Latest / Honey Badger Radio / Hostile, aggressive feminist funding | HBR Talk 345

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Hostile, aggressive feminist funding | HBR Talk 345 · Honey Badger Radio

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Looks like you were getting into something good on Twitter.
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, on Twitter again.
• 0:08
  Speaker 3: Well that's what happens when I forget my how to
• 0:11
  Speaker 3: set my alarm. So we are we are hot MICD
• 0:15
  Speaker 3: by the way, But everybody needs to know Anna screwed up,
• 0:21
  Speaker 3: and when I screw up, I do a good job.
• 0:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, fifteen minutes.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: Fifteen minutes is not late.
• 0:27
  Speaker 3: I'm running on woman time today, guys, Just so you.
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Turn up exactly when fate.
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, no, a woman is never late, you misogynist. Seriously,
• 0:45
  Speaker 3: I just have to learn the difference between am and
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: PM on my alarm clock. It really sucks. I like,
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: that's such a dumb screw up. But I mean I
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: do shut like that all the time.
• 0:56
  Speaker 4: So there you go.
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: So hello and welcome to HBr.
• 1:00
  Speaker 4: Talk three forty five.
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: Hostile aggressive funding. This is an interesting one, guys, because Okay,
• 1:09
  Speaker 3: so there's a term hostile aggressive parenting, and it generally
• 1:14
  Speaker 3: means interfering in the other parent's access and lying about
• 1:19
  Speaker 3: the other parent in order to abuse the other parent
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: by turning the children against the other parent and denying
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: the other parent access like marginalizing the other parent on
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: purpose as a tool of abuse. So this hostile aggressive
• 1:35
  Speaker 3: funding title. You'll see what I mean here, but I'm
• 1:38
  Speaker 3: your screw up. I mean your host Hannah Walllett here
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: with Nunsense annihilator Lauren Brooks and the personification of perceptivity
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: Mike Stevenson and tonight, dear feminists, we want a divorce,
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: but before we do that, we gotta do what we
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: gotta do. As always, Honey Badger Radio dishes out Ace
• 1:56
  Speaker 3: morgasboard of thought provoking discussions and as experiences both ree
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: and long past have demonstrated, the provoked thoughts.
• 2:03
  Speaker 4: Are fighting back.
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: They've made it clear that for people like us, relying
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: on third party payment platforms like Patreon to fund our
• 2:10
  Speaker 3: work is treading on thin ice or building our house
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: in the path of a rapidly growing wildfire. In light
• 2:18
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• 2:53
  Speaker 3: the top of the page.
• 2:56
  Speaker 4: So I have been.
• 2:58
  Speaker 3: Claimed, Gabriel, phil and Lucas said, you're our screw up, Hannah.
• 3:02
  Speaker 4: There we go. Oh, it's it's so bad.
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: Like there are mistakes and then there are like, you
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: fucking dumb ass mistakes, and this this one was just
• 3:12
  Speaker 3: a you fucking dumb ass mistake. So, like everybody knows,
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: I could do it yourself.
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: Lucky that I'm never in charge of streams. I can't
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: even imagine all the technical difficulty.
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: Well, you might just simplify everything and then we wouldn't
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: have this problem.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: Like it, I would stress out every time, and I
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: would pull out the last strands of hair that I
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: have left on my head.
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: I kind of do that, although I just I just
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: have so much hair that you can't tell, like I
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: I have a ship ton of hair, like you guys
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: have no idea. Oh but in any case, and it
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: gets everywhere too, like when we vacuum the house, we've
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: we have to take a broom and sweep first if
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: we haven't vacuum and did more than a week, which
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: occurs regularly because of my overtime.
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: That's just what happens when you have long hair. Yes, well,
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: but my hair is so thin that it's invisible. Lauren
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: is encountering this problem as well. I've no doubt she
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: still encounters hairs all over her place, but I don't
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: know how she even sees them because they're so thin
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: that they're like invisible.
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: You don't see them, you feel them.
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I'm constantly getting them in my mouth when
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: I'm trying to eat. It's awful.
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: Minus like somebody bred me for my head to produce
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: something similar to if you if you combined like silk
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: and kevlar, you get you get my hair and it's
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: not even that thick. It's it's not like it's not
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: like it's it's you know, super super dense or super
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: you know, like big strands, like some of those strands
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: are super thin. But when it gets around the beater
• 5:04
  Speaker 3: bar on the vacuum, We've broken like three or four
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: beater bars on vacuum cleaners. Guys, I am not kidding.
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  Speaker 3: It is insane, and I mean, yes, it is three
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: feet long. My hair is three feet long.
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  Speaker 4: But that's still like it literally snapped.
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: The beater bar is an inch thick and it snapped,
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: so like the last time that happened was that was
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: when I was like, all right, I'm gonna take a broom,
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: and because brooms will sweep the hair into a ball,
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: and then it's my hair. So I can pick up
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: the hair ball and shove it in a trash can
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: and nothing breaks. So there you go.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I dread to think how much of my
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: hair I've eaten over the years. It shouldn't be too
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: much of a problem because because for centuries, indeed for millennia,
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: we've been eating raw animals with their hair still on
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: and we're somehow able to digest. I heard about this
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: one story of this Indian girl who had had a
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: habit of chilling on her own hat.
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, and she got a big hair ball in
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: her gut. Yeah. See, I can't stay getting my hair
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: in my mouth. That will actually make me vomit.
• 6:15
  Speaker 4: So there you go.
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: But speaking of things that make me vomit, we're gonna
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: look at some funding of feminist initiatives today, and this
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: one actually, like I say this, like everything else we've
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: read about didn't piss me off, but this this, it's
• 6:29
  Speaker 3: yet another thing where we've said this is happening in
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: feminist gas light US with you know, oh that's not
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: you know, these things are all privately funded and blah
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: blah blah blah blah. These are you know, universities can
• 6:41
  Speaker 3: fund whatever they want and feminists can do whatever the
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: research they want. You could do your own research and
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: blah blah blah. This is literally funded by a project
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: grant from the US Department of Health and Human Services.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: All Right, So if you don't understand why the funding
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: by the US Department of Health and Human Services is important,
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: the US Department of Health and Human Services funds the
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: National and Partner in Sexual Violence Survey, and these types
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: of surveys and other types of research done by feminist
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  Speaker 3: led research teams that are pretending to do research while
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: they're actually figuring out ways to frame their ideological claims
• 7:30
  Speaker 3: as research. They use that then after it's done and
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: they have a set of statistics that looks real and valid,
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: they take that to Congress and they say, well, we
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  Speaker 3: need a law to prevent this or to make men
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: do this, an obligatory law, a restriction, a change in sentencing,
• 7:55
  Speaker 3: whatever laws that for instance, guidance that prevents prosecuting attorneys
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: from going after liars in court, for instance, if they're
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: if they've lied about being abused or lied about being raped,
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: and then it turns out that the lie is the allegation,
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: not just lying about you know, well I was there
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: to buy drugs, or lying about, you know while I
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: was there because I was cheating on my boyfriend or
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: something like that. But no, the actual allegation itself is
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: a lie. They won't go after them. Those stipulations in
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: policy come from research quote unquote like this that is
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: federally funded. So what I found I decided to look
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: up more on masculinity and femininity because there is a
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: term that feminists use called hostile hostile masculinity, and they
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: also use a term hostile femininity, but it's not defined
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: in the same kind of way. So it's kind of
• 9:07
  Speaker 3: like toxic masculinity and toxic femininity, where toxic masculinity is
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  Speaker 3: behaviors that men engage in that feminists disapprove of because
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  Speaker 3: they on the basis that they they are a detriment
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  Speaker 3: to women. But hostile or toxic femininity is women engaging
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  Speaker 3: in self sacrifice for others sake, or women not following
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  Speaker 3: the sisterhood, you know, that kind of thing. So it's
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  Speaker 3: it's completely not about any detriment that they are to
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  Speaker 3: the opposite sex. It's it's always women are always the
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  Speaker 3: victims of it, men are always the beneficiaries of it.
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  Speaker 2: Let us not forget that the idea that hostile femininity
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  Speaker 2: femininity is some kind of oxymoron, is an affectation of additionalism,
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: the idea that women are naturally demure and submissive. So
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  Speaker 2: how could femininity ever be hostile? Well, yeah, that's the
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  Speaker 2: result of your ideology, and I know the fact that
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: it's been around for a thousands of years since the
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  Speaker 2: advent of chivalry would make it seem like there's no
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  Speaker 2: this thing as hostile femininity. But you know, how bad
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: does this have to get before you come to the
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: conclusion that you were wrong and that yes, femininity could
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: absolutely be hostile. I mean, even Shakespeare tried to warn
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  Speaker 2: us about this with many of his characters Lady Macbeth
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: and all of this it did go back as far
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  Speaker 2: as Eve from that, you know that story that you'll remember.
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  Speaker 2: Eat this apple. You have to eat this apple. The
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: serpent told me, Well, the serpent's hostile and your hostile,
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: and we all fell for it. So yeah, in fact,
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: arguably femininity is even more inherently hostile than masculinity, because
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  Speaker 2: at least men have this notion of fair play. Yes,
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  Speaker 2: they are in charge of war, they are in charge
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  Speaker 2: of combat, but these things have, you know, rules, there
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: are rules to combat. That there's not so many rules
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: to war, but there are still some. There's no rules
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  Speaker 2: to the female version of combat. It's like, no, scratch
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  Speaker 2: out your eyes, scratch out your hair, any dirty tactics
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  Speaker 2: will work. And it's not just in the physical sense,
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: it's in the psychological sense. But there are there are
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: no rules to the hospitality of female conflict. There's there
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: there are no boundaries, not certainly, not in the psychological sense.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: Anything that will destroy you, we will do and and
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: and and Yeah, men have become blind this ever since
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: the age of chivalry. And that's not a misogynistic thing
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: to say much. That's I'm being respectful of women when
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: I say that, I'm not just saying they're perfect angels
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: who would never do anything. No, no, they they're fucking
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: crafty bitches. Be crafty, like be aware you go.
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: And actually, you know, people get the Bible wrong on
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: a lot of accounts, right, But one of the biggest
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: ones that women get wrong is the story of the
• 12:32
  Speaker 3: original sin, the apple and so on, which we we
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: don't actually know that it was that specific kind of fruit,
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: just the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good
• 12:42
  Speaker 3: and evil. Right, So that story, if you remember from
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: from your days as a kid, when it when it
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: first gets told to you, is about the devil in
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: the form of an animal, appealing to Eve's narcissism. Oh,
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: God is hiding this from you.
• 13:07
  Speaker 4: You'll be like God.
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: If you eat this fruit, you'll be just like God.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: It's it's the same as everything that I've said in
• 13:17
  Speaker 3: the past about humans and the concept of sin as
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: a means of explaining stupid choices. Right. Vanity, Vanity is
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: the Devil's favorite sin. Vanity is how we fall every
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: single time. If Eve didn't have a big ego and
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: she didn't want to be like God, and she just
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: wanted to live her life and be happy and enjoy
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: all of the amenities of the Garden of Eden, and
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: if the devil hadn't been able to convince her that
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: something great that she deserved because she was great was
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: being kept from her, we would never be having this conversation,
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: at least not if we are to believe everything that
• 14:12
  Speaker 3: we read about that particular incident. And I, you know, personally,
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: I see no reason not to if you look at
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: the history of women's screw ups, right, even the stupid
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: screw up I had that started to show late. I
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: didn't double check my work. I didn't double check when
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: I set the alarm. I know damn well that every
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: time I've screwed up that alarm, it's because I've set
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: for AM when I meant PM or vice versa. And
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: I didn't think it was important at that moment. I
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: didn't feel like, oh, I'm you know, no, I did
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: did it right this time? Didn't do it right this time,
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: didn't double check? Whoops, vanity is my favorite sin. Right,
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: I'm good enough, I did it right, no double checking, Eve,
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: I'm good enough. I should be like, God, give me
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: that goddamn fruit. That's that's how women fuck everything up.
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: And the difference between women and men is that when
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: men do that, and they do there are men who
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: do that, right, they get called on it by everybody.
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: You fucking arrogant bastard, Look what you did. Right, When
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: women do it, people are like, Oh, don't embarrass her,
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: it's no big deal.
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she didn't mean to. It was an innocent mistake.
• 15:37
  Speaker 3: You know, even little things like you know, Joe and
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: Janet both go walking through cvs. Both of them have
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: on a pair of pants that are too long. Both
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: of them have rolled up the pants at the at
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: the foot, so there's a cuff and the cuff sticks
• 15:56
  Speaker 3: out a little bit. Both of them walk through I
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: don't know, the aisle that has all the little medicines,
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: and both of them knock one little tube of medicine
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: off the shelf by accident with the edge of their
• 16:09
  Speaker 3: cuff and it falls down into the cuff of their pants. Right,
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: both of them get flagged on their way out the door.
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: Both of them get accused of shoplifting, right Joe. Joe
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: is going to explain himself but generally accept the consequences
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: or specifically talk about evidence if if he is accused, and.
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: To use of your previous president. Yeah, there we go
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: admit to any of his mistakes.
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: No, but yeah, like he'll he'll say, oh, gosh, I
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: didn't mean to do that. I'm so sorry. Here, I'm
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: not taking it, or he'll offer to pay for it,
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: or he'll say, well, what is the video show? Does
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: the video show something that indicates I did this on purpose?
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: Because I know you have video on those aisles, right,
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: But no, Janis, She's going to be like, I didn't
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: do that, you did this to me. I'm a victim
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: of this situation.
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: Howard are you?
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: And uh, you know you you're clearly holding against me
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: something that was beyond my control. And I'm gonna sue, right,
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: That's that's where she's gonna go with it. She is
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: not going to say, oh, I'm so sorry, I didn't
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: mean to do that. What does the evidence show, I'll
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: pay for it. None of that's going to come out
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: of her mouth. She's gonna deny, right, She's going to accuse,
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: and she's gonna reverse victim and offender. It's going to attack,
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: and that's it. That's that's the difference, because she's going
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: to make it all about herself and he's going to
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: make it all about the misunderstanding and attempt to fix things.
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: He's humble, she's vain.
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: So that's what that's kind of what.
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: We're dealing with here as well. Right this, I when
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: I look up masculinity and femininity, because of that difference
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: in the way masculine and femininity are masculinity and femininity
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: are treated by feminists, I thought i'd find more stuff
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: about like so called toxic masculinity. R. What I found was,
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: there's a lot of grants that are focused on masculinity,
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: and there's a few grants that are focused on femininity,
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: and interestingly enough, some of them are the same grants.
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: This is one of those. So this is the Department
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: of Humans, Health and Human Services funding.
• 18:39
  Speaker 4: A study.
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: By a student at Wayne State University. They they threw
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: two point seven million dollars in obligated funding. It's a
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: million one point seven has been spent for this study.
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: And this this.
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: Paragraph, I'm not reading it from here because I hate
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: all caps. But I looked up, like I looked through it,
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: and then I looked up what this initiative is because
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: this first sentence here is the name of the study
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: Alcohol's effects on effective cognitive and behavioral responses in a
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: virtual reality dating simulation.
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: So this is the.
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: Actual report, the actual not report of the study because
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: it's in the process of being done according to its timeline.
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: But this is the proposal. This is on the National
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: Institutes for Health website in ih dot gov. It's reporter
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: dot in ih dot gov. And you'll see this link
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: in lowbar or at least it should be in the lowbar.
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: Alcohol's effects on effective cogn bitiven behavioral responses. And if
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: you are dating simulation, this is the project number.
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: I feel attacked.
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, there we go, and cash trying to hate
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: when websites do this. Oh you didn't want to see
• 20:15
  Speaker 3: the top of what you were looking at, right, We're
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: gonna have this header cover it. So let me see.
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: I'm going to move our window up, let me unlock it,
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: move it up, and we'll just cover We'll just hide
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: the header. We don't need a header anyway, all right, abstract,
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: Approximately half of all sexual assaults involve alcohol consumption by
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: the perpetrator, victim, or both. So that's the first sentence,
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: all right, I want you to think about this. Approximately
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: half of all sexual or sexual assaults involve alcohol consumption
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: by the purpose trader victim or both both? Right?
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: This is.
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, this is well, there's there's two questions here, right,
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: because if a woman consumes alcohol, her consent is considered invalid. Right,
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: So if a man consumes alcohol, why isn't his consent
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: also presumed invalid? The next question becomes with with alcohol
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: or with sexual assaults, because when you look at statistics
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: that feminists promote on sexual assaults, they come from a
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: survey that counts it as a sexual assault. If you
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: had sex with someone you didn't plan to have sex
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: with because they gave you alcohol, right, even if you
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: didn't drink it, or because they did you a favor
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: and you felt obligated, or you know, because they misled
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: you about something, so they consider you a rape victim.
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: If you're female, If a guy lies to you while
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: he's drunk and you have sex with him, you have
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: sex with a drunk guy. He can be a rapist,
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: even if you were sober.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: Is there any drunk Is there any drug that can
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: make someone less susceptible to sexual advances? You would think
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: there would be, because not every drug makes you less inhibited.
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: There are many that make you more inhibited. It's sort
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: of depending on the situation. There are many drugs that
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: can make you more paranoid. Almost all of them are
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: illegal up to an including Class A. I mean, weed
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: is one of them. It depends on the recipient. But
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: we're as well known for making people more paranoid. And
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: and the even stronger psychedelics, such as mushrooms are acid
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: can make you even more paranoid. And if you find
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: yourself in a situation that makes you paranoid, you're sort
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: of more attempted to sort of run away and stuff.
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: But if this is ever reported to the police, like
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: he gave her mushrooms, they would go, oh, well, this
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: obviously made more imped more susceptible to persuasion. And yes,
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: in some situations it is, I mean arguably in most situations.
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: But is there any drug that the police or indeed
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: the legislative branch would say does not count well as
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: a sort of date rate. No, because every drug does
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: impair you in some sort of way.
• 23:50
  Speaker 4: There there there there are.
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: Drug Indeed here I should stop.
• 23:56
  Speaker 3: There are some drugs that actually cause excessive wedding and
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: body odor that might that might make someone so offensive
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: to other people that the rapists couldn't stand to get
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: close enough to commit the crime. But but aside from that,
• 24:16
  Speaker 3: nothing that I can think of.
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: I suppose drug alcohol is higuably one of those drugs.
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: Alcohol can make you more assertive, It can release your inhibitions,
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: but it can do it in a way that makes
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: you more assertive. Yeah, and it sort of makes you go, no,
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: fuck you, I'd rather fight you than fuck you. Yeah,
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: it's true, that is true. It has the effect amongst
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: same sexes, like men who drink alcohol amongst each other,
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna start fucking each other. They're gonna start fighting
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: each other.
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: Same with women, well, especially if one of them makes
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: an advance and the other one is not keen on
• 24:53
  Speaker 3: it like that, that will result in an ass kicking
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: one direction or the other.
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: Theoretically, this think could happen with men and women yep,
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: like alcohol could could put them more on that God.
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: And see, I don't know.
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: I never situation been drunk drunk. I got tipsy once
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: and I didn't like it. So I don't like being
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: off balance, and I don't like feeling like I'm not
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: fully in control so of myself anyway, I don't have
• 25:24
  Speaker 3: to be in control of everything else. But but yeah,
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: so my question my thinking on this, Like when you
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: look at this, this is a statement that a man
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: can be too drunk to consent to sex by the
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: standards that would be applied to a woman and still
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: be called a rapist if he engages in a non
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: violent sex act with a woman and she later then
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: accuses him of rape. This is what feminists used to
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: promote the idea that being drunk unk doesn't get a
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: guy out of a rape charge. Self report surveys conducted
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: with victims and perpetrators have provided valuable information about alcohol's
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: role in sexual assault. However, causality cannot be established from
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: correlational designs. In other words, correlation is not causation. When
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: participants are randomly assigned to drink conditions and laboratory studies
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: causual conclusions can be made regarding the effects of acute
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: alcohol consumption on behavior. The major challenge for experimentalists is
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: to develop proxies for sexual assault that have been strong,
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: that have strong construct validity and experimental realism. Virtual reality
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: environments provide the opportunity for participants to become immersed in
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: the simulated environment. Thus, participants are expected to behave in
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: ways and to make choices that closely relate to their
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: behavior outside the laboratory. This drives me nuts. There we go,
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: so I think that should should still be showing. The
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: tough thing is that the print will be really small
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: on on your screen. But uh, I don't wanna. I
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: don't want to lose the print off the edges here,
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: so I'm gonna have to keep it that way. Virtual
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: reality environments provide the opportunity for participants to become immersed. Thus,
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: participants are expected to behave in ways make choices that
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: closely relate to their behavior outside the laboratory. So here's
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: here's the first problem. Right, I'm like everybody that listens
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: that's a gamer will understand this. Right, you can become
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: completely immersed in a game that you're playing completely and
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: you will still do things that you would not do
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: in real life, right, because you know it's a game.
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: And I'm not just talking about accepting the reality of
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: dragons and elves and monsters and physics that don't apply
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: in a real world and things like that weapons or
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: it did the.
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: Very idea of killing. Right, That's the point I've read
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: many times, like five year olds can play a video
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: game and be like ha ha, you killed me, ha ha,
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: I killed you, and that they're completely on deard with
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: the idea of murdering. They realized that it's not actual murder,
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: it's just nullifying one of the objects on screen and
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: then resetting to the point where they're no longer like nullified.
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: They can tell the difference between like actually killing a
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: human being and killing a computer character.
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: They are safe and their solid knowledge that there is
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: no real world impact for their action.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: It's just play. Like, no one understands play better than children.
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: They can play anything, including being a boy or a girl.
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so they're basically taking people, They're putting them in
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: an environment that they know is not real, and then
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: they're going to measure their behavior in that environment and
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: attribute a likelihood of engaging in that behavior and real
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: world to those same people. Right, there are virtual reality
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: first person shooter games where it's just it's the same
• 29:35
  Speaker 3: thing almost as what we used to do. Gen X
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: used to do as kids. We had a game we
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: called Guns. That was the game. The name of the
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: game was Guns. We're playing Guns, and that was essentially
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: a free for all shootout with with not real guns. Right,
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: you had everything from plastic guns, like toy guns that
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: didn't fire any projectile of any kind, squirt guns, and
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: like little pellet guns that would fire a pellet, but
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: it was just enough to that you knew you were
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: hit by something if something actually you know, was on target.
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: Two When we ran out, we had kids that held
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: gun shaped sticks, and a lot of times you would
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: just point the gun at somebody in yell bang, and
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: then there was argument over whether or not the person missed,
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: unless they had a pellet gun, in which case you know,
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: you knew. And I mean we were a little rougher
• 30:34
  Speaker 3: than that in my neighborhood. We fought with bb guns.
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: You just didn't shoot anybody in the face because you know,
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: you can put someone's eye out with a baby. We
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: didn't have nerf guns yet. That was I think in
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: the nineties when those things came out. It might have
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: been in the eighties, but none of none of the
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: kids in my neighborhood had them. I think they may
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: have been a little more expensive and our parents could
• 31:01
  Speaker 3: afford if they existed. Most of us, though, like we
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: had squirt guns and stuff. In the summertime, we played
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: with scuore guns all the time, but yeah, there are
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: there are now VR games that are basically that game.
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: And you know, you have the same issue of you
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: get hit and you get quote unquote killed and you're
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: down for a particular period of time, and then you
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: re enter the game because it's not real. You didn't
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: actually die. Your character's not even permanently eliminated. Yeah, yeah,
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: they're skeptic, says the honest. Kids would make a ricochet
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: sound when they when they knew they missed.
• 31:46
  Speaker 4: True. True, there's a lot of.
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: Fun pretend with those things, and we all knew that
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: that there was a huge difference between playing with them
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: and pointing a real gun at a person.
• 31:57
  Speaker 4: You just didn't do that.
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: In fact, if you're fine had guns or your mother
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: had guns, because in our house my mother had guns,
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: you didn't touch them. That was a no no. You
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: might get your ass whipped if you touch them, And
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: it was it was scarier to face the possibility of
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: a parent finding out that you touched the real guns.
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: Then it was to face the possibility of death as
• 32:22
  Speaker 3: somebody screwed up with the real guns.
• 32:24
  Speaker 4: Like that was. That was the way it was.
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: So the the stats that you see today on kids
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: playing with guns and shooting each other. I think a
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: lot of that is because of the deterioration of discipline
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: in homes and the fact that in a lot of
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: instances there isn't a dad there because you know, he
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: is in a lot of ways the enforcer. But yeah,
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: that recognition and that differentiation between real and not real
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: unless that has deteriorated so badly in the Zoomer generation
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: that they genuinely should not have games. This experiment is
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: already bad, just based on the fact that they're putting
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: people in a VR environment and then treating their behavior
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: in the VR environment that they know as a VR
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: environment as if it is indicative of what they would
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: do in real life in that same circumstance. That's a problem. See.
• 33:36
  Speaker 3: The goal of the proposed research there we go is
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: to build on the promising findings from PLS recent reaching
• 33:45
  Speaker 3: or recent R twenty one. Grant and I haven't looked
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: that up yet, developed a dating simulation as a new
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: experimental paradigm for examining alcohol's role and acquaintance sexual assault
• 33:56
  Speaker 3: perpetration committed by men against when so they've framed it specifically,
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: this is only about male perpetration, right, So this research
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: that's being funded the funding of this research. The entire
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: goal here is to frame sexual assault that takes place
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: because of alcohol, because of alcohol consumption, as something that
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: men do to women, not something that can happen to
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: both sexes, not something that can be done by both sexes.
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: Just whenever there's alcohol involved, the guy is a rapist.
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: That's your federal government funded that, right. The first specific
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: aim involves enhancing the VR dating simulation based on insights
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: from our empirical findings and new techno logical developments. It
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: will be three dimensional, with participants wearing head mountain displays
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: that immerse them in the virtual world with their female companion.
• 35:11
  Speaker 3: The second involves systematically evaluating the impact of situational cues
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: manipulated within the virtual reality environment, which are expected to
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: evoke the in the moment cognitions and feelings that are
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: hypothesized to increase the likelihood of sexual aggression among men
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: predisposed to be sexually aggressive. So, again, specifically, they are
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: framing this as something only men do and only women experience. Right,
• 35:45
  Speaker 3: there is no equivalent. Women do this too, So they've
• 35:52
  Speaker 3: got this experiment, right, They're putting men in this environment
• 35:57
  Speaker 3: that they know is not real. They're assailing them with
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: in the moment cues probably stuff that indicates, you know,
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: in normal circumstances, that indicates consent. Right, the woman flirts
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: with them, the woman acts receptive, and so on, and
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: but she's but he knows she's drunk, and therefore anything
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: he does then is considered sexually aggressive.
• 36:31
  Speaker 4: The third specific.
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: Game involves examining the effects of acute alcohol consumption on
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: men's sexually aggressive responses. Then the virtual simulation, based on
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: the findings from studies associated with specific game, two situational
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: factors will be manipulated, resulting in a two alcohol conditions
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: sober versus intoxicated target. So in other words, they're they're uh,
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: they're looking at this from the perspective of is he
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: drunk or from the perspective of is she drunk? Higher
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: low level qu that affects participants perceptions of the woman's
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: sexual interest. So if he's drunk and she flirts, or
• 37:24
  Speaker 3: if she seems drunk and she flirts, versus higher low
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: level cues that affect participants sense of entitlement and anger
• 37:33
  Speaker 3: after a refusal. And this is again right here, this
• 37:39
  Speaker 3: is a feminist assumption. Right, So they're going to take scenarios.
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: This is again the welfared Department Health and Human Services
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: is the welfare department. The welfare deartment department funded a
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: study in which they are going to put guys in
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: a virtual reality environment they know is not real with
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: indicate indicators that the girl is drunk, or they are
• 38:11
  Speaker 3: going to get the guy drunk and uh, and then
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: they are going to have a girl flirt with him.
• 38:18
  Speaker 3: And and either they're going to have a sober guy
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: reacting to a drunk girl flirting, or they're going to
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: have a drunk guy reacting when a girl who has
• 38:29
  Speaker 3: been flirting with him suddenly is no longer receptive, and
• 38:36
  Speaker 3: that they consider that normal.
• 38:39
  Speaker 5: I would think that, you know, just the fact that
• 38:43
  Speaker 5: they're going into this knowing that it's not a real situation,
• 38:47
  Speaker 5: that this is this is made up, This is all fictional.
• 38:52
  Speaker 5: You can't possibly get an accurate reaction out of these people.
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: So how in any way, shape or fan is this
• 38:59
  Speaker 5: supposed to be scientific in nature?
• 39:03
  Speaker 3: Now? Already it doesn't seem scientific. No, no, But they're
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: clearly trying to manipulate men into certain behaviors, right, They're
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: pushing men into flirting back and engaging in you know,
• 39:20
  Speaker 3: like the pursuing behaviors that men engage in when they're
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: interested in a gal and she seems receptive, and then
• 39:28
  Speaker 3: they're pushing men into reacting while drunk when a gal
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: that has seemed receptive suddenly starts acting bitchy instead, and
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: they're put they're doing this in an environment the guy
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: knows is not real, And the question becomes are they
• 39:48
  Speaker 3: telling them what the experiment is or are they just saying, Hey,
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: we got this VR game you can play.
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: Check this out.
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: Oh, but you got to drink a beer first, you know, because.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: Again there's this age old assumption that the female sexual
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: experience sexual experience is inherently receptive, and that the male
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: sexually experiences inherently what's the word penetrative? I would say
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: it's often assumed that the word fuck means for a
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: penis to fuck a vagina. But again, that's that dates
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: back to the to the chivalry problem, that it's it's
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: men that do things to women and it's women that
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: receive things from men. But you could just as easily
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: portray it in the opposite direction. I mean, how does
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: a penis not receive a vagina. I mean, vagina certainly
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: doesn't penetrate a penis, but it envelops a penis, if you,
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: if you want to use the proactive terminology, and in
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: that sense, a penis can be receptive two a vagina.
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: In the same way that a person can be receptive
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: to a hug.
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: Exactly exactly in either direction or in both or neither.
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: We've just got so used to this idea that that
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: men fuck women and not the other way around. Yep,
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: even though it's clearly both you're you're you're both doing
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: the fucking, you're both doing the receiving, shall we.
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: Say, yeah, yep and uh and in in terms of
• 41:47
  Speaker 3: this simulation and this this experiment that's completely being ignored, right,
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: The whole underlying scaffolding of this is the idea that
• 41:59
  Speaker 3: in a sectual encounter, men only pursue, women are only pursued,
• 42:07
  Speaker 3: and if someone's in the wrong, it's always only the man.
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: Nothing that women do that is aggressive, rude, or dishonest
• 42:19
  Speaker 3: is abuse, But anything a man does that a woman
• 42:23
  Speaker 3: objects to is abuse. So if she is aggressive, rude,
• 42:27
  Speaker 3: and dishonest with him and he responds with any type
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: of objection at all, even just walking away and saying, Okay,
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: you're being a bitch. I don't have anything to do
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: with you. That's him being rapie, not her wasting his time.
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: So if you know a guy's flirting with you, you
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: have flirted back, you've gotten him to buy you two
• 42:53
  Speaker 3: or three drinks, and then all of a sudden you
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: turn off the affection because you've gotten what you wanted
• 42:58
  Speaker 3: and you don't want anything else from him. There's nothing
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: wrong with that, ladies, according to this behavioral study. But
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: if he gets upset that you just got thirty or
• 43:11
  Speaker 3: forty bucks worth of drinks out of him and by
• 43:15
  Speaker 3: by pretending to be interested, and then all of a
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: sudden you walked away and quit flirting with him because
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: you've tapped him out, that's him being rape That's the
• 43:28
  Speaker 3: idea that they're trying to promote here. So this then
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: they support quote unquote, support this with the following okay,
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: and it's all showing on the screen. Get risk. Factors
• 43:41
  Speaker 3: associated with sexual assault perpetration will be assessed in a
• 43:44
  Speaker 3: separate session and are expected to interact with alcohol and
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: Q conditions. And Q conditions again are flirting, flirting or
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: not flirting? Right and Flirting can include anything from batting
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: eyelights and saying sweet things to dressing with a purpose
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: of getting people to look at your body and then
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: moving to emphasize that your particular interest is in this
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: guy in particular, looking at your body, like wiggling a hip,
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: raising the hem of your skirt, bending forward to show
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: more cleavage, all the things that we ladies do when
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: we want to command a man's attention, because we know
• 44:27
  Speaker 3: those visual cues like our are are like cocaine into
• 44:33
  Speaker 3: a guy.
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: We know that.
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: So yeah, all of this is again coded language, right,
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: so Q conditions such that, oh, go ahead, I thought
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: somebody was starting.
• 44:54
  Speaker 4: To talk, No, okay, not only I was muted, okay.
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: Such that in talk cicated men who are predisposed to
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: sexual aggression, example, high pre existing levels of hostile masculinity
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: and exposed to sexual interest and entitlement slash anger cues.
• 45:14
  Speaker 3: In other words, again, this woman demonstrates an interest in
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: you and then cuts it off without warning or any
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: obvious reason. That's what they mean when they say exposed
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: to sexual interest and entitlement. Slash anger cues are hypothesized
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: to be most likely to be sexually aggressive. Further, studies
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: can alter aspects of the simulation to increase generalizability to
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: different populations. They want to be able to accuse as
• 45:46
  Speaker 3: many men as possible. That's what that means. The applicant's
• 45:49
  Speaker 3: long term goal is to identify modifiable risk and protective
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: factors that can be used to develop evidence based prevention
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: and treatment interventions to reduce sexual violence. So what they're
• 45:59
  Speaker 3: looking for, what they're trying to justify here, and this
• 46:01
  Speaker 3: is another key factor. Right, when somebody is accused of
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: a sexual assault and then they get arrested and they
• 46:14
  Speaker 3: get charged with the crime and prosecuted, they get a
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: psychic val as part of the prosecution, and that psychic
• 46:23
  Speaker 3: val determines their mentality for the court system, and in
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: a way that is used to indicate that it's likely
• 46:35
  Speaker 3: that they're guilty because they have certain attitudes or beliefs
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: or you know, that they have certain levels of feelings
• 46:41
  Speaker 3: and stuff like that. Men aren't allowed to have feelings, right,
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: And then after the case is over, after the hearing
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: is over, if they have been convicted, then they are
• 46:53
  Speaker 3: subjected to a perpetrator program. And I know at least
• 46:58
  Speaker 3: one guy who was falsely convicted who was forced to
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: go through that kind of perpetrator program before his conviction
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: was basically overturned, and that program gaslighted him so badly
• 47:16
  Speaker 3: that he lost his mind and his behavior thereafter was
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: completely different than his prior behavior, and he basically just
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: went nuts, like started to do an unrealistic shit. I'm
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: thinking that he was going to succeed with it and stuff,
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: but yeah, in any case, that's what they're doing. They're
• 47:42
  Speaker 3: looking for things to add to these perpetrator programs to gaslightmen.
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: You have these attitudes and beliefs. So when I looked
• 47:51
  Speaker 3: into this and I thought, all right, what the hell
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: is hostile masculinity? So I started looking into a looked
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: it up on Google, and of course Google has this
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: nice little AI assistant that goes through these various publications
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: that have already been like, you have everything from PubMed here,
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: Birmingham University, Springer, which is a conglomerate of various research
• 48:22
  Speaker 3: papers and stuff, UCLA communication Sage journals, and other sort
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: of depository of different research. You can find a lot
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: of stuff for free on Springer that is behind paywalls
• 48:39
  Speaker 3: and other locations and stuff. But so hostile masculinity, what
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: the AI assistant gleaned from this set of publications is
• 48:51
  Speaker 3: that it is a personal personality profile that includes attitudes
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: and behaviors that can lead to sexual aggression. So it's specifically,
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: it's specifically defining masculinity as rape. That is what the
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: term does. It defines masculinity as rape. It goes on
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: to say that it's characterized by a need for dominance, distrust,
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: and hostility toward women, and then it has a whole
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: set of components and risk factors. Goes on sexual dominance,
• 49:24
  Speaker 3: hostility toward women, adversarial sexual beliefs, rape myth acceptance, and
• 49:29
  Speaker 3: acceptance of interpersonal violence. Which you kind of wonder about
• 49:35
  Speaker 3: these last two last ones because so rape myth acceptance,
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: for instance, what constitutes a rape myth is defined by
• 49:48
  Speaker 3: feminists who consider a woman's given consent invalidated by her
• 49:54
  Speaker 3: lade later withdrawal of it. So if you stay the
• 50:00
  Speaker 3: belief that when a woman consents to sex, it's fair
• 50:05
  Speaker 3: for a man to take her at her word and
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: believe her, that's that's considered a rape myth. Right, So
• 50:13
  Speaker 3: if you if you accept that, you're engaging in hostile
• 50:17
  Speaker 3: masculinity right there. According to feminists an acceptance of interpersonal
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: violence a belief that forces a legitimate way to establish compliance. Right,
• 50:28
  Speaker 3: they say that, But then if you accept that violence
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: is a thing that exists in society that you should
• 50:34
  Speaker 3: be prepared to avoid or defend yourself from, that's also
• 50:39
  Speaker 3: considered acceptance of interpersonal violence. So, for instance, acknowledging that
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: walking through certain neighborhoods increases your risk of getting mugged,
• 50:49
  Speaker 3: especially if you look like you might have money, that's
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: that's acceptance of interpersonal violence. And therefore you're a rapei bastard.
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: So y'all better get get cracked and go into a
• 51:02
  Speaker 3: gang neighborhood in in expensive clothing with those shoes that
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: guys are shooting each other over this year again, and uh,
• 51:10
  Speaker 3: don't don't assume that you might get mug there, because
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: that makes you a rapee bastard. Like that's basically a
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: feminist attitude.
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, when a woman says yes, it doesn't mean yes.
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: It means to be confirmed. When a woman says no,
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: it doesn't mean no. It means to be confirmed, and
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: not even to be confirmed by her, It means to
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: be confirmed by the state. Isn't there someone you forgot
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: to ask.
• 51:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's.
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: Not even Jesus, and it's not even her family, like
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: like these things were apparently back in the olden days.
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: It's the state gets to decide whether a woman's consent
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: counts or not. Ah, good times.
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: Well, and you know if if woman says yes and
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: then the state decides that she didn't mean it and
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: you disagree and you argue, that makes you a rape
• 52:11
  Speaker 3: bastard and indicates that you're guilty.
• 52:17
  Speaker 5: Unbelievable, I mean, and I'd love this attitude, you know
• 52:22
  Speaker 5: how they feel that they have just the moral high ground.
• 52:25
  Speaker 1: Well, if we tell you these things, then you know.
• 52:28
  Speaker 5: It's it's it's going to deter you from committing this
• 52:33
  Speaker 5: heinous act.
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: Right. Well, no, that's that is laughable.
• 52:37
  Speaker 5: That's like the people who put several locks on their
• 52:41
  Speaker 5: doors or their cars.
• 52:42
  Speaker 1: And all these alarms and shit.
• 52:44
  Speaker 5: Anyone who wants to steal from you is going to
• 52:47
  Speaker 5: find a way to do it. They are not going
• 52:50
  Speaker 5: to be deterred by anything that you do to them,
• 52:54
  Speaker 5: you know, or put it in their way. If they
• 52:58
  Speaker 5: want a thing, a thief is going to try and
• 53:00
  Speaker 5: steal it. You know, you can't you can't train a
• 53:04
  Speaker 5: criminal to not be a criminal.
• 53:09
  Speaker 3: In fact, if you've got a lot of locks on
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: your door, you know what they do. They wait until
• 53:15
  Speaker 3: you come home at a time when there isn't a
• 53:19
  Speaker 3: bunch of neighbors out and about in your neighborhood, and
• 53:22
  Speaker 3: they come quietly behind you with a gun and they
• 53:25
  Speaker 3: make you let them into the house.
• 53:28
  Speaker 4: Yep, a gun, you say, yep, that that.
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: Kind of thing has happened. To wear a knife, or.
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: They don't bother with any of the They just rip
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: you out of your home. They just stick their foot
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: in your door when you're trying to get in. Yeah,
• 53:44
  Speaker 2: and then they people you out into the street and
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: then they get you arrested for being racist.
• 53:51
  Speaker 3: Yep, or they go after In fact, they don't have
• 53:56
  Speaker 3: to to take your stuff out of your house, right
• 54:01
  Speaker 3: They get into your bank account. They don't even need
• 54:04
  Speaker 3: access to you. They don't need access to your phone,
• 54:06
  Speaker 3: they don't need access to your computer. All they got
• 54:10
  Speaker 3: to do is have access to the right group of
• 54:12
  Speaker 3: people that warehouses your information along with a shit ton
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: of other people, and they get access to your bank account. Right.
• 54:24
  Speaker 3: But yeah, In terms of all of this, the upshot
• 54:28
  Speaker 3: is that feminists have created a framework by which they
• 54:33
  Speaker 3: can define rape as something strictly a male behavior, strictly
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: a female experience at the hands of men. That it
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: doesn't matter when women do it, and that normal male
• 54:48
  Speaker 3: behavior being the person who pursues in a relationship, which
• 54:54
  Speaker 3: they define as a desire to control, right expectations that
• 55:00
  Speaker 3: it women will not be assholes and and yeah, Derek
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: Workman points out, they can steal your house now they
• 55:08
  Speaker 3: electronically they can steal your house, but the women will
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: not lie to you. That women will not fake interest
• 55:16
  Speaker 3: and then get money out of you and walk away,
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: and things like that. Those expectations are deemed rape when
• 55:23
  Speaker 3: men have them. When when men don't trust women, that's
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: deemed rape. When men don't like women, that's deemed rape. Right.
• 55:34
  Speaker 3: When men believe that women exploit them after women have
• 55:40
  Speaker 3: exploited them over and over again, that's inherently rape, according to.
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: These When men refuse to have sex with women.
• 55:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we've been told that actually on social media by
• 55:54
  Speaker 3: feminists arguing that denying women what they want is sex
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: fuel abuse. If women want to be a little hoe
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: for a minute, Uh, and you say not with me,
• 56:09
  Speaker 3: you're a rapist without ever having sex with them. If
• 56:15
  Speaker 3: you say I'm sorry, you're gonna find somebody else. I'm gay,
• 56:20
  Speaker 3: that's rapey. Seriously, Yeah, John Doe, gays are crapy, uh,
• 56:30
  Speaker 3: but they're very nice. There we go.
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: You don't have to say crapy.
• 56:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I know. I don't like it either, but we're.
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: Not monetized anyway. Rape, rape, rape, suicide, suicide, suicide, Hitler, Hitler, Nazis, Nazis.
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: Nobody gives up.
• 56:50
  Speaker 3: That that, by the way, is an order of of
• 56:52
  Speaker 3: operations or not operations, but a full sentence.
• 56:57
  Speaker 4: Rape suicide, Hitler, Nazis. You've just been told what to do.
• 57:05
  Speaker 3: Just just make sure that you're dealing with Hitler Nazis
• 57:08
  Speaker 3: and not just people you just don't like. Don't don't
• 57:12
  Speaker 3: be from the Everything I don't like is Nazi, and
• 57:16
  Speaker 3: everything you say makes you Hitler School of debate exception.
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: Acceptance of interpersonal violence is an interesting thing too, because
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: if you go to statistics on UH domestic violence, the
• 57:30
  Speaker 3: overwhelming majority of cases are female perpetrated, female initiated, Right
• 57:37
  Speaker 3: you have, Oh yeah, John Doe points out his comment
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: can still get filtered.
• 57:43
  Speaker 4: That's true.
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: It bugs me though, all right, because if I'm not
• 57:48
  Speaker 3: uncomfortable with you saying it. It's it's it should be
• 57:52
  Speaker 3: all right.
• 57:53
  Speaker 4: I am arguably the one person who who should.
• 58:00
  Speaker 3: Be able to make it okay. It's like like getting
• 58:04
  Speaker 3: the N word passed from a black person. I am
• 58:07
  Speaker 3: a rape victim, Well, I was a rape victim. I
• 58:09
  Speaker 3: am a rape survivor. Hey, I was raped at gunpoint, right.
• 58:14
  Speaker 3: I was molested as a child and I was violently
• 58:17
  Speaker 3: raped by another kid as a child. So I have
• 58:21
  Speaker 3: male perpetrators. I have female perpetrators in my past. Nothing
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: that happened to me happened after I was an adult either.
• 58:27
  Speaker 3: It was all childhood trauma, childhood and adolescence. The gunpoint
• 58:32
  Speaker 3: one was was in my adolescence, and it was because
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: I was hanging out with criminals and they committed a
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: crime against me. Huge surprise, guys, If you hang out
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: with criminals, you might become a crime victim. Just so
• 58:46
  Speaker 3: you know.
• 58:48
  Speaker 4: But please jo.
• 58:52
  Speaker 3: Like all other channels where we're allowed to talk more like,
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: all of these things that happened me were horrible when
• 59:02
  Speaker 3: they happened, and it took me a long time to
• 59:04
  Speaker 3: recover from them. But the one thing that I've maintained
• 59:07
  Speaker 3: throughout that time period, throughout that recovery. Is that line
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: right from Labyrinth? You have no power over me. It's
• 59:17
  Speaker 3: not happening to me now, they're not doing it to
• 59:19
  Speaker 3: me now, none of them have access to me. Now,
• 59:23
  Speaker 3: I'm sure as fuck not giving them the power to
• 59:26
  Speaker 3: re traumatize me by being afraid of a word A word.
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: I mean, come on, it's one of these things that
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: if we can't talk about it, we can't stop it
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: from happening again. We can't stop it from happening to
• 59:43
  Speaker 3: other people. We can't stop other people from suffering because
• 59:47
  Speaker 3: of it.
• 59:48
  Speaker 4: So you're damn right.
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: I am a thriver, and no, I wish that stuff
• 59:55
  Speaker 3: didn't happen to me. I wish that I never experienced
• 59:58
  Speaker 3: any of it. Am I still afraid of it? No?
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 3: You know, Am I still suffering trauma today? No? I
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 3: mean shit, it was thirty years ago, plus most of
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 3: it was most of it was more than forty years ago.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 3: I'm not that much of a whip guys, But yeah,
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 3: I understand YouTube might hide your comment, censor your comment.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 3: I'm just gonna call it what it is because that
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: is censorship if you use that word. But nobody should
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 3: be afraid to use it in front of me. It's bullshit.
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: It's just a word when you're saying it. The concept
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: is something that we have to deal with because it
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 3: happens in real life, and if we just use new
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 3: speak glass that over, we are doing a terrible disservice
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 3: to everyone who has experienced it. Male female, adult, child
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 3: doesn't matter. If we can't examine what people have done
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 3: and what has happened to people, and look for remedies
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 3: and to deal with it honestly, then it's going to
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: go on forever.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: Through dangers, I'm told, and hardships unnumbered. I have fought
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 2: my way head to the castle beyond the Goblin City
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: to take back the child you have stolen, for my
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 2: will is as strong as yours, and my kingdom is
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: as great altogether.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 3: Now you have no power over me, yep, And that
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 3: is my attitude wholeheartedly. You can't make me afraid. Only
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 3: I can make me afraid, and I'm not gonna do it.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: So yeah, but this is the take on hostile masculinity.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 3: I went to look at Groc too. I asked Groc
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 3: a whole bunch of questions. But we aren't gonna read
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 3: the whole thing later, probably after we're done with the
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 3: video that we're going through now. In after shows, I
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: will I'll go through the entire Grock conversation here, but
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 3: I will read this part. So I asked Groc what's
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: the meaning of the feminist term hostile masculinity? And Groc
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 3: had an answer. The feminist term hostile masculinity refers to
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 3: a specific expression of masculinity that is characterized by aggression, dominance,
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 3: and hostility, particularly toward women, are those perceived as challenging
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 3: traditional gender norms. It's often used to describe behaviors or
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 3: attitudes that reinforce patriarchal power structures through intimidation, violence, or
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 3: suppression of others, especially women or non conforming individuals. In
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: feminist theory, hostile masculinity is typically contrasted with healthier or
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 3: more equitable forms of masculinity. So the Goufus and Gallant
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 3: school of behavioral modification right, Guphis is toxic and hostile,
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 3: and Gallant is manageable. It's linked to concepts like toxic masculinity,
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 3: though the two aren't identical. Hostile masculinity specifically emphasizes overt
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 3: aggression or antagonism and of course, toxic masculinity has a
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 3: whole range of things scholars and activists might point out.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 3: Might point to examples like misogynistic rhetoric, sexual harassment, or
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 3: physical violence as manifestations of this phenomenon. The term comes
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 3: up in discussions about how societal expectations of men to
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 3: be tough, unemotional, or controlling can foster attitudes arm both
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 3: women and men themselves. It's not saying all masculinity is bad,
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 3: just that this particular flavor is destructive. So then you know,
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 3: I looked up hostile femininity, right, Well, obviously you know
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 3: we've we've had this discussion about hostile masculinity and toxic masculinity,
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 3: and it's clearly antagonistic toward women, right, So what is
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 3: hostile femininity? According to Google's AI, hostile femininity is a
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 3: personality trait that describes a woman who is hostile toward
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 3: other women. Right, Your man, your hostile. Your hostile masculinity
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 3: makes you hostile toward the opposite sex. If you're a woman,
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: hostile femininity makes you hostile toward the same sex. It
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 3: can include behaviors such as gossiping, social ostracism, and accepting
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 3: rape myths. So if you agree that when you consent
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 3: to sex that that consent is valid and it is
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: irrefutable later on, you're engaging in hostile femininity, Lauren, do
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 3: you feel like you're hostile? Are you still there? Lauren? Yeah,
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 3: I'm sorry.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 4: So what do you think?
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 3: Do you feel hostile?
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 1: No, women are not They're not capable of hostility. Are
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 1: you kidding me? It is impossible?
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, this is insulting actually when I look
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 3: at it. So, men are hostile toward women, but women.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 3: Feminists can't acknowledge any sort of female hostility toward men.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 3: Women can only be hostile toward other women. So female, yeah,
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: female hostility, intersectional interest, sexual competition, same sex, aggression for
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 3: reproductive advantage, right, rape, myth acceptance, hostility toward women, judging
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 3: women based on factors like revealing clothing. If you don't
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 3: like some some little hoe sidling up to your guy,
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 3: uh and and show shoving her cleavage up his nose,
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 3: your hostile. You're hostile toward women, Lauren.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: You try it and you'll see how hostile.
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 3: I'll fucking get.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: Damn right.
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 3: I will admit that unless my husband is uncomfortable with
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 3: female attention I think it's funny.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but because I know.
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 3: It's it's not going He's he raised two of the
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 3: most adorable daughters, and his ex wife was a gymnast
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 3: and when she was young, she was an absolute cutie.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 3: She was just absolutely beautiful. She was better looking to me,
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 3: and you know, that was that was I could say
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 3: that with no discomfort whatsoever. She just wasn't very nice
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 3: and she cheated on him and left, and that was
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 3: that was her mistake.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 5: The cuter they are, that they tend to have a
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 5: mean streak.
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 3: I noticed that a lot of attractive women are not
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 3: very nice. Actually, you're right, although I have met some
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: attractive women who are very nice, and uh, you know,
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: and I've been attractive enough that I had some modeling jobs,
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 3: not big ones, but you know, and it's I didn't
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 3: have the same inclinations to be bitchy and mean to
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 3: just two men in general, somewhat toward other women.
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 2: But one good thing about attractive women is they have
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: no qualms about fighting other attractive women. That's the same
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 2: way strong men have no qualms about fighting other strong
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: men if the occasion comes upon them. So yeah, never mind,
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: never mind finding a woman who will look at you
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: in a certain way. Find a woman who will fight
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 2: any bitch but will never fight you. Yeah, I don't
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: want to. I don't want to sound like a simp.
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 2: But I found myself a woman who will fight any bitch,
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 2: but she loves me.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 3: Yes, there you go.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 1: Ons.
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: So you find a woman who will fight any bitch
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 3: and then you start investing in jell O, then you.
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 4: Sell tickets gagey.
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 3: Ce. See, we are engaging in hostile femininity now. But
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 3: so that's what Google has to say about it. And
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 3: by the way, this conversation I had with Groc, Groc
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 3: gets the apex fallacy. When I started giving Grock feeding
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 3: Grock information studies, statistics and stuff like that, Groc came
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 3: to the conclusion of feminists are full of shit. But
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 3: if you want to read that conversation with us, you're
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 3: gonna have to sign up to be part of future
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 3: after shows because that's where it's gonna be. It's not
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 3: gonna be in the main show. So you know, like
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 3: I said, go to do Honey Badger Brigade dot com
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 3: and feed the Badger dot com and check out ways
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 3: to support us, because that is where this content is
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 3: going to be. The full conversation anyway, Lauren, what were
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 3: you going to say?
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 5: I think it's a little ridiculous to gender or try
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 5: to engender hostility, you.
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: Know, because people can be hostile towards other people.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 5: It's it's you're hostile towards a set of behaviors, not
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 5: just because it's a woman or just because I'm a man.
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 2: You know it.
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 4: Now, there are.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 5: There are hostile things that women do to other women,
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 5: but it's not necessarily like it. It's not I don't
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 5: know how to say what I'm trying to say.
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 1: It's not something that.
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 4: Only it's not jenu.
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not like being mean to when anybody can
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 5: be mean to women. You know what I mean that
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 5: that's not a hostile female. It's not the epitome of
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 5: a hostile female. You know. A hostile female is one
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 5: that is just no matter what the circumstances are, she's
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 5: in a foul fucking mood, and you whatever is in
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 5: her way is the object of her ire.
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 3: You know. Let mean you think about it this way,
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 3: all right, that scenario we talked about before you get
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 3: home from work, you're dead tired, You're not necessarily paying
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 3: as much attention When you walk from your car to
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 3: your house, you get onto your doorstop and or your doorstep,
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 3: and all of a sudden, there's a person behind you,
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 3: and something sharp and cold and metal is up against
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 3: your ribs, and the voice behind you says, don't say anything,
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 3: unlock your door. We are going inside. I'm gonna take
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 3: all your shit, right, and you say, I don't have anything,
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 3: you know, don't do this anything along the lines of
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 3: a refusal. The person responds with why you being so hostile? Yeah,
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 3: you know, you say, don't rob me? And they say,
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 3: why are you calling me names? What's wrong with you? Right?
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 3: That is feminists using the terms hostile masculinity and hostile femininity.
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 3: You get into a sales call. Somebody calls your house
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 3: and says, I got a great deal for you. I'm
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 3: gonna waterproof your basement for ten thousand dollars and it's guaranteed,
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 3: it's definitely not going to cost you more than ten
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 3: thousand dollars. And you say, oh, that's awesome. You see,
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 3: I just bought this apartment building and my basement is
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 3: almost the size of an entire city block. Oh well,
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 3: you know that might cost a little more. And you
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 3: say all, you said, guaranteed price ten thousand dollars. I
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 3: want the guaranteed price. The person says, why are you
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 3: so hostile? You know, why are you so entitled? Well,
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 3: you promised me that, you told me it was guaranteed.
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 3: When someone says I consent, I agree, I'm going to
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 3: do this with you. When someone puts their hands on
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 3: you and actually demonstrates physically that they are a participant,
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 3: that is involved because they want to be involved, they
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 3: know they're involved, they're they're genuinely interacting with you, and
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 3: then later they come along and say.
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 4: Why are you so hostile?
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 3: Why are you accusing me of consenting? That was rape?
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 3: You raped me the whole time. I climbed on top
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 3: of you and rode you like a bull in a bar,
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 3: the mechanical bull at the bar, Like that was you
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 3: raping me? Like that's femininity or feminism calling men hostile
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 3: masculinity or accusing men of hostile masculinity. And when women
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 3: acknowledge that that happens, that's femininity, right, hostile femininity according
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 3: to feminism, So the conversation. The term hostile femininity isn't
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 3: as widely established or consistently defined in feminist discourse as
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 3: hostile masculinity because they don't want to talk about it right,
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 3: But it's sometimes used to describe behaviors or attitudes associated
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 3: with femininity that are aggressive, manipulative, or antagonistic, often in
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 3: ways that reinforce harmful gender dynamics or stereotypes. Unlike hostile masculinity,
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 3: which has a more specific academic and cultural footprint tied
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 3: to patriarchy, hostile femininity tends to appear in less formal contexts,
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 3: like online debates or critiques of gender roles, and lacks
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 3: a unified theoretical backing. In other words, feminists have not
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 3: really explored this idea at all. They just came up
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 3: with a bit of a definition in order to manage
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 3: the fact that people noticed that they did not treat
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 3: the genders equally when creating the term hostile masculinity. When
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 3: it's used, it might refer to women who weapon not
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 3: weaponized traditional feminine traits emotional manipulation, passive aggressiveness, or leveraging
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 3: social expectations of feminine female frigidity or fragility to undermine others,
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 3: including other women. For example, some might label mean girl
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 3: behavior like exclusionary cliques or relational aggression as a form
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 3: of hostile femininity. In certain conservative or anti feminist circles,
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 3: it's occasionally thrown around a critique women who are seen
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 3: as overly confrontational or anti male, though this usage is
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 3: more rhetorical than scholarly. So and there's no definition in
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 3: feminist literature. So I thought, all right, So there's both
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 3: terms essentially refer to hostility toward women, or at least
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 3: perceived hostility toward women, not a single term for perceived
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 3: hostility toward men. So I asked, did you notice that
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 3: feminist discussions on both terms refer to them in terms
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 3: of that sexes hostility toward women, but not toward men.
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 3: And all of a sudden yes, Grok noticed in feminist discourse,
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 3: hostile masculinity is explicitly framed as hostility directed toward women,
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 3: rooted in patriarchal power dynamics. The focus is on how
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 3: it harms women, reinforces male dominance, or pushes perceived weakness.
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 3: With hostile femininity, the patterns less consistent since it's not
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 3: a mainstream feminist term, but where it appears in feminist
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 3: adjacent critiques, it is often still centered on harm to women,
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 3: women policing each other's behavior to enforce patriarchal standards, slut shaming,
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 3: or competition over mail approval. When it's used outside feminist circles,
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 3: then it might imply hostility toward men, but not when
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 3: it's used in feminist circles. So then I asked, does
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 3: feminism have any term for hostility toward men that feminist
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 3: scholars have discussed as often and as seriously as they
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 3: have discussed hostility toward women, And it says feminist scholarship
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 3: doesn't have a widely recognized, consistently used term for hostility
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 3: toward women or toward men that matches the depth and
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 3: frequently frequency of terms like hostile masculinity or misogyny. Forism,
• 1:17:56
  Speaker 3: the term is feminism. So the rest of this conversation
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 3: once I once I got Grock to notice that I
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 3: started attacking patriarchy theory, and I got some interesting results.
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 3: I went from patriarchy theory to the supporting claims about
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 3: intimate partner and sexual violence that women use to presume
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 3: female oppression, and I even discussed a little bit about
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 3: their claims about history and it Groc had some interesting responses.
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 4: So, like I said, we will go over this.
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 3: Whole thing beginning to end in a future patron only
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 3: after show. But I wanted to get across here. Where
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 3: we started was at this federal funding, all right, two
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 3: and a half million dollars two and a half million
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 3: dollars for one study at one university using questionable methods
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 3: at best to get men to make it look like
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 3: their rapeye bastards by responding to how women flirt when
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 3: they're tipsy or drunk, and by responding when a woman
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 3: how how to how women flirt and then cut off
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 3: their attention when their tipsy are drunk or when the
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 3: man is tipsy, you're drunk. Right, So two point six
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 3: million dollars to help students Auty University frame drunk rape
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 3: alcohol facilitated rape as something that men do, women experience,
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 3: and that happens because men have hostil latitudes toward women.
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 3: And you paid for that. He came out of your pocket.
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 1: That makes me hostile.
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that makes me hostile too.
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 4: So we didn't get a lot of super chats. We
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 4: didn't get a lot of.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 3: Super chows, but Meredith g did give us five dollars
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 3: and said, HBr talk three forty five Honey, for the Badgers.
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 3: So does this sound like hostile aggressive feminism to you?
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 3: I personally think it's pretty hostile.
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, fucking hostile, as as Pantera would have put it.
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 2: They had this song called Fuckingle. Sometimes it's okay to
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 2: be pretty fucking hostile, yeah.
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 3: But sometimes it's political and then sometimes the government will
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 3: pay you for it. Richard Bierre says he wants to
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 3: speak with our manager. Okay, but tweet at at Honeybudger
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 3: bite on X post at Honeybudger Bite on X that's
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 3: our manager. So I think with that, I'm going to
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 3: go ahead and call it because this is pretty much
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 3: what I wanted to go over today, and we pretty
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 3: much went over it. I don't really know that there's
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 3: that much more to say about this other than pointing
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 3: out the double standard and pointing out the abyssmal failure
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 3: in creating research conditions and methodology that will get trustworthy
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 3: results that can be generalized to the rest of the public.
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 3: This is this is basically the same fake, made up
• 1:21:55
  Speaker 3: shit that you see justifying the Violence Against Women Act
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 3: and other types of feminist lobbied legislation. So with that,
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 3: I will thank my two co hosts for going over
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 3: this with me, Thanks to the listeners for taking a
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 3: look at this ship with me, and thanks to everybody
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 3: who works in the background to make HBr talk happen.
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 3: So not very hostile of me, is it?
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 1: Good night God, It's see you next Tuesday.
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 4: Get there you See you next Tuesday.
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 3: See you next Thursday.