
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  Speaker 1: Las Vegas and Macaw get crazy with this. You make
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  Speaker 1: a great point. The argument goes back to legitimacy, Like
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  Speaker 1: it's totally legit and on the right side of the
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  Speaker 1: law for there to be a bookie in say Monaco,
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  Speaker 1: and you're betting on car races in Monaco. But we
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  Speaker 1: had a super producer, Max, jump in for a second. Max,
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  Speaker 1: you want to give us some on the street recognition
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  Speaker 1: of bookies.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think another big thing about bookies
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  Speaker 2: because I've known some bookies. Most time they're part time bookies,
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  Speaker 2: not like big time bookies. But until recently, socially America,
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  Speaker 2: like sports gambling was very legal in most places in
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  Speaker 2: the country. It's just illegal, right, yeah, illegal right yeah, yeah, apology,
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  Speaker 2: but yeah, I.
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  Speaker 4: Just making sure because it's a little confusing and it's
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  Speaker 4: still kind of a gray area where like now you're
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  Speaker 4: starting to hear these ads for these sports books, and
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  Speaker 4: like when you go to certain casinos they have the
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  Speaker 4: section where there's all these different what they call sports books,
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  Speaker 4: and it's what gets back to sort of this.
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  Speaker 3: Old timey way of doing things.
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: One of the fantasy football podcasts I listened to, I'm
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  Speaker 2: not giving any publicity or for advertising anyone here someone
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  Speaker 2: we're talking to.
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  Speaker 1: This is brought to you by DraftKings.
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  Speaker 2: Actually no, it's not DraftKings, but one of them.
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  Speaker 1: No, no, but this is brought to you by DraftKings.
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  Speaker 2: I was listening to a fantasy football podcast and they were
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  Speaker 2: talking about a specific sports book that was like there
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  Speaker 2: are big lines like the only one legal in Florida.
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  Speaker 4: Right, yeah, right, that's the kind of language you're starting
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  Speaker 4: to hear in this copy when we're still in this
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  Speaker 4: wild West day. We talked about this very much in
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  Speaker 4: our Fantasy Sports episode. So all this stuff kind of
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  Speaker 4: figures in.
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  Speaker 2: And how this ties in with bookies is like, you know,
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  Speaker 2: for a long time, it's like, Okay, how do you
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  Speaker 2: gamble on these things? There's just a guy you knew,
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  Speaker 2: like in the neighborhood, who was outside of the bar
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  Speaker 2: with you.
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  Speaker 1: There's an etymology we have to get into, which is
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  Speaker 1: that the in the origin story, during the day the
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  Speaker 1: book makers or the book would physically write down in
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  Speaker 1: a book your donation or your gamble and the odds
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  Speaker 1: of a thing. So there is a reason it's called bookmaking.
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  Speaker 1: They were literally making a.
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  Speaker 4: Book one hundred percent and just wanted to pull a
• 14:19
  Speaker 4: little tidbit that was news to me, or at least
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  Speaker 4: a question that I had that I maybe didn't fully
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  Speaker 4: have the answer to, and involves a term that you
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: like to throw around them, the vigoroush The way that
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  Speaker 4: bookies cover these bets is by or at least more
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  Speaker 4: than cover. They're covering it, I guess, because people have
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  Speaker 4: to pay down on their bets and then they either
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  Speaker 4: get their money back plus whatever the winnings is based
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  Speaker 4: on the odds of the bet. The bookmakers control the odds,
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  Speaker 4: and they strategically not manipulate, but they sort of have
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  Speaker 4: to have knowledge of what's being bet on in such
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  Speaker 4: a way that they can move the odds around to
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  Speaker 4: attract bets, but also make sure they're covering it and
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  Speaker 4: that they're able to get their commission or they're viig
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  Speaker 4: or vigorous.
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  Speaker 3: Right.
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  Speaker 1: So, the folks at the Kentucky Derby during its origin story,
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  Speaker 1: it was not necessarily a social nor a fashion event
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  Speaker 1: it was not the met Gala or whatever. They wanted
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  Speaker 1: to make money off these horses. And so when our
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  Speaker 1: buddy CM White shakes down all the bookies at the
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  Speaker 1: new Kentucky Derby, the bookies boycott. They say, we're just
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  Speaker 1: not going to show up. No one can gamble, you
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  Speaker 1: can't make high dollar bets over at the Derby. This
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  Speaker 1: happens in eighteen eighty six. Our pal gold Rush James Hagen,
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  Speaker 1: does not vibe with this. He learns he cannot place
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  Speaker 1: a bet on his champion horse that he, in a
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  Speaker 1: burst of humility, names Ben Ali, and so he says,
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  Speaker 1: you know what, I'm with the bookies, I'm going to
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  Speaker 1: boycott the race as well. Not one horse from my
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  Speaker 1: stable will participate in your little Kentucky Derby, and we're
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  Speaker 1: not gonna play ball until the bookies return. Derby leadership
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  Speaker 1: calls his bluff. That pisses him off even more. He
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  Speaker 1: goes to talk to his other horse owning friends. What's
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  Speaker 1: the word for a guy who owns horses the way
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  Speaker 1: you own a restaurant?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know.
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  Speaker 1: A horseboy, horseboy, horsemen?
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know.
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  Speaker 4: I'm sticking with horseboy for just about everything pertaining to
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  Speaker 4: the topic because I just love it so much. This
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  Speaker 4: was bad news, right, This was like borderline devastating because
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  Speaker 4: everyone starts to join in with these boycotts, other people
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  Speaker 4: that have interest in the book, making nests of it all,
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  Speaker 4: other owners, other you know, gamblers, et cetera. And while
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  Speaker 4: the bookies did return the fire year in eighteen eighty seven,
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  Speaker 4: the damage had kind of been done at least up
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  Speaker 4: until some changes took place.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, this pattern continues until Churchill Downs goes so far
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  Speaker 1: Churchill Downhill that it is going to be closed and
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  Speaker 1: bankrupt around nineteen oh three. So it gets sold off
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  Speaker 1: and a new crew steps in another colonel of course. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: his name's Matt Wynn. He's also from Louisville. And Churchill
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  Speaker 1: Downs manages to repair its reputation. It becomes the number
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  Speaker 1: one race for three year old thoroughbreds here in the
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  Speaker 1: United States.
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  Speaker 3: So let's just say that you're a jockey or what
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  Speaker 3: do you say, a.
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  Speaker 4: Horse lord, you know, the horse lord's fun and you
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  Speaker 4: got a nagger affiliate or stallion that wins over there
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  Speaker 4: at the Kentucky Derby. Well, I mean, wouldn't you want
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  Speaker 4: to keep going?
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  Speaker 1: Why stop? There, says everybody with a gambling problem. After
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  Speaker 1: winning the Derby, horse owners start sending their horses in
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  Speaker 1: the US to compete in two other races, the Preakness
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  Speaker 1: Steaks in Baltimore and then the Belmont Steaks in Elmont,
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  Speaker 1: New York.
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  Speaker 3: In Belmont, New York, why don't they call it the
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  Speaker 3: Elmont Steaks. That doesn't make any sense to me.
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  Speaker 1: It's a whole thing.
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  Speaker 3: Also, the Preakness. Doesn't that sound like a thing you'd
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  Speaker 3: say about something that was really rad Like that is
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  Speaker 3: the Preakness, The absolutely ruickness, you know.
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  Speaker 1: Right, like the ability of having or the capability of
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: having the peak of a These always strikes me like
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  Speaker 1: Jinko's are Preakness nineteen nineties jeans peak Preakness.
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  Speaker 4: Indeed, So these other races were pre existing, but it
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  Speaker 4: was just kind of like the success of the Kentucky
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  Speaker 4: Derby kind of elevated them in a way because they
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  Speaker 4: were the only other games in town.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, they're pretty profitable races. In nineteen nineteen, there's
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  Speaker 1: a horse named Sir Barton who is owned by a
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  Speaker 1: human named John E. Madden, and Madden is also from Kentucky. Anyway,
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  Speaker 1: Sir Barton wins all three of these races, the Kentucky Derby,
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  Speaker 1: the Preakness Stakes, and the Belmont Steaks. This means the
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: Guy was the first triple Crown horse, a term we've
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: all heard before, but the term itself isn't used until
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: more than a decade later.
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 19:29
  Speaker 4: A second horse named Gallant Fox also won all three.
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: Is this what they call the triple crown?
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: This is the triple crown because Gallant Fox inspired the
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: sports writer of the time, Charles Hatten, to popularize the
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: term triple crown. And this launches huge public interest, not
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: just in the States, but across the world, right, because
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: we learned this from England, and we learned this from France.
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: And there's a dark side because everyone in the US
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: is at this time fueled with a growing interest in
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: the pseudoscience of eugenics and social Darwinism, and they started
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: asking each other in certain circles whether it was possible
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: to breed a quote unquote super horse, and.
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: If we can do it with horses, maybe we can
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: do it with people.
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 20:24
  Speaker 4: It's weird, dude, The idea of like observing these specimens
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: being put through their paces. It just kind of like, well,
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: you're gonna get to it, Ben, I mean, I don't
• 20:32
  Speaker 4: mean to scoop it, but you know, with athletes that
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: put themselves through the ringer, you know, whether it be
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: training or drug enhancement, they know what they're doing, right, Yeah.
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll get to it. Lets let's talk a little bit.
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: Let's talk a little bit about the Triple Crown.
• 20:47
  Speaker 4: Since nineteen thirty one, the Triple Crown races have happened
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: in a specific order, for you win the Derby, then
• 20:54
  Speaker 4: the Preakness, and then the Belmont. First live radio broadcast
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: of the Derby came on May sixteenth, nineteen twenty five,
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: where you would have just had some absolute rapid fire
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: mid Atlantic follow.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: By Babada's Charlie Brown left, tors bang, thank you, thank you.
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: We're gonna get into some really fun horse names, but
• 21:15
  Speaker 4: it just it's become such a joke in the best
• 21:18
  Speaker 4: possible way, these absurd horse names. And that's what I
• 21:20
  Speaker 4: think of when I think of the Kentucky Derby. Is
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: this that cartoonish kind of coverage.
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: Right, And if we fast forward, the first television coverage
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: aired on May seventh, nineteen forty nine, that was regional
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: and was pre recorded. The first national television coverage airs
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: on May third, nineteen fifty two. This feeds public interest.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: This is great for the bookies. This is great for
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: the people who own and sell the horses. In nineteen
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: fifty four, just a few years later, the official prize
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: they call it a purse for first place, exceeds one
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: hundred thousand US dollars. In nineteen fifty four, if we
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: can throw to an inflation calculator, Max, give us a
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: wildly different boop.
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's relaxing, Rex.
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, we got around one point two million dollars in
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: today's dollars.
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, one billion, nearly one point three Yeah, one million,
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: two hundred thou nine and twenty one dollars and ninety
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: three cents. Uh. This is a big business, and like
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: all big businesses with serious money on the line, serious
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: problems come to light and you set it up so well.
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: In the human athletes then and now fall victim to
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: accusations of doping, and horses are no different. Here's another
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: horse name. We love a horse named Dancers image in
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: nineteen sixty eight.
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: That's right, Dancer's image in nineteen sixty eight was found
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: to contain the horse contained traces of an anti inflammatory
• 23:12
  Speaker 4: painkiller called phenal beautazone.
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, unlike human athletes, our equine friends don't possess the
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: ability to consent to being doped or drugged, and they
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: don't have the capacity to understand what's being forced upon them.
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: This is just the beginning with issues surrounding animal racing,
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: from camels to dogs to horses. People oppose this.
• 23:38
  Speaker 4: Do you remember there was a I think it was
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: an HBO television series about horse racing that happened a
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: handful of years ago, and it was canceled very quickly,
• 23:48
  Speaker 4: maybe even before the season ended, because of it was
• 23:50
  Speaker 4: just rampant abuse of the animals, because they were trying
• 23:53
  Speaker 4: to make it as real as possible, and the only
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: way to make it as real as possible is to
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: treat the animals with a lot of, you know, brutality.
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 24:01
  Speaker 4: The show is called Luck and it was canceled due
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: to the deaths of three horses during its production. This
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: was a Dustin Hoffman vehicle and Pete got in the mix.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: And so I'm saying, if that's what they're doing in a.
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: TV show to paint an accurate picture of this era,
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: what must.
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: Have been like you know, in the era.
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely an odor in the court, which is also
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: a name of a real life racehorse. Look. Just last year,
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty four, a journalist named Kalia Richardson from Rolling
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: Stone dove into the controversy surrounding racehorses. She said, quote
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: corruption and a witted all costs mentality have long been
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: a part of horse racing, but in recent years that
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: culture has led to dire consequences. The FBI got involved, folks.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: More than two dozen people were charged with secretly distributing
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: drugs to race horses in twenty twenty and in twenty
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: twenty three, not that long ago, twelve horses. A dozen
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: horses died at Churchill Downs immediately before and after the race.
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: And Ben, you pointed out in your research that the
• 25:22
  Speaker 4: New York Times documentary Broken Horses is a good watch
• 25:25
  Speaker 4: if you want to dig a little deeper. Plus, we
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: have explorations of this on our other show stuff they
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: don't want you to know, along with our pal Matt Frederick.
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: And our pal Dylan, the Tennessee pal Fagan.
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: Yes, indeed also a bit of a horse point.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: So we didn't want to leave you without a dope,
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: hoof to trot to dress hodge is weird. A lot
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: of people comment about the Kentucky Derby in terms of
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: social like social import right, So when you are looking
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: at the derby and the actual derby, by the way,
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: the actual horse racing is a very small part of
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: the modern experience. A lot of times the media is
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: going to focus on the fashion, the eye popping hats. Noel,
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: this is where you and I learned about something called fascinators.
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah, not to be confused with terrifiers. That's very different.
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: It's his own thing. Fascinators are a super posh accessory.
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's weird. Imagine the fanciest hat pin or
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: headband ever. It's a hairclip times a million. They're colorful,
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: they're vibrant. People wear them to stand out at the
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: Kentucky Derby, even if they're not wearing a hat.
• 26:51
  Speaker 4: Can I just say that I really love that National
• 26:54
  Speaker 4: Geographic is commenting on this as though they're like observing.
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: Like animals in the wild, and not the horses.
• 27:00
  Speaker 4: I'm talking about the people, you know, and these weird
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: mating rituals like peacocking around with their bizarre hats. I'm
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: sure we saw some like some of those crazy taxidermy
• 27:10
  Speaker 4: hat type situations that we've discussed I believe with our
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: buddy aj Bahamas.
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, good callback, Noel. This reminds me of being
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: in college and looking at anthropological satire like the Nasserrema.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: Dude, I love that. Yeah, I talk about that any
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: recent episode of stuff. They don't want you to know.
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: Let's not spoil it.
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: It's just a it's a sociological deep dive that will
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: tickle you satire.
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: We hope we also know that sombreros are common at
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: the Kentucky Derby.
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that threw me a little bit.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's a type of hat.
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: It is a type of hat.
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: But I mean, are we talking like Mexican sombreros or
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: is there is that not.
• 27:54
  Speaker 3: Like a bit a culturally appropriate of but maybe I'm I.
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: Mean it's more surface area port, more flowery stuff and
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: ribbons on it. These people are walking around with full
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: floral arrangements on your shirts.
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: I guess it's a good point.
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: Also, they're also walking around being intensely white and the
• 28:12
  Speaker 4: same they're.
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: Also appropriating the earlier races in England and France.
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: Not to mention Yeah, No, it's a good point this.
• 28:23
  Speaker 4: I won't be too pedantic about it, just that when
• 28:24
  Speaker 4: I saw some breras that threw me for a bit
• 28:26
  Speaker 4: of a loop.
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: We also have a term that I've seen.
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: It's one of those better Minehoff things in literature, A
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: good bit recently, the idea of a close which can
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: just be described like as a bunch of things like
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: a tide ribbon under your chin would be a closeh
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: But it's also here, very specifically, a style of accessor.
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like a bucket hat, a pillbox hat. This goes
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: so deep it could be an episode all its own.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: We're probably not the ones. We're not the have dashers
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: you're looking for. We can tell you for anybody who
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: just asked, wait, I'm a guy, what do I wear
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: the Kentucky Derby, we can tell you can wear a
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: bowler hat once upon a time known as a Derby hat.
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: Yea the Brown Derby in Los Angeles, famous Hollywood hot
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: spot in the golden age of cinema.
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you can rock a pork pie here in the States.
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: Over in Louisville, Kentucky. You can wear a fedora for
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: the Kentucky Derby people won't be mad at you. The
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: custom hats are apparently quite expensive. There's a Kentucky Derby
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: Museum milliner named Jenny Fanisdale who told Business Insider that
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: people pay upwards of five hundred to six hundred dollars
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: US for a custom hat that they only wear once.
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: That seems like a lot of money for a one
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: use thing, but who are we to judge?
• 30:06
  Speaker 4: I have to say something just to correct myself, the
• 30:09
  Speaker 4: word klosh. I was totally wrong about what it was.
• 30:12
  Speaker 4: I knew i'd seen it, But you know what it
• 30:14
  Speaker 4: also is, Ben. It's the thing that you put over
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: food for the big reveal the domes. It's called a klosh.
• 30:21
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry. I said it was a bunch of ribbons,
• 30:23
  Speaker 4: and that was its own thing that you already mentioned
• 30:26
  Speaker 4: as well. But a klosh is that dome thing with
• 30:28
  Speaker 4: the little handle that you pull off to reveal the
• 30:30
  Speaker 4: fancy chicken or whatever.
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: I love it. And now, as we're wrapping up the
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: history of the Kentucky Derby, which is really a history
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: of Americans or Yanks trying to catch up with the British,
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: we could not picture a better ending than giving you
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: some of our favorite kooky racehorse names. I love goat Zapper,
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: I love po too.
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, tell us about that one.
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: I believe there was a fun typo situation that led
• 31:03
  Speaker 4: to that name.
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So this is a horse from the seventeen hundreds,
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: and his owner asked the kid working at the stables
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: to write the horse's name down. The horse was called Potatoes.
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: That's what he responded to. The kid wrote pot and
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: then wrote the letter O eight times, and the owner
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: loved it, and so now the horse's name is historically
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: po two.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: It's like one of those like you're trying to, you know,
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: make it hard for people to find you on social media,
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: and so you put like a very specific number of
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: like o's or i's or whatever. Have we talked about?
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: Hoof hearted? Hoof hearted?
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: I love who hearted? Yeah?
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: Who heard?
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: Can you say it five times?
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: I don't want to. I'm not going to do it.
• 31:51
  Speaker 4: Okay, who farted? That's how you say. It's all about
• 31:53
  Speaker 4: where he put the em fastus. And just just to
• 31:57
  Speaker 4: crib a little bit from Britannica here, at firstance, they
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: say hoof hearted seemed like a charming and appropriate.
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: Name for an equine friend.
• 32:05
  Speaker 4: But if you say it five times fast as you
• 32:07
  Speaker 4: pointed out, and you'll realize it's a clever dublo tendre
• 32:09
  Speaker 4: that made it past jockey club sensors.
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: And that's a big part of this whole horse naming game.
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: Got another one, are uh? And then I also some
• 32:19
  Speaker 4: more modern ones. I found a minute ago. Let's see
• 32:22
  Speaker 4: if I can find it.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: Oh, I love ben Dover, no pun left behind. I
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: love sofa king fast. Get it sofa space king space fast,
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: but say it quickly.
• 32:36
  Speaker 4: That's a good old gag there, like a sofa king stupid. Also,
• 32:40
  Speaker 4: it's fine, We've got no souper. No, It's just it's
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: just an old gang. It's like it's where you like
• 32:46
  Speaker 4: write it down and then you ask someone to say
• 32:48
  Speaker 4: it over and over again, and then they end up saying,
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: I am so fuck gang stupid. You know, it's like
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: a it's a gag. It's a goof classic no soup
• 32:56
  Speaker 4: for you from the peak times of Seinfeld. We've got
• 33:01
  Speaker 4: bodacious tatas from nineteen eighty five.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: Let's see, we've got Anita Bath, We've got Hugh Jass,
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: We've got Chester drawers.
• 33:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, these are all Bart Simpson prank phone calls. Basically
• 33:16
  Speaker 4: Branjelina from two thousand and five, Peak Brad and Angelina time,
• 33:21
  Speaker 4: what am I chopped?
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: Liver? All one on one word.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: I like the ones that are like a sentence.
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: Oh not everything, yeah, from two thousand and eight. We
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: have one, just so, where's the beef?
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: We have some that are pushing the limits. And I
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: want to give a shout out to ideal horse name,
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: who seems very into this. I was not aware of,
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: you guys that there is literally a horse called maya
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: enormous boot.
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, and we couldn't.
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: We couldn't end today's episode without talking about Panty Raid
• 33:58
  Speaker 4: Panti of course.
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, put some respect on his name. Midnight Charger, ghost Zapper.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: We got Max coming in.
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: Hot, all right.
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: So, as there always is for these things, there is
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: of course a random horse name generator.
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: Love it guy.
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: You guys want to here's someone's like.
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, play the game. This is like, uh, this is
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: like when I was reading weird words from that reference word.
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: So I'm going to say the name. You tell me
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: what the horse looks like or like sounds like here
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: are something. We got a majestic mirage.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: It's clearly a horse.
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: Wait, what are you asking, Max, you're asking it to
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: describe the horse.
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, what what do you think? Why why would we
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: name this horse?
• 34:39
  Speaker 4: I couldn't possibly answer that. I have no frame of
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: reference for any name to horse ratio.
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: There's no logic or reason.
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah to this, I think that's the point.
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: How about Thunderbolt Tango.
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: Maybe he's got like a yeah, a bit of a stripe.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: That horse has a tank top, it loves the savannah bananas,
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: and it probably does scratch offs.
• 35:00
  Speaker 4: I'm also picturing it as being the kind of little
• 35:01
  Speaker 4: pony that like a cowboy might ride, maybe with like
• 35:04
  Speaker 4: a lightning streak stripe along its side.
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: Now I'm thinking of just race cars. I don't know, last.
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: One worst one, and I got velvet Nebula's.
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: Oh oh luscious fur. I would say, uh, probably machine
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: night rider.
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: Bit of achine.
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's a fun to pet.
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: I think I'm gonna use that nickname now, going for it,
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: but for something very different.
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: Was it again?
• 35:28
  Speaker 4: Velvet velvet Nebula, Velvet Nebula, Yeah, because I'm also now
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: thinking of space stuff.
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: I'm thinking of inper.
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: NASA for sure, first horse on the Moon. I am
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: super into it. Hey, hey, Max, you're gonna use Velvet
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: Nebula as your new persona.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: I think I am, and you can be my starry Strider.
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: That's really sweet. What can I be?
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: You can be my moon shadow dancer.
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: Oh I love that, Thank you so love it.
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: That's very uh, that's very Van Morrison. Right, marvelous night.
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: For moon dances doing jazz hands.
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: We don't even have time to get into the traditional
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: cuisine of the Kentucky Derby, but we do have time
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: to thank you so much for tuning in, friends and neighbors,
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: fellow ridiculous historians. We're gonna call it a day. Thank
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: you as always to our super producer, Velvet Nebula. Max.
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: We're gonna use your horse name from now on.
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: Bet are you talking, by the way, are you talking
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: about the Hot Brown?
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: There's some funny dishes associated with the Oh my goodness,
• 36:34
  Speaker 4: but look at hop, y'all, it's worth it.
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: And if if it's if you're.
• 36:37
  Speaker 4: Familiar with other big, big, big money type of legacy
• 36:41
  Speaker 4: events like the Masters where they've got these famous pimento
• 36:45
  Speaker 4: cheese sandwiches or whatever. Oh yeah, I've never had one
• 36:48
  Speaker 4: and I grew up there, but yeah, the Hot Brown
• 36:51
  Speaker 4: classic Kentucky open face sandwich. It's just turkey and bacon
• 36:54
  Speaker 4: and some sort of gravy it looks like.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: And big thanks as well to Alex Williams who compose
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: this banking track. Big thanks to aj Bahamas, Jacobs, Doctor
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: Rachel Big, Spinach, Lance Oh and our new friend Ross
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: bettish Man.
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: Ross is so cool I hope to have him back
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: again Talk ninety some.
• 37:13
  Speaker 4: He literally brought in the scope of the show time
• 37:16
  Speaker 4: wise with his very presence.
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: Thanks to you as well. Ben, This is a great one.
• 37:20
  Speaker 4: Thanks for bringing this and doing all the research on
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: the Kentucky Derby.
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: We'll see you next time. Anita Bath, Dixie Enormous, jack Niehoff,
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: Pat Mind, Wildie Stroker, and of course Buck Naked Hand.
• 37:33
  Speaker 3: We'll see you next time, folks.
• 37:42
  Speaker 4: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
• 37:46
  Speaker 4: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.