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What I've Learnt - Amy Nobile Messing · WHAT I'VE LEARNT

• 0:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Amy is a holistic dating coach and author of Dating for the One, which launches in 2027.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: Love, Amy, is her coaching business that marries the technology of modern dating with a holistic view of human-to-human energy and connection.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: Amy says she tracks all the beautiful love stories that she's had the privilege of watching bloom.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: And one thing they all have in common is this unbridled and glowing gratitude for each other.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: It's the kind of energy that beams, we can't believe we get to do this together.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: In early dating, look for signs that this person sees life through the lens of gratitude.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_01: For example, how do they speak about their loved ones?
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: How do they show up for them?
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Do they take them for granted?
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: She lives with her husband, Brett, they met on Bumble, in Los Angeles and New York City.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_01: So, Amy, welcome to the What I've Learned podcast, all the way from LA.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: Very excited to have you join us.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_02: I'm really excited to be here.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: Well, all our listeners will be very excited to hear your story.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_01: Tell us a little bit about your background.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: Obviously, you, I mean, I follow you on Instagram.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: I love your authenticity, which is part of the reason that I've connected with you.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: You were married for 20 years.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: Tell us how that's that journey went for you.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so met my ex-husband at our very first job in New York City, and we were in our mid-20s, and it was such a good match then, right?
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I was such an ultra people pleaser and ultra caregiver, and he was someone who really needed to be taken care of.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_02: So in our 20s, it was like perfect.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_02: And cut to 20 years later, when when you date in your 20s, you don't even know who you are.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_02: And no one has ever taught us how to choose a partner, which is arguably the most important choice of our whole lives.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_02: And so, kind of unsurprisingly, if you look at the divorce rates, we woke up in our 40s and thought, oh my gosh, this really isn't a fit anymore.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_02: We had two preteens.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: I really struggled with the decision.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_02: It felt wrong.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_02: It felt like a long-lasting marriage was such a status symbol.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: And how could I, without anything egregiously wrong, leave that?
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm a very spiritual person.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_02: And so I dug deep and went on my own journey and I left.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_02: And it was a really tough decision and two really upset kids.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: And no real reason except for I really felt like there was something more for me on the other side.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_02: And I just, I couldn't ignore that anymore.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's a really common experience.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: At what point did you was there a point where you thought, well, like I myself have been married nearly 30 years?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: So I understand that the journey is always one of up, down, round, about, and you make decisions, as you say, when you're younger.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_01: And they often say the longevity of relationships is because you almost start a new chapter each decade or each few years.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_01: You have to literally reinvent or reconnect.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: Was there a point during that decision-making process where you thought, I can get through this, I can push through this?
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's often a challenge for people where they go, Well, is this just a sort of a phase or is this something?
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, clearly for you it wasn't.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_01: How you talk about the deep dive.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: What was that deep dive about?
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: Did you get support?
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: Did you have therapy?
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: Did you find that there were others that helped you make that decision or supported you in your decision?
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's a really good question.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_02: I felt really alone in a lot of moments because the judgment from other people who said, well, if something didn't really happen, like if no cheating happened, or if if there was no abuse, then it's fine.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: You should stay.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_02: And there was a lot of, I felt like shoulds involved.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so I did prolong the leaving for a really long time because I thought, well, who am I?
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_02: Who am I to leave something if there's not really anything wrong?
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_02: But the deep dive for me was therapy.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: I was so privileged to be able to go to therapy and I had an amazing therapist.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_02: And also meditation for me to really get quiet and realize, like, what was I resisting, you know?
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: And what I really was resisting was my truth, which was I didn't want to be a caregiver anymore for my partner.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_02: And knowing that we had been through our own therapy, knowing that this was going to be the dynamic.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_02: If I stayed, then this was it.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I had to sort of grapple with that.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I kind of came to this realization that I needed to be on my own.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: And the next chapter was very fuzzy.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_02: I had to make peace with, I wasn't leaving to find something better.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_02: I was just leaving to be aligned with myself at that point.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: And a very brave choice, too, as you talk about the pressure socially, also emotionally, having to, you know, that's a very courageous choice on one hand.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: But then one could argue that in some ways it's courageous.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of people stay when maybe it's not necessarily the best choice for them personally.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_01: Did you, I mean, I've seen your you actually did this great post where you talked about, you know, I was alone in New York.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: You're alone, you were completely alone, really, as as you reflected just now, but you're also literally alone.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: So it wasn't like you had a great support system, you had no idea where you were going to find your tribe, your people.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: And also then you uncouple, when you're not with a couple, I'm assuming all the couple things dropped away.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: I'm imagining.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, totally.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_02: And and now I see with my clients that it's often the case that when you are going through a metamorphosis, it's not just personal, it's not just romantic, it's it's your job, it's your worth, it's your friends.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's I had to let go of two really close friends because I realized they also were in this toxic dynamic of me caregiving for them and them kind of not giving as much back.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so when I was in therapy, I realized, oh my gosh, like I, you know, don't even know who I am.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I need to go deep and, you know, know, figure out what my core values are, what do I stand for?
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: What do I want to do?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_02: I was in between careers.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: I had let so much go.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_02: And you really do realize who's there for you.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it's sort of surprising where, you know, certain friends will come out of the woodwork and carry you through that hard season.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_02: And so there was a lot of loss and a lot of grieving for the loss.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_02: Now my kids who are in their early 20s will say, what a great decision that was.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_02: Like you guys are so much happier, each individually, and now they can see it.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: And that's such great validation now.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_02: But at the time, you know, I felt somewhat selfish.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I actually totally understand that.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: That makes a lot of sense because at the end of the day, you are trying to to the outside world, they can't possibly know what you're trying to navigate.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I I think there's a lot of women and men to some degree who are stuck in that same loop.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where you went on your journey and help others on their journey.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so you have a lot of wisdom to share, much of which I've been following a little bit online, but also I think, and in your book, but I think at the end of the day, if you can stand firm on what it is that you need and you can learn from it, then you become somebody that can mentor others, which is the story that where it took you.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_01: So take us through once you left, and I'm assuming you're from what you describe, your ex-husband and you you're not in a state of conflict, you seem to, from what you've outlined.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_02: It's been really, really amicable.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: And and I give him a lot of credit for that.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_02: And it's been wonderful.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: We're wonderfully co-parenting, and I know it's not always that way.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_01: So well, I mean, that would sound like it's a credit to you and to him, and that shows that sometimes you can connect with somebody, and that person, you have a story with them.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like for 20 years, it's not a short story, right?
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's a pretty amazing thing.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh, we dated for six years before that.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: So, and and we love our kids so much and revel in them on text.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_02: We have a family group text.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: So I feel really lucky about that because I've got lots of friends who have had contentious divorces.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: But what was really interesting is I was kind of flung into single life in New York City in my 40s with not a clue about how to go about dating in this new era, right?
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: And forget just even how to navigate the apps, which gets such a bad rap.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: I really didn't know.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's like if I decided to go become a doctor or a painter or change my life in some way, I would have a roadmap pretty easily.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like you could get the roadmap and work really hard and pivot your life.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: But when it comes to dating and reinventing that part of your life, there really is no roadmap.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_02: There's weird rules and people have all kinds of crazy advice.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_02: So I found myself surrounded by negativity.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, all these wonderful single friends of mine were like, you're gonna hate it.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: This is awful, good luck, there's nobody good.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I'm in New York City.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_02: Are you kidding?
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so I did embark on a journey of exploration, not only of who I am now, but what is dating all about?
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_02: And it can't all be bad.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_02: It can't, like there, there's a sea, a sea of amazing people out there.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_02: So I realized that there was no roadmap and I had to build it for myself.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_02: And in building it for myself, which included figuring out my core values, you know, figuring out like, what does intentional dating mean?
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like I need to be intentional.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_02: I need to ask questions that I wish people would ask me on early dates to discern whether they're emotionally mature, whether they're really ready for something, whether our core values align.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so I kind of like looked at it like a project and I had this big binder notebook.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I was kind of like just creating this like program for myself and funny questions and cerebral questions, and I just wanted to, I wanted to reinvent dating.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_02: And my first task was the five-hour first date, which could had to go away.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, there's no, I cannot go on another five-hour first date where in the first five minutes you know you're never gonna see this person again.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_02: And so I decided that I started going on one hour max mini screener dates.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: So I would say someone said, Yeah, I'll take you out Saturday.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_02: And I would say, Oh, I can, I can go Friday from six to seven before my dinner.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_02: How's that?
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_02: And that was a great way of filtering people out too, because anyone who was rude about it, oh, what, you're not gonna give me a whole night.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, okay, see ya.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: Bye.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_02: And it was great.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so I started dating lots of people and even stacking up dates on certain days.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: And it was more of like a social anthropology experiment.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: I read that, and then you said that.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_01: I love that anthropology.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: You said you're quite a scientific, your brain is quite scientific, and the way you approach this was anthropological.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: I loved that.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: I thought that was really, really clever.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_02: Super nerdy.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's like I I just kind of I tried not take things as personally as maybe my friends were.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: And in doing that, I was able to sort of observe and go, why was I so nervous on that date?
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, my nervous system was out of whack.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: Interesting.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm calling it chemistry because this person is really good looking, but my nervous system's out of whack.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_02: What is that all about?
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_02: And so I started to just put together the pieces in a way where I then started to attract people that were really aligned with me, like aligned with my really nerdy, goofy humor, aligned with my spirituality.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_02: And I would ask questions on early dates to kind of weed people out and thinking, you know what?
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not for most people.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: I my goal is not to be chosen.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: My goal is simply see if I'm aligned with someone.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: And when I shifted that lens, which is sort of the whole theme of my book coming out, when I shifted that lens, then all my need about, oh my God, I hope I get another date.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_02: I I just want to be chosen.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I want to get an A on in dating, that just went out the door.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: And then I realized, okay, like it might be a 50 more dates before I really click with someone.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: That's cool.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_02: That's all right.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: You know, so I started you flipped the lens, yeah.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I created the program that I now use with clients.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: I never in a million years thought I would create a career out of this, but I met my now husband on Bumble and we started dating.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: And my friends were like, come on, like you're having a ball.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: What is, you know, so I started helping them and helping their friends.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: And then eventually I, oh, hold on, like I can actually do what I love.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_02: This is insane, you know.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's really interesting to me too.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: You went from people pleaser, caregiver, facilitator, supporter, all of those things that are actually quite archetypally.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of women are in that role, some of which is very rewarding and beautiful, and no one's saying it's either or.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: But then you went to what do I need?
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_01: What do I want?
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_01: How do I?
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: So you became one that didn't need to be chosen, didn't need to be approved of, but somebody who could actually have agency in your life journey.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it also goes to the way that we as women often are raised, you know, to be of service.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: And there's nothing wrong with that because a lot of that is beautiful, but it also can sometimes blur the lines so that you can't actually work out what it is you think or what, you know, right.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: I I would call my girlfriend and I would spend 20 minutes talking about how I thought this guy was into me without even thinking about whether I was into him or whether we were even aligned, whether we had the same vision for our lives moving forward.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: So it and it really kind of takes the pressure off when you kind of approach it this way.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: You know, if you were going to make a new like girlfriend, like just a friend, if you moved to a new city and you wanted to meet a new hiking friend, you wouldn't put that same pressure on yourself.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_02: You would just say, Oh, let's see if we get along, let's see if we care about the same things, let's see if we have the same vision.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_02: And so, so that's how Love Amy was born is just, you know, giving the roadmap to us that we've never been given.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: And it's amazing because I'm fighting so, I mean, my success rates through the roof.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's because it's just about, you know, drilling down at the beginning and not being afraid of rejection.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, rejection is just the universe saying, hey, move over, let's go.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_02: And what I find is people get stuck early on in something because it's chemistry fueled and it feels good.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_02: And then they wish and hope, they just hope for the best, just like Disney teaches us, you know.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: And nothing wrong with Disney, but that's yeah, we get stuck in our head.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, which goes back to the same the archetypes that somehow fuel and carve out this chosen path for some people that is not necessarily the right one.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: So, how did you find your?
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, the experience of dating apps, obviously, you've met your husband now through Bumble, which is great.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not like you're actually dissing the dating apps as a as a resource.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: You're saying that that can work for some people.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm I'm also seeing a lot of like there's a lot of reading parties, people meeting in cafes, lots of, you know, even dancing, everyone's doing these things I've ready New York, even if they're early for the older people, dancing, you know, like at seven, seven p.m.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_01: rock up for a like, you know, it's quite oh yeah, that's me.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's us.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_01: So so do you think that the dating apps have a role still?
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_01: And do you think there is also a movement back towards how probably you and I grew up more, which is meeting at your local, meeting through friends.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: Is that changing?
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: Is that what you're observing or what what are you seeing out there?
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, it's so interesting.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I I get people every week asking me, like, or just telling me how much they hate the apps and and they don't work.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: Here's the reality, okay?
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_02: The reality is six out of 10 couples today meet from an app.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_02: It it really is, they do work.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: There is a method to the madness.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_02: I know it feels daunting because we're trying to extract some sort of energy from a flat profile with a few crappy pictures, and we're trying to feel a certain way, and it's not gonna work that way.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: So I have a I have loads of advice for that.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_02: And yes, I mean, people are increasingly conjuring new ways of meeting people in person.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_02: But here's the trick.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, you can go out in your community and join every club and group and cooking class and whatever.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_02: You can swipe all day long.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: But here's the secret are you dating from your wound or your worth?
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: Most people don't realize they're dating through their wound.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: What does that mean?
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: They're gripped on a subconscious level with fear based on a past heartbreak, a divorce, what they are just so afraid of happening.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_02: They're afraid that their person just doesn't really exist.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: So they're half-heartedly dating.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_02: And that is energy.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_02: Energy is felt.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: And so half the work I do with clients is opening them up to love, opening their heart again, flirting with life.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_02: Go go to your, you know, local restaurant and say hi to someone.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, if we are walking around with closed hearts, it doesn't really matter what you do.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's not gonna happen.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_01: And then in terms of if you operate from worth, so if you switch, which is your uh what you're saying is if you come from worth, how does one move from wound to worth?
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_01: How do they do that?
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: How does that shift happen?
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I just literally wrote that chapter.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_02: So it begins with taking a good hard look at your belief system and love.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: And that can start from the way you were on my long intake forms for form for clients.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_02: I have a question, like, what did love look like growing up for you?
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_02: When did you stop believing that you could have whatever you dreamt of, right?
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_02: And name a toddler if she's walking around, like, yeah, I'm okay.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's like we're we're all born worthy of love.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_02: We're we we run around as little kids, just excited for life.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_02: They flirt with life.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_02: And somewhere along the way, those doors start to shut.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_02: So you have to do the work to figure out where did the doors start to shut for me?
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_02: And where did I give up this idea that I'm lovable and that I can achieve the love that I really, really, really dream of.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_02: And once you sort of do that work, and it might even be a moment when you were 12, someone said something to you that made you feel less than.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, but really pinpointing those and then working hard to flip those statements.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_02: So instead of, wow, you know, I just need to lose five pounds, you know, I hear that a lot.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_02: I just need to do X, Y, Z before I can start dating.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I am worthy of love exactly as I am.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: And really understanding what limiting beliefs you're carrying and just begin to notice what it feels like to flip them and to just let them go.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_02: And there's lots of ways, meditation and journaling and lots of ways to help.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_02: But but first it's just awareness because most people don't realize they're walking around feeling that way.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's really true.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I think what you're saying, it's almost like you study lots of other things and you evolve in lots of other ways.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_01: There's no reason why you can't transition from wound to worth or to almost treat it like something that you have to educate yourself and learn about and try and separate from the Disney version, which is so ever-present and so everywhere.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's also confusing for a lot of people.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like I have single girlfriends who are absolutely divine, talented, smart, independent, incredible women.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but they come up against this, some of them come up against this wall all the time where I just go, wow.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, some men behaving badly, but also coming back to your point, making sure they're worthy and treating themselves with worth.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: And that is absolutely a challenge.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: And it is a challenge.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_02: And we don't realize that we're we're a whole culture of people pleasers and perfectionists, and so that really imprints in us.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_02: And and I call it the choose me wound.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_02: We don't even know we're walking around with it.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_02: We just want to be chosen, we want to be anointed, and it's it's uh like I want to get a gold star.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_02: And so really letting that go and being willing to believe that you are really worthy and that your love definitely exists out there.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: And then just to start to open your heart, and I I call it flirting with like if it's like, you know, just start to smile at strangers a little bit, start to get out and about a little bit and just shift your energy.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's like even when you're swiping on an app, even if you you know think oh the apps but I tell people don't swipe when you're if you're in a bad mood it it won't work it's just energy so it's like you know I'm just helping people shift their lens and you know kind of clean off their lens a little bit and just be willing to take that leap in baby steps and so from your experience with your clients are you finding that most people are meeting through these apps that you're seeing success or are you seeing more success on the ground so to speak out in the sort of old-fashioned way of doing things are you seeing a bit of both or what what it is a bit of both it kind of reflects that that statistic so like six out of 10 clients that's pretty accurate will meet on the apps.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: I always say it's it's my favorite roomy quote I'm quite spiritual and and it's sort of you begin walking and the path appears.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_02: I think we when it comes to love we're kind of really like scared to be vulnerable.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_02: So we kind of sit back and we kind of dip our toe in and we're waiting for you know to be shown that it's okay.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's like nah you just have to put yourself out there.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_02: So I just I say the apps are great because it's just a vehicle to get you out and about it's good to just start going on those mini screener dates just practice practice being intentional practice asking on a first date hey how's dating going for you?
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: When you ask that question boy you're gonna get a lot of information on the first date.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_02: You can never assume that just because you're on a date with someone they're ready for a relationship.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: You can't assume they're emotionally mature and you certainly can't assume that they care about the same things you do.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: So you know gratitude is my number one core value.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: And if anyone listening by the way DM me on Instagram I'll send you this core values quiz.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_02: It's awesome you can take it it spits back you know your core values so on every first date I used to ask people hey what are you grateful for?
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_02: You know gratitude is really important to me.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_02: And the answers were really telling really interesting and and every once in a while someone would look guy would look at me and say like ew that's a weird question.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I thought okay think next yeah I love that and also you you know you're reflecting manifestation as well like the idea that you can manifest and that part of that and that spirituality which I also believe very much in you sort of have to go in what you're saying is you go in with a s a different lens and a sense that you are actually actually in control of this journey and you can create something.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: It's not like you just a sort of like some sort of throwaway that has landed in the wrong place.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_01: You've actually chosen to be there and you'll choose your next chapter.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly and just it's it's that faith faith that that love is out there for you.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_02: And it's funny because all my clients mostly are they're mostly women they're rock stars in every way and in this particular area they just have a really hard time believing that love is out there.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_02: So we do a lot of manifesting work where it's sort of like why not me?
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_02: Like why not of course you know this love is there and it's just not quite as tangible as like oh I'm gonna get that house or I'm gonna get that job or but but part of it is having that faith and and it is amazing to watch.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_02: I mean I see amazing love stories all the time bloom out of nowhere.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's just know if you're listening it is not by accident and you're hearing my voice and I'm telling you right now that love is available for you.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_01: And on that note do you have do you have an example for can you give us a little anecdote of of somebody or a couple or a person that it was a client that found love have you got a like a great I'm sure you've got lots of stories I was reading you've got lots of great little love stories and seeing all the no I have I have such great just one comes to mind where this woman amazing client in her 50s had lost her husband and came to me and in tears and said I don't know this was he was the greatest love of my life and cut to a year later you know we had done all this great work and then she went off and she was sort of dating around and hadn't really met anyone special and then texted me a picture of them and said I met I met an even greater, you know, just equally as great love and they're just having the best life I have I have another client recently she's in Dallas in the in the States and she literally just met her person on an app and she swore she would never meet anyone on an app and it was literally the we were sharing a screen and swiping together which was really funny.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_02: And she almost didn't swipe on him and I said wait hold on go back.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_02: Why why are you not swiping and she's like well look at his t-shirt it's awful and I said okay we're not gonna we're not gonna swipe left based on a you know crappy t-shirt.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_02: So boom and now they're engaged.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my God I love that story.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: And also just it sounds like you walk people through actually using the apps if they need that support because I think there's a lot of people particularly over 40 who are a little anxious about that and who are not comfortable with that space.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_01: So is that something you also do to navigate it can be a bit daunting for people who are not used to that.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: Oh sure it it absolutely is and so yes and on my Instagram page I have lots of tips as well.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_02: Once you kind of understand that you're safe first of all and you're never going to give out your number before you ask for a last name.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: So anyone listening, no one does this it's really important.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: So that you can kind of feel safe when you're swiping and once you feel in control that you can unmatch anyone at any time if they say something weird boom unmatched they can't find you.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_02: So there is a method to it and it doesn't have to be so so scary.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_01: I think that is a really important factor too I mean because safety is paramount.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_01: So there's the daunting of how does this work and then there's the safety aspect where people who have never done but I suppose you know 20 years ago you'd walk into you know a cocktail bar or a pub or whatever it was and that's how people and some people still do that but I suppose it's not that different.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: Is that your experience?
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's just a safety yeah yeah I mean what's not safe is when you just it's amazing to me.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's just amazing to me how people will just meet someone on an app, not ask for their last name and then go meet them somewhere privately like don't ever do that right.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: So when you when someone says hey we should connect don't even give your number out before you say hey sure but what's your last name I always ask and that's a great filter because 30% of people will just ghost you at that point.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_02: Great by see ya and a gentleman or a woman who's respectful will say of course you know here's my last name and then you can Google really quickly okay they are who they say they are I find found them on LinkedIn or Facebook and off you go.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_02: But always meet for a mini screener date in a public place.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_02: So then you have your first vibe check and then after that there you go.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_01: I love the mini I love love the mini meetings.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's very clever.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_01: So you don't have to it changes the game it does because who wants to sit for five hours talking to someone that after you say five minutes in, you're like, yeah no.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_02: And also for women listening do not it it eliminates like I would often come from a workout of course maybe I'd put some lip gloss on but I would say to the person hey listen I'm running around I'll probably probably be at my workout gear.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_02: And it really lowers the stakes so that you can show up as you and you can ask questions you can sort of be a little vulnerable and the bonus to that is on your second date if you really like the person you go to dinner and then you look you set the bar sort of here and then you can up it.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah I love that.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah I remember Brett on our second date was like oh hi so with Brett your husband how how long was it before how how much time did you have post your 20 year marriage to actually finding your new love and your next chapter?
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah it wasn't all that long but I will say I don't recommend this at home.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: I did make this my job and there were certain days I was going on three, four dates a day.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_02: I would space them out in my favorite coffee shop or sometimes at a bar with like mini screeners.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_02: So it was a handful of months where I was just dating up a storm and then we met and then we kind of slow rolled it.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_02: We took it slow and and I was not interested in like speeding into anything.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_02: So we it took us quite a while of dating and and moving slowly but if I always say good rule of thumb is if you're going on one mini screener date every week or two, then you have a momentum, you know, and keep a journal and ask intentional questions.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think statistically that improves your chances of meeting someone by tripling the the the actual how many times you go on those dates?
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like if you go four times a week is it statistical but statistically is you're improving your chances or not?
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_01: Or is that your experience?
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_02: 100% and and if you're going on one a week it's really not all that many.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_02: But another thing I would like to point out is you know you're not I think I see this all the time we have an image in our head okay of who we think our person is and even if someone says no I'm open minded I've I'm open minded when you're swiping you're not very open minded.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_02: You know you have to be really careful and this again goes back to manifestation you can dictate the what I would like to meet my soulmate, but not the how and not the when and they're not going to come in the package you think I have a I have a client right now dating someone who is wildly different in every way shape and form that she had in her the image she had in her head, but they're so aligned and they're so in love.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_02: And so you really have to throw that image out the door and just start going on dates without thinking is this my person just go on dates thinking I'm gonna practice alignment and I'm gonna practice intentional dating and then it will sneak up on you and you'll be on date three with someone where you're laughing and you are really talking about how you know you both want the same things in the future that's the better way to look at it.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so for you just the logistics of somebody who wants to on board with you how does that work and I have read and I don't know if this correct that you can charge up to$40,000 for a I'm not sure what that is.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_01: Is it a session?
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: Is it a what what is that and how does that work?
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: And obviously that's a lot of money but at the same time it is let let's talk through that logistically as people listening who may want it on board with you what does that look like for them?
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_02: Of course and everything is available on my website which is loveamey.coco and you can email me and and I do info sessions every week with people.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_02: So it's a four month in-depth deep dive transformational program.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_02: So it is a program for someone who says okay I am scared but I'm excited and I would like to transform from fear to love from wanting to be chosen to wanting to date intentionally and be aligned.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I do I do laugh I have a client who said oh my God I figured out what you are if if you a love coach, a life coach and an energy healer had a baby, it would be you.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_02: And I say that because there's a lot more than just I'm gonna help you swipe.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_02: We are going deep we are shifting energy I'm also an intuitive so I have the ability to tune into someone very quickly as well as tune into the people that you're dating.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so I will say to someone don't ask me how I know this but you need to ask this person X, Y, Z.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_02: And sure enough, you know, so it's it's a pretty heavy duty program.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_01: And so so is that correct those sorts of figures and or does it vary or do you I mean obviously as you say people could look on your website or on your socials but just conceptually for somebody wanting to are there different levels that they can come they can onboard?
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_02: So I have one program and one program only it's the four month program.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_02: It is 40K and that's why I'm also writing a book which will be significantly less so when that comes out that's well that's exciting.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah and that's coming out next year.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_02: I read it summer of 2027.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah yeah well you've certainly carved a really interesting story and a d interesting space and I think are you are you noticing that there are a lot of lonely people out there and that you're well you actually are in service in a different way now yeah it's really interesting I just love working with my clients and the success stories are insane.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_02: I mean the my success rate's really really high and I think you know yes people all of my clients will say the same thing I didn't realize that I didn't need to add anything to my life but what I did need to do is take away the barriers that I built the barriers to love the barriers to be vulnerable the barriers to let someone really see me on a spiritual level on a holistic level.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_02: So I think we're walking around with a lot of armor that we've built over the years without realizing it.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_02: So part of me is is just when I see a client and I meet them for the first time, I see them as unburdened.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_02: I see them as free.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_02: And it's my job then to have them see themselves that way too.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: And so that that begins the work.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_01: Well I think it's really interesting.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's really wonderful to hear your story and I think there are a lot of people out there that are hearing that there are options.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_01: Obviously you're probably a very shall we say bespoke coach and so people really have to commit is what you're saying to that journey.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly I always say I can tell right away I do my info calls on the phone I refuse to do video and because I'm sort of just reading energy a lot of people will say but I'm so cute.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_02: I want to show you I'm sure you are but we're just gonna be on the phone and I I turn people away a lot if I feel like they're not quite ready because it doesn't benefit either of us and sometimes people just need to go really do some more work on themselves and if they're really gripped with fear but that that's part of that's part of the whole thing.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: And most of them I would assume most are single or have been single for a long time or are they people who are partnering and trying to exit like like you did.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I mean most people it's funny it's all ages it's like 23 to 80 I've worked with all over the country and world and for the most part people are single have been single.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_02: So every once in a while it'll be someone going through a breakup but very often I'll say like you need a little time before we start.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_01: Well thank you so much Amy we've loved having you join us at the What I've learned podcast and for those that are interested you can obviously go and have a look at Amy's socials and uh yeah very interesting and hopefully you'll come out to Australia and come see this beautiful city.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh I would love pretty special yeah so you take care and thank you once again for joining us at the What I've learned podcast.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_01: Well thank you for joining us on the What I've learned podcast I hope you enjoyed that interview because we are so privileged to have a wonderful platform where guests come on and share lessons learned, rivers crossed, mountains climbed we love our shared humanity and we are so grateful to have such a beautiful community.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_01: So remember to stay curious kind and connected and we'll see you next time at the What I podcast