Latest / Hart & Hustle Podcast / Why your career path does not have to be your calling

Transcript

Why your career path does not have to be your calling · Hart & Hustle Podcast

• Efrain: Welcome back to another episode here on the Heart and Huzzle Podcast. We got Miss Rosie. How you doing, Miss Rosie? Rosie Chinea Shawver: I'm doing good. How you? Efrain: Good. Where are you virtually? I always love to know what we're virtually talking to someone from. Rosie Chinea Shawver: So I'm in El Segundo, California, which is just outside of Los Angeles in Southern California. Efrain: Born and raised Cali girl, or how did you get to Cali? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Totally. Born and raised. I grew up in Oxnard, it's like an hour north of LA. And I've lived in a lot of places, but moved back here to LA to be closer to my family and also to work at USC. That's that was like my family and the cool job that I had for the last nine years. Efrain: I love it. I I I really wanna know, like you mentioned a little bit before we got on being running, right? Staying active. And I know my friend when he moved from Orlando to LA, he started talking he about hiking. And it looks like you guys just love to kind of be active in the outdoor world. Is that a Cali thing? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, you know, I think it is. I mean, the weather here is like perfect all the time. So yeah, I I'm a runner. My daughter and I play tennis too. She actually's on the varsity tennis team and I played in high Efrain: Okay. Rosie Chinea Shawver: school. So we're just active and like last night we were on the tennis courts at 8 p.m. And this morning I was running at like, I don't know what time, like nine, nine o'clock this morning. So it's it Efrain: Wow. Rosie Chinea Shawver: the weather's just good all the time. It's not super hot, not super cold. It's it's super sweet. Efrain: I was in LA earlier this year, actually, and one thing I realized is the palms that fall all over the street. Okay, so there was palms Rosie Chinea Shawver: Ha ha ha. Efrain: all over the place. And you know, we have palms here in Orlando, but nothing compared to what the palms look like over there. And and then it was like late at night. I had just got in and the wind was so crazy. Like I now notice why the palms were on the floor. And the wind is just like truly like. Swaying me. I'm like, my god, this is this is intense. Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah. Well, you know what I found out? The palm trees are not native to California. They actually were like imported here. So and now they like, you know, they they seem as if they're native. Efrain: The thing, yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, which is nuts. But yeah, we get the Santa Ana winds. and they come, I don't even know how often, probably more than once a year. And it could be pretty wicked. I live on the coast, so like we get Santa Ana's, but it's not as bad as like more inland. and Efrain: Got it. Rosie Chinea Shawver: yeah, but you know, I went I this summer I traveled for work. I went to Houston and also DC and I, you know, jogged outside and I went to some pure bar classes in in both Houston and DC and the weather I just came back so spoiled. Like I'm like I it's not humid, it's not as hot. Like I and I could live in humidity. My my family's from Puerto Rico and Cuba, so like the humidity isn't that big a deal, but when you're running it feels like a big deal. Efrain: Love it. I love that you say when you got back home, you realize you just appreciate a little bit more. that happened to me about a month or two months ago. I went to Phoenix, Arizona in the middle of summertime. Yeah, tell me about it. I Rosie Chinea Shawver: dude, that's hot. Efrain: was kind of voluntoed, you know. My best friend was having a baby shower. And I would tell you when she was like, just Ephraim, understand that it's not Florida hot. Like it is dry heat. I'm like, we have heat, humidity, like, but I realized what she was talking about. It was just almost like Why do you even live here? What are you doing here? This is this is dangerous. So no, I can imagine. And then when I came back home and everything just looked dry and dead over there. You come back home and everything in Orlando's green and the trees and the, you know, I appreciate the humidity. I started to really be appreciative of my own, you know, city for sure. You don't realize it until you're gone a bit. I love it. Rosie Chinea Shawver: For sure. For sure. there's beauty everywhere, right? Like I lived in New Mexico for six years and I'm a water girl, so it was rough to be away from the ocean. But the mountains there are so gorgeous. But they also have dry heat. It also snows in Albuquerque. Little known fact, I had no idea when I Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: moved there that it snowed. And this coastal California girl was like chipping the snow with my credit card off my windshield. Like I have no idea, right? Efrain: I cannot Rosie Chinea Shawver: So but anyhow it's but there's beauty in in it all, right? We gotta embrace that too, because people live everywhere. Yeah. Efrain: Yeah, a hundred percent. let's talk about the leadership opportunity that you've have been in for the you know a few years here. I mean, I I would say that you've probably given your life to this type of work to pour back into others, but what is the organization that you're representing today and what is your title with them? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yes, I'm the president and executive director of the Catholic Campus Ministry Association. what we do is we help form ministers so that they can then go out and reach students for Christ. and I stepped into this role about three years ago and I feel like there was a plan always kind of like not in my head. Like I didn't I didn't work my way up any ladder. Like that wasn't like what I was desiring. Like I started Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: off as a campus minister myself and just as my leadership skills kind of grew and people saw that in me and they pulled those things out of me and they poured a lot into me too, right? Like I have Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: a ministry degree, but people poured into me nonprofit management, fundraising, and all and I'm still learning a lot of stuff, right? Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: yeah, so I that's kind of how I landed in this role was through the grace of God and through like some incredible mentors who helped me get here. Efrain: I love I'm I'm gonna go to that in just a bit, the people that poured into you, but how how old is the organization? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, so we started in nineteen sixty-nine as a offshoot Efrain: Wow. Rosie Chinea Shawver: of the United States Catholic Conference of Bishops. and so there was this council in the nineteen sixties. It was called Vatican II. And basically it was a continuation of the theology of the Catholic Church, but things changed. Like the mass went from Latin to the vernacular, which means the language of the country. Like so here it's English, right? The mass went, the priest used to turn backwards and and now he turns forward. So things like that changed. But then also more people like myself were able to move into leadership positions. so that's why they expanded this organization to to include people like myself, lay people is what Efrain: Got it. Rosie Chinea Shawver: they're called. so we've been around since then and we serve three hundred and sixty-seven campuses across the country, which is incredible, and a real, real gift. Efrain: How do guys stay engaged with so many people? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, we've got an incredible team, incredible staff. that really we even have like two people on our team that's full-time job is just to call people and to continue to like build relationships with folks over the course of the year. We do Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: have two annual conferences that are in person. One is always in DC. That's why I was in DC earlier this summer. Efrain: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: and then the other one rotates around the country. So our last one was just here in Southern California at the University of San Diego. And we have about Efrain: How many folks Rosie Chinea Shawver: 250 went to the one in San Diego, and then about 60 went to the one in DC. The one in DC is like a boot camp for new ministers. So that's why it's smaller. and the other one's like for everyone, and it's much wider. So that's why we're able to get more folks who are engaged in that conference. We have monthly Efrain: that's I'll Rosie Chinea Shawver: webinars. We offer professional mentorship for these ministers. Well, we have a lot to engage these campus ministers. I mean even an online resource bank that just launched last year. So lots lots of lots of ways to stay engaged if folks desire to stay engaged, right? It's two way street. Efrain: Yeah, and and it seems like it's not just an older organization, it's a pretty huge organization. The people that you guys serve and things like that. So Rosie, you mentioned about just leaders pouring into you. Do you 'cause it happened to me recently where I was like, you know what? Let me call these leaders that really gave me the opportunity to be who I am today. Have you ever called those people? I mean, this is a time to give the flowers if you haven't. Like who are those people that you just remember were pouring into you? What are some of the things they were saying to you? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, I think immediately of Father Mark Pedrez. He's a Dominican priest of the Western Dominican province. he he was my campus minister at UC San Diego. I'm actually gonna see him in a few weeks. so he and I stay very connected. he's gonna Efrain: Nice. Rosie Chinea Shawver: come down and hang out with a few of my friends here. And I feel like I thank him constantly because he saw something in me and like ri was like, You should go get a theology degree. you know, you should consider doing a year of volunteer work. Like I felt like he was like the hand of God just like kind of guiding me when I was like so young. I was 18 to 22 when Efrain: Wow. Rosie Chinea Shawver: when I met him and he's still a good friend. He married my husband and I. He baptized my daughter. so he I mean, he's just a precious man in my life. I think of him. I think of there's someone at the United States Catholic Conference of Bishops, her name is Barbara McCrabb. She We were at a some conference somewhere and I didn't know her. And she's like, Hey, I I saw you speak or I saw you do something and she sought me out. We had a meal. And ever since then, you know, she and I have been not only good friends, but she has mentored me, especially moving from a local role to a national role. she's been just providential and just a great gift for me in my life and Yeah, I really, really appreciate her. And then I feel like there's just friends, right? Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: Like friends who are like accompany us on the journey. Like my best friend Karen, she lives here in Los Angeles. And, you know, we're the same age. I think we mentor each other through Efrain: Yeah, yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: all stages of life. But those are just folks that come to the top of my mind. I I can't forget my so I had a friend, he was my boss at at USC when I was the director of campus ministry there. He was the president of the Catholic Center. at the time. And he's really the one who taught me how to fundraise. he was one of the main and and he carried me along, right? Like he would bring me into advancement meetings when they were doing planning around fundraising. Like again, I have a ministry degree. I don't I wasn't trained in fundraising. So like Efrain: Hmm. Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: it's but it's really helpful now running a nonprofit with the skill set that he helped me. I I'm able to do it alongside a team with the organization that we run. So these people are just Incredible. Incredible folks. And I feel like we have to give back given given that people poured into us, like w we have to do that for others also, right? Like it's just something that's Efrain: Percent. Rosie Chinea Shawver: necessary as humanity. Efrain: No, I f I feel you're c so correct. It's like we'll die with all this knowledge if we're not giving it back. And what good does that do for humanity? What good does that do for the future? I'm always about pouring into others. I'm about, you know, just really sharing a story because I think a story, you know, when someone tells you a story, when someone kind of motivates you to do something that you never even thought was possible but believes in you. That's sometimes all you need is someone to believe in you. So, you know, you talked about some of those leaders that early on in in, you know, your life and their lives, they were just pouring into you, right? Because that someone poured into them. I think it's there's something fascinating about that, is how we get to where we're at today. You know, I I it's because of that. So I think it's cool that you have those friendships. I think about my when you mentioned like friends mentoring each other. I have a friend that it We call ourselves trauma bonded friends, right? Like when we were young, we were truly just talk to each other on the phone about nothing. Sometimes we're in silence. But because we didn't have anything else, we just sat there at nighttime after school and just listened to each other breathe, type stuff. And we've helped each other, you know. And at 18 years old, both left our houses, moved in together at some point, you know, almost full out as friends, came back. Here we are 20 years later, where we're godparents to each other's kids. And and we look back and think to ourselves, like, man, How appreciative we were that in a time when we might have felt alone, we had each other. And I think that there's there's something cool in that. and then we're both successful. You know, I think we're both two kids that people counted us out very early because of the trauma that we were going happening in our lives. But we always just look up to each other, I would say. And anytime she's doing amazing, I gotta step up my game and vice versa. We hold each other accountable and we're honest. It's always cool we just have honest people around you. what what brings you into the world Rosie Chinea Shawver: I agree. Efrain: of of like spiritual though? Like you grew up like this, you grew up Catholic already? Rosie Chinea Shawver: yeah. I did, yeah. I mean, so my mom and dad, like I mentioned a little earlier, Puerto Rican and Cuban. So I just feel like it's in our blood. but I really wasn't active in my faith. I mean, I went to church in my family begrudgingly. Like I Efrain: Mm. Rosie Chinea Shawver: I would like lay in bed and my parents would like force me out of bed to go to church. I remember that as a kid. and what really kind of moved me was in college. Like I I had before I left to UC San Diego for my undergrad. I I never prayed as a kid, ever, ever. And then one t I do remember one time praying and I said, God, if you get me into UC San Diego, I promise I'll go to church every Sunday. And then I got into the school and I didn't go to church. So I kinda Efrain: my god. Rosie Chinea Shawver: like went back on my promise. And my I I met a girl, another Cuban girl, and she just kept inviting me to come with her. And I went and I mean, in all truthfulness, there was a really cute boy in the choir. Efrain: Ha ha ha ha. Rosie Chinea Shawver: And that's like what hooked me in the beginning. But over time, like the community just embraced me and like I was able to find meaning in a world that like was like devoid of meaning. And I just by by the time my sophomore year rolled around, I knew I didn't feel called to be like a doctor, which was a hard shift because ever since I was a little kid, I wanted to be a pediatrician. It was just too cutthroat for like my personality. And Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: and I'm cutthroat in other ways, like on the tennis court. I get mad. But that's different, right? And like, Efrain: Yeah, yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: so anyhow, by the time sophomore year rolled around, I kind of felt an inkling like this is where I'm supposed to be, this is what I'm supposed to do. Like I'm good at this. Like I tell my students, I tell my daughter, like, you know, you find your biggest passion in the world. And where that intersects in a place that there is not like something happening, or there is something happening you could fit it. And that is like where you're called to be. Like your biggest one of your biggest passions and like what what the world needs, and find that intersection. And it should, it should create joy, right? At the Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: end. And and not everyone, I know that that's hard. And sometimes people end up in jobs that they don't feel super passionate about. But if we can try to find those kind of where those two things intersect, I mean, we gotta work this forty hours a week, right? My hope is it Efrain: Yeah. I mean Rosie Chinea Shawver: it's coming from a place of calling, right? Efrain: Yeah, and sometimes we just honestly kind of to your thing of people not finding it. Sometimes we sit in in places that are are not comfortable, but we just feel comfortable. You know what I mean? I know for me it was I was I loved the job that I actually had. I was facilitating, I was traveling the world, all these good things. Now there was those things I did not like. So when I found myself venting at dinner, you know, to my wife, and it became like the conversation that I'll continue to have. I had to do something about it. So even though I love the people I was working with, I love the job. And and at one point I felt like I remember telling my wife, one day I'm gonna travel and and and speak to others and I'm gonna do this all on somebody's dime. Well, guess what? That was happening. You know, and I walked away from that, but also found, you know, happiness and I found things that I truly never thought I would be doing, which one is these podcasts like. The only reason that I'm able to do these and have these conversations was because I took that leap of faith, but also to really lean into something of passion, which to me was wrestling. The escape from reality as a young kid. And I remember just thinking to myself, like, one day I want to do something in wrestling. But as you grow older, you think that it becomes impossible, right? WWE's so big. There's no there's no way. You know, and and one of the first opportunities I had was to interview these wrestlers that I grew up watching. That allowed me to know that, wow, it is possible. I'm only three years in, but I I I see what's possible with just doing it, right? Just love what you're doing. And then I'm building community around it. So I get to really talk about the ups and the downs and the mental health because just because I'm in wrestling doesn't mean we don't talk about human life, right? so you are right, man. You've really got to find what is it. Y what is that thing that you truly love? Stop chasing paychecks, I like to say. And I think I told you this, Rosie, is we got to chase passion and purpose. The money will follow. And 'cause in reality the money's not everything. We've I've had times where I had the money and and still wasn't happy, right? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, agreed, agreed. And you know, there's if you're in a space I love what you said. If you're in a place of desolation, in a place of complaining, right, more than like seeking and feeling that joy, then there's real discernment that has to happen. Cause I've been there. I mean, I I working in the church where I'm working with a ton of humans, right? Like it's not like we're all godly people. Efrain: Yeah. Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: and and there are moments when you're like, wow, I shouldn't be treated this way constantly. Like it is time for a shift. but that takes it it takes the ability to make to yet our identity doesn't rest in our job, like our identity rests rests in something else. Our di for me, like our identity rests in Christ, right? So like, and if it yeah, if we if we intermix that too much, like I I am a doctor and that's all who I am, then then there needs to be some discernment around that too. Efrain: Yeah. Yeah, a hundred percent. Rosie Chinea Shawver: So anyhow, I just I love what you said, 'cause I think you're spot on. Cause you could love something, but it has to be the right fit at the right time. and that Efrain: Hundred percent. Rosie Chinea Shawver: takes us maturity, I guess, in our own self. Efrain: And and some ego, you know, sometimes and just to realize that even you mentioned it earlier, this was not my plan, right? This was God's plan. So a lot of times Rosie Chinea Shawver: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Efrain: we have a plan. We think, this this is definitely the plan, right? And it's like, that's not even the plan. You think it is. You know, someone told me, and now I'm gonna have to live with this forever and work on it. But someone says, Efraine, I think sometimes you may be in the car with God, but you're not letting God drive. And I'm like Rosie Chinea Shawver: Mm. Efrain: Really? You know what I mean? Because sometimes we're in our own ways, right? giving it up to God and allow him to steer you instead of trying to fight and you're just trying to like you you don't understand why you're not getting through. Well, maybe you're in the wrong spaces, you know what I mean? So we could definitely stay on that topic, but I I think they got the message. I did want to talk about students and how students find this opportunity. You've talked about serving for years now, for decades. How are students finding this? Is it QR codes? Is it one friend shares with another friend? You did talk about conferences. So I could be I imagine that's a little bit of it, but how do we spread the word? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, man, I feel old. You said you've been doing this for decades. Efrain: I'll take it back. Rosie Chinea Shawver: I'm not that old. Anyhow, I guess yeah, it's been a little while. you know, really it's funny because in the ministry spaces, people go, we gotta market this better, we gotta put this on socials better. And all that's true. But the number one way is actually the way Jesus did it is by talking about it one by one and inviting people into it, right? Like the reason I came back was because of Michelle, my Cuban friend, who invited me to come to church. Otherwise, Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: like I I'm I'm sure God would have found me in another way and would have brought me in another way. But like I yeah, I mean it's it really is. The number one way is like an invitation from another friend. Efrain: Mm-hmm. Rosie Chinea Shawver: the advice I give to parents, because I think parents are very anxious, and rightly so. I mean, I have a daughter who's fifteen going to college in three years, and not that I have a ton of anxiety around it, but when we go visit campuses, so this is the advice I give. When you go visit a campus, make sure to go look for the Catholic church that's doing ministry or whatever denomination you might be that that's doing ministry specifically for your child when they go there. Because my hope is that that's going to be my daughter's home away from home. and I want her to feel comfortable hanging out on those couches. I want her to be able to find some friends there. Because even if it's just two hours away from me, she needs somewhere to go that's not just her dorm room. And just knowing that things like, you know There is things like depression and anxiety, and the world is moving a million miles an hour. And we need to be able to like plant seeds in the minds of our young people that like there are places that are safe for them to go to explore who they are, as well as figure out what they're called to do within the craziness of life, right? so for parents, that's what I do. Whenever you're going on college tours, look for that Newman Center, go look for that church, go look for that ministry. alongside the college tour of course and asking all the academic questions. because I think i we gotta just think about that ahead of time. Like it can't be an afterthought. and then for young people, go like literally you can Google it. Like I'm going to I don't know. I if you're going to USC, Google Catholic Church in USC. If you're going to Notre Dame, same thing. Like or if you're going to Fresno State, like s it doesn't matter. You could Google it and find it. and typically they have, you know, Facebook pages, Instagram, Some places are advanced and have TikTok, others don't, but Instagram's probably the safest space. anyhow, yeah, that's that's what I would say for young folks. Efrain: Okay. Rosie Chinea Shawver: yeah, and bring a friend. Always bring a friend. If you're too scared, bring a friend with you. It's like we shouldn't be scary, but sometimes, Efrain: Easiest thing to do, yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: yeah, just bring somebody with you. Efrain: I I heard these stats and I may screw it up, you can probably correct me here, is that a student s tends to lose that part of themselves once they get into college because they don't find those opportunities. Is that correct? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, the first three weeks of the school year are the most crucial times during the school year because and the fall semester, because that's the time when freshmen and others make their friend groups and they don't stay the friend groups for the entire four years necessarily, but they're finding their niches, right? Sororities, fraternities, sports, whatever it is. So as ministers, our job is to be on campus, not just like shut behind the doors of the church. and trying to bring people in and really encouraging our students to do that because I'm 46. Why would they like come to a hangout with a 46 year old woman? Like they're gonna go hang out with like the other 21, 22, you know, 20 year olds, right? So it's really encouraging Efrain: Yeah, yep. Rosie Chinea Shawver: my my young people to be able to go out and reach their their potential new friends. Yeah, especially again, for me it's this this idea of meaning and purpose and like young people, obviously if they're in college, you're trying to figure out what they're gonna do for the rest of their life and why not do that within a context of faith. it just it feels like the most natural because it's the most reflective. I it's the most it and you're doing it amongst people who hopefully have very similar values to you too. Efrain: Yeah. And I want people to that are possibly listening or watching this that are in that young bracket, right? Don't sleep on Rosie. She has all the wisdom and knowledge. I mean, growing up, Rosie, I've always loved me to talk to someone that was a little older because that's where I learn the most. Right. Those people that are doing life with you and you guys are here. It's like you guys know probably the same amount of things. But I if I go here, someone that has kind of lived a little bit more life and experiences, man, the things that you actually Get to learn and stay ahead of the game. I think for me, I've always had this old, so I just love to always talk to older people. I think that's what allowed me to get sometimes where I'm at today is because I heard those things, you know, show me your five friends, I'll show you your future, right? As cliche that was, we didn't want to hear as a kid. I remember those moments, right? This was some an adult that was telling me that. I learned don't buy what you want, buy what you need, Ephraim, right? And that's taking me long. Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah. Efrain: You know, sometimes you want a new phone, realizing I don't I don't need that new phone actually. Rosie Chinea Shawver: Ha ha. Efrain: and now that I'm a father even I definitely realize I don't need the shoes, I don't need I'm shopping at Ross now, Rosie. You I'm shopping at the Rosie Chinea Shawver: Nice. Nice. Yeah, I mean, I feel like you're right. Like really we can gain wisdom from anybody of any age. really. I mean, whether they're in their seventies or and I learned a lot from, you know, the eighteen to twenty two year olds that were part of my ministry too. So it's it's a two-way street. And again, it's part of opening up your mind, opening up your ego. And not thinking Efrain: Yeah. Rosie Chinea Shawver: that you know everything because there's no way I know everything. And that's I think there's real humility in that. Efrain: Yeah. I I think the people that are watching will also be upset if I don't ask this question. You mentioned how someone showed you how to do fundraising. What are those tips and tricks you felt that have made you good at fundraising? made it great. You could tell me how good, great, awesome you are. Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, I think I think being a continual learner is one thing, like recognizing that like I don't know everything, which is something I just said as well. Like I think that continuing to learn how to do it is something that's really important. The second thing is I plan pretty well. so very well organized. We have a plan for the entire year that we set out on like what we're gonna do, who we're gonna approach, how we're gonna grow our network, things of that nature. Efrain: Mm-hmm. Rosie Chinea Shawver: And the third is I truly care for every single person that we interact with, whether it's a student, a campus minister, or a a fundraiser, or somebody we're like a benefactor. they are all God's creation. And I'm not just asking for monies. I'm just not asking for money. Like I'm asking them to give a piece of themselves to this ministry. And Efrain: Mm. Rosie Chinea Shawver: I mean, I've had People who open up their hearts to me who are benefactors, right? Someone who just started dating somebody, somebody who's per like a family member just passed away. Like and what am I doing? I'm loving them. Like I'm sending them gifts. I'm like pouring myself into them and I'm praying for them. So I think the relationships component, that's that was the most natural thing for me. Be from going from, you know, just ministering with students to also ministering with folks who are benefactors to C CMA is like The relationship stuff is is natural to who I am and like I truly care for folks. So I think as long as you can know how to build relationship and you're not afraid, there's a lot of fear around money, like asking for money. As long as does to not be afraid, like if if they know you're fundraising and they take a meeting with you, they know you're gonna ask for money. So don't be afraid to ask for it. I think there can be some fear around that. And really that takes reflection also because Maybe there's some negative connotations one has with money. Like maybe your parents or our parents like just didn't use money well, maybe they didn't talk about it, and maybe it's just been a scary topic for your entire life. So of course asking for money is gonna be scary because that's kind of the background we have. So it's like unpacking some of your own history, I think is something that's important too around around money and philanthropy. Efrain: it's funny, years ago, what it I am thirty six now, maybe ten, a little bit over ten years ago. I remember going to this realtor and you know, seen his house, seen his car, area he lived, and thought to myself, maybe I should go be a realtor, right? So I go to him and he knew the work that I was doing nonprofit wise, you know, already. So when I said, Hey man, I want to know more about real estate, is there anything that you can tell me? And he says, Efraine, you don't want to do this. This is a career. He says, You're in the asking business, and there's people that are willing to give million dollar checks, but you have even gone out to go ask them. And I said, and I never understood I'm this young, you know, guy at that moment. But what I did know is that I did not like to ask for money. Like that just wasn't who I was, right? Like growing up, adopted and without anything, it was very hard to ask. You know, I just always figured it out type thing. And now, even now when we're trying to talk about sponsorships, I had one of my One of my mentors that I invited to this event, because it's one of the biggest ones that I've put on, XYZ. So she's Yeah, how much to sponsor a table? Ephraim wants to think with his pockets and says, no, you could, you know, and his just his his life experiences of she was so good, she poured into me like you don't gotta pay anything. So then I was like, I can't be that. So then I found someone, right? Sometimes as a leader, you gotta go find someone else that's going to do the work. So I'm gonna put her on the list and I'm gonna go have such and such call her so she doesn't even have to worry about it. She's okay telling numbers, she has no relationship with her. So sometimes you just also get out your own way. And as a leader, go find if this is not your forte or you do not like doing this, that is okay. Someone else like Rosie is okay doing it. You know what I mean? So go find you that person that could also just help you and and be that thing that you may not be good at as well. That's just what life Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah. Efrain: is about. Rosie Chinea Shawver: 100%. And we could be good at it, but sometimes we need somebody who's great at it. So we just hired a VP for Efrain: Mm, come on now. Rosie Chinea Shawver: for philanthropy, and she is amazing. Like I'm so excited. Like she just started like a month ago, six weeks ago or so. And you know, I feel like I'm a baby fundraiser still. Like I, you know, I've been Efrain: Okay. Rosie Chinea Shawver: doing it for like five years full time basically. Whereas like she's done it for fifteen and she's done it at Indiana University and through other a areas also. Yeah, so y you're spot on. Sometimes it is about adding people to your team who could who have like stronger skill sets around those areas than you do, right? Efrain: Yep. Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah. Efrain: We had a great conversation. I want people to know where can they find more information? students that may have come across this video to also be able to tap in. What is the website? What are the socials? Rosie Chinea Shawver: Yeah, yeah. So our website's the easiest place and it's got links to all our socials is www.ccma network.org. Again, ccma network.org. Efrain: Love it. And what is one message you want to leave to our youth that are also watching? Rosie Chinea Shawver: man, one message. That's a big question. Yeah, I think two things. Just be patient with yourself. Like that your twenties are hard. They will always Efrain: Mm-hmm. Rosie Chinea Shawver: they're great. They're fun. But you're like trying to figure out who you are. And and recognize that like yeah, that one decision, like if you decide to do one thing career wise, like it doesn't mean that you have to do that forever. Like it's one like if you go to one college and that college Isn't a good fit, it's okay. And that trajectory is gonna be all right. Or if you choose one degree and you end up doing something different later on, it's all good because somebody else is taking care of you. Like God is taking care of you, He sees you, He knows you and He loves you. and that's hard. That's hard for folks to recognize, but Yeah, that's the the closing message. Efrain: That's it. I love it, Rosie. I love it. Yeah, there you go. This is Rosie. I'm Ebrain. We appreciate you watching. Make sure you subscribe, like, and comment. And we'll catch you on the next episode. Later.