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What Makes the Perfect Production Number · Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast

0:07
SPEAKER_00: Have you ever wondered what goes on behind the table at a dance competition?
0:10
SPEAKER_00: Exactly what are the judges looking for anyway?
0:13
SPEAKER_00: This is Making the Impact a Dance Competition podcast.
0:15
SPEAKER_00: Each week we'll cover a different topic related to the world of competitive dance from the perspective of the judges behind the table.
0:23
SPEAKER_00: Love them or hate them, production numbers are here to stay.
0:26
SPEAKER_00: From elaborate storylines and set pieces to dozens of dancers executing flawless formation changes in complete sync, production numbers can be many things.
0:35
SPEAKER_00: Today on Making the Impact, we're joined by IDA judge and dance teacher Veronica Silk and Christina Wigginton, owner of CK Danceworks, to discuss the ins and outs of the perfect production number.
0:49
SPEAKER_03: Hey everyone, welcome to this week's episode of Making the Impact.
0:53
SPEAKER_03: I'm your host, Courtney Ortiz, and I'm here with my co-host, Leslie Mueller.
0:57
SPEAKER_03: What's up, Courtney?
0:58
SPEAKER_03: Not much, I cannot believe.
1:01
SPEAKER_03: It is our final episode of season three.
1:04
SPEAKER_03: Episode 106.
1:06
SPEAKER_03: Oh my god, I cannot believe it.
1:08
SPEAKER_03: It's crazy.
1:08
SPEAKER_03: We've done so many episodes.
1:10
SPEAKER_00: So many episodes.
1:11
SPEAKER_00: And it's been, you know, back uh in in recording land or in podcast land, you guys hear from us every week, but we, you know, we kind of bank some episodes because we have busy lives and things to do.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: So it's been a minute since we've sat down to do this.
1:22
SPEAKER_00: So I'm super excited to sit down with you today and some new friends and talk about production numbers.
1:28
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think this is a great way to round out our season with talking about something as popular as a production number because I think every studio probably has one.
1:37
SPEAKER_03: And it's usually the entire studio that comes together for this one giant dance.
1:42
SPEAKER_03: And they also might even like finish or be a finale in your recitals and things like that.
1:47
SPEAKER_03: It's the show stopping finale, and that's what we're here to bring you today on making an impact is that finale episode.
1:53
SPEAKER_03: Finale episode.
1:55
SPEAKER_03: And speaking of finale episode, we actually launched another episode today as well that you can listen to.
2:00
SPEAKER_03: It is our actual for real, for real season three finale episode.
2:04
SPEAKER_03: So this is the topic episode, and then we have a little, you know, cute little short and sweet wrap-up of season three.
2:10
SPEAKER_03: If you want to go give that a listen as well today.
2:12
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just keep keep it ongoing.
2:14
SPEAKER_00: After you press play on this, don't stop it.
2:16
SPEAKER_00: Let it roll through the last one.
2:18
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
2:19
SPEAKER_03: So it's been a great season.
2:20
SPEAKER_03: Thanks, everybody, that's been tuning in.
2:22
SPEAKER_03: Or if you're new to Making the Impact, we are so grateful for your support.
2:26
SPEAKER_03: And speaking of support, we couldn't make this podcast possible without our fabulous sponsors.
2:31
SPEAKER_03: And first sponsor for this week's episode is Dance Costumes by Urzua.
2:36
SPEAKER_03: Dance Costumes by Urzua and Urzua Dancewear offers high-end custom, one-of-a-kind costumes for everybody.
2:42
SPEAKER_03: Choose from a wide selection of fabrics, designs, styles, and more to make your vision come to life.
2:47
SPEAKER_03: Whether you're looking for a custom costume for the stage or a unique dancewear outfit for a convention, Dance Costumes by Erzua and Urzua Dancewear will make that possible.
2:55
SPEAKER_03: You can receive 15% off all costumes and dancewear using our exclusive podcast promo code at Impact15 in all caps at checkout on dancecostumes by Erzua.com.
3:05
SPEAKER_00: And joining us new this season as a sponsor is DancerFitness.
3:08
SPEAKER_00: Have you ever noticed that dancers are a very specific type of athlete?
3:12
SPEAKER_00: Don't you think they should be training like one?
3:13
SPEAKER_00: Introducing DancerFitness, the most comprehensive resource for safe and effective strength training for competitive dancers.
3:19
SPEAKER_00: You can find hundreds of exercises and training plans designed exclusively for dancers from beginning to advanced.
3:24
SPEAKER_00: Whether you want to practice more consistent pirouettes, gain higher elevation in your jumps, or work on your core strength, DancerFitness.com has you covered.
3:32
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3:38
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3:42
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3:44
SPEAKER_00: Be sure to follow them on Instagram for some great training tips and tricks and start cross-training your dancers today at DancerFitness.com.
3:50
SPEAKER_03: And I'm sure you've all heard about our very special Making the Impact Awards that we have sponsored this season at IDA affiliated competition events.
4:00
SPEAKER_03: This is a judge's choice award where if you have at least one IDA judge on your panel at an event, then you will be able to receive this award.
4:09
SPEAKER_03: It's the judge's choice.
4:10
SPEAKER_03: This is the one dance that the judges cannot stop thinking about by the end of the competition.
4:15
SPEAKER_03: And our judges have loved giving away this award.
4:18
SPEAKER_03: And everybody who's won this award have been so grateful and so excited to be the Making the Impact Judges Choice winners.
4:26
SPEAKER_03: So one of the perks of winning this award is you get a special shout out live on our podcast.
4:30
SPEAKER_03: So we have a few recent award winners that we'd like to shout out now.
4:34
SPEAKER_03: First up from DECA Dance Competitions event in Atlantic City, New Jersey.
4:37
SPEAKER_03: This goes to Summer Levine for her solo Microphone from Kalen Dance Studio in East Brunswick, New Jersey, and from Star Talent Productions event in Columbia, South Carolina.
4:47
SPEAKER_03: This goes to Emmy Mae Pettin for her solo Moving the Line from Let's Dance in Mauden, South Carolina.
4:53
SPEAKER_00: And from Spirit of Dance Awards Ledgered Connecticut event, one of the events I directed this season.
4:57
SPEAKER_00: Fred Thornley for his solo Dude Looks Like a Lady from Lakeside Academy of Dance in Middletown, Connecticut.
5:02
SPEAKER_00: Fred, I loved it so much.
5:04
SPEAKER_00: From Spirit of Dance Awards in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania.
5:07
SPEAKER_00: Stephanie Ziobro for her solo My Wish from Dance Design Studio in Easton, Pennsylvania.
5:12
SPEAKER_00: So congratulations to all of our recent Making the Impact winners.
5:15
SPEAKER_00: You guys are really making the impact.
5:17
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
5:18
SPEAKER_03: All right, y'all.
5:19
SPEAKER_03: It's time to jump into our final episode of season three.
5:22
SPEAKER_03: And today we are talking about production numbers.
5:25
SPEAKER_03: And we have two brand new guests to our podcast.
5:28
SPEAKER_03: And first up, I would love to welcome I an ID8 judge who is new to our roster but also new to the pod.
5:35
SPEAKER_03: Please welcome Veronica Silk to the podcast.
5:37
SPEAKER_03: Welcome Veronica.
5:38
SPEAKER_02: Hi, ladies.
5:39
SPEAKER_02: I'm so excited to be here.
5:40
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for having me.
5:42
SPEAKER_03: Yes, we too.
5:43
SPEAKER_03: Super excited.
5:44
SPEAKER_03: And I'm so glad you made it on to season three before we jump into season four.
5:49
SPEAKER_02: Just in time.
5:50
SPEAKER_02: Just in time.
5:51
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
5:52
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, we're really excited to have you.
5:54
SPEAKER_03: And I am can't wait to learn even more about you.
5:57
SPEAKER_03: So if you wouldn't mind sharing with the world a little bit more about where you're based, where you grew up, and any career credits you'd like to share and what you're working on now.
6:05
SPEAKER_02: Okay, sounds great.
6:06
SPEAKER_02: Well, as you just said, I'm Veronica Silk.
6:09
SPEAKER_02: I'm originally from Boston, Massachusetts.
6:11
SPEAKER_02: Then I went to high school in Orlando, Florida.
6:15
SPEAKER_02: Went to college in Miami, Florida, graduated from New World School of the Arts uh in 2012.
6:20
SPEAKER_02: I stayed there for a few years and danced at a um full-time modern dance company for three seasons and wanted to change.
6:27
SPEAKER_02: So I moved to Atlanta, Georgia in 2015.
6:30
SPEAKER_02: Kind of like a freelance artist, which was a big shift from you know being a full-time dancer in a dance company.
6:37
SPEAKER_02: But I have made plenty of connections.
6:40
SPEAKER_02: I've been doing I've traveled a bit, Puerto Rico, Brazil, Czech Republic, dancing, freelancing.
6:47
SPEAKER_02: Um, here in Atlanta, I've done work for the Atlanta Opera and Aurora Theater, doing a few musicals.
6:53
SPEAKER_02: I've done Dance Canvas and Black Nativity.
6:55
SPEAKER_02: And now I am the Middle School Dance Director at Woodward Academy.
6:59
SPEAKER_02: I also teach at Just Dance Studio in Douglasville, and I am the dance department chair for the Governor's Honors Program.
7:06
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
7:07
SPEAKER_02: So doing a lot.
7:09
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
7:09
SPEAKER_02: So school just finished, and that chapter is closed for a few months.
7:14
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna start doing GHP and the next couple of weeks.
7:18
SPEAKER_02: And I actually started I'm on a production cast of guys and dolls at the Atlanta Lyric Theater.
7:23
SPEAKER_02: So as a career, so that will open in August.
7:27
SPEAKER_00: So yes, so thank you for fitting us into your busy schedule.
7:32
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
7:32
SPEAKER_03: Wow.
7:33
SPEAKER_03: Oh my gosh, you better stay busy down there.
7:36
SPEAKER_03: I like it.
7:36
SPEAKER_03: I'm trying.
7:38
SPEAKER_03: I love it.
7:39
SPEAKER_03: Well, thank you so much for joining us and being here today on the pod.
7:43
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for having me again.
7:45
SPEAKER_03: So we have another new guest who is also from Georgia.
7:49
SPEAKER_03: We have a lot of Georgia in the house today on the podcast.
7:52
SPEAKER_03: And Leslie, would you like to do the introduction since I would.
7:56
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
7:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
7:57
SPEAKER_00: So I have known this lady for quite a few years.
8:00
SPEAKER_00: She was one of the first jobs that I took teaching after I graduated from college.
8:04
SPEAKER_00: We have some connections through Oklahoma City University, through some friends.
8:08
SPEAKER_00: And she has been just such a a great person in my life in the teaching world and being able to go back and teach for her amazing students most summers for about the past almost decade, I feel like.
8:20
SPEAKER_00: So welcome to the podcast, Christina Wigginton.
8:23
SPEAKER_01: Hi guys.
8:24
SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
8:25
SPEAKER_03: I'm so excited.
8:26
SPEAKER_03: Yay.
8:27
SPEAKER_03: We're excited to have you and from the studio owner perspective, too, which I think is important to have for this production discussion because every studio owner is probably a part of or contributing in some way or another to the production at a dance studio.
8:42
SPEAKER_03: So I'm and I've also heard that your productive are fabulous.
8:46
SPEAKER_03: So can't wait to link to a few of them in our show notes for our listeners.
8:50
SPEAKER_03: But uh, Christina, if you wouldn't mind telling the world a little bit more about you.
8:54
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
8:55
SPEAKER_01: So as I said, I'm Christina Wigginton and I am one of three owners of CK Danceworks in Dallas, Georgia.
9:02
SPEAKER_01: I also serve as the creative director for Dance Elite, which is our competition portion of the studio.
9:08
SPEAKER_01: We have four different competition divisions broken down into 20 individual competition teams.
9:13
SPEAKER_01: So we're a pretty large studio.
9:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
9:15
SPEAKER_01: I actually grew up in South Georgia, somewhere called Cairo, Georgia.
9:19
SPEAKER_01: And um I took my first dance class when I was four, and I went on to grow up dancing at what is now called Off-Broad Street Center for the Dance Arts, under the direction of Dana Prince Willis.
9:30
SPEAKER_01: That's my first mentor and kind of the person that showed me the light of what this beautiful dance world is.
9:36
SPEAKER_01: It was really neat.
9:37
SPEAKER_01: I won an award when I was sixth grade, and it was the first time this award was ever presented.
9:42
SPEAKER_01: And it was kind of like um, it was named the Marie Joyner Award of Dance.
9:48
SPEAKER_01: And it was um named after the original owner of the studio that was then sold to Dana Prince Willis, that was my teacher.
9:55
SPEAKER_01: But it was basically just like an award that encompassed a student that was very committed, just kind of would eat, breathe, and sleep, dance.
10:03
SPEAKER_01: So anyway, it was the first time it was ever awarded.
10:05
SPEAKER_01: I was the youngest recipient ever because it was the first time in sixth grade.
10:09
SPEAKER_01: And I remember at that moment knowing that this is what I wanted to do for the rest of my life, hands down.
10:14
SPEAKER_01: Now I've it's not, you know, over dramatic to say that I really mean this.
10:18
SPEAKER_01: I've never looked back.
10:19
SPEAKER_01: And so I knew that I wanted to be a choreographer and teach dance in some kind of aspect.
10:24
SPEAKER_01: So I co-taught my first dance dance class when I was 15.
10:28
SPEAKER_01: And then since then, I've taught at almost 30 dance studios.
10:31
SPEAKER_01: I have traveled a lot with my husband that was in the military.
10:34
SPEAKER_01: And so now I'm at my own studio where we just completed our 18th annual recitals and showcases yesterday.
10:42
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
10:43
SPEAKER_01: Recital hangover is real.
10:44
SPEAKER_01: We did nine shows in two and a half days.
10:46
SPEAKER_01: It was epic.
10:48
SPEAKER_01: But it was great.
10:49
SPEAKER_01: And then besides that, I have two beautiful but crazy little girls.
10:53
SPEAKER_01: And I live with my high school sweetheart of 25 years in Atlanta, Georgia.
10:58
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
11:00
SPEAKER_01: Wow, what a great idea.
11:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thank you.
11:04
SPEAKER_01: And I'm so psyched to be here because what we're talking about is it's that's my jam.
11:09
SPEAKER_01: It's my thing.
11:09
SPEAKER_01: I am a production girl through and through.
11:11
SPEAKER_01: So thank you guys for having me.
11:13
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
11:13
SPEAKER_01: Of course.
11:14
SPEAKER_00: And they really are.
11:15
SPEAKER_00: They're really, Christina just has her brain.
11:17
SPEAKER_00: I my brain does not do that.
11:18
SPEAKER_00: My brain does solos.
11:19
SPEAKER_00: One person.
11:20
SPEAKER_00: Me too.
11:20
SPEAKER_00: There's a formula, you do a circle, you go in a diagonal, you go in a deck.
11:24
SPEAKER_00: That's it.
11:25
SPEAKER_00: But then you add like 40 other people, and I'm like, oh, it all breaks down.
11:28
SPEAKER_00: So like I'm excited to hear how your brain actually does all of that with with a million people on stage.
11:33
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:34
SPEAKER_03: Excited to hear you says tips and tricks as well.
11:37
SPEAKER_03: Maybe we can do that as well for all of our listeners.
11:40
SPEAKER_03: So yeah, let's jump on into this final episode.
11:45
SPEAKER_00: Final episode, productions.
11:46
SPEAKER_00: Um, and it will be a production because there's a lot to cover in the production number world.
11:51
SPEAKER_00: Because I think I we actually did a little bit of research, you know, because Courtney and I have been judging for about a decade, a little bit longer probably, and have participated in production numbers and everything.
12:00
SPEAKER_00: But, you know, you can see a lot of different ideas of what a production number is based on where you are and what studio you're at.
12:06
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, uh, and the rules that we found on the Compton websites are also varied.
12:12
SPEAKER_00: There is not one tried and true like definition of what a production is.
12:16
SPEAKER_00: So I'm curious, Veronica, in your experience, just as a dancer or teacher, judge, everything, what do you consider to be a production number?
12:23
SPEAKER_00: What are the aspects that make it up?
12:25
SPEAKER_02: Um, well, as a judge, I love production numbers because it it allows the choreography to be really creative and elaborate um without like any judgment.
12:36
SPEAKER_02: And good a lot of the times there can be a lot of collaboration.
12:40
SPEAKER_02: I don't know if Christina does collaboration when she does col uh production numbers, but I have definitely choreographed and then had like other people choreograph throughout their production.
12:50
SPEAKER_02: But what I'm looking for is uh creativity, cleanliness as well.
12:55
SPEAKER_02: Um, because sometimes with production there can be a lot of things happening, which can be a great thing, but sometimes if it's not as clean, um, there's always a lot of dancers on the stage.
13:04
SPEAKER_02: I would say 30 to 40, but I've seen a production number with a hundred uh students, and I was like, are they gonna fit on the stage?
13:12
SPEAKER_02: Right.
13:13
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, so I love love it as a judge, and also production numbers normally come towards the end of the competition.
13:20
SPEAKER_02: So you've been seeing these dancers uh a lot of times on the stage.
13:23
SPEAKER_02: So it's kind of like you're giving uh critiques, but you can also like sit back and enjoy and watch and you know, really, you know, dive deep into like, oh, this is really fun.
13:33
SPEAKER_02: So yeah.
13:34
SPEAKER_00: Nice.
13:34
SPEAKER_00: And any thoughts, Christina, on like when you choreograph a production, are you going with something specific in mind?
13:40
SPEAKER_00: Is it just the number of people, or do you have sort of a a formula for how you begin to create it?
13:45
SPEAKER_01: So I guess my I always so I feel like my ideas always come random places.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: Like um, in fact, I came up with an idea that we're going to use next year.
13:55
SPEAKER_01: It's it's it's one of our productions, but we actually call it a line because it's not everybody, it's about 50 of our kids.
14:01
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
14:02
SPEAKER_01: And weirdly enough, I was in the bathroom.
14:05
SPEAKER_01: I was washing my hands.
14:06
SPEAKER_01: Um, but I was washing my hands after the bathroom.
14:09
SPEAKER_01: And um, for some reason it popped into my head what we're going to do.
14:13
SPEAKER_01: And so the idea always comes from the most random places.
14:15
SPEAKER_01: Like I remember one time I got an idea for our production when I was hiking.
14:19
SPEAKER_01: I think we were in Montana with my husband.
14:22
SPEAKER_01: And or or and then one time I was hiking uh Kennesaw Mountain and got the idea for one of our wedding productions that we did.
14:28
SPEAKER_01: I think it was just a song in my head.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: And so it always kind of starts with a theme, and I think this is something we'll kind of touch on later that I think some productions can tell a story, and some productions can just be about a generalized theme.
14:42
SPEAKER_01: And I know there's actually kind of going back to what you're saying, there's different rules at competitions, and we actually kind of got caught up in that one year because sometimes ours kind of tell a story and sometimes it's about an icon or a singer.
14:53
SPEAKER_01: Right.
14:54
SPEAKER_01: And so a lot of times competitions don't actually consider that as telling a story.
14:57
SPEAKER_01: But um, I always kind of start there and then from there it's more just about finding the music, obviously.
15:04
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of times I become inspired by the music I already have, and then we kind of figure out how best to tell that story, and as the story progresses, what ages and what groups are going to be able to portray that, and then kind of how to move it along.
15:17
SPEAKER_01: So I don't really think I would think about dancers in the beginning, as crazy as it is.
15:21
SPEAKER_01: I kind of the theme and the music really drives it for me.
15:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:26
SPEAKER_03: I'm intrigued when you said uh that this whole story versus theme discrepancy potentially with competitions.
15:35
SPEAKER_01: We um it was actually a nationals that we were at in one of our our we called it production because that's what it is when we have like our one of our um specific portions of our competition teams.
15:46
SPEAKER_01: There's six individual teams within that, and so they all come together to do a production together.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: So that's about I think that year was maybe 80 dancers.
15:54
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
15:55
SPEAKER_01: And that specific production was about Paul Abdul.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: And um, we just used a bunch of Paula music, and so it wasn't, yeah, I know it was great.
16:03
SPEAKER_01: It was totally, and we did a lot of moves that I did when I was younger.
16:06
SPEAKER_01: It was awesome.
16:06
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
16:07
SPEAKER_01: But you know, that's not really telling a story, but we have some that are much different.
16:11
SPEAKER_01: We we had one production that went through like the not really a story of a wedding, but like a wedding from beginning to end called I Do, and it was really great.
16:19
SPEAKER_01: And so anyway, we actually had feedback after a nap.
16:22
SPEAKER_01: Oh, thank you.
16:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
16:23
SPEAKER_01: After the competition, we had some feedback from the judges that was like, I don't really think this is a production.
16:28
SPEAKER_01: This should be considered a line because it's basically a glorified jazz dance.
16:32
SPEAKER_01: No.
16:33
SPEAKER_01: So but then you have some competitions.
16:36
SPEAKER_01: I feel that productions are based on how many kids you have in there.
16:41
SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
16:42
SPEAKER_01: A two-minute routine, right?
16:44
SPEAKER_01: If there's 50 kids in there, it's a production.
16:46
SPEAKER_01: So I would say really just to know your audience, and by audience I mean competition.
16:50
SPEAKER_01: Read the rules.
16:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
16:53
SPEAKER_01: Especially when you're going in for those competition entries and to enter everything, I think that's pretty specific because um it is very specific to each competition.
17:01
SPEAKER_03: I do want to kind of chime in with something right off the right out the gates.
17:06
SPEAKER_03: And I feel like Leslie and Veronica, you can tell me your thoughts on this.
17:10
SPEAKER_03: But I think that like in that scenario, and I could be totally wrong, Christina, but I feel like in that scenario with the judge giving feedback, it could have just been more of a judge preference versus the competition's rules.
17:21
SPEAKER_03: Because I personally do not know what each competition requires in the production category.
17:29
SPEAKER_03: I just have a vision in my head as to what equals a production, which is what we're talking about right now.
17:34
SPEAKER_03: Right.
17:34
SPEAKER_03: Which I'm cool with the story, I'm cool with the theme.
17:37
SPEAKER_03: I just, to me, a production is you you need to have a mass amount of people on stage with different, you know, hopefully different songs, maybe contributing to a type of theme, but I don't necessarily need a story.
17:51
SPEAKER_03: And I've also heard that like some studios are smaller, so they don't have some of them.
17:55
SPEAKER_03: I might not even have 50 kids.
17:57
SPEAKER_03: Right.
17:57
SPEAKER_03: Like I've I've seen studios who only have 15 dancers, which this is their entire studio production, but they it's telling a story, but then it's it has to be in the line category because there's not enough dancers to be in the production category.
18:09
SPEAKER_03: It's like so many weird rules.
18:11
SPEAKER_03: And uh we actually like did a little bit of a digging ahead of time to read some of the production rules on each.
18:18
SPEAKER_03: And we were both really surprised at some of them.
18:20
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
18:20
SPEAKER_00: It's like, oh, that's all they care about.
18:23
SPEAKER_02: That's so strange.
18:24
SPEAKER_02: Because yeah, different competitions, I'm not looking as a judge at their rules of like this is a production, I'm gonna, you know, critique it as such.
18:32
SPEAKER_02: Right.
18:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
18:32
SPEAKER_01: Well, and I do know that I can tell you for a fact that I know of a competition that production is also not production is a category.
18:40
SPEAKER_01: Yes, right.
18:41
SPEAKER_01: It's not a dimension it's not correct based on per level.
18:45
SPEAKER_01: Right.
18:45
SPEAKER_03: Well, is the level is it still broken into level?
18:48
SPEAKER_01: So wait, so well, and so that depends because the last competition that we just went to, all productions are in the same division, no matter what level those dancers are.
18:58
SPEAKER_03: And that makes sense to me because most of the time, like I just mentioned, the production is usually the entire studio coming together or two different teams, like the junior team and the senior team, coming together.
19:10
SPEAKER_03: So it makes sense to be across the board all levels competing against each other, because let's be real, you probably have a ver a variety of levels in that production.
19:18
SPEAKER_03: So why are we gonna break it into uh, you know, advanced production versus novice production versus intermediate production?
19:25
SPEAKER_00: Like let's just all go ahead and all of them end up in like the nine to eleven category anyway, because the average babies, that's right.
19:33
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so that's I I like that.
19:35
SPEAKER_03: I think that more composition should do that.
19:37
SPEAKER_03: Where you know, that suggestion that that you just said that you experience Christina of just let's all go head to head.
19:42
SPEAKER_03: Production category, no levels, sure, it could even be no age, it could be even no age division too.
19:48
SPEAKER_03: Like we don't really need an age division for production.
19:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and not to mention, call me the crazy dance studio owner, but I just want to like sit back and watch all the productions.
19:57
SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, I get so excited at production time, it's like, okay, guys, you're checked in.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna see you for an hour because I'm going to see in the audience and because I love it.
20:04
SPEAKER_01: And I just oh, it's so funny.
20:06
SPEAKER_01: I love it so much.
20:07
SPEAKER_01: And so, like, how about like, can we like not even make productions like available for competition?
20:12
SPEAKER_01: Can we just watch them and not give any awards because they're so funny, right?
20:15
SPEAKER_01: Like, they just be there level they are.
20:18
SPEAKER_01: True, and that could be nice.
20:19
SPEAKER_03: What's about yeah, right?
20:20
SPEAKER_03: I like that idea.
20:21
SPEAKER_03: Let's not even there we go.
20:24
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, right.
20:25
SPEAKER_02: And that's what I was saying.
20:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's what I was saying.
20:28
SPEAKER_02: Like, as a judge, I really like to just watch it's a point of like, oh, well, let me let me say some things because I'm here in this week with uh everything going on and everything like all-encompassing.
20:38
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, wow, this is really great or beautiful or upbeat or different things like that.
20:43
SPEAKER_03: Um, so I'm here for just you know, not competing it, just watching it could maybe like receive like a you know, like maybe it could just be like not a score and not a critique, but uh just like okay, which like let's take a vote, judges, which one was your favorite, or something like a judge's choice kind of thing.
21:00
SPEAKER_03: Sure.
21:00
SPEAKER_03: That could be oh, okay.
21:02
SPEAKER_03: I hope competitions are listening out there because we just made some great suggestions, everybody.
21:08
SPEAKER_00: They give you a whole new category to do over here at me.
21:12
SPEAKER_00: Right.
21:12
SPEAKER_00: This is true.
21:13
SPEAKER_00: Listen up, guys.
21:14
SPEAKER_00: That is funny.
21:15
SPEAKER_00: All right, here's some just sort of more technical questions.
21:20
SPEAKER_00: Uh, and this is also probably like a little bit of a hot topic because also as a judge, sometimes you're like, why is this dance still on the stage?
21:28
SPEAKER_00: Why is it nine minutes long?
21:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
21:31
SPEAKER_00: It could have been four minutes long and still been a production.
21:34
SPEAKER_00: How long do you think a production number should be?
21:36
SPEAKER_02: Well, coming from a judge, I I think I think around the five to six minute range is a is a good range, depending on how many students you have.
21:46
SPEAKER_02: But coming from a choreographer range, sometimes you have so many songs that correlate with, you know, your theme and your story, it's hard.
21:54
SPEAKER_02: So I can see it from both sides.
21:56
SPEAKER_02: But now being on the opposite side as a judge, I'm like, yeah.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: Um around 450.
22:02
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, let's let's do this.
22:05
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so um I would say from five to let me change it.
22:09
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna say from five to seven.
22:11
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna bring it down a little bit.
22:14
SPEAKER_02: All right.
22:14
unknown: Right.
22:14
SPEAKER_02: We'll take it.
22:15
SPEAKER_03: What about you, Christina?
22:17
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so I might get some eye rolls of this, but we're asking for honesty here.
22:20
SPEAKER_01: Yes, we are.
22:21
SPEAKER_01: So again, you guys know this is my thing.
22:23
SPEAKER_01: So I think it really depends on the number of kids.
22:26
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
22:27
SPEAKER_01: So we my personal rules, I live I limit our biggest production to eight minutes.
22:32
SPEAKER_01: And again, that's usually 95 to 100, like 105 dancers.
22:37
SPEAKER_04: Wow.
22:37
SPEAKER_01: My routines with like 55 to even 60, that's five, six minutes.
22:43
SPEAKER_01: And I say six minutes because it's crazy because I have tried my best to edit those things under five minutes.
22:50
SPEAKER_01: And it's always 5.05, it's always 5'10.
22:53
SPEAKER_01: So the five to six minute mark is pretty good.
22:55
SPEAKER_01: So this is, I kind of feel like that even though eight minutes, yes, can definitely be a long time.
23:01
SPEAKER_01: And we know that it's very like subjective to what you're watching, what's being put on stage, how creative it is.
23:08
SPEAKER_01: But I want to make, I think it's important to make sure that you have enough time for everyone to have like ample stage time.
23:13
SPEAKER_01: And so for me, I think that you really want to get like a good bit of dancing for everyone, just other than just being like background for another group or coming on and just waving and run off, bouncing if they're little and then running off.
23:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
23:27
SPEAKER_01: So, which is another thing for me, but um, we'll get to that later, I'm sure.
23:30
SPEAKER_01: Um, I like to see all of my like individual groups on stage, like at least three times, even if it's not long, like maybe it's 30 seconds.
23:38
SPEAKER_01: And so, like, if some of our some of our productions have like five or six individual groups, by the time you see everybody like three times, and then I like for everybody to kind of come out at the end, that's our formula, then that usually comes to between seven and eight minutes.
23:51
SPEAKER_01: We always cap it off at eight.
23:52
SPEAKER_01: That is my hard rule, even if it's like a phenomenal whatever, we're gonna take that off, whatever we need to do.
23:58
SPEAKER_01: Um, but usually seven to eight minutes, you know.
24:00
SPEAKER_01: But I do think that you have to gauge that too for like how how the level of dancers, like can they carry that?
24:06
SPEAKER_01: How new is the choreography?
24:08
SPEAKER_01: Like, don't we don't want to see the same thing over and over.
24:10
SPEAKER_01: We need to keep seeing fresh ideas.
24:12
SPEAKER_01: And so as long as you've got some fresh ideas for eight minutes and it's gonna keep, I always call it pencil down, it's gonna keep the pencils down and us just watching, then I think, you know, I think eight minutes is pretty good.
24:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
24:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
24:25
SPEAKER_00: Well, and that's I mean, that is the goal.
24:26
SPEAKER_00: Like, you want me as a judge to be able to sit back and say, I just have nothing to say because I'm so engrossed in your dance and your story and your the amazing things you're doing, you know.
24:36
SPEAKER_00: Like, but the minute I need to pick that pencil up or start being like, all right, so I've seen that knee drop four times.
24:41
SPEAKER_03: Right.
24:41
SPEAKER_03: Right.
24:42
SPEAKER_00: And it's still wrong and it's still dangerous.
24:45
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
24:47
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
24:48
SPEAKER_03: That's I think I think that's uh really great valid points.
24:51
SPEAKER_00: All of everything, all of it.
24:53
SPEAKER_00: Um well, and because you know, of and we haven't even started talking about how much time it takes you to conceptualize this and teach it.
24:59
SPEAKER_00: And so it's like, yeah, you better get those kids on stage for three times in an eight-minute dance because otherwise, what are they paying for?
25:06
SPEAKER_00: You know, like you went to all these rehearsals and you show up twice and you walk on stage and you that's it, you know.
25:11
SPEAKER_00: So there's a whole lot that goes into it.
25:13
SPEAKER_03: That that being said, let's go there and talk about that because you mentioned it, Christina, and I think that it's important to talk about, especially for newer dance parents out there who might not really understand this whole crazy world that we're living in.
25:24
SPEAKER_03: So, like we talked briefly talked about the fact that the age range for a lot of productions ends up being like a the in the junior division, because even if there's seniors, even if there's petites, because it's just where the ages average out, and you probably have a lot of juniors in your studio.
25:40
SPEAKER_03: But that being said, I think there used to be rules, and I could be wrong, but there used to be rules as to like based on the age division that a dance is in, that age division or younger has to be on stage for a required amount of time within the dance for it to be.
25:54
SPEAKER_03: I'm sorry, no, I don't know about that anymore.
25:56
SPEAKER_03: I don't think that exists anymore to be on the state.
25:59
SPEAKER_03: Absolutely right.
26:00
SPEAKER_03: I remember that.
26:01
SPEAKER_03: But like that was like a percentage.
26:03
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it wasn't just to kind of make it fair because it's like, okay, well, you can't just put an eight-year-old in a senior level dance to bring the age down to teen and the eight-year-old scorpion and walk off.
26:13
SPEAKER_03: Right.
26:14
SPEAKER_03: Like, you know, there's like sneaky ways to like work the system.
26:17
SPEAKER_03: But that being said, I do like what you said, Christina, about the fact that you want all age dancers to have the same, not the same amount of time, but at least have the equal amount of time on stage.
26:28
SPEAKER_03: Because there are studios that do bring the littles out to do a little booty shake and skip off and leave, and you never see them the rest of the day.
26:37
SPEAKER_02: At the end, they're like all the way in the back, you know, the final right.
26:41
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they're in the back.
26:42
SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, well, you know, we know the older kids are kind of, you know, in the front and they know the choreography, but the if the little ones are on the stage, they they need to know the choreography as well.
26:52
SPEAKER_02: And you can't hide them in the back.
26:53
SPEAKER_02: Like bring them to the front.
26:55
SPEAKER_02: So I love that you say they have the same amount of or ample amount of time to be on stage and showcase their level and you know, their put their what they're putting forth in you know, the choreography and what they're adding to it, the performing.
27:08
SPEAKER_03: Deserve the same recognition on stage.
27:11
SPEAKER_03: They paid the same entry fee.
27:13
SPEAKER_03: The older dancers didn't pay more money because they're on stage for longer.
27:17
SPEAKER_03: Like, so for all my little, my newer dancers or parents who were like, oh shoot, that's totally my dancer that just walks out on stage and leaves.
27:25
SPEAKER_03: Like, I mean, maybe mention it to the I don't know.
27:29
SPEAKER_03: Like, I would be a little disappointed as a parent if that's what I was paying for.
27:33
SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, it's cheap.
27:35
SPEAKER_01: I really think, yeah, it's not.
27:37
SPEAKER_01: And I just they're part of that dance.
27:38
SPEAKER_01: So just like you said, I feel like that rule, it was like a percentage.
27:42
SPEAKER_01: Like they have to, I I don't really remember, but they have to be on stage a certain amount of percentage, and I cannot imagine the adjudicator that had to figure that out.
27:50
SPEAKER_03: No one did probably because they wrote it down.
27:53
SPEAKER_01: So that's the thing, is it's just a guy, it's a guideline, right?
27:55
SPEAKER_01: Right.
27:56
SPEAKER_01: And so I just I do think it's so sad.
27:57
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna harp on the little biddies for a second, when they don't get a dance by themselves, they come out as props, or they're carried across the stage, or they come on for like a little hi and then you know run off.
28:08
SPEAKER_01: I just think that, you know, I know that they can't like they should be able to showcase what they're doing.
28:13
SPEAKER_01: If they have dances individually that they're already competing, then they do have some skills that can go in that.
28:19
SPEAKER_01: They don't have to come out and do 7,000 leg turns.
28:22
SPEAKER_01: Nobody does, right?
28:23
SPEAKER_01: No crazy leaps to make an impression.
28:25
SPEAKER_01: What they can do is come out and show you what they're working on.
28:29
SPEAKER_01: How do they add value to that production?
28:31
SPEAKER_01: Right.
28:31
SPEAKER_01: Is why are they in there in the first place?
28:34
SPEAKER_01: Just like you're saying, is it because you want to bring the age down or is it just because they're supposed to be?
28:38
SPEAKER_01: But I do think that some talented choreography and a creative mind can work them in so they really feel like they're adding to that.
28:46
SPEAKER_01: There's got like this theme that it compromises your production, there's got to be a creative way to pull them, to pull them into that and just kind of broaden the whole the whole production idea.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: And then I that way I feel like it gives much more of a full studio vibe.
29:01
SPEAKER_04: Right.
29:01
SPEAKER_01: And on the same token, not even the little biddies, I don't think that you should hide everyone behind your best and most talented dancers.
29:09
SPEAKER_01: You know, we know that you have some strong ones, but those dancers do not have to be front and center for 90% percent of the whole production.
29:16
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, we've seen uh you as judges have seen them dance all weekend, more than likely.
29:21
SPEAKER_01: You know what they can do.
29:23
SPEAKER_01: Show us what else, you know, that your other dancers can do, or or how can I just think it takes a little extra thought process and even like some research.
29:32
SPEAKER_01: Like, watch what other people are doing out there to kind of get some different ideas of how you can showcase them in different lights and you know, just make it seem more like a whole studio effort than like these dancers are kind of leading and everybody else is just background dancers.
29:46
SPEAKER_01: So I think it's fun and it should productions are fun.
29:49
SPEAKER_01: It should be fun for everybody on stage.
29:50
SPEAKER_01: Everybody should be able to have that opportunity to showcase that that thing.
29:55
SPEAKER_03: Totally agree.
29:56
SPEAKER_03: And even just the mention, like I will even take, and this isn't preference, but I will take this over dancers not being on stage, is still having them on stage, even if they are a prop in so to say, or you know, adding layers or dimension in the back, I will take that over them just staying off stage the whole time.
30:17
SPEAKER_03: Right.
30:17
SPEAKER_03: Because at least they're standing on stage doing something, showing off their costume and smiling and contributing.
30:22
SPEAKER_03: But if they're just gonna be off stage waiting until it's the grand finale, like I notice that as a judge.
30:27
SPEAKER_03: I just want studios to know that.
30:29
SPEAKER_03: Like I notice that you your littles or exactly we all how can you not, as an audience member, like even as a parent, you're like, okay, it's been five minutes and my dancer hasn't even entered the stage yet.
30:41
SPEAKER_03: Like, you know, I think that those types of things need to be thought about in the creation of productions.
30:47
SPEAKER_03: And I mean, this sound kind of sounds a little bit mean, but honestly, like all of these amazing layers that you were talking about and the creativity that you were talking about, Christina, like that shows and and qu and that shows that you care about, you know, the final product.
31:00
SPEAKER_03: But there's a lot when you were saying that, I was thinking about all of the productions that I don't see all those things in.
31:05
SPEAKER_03: Right.
31:05
SPEAKER_03: And then it just makes me feel like, well, that studio was just lazy, and they just like, you know, wanted to slap something together and just call it a day.
31:11
SPEAKER_03: And here's our production, whoop-de-doo.
31:13
SPEAKER_03: And it's like, well, that's why it's not scoring well.
31:15
SPEAKER_03: Right.
31:15
SPEAKER_03: Because you didn't really put the creativity behind it.
31:17
SPEAKER_03: You didn't really think this out.
31:18
SPEAKER_03: And that's what we want to say.
31:21
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you don't want them to think like they're a second thought, like, oh, we have these great advanced senior dancers.
31:25
SPEAKER_01: This Beyoncé number will be wonderful.
31:27
SPEAKER_01: How do we work these little bitties in there like for five seconds?
31:30
SPEAKER_01: You know, I think take the take the extra time to come up with something that is equal for everyone and that everyone can enjoy.
31:38
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
31:38
SPEAKER_03: Leslie, what is your thought on time limit though?
31:41
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think it's kind of like we've all been saying, you know, we've all sat there and wondered why this dance is still happening.
31:47
SPEAKER_00: You know, it's like we've always taught a seven-year-old needs to be doing a two-minute solo.
31:51
SPEAKER_00: I don't need to see you get tired at 259 and it's a 305.
31:56
SPEAKER_00: Like if you're show me what you can do and then be done, you know, and that's the same for productions because, you know, you start with a bang, but I also need you to end with a bang.
32:04
SPEAKER_00: But if you don't have the gunpowder to end with a bang after eight minutes, then you've, you know, my score is just kind of going down.
32:11
SPEAKER_00: So lengthwise, you know, I'm I'm more for probably five to six, but I keep thinking of some recent productions that I've seen where if you do it well, you could do a whole musical in eight minutes.
32:22
SPEAKER_00: I saw a little mermaid recently that I was like, wait, you literally did the whole musical somehow in eight minutes.
32:27
SPEAKER_00: And it was brilliant.
32:29
SPEAKER_00: Completely up to speed.
32:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:31
SPEAKER_00: And if you can do that, then yes.
32:33
SPEAKER_00: But but then I've seen, you know, somebody did a West Side story and I was like, but where are we?
32:37
SPEAKER_00: What's happening?
32:37
SPEAKER_00: How did you you can't.
32:38
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:39
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't happen.
32:39
SPEAKER_00: So you just, I think, have to be picky and choosy about your theme or your or your show or your story to be able to say, okay, can I reasonably, cohesively for somebody who doesn't know maybe somebody doesn't know what the Little Mermaid is.
32:52
SPEAKER_00: And if you put that eight-minute dance on stage and you skip something, they're confused.
32:55
SPEAKER_00: Right.
32:55
SPEAKER_00: So I always try to think of when I'm watching, like, what does Joe Schmoe on the side of the road who doesn't know anything about dance, think about this dance?
33:02
SPEAKER_00: What what's that person looking at?
33:03
SPEAKER_00: And are they going to understand from point A to point B to point C?
33:06
SPEAKER_00: And if you can't do it all in eight minutes, maybe that's not what you do.
33:09
SPEAKER_00: But if you can do something in five minutes really well, like you kind of like Christina was saying, some of her stuff is more themed-based.
33:16
SPEAKER_00: That that I think you can do.
33:17
SPEAKER_00: And like bing bang boom, get it done and and don't be exhausted at the end and like dying.
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34:30
SPEAKER_01: And I'll say there has there have definitely been instances to where we've had a a production fully choreographed maybe in January, and I can tell as we're rehearsing it that there is there's just dead space.
34:44
SPEAKER_01: It just doesn't need it.
34:45
SPEAKER_01: And I feel like I got even better before I had my girls.
34:50
SPEAKER_01: I um had a lot more time, and so I was able to judge a lot.
34:53
SPEAKER_01: And I kind of feel like every choreographer and dance studio owner should have to judge at least like a year of their life so they can see it from the other's perspective.
35:03
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
35:03
SPEAKER_01: Because now I am much more apt to be like, you know what?
35:06
SPEAKER_01: We don't need that.
35:07
SPEAKER_01: That is definitely 30 seconds that is not additive right now.
35:10
SPEAKER_01: Like let's let's let's pull that out and figure out how we can make this, like you said, more cohesive.
35:15
SPEAKER_01: And so um, you know, I think if I can if if we could if we can do it in six minutes versus seven and it's better, then we're gonna do it.
35:22
SPEAKER_01: I'm not, you know, we're never extending something just, oh, we have an eight-minute production.
35:26
SPEAKER_01: This is great.
35:26
SPEAKER_01: Because honestly, like well, and leave them wanting more.
35:29
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's just like that's good advice for everything.
35:32
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
35:33
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
35:33
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, whoa, where's the Little Mermaid 2?
35:35
SPEAKER_00: I know that was a bad movie, but like, can we get Little Mermaid 2 on stage?
35:38
SPEAKER_03: And just Oh, that's our advice favorite.
35:40
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
35:41
SPEAKER_03: And just to let everybody know over in the listener world, that we did kind of do some research and look to see like what the going rules time limits were for productions, and I'd say the average was max eight minutes, just so you know.
35:55
SPEAKER_03: So um, that does not mean you have to use it.
35:58
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
35:58
SPEAKER_00: But it's and that is also that's very good.
36:01
SPEAKER_00: And then this is gonna segue so beautifully into my next question.
36:04
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes that eight minutes includes your setup and breakdown of your potential props or set.
36:10
SPEAKER_00: Do we think, Veronica?
36:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm so curious to hear from you because you're you just mentioned in your intro that you're choreographing a production of guys and dolls.
36:17
SPEAKER_00: And that's a it's a production because it's a musical.
36:20
SPEAKER_00: You say you're choreographing a full-blown musical, and the production number is kind of just a miniature musical if you're doing it, you know, in a certain way.
36:26
SPEAKER_00: How do you feel in production numbers?
36:28
SPEAKER_00: Are props necessary?
36:29
SPEAKER_00: Are sets necessary?
36:31
SPEAKER_00: How do they increase or decrease the value of the number?
36:34
SPEAKER_02: I uh ooh, this is a very large question.
36:39
SPEAKER_02: It is because you can go both ways, but okay, I'll go with uh sets first.
36:46
SPEAKER_02: And I sometimes do think sets are necessary, depending on how many students you have on stage.
36:51
SPEAKER_02: And that could just be like different platforms in the back, so you have different dimensions and levels on the stage.
36:57
SPEAKER_02: Because, like I said, I did see it was, I think it was like 120 students dancers on the stage, but they didn't have anything on the stage, so it you couldn't really see any of the formations, especially you know, judges sit right there.
37:09
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
37:10
SPEAKER_02: So with set, yes, I do.
37:13
SPEAKER_02: And then majority of musicals have sets to continue developing the story or theme, right?
37:19
SPEAKER_02: Props.
37:20
SPEAKER_02: I've seen a lot of productions with great props, and I've seen some that I'm like, uh, I don't know why we would we would need that on the stage to help, you know, telling the story.
37:30
SPEAKER_02: And I've seen some without props, and I'm like, that's awesome.
37:33
SPEAKER_02: Now some of them do have a lot of costume changes, which help develop, you know, if it's say if it was you're doing the Paula Abdul one, maybe you had, you know, uh one of her videos and then they changed to something else to help develop the story.
37:46
SPEAKER_02: So I think I just went in a circle and didn't give you a straight answer.
37:50
SPEAKER_00: Listen, sometimes that's the answer though.
37:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
37:53
SPEAKER_00: You covered it.
37:54
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
37:54
SPEAKER_02: But I do want to say if you do have props or sets, you have to practice putting, you know, stuff on the breakdown because sometimes I'm like, uh-uh, uh, we we've been here and you know, sometimes competitions do say there is a penalty, but a lot a lot of the times, you know, we're not really giving the penalty to them, right?
38:11
SPEAKER_02: That's right.
38:11
SPEAKER_02: Unless it's right, you know, very yes, but but still as a courtesy to the audience, to the judges, just you know, for the people that are coming right to practice and make sure you can um set up and break down in a timely manner.
38:26
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
38:26
SPEAKER_03: Don't get me started.
38:29
SPEAKER_03: Oh my gosh.
38:31
SPEAKER_03: I that is one of my biggest pet peeves in the competition world is how the power tools are coming out, and here comes 20 dads on the stage with with what are those things called?
38:44
SPEAKER_03: Dollies and like I'm like, what is happening?
38:48
SPEAKER_03: I true, I'm sitting there as a judge with my jaw on the floor when the power when I start hearing drills on stage.
38:55
SPEAKER_03: Because it to me, it is beyond disrespectful.
38:58
SPEAKER_03: Personally, that's how it comes across to me because I'm like, okay, cool.
39:02
SPEAKER_03: You do have there are time limits for a reason.
39:04
SPEAKER_03: Like Leslie said, some of these time limits ha include prop setup, which when we did our research on this episode, we would say around two and a half minutes for setup and two and a half minutes for breakdown is kind of the across the board rule for production numbers, not lines, not large groups, anything else.
39:22
SPEAKER_03: You get like 30 seconds, which never gets followed either.
39:26
SPEAKER_03: So I think for me as a judge, it just like you said, Veronica, it ha you have that's part of the dance.
39:32
SPEAKER_03: You have to rehearse it.
39:34
SPEAKER_03: That there needs to be a day when all the prop dads are there off stage.
39:37
SPEAKER_03: All right, guys, it's production time.
39:38
SPEAKER_03: Let's go put the timer on.
39:39
SPEAKER_03: Let's see how fast you can do it.
39:40
SPEAKER_03: I mean, if that's not done and I'm sitting there literally eating my snack with my arms crossed, waiting for you to finish setting up your prop, I'm already going into your dance upset.
39:49
SPEAKER_03: And you don't want that from your judge.
39:51
SPEAKER_03: Do you know what I mean?
39:52
SPEAKER_01: Because the whole time you're like, this better be good.
39:54
SPEAKER_01: It better be better be worth it.
39:56
SPEAKER_01: You've ever seen, yeah, then it's already.
39:58
SPEAKER_03: And that prop better, that prop better be used.
40:01
SPEAKER_03: If you spent five plus minutes that you weren't even allowed to use to set it up, and then I'm literally upset watching that prop not used at all.
40:11
SPEAKER_03: Which P.S.
40:12
SPEAKER_03: If you haven't listened to our prop episode, that's a good one.
40:14
SPEAKER_03: Go listen to our prop episode, which was at the top of the season, and you heard me talk about this for an entire hour.
40:21
SPEAKER_00: Lonely sad prop over there that's like not even it's broken and yeah.
40:25
SPEAKER_03: I will say though, I'm not mad at a set piece that is utilized.
40:28
SPEAKER_03: And I think that they can be very well done.
40:31
SPEAKER_03: I also love when the sets move.
40:33
SPEAKER_03: That's also really exciting.
40:34
SPEAKER_02: If they have a reveal.
40:36
SPEAKER_03: Yes, I love a reveal, and I also love when they are prop when they are safe props.
40:41
SPEAKER_03: So like I can tell that whoever designed them actually put like brakes on them if they're supposed to move, or they're really stable and sturdy, because the other thing you don't want is for me to be cringing in my seat scared that you're gonna fall off of a prop or something like that.
40:54
SPEAKER_03: So I'm not I don't hate props.
40:56
SPEAKER_03: I just hate how long they take to get set up if you go over the time limit, which don't do that.
41:02
SPEAKER_00: Well, and I think too, like Veronica said, the the platforms do become almost a necessity in the kind of venues we're in.
41:10
SPEAKER_00: Because if you were if you're choreographing a, you know, a field show, I'm up in in the stadium looking at your formations with a hundred people and that looks amazing.
41:18
SPEAKER_00: You don't need a platform for that.
41:20
SPEAKER_00: But on uh in a in a venue like we're at, you know, I I see your hundred dancers, and you know, unless you're very creative about getting them everywhere, if you're just in 16 straight lines, I can't see you, you know?
41:31
SPEAKER_00: And so the platforms I do like if they're ready to go, and like, you know, there is a there's choreography involved in saying five, six, seven, eight, dad's carried on.
41:39
SPEAKER_00: Put it down, push it back, walk away, start.
41:43
SPEAKER_00: Like dads are choreographed.
41:45
SPEAKER_00: You guys have to be choreographed too, because there's nothing worse than just like the poor dad who just got roped into this last minute, like, hey, we need your manpower.
41:51
SPEAKER_00: And he's like, I uh what's upstage?
41:54
SPEAKER_00: Like he doesn't know where to put this box, you know.
41:56
SPEAKER_00: So help your dads out, have a day, have a beer, you know, like party so they know.
42:03
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
42:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think it's I I just I think it's like with everything else, you just have to really think about it smartly and creatively.
42:11
SPEAKER_01: And and again, if you've taken a second, if you had a chance to judge and see it from the other, the other perspective.
42:18
SPEAKER_01: I do remember one dance that uh we saw that it prop took about 15 minutes to set up.
42:24
SPEAKER_01: No, it was a production and it was a two and a half minute dance.
42:27
SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
42:29
SPEAKER_01: And no, it was literally just scenery, nothing was used.
42:33
SPEAKER_01: And it yeah.
42:34
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, nope.
42:36
SPEAKER_01: That really just makes you kind of stop and think like that whole dance could have been done without that.
42:40
SPEAKER_01: I mean, absolutely love, love props because I love the entertainment part of it.
42:44
SPEAKER_01: I think that like if used correctly, it can really bring life to it.
42:47
SPEAKER_01: I mean, we've done like everything from like scale-sized school bleachers when we did like um a school theme.
42:53
SPEAKER_01: We've done we've had an 18-foot pagoda on stage that was used and ran in and out all kinds of stuff.
42:58
SPEAKER_01: Um, one of my favorites is that we did a platform that was rigged with a fan underneath.
43:03
SPEAKER_01: So we had like the full Marilyn Monroe moment.
43:06
SPEAKER_03: That's curious.
43:08
SPEAKER_01: Very cute.
43:08
SPEAKER_01: So that's being used, and you know, and then we do like a lot of hand props, but they're being used on stage for a long time.
43:15
SPEAKER_01: So we've had like bamboo sticks, um, Venetian masks, giant plastic lips, all those kind of things.
43:21
SPEAKER_01: But my rule is if we're using them, it's gonna be on stage for at least 45 seconds to a minute.
43:25
SPEAKER_01: Like it's not an on-side.
43:27
SPEAKER_01: We have to do something with it, and it needs to look creative.
43:29
SPEAKER_01: Like, we're not just gonna have a fan and fan ourselves, we're gonna do cool like formations and there's open and closes.
43:35
SPEAKER_01: One of the coolest things we've done this year is that we had pizza boxes.
43:39
SPEAKER_01: We did like an Italiano thing, and um, our little ones used pizza boxes.
43:44
SPEAKER_01: They danced for a full like two minutes on stage, got themselves on and off.
43:47
SPEAKER_01: Everything was great.
43:48
SPEAKER_01: And obviously, we want to do this creatively because we didn't want to mess up the flooring, but I wanted them to, they're making pizza, and so there needed to be flour that blew like a little flower puff into the air.
43:59
SPEAKER_01: But we took Enough time to practice that so much to make sure that A, it could be seen to make sure it was worth it, but B, it can't be too much to damage the floor for any of our dancers or any one after us.
44:10
SPEAKER_01: And so we kind of really think like, do we need this?
44:14
SPEAKER_01: And if we do, how do we use it smartly and effectively?
44:17
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
44:18
SPEAKER_01: So I think I just think it can't be anything that's done without care.
44:21
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
44:22
SPEAKER_00: Right.
44:22
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
44:23
SPEAKER_00: I want to see that number now.
44:24
SPEAKER_00: I know.
44:24
SPEAKER_00: That sounds cute.
44:25
SPEAKER_04: I know.
44:25
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
44:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
44:26
SPEAKER_01: All right.
44:27
SPEAKER_01: It'll be on YouTube in like three weeks after national.
44:29
SPEAKER_01: So we'll be following up.
44:31
SPEAKER_01: We'll link it in the show notes.
44:34
SPEAKER_03: Um while you were while we're talking about the whole prop thing, I think that I as you were talking, Christina, it kind of made me think, go back to that one of the first things you said about how, well, this looks like a glorified jazz line and not a production.
44:49
SPEAKER_03: And I think that, and I didn't see that dance, obviously, but I think that many other studios could get into this dilemma as well if they don't have a set or props.
45:00
SPEAKER_03: Because when compared to a studio that does, then it looks like, well, this isn't a production.
45:06
SPEAKER_03: Right.
45:06
SPEAKER_03: You know, and I think that's an issue in our industry based on the definitions from the competitions.
45:12
SPEAKER_03: Because based on the research we did and just looking at some of the bigger competitions that everybody knows about that have been around for a really long time, there's some definitions of pro of production numbers that just says it's this length of time and it has this amount of dancers.
45:28
SPEAKER_03: The end.
45:29
SPEAKER_03: That is the only rule.
45:31
SPEAKER_03: Um, there's some definitions that say must follow a story or a theme.
45:36
SPEAKER_03: So there's both of those in there.
45:37
SPEAKER_03: Then there's some definitions that say must include props or set pieces.
45:43
SPEAKER_03: Like as a requirement.
45:44
SPEAKER_03: A requirement for the production category, which I found very interesting.
45:48
SPEAKER_03: And if that's the case, I think that those competitions need to make it very, very, very clear to their judging panel, right?
45:56
SPEAKER_03: Yo, this is in our rules.
45:57
SPEAKER_03: And most likely every studio is going to have a prop.
46:01
SPEAKER_03: And if they don't, I guess it's not a production.
46:03
SPEAKER_03: I mean, do they get penalized for not having a prop?
46:06
SPEAKER_03: Like, I don't know.
46:06
SPEAKER_03: I and I don't really like that rule, to be completely honest, because I don't think there's a lot of studios that are super against props.
46:14
SPEAKER_03: Like, I don't want to have to tow something, I don't want to have to store something.
46:18
SPEAKER_03: So why would you make that a requirement to have a prop or a set piece in your rules?
46:24
SPEAKER_03: That just feels greedy to me, honestly.
46:26
SPEAKER_03: Like, I mean, greedy in the sense of like it costs extra money to build a prop or exclusionary.
46:31
SPEAKER_00: Maybe not greedy.
46:32
SPEAKER_00: But it's like, you know what?
46:33
SPEAKER_00: If you don't have a storage unit or dads who are willing to build a prop, you can't do this.
46:37
SPEAKER_01: And it's like I could probably Yeah, or like a$5,000 U-Haul budget.
46:43
SPEAKER_00: Well, because I that's my thing.
46:44
SPEAKER_00: It's like when when I see big props on stage and they don't get used, or even small props and they don't get used.
46:49
SPEAKER_00: One of my comments usually is somebody's dad took the time to build this in his garage, possibly store it in his garage, got it in his truck here.
46:57
SPEAKER_00: Like somebody took the time.
46:59
SPEAKER_00: Right.
46:59
SPEAKER_00: And that is worth something.
47:01
SPEAKER_00: And for you to just leave it in the corner and stand on it once and then go back into the other corner and just do PK turns, like you didn't do that person service, like you didn't do their work justice.
47:12
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so, but again, if you don't happen to have the prop ads or the U-Haul budget or the storage unit budget, like you should still be able to do a production number.
47:19
SPEAKER_00: Right.
47:19
SPEAKER_00: Maybe you're really creative and you don't need any props, you know?
47:22
SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I think about it without props, you know.
47:24
SPEAKER_03: And like you mentioned, Christina, I think an an alternative is the is the changing of costumes in slight, delic, small ways.
47:31
SPEAKER_03: You know, it doesn't have to be another costume that costs a hundred dollars.
47:33
SPEAKER_03: Like, no, add a shirt, add a this, add an accessory, and boom, you're now a new character or you're now a new part of this show type of thing.
47:41
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
47:41
SPEAKER_02: What were you gonna say, Veronica?
47:42
SPEAKER_02: I was just saying, even outside of competition world, there are d there are productions that don't use props, like even musicals or dance concerts or you know, things like that.
47:51
SPEAKER_02: That's where it has come from.
47:53
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
47:53
SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I think it's very exclusionary to say you must use a prop.
47:57
SPEAKER_02: Um, because some dances don't don't need it.
48:00
SPEAKER_02: And maybe some judges don't know that.
48:02
SPEAKER_00: The judge that said that, yeah, maybe they, you know.
48:05
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
48:05
SPEAKER_00: And may and maybe that's on us.
48:06
SPEAKER_00: Like, I mean, I don't read every competition's rules.
48:08
SPEAKER_00: I used to judge for like five or six different companies every year.
48:11
SPEAKER_00: And so I just show up and look at their scoring rubric, of course.
48:14
SPEAKER_00: Yes, you know, and then I'll ask the question, like, well, what do you get?
48:17
SPEAKER_00: What's a trick to you?
48:18
SPEAKER_00: How many tricks in this number?
48:19
SPEAKER_00: Like some of the big rules that like we're very aware of that are different, but like that kind of rule, I wouldn't have asked about that.
48:24
SPEAKER_00: I guess I should ask about that.
48:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sure.
48:26
SPEAKER_03: Sure.
48:27
SPEAKER_03: And I think it's important for the competitions to make sure that that the judges know those types of things that are that drastically different.
48:33
SPEAKER_03: Oh, at our competition, I know you work for a lot of different competition companies, but at our competition, this is what this rule is, and this is what this rule is, just so you know, because a lot of competitions might not lay that out clear um for everyone across the board.
48:46
SPEAKER_03: And then studios are just trying to do the right thing by following the rules, and then the rules might not even be enforced or known by the people on the other side of the table.
48:55
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
48:55
SPEAKER_01: I know of a story, not us personally, but another um dance studio owner that they had their production.
49:01
SPEAKER_01: I think I think the judge wound up, I don't know if they actually I don't think it showed.
49:05
SPEAKER_01: I think they just declared it when they were speaking, but they knocked off some points because it was over time limit.
49:11
SPEAKER_01: Like I don't know if they were keeping time near their table, but that studio had purchased extra time.
49:15
SPEAKER_01: Right.
49:16
SPEAKER_01: Because you can never know that's a thing.
49:18
SPEAKER_01: That's a thing.
49:19
SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, I uh it's just gotta be hard with all the different competitions, just like us as studio owners, when we go and enter these competition entries, it is literally a full-time job for about four months.
49:29
SPEAKER_01: You have to go and read every single rule.
49:31
SPEAKER_01: And okay, so this is, you know, they don't even have a musical theater category.
49:35
SPEAKER_01: It's supposed to be character or, you know, how many tricks can be in this number?
49:40
SPEAKER_01: What does it have to be?
49:40
SPEAKER_01: Like, is he tumbling?
49:42
SPEAKER_01: It's that's tough.
49:43
SPEAKER_01: And so while I do agree that yes, the information is there, we need to read it thoroughly and understand, it is kind of like let's highlight a few things that have been problems in the past and let the judges know.
49:53
SPEAKER_01: And let's also let studio owners know that going into it.
49:55
SPEAKER_03: Totally.
49:56
SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
49:57
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think that's I think that's great advice.
49:59
SPEAKER_03: And and going back, I do think that to all of the studios out there that don't use props or sets for your productions, I would say avoid the comps that require um that in their description, but also don't feel obligated to, if that makes sense.
50:15
SPEAKER_03: If you can put on a great piece without a proper set, that's great.
50:19
SPEAKER_03: Good for you.
50:20
SPEAKER_03: Props to you.
50:21
SPEAKER_03: Props to you.
50:22
SPEAKER_03: Props to you.
50:23
SPEAKER_03: Props to you.
50:25
SPEAKER_03: Yes, yes, yes.
50:26
SPEAKER_03: I love it.
50:27
SPEAKER_03: I love that.
50:28
SPEAKER_03: That's so funny.
50:32
SPEAKER_03: So, what have been some of your favorite production numbers that you've ever seen, or maybe done yourself?
50:39
SPEAKER_03: I mean, Christina, you told us a little bit about some of your fun ideas, but is there any that come to your mind that you've seen that you're like, wow, I'll never forget that?
50:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so two that I have not done.
50:51
SPEAKER_01: It was actually a presidential election.
50:52
SPEAKER_01: And while I know, you know, politics, it's always a super important topic, but before it was kind of like such a hot button issue.
50:58
SPEAKER_01: I don't know that I could even watch a presidential election on a stage now.
51:03
SPEAKER_01: Um, I saw a routine, it was killer.
51:05
SPEAKER_01: It was like half the shoo was red, half the shoo was blue.
51:08
SPEAKER_01: There was podiums, there was stars and stripes.
51:10
SPEAKER_01: It was very cool.
51:11
SPEAKER_01: I had a little Kanye, which I don't think you could do.
51:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
51:15
SPEAKER_01: Um it was so incredible.
51:17
SPEAKER_01: It was really, really cool.
51:19
SPEAKER_01: Just how they did like the rallies and the actual election, and that was neat.
51:23
SPEAKER_01: And then um, I have some very dear friends of mine um that did a Lady Gaga production, which was wonderful, but it started with um this dancer on this huge platform in the middle of the stage, and she had this gauze skirt that wrapped around her waist and was as big as the stage, draped over everything.
51:40
SPEAKER_01: And so it well, it took a long, it took a little while to set up.
51:44
SPEAKER_01: When she saw her up there, sounds worth it.
51:47
SPEAKER_01: It was worth it, right?
51:47
SPEAKER_01: I'm we're talking like a 40 by 50 skirt.
51:51
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
51:51
SPEAKER_01: And she started like that, and she was very gaga, and I mean, like it was just beautiful.
51:55
SPEAKER_01: They came out with these sticks with disco balls, and um, they came out in platform heels at the at the end, and it was just very much in character.
52:04
SPEAKER_01: The bigs, the littles, everyone dancing.
52:07
SPEAKER_01: That really, that really stands out to me.
52:09
SPEAKER_01: I think one of my favorites, we did something, we have a habit because we're CK dance works, and C is for Christina and Ken K is for Kinzie, one of my partners.
52:20
SPEAKER_01: We put C, it's kind of ridiculous when Leslie knows all about this.
52:24
SPEAKER_01: We put CK into everything we can.
52:26
SPEAKER_01: So, like, you know, like an email just went out before recital that said good luck, and the CK is gonna be big and a different color in luck, and we try to do that in everything, and it's crazy.
52:36
SPEAKER_01: But we called it prep school, and it had a big CK.
52:39
SPEAKER_01: But I'd had this idea, and this was a a production that I'd had in like my playlist ideas, gotta get it done for five years.
52:46
SPEAKER_01: And I just I could see it, I could see the girls in like the white button-up private school cardigans with a CK crest here, and I could see the skirts, and I could see the bleachers, but I didn't have the music, but I knew it was gonna come, and it took me about five years.
53:00
SPEAKER_01: And then one day, I don't know where, I was sitting somewhere, and I think Beyonce's schooling life came on, and I was like, that's it, that's my finale number.
53:10
SPEAKER_01: And uh we had bleachers on the side, we used them.
53:14
SPEAKER_01: Uh, we had like a little excerpt from Mean Girls in there.
53:17
SPEAKER_01: We had my littles were football players, the group above there were cheerleaders.
53:22
SPEAKER_01: We had band members, we had I'm forgetting one, but the debate club or something.
53:27
SPEAKER_01: Everybody was we had like a run-through sign where our like little football players ran through and broke the sign and then danced like a little ESVN Monday night football.
53:35
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, it was just really neat because everybody felt so a part of that because we really like um had a whole school vibe the whole year, and it was cute because they all had their individual costumes and then somewhere out through the production they would go on and put their car to get on.
53:50
SPEAKER_01: So at the end, there was like look like a hundred prep school girls all up there dancing together, and we had the levels, and it just turned out to be really fun.
53:58
SPEAKER_01: So um, it was that's probably my favorite.
54:00
SPEAKER_01: It was, it was just really neat and a really, a really fun one.
54:03
SPEAKER_01: And that's what's so important to me is I just think it, you know, for me personally, I just think it needs to be entertaining.
54:09
SPEAKER_01: Everybody just wants to be able to sit back, and that's what dance is about.
54:11
SPEAKER_01: We want to, we want to feel something.
54:13
SPEAKER_01: And for me, productions are about feeling good and fun and like I want to see that again, or I want to be in that number.
54:18
SPEAKER_01: That's so fun.
54:19
SPEAKER_01: And um, so yeah, that one really sticks, that one always sticks close to my heart.
54:22
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that sounds so fun.
54:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it sounds great.
54:25
SPEAKER_00: Any good memories for you, Veronica?
54:27
SPEAKER_02: Yes, actually, it was a nursery rhyme theme.
54:31
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
54:32
SPEAKER_02: And this it was so amazing.
54:35
SPEAKER_02: I mean, they had Humpty Dumpty and he cracked open.
54:38
SPEAKER_02: They had Mother Goose, Little Red Riding Hood was like a hip-hop section.
54:42
SPEAKER_02: And then what took it over the top for me was when the cow jumped over the moon and there was a spork in the spork in the spoon.
54:51
SPEAKER_02: The fork in the spoon.
54:52
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god.
54:55
SPEAKER_02: But the way they had like the platform, it did it itself.
54:58
SPEAKER_02: Oh cute.
54:58
SPEAKER_02: And then somebody, so there was like the moon, and then the cow like jumped and did the somersault over.
55:03
SPEAKER_02: It was just phenomenal.
55:05
SPEAKER_02: And I actually didn't judge this.
55:07
SPEAKER_02: This is when I was, you know, just at competition with the dance studio I teach at.
55:11
SPEAKER_02: And I just sat there like mouth open, jaw wide.
55:14
SPEAKER_02: It was just so creative, and it was clean, but it was entertaining.
55:19
SPEAKER_02: Everything progressed the story, right?
55:22
SPEAKER_02: Everything mattered, everything like had a purpose.
55:26
SPEAKER_02: And I was just like, this is awesome.
55:28
SPEAKER_02: Um, that same studio, actually, that was like a few years ago before COVID.
55:33
SPEAKER_02: That whole thing happened.
55:34
SPEAKER_02: And then I saw them a couple weeks ago at a different studio and a different competition.
55:40
SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, is this the same studio?
55:42
SPEAKER_02: And it was.
55:43
SPEAKER_02: And they did it, it was kind of like a Star Wars theme, but just not Star Wars.
55:48
SPEAKER_02: It was like different aliens and things that have happened in movies like Space Jam, um Guardians of the Galaxy, like fighting each other.
55:56
SPEAKER_02: Cool.
55:56
SPEAKER_02: And I was like, it's mind-blowing.
55:59
SPEAKER_00: Yes, yeah, whose brain is this?
56:01
SPEAKER_02: Like, oh my goodness.
56:03
SPEAKER_02: It was a studio owner.
56:04
SPEAKER_02: So I'm like, you guys have like gold.
56:06
SPEAKER_02: You guys are amazing.
56:08
SPEAKER_02: So yes.
56:09
SPEAKER_03: So creative.
56:10
SPEAKER_03: I love that.
56:11
SPEAKER_03: I love I love hearing this.
56:13
SPEAKER_03: Anything off the top of your head?
56:14
SPEAKER_00: Just I mean, honestly, that little mermaid I saw a few weeks ago, I just I couldn't get over it because it's it's just it's one of my favorite.
56:19
SPEAKER_00: It's like nostalgia.
56:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
56:21
SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, because it has already been done as a musical, it is easy to adapt.
56:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think, because there's a lot of parts.
56:28
SPEAKER_00: You could be a lot of fish, you can be fish creatures.
56:30
SPEAKER_00: Somebody recently also did a Beauty and the Beast that was done very well and just was able to just take little snippets here and there of just the whole story.
56:38
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I also love it when when they take when production numbers sort of do a well-known story but take it out of context or put it into sort of like you said, that nursery rhyme context, which is always just, you know, a feat of creativity.
56:51
SPEAKER_00: Right.
56:51
SPEAKER_00: You know, yeah, you can just do a musical that already exists and just do it, and that can be done really well.
56:56
SPEAKER_00: But if you're able to just sort of put a different spin on something that already exists, that's I really love that.
57:01
SPEAKER_00: And I love being surprised um and like delighted by things that come out of people's brains.
57:06
SPEAKER_00: I think it's so much fun.
57:07
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think that's what's so special about the productions, like we talked about, is just the entertainment value and the creativity.
57:13
SPEAKER_03: Like that's how we really started the conversation is right.
57:15
SPEAKER_03: What, you know, how how can you make this creative?
57:18
SPEAKER_03: And yeah, I've definitely seen my fair share of like, all right, we're just gonna go down the whole soundtrack of a musical and uh, you know, do do the dance and here here's a Grease production.
57:28
SPEAKER_03: And it's like, cool, but how can we make it different?
57:30
SPEAKER_03: How can you make it you?
57:31
SPEAKER_03: How can you make it, you know, re- really scream your studio?
57:34
SPEAKER_03: Right.
57:35
SPEAKER_01: I think a really big part of that is music choice.
57:37
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
57:38
SPEAKER_01: Um for me, I think that's why a lot of times, like I said, I sat on prep school for so long, is that, you know, if you're gonna do a Barbie production, awesome.
57:46
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I absolutely love Barbie, I'm a Barbie girl, 100%.
57:50
SPEAKER_01: What can we use different that's not I'm a Barbie girl or life in the dream house?
57:55
SPEAKER_01: Like, I think when you can find, you know, I think remixes can be your best friend or even things that just, you know, hint at what you're saying.
58:04
SPEAKER_01: Like, how can you make that song come in?
58:06
SPEAKER_01: Because I think it's very possible to have three different, you know, Barbie productions side by side and they can all be completely different.
58:14
SPEAKER_01: So, how can you make your stand apart from everyone else?
58:17
SPEAKER_01: You know, what can you do that talks about dolls or talks about plastic or, you know, anything like that?
58:23
SPEAKER_01: So I think that is so important because, like you said, just, you know, um, Hamilton's a little different.
58:29
SPEAKER_01: You know, you probably should stick to that music unless you're gonna do a take on Hamilton, an all-girl pass or something like that.
58:35
SPEAKER_01: But, you know, how can you find some a different like studio soundtrack for that that that encompasses that?
58:43
SPEAKER_01: So I, you know, I think I think that's just so important and it's so important to making a good production um that no one's ever seen before.
58:53
SPEAKER_01: Like if you're gonna do Vegas, we've all seen a ton of Vegas productions, right?
58:58
SPEAKER_01: Same thing with a runway.
58:59
SPEAKER_01: Everybody uses a runway.
59:00
SPEAKER_01: So like what what new music can you bring to that or how can you do it differently?
59:04
SPEAKER_01: You know, I just I think that's really that's really important.
59:07
SPEAKER_01: And that's what sticks with people is to see something new that you haven't done before.
59:11
SPEAKER_01: And so much of that really does stem from music.
59:14
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
59:14
SPEAKER_03: And with the music, uh just like one final question before we kind of wrap this up.
59:19
SPEAKER_03: What are your what are y'all's thoughts on just genres of productions?
59:24
SPEAKER_03: Do you feel like there needs to be every style possible in a production number?
59:30
SPEAKER_03: Or can a production be just jazz or just lyrical or just contemporary or things like that?
59:36
SPEAKER_03: I've seen a lot of variations on this, and I also think that a lot of studios feel like there needs to be every style in a production number, and I'm not sure if I'm always on board with that personally.
59:48
SPEAKER_03: So I'm curious to hear y'all's thoughts.
59:51
SPEAKER_02: I think it kind of takes away.
59:52
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna agree with you, Courtney.
59:54
SPEAKER_02: I don't think I need to see, you know, point and then jazz, contemporary hip hop all in one production number, especially if it doesn't add any value to your your theme or storyline production, etc.
1:00:09
SPEAKER_02: I think you can if you want to add, and it does, I've seen it done well before.
1:00:14
SPEAKER_02: Um but majority of the time it's it's not done very well.
1:00:19
SPEAKER_02: So I I think that sticking to one genre, maybe a couple in between, because you can do like a contemporary jazz, you can do like a uh jazz funk with hip-hop, you know, you can mix genres together, um, but you don't necessarily necessarily need to pick from every pot, every genre.
1:00:38
SPEAKER_02: Right.
1:00:38
SPEAKER_02: Um, because majority of the time it's not it's not done too well.
1:00:42
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
1:00:43
SPEAKER_00: And then it's hard, you know, it's stressful trying to find your tap shoes in the dark.
1:00:46
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
1:00:46
SPEAKER_00: You got Sally's tap shoe, you danced with one tap shoe or it doesn't get laced up.
1:00:49
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:00:50
SPEAKER_00: It's hard.
1:00:50
SPEAKER_01: Like it's a lot.
1:00:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:00:53
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:00:53
SPEAKER_01: I think personally I I can't imagine just from my brain, it would have to be a production about, you know, something about Broadway where it's showing 18 or something like that.
1:01:03
SPEAKER_01: A day in the life of a dance studio.
1:01:05
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, totally.
1:01:06
SPEAKER_01: But I think if really is gonna depend on, I think it's okay to mix styles, but I don't think it's a necessity.
1:01:12
SPEAKER_01: In fact, I don't think it's it's additive unless it calls for it.
1:01:15
SPEAKER_01: We did one of my favorites was about it was called CK Airway, it wasn't and it was about um planes and air travel and everything.
1:01:23
SPEAKER_01: And so there was like a little Frank Sinatra come fly with me.
1:01:26
SPEAKER_01: And so we did a 30-second tap piece.
1:01:28
SPEAKER_01: Little sauce with a couple of with a yeah, absolutely.
1:01:31
SPEAKER_01: And it was wonderful.
1:01:32
SPEAKER_01: And even with our Italiano that we're doing this year, one of the songs has a little uh 30-second hip-hop piece.
1:01:38
SPEAKER_01: So my girls throw on like a red jacket, some white shoes really quick, come out and do a little ditty, and then run off, and then the rest is jazz.
1:01:44
SPEAKER_01: So I think if it if it is cohesive and and the music calls for it, then yes, but I don't think that I couldn't see like try that being a necessity to try to add like, okay, what music am I gonna be able to bring in to be able to work in some point here and you know, let's go get the clogging shoes on now.
1:01:59
SPEAKER_01: I think it would need to call for it.
1:02:01
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
1:02:01
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
1:02:02
SPEAKER_03: I totally agree.
1:02:03
SPEAKER_03: And I I was just kind of I feel like I've seen like a resurgence of let's do every genre in a production number recently um at some competitions, where it's like almost feels like that the studios feel it's a requirement.
1:02:18
SPEAKER_03: Well, well, what will make this dance so exciting is if we start with jazz and then we're gonna go off, we're gonna put our tap shoes on, and then we're gonna come back and we're gonna have our hip-hop shoes on, and then we're gonna come out on bare feet and we're gonna do our our contemporary section.
1:02:30
SPEAKER_03: Like that's what it comes across to me.
1:02:32
SPEAKER_03: Like it's uh we're going to win because we're showing so many genres.
1:02:36
SPEAKER_03: The versatility.
1:02:37
SPEAKER_03: And it's like, actually, no, because it you're like you said, Leslie, uh, one shoe didn't make it on and the shoes are untied and you didn't get your hoodie on, you know, whatever it is.
1:02:48
SPEAKER_03: There's with all the fast changes happening and the chaos of ha what's happening backstage, it's like, is it really worth it?
1:02:55
SPEAKER_03: And is this clean enough and is it, you know, done well?
1:02:58
SPEAKER_03: Right.
1:02:59
SPEAKER_03: If it enhances the dance and you feel like, this is this totally feels like a hip-hop vibe, like who can I get that will do that have enough time to change their shoes, change their outfit if there is a need, and come back on stage without feeling frantic before they have to rechange to get back on stage again, then we can do it.
1:03:16
SPEAKER_03: But if you're just kind of throwing every, you know, tool into the toolbox to come out here and do this crazy dance that just looks like a sloppy old mess, that's not really the best choice when, you know, there's not a necessity.
1:03:28
SPEAKER_03: I've seen fabulous production numbers that are just straight up contemporary dance.
1:03:33
SPEAKER_03: And most of the time we think high energy and like, you know, jazz or hip-hop for production, but I've seen amazing contemporary production numbers.
1:03:40
SPEAKER_03: And I've seen, you know, like I love, like we said, the ones that just really th like change it up, take me on a new journey with songs maybe I know that I hear all the time, but like, wow, you created a new magical story.
1:03:53
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, or a genre that one that I would have never thought to do, or you know, things like that.
1:03:58
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think is and it's hard because let's be real, we've seen so many productions, and I'm sure you have seen it's like how many more themes are out there, how many more ideas are out there, but I've I've seen some really unique ones, honestly.
1:04:15
SPEAKER_03: I've seen a clue production, which was really cool.
1:04:18
SPEAKER_03: And they like the board game, and they really they had all the characters, and then they really told a story and created a story, which I thought was really unique.
1:04:27
SPEAKER_03: Um, I've seen a production with moods, different moods that you are, and like happy or sad or grumpy or angry, and different and and the dancers embodied those moods, like even in their expression, which I thought was really cool, and it really made sense, you know.
1:04:44
SPEAKER_03: Um, and those are the ones that are memorable, like a very unique concept that you're like, oh wow.
1:04:49
SPEAKER_03: Or I remember a production out in Los Angeles, which everyone's done a high school musical, but it was just so it was like I was watching the movie, like with better choreography.
1:04:59
SPEAKER_03: Like it was like amazing, you know, those are the ones that you don't forget.
1:05:04
SPEAKER_00: The clean, cool concepts, well done, well executed.
1:05:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:05:09
SPEAKER_00: And I think on that note, let's give a little bit of like leadout advice on if you're choreographing a production number, you know, your best advice to to aspiring production choreographers, because there's there was a lot we covered today.
1:05:23
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
1:05:23
SPEAKER_00: Um, and that if we've got a bunch of teachers listening, which I know we do, and we're headed in towards summer, so like this is prime time for getting your new ideas.
1:05:30
SPEAKER_00: There's anything else you guys can lead us out with.
1:05:32
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
1:05:33
SPEAKER_03: What we want to see in production numbers in the 2023 season.
1:05:40
SPEAKER_02: Well, in the 2023 season in production, I would love to see cleanliness, um, creativity, cool formation changes.
1:05:48
SPEAKER_02: Maybe you have so many, you know, dancers on the stage.
1:05:51
SPEAKER_02: So trying to figure out how to get them on and off the stage, maybe without just walking and running, that's great.
1:05:57
SPEAKER_02: I would also say um performance.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_02: And technique kind of go hand in hand, especially in production.
1:06:03
SPEAKER_02: So you want to have not saying that you have to do 32 poite turns as technique, but just being clean with your technique.
1:06:10
SPEAKER_02: Um, and I would also say when we were talking about for costume changes and you know, different props and things like that, you have to rehearse that.
1:06:19
SPEAKER_02: Like, you know, that's a part of your rehearsal process.
1:06:21
SPEAKER_02: You can't just give the students, the dancers, you know, the things that they're gonna wear.
1:06:25
SPEAKER_02: Take this jacket off at this part.
1:06:26
SPEAKER_02: No, they have to continue to rehearse it.
1:06:28
SPEAKER_02: So they need to have those costumes before going to competition because a lot of the times you can be late, you know, especially knowing which wing to come out of.
1:06:37
SPEAKER_02: There's so many things happening on stage, knowing where your formation is.
1:06:40
SPEAKER_02: So just even the little minute things that you don't think judges pay attention to, we do because it's like that one person, oh, they're late coming in because they forgot, you know, couldn't unzip their jacket or didn't know where to put it.
1:06:52
SPEAKER_02: So knowing those little details as well, I think will really help like give a clean, beautiful production.
1:06:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I just I think that really starting from beginning to end to make sure you have a good cohesive theme that you've got music that goes with it and and you think that that's right for your dancers.
1:07:11
SPEAKER_01: There's also, I think, a part where you're like, maybe your heart's been, you know, looking to do something forever, but maybe you're just not your kids just aren't there yet, or maybe it's just not quite the right time, or the numbers don't support it.
1:07:22
SPEAKER_01: You know, kind of keep that in your back pocket.
1:07:24
SPEAKER_01: But um, I feel like really just making sure you have a good formula, formula of music and an idea, the dancers you'd feel like you can pull it off.
1:07:31
SPEAKER_01: I do think it's important, like she was saying, you know, entrances and exits and formations.
1:07:37
SPEAKER_01: There's all these great apps now that can help you with that.
1:07:39
SPEAKER_01: But um, you know, you just want to keep it consistently changing and consistently exciting because again, you want that pencil down feeling like I just want to watch this the entire time.
1:07:49
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I do think I think, you know, rehearsing it and making it clean is so important.
1:07:54
SPEAKER_01: But I just kind of want to end with that I just think productions are so fun.
1:07:58
SPEAKER_01: And I think it's a wonderful way for your students that might not get to spend a lot of time together or ever dance together to really be able to come together and feel as a big team as the studio.
1:08:08
SPEAKER_01: Um, I know with just finishing my recitals, I love being backstage.
1:08:12
SPEAKER_01: A competition I'm usually out.
1:08:14
SPEAKER_01: We check people in, we we sit out there and watch it because we're nervous for them.
1:08:18
SPEAKER_01: We want to see if those corrections were implemented and see what it looks like.
1:08:21
SPEAKER_01: But I have recital, I just feel so laid back and I want to be back there.
1:08:24
SPEAKER_01: And so the energy is just so palpable and intense during production.
1:08:30
SPEAKER_01: And we have older girls that are like sitting there with the younger girls to make sure they know when to go on stage, or the younger girls are zipping up the older girls or fixing their hair and they're sitting there, you know, sitting on their, sitting on their hips, watching what's happening, they're cheering for each other.
1:08:42
SPEAKER_01: And it's just the it's really neat because we have a our tradition is the last two counts of eight of our production is always the exact same.
1:08:50
SPEAKER_01: We have something where everybody splits lines, they come back in, they pivot turn.
1:08:53
SPEAKER_01: Does not matter what production it is, it is always the exact same.
1:08:56
SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, a count or two of eight before everybody goes on for that and everybody's on stage together, they're just so excited and everybody's high-fiving and hugging, and it's just so neat to see that.
1:09:07
SPEAKER_01: And then to see them hit that final pose and hear the audience, specifically your studio, cheering for that and see their faces when they come off stage really is magical.
1:09:15
SPEAKER_01: And literally, they could walk off stage and never get an award, and they would all be so happy.
1:09:19
SPEAKER_01: And so I feel like if it's not, if you haven't ventured out into production territory yet and you're a little nervous, I think it's worth it in the end.
1:09:25
SPEAKER_01: You get that good formula going.
1:09:27
SPEAKER_01: The kids look back on that's that's honestly for us, that's what they remember year to year.
1:09:31
SPEAKER_01: That's how they remember what year it was.
1:09:32
SPEAKER_01: Oh, wait, was that prep school year?
1:09:34
SPEAKER_01: Was that CK Airways year?
1:09:35
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
1:09:36
SPEAKER_01: I love that one.
1:09:37
SPEAKER_01: And so it really is, it's just something that sits within.
1:09:39
SPEAKER_01: And I just think it's a great, if you can handle it and feel like it's something that you can take on your plate.
1:09:43
SPEAKER_01: It's a wonderful addition.
1:09:46
SPEAKER_03: We hope you enjoyed our final episode of season three on making the impact.
1:09:51
SPEAKER_03: Shout out to our very special guests for joining us.
1:09:53
SPEAKER_03: Be sure to follow them on social media.
1:09:55
SPEAKER_03: You can find Veronica at Veronica underscore soap, and Christina at In the Barbie World, and follow her studio at DK underscore danceworld.
1:10:05
SPEAKER_00: Don't forget to follow Making the Impact on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Podcast, Google Podcasts, and pretty much everywhere you listen to podcasts.
1:10:14
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1:10:19
SPEAKER_03: Diva Dance Competition is America's live judging competition.
1:10:24
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1:10:28
SPEAKER_03: Dancers are asked to stay on stage following their routine.
1:10:31
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1:10:38
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1:10:50
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1:10:56
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1:11:06
SPEAKER_00: Thanks for tuning in to season three of Making the Impact.
1:11:09
SPEAKER_00: Season four launches September 1st with weekly episodes releasing every Thursday.
1:11:14
SPEAKER_03: That's a wrap on season three of Making the Impact.
1:11:17
SPEAKER_03: We hope you enjoyed it.
1:11:18
SPEAKER_03: We'll see you in season four.
1:11:20
SPEAKER_03: Until then, keep dancing.