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Transcript

Rugby Direct - Episode 127 · Rugby Direct

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow
• 0:12
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• 0:17
  Speaker 1: inside the game from every angle. It's Rugby Direct with
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Elliott Smith, powered by News Talks EDB.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Welcome into Rugby Direct powered by habit Health, tackling all
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  Speaker 2: your aches and pains from sport and workbook online at
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  Speaker 2: habit dot Health to see a physio and get back
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: in the game. Faster to Alligott Smith with me as
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: always Liam Napier from The New Zealand heral big episode
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: of Rugby Direct coming up for you today. We'll get
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: into the semifinals and the upcoming final very shortly. We'll
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: redraft the All Black Squads that we did a few
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: weeks back, and Kevin Malloyd, who was the board share
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: of Super Rugby Pacific, is going to join the podcast
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: as well. It is all go Liam, as it was
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: over the weekend and we have our final the Blues.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: We'll host the Chiefs on Saturday night. The Cane train
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: has derailed. It's been put out of service. It's like
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: the Auckland Transport trains just simply don't exist.
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: It's tough to take, isn't it real low weekends, wasn't it.
• 1:14
  Speaker 3: But you know what, it's Monday morning and I've come
• 1:17
  Speaker 3: in and I've reconciled the fact that at least the
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: Crusaders are.
• 1:23
  Speaker 4: In the final. Mate, you know it's.
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: Here we're talking more about the Hurricanes.
• 1:27
  Speaker 4: You's going to take your blessing.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Sometimes very buoyant. I needn't picked them last week in
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: the tipping, but you were very boyantce Canes year all
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: the way through and now what's gone wrong?
• 1:37
  Speaker 4: Well, I don't know if that is Zachar.
• 1:38
  Speaker 3: I have been waiting for the Canes to fall over
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: to a degree all season and they have. I don't
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: take any joy in that. In fact, it was incredibly
• 1:48
  Speaker 3: punishing to watch that semi final at the weekend. There
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: was just felt like they choked to a degree. And yeah,
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: I guess we'll delve into that, but it was a
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: very very tough watch from a cane's perspective, wasn't it.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: Indeed, we'll get onto that in a minute, but let's
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: go to the Blues Brumbies first and foremost Friday night
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: and relatively official from the Blues, they started really strongly
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: and that was the key for the Rumbies. They needed
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: to start strongly. They didn't get a good start the Blues.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: At one point they could have been on track for
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: fifty or so. They didn't quite happen. In the end,
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: Brumbies came back into it, but it was always well
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: out of their reach after that fast start from the Blues,
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: who just as said, laid the platform, got points on
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: the board early and the Brumbies had to play on
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: the back foot and that's never going to work for
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: them at Egen Park.
• 2:35
  Speaker 4: No it's not.
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: And the Blue scored four triers in the first quarter.
• 2:38
  Speaker 3: Two of those came from botch rees start receptions from
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: the Brumbies, one from a rolling wall, and the fourth
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: was a Stephen Peifetter long ball to Caleb Clark in
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: the corner. So you've got to do the basics where
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: you must take your kickoff receipts. You can't give the
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: Blues easy access to your twenty two where they can
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: get a roll on, get their big boys going forward.
• 2:59
  Speaker 3: They don't need any league ups or any assistance. So
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: the game was done after twenty minutes and that was
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: almost the case, and both semi finals or a degree.
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: But yeah, the Brumbies they weren't helped by losing James
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: Slipper and they're starting lock prior to kickoff and I
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: think they're type five needed those players and they were exposed.
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: The Blue scrum dominated right throughout the game. And yeah
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: they had some issues in the third quarter, number of
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: mistakes inviting the Brumbies back, but there was never ever
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: a sense the Blues were going to lose that game.
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: After that start, they were never really threatened. They did
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: what they had to do and I think the most
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: pleasing thing for the Blues was there was no sign
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: of nerves. This is it was a big occasion the
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: semi final finals. Rugby is difference. The Blues have failed
• 3:48
  Speaker 3: in the past two seasons in the finals. They got
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: smashed in christ Church last year. Different opposition, different scene, sure,
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: but those things can have an effect and for the
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: Blues to start that well in a semi final, that's
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: probably what bodes best for them.
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: I agreed that the Brumbies talked during the week or
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: Stephen Larkin about previous time they went Eaton Park when
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: they got dusted by forty to fifty. They learned a
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: lot about the contact area and various things. Well, they
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: didn't come across on Friday night. The Blues beat them up.
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: There a lot of turnover ball. The Brummies just weren't
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: able to impose themselves on the contest, and that is
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: always going to happen when you go behind early on
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: the scoreboard. But you say, watch those restarts. Just couldn't
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: get into the game, and you know you're never going
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: to find a way back into the game from that point.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: So I thought, I agree, the Blues are very, very good,
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: and when you can make some technical substitutions around the
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: fifty to fifty five minute mark, take some of those
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: players off that you need to one because the second
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: half I got a bit scrappy, but too just to
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: protect them for the final next week. That's always a
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: good spot to begin as a coach. In the semifinal.
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's massive, and I don't think you can underestimate
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: the fact that those changes, but also the fact that
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: the Blues have an extra day rest that Hurricanes chief
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: semi final, they absolutely took lumps out of each other
• 5:04
  Speaker 3: and we've seen that with the Chiefs casualty wards and
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: then you know, the the rest of this week is
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: going to be pretty telling for who's available who's fit
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: for the Chiefs. But to have twenty four hours to
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: be able to sit back and watch that semi final,
• 5:18
  Speaker 3: to then have the final at Eden Park, you know,
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: everything really is stacked in the Blues favor and making
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: those technical substitutions getting a few players back this week.
• 5:27
  Speaker 3: I think they'll probably get Bryce team Locklam at Funnel
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: the lock So you know, the Blues a certainly in
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: the box seat.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, on the basis of what we saw Friday night. Absolutely,
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: and they're going to be at home home advantage, which
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: perhaps maybe they weren't expecting once they finished that game
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: on Friday night, maybe thought that they might have to
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: go down to Wellington. Obviously probably sixty four a game
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: in the Canes favor at that stage, and I've been
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: kinder described it as what choosing between cholera and the plague.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: It was a very very good line as to where
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: they wanted the Hurricanes or the Chiefs in the final.
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: Which one of the Chiefs the plague or the will
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: call what's worse.
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, look, i think they'll be hoping to be the plague.
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: Weldn't they come and cripple the Blues at the knees
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: and look, they are every chance of doing that. But
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: when you look at the Blues to this point in
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: the season, you've got to be impressed with what Verncotta
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: and the coaching team have done, haven't they. And it's
• 6:29
  Speaker 3: not just Vern, you know, Paul Tito is a big
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: part of that team. Greek feet has you know, had
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: a big impact on the scrum and they had some
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: disruption early in there with Tony Brown coming in and
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: Jason o'hellerin running the attack. You know, you could sit
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: back and say, well, they don't stually have much of
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: an attack because they're playing very much like a French
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: South African team with that those direct, powerful carries, one
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: off the ruck, doing the simple things. Well, even the
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: wingers Mark to Leah, Caleb Clark coming in looking for work,
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: Rico o'whani the same. So it is a bit one
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: dimensional what the Blues throw at you, but it is
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: highly effective, incredibly different to stop, difficult to stop, and look,
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: Vern has red the Blues of their inconsistencies. You know,
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: they've had complacency patches within games, but it's when they
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: have been on top and very dominant. Who was Adulton
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: Popolli talked about they've had a couple of wake up
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: calls this year and their losses against the Crusaders and
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: the Hurricanes, and how that's had a positive impact on
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: their mental space and preparing for finals.
• 7:35
  Speaker 4: But Vern certainly brought a harder edge, isn't here he has?
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: And it's funny you mentioned that around the wings looking
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: for work because they're not getting a lot of it
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: in the user positions and that's what all the Blues
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: have always been about, that expansive style of footy. They
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: can run it from their owning goal and try and
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: make something happen here. But this year we've seen just
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: a very cohesive team around the exits, getting into the
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: right areas the ground and then when they get into
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: you know, the red zone or thirty meters out, they're
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: very direct at that point. They use the likes of
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: Papaliti and Tuebologi before he got injured, now Dowry direct
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: runners to get them into the twenty two and then
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: just from there they inch inch inch four but with purpose,
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: strong carries, really hard running and you know, we was
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: seeing caleber Car the leaguet a few finishes, but they're
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: not you know, scoring sixty seventy meters wonder tries are.
• 8:23
  Speaker 4: They No, they're not.
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: And it is to a degree a test style of
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: football that the Blues are playing. You think about where
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: they're dominant, the set piece, the scrum. It has crushed
• 8:32
  Speaker 3: so many teams this year. They're tactical, kicking where and
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: when they use the ball, and their their style of carrying.
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: They're they're cleaning out their body high. All these little
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: things they've they've got right. And I guess also what's
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: encapsulated their season as a guy like Harry Plummer. You know,
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: you look back throughout the Blues history, Carlos Spencer, they
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: went out and bought Bowden, Barrett's, Stephen Peterefetter. All these
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: guys are classy, silky, you know, quiet flamboyant operators to
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: a degree in their own right. And then you've got
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: Harry Plummer, this local boy who's flitted between twelve and ten.
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: It's had a number of injury issues, very much been
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: second fiddle pretty much all of his career. And then
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: the Blues are now on the cusp of their first
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: fully fledged title in twenty one years, and he's the
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: most unheralded guy driving them around the park kicking fifty
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: twenty two's, you know, being very simple but effective and
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: what he's done. And so that is the Blues in
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: a nutshell this year.
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: It certainly is, and they'll go into the final I
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: think this week as the favorites. But let's go to
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: Saturday afternoon and the Chiefs and Hurricanes, and as we
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: talked about there and you mentioned before, down to a
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: fast start in many ways, the Chiefs came out at
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: the blocks at pace and put the Hurricanes on the
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: back foot. And when you've got to chase the game,
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: that is always a tricky spot to be in, and
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: the Chiefs just forced the Hurricanes to do that. It
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: was never quite out of reach necessarily, but they kept
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: them in arm's length, I thought. And that was a
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: very good Chiefs performance.
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: It was.
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: But on the flip side, it was quite a poor
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: performance from Hurricanes. And right from the start they went
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: away from what's worked for them this year. They wear
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: the Blues didn't look nervous. The Hurricanes did, and they
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: kicked away so much position in their opening quarter and
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: they allowed the Chiefs to run it back at them
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: to chance their just kickkickkick, And this year they've used
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: the ball well, and they nullified the one of their
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: greatest drengths, their loose forwards. I thought, Brett Cameron, you know,
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: didn't have a great night. Reuben Love struggled to weave
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: at the back to impose himself on the game as well.
• 10:48
  Speaker 4: It really was probably one of.
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: The Hurricanes' worst performances on the biggest stage in front
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: of a big home crowds. So yes, the Chiefs came
• 10:55
  Speaker 3: out of the blocks and blew the Hurricanes away, but
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: the Hurricanes helped them do that by giving them so
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: much position and saying, hey, yeah, you bring it to
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: us rather than we're going to take it to you.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: They did, and the Chiefs used to. I thought, you know,
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: while a Titi superbly, it was incredible, incredible forms.
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: One of the great individual super rugby performances in history.
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: You know, that might be a bit inflammatory to a degree,
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: but I think also with Tit, the potential there has
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: been recognized by the fact you're playing Luke Jacobson up seven.
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: You know, he was the Chiefs, he's the Chief's captain.
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: He's bolted on eight and they've accommodated Wallace a Tit
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: starting at eight. Because that impressed by him and just
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: to look at him physically. He is probably the most
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: traditional style of eight New Zealand has, isn't He's big,
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: He's powerful, but he's so silky and everything he does
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: is ball skills. He could you know, kick as well.
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: Quite reminiscent of Hoskins in terms of his skill set,
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: but probably a bigger man. And geez, that matchup is
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: going to be incredible, isn't it.
• 12:03
  Speaker 4: In the final.
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: It's going to be really good. Look, I was utterly
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: impressed by him. Yeah, the Hurricanes just I don't know.
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: Last week we saw a bit against the Rebels as well,
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: And this is something that Clad McMillan picked up on
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: and spoke about it in his post match media conference
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: on Saturday and also with Jason Pine on weekend. Spat
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: and used to exibb just around some of the things
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: that spotted from the Hurricanes in that Rebels game that
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: may be suggested they weren't entirely comfortable with the style
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: they were playing all that they weren't exactly built for
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: playwer footing and the Chiefs really exploited that exploited some
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: of those eras and that takes good awareness from the Chiefs,
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: but also shows that probably learned a bit from last
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: year where they got undone in the final, and you know,
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: the Hurricanes will take a few lessons from that, I'm sure,
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: but just probably weren't quite built for playoff footing in
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: that regard.
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they say you've got to lose one to win one,
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: and a couple of weeks ago, Verncotta said after the
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: Chiefs blew away the Reds that the Chiefs heads removed
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: their mask, and I think that's a great way of
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: describing it, because we'd banged on and bashed up the
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: Chiefs still a degree throughout the regular season and fair
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: enough too, they were underwhelming, but they have come into
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: this finals and really come out of the blocks and
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: laid down a marker with the style of rugby, with
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: our play, with their cohesiveness, with their big players standing up.
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: You know, really Clayton McMillan seems to have time. They're
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: run this year and that would be a bit. There's
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: a massive lesson for them from from last year and
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: the Hurricanes. You know, they finished top and they almost
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: did a Blues in recent years. You know, if you
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: think about the Blues when they staggered past the Brumbies
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: in the in their semi final. Well, the Hurricanes were
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: unimpressive against the Rebels and then didn't didn't rise again
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: for the Chiefs. So very contrasting and what you want
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: and need from a team coming into successive finals matches.
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: Just picking up on that as well. I guess we
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: talked about them during the season not really hitting any
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: great heights. I still finished fourth, but is there probably
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: a lesson there in the bloated format. This might be
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: something we can ask kivem malloy about a bit later on,
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: but just the you know the nature of the playoffs,
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: knowing that you don't have to beat you have to
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: pick essentially for two weeks at the end of the season,
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: maybe in three and you can win a Super Rugby title,
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: which kind of extinguishes the point of the first fifteen weeks.
• 14:28
  Speaker 4: It does.
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: That's very fair and home advantage is important, but it's
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: not the baer win end or. And I think the
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: Chiefs had never won an away final away semi in
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: their history. Well that they put that to bed, didn't they.
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: And another point on the Chiefs is they did it
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: the hard way. Two yellow cards, so everything was stacked
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: in the Hurricanes favor.
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: They're at home.
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: They had one man advantage for twenty minutes and I
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: know one of those periods they didn't score any points.
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: So they had every opportunity to win that game and
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: couldn't do it. So the Chiefs have taken the hard road.
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: They have to go away from home again the face
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: of a bit of adversity with injuries, but they've already
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: overcome a lot and they showed that within that Hurricanes
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: game as well.
• 15:10
  Speaker 4: Well.
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: They had two tries ruled out as well. I mean
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: obviously ruled out, but shows probably their dominans that they
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: did have those try scoring opportunities to an extent that
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: could have even been even further in front of the Hurricanes.
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: The Chiefs the couple of injuries. As we touched on
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: the SEMISONI Takeyo Hole definitely out achilles issue. Seems like
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: he's going to miss at least some tests. We don't
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: know how many as yet. Might get a picture on
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: that in the next couple of days, so they're going
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: to have to bring in well. Bradley Slater also the
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: possible mcl sort of injury, so he's doubtful for the final.
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: They might to use Claddon's words yesterday, give them a
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: bit of strapping and send them out there. So they
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: are going to have to get Tyrone Thompson, who's a
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: player that's been talked about for a number of seasons
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: as a real comer in New Zealand rugby, hasn't really
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: got his opportunities, has been linked with the NRL. This
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: year's brother Leo plays for Newcastle, a big opportunity for
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: him presenting this weekend and then they're gonna have to
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: find another hooker.
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: From some I think Tyrone is going to the NRL,
• 16:11
  Speaker 3: so you know what to send off. And there are
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: a number of different storylines around this game in terms
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: of Vern Cotta and Clayton McMillan, Vern coach Clayton made
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: him as captain, so some real nice symmetry there, I know,
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: the great mates off the field and Akira Awana playing
• 16:29
  Speaker 3: his last game for the Blues, Tyren Thompson going on
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: to the RL, so you have these sorts of things.
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: But yeah, injury wise, SAMMASONI is a huge loss. He's
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: struck form at the right time for the Chiefs and
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: if it is an achilles, it is an achilles. If
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: it's a rupture that would be season ending, but we
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: don't know how bad that is. And when you look
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: at the Blues strengths, going that deep in your hook
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: of stocks is a concern, particularly from a scrum perspective
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: where the Blues are so dominant. So that's a real
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: concern for the Chiefs.
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: We look at the way the Blues are played and
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: they've really found what they want out of Rickettellian Eckland
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: that they're one two punch kind of liking it to
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: the way the Crusaders had Brinhill Mitch Strummond looking for years.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: And now you wouldn't say, and maybe they now are
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: in the conversation, but you wouldn't say Rickattelli Eklund's all
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: backs players. But they played the role that the coach
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: wanted them too, similar to Hall and Drummond, and just
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: did the nucleus of the job very very well. That's
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: gonna be tough for the chief try and respond to
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: this week.
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: It is a risky scenario, isn't it, Because let's say
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: Bradley Sada has a ligament injury with his knee, You
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: strap it up, you give him a jab. Perhaps is
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: he going to last the distance Tyrone Thompson not a
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: target there. Yeah, Tyron Thompson hasn't played a lot this year.
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: How many minutes has he got in him? And then
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: you're looking at bringing in a guy millennium Son Adivu,
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: who was the former King's College First of Thing captain.
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: He's played nineteen games for the Naki but hasn't played
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: super rugby massive stage. Let's say he's on in the
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: last ten minutes and has a match winning, potentially lineout.
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: How's he feeling about that situation? So it's a real
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: risky scenario for the Chiefs.
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: It certainly is. Indeed, yes, some interesting decisions ahead of
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: Claydon McMillan.
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: Hopefully they get Sean Stevenson. He is a late exclusion.
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: I thought that would be a big loss for them,
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: but they seem to navigate that.
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: No. Tourre at fullback is becoming more accustomed to that
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: position and playing really well. I'm going to move the
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: tipping up forward here just to continue this conversation. You
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: picked Blues Chiefs Finals. Congratulations, so you moved to sixty
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: five points.
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: I did, actually, ever, we wager at the tab on
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: that as well, So well do you take that?
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: I went the Blues canes and that got me one point.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: So I don't think I can overhaul this nineteen point deficit.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: But do you want to? Could we put twenty five
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: points on.
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: When it's exil?
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: All right? Who wins the final inn? Well?
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: Look, I want the Chiefs, but I'm going to have
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: to tip the Blues. And why I think they're ready.
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: They're comfortable in who they are, they know what they
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: want to do, they're at home, they're fully fit again,
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: players back, they've got an extra day.
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: Everything's stacked in their favor.
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: Really, I just can't see the chief Chiefs mintum? Is
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: that a chief Smarner? Chief Smarner, he's smarting momentum. They
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: did the way they played last couple of weeks. I
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: don't think that they'll find this fine playing away from
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: home too big a challenge. Obviously it's going to be
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: a challenge, but I don't think that's an issue really
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: for them. They get the start's going to be key, well,
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: not in the first ten to fifteen minutes. I think
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: how this game is going to go. It could be
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: an arm wrestle. But if the Blues can start against
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: the Brumbies, it's going to be half for the Chiefs
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: to try and chase the game from.
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: That point h And you look back to that, it
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: was Claik McMillan, you know that now infamous line. It
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: was two weeks ago the Chiefs lost to the Blues
• 19:58
  Speaker 3: and the rigular season match at Eaton Park, and they
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: had at least half a dozen guys missing, and they
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: weren't actually that far away they were, they were beaten.
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: But Claik McMillan, the post Press corrence said I'll see
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: you back here in three weeks and what do you
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: know to earn profit?
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: Profit? Clayson got it right. Indeed he did right. Let's
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: get into our all black selections. So we did these
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: a few weeks ago. I've re selected my team and
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: I'm going to run through now. This is going to
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: be named next Monday afternoon, around five thirty ish. So
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: there's obviously been a few players that are now unavailable
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: since we selected. I've had a few different changes of
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: heart around some of these things. So I'm going to
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: read out what I think now and you can respond
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: to to that lemb if that works for you, just
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: do it all right. Props ethan degree Terrell Loanback's offer
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: Thonga Fasi to Mighty Williams Fletcher Nule. Now I'd Selectavy Numia,
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: but we haven't got a complete picture on how fit
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: he is as yet, so if not, I would go
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: with George Bower, so that there'd be six props.
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah, very interesting to see prognosis on nomea cruel timing
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: for him, like Patrick Twopolo to Samasoni Takaho and others.
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: But yeah, I think there's a chance they potentially go
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: five props. So I'm actually going to go five and
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: add an extra loose forward because I'm finding that incredibly
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: difficult to select.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: You'll get to that in the moment. I found it
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: very difficult to select as I was putting this together. Okay,
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: so I went George Bauer. If Nimir is injured. There's
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: not a lot of depth that loose hid in New
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: Zealand at the moment.
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: No, not not really.
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: There's Joe Moody, but he doesn't have a super rugby contract,
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: so it would be a bit of a not a
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: desperate selection, but a very much a stop gat one.
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: So you'd think they probably would go George Bauer.
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: Aiden Ross has been there but discarded pretty quickly. In
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: twenty twenty two. I guess Joshua Forzatour looks like a
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: plaid for the future, but maybe too soon from as yet.
• 22:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, too soon. So yeah, I think it's basically between.
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: I think if they are selecting the next it is
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: likely to be George Bauer.
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: Okay hookers, Cody Taylor suffer now SAMASONI Takyo who is
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: going to be injured, and it sounds like for the
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: part of the Test season, So I've gone Ricky Rickettelli.
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's fair. He's been very consistent for
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: the Blues this year, matured in what he's doing. He
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: is quite small, I think, but low center of gravity,
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: very good for the Blues this year, nailing his throwing.
• 22:34
  Speaker 4: So I think he's next. Cab off the rank.
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: George Bell was probably in the conversation, but I didn't
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: think he had a great season for the Crusaders, and
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: depth elsewhere is not flash.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: No, it's not. I was trying to think who else
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: could be in the conversation, and there's not many that
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: are close to the conversation. In all honesty, there's quite
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: a big drop off. Someone like a Jack Taylor at
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: a Honders looks promising, but again far too soon. George
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: bell looks promising, didn't have a great season. I didn't
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: think Henry Beller's brother again looks like it may be
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: a contender for the future, but again very very early.
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: So beyond the top three in the country, there is
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: a bit of a drop off locks Scott Barrett two
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: po VI. When we did this last time, I had
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: Patrick typolot To and Lockla McConnell now is injured. McConnell
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: has been injured, haven't seen a lot from him recently,
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: and seems to have been surpassed even when fit, by
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: Sam Dowry. Having mulled over what we talked about last week,
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: I'm going to go Sam Dowry and Josh Lord, who
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: reports suggested would be fit for the opening or around
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: early July, so so that Josh Lord if not, and
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: I told Arkoi would be my pick.
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree to a point. I think Sam Derry's
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: got to be in that conversation. Whether Razor has got
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: over him leaving the Crusaders. I guess we'll wait and see.
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: But those third and fourth ones are very out for debate.
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: I still am surprised that Monarchy Selbu Rica is not
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: on the bench for the Chiefs. I think we probably
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: found out a wee bit about the Hurricanes locks at
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: the weekend, a bit of a black mark for them.
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: So you're really scratching around for compelling contenders there. So
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: I really don't know who that fourth fox is going
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: to be.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's a tricky one. Let's go to loose
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: Fords because this is a really interesting selection. Now I've
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: selected five or only for the five I selected, sorry,
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: I think the six because just go side note for
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: a point. When we sitched this, originally we selected thirty
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: three players. We now believe, well, no, it's going to
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: be thirty two. So I had to cut someone somewhere,
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: and I've got a loose forward. So I had Artie Savia,
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: Sam Kine, Dolden, Papa le Braid, and you'll see Ethan
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: black at a Semipenny fen Now last time, I'm now
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: selecting Artie Savia, Dolden, Papa le Ethan Blackadder, Luke Jacobson,
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: and Hoskinstitucco. So I've left out Brandon your Seae, Semipenny
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: feenwe In, Sam Kane Kane is obviously injured. Braandon your Sea,
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: I think is not as just run out a little
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: bit of puff hitting into the playoff stages. I think
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: he still had a good season. Seven Penny Female, I like,
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: but I have a couple of worries just around his
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: discipline and some of his tachning technique. So those are
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: my five.
• 25:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think you're right about Bradon Yo say he
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: was a big mover for the season, but I think
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: it's lost a bit of ground on Hoskinstituto. And while
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: it's only it's not just one performance, but Wallas a
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: TC very much elevated his presence at the weekends to
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: being in the conversation. I don't think he's quite there yet,
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: but another big performance in the final. These performances at
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: this stage of the year count for a lot more
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: than earlier in the season. I've given myself a bit
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: more rigor room here, so I'm taking six with a
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: leaving out one prop. So I am taking Summer PENNI Female,
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: and I agree that there is a degree of risk
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: about his the style of his play, but he also.
• 26:05
  Speaker 4: Brings a real point of difference.
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: If you're looking for an out and out six, you
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: know that real enforcer somebody who strikes fear in the opposition.
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: That's him, So I would like to see him included.
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah the other Yeah, well I agree with Walls. He
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: had it stormer and we look at the Super Rugby
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: semi final last year. We are a kra and host
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: intitut to play themselves out of all blacks and all
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: blacks fifteen positions. So what Hoskins did anyway? So these
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: these matters do count and stepping up in a semi final,
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: there's no mean feat from a youngster like that. If
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: I could make room from my would but I just can't.
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: Peter Lucky is the other one who has had a
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: very good season. But so many options there, in fact,
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: four of them can play open side flanket that I
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: just couldn't justify taking Peter Luckey as another open side.
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's no rush with a guy like Peter Lucky.
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: I think he has had a great year. A thirty
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: two man squads limited, I think they're potentially going to
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: take thirty six for the rugby champion of the Ragby Championship.
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: It gives you a lot more room. India tool will
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: be more. Again, it's a long season, but with that
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: versus around the open sides, you probably don't need to
• 27:11
  Speaker 3: take Peter luck I just yet.
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: Halfbacks, I've gone TJ. Pettinar Fin like Christy Courtz Rata,
• 27:17
  Speaker 2: which is the same three as last time. Any thoughts, Yeah,
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: I don't know if Finn's done quite enough yet.
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: He got one telling turnover against the Brumby's quite close
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: to his line to sort of sum up his point
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: of difference, that that defensive ability very nuggety gets in
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: there and scraps away. He's only had two starts I
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: think maybe three since coming back from injury. I'm a
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: big Noah Hotham fan, so I think that's a three
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: that they would go with. If I was selecting the squads,
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: I'd be a bit bold and I would take no
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: hope them with Cortez, Ratama and t J. Pettan because
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: I want to see those young guys invested them for
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: the future.
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: First five is no change. McKenzie Barrett Petter Fetter. I'm
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: not convinced that Peter Fetter is going to make it,
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: but I've select him an lay on the basis of
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: what I've seen there.
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: If you're selecting three first five, z, those are you
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: of three Interestingly enough, Petifetter's heads virtually zero. He's played
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: maybe half a game at ten for the Blues since
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: coming back from injury. He was sidelined for two months,
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: so hasn't had a chance to stake his claim at
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: all there. But he does come into first receiver and
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: play that role for the Blues with the Harry Plummer
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: and the dualmaker type role. So if they're selecting three,
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: that will be the that will be the compilation.
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: Did Barrett play but at first five for Coastal or
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: do you play it full back? I don't know.
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: Sure came off the bench second half.
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I heard a few whispers a few weeks
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: back he was going down and they got shut down.
• 28:44
  Speaker 4: So it's very keen to keep it on the quiet.
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: You kept it on the quiet, but I think I
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: heard it about four o'clock on Saturday afternoon. I guess
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: we played for Coastal today midfield, same as when we
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: last drafted this. Jordi Barrett, ricco Yuani and telling it
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: abound Billy Procter, Yeah, lock itin.
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: I guess The only question there is whether Razor thinks
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: David have Allie's done enough?
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: But I don't I can't see the evidence for it.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: Outside backs. Last time round I had Caleb Clark and
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: Moni Nadawa, Mark Talia Rubin Love. Caleb Clark doesn't make
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: the cut this time, which is probably a bit rough.
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: But Severa Reese had a very very good season in
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: a pork Crusaders team, So I've gone with severe Reese
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: over Caleb Clark on this occasion.
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think like other Hurricanes, I think Rubin Love
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: didn't have his best performance for the Hurricanes. Whether that
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: counts against him for Black selection, time will tell. But
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: when you're looking at that squad, Bowden Barratt's you're only
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: out and out fall back to a degree can play there,
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: I guess McKenzie. But he's your your ten, new one
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: and focusing on that. So maybe Ruben Love's at risk.
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: Not sure, but if you want to, yeah, I guess
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: it's whether they take the third ten or invest in
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: Ruben Love. I'm selecting Caleb Clark. I think he has
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: come back in exceptional shape this year. He lost a
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: lot of weight. He's actually put a bit more on
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: later in the year to satisfy cdd A ball in
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: the way he's getting involved. I think he brings a
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: point of difference in the air with his ability to
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: take restarts. His work rate's been exceptional, so at this
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: stage I would probably not take Sevu, which.
• 30:26
  Speaker 4: As harsh because he was the best crusader all year.
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: But I think Ammonia no Nadawa really stepped up for
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: the chiefs at the weekend, didn't they as well?
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: I thought he's excellent. Yeah, I really did. So that's
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: the squad there, eighteen fourteen split thirty two man squad
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: and the actual squad will be announced Monday. I saw
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: a bit of conversation last night on social media around
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: the definition of Bolt. If we get that cleared up
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: for next weekend, that would be very handy.
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah, who's a bolter and that squad probably Wallace the
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: TT is the only one really on the fringe.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: Bolt is going to be someone that very few plead
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: people had in their MOX squads. Shortly. Yeah, it's a
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: player at a bolt out of nowhere. That's the Bolton means,
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: isn't it.
• 31:10
  Speaker 4: I can't remember his name right now. That's some Yeah,
• 31:13
  Speaker 4: Josh Lord.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: A couple of years ago, Brick Cameron, Brick Cameron, those
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: year Boulters, Billy Propton not a Poulter. We got it
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: cleared up right the second break and Rugby to come
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: back with the Final four our MVP Middle as well
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: and Kivin mlloy super Ruggy boards year to come as well.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fans.
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: You're back with Rugby Direct time for our final four.
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: Four quick questions around the rugby world. It's rip through them,
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: Liam grab the Hurricane season out of ten.
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: For me, Look, it's going to be an eight.
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: I think exceptional year, regular season year finished top and
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: deservingly so I think when you take a step back
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: at it, look at that squad, the fact that artist
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: Severe wasn't there, they lost, came Roy Guard, you got
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: a first year head coach coming on board. For me,
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: they really did exceed expectations, very very disappointing, underwhelming finished
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: to play like that in a semi final. But if
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: you had told me at the start of the year
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: they were going to finish top and lo's a semifinal,
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: I would say that's a successful year. So I don't
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: want to let the end totally shape the narrative, but
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: it did leave a bit of a sour taste.
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going to go seven and a half because
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: similar to you, we didn't have them that high in
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: terms of women, did our preseason predictions, but they were
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: clearly the form team for a long period of this
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: competition and just ran out a puff I think towards
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: the end he finished top. I think making a semi
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: final is and being beaten there is under achievement. So
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: take a half a point for me there, but seven
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: and a half out of ten. I mean Clake ledla
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: fird season in charge, especially at fifteen's level at Super
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: Aguia level. Very very good from them and plenty of
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: build on next year with Adie Savier comeback. Topic number two,
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: Why did no one want to see the Brumby's play
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: the Blues in the Super Braakmy semi final at Eating Park.
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: There's a number of factors in this one as they
• 33:19
  Speaker 4: are an Australian team.
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and that is a big factor if you look
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: at the crowds across the whole season. You look at
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: who turned up for the Reds Chiefs quarterfinal, the Rebels
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: Hurricanes quarterfinal and yeah the Blues Brumby's semi final. Kiwis
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: expect what they've been given from the Australian teams and
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: it's now Australian teams are now zero to eighteen in
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: New Zealand for playoff games, and until there's a consistent
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: degree of unpredictability, there is going to be a degree
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: of apathy with Australian teams and that's been proven.
• 33:59
  Speaker 4: So that was a factor.
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: The Brumby style of Arabi is probably a factor, and
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: the factor was just absolutely pissing down for most of
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: the day in Auckland.
• 34:07
  Speaker 4: Is what effector for a walk up crowd.
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree that the rain was a big one
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: as well, but I mean it was bucketing down to
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: about two to two thirty on Friday and then started
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: running again later in the day as well during the
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: game and afterwards. The rain is a big factor, but
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: I think the overwhelming element is that the fact that
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: it's the Australian team. If it had been any of
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: the New Zealand franchises playing them, would have been thirty plus.
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: I reckon they would have got. The fact of the
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: matter is that the Australian teams are to draw card
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: and that is a big issue for Super Ragby to
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: try and fix, but more so Rugby Australia to try
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: and fix, and with the Rebels joining the great Graveyard
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: of Super rugby teams, it's hoped that the talent card
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: and Gordon aside, can move to those other teams and
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: lift them up to the point where there is some
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: real jeopardy when the Brumbies come to town for a
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: semi final, or the Reds or whoever it might be
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: that you do not know how this is going to
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: play out, because it played out exactly as many would
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: have expected on Friday night.
• 35:03
  Speaker 4: Yes, that predictably. Is that just on the Carter Gordon thing.
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: That's tools the absolute face of mismanagement that as Australian
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: rugby over the past couple of years, Hamish mcclennan, Eddie Jones,
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: they have really a lot to answer for because Carter
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: Gordon is a massive talent and he's a massive loss.
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: He should not be leaving the game now. Yeah, good
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: pick up for the Titans. Looking forward to having him
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: in my NRL fantasy team next year because I think
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: you'll be quite low value to start with, but plenty
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: of upsides, so I'll be getting on. That's T twenty twelve.
• 35:34
  Speaker 4: Less money to go to the error which is a
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: lot that does.
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: Say, say quite a lot.
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: Leaving aside our own selections which you've just heard, which
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: position will cause the most debate for your black selectors
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: this week? I just want to pin you down to
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: one limb Okay Locke. I think there's a lack of
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: compelling candidates, so I expect.
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: That it'll be some raal robust debate about who those
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: third and fourth candidates are.
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: I reckon lose forward because it's a matter of, as
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: we touched on there, how many they take and who
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: they take and what cover you need the cross blindside
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: open side number eight, So I think that mix will
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: be the point of contention. I agree about a lot
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: to an extent, but I think the cream rising to
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: the top in terms of dowry and maybe there's one
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: position there that they do consider, but I'm going to
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: lose forward there. And topic four, we heard Clark laid
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: Law and CLAYT. Macmillan both unhappy about the refereeing of
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: high tackles inconsistency across the board following the semi final
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: on the weekend. Do they have a point?
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm not into refbashing at all, but I thought
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: it was quite fast, caught times some of the not
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: just the decisions, but I think it's the inconsistency that
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: leaves frustration.
• 36:41
  Speaker 4: CLAYT.
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: Macmillan was absolutely spinning chips and the coaching box when
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: I think it was TJ ped Andara, similar sort of
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: tackle to which a Summer penny female head clash yellow
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: card on Pedanata.
• 36:53
  Speaker 4: I can't remember who Pedinara was on.
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: It might have been Setti or female and a very
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: similar incidents and nothing came of it. So that's what
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: leaves coaches, fans disillusions, and I think there was a
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: real for it's been great this year to not have
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: the TMO overbearing influence, but that was a match where
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: that was the case and there was a frustration, a
• 37:24
  Speaker 3: lot of stoppages, a lot of going back tries, a
• 37:26
  Speaker 3: ruled out for incidents. So hopefully that's not the case
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: for the final.
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: Let's hope. So the one thing for me, it just
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: seems across the board now the seven of the USC
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: final or semi finals on the weekend as well, the
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: inconsistency across the board is becoming a real bug beer.
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: And this goes to the point that mean you've made
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: is that rugby's rule book needs to be simplified, needs
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: to be We needs to have some clear guidelines over
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: what is a red water is a yellow because you
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: look at incidents now and half the fans might say
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: that it's a red, half might say it's a yellow.
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: You need to get to the point where it is
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: a lot clearer for fans world Rugby don't seem in
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: any hurry to do that, which is a real shame.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: But we're getting more and more of this across the
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: water franchise level. But let's move on to MVP medal
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: voting and this is the final one. Hoskins at two
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: too went into the final round with a eight point
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: lead over Dalton Papaale, Billy Procter on nine, suffer More
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: on eight, and then a whole host of players. I
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: was meant into count up how many we've got, but
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: I reckon theyre probably about twenty five thirty had points
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: over the course of the season. So I'm going to
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: give my three two ones first, and I suspect our
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: three might be similar in the fact Wallace a Titi
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: is going to get my three points. Thought he was
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: excellent as we touched on earlier in the podcast that
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: was a rampaging effort on all cylinders across all sides
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: of the park from war Titi and the fact that
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: you know we've touched on it before. I think he
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: got points at some point earlier in the season. He's
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: got five already, but the fact that he's put himself
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: now into all Blacks consideration player from completely nowhere at
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: the start of the season speaks to how good that
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: before Wents was. My two points goes to a J Lamb.
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: Thought he was very very good in a position that
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: I wasn't sure was suited to him in second five
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: more a winger or center. He made it his own
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: on the weekend. And the point now that Bryce he
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: might be back by you probably stick with someone like
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: a J Lamb, I think when you look at that
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: this week. And then my one point goes to Courtez Ratama,
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: who I thought had a good game and outpointed T. J.
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: Pitanara in the half back stakes in that semi final.
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: Yep, all very fair.
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: I think it's fair to say Wallace cleaned up, doesn't
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: It was him and him in daylight is ball carrying
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: his prominence, So he gets my three. I thought Damien
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: McKenzie was very good for the Chiefs, influential, great goal kicking,
• 39:47
  Speaker 3: really stepping up at the right time. So that's heartening
• 39:50
  Speaker 3: for Scott Robinson for has bolted on starting first five
• 39:54
  Speaker 3: and Stalton Papolle. I think he's stepped up and assumed
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: the captaincy and Patrick Tupaloto's absence, so he gets my one.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: Well, Hoskins to two to wins the Rugby Direct MVP medal,
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: So congratulations Hoskins on that final achievement, joining two other
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: players whose names escaped me at this point in time,
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: Boden Barrett one one year. Hoskins loves his blaking, so
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: I'll make sure make sure you get that middle left
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: cross to him.
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: Get it out.
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: So right, let's take a break on Rugby Direct. Come
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: back with Kivin mcloy the cheer of superkod pacific after
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: this for yourself a real rugby fan, this is Rugby Direct.
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: Every try try it's sixty si, every tackle pack get
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: up again before time.
• 40:36
  Speaker 4: It's Rugby Direct.
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: Pleasure to have super Rugby board cheer Kiven mcloy with
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: us on Rugby Direct. Kevin, thanks for joining us.
• 40:46
  Speaker 4: Great to be here.
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: What's a culmination of what the last fifteen sixteen weeks?
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: We have our final the Blues and the Chiefs, and
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: Eden Park's going to host it. How excited are you
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: for the weekly hit?
• 40:57
  Speaker 4: Very excited.
• 40:59
  Speaker 5: Look, I think it's a pretty ideal way to have
• 41:02
  Speaker 5: a showcase. We're looking forward to ideally having a pack stadium,
• 41:07
  Speaker 5: you know, forty plus people as your final with two
• 41:12
  Speaker 5: very hot teams. At the moment, I'm not sure we
• 41:14
  Speaker 5: could ask very much more, to be honest.
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: How would you assess the season that's been.
• 41:19
  Speaker 5: Look, I think the best thing for us has been
• 41:22
  Speaker 5: the quality of the product. There's been some great rugby
• 41:25
  Speaker 5: this year, and as long as the product's good, you
• 41:27
  Speaker 5: can build on it from there. So being very happy
• 41:30
  Speaker 5: with the quality of a lot of the games, there's
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: been a number of things I think around almost I
• 41:35
  Speaker 5: want to call around the fringes of it that we
• 41:37
  Speaker 5: can learn to do better next season. I think there
• 41:40
  Speaker 5: are elements of the draw that we can improve on. Absolutely,
• 41:44
  Speaker 5: we're having a close look at what we do a
• 41:45
  Speaker 5: souper around next year. I think that's something that needs
• 41:48
  Speaker 5: to be looked at. But as long as we've got
• 41:51
  Speaker 5: a strong quality a product.
• 41:53
  Speaker 4: I think we're on.
• 41:53
  Speaker 5: You know, we've got a pretty good base. And the
• 41:56
  Speaker 5: other thing that I think we've been very happy with
• 41:58
  Speaker 5: is being the officials and a lot of work and
• 42:01
  Speaker 5: conversations with them at the beginning of the season, especially
• 42:04
  Speaker 5: after what happened in that World Cup final. We did
• 42:06
  Speaker 5: not want to have a season and where rugby was
• 42:09
  Speaker 5: blighted by TMOS. And to be honest, the officials has
• 42:13
  Speaker 5: been great and working with the officials, I mean they've
• 42:15
  Speaker 5: got exactly the same attitude we have in terms of
• 42:18
  Speaker 5: making these games far more appealing to fans.
• 42:21
  Speaker 3: When you talk about what's worked well the officiating, the
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: less focus on TMOS, some of the rule tweaks, and
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: then coming to the draw, I guess if we look
• 42:33
  Speaker 3: ahead to next year, what specific things are we talking
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: about daytime forty you know, Easter week in scheduling those
• 42:40
  Speaker 3: sorts of things.
• 42:42
  Speaker 4: Yep, that's exactly it.
• 42:44
  Speaker 5: Trying to get more afternoon games, thinking about Sundays, and
• 42:49
  Speaker 5: that's a bit of a challenge for the five day turnaround.
• 42:51
  Speaker 5: But do we have occasions where we don't have the
• 42:53
  Speaker 5: five day turnaround? And you know, not all the time,
• 42:55
  Speaker 5: but maybe once or twice in the season, a club
• 42:57
  Speaker 5: has to live with that.
• 43:00
  Speaker 4: Referees.
• 43:01
  Speaker 5: You know, we've tested the concept of miking the refs
• 43:04
  Speaker 5: up in the stadium and they've been doing it with
• 43:06
  Speaker 5: the Brumby has been doing it for a little while now.
• 43:08
  Speaker 5: We've tested it a couple of times. We tested it
• 43:10
  Speaker 5: in Chrostitch. I think there's a lot more we can
• 43:13
  Speaker 5: do with that, so, you know, just so the crowds
• 43:15
  Speaker 5: know what's going on. You know, that's a pretty obvious
• 43:17
  Speaker 5: thing to be doing. Looking at the drawer around areas
• 43:22
  Speaker 5: like Anzac Day and you know, we just gave an
• 43:24
  Speaker 5: Zac Day away this season. You know, what do we
• 43:26
  Speaker 5: do around en Zac Day to actually make that something
• 43:29
  Speaker 5: that's far more attractive in the context of the whole
• 43:31
  Speaker 5: competition as well, because.
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: You look at the NRL and they do what three
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: four games maybe three on a day, But this year
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: I think you played ew zy on Australian teams on
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: the one weekend, plus MOREEA against VG, but nothing on
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: the day itself. So those are the thing opportunities you
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: need to take advantage.
• 43:46
  Speaker 5: Of more absolutely, and maybe you know, one of the
• 43:49
  Speaker 5: things we're looking at is do we combine or do
• 43:51
  Speaker 5: we have super Round over Anzac weekend right, and then
• 43:55
  Speaker 5: turn it into a real New Zealand versus Aussie you know,
• 43:58
  Speaker 5: and just take maximum advantage of the ability for people
• 44:02
  Speaker 5: to travel as well with that extra day. So it's
• 44:06
  Speaker 5: all those sort of things that we're looking at right
• 44:08
  Speaker 5: now because it's a fairly hot time for us in
• 44:11
  Speaker 5: terms of the next couple of weeks getting the straw right.
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: If we pick up on super Round, I guess without
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: Melbourne Rebels presence there next year, it's fairly well signposted
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: that it's hardly like it not be in Melbourne. If
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: we look at the alternatives, there's a bit of a
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: romantic scenario around maybe Fiji, but then there's challenges around
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: accommodation and lighting and the like. New Zealand's I guess,
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: I think there is a desire to have it here,
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: but probably not in the business of cities bidding for
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: sports events in the same way that Australia does. So
• 44:43
  Speaker 3: does that mean it's more likely to go to a
• 44:46
  Speaker 3: city like Perth or Brisbane. How far down the line
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: are you with where super Round will be?
• 44:52
  Speaker 5: Well, you've summed it up pretty well. Actually, where a
• 44:56
  Speaker 5: reasonable way down the line with those discussions because it's
• 44:58
  Speaker 5: a critical part of the draw. So yes, in an
• 45:02
  Speaker 5: ideal world, it'd be great to have it in Fiji
• 45:04
  Speaker 5: if you talk about fan centric how good would that be?
• 45:07
  Speaker 5: But there is You're right, there's some infrastructure challenges here.
• 45:10
  Speaker 5: It's not completely out of the mix, and so we're
• 45:12
  Speaker 5: still looking at it. Perce have put their hand up
• 45:15
  Speaker 5: and Perce could be quite attractive. There's some challenges there
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: with the distance of travel, but in terms of stadium
• 45:21
  Speaker 5: and support and you know, Perce could be an attractive venue,
• 45:25
  Speaker 5: not so much Brisbane but potentially Gold Coast down that
• 45:28
  Speaker 5: area because you know that would take a lot of
• 45:30
  Speaker 5: boxes for us. But as you probably understand, it's a
• 45:33
  Speaker 5: massive financial consideration and that's one of the reasons why
• 45:36
  Speaker 5: we can't look to have it in New Zealand because
• 45:39
  Speaker 5: you know, the reason we had it in Melbourne was
• 45:41
  Speaker 5: a Victorian state government wrote a nice big check for
• 45:44
  Speaker 5: all the teams that missed out on home advantages. So
• 45:47
  Speaker 5: you know, we are reliant on that financial backing for it,
• 45:51
  Speaker 5: and that does take a lot of the news. What
• 45:53
  Speaker 5: does take New Zealand out of it completely at the moment, Unfortunately, a.
• 45:56
  Speaker 2: Lot of que is on the Gold Coast, a lot
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: of keys like going the Gold Coast for holidays.
• 45:59
  Speaker 5: Exactly right, and easy travel, you know, great little stadium,
• 46:04
  Speaker 5: you know you could, So it's very much what's in
• 46:08
  Speaker 5: the main for us as well. We're certainly looking at that.
• 46:10
  Speaker 3: Yep, conceptually, if we look at the Super Rugby Board
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: and the Commission, it's been set up, you know, in
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: the past year to put the competition front and center
• 46:21
  Speaker 3: because historically the national unions have used it largely as
• 46:26
  Speaker 3: a vehicle for the test scene. And I guess that's
• 46:29
  Speaker 3: part and pastor of rugby that the test scene is
• 46:31
  Speaker 3: always going to take priority. But how much I guess
• 46:35
  Speaker 3: power do you have to enact change? You know, the
• 46:40
  Speaker 3: national units are still heavily involved. I guess it's an
• 46:43
  Speaker 3: ongoing process. But this I imagine there's things you'd like
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: to do and then you maybe get some pushback. So
• 46:48
  Speaker 3: just generally, what's the Super Rugby Commission Board role and
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: how easy is it to get things done?
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 46:56
  Speaker 4: Good question.
• 46:58
  Speaker 5: So we're governed by a JV agreement which has been
• 47:01
  Speaker 5: agreed to by both the unions. Now and you said
• 47:04
  Speaker 5: this in your opening in your comments just seen it's
• 47:06
  Speaker 5: absolutely right. The Union's fair play to them have recognized
• 47:09
  Speaker 5: that the Super Rubbie competition itself needs some specific and
• 47:13
  Speaker 5: deliberate focus, which is what the Commission has been put
• 47:16
  Speaker 5: into place to do. We governed by this JV agreement
• 47:19
  Speaker 5: which which basically says our core remit is around bums
• 47:24
  Speaker 5: on seats and eyeballs, right, So it's marketing the game,
• 47:27
  Speaker 5: doing better things for the game. Now that leads into
• 47:30
  Speaker 5: a number of areas because that can impact shape of
• 47:32
  Speaker 5: the game. You know, some of the things that have
• 47:35
  Speaker 5: been done around the rules, officiating, which I've mentioned, marketing,
• 47:39
  Speaker 5: comms plans. There are a number of areas that are
• 47:43
  Speaker 5: called major matters that we just don't get ourselves involved.
• 47:45
  Speaker 5: And we can't as a board change the complete structure
• 47:48
  Speaker 5: of the competition, so that's really up to the unions.
• 47:51
  Speaker 4: Now.
• 47:52
  Speaker 5: What the Commission does and the Board does though, however,
• 47:56
  Speaker 5: is provide a great forum for discussion. So some of
• 47:59
  Speaker 5: these meteor issues around the future of the competition and
• 48:02
  Speaker 5: some of the things that are worth discussing. That's the
• 48:05
  Speaker 5: discussion point. And you know, we've got fo we've got
• 48:08
  Speaker 5: more Robinson, We've got you know, the key people sitting
• 48:10
  Speaker 5: around the board table. Ultimately can we make the decision. No,
• 48:14
  Speaker 5: but we can have a pretty good discussion and raise
• 48:17
  Speaker 5: issues that can then go back to the Unions for
• 48:20
  Speaker 5: hopefully for ratification or otherwise. So if nothing else, I
• 48:24
  Speaker 5: think we've got a good forum to be discussing some
• 48:26
  Speaker 5: of these other key issues as well.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: So in terms of the rebels decision this year, you
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: just had to watch and wait and see what Rugby
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: Australia did there.
• 48:33
  Speaker 5: One hundred percent there was Rugby Australia's call. We had
• 48:36
  Speaker 5: to watch and wait and then once we're wants the
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: decision had be made. The ramifications of an eleven team
• 48:42
  Speaker 5: draw we worked from there.
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, what kind of impact is it going to have,
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: I guess on Super Rugby next year, but the next
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: five years not having a team in Melbourne and that
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: eleven teams scenario you've got at the moment.
• 48:53
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm not sure about the impact of the team
• 48:56
  Speaker 5: in Melbourne, which is such a big concern. The eleven
• 49:00
  Speaker 5: teams next year is just a bit nigley, you know,
• 49:02
  Speaker 5: an odd number for the draw. So but it is
• 49:05
  Speaker 5: what it is and we're going to work our way
• 49:06
  Speaker 5: through it and there are going to be some advantages
• 49:09
  Speaker 5: because you know, every team is going to have a
• 49:11
  Speaker 5: couple of bye weeks. Well, you know, I'd like to
• 49:14
  Speaker 5: think that doesn't mean that all blacks will have to
• 49:16
  Speaker 5: be stood down as often, so you're going to get
• 49:17
  Speaker 5: quality players. So there's going to be some aspects to this.
• 49:20
  Speaker 5: We're going to rethink the finals, you know, so how
• 49:23
  Speaker 5: many teams actually go into the finals. So there may
• 49:25
  Speaker 5: be you know, for those people who think that eight
• 49:27
  Speaker 5: teams doesn't have a lot of credibility, well we're probably
• 49:30
  Speaker 5: looking at six teams in a different shape of the finals.
• 49:32
  Speaker 5: So there's there's some things that are that are positives
• 49:35
  Speaker 5: going forward. It then becomes really interesting on what we
• 49:37
  Speaker 5: do from twenty six onwards, and the fact that that
• 49:40
  Speaker 5: is obviously the start of broadcast deals on both sides
• 49:43
  Speaker 5: of the Tasman is quite important as well. So we
• 49:47
  Speaker 5: will be and one of the key discussion points is
• 49:49
  Speaker 5: what is the nature of the competition and how many
• 49:51
  Speaker 5: teams will be in the competition from twenty six onwards basically,
• 49:55
  Speaker 5: and what would those what would those teams be.
• 49:59
  Speaker 3: Yes, we'll pick up on the future soon, but just
• 50:01
  Speaker 3: drolling down into that finals format, there was an alternative
• 50:05
  Speaker 3: floated around the seventeen model out of the the NFL.
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: How definitive can you be today about it will be
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: six teams which were the finals in terms of the
• 50:18
  Speaker 3: top two teams getting the week off, And like you say,
• 50:21
  Speaker 3: how important is that from a credibility integrity perspective when
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: you do only have eleven teams.
• 50:26
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I can't be definitive. I can tell you that
• 50:28
  Speaker 5: we had a good discussion on it. We're going to
• 50:30
  Speaker 5: have to make a decision reasonably soon because we'll have
• 50:33
  Speaker 5: a you know, we have to nail in the fact
• 50:35
  Speaker 5: that we'll have sixteen rounds and then the three rounds
• 50:39
  Speaker 5: probably for a nineteen week competition. Sorry, there's one extra
• 50:43
  Speaker 5: week than this year. There's one extra weekman this year. Yep,
• 50:47
  Speaker 5: but it was it's something we haven't made a final
• 50:49
  Speaker 5: decision on yet. So sixteen six teams or seven teams
• 50:54
  Speaker 5: is still a discussion point. If you want a personal perspective,
• 50:58
  Speaker 5: I think you should be six just because that makes
• 51:00
  Speaker 5: more sense.
• 51:01
  Speaker 4: I think yeap.
• 51:03
  Speaker 5: Where six gets tricky is remember a lot of these
• 51:07
  Speaker 5: teams and they all run at a pretty lean financial
• 51:12
  Speaker 5: you know, they're they're only on a shoe string budget.
• 51:14
  Speaker 5: These guys, you could end up finishing second and you know,
• 51:19
  Speaker 5: and then potentially only in the finals thing, or even
• 51:23
  Speaker 5: first only having one home game and getting knocked out,
• 51:25
  Speaker 5: and so that that can hurt financially because these teams,
• 51:30
  Speaker 5: you know, are really reliant on finals football to help
• 51:34
  Speaker 5: their balance sheets. So we're going to have to think
• 51:35
  Speaker 5: that one through is a little bit as well if
• 51:37
  Speaker 5: we do go to six teams.
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: If you look at the eight teams at the moment,
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: I don't think there's been a team from that five
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: to eight block that's beaten a higher ranked team in
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: the years we've had the quarter finals. So what I
• 51:50
  Speaker 2: guess thats have you come to a realization as a
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: board that it's probably not working even before the rebels scenario.
• 51:57
  Speaker 5: Well, it's a bit of a double edged sword, isn't it,
• 51:58
  Speaker 5: Because you're right, there is that element. But the other
• 52:01
  Speaker 5: element to that is we went into round fifteen, the
• 52:03
  Speaker 5: final round, and there was only one game that was
• 52:06
  Speaker 5: you know, that was I think it was the Wartars
• 52:09
  Speaker 5: and Rids was the only game that was irrelevant. Every
• 52:11
  Speaker 5: other game there was something on it in terms of
• 52:12
  Speaker 5: how the top eight looked. So but look, I think
• 52:16
  Speaker 5: when we decide on or we have the conversation and
• 52:19
  Speaker 5: work out for twenty six onwards how many teams we
• 52:21
  Speaker 5: actually have. I think there'll be another conversation around what
• 52:24
  Speaker 5: the finals makeup looks like.
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: Frankly, I guess if we cast the head to that
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty six window and the forecasting, you know that
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: eleven teams is an ideal that in a perfect world
• 52:38
  Speaker 3: you would add another team maybe more. How realistic is
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: that and what is a realistic destination for that team?
• 52:48
  Speaker 5: When you say destination in which team, who would it be?
• 52:51
  Speaker 5: I think at the moment, obviously it's really early days.
• 52:53
  Speaker 5: But if you look at the obvious candidates, you've got
• 52:58
  Speaker 5: potentially bringing Japanese teams into the competition, You've got the Haguaris.
• 53:03
  Speaker 5: I don't think there's an option to bring South African
• 53:05
  Speaker 5: teams back into the competition. And then outside of that,
• 53:10
  Speaker 5: you know you've got potential, you know, probably more of
• 53:13
  Speaker 5: a stretch. Do you look at the West coast of America.
• 53:15
  Speaker 5: I'm not quite sure they're ready for a high performance context.
• 53:18
  Speaker 5: So I think all of that will be up for discussion,
• 53:23
  Speaker 5: and a lot of that, to be fair, will be
• 53:25
  Speaker 5: drawn by the two unions that that clearly falls is
• 53:28
  Speaker 5: a major matter in those conversations.
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because I guess how far do you push it?
• 53:32
  Speaker 2: Because one of the criticisms of Super Rugby, especially when
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: you know pp South African teams and Japanese it was
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: run over about six time zones and became increasingly hard
• 53:41
  Speaker 2: to follow, very cumbersome in terms of its number of
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: teams and the way it works. So how how do
• 53:50
  Speaker 2: you go just balance that with the need to expand
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: and the need to look at new horizons.
• 53:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right.
• 53:55
  Speaker 5: I think if you take a fans lens on this,
• 53:57
  Speaker 5: we have sort of mucked around with this competition so
• 54:00
  Speaker 5: many times, from Super fifteen to Super twelve to you know,
• 54:03
  Speaker 5: it's like, okay, let's keep a consistency of what the
• 54:06
  Speaker 5: competition is and the structure of it for as long
• 54:09
  Speaker 5: as we possibly can. So so the best leagues in
• 54:11
  Speaker 5: the world aren't mucking ground with the structure of their
• 54:13
  Speaker 5: competitions every other year. So now we are in a
• 54:17
  Speaker 5: situation where twenty six onwards we are going to have
• 54:20
  Speaker 5: to introduce at least one other team to get ourselves
• 54:22
  Speaker 5: back to a balance. But having it, we have to
• 54:25
  Speaker 5: be really cognizant of that team being appropriate and high
• 54:29
  Speaker 5: performance context. So they're going to add to the competition
• 54:32
  Speaker 5: and we're also going to have to be cognizant the
• 54:34
  Speaker 5: fans are going to still understand that, you know, there's
• 54:37
  Speaker 5: some real credibility in the nature of the competition as well,
• 54:40
  Speaker 5: and all of that will go into the mix and
• 54:42
  Speaker 5: the discussions, and then of course, overlaying all that, you've
• 54:45
  Speaker 5: got broadcaster discussions and the number of games they want,
• 54:47
  Speaker 5: the time zones that work for them, and viewership and
• 54:50
  Speaker 5: those are really important considerations as well.
• 54:53
  Speaker 4: On those broadcast negotiations.
• 54:55
  Speaker 3: You know, they're extremely important to the financial future of
• 54:59
  Speaker 3: New Zealand and Australia and I guess they're coming to
• 55:01
  Speaker 3: a head now to a degree. So and those broadcast
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: negotiations are going to want blueprints for the future for
• 55:09
  Speaker 3: Super Rugby, for Rugby Championship and the like. So how
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: long do you have to establish a plan for who
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: and where that that twelve team is going to be?
• 55:20
  Speaker 5: Well, I think those are that's those are ongoing discussions
• 55:23
  Speaker 5: that the unions are having now and that's very much
• 55:26
  Speaker 5: in that's very much major matter for the for the unions.
• 55:29
  Speaker 5: I guess our role in that is if it was
• 55:33
  Speaker 5: a Rasky the unions that be responsible, we'd be the
• 55:36
  Speaker 5: s is supportive or actually informative and saying hey, this
• 55:40
  Speaker 5: is what we'd like to see and just remembering the
• 55:42
  Speaker 5: integrity of the competition. We just we just solowly focused
• 55:45
  Speaker 5: on what's going to be good for this competition. But
• 55:50
  Speaker 5: I understand that those broadcast conversations are absolutely active and
• 55:53
  Speaker 5: live now and there is going to be some time
• 55:56
  Speaker 5: pressure on that the closer we get to understanding what
• 55:59
  Speaker 5: the deal is going to be for twenty six onwards.
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, do you have a view more broadly on Super
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: Rugby about things like a draft or.
• 56:08
  Speaker 4: Selection?
• 56:10
  Speaker 3: For you, I know you're probably powerless to a degree,
• 56:13
  Speaker 3: but for just you know, floating the idea here about
• 56:19
  Speaker 3: selection across the Super Rugby. You know all blacks been
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: able to play for Australian teams and vice versa. Do
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: you envision a day where that happens or is it
• 56:30
  Speaker 3: a bit of a bridge too far?
• 56:32
  Speaker 5: I'll give you, I guess a personal view, and it
• 56:35
  Speaker 5: is something going back to a conversation before where I
• 56:38
  Speaker 5: think it's a good discussion point for for us to
• 56:40
  Speaker 5: have around the table. Draft might be at this stage
• 56:44
  Speaker 5: even in the medium term a step too far. Having
• 56:47
  Speaker 5: said that, you know, again personal perspective, Rich Manger, right, Well,
• 56:52
  Speaker 5: you know, Andrew Forrester at the Force could probably write
• 56:55
  Speaker 5: as big a check as the guys have written in Japan.
• 56:57
  Speaker 5: And if he was allowed to stay and that was
• 57:00
  Speaker 5: still within the Super Rugby ecosystem, he was still eligible
• 57:04
  Speaker 5: for the All Blacks. How good would that be? Right
• 57:06
  Speaker 5: for the competition? Ardie Severe goes to the war attas
• 57:09
  Speaker 5: you know, that would help the competition and the crowd
• 57:11
  Speaker 5: as well. You know, you take some of these really
• 57:14
  Speaker 5: good players and allow them to move within the ecosystem
• 57:17
  Speaker 5: of super rugby. That just even if it was just
• 57:20
  Speaker 5: an arrangement with the top fifteen to twenty players, so
• 57:23
  Speaker 5: you're not necessarily impacting the high performance development of younger
• 57:27
  Speaker 5: players coming through. But once you've reached that superstar status,
• 57:30
  Speaker 5: you know, you could start ranking these players and there's
• 57:32
  Speaker 5: there's a cost for them and they can move around
• 57:34
  Speaker 5: the competition. And again, purely from a competition perspective, how
• 57:38
  Speaker 5: cool would that be?
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: Indeed, I guess from Australian perspective which we don't often
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: consider here in New Zealand. But they haven't won the
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: compinent number of years. The teams have been not on
• 57:48
  Speaker 2: the final for a number of years, you see on
• 57:51
  Speaker 2: various articles. So do you think it's time to pull
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: out of Super Rugby even you know that, I know
• 57:54
  Speaker 2: the deal in place to twenty thirty and go to
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: a club competition or something over there. But what value
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: is Super Rugby providing to Australia.
• 58:01
  Speaker 5: I guess at the moment, Well, it's it's a tough
• 58:05
  Speaker 5: environment for them over there. At the moment, I think
• 58:08
  Speaker 5: the you know, with Standard Broadcaster, it's a it's a
• 58:11
  Speaker 5: limited streaming channel, so it's it's really hard to get
• 58:15
  Speaker 5: much visibility. I know in terms of marketing, budgets are
• 58:19
  Speaker 5: completely dwarfed by n r L and NFL and a
• 58:25
  Speaker 5: f L, so it's a it's really tough to get
• 58:28
  Speaker 5: any traction. And so I think what's going to be
• 58:31
  Speaker 5: really important for them in the next little while is
• 58:33
  Speaker 5: the Australian team starts to perform and win a few
• 58:37
  Speaker 5: games and that people start to actually fall back in
• 58:40
  Speaker 5: love with rugby again. The audience is there, and the
• 58:43
  Speaker 5: and the passion is there, but at the moment it's
• 58:46
  Speaker 5: with the lack of success and some of the other
• 58:49
  Speaker 5: sort of issues that have gone on in rugby in Australia.
• 58:53
  Speaker 5: I know it's it's hard to get traction.
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: It really is good new CEO about to start. What's
• 58:58
  Speaker 2: he going to bring to super about to start?
• 59:01
  Speaker 4: I wish it was about.
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: Remember my brain when he was when he was going
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: to get on board.
• 59:07
  Speaker 5: Jack Jack Measley. He starts on July twenty seconds, so
• 59:10
  Speaker 5: he unfortunately had twelve weeks three months. Yeah, notice Pier
• 59:15
  Speaker 5: which is quite brutal, and he's on gardening leave at
• 59:17
  Speaker 5: the moment. Actually, we're bringing him over for the final.
• 59:22
  Speaker 5: I can't wait for them to start. I mean, the
• 59:24
  Speaker 5: great thing about what Jack will be doing is that
• 59:27
  Speaker 5: he will be one hundred percent focused on this competition,
• 59:30
  Speaker 5: living and breathing it. And at the moment, you know,
• 59:33
  Speaker 5: it's fine that we've got this governance board in place,
• 59:35
  Speaker 5: but as a governance board, we can only do so much.
• 59:37
  Speaker 5: And there's a lot of things that you know, a
• 59:39
  Speaker 5: lot of great ideas, a lot of things that need
• 59:40
  Speaker 5: to be implemented that you need a team to go
• 59:43
  Speaker 5: ahead and do. And Jack was Jack was an outstanding candidate.
• 59:49
  Speaker 5: And I think we said before he's got a really
• 59:52
  Speaker 5: strong background of marketing.
• 59:53
  Speaker 4: So he's you know, the A.
• 59:57
  Speaker 5: League experience is good because he's had to learn to
• 59:59
  Speaker 5: scrap and fight there as well, and he's going to
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 5: have to learn to scrap and fight, especially in that
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 5: Australian environment. As we're saying, he's a rugby man. He
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 5: loves his rugby th is playing until just recently, and
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 5: so I can't wait to him for him to get
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 5: on board actually, because that will allow us to have
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 5: some more traction and to say we're going to have
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 5: somebody living and breathing. What's good for the competition twenty
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 5: four hours, you know, seven days a week.
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 4: That's perfect.
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: Just on that though, because as you mentioned that, sometimes
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: it's a super akable you're a wee bit powerless or
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: you can't influence timid decision. So what power I guess
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: is he going to bring or have?
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 5: Well, one of he'll be doing. You know, there's still
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 5: within the context of what I was talking about with
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 5: eyeballs and bums on seats and marketing the game, how
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 5: we do with for the officials, number, the shape of
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 5: the game elements, communication plans, you know, things like fantasy leagues.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 5: There's a boy you start to list it out, you
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 5: know the draw, making sure that draw the Sunday football
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 5: we're talking about potentially afternoon football. Are the implications of
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 5: that there's you know, it doesn't take you very long
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 5: before you've got a long list of things that he
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 5: can absolutely still be influencing and be quite effective for
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 5: the competition.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 3: Yep, if we bring it back to this weekend, Eden
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 3: Park Chiefs Blues, we certainly can't let you escape without
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 3: a prediction.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 5: I'm not I'm completely neutral. My prediction is that there'd
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 5: be a great crowd in the great game. That's probably
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 5: all that I should be really saying. I'm going to
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 5: tell you what I am really looking forward to. If
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 5: you're if you're if you're a rugby fan, how good
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 5: is this going to be? I mean, this should be
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 5: an absolute cracker And as I say, just really hoping
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 5: that as a showcase, even it's played in front of
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 5: a full crowd, it'll be superb.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let's hope for that. Given below, thank you for
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: joining us on Rugby Direct. Grateful for your time, Thank you,
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 2: thank you. Thanks guys, that's a fascinating chat with Given below,
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 2: wasn't it? Liam? Plenty of issues you'd be up for
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 2: a trip with the Gold Coast for Super Round.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sure somebody Gold Coast Airways can d get
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 3: us over there and get us here.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 4: But yeah, some some big takeaways there.
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 3: I guess Super Around not coming to New Zealand's Super
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 3: Ugby Commission family in favor of a sixteen finals format
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 3: next year.
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 4: And who knows where that twelve teams coming from.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: It could be from anywhere at this point in time.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: That'll do us for Rugby Direct will be back next Tuesday,
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: live from the People's City, the Garden City, the city
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: that shines, christ Church.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 3: I'll have to pick up the move, won't we. It's
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 3: gonna be a somber, somber place.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: I'm expecting a sort of welcome at the airport, the
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 2: celebratory sort of hucker is I come down the the
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: escalators welcoming one of their favorite sons home.
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 4: It's gonna be a Blues, Chiefs, Heavy or Blacks team,
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 4: isn't it.
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 2: M Yeah, well we'll get to that next week. We'll
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: be in christ Church. The squad naming is on Monday.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: Will be back with you on Tuesday on Rugby Direct.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: Very much looking forward to that. On behalf of Liam
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: Napier wishing you a very good weekend. Thanks to our
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: friends at Habit Health for technic all your aches and
• 1:02:58
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• 1:03:00
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• 1:03:01
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• 1:03:03
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• 1:03:10
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• 1:03:13
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